Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Rachelle Croft: Competitive Adventure Driver and Overlander

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Rachelle Croft: Competitive Adventure Driver and Overlander · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I am
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: your host, Scott Brady, and I am here at Day
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: one of the Overland Expo, and I am here with
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  Speaker 1: a longtime friend and someone who has been a huge
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: inspiration to me, Michelle Croft. She is the co founder
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: of x Overland, which in my mind is the premium
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: overland video team in the world. And she is also
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: the founder of the Excels racing team. So we are
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: going to talk about racing in the deserts, We're going
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: to talk about traveling around the world. We're going to
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: talk about how she manages traveling with Clay Croft because
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: we have some shared experiences. I actually may have spent
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: more time in Russian hotel rooms with Clay than you have.
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  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Okay, there's one pink Russian hotel room that really comes
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  Speaker 1: to mind that I think we have photos of somewhere.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Even the pillows they were hearts, So Clay and I
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  Speaker 1: had a very special moment in that. So thank you
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: Rachelle so much for being on the podcast. Thanks to
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: this week sponsor Gcioutdoor. Whether you're heading out for a
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: weekend of adventure in the woods or to your backyard
• 1:06
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• 1:42
  Speaker 4: Thanks again, GCI, Thank you so much for having me
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: honor to be here.
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you're so welcome.
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  Speaker 1: Now, the first thing that comes to mind for me
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  Speaker 1: is what did you do before you started adventuring around
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  Speaker 1: the world. What was your life like before you decided
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  Speaker 1: I'm going to put a truck and a container and
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  Speaker 1: ship it to Morocco and go race.
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  Speaker 3: What was life like before that?
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  Speaker 4: That's a really good question. So Clay and I met
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: in high school. Were high school sweets. I was fifteen,
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: he was sixteen or seventeen, I can't remember. Honestly dated
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: long distance. We got married very young. Our plan was
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: when we got married I was twenty he was twenty one,
• 2:19
  Speaker 4: that we were going to travel the world together.
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  Speaker 3: Oh amazing, that's what.
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  Speaker 4: We were waiting for. We were waiting for that moment.
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  Speaker 4: And then Cyrus came along. Okay, surprise, surprise, A good surprise,
• 2:29
  Speaker 4: but it was a surprise. We were very young at
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: the moment, and we said, Okay, well, we've always wanted kids,
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: so we're going to have kids now, and we're going
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: to just flip those things around. Sure, so let's have kids.
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: And then because we're brilliant, we decided to start a
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  Speaker 4: business and have kids and be broke all at the same
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: time while dropping out of college.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: So that's for that train hit it.
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  Speaker 4: And Clay was figuring out what he wanted to do.
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  Speaker 4: He loved being outside and he just recently discovered filmmaking
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: and cinematography and he just fell into it. And I
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: knowing him as long as I had in high school
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  Speaker 4: through college, he is not someone you ever put at
• 3:05
  Speaker 4: a desk and tell him to go to work.
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  Speaker 2: Sure you do not box that guy in.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I was like, yeah, get a camera, let's
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  Speaker 4: do it, so I was the kind of consistent, steady
• 3:16
  Speaker 4: income at that moment. I worked at coffee shops, which
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: is why I love coffee, and I'll post on that
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: sometimes for sure.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, you make great coffee. Oh thank you.
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  Speaker 4: We started a film business called Highland Productions. We still
• 3:27
  Speaker 4: have that to this day. At that same time, I
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  Speaker 4: was pregnant and so we were going down that road.
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  Speaker 4: So the way we paid the bills was he would
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: shoot wedding videos, soccer videos for seniors, for college applications.
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  Speaker 4: We did a few local commercials, and that was how
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  Speaker 4: we got by. He got his experience that way, and
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  Speaker 4: so by the time twenty ten rolled around, I was
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  Speaker 4: pregnant with Eli, who's our third son. And that was
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  Speaker 4: my life up until then. So we were married in
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  Speaker 4: two thousand and four into twenty ten. And I will
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: be the first to tell you, and Clay will maybe
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  Speaker 4: not say this because he's nice. I was not a
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  Speaker 4: fun person to be around.
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  Speaker 3: That's a lot of responsibility, it was.
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  Speaker 4: A lot of respunability. It was very stressful, and I
• 4:02
  Speaker 4: was an adventurous person. I grew up in Montana. I
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: loved doing things outside and I loved travel, and I
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  Speaker 4: felt like it was that was my time where I
• 4:10
  Speaker 4: was going to go and travel. I was in my twenties, sure,
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  Speaker 4: and then I'm like, Okay, I'm raising kids now and
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  Speaker 4: Clay's working on this business and he's getting to travel.
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  Speaker 4: So I was a little resentful that I was home,
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  Speaker 4: and like I said, I had I had issues, I
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: had stuff to work there after a little depressed and
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: you know, some people will hear my story, but I
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: being sexually abused at a young age, all that was
• 4:33
  Speaker 4: feeding into it. It kind of all came to a head, sure,
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: and I was finally ready in twenty ten. It was
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  Speaker 4: like I need to work on this, Like this is
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  Speaker 4: not the person I want to be. I am not
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  Speaker 4: the best mom I could be for these kids. And
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  Speaker 4: this is not Clay's fault. And if I want my
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  Speaker 4: life to change, what do I need to do? And
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  Speaker 4: so within this window between twenty ten and twenty eleven, WED,
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  Speaker 4: that was when we started Expedition Overland in twenty ten. Sorry,
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: and answer to your question, before that, I was home
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  Speaker 4: with the boys, I was working part time at home.
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  Speaker 3: How did you how did you make that transition?
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  Speaker 1: You had this moment of awareness, Yeah, where you were
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: recognizing that your life was not what you thought it
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: would be, but you're now becoming a person you don't
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: want to be. Yeah, how did you move from that
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  Speaker 1: place to where you are now? What were some of
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: the changes that you made in your life that really
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: made an impact.
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  Speaker 4: That's a really good question. I started reaching out to
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: people that I didn't know one. I recognized I needed friends.
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  Speaker 4: I didn't have a lot of friends because a lot
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  Speaker 4: of people we went to college with had married and
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: moved away, or they just moved away. And we were
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  Speaker 4: the first ones to have kids in our circle, so
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: it was just a very lonely time you were young,
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: we had kids, and nobody else could relate to us,
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  Speaker 4: and we were trying to start a business. I realized
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  Speaker 4: right away, I need like minded people around me to
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  Speaker 4: help me because I'm not doing well on my own,
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: and so I started reaching out to some girlfriends. I
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  Speaker 4: had one of our mentors that we'd gone to Uganda
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  Speaker 4: with in the past, that Clay had gone on some
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  Speaker 4: trips with. He had a daughter lived in Bozeman, and
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: I was literally like, duncan I need to meet your daughter.
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  Speaker 2: I don't even know her, but I just need a friend.
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  Speaker 4: And which is scary for a girl to come out
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  Speaker 4: like girlfriends are really hard to find.
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  Speaker 2: I needed something, So that was the first step I took.
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  Speaker 1: So you feel like reaching out to make other connections
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  Speaker 1: with people that you trusted, Yeah, that was the first step.
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  Speaker 2: Yep, it absolutely was.
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  Speaker 1: And then what came next after that that helped you
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  Speaker 1: continue to climb that ladder out of that place.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah. I think I knew am I just in my
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  Speaker 4: being and in my gut that it was time for
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  Speaker 4: me to deal with my past. And everybody gets to
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  Speaker 4: that time. Everybody gets that point at a certain time
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  Speaker 4: in their lives. You can't rush that. Even if you
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  Speaker 4: look at someone you're like, oh, you need to deal
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: with your stuff, you can't rush that. It's on your
• 6:41
  Speaker 4: own time. We did premarital counseling before we're married, and
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  Speaker 4: I remember our counselor is like, uh, you, this is
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  Speaker 4: gonna come up and I was like, no, I'm fine,
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  Speaker 4: It's it's all good. And it took me seven years
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  Speaker 4: later to actually be like, oh, I need to deal
• 6:53
  Speaker 4: with this. So I reached out to I found counseling
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  Speaker 4: and local counseling. I found just people in the church
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  Speaker 4: I trusted. I literally was grasping for straws because one
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  Speaker 4: nobody was really talking about that topic. And so I
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: just started reaching out to different churches in the area
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  Speaker 4: and I was like, can I do you have a
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  Speaker 4: woman counselor can I meet with you? Do you have resources?
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  Speaker 4: And just kind of that It finally led me to
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  Speaker 4: someone who could start helping me in that process.
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  Speaker 2: That was a big thing for me.
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  Speaker 3: No, no, thank you.
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  Speaker 1: That's it's such an incredible journey that you have been
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  Speaker 1: on and you being vocal about those experiences as I
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: remember you describing to me soon after you started that process.
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  Speaker 1: The number of people that reached out to you, Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: that needed that touch point recognition that here is this
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  Speaker 1: person that has done all of these amazing things and
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: they're talking about something that I've experienced as well. You
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  Speaker 1: feel like you were able to help others like that.
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  Speaker 1: You had a lot of outpouring of folks reaching out
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  Speaker 1: to you.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.
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  Speaker 4: So after to fast forward a little bit in twenty fourteen,
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  Speaker 4: that was the second rally I did in Morocco, and
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: we ran kind of this whole campaign about hey to
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: raise awareness to rediscover your voice, and I partnered with
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: a nonprofit out of Atlanta, and the whole reason behind
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: it was to tell people like, hey, we need to
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  Speaker 4: talk about this, but don't get stuck in it. You
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  Speaker 4: can still go out and be the person you want
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  Speaker 4: to be. It might take a little extra work, but
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  Speaker 4: I'm out here racing in the desert because this is
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  Speaker 4: what I found, Like kind of lit that spark in me.
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  Speaker 4: And that's why Morocco is so crucial also to my
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  Speaker 4: healing process because I found that thing and that's not
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  Speaker 4: it for everybody. It's going to be completely different. You
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  Speaker 4: don't have to ship a track to Morocco to do that.
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  Speaker 2: You know.
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  Speaker 4: For me, I needed a big like shift and jolt
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  Speaker 4: and it just really drew me and so I kind
• 8:35
  Speaker 4: of it definitely lit that flame in me again to
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  Speaker 4: be like, this is who I want to be. This okay,
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  Speaker 4: here's here she is. Like it was like I hadn't
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  Speaker 4: even met her yet. Being out there with these women
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  Speaker 4: and problem solving and having hard days and getting through
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  Speaker 4: to the other side. That was the person I knew
• 8:51
  Speaker 4: I wanted to be.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's that's incredible. And how did you find out
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: about the trophy? Ayesha day Gazelle's how did you even
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: learn that it existed.
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so Clay actually was my touch point there. He
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: was in I think it was Hollister where he met
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: you for the first time. Sure, and he was debuting
• 9:09
  Speaker 4: our very first episode of Expedition Overland and Emily Miller
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  Speaker 4: was there talking about this rally in Morocco and Clay
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  Speaker 4: had met with.
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  Speaker 2: Her, chatto with her.
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  Speaker 4: He's like, hmm, this might be good for my wife
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: in a very loving way. She needs something like this.
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: And he brought home this postcard and handed it to
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: me and I looked at it literally and was like, well,
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  Speaker 4: that'd be nice, wouldn't that be cool? And I was
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: telling you I was not a nice person. That was
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: when I first heard about it. And then at our
• 9:32
  Speaker 4: first SEMA show, you encourage us to go figure out
• 9:35
  Speaker 4: what we could do with Expedition Overland. I met my
• 9:38
  Speaker 4: first teammate, Julie Meadows at the Max Jack Spooth and
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: I'll never forget it. Brian mcvickers was there and Julie
• 9:44
  Speaker 4: and myself and Ben and I think one other guy,
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: and she was like, Hey, did you hear about this
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: rally in Morocco? I was like, yeah, it sounds pretty crazy,
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: and she was like wouldn't that be kind of cool
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: to do it? And I said, yeah, it would be awesome.
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: I was like, well, I really like to drive. She's like, well,
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: I'll learn to navigate. And then all these guys came
• 9:58
  Speaker 4: around us, these men, and they were so like, you
• 10:00
  Speaker 4: girls need to do this. This is amazing and I'll
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: never forget that support that we had from them. It
• 10:04
  Speaker 4: was really cool. It really helped propel us. And that's
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: literally how we started. The race was five months away.
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: I knew nothing about raising money or driving in sand.
• 10:14
  Speaker 4: I grew up in Montana. I was like, I can
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: drive in snow. It's at the same I have no idea. Awesome,
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: And that's where it all started.
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  Speaker 1: So you're five months out, you reach out to the
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: organization to find out what that means. Did you talk
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: with Emily as well to get some insights.
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  Speaker 4: She was phenomenal, So she really kind of took the
• 10:33
  Speaker 4: role of kind of the American liaison for us, because one,
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: I didn't speak French and it is a French event,
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: so I didn't even the website wasn't even in English.
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  Speaker 4: I had no idea, and so she really helped. She
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: had done it, or I think she competed for three
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: years as well, and she got really passionate about it
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: and wanted to include other women in this, and so
• 10:52
  Speaker 4: she really helped hold our hands and go.
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: Through the whole process.
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  Speaker 3: What truck did you take?
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: So we shipped the tooth thousand and seven Toyota FJ
• 11:01
  Speaker 4: and it was the Max Tracks FJ cruiser at the time. Okay, sure,
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: and Max Tracks came on as our first sponsor for
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: the rally Jagazels.
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: Wow, I will never forget Brad doing that for us.
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: Brad is such a great guy, amazing and he recognizes
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: those those leverage points. He's done that for people and
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: he realizes like if I do this thing, it will
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: make a huge difference for someone. And I've seen him
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: do that a few times. Yeah, Brad's an amazing dude
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: for sure.
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  Speaker 4: And he did that with Expedition Overland too. He saw
• 11:31
  Speaker 4: that in Clay and he was like, you know what
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: I've been where you are starting a business and I
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: needed someone to believe in me. You were one of
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: those people for us, and he was like, I will
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: be your first sponsor. And he's still one of our
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: longest running members.
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: Incredible.
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: The whole organization, and of course what Matt and Laura
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: have done with it here in the United States is
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: so impressive. So okay, so now you've got an FJ Cruiser,
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: You're going to go and race in Morocco. Did you
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: do anything to the truck? How did you prep it
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: for this? And how did you prepare yourself?
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: Great question?
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: So, like I said, this was new for everybody. So she,
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: for the first time kind of got a training rounded
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: up in San Diego to teach us how to drive
• 12:08
  Speaker 4: in the sand dunes. And so I flew into Las
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: Vegas and met Julie, who I had only met once,
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: and it was kind of that moment you get off plane,
• 12:15
  Speaker 4: You're like, what am I doing?
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: Like I really thought, was this really going to happen?
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: And I remember. So we stayed with them at their
• 12:23
  Speaker 4: house in Las Vegas. We drove to San Diego. We
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: had a class, and the only teacher that could teach
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: us navigation had come in from Canada and spoke French,
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: so it was a very heavy French accent trying to
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: teach us how to use a map and plot points,
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: which I'd never done in my life. And I'm still
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: not good at it, I'm not thank goodness for navigators.
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: So we had a little bit of that for a
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: day and then we went out to Glamis and this
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: is really cool. Rod Hall was there because he was
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: one of Emily's mentors and as well, so he my
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: first one of my first experiences driving in sand in
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: that FJ Cruiser was Rod Hall on my back seat
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: and he's just like going it, you know, he just
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: looked at this big sand hill. I'm like, can I
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: make it up that. He's like, I don't know, let's
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: find out. Put it down, hammer down, you know.
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: And that was my training.
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: As we did other things too, but that was that
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: stood out and it was fantastic.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: That is that memory.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: That is something about sand is that you have to
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: trust momentum a little bit. People confuse speed with momentum,
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: but speed rarely does what you wanted to do in
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: the sand. But momentum makes a big difference. Yes, if
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: you can just kind of maintain that momentum through the
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: dunes with just enough to crest the ridge, it totally
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: makes a difference.
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Well so that's your training.
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: Yep, you've got it.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: You've had some navigation, you've done some driving, the truck
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: goes in a container, yes, thankfully. And then where did
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: you fly into Did you fly right into Morocco or
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: did you fly to Europe first?
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: Or we flew into Europe.
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: It was one of the years where our officials start
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: for that rally was in Paris, which was amazing.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: That is amazing.
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: We were right across from the Eiffel Tower. It was gorgeous.
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: And that year we were only one of two American teams,
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: so we fly in are. The truck had been shipped
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: to a friend in Belgium who drove it down to
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: Paris for us. Julie and I flew into Paris with
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: all our luggage way too we way overpacked, as everybody does.
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: Sure the truck was way too heavy. We had like
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: seven air filters. You were prepared, very prepared, and so
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: we had way too much stuff. It was really heavy,
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: and I remember we had to get something welded to
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: the bottom. It was a skid plate that needed to
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: be fixed. And we just drove the FJ down Paris
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: and we're like that kind of looks like a service station.
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: And we pulled in, not speaking a lick of French,
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: trying to explain to this guy in English and charades
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: you know, sure what I need done to the underside
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: of this truck. And finally we like run down the
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: road and find someone that can speak English can translate
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: for us, and he comes back and translates and then
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: we get it figured out. And that was like, I
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: haven't even started the rally yet and I'm already in
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: a rally. This is like the most I've ever been
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: out of my comfort zone. And it was so fun.
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: You just got to make fun of yourself. That's all
• 14:58
  Speaker 4: you can do.
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: You do, Yeah, you do.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: I mean I look back at pretty much everything I've
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: done and can make fun of myself.
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: I'm like, why did I even do that last week?
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: I don't even know why I did. Yeah.
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the ego is all in our own mind. Yeah,
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: there's not a whole lot of coolness happening.
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: Okay, So you start in Paris and how many teams
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: were competing.
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: I believe there was around one hundred, and it was
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: between one hundred and thirty and one hundred and forty.
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: That is a lot.
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: It's a lot. They're in their thirtieth year this year,
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: so it's amazing. It's an amazing event. Yeah, one other
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: American team. We just were kind of flying by the
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: seat of our pants. You know, they're barking instructions that
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: you and French on where to pull up and what
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: time and what your start time is, and we're like,
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: I don't even know how to sticker a car and
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: we're supposed to sticker a car. And it was a
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: whole It was just one thing after another. I'm like,
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: I have no idea what we're doing.
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: So amazing. Yeah, so then you drive from Paris. I'm
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: assuming you probably end up in Marseille or something for
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: the fairy.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: Nope, Tangiers on the other side. Yeah, what's sorry, what's
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: the Spain side?
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: Oh so you Yeah, you went from out of probably
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: Gibraltar or somewhere near there.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: I believe.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: So, so you took a ferry over to Tangiers and
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: then does it start in Tangiers?
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: So then you drive eight hours to air food you
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: actually start.
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a great area.
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: And we didn't know that at that time. Nobody had
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: credit card machines anywhere or internet, so we didn't even
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: know how to get from Paris to the fair. That
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: was the first challenge, and I remember we'd see another
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: team and we were like, oh, thank god, there's another.
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: One and you're hoping that they're not lost too exactly yep.
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: So then we ferry. That's an all night I think
• 16:41
  Speaker 4: we got on the ferry at midnight, early slept. We
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: forgot that our truck doesn't have you can't have access
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: to your truck when it's on the ferry, which all
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: our food was in, so we only had enough change
• 16:51
  Speaker 4: to scrounge up to like buy a croissant and we
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: split our croissant the cafin and then we get off
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: in Morocco and drive to air which we didn't know
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: where to go. There was like official policemen kind of
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: pointing it's all roundabouts, you know if you've been there,
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: and we're like, I think we go this way and
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: this looks about right, and figured it out.
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: We made it.
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: That's so amazing. And then how long was the event?
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: So the event there is nine days.
• 17:16
  Speaker 4: You have a prologue day which they give you maybe
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: three or five checkpoints. It's not scored, but it kind
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: of sets the placement of teams on which courses they'll
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: put you on throughout the rally. Okay, we thought we
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: found our first checkpoint on the first day, we're like,
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: this is so easy, and then we get there and
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: it's the wrong one.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: We're like, oh crap, this is this is how this
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: is going to go.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: So you found a checkpoint but not the one you
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: thought you were fine? Oh interesting, No, that's challenging.
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: Yep, there's I think now they have up to five
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: different groups. Okay, feel the ABCD, maybe g Sure, so
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: you might find that red flag in the desert, but
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: it might not be yours, got it and they won't
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: tell you.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Now, were you also sleeping out of the vehicle too,
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: or was there a BiVO whac?
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: There's a BiVO whac.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: You're actually not allowed access to your vehicle at night
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: because a lot of teams in the past have cheated
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: doing that. They would put in GPS units.
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: So in this.
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: Rally, much like the rebel, you're not allowed GPS or electronics,
• 18:07
  Speaker 4: all paper maps, compasses, rulers, and they would have teams
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: in the past that would plant GPS units and all
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: this stuff. So you lock your cart and you actually
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: turn in your keys and you leave, so you're tent
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: camping it in kind of a roped off area. Sure,
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: but they feed you. They have like trailer showers, very safe.
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: It's a great experience. Yeah, Morocco is a beautiful country.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: It really is.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: So when you would navigate by paper map, and I'm
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: asking the question because I just competed in the trek event, yeah,
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: where I had the opportunity to do more of that
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: kind of orienteering, did you find that you focused more
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: on I want to know exactly where I am by
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: triangulating or did you use more I can tell that
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: I'm most likely on this road and that looks like that,
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: and you were doing more dead reckoning on the map.
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: How did you guys find that you navigated efficiently for
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: the race?
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, great question, and you'll see a lot of teams
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: have different styles. So it took us a few days
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: to figure out our bearings. First of all, we always
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: have a forget what they're called. It's like a rally computer,
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: but it counts down kilometers precisely, and it's calibrated to
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: your truck. So honestly, that thing is our saving grace
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: because we'll first put a paper map down and we'll measure, okay,
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: to get from checkpoint A to B, this is twenty
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: seven point five kilometers at this heading.
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: Now, in Morocco sometimes you can go a straight line
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: into that heading. In the US, you cannot do that,
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: which is why they're a bell I think is it's
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: a lot more challenging in those ways. So you learn
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: very quickly if you have a navigator that understands features
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: and can pinpoint that feature on your map. Okay, out
• 19:39
  Speaker 4: my passenger window, I should be seeing this mountain at
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: around five kilometers. Okay, that's that mountain of five kilometers.
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: We're in the right area. But then sometimes when you
• 19:47
  Speaker 4: get to those checkpoints, they'll hide them like down in
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: a divot so you can't see them. They'll put them
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: behind a bush. Interesting, that's where you start triangulating to
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: really pinpoint your exact position.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, so we kind of use all three.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: So you would that makes sense, So you would you
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: would take the gamble of we may just run right
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: across it and be very fast.
• 20:07
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: If we don't, then we're not going to go and
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: try to drive around until we find it. We're going
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: to find out exactly where we are. It makes a
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: lot of sense a minute.
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: The second you get the gut check of like, oh,
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: I don't know where I am. You need to stop
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: because what and this is a mistake we made. We
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: were lost the whole first year in Morocco all the
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: time because you keep trying to talk yourself into it.
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: And then you do what's called magic map. So you
• 20:29
  Speaker 4: look at something and you're like, oh, that's totally that mountain.
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah that makes sense, and you kind of turn it.
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: You're like, yeah, yeah, that's that. You know ravine, Yeah, yeah,
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: that is that, and then you convince yourself because as
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: when you get lost, there's like a brain I forget
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: what it's called. There's a neurological reaction that happens, and
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: your body just it has to know where it.
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: Is, okay, and trying to fill in the gaps.
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: Yes, and so you'll make really dumb and irrational decisions
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: based on I just need to know where I am
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: right now. That's why I tell people the second you
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: feel that something is off, you need to stop and
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: figure it out. Because if you know at least where
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: you are, even if it's even if you can draw
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: a circle the size of an orange on a map
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: of where you are, that calms that response down instead
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: of just being like, I don't even know in the
• 21:10
  Speaker 4: world where I am, because you'll go with there. You're like,
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: I don't even know. I could be in America, but
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: I'm in Morocco. You just freak out.
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: That's interesting. Yeah, I remember when we did We did the.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: Outback Challenge in Morocco, which is a similar area to
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: where you raced, and Nathan Henman was my navigator, and
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: we're cruising along.
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: We're kind of lost.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're generally going in the right compass bearing, but
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: other than that, we're pretty much lost. Yep, we're on
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: this road and he says, I think I know where
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: we're at now. He's like, we're going to come up.
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: We're going to come up to this major road and
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: you're going to make a left and I'm doing eighty
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: ninety miles an hour across the desert. Oh no, And
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: then he realizes that it wasn't a road. It was
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: actually the border. So we had somehow gotten ourselves into Algeria. Yep,
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: and we were trying were we thought we were going
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: in the right direction, but we were actually heading back
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: into Morocco.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: So, and if it's middle of the night, can't see
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: the lights only go so far and all of a sudden,
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: we see like this hut illuminated, and then we see
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: this bar across the road, and we see this Moroccan
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: military guy and literally, by the grace of all the Gods,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: I'm doing so I can't stop. There's no way I
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: can stop. And he decides to open the gate. He
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: flips the way, he flips the gate up, and we
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: never I never lifted.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: I just kept wow. And Nathan and I laugh about that.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: That's amazing. It was an amazing It's so you can
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: be convinced. Yes, and we were.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: We were convinced, and we were on why road yep,
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: going this direction and we were actually on X road, yes,
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: heading mostly in the same direction, but we were totally lost.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: Really interesting.
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: Yes, And that's tricky and Morocco because the road on
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: your map is probably not the road you're on, because
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: over time, you'll see you'll have five roads right next
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: to each other, got it. You don't know which one
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: is on the map that you think you're following. And
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: that's something nobody tells you until you get over there.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: And I found that a lot of those maps over
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: there were not accurate. There were features that weren't.
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: There, or like usually the mountains. Was that stuff was
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: pretty good?
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: But yeah, like a like a waddy or a herb
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: field or whatever was either bigger or smaller than Yes,
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: and that was pretty challenging.
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: Yes, And that's when to get into nerdiness of it
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: a little more. You can you get out of your
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: car and you take your compass and you actually take
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: a heading of the road that you're on, okay, and
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: you can compare that to the map to see if
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: you're on the right road. Got it, as well as
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: using eurodometer to track. The other thing you can do
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: is you can take a heading from what feature you
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: think that is and see if that lines up with
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: where you're at on the map.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: And did you find on your compass that you would
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: just bake in the declination? Did you have accomplished compass
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: where you could just adjust for the magnetic declination and
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: then you just stuck with it?
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: We actually or did you calculate that each time?
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: Nope?
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: In Morocco they would with our checkpoints each say, they
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: would tell us what to declinate our compasses too, which
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: is great because that's almost impossible to keep up with
• 23:59
  Speaker 4: sure us when we're moving at that pace. Sure, there
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: was some days, if we had a really big transit day,
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: we might move half a degree or a degree, sure,
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: but it was.
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: Never too much. In the rebel, that changes a lot more.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: Got it because the distances are longer. Yes, got it? Yeah.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: At the end of the Ayisha de Gazelle's you've now
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: completed this incredible adventure. What were your big takeaways? Did
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: that feel like you came into this person that you
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: wanted to be? What did you learn from that that
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: has now affected your travels and stuff going forward.
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: I learned that one, I really love challenging myself, and
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: I need to challenge myself because it's as humans, I
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: think we all. Your brain is wired to make you comfortable,
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: and as soon as you are comfortable for a long time,
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: it's harder and harder to get out of that comfort
• 24:46
  Speaker 4: zone and to take a risk or to embarrass yourself,
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: which really is just your ego. At the end of
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: the day, I also learned I was capable of a
• 24:53
  Speaker 4: lot more than I thought I was.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: It was so easy.
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: Clay and I had been best friends for so long.
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: It's just at home even it's like, hey babe, can
• 25:00
  Speaker 4: you get that for me?
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: Oh?
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: Hey, babe, can you do this, and of course he's
• 25:03
  Speaker 4: an amazing gentleman, so he'll do it. And when you're
• 25:05
  Speaker 4: out there, you don't have that I can't be like, oh, hey,
• 25:07
  Speaker 4: can you go air down.
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: That tire or fix that tire.
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: Nope, it's I have to do that, and even if
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: I don't know how, I have to figure it out.
• 25:14
  Speaker 4: It's a great experience because there's no one looking over
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: your shoulder, either to see if you're doing it right
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: or wrong, or maybe giving you advice, which is very
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: well meaning.
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, just a note to all that are listening. Can
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: we stop with the man's blaming. That'd be great because
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: now I hear it and I'm like, oh, I used
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: to do that.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know it comes from a good place.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: I do like I have no issues, but it as
• 25:36
  Speaker 4: women were, so we're already embarrassed that we're trying something new.
• 25:40
  Speaker 4: So even if you're really trying to help give advice,
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: it makes us second guess ourselves. And I did things
• 25:46
  Speaker 4: that were totally wrong, but I got to the same
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: solution and then I was able to be like, Okay,
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: next time, I'm going to try it a different way.
• 25:53
  Speaker 4: And it just allows that space for me to mess
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: up and make mistakes.
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: So you found that you really appreciated the struggle. Yes,
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: being allowed to struggle. Yeah, not in the moment maybe,
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: but yes, I find that I'm that kind of a
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: learner too. If I if I don't have the struggle
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: a little bit, it doesn't bake in as deep. If
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: someone just helps me get to point Z too quickly
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: without bumbling a bit along the way, I don't tend
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: to retain it.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: As well exactly.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: And I'll even get really mad, like I'll be like,
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: why don't you help me with this? And Clay's like, hey,
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: you want to do it yourself. I'm like, oh, you're right, okay,
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: I'll figure it out.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: Well, And you did, and you completed this amazing event.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: And then, if I remember correctly, you decided to go back.
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: You liked it enough that or at least you liked
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: the struggle enough that I'm going to go do this again. Yeah,
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: so what happened next?
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: So these things are very addicting, which is why you
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: see teams come back again and again. And maybe you've
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: experienced this with your rallies or competitions, like next time,
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: I am going to do it this way, and so
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: doing the first one. Our goal was to have fun
• 26:59
  Speaker 4: and to learn and to finish. We didn't want to disqualify.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: So we finished that rally and you learn so much
• 27:06
  Speaker 4: your on site training that I couldn't wait to get back.
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: And I was like, I got to get back. And
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: then I saw the women and how they've done such
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: a good job at that rally of giving you a
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: platform because you have media, you have social photographers and newsletters,
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: and they really try to elevate these teams and what
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: they're doing. And I looked at that platform and where
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: I was at my journey, and that's when I was like,
• 27:28
  Speaker 4: I want to go back, and I want to use
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: it for something that I can speak to to hopefully
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: help women or whoever in the world. So that was
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: year two, and then from there we went right away
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: again to your three in twenty fifteen, and so we
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: got a little bit better each time. I think our
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: first year we came in like eighty ninth or something,
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: so awesome.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we finished.
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: So the next year we were forty eighth, and then
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: the year after that, I think we were twelfth or fourteenth,
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: I can't remember.
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: That it's amazing.
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: So I was like Okay, we're getting better, no doubt. Yeah, sorry,
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: I forgot what the question was. Totally just lost my
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: train of thought.
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: No, that's also good too.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: What I'm thinking of is what were like the key
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: takeaways for you that then helped you go on to
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: the next stage in your travels. So you do the
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: Aishad Gazelle's for several years, you gain all of this
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: knowledge and experience and confidence. What did you then see
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: as your next goal? Whatever that is? I mean, what
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: was Because there's this great opening that's happening, You're achieving
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: all of this amazing stuff, and then you want to
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: go do something else. What becomes the next goal?
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: It was interesting because the next goal for me at
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: the time was I wanted other women to experience what
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: I had experienced. So I knew in myself the change
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: that had taken place and the confidence that came with
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: at and I was like, more women need this experience,
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: they need a safe place to learn to make mistakes
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: and gain a little confidence. And so my kind of
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: goal came from that was wanting to get more women
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: involved in it. There was also other rallies I looked
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: at doing, which I would still love to go do,
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: but I don't think looking back, that wasn't really.
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: My primary goal.
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: I would say it was getting more women in the
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: space and waiting for the day when one of these
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: would happen in the US, which I was really excited about,
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: and to help women with training and get them into.
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: It, and that's exactly what happens.
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: So Emily Miller, who I look forward to having on
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: the podcast at some point in the near future. There's
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: an incredible person with a lot of experience around the
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: world and as a business person and everything else like that.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: So she decides to start the Rebel Rally in the US.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: And now tell me how that came about for you
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: and what was the next steps for you.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was really excited.
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: That was in twenty sixteen when she did the first one,
• 29:35
  Speaker 4: and at the time, you know, for exhibition overland, we
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: had done Alaska. At that point, we done Central America,
• 29:41
  Speaker 4: and then I'd always really wanted to just do more
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: in the US. And I was like, because I would
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: hear we'd be at these events and women would come
• 29:48
  Speaker 4: up and be like, oh my gosh, I want to
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: do that, but I can't afford to go to Morocco
• 29:51
  Speaker 4: that's just a big commitment, and it is. It's a
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: massive commitment. And so finally I was like, here's your chance.
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: Now there's one in the US, and it's a third
• 29:59
  Speaker 4: of the price going to be training. You know, you
• 30:01
  Speaker 4: don't have to learn another language. It's a great entry
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: point and it's in other ways it's a lot more difficult.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: I think it makes you a better navigator. So Emily
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: it had been one of her goals for a long
• 30:11
  Speaker 4: time because she saw all these pieces and she was like, Oh,
• 30:14
  Speaker 4: if we could like put these pieces together, what could
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: we create in the US.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: It would just be phenomenal. And so I got to
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: be one of the first teams in twenty sixteen in
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: the inaugural event, and it's leaps and bounds different to
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: where it is now. It's amazing to watch how she
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: grows it and changes it every year and the mistakes
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: they've made and then learned and applied it and made
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: it an even better event.
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: We're going to take a brief break and we will
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: be right back. This week's episode is supported in part
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: by icamper I make innovative hardshell and soft sided riof
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: tents that are designed to survive long term overland use.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: Their revolutionary X cover won the Overland Journal Editor's Choice Award,
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  Speaker 1: eliminating the bulky PBC cover and also allowing for the
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: fitment of crossbars for carrying and kayaks. Their Skycamp Mini
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: is another award winning design that provides a hardshell tent
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: in the footprint of a much smaller clamshell model. This
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: is the perfect solution for smaller vehicles or on vehicles
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: where rack space is dedicated to other systems. I Camper
• 31:16
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  Speaker 1: the world with those you love most. You can find
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: out more about their quality tents at Kamper dot com.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: It seems like that she does.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: Emily does an amazing job of surrounding herself with exceptional people. Yes,
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: and anytime you do that, even if you get a
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: couple things wrong, it's like when you surround yourself with
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: that kind of caliber of individuals.
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: Yes, you don't.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: Stay in that place for very long. It quickly accelerates. Yeah,
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: that's what I've seen. I mean, she's so impressive.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, very true. I would agree with one hundred percent.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: Talk about this is a question that I've always had
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: about the Rebel is how do they keep people from
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: driving too fast? Because that is one of the challenges
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: is it's very easy to say like I'm going to
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: do trophy truck light and I'm going to drive super fast.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: Like how do they manage that making sure people aren't
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: driving too fast because these are open public roads.
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So the.
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: Way it's set up is the rebel is one, it's
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: not a race for speed, so you get no extra
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: points for going faster. It may save you time throughout
• 32:21
  Speaker 4: your day to get more checkpoints. So there's that concept.
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: It's a very different concept from like a Baja race
• 32:27
  Speaker 4: where you're just gone to the wall seat who gets
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: their fastest. The other thing is is she really ingrains
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: in people that this car is your third teammate and
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: it needs to get you all the way to day
• 32:36
  Speaker 4: eight because if you break your car, which usually happens
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: because you're going too fast, you might not finish. And
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: then look at all of that prep and work that
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: you put into this and you made one dumb airr
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: and went too fast and I have to drop out.
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: So it's a combination of sportsmanship and mechanical sympathy that
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: keeps people a little bit mindful of speed, but they
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: don't have they don't have any tractors on their do
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: so they can keep an eye on somebody doing one
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: hundred and fifteen.
• 33:02
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, so they also have trackers. Yeah, they can
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: tell how fast you're going at any time during the day.
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: And also Emily has worked really hard to get the
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: permits to allow this many cars to go through these
• 33:14
  Speaker 4: certain public lands, and she tells us all as teammates
• 33:19
  Speaker 4: were like, Hey, if you guys don't respect this, we
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: will not have a rebel in the future because we
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: will get shut down. So that's one aspect is everyone
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: carries that responsibility and then if it needs to come
• 33:31
  Speaker 4: down to it, they'll just take points away if you're
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: speeding dock points.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: That's good because it changes the nature of the event
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: so much where it removes some of these really interesting
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: skills and then it just becomes about who can build
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: the biggest, fastest truck exactly. And that's what I really
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: like about it. I like the fact that there are
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: all of these skills that in many ways directly correlate
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: to travel as well. But it allows for teams to
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: show up with a stock Tacoma yes, they've done all
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: of their training and they've learned how to navigate. They
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: can actually place really well without a lot of money
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: being spent very well.
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: She really encourages.
• 34:10
  Speaker 4: She actually has its own categorization called the bone stock category,
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: and that was actually the year my teammate and I
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: won in twenty nineteen. We took a bone Stock Lexus
• 34:19
  Speaker 4: GX four six. That's right, and it if you looked
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: at that thing and the places we took it, it's
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: like it didn't make sense.
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: They're amazing vehicles.
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: Though they're amazing vehicles, and it's that thing she really
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: wants to drive home is, hey, you don't need the
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: suspension and then all the things that we think we need, right,
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: you do need to learn how to be a good driver,
• 34:38
  Speaker 4: because if you learn these simple foundational skills and practice them,
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: you can take just about any car and do what
• 34:44
  Speaker 4: we're doing over nine days.
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: What was one of the craziest things that happened to you?
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: You've done that three years? Ye Now, okay, so you've
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: done three years of the rebel. What is the single
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: most insane thing that happened in any one of those events?
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: I want to know, Oh man, maybe there wasn't one.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: Maybe, I mean, I think there's a lot that happened.
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: Maybe I'd block them out there.
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: There was definitely one area that we had the GX
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: in and it was like, I forget where we were.
• 35:10
  Speaker 4: We were We were in an open OHV area and
• 35:13
  Speaker 4: it sees a lot of side by sides and a
• 35:15
  Speaker 4: lot of turphy chucks. It wasn't Johnson Valley. It was
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: another one. And the whoops were like, I mean, just giant,
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: and it had gotten a lot of moisture before and
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: we had this these two blue checkpoints that were up
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: around this like canyon kind of mountain, and then it
• 35:29
  Speaker 4: would come back down to base camp. And so as usual,
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: it's getting late, we're close to our time, and we're like,
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: I think we can snag those last blue checkpoints.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: I think we can do it. Let's go for it.
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: And I'm going and the road, the road, the track
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: seems okay, and then we turn a corner and it's
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: just ruts and whoops, and I so those GX is
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: on the back. You can raise the suspension if you're
• 35:50
  Speaker 4: under what is it, eighteen miles per hour or something.
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: So I would literally go at it at a diagonal
• 35:55
  Speaker 4: and just creep down in this woop and put the
• 35:59
  Speaker 4: suspension up and then creep out of it.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: And it was It took us probably three times as
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: long as we thought it would take us.
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: You'll make it in time.
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: We did make it in time, and we got one
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: of them.
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: Oh that's good. So it was worth the risk.
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: It was worth the risk at that point. I don't
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: I don't know if I would have done it again.
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: If I would have known what that terrain is, I
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: would have been like, it's not worth it.
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: I remember talking to Joe Baccall and I said, what
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: are you going to use for pre running? Is like,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: I just take one of the one of the gx's.
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: That's what they would just pull a GX out of
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: like the test fleet in Arizona and go pre run
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: the five hundred or the one thousand totally stock vehicles.
• 36:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they are really amazing, Yeah amazing, how good they
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: work well. So, now, pivoting a little bit from your
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: successful racing career in the AI should A Gazelle's and
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: the Rebel Rally, what were some of the things that
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: you learned from that that you feel has directly translated
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: to travel for you? Those takeaways that you found yourself
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: employing when you're in Baja filming with x Overland. What
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: were some of the things that you pulled away from
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: that training and racing that you find applies now to travel.
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah, first and foremost, we mental toughness, because these are
• 37:08
  Speaker 4: long rallies. They're eight to nine days, let's travel time,
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: and you're in the car ten to fourteen hours a day,
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: give or take day after day, sleeping in a tent,
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: and the mental you kind of everyone knows you hit
• 37:20
  Speaker 4: that wall and you have a choice to make. Okay,
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: am I going to give up and just throw a
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: fit and just say this sucks and what am I
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: doing here? And back off? Or am I going to
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: push through that wall? Have a good attitude, finish strong,
• 37:33
  Speaker 4: and do the best I can, even even if I
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: just made a really horrible mistake, which we've done many times.
• 37:38
  Speaker 4: So the mental toughness it takes to continue going to
• 37:41
  Speaker 4: have a good attitude, learn how to take care of
• 37:44
  Speaker 4: your body and yourself to get you to the end
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: and still come out with a great relationship with your teammate.
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: Communication is the biggest takeaway for me because when we're
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: on ex Overland trips watching it.
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: A lot of people don't.
• 37:56
  Speaker 4: See it's a slog. It is a lot of work.
• 38:00
  Speaker 4: We're filming, you know, filming comes first. So it's twelve
• 38:03
  Speaker 4: to fourteen hour days and you're with eight people and
• 38:05
  Speaker 4: you're all sleeping together, you're working together, you're doing everything
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: for three weeks, four weeks, six weeks. So carrying all
• 38:13
  Speaker 4: those skills through of communication and knowing when I need
• 38:16
  Speaker 4: to walk away and just have a little bit of
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: a space or alone time digging, you know, pulling up
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: your bootstaffs and being like, I'm so exhausted, I don't
• 38:23
  Speaker 4: want to run out there and get Do we really
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: need this shot? Yes, we do, because we're doing the
• 38:27
  Speaker 4: best work, and that's what it takes. I would one
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: hundred percent say the mental toughness and learning how to
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: communicate effectively.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: On the maybe the hard skills side, how have you
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: found that those navigation skills, I mean it does make
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: a direct correlation from my mind, But what were maybe
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: some of the some of the things that you took
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: away that you realize, Yes, now I'm a better traveler
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: because of being a racer.
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: Driving skills, for one was a big deal. Knowing how
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: to listen to my car. Clay is always getting so
• 38:57
  Speaker 4: frustrated with me because I'm the one that's like, no,
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: it's fine, it's fine, It's it's fine, you know, and
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: he's it's a Toyota, it's fine, and he's like, we're chell.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: You have to stop.
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: If something doesn't feel right, we have to stop and
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: take the time to fix it. And so learning how
• 39:11
  Speaker 4: to be in tune with your vehicle, how it's supposed
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: to be feeling, what's off, get out and look at it.
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: Don't be afraid to try things if something doesn't seem right.
• 39:21
  Speaker 4: Even I'm really bad at mechanics. That is, I need
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: to go to mechanics school.
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: Sounds interesting, I'm really.
• 39:26
  Speaker 4: Bad at it. I think Jeffer Clay told me. They're like,
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: just look at something. If something doesn't look normal, that's
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: all we need to know, and then you can go
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: from that sense. Just taking those little technical skills is
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: really helpful for us learning. I'm constantly working on my
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: throttle control driving well, because if the guys are flying
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: drones or need a certain shot, they need a really
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: smooth driver, and that it's a very complex machine.
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: It is so.
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: And then in travel, just being in Morocco and interacting
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: with the culture, being in the villages, and I loved
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: the cool thing about that is you go through parts
• 40:01
  Speaker 4: of Morocco, a lot of people don't get to see.
• 40:03
  Speaker 4: We're out there with nomads in the middle of the desert.
• 40:05
  Speaker 4: Just having the empathy for people of oh my gosh,
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: this is your life. You live here with your two
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: kids in the middle of a desert and you have
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: a goat, and this is it. I don't I don't
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: think anybody that sees that wouldn't be changed or moved
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: by that. So it's all of those pieces come into
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: play for me.
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: How do you feeling How do you feel like those
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: experiences changed or moved you?
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: Good question, Scott.
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: I think they just continually remind me that my little
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: box of a world is not all that there is
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: in life. There is a big world out there, and
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: we can, especially in America, it's just very easy with
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: everything we have going on, to be very what is
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: it introspective, which can be a good thing, but it
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: can also kind of dictate a lot of things around you.
• 40:47
  Speaker 4: I think that's why we love to push people, even
• 40:49
  Speaker 4: on ex overland, to cross a border and to experience
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: another culture, because when you interact with another culture and
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: you see how others live, I think it just gives
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: you such a respect for other people in the world
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: and why they do the things they do. It makes sense,
• 41:04
  Speaker 4: you know. It goes back to the age old quote
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: like walk a mile in their shoes.
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: It's so true.
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: Well, and you can realize that what may on the
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: surface appear as having less than yeah, oftentimes is the
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: opposite where they have much more than we do, yes,
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: which is they laugh more, they spend more time with
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: their families. Yes, they spend more time preparing meals and
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: interacting with their neighbors and their friends. So it is
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: it's very easy to look simply at the world through
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: our own lens, which gives us we miss out on
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: that opportunity to change. And I think that that is
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: where travel is so beautiful, is that it just opens
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: your mind to the fact that there's a thousand different
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: ways to live, a million different ways to live. If
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: I take a little bit of the good from each
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: of those things, my life might actually change for the better.
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, I love I call them nuggets.
• 41:58
  Speaker 4: I love taking a nugget kind of of information from
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: where I go that impacts me might not impact anybody else,
• 42:05
  Speaker 4: but it made a difference to me. Whether that's a
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: book I'm reading or show I'm watching, or somewhere I'm traveling,
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: I can always learn something and get something out of
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: that that can better my life.
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: Speaking kind of on that front, if someone was to
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: come up to you, like, let's say a family member
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: that has been following your adventures around the world and
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: they want to start to travel, and they said, Rachelle,
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: what advice would you give me being new to overlanding?
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: What advice would you give someone that they're new to
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: going and seeing the world.
• 42:34
  Speaker 4: I would say, stay teachable, try not to carry our
• 42:37
  Speaker 4: own biases into another country, because anytime we travel, it's
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: like going into someone else's house. How do you act
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: in someone else's house. You don't walk in and be like, well,
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: a demand this food or why don't you have this?
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: You know it's their house, you don't live there. And
• 42:51
  Speaker 4: just having a lot of respect and being very teachable
• 42:55
  Speaker 4: is a great place to start, whether going up to
• 42:58
  Speaker 4: the state park or in another state that's not your
• 43:00
  Speaker 4: house either. You know they have even by states, I see,
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: there's a little different culture and things that we have differently,
• 43:06
  Speaker 4: So just be willing to be teachable and to learn,
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: and you don't need all the fancy gear. I know
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: at ex Overland we have a lot of gear, but
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: we run a production company out of those tracks, sure,
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: and we have different obligations, so that's how we have traveled.
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: But I love being like Kurt does, and I know
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: you do.
• 43:23
  Speaker 4: You throw a stove or a jet boil in the
• 43:25
  Speaker 4: back of a car and just go somewhere and you
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: will actually learn more from that experience of what you
• 43:29
  Speaker 4: really need or what's important to you to make that
• 43:32
  Speaker 4: a better travel experience for you.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's there's a million different ways to travel,
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: and I think being very well prepared with a lot
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: of high quality equipment and especially high quality vehicles, you
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: can actually stick closer to a plan, so you can
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: oftentimes see more. You have less interruptions because you don't
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: need to go find this thing or that, or the
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: vehicle doesn't have a problem. So I think being well prepared,
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: like I see with X Overland, it does have its advantages,
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: But then so does throwing us wag on the back
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: of a motorcycle and just figuring it out.
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: It all depends on what you wantactly.
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: Exactly, and I think that they both have very much
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: have their place.
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: One of the things that I like to ask in
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: these interviews is the books that have had an influence
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: on you, or maybe some takeaways those maybe some of
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: those nuggets that you have heard from people that have
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: been your mentors in your life, or maybe a podcast
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: that you like. I mean, obviously X Overland produces some
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: of the highest quality video content in the world, so
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: that's a great place for people to.
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: Go to learn more.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: But how about for Rachelle, what where do you draw
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: that inspiration from.
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: I love a lot of podcasts.
• 44:39
  Speaker 4: I would say, man, I was definitely on a Oh gosh,
• 44:45
  Speaker 4: what is his name? I'm gonna have to get back
• 44:46
  Speaker 4: to you on his name. Okay, Obviously it's very important
• 44:49
  Speaker 4: to me because I can't even remember. I love a
• 44:51
  Speaker 4: lot of rachel Hollis's books. Okay, she speaks a lot.
• 44:54
  Speaker 4: One of the books that I loved it was her
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: first kind of nonfiction. It was called Girl Washer Face.
• 45:00
  Speaker 4: It was basically a book on like, hey, if you
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: want your life to change, then do something. Don't sit
• 45:04
  Speaker 4: there expecting the same different results, right, It's stupidity. To
• 45:07
  Speaker 4: sit in the same thing you're doing and do it
• 45:09
  Speaker 4: day in and day out expecting different results.
• 45:11
  Speaker 3: So that's a definition of insanity.
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, definition of insanity.
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: Yep.
• 45:16
  Speaker 4: So it was just a very It was a book
• 45:19
  Speaker 4: I needed at the time to kind of it was
• 45:20
  Speaker 4: a good kick in the pants to be like, all right,
• 45:22
  Speaker 4: you know what, Yeah, I need to do better at
• 45:24
  Speaker 4: these things, or this is something.
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: Stirring in me.
• 45:26
  Speaker 4: I just need to start, whether that's writing something down,
• 45:30
  Speaker 4: making a plan, making a dream list of Hey, in
• 45:32
  Speaker 4: two years, do I want my life to look exactly
• 45:35
  Speaker 4: like it does now or do I want it to
• 45:36
  Speaker 4: look different? I would say that's one thing I really
• 45:38
  Speaker 4: encourage people is, you know, we hear it a lot.
• 45:41
  Speaker 4: We'll go back to your roots. Well, why aren't you
• 45:43
  Speaker 4: doing what you used to do ten years ago? I'm like,
• 45:45
  Speaker 4: I don't want to be the same person I was
• 45:47
  Speaker 4: ten years ago. She wasn't awesome, she was okay. But
• 45:51
  Speaker 4: I would never want to not grow, because if you're
• 45:54
  Speaker 4: not growing, you're dying.
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: It's true, you know.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very difficult to stay a steady state that
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: we're either getting either getting stronger or we're getting weaker.
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that book to me was really helpful. I
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: love reading.
• 46:08
  Speaker 4: It's called The Gift of Fear, and it sounds counterintuitive,
• 46:12
  Speaker 4: it's actually a great book. We recommend it to a
• 46:13
  Speaker 4: lot of our team members that travel with us, and
• 46:15
  Speaker 4: it's really about listening to your gut instinct and as women,
• 46:19
  Speaker 4: I was never taught to do that. I was raised
• 46:21
  Speaker 4: to be a good girl, and you think the best
• 46:23
  Speaker 4: of people, and you don't make a fuss and you're kind,
• 46:26
  Speaker 4: and so I always neglected my gut because I would
• 46:30
  Speaker 4: rationalize it away. And so that book is really good
• 46:32
  Speaker 4: about being like, hey, listen to your gut. So I
• 46:35
  Speaker 4: recommend that to anybody traveling.
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: And that's being kind to yourself. Yes, I think.
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of times you see people and
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: myself included, I've had to learn this that being nice
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: is not always being kind No, either to yourself or
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: to others, that you're usually better off being very clear
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: that this isn't working, or I need to set a
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: boundary here or whatever, especially with your travel mates. Yes,
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: like this, if you don't feel comfortable in a place, yep,
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: everyone has to respect that this one individual feels like
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: this is not right.
• 47:04
  Speaker 3: We got to move on yep.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: That's a rule in our group.
• 47:07
  Speaker 4: If if any one team member does not feel like this,
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: we should camp here, stay here, talk to this person,
• 47:13
  Speaker 4: no questions asked, we pack up and move.
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's good.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 47:16
  Speaker 4: Another good book boundaries. Read a book on boundaries. I
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: was never taught that. I don't think a lot of
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: people were. It seems to be happening more and more now,
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: but doctor Henry Cloud wrote a really good one and
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: that really impacted my life for the better. Especially when
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: you travel to different cultures like Morocco. They do not
• 47:33
  Speaker 4: listen to you when you say no. I don't know
• 47:35
  Speaker 4: if you have this experience. Hey, come to my shop
• 47:37
  Speaker 4: and maybe it's because I'm a woman. I don't know,
• 47:39
  Speaker 4: So come to my shop and buy rug. I'm like no, no, no, no,
• 47:42
  Speaker 4: you have to and they'll like literally like take you
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: by the hand and want to pull you. And it
• 47:45
  Speaker 4: was like, oh, you aren't offended if I say no,
• 47:48
  Speaker 4: and I have to actually get very firm with you.
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: Maybe I don't have to do that in the States,
• 47:52
  Speaker 4: but learning boundaries is very key to travel and listening
• 47:56
  Speaker 4: to your gut.
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and having those in place with your travel companion,
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: because that's when you can have those misunderstandings and hurt
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: feelings can compound by not speaking up early about how
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: we feel about something.
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm still learning that me too, very much.
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: So it's something I work on all the time. Need
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: to do better at for sure. Those are great suggestions.
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: On the book side. How do people find out more
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: about the Rebel Rally Trophy? I Isha de Gazelle's any
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: recommendations that you would have for someone that's listening that
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: wants to go have an adventure like that.
• 48:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so if you go to I can't remember if
• 48:32
  Speaker 4: it's the or just Rebel Rally dot com, it'll pop
• 48:35
  Speaker 4: up right away. And they actually just launched a new website.
• 48:37
  Speaker 4: It's gorgeous. It's full of information. It's full of a
• 48:40
  Speaker 4: lot of trainings throughout the year that they will offer
• 48:43
  Speaker 4: in different parts of the US. Also a Facebook group,
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: I can't remember they've got a few, but just the
• 48:48
  Speaker 4: Rebel Rally Facebook group is a great place to interact
• 48:50
  Speaker 4: with others and a lot of the questions that I
• 48:53
  Speaker 4: get asked, they're all kind of helping each other out
• 48:55
  Speaker 4: in this group in answering those questions.
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: The rallies.
• 48:58
  Speaker 4: De Gazelle's You can also go to the website. If
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: you just google Gazelle Rally Morocco, it'll pop up. Sure,
• 49:04
  Speaker 4: I believe there's an English version, so click the English
• 49:06
  Speaker 4: and it'll pop up. They're offering a lot of different
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: rallies now, which is really fun cool and there's more
• 49:11
  Speaker 4: popping up throughout the world, which I'm really excited to.
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: Learn about it.
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: And then how do people find out more about excels
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: and how do they find out more about xoverland and
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: you as a traveler?
• 49:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so you can go to xoverland dot com is
• 49:25
  Speaker 4: our main website. We just launched a whole new network
• 49:28
  Speaker 4: and we're really excited about that.
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: We'll be pulling in what's the name of the new network.
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's called the Overlander Network.
• 49:35
  Speaker 3: Do they just go overlandernetwork dot com?
• 49:37
  Speaker 4: Is that how they It's actually special dot tv okay,
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: Flash Overlander Network okay, and that will take them to it.
• 49:45
  Speaker 4: It's the first time we've done kind of behind the
• 49:47
  Speaker 4: paywall and we're really excited about it. It's opening a
• 49:50
  Speaker 4: lot of doors to have future storytellers on there that
• 49:53
  Speaker 4: we can showcase separate projects we can do, as well
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: as doing what we do with Xoverland.
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: What an amazing concept.
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: I think that we need that in the space a
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: way for because creating beautiful content is time consuming and
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: expensive and people it's only fair that they are compensated
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: in some ways. So it makes sense to have a
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: network like that where the creator and the creative and
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: the network manager is able to all make some fair
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: compensation from that.
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're really excited about it.
• 50:21
  Speaker 4: And then my own is Theexcels dot com or you
• 50:24
  Speaker 4: can find me there on Instagram under Rachelle Croft or
• 50:27
  Speaker 4: the Excels. The Excels kind of comes and goes because
• 50:29
  Speaker 4: it's it's not a priority, it's a side and it
• 50:32
  Speaker 4: kind of pops up when I'm in rally season. I'm
• 50:34
  Speaker 4: hoping in the future to be able to offer more
• 50:37
  Speaker 4: beginner classes for women. I just got asked, actually right
• 50:39
  Speaker 4: before I popped in here, She's like, when.
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: Are you doing that? Like, I don't know, but I
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: need to do it.
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's great. And then what is next for you?
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: What's the next big adventure for Rachelle Now that you've
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: done all these amazing things, what's next?
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: Great question, so you want to.
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: Go, Yeah, well, my next adventure for this year's Rebel
• 50:57
  Speaker 4: is I'm actually going to be their live show host.
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: Perfect So they do a live show every day of
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: the rally. It's morning.
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: They just do a course check in afternoon and then
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: a show at night, so you can tune in live
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: and we give the highlights of the day. I'm really
• 51:13
  Speaker 4: going to be in the competition. Since I have been
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: a competitor, They're excited to have me come on and
• 51:18
  Speaker 4: kind of think strategy of why teams made the choices
• 51:20
  Speaker 4: they did and where I think they'll go.
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: So that's gonna When does the Rebel start. It's soon,
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: isn't it.
• 51:26
  Speaker 4: It's October seventh, very soon, like a week after I'm
• 51:30
  Speaker 4: home from XO. Yeah, I'll have a week home check
• 51:33
  Speaker 4: in with the kiddos, turn around, and fly out.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: But I'm really excited about it.
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: That's amazing. Rachelle, thank you so much for being on
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: the podcast. Clay and you both are like some of
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: my dearest friends, and I'm so grateful for both of
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: you and everything that you guys have accomplished. I think
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: it is such not only a testament to achieving your
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: dreams if you put enough energy and gumption behind it,
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: but also being an inspiration to others. You guys have
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: always done such a wonderful job of inspiring people to
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: go see the world and we are all so grateful
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: for that.
• 52:02
  Speaker 4: Thank you, Scott, I mean you inspired us, so it
• 52:05
  Speaker 4: all comes back around.
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: It does absolutely well.
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Rochelle, and we thank you all
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: for listening and we will talk to you next time.