Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Jon & Eddie Arnold about their choice of The Ice Warriors (2/6)

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Talks to Jon & Eddie Arnold about their choice of The Ice Warriors (2/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:33
  Hamster with a blunt. Pen knife, they're doing
• 0:35
  quicker. Quicker.
• 0:37
  Welcome back to Hamster with a Blunt pen Knife, the Doctor Who
• 0:41
  Commentary Podcast. I'm John Arnold and I am here
• 0:46
  with, as ever, Mr. Joe Ford. Hello.
• 0:49
  Hello. And his superior 21st century
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  reboot. And I had to bring him along.
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  It was a condition. Ice Lord.
• 1:00
  God, do I regret it. We call him Ice Lord Arnold.
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  Ice because I think, because I think if he didn't bring me
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  along, it would just get too erotic.
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  Like the book club? Jesus.
• 1:14
  Yeah, Well, it depends. What he hasn't listened?
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  To it, it depends what we're reading.
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  Well, ask Luke and Andrew. What?
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  Do we all think about oh, sorry John, now look, come on, I'm
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  trying to push us away from being rude.
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  What do we all? Think about animations.
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  Well, you know. What do we think of what?
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  Sorry my father's being too interrupted.
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  I just. Can't get the sentence out.
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  Eddie, it's so hard. Thank you.
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  What do we all think of animations?
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  Well, I quite like them. Do you have them all?
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  Well, yes we do. We've got them all on steel
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  Book. Oh, steel book.
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  Oh my God. Yes, because my father is up to
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  getting the most deluxe version of everything he can.
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  Somebody's earning very well in your house then, Eddie.
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  We've only got the DVDs here. I I cannot wait to inherit all
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  this from him later on. Oh.
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  Really is your father. Stinky, I'm waiting for the
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  arsenic in my coffee. Tea well.
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  Yes. Now, do you know what, Eddie?
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  I've got a little trick. Yeah.
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  I can't believe I'm going to do this, but arsenic tastes a
• 2:18
  little bit like almonds, right? So if you want to make a coffee
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  with almond milk, yeah, you could discreetly hide the
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  arsenic in there, and then you could be rich by the end of the
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  week. OK, I I believe my grandma's
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  almond milk anyway, so I'll go and ask her, right?
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  Just spank that all right for the future.
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  Yeah, I'll remind. You, your cousin Ed, your
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  cousin's getting all the books to get it.
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  Oh well, not getting the book I've got here.
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  Yeah, you. You have currently lost my copy
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  of Food from the Deep. Don't even go there.
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  Well, yes. So that means you can't give all
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  your books away. I'll give a whole but one of
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  them way. It'll be easy to find it
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  afterwards, I suppose. Why ever happened to this
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  podcast? I mean, the last one we did I
• 3:04
  was gassing children. In this one, I'm convincing
• 3:07
  children to murder the parents. I mean, what's?
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  It's going to a very dark place. We're just, we're just arguing
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  about me. At one point I was going to
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  start reading Theory from the deep.
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  I'd read chapter one that it was in my bag I was bringing to
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  college and whatnot. But I stopped using that bag
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  when I got a laptop and I think I just left View from the Deep
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  in there. So that's the last place I knew
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  it went, but now I don't know where it's gone.
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  That's a very expensive book, you know, it's quite rare.
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  Yes, and my. Father.
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  My father is very annoyed because it's his original copy.
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  Obviously I've now got this in place because I've now decided
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  I'm going to try and read as many of the target books as
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  possible. Now you're holding up a book and
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  saying. Marathon the target books.
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  Looks like what? You're holding up a book and
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  saying this, but you're not now it's an audio we're doing, so
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  you better tell everybody what you're holding up.
• 4:06
  Oh yes, I'm holding up the novel Doctor Who into the nightmare of
• 4:10
  edges and. So it's got a great cover that.
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  Yeah, the yeah, I was. I was looking at the Mandarin
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  Michio Day and thinking. It reminded me of the Yeti from
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  the Web of Fear in the 1st. Episode.
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  Eddie, are you claiming superior knowledge?
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  That's my best twist, I'm afraid.
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  Well, he's very good loose B and isn't good either.
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  Oh well, I mean, to be fair, Nightmare of Eden is the best
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  season 17 story anyway. Oh.
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  I love it so much. Followed by Destiny, the Daleks,
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  then boy. Then.
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  Haunted Simon then, then sharded, then creature from the
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  pit, then a brick wall then. You are only doing that list so
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  you can put sit your death at the end, aren't you?
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  Oh yes, I know. I know your games by now.
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  Well, for my part, Charlie put us back on track.
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  I love the animation. I think we're very lucky to have
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  them. I just.
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  Don't go from animations to books.
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  Well, it happens, it happens. But I do think they are variable
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  in quality from story to story. Of weather fear.
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  Weather fear is not great. I think fury from the deep is
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  with the old Mr. Long arm. This is a bit tricky as well.
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  I love the invasion one. This one is good but quite
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  simple. I think it's an early one.
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  This isn't it. Yeah, it's not when they were
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  actually taking the animations fully seriously.
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  But again, like, we wouldn't have the complete story of Adam,
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  so we're kind of lucky that they do it.
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  It does beat the hell out of the recons.
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  I have to say. I love the work people have done
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  on the recons, but it's such tough sledding to watch.
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  Yeah, when I when I was doing my marathon, I didn't even like do
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  the recons. I just listened to the audio.
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  Yeah, I prefer that as well. It's a bit more immersive, isn't
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  it? Yeah, because it lets me imagine
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  it instead of seeing 01 image. Oh.
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  What was your favorite soundtrack to listen to then of
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  all of those? Probably Dalek's master plan.
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  Oh, it's a banger in it. And Marco Polo as well.
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  I quite like both. He was going to Marco Polo.
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  I was like, is he going to like, is he going to get through it?
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  And he came out raving about Marco Polo.
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  Here's water, Eddie Arnold. I was trying to think of a quote
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  from the Dallas master Plan. Oh, yes.
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  I'll say it later in this. Now you shut up, Sir.
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  There you go. I know, I know, a quote from the
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  Daleks master plan and also so does Victoria in this episode
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  because she screams just like Katerina did on her way out.
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  Oh. No, I know less sucked out the
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  airlock at the end. Oh boy.
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  Should it should have been Amy? Really.
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  Well, yeah, all of them really should.
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  Be Vic. Amy should have been on the
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  Fraser when it crashed into Earth, but.
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  Unfortunately, father just to annoy you should have been ace.
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  Well, if we think about it. Always, Brenda.
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  Given, given Clara is on is in every point in the Doctor Who's
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  history, she is in one sense on that freighter.
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  She does die horribly on that. Freighter, What a lovely
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  thought. That's why.
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  There we go. I'm sure.
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  I'm sure you were so happy. The end of Face, the Raisin on
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  initial. Watch.
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  Oh, but yeah. But it took forever for her to
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  die, didn't it? And then they followed up with
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  the worst episode of this series.
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  Yeah, and then they brought her back.
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  Eddie and I don't go off in some weird lesbian relationship in a
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  time travelling diner. I mean, what the hell?
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  With with my Co star Maisie Williams.
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  Yeah. Oh, yes, that's right.
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  Yeah. He asked it every time a Game of
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  Thrones star comes up. He's like, Oh yeah, they're my
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  Co star you even when I'm not saying.
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  Can't argue. Yeah, even when they're not on
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  the same scene as him, he will just say oh they're my Co *.
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  Yes, you. Hey, there's my Co *.
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  Yeah, he has Big Star as well. He did get the Oscar for Best
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  Extra in that episode, you know. Yeah, certainly.
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  Well, well, it must not have been a very good Oscar.
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  No, no, it's that Superman cut behind him.
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  Look, John, what do you think of the animations?
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  I I totally enjoy them. I'm one of those that I will say
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  I prefer when they add to the story.
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  It's like the Celestial toy maker is a ropy old script.
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  It's it's almost the unwatchable, I think as a
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  recall. And this was the same track and
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  they do something really funky with it.
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  Yeah, something like the moon base.
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  The moon base is terrific anime gorgeous even.
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  So they put money into it. Would you?
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  Say it's bad to watch on recons and whatnot.
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  What the moon base? But it's like if you're saying
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  anything negative about the moon base, I know someone I can
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  forward that to. You can.
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  I'm not saying anything negative about the moon base.
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  Who's that the? Animation improved what is what
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  is one of our other friends. Other friends?
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  My other friends apart from me? What's this?
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  No. Yes.
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  No, he hasn't. Yes, because I know other people
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  outside of this podcast. Outrageous.
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  Outrageous you. Don't claim to have a life.
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  Next. No, you've been listening to
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  Doctor Who Missing out, So soundtrack.
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  Father, you what you've from what you've taught me, you've
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  read every Doctor Who book at least once, and you've read most
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  of them twice at least. So tell me about no.
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  Luck yourself, shadow mind, probably.
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  Tell me about no life yourself. Well, no.
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  I mean. My father like son, right?
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  Look, unfortunately. He knew adventures, but what we
• 9:53
  did instead of getting laid in the 90s was terrible.
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  Oh well, I'm glad I wasn't around then.
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  You know, I'll tell you what's a good animation, fellas.
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  The 10th Planet, episode 4. That's a fantastic animation.
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  Gorgeous. Yeah, unfortunately my father
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  does not like the tense planet because he is wrong as hell.
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  So it's. More than the story deserves.
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  It is beautiful though that animation in.
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  Episode 4 anyone who's listening to this immediately whenever
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  season 3B comments come out, just go and comment how John
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  Arnold is so wrong. Well, they usually do, Eddie.
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  Yeah, I don't blame them. I feel sorry for everyone else
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  having to put up with him hating on it.
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  Well, you've got a part with him every day, all right?
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  You're the one who's losing. It Kill the Moon is definitely
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  the best episode that's. Meanwhile, every single episode
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  after it is better. Do you know what I'm in the mood
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  for, fellas? Are you in the mood to see some
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  ice? Warriors.
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  Well, no. I'm in the mood to watch
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  Victorian miss sort of sniveling around a load of ice.
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  Do you think you perhaps you could achieve that for me today?
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  What? Watch it for you.
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  Well, no. Do you think I'll actually see
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  that, you know, some dreadful? Victorian to wait a little while
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  to proper. OK, so not in this one.
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  I swear she's with the Ice Warrior in the room in this one.
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  Sniveling. Yeah, she's in the room.
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  Yeah, the ice were kidnaps and this.
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  Doesn't oh, stay away from me. Oh, help.
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  Me. Oh.
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  Joe, you sound like you've been trying to affect that sort of
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  impression for years. Yeah, how am I doing?
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  Oh, he. Has you are perfected, Eddie.
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  Yeah, but it also sounds like the voice.
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  I'm going to try to make him bad.
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  Shall we go and watch this episode?
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  Maybe. And who's counting in this time?
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  See. See, he started on you.
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  Now you're in trouble. What have I done to you, Toby
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  Haddock? First, now Eddie Arnold.
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  Oh, I've just corrupted everyone.
• 12:02
  Yes. Who's got to count us in?
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  Well, my father opened the episode and I counted us in last
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  time, so. Me.
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  Would you like to take the 2? Oh, I'd love to thank you in 3-2
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  one. Off we go down the great time
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  tunnel of space. I don't know where I was going
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  with that. Look at how sinister Patrick
• 12:28
  Trouten looks coming out of there.
• 12:31
  Are you saying Patrick Trouten could ever be that sinister?
• 12:35
  This is one thing I do about modern animations.
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  They do maybe, but not actually do the animated theme tune as
• 12:41
  well. That's glorious.
• 12:42
  So we've sort of gone away from and now it's just like.
• 12:49
  Daddy's got bored already. Yeah.
• 12:53
  No, sorry, I'm just taking time to get away from your singing.
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  You ain't going to get far, I'm afraid, if you're staying on the
• 13:01
  call. Call me when you've got to help
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  them out. Oh, I could have an album I
• 13:07
  could not do. Yeah, ukulele music.
• 13:10
  Get that ukulele go in. OK, Yeah, let me just give it a
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  try and see if you can guess what it is.
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  Ready. What's that?
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  An Ice Warrior. And no, especially the start of
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  Nightmare of Eden. Chile punching the ice.
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  Oh God, I love this. Now punching the Ice Warrior.
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  Here we go. That's right.
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  And he's taken Victoria prisoner straight away.
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  Oh, I've got a big question for the two of you, actually.
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  And it's all about Leader Clint and Penley, because now I have.
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  Oh, they were shagging. Weren't they that?
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  That's the impression I get. Yeah, totally.
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  It's like they rat it like Knights.
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  No, obviously that's not in the script, right?
• 13:58
  But the performances of especially Clen, he's so angry
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  rapidly, like the only way you could possibly be that angry
• 14:08
  with somebody is if they'd let you down in a really bad way.
• 14:11
  And I don't think I don't mean professionally.
• 14:15
  No. Well, frankly, when I when I.
• 14:19
  When I think of. When I think of angry couple in
• 14:24
  Doctor Who, I immediately think back to Meg Seeley and her
• 14:27
  husband. I imagine that's probably what
• 14:30
  they were like actually on the base a bit, you know?
• 14:33
  Well, yeah, except. Except she didn't have to point
• 14:37
  a gun at an awesome. She would say to.
• 14:41
  Judson and Millington too, obviously the.
• 14:45
  Only. Reason Meg Seeley hasn't
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  appeared up to this point is because all the monsters are too
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  scared to face her. I know Penley would bring store
• 14:54
  back to the base and Clint would go.
• 14:57
  And don't think I'm having that dirty old tramp in my house, you
• 15:00
  know, just like Mick Sealy. I'm guessing look at it is
• 15:05
  obviously the Doctor J they're going out too.
• 15:09
  Quite obvious. Look at this.
• 15:10
  Wow. I mean, it is a bromance, isn't
• 15:12
  it? What I mean, what is a bromance?
• 15:14
  What are you talking? Are you talking about the
• 15:15
  doctrine came? In Tonic.
• 15:17
  Yeah. Yeah, I remember.
• 15:20
  Once the time, male friend. I remember one time on Twitter I
• 15:24
  saw someone shipping the Doctor and Jamie is gay and then I
• 15:26
  think Fraser Hines replied to it saying they're not gay so I.
• 15:30
  Don't think they're. Crazy would say that.
• 15:32
  Debug. I do think they're in love.
• 15:34
  I think they love each other. Oh yeah, deeply.
• 15:37
  But that's not that sort of. Life, the tonic platonic.
• 15:40
  It's a bit like you and me, John, you know?
• 15:42
  Yeah, totally. Wow, they broke my heart all.
• 15:47
  Right, I'll just, I'll just go downstairs and tell my mum that
• 15:50
  the relationship's over. No, God, please don't.
• 15:53
  All right? I don't want to come in around
• 15:54
  here with a chainsaw. Yeah, and I'll go in there and
• 15:57
  tell you rather her she's Belfast.
• 15:58
  So. Oh, she's.
• 15:59
  Belfast, she wouldn't be so kind as be that quick.
• 16:02
  You tell my other half here be over the moon.
• 16:05
  It's like I'm going to put up with you anymore.
• 16:06
  Thank God. But you know what this would
• 16:10
  mean, Eddie? It would mean that, you know, we
• 16:12
  would be your parents, the two of us on this call.
• 16:17
  That, that'll be torture. Well, yeah, you've seen the
• 16:19
  chaos that occurs in these comments every night.
• 16:23
  This would be your life. Your life.
• 16:28
  I'd be scared to go anyway. Like.
• 16:31
  You know, you know, maybe they'll not be scared to go to
• 16:33
  your room in the evening. Well, yes, indeed, that's all
• 16:39
  with all parents. So that is that's with all
• 16:41
  parents. You know she's always knock.
• 16:45
  Yeah, and I don't. Oh, do you not?
• 16:47
  Because I'm a bit rebellious. Are you that sort of?
• 16:50
  I was the sort of child that waited until my parents were
• 16:52
  just going to sleep and then I'd come dashing in the room and
• 16:55
  wake them all up? Are you that child?
• 16:58
  Oh, that's very much him, yes. Yeah, I used to love doing that.
• 17:02
  I'd literally wait until they're just on the verge going to sleep
• 17:05
  and then go Oh my God come battering in the room.
• 17:10
  I think the sort of child I was was I'd wait for him to go sleep
• 17:13
  and then go downstairs and go on my iPad.
• 17:17
  Oh well, no. Hang on, Oh you wouldn't wake up
• 17:19
  October kid he sued, stay up all night and then fall asleep in
• 17:25
  school the next day? He's recalling a real instant
• 17:28
  there. What was she doing all night?
• 17:31
  I said it was a new update on the game I was playing at the
• 17:34
  time, and I didn't take you like that in the end.
• 17:38
  But what ended up happening was I ended up being so tired in
• 17:42
  school that I fell asleep in the teacher tried waking me up.
• 17:45
  And then, yeah, everyone thought I died.
• 17:50
  And then and then I went back up and they were like, Oh my God,
• 17:53
  you're alive. And then I got set on the
• 17:55
  teacher's chair and have Maltese.
• 17:56
  It was it was class Eddie it. Sounds like a very dramatic sort
• 17:59
  of a day. I also got walked home just so I
• 18:02
  didn't fall asleep on the way back.
• 18:05
  Yeah, I was amazed when the teacher turned up on the
• 18:07
  doorsteps like dirty hell. Did they confiscate your iPad in
• 18:11
  the evening after that? I don't remember.
• 18:14
  I should have done. It's not as bad as the time that
• 18:19
  I swore in front of my grandmother because of prom.
• 18:23
  If I'd have sworn in front of my grandmother, she'd have washed
• 18:26
  my mouth out with fairy liquid. That's what she used to do.
• 18:29
  There's only 22. Yeah.
• 18:32
  How did you? Swear words at 2:00.
• 18:35
  Let's just say John Arnold is my father and I'm and I'm the child
• 18:40
  of an Irish. Woman, I think people could
• 18:42
  study these recordings. No Irish woman they could study
• 18:45
  them and and take them as a way of how not to raise children.
• 18:48
  Swearing at 2:00. You know they should.
• 18:50
  They should study these in school.
• 18:52
  Yeah, no. Oh.
• 18:54
  He he it was brilliant because he he just came up big innocent
• 18:57
  base, huge grin and just. No, he didn't.
• 19:05
  Needless to say. It was OK it all.
• 19:06
  It all went quiet for a bit and then my parents went home and
• 19:10
  then I got a big phone call, I bet.
• 19:14
  You did? Yeah, I.
• 19:15
  Was like, oh. Are you teaching this 2 year
• 19:18
  old? Well, you know what we're also
• 19:21
  ditching? We're ditching the Ice Warriors.
• 19:23
  Well, I don't, but it's such a great story Yes, it's weird.
• 19:26
  No, because you know what? I.
• 19:28
  Think this animation, Yeah, the one thing this animation
• 19:32
  understands, it's constant movement.
• 19:34
  It's, you know, because that's what this needs, because the Ice
• 19:39
  Warriors slow the story down so much.
• 19:42
  It's like a story told half the time if they just talk normally
• 19:46
  or. Just yeah.
• 19:48
  But you just find anything slow frantically.
• 19:51
  It's like on Sundays when I take my time to enjoy my food.
• 19:55
  You say I'm slow. I mean, I'm going to say.
• 19:58
  Something that takes you an hour.
• 20:01
  To buy it might be controversial now because I think this would
• 20:05
  be a much tighter 4 passer easily.
• 20:07
  This could be a four passer. Like there's probably enough
• 20:10
  incident for 4 episodes. But what they pad it out with,
• 20:14
  hang on, hear me out. They pad it out with character
• 20:16
  stuff, which I really, really like, but it means it's slow,
• 20:20
  OK? Can I just say if I had enough?
• 20:24
  If I had enough episodes of Classic Coup to like, if I could
• 20:29
  remove any episode of Classic Coup, that word like Feller just
• 20:32
  padding out and making it certain that I think frankly
• 20:37
  we'd have about 8 more seasons of Classic Coup at least.
• 20:42
  I thought you're going to say if you're going to do that, you'd
• 20:44
  lose. You'd just have City of Death.
• 20:46
  That's that's the padding of Season 17, isn't it Ed?
• 20:52
  Death. That's entirely Paddy, isn't it?
• 20:55
  Just a load of funny lungs strength.
• 20:57
  Oh yeah, just get rid. Just get rid of all that and
• 21:01
  then maybe make a new story out of it.
• 21:02
  Frankly, Doug 7 has so much potential, but waste it on the
• 21:06
  city of Death. I Oh my God.
• 21:09
  He's never seen hitchhikers. So I've had so much potential,
• 21:14
  but he wasted it on City of Death.
• 21:16
  Boy oh boy, are you trying to be the poster?
• 21:19
  Child. For the dart board tonight.
• 21:23
  Well, I will say the Pirate Planet is my third favorite
• 21:26
  story in the whole show. Oh, OK.
• 21:28
  Well, you have redeemed yourself then.
• 21:29
  Well done. And it's my father.
• 21:32
  I believe my cousin showed me hitchhikers at one point.
• 21:35
  Really feature of the film or the film TV you haven't seen ATV
• 21:40
  The TV? No.
• 21:42
  It's the inference here, then, that that Penley has left Clint
• 21:48
  for store, I think. So that's what I was doing.
• 21:52
  So Angus, yeah, that looks, he looks like David Mitchell in
• 21:55
  this, doesn't he does. As much as much as I'd like
• 22:01
  class Q, if I had to remember any character names besides like
• 22:05
  significant companions and whatnot, then I think I'd be
• 22:09
  fucked. Well, Penley is the man on the
• 22:11
  left. There, with the beard and store
• 22:13
  is the. Man on the right, on the left
• 22:15
  well. There's only.
• 22:16
  One of them on the left it's. Recanding.
• 22:19
  Very languid. Yeah, very languid reclining
• 22:22
  here, isn't it? And if I if I was doing a pork
• 22:24
  when I was like that apple there, you know, that kind of
• 22:26
  thing. Innocence.
• 22:29
  Yeah, the. Temptation for reasons for
• 22:32
  reasons. I'm not getting the context.
• 22:33
  Exactly that you didn't. You didn't allow.
• 22:37
  You don't want to know selected ancient food plants.
• 22:40
  Yeah, OK. Joe, did you just watch classic?
• 22:44
  There you go, it's a phallics. Joe did.
• 22:47
  Joe, did you just watch all the classic and then you saw all the
• 22:50
  beaded men there and went, yeah, I want to do that.
• 22:54
  What? My beard.
• 22:55
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 22:56
  Well, you know, it's quite fashionable to have some stuff
• 22:59
  all these days. No, I was sort of modelling mine
• 23:02
  on all those hairy men from State of Decay, you know, with
• 23:05
  those crazy beards. I'm going to grow my mat long.
• 23:09
  Or maybe but you know mustache like the guys in Colony in
• 23:13
  Space. Maybe you should go.
• 23:16
  Maybe you should go like full on master and beer and have a
• 23:19
  goatee. Oh yes, and that could be truly
• 23:21
  evil and stroke my beard, yes. And then be camp.
• 23:26
  Eddie, that ship has sailed because.
• 23:29
  I was going to say I was good. I'm going to go from the bloke
• 23:32
  who opens in the Mutants. You know, it's start of episode
• 23:34
  1 I. Love you.
• 23:36
  You're the first person to say to me, and then you could be
• 23:40
  camp. Thank you.
• 23:43
  Yeah, you haven't been trying hard.
• 23:47
  Because I'm so Butch. You're so butcher.
• 23:51
  Give me an Eric Saywood Sprint. He likes your life.
• 23:55
  I remember when this came out on video, the Ice Warriors and.
• 23:59
  Obviously your day. Yeah, quite a while ago, yeah,
• 24:03
  you could watch one obviously as live action and then four.
• 24:06
  And I never watched two or three.
• 24:08
  I would always skip to four. And really, you don't miss much
• 24:12
  episodes two and three it is No, no, no.
• 24:16
  They're. Still in that bloody storeroom?
• 24:18
  Look at it. Stuck in there for no.
• 24:21
  Because he's given her all the exposition about Mars and where
• 24:24
  they're from. It's a tedious shit, yeah, but
• 24:27
  it's it's like the exposition about Earth situation.
• 24:29
  Father. Father Positivity.
• 24:31
  Positivity. Positivity.
• 24:35
  Bold it's it's just in front of the quite dull story covered
• 24:41
  Bernabec. So talking to.
• 24:44
  Father, I did say. Something positive.
• 24:47
  Say something positive. Deborah Watling won't be on
• 24:52
  screen in a minute. Yeah, that is a positive,
• 24:59
  although I do know what you mean about like, I do like I do.
• 25:03
  I do like the, I suppose. I like the design and I love the
• 25:06
  fact that they're huge, you know, they're really tall and
• 25:08
  loom over people. Yeah.
• 25:09
  Of course you love that. And they have.
• 25:13
  Silhouette as well, like when they're shot in silhouette
• 25:16
  they're great, but I think you're right about the voices
• 25:19
  because it means they joke really slowly all the time.
• 25:24
  Well, just take Joe me. Joe, is that?
• 25:27
  If they just talk normally. Joe, may I ask, is the voice the
• 25:31
  only thing that's turning you off from wanting to be with one
• 25:33
  of them? What?
• 25:35
  Marry one? Yeah, I suppose we could have a
• 25:37
  good life together. Yeah.
• 25:39
  He'd look after me, protect me. Yeah, and then he'd turn you
• 25:42
  into on the square boxes from members of Mars.
• 25:45
  Oh, the bouncy balls you mean. I bloody love those.
• 25:48
  Yeah God man, why? I wish they could do that back
• 25:50
  then. Imagine turning Arden and this
• 25:52
  bunch into bouncy balls. Well, they did.
• 25:56
  Bouncy scores Baron the giggles. Oh yeah, it's.
• 26:00
  Brilliant screaming face on the ball.
• 26:03
  That was so great I've. Only dropped it off the
• 26:06
  buildings. Actually, you know, they really
• 26:11
  are going for making the animation look like the live
• 26:15
  action because in some of the later ones, underwater men is
• 26:17
  they just take liberties, don't they?
• 26:19
  And macro terror. I don't think I've actually
• 26:21
  watched the underwater menace animation because it's good when
• 26:26
  when it come out, I was, I think I was on the marathon and it's
• 26:30
  like I believe I had to go off to my cousins that day so I
• 26:34
  couldn't watch the animation and and plus at the time our disk
• 26:38
  player wasn't working. So and it wasn't my fair either
• 26:42
  had to do it. Oh.
• 26:42
  We can. We can sort you on that, don't
• 26:44
  worry. Yeah, but Frank.
• 26:46
  But frankly, I I prefer watching my fish people do it properly.
• 26:56
  Have you not seen that swimming scene?
• 26:57
  I think it's one of the greatest constructed scenes in the whole
• 26:59
  show. What the hell is that?
• 27:07
  Look at that model behind her there.
• 27:10
  Did you say? It's.
• 27:12
  It's a naked lady. Rude.
• 27:17
  How do these things appear in Doctor Who?
• 27:19
  Oh. My God.
• 27:20
  Well, well. Frankly, I can't.
• 27:22
  Frankly, whenever I see a statue, I probably conquer
• 27:24
  anywhere, anywhere without seeing it naked.
• 27:26
  So yeah. I think this is going to be a
• 27:30
  bold statement. Now.
• 27:31
  I think Victoria's storyline is tantamount to an abuse storyline
• 27:37
  because I think it is utterly irresponsible for the Doctor to
• 27:42
  take somebody that is. So she's so not equipped for
• 27:46
  these adventures. Yeah, and not just put her
• 27:49
  somewhere safe after Evil of the Daleks.
• 27:52
  Instead, he takes her into the most terrifying adventures
• 27:56
  they've ever had, one after another, to the point where
• 28:00
  she's so anxiety driven she basically has a breakdown in
• 28:04
  theory from the deep and begs to be let go.
• 28:08
  Discuss. Cheers, you'll find a redemptive
• 28:11
  reading of well. Did you hear their infusion
• 28:13
  leak? They're annoyed that they were
• 28:15
  only landing on Earth after Talos and then obviously the
• 28:18
  next story they go back to space.
• 28:22
  But Eddie. Like finding a redemptive
• 28:24
  reading of Deborah Watley's performance, which is impressing
• 28:26
  me mightily. Oh, no, I just, I think it's
• 28:29
  irresponsible for the doctor. But he says in two of the soccer
• 28:33
  and our lives are different from anyone else's.
• 28:36
  No one else can do what we're doing.
• 28:38
  And then takes on a series of horrific escapades.
• 28:43
  Well, yeah, because, because obviously enemy of the world,
• 28:46
  she has to work to female stereotype.
• 28:49
  What is she doing now? I'm pretty sure she's like
• 28:51
  changed to be some sort of waitress at the time, isn't she?
• 28:54
  Shove her in the kitchens, don't they?
• 28:56
  Oh, orange pill. Candy pill.
• 28:58
  Kaiser pudding. Yeah, that's it.
• 29:02
  What does he say to her? Peel those spuds?
• 29:05
  Yeah, now, but. Then again, what a.
• 29:08
  That's what this is missing a bit.
• 29:10
  It just needs a lot. 1 off comedy character.
• 29:13
  It needs more. Store stores the comedy
• 29:16
  character in this. He's right.
• 29:18
  Like he's not quite funny. You're trying to betray me.
• 29:26
  Oh God. Well, that's the Scottish
• 29:28
  viewers guard or listeners guard.
• 29:29
  Yeah, sorry. The two Scottish.
• 29:32
  Oh, listen. He's just said you should trust
• 29:39
  human beings and not computers. So he takes a moral stance,
• 29:43
  doesn't he, against technology being in charge?
• 29:45
  Imagine this being in nowadays in the age of artificial
• 29:48
  intelligence. Well, I mean, I think maybe
• 29:51
  that's the the dangers that they're warning us about here.
• 29:56
  Yeah, but you know. 60s, which is white heat of technology,
• 29:59
  absolutely is. Oh yeah, and I've, I've seen BBC
• 30:03
  archive videos of them being scared that computers are going
• 30:05
  to take over the world as kids. It's like no but.
• 30:08
  Computers are taking over. Like literally, we're using AI
• 30:12
  for everything now. There's got to cover time when
• 30:14
  you don't even have to study. You just use AI to create all
• 30:19
  your work. It's terrifying.
• 30:22
  You know, maybe if we'd actually, what if people had
• 30:25
  actually watched and listened to all this television, maybe we
• 30:28
  wouldn't be in the position we are now.
• 30:29
  I think you're probably right. It's like, it's like they're
• 30:33
  trying to develop like AI soldiers and whatnot.
• 30:36
  I failed somewhere, but it's like, have you not?
• 30:38
  Have they not seen all the Terminator films that are very
• 30:41
  much explaining why that's a bad idea?
• 30:43
  I mean, they were trying to warn us about the environment in the
• 30:46
  Green Death, and we've been destroying the ozone layer ever
• 30:49
  since. Well, to be fair, we were
• 30:51
  already. You're trying to, you're trying
• 30:53
  to more respect you and lay here basically.
• 30:55
  Yeah, and you know that Seminole Classic Orphan 55 was trying to
• 30:59
  do it fairly recently as well. Are you saying Orphan 55 is a
• 31:04
  classic? I am absolutely saying that yes,
• 31:08
  the only. Thing I'm the only thing.
• 31:10
  It's a classic. Of it, the only thing it's a
• 31:11
  classic of is a classic example of how not to do Doctor Who.
• 31:16
  Many were saying. Many would say that's the hungry
• 31:18
  Earth, Eddie. Oh yeah.
• 31:20
  But except that's it done right. What's the Hell's happened to
• 31:26
  Clint? Why is he falling over?
• 31:29
  I, I think maybe he I think maybe maybe he's having
• 31:34
  daydreams or something not. Sure.
• 31:36
  What's going on? Look.
• 31:38
  And look how concerned Penley. Is you do this.
• 31:42
  Yeah, look. After.
• 31:43
  My ex lover. Yeah, it's, it's definite.
• 31:47
  They're definite. And if it's not in the script,
• 31:49
  they're playing it. They absolutely are playing it,
• 31:51
  aren't they? Yeah, so are you suggest going
• 31:56
  to be like those Doctor Who fanships who call every
• 31:58
  character gay or lesbian? No, but we are shipping Penley
• 32:03
  and Clint. Yeah, totally.
• 32:06
  Love triangle. Eddie, I agree with you.
• 32:08
  I think I think some people can do that too much, but I think
• 32:12
  sometimes it's there and I think it's there here.
• 32:16
  The amount of times I've seen people trying to say Kate
• 32:19
  Stewart is lesbian. How could she be lesbian?
• 32:22
  She's having having it off with Abraham.
• 32:25
  Yeah, and that, and then they're trying to say, Oh no, Richie's
• 32:29
  in love with Osgood. Oh, bless those people.
• 32:32
  Well, you know there's no harm in shipping though, isn't?
• 32:35
  There, Oh, there's nothing there is there with OO's kind of
• 32:38
  innocentish character. She's she's looking in the
• 32:41
  mirror and having it up with herself.
• 32:43
  I do think if you want to write fan fiction about Osgood and
• 32:46
  Kate Stewart, there's no harm in it.
• 32:49
  No. Well, you just what you do if
• 32:50
  you write fan fiction of Osgood with Osgood.
• 32:54
  Yeah, that is the product of a disease, mine, Idi Arnold.
• 32:59
  You've met him nicely. Are you calling me the product
• 33:03
  of a disease? Mine.
• 33:06
  Are you my son? That would be you exactly.
• 33:11
  Now come on Ed, you've got to admit there is just a lot of
• 33:14
  YABBA going on in this episode. To be fair because if you lot
• 33:18
  yabbering and I haven't been able to see all the yabba.
• 33:21
  Well, I'm so sorry, but you do want to talk all over it, OK?
• 33:25
  Well, to be fair. Not much you talk.
• 33:27
  With the sound off. Jamie goes, we mustn't just
• 33:30
  stand around waiting. And Jamie goes no, no, the
• 33:33
  Doctor goes no, we'll let him keep Victoria.
• 33:35
  It's OK, we don't want to back. Well, frankly, that would be you
• 33:40
  2 in that situation. Oh please.
• 33:43
  I would have murdered her in Tomb of the Side Men.
• 33:46
  I'd have had her turn. No, I'd have put her in the
• 33:48
  Toberman role, you know, and had her.
• 33:51
  I think before you did that I would have shoved you down the
• 33:54
  tomb doors and locked it. I'm glad I'm not down there with
• 33:58
  you then. Oh well, it'd be cold there
• 34:02
  anyway. Hey, Cyber Joe would have a
• 34:05
  syringe on you, Ed. That's right.
• 34:07
  Yeah. No, you will be like ours.
• 34:09
  Are you? Implied there's a brain to be
• 34:11
  converted in him. Well, he's, no, he's making a
• 34:15
  good point there. To be fair, I use my two brain
• 34:18
  cells on hamster, but they sort of just circle around in my
• 34:21
  head. Two.
• 34:27
  You've got two, you lucky. Bastard, I'm.
• 34:29
  Stuck with this one. Just the 1 is.
• 34:33
  That and he he nicked my list. It's the one that weren't in
• 34:36
  sale the life. Haven does a lot of work.
• 34:39
  It Mike fellas implying as if he has brain cells.
• 34:43
  This cliffhanger in a minute where they're activating all the
• 34:46
  Ice Warriors often, that's a great moment and I would love to
• 34:49
  have seen that as live action. Well, frankly, how about we all
• 34:54
  just spent a time saying go get all the live actions from the
• 34:56
  BBC archives. If it was only that simple, So
• 35:01
  what? Well, someone should make a
• 35:02
  Doctor Who story about how, oh, the TARDIS materializes in the
• 35:06
  BBC fire burner and collects all the missing episodes and that's
• 35:09
  where they're all gone. I mean, did you see Belinda
• 35:12
  Chandra in Lux burning all that film?
• 35:15
  I just know that was a piss take, wasn't it?
• 35:17
  Of. Oh yeah, that's exactly what I
• 35:20
  was. It's hilarious.
• 35:22
  But well. How do we save the day?
• 35:24
  Burn all the old Doctor episodes.
• 35:26
  And I see you were very happy to find out that you shared a
• 35:28
  birthday with her as well. What?
• 35:30
  Who? With Belinda's actress.
• 35:34
  Oh no, she's a great actress, so it's not her fault she was
• 35:38
  shouldered. And then when I told you that,
• 35:39
  you just reacted with a puke emoji.
• 35:43
  You don't forget nothing. You do you.
• 35:45
  Jesus. No, he's got.
• 35:47
  A long memory. And you?
• 35:50
  Might go on the long shot of the ice warrior and then the close.
• 35:54
  Don't you love how they sort of smile like that?
• 35:56
  They're so happy to be evil. They're a bit of the Silurians
• 36:00
  and warriors. It is kind of nice to always
• 36:03
  make like cave drawings. Type Oh yeah, But that's why my
• 36:07
  father's always smiling. Well, because he's evil.
• 36:10
  Yes. Welfare.
• 36:13
  Well, Eddie, you better take us back to Fraser's comments.
• 36:17
  Oh. Yes, those comments.
• 36:18
  Yeah, come on, let's let's see what he's going to bang on about
• 36:22
  this time. But two, he says, he says quite
• 36:26
  a lot. The Ice Warriors themselves are
• 36:29
  brilliant full stop, lumbering, hissing and sapping their way
• 36:33
  through the story. You can see why they were
• 36:36
  brought back and have endured into the 21st century.
• 36:39
  Hail flashes them out really well.
• 36:42
  You get a real sense of back story in hierarchy with him that
• 36:44
  is unusual for this time and and Bernard Breslaw breathe life
• 36:50
  into that. Could have been another generic
• 36:53
  monster, only just mind they need a blue inhaler or something
• 36:57
  to help with that hissing they. Do they do?
• 37:02
  I mean, OK, I know you've done all the story, John, but you've
• 37:05
  got to acknowledge that the Ice War is caught on.
• 37:09
  Oh, they're great, and I love that book cover as a kid.
• 37:13
  It's just that. Yeah.
• 37:15
  And Victoria because? Of energy from the yeah,
• 37:20
  Victoria, she gets on two book camps.
• 37:21
  That's more than most companions did.
• 37:23
  I think it's more than the entire rest of the 60s
• 37:26
  companions. Well, yeah.
• 37:27
  Well, yeah, but that's because they just showed who's the best
• 37:29
  companion is in that point. Do you really love Victoria that
• 37:32
  much, Eddie? What are you saying she's bad
• 37:35
  companion? No, no, I'm asking if you love
• 37:37
  her. Well, not that way, but I do.
• 37:42
  I do quite like her as a companion.
• 37:44
  Why? Because she snivels along.
• 37:47
  She's insane. Well, tell me what's wrong with
• 37:51
  it for. Well, she's just a being
• 37:54
  useless. She doesn't ever do anything
• 37:56
  useful. Well, well, if you well, I can
• 38:02
  guarantee you if you named, if you named like every other
• 38:05
  companion in the series, I can guarantee there would be at
• 38:07
  least three to five other companions who are the exact
• 38:10
  same. I shall do a comparison.
• 38:11
  Zoe does the calculations that takes out an entire cyber fleet
• 38:16
  in the invasion. Now Victoria couldn't do that.
• 38:20
  Well, yeah, but just get just give her some time to go
• 38:23
  screaming and then she'll scream them all away.
• 38:27
  Imagine that they give her a big loud Halo.
• 38:30
  The whole fleet just runs away. But Can you imagine hearing the
• 38:34
  mind robber? Not really, no.
• 38:37
  Although, no. Yes, because they could probably
• 38:39
  do lots of Alice in Wonderland with her, couldn't they?
• 38:41
  Yeah. But then you'd use that kind of
• 38:43
  sequence with the carcass, I suppose.
• 38:45
  Debbie, what did play out? Lesson 32.
• 38:48
  I love that sequence so. Great.
• 38:50
  Please don't do anything rash and.
• 38:54
  The way she just comes up, like so eager and keen is gorgeously
• 38:58
  turned. But but you could have like the
• 39:01
  White Rabbit and I don't know really, but sinister versions of
• 39:05
  Alice in Wonderland, you know? And just for record, everyone,
• 39:07
  we're talking about the two best Second Doctor stories here, The
• 39:10
  Mind Robber and The Invasion. Oh, funny enough, I've just done
• 39:13
  The Mind Robber as well, you know, with a load of Scottish
• 39:16
  men. It was very hard.
• 39:18
  They were teaching me all. They won't like listening to
• 39:20
  this considering how you slagged off all the Scottish people.
• 39:23
  Yeah, well, no, I slagged. It never getting back on the
• 39:25
  police box again. I was slagging them off on the
• 39:28
  call. Eddie, don't worry about it.
• 39:32
  Well, look how you tell each other that you love them in
• 39:34
  Scotland. They kind of said, they said the
• 39:38
  more I assaulted them, the more they were convinced I adored
• 39:41
  them. Yeah, There you go.
• 39:43
  It's true. Well, Joe, don't.
• 39:45
  Don't you just adore everyone that you podcast with,
• 39:47
  essentially? Absolutely, it's all my family,
• 39:50
  that's why all my all my lovely mates.
• 39:52
  Yes, I believe Chris Chibnall would call it a fam.
• 39:58
  And I and I believe there's a Sarah Jane quoting Journeys and
• 40:01
  for it. Oh go on, tell me.
• 40:03
  I don't remember exactly, but it's like you say, you're a
• 40:06
  lonely man, but you've got the biggest family in the world.