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White Christmas · The Art of Costume Podcast

0:06
Hello and welcome to the Art of Costume podcast.
0:08
I'm Elizabeth Joy Glass. And I'm the ghost of Christmas
0:11
past Spencer Williams. You would be the ghost of
0:14
Christmas Past. Yeah, is that usually the creepy
0:16
one? Yeah.
0:17
Yeah, the one that comes off like chains and, you know, like
0:21
a ghostly figure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, the ghost of
0:24
Christmas Future is also pretty creepy, but yeah, 'cause you'd
0:29
be like, OK, let's go, Let's figure out what you did wrong.
0:33
Yeah, If I were to go to the Christmas future, I would just
0:35
be like, just so you know, like elections are going to go this
0:38
way and climate change is going to cripple the economy and
0:41
devastate our world's, you know, wildlife.
0:45
And I would just, like, talk about the future.
0:47
It's so much. We'd be like, oh, I can't, I
0:49
can't do it. You would, you would depress
0:51
them, yeah. Start showing them my my news
0:56
feed. Yeah, they just feel like what?
1:01
Happy holidays, Christmas nerds. Welcome to our holiday specific
1:07
season finale, our fifth season finale.
1:10
I'm so excited. I'm so excited.
1:13
I'm so happy we're doing a Christmas movie again.
1:17
We didn't. Yeah, we didn't for like a year
1:20
or two, cause there aren't that. I mean, there's a lot of
1:24
Christmas movies, just not a lot of Christmas movies that we want
1:28
to talk about. Yeah, I mean, we did Elf, we did
1:32
the Grinch, we did Jingle Jangle, we did a bunch of them.
1:35
So we were kind of like, I don't know, I feel like maybe the
1:38
costumers aren't into it as much.
1:39
But then we start talking about cozy classics and I so I have
1:46
this, this memory, if it's not even, it's not even like a
1:48
distant memory. It's like 2 whole years ago.
1:50
I went and visited my dad in Iowa and I was like in this warm
1:55
bedroom with like a heated blanket and I kept falling
1:58
asleep and waking up and I left. I think it was like Turner
2:01
classic on or whatever. And White Christmas came on and
2:05
I've never seen this movie before.
2:07
And it was the part, you know, one of the multiple musical
2:10
numbers. I sat up in bed and I was like,
2:12
what is this? I really want to see this wife.
2:16
I never seen this. So when we were talking about
2:19
cozy classics, I texted Elizabeth.
2:21
I was like, Hey, there's this movie that everyone talks about
2:24
and I've never seen and it it's definitely cozy classic and it's
2:27
a holiday movie. So I don't know.
2:29
I felt like it hit the nail on the head.
2:30
Sorry to My Fair Lady, we will get to you but.
2:34
Yes, yes, no, you, you texted me, 'cause I hadn't started the
2:39
slides that and you were like, hey, what if we did this?
2:45
And I'd seen it like a million years ago in high school.
2:48
And I was like, oh, that's a good Christmas movie.
2:50
That's a good Christmas movie. Might as well make it a holiday,
2:54
so. We might as well, especially
2:56
when we have such a great team of actors.
3:00
Costume designer Spencer, do you want to give us a summary for
3:04
White Christmas? I Do White Christmas Bob Wallace
3:08
and Phil Davis, 2 army buddies, become a top notch musical
3:12
comedy team. After the while on the road in
3:15
Florida, the stars become involved with two aspiring
3:18
singers, the sister act of Betty and Judy.
3:22
Despite some romantic complications between the
3:25
couples, everything ends on a happy note when Christmas Eve
3:28
brings rave reviews for the show and much needed snowfall.
3:32
And that is White Christmas. It's such a it's such a cozy
3:38
movie. And part of that is the
3:43
costumes. Let's meet our costume designer,
3:47
a classic Edith Head. You know, just a goat.
3:51
Just the goat, literally. You will know her work from her.
3:59
Some of her asking Oscar winning winning films such as The
4:04
Heiress, Samson and Daliah, All About Eve, A Place in the Sun,
4:09
Sabrina, The Sting and some of her not Oscar winning films like
4:16
To Catch a Thief, The 10 Commandments and Funny Face.
4:20
She didn't win something for a funny face, I could have sworn,
4:22
but. I don't think so.
4:24
Maybe she was. She could have been nominated.
4:26
Yeah, I believe you. That's a lot to keep track of
4:29
with this Edith Head. She got like 38 nominations in
4:34
her life or something like. Speaking of, I would like to
4:37
watch All About Eve on the podcast at some point next year.
4:41
That's good. It's such a good movie.
4:42
I watched it again recently. It's so fun.
4:46
But yeah, Edith had the costumes of this film in particular I
4:51
think are just so fun. You know, I love the holidays,
4:55
but you know, I'm more of a Halloween person.
4:58
Obviously. Yes, you are.
5:00
And I tend to sometimes get frustrated with the typical like
5:04
red and green or the Santa look to me just always feels done,
5:09
you know, done over and over again.
5:11
But the way that Edith had approaches film in the 50s, I
5:16
don't know. It felt like some very
5:19
revolutionary holiday costumes. Honestly, it was.
5:22
It felt, it feels different. And to this day, it still feels
5:25
timeless to me. It, it does feel very fresh in
5:30
white Christmas, especially because like the 50s, this is,
5:33
this is post World War 2. Like everybody's still kind of
5:38
like getting back on their feet after the war and it this time
5:43
period, the 50s and 60s, at least in America, it's very much
5:48
where like our modern looks and ideas for Christmas were
5:53
established. Like, people love a good like
5:58
1950s, like themed Christmas decoration or like, like my dad
6:05
like collects vintage Santas. So it's definitely a time period
6:13
that, at least for the States, really establish.
6:16
Like, this is what it looks like when we celebrate Christmas.
6:20
And I really think this movie, and especially that final
6:24
musical number, has a lot to do with that.
6:26
Yeah, yeah. Oh, that last musical number.
6:29
It's a good one. Well, we have a lot of costumes
6:31
to get into. Not a lot of behind the costume
6:34
facts. I should have went to the
6:36
library before. I'm very sorry, but it's the
6:39
season finale, so I want to get some hot chocolate, cuddle up in
6:42
bed, and let's just talk about some fun, glitzy, glamorous
6:46
white Christmas costumes after the break.
6:53
Hi, I'm Dan, who does all the magic behind the scenes.
6:56
I wanted to say thank you. And if you want to support the
6:58
show even farther, go to tpublic.com/user slash The Art
7:05
of Costume, where you can buy a couple variations of our logo on
7:09
T-shirts, mugs, and stickers. Also, be sure to leave a like
7:14
comment and subscribe. And if you're an audio listener,
7:17
leave us a Five Star Review and Apple Podcast.
7:20
Now back to the show. Spencer, Are you ready to jump
7:29
into White Christmas? I am especially I was not I was
7:34
not expecting to drop into World War 2 torn battlefield.
7:40
I know we start Christmas Eve 1944 and we are at a clearly a
7:52
army encampment for the US somewhere in Europe they're.
7:56
Like it's vague but it seems like hell.
7:59
Yeah, it honestly, this first scene, I was like, oh, for a big
8:07
musical of the time, they really made this first scene look
8:12
depressing, which makes sense. But also I was like, oh, OK,
8:17
like Christmas. And I'd seen it before.
8:18
I'd forgotten about this. Yeah, yeah.
8:21
And especially because this film is so heavily relies on color
8:25
too. So I thought it was very
8:26
exciting to kind of start with this very desaturated, you know,
8:31
dark, like kind of lonely environment.
8:33
So that as the color starts to come back into the film, it's
8:38
it, it gets all very exciting. One thing that I love to learn,
8:40
which I didn't know, this White Christmas, it was Paramount's
8:45
first Vista Vision film. And I really feel like you get
8:49
to see that with that first. I mean first scene, you see it
8:53
throughout the film. It's just like those big,
8:56
beautiful shots of this war-torn set.
9:00
Even though it was very grim and dark, you really get to see it
9:03
in all of its detail and no details left unturned with this
9:08
World War Two set and the entire film.
9:10
Exactly. And I love the desaturation
9:13
'cause even we have our two main characters, Bob and Phil,
9:19
they're like they're doing a Christmas number and they're
9:26
dressed up as Santa. But it it's also very
9:30
desaturated. Like all the Reds that really
9:33
pop at the end just melt in in this first scene.
9:39
Yeah, it's it's very funny. Well, funny and not funny.
9:44
I thought it was funny. Donna set that.
9:45
I'm like, obviously this is on the sound stage though, you
9:48
know? So it's just, it's so fun to go
9:51
back and see scenes like this. But you know, I'm obsessed with
9:56
Bob and Phil. They're such a great duo.
9:58
Being Crosby and Danny Kaye, they're just so fun.
10:02
And honestly, this would pick up my spirits too.
10:07
Yeah, absolutely. And I love how, like, they're
10:11
only in the situation because Phil saved Bob's life.
10:16
And it's like I you get the impression that, like, Bob was
10:19
an entertainer also before the war.
10:22
Oh yeah. Who had had some success, but
10:25
then the two of them together after the war skyrocket to fame.
10:31
I mean, they were hitting the ground running and all of their
10:34
numbers are together together. So hilarious.
10:37
They're always very dapper and put together.
10:40
It's just like a classic look that, I don't know, it's just so
10:44
much nostalgia in it. Absolutely, Especially because
10:48
after the war we kind of get this like newspaper headline
10:53
montage. All from Variety, by the way,
10:56
which I thought was funny. Of their careers with like
11:01
snippets here and there and they're becoming producers and
11:05
we get to see them at their club act in Miami and they're just
11:11
wearing like it. It looks so silly, but it's so
11:14
fun. They it's like a barbershop
11:16
quartet kind of look with like the straw hat burgundy.
11:21
They're canes. And I was just like, OK, here we
11:24
are, here we go. This is what I remember.
11:29
The canes are hilarious. Bob is played by Bing Crosby.
11:34
Of course, the Bing Crosby. And I just thought he was so
11:39
great in this role as Bob, too. I mean, really, this is a pretty
11:43
heavy hitting cast. Everyone's pretty fantastic.
11:46
Yeah. His eyes though, they look right
11:50
into your soul. I know they're so blue.
11:54
And I think Danny Kaye alongside him, I was just like, oh,
11:58
casting perfect. He's hilarious.
12:02
We also get cause Phil just wants Bob to settle down with a
12:07
wife for some reason. Yeah, he's very intent on it.
12:10
She's so intent on it 'cause he's like, you're miserable,
12:13
Obviously you need a woman 'cause that solves problems.
12:20
Back then it did. Did it?
12:24
Well. Did it, Spencer?
12:25
That's what that's what the rule book said.
12:29
Technically, yes. And.
12:32
I am obsessed with the two dancers that Phil wants them to
12:37
like take out for the night, especially with the girl.
12:42
Oh my gosh, what did she say? It's mutual.
12:44
I'm sure that's a good one and they just have such like classic
12:52
showgirl looks. Oh, yeah.
12:54
They're very beautiful. And you could tell.
12:56
I mean, you know, Edith Head and her team had a had a good time
13:00
with those two in particular. They probably were, you know, I
13:03
wonder what other films does showgirl costumes might have
13:06
been used in, but they're just so.
13:08
Oh. We should check.
13:09
Spectacular. So sparkly.
13:11
Love the purple, of course. The purple with the green and I
13:15
love she uses this look a lot of like this the body, the short
13:21
like body suit with this like peplum skirt.
13:26
Oh yeah, So like it looks almost looks like they're wearing a
13:29
gown, but like, their legs are free to do these.
13:31
Fantastic. You'd have had love that
13:34
silhouette in this film. It's actually it's we're going
13:37
to talk about again later, but it's it's my favorite.
13:41
It is there a lot what is also there a lot in this in this film
13:46
is Dior's new look also gets a bit of a showing in this.
13:51
It's being developed and shown around the same time.
13:55
So I think Edith Head was very much inspired by it and you can
14:00
see it in our introduction to the Haines sisters.
14:06
This fantastic. A lot of people are calling it
14:10
turquoise blue but I always saw it looked like a very like light
14:15
sky blue. To me it looks cerulean blue.
14:22
OK. If we want to go there.
14:25
All right, Well, there's cerulean blue dresses.
14:34
It's got that cinched in waist. It's got that that big wide hip
14:41
for the skirts with the T length.
14:43
I'm just like, Oh yes they are. They are killing it fashion
14:48
wise. Yeah, once you said that, it
14:50
kind of clicked almost immediately.
14:52
And like, this is definitely that silhouette that means that
14:56
skirt is heavy. Oh yeah.
14:58
I mean, that's holding them down.
15:01
Plus they have these huge ostrich feather fans behind
15:04
them, which that's that's a lot of feathers.
15:06
As well that are dyed ombre blue and have gems like inside of
15:12
them. Like we I we have big
15:19
spectacular films now, we really do.
15:23
But there was just something about those big studio films.
15:28
Yeah. It it's, it's like, it's like
15:30
the random almost like garish detail is just so cool.
15:36
And to me, I feel like what it is, you know, after having just
15:39
done Wizard of Oz and we watched some other like, you know,
15:43
Cleopatra, Yes, Cleopatra, another one.
15:46
Like, that's a perfect one actually.
15:48
Like, between that and these other films we watched this
15:50
season in particular, I feel like classic Hollywood studio
15:53
films. They never knew when, like,
15:55
enough was enough, you know, just more was more.
15:58
And they would always complain about like, oh, we're going way
16:00
over budget. And then you would look at the
16:03
things they would do like, well, yeah, of course, because every
16:07
single detail was thought of. And.
16:09
You know, say what you want about the old Hollywood studio
16:12
system, but I mean, they did it. It felt like they did it right
16:17
because they always are Marino classics like this because the
16:20
color, the fantasy, the detail, it was just always there and it
16:24
was always taken to a different level.
16:26
So, you know, that's why like someone like Edith Head is the
16:29
goat because I mean, I just look at it.
16:32
This was just costume after costume for a little Christmas
16:36
movie. For a little Christmas movie,
16:39
The studio system definitely had its problem, but it created some
16:43
bangers. Yeah.
16:45
And one of them is this musical number.
16:48
Sisters with Rosemary Clooney is Betty Haynes, and we have Vera
16:57
Ellen as Judy Haynes and they're just hilarious through this
17:01
whole thing. They're so funny and so
17:04
beautiful. Like just looking at their faces
17:07
striking out. That's just like Hollywood
17:09
glamour right there when you see.
17:10
Absolutely. They're yeah, they're hilarious.
17:14
Their costumes are funny to me. I really feel like they're,
17:17
they're kind of like the soul to this movie.
17:19
And they're actually not like in as many scenes as you would
17:23
think when you see like the promo of it.
17:25
They're in the musical numbers. I mean, Fiora Allen's basically
17:28
doing backflips consistently through.
17:32
Through the whole thing. And it's so funny because, you
17:37
know, Danny and Bob have come because they're the sisters of
17:43
an old Army buddy. So they're coming to see their
17:46
performance. So after the sisters number,
17:50
they sit down with them and I like you get the impression that
17:55
like, yes, they're working, they're taking care.
17:57
Like they're not doing poorly. Yeah, but they're definitely on
18:03
the road all the time. But they somehow pack these two
18:08
gorgeous just like evening gowns.
18:12
Each suitcase can only hold 1 gown.
18:14
Like I am low key obsessed with Betty's, like Violet, just like
18:26
this gorgeous tall dress just for a casual sit down in between
18:30
numbers. Like, come on.
18:32
Yeah, and I was on the other hand of that, I was really in
18:36
love with Judy's looks. She really has.
18:39
Her looks were very inspired by to me, it felt almost like
18:44
Chinese culture and her silhouettes, I don't know if you
18:46
noticed, but she always was wearing like these high collars,
18:49
stylized lines going down the center, even even in her like
18:54
kind of like classic sheer looks To me, it's still has like a
18:57
very like world like well travelled silhouette to all of
19:02
her costumes as well too. She's the sister that I feel
19:05
like has done a lot more travelling than, say, Betty,
19:08
who's very Americana, very, you know.
19:14
I. Mean housewife?
19:15
Almost. Yeah.
19:17
Yeah, Betty Stress is straight from Dior and I feel like Judy
19:23
picked hers up, like maybe from someone who had travelled
19:29
abroad. But you're right, that
19:31
definitely has a much more cultural influences.
19:35
Also for Judy, though, a lot of her dresses, they're a little
19:42
more girlish, they cover up a lot more.
19:46
And I think it's because she is the little sister and while she
19:53
loves her sister, loves being part of their act, she is afraid
19:57
like that she's holding her older sister back and kind of
20:02
maybe wants to do her own thing a little bit.
20:05
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Oh, I love these two costumes
20:08
though too as well. When we get to see Bob and Phil
20:11
get to play around with the with the girls props a little bit.
20:16
Especially because like, the cops are after Judy and Betty
20:22
because a landlord said they burned a hole.
20:27
Something I even carpet. I watched that scene and I was
20:31
like, wait, what's going on? I even had a Wikipedia.
20:34
I'm like, can you explain what's happening 'cause I don't know.
20:37
Yeah. And like Phil just like is like,
20:45
oh, this is totally Betty is totally the girl for Bob.
20:50
And he's like, all of a sudden trying to like, orchestrate how
20:54
they can, like, he can get the two of them together.
20:58
And part of that is helping them escape the sheriff.
21:02
Yeah, Phil right now looks like the human.
21:07
If if SpongeBob were to become a human, it would be Phil and the
21:11
same. Stop.
21:12
Yes it would, because they put on what they can of the sister
21:17
costume. We're going to put up a side by
21:20
side Phil and SpongeBob and you'll see what we're talking
21:23
about. Oh my gosh, yes.
21:25
But yeah, I love when the two of them do the sister number,
21:30
especially because it seems like Bing Crosby is just having the
21:33
time of his life in that moment. Totally.
21:37
He's yeah, he's such a good performer and you could just
21:39
kind of tell that he's really kind of game for everything.
21:42
But they all end up at the ski resort cabin of their old army
21:49
officer who is down on his luck. So they decide to bring their
21:58
show to his ski resort to hopefully attract some business
22:02
help him out. Because there's no snow in
22:05
Vermont for the skiers. So all the skiers are canceling
22:08
their reservations, no? It's a Christmas tragedy.
22:13
It is a Christmas tragedy. They only have like what, like a
22:16
week to Christmas and there's no snow.
22:21
Yeah, this leads to this musical number.
22:24
So this is a musical number I was talking about earlier when I
22:27
woke up and I was like, what is this movie?
22:30
The moment when you see Judy arise from the back of the room
22:35
and that white like you mentioned, that silhouette that
22:39
Edith had so loves in this film. It's very short cut, but then
22:42
she has to strain peplum behind her that trails behind her with
22:47
the bright red gloves. It is such a stunning costume,
22:51
the way her arms move and that loved, and I'm walking through
22:55
this crowd of dancers. It is a spectacular show.
22:59
There's nothing quite like it. It really is.
23:03
And I love Betty in this scene as well, because Phil and Bob.
23:12
Yeah, Phil and Bob, they're, they're wearing like black and
23:17
red, like not traditional Christmas, but it feels very
23:22
Christmassy still. And then Betty comes out in this
23:26
fully sequin black with red accent strapless gown, and she
23:33
just looks gorgeous and she reminds me of a Barbie doll.
23:36
I'm like the woman who created Barbie totally saw this because
23:41
Barbie has a very similar iconic gown from around the same time
23:46
and I'm. Like Elizabeth would know.
23:47
She knows her iconic Barbie gowns.
23:49
Yes, I do. I'm like, Oh my gosh, she's like
23:54
a living Barbie doll in this number.
23:57
Yeah, I, I love that. The like, contrast again, like
24:00
how Betty tends to kind of, I don't know, like she works
24:03
really well with Bob and Phil. And then Judy comes in and she's
24:07
like the Satine of Moulin Rouge or whatever comes in.
24:10
It's like, I'm going to command this entire stage and you're
24:14
with like the boys act over there kind of.
24:16
And so together, that's why they work so well together.
24:19
They really do. And I love the background
24:22
dancers 'cause we have the guys in these fantastic green
24:29
tuxedos, especially the guy who's like a feature dancer in
24:35
like a Grinch green tuxedo. And they're wearing these like
24:40
bright red shirts, red gloves, and I'm just like, eat up head
24:45
like how? How many candy canes were you
24:49
eating while designing this number 'cause this is wild.
24:54
It's like she must have like been on a sugar high.
24:57
Yeah, and just seeing like all the other dancers too, it just
25:00
feels like different variations of like gift wrapping paper and
25:04
bows. Yes.
25:05
I know it's not but like just seeing it from afar and that
25:08
Vista vision like look, it just all looks.
25:12
It all works so cohesively beautiful.
25:14
Feels like the like wrappings underneath a tree.
25:16
Yeah, especially the the women, their their headdresses look
25:20
like big bows and then their their body suits almost each of
25:25
them look like 1/2 of like a point set of flower.
25:29
Like, it's very much like that, like like elongated petal
25:35
silhouette, but things get dramatic.
25:40
They do. At the ski lodge, really
25:42
quickly, the boys are like, trying to figure out how to
25:47
help, you know their old commander as best they can.
25:53
And there's the snoopy housekeeper who keeps listening
25:56
in and overhears some stuff, takes out a context, tells
26:02
Betty. Oh, right.
26:04
Which makes Betty think that the two of them are just like PO S s
26:09
who are trying to use this opportunity to like make
26:13
themselves look better to the rest of the world.
26:16
It's literally a bad game of telephone.
26:18
It's a horrible game of telephone and all of a sudden
26:21
Betty's like, never mind Bob, I'm I'm not interested, even
26:26
though we were making out last night.
26:32
So her sister has the brilliant idea to get fake engaged to kind
26:40
of force her sister to get back with Bob.
26:44
Yeah, which to me, I was like, the math isn't math thing, but
26:47
that's kind of what I, I gathered.
26:49
I was like, oh, it's a, a phony engagement too.
26:52
Oh, what's going on over there? Elizabeth just fell, even though
26:58
she's sitting down. I was like slowly sliding down
27:04
and I needed to needed to write myself.
27:08
Yeah, that's a phony engagement that I mean, her job, her, her
27:13
plan. Typically it kind of works
27:15
actually. But Betty though, she another
27:19
like very classic 50s silhouette, looking like Betty
27:25
Davis over there a little bit with the pearls, while again,
27:29
Judy is also very covered up, always has like her neck up
27:34
covered, but lots of different, you know, movement and and
27:40
pleats in her costume as well. I really love Judy's look in
27:44
this scene. It's very ski lodge.
27:48
And I love how it's very casually like, 'cause her, her
27:53
and Danny announced their engagement at this cast party
27:58
and she's wearing it's, it's like a, a white turtleneck
28:01
dress. And it has this, I don't know if
28:04
they were sequins or it's some sort of embellishment on the top
28:11
that almost makes it look like Argyle.
28:14
Yeah, like pattern a little bit. And it's like, it's so ski
28:18
lodge. Like the white is very much, you
28:21
know, oh, I'm gonna be a bride. We're getting engaged.
28:24
Isn't that exciting? But Betty again, that gorgeous.
28:33
I love it's velvet and I love it.
28:36
Or I don't know if it's velvet. It might be a satine because
28:39
it's it's not as like it probably is velvet.
28:43
They went they would always go all out.
28:45
So it probably is velvet. I didn't get good, too good of a
28:49
look at it up close, but I did love Phil's, you know, kind of
28:54
checkered print suit, though, that he's wearing for his
28:57
engagement, though. I would actually wear that.
28:59
I don't know if it looked good on me, but I'd give it a go.
29:02
I think I I don't know if that particular check would look
29:06
good, but I think a check would look.
29:09
Yeah. Would look good on you.
29:10
It's kind of like a Wednesday Adams type color.
29:13
It's like not black. It's it's different Shades of
29:16
Grey. It's like a bluish grey, which
29:21
looks fantastic, but this is like Bettys last straw is her
29:27
sister getting engaged and they have a talk like well, I guess
29:32
there's no sister act anymore, even though Judy she's trying to
29:37
be like, hey, you could like also find a man.
29:41
Yeah, things get severe for Betty very quickly, and she has
29:45
this sort of revenge dress #2 which is just absolutely
29:51
gorgeous. She gets like a lounge singer
29:54
almost act in New York and it just kills it.
30:03
Like the rhinestone studded gloves, the back to that dress.
30:09
Oh my gosh, with the big ass brooch.
30:12
Yeah, it's gorgeous. She's killing it.
30:16
And I love the mermaid silhouette.
30:18
I used to be deeply obsessed with mermaid silhouettes when I
30:21
was like, especially when I was in college.
30:24
Really. Yeah.
30:25
Which to me now I'm like, but like Betty's doing it right
30:30
though, right here. Like this is how you do the
30:31
mermaid silhouette via Edith Head.
30:34
Like this Looks incredible. This does look incredible.
30:38
And I was the reverse like in high school and like college, I
30:43
hated the mermaid silhouette. I think because at the time
30:47
there were a lot of really ugly prom dresses that were the
30:52
mermaid silhouette. Like it's just there were a lot
30:55
of dresses in the mermaid silhouette that were not cute.
30:59
But this is, I'm like, I think this is what a mermaid is
31:02
supposed to be. It's much more.
31:04
This is how. You do it right.
31:05
Yeah, it's a lot more subtle than like a lot of mermaids of
31:09
the time. And she just, she kills it and
31:13
Bob's like, hey. Yeah, hey, Remember Me?
31:18
Hey I don't know what I did, I would like to fix it.
31:22
I think what makes the merits successful is that it's paired
31:25
with like, like you said, the back cut out is incredible.
31:29
Yeah, paired with a different colored glove that's also
31:34
jeweled. Yeah, that that's how you do it,
31:36
right? Also like the proportion of
31:38
things 'cause we I have her sketches up here and even in the
31:43
sketch I don't love how the mermaid looks like the skirt is
31:48
too like it comes in way too much in my opinion.
31:53
And then it's like all of a sudden there's it looks more
31:55
like what should be a peplum higher up and then like a
32:00
mermaid. But then the end product is very
32:03
graceful and flattering. Yeah, I think it went in the
32:07
right direction because I too feel the same about looking at
32:10
the sketch. But yeah, that's that's such a
32:13
great. Even though Betty is, you know,
32:16
scoring at this moment, her show is killing it though.
32:19
I would go I would go see Betty's scoring show.
32:22
Her, her show's killing it. I would also go see that and and
32:26
she catches Bob's like late night appearance where she
32:32
realizes like, oh, they're not trying to take advantage of of
32:38
the in their old commander. They're just really trying to
32:42
make sure he he doesn't go under.
32:46
They're really trying to put together a very nice surprise
32:49
event for. Him.
32:50
Too, So we see Bob and Phil's old battalion, all the boys get
32:56
back together, and it's this great, beautiful tribute.
33:00
I didn't really realize we were watching such a patriotic movie
33:03
when I turned it on, but, you know, it's.
33:05
The 50s, of course it's patriotic.
33:08
Yeah, but when I turned it on, I I didn't know that until I was
33:11
like, oh, OK, World War 2. So it's, it's actually very
33:15
touching. I I even teared up a little bit.
33:17
I was like, oh that's very sweet.
33:20
And then they paired off with this great send off number at
33:22
the end though, and I was waiting for this 'cause I knew,
33:25
I knew from all the promos. It was like there's a scene when
33:27
they're in high glam Santa costumes.
33:31
Yeah. And this does not get more high
33:34
glam Santa than this very moment.
33:36
No, no it doesn't. We have the boys in in matching
33:41
red Santa suits with just like killer Red.
33:46
I think it's like rhinestone and sequin, like snowflakes.
33:51
Yeah, on it. Like not.
33:53
This is also what I love like about these films.
33:56
The guys are like also dressed to the nines.
33:59
They are. I was gonna say Santa should
34:01
take some pointers because I like the way that the trouser
34:04
hits right above the boot. Yeah, it's very kind of
34:08
European, actually. Yeah.
34:09
So I'm like Santa. I don't know if there's like a
34:12
different Santa in like Europe and one in the US or what.
34:16
That makes sense. Yeah, I mean, that's how else
34:18
you get around the world so quickly.
34:21
I think European Santa should probably they they all the Santa
34:25
should take this little tip so. They should, and Missus Claus
34:29
could learn a thing or two from Betty and Judy.
34:33
Like I love Betty's look in this scene.
34:38
It's again that like Dior new look, cinched waist, full skirt
34:44
to the floor. It's this beautiful satin and
34:48
the muff and the sequins and the brooches and the everything.
34:53
And some point to that, like, I love how you and I are so
34:56
opposite Betty and Judy because me, I love that Judy's so
35:00
avant-garde and she has this muff that's kind of like off
35:03
shoulder a little bit, kind of like metrical.
35:07
Yeah, that's cool. I'm like, OK, she's edgy.
35:10
I like it. Edgy.
35:11
Mrs. Claus. Yes.
35:13
Yes. And I also like this is one of
35:16
the like attention to detail things I love about old
35:20
Hollywood is when you there's this great part where it's like
35:26
we got Judy and Danny and Betty and Bob on opposite like sides
35:33
of the Christmas tree. And there's this cute little
35:34
ballerina dressed up in white and sequins.
35:38
But Judy and Betty, they have these like white fur likes like
35:44
over skirt swooshes and they go to opposite sides so that they
35:50
they match on either side of the screen.
35:54
Oh. My gosh, they do.
35:55
I didn't even realize that I'm looking at it now.
35:58
Like it's like that's like, why would you think about that?
36:03
Yeah, those are the details. It's almost like it feels like
36:07
Edith had was working almost like the production designer on
36:10
this film at some points, the way that she was using costumes
36:13
to build these different. Like earlier we talked about how
36:15
I felt like we're building out the gifts under a tree and now
36:19
she's building out like the curtain or the the skirt
36:23
underneath the Christmas tree with their actual skirts.
36:26
Absolutely. That's incredible.
36:28
That's a I went. I didn't even catch that.
36:31
No, it's so cool and it's an amazing number to end on with
36:37
the snow coming down in Vermont. Everyone's happy, everyone's
36:41
fulfilled. You feel kind of warm and fuzzy
36:45
on the inside as a viewer because you just watched a nice
36:50
Christmas movie, Spencer. It was so sweet, I loved it so
36:55
much. Let's take a little break and
36:56
get a hot chocolate refill and when we come back we will play
37:00
our favorite games for the final time this season.
37:03
Yes. All right, Elizabeth, I hope you
37:09
got your hot chocolate refill, probably with some Bailey's or
37:14
something in it if I know you. You know me.
37:21
Gosh, such a great movie. Let's do our stitch rating.
37:25
So cozy. I feel like.
37:28
I feel like I could have almost even fell asleep a couple times
37:32
watching this film because I was just so content and cozy, you
37:34
know, like they have a fireplace on, have some hot chocolate
37:38
watching White Christmas. That's just a vibe listening to
37:42
these musical numbers. It was great.
37:44
So I feel kind of weird giving this just rating because I don't
37:47
love these just ratings to old Hollywood films because I'm
37:51
looking at from different lens of, you know, they're so
37:54
classic. So if I would have watched this
37:57
in the 50s, I probably would have gave it A5.
38:00
So that's what I'm gonna stick with.
38:02
I'm going with 1950s Spencer, what I would have gave it.
38:06
Understandable. Understandable.
38:09
I am definitely. I'm giving this like a solid
38:14
four. Yeah, 'cause this is a vibe.
38:17
You're totally right. This movie is a Christmas vibe.
38:20
Like it. It just is.
38:24
This story's weird. Yeah, actually I'm going to
38:27
downgrade to four. Also with you, 'cause I didn't
38:29
understand what's happening half the time.
38:31
I just knew I liked it. This story is they could have
38:34
taken some of that musical number parts and like wrote the
38:40
non musical number parts better. Yeah.
38:44
Like I think that would have been a good trade off.
38:47
'Cause when they were singing, we were all having a good time.
38:50
It's when they start talking. I was like, wait, the landlord's
38:52
mad about what now? I know, I know.
38:58
I'm like, it would have cause like, yeah, no, it I, I'm not
39:03
going to get into it. They could have made this make
39:06
more sense. The script wasn't all the way
39:09
there. Well, I I like the idea of like
39:12
the surprise for the major at the end.
39:15
Like I loved building up to that.
39:17
But all the like random drama was like kind of like not fully
39:21
baked yet. Yeah, that part made sense, but
39:27
the the relationship drama, Yeah, the.
39:30
Side stories, It just wasn't necessary.
39:32
It was not hitting. It was not working.
39:35
Well, like this is, it's the holidays.
39:37
Just fall in love already. Yeah, get on with it.
39:40
This is this is a 2 hour film, which I was actually surprised.
39:44
I thought this was gonna be like 3 hours 'cause it's it's the
39:48
1950s. They made some long ass films,
39:51
Yeah. And I'm like, I wouldn't have
39:54
minded half an hour if it meant the story overall was better.
39:58
Yeah, I've almost feel like they need to either need to commit to
40:02
just going full musical or they need to align some of the story.
40:06
But yeah, either way, still such an incredible film.
40:09
I'm glad I got to watch it. Let's play our favorite game.
40:12
One costume to rule them all. Are you ready?
40:14
Hit it, Spencer, the one costume to rule them all.
40:24
All right, so my costume is quite easy.
40:27
Actually. I had to pick Judy's white high
40:34
low look with the peplum train behind her when she arose from
40:39
that riser during the musical number 0.
40:41
Those red gloves? The red gloves I love.
40:45
That's one thing I've been loving lately is gloves.
40:48
Specifically red gloves. I've been I've seen him a lot in
40:51
films lately. I know this one didn't come up
40:54
come out so recently, but either way, it's such a look.
40:58
It just feels so put together. The hair is right, everything
41:01
down to the shoes are right, the jewelry, it's just perfect.
41:06
And I honestly want to watch this film just because of this
41:09
costume. So it was worth the wait.
41:12
Definitely worth the wait. MY1 costume is the sister's
41:18
costume. A duo.
41:21
It's, it's just so fun. It's, it's so of the time.
41:28
It's very recognizable. I also love like, it's a
41:31
Christmas movie and it's like this number is not a Christmas
41:35
number, but like the blue, the sparkle, the lace.
41:40
It reminds me of snowflakes. Yeah, and I just, it's so much
41:45
fun. And then how, you know, the guys
41:48
take bits and pieces to do their own version.
41:52
It's it's so fun. It's so fun.
41:55
Reminds me of like a winter Peacock almost a little bit.
41:58
It's like a winter, like a Peacock caught out in the snow
42:01
or something. Absolutely and.
42:03
With that, that doesn't just bring us to the end of this
42:05
episode. That brings us to the end of
42:07
Season 5 of the Art of Costume podcast.
42:10
Elizabeth, what a year we have. Oh yeah.
42:14
I mean, this year started with the fires and Pasadena and
42:18
Altadena, if you all remember that I.
42:20
Moved back out here. Yeah, Elizabeth moved to LA, We
42:25
started the season with Wicked and we had Nos for Ratu around
42:29
there also going all the way through Ward season and Sinners
42:34
and I don't know, we've just done so much this year.
42:37
It's and it flew by at the same time.
42:39
Cleopatra One episode was an entire journey for us.
42:43
I'm still talking about Cleopatra.
42:45
We had we we're on YouTube this season.
42:48
That's also new this year. It's it's been a year.
42:52
It's been a year. What was one of your favorite
42:54
episodes this year? That's so hard.
42:58
I don't know, Cleopatra just like sticks out to me.
43:01
That's so that's. Mine too, I really loved doing
43:04
Cleopatra. I think because like, I knew I
43:08
was like, ooh, this is gonna be fun.
43:09
This is gonna like, I knew there was drama surrounding Cleopatra,
43:15
but then we we found the podcast and I did my research and we
43:19
were just like back and forth, like, oh, my gosh, this
43:22
happened. This happened.
43:23
Like, it was almost like we were watching a miniseries.
43:27
Yeah. That episode might end it for
43:28
you all on a Tuesday, but we were talking about Cleopatra for
43:32
weeks after that episode. Yeah.
43:34
We did our vampire month this year.
43:37
Yeah. Which was fun deep diving into
43:40
hot sexy vampires. We watched True Blood this year.
43:43
Well, attempted to watch True Blood.
43:45
I don't know if you all know this, but I only got through
43:47
like three seasons. And you did not get far.
43:49
Now my brain was exploding. I couldn't.
43:53
I could do it, but I really wanted to.
43:55
We discovered only lovers left alive.
43:58
That that was a good one. We did a live episode this year.
44:03
I did the sketch the screen event with HBO Max and
44:06
interviewed 8 designers. That was crazy.
44:09
That was incredible. Oh, we had on Sandy Powell this.
44:13
Year we did. Oh my gosh, that was this year.
44:16
That was this year. We talked about Shakespeare in
44:18
Love and Orlando that I still get goosebumps when I think
44:26
about the episode because I was so terrified to meet Sandy
44:29
Powell just because she's, she's one of, she's a living legend in
44:33
our field, you know? And Oh my gosh, we were
44:35
complaining about the bird that wouldn't shut up outside our
44:38
apartments. Yeah, she logged on.
44:42
Yeah, she logs on. And we were like, Hope.
44:43
I wish you all would have been on set.
44:45
I mean, Elizabeth puckered up real quickly.
44:47
Oh my God, she's in my living room.
44:51
That's so scary. It was so.
44:54
She was so lovely though. She was so cool.
44:58
Yeah. I mean, we interviewed a lot of
44:59
cool people this year. We also launched the Costume
45:02
House, our sister podcast, which I should say, we're going to be
45:06
going on a little hour holiday end of the year break for a few
45:11
weeks. We don't have a comeback date
45:13
yet, but it will likely be sometime in January.
45:16
But the costume House of Spencer Williams, our sister podcast,
45:19
will still continue next week after the the holidays.
45:25
Before New Year's, we're going to have a Tron episode, Tron
45:29
Aries with costume designer Christine Beaseland Clark, which
45:32
Elizabeth actually interviewed Once Upon a time for her work on
45:35
Star Trek Picard. I did.
45:38
I did. I've never got to meet her.
45:40
So now I got to meet her and she was so cool.
45:43
And we have lots of more episodes coming up.
45:45
And I'm sure you're all wondering where is the Wicked
45:49
and the Frankenstein episode? It's on the tip of everyone's
45:53
tongue. It's coming.
45:55
It's. Coming.
45:56
But with films like this, Oscar films, 'cause we all know that's
46:00
probably where this is going. It's a longer timeline, so
46:04
expect lots of returning back to Oz or Guillermo del Toro's
46:10
messed up mind in the new year. Yes, everyone.
46:16
If you want to send us your thoughts on White Christmas,
46:20
e-mail us at theartofcostume@gmail.com.
46:24
And as always, follow us on Instagram at the Art of Costume
46:27
Pod TikTok at The Art of Costume.
46:30
We're posting lots of great content there all the time.
46:32
And it's probably too late for you to get a holiday gift, but
46:36
still do it anyways. Head to the Art of
46:38
costume.com/pod store. Shoot, text me.
46:42
I'll. I'll drive it over to your house
46:43
if you live within 5 miles of me.
46:46
OK, it's. Very specific, yeah.
46:50
And if you all maybe wanted to get us a little something for
46:54
Christmas, you could leave us a five star text review on Apple
46:59
Podcast or just a five star review on Spotify.
47:02
Both help us so much and are greatly appreciated.
47:06
Hey, that would make my holiday break.
47:08
Same. Same honestly.
47:10
Because I love reading nice things.
47:12
And if that Elizabeth, congratulations to you on
47:17
another fun, successful season. It was not without challenge
47:20
this. Year, yes.
47:23
But I'm proud of the work we did, and I'm just so happy that
47:27
we have to get the that we get to share it with all of our
47:29
listeners time and time again. And we appreciate all of you so
47:32
dearly. We love you, costume nerds, and
47:35
I'm excited for 2026, which sounds crazy to say.
47:39
Sounds wild and. With that, happy holidays
47:45
everyone. Take care of yourselves, don't
47:46
drink and drive. Have a happy holiday.