Latest / Real STRength with Sarah Draper / The Pause That Changes Everything | #8
Transcript
- speaker-0: Sarah, I'd never experienced kindness. I didn't know what to call that. All I knew is how it made me feel. What disabled your brain from being proactive. To become aware of awareness is everything. That's the key. That's the start. speaker-1: Journaling leads to awareness and curiosity and eventually clarity. speaker-0: Your energy should be used to grow and to inspire and to motivate. And I will say that comes after. speaker-1: Welcome to the Future Walk Podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Draper. Each week on the podcast, I explore tools to help you lead your best now and into the future, and I talk with top leaders to see how they stay focused when life gets cluttered. It's time to stop reacting to your life and start leading it. Welcome to Future Walk. Welcome to the Future Walk Podcast. I'm Sarah Draper and I'm so glad you're here. Today I'm joined by Pam. Dwyer. Pam is a speaker, a best selling author as PJ Hamilton, and host of the Delay the Binge podcast. She helps people understand their patterns and choose differently, particularly around stress responses and quick fix behaviors. Recently I was a guest on Pam's show, and afterward I spent some time thinking about our conversation. And what stood out to me the most, and a big reason I thought she'd be a great guest on this show. Was that we've both come to the same conclusion from different angles. The idea that you don't have to fix everything immediately. And that the most powerful thing anyone can do is create a pause between the stimulus and their response to it. I teach leaders to step outside and take a future walk to physically create that pause. And Pam teaches people how to use that. pause to break automatic patterns and choose intentionally. I wanted to bring around today to dig deeper into this. So Pam, welcome to the show. speaker-0: Hello, thank you for having me. I'm so excited. speaker-1: Good to have you here. Thank you. Thank you. Well, before we dive into the mechanics of pausing, I'd love to hear a little bit about you. Have you shared some of yourself with our listeners? What you do, why you do it, and what's important to you. speaker-0: Well, I am ⁓ by trade, I am a web designer, believe it or not. But I got tired of sitting in a dark cubicle. So I started writing. Started writing and I realized I love this. Wow. And I love it so much that I wrote a book, put all my journal notes from counseling in there and just laid it out there. And it really made a difference. So now I am working on two more books. ⁓ Delay the Binge and then an an extension of my first book called Branches from the Piney Woods. And I'm working on those diligently. And I will say, Delay the Binge, it keeps evolving. And so does my book. So my publisher's like, Would you just stop changing it already? So I'm really focused on that. Yeah. And I'm a Grammy. So I have ⁓ twin 11-year-old boys. speaker-1: Ha ha ha. speaker-0: And a little six year old girl that thinks she's thirty. So I spend all my spare time spoiling them rotten. speaker-1: I love that. ⁓ my goodness. That's amazing. So so thank you. So you started as a web designer and you became an author and and through that you became this best selling author and you've got more in the works. So you are a busy person who's impacting and influencing lives out there. speaker-0: I wouldn't have it any other way. speaker-1: ⁓ I love that. I love that. And, you know, I, you know, to think about what what it's probably taken for most people to be at that level of accomplishment and service and success, however is defined, you know, whether it's through the best-selling author or your your year plus long podcast or the impact that you get to be a grandma to these wonderful kids and and all the good you do and all the good that's that's still in the works for you. That takes a lot out of you, I imagine, right? And yes. Have you have you and you know, I kind of want to start with this question as we as we begin our conversation today is have you had a time in your life, something that stands out to you where you started to feel yourself getting pulled off rail? Or you didn't even recognize it. And maybe you looked back later and you're like, How did I get here? Or have you been able to resist? You know, what that speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Like when life has tried to pull you in a different direction. Is there a story you'd be willing to tell us about that? speaker-0: Well, I am a storyteller first and then a writer. So an author. But yes, and I have spent most of my life off rail. Because and that's basically you if you read the book, you'll see that for yourself. But ⁓ I come from a very ⁓ dysfunctional, abusive childhood. And that's the the book it covers that part of my life. But when you grow up like that with that type of ⁓ trauma You carry a lot of brokenness with you into your adult life. And ⁓ also when you grow up without any any help or any encouragement, you have to figure things out on your own. You learn real quick that, you know, how to read the room, how to read people, how to survive. And I would try things, but I had no knowledge of how to do it. in life and so then I would derail. I would I would fail. Mm-hmm. And I soon learned I learned from my childhood that it's not failure, right? It's just temporary. And any pain or discomfort or dysfunction, I started using it as energy, as fuel. And using the pain as purpose. And it really made a difference in my life. ⁓ And I was impacted by just, I always say a handful of people when I was growing up. I was like one of those little urchins, you know, dirty, filthy, starving, you know, with the big eyes, you know, people don't want to look. But my sister and I, we used to go and steal hot dogs from this convenience store down the road. And I don't know if I told you this story, but anyway, so and I we would go in like once a week. It was the summer, so there were no school lunches. And so we'd still hot dogs and hot dog buns. She'd put the buns under her shirt. I'd put the weenies under mine. We'd walk out. Mm-hmm. We did this for weeks. And then one day the name of the place is Mac's Superstop. And so Mac stopped us one day. He goes, Hey you two, stop right there. We thought, ⁓ no, we're going to And we turn around and Mac is holding a bottle of mustard. speaker-1: Jail. ⁓ no. Yeah. speaker-0: And he said, You've been taking my hot dogs for weeks, girls. Wouldn't you like some mustard? And we said, Yes, sir. He goes, Look, don't steal from me. You ask, and I will be happy to help you. And so we took the mustard and the hot dogs and he gave us a bag this time. And we walked out. And as I was walking out, Sarah, I'd never experienced kindness. So I didn't know what to call that. I didn't know that why that happened. There had to be an angle. There had to be something he needed from me. Uh-huh. All I knew is how it made me feel. And I wanted to do that. I wanted to be just like Mac. And to this day I am. And it took him what, five seconds, six seconds to impact my life forever. speaker-1: Yeah. That's incredible. I mean you look at that impact of one person, one adult, one leader, one person, one friend, one person, a stranger, sort of stranger who sees someone else in need, and that that kindness which you'd never experienced before. speaker-0: Right. And we do children that grow up like that, Sarah. I I wish so much I could help people understand. I wrote a a short story once and it's called Help Hurts. Because I remember growing up, ⁓ my mom had food stamps, you know, government aid. And there was a point in my life where I was really embarrassed to go to the store with her because she was gonna pay with food stamps. Okay. One day she she asked me. speaker-1: ⁓ speaker-0: Are you embarrassed? Are you ashamed? And I said, Yes, mama, I am. And she's just had this look on her face. She goes, Well, how do you think I feel I can't feed my own children? So I always wondered why people are so happy to throw money at that. And they are not willing to give their time. And why didn't somebody sit my mom down and say, okay, you obviously have trouble with money handling, managing money. How can I help you with that? speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. Wow. speaker-0: Right. You know, and and that way our dignity is intact. Yes. And we have so much shame, you know, and that I grew up with a lot of shame and self worth issues. And so I derailed a lot, you know, just getting to that part, but I did learn a lot. And so my work now ⁓ comes from one idea that I learned, you know, firsthand from a ⁓ from mistakes. And that is how you learn is by making mistakes. And so it came from patterns. I started noticing patterns and I kept seeing this over and over. The outcome would be different or the situation would be different, but I noticed I handled the situation the same. I was reacting. Okay. Not being proactive. I wasn't taking a moment to evaluate why I was about to do this thing. speaker-1: Right. speaker-0: It could be with food, alcohol, drugs, you know, overworking, over pleasing, saying yes when I wanted to say no. Yeah. You know, all the things. But I took a moment to establish a and it takes practice. At first, you're just your lower brain wants to really just comfort you quickly and temporarily. Okay. And we listen. But if you bring speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: the thinking part of your brain, the front part of your brain, back online, you it will tell you, okay, you've you've had a hard day, you had to deal with people that have hurt you in the past. And so now you're wanting to eat this entire chocolate cake. It does not serve you, Pam. speaker-1: Yeah, because that yeah, that doesn't serve your long you, but in the moment that is really difficult for many to to kind of discern and recognize. speaker-0: Yeah, and and I don't I'm not gonna go on and on, I promise, but I just wanna get to the point of what the how I arrived at where I'm at today. And I started putting name to all kinds of little handy ways for me to figure things out and how to survive. And the plus one theory is doing your best to plus one more. Okay. And I learned that in eighth grade, running a four lap around four laps around a track. And I was very malnourished and I was beaten a lot. So I wasn't strong in eighth grade. And so they would all p in PE and or gym, I don't know what anybody else calls it, but the coaches would say, Okay, we're gonna run the time mile four times around the lap fr around the track. And if you stop running you and walk, you will have to start over. I hated it so much. They the whole class was waiting on me. And in eighth grade speaker-1: ⁓ wow. Right. That's pretty significant. speaker-0: It's very demeaning. And I just couldn't do it. So they finally the bell would ring and they'd say, Come on, Pam. I was so embarrassed. But so one when they say we were going to do it one day, I had had a particularly bad day with being hurt physically and mentally the night before. And so I was sore. But I was angry. Mm-hmm. And I didn't understand that that emotion. But when they did, I just started at a slow trot. I thought if I do slow try. So I got around once and then twice I couldn't feel my my feet and my lungs were about to burst. But I refused to stop. And then I started thinking about the unfairness of my situation. Why do those girls have such a good life? Right. And I have to, you know, just battle for life every day. Right. And I just got more and more angry. I started running. speaker-1: Ray. speaker-0: Faster and faster. And then I started crying. So and I was running on a full on sprint, third lap, fourth lap. And I I finished and I collapsed. And I thought to myself, Where on earth did that come from? That reserve like that's been inside me the whole time. And so I named it. I called it plus one. And whenever things would get bad, I would just r say, Okay, this is time for a plus one. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: You gotta find this fuel, this reserve, and push through this thing. And I raised ⁓ both my kids on the plus one theory in youth ministry. I taught every youth that ever came across my class. And powerful. Yes, it's powerful. speaker-1: ⁓ Your thing. You're reserved powerful. You know, it it's incredibly just all of that. Thank you for sharing. First of all, I I I I want this podcast to be, as you know, it's it's at the beginning part of it, and you are officially my first guest. So it's just so good. Thank you. ⁓ Thank you. I'm so grateful and it's again an honor to have you on it. So, what I want this podcast to be is a place where leaders can share the stories that sometimes in speaker-0: It's an honor. speaker-1: An an online atmosphere or even in person. We're very good at curating things. We're very good at highlight reels. But deep down, we've all had challenges of different sorts and struggles. And there's so much opportunity for growth, for a leader, for anyone to be able to recognize that. But sometimes we don't even recognize it within ourselves until or are willing to recognize it until we hear someone else. sharing their side and through seeing or hearing about someone else's strength in a circumstance. The circumstance could be very different or it could be similar, but hearing about that strength, seeing someone else's fortitude and their resilience and their growth and all these things, sometimes it gives us the space to open up and find it within ourselves. And so again, I appreciate your vulnerability and sharing that. ⁓ but it's incredibly powerful because of where it's brought you. And I can't help but reflect the struggle, right? Struggles. Struggles are rears real, struggles are are varied. They can lead to growth if a couple things happen. One is intentional reflection for learning moments and then figuring out how to apply those going forward. And I think that's a really key component of resilience that we don't focus on enough is is that in looking back, the intentional diving into something, s making sense of it, figuring out what we've learned from it and then and then moving forward. Have you s found that in your life that that's helped you? speaker-0: ⁓ my goodness, yes. Okay. a lot of times, you know, I would share my story with someone and they're like, Well, how did you end up like you are now? How did that happen? Right. Well, I mean, and I explained to them I have three brothers and three sisters. Mm-hmm. You know, and not all of us, you know, were able to break that vicious cycle of abuse. Mm-hmm. And it makes me sad, but it's a choice. It it's literally a moment. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Where you make a decision, why do I keep doing this? I know it doesn't serve me. Right. And I make a promise that I'm not going to do this behavior again or this pattern tomorrow. And then tomorrow comes and guess what? I do it again. Why? You have to ask yourself why first. Yeah. You know, to gain a little momentum and pause long enough to just it could be five seconds. speaker-1: Yeah, yeah. speaker-0: 20 seconds, 30 seconds, everyone is unique and different in their needs. And you'll figure it out. But if you just bring the your brain, your thinking part of your brain back online, yep, you can figure out what's causing you this. You know, good because I'm very passionate about telling people, like even now, tools, right? Bariatric surgery, GLP1s, all the tools that are out there, I am not. diting them. I think they're amazing. They help people save people's lives. However, they need to work on what's really going on, why they're there in the first place. Because it is just a tool and it is not going to do it all for them. They have to do the work. speaker-1: Yeah. Thank you for golly. Thank you for sharing all of that. And you brought up so many key points. I'm gonna kind of ⁓ dig into a little bit this idea of taking that pause. Another thing, this is why I wanted you on where's this this connection here. Pausing is has changed my life and learning different strategies to pause and being very intentional about it. My side goes back to learning like putting words to it. And and then making change happen in my own life because I was able to put words to it in frameworks and context goes back to when I first learned about Victor Frankel when I was in grad school and and and ⁓ the Holocaust survivor and man's search for meaning and his famous quote, you know, between stimulus and response, there is a space, and that space lies our growth and our freedom. And I'm just going off of memory, but I think I've got that fairly close. But the idea that between a stimulus and someone's response to it, there's always space, right? There's it can be very infinitesimally small or it can be very long. In fact, my personal and leadership and professional mantra is embrace the space because I've had to learn how to find that, sometimes create that space, other times find comfort in it, or at least acceptance of it if I can't find comfort in it. Then later reflect and and identify some growth as much as I can. But with your ⁓ with your work, right? This idea of embracing this space, the pause, creating that pause between someone's their their patterns of behavior and that future, kind of that future self they they're they're wanting to be, that change they're hoping to happen happens in that pause, right? So what are tools and strategies that you use when you're working with people to help them? speaker-0: Mm. speaker-1: learn how to recognize and then work in that space. speaker-0: Well, there are so many ways. And as I mentioned before, everyone is truly unique in their situation. Yep. And so when I first started trying to piece this ⁓ framework together to help people, that was my challenge. But then I just had to keep reminding myself that delay the binge is really about just simplifying it, recognizing that moment before a pattern runs automatically and creating enough space. To choose something different, not perfectly, okay, just intentionally. And when you can do that in real time, you start to change how decisions are made. And that shows up in everything communication, leadership, performance. And this is where we start getting all the unique people under one hat or one roof, so to speak. And so the tools that we would im implement would vary. A lot of the the w I'm a huge advocate for journaling. Okay, because the brain loves patterns, whether they're good or bad. And it's going to reflect back on old patterns. Even when you try to replace them with different patterns, it still wants to go back to where it was safe. And so in order to make that stick, that change, that pattern, sti the one you want to stick, you know, journaling will help you do that because it's again helping the brain learn. And dump. I call it dumping. Okay. So if you journal, a lot of people are like, I don't have time. Mm-hmm. I don't want to do it. That's dumb. A lot of people don't like journaling until I challenge them for just two weeks. Yeah. I'm like, if you want me to help you, I just want you to see what your patterns are. And the only way that you can do that is if you document when you do not pause and speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: partake in whatever behavior we're trying to fix or change, you need to write down what was happening when you what what took you there to that reaction. What was what disabled your brain from being proactive? And I I said just try it for two weeks. You just can write one sentence and send it 'cause as I promise you, if you asked me now, if I didn't journal what I was feeling two weeks ago, I would not be able to tell you. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-0: I'm not gonna remember that. And so they would do it. And there has never been one person that has said, I see the pattern, I see what's happening. So then in their unique situation, they find what is triggering them. No, they become aware. You know, if awareness is everything, that's the key. That's the start. ⁓ being aware, being curious, and curiosity creates clarity. speaker-1: Yeah. ⁓ I love that too. So awareness journaling leads to awareness, then curiosity and eventually clarity. speaker-0: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Right, exactly. And and a lot of us sleep deprivation is a huge issue too for the brain and for ⁓ our health. Right. And it ⁓ most people say it's because ⁓ they just have so much going on in their in their head. Right. And they can't they can't relax. speaker-1: If I just turn off the switch. speaker-0: But we do a brain dump. And a brain dump is where everything that's in your head, it could just be one word. I want you to write it because the action of writing it on a piece of paper and just dump everything you're thinking about. Mm-mm, mm-mm. You will feel so much better. And then you do have to pick one, maybe two priorities to focus on, but you're not letting it all go. All those things have to be done, but not tonight. Tonight you're dumping it. speaker-1: You dump it. speaker-0: Onto the paper. And so that's another tool. And again, it involves journaling. speaker-1: Yeah. Great. Giving it a place to sleep as well, a place to rest. speaker-0: And another example is there was this one woman that every day after work she was so stressed and had and was riddled with anxiety about going home with five children, making dinner, getting all the homework done. She just and she had a very stressful job. And so she's like, What I do, Pam, is I I go through the drive-thru at a burger place and get Two, three burgers, four ex you know, four fries, a shake, ⁓ I mean, gorging herself. She goes, and I eat it all before I get home. Mm-hmm. Because in her mind she was not gonna have time to eat it. And she didn't really want anyone knowing that she was doing that. And so what we do is we trick the brain. And how we do that is I challenged her to if you're gonna stop, then you need to park and go inside and order. Okay And she's like Well, that's not very convenient. I said, No, it's not. That's the purpose. And there is no way that's the she's not going to eat that much volume, that much food in front of other people. She's hiding it. Right. And so go inside. That has to be the condition that if you're gonna order fast food, you have to walk inside and order it. And she stopped going. speaker-1: Yeah. Sure. That's the But that's the pause. Yeah. That's the pause. speaker-0: She didn't realize it, but that's the pause so that she can think, Okay, this is a lot of food and it's obviously so much that I'm embarrassed about it. speaker-1: Creating that space in your habits for the brain to see a different way. But still requires that reflection and then that leads you to intentionally making a different decision. speaker-0: Yes, and and what's driving their decisions. That's what we're trying to figure out. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ I like that. ⁓ thank you. journaling. I will if we can go back real quick to just journaling. This is a question people sometimes ask me, and I I'm happy to share what I respond with, but sometimes I want to hear from you because you've seen so much success in this place. I do a different type of journaling. I do a gratitude journaling, which is trans that's part of my pause. But how I want to get into the how because I I'm often asked by people. Do I have to write it on paper? Can I just put it in my phone? You know, like can I type out? Like, what is the mechanics of that? What does that look like in in a practical life? speaker-0: There's been a lot of studies and research on that. But there I can't remember the the the term, but actually physically writing on a piece of paper is so much better for your brain pattern than speaking it or watching it because we're you go you go numb. It's just like scrolling. Okay. We just mindlessly scroll or binge on Netflix. That's a common you hear that, ⁓ I binged on Netflix this weekend. Right. You're just wanting to not address what's really going on. Mm-hmm. When you write on a piece of paper with a pen or pencil, you are having to think about what you're going to write. If you have a phone and you're gonna speak it, it's not the same. The brain responds differently to physical writing of emotions or thoughts. speaker-1: Great. Thank you. I I appreciate that because I think that is something that ⁓ people are just always curious about. And certainly if someone's gonna try a new habit or new it's not a habit yet, a new practice, maybe ultimately making it a habit, having some solid foundation to start with of the actual mechanics of it's valuable. I'm a writer. I'm sitting here writing just little notes as we're talking because I know like I probably won't even come back to any of them, but like this is how I'm learning and this is gonna help me later when I reflect on this conversation. And so yeah. speaker-0: And for Pete's sakes, it just get a cheap spiral. You know, people want to go so to the extreme. They want to make a big dramatic change. And you cannot it didn't you didn't you didn't arrive at this place that quickly. And so it takes small intentional steps. Just because if you if you don't take just small movements, you're gonna just not wanna do it. You have to just do one, just focus on one thing today. You know, and if that's going to the store to get a cheap little tablet that you can use for writing your thoughts down, then that's what you get. speaker-1: Thank you. what happens when someone messes up? I guess this is another another branch of this thing, inevitably we are going to fail with change efforts. We're gonna fail when we're doing something, we're gonna make mistakes when we're doing something we've done a bunch of times already, but change efforts are particularly rife with ⁓ challenges and struggles and ⁓ not making our goals. And I I know that's in that space of discomfort when you're outside of your comfort zone, when you're working in that space that's actually your growth zone where you're not repeating known things near, but still that's really psychologically challenging and emotionally for for many when they make a mistake on something that they're that they're working towards. So how do you either for yourself or when you're working with others, how do you help them when mistakes happen? speaker-0: Well, we first of all I explain the real meaning of fear and ⁓ fear is just hurt feelings. speaker-1: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. speaker-0: It it really is. It's just a a a a place that you have pain and your fear of failure. And I always ask people, okay, so let's say you do fail. Mm-hmm. I don't even like to use the word, but let's say you do fail and so you know, but I mean I I raise my kids to to welcome failure as a learning tool. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: I I would never forget my son who's thirty-six in third grade, his teacher called me in after his first day of school. And I thought, ⁓ no, he's in trouble already. So I went in and she goes, I just want to commend you. She goes, I asked the class how we learn. And your son raised his hand and he said, By messing up. speaker-1: ⁓ it's great. speaker-0: And so I that's the first time I realized, wow, they're listening or watching. And so but it's so important that we realize and embrace our failures, our setbacks. You know, life is hard. Life's not fair. And things are going to happen. And you just need to be proactive in how you handle those things. Because worrying is speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Being angry, being afraid, none of that changes it. And we know this. See, that's the thing I keep saying. We all know that. But we don't practice it. We don't remind ourselves of that when we're going through something that's really hard. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. How important are other people in that? Sorry if I when they cut you off there. speaker-0: I was just saying is some people need help. Some people need to be reminded. speaker-1: Yeah, absolutely. And and ⁓ you know, I as as you're sharing that, I'm I'm thinking about other people and your plus one theory could also be applied to we need other people, right? As a species, we're pro social. Can we can you add someone or a resource or a relationship there to help you? Do you engage in that when you're working with people as well or in your own life? speaker-0: Yes, of course I do. Of course. Yeah. And you know, it's all just and and I will say, you know how they sta ⁓ tell I don't know if you've ever been told this, but the shoemaker has the worst looking shoes. speaker-1: That's true. You really, I mean, I've never looked at a shoemaker's shoes, but there's you could apply that to pretty much any profession, right? Yes. Right. That was super popular. And I wouldn't even go through. We had a book club and I was in the FBI at the time. And one of the women who works in the program that that book was directly about, she's like, I didn't read it. She's like, when I go home, you know, like and I'm like, I can totally get that. I can understand that. Or speaker-0: Yeah, but speaker-1: Or a contractor who doesn't do their own kitchen. Like right. That's yes. Everyone else. Yes. Yes. Yes. speaker-0: They don't have time. Mm-hmm. And so my point with that is is just that sometimes I have to every day what I do for myself, you know, it doesn't always work for someone else. Mm-hmm. So we have to do what I call troubleshooting, trial and error. But that's the the the messing up thing. That's the, you know, maybe this doesn't work for you. But first of all, we have to be honest with one another and we have to communicate. We have to connect. And you have to be vulnerable in order to let someone else come in there and offer suggestions of things that might be hard at first. And so you have to be coachable or teachable. And if you're not, then you're not ready to make improvements. But I'll tell you what, if you if you just think this is a mental thing, a mental issue, it will speaker-1: Mm-hmm. speaker-0: affect your body, ignoring what your body's trying to tell you constantly. It's a it's a fabulous machine, our bodies and incredibly smart. Think about what all it's doing all the time, constantly. And it will tell you, you know, when things are are starting to get scary and could become physical, could become health issues. You know, stress is and anxiety is one of the biggest killers in the world. And so speaker-1: Mm-hmm. speaker-0: You know, that's that's called quiet depletion, which is my favoritist thing right now. I'm really doing a lot of research on that. ⁓ speaker-1: ⁓ interesting. So learning you might have to pause to listen to yourself and that quiet depletion. I think of that as in a way sometimes drift, drift away from what's best for you, drift away, you know, for so quiet depletion. And you're doing a lot of research in that. Yeah. ⁓ speaker-0: ⁓ yes. And it affects are you ready for this? Over seventy seven ⁓ seventy percent of women in the corporate world. You know, the the women that have careers. speaker-1: Yeah. It's a high number, but actually not surprising. speaker-0: Well, it's because we get it all done. We're doing checking all the boxes, but we're also afraid of failure in anything we're doing. It must be the best. We ⁓ it's perfectionism. And we're not gonna settle for anything less, especially when it comes to our children. Right. They will be a part of all the sports. They will be the best on the team. I have to get them special lessons on you just keep adding to your plate. speaker-1: Right. speaker-0: And you forget about yourself. Right. You know, and that's where you're you're just exhausted mentally. You don't have time to speaker-1: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, there's so we want to ask kind of one one last little framework here or kind of yeah, I guess a little framework type of question or major maybe more conceptual is I believe we have some alignment in this and our world you're talking about time and this is what makes me think of it. Our worlds are obsessed with like speed. And optimization and kind of fine-tuning things. And I believe I've long talked about this. Part of my own journey is like leadership or being there for someone else isn't about figuring out how to squeeze more out of someone else or squeeze more out of yourself. Right. It's it's it's its foundational element is figuring out how to cut through the noise, figure out what's most important. And then when necessary, building up your capacity in those areas, supporting people, resources, all those other things. But it's more about cutting the noise than just getting more out of people, if you will. ⁓ I also feel like we we rush through the things that matter most because we waste time with the things that don't matter as much. And then we end up in a little bit of panic or a little bit fray because. We've been sucked in, and I don't have to name what those things are, but been sucked into things and leaving us not enough time for what is truly most important. So I believe a pause helps to differentiate with between what is loudest and then what's truly most important. ⁓ do you have any like practices you encourage people to do or you do yourself to really do something beyond journaling ⁓ or in addition to journaling to kind of figure that that choice out what's most important for me and for my life in this season. speaker-0: Movement. Movement. Yes. Yes, because ⁓ like before, there's two things that I've really been working on myself with. Number one is listening. So I started to podcast to practice my listening skills. And then there's maintenance. ⁓ how to maintain or sustain any progress you've made. ⁓ huh. You know, instead of feeling like you have to start over. No, no, no, no, no. You stop. speaker-1: Yeah, right. speaker-0: here for whatever reason, whatever happens, it's not failure. And it's not a matter of willpower. You just stop the train here because you're going to pick up from there and move forward. Yep. You know, but energy is the other. I always give people this visual and it helps a lot. And it helps with me too. And it that is we have a tendency to focus on the negative, right? The things that are going wrong. That's what consumes us. If someone's unhappy with our work or something we've we've done, that's where we put all of our energy. And it's so excuse me, but it's ass back back ass backward. Because your energy should be used to grow and to inspire and to motivate. You know, ⁓ gain some and and I will say on on motivation, that comes after the action. speaker-1: Yes. Yeah. speaker-0: You need to get some momentum in there. And then I promise you the motivation will happen. But if you wait on the motivation to come first, you'll never do it. speaker-1: Like that momentum leads to motivation. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. And and we're not gonna use this word discipline. I I've learned to use devotion. speaker-1: That devotion. speaker-0: Yeah. Discipline sounds structured and hard. Yep. Devotion to yourself, to your body, to your mental health, all of those things are critical, but your energy source. Yeah. Just like the plus one theory, finishing stronger than you started, you have to find this energy, this resource that's in all of us. You just have to figure out how to tap into it and apply that. to the goals that you're setting or the changes or the patterns you're trying to fix or change or create, you apply all that energy to that. You know, just like the male robins let them, you know, anything that's happening that's negative or or causing you anxiety, let's just let that go. Focus over here on the good speaker-1: Mm-hmm. that go. Easier said than done. So critical. And you mentioned like the physical act of movement being valuable in this process. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. It's so critical. Before every podcast interview or before anything I'm going to do that I'm a little anxious about or nervous, I go for a long like a three mile walk. I make sure that I do that right before the interview. And it really does help me focus better because sometimes I can't find my words. I don't know if you're speak have you ever talked I'm sure you have talked in front of a large group of people. speaker-1: ⁓ nice. Yeah. Yeah. speaker-0: And sometimes my mind will just go blank. And so that I have to quickly think of something to say. You know, but ⁓ I just I'm very determined to be a better speaker, a better communicator, because all I wanna do is just help people find what their strengths are. Just wanna help them. speaker-1: Right, right, right. I love that. ⁓ thank you. Well, you, I mean, you just laid out the purpose of the future walk to just think forward, you know, in advance of something. You're talking about doing a future, what you you do a walk in advance of a podcast, like today, right? I think of that as the future walk, just thinking forward to that next thing, however, you want to be, or setting your strategy on a longer time horizon, or Connecting or reconnecting with someone who's an important part of your future, just moving while thinking forward. There's a lot that's happening in the brain and the body there. And as you pointed out before, right? They they are very connected. some say they're this one, right? And so the the connection between the brain and the body or the synchronization and the integration of that effort is really helpful for however you whenever you need to be your best for something that's up. Come in. It's a great tool. speaker-0: I'm excited about it. I wanna see everything I you've gotta I think you sent me something in an email, but I'm definitely going to do that because walking walking is very healing. speaker-1: Yes, it is. Absolutely. And it's and it's it's so cool. Like neuroscience right now is showing what cultures have known for probably millennia, the value of walking while engaging, whether you're a philosopher, you're an academic, you're in a relationship, you're just a whatever it is. So the the value of moving while thinking or moving while talking and and the the the impact of that is on creativity, on speaker-0: Really speaker-1: reducing barriers between communication on increasing psychological safety. I mean just it goes on and on and on the impact. It's really cool to see the the science and the research proving out what we as humans I think innately know. speaker-0: ⁓ I mean I mean movement is is life. I've heard that many times. speaker-1: It is. All right. Well, thank you so much for being here. If there's one thing you want people to remember as they look at what they can do to make that positive change in their life, what would it be? speaker-0: Hmm. I think I think a lot ⁓ of of leaders or or just people, let's just say people, are trying to fix behavior after it shows up. Okay. So after the reaction, after the breakdown, after whatever the behavior is. But by that point, you're already reacting, and the real shift is learning to notice it sooner. So if I could advise you of anything. is just to take a a ⁓ moment, right, before every decision. And if you can just learn to recognize it, because we're all smart people, we have brains, we think. Create space to choose instead of react. And that changes everything. speaker-1: ⁓ that's wonderful. Create this space to choose instead of React and that changes everything. Thank you. Beautiful. Okay. So where can people find more about you, learn about you and your work, find your books? What what would you like to share there? speaker-0: ⁓ my goodness. So ⁓ if you want to I really try to encourage people to read my short stories because my style of writing is very funny. If you want a good chuckle the first part of your day, and it takes literally two, maybe five minutes, depending on what kind of reader you are, to read it. But if you sign up on my email list, you'll be the first to get it in your inbox every Tuesday morning at five AM. ⁓ but it's there for you to reference. If you do not want to join the email list, you can access those stories, every one I've ever written from authorpjamilton.com. And as delay the binge, delay the binge dot com, if you go, if you just go to delay the binge dot com, it will guide you in all the areas that you could go. speaker-1: Great. Great. So delay the binge dot com and author PJ Hamilton, the short stories. speaker-0: Yes, and and it really shows your support for our message when you do sign up because that's how we communicate with you. That's how we let you know this book's coming out. We're launching it. You know, you'll be the first to know. So speaker-1: Encourage you. Thank you so much. And Pam, thank you truly, truly for being here. greatly appreciate it and greatly appreciate your time and and sharing and just this first having me on your podcast and now sharing some of this in greater depth here. I think the the more we can share these messages, it's it's a hopeful, it's a it's a hopeful and it's a really ⁓ deliberate process of being devoted to yourself. So so thank you there. You're so willing. ⁓ it's great. Thank you. And for our listeners, ⁓ if ⁓ you know anyone who could benefit from this episode or this podcast, please do share with them. ⁓ make sure you look up Pam and her really important work she's doing. And this week, remember when you feel that stress spike or you feel yourself going into reaction mode, take that pause. Take that pause, make a different choice. Step outside and go for a future walk if that helps, but really claim that. pause. And I'm Sarah Draper. And until next time, enjoy your walk.