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A Veteran's Journey to Healing through Hiking · Off You Pop!

• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: This is Off You Pop, the podcast for hikers and adventurers who want to be epic in just one day.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: Today's episode is personal.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: Jason isn't just my co-founder.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: He's a US Army veteran who walked out of service with the same thing a lot of veterans carry.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: A story he didn't know how to tell yet.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: He'll be the first to say the uniform comes off fast, but the mission doesn't.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_01: And when the mission disappears, you're left staring at a version of yourself you don't fully recognize.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: What he found, slowly, stubbornly, honestly, was that the trail gave him something the civilian world didn't.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: Structure, challenge, and a place to breathe without pretending everything was fine.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: This episode isn't about heroics.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's about the quiet fight that happens after the fight.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's about rebuilding identity one mile at a time.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're a veteran listening, this one's for you.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: Not to recruit you into anything, but to remind you that you're not alone.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: There's a place out there where your grit still matters.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: This is Guest Pop.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: This is Jason Perkins, and this is Off You Pop.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: So Jason, uh welcome to the podcast.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Very special guest because you're our first guest, and also a very special guest because you're co-founder of Blister Pop.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: And uh you've been the silent behind uh all the action.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: You haven't really made it onto social yet, and uh you haven't been on the podcast yet, but I know people are gonna be excited to learn about you and all the great things you you've been doing.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_01: And uh hopefully this is the first of a lot of these types of conversations that we're gonna have.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: But today it's really about you and about your veteran experience, because I think that brings something unique to Blister Pop and something that I think a lot of folks like you, hikers like us, uh, you know, getting out into the wilderness because it's a place where you can heal.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: So let's uh let's get into the podcast.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: So let's start with, you know, what part of military life shape you the most, for better or worse?
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: Well, first of all, let me say thank you for having me, Philip.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate it.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, the military journey for me was interesting.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: It was really a search for discipline for me out of high school.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: I was really lacking some true guidance and was too smart for my education, but too dumb to follow directions.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: And my father said that the military discipline was the right place for me.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: So in my eyes, I ended up following in his footsteps and going down the path of when I went and tested at MEPS.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: I tested high in mathematics, and they wanted to put me in all these types of different mission essential type roles, back office type things and stuff.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I went into combat MBOS and followed my father's footsteps into the 82nd Airborne.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that was really where I found the structure and discipline that really helped me kind of structure and gave me the foundation for my life that I've kind of taken into the rest of my journey in life.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: So thinking about your service, what do you what do you think you carried out of service that people don't usually see?
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: The constant mental preparation of being ready at, you know, two hours notice to go anywhere in the world and how that that that preparation on your mind to be ready for those scenarios any day and at at any time is really kind of the impact that it left on me that I took out into the normal world that you just don't see.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: You don't see those in veterans, you don't see that type of structure that they've gone through and seen in their lives.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: So so thinking about when you when you left the military, what was the thing that nobody really warned you about?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Oh for me it was uh it was a loss of separation.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: It just felt like I was losing my village and I didn't realize it, my people.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: There was a a disconnect.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: I went out on a a military discharge of uh a medical discharge is what I meant to say.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so for my separation it was very cold.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: The military separated me like I was damaged material.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: So there was a big disconnect that I felt like the family that I had believed in and developed and worked so hard to be a part of was now just kind of cutting me loose into the world without any connection.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: And that was one thing that was really hard for me that I've struggled with for a long time and probably still struggle with.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: So so was there a moment when you realized I'm not okay or you know I need something different?
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think a lot of for a lot of veterans it's an ongoing it's horrible to say, but it's an it's an ongoing, it's a mask, it's a lie that we try to we carry for a long time that we don't realize that there's something wrong with us still.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: And we pretend like there's nothing wrong.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: We tell everyone that everything's okay.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, it was a compilation of man, it was later in my career, it was probably 2016, and I had gotten diagnosed with multiple sclerosis, and it was this changing moment of feeling like I was I was just lost and I didn't know where to turn.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I you know, the military friends and the military background that I'd had I'd reached out to and there was just like this empty spot of feeling like I didn't have I didn't have that culture anymore.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't have that place to go to find my heart or to find my my place where my mind was at ease.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: So so how did you handle the pressure to look, you know, squared away even when you weren't feeling that way?
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think a lot of us it's it's a mask of everything.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: For me it was I hid from hid from the the things that I was struggling with from overworking and overcommitting and just over-responsibility and never truly addressing what was troubling me mentally as a veteran.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for me it was it was just uh that constant struggle.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: I just never felt at peace in myself and was always looking for for that next journey and that next that next mission, I guess is the easy way to say it.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: It sounds crazy, but you come out and the structure of the military has you very focused in in different areas, but once you separate, there's a big disconnect, and you have to find your way and struggle through that, and the support mechanisms aren't very clear.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: So you're kind of left out on your own in this this scenario.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: So you you try to find scenarios, and for me it was trying to find scenarios that put my mind into hard spaces and really into that hard struggle that the military taught me how to challenge and manage my way through is where I found peace.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_01: So what did support look like for you by that time or do you wish it looked like for you?
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny because you y you realize after the fact that people were trying to support you on some levels, but you were too stubborn or too for a lot of us too broken to really take that help.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: We didn't know how to ask for help.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: I think for me personally, just personal experience, asking for help in the military wasn't something you did.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: I I just kind of tried to figure things out on my own and it was more of a survival mechanism.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: So when I came out to the real world and I struggled with mental health issues or separation from friends that I had lost or different things in that environment, it just didn't prepare me.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: I I just didn't know how to communicate.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: I I think that I wish there was better communication for me.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: I know the support was there on some levels, but it it's only started to really get better mental health-wise over the last few years.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: So it's I think that's an ongoing issue for for us as veterans as a whole.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So if you could talk to that version of yourself now, what would you say?
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think for me, the simplicity is I need a little bit of heart in my life.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: I have to constantly be searching to find that that next challenge or that next mission.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's really the foundation of of what I of how I operate and how I I process do things.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: As I started going on hikes, I realized that internally they were like mental missions for my mind and I would challenge myself whether they were to a summit and back down or to a point-to-point location.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And through those times my mind became clear, not on everything, but normally there was one subject of hard that I was having issues with over the past months or and through the challenge of being out there on the trail, it's it's it's allowed me to find focus to deal with those issues, I think, is is really where I found it.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: That's great.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: So let's let's switch a little bit to talking about hiking and about the trails and do you remember what the first hike or challenge was that actually made you shift?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: Something inside you changed.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think it was my timing was right like 2022.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that was the first time we met.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: My mom had passed away and I had just came out of a couple different races, the death race and the gauntlet and different type of challenge races as I was doing.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the Alderhythm had picked me up and sent me something called World Record Attempt at Mount Everest for the world's highest optical course and then descent of an I believe it was like a marathon down.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so I decided that that was how I would honor my mom's passing, that I would take her ashes to Mount Everest and try to give her the highest point to the heavens.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I signed up to go on this hike that was in a lot of lot of terms epic.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: And that was really thy my first first time in a long time that I'd found peace, a lot of clarity, a lot of transition out of just pain and suffering of darkness, and really just was able to let some true emotions go.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: Really let some things transition out of me that was kind of bothering me.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: So sorry about that.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no, no, I you know, I remember that hike very well.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: For me, that was also, you know, a real opportunity to really experience what it's like to be out in the wilderness at the extreme end where the environment can kill you.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: And up until that point, I've been like you've been doing a lot of these organized events, you know, uh obstacle course races, venture races.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: But that one was really one where we were pushing the limits and we were in a completely hostile environment.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_01: I remember even a couple of folks uh dropped out and it was it was a real struggle.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I just I just have this this moment I remember, and I think you're probably asleep.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: I was, I think we were about 15,000 feet or so in one of the small towns on up on the way to Everest Base Camp and it was the middle of the night and I was suffering from the altitude and I started hyperventilating.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: And every time I would think I was about to fall asleep, I get this like the dog I'm gonna die.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I had to get rushed to the to the doctor.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought, I'm I'm a super fit guy, and this is the first time I've really felt like I might actually die.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: What am I doing?
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: So that really was a life-changing experience.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember we were lucky we had a you know a strong support team of, you know, like-minded athletes.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that was such a great experience because we were, you know, all going through sort of this similar life-changing uh uh event, and it was great to have a lot of folks there to support us.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: So when did you when did you realize that adventure wasn't just recreation, it was really recovery?
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I think in that moment, I mean that was the start of it.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's recovery, it's it it's therapy, it it's it's mental health therapy on a level that people don't talk about.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think on that trip and all the trips after, they've just built on mechanisms of giving me clarity on things that I've struggled with and remembering when you know life truly does get hard, that we have this.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: We got this, that there's support mechanisms out there that you've challenged yourself, that you can handle these challenges.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: And even speaking on back to the Everest trip, the amount of people that were so uniquely different on that trip that were all finding struggles on different mental issues was it was really epic to feel emotionally.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: There was just something healing to understand that from a doctor to an athlete to a CEO, that all these people were having the same mental type struggles and they were able to find clarity out on the trail.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's when it really started to pay dividends and understanding.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: And it didn't happen in that moment there.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: It happened when I came back and had months of just really understanding and relax or just you know thinking back on that time that we shared on the mountain and on the trail and the heart and just everything that was accomplished for everybody on that trip was just kind of what it reminds me of.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I you know, one one great thing I took away from that trip, I mean, apart from our our friendship and all the adventures we've had since then is I think one of the one of the hike leaders there said to me this one thing that I I keep carrying with me.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, the mountains have their own time.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: And whenever I'm out in the mountains, often when I'm on my own and I'm starting a hike and you're kind of trying to settle into it, you're sort of carrying all with all that stress and aggravation with you from the week, and you're out there in the wilderness on your own.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: I sort of overeager, still like got that stress, and I think, you know what?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: The mountains have their own time.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: This hike's gonna take as long as it takes.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: And that sort of settles me down, and that's where the sort of the relief and the recovery really begin.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: At least in my mind.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: So let's move on to to blister pop.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: So we've been hiking together now for like four or five years.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Doesn't seem like that long, so yeah, crazy.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we've done some uh some really challenging hikes, um, partly because I think we're both driven by the challenge and doing hard things and really wanting to push ourselves.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think we both know that's really where the healing and the recovery begin.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really what started this idea of you know bringing this to people and bringing this structure and organization to everyone so that they can really take on these difficult and challenging hikes.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I've already had to say this a few times.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: We've only been doing this for three or four months, so I've already said this to a number of people.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: They've said to me, you know, what's your your easiest hike?
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: Well, there isn't an easiest hike.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: These are supposed to be hard hikes.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: So how would you say your military background shapes the way you think about sort of the systems that we're putting together, safety on the mountain, and the challenge itself?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: I think with both of our experiences that we have, uh we look at these uh blister pops as really individual missions that people can go do.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: And the amount of detailed work that we try to put in in the podcasts and the guides is really to really make it as safe and really as informational as possible.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna say easy because none of these hikes are supposed to be easy, but what they're supposed to be is informational.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: You have the systems in play to have the maximum chance of success and really have the maximum chance of getting all the energy that that mountain has for you or that trail has for you.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: We're trying to really maximize the logistics in your hand through the podcast and the guide to where when you go on these hikes, that all you really have to do is focus on your journey of recovery and really knocking it out of the park because they're not easy.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: I've been on what we've been on three out of them right now, three out of the 21.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: And everyone has presented its unique challenges so far.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm excited to continue to try to knock out the rest over the next two or three years.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that really that structure that the military gave me about having as much information as you can before you go into the mission to maximize success with maximum safety is really what we're looking for.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: I I think this might be a British military thing.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: Have you heard of the six Ps?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: No, I haven't.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Tell me, tell me.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: Planning and preparation prevents piss-poor performance.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: So there you go.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: So that's really what this is about.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we're trying to make sure that these things are doable.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: And certainly we've, I mean, we haven't just done the blister pop hikes, we've done a whole bunch of hiking over the years.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: And uh we've made mistakes and we've put ourselves in danger.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: We've made safety errors, and it's really that experience of understanding, you know, when is the right time to do this hike.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe we shouldn't do the Grand Canyon in July, Jason.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: That might we might nearly die, you know.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: But learning out, you know, not not only the logistics is really one of the challenges that people have.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's sort of that initial fear moment of, oh, I don't think I could possibly do this.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: So the guides really tell you, you know, how how do you get there?
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: Where should I stay?
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: What time of year should I go?
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_01: What are the dangers?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: How do I mitigate them?
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: But really, I like what you said about us trying to, you know, build a system around this so you can enjoy the experience.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Because if you have all the information that you need and you have confidence in that information, when you're out there, it's more about enjoying the experience and enjoying that journey with sort of a little bit of confidence that you kind of know what you're getting into.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: Now, every mountain's different and every day is different.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_01: So uh you do have to be prepared and be prepared on the ground to, you know, to change your plans.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: But at least we're hoping with these guides, you'll have that confidence to get out there, get get off the couch, start training, be ready and feel like you can really take on these epic hikes.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: So how do you think that veterans will uniquely understand you know our blister pop ethos that we're trying to build?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you understand this, Phil.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: We've talked about this numerous times.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: If we can take every obstacle out of their way that's mentally really blocking them logistically and put them at that first step, right?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: That first step on the trail and allow them to feel that they have supported information, we understand that the chances of them taking that first step are so much higher.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really where the recovery for us starts, what we're trying to accomplish is getting people to that first step.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's where the information that you've been doing for our group, right?
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let's be fair.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: We have a hiking group with uh there's Leo and yourself and me, and you've been that logistical.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: genius in all of these hikes for us.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: And really that's kind of now turned into this company to where we're putting people at that first step of everything out of their, you know, everything out of their peripheral view and be like, this is your recovery.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: Take this step.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: We're here with you.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's where it's you really start to see the excitement.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: So you know one of the things I wanted to do was make sure that blister pop wasn't a like a stuffy hiking experience.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: You can see we got this sort of explosive logo, but it's really just to get your attention.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: Really what we're about is the journey and the experience and and doing things in a safe and sensible way, even though we'll joke around a lot and we'll, you know, we'll make it fun, but ultimately that's not what this is about.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: This is about the journey itself and you being out in nature and and find finding healing.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: So what do you hope that veterans will feel when they encounter blister pop for the first time?
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: I hope that they just feel that they're not alone.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: That in that moment that they realize that this is it's about them.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's about that that journey of not trying to compartmonize them but just trying them to give them a place that they can be a part of a system that they can jump into and find these journeys with other veterans and other people that are like minded.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we talk about it all the time is is how important mental health is for our society as a whole.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if we can just make any dent or impact through veterans or other people that are doing these events with us, I think that's really where the excitement starts to come in and we really start to see the impact of what Belop is.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: If a veteran is listening and thinking, you know, maybe this is for me, what do you recommend the first small step is that they take I think the first step for me if I was talking to 'em directly I would tell them to sign up for a blister pop that was close to them.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: About six months out, find a local group on social media to do hike each training and really start interacting with the blister pop community on social media.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: Really start talking to the people that are doing these events, that are training for these events, that are mentally thinking about the challenges of these events and really becoming a part of the community.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I think through that what they'll understand is we're no fluff.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: We're just about helping people we want to find mental health for everybody.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: We want to find mental health help for everybody.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think right now that would just be the simple easy message is come along for the journey.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Come take that first step with us.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: I love that Jason I always think it's funny it's it was so sort of born out of the end of the hiking season last year when the snow came in I'm thinking oh God what am I going to do next year?
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I've always found from for me and for my mental health to make sure I don't end up in places, you know, dark places I shouldn't be, I need a goal to work towards and that's why I you know I put this together with you is I think, you know, we've we've always you know talked about what what's the next big thing we're going to do next year.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: And setting that goal you know six months out nine months out 12 months out is really great.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: You set this really big goal for yourself and it gives you that momentum that carries you through to that goal where you you know you've got to train get you up in the morning you've got to go to the gym got to go hiking got to you know go running whatever that thing is for you.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: So you're mentally and physically fit enough to take on this challenge.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: And that's always been important to me is to have a goal.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I I kind of agree if there's a first step, sign up.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny there was a woman at work who's just trying to get back into into running and she was she was like well I've been out a couple of times and I don't know maybe I'll sign up for a 5K or a 10k and I said well what are you waiting for?
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: Sign up for that 5K and you've got that as a goal and something to work towards she signed up for a half marathon and uh I think she's running it next week and just the pleasure she gets on her face knowing that she's got out there and done that.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: And that's sort of the same approach I hope people take with this is maybe you're not gonna do the hike next weekend.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's a big goal because these are big hikes and I think that's the perfect first step.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: Come here Yeah and it it's just uh piggyback because I didn't Matt you said it a lot better for me there.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: Having that goal for me has been so important.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it is giving me the structure that I've needed to be in that 5 a.m group, waking up, training like I'm back in the military, really focused on that for me it's the mission because it's just a mindset of how I was trained.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: But these hikes and events that we've been on have really been they've really been like holidays in my calendar.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: They I mean they are like staple points for me to go and accomplish.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_00: They are like mission journey trips that yeah and so having those there has been just so important for me.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah we keep talking about it but yeah sorry.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: No no that's that's fine and I'm I'm gonna start to wrap this up I got a little bit of spiel at the end for everybody to give them a little bit more information about what we're doing and and stuff.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_01: But I did want to say that you know we're real like we put together some of the toughest most iconic day hikes in America and it's it's our itinerary too that these are the things that we're aiming for.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: And you know Jason and I a month or so ago went down to Palm Springs to take on one of the toughest day hikes in America at least people call it one of the toughest day hikes in America I actually think it's third or fourth on our our list in terms of how we think about difficulty.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: We created this sort of algorithm to measure the difficulty of a hike and while everybody's saying this is the hardest and this is the toughest, we don't think it is it is certainly a tough day.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a San Jacinto it's 21 miles it was it's 11,000 feet in elevation gain in one day it's a monster for sure.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it was a tough day when we went out there it was like 86 degrees or one in the morning when we left and then there was snow at the top so it was a tough day but that's what it's about.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: That's what we're aiming for.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah that one was awesome I and the challenge going into that one I mean what do we have like a 1 a.m start time and you're putting on your backpack and people are still ending their evening party and in Palm Springs and boy you park right next to that art museum and you head up that little tiny trail and it was just it was truly an epic journey through different environments and different landscapes and then you get up well I you'll have to correct me but it was like eight nine thousand feet you get up to where the gondola is and then you have all these people vacationers that just rode 9,000 feet up to where you're at and then now they get to hike the last you know six miles with you up to the summit.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: But it was truly truly yeah just what blister pop is all about and the journey was awesome and and and definitely epic for me.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: So uh so let's wrap wrap this up I got a little bit of spiel at the end for everybody but thank you Jason it's been a really awesome you know learning about your veteran experience and I'm I'm really glad you were the very first off you pop guest and we got some awesome hikers and guides lined up.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_01: Jason and I have not just been hiking together for five years but we've got like 10, 15, 20 years doing all sorts of crazy adventures and sometimes we've crossed paths and we didn't know it in the past but we've met some awesome and amazing people you know around the world who are who've agreed to be on this podcast in the future.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're so excited to share with you their stories as we continue to develop not only Blister Pop but off you pop and the whole community.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_01: So you know Blister Pop really exists you know for big day hikes like this.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's for people who want big stories they don't need a lottery they don't need a challenge but they need a kickstart they need a guidebook an itinerary a narrative system that really makes epic human scale adventures feel possible.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: So if you want to see what we're building head to our website it's www.blisterpopadventures com or put it in the show notes and if today's conversation you know lit something up in you especially if you're an adventure a veteran sign up today get your first guide get that big goal in place but I really wanted to share this exciting thing that Jason and I have been have been working on and we're really starting to promote and put that out out there in the world.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: We've created this epic challenge that's really the heart of our company it's called the T5 the Tahoe five peaks and this is one epic challenge.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's a 50 mile 1300 foot five summit odyssey around Lake Tahoe.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's one of the hardest day hikes in America it's about grit, pacing uh altitude and it's a story wrapped into one continuous arc and you've got 24 hours to get it done.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: So you can read the full guide and the logistics and all the formats on our other website at www.tahothenum5peaks.com and because this episode is for the people who've carried more than most of us uh we're offering a 20% discount for all of the veterans so if you sign up either to a blister pop hike or a Tahoe Five Peaks use this code veterans20 at checkout and you'll get 20% off.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: So whether you're stepping into your first big day or your next one you're not doing it alone there's a community here there's a story waiting just for you and there's a big day adventure for when you're ready.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you Jason I really appreciate your time this evening and your partnership in helping me build this now thank you Philip appreciate no problem now off you pop.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: Off you pop