Latest / Monero Talk / Anonymity & Secure Communications w/ prancing389, Monero Price Report, News & More! | EPI# 151
Transcript
- Sunita(00:00:07 - 00:00:39): You are about to opt in to Mineratopia, a show for the Minerat community where all are welcome to join From noob to maxi no matter what bags you hold Just sit back and relax to the sweet sounds of Minerat's latest progress Or if you're feeling inspired join us on stage Remember the only thing that can stop Minerat is a false belief that it can be stopped And if you want to win the revolution faster, we recommend you remove your XMR from all custodial exchanges immediately Warning, voting accidents are common around here. Don't forget to properly secure your private keys Sunita(00:00:40 - 00:00:42): Mineratopia starts now Doug(00:00:44 - 00:01:05): Good morning, happy weekend everybody We had a few technical difficulties or someone somebody said and in the comments Someone said it was kind of funny. I lost the comment or somebody that lead it. Somebody said something like technical issues or satanic You know, agencies trying to run this you know stuff like that Tony(00:01:05 - 00:01:27): No, it has nothing Yeah, we shadow band ourselves I don't know, like it's like there's not too many variables, but for some things get knocked out of whack It's whenever we try to change and like make things better. It's just picking things much worse So right now I don't even know where my sound is coming out of but it sounds okay, right? Doug(00:01:28 - 00:01:43): Sounds very good. Yeah, and it sounds like it's coming from the mic so yeah, the camera looks good, the microphone sounds good Next, it's all good. All right, let's get the let's get started Okay, somebody said no short way server said as long as you speak up otherwise a little quiet Tony(00:01:43 - 00:02:04): For me sounds good. So I don't know. I mean I could raise my gain a little bit about that. Is that better? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that sounds a little better. All right sweet and now I'm sure people will be complaining that I'm too loud It's the other thing you're complaining like just honestly shut the fuck up like you don't have to watch the show Really? Tony(00:02:04 - 00:02:22): Really don't care who you do is to get information I get people that just like it pick about the stupidest fucking things. It's really fucking annoying like yeah You really if it's I don't know if the sound levels are to your to your liking. I don't know to tell you man move on Doug(00:02:23 - 00:02:37): All right, let's move on to pressure port. Okay, before I say that I before we go on to pressure port out I want to say I like the light the purple light with the mural and the whole thing. It's really nice. Looks really good. Yeah, okay Sunita(00:02:44 - 00:02:54): The Manera to be a price of course segment is sponsored by local Manera avoid using KYC exchanges buy and sell Manera directly for Fia peer to peer Bawdy(00:02:54 - 00:03:08): Hey, how are you doing? Good just partaking with the technical difficulties with you guys Although today I got all my shit worked out. I should get to get across Tony(00:03:09 - 00:03:13): Yeah, like America Rada goes around like one of us has technical difficulties. It's funny Bawdy(00:03:13 - 00:03:48): I mean the way you like we try to fix something it only makes it worse and then after like much struggle and like head banging against the wall You finally it's probably like one little setting somewhere and like just one little thing that you forgot about like something is unplugged Or maybe a cable's bad and you're like just that one thing and then it gets better like at like you just keep improving things get better And better your automation gets better. But yeah, I mean it feels like the more you work with technology the more you realize that everything just barely Fucking works yeah operating systems code software everything just like barely works. Mm-hmm sit so Bawdy(00:03:48 - 00:04:19): Yeah, I just so talk a little bit about price and so the ETFs launched we have some some history behind us now I thought some of the ways that they named these ETFs were hilarious. So for example Valkyrie they named their ETF Burr That's so that's their Bitcoin ETF kind of funny they launched the ETFs and basically you know price has fallen since the launch of all the ETFs Let's go over some of these names. Okay, so there's like ten of them. There might be more than ten but Bawdy(00:04:19 - 00:04:52): So you've got the I shares Bitcoin trust I shares is like one of the primary people that do ETFs for like commodities and stuff They're called I bit the Van Ek Bitcoin trust is called HODL Let's see we went over the Valkyrie Bitcoin fund. That's B our RR Burr Yeah, you got to wonder like They had to have been like you know these fucking finance bros after after work one day in the bar There's like wish we call this fun man. I don't know what about Burr all the moonboys are always complaining about all the Burr the Burr money that J Palprinz Bawdy(00:04:52 - 00:05:23): You've got wisdom tree Bitcoin you've got a bit wise ETF arc 21 shares Bitcoin And supposedly these things have been doing a shitload of volume so if I am to believe Twitter and I haven't gone and like really verified it for myself But apparently like more volume has been done on this Bitcoin ETF than like any other ETF in the history of ETF releases So that's interesting especially since the price has been down Gray scale is trying to get their price normalized they've been sharing off chunks of Bitcoin trying to Bawdy(00:05:23 - 00:05:59): You know and that's actually like in hindsight that's some that's an interesting dynamic because we could have looked at that We could have said hey they're still a 10% gap of the Bitcoin trust or the the GPTC gray scale Bitcoin trust And that's getting converted to an ETF so they've got to they have to normalize that price differential now And the only way they can do that is by selling off Bitcoin removing Bitcoin from that trust So kind of in hindsight you could look at that and said yeah that's going to be significant selling pressure right there Maybe that would going forward that could actually be a little bit of an instructive point for us once gray scale normalizes their price Bawdy(00:05:59 - 00:06:33): To like they normalize the their ETF value to the actual Bitcoin that they're holding maybe that would be a moment for pivot right because right now things are kind of like slowly drifting down basically the charts don't look great But maybe once gray scale normalizes that could be like a pivot point where we could see some resurgence just an idea I have to think about that some more later on later on this week So the real the real story here today is stocks NASDAQ and S&P so the NASDAQ is now made a nice big bounce well above its previous all time high which was here Bawdy(00:06:33 - 00:07:04): The the white and green lines are a global liquidity so the white line is sorry the green is US liquidity and then white is a global liquidity so it includes the US liquidity but it also includes all of the M2SL all the M2 money from all the other different banks out there And those baking balance sheets plus everything that's going on with the macro money liquidity situation in the US And so you'll see like you know that I this is something I hadn't looked at I don't know why I just stopped looking at the global liquidity for some reason but yeah in the beginning of December Bawdy(00:07:04 - 00:07:41): We just had a big bump things just jump to the top side which kind of makes sense because you know stocks stocks bump I think that these things tend to play off of each other So stocks pump you're the companies out there the financial bros they're more they have a higher evaluation suddenly they can justify more more borrowing more lending And again borrowing and lending is the way in which new money comes into being that's that's the the stork or j pal bringing more money to the world So then like okay then then global liquidity pumps and then you get the stock market pumps again so yeah I mean right now the stock market is the place to be Bawdy(00:07:41 - 00:08:16): Even if we take a look at the the relative prices so this is Bitcoin this is Bitcoin so this is Bitcoin relative to the NASDAQ And yeah I mean you'll notice like in terms of the plub lines that was kind of like a reasonable spot to expect to expect a little bit of topping action there At some point in a real bull market this things gonna break break to the upside here these are like kind of very long term standard deviation line so I would expect that things need to spend So if things were gonna break I'm not saying it's gonna go up right here it could very well just come to the downside and then go to the upside Bawdy(00:08:16 - 00:08:50): But at any rate these standard deviation lines are gonna be pretty strong and there's gonna need to be some some time spent here turning before it really before Bitcoin really starts out performing the NASDAQ So I wouldn't I wouldn't expect Bitcoin to be making significant massive gains that outperform NASDAQ for a period of time I guess we could look at the range here 30% up 30% down right so we're looking at 20 to 30% oscillation to the up and down side But I wouldn't expect Bitcoin to like 2x outperform the NASDAQ here until until like a real big macro bull market starts again Bawdy(00:08:50 - 00:09:34): And you know I mean people probably would want to quibble and say well we are starting a big new macro bull market and okay maybe we are probably we are almost certainly we are But you know that doesn't mean that price has to go up now right That doesn't mean we'll get the hockey stick exponential move just quite yet I mean yes we had some exponential moves but we're not looking at like It's not you know it's not August of 2020 or anything like that or or December of 2020 right we haven't we haven't seen those kind of movements just quite yet Let's see this is this would be the total market cap relative to the NASDAQ so again don't worry about this Bitcoin thing up here that doesn't actually count what's what's actually being shown here in fact what I could do is they moved the they move the meat button or they move you know actually we're not gonna screw it that Bawdy(00:09:34 - 00:10:16): Anyways this right here is a strip that I wrote that's like the total combined market cap of everything and that's the that's the candles that we're looking at anyway so this is total market cap relative to to the NASDAQ And it is also doing pretty well along those same lines like this thing could have more a little bit more like this chart looks slightly more optimistic to me in the short term than then the Bitcoin versus NASDAQ chart So I mean on that theme let's go take a look at the dominance Bitcoin dominance so Bitcoin dominance here right we we had that wedge kind of broke down and then right now like there's just seems like it seems like it's holding out pretty good here the Bitcoin dominance probably the ETF is keeping it you know at the Bawdy(00:10:16 - 00:10:53): 4 fronts in a lot of ways I think that's all on purpose right like we don't have to hash that out again keeping the coin that you can't actually use very well and that every time people try to use just clogs up keeping that at the 4 front of the picture really really keeps people away from from the idea of actually using this money that's the power that's the thing that has to be taken back we don't need another store value that goes on to reserve balance sheets and that's held for long periods of time by big companies but no one actually use like that doesn't give us freedom like just because you can audit it that doesn't do shit like it doesn't Bawdy(00:10:53 - 00:11:27): matter like that's oh we can audit it now okay whatever like you really think that the United States doesn't have eight tons of gold like I don't think they're I doubt that they're like seriously lying about that they might be lying about where it's stored is probably not in Fort Knox but okay whatever yet I digress so Bitcoin dominance here yeah I mean fell out of the wedge seems to be hanging on this thing could go up it could go down it doesn't matter I tend to think that down would be the direction here slowly me and during down is alt coins start to play a little bit of catch up at some point I feel like there's got to be a breaking story for the Ethereum ETF you know like oh at least company Bawdy(00:11:27 - 00:12:05): you filed for the Ethereum ETF and now the battle will begin again right there look at Ethereum onto the onto into the macro I don't know into the traditional finance world if that happens like the moment that you see the the Ethereum ETF like hitting the news headlines that's where you can start to expect that all coins could could begin there a period of time where they outperform Bitcoin so I mean this thing will go back and forth right like at some point if you know to convince the plebs that a new big macro move is back on you know a new all time high they'll have to push Bitcoin first to sort of convince everyone and then and then all coins will follow and you always you have to remember Bawdy(00:12:05 - 00:12:36): like the fundamental factor behind that is that the thing they're going to make the most money off of is selling shit coins into generosity gambling to the plebs like Las Vegas is a massive city and I built you know my personal investment has built a lot of those casinos or some parts of those casinos I'm sure and it's the same way with with cryptocurrency like it's not Bitcoin that's the primary money maker or you know for these for these insiders for the crypto ball and now also the financial Bawdy(00:12:36 - 00:13:07): and it's the altcoins it's the shit coins the things that they printed from nothing for free the degeneracy that goes around they like they make so much money on that so like they have to keep Bitcoin doing good and they use it to sort of supplement the the altcoin game so yeah anyways that's I in my opinion that's like kind of a fundamental backdrop of why altcoins basically always have to be a little bit more in the form in these big big background movements so let's take a quick look at the rest of the macro so we talked about the dollar index kind of showing some strength here like it had Bawdy(00:13:07 - 00:13:41): balanced off that lower standard deviation and you know that now maybe maybe we could see a little bit of move to the upside overall dollars basically looking stable looking for the dollar to set up on a macro move to the upside or the downside at some point and again right now this is just consolidate consolidating volatility will probably expect this to just sort of consolidate for a period of time make some kind of setup and then whichever direction that it's going to go will probably take the opposite end of that right so dollars looking like it's about to break down like it's going to want to come visit this is these lower very long term standard deviations Bawdy(00:13:41 - 00:14:14): and then we signal to us that time it'll be one of many signals we're looking for that you know a big another all time high and crypto is coming summer is coming in that regard and though gold gold just you know kind of chill in here same thing we like again we don't really I mean this thing like sometimes it just makes these violent things like that we did at the end of last year and not in October where it just went down in the back up right now yeah I mean it's just kind of sitting here doing nothing and there's a there's probably like a part of the reason for gold to just sort of sit here and not do much is because they already Bawdy(00:14:14 - 00:14:50): now pushed the NASDAQ to new all time highs and now the excitement like the the focus and the vision is going to be on NASDAQ and and stocks and then some to some extent cryptocurrencies and so that that really does really go like why are you going to hold gold which is just sitting here doing this shit when you can be in the NASDAQ which is putting on new all time highs so that's always like a prominent thing that's that happens it's a sociological thing so I would just expect that to continue at this moment I wouldn't expect gold to break out at some point you know it's it's going to but I just wouldn't expect that on the short term necessarily so OK let's take a look at bonds bonds Bawdy(00:14:50 - 00:15:30): now much here to be excited about the long end of the curve is bumping up just a little bit you'll notice that things are getting me entering on back towards that zero point so I was looking at this and I was wondering OK what happens if the long end of the curve like OK let's suppose that the long end of the curve comes to the top side up here and then we get an overall not inverted yield curve right like if that happens has that happened before and the answer is yes in 2008 and 2008 that actually kind of happened back here I'm not entirely sure necessarily with the signals because I just sort of notices but you'll notice that the long end of the curve came in like our Bawdy(00:15:30 - 00:16:07): performance I shouldn't say our performance is actually this means bonds going down the long the interest rates on the long term bonds came back to normalize right here to be above the short term which is in yellow and that's like that's what should that's what should happen interestingly enough what you'll notice here is that on the NASDAQ as that was happening like the NASDAQ was kind of topping what's also interesting is that it even technically made a slightly higher high just a few months later even as bonds were crashing so yeah I mean these are all patterns like what kind of be looking at this it's like it's so slow moving it's just hard to you know it's it's like hard to watch because you're like Bawdy(00:16:07 - 00:16:43): if there's anything change it's been a month it's been two months nothing has changed but that's how it surprises you like it will be steady state nothing will happen something will like flash or warning signal at you and in a few days or a week and if you're not paying attention you'll miss an opportunity so unfortunately that's often just how opportunity is it's just mostly sitting and waiting until something very clear emerges from the chaos and then you like nope that's a signal let's let's take a move here and then you unlike how you manage your stack and what you want to do like that's a strategy that some traders will use right you'll just be bored the entire time and you only take trades every now and then when you feel like you have really high confidence Bawdy(00:16:43 - 00:17:22): otherwise you're like you'll be like nope I'm fine I'll watch these opportunities pass me by it's not a big deal I want to make sure that I'm winning I want to make sure that I don't take losses right the the Warren Buffett strategy of of rule number one don't lose money so yeah anyways we're kind of looking at this looking towards looking from the past to see what might happen here I don't know that would be interesting if the yield curve normalizes right here and then if it normalizes and then nothing bad happens with the stock market and it stays normalized for months and months and months will just say all right they probably like I don't know they did something right to cover there's not a problem but at least for the time being that we have the reverse repose Bawdy(00:17:22 - 00:17:59): which still have half a trillion dollars we're going to probably say that nothing bad's going to happen as long as they've got reverse repose to rely on so for the moment we're not going to be looking for any major crashes in the near in the near future once these are reverse repose start to get towards that zero point we might start getting a little suspicious or anxious or you know opening up the possibility in our minds that that something new could be emerging uh mineral I'm sorry that we never talked about man error that much what's there to talk about guys only the technicals the fundamentals the usage all of the good people and the awesome things happening the ecosystem but price you know like there's just not much to talk about Bawdy(00:17:59 - 00:18:44): and price are still this is still falling volatility um it's I mean we're like smack dab in the middle of these of the moving average bands the white bands here the ones down here at the bottom I don't know if you can see that the ones at the bottom are like the very very very longest term moving averages but the short term moving averages are in white right here and we're basically smack dab right at the moving averages so yeah there's not much to talk about here if crypto goes up probably will sort of go up crypto goes down probably a mineral will sort of go down but mostly stay stay so um we had uh in terms of like Bitcoin versus mineral we sort of like we talked about last week we sort of hit this this point right here just above like the very very long term lower standard deviation things Bawdy(00:18:44 - 00:19:42): bound stuff on the on the longer term I don't really I really I don't like this chart at all like from a wave magic standpoint this is fucking horrible these bands are already curving down like the standard deviations are curving down classically what will happen is this will get to the standard deviation area here and then find another reason to go to the downside so that's what the technicals would say on on this chart sorry to you know sorry to bear bad news there but that's just what the chart says so I got to tell you guys what the chart actually says things look somewhat similar for Manero versus Ethereum it's not quite as bad because the these bands have only just barely started to curl under and hypothetically technically if Manero jumped up here and like established it like established above those bands that would actually be a very good sign in terms of the ratio relative to Ethereum um but man that's you know that that's a lot of ifs right there I mean it's not a lot of ifs but the one if Bawdy(00:19:42 - 00:20:25): uh jumping above that above that band like that is definitely a big if um if we think that the crypto run here's not over that we're going to get like a secondary peak kind of like we did in 2021 I mean so far guys this is looked exactly like the 2021 futures ETF releases we had 15% on the data ETF got released and then bleed out after that um we're kind of in the bleed out phase or the consolidation phase whatever you want to call it um and right now things would yeah I mean with the stock market going up with liquidity being in like there's global liquidity there's um US liquidity with that backdrop you would say yeah it would make a lot of sense that we'll get another fucking you know D Bawdy(00:20:25 - 00:21:07): Jen pump on on Bitcoin and in all coins so with D Jen pumps via leverage right via via liquidity and leverage they don't put that into Manero they don't put it into gold they put it into their generic shit coins they move that leverage and they move that money into the places it's going to make them the most money and they didn't get Manero for free you know so as we've talked about so many times so what it means is that if we think that's the macro backdrop and there's a reasonable likelihood of a secondary pump here on crypto markets Manero's not gonna not gonna come here to the upside for theory Manero's not gonna reestablish itself in some you know big area here and then do that like what's going to happen Manero's going to maybe get up here and then falter and then come down as as they pump the markets Bawdy(00:21:07 - 00:21:34): like at least in a relative fashion right like Manero will be the side red headed stepchild beneficiary of that liquidity but it won't get anything like it won't get any directly from from the cabal so yeah again that's just like the realities we're dealing with sorry to be to be so negative uh regarding the the Manero's relative price but I just gotta tell you guys the way I'm the way I'm seeing things so um I guess that's about it there's there's really not much else to talk about here unless uh Tony(00:21:34 - 00:21:56): any guys have questions let me check the YouTube comments out what do you what do you think of uh the zcash drama so it's yeah yeah ending the knee and it looks like they're gonna remain being listed on bynats Manero I don't think we'll we'll have a similar fate right I think Manero is gonna be removed what do you thoughts there yeah it's it's funny how they're so willing to solve Bawdy(00:21:56 - 00:22:06): pone like oh look how compliant we are look how easy it is to uh just like the regulator dick okay guys got done with that that the community is like behind it I know I know some Tony(00:22:06 - 00:22:13): people aren't and which I'd expect I just thought I would just think a lot more people in zcash wouldn't want to go down that Bawdy(00:22:13 - 00:22:49): road so that's a bad precedent is there really is e-cash community is that the fabled zcash community I guess you guys on twitter I don't know trying to figure it out every time I see positive zcash comments like they they feel fake they feel forced and when I look at their profiles rarely I just kind of like is this real like is this the bot I mean the people associated with zcash like they're they use bots like they have no moral hang-ups against astroturfing support for their coin I thought it was funny that's very sober one of the manero Bawdy(00:22:49 - 00:22:56): bros out there I can't remember which one sorry bro um but uh they uh they were like very sober did you delete all your pros e-cash Tony(00:22:56 - 00:23:04): treats where did they go I saw that uh way of trying to bring it all man now this is now this has changed yeah that that's great is at the case that you really Bawdy(00:23:04 - 00:23:22): delete all his I mean I didn't painstakingly go through all his tweets and neither did I run a search a twitter search I don't trust Twitter search anyways like I've used it sometimes you're like yeah this doesn't show sometimes it works usually works pretty good another time she's like yeah it's a funny that's good yeah I'm just I'm just looking at uh Tony(00:23:22 - 00:23:30): menero to uh zcash transaction count and yeah it's something we could pull up manero transaction counts is stable Bawdy(00:23:30 - 00:24:05): oscillating between 20 25k see if you can compare to uh zcash z glass now I think it's glass node cc we should be able to see in both what do you use for um oh they do have zcash here of course we're got um don't believe that hockey stick down there that's that's probably just some artifact of the way they print the chart um yeah it looks like they're let's go to the longer timeframe huh three years yeah so it looks like I thought zcash transactions were lower than this I mean at a minimum like their transactions are falling so if they're down to 3000 transactions per day that means that they're Bawdy(00:24:05 - 00:24:38): they're hidden transactions or they're shielded transactions are far lower I mean this is pretty bad like they're down they're down to the same levels that they were consistently at how they're even lower than they were back in 2018 2019 like who used the zcash like who in their right mind like they don't have any dark web support so all the all the drugies out there going to the dark webs they're not hearing about zcash they're hearing about meneroly their suppliers are like please use menero um you know the websites the the so the new silk roads out there they're like please use menero it's a better you know it's just better to use for the squeeze case particularly yeah so it's Bawdy(00:24:38 - 00:24:55): hard to believe that they're their shielded mounts are doing anything better and plus you have to realize a lot of these transaction counts um I think these are were inflated partially by the by that attacker I don't know if he's still out there attacking but it was like it didn't cost him much it was just like ten bucks a day or something to flood the flood their network all right yeah I Tony(00:24:55 - 00:25:00): don't know there's else has questions oh yeah back to the youtube hero people are asking how about Bawdy(00:25:00 - 00:25:33): derro i mean i don't want to get locked into anti-derro position i just feel like releasing bullet proofs before the math out it was complete is not like that's bad juju like you're not supposed to do that that that speaks directly to their to their competency or their to their decision making um i don't know i mean i've heard them kind of come back and say well you know listen that like i remember Seth did kind of a long ride upon it and i don't remember everything about it i just spend too long i haven't looked into it i mean i guess like bro if there's going to be degeneracy Bawdy(00:25:33 - 00:26:05): and there's money to be made i can't fault you for it all i can say is just um you know make sure that you've got a big strong stash of a narrow that you use regularly um personally i would i would much much rather see um dark five and or zanno come into prominence um but uh yeah i mean uh sorry i don't have much more to say on that i don't want to start talking out my ass there's like other things too that derro did that were questionable but they i've also heard some counter positions that it's like okay like so for example okay um the they had their their code was not open source for the first year and there would have been no way to tell if they had printed extra Bawdy(00:26:05 - 00:26:36): coins that is apparently not the case anymore they they did open their code you can't audit the chain in a similar fashion that you could audit my narrow um to to see that they didn't like secretly print any coins um for the first year that was like wow that's you know close source software guys for privacy coin well like it's just hard no um but they open that up but they're still like other things as well so um it has like a broader amounts of support from the tv guys like from the from the burwick guys the anarcho polko um from the anarcho polko guys so maybe maybe there's Bawdy(00:26:36 - 00:26:42): something to be had there um yeah that's it's all i got to say about that yeah i saw people like Tony(00:26:42 - 00:26:49): tweeting that they think the same people that started manero started derro uh no i don't think i Bawdy(00:26:49 - 00:26:54): don't think so guys i'm not seeing any evidence of that yeah like you could it's easy to say that Tony(00:26:54 - 00:27:12): but like what what why would you think that it's a nice rumor to start but it's like yeah no evidence of it and and why so i don't know nothing to get sterile like right yeah i'm not gonna hear wage war against them but just just be you know realistic about a case i mean derro does not look Bawdy(00:27:12 - 00:27:47): like it's participating in any of the um i mean it's down like it's from from the top in 2021 it fell all the way through october last year and now it's almost basically at that same point it's still almost it's 90% down from the top like this in a in a in a world where we had the kind of leverage and the kind of liquidity and pumps that we've had over the past year in the past 12 months you would not expect a coin like derro to still be at its local lows or very very close to its local lows from the top it should it should at least be hanging out somewhere around here or Bawdy(00:27:47 - 00:28:22): somewhere around here like but it's not so you have to ask yourself why is it not is there some kind of central holder that's continually selling coins on some market trying to maximize their value right each pump you get some mega pump and then it slowly bleeds out you get some mega pump and then it slowly bleeds out maybe that's not a mega pump let's take a look yeah that's 130 130% over 2x this is the same kind of shit you see on charts like like ripple when you have large centralized supply holders and you get these occasional you know green dole those to the upside and then you take the stairs down and everyone thinks oh at every single point you've got new liquidity entrance into Bawdy(00:28:22 - 00:28:57): this market saying oh look how much it's fallen it pumped it's setting up here it's consolidating getting ready to pump to the nope it's crushed again that's like such a common tactic that's used by like it's it's the same chart over and over again when you have central holders even Z cash and I also get even Z cash has like similar dynamics that happen yeah I mean you'll notice the the C cash is and it's not the full chart I don't want to be I don't want to be accused of doing what people do to Bitcoin to Minero especially the Minero versus Bitcoin chart yeah I mean look at the Z cash it's this whole time lows like why well maybe it's that 20% founders report that could Bawdy(00:28:57 - 00:29:29): have some things to do with it yeah so it's it's the same thing I just be careful you know like maybe you can maybe you'll hit you know hit the double green hit zero or zero zero on the roll it wheel it happens sometimes like but just know that it's it's gambling right you're gambling getting into Dero unless you have some kind of like insider information or like you just have some further penetrating insight into the Dero markets as they relate to crypto that the rest of the bros don't see and that I particularly have not been looking at and might not be able to see myself like if you have some really good insight sure go for Dero like maybe you'll have an Bawdy(00:29:29 - 00:30:03): opportunity there but like I just wouldn't given its current dynamics I don't see a reason to think that that should necessarily turn around and like just why there's so many other coins that are performing like there's so many other coins that have hope and promise and hype and and visibility and everything like if Minero is ignored because of its privacy features like what's Dero gonna be like are they are they gonna add Dero all of a sudden so we're gonna love Dero and if they are adding Dero to the exchanges like what does that what does that tell you like that might not be the best sign in fact that it that it actually performs what it's supposed to do so I mean for all these Bawdy(00:30:03 - 00:30:19): reasons like it's just I mean I'm just like painting a picture here the sort of like stream of consciousness at the moment like this is my thoughts on Dero like if you asked me about it in a moment I'm just not confident that I would I wouldn't bet money on it unless I had some special insight which I don't so if you do you know good luck to you yeah I mean an imprisous side I mean is it Tony(00:30:19 - 00:30:39): actively being worked on or is it like one death I mean I know that this guy is alleging that the Minero the people that that created the crypto no white paper which we know is not the case like or the early Minero devs created Dero not the case um but is there anybody even developing on Dero Bawdy(00:30:39 - 00:30:48): or is it just like one dude that's yeah that's a good question I really don't know if they're developing ecosystem looks like I just don't know if it's still on it you know the excited I mean Tony(00:30:48 - 00:31:13): obviously I get it it's people that hold Dero bags that are trying to just you know for for our community people are listening that are interested just be really careful I don't see anything that really I don't know makes it interesting I mean I would like to be proven wrong is there some kind of like vibrant development going on are there really smart people working on Dero that are putting that that are creating something interesting I just I just don't see that yeah yeah Bawdy(00:31:13 - 00:31:47): I agree someone here is asking thoughts on Memble Wimbled seems it just went quiet um I think Memble Wimbled relatively mature in terms of like the goal of what they wanted to achieve um a few years maybe as two years ago now I read a paper that that said that um it was broken that it can basically be totally unwound just because one person came out and published a paper on AR XIV arcs of that doesn't necessarily mean that it's broken but I mean there is someone out there that seems to know something about map and cryptography that says that they think it's broken um maybe Bawdy(00:31:47 - 00:32:19): it is maybe doesn't like when implemented it and um you know that was like their big claim to fame for a while other than just being a carving copy of Bitcoin with a slightly different mining algorithm I don't know like it personally I wouldn't want to see any technology developed with Memble Wimbled because it's like it might not be strong privacy it might have problems and it might be able to be unwound so you're going to get the worst of all worlds you might not have good privacy and then you might end up getting to de-list it right you might end up getting called a privacy coin if Bawdy(00:32:19 - 00:32:49): you're like hey look at our Memble Wimbled uh it's kind of funny in a way that Litecoin is not in de-listed it's not you know being subject to those to those problems um but I mean as as we've seen again the pattern here is like we're going to de-list all the privacy coins these have privacy enhancing features you've got to get rid of the coins oh okay we're going to de-list them on and later well actually we you know what we kind of made a mistake um looks like C cash like they have these transparent addresses that you know maybe we don't need to de-list C cash oh you know and Litecoin also like Memble Wimbled is opt in you don't have to use it it's just like coin Bawdy(00:32:49 - 00:33:23): join on Bitcoin we don't we don't ban Bitcoin well okay we released everything except for Miner which they don't they leave the last part out right that's the silent part um I think Memble Wimbled is mostly just marketing advertising if you want strong privacy useful membership proofs use like use a Zcash construction uh or the Z case NARS construction now which does not require the trusted setup or if you do a trusted setup take in like take in like a thousand points of uh of entropy over the course of a month or two like they did when they launched tornado cash or use ringsick entry use a strong well-known technology that that works um or and and make it default Bawdy(00:33:23 - 00:33:27): or just don't implement it at all like it just seems more like a marketing tactic that's my Tony(00:33:27 - 00:33:58): yeah it's something that Memble Wimbled for sure and you know network effect it's a it's a real thing right like you keep coming up a new fangle tech uh new ideas that do things in different ways that maybe quote unquote provide more privacy um but is anybody using it like where's the network effect that's that's a big part in this right so it's always so all right man fantastic as always and we will keep moving on uh stay on board you can't I see neon is asking where is the guest Tony(00:33:58 - 00:34:03): link we post the guest link during the viewers on stage segments so well usually happens at the Bawdy(00:34:03 - 00:34:09): other the show but I got a bounce out I um I'm gonna head down to the greater reset here later today Tony(00:34:09 - 00:34:16): I'm already late and so just going on into fixed on car who runs that that's dark bros oh yeah Bawdy(00:34:16 - 00:34:38): very cool very cool where's uh it's in meralia mexico which is like halfway in between um say mexico city and port the way to central mexico beautiful area it's just like a couple of days or how long does that go on for uh it's been going like it's they started on Wednesday I believe it was Wednesday and they're going until sunday uh or tomorrow maybe monday um and then we might go camping Bawdy(00:34:38 - 00:34:48): or something up in the mountains very cool then very cool it's awesome I have a good time and joy thanks joy i guess i'll talk to you next week urban all right body bye have a good week night Doug(00:34:48 - 00:35:14): right you want to run the news yeah we can start and then if you hop on the little little little let's run the news and then we'll go back to the guest okay okay let's run the news segment now okay everybody welcome to you okay we're today huh not today now are you Tony(00:35:14 - 00:35:19): today what are you still in your pajamas over there something oh i have to go well no i'm still Doug(00:35:19 - 00:35:51): i'm just getting this um getting stuffed out of my apartment so it kind of looks messy yeah so all right to look nice all right okay let me look on the screen to make sure it looks good and it does okay so first thing six years of cake thank you all we said for making cake a massive success over the last six years if you're interested in reading my notes on the six-year journey and do so on on the Reddit here's six years and hopefully a lot a lot more uh cake wall wrote it wasn't easy but with our help we made storing Sunday and exchanging for the safety of piece of Doug(00:35:51 - 00:36:15): cake um cake what is really amazing app and um one of the best features is the gift cards and it's really really cool that they added the prepaid uh visa cards so you can get that as well you can get gift cards for any store you'd like if you want specifically for Nike for our didas I think from Chipotle whatever you'd like overall it's an amazing app i've been using it for Tony(00:36:15 - 00:36:47): I think two years or something like that yeah I think I might be the the oldest standing user I I have to be one of the first you think other than than the cake team itself we did a spaces the other day with Vic awesome which is great to kind of celebrate the six years that we're talking about it um yeah one of the the stories is uh one when cake first launched because they were the first iOS Manero wallet he was actually waiting for another one to launch I think it was I Tony(00:36:47 - 00:37:20): guess it was my Manero everybody had their eye on and I thought they were gonna release the first iOS wallet and the cake actually came out of nowhere uh wasn't on the radar they hadn't posted anything saying we're working on working on things um just you know Vic in the background uh built built this with you know with his devs and then when it was ready he put it out there and everybody was like kind of blown away like what is this uh a Manero iOS wallet and I was one of the first people to reach out to Vic because in his post he had mentions that he's from New York City or Tony(00:37:20 - 00:37:53): there was there's some some some reason I knew he was from around here and so I reached out and we started DMing and I met up with them for a beer and it's so how and the rest is history um my my thinking that was like all right I got to meet up with this guy before I before I start you know trusting it and putting my money on it I'm just gonna go old school and meet up again uh but I'm not tech savvy enough to understand if it was developed while so I'm like let me go let me go shake this guy's hand see if I trust him uh and yeah I certainly do and Vic has uh has shown Tony(00:37:53 - 00:38:28): to be very trustworthy in the community and has given so much to the community in addition to cake wallet itself and all the features he's added through cake throughout the years and listening to user feedback you just give done a lot for the Manero ecosystem itself uh donate always the first to donate to things and to support people so tremendous tremendous thank you to cake and it's kind of I don't know uh slightly depressing to know that it's been six years like holy shit time flies no bronze yeah you know like like what crypto was like crypto is not new anymore guys right like Tony(00:38:28 - 00:38:35): crypto is like oh it's kind of like like the young kids are like they're they're up and cut like crypto is Doug(00:38:35 - 00:39:00): is old now I don't know it never sounds so weird to say 2024 20 20 for like we're closer to 2030 almost now it's whatever um yeah but um Vic is amazing and um also what I like about cake wallet is just the UI design like it's a beautiful design the colors uh the simplicity of it it's not that complicated it's user friendly so it really really thought about the app when he made it and he Tony(00:39:00 - 00:39:35): keeps getting better and better and and better so yeah it's kind of funny too like the branding of cake is like friendly and happy and positive which is good right and then you have like you know a lot of things in Manero it's like like uh um and our key yeah and our key side which which I totally appreciate but like cake is like more cypher punk than anyone because he's actually he's actually doing it and like getting users and getting people to use it and in portraying things in a positive light right like Manero it's just it's just money it's just cash yeah go on dark Tony(00:39:35 - 00:39:40): markets and use it for those purposes but you could just use it for yeah and it looks and it Doug(00:39:40 - 00:39:55): just looks looks welcoming as an app uh set it up to people that are not techy at all like paddle at all at all they can't even send money around and you know like monero and stuff and they found they find cake wall to not be that complicated and they liked it. Doug(00:39:55 - 00:40:02): 60 years, 600 years, six thousand um somebody said in the youtube section in Rico Dursal has a dev Tony(00:40:02 - 00:40:18): segment being skipped lately. Yeah uh we're we're gonna bring it back actually somebody coming on next week to do it. Awesome. We love the devs tech segment we will be bringing it back and we might be adding another like monthly segment on different things as well. Yeah I've been trying Doug(00:40:18 - 00:40:26): to get someone for that I'm still looking. Oh they'll be. Should we men I know we should don't mention it. Have you mentioned it before publishing? Yeah. As well mention it. Um well I know Tony(00:40:26 - 00:40:59): Alaska Ainoan has some ideas as well. This will and but yeah in just in general we're looking to do it's not weekly maybe a monthly kind of report on doings in the in the dark market right with regards Manero would be cool. Uh so so anybody that's really has their gear to the ground with that regard that watches things over there that wants to come on the show. You know you don't have you don't have to show your face um you could disguise your voice if you want if you want to sound all ominous and what not and cypher punk. Um also come and show your face right I don't Tony(00:40:59 - 00:41:25): I don't think that there's anything illegal about going on and viewing the dark market uh or the you know the dark net and uh we want to do kind of like a monthly segment on that get a report on what's going on um see how Manero is growing there in different ways it's it's being used where adoption's happening and all the all the interesting things that it's being used for there. So that's that's what we're trying to do. So if anybody is interested in being that person Doug(00:41:25 - 00:41:58): please additionally I think it'll be so so interesting if we had the guests that um no you know necessary Manero to do certain activities on dark net markets and you know obviously no you know no camera and then they can use a Batman voice modulator whatever they want to you know to disguise their um their identity but I think it would be really really really interesting just to get to know why they are using Manero why they think you know when they're useful versus other ones I'll be interested so yep okay um so this is this is interesting the Irish government wants to Doug(00:41:58 - 00:42:15): pass a law that could see your you or your loved ones jailed for possession of memes or tunes or any content that could be deemed faithful um and then she lost the road coming soon selling memes cartoonists and west coast gangs to rap songs to Ireland don't dark net markets for Bawdy(00:42:15 - 00:42:24): Manero um tonight's watch this video one hit rip sound yeah I don't hear talking I don't hear Tony(00:42:24 - 00:42:30): sound Tony yeah I don't hear her sound do you oh oh it should be able to because I said it to Bawdy(00:42:30 - 00:42:40): the shooter worked ah wow oh my god okay Jack can you build it? yeah okay I will now can you hear now? Women(00:42:40 - 00:42:47): yeah the Irish government is proposing a law known as the hate speech oh before that there are Doug(00:42:47 - 00:42:58): 38 people watching this video for YouTube and just 14 likes and Rico there's a set guys if you're watching like it like share subscribe yeah you have 48 people like and share Tony(00:42:58 - 00:43:08): uh this is pretty good man we consistently have like 50 live viewers on YouTube and then we have people watching it elsewhere yeah the only way this grows if people like and share so go ahead and do it Women(00:43:08 - 00:43:44): please do so that's right needs to be speech this law could have dire consequences for our democracy next most next more than this law will have uncertain effects on artistic and musical expression please support us it could stifle the activity of public campaigning on political and civil issues and also curtail speech relating to topics about religion ethnicity sex and gender you could even be jailed for possessing documents cartoons or memes on your devices even if you never read them or intended on sharing them mere possession could make you a criminal under the floor help stop this law Women(00:43:44 - 00:43:50): visit www.free speecharland.ie forward slash take action Doug(00:43:50 - 00:44:01): Jesus yeah can you imagine like the fun memes of for example against the government or the president in Ireland or you know anything that they need to be eightful and then you can go to jail Tony(00:44:01 - 00:44:15): actually be jailed yeah i mean that's the ultimate form of uh censorship right so really really scary stuff guys and if it happens there then you'll start to see it happen in other places um but Doug(00:44:15 - 00:44:31): yeah this is why we manarell uh fox co-ed uh and send in the youtube section how do i know i have it in the phone well i mean maybe i mean they they don't but you know for some reason maybe if they go to you on the street and say oh i mean i'll be highly likely but i don't know they could they could Tony(00:44:31 - 00:45:04): find that the point is it's it's gonna have a chilling effect right because most people what don't want to do illegal thanks uh so if they create laws like this it's just gonna have a chilling effect on society where they're gonna be uh you know apprehensive and they're gonna not be as willing to you know post things and memes that they think might get them in you know that are controversial and those are the often that they that's the type of speech that we need the boss right it's the image that is controversial those are the messages that you need to get out to the public forms Tony(00:45:04 - 00:45:15): for the public to decide whether or not these are good ideas or bad so very very dangerous very dangerous idea to just move in that direction start to censure things in those ways ready dangerous Doug(00:45:15 - 00:45:34): and actually fucks quite think about it this way what if it's going to be incentivized for people to report you i've seen someone on the bus looking up memes at this time to be hateful because blah blah and then i mean you we will not probably know not know that you've been reported and all of a sudden that you know so there's so many things plus plus what Doug said i mean it's just i can't believe Tony(00:45:34 - 00:45:55): there's actually a bill i mean that is yeah irohland what is going on over anybody that that lives there that has more details on that please jump up on the viewers on stage i'd love to get some local input on let's go out there that sounds absurd like how how could how could it have gotten to that point where these citizens have elected people that are that are willing to move their Doug(00:45:55 - 00:46:28): country that direction that's fine and anything anything can be hateful anything you may not think that it's hateful but it's yeah let's move on let's talk about uh um michael sailor and the bitcoin community so sever privacy road are we in it for freedom money or purely fiat number go up will never in a million years understand why people sin after sailor when he stands against everything that bitcoin was created to be ridiculous that he had lines all the major conferences throughout the year and say and such things like this stop talking about regulatory arbitrage Doug(00:46:28 - 00:47:04): censorship resistance privacy and tax evasions these are all bad ideas we hate that people with billions of dollars they don't want to invest in crypto networks that support anarchists say to explain um anything that advertises privacy and freedom from government theft becomes a direct enemy of the FBI interball and every law enforcement agency on the planet so then what is the point of bitcoin just to adhere to regulations and obviously you know fiat number go up it's definitely not about freedom if it's if you don't you know um focus on censorship resistance privacy and not Tony(00:47:04 - 00:47:36): bending the need to any organization in the world michael sailor has been like uh like one of the worst things for crypto he's just out there um just destroying what the meme of bitcoin is supposed to be it's he's started into not even digital gold i'd say this all time i think he's he's pushing it towards digital property which is really what it what it is um it's non fungible digital property he's even talked about it in those terms kind of like owning a piece of Manhattan and what is that Tony(00:47:36 - 00:48:07): when you when you own a piece of property everybody knows you own it right that's right it's out there it's public knowledge um the whole world the knows you own it the whole world knows when you transact it and sell it to somebody else um this is sailor's vision of bitcoin it's not about censorship resistance it's not about pure to peer untraceable digital cash it's about digital property um that's on a ledger for the whole world to see and he thinks that's i don't know that's i get that that's Tony(00:48:07 - 00:48:23): good for for for people that want to want to store their wealth in this in this digital thing um you know we talk about all the time on the show i mean at the end of the day the one even gives it its base utility why why is it even have value in the first place exactly yeah what what what what Doug(00:48:23 - 00:48:54): makes it so special the fact that it's the first i mean yeah but we had you know for example um we had the first cars the first planes and whatever and that's that's cool but we have stuff that are way better now than the first car that we invented 100 years ago or the first planes so i mean it's people make it people turn into a holy thing that it's the bitcoin blockchain and it's so special and it's the first first crypto effect which you know which is true i mean being first does help and it has a big name and everybody knows bitcoin but it's time to move on there's Doug(00:48:54 - 00:49:16): nothing special it doesn't work as money which is the most important thing so then what is the point of it it's not censorship resistance doesn't offer privacy it doesn't really work as a currency a lot of people in the bitcoin community they don't agree with the 21 million uh cap of coins plus what is gonna happen to reminders eventually when they're just going to rely on fees how is the network going to sustain itself you know yeah i mean it was that with Tony(00:49:16 - 00:49:41): sailors really saying to to right if bitcoin is going to the mood we're going to need a lot of deep pockets to climb on board people with billions of dollars don't want to invest in crypto networks that support anarchists so uh uh you know he's laying it out right there right so if if you want the number to go up this is the direction we need to move and that's that is the problem with bitcoin there does any towards number go up instead of towards being pure to pure Doug(00:49:41 - 00:49:52): digital cash yeah i keep them moving let's keep them moving with more stuff from uh suffer privacy this one um is about him being called lynch yeah yeah yeah this is this is just Tony(00:49:52 - 00:50:26): crazy so this guy t-dev is just he's a disaster he's he's kind of like like like respect for samurai wallet and what they've done creating privacy tech for bitcoin but this dude t-dev is just horrible for the space i mean here he is he's calling for the lynching of seth for privacy obviously i you know he loves being extreme right like i was saying before right like so so cake wallet is all like cheery and you know butterflies and and cake samurai wall it's really badass in fact Tony(00:50:26 - 00:50:57): it's a rug like he's like the badass dude in the world uh yeah i guarantee you everything about this guy is like such a little bitch i mean so here he is attacking seth for privacy because seth pointed out that the implementation of btc uh arrow atomic swaps that they're used a b uh made is it isn't the isn't the most recent implementation and it's the one that will effectively Tony(00:50:57 - 00:51:32): allow it to be seen that bitcoin is being swapped into minarel um right like so chain analysis companies will we'll we'll be able to see that and so seth is just just pointing this out he's not saying you know don't use it he's just just pointing pointing out a you know how how the tech actually what the implications are and uh t-dev calls for him calls for his lynching because because of this which you know it's just respect lost right i mean so if if their tech is as good as as as they claim Tony(00:51:32 - 00:52:07): they should have no problem talking about it out in the open and they shouldn't be calling for the lynching of people that are just questioning it and bringing up points about it i'm just really surprised because like their their whole thing is like being against btc maxis and they've created their own kind of group of maximalism um the t-dev back i don't even i don't even know what it is i can't really even describe it it's just whatever he says is correct uh he wants to control the narrative he doesn't want people you know uh talking talking about his technology in in an open way and Tony(00:52:07 - 00:52:38): having debates about it he flipped out on me because we had um no parra on our show the creator sobby wallet you know wasabi's competitors with with samurai um and because of that now he refuses to engage with me he won't come on well he doesn't go on podcast anyway but he's he doesn't want samurai to participate in anything we do or whatnot because we had a guest on the show from competing company that they don't like like that just that just show that just screams of Tony(00:52:38 - 00:53:13): insecurity to me right like what what are you afraid of you know you're working on a technology let's come talk about it because talk about the pros and the cons we can compare it to your competition but if you're trying to shut down anybody that's like talking about your tech in an open way or if you're trying to shut down anybody that has that that associates with people that are your competitors and now you don't want to like associate with them i mean that's like i don't know that's that's the ultimate form of cancel culture it's like like the fatigle to being a cypher punk Doug(00:53:13 - 00:53:45): like you're you're not you're just a punk wasabi was a good one um and especially like if you're against censorship then how about be be the one to allow other people to talk even even if you don't agree and as long as it's a respectful exchange then just let the other person talk for example we wanted zalk on the show multiple times just you know just because maybe we don't agree on certain stuff we can still discuss or a monoratopia anybody's welcome and there are people people z-cash people everybody as long as you communicate and we're all on the same app and we get along Doug(00:53:46 - 00:53:51): that then all there's kind of be competition always but be respectful and always um or even Tony(00:53:51 - 00:54:24): outdoors open you know sound especially people i'm so excited they they're doing the the big coin to mineral atomic swaps and they're very excited for them but like like let's talk about it and just because doing it doesn't mean we all have to say okay bow bow our heads you'd be like this is this is this is amazing this is perfect we're allowed to question it and we're a lot you know we're we're gonna do that they're gonna lose users they're gonna lose customer um because like uh rice healers say it screams scamp to me this is this is how people are gonna view it especially Tony(00:54:24 - 00:54:49): not even with the me right but i had wasabi on there all right sure i'm just a podcast guy say what you want yeah okay but when you attack set for privacy extremely intelligent diplomatic dude who's been nothing but like honest and and and straightforward in this space and very balanced in how he approaches things if you attack him for making comments on your tech you're you're Doug(00:54:49 - 00:55:04): gonna lose a ton of credibility mm-hmm and especially one set for privacy comments on something it's not just too common he's actually giving you a destructive good yeah that if you take and your product is going to be better because that's what he cares about and that's what the community wants Tony(00:55:04 - 00:55:26): well saying it's it's all about marketing uh yeah i don't understand that marketing approach i get they have like their little army of people that are in their cult but i don't see how that tent is gonna grow beyond that small army because there's only so many people that are gonna go along with that because most people are smart enough to to not want to be part of a cult that's what you Doug(00:55:26 - 00:55:33): well has a lot of success no drama easy to use you know still gives you the freedom that monarrow Tony(00:55:33 - 00:55:44): that you know all this stuff yeah i'm pretty sure of dick would never call for the lynching of anybody's that that that's on his technology yeah plus you have some level of responsibility if Doug(00:55:44 - 00:56:14): you're part of a team uh to you know be careful with the stuff that we say on the internet because people will find that but anyway uh let's move on let's talk about Stripe so Stripe is trying to blackmail someone for selling Bitcoin mining hardware so Rob sat on twitter de platforming freedom technologies now what the world needs striped as realized it is on the wrong side of history please retweet like for visit of visibility Stripe support said hey Rob thanks for waiting while we looked into this looking at your website it appears you're selling mining hardware could you confirm if this is something you'd be Doug(00:56:14 - 00:56:47): willing to remove from your website at present mining hardware is against or terms of service and so is unsupportable and then fluffy pony tweeted back if only there were some alternative form of payment you could accept for mining hardware maybe something that doesn't require centralize third-party to accept payments i knew this is crazy talk and you'll never exist but just imagine such a world win-kwing and then somebody said reply back i'm never fix that you can the platform selling CPUs 100% yeah so it's interesting Stripe and then we talked about Doug(00:56:48 - 00:57:17): PayPal censoring just because you tweet the tweet is something that might be regarded as hateful then you'll be still subtract i think 2300 dollars or something from your account per hateful comment or whatever you wrote i'm pretty sure that's how it works so if you made two that's like $4600 and i think it's still being implemented i think at some point they had it implemented and they they they took it off and then they put it back on yeah yeah but fluffy spoils like why they even Tony(00:57:17 - 00:57:24): using the system you know to you know using minera to sell their their mining equipment or or Doug(00:57:24 - 00:57:48): Bitcoin yep awesome yeah keep moving keep moving what i was talking about jp morgan jme diamond calling Bitcoin a pet rock this is yeah so let's watch this video let's see what happened forecast is this all here is is he what anymore i think he is back yet he's back you want to finish the new section and then go to back to the guest or do you want to yeah my little little Tony(00:57:48 - 00:57:53): little strut for let's get through the news we'll bring him up okay we can go faster for the other Doug(00:57:53 - 00:58:00): ones i just want to start loading let's refresh there we go that i know i know you you find sort Men 1(00:58:00 - 00:58:26): of laborious at this point uh good good word which is Bitcoin yeah um this ETF was approved uh just about a week ago now and i think a lot of people are trying to understand what it ultimately means uh jp morgan i imagine uh if you were climbing jp morgan you could call your broker and say uh get get get me some of the ctf uh what are you telling what did you tell your brokers to tell them back when they make that call yeah so this is an important thing i went this is the last time Men 2(00:58:26 - 00:58:59): i've ever told us the cmb city okay so oh my god the lock chain is real it's a technology we use it it's gonna move money it's gonna move data it's efficient we've been talking about that for 12 years to when it's very small okay so i think we've wasted too many words in that crypto currencies there are two types there's a crypto currency which might actually do something think if a crypto currency has an embedded smart contract did it and then we can use it by a small real estate and move data that may have value idea of tokenizing tokenizing things that you do something with and then there's a one which does nothing i call it the pet rock the Bitcoin or something like that and Men 2(00:58:59 - 00:59:30): so on the Bitcoin you know there's first i'm not trying to make a joke here there are use cases ml fraud anti money laundering tax avoidance sex trafficking those are real use cases and you see it being used for hundreds maybe fifty hundred billion dollars here for that that is the end use case everything else is people train among themselves so calculate yeah now okay now my last statement the last time i ever told a Bitcoin is i defend your right to do Bitcoin i think Men 2(00:59:30 - 00:59:40): now you're okay okay i don't want to tell you what to do so my personal advice was to don't get involved but i don't want to tell any one of you what to do is a free country what do you think so what do you Men 1(00:59:40 - 01:00:02): make a best what can you make out the other firms the black rocks of the world that that obviously in a lot of i think changes view of this obviously yeah and maybe he changes view because you think he genuinely believes in Bitcoin or or believed it because he thinks that there's a marketplace for it and he wants to be a part of that market but what do you think of the and there's about a dozen big financial companies fidelity number one i don't care so just please Men 2(01:00:02 - 01:00:17): stop talking about this shit and and i don't know what he would say about blockchain versus currencies do something versus Bitcoin it does nothing and maybe that's not different than me but you know this is what makes a market people have opinions this the last time i'm ever Men 1(01:00:17 - 01:00:25): sick my opinion he's not what's happened that i know i not wrong he's not wrong uh he's saying Tony(01:00:25 - 01:00:57): Bitcoin's only use case is that of a pet rock uh actually know it does have so well he's wrong the one way right so he's saying it does have some utility and that's for purposes of you know using it on the dark market or paying rancums um but it's it's not even it's not good it's not even good it's being used for those purposes but it's not good for those purposes that it's in use that less and less for those purposes because people are realizing it doesn't function well as digital cash so it doesn't even have that utility that that's where he actually is wrong so it's Tony(01:00:57 - 01:01:22): it's more akin to pet rock uh than anything else he's actually going to get more credit than than it deserves i would say at this point nathas a good point uh remzi ron and can somehow sustain itself forever and continue to be number go up as people just blindly decide to to all agree that this thing has value forever even though it has no base utility somebody wrote Doug(01:01:22 - 01:01:53): Bitcoin does do something Jamie it obsulates you now i don't think it does yeah all right let's move on let's talk about um yeah let's get into some some trump news so these are these ones are pretty promising um president trump just made a new promise and you have sure tonight and i have full confidence he will keep keep it tonight a trump said i'm also making not a promise to protect americans from government tyranny as your president i will never allow the creation of a central bank digital currency Doug(01:01:53 - 01:02:13): such a currency will give the federal government absolute control over your money this will be adventurous threats to freedom and it will stop it from coming to america we're also going to put in place strong protections to stop banks and regulators from trying to debank you for your political beliefs that will never happen while i am your president promising to see uh a little Tony(01:02:13 - 01:02:46): troubling that it took trump so long to get there he's been a little bit slow on the whole crypto thing uh and the cbdc thing right ronda santis was like the first really strong against cbdc's i think saw rfk juniors against it obviously rama swami was against it so now it looks like rama swami has has dropped out of the race he's now teaming up with trump and it looks like he's whispering in his ear and trump is actually listening to him which is that's encouraging right so if trump is going to be our next president uh it's nice to know that it looks like we'll have rama Tony(01:02:46 - 01:03:22): swami there by his side whether he's the vp or something else in his cabinet um he will be informing him on crypto on cbdc's and who knows maybe maybe even something like minero and digital cash right so i've been trying to get rama swami's attention i would love to hear his full take on digital digital the digital cash use case for crypto i've heard him say things that seem to very much align with being supportive of it and believing that you know we need we need a cash replacement for the Tony(01:03:22 - 01:03:57): internet uh so maybe this is our pathway towards that rama swami whispering in the year of of trump but trump doesn't doesn't doesn't arrive at these things on his own it just it just kind of proves that you know trump trump is there to to please the people he sees he sees the liberty thing working he sees it working with how successful malay is now right and uh he sees malay trending on the internet so he's like let me do some of that let me do some of that base malay uh anarko libertarianism talk um but it's good it's good that whether he's doing it just to pander to Tony(01:03:57 - 01:04:01): the people doesn't matter the fact is he is doing and he's helping to spread the meme it's spread these Doug(01:04:01 - 01:04:31): ideas can't wait to talk about me lay actually we're gonna talk about it in a little bit um because last week we were wondering what what is he doing at wwef conference what is he going to talk about and his talk was really interesting so we're gonna get into it in a little bit um let's talk about tom emmer so representative tom emmer agreed with former president Donald trump's view of central blank digital currencies as a threat to financial privacy and essentially what this article is saying is that he would like to work with uh with trump tom emmer would like to work with trump to fight against Tony(01:04:31 - 01:05:01): the expending government surveillance state and uh for front of that always out there against cbtc's and always speaking positively about digital cash but it seems like the zcash people have gotten to him for some reason manara people aren't able to including myself i've tried to spoken to his office so i fight out a little sus like he's willing to talk to zcash related people um hasn't hasn't been willing to talk to the men the the manara people or or bring i don't think he's mentioned manara Tony(01:05:01 - 01:05:07): by name um i don't know what that's all about can you imagine if we got me lay to come to our Doug(01:05:07 - 01:05:12): conference margentino obviously that that that is the goal that is the dream that'll be amazing oh my Tony(01:05:12 - 01:05:35): god that would be so cool we're gonna like for that and how we might be attached to it but uh i'm sure i'm sure it's a busy guy we'll see uh yeah we should say you know next manara to up your conference will be in Buenos Aires will be in Argentina and we now know that it's going to be in December it's going to be the first weekend in December alongside la decaf Doug(01:05:36 - 01:05:45): okay god if can't imagine if if nearly actually came to the conference we wouldn't need we put a thousand cents of house of people hopefully calling yeah i'm gonna do it away where it's going to be Tony(01:05:45 - 01:06:07): obviously open for for locals to attend basically if for like a nominal price or very cheap or the sections will to be able to it's going to be built in a way we did like we did the last manner so it'd be in Mexico city uh with the marketplace open to the public so that's going to allow anybody to kind of like integrate into the conference and come and learn about the narrow Doug(01:06:07 - 01:06:43): we shall run the space next to the governmental building for what classes by hey what is what what's that now why there are so many people there it was like me let it come talk of course that'll be also let's talk about um a tweet from jim jim jordan we know we know we know the federal government flag turns like um mega and trump to financial institutions if america's completed transactions using those terms what was also flagged if you bought a religious text like a bible or shopped at best row shop that's what's interesting yeah scary stuff guys like here we here here we are Tony(01:06:43 - 01:07:06): talking about irland and how how they're ready to make certain memes illegal uh we got the same thing going on in this country a different form of it um once again this is why we've been air out so we can preserve our our liberty and our free speech in the digital age because we can't rely on ungovernments to preserve it for us and if that wasn't scary enough i was going to pretty Doug(01:07:06 - 01:07:25): scary and concerning stuff so the wf just confirmed a global cbdc they made the world track what you eat your travels who you speak to and everything else you do in life but of course they're doing this to save us from climates and merges so let's watch this uh this video we're developing through Video(01:07:25 - 01:07:44): technology and ability for consumers to measure their own carbon footprint what does that mean that's where are they traveling how are they traveling what are they eating what are they consuming on the platform so individual carbon footprint tracker hmm they too we don't have it operational yet Tony(01:07:44 - 01:07:48): but this is something that we're working uh oh wait for like belay to just come like crashing through Doug(01:07:48 - 01:08:19): the the background like yeah it's it's so here i don't even know what work to use to be able to to utter those words but just like and just just so confidently and so without worry like yeah we're gonna track what you eat your travels he speak to everything else you do live and all the stuff they are to protect you i bet this is guy even have kids or family that's what i wonder you know this your dollar your your your son is going to live for that i don't think he's going to have Doug(01:08:19 - 01:08:24): an option to opt out or maybe he wouldn't maybe it was something i mean these people are so Tony(01:08:24 - 01:08:30): shortsighted and so selfish to want to push the world in this direction i think i know what the Doug(01:08:30 - 01:08:42): fix is so what we need to do we're gonna go to wf we need to put some uh iowalskine their um beverages make them drink it has some spiritual awakening and i think we're gonna be better Tony(01:08:42 - 01:08:55): on rinse and iowash has on demons though i don't know i don't know i don't know what is the gonna turn worse this is just coming from your inner ability just to control people yeah i keep Doug(01:08:55 - 01:09:29): moving i want to watch me lay in a little bit um let me just mention a couple stuff about the digital euro and then we're gonna switch to to me later that we have um three more stuff that are faster um the EU is about to outlaw and restrict some of the most prized features in crypto so the EU is taking aim at pricey points and self-custody wallets under new anti-money laundry regime is not about anti-money laundry it's about you not owning anything at all with your money or your house or anything they don't want to own anything this is the whole point Doug(01:09:29 - 01:09:44): restrict yourself to the wallets payments increasing the tracking of crypto transfers betting privacy coins it's this is what basically it's all articles about um yeah so that's what they're working on and that's what it's coming and um that i mean it's just kind of Tony(01:09:44 - 01:10:11): distractive for a moment that's uh that's big news right so they're they're we've talked been talking about on the show for a long time uh they're looking to clamp down on on privacy coins on privacy tech and i i'm just and just the ability to use crypto the way it's meant to be used pure to peer where you you know host your host your own wallet um so we we know it's been coming down the pipe it looks like they're inching closer towards that and they don't care Doug(01:10:11 - 01:10:38): about terrorism they don't care about war they're funding those stuff anyway the hope yeah it's it's such um such a shitshow um they just don't want to own anything and they said these are free critical changes european european union lawmakers are expected to make this week as they complete a three-year process of updating the blocks rules on money laundering and terrorist organization funding AMD financial sector and you can see how much money you know how to maybe this week get somebody on Tony(01:10:38 - 01:10:51): on from uh you know from the european scene that's part of part of the uh the legislature over there that come on and talk about it because i mean that's just tremendous news if if that actually happens Doug(01:10:51 - 01:11:09): it's tremendous news and then let's talk about um this so the prohibition of cash payments over 10,000 euro and prohibition of anonymous cash payments over 3,000 euro so this is definitely a war on cash that is happening in and europe and everywhere in in the world right now wait scroll Tony(01:11:09 - 01:11:15): up who's who's tweeting that that was uh patrick uh brainer yes this is a guy who's incredible yeah Bawdy(01:11:15 - 01:11:23): this is the show awesome that'll be awesome yeah yeah we can get this guy part party thanks right yeah Tony(01:11:23 - 01:11:35): yeah bell chin yeah probably interesting uh fortunately he very much the minority over there in in in in the part of it but uh at least he's trying and guys if you all to get anybody's attention Doug(01:11:35 - 01:11:41): just message them and let them know that you know maybe we should interview them or get get us Tony(01:11:42 - 01:11:58): you're absolutely yeah yeah your your people are always welcome to be on the show on this show as well as a special guest if you ever want to come on talk about some project you're working on that's digital cash uh freedom tech related chat bannerotopia protonmail.com always let us know if you want Doug(01:11:58 - 01:12:17): to call on the show or show now so talk to someone let us know yeah we go over 50 viewers now guys liking share 44 on YouTube and selling likes go at more to do awesome self padrador hey man hey nice okay now let's go to me lay let's go to me lay speech well this one is 22 minutes and I'm not Tony(01:12:17 - 01:12:49): going to I'm gonna play a section out of it actually um yeah 20 minutes long I recommend everybody if you have and I give this a listen share with your friends and family I'm sending it to everybody in my family and let me they're not okay they're they're they're definitely don't uh lean as far a narco capitalist as I do uh but he mille does a great job here at summarizing the problems with socialism so it's it's just a great great thing to to share with friends and fam to get the Doug(01:12:49 - 01:13:17): information out there so many said I'm gonna play a clip um but somebody said I'm from Argentina and I'm sorry to see this guy is our president I'm embarrassed but he will be gone soon this is a box and 22 comments this is a box well no that's interesting okay do you have 22 comments brainwash people out there man after arjitina too we're very proud of our president when he was elected with 56% of folks we all support him oh yeah I don't know he has gotten I think Tony(01:13:17 - 01:13:31): significantly more views than uh when Trump went and spoke at the w yes at Trump's videos been on for years now while he's already far surpassed it that's incredible um people like what he's saying Doug(01:13:31 - 01:13:36): uh let's let's watch 47 seconds yeah I think this is a good one because I think it's a used Tony(01:13:36 - 01:13:42): AI to to translate so we could hear him speaking yeah in english any zone voice still Doug(01:13:42 - 01:13:57): to your knowledge is amazing uh uh uh um yeah yeah where he said he said but yeah somebody said that actually um he didn't speak in english and this doesn't matter translation I heard oh no yeah all right but I guess like maybe still a couple of wars Milei(01:13:57 - 01:14:34): yeah they're for a bit just be gay yeah neo-Marxists have managed to go up the common sense of the western world they achieved this through the appropriation of the media culture universities and yes even international organization the final case is very serious as it involves institutions with huge influence on the political and economic decisions of the countries in these multilateral organization fortunately more of us dare to raise our voices as we see that if we don't confront these ideas head on the only possible destiny is more state more regulation Milei(01:14:34 - 01:14:41): more socialism more poverty less freedom and consequently a worse quality of life he's just Doug(01:14:41 - 01:14:57): sounds too good to be true and can you imagine being on stage at wf most of the people that go they probably don't care about the human population they actually want to enslave it then this guy hops on stage and says all the stuff they probably want to assassinate him as soon as he steps up Tony(01:14:57 - 01:15:23): off the stage um yeah people are saying like why did they even let him speak exactly yes obviously you still have a lot of people out there saying that he's like controlled opposition otherwise why would they let it do this I mean my take is all right if it's controlled opposition then but they're really taking a great risk here and then so be it because the end result is he spreading these ideas further than they've ever been spread um it's so we got we got to applaud that Doug(01:15:23 - 01:15:34): it's making progress the networker said on youtube his lips mesh he's a i generated words scary accuracy yeah it's really and it's using his own voice as well yeah it's that's terrifying because Tony(01:15:35 - 01:15:45): you just think of what they can do right uh you're gonna see you're gonna see videos very too convincing videos of of world leaders celebrities whatever saying things that they're not actually Doug(01:15:45 - 01:16:20): saying it's gonna be it's gonna be scary guess they can make one of you I love there I love the cash this one there are the wind that's that's a fake right away you'll know um yeah but you should definitely watch the whole speech uh if you have a chance it's a really good speech by me like um let's talk about this over quick and then one more thing and then we'll go through a guest since he's been uh patiently waiting multiple US Senate bills object to CBC's definition of money basically bills of gas referring to a CBC as money have been filed in the in the states of Doug(01:16:20 - 01:16:51): Utah, South Carolina, South Dakota and Tennessee these these uh the bills would exclude ascibally see it from the definition of money and could create a significant robust ascibally see into united states so that is good news and then the last thing so we talked about Germany and uh truckers and farmers protesting this actually happened in Romania um I actually didn't see the news but I've seen it on Instagram of my friends and they were probably uh posting on the stories and um I just kept seeing a lot of trucks and and farmers and then I was like it's Doug(01:16:51 - 01:17:25): not happening in my own country as well and then I started looking into it and and it is so Romanian truckers and farmers are uh protesting against the government and same stuff um that they're not doing they want lower taxes higher subsidies and they just won't demand that they were not giving them and the Romanian government is um not helping farmers um of course they trying to get rid of them as well and I'm happy that the protests are going on in my own country as well and people are stepping up so people are rising up people are rising up um yeah so that was the intersection uh kuno fundraisers for them yeah that that would be cool you see if I can actually Doug(01:17:25 - 01:17:37): play this uh a bit off this video let's see what they show local credit unions in commune okay um yeah but a lot of trucks basically um yeah or that and hopefully that will start to happen right Tony(01:17:37 - 01:17:51): banero being used uh fundraisers for funding political movements around the world that are freedom oriented uh hoping maybe 2024 is is the year we we see more of that somebody said going to see a Doug(01:17:51 - 01:17:56): video of dog selling off his banero for Bitcoin coming soon if you see that that's a fake Tony(01:17:58 - 01:18:01): that's a fake all right that's the news so let's move on to guest Sunita(01:18:01 - 01:18:16): the manera topia guest segment is sponsored by take wallet store send receive an exchange of mara and Bitcoin safely on ios and great too take wallet is open source and you always control your own Tony(01:18:16 - 01:18:44): keys hey prancing you got you this time hey yeah how do I thanks for staying with us sorry about that we got all right you're going yeah it was great so what's going on man I actually don't know much about you you reached out you wanted to come on the show you had some some some thoughts to share I think related to how privacy communities can better communicate and organize in a safer Pracing389(01:18:44 - 01:19:17): more resistant way right right right you know I am really new to the uh to the crypto community uh i'd say you know less than eight months so you know over the summer last year I started looking at it and and I started you know and okay even before that you know I've been in this sort of discovery mode this sort of quest for truth I think a lot of us are going through that right now and and and so I've been going down a lot of the rabbit holes and you know some of it's not Pracing389(01:19:17 - 01:19:51): related to crypto and and that and whatnot but um one of the things that that struck me when I started with oh and I found your Monero top show was uh and and I saw some of the some of the other sites that you use to you know sort of piece the whole thing together was you're even though you're you're you're working you're you're supporting Monero which is on a blockchain you're not using the blockchain to uh to secure your own communications so you're you're using Pracing389(01:19:51 - 01:19:59): platforms like YouTube and you know the you know and I've heard a last good on uh that is how Tony(01:19:59 - 01:20:29): you discovered us right I mean I agree with you we'll we'll get more into it and uh I think there's things that can be done but also what we try to do here is be the public facing side right the tip of the iceberg right Monero most of the arrow is is under is underwater uh but we're we're the tip the public facing tips so that people can discover us we have the public telegram chat is it is it encrypted chat no it's it's a public forum so we're not there we don't Tony(01:20:29 - 01:20:59): care if uh it's not private or whatnot right and then YouTube right act is a lot of the the world is on YouTube we also then we we put our our shows out we simultaneously post them on a lot of alternative media sites in um library uh and a bunch you know a bunch a bunch of others but uh that that's why we do that so that people can come and discover us right and so so what I was Pracing389(01:20:59 - 01:21:35): suggesting was uh you know I don't know if if you caught some of the some of the lead up to this is uh you know I I've been using a uh social a new social networking platform called Bastion now it's it you know like a lot of uh uh things that are new it doesn't have this wide audience so it's not your the proper place for the sort of outreach you're doing here however it's a good backup to your like your monarotown uh forums type thing it it may not replace Pracing389(01:21:35 - 01:22:09): all the functionality in monarotown but it's a good sort of a backup like when they hit the internet kill switch and and DNS is not working yeah uh yeah I've got some feedback yeah you can you can uh you know code your IP addresses in your host file things but you know most people are going to do that they're not going to do that with every single site they go to so uh you know to have a a place that you know that it's going to be resistant to that you know Bastion is on the blockchain Pracing389(01:22:09 - 01:22:26): it's there forever it doesn't ask for a phone number or an email address it's completely anonymous just like starting a monarot wallet you know like you're gonna get a you're gonna get a seat for you know you're gonna get a seat freeze and and that's that's your way back in and you know if you Tony(01:22:26 - 01:22:33): lose that what would you say it's on the blockchain what what is it built on top of it's built on top of a Pracing389(01:22:35 - 01:22:44): they call it a pk coin I don't know the I don't know the the details but uh b a st a I'll put it Tony(01:22:44 - 01:22:56): in the in the chat here but why why not and why not something else why not um session are you familiar with session or uh you know there's a lot different things out there no I didn't know Pracing389(01:22:56 - 01:23:02): you know this may be uh you know this may be refunded some of the things you've already super Tony(01:23:02 - 01:23:12): popular right now built on on on on Bitcoin um why why that yeah yeah I don't I don't know uh you Pracing389(01:23:12 - 01:23:35): know I'm too new to the community to to have all that background that you may have I don't know all the other uh secure you know the the all the other blockchain uh methods that you already know so I'm just enthusiastic to be here and to and to try to help the community and and in any way Tony(01:23:35 - 01:23:42): that I can so uh yeah no good good thoughts so how did you how did you even find your way to Pracing389(01:23:42 - 01:24:17): Manero then what was uh what was kind of your path there well uh you just recently came on uh one of Mike Adams decentralized TV shows okay man I've been listening to Jeff Burwick for all you know almost a year now and and so I mean these are the two guys that really have you know talked up Manero and and I bought my first Manero in September of last year okay and and and I made several more uh you know uh several more purchases um you know I can't find my Pracing389(01:24:18 - 01:24:41): I seem to have lost my seed phrase so that that that may be a problem but other than that um you know Manero seems uh quite interesting uh you know and and I and I support the idea of Manero the the digital cash fungible private and and and adjust its contribution to liberty for all human beings Tony(01:24:41 - 01:24:53): on the planet fantastic to hear I mean um what do you what do you think of it like are you into other cryptos too or is it is a Manero that's really kind of no no I mean if it's not privacy crypto Pracing389(01:24:53 - 01:25:29): it's not worth uh it bothering with you know I mean a bitcoin is is uh you know with a with a visible blockchain it's uh it's I have no use for it you know I mean uh you know even the transaction fees are high so if I'm if I'm gonna come into uh to to to a coin to swap for Manero I'm coming in with something with less transaction fees right you know so I have no use for Bitcoin plus you gotta remember you know I've been watching the precious metals on markets as well and where the Pracing389(01:25:29 - 01:26:03): precious metals have been uh trading on the comments for years and those are all derivative based trades are all GLD and SLV and you know anything that's on an ETF is being finally manipulated by the you know the cabal uh you know so anything that's on an ETF is you just have to get away from it as far away from it as you can and and to and now that Bitcoin is on an ETF uh that whole chart Pracing389(01:26:03 - 01:26:33): that that he showed earlier uh uh with the Bitcoin versus XMR it's it's just it's not even uh worth looking at anymore because that it's going to be tainted by this uh influence of the cabal so you know what what we really need is uh it's as a measure of of our performance is you know how how many vendors are accepting Manero you know uh I want to spend Manero everywhere I go I don't Pracing389(01:26:33 - 01:27:06): want to I don't want to go through a credit card that uses US dollars you know uh I mean as a stands I have an open issue with cake pay because they they won't refund my money and you know so I'm not at a conclusion there so I don't want to you know trash cake pay just yet but you know what what happened I bought a visa card uh the visa card didn't work anywhere I tried to use it I tried to settle it with the you know as you know if you bought the if you buy a visa card Pracing389(01:27:06 - 01:27:38): using cake pay what cake pay does is they take your Manero and they and I guess they fund they they forward the money to a third party who then issues the card and you go through this you know process of you know plug it in your information it's uh it's it's very you know KYC or in it so I plugged in all that and then I tried to use the card to get used the card anywhere uh and and I went back to him and I tried to resolve it and cake pay says oh you've got to go to the card Pracing389(01:27:38 - 01:27:49): issue and card issue it says oh you've got to go to your you know that they're all tongue fingers back and forth so I can't get a refund so yeah I won't deal with anything related to cake pay Tony(01:27:49 - 01:28:00): until this is resolved okay okay we got to get that cleared up for you I mean usually have tucks on the show and he's he's with cake now he could uh we help you out with that yeah I mean Pracing389(01:28:00 - 01:28:33): I may have made a mistake along the way but you know regardless uh you know I can prove I sent the money to the Manero you know I'm not you know I can also prove or they can prove that I'm not using the money you know that I haven't accessed the card and not and the cards been declined you know that you know that's easily provable so you know what's the problem you just you you get out you know if if you can you know if you can find a way to take my money and not Pracing389(01:28:34 - 01:28:40): not do it I mean I mean I don't know how business stays in business uh if you know they need Tony(01:28:40 - 01:28:57): repeat business right and I think they need to have an issue of uh cake pay people buying cards that are not working so I don't know I don't know what's going on there um uh you know I would I would suggest do you have do you have twitter reaching out to them on twitter DMing them uh that Pracing389(01:28:57 - 01:29:20): might be your best way um and like I said I got somebody on Manero Town that that seek to want to help another person and I reach out to him to with a DM in in in the Manero Town forum um I haven't I really don't lose Twitter or okay well you got to hold Luma Manero Town so yeah Tony(01:29:20 - 01:29:33): yeah figure figure that out with you I mean at the end of the day that the real goal is to use Manero natively right and to to spend it um people at places that actually accepts Manero Pracing389(01:29:33 - 01:29:57): definitely absolutely and no KYC you know you you mean you know you you going through the visa is is uh is kind of defeats the purpose as well of Manero because you're back to KYC and you're back to you know tracking you know uh the the surveillance grid basically yeah the goal is to use it Tony(01:29:57 - 01:30:31): peer to peer uh we're launching XMR bizarre soon with with the hope that that becomes the place that people use it for there's also Manero market that exists right now uh there's Manerica that is a great resource for showing all the different places that currently accept Manero um so there there is quite a lot you can do right now with it but yeah I mean that the the the gift cards is that is a nice bridge temporary bridge that we can use for those that are really trying to completely live off off of Manero uh sometimes you know I have to buy a gift card to Tony(01:30:31 - 01:30:41): I don't know to purchase something on Amazon or whatever it may be just so they can uh get everything they need for their for their daily living but the end goal is that uh we won't need Pracing389(01:30:41 - 01:30:53): these gift cards in the well you know I've asked them just to you know take the visa balance uh the master card balance and just move it over to gift card which would be you know yeah I don't Tony(01:30:53 - 01:31:07): I don't know enough about the details of that to be able to tell you what to do I mean I don't I don't I don't work for cakes I don't know uh but I know they they always are very accommodating to anybody that's having issues so if you get in touch with the right people I'm sure they will Pracing389(01:31:07 - 01:31:39): solve it for you well hopefully you know one of them is looking here I don't want to you know I don't want to go on and trash them you know give them a you know the people off front usually don't have the ability to you know offer creative solutions so you know I want to give a chance for the company to you know learn of my problem and and try and resolve it I mean the people off front were not helpful so you know they they need they need they definitely need to improve in Pracing389(01:31:39 - 01:31:57): that area because the people out front are just pointing fingers at each other and you know that it's I'm just left holding the bag you know you know you know sorry you know you're out your money you know that that's the one you go with the money we'll we'll get you in touch with the Tony(01:31:57 - 01:32:11): right person uh I don't know what else to say there how much how big of a credit card thing did you buy uh a hundred bucks oh okay okay yeah I made another I it's not where that doesn't that doesn't really add up maybe you're doing you must be doing something wrong so they'll they'll Pracing389(01:32:11 - 01:32:23): teach yeah you know if if I'm doing something wrong I should still be able to get my hundred bucks you know what I mean like I shouldn't penalize me my money because I did something wrong Tony(01:32:23 - 01:32:43): being very sure I'm penalized yeah it's just uh you gotta get in touch with the right the right people right all right man let's let's bring viewers on stage you have anything else you want to bring up I thought you wanted to talk more like uh about the you know you were just gonna come up here and and uh issue a a complaint which is five but that'd be more of a viewers on stage thing Pracing389(01:32:43 - 01:33:12): I thought we were gonna have uh more so baston I tried to give you I wanted to give a demo for baston show the thing but I had a problem with street yard so I can't show you the app I I can't uh you know cheer it uh I tried to do the present I could try it and if it if it breaks on me I'll be at the end of my uh presentation anyway so let me let me try and do that you want to try that Tony(01:33:12 - 01:33:34): what do you guys no let's let's move on to viewers on stage uh Tony if you want to move on to viewers on stage and then prancing you can peer and participate in in the car well um but I want I I don't want to do something in a way where people won't be able to really uh see what's going on so I'd rather stick with that Tony would I add in uh role viewers on stage yeah let's go ahead Sunita(01:33:34 - 01:33:47): it's the viewers on stage segment it's that time where we invite you viewers up on stage to comment on anything you've heard so far today ask the guest the question or maybe talk about one of the Doug(01:33:47 - 01:33:53): news top news top come on down all right all right let's add my last time on hello how's my sound the Viewer 1(01:33:53 - 01:34:18): wind isn't cut anything is it not yourself perfect it's like okay I get I was oh it's uh yeah the weather seems a little different today I don't I don't know if you can tell but I was also worried about the water oh no I ain't noisy but honestly sounds like no you're fine it sounds like a lot of anybody who says Alaska is in gorgeous now I'm just kidding I'm not in Alaska Tony(01:34:20 - 01:34:33): so I'm sorry everybody know whether it's called the Alaska's bliss oh yeah just to keep them away I don't know do you know the stuff the app that prancing's talking about so it's one of Viewer 1(01:34:33 - 01:35:07): those situations where the more the better right and the more redundant your systems are the better but then you run into this contradiction where you know how much time can each community invest in making themselves available and present on every platform now I have actually heard of bastion and I do know that it's built on some kind of blockchain and I believe it's portable like you could actually use a lot of the code to add it to other blockchains that would be able to carry it Viewer 1(01:35:07 - 01:35:41): but that's as far as I've gotten it's definitely it's definitely worth looking into I know that you have a small crew dog of people who are pretty technically proficient that could definitely you know check the numbers check the code make sure that it looks legit of course and it's the more options outside of the of the traditional systems the easier it is to keep them honest too a lot of these main main line I mean there's there's kind of a reason why X has Viewer 1(01:35:41 - 01:36:14): come back from its from its Twitter days right because there were so many different people who had so many different problems with Twitter and this rebranding this fake is I think it actually probably is has worked really well at revitalizing and I think because of all of the alternatives there was the real threat of losing the the minds of the public right but I'll quit ranting let's see what everybody else says or start doing my preachy thing people asking for the link I just put it Tony(01:36:14 - 01:36:26): up there so neon if you want to jump up anybody else that wants to jump up slave blocks looks like we have slave blockers here again get everybody up here at the stage and if you can if you can help SPEAKER_02 (01:36:26 - 01:36:39): I've put up a bounty for a monoroo joe because we need IPv6 support in monoroo joe so I've put up a bounty for it and it's currently got 0.1 min arrows so if you can donate to it please very cool Tony(01:36:39 - 01:36:43): very cool you could you could share that and show it right now if you want I can get the link for you but Viewer 1(01:36:43 - 01:36:49): I'm not going to try to do that presentation crap okay you know where to send the send the SPEAKER_02 (01:36:49 - 01:36:55): bounty link to me on section please sure and it's on manair I posted it on the manairo town yesterday Tony(01:36:55 - 01:37:12): so it's definitely up there yeah if you posted in the chat we could we could show it Tony could put it up practicing so so are you using is is cake the the app that you're using for for all for your manairo for sending receiving or do you use other apps as well practicing you there yeah yeah I'm Pracing389(01:37:12 - 01:37:22): there so I haven't you know successfully purchased anything with manaro this was my first attempt to Tony(01:37:22 - 01:37:38): you know purchase something with manaro and you want to you have your cake wallet if you want to do a receive and and show it in the screen I'll send you a tip I can't I can't I can't make a hole with your hundred dollars but I'll happily send you a tip just to kind of give you a Bawdy(01:37:38 - 01:37:45): a better experience I want to try the cat got it okay thanks man I don't have that available right Tony(01:37:45 - 01:37:52): now I I can't know you could email me and email me your manaro dress and I'll happily send you a tip Viewer 1(01:37:52 - 01:37:57): send to witsy to them the words kind of an interesting point to be made here and I think Tony(01:37:57 - 01:38:34): uh myself I know I also think I heard yeah uh bick is chiming in so see uh like Lewis say this is not big as good he's he's just jumped on he's saying what's with the hundred dollars uh big we're not exact sure what happened I think he he tried to buy a was it a visa it was a visa card it was a master card is a master card uh he paid for the hundred dollars of manaro and he's saying it's it's not working it's not working anywhere so I don't really know you know where it's going wrong but bick where can we direct him to so he can get this resolved because in the is in the comments SPEAKER_02 (01:38:34 - 01:38:45): right now and prancing that is the that is the CEO of cake that's the that's the big man in charge so you you talked about getting to the right person if if he can't help you nobody because that Tony(01:38:45 - 01:38:53): if you read that or you said you on manaro town did you did you talk do you talk to support directly Pracing389(01:38:53 - 01:39:08): for cake I think I think I talked to him on manaro town I think he knows of this uh transaction uh let me look at my manaro town um really quick okay in the mean what we're gonna talk to other Tony(01:39:08 - 01:39:18): people here and just uh talk about kind of using whatever things of the day uh slave locker anything you want to bring up hello good there what about the mic very good a lot better than Viewer 3(01:39:18 - 01:39:36): the last time yeah i want to I wanted to rephrase my um gratitude towards co and um my admiration for the devs and yeah so less time the mic was bad so i wanted to say that couldn't agree with you Tony(01:39:36 - 01:39:42): more man co has has done tremendous things uh what what has you thinking about that right now Viewer 3(01:39:42 - 01:40:18): why why are you thinking about about co um no because uh without him i wouldn't be able to do the translation and for all the people on IRC giving always the answers to to my questions um further more yeah kate young if it wouldn't be for her the bulletproofs chapter would still be in working so yeah i just wanted to say that put it out there everything i say comes with a grain of salt i'm just the hobbyist and so thanks so much for being here letting me be here again Tony(01:40:18 - 01:40:23): yeah of course man every mind is again what what translation are you working on right now uh now Viewer 3(01:40:23 - 01:40:53): currently i'm not i was working on this um direct ip call system that i share the link now and i send an email to last can on uh i don't don't know if you received it um yeah uh so um so it's the way i talk with my mom and with my wife in bulgaria and uh my mom in portugal my wife in bulgaria so i developed it myself uh one image will speak four thousand words i share the link there uh it's Viewer 3(01:40:53 - 01:41:00): on get up so perhaps you want to put it on on full screen uh or i don't uh uh uh uh Tony(01:41:00 - 01:41:10): vick is coming up i don't know yeah you could share you could share the link in the comments maybe tonic can get it up yeah eloscate out of anything you want to bring up this week Viewer 1(01:41:10 - 01:41:44): son your mind oh man there's always something right but one of the things that i wanted to point out from like a waging war perspective because i always like to think of terms of war that's my nature right is uh you know we have a pretty good front as far as what you do uh getting the word out and all that stuff um you know you've been able to get the word out to some larger uh internet personalities like uh health ranger brought this gentleman into the fold but now this is where uh Viewer 1(01:41:44 - 01:42:19): i don't know if you remember the michael tenor review where he was saying that there's a uh a major shortfall when it comes to the usability of vanero um and when people who are outsiders coming in it's we're so used to the technology that we just fail to understand that they don't know where to go to buy things and that's why i love the monarica element right and they're they're learning how to use the app but a lot of these people you know they they barely know how to use the other apps or Viewer 1(01:42:19 - 01:42:52): whatever um and there's no like one place to go to try to wrap their heads around it can be um can be an issue and this is one of the places where uh traditionally speaking like if you're a waging war on a foreign countries government and you wanted to work on like hearts and minds sort of deal what you would do is you would have ambassadors you would have people trying to step by step show people how to use um what you're attempting to get them to use and and during the process kind of Viewer 1(01:42:52 - 01:43:23): continuing the marketing process of why it's uh why it's beneficial and i think a lot of people who find out about monero on the internet um there's not anyone standing there to kind of hold their hand as they venture off into a brand new technology um and then when it's time to for example go and buy a coffee it's like well i can't use it natively so i now i need to use the supporting structure and then if i want to use the supporting structure i have to and so it's layer upon layer Viewer 1(01:43:23 - 01:44:00): upon layer of complexity which is fine if that's how you get there however it's not fine if there's no one to make sure that as they graduate from one layer to another um and what is it a squail a bit corner uh i forget um the guy that we just had on uh the last yeah you know he takes the time to teach layer one layer two with bitcawing he takes the time to teach them like all of these steps that ambassador level um is something that is sorely missing i've got a bird throwing Viewer 1(01:44:00 - 01:44:36): shit at me up there but uh it's so those listening becoming an ambassador for teaching people how to use xmr for the first time and teaching them what each step in the process represents like who's doing each step um and then finding um you know like we were talking about with xmr bizarro important it is going to have people in the beta trying every different thing it's the same with our real world examples of training people how to use xmr we need to figure out Viewer 1(01:44:36 - 01:45:05): where the weak link is and we need to apply our efforts at every level to fixing the weak links of onboarding people for xmr right it's because we've got the tech side pretty wrapped up i think you're moving the ball down the field pretty fast as far as the marketing it um it's the onboarding and the usability for people who are not tech savvy is still very lacking um so that's my two Tony(01:45:05 - 01:45:35): cents on that practicing any any thoughts there because i mean you you literally just kind of went through this experience yourself are the things that you existed in minero that would help you with onboarding and understanding i mean other than this issue you're having it we have pick on i'm sure old time it's good but i just want to get your your kind of thoughts um as as a newbie are there are the things that you wish were a little bit different in terms of usability in minero Pracing389(01:45:35 - 01:46:11): but i i i think uh i still need to learn about some of the some of the places where minero can be used so i've i've got some learning to do and and i don't think those resources are are published um you know in a in a place that where you know they've ended up in front of me uh you know i i most of what i've learned about minero the the the really cool stuff i've learned on minero talk you know so uh you know this this podcast has been wonderful i mean uh you guys Pracing389(01:46:11 - 01:46:45): i'm gonna laugh from you guys and and uh you know i'm i'm so enthusiastic about it and you know i you know i want you to put me to work i mean this is this is a uh that you know for someone who you know is liberty focused like i am you know i you know i i can see no no more noble uh effort to you know uh to spend my time on uh i really you know uh really believe in in what the privacy Pracing389(01:46:45 - 01:47:15): coin the digital cash is trying to do now uh you know at the end of the day i mean you know you need it it's like it's like you go to Walmart you go to Walmart and you and you you buy something you don't like me you want to you want your money back then you you know no questions asked you get your money back i mean you know it's not a it's it's not a you know we're gonna make you work for it you're gonna have to do a million things and and you know and you're gonna have to Pracing389(01:47:15 - 01:47:51): talk to customer support back and forth to use up you know like you know 10 20 hours of your time by the time you're you get it resolved i mean none of that i mean you go to Walmart and you tell them i look i need a refund i made a mistake by this purchase i don't want this anymore you don't have to even give a reason okay well we want your business repeat business so here's your refund long as you could prove you paid it you got to receive and all that but long as you're bringing you know you you're not as long as you're not stealing from them then you should just you know Pracing389(01:47:51 - 01:48:04): no questions asked just don't don't give a don't make so many obstacles for people to get you know a resolution on their money and yeah right isn't Walmart right it's it's it's Tony(01:48:04 - 01:48:25): decentralized ecosystem but it's inspiring to hear that you're that you're that you're so passionate about it that this the concept has taken hold of you to the point you want to dedicate time to teaching other people about it which is exactly what i'll ask you not saying we need to do it let's let's get picked up here because i think you want to pick hey dog hey pronouncing Viewer 2(01:48:25 - 01:48:59): hey guys how you doing uh so yeah i'm just say some things about and in general with with cake pay number one has been a huge success when we were selling thousands of dollars a day of the master cards and v says not all that and by the way i recommend everyone that's listening i think the master cards ones seem to work better and more chance of adding a cure apple pain google pay um so it's it's it's been good and i like i always say when things work nobody's going online and posting a review hey this is an amazing experience you know you're more apt to go on uh and Viewer 2(01:48:59 - 01:49:30): rather than negative review or complain if something doesn't work right which is just just normal and that's fine but but français i don't know your situation exactly because obviously um i'm not i can each support ticket on a on a daily basis uh we have a full support staff for that but but i think i'd like to just say also to the whole manero community you know to get cakes of four it's not reddit the manero subreddit it's not manero town i think people don't want to see Viewer 2(01:49:30 - 01:50:01): support stuff for cake going on there all the time if you are having problems with cake pay or cake wallet or anything reach out to us directly that's the best way to get help um and you know we have people on 24 hours but you know especially with case wait for them to reach out to you directly and is is it in the app it's it is right there's a is it support yet there's an app chat right in an app chat support right in the app so you can use that so but you know regarding cake pay um Viewer 2(01:50:01 - 01:50:35): sometimes yet it takes time because if there's a problem which is rare i think a thousands of cards are selling day and maybe we have a problem once a week at the most um so you know we have to go back to our provider and say hey this user had this problem where the card is not loading or they're not getting their email and then um you know that they investigate so yeah sometimes it does take 24 hours or so to get a resolution um but again français i don't know your situation uh but definitely reach out to support at cake wallet.com or or even our telegram group the telek Viewer 2(01:50:35 - 01:50:41): wallet telegram group uh somebody will help you there so i'm sure it's something resolvable um Pracing389(01:50:42 - 01:51:17): but so great did yeah so vick i sent you an email at vick at cake wallet.com and i forwarded the uh the email from your support team that that that sort of pointed me back to free paid digital solutions which is like all i get is this finger pointing now i'm doing most this by email so i've got lots of different emails of people giving me canned answers that are what we've got before so maybe maybe we could take this offline and i can yeah definitely Pracing389(01:51:17 - 01:51:34): more detail i don't want to like i say i i want cake wallet to and cake pay to be successful uh so you know i but i also want my my my problem to be solved and uh and and i hope we can we can Viewer 2(01:51:34 - 01:51:39): link up afterwards yeah yeah let's not let's not bore everyone with that but yeah definitely Tony(01:51:39 - 01:51:56): oh hell basement look look someone yeah we're already emailing back if you want to email me and then i'll pass it on to them or you know i i think like vick said jumping in the telegram group cake telegram group is probably the best way and then you'll have a bunch of people ready to solve your problem oh Pracing389(01:51:56 - 01:52:15): but i lied i am very much green yeah vick if you could just post in the in the in the chat of you know something about you know where to contact you directly uh what's the easiest way of the yeah they're okay i'm lame for what just how did i talk yeah honestly i'm contacting Viewer 2(01:52:15 - 01:52:27): me directly is probably i mean i'd love to help you but the support staff would have more information on each case that's going on but yeah i can you can you can you can contact me directly to no problem Pracing389(01:52:27 - 01:52:39): it to the bottom well i can say i've been multiple times with the support staff they keep going to back and forth and and uh so i'm in sort of this uh you know this endless loop of their Viewer 2(01:52:39 - 01:52:46): their hand you know kind of thing i'll put it i'll put it in the in the private chat here my telegram Viewer 1(01:52:46 - 01:53:20): okay sounds so i just wanted to throw something out there about what i what i think is absolutely beautiful which is you've got this i mean the this man is truly pioneering like on ramps and off ramps for everything manero and he's even getting in the trenches and running his own marketing campaigns and everything and here you know like he said you've got your one out of a few hundred case where something goes wrong and then of all of those where the support isn't going well Viewer 1(01:53:20 - 01:53:58): and here he is because for one he's such an active participant in the community that he's listening to the manero talk in which the grievance is being aired right but then another thing is you know i'll i can appreciate in fact i've heard from tux just how much work has to be put into you know some of these bleeding edge payment processing like mechanisms and how much work goes into just trying to make them work right so but on top of that here we have a man who is passionate about Viewer 1(01:53:58 - 01:54:33): the idea of a a freedom-minded financial system and this this gentleman that has made it onto manero talk is precisely our target audience and what we need to be paying attention to here is when he transitions from the the payment processing that he's used to to what it is that we do and has become second nature to a lot of it what are we doing to make that transition as smooth as possible and i would like to point out that what vick is doing right now is exactly what i was Viewer 1(01:54:33 - 01:55:06): suggesting a little bit ago which is you know you have to be that ambassador you have to really dig into okay what was this man's use case why did it fail as his use case how do i make it better and this isn't even it sounds to me like it's actually the third party that might be at fault here and yet he's still digging as deep as he possibly can to figure out what is yeah but that doesn't just have to be with examples like you know cake pay every little thing that we do so with you know Viewer 1(01:55:06 - 01:55:40): we had talked about the flyer situation right where you you know people pass out flyers to make people aware of manero okay so if you pass out a flyer are you following up to figure out hey did my flyer work did they understand the words that were on the flyer do they know who to contact to onboard themselves do they do they have somebody to talk to about the transition and i found that to be the case uh i onboarded a guy at Costco one time uh to manero and Viewer 1(01:55:41 - 01:56:13): so he actually bought manero for cash from me allegedly according to some possibly maybe maybe not boating accident whatever uh so he he got on board and then i talked to him maybe a month later and he was confused about why wallets sink and what was it about like how come the amount of manero that he bought change things that we all understand that you know the price of manero and the price of the dollar don't always match up at the point that you bought it or what sinking Viewer 1(01:56:13 - 01:56:47): a wallet is and that was when i realized it like there are so many things that we take for granted that we already know and every single one of those things it's just like you know you don't just get on a bike and learn to ride a bike you kind of learn about what wheels do you kind of learn about what the pedals are for you learn about how to steer it like um and we do not want to become an echo chamber of manero people talking to manero people about manero people and then like just Viewer 1(01:56:47 - 01:57:17): grinding our teeth when we look at people who don't understand how to get on board like so my wife was into manero for like six months i think before she even made a wallet there's just like if something was bought or sold with manero i i did it right and she was just used to the idea and she was like hey i need to make a wallet and i need to put manero on it so i can use manero and you're not and it just dawned on me like this is my wife and she doesn't even have a manero Viewer 1(01:57:17 - 01:57:51): wallet like what am i doing people so and i guarantee you all of us are that guilty that we that we are not actively following up with people who are interested or passionate about the technology to make them able to do what it is that we promised them they would be able to do you know and this is not so much a technological shortfall on the part of the developers this is not some i mean using cake wallet is like literally easier than using the banking apps that i use with like Viewer 1(01:57:51 - 01:57:57): fiat fed note garbage i'll shut up but i think you guys get it what uh you know print prancing Tony(01:57:57 - 01:58:20): brought up a good point though right like so he's very excited about manero he wants to spread the ideas he's like i i want to do work for manero uh what what are some things we think he can do to to contribute and to help grow manero and grow grow adoption anybody anybody got ideas right trance and you might telling on it fallus where where you're from Pracing389(01:58:20 - 01:58:54): for looking at the general fence out to be yeah i'm from central florida and i i have a a prancing me too oh great that i have a chin and toward i have a bit toward uh linux and uh open source i i wouldn't consider myself a dev or a developer but i'm a user of debian linux and i don't use a Microsoft or Apple product in my home wow i use exclusively Pracing389(01:58:55 - 01:59:35): linux of one variety or other currently i my favorite distribution is debian and and i would be willing to become a test platform test participant for any any app that is developed within the community that is bound toward linux i have i also have a i have a cloud server of my own on my personal cloud server which is run on proxmox which is kbm and also a a virtual container Pracing389(01:59:35 - 01:59:57): server which i i love using the the vcs and so you could i can you know bring up a version of linux really quickly and tear bring it up tear down you know great for a lab environment and i i could use that in in a lot of my testing if there was some tests i could do for the community SPEAKER_02 (01:59:57 - 02:00:08): so for you checking it out there you might have a look at the monero community irc and matrix channels because they have a lot of discussions about different community things that might that Viewer 4(02:00:08 - 02:00:15): might be interesting to you yeah matrix is good also you can just do some shows and tell them Tony(02:00:15 - 02:00:23): so consider joining the xmr bizarre chatroom you could help once we launch with with testing things Viewer 4(02:00:23 - 02:00:46): out there i2p go ahead sorry about that yeah there is one great way to increase adoption in if it's in florida just tell the dangers of cvdc in any gun shop pawn shop any kind of local shop or in the proper community just tell them the adoption of gold bullets and privacy coin and they Tony(02:00:46 - 02:00:52): will come by themselves i2p's been pushing that narrative lot and uh i agree i think that that's Viewer 4(02:00:52 - 02:01:24): the simple means yeah i think that's actually much effective because there is already a political right now a contingent growing between nd cvdc so how do you counter and a proper cvdc implementation you need like physical cash gold if you are in the united states it's very important to have those guns and ammo trading of guns and ammo and as well as how do you replace like with floppy ponies to Viewer 4(02:01:24 - 02:01:31): save if there is a system in online which we could use for privately transaction that is monero Tony(02:01:31 - 02:01:47): oh yeah that's a good direction to go absolutely very good point yeah we are at conferences and we have that big poster uh what's his name Schwab on it and uh it's you know it says they can kill cash Viewer 4(02:01:47 - 02:02:22): but they can't kill minera right like people yeah i think yeah i think all monero conferences should be like linked with the guns then they will get like the idea that yeah there is a risk of wrench attack five dollar wrench attack but then when you have the real stuff then how do you counter then and yeah i think i will talk about the zcash thing the thing which is happening in the samurai dev incident which set of privacy as well as piro zeno as well as those other projects uh the thing Viewer 4(02:02:22 - 02:02:34): is in the zcash this one exchange only address it's not an they have implemented in the protocol version i think we should have give the correct information uh piro's case is different Tony(02:02:34 - 02:02:40): i realized that when i put it out there look uh yeah but i don't really told yeah that's it's a Viewer 4(02:02:40 - 02:03:11): it's a yeah i think yeah it just shows like uh the culture is compared to monero the culture of zcash as well as piro those are very weak but yeah in phiro's case it's actually much worse they implemented protocol live um uh exchange only addresses but zcash it's still okay like they have like neutral stance but their community member one guy has implemented other's on wallet Viewer 4(02:03:11 - 02:03:41): means that their idea is uh their roadmap is to depreciate the transparent address but uh when they remove those uh orchard as well as those halo two licenses from bosl they change the license to m it and then suddenly the the problem came so they thought that better to use the unified address keep like stent address uh zero knowledge prove it's property use of zero knowledge prove Viewer 4(02:03:41 - 02:03:55): they will just make a exchange or the address by wallet for developers themselves so yeah actually they shouldn't do that but still yeah it's not that compared to phiro's one but yeah that is Tony(02:03:55 - 02:04:01): true and it still shows that they're they're willing to cater to yeah they are weak but that's the Viewer 4(02:04:01 - 02:04:37): thing instead of using the development workload of phiro that implemented protocol level changes or even the zcash team implementing their resources to make sure that the wallet developers can do that is compared to that if you just focus on taxes and p2p options the problem would solve itself like monero the problem with automatically solve itself so i think they need to wake up to that i think they are waking up to that but yeah it will take us know the frog will boil slowly it will Tony(02:04:37 - 02:04:52): be a very tough process but yeah if the zcash community is looking to deprecate transparent addresses how the how then are they going to be allowed to uh interface with these exchanges Viewer 4(02:04:52 - 02:05:22): oh there is a lot of misinformation like there is a difference between deprecating transparent addresses as well as deprecating transparent addresses and transparent pools so they did not do not have that much of a majority like there is a small minority contingent that even want to deprecate the entire 10 transparent pool as well as transparent addresses they would only want shielded addresses and shielded pools but they just want to see the Viewer 4(02:05:22 - 02:05:58): the functioning it's like a developer thing like the zuko and the some of the developer have somehow implemented a culture like they care about consent users consent they actually want to get the data how many users they actually want to press the button like door like how many users are actually want to use the privacy function but i think it's actually compared to monero it's actually a bad strategy yeah i think it's good you want to stay in exchanges but for the culture wise the Viewer 4(02:05:58 - 02:06:31): monero's culture is much better because even if you like monero's case even if you get delisted the price there is no such effect like it's still $152,152 it's like stable it's basically a privacy stable coin but yeah and there is something other thing the hero thing is different if we check their GitHub once upon a time Trevor door made a GitHub issue comment there security they have Viewer 4(02:06:31 - 02:07:07): some issues with the implementation of bullet groups as well as passion homomorphic encryption but that's not the issue the other issue is the implementation in such a way like it was very weak implementation like if you check their GitHub it's not that's but yeah it's still better it's something new like and i think their marketing is also very bad they cannot properly describe their product well like you cannot have fully homomorphic encryption and you do not have successful Viewer 4(02:07:07 - 02:07:14): zero knowledge proof it will never work it's a pain you need to have zero knowledge proof what what is Viewer 3(02:07:14 - 02:07:21): zero that has you is it provide for private smart contracts or not yeah it provides smart contracts Viewer 4(02:07:21 - 02:07:43): but for like payment if you really want like censorship resistant underground like high quality privacy i think the full chain membership proof of monero that model as well as halo do those are the only option right now or maybe if Neptune cash this one comes up with it we bought it i just don't Viewer 3(02:07:43 - 02:07:48): know what i bought i bought in i i thought it would be the private ethereum and all that Viewer 4(02:07:48 - 02:07:58): uh never too so better than surveillance coin but it's still weaker like it's not that yeah i Viewer 1(02:07:58 - 02:08:05): just wanted to answer bh as a bh had mentioned this uh best everyone should know that there is a Viewer 4(02:08:05 - 02:08:42): pre-mind uh but because they have to develop somehow their project uh so yeah and the samurai dev thing is another different thing so what set of privacy set about the use of taproot addresses for coin joint that's actually better advice but yeah there is an issue like samurai devs they want to somehow because they made a bad pledge they don't want to touch other coins but they still somehow made sure that they're uh uh followers that they can tell their followers that they are Viewer 4(02:08:42 - 02:09:14): only touching the toxic change and exchanging it with monero but it's not a proper monero wallet but the thing actually happening is more different like they do not like like taproot addresses which actually brings little bit of privacy it's actually not that great but still it's little bit better compared to normal addresses seg with addresses but yeah whatever the suggestion like uh set of privacy as given is actually better for them but there is also a downside Viewer 4(02:09:14 - 02:09:48): like if you want to properly implement coin joints even in like whether it's samurai wallet or wasabi wallet or even cash fusion of bitcoin cash you need confidential transaction otherwise it will lot work because you have the toxic change you have the issue with the nodes getting because you do not even have dandelion plus plus it's a lot of issue so that uh yeah the most important thing is the culture is not there because if there is an active privacy culture they would have implemented Viewer 4(02:09:48 - 02:09:55): confidential transaction long ago so yeah you need to have that culture also yeah I wanted to throw Viewer 1(02:09:55 - 02:10:31): out there we had a person and be a BH on the chat was asking about donating to a squaila bit coin for monero noto even though there's not a kuno up right now both Doug and a squaila have posted wallet addresses and I believe if you send a payment from cake to cake can't you attach a message to it I've never actually tried but I think you can but there okay but basically you could uh you could either reach out to Doug directly and he could allocate you know whatever donation Viewer 1(02:10:31 - 02:10:51): toward such a thing until maybe there is a kuno but that's not a bad idea it'd be really cool to have a no-do in South America so they'd have their own node and they could use light wallets privately that's an interesting message there in fact if it comes to pass he should let me know yeah Tony(02:10:51 - 02:11:13): yeah thank you thank you for bringing it up yet BH if you want to email me minero topia protimel.com to help to help get a squaila bit coin a no-do would yeah I'd love to help you out with that obviously that'd be fantastic oh we got Alex and narco on how's it going man hello can you hear me yeah how Viewer 5(02:11:13 - 02:11:44): you doing great yeah I've been cooking on some stuff and I would like to share it with you if I can please please do stages all yours all right so I will try to share my entire screen and hopefully this works no bit it's not the right one um yeah I've been coding on my personal website quite a bit and I'm just gonna share my screen here all right um so beautiful I cannot move this Viewer 5(02:11:44 - 02:11:51): away it's hard to go like this move this over yeah so I've been working on my personal website Tony(02:11:51 - 02:11:58): we're right now I'm black right now I'm only seeing black right now oh no that's not good so I'm Viewer 5(02:11:58 - 02:12:34): sorry I switched my desktop environment from x11 to wayland and yeah for the Linux folks this may mean something can you see this can you see my screen now yeah okay perfect um yeah so I've been working on my personal website for those of you that recognize my name I've been around in the computer monero community and I got inspired through monero to learn to code so I'm really excited now that I have a website that also has a monero integration basically I do a podcast where Viewer 5(02:12:34 - 02:13:04): I discuss ideas like crypto um crypto energy or anarcho capitalism um I started my podcast in German and I read through these books like the ethics of liberty by Rothbard or an entry of the state by Rothbard or what has government done to our money and then also a book by i and rand and those were episodes in German they are now two three years old and I restarted Viewer 5(02:13:04 - 02:13:39): doing my podcast but now my focus has shifted and I'm much more into the cipher punk ethos of building the energy we want to see in the world and then just opting into it so um yeah I started doing episodes again and this is my latest episode um where I just have my first episode in English actually so that's also the thing I want to announce if you are looking for some more content in the cipher punk niche then um maybe give my podcast the checkout the website is Viewer 5(02:13:39 - 02:13:45): elixanarko.live and yeah for your best I love that you jumped out today because I was trying Tony(02:13:45 - 02:14:03): or I was going to reach out to you to come on and be special guest because I did see this announcement that you're not doing the podcast in English yeah I will definitely be a listener very nice I check it out and I think I know what you're about to announce next which I thought was super cool go ahead and tell everybody what you what you're what you're doing and how you integrated Viewer 5(02:14:03 - 02:14:38): a banero yeah yeah okay so so first I also I'm just I'm so happy about all the technology that I get to use I also have slides for each episode so these are show notes that you can watch while going through the podcast with me sometimes I also have links there and and this is so cool I'm doing all of this with like e-max this it's a markdown file where I can generate this presentation and just have it as an html file and then put it in my or my server so super cool and the cool Viewer 5(02:14:38 - 02:15:12): thing for the monero folks is how these how the funding model works so I'm locked at this sold splurl right now I don't have any new episodes but if I do they are coming out first with a funding goal so and this is how it works I release my episodes with a funding goal let's say like five euro in monero that was the the price of the last one because I didn't put much effort into it but basically some amount and then it's therefore the community with the sub-adresse people Viewer 5(02:15:12 - 02:15:42): can donate if they wish to help to unlock the episode and once the funding goal is reached you know there is a monero wallet rpc on the server just checking the the addresses and then there's some logic so if the amount is if the paid amount is above the funding goal the episode is marked as unlocked and then will just automatically be released on the website and in the rss field right now you can't see this because I don't have any locked episodes but then there's like a card here Tony(02:15:42 - 02:15:55): QR code or progress bar and yeah and they hold it or other people to do this to kind of learn from what you're doing here like other podcasters that may want to follow you here follow yeah so Viewer 5(02:15:55 - 02:16:26): this is a little bit ways into the future but I think this right here is what it's all about being able to use technology open source technology that is available on the internet and like engineering it all together for something that is useful to you and I will definitely give like walk through about my website I'm using t3 stack in the as my framework so t3 stack is using a type script next Viewer 5(02:16:26 - 02:16:57): js react js tailwind CSS it's a really cool framework to build websites fast and just the ability to have a monero integration and then sell any kind of especially digital product like a podcast episode MP3 file this is it's like it's perfect for the internet you know you get a digital product you pay with digital cash and it's just a thing of beauty and also like the episode unlocks once Viewer 5(02:16:57 - 02:17:30): and is out there like I don't believe in intellectual property I don't want to enforce copyright so I think it's just this value for value economy that's also like in the podcasting 2.0 space but basically where you know the listener gives back to the content producer and you kind of skip the need for advertisement where the yeah the listener really turns into the product and is now targeted by the advertisers instead of being the customer of the podcast I just want to interject real quick Viewer 1(02:17:30 - 02:18:05): that hey Doug this is literally exactly what I was trying to tell you to do about XMR bizarre I was thinking where they're yeah it's where you launch the source code and the the final round of beta testing you launch them simultaneously when a certain goal is reached it's in this guy has like a perfect working example of exactly that and I can't tell you how fucking happy that makes me for somebody that actually show what I was talking about and this use case for for podcasts Tony(02:18:05 - 02:18:24): it makes so much sense for all the reasons you're talking about Alex so yeah the the user is no longer the customer you get you get paid but it's not that everybody has to pay just the initial unlocking which gives them access once once the episode is kickstarted right once enough people Viewer 5(02:18:24 - 02:18:55): have chipped in yeah that isn't really cool also you think about the incentives it's also like I cannot relax on my royalties and say oh yeah three years ago I made these great podcasts at a certain I'm still earning money for it no I have to like constantly keep producing stuff and hopefully if my audience grows I will be able to like demand more and more funding goals and hopefully yeah if the community grows it's not much that much for the individual listener like if you chip in Viewer 5(02:18:55 - 02:19:30): a dollar here and there that's totally fine and it's exactly what I'm hoping for and the content is out there so you're able to reach the maximum amount of people as well it's not like you have a payment wall and like a barrier to entry for newcomers so I really think this is like and this is not my idea I got this from Stefan Mollin you like 10 years ago when he was talking about copyright and how it's really an issue of the business model with these intellectual property things Viewer 5(02:19:30 - 02:20:07): quote unquote that the musician the author the podcast that they need to find a better model to monetize themselves and like having this lazy excuse of the state enforcing copyright is really not the answer to the solution so he gave this example of JK Rowling like writing the first two Harry Potter books getting an audience and then with each book being able to demand more and like still being very wealthy and living a nice life but yeah just the fun when I just add can Viewer 1(02:20:07 - 02:20:37): I add one more thing and that is this stretch goal which for podcasts maybe not so much but stretch goal what I mean by that is a perfect example art admoneratovia we plan on doing this but if we can unlock this stretch goal we will do this so for example like we want to have a vendor selling this stuff but we're going to have to buy the product in advance so this stretch goal Viewer 1(02:20:37 - 02:20:53): funds purchasing the product so we can sell it for manero at manero topia or so the so stretch goals work absolutely hand in gloves with this business model and it's particularly useful for people SPEAKER_02 (02:20:53 - 02:21:07): with way too many big ideas like Doug Alex I'm curious what I'm random books do you like because I just read recently at Les shrub and really really enjoyed it yeah I mean I'm I love all of them Viewer 5(02:21:07 - 02:21:41): I'm also listening right now to the audio book of Atlas Shrugged for the second time I read it like 10 years ago and it really deeply influenced me so here I read the the virtue or I think the lush title is the virtue of selfishness maybe and yeah I just love all of her work and I really have to say now that I listen to Atlas Shrugged again it's ominous how well she predicted the downfall like I live in Germany and the train system is really not that great and there's like just Viewer 5(02:21:41 - 02:22:16): today I went into the city of Frankfurt and the train took like 40 minutes to arrive and it was super stuffed like you were standing back to back with your neighbor and this is exactly what I read is also describing in Atlas Shrugged and this will be also a topic of a future episode I think the analogy between and I kind of spoil the book here a little bit so close your ears if you don't want to hear it the analogy between gold's gouge so the place where the prime move was the Viewer 5(02:22:16 - 02:22:51): industrialist the capitalist or fleetoo from the grasps of the looters and mooters as they are called in the book and this is it's kind of like the lunar punk ethos I think you know they hide in a valley in Colorado in the mountains they have like a like a mirage projected with refractor beams on the mountain so it looks like there is no valley there at all and this to me seems like so much like cryptography that we have this mist of cryptography that allows us to shield what's actually Viewer 5(02:22:51 - 02:22:58): going on and yeah allows us to live in privacy and be sovereign individuals and all that kind of Tony(02:22:58 - 02:23:10): stuff awesome man love what you're doing I love that you're putting your content out there in English now too so we all get to us English speakers get to enjoy it as well yes like Viewer 3(02:23:10 - 02:23:16): some echo I wanted to be on the meter but I couldn't because I should work so I can't do Viewer 5(02:23:16 - 02:23:47): this okay so that brings me perfectly to my next topic so there was a meetup in frank for Germany last november and there will be another one this February on the 28 at six o'clock again the website for more information is monero of.info and yeah we have a simple xchat group that's I think the best place for people to come when they plan on attending and we will also be able to stay Viewer 5(02:23:47 - 02:23:53): in touch and we don't have to use meetup.com which is not that great and also you have to pay for Viewer 3(02:23:53 - 02:23:59): it to host meetups and stuff why don't you do it on the weekend what's the week is that it's Viewer 5(02:23:59 - 02:24:08): again Thursday oh man and I do it and so I assume you can live far away from Frankfurt no it's Viewer 3(02:24:08 - 02:24:15): geese so it's just that I work and it's yeah I get how many people you get to show up to these Viewer 5(02:24:15 - 02:24:50): uh metero meetups so the last time we had like 20 some people I want to say so I was really surprised and some really came from far places like a three hour drive in one direction so maybe this is persuading you I don't know who was talking just now to to come um yeah but yeah some 20 something people showed up and it was really cool like I had these posters that are kind of dated unfortunately like they still say something about coffee on here but I was able to um pawn of some of my Viewer 5(02:24:50 - 02:25:11): monero conversion dies and I gave a talk that I also have a video up on this website monero oaf.info um and yeah Vic from cake wallet was kind enough to sponsor a giveaway I was onboarding like oh new people on the meetup and it was just a great experience especially since we don't have SPEAKER_02 (02:25:11 - 02:25:23): that much content like this in Germany Alex I can't see your screen because of my my low vision what is your domain name I'm very interested to look at your website what is your domain so Viewer 5(02:25:23 - 02:25:54): domain for the meetup is monero oaf.info so or monero roofe moneroofe I can also post it here in the chat if you want to and for my personal website it's elixenarcho.live with a non perfect thank you yeah so yeah that's about it and again I'm super excited about technologies where we use for example the library um monero typescript this is a yeah a typescript Viewer 5(02:25:54 - 02:26:30): library because that's not the right domain anyway um that's a typescript library that you can use to yeah control a monero wallet in typescript code do some integrations with it and I really have to say it is not that hard to code your own payment gateway like I did here um so I also proposed a talk about this on the next monero con like giving a workshop with monero typescript for web developers who are interested and this is really powerful stuff because imagine about all of the Viewer 5(02:26:30 - 02:27:04): use cases that you can implement with this and yeah amazing man thank you for jumping out today yeah and for that uh maybe it's nice okay the final word when I like I remember this so clearly I was super interested in monero and the ethos behind it and I really wanted to start learning to code but it always seemed so daunting to me like you know you see these brains um that are just super competent and highly versed and like seemingly everything but then I listened to one of the Viewer 5(02:27:04 - 02:27:37): episodes of the monero talk where there was some guy who said he also learned to code himself and a program like some exchange thingy in python and it is really doable like if you're motivated enough this is really something you can learn and don't be afraid or put off by yeah the seeming complexity will never learn all of programming but you don't have to like if you want to program with monero you don't have to learn c++ or like a highly complex language you can do it with python Viewer 5(02:27:37 - 02:28:08): with with with java script with typescript and these are much more human readable languages like sometimes I look at the code now and it reads like plain English you know and it's just a matter of practicing and it's well worth it because you become so powerful the fact it's the wielding magic especially when you're experimenting with internet money like it's so crazy you're just your own payment gateway you don't need to have permission by anybody it's which by the way you're Tony(02:28:08 - 02:28:36): reminding we were talking about it last week trying to get uh implement tipping into the chat over here um-hmm in veneratopia we got it we got to work on that I know uh shortwave surfer I think you were talking about it in the private in the um xmr bizarre chat or somewhere right uh ideas on how we can get that moving we got to get that going on on on the show so where people viewers can comment and tip with venero natively that would that would be awesome yeah funnily Viewer 5(02:28:36 - 02:29:04): enough um sorry to hog the mic but uh I've proposed the tippics mr like years ago now and we still haven't completed it this would be exactly the use case for it if you don't want to wait so much you can do it much simpler by hosting your own um monero arp uh wallet arp this is like um you just have to have a monero wallet arpc and I believe uh hundahausen uh you may recall his name Tony(02:29:05 - 02:29:11): yes to be uh next week he's gonna be doing our dev report like uh perfect so he has coded some very Viewer 5(02:29:11 - 02:29:38): simple um very light service that does exactly this with just um some uh java script a park template and then the monero wallet arpc and yeah awesome so oh get that get the show and uh thank you so much for everything you're doing I think the consistent you see you bring to the table duck is really something to be admired like being like that consistent takes a lot of effort I appreciate Tony(02:29:38 - 02:29:53): thank you so much uh and you know you're always you're always welcome to jump on anytime and once again I encourage people to check out Alex and argo definitely now that he's uh putting content out there in english do you want it you want to just uh put it out there again where people can find the Viewer 5(02:29:53 - 02:30:27): podcast yeah so use a podcasting app other than Spotify just the rss reader with audio basically uh I use on android antenna pot pro I think it's called it's also free and then my website is elixenarco.live you can find the button to subscribe to the rss feed or the rss feed is also elixenarco.live forward slash feed forward slash rss and now it's just then if you want to go to the monero often bar um meetup monero os.insole yeah people who are listening around the world to uh consider Tony(02:30:27 - 02:30:41): throwing a monero meetup where you live we could we could try to help you out a little bit here you know let us know if you're looking at the row a meetup uh we need to be doing more of these globally practicing maybe that's something you want to do you want to host the monero meetup Pracing389(02:30:41 - 02:30:48): well I don't I don't think I'm qualified but uh I know what a 10th one if we had one yeah yeah SPEAKER_02 (02:30:48 - 02:30:55): are you can host an aeromena for all the retired people it's absolutely i2p sounds like he might be Pracing389(02:30:56 - 02:31:04): the the knowledge in the background hopefully uh uh he maybe he can train me well we'd like Viewer 3(02:31:04 - 02:31:11): to show i would like to chill my project just show it yes can you do it can i click on present SPEAKER_02 (02:31:11 - 02:31:16): here and then you're saying yep yep you just do present and then what you want to share Viewer 3(02:31:16 - 02:31:22): the work uh what huh no does he have them permission there's green roads and taros screen Tony(02:31:22 - 02:31:32): yeah you could do that approach such a work i'm not sure he asked it be granted permission now here it is yep oh shit i asked out in a row you there it is there's just that's your screen Viewer 3(02:31:32 - 02:32:05): okay do you see that yep we see it so yeah so that's the uh get to the counts uh slive minus blocker and um like this is the minimalistic uh um networking routing protocol to make direct ip calls and it took about like i don't know uh and since it started like um like four years ago i wanted to definitely make uh encrypted phone calls just like that Viewer 3(02:32:05 - 02:32:40): without uh smart phones without anything and i was in burlin uh having a networking course and i called my wife over the landline and cost 40 euros uh ironically uh my cousin um in the past that was the Deutsche de Mokata Schubert public and when my mother called them like 60 years ago um not 60 like um when the DDR was um he went to a pay phone and he called her back saying don't call Viewer 3(02:32:40 - 02:33:15): me because they're listening and all that and and on that same house where he was called and had this conflict uh yeah so i um called my wife in Bulgaria and she used the soft phone this uh is zip it's been around for 30 or 40 years so it's just uh wipe in open VPN and it has twice the Dunbar number so you have 255 people uh can talk to you like you are the server for 255 people do you Viewer 3(02:33:15 - 02:33:46): see my mouse so this is the server this is one of the tunnels this is your server tunnel and then when it says this property that it has the default network name space and these are the custom network name spaces so each one has a tunnel of themselves so you are you can have 255 open VPN clients and this is the classical phone um it uses no pbx and the west sunday uh i put um the Viewer 3(02:33:46 - 02:34:19): ironic funny remark that it is 1984 um there there was a south sea bubble in nine and 1720 at sixth of January there was something about the south sea bubble and so what happens is that everyone uses the same private uh ip address and it's completely irrelevant and there are no collisions because if if you don't use always the same one then there is a range and then it won't Viewer 3(02:34:19 - 02:34:58): work but now it does and this took like um like three months to do and i only do it that weekends and so i just wanted to to show that i don't want to hug the mic and all that but uh it works it's for cly and i put the bounty out also for that my memes i know that's 0.1 for who makes a more minimal uh routing protocol in winix that allows for direct ip calls because this runs on your raspberry you have to be knowledgeable about the cly and um but it's um it works and it's great Viewer 3(02:34:58 - 02:35:15): what what we just check if it perhaps i can but no my mother turned her off and particle she's always wants to uh mutt-wast energy well very cool bad so i just so if you can just remember Tony(02:35:15 - 02:35:23): it's like what's the so people would use this instead of traditional encrypted chat means Viewer 3(02:35:23 - 02:36:00): so it's like there is no SDK there is no smartphone there is no a p i there is like uh just that you want to server running on um there is no um other softwares complete minimal there is nothing you see the packets coming in it's peer-to-peer so uh if you do not forward the ports on your router you do need the vps and that's very interesting because um we should have open out of band connections of monero nodes like we have i2p we have tour we have queernet and we have we should have more and more Viewer 3(02:36:00 - 02:36:32): and uh distribute blocks over uh websites or whatever be really resilient so this works for phones but it could also work for nodes like to you have your uh monero node though and i think that's a great name because it's no do also uh you don't need to do anything probably just plug it in right that and that's right yeah so out of bands uh monero um full node the communication is important Tony(02:36:32 - 02:36:39): very cool very nice people are out there working on these things uh yeah you're welcome to Viewer 4(02:36:39 - 02:37:14): yeah voiceover ip is very cool and yeah i think we have to check out for the network level privacy also like the door project they are doing that artich of like a rust based door client i think i2p also should do though their rust client they should focus on those i think some other one other project i think it's popping up with their rust client so yeah this actually we have to take care that the problem which happened in the surface internet the problem with mobile towers and everything Viewer 4(02:37:14 - 02:37:42): the mass which came from that i think we have to rectify that then only we will have a good amount of network level privacy so yeah voiceover ip is actually a good thing uh it's not applicable everywhere but still it's a it's still a good and yeah simplex like if you are going to a conference using monero and communicating with simplex chat or even session it's still better Tony(02:37:42 - 02:37:54): okay beach is asking Doug if you ever thought of presenting to a college computer science group about monero could be a way to spread xmr and recruit more developers uh it's a great idea SPEAKER_02 (02:37:54 - 02:38:03): it's a fantastic time if you want to put it on screen their dog i'm sharing my screen with the uh the bounty i mentioned earlier the qr code that you can donate to that if you wish Tony(02:38:03 - 02:38:07): okay you just want to explain to everybody again what this is donating for for what the what the SPEAKER_02 (02:38:07 - 02:38:43): what the causes here yeah so basically uh monoroo joe the android the android of a narrow app does not support properly support ipv6 and ipv6 is the future of the internet um as much as you might like enter hate it it is the future of the internet and it needs to be supported what happens is it will it will connect to the node it will get like the block height and everything like that but you can't load your wallet with it so like it'll try to load and then it will just fail and kick you back to the kick you back to the receive stream so anybody with anybody with either who doesn't not have ipv4 SPEAKER_02 (02:38:44 - 02:38:51): or can't use an ipv4 node won't be able to access uh nodes with monoroo joe until ipv6 Tony(02:38:51 - 02:39:02): order is enabled hey anybody that wants to donate to that there there's the qr code very cool man thanks for spreading the word on that you can you know continue to put the word out how far SPEAKER_02 (02:39:02 - 02:39:33): you off from the bounty um i've contributed 0.1 uh manero to it um it's not a it's not like a closed bounty or anything it's it's not for me it's it's gonna be for somebody just to code it so anybody who wants to donate to it and you can pick it up then go right ahead and pick it up and put a PR out on get hub and get it merged and uh then it'll be yours but it's got 0.1 manero right now um at least last time i checked and i put that up and i'll put more up to until it gets done Tony(02:39:33 - 02:39:39): oh nice any any other like important bounties that are sitting out there that haven't been uh Viewer 4(02:39:39 - 02:39:45): having claimed and he like what do you even do the nostril client the nostril client ping SPEAKER_02 (02:39:45 - 02:39:51): the monoros nostril client um it there's still a bounty up for it i saw that too Viewer 1(02:39:51 - 02:40:05): might i suggest that there should be a bounty for uh possibly like guest expenses for uh like notable guest the expenses of getting them to minero topia like great what was like what was his name that SPEAKER_02 (02:40:05 - 02:40:15): wanted like money to get him to minero topia was that uh peter taught or was that somebody else yeah peter taught yeah yeah we had we had the thing it was was it feels everin it was somebody Tony(02:40:15 - 02:40:35): like that it was never a bit as well yep we paid him as well i mean everybody you know a lot of people we reimburse you know for for travel with some uh someone or more peter taught at peter five maybe pay him in in uh uh lightning which was a funny experience one of the best anti-lightening Viewer 1(02:40:35 - 02:40:41): marketing strategies ever is to ask people to pay you in it they're really that car especially Tony(02:40:41 - 02:40:47): when the lightning uh addressed he sent me expired and he had a resendant yeah i should have Viewer 4(02:40:47 - 02:40:53): recorded it it would have been a meme i've good to read all right guys we are we are approaching three Tony(02:40:53 - 02:41:20): hour we are at our at three hours i see viewers are starting to dwindle at this point this was uh you know another another amazing show another marathon some uh amazing guests today amazing surprise guests i'm gonna close it out here unless anybody has any last things they want to put out there anything anything don't want don't twice all right we'll call it we'll call it here Tony i don't know if you want to is Tony still here to release Tony no no just just i wanted to tell Viewer 3(02:41:20 - 02:41:34): a joke like whenever there is something like epic happening in monero or somebody says something great like uh just for fun you should say the block heights so it's like recorded Viewer 1(02:41:34 - 02:41:57): the i wonder if we could get block height integrated into like the the um the screen you know when your screen is locked on a graphing phone if you like make the clock pop up somebody should write in like setting an approximate block height for monero underneath the clock all right well well Tony(02:41:57 - 02:42:28): ended well ended on that uh thank you so much everybody we do these shows every week saturday at 11 a.m. Eastern as everybody should know by now uh the shows open to all that want to participate is always to keep it digital cash liberty tech related if you ever want to be a special guest reach out to us monero topia at protonmail.com otherwise you can just jump up on the viewers on stage all right guys have a good one ciao thank you for joining us on this week's monero topia Sunita(02:42:28 - 02:43:11): episode we stream live shows every saturday at 11 a.m. Eastern you can find and subscribe to our show on youtube and odyssey or listen to the podcast on iTunes Spotify or Stitcher don't forget to follow us on twitter or join us in the monero topia telegram group see you all next week