Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / MBA Wire Taps 529: Software engineer, waive test. 334 GRE, working in Japan

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MBA Wire Taps 529: Software engineer, waive test. 334 GRE, working in Japan · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Foreign. Welcome to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. I'm Graham Richmond and this is your Wiretaps for Monday, October 19, 2026. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things going this week?
• 0:29
  Speaker B: Very good, thank you, Graham.
• 0:30
  Speaker A: So I'm recording this episode from a crisp autumn morning up here, and I'm in Boston at the moment, but I know, you know, we're kind of. Things are still pretty busy. Right. You've been tracking Livewire posts and, you know, interview invitations. What's, what's the latest news? What's happening?
• 0:46
  Speaker B: Yeah, we're seeing quite a few interview invitations coming out from a variety of different programs right now, actually. Obviously, Harvard, as we talked about, I think we talked about this last week, actually rolled out their interview invites. And once Harvard sort of rolls out their interview invites, we tend to see quite a lot of other programs sort of following suits, just only because Harvard's quite early in that process, not for any other real reason. So, yeah, I would estimate about a third to. Yeah. A little more than a third of the schools that we track are now rolling out those interview invites. There are still some big schools that we haven't yet seen interview invites. But yeah, I mean, just, just there's a lot out there we're still waiting for. Wharton, for example, I believe we're still waiting for Booth, unless they come out later this week, which they might be predicted to. I can't remember what I said last week.
• 1:40
  Speaker A: No, I think last. So last week we had predicted, I think, that UCLA and Booth would to get their invites out, but I don't. I haven't. I didn't see any yet.
• 1:48
  Speaker B: Yeah, so I anticipate. I mean, obviously we're recording on Thursday.
• 1:52
  Speaker A: Oh, good point.
• 1:53
  Speaker B: So I anticipate Booth will probably come out later today as we're recording. So whilst folks listen to this, Booth typically is the week post Harvard in doing this. So we shall see. And then we've got a few application deadlines. Mendoza and Johns Hopkins Carey have got a deadline next week, and Johns Hopkins Carey is also scheduled to release its early action decisions next week. So there's a variety of different sort of things ongoing. And Livewire is. Is certainly very busy.
• 2:25
  Speaker A: Yeah, makes sense. The other thing that's going to happen this coming week is we're kicking off our regional series of webinars. And the regional series.
• 2:34
  Speaker B: Oh, come on, Graham, we. Before you get into that, we got to the big news. The big news. Admit IQ is live.
• 2:41
  Speaker A: Oh, that's right.
• 2:42
  Speaker B: Yes. Come on.
• 2:44
  Speaker A: All right. I. Well I was, I've been traveling, I'm jet lagged but yes. So we. Yeah. So the formerly known as AskLear admit admitiq is now completely refreshed and rebranded and live on the site. I love the way it looks. Obviously we rebuilt the engine over the summer and into the fall so that's already kind of kicking some serious. But yeah. And you've been going down the rabbit hole of really figuring out like how to optimize all the data that's in our kind of rag and the things driving our AI tool which is, you know, way above my pay grade and head but I'm kind of enjoying watching this tool get better and better.
• 3:24
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. I mean obviously, I mean not to geek out to anybody listening but you know, if you're feeding content into a rag model retrieval augmented generation, you need to prepare that content so that ingested into that rag model effectively and efficiently through what they call the chunking process, embeddings, etc, etc. So I've been playing around with Claude and using Claude skills to actually improve our ability to, to prepare and optimize transcripts for that process. So yeah, and you know, I've always liked to do a bit of geeky stuff without actually getting my hands dirty with real code. So Claude code and Claude skills have been a real blessing for me.
• 4:12
  Speaker A: Yeah. And actually it's, you know, with a company like Clearbit where we're publishing so much content, we're hosting so many events and constantly just on the receiving end of all this great knowledge and information.
• 4:22
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 4:23
  Speaker A: Taking that and getting it into the rag in a way that is useful to people on our website. Is it? That's there's a whole process that goes on behind the scenes and yeah, we don't want to geek out too much but definitely head on over to the site. We did a bit of a refresh on the site generally in the last week, so still ironing some things out but we have kind of a new, slightly new menuing system and. Yeah. And the kind of rebranding of the AI tool to admit iq. So check that out. And then the other thing that I was starting to talk about, Alex, is we do have our some events kicking off this week. This is the time of year where we start to do webinars that organize schools by region. And this isn't just kind of for fun. I mean we do it with a real purpose in mind and that is because we believe that geography plays a big role in opportunity. And so this week we're doing a Mid Atlantic session, a Northeast session and a Great Lake session. And so you can imagine, you know, I mean, I'll give you a sense. The Northeast one I think is, oh gosh, it's, it's Yale, Harvard, it's all the schools up in the tuck, et cetera, maybe Cornell as well. And then we have kind of a, you know, a Mid Atlantic one with Wharton and Darden and maybe Georgetown. I don't have the list in front of me, but you get the idea. And the thinking is, and we, we do next week will be Texas. We have one in the southeast, one on the west coast. But these all really hon in on like what are specific opportunities for careers relating to the region, where the schools are located and where the schools typically have the biggest, strongest alumni databases. Right. So yeah, anyway, these are fun and there's, you know, we do ask them questions about their application process. A lot of tips in there. So if you're interested in any of these schools, you know, come on out. I think it's Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday this week and then the same thing next week. All of them are at, I want to say noon eastern, but I need to double check that. But anyway, you can go to queer admit.com events to sign up.
• 6:09
  Speaker B: Yeah. And like you say region is really important. I would hazard a guess that 70% of alums across the board pursue their careers in the region in which the MBA program they pursued exists. Right.
• 6:24
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 6:25
  Speaker B: I mean there'll be some exceptions to that. Like Wharton obviously is in the mid Atlantic region, but feeds to the majority of its alums into the Northeast. But the majority of programs will feed directly into the their region.
• 6:37
  Speaker A: Yes, to the extent that some schools even obfuscate that. You know, like we see some schools not, you know, like NYU will tell you 80. What 80 some percent land in kind of the Northeast or something. Right. And most of that's New York. Yeah. But yeah, it's, you know, I think Columbia is the one that doesn't report any, any geography, you know, geography data within the U.S. it's like this percent landed in the U.S. yeah. But anyway, so yeah, geography matters. Come to these events will be fun. On the admissions tips side, you mentioned, Alex, that we're waiting for Wharton.
• 7:05
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 7:06
  Speaker A: To release the their interview invitations. And what we did in the interim is we ran an admissions tip about the Wharton interview process because it is radically different from every other school that you will apply to. Wharton does not do a kind of one on one traditional interview. They do something called the team based discussion. Some of our Listeners are probably well aware of this, but we ran a primer on the website that sort of explains what it is, how to prepare. Obviously, we're still waiting for Wharton to release the prompt, which is. The prompt is a question that all the candidates invited to the team based discussion are given that they have to kind of prepare. So read the tip, there's a ton of info in there. There's also a really nice prominent link to podcast episode 454, which we recorded last fall, where we talked a lot about the tbd. And in that episode we broke down last year's prompt, but obviously we'll probably do a similar episode this year once it's available. So. Yeah, anyway, lots of info on Wharton there on the website.
• 8:02
  Speaker B: October 28th, by the way. That's when they're going to release those interview invites.
• 8:07
  Speaker A: Yeah. So another week and change for that to be out there. The other thing I wanted to mention, Alex, is we caught up with Bailey McChesney, who is the Dean of Admissions at Vanderbilt Owen, and we asked her the usual set of questions that we've been asking all of our admissions directors who've come on the site. And I wanted to highlight one of her responses because I thought it was kind of interesting. So we asked her about what's the, you know, what's the value of the MBA besides roi, you know, why do people do this? And so her answer goes as follows. She said, the value of an MBA extends well beyond your first job. Students develop as leaders, broaden the way they approach complex problems, and gain a deeper understanding of how to work effectively with people who have different perspectives and experiences. The MBA experience also provides opportunities to build a lasting network through a community of classmates, faculty and alumni. When I speak to students at graduation, they rarely focus only on their job or return on investment. Instead, they express gratitude for the intangibles, their experience, the growth they saw, and the relationships they built. So, Alex, that's a common theme we've been hearing from schools, but there is much more. I feel like there's been this tendency towards a kind of reductive summary of like, oh, the MBA is just about the first job you get after it. And that's nothing could be further from the truth because it's a much more lifelong sort of benefit. But I thought Bailey did a nice job of articulating that.
• 9:34
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And I like their reflection in terms of graduation. That's what the students talk about.
• 9:40
  Speaker A: Right.
• 9:41
  Speaker B: And I can absolutely imagine that for sure.
• 9:44
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So if you're interested in Vanderbilt you know, business, you know, Owen, there's a ton of other questions we ask her about their application process. She gives some good tips on how to prepare for their video interviews. And so go check that out. We also. Alex caught up with real humans. So current students at a couple of schools this week. One of them was Esade in Barcelona. And I'm just going to pick a student and share a little bit about their background and what they had to say about their experience so far in the, in the program. So we caught up with a guy named Mateo. He's 31, he's from a place called Palmy in Calabria, Italy. And he went to school. It looks like he did both a bachelor's and a master's in Italy. He didn't specify what it was in, so I don't have that information. But before coming to business school, he did several years working as a consultant with both Accenture and Deloitte. So he had what looks to be, gosh, five years plus in those two organizations. And then what he was doing in his spare time is very important here. So for about five plus years, he had been working part time in the food slash artisan pastry business. It was a family business that his family runs. And he got involved in that kind of just in parallel. And so I'm mentioning that because it's what kind of led him to business school. So we asked him, why did you go to business school? And he said, I decided to attend business school because I reached a point where my experience had grown in two directions and I realized which one I wanted to build my future on. Five years in consulting at Deloitte and Accenture gave me structure, discipline, and the ability to lead teams through complex transformation projects. But it was my family's artisan pastry business that showed me what truly energizes me. Over eight years, I led the rebranding, launched new products and packaging, and opened export markets in Spain and France, Germany and Belgium. Seeing a product travel from Italy to adapt to new tastes and find its place in people's lives in new markets made me realize I no longer wanted to advise companies from the outside. I wanted to build brands and markets from the inside. That is why I chose to pivot towards the consumer goods industry, focusing on new market and product development. And so that's al Alex what landed him at business school. And I think it's just such an interesting story. There's a lot of detail in there about the products they, they make in his, in his family business. And yeah, he just, he tells a really good story in the interview. It's very interesting.
• 12:19
  Speaker B: Yeah, it's like this. Do you want to be an advisor or do you want to be a doer?
• 12:23
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, really interesting. So.
• 12:25
  Speaker B: And this candidate wants to be a doer. I. I prefer to have the advisory role because I never want to take any. Any risk on my own capital. But have. Yeah, but, yeah. So this is a really important distinction, and we see this a lot. I mean, entrepreneurship effectively. I just think it's absolutely fantastic. Innovation, entrepreneurship, etc. Etc. I love teaching it, but I just can't do it.
• 12:51
  Speaker A: I think you're pretty good at being, you know, innovative. You know, you've helped us a ton over the years. But one other thing we asked him is, you know, what are you excited about being in business school? And this is interesting because he talks about the fact that he's never left Italy. So he says what excites me most is discovering how this year will change me as a person, even. And also as a professional, but mostly as a person. Right. So he says, for the first time, I'm living abroad, surrounded by people from all over the world in a program as intense, as ambitious as this one. Every day I'm exposed to new cultures, new perspectives and new ways of thinking, and I can already feel them pushing me out of my comfort zone. So I think, again, just a testament to the value of the degree. Right. Coming into a place like Esade, he's probably surrounded by people from all over the world. Right.
• 13:36
  Speaker B: So the products he was managing went abroad before he did.
• 13:39
  Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Good point. I know we got to kind of move on here, but one of the products they make is something called a panettone, those little Italian dessert cakes which are very popular on the holidays. And I guess they. One of the big things he talks about is they made a kind of a version that was sort of designed for the Spanish market. That's seems to have worked nice. Yeah. We also caught up with students at Uva Darden in Virginia, and I'm going to profile one of those for you. So this is Shelby Burch. She is a member of the class of 28. So she's in her first year. She's 32 and hails from Orlando, Florida. She went to University of Central Florida, and she studied communications and humanities. She also has a master in Public Policy from Georgia State University. And using that degree, she had a lot of interesting experience before business school. So she worked. Well, a couple of those, you know, worked at Peace Corps for a couple of years as An English primary school English teacher, she also worked for AmeriCorps. She spent some time working for the Congressional, Congressional Black Caucus foundation, and she even did some work with Management Leadership for Tomorrow, an organization that is kind of friends of Clear Admit who helped people find their way to, to business school and, and into. Into business careers. So we asked her, well, why are you going to business school? And in her case, you know, she has a very non traditional background in kind of policy and she says, I loved working with leaders and communities to solve complex problems, but I often felt that I didn't speak the same language as the leaders I supported. I could see myself pursuing leadership and scaling my impact, but I wasn't sure how to get there. I wanted to accelerate my career, position myself for leadership and expand my toolkit so I could communicate effectively with both organizational leaders and the communities they serve. Many of the leaders I admired had MBAs, and they often described the experience as transformative for both their personal and professional development. So that's what led her to business school. But she's having a blast. She goes on in the interview to talk a lot about what a great community Darden is and it's really close knit and she talks a lot about the case method, which as we know, is their primary method of instruction.
• 15:44
  Speaker B: So yeah, no, fantastic. And her profile will bring a lot of value to that community.
• 15:49
  Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So one last tidbit before we talk about this week's candidates is that we continue to roll out the podcast I've been recording with admissions directors. So last week we ran out one with Katie Radahl, who is currently the head of admissions at unc. Kenan Flagler. She just had some really terrific responses to the, to the questions, but it was nice to connect with her because, Alex, I don't know if you know this, but before working at unc, she had worked at MIT Sloan and helped them set up a big program with a partner school in Asia. And I also want to say, I hope I don't get this wrong, but I'm pretty sure she did a stint with one of the MBB. Maybe it was McKinsey. In any event, she had a lot of interesting kind of industry experience and she's been, you know, in the admissions world for a long time. So yeah, just a great conversation. You can hear that wherever you're. Listen to this episode.
• 16:41
  Speaker B: Very good.
• 16:41
  Speaker A: If you want to write to Alex and I write to infoearadmit.com I will say it's been a little while since we got an email from someone, Alex. So we're, you know, we like getting those notes. So just send us a note. Use the subject line wiretaps. We'll write you back, Alex. Anything else before we talk about this week's candidates?
• 16:57
  Speaker B: Let's kick on.
• 16:58
  Speaker A: All right, so this is wiretaps candidate number one. So our first candidate this week comes from an apply wire entry, and it's from a candidate who's applying now to start in the fall of 27. They have 11 schools on the target list, and those schools are Babson, Berkeley, bu, George Washington, Georgetown, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Indiana, Johns Hopkins, Michigan, Michigan State. So those are the list of target schools. This Canada has been working in software engineering. They have an undergraduate degree in computer science and engineering. They earned a 3.83 out of 4 in that GPA. This candidate is located in India. They've been working for three years, or they will have three years at the time of admission. And I think that actually probably means they really have two at this point. They are an Indian male, again working in India, and they would love to post mba, get in charge, get. Get involved with, with product management and maybe in the long term, getting into venture capital. I think they specifically cite an interest in what they call assistive technology. And I think that relates to, you know, people who have disabilities or. I'm not really sure what they mean by that, but I'm guessing that's what it means, you know, assistive technology that helps you to access things. So in any event, the big thing that they mentioned that I want you to comment on, Alex, is, is you'll notice I didn't share a test score and they actually left a note saying applying to these schools via test waiver, no GMAT or gre. So, Alex, what do you make of this candidacy?
• 18:32
  Speaker B: Yeah, I think they're selling themselves short by making that decision. And quite honestly, the choice of schools just seems quite random. It's sort of across the board and so forth. And certainly with the exception of schools like Hass and Ross, they're sort of targeting top 20, top 30 programs and so forth. So, yeah. Will they get admitted to some of these programs? Probably, if they do a decent job with their application and so on and so forth. Obviously their GPA is. If that's a conversion from an Indian scoring system, that's a really super gpa. So I imagine they're super smart and I imagine that they've done well at work, but they're a software engineer out of India. I think if they'd got a great test score reflective of that gpa, ie, you know, if it was a GRE similar to our next candidate, which is in the, which is 334, or if they had a GMAT of sort of 705 or something like that, you package all that up together, I mean, they, they would be looking at certainly top 16 type programs or more top 16 type programs than they're currently looking at, as well as the potential for scholarship money. So this might actually be an expensive decision on their part to take a waiver. So if they're targeting round two versus round one, it would have been ideal if they got the test score done and applied in round one because they are from an overrepresented population. But if they're targeting round two, I would really encourage them to put the brakes on anything that they're doing. Prep hard and get a test score that's reflective of their aptitude because financially that might be a really smart thing to do. So hopefully they listen to this and think about it. I like their goals. Right. Assistive technology, obviously, you know, there's something about their life, their circumstance and their experiences that have got them interested into that. So that would be weaved into their applications. No doubt. It definitely has a social impact focus. And you know, I think that they're not necessarily exploring venture capital, but they're exploring a venture in assistive tech as a long term goal. Right. So they already have an idea for that which business schools will love. Right. They'll love the fact that their applications are anchored around a really interesting long term goal. So please, I would really encourage this person, if they're applying in round two, to rethink that test waiver.
• 21:21
  Speaker A: Yeah. So there are a few things that jumped out at me right away. So first of all, they have 11 schools on the target list, which is probably several schools too many. Second off, as you point out, they have a really strong gpa, potentially solid work experience. And so why, you know, maybe, you know, they're casting a very wide net. You know, they have schools on their list like, you know, Michigan and Berkeley, but then they have some schools that are much lower ranking on the list too. So it's just too wide of a spread. And then the fact that they're from an overrepresented demographic, Indian male, computer engineer, software engineer. I mean, you know, then to waive the test just seems like a really bad idea. Yeah, it just, and I know, I understand why this could happen because schools that do offer waivers are, you know, they don't say if you are overrepresented don't waive. You know, they never would say that. Right. They would say, oh, if you think you meet the criteria, then fill out the waiver form. But the truth is, is that if you're in a competitive part of the pool, I mean, you're probably, you know, you're better served having a test. Especially, as you point out, if this guy's as smart as his GPA would suggest, why not take the tests, hit it out of the ballpark and then get into some of these schools or even higher ranking schools with a nice scholarship or something. There's one other thing I want to point out about this candidate and that is that they're quite young, you know, I mean, two years now, three years upon admission or matriculation. They. I don't know what the rush is. You know, part of me is like, wow, maybe they should get another year of experience, get a killer test score and apply in round one next year to top 16 business schools, you know, so, yeah, it's, there's a lot to unpack here. But like you, I'm quite enthusiastic about this. You know, their interest in accessibility work and the fact that they have, you know, an idea for an assistive tech venture.
• 23:00
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 23:00
  Speaker A: You know, there's social impact in there, there's a lot to like potentially, but I feel like they're sort of rushing to get apps in and cutting some corners as a result. And you know, it just, there's, there's not a real methodical approach here.
• 23:14
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:14
  Speaker A: So. Yeah, yeah. So work to be done.
• 23:16
  Speaker B: Yeah. Like I said, selling themselves short. Yeah. In the way they're approaching this.
• 23:20
  Speaker A: Yeah, totally. All right, I do want to thank them for sharing their profile. Hopefully they've tuned in, heard our advice and can make some changes accordingly. Let's move on and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two. So our second candidate this week comes from another Apply Wire entry that you've selected over on the site. And I should mention, like anyone listening, you can go and post to Apply Wire and be featured on the show. It's not very difficult to do, but in any event, this candidate has seven target schools. The schools are Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Michigan, Kellogg, UVA and Yale. They're looking to start next fall. Their pre MBA career has been in the consumer insights space, focusing on consumer packaged goods. They're interested in moving into consulting after business school. They have a whopping 334 on the green. Very high score there. Their GPA from undergrad is a 3.4. They attended a leading university for undergrad in Pakistan, but they currently have six years of work experience. And this is the really fun wrinkle with this candidate. They're located in Japan, so they are Pakistani in origin, but they've been working in Japan. They began their career at a global research like at a global research, research and expert network firm in Pakistan where they were just sort of supporting quantitative research for strategy consulting firms. And I guess at some point they joined the Japan business of a large multinational consumer goods company and relocated from Pakistan to Tokyo. Like sounded like they kind of worked their way up and ended up getting to the headquarters. Right. So very interesting there. And you know, they've, they've had some international experience as a result. They also still do some volunteer work with a rural development organization in Pakistan. They help with grant proposals, they do workshops helping kind of small agribusiness owners on business planning. They really that they claim that work's very meaningful to them because they, you know, have their kind of family roots in the region that they're helping. And as I said earlier, their post MBA career goal is to join the consumer products practice of a leading strategy consulting firm in the US in the long term they want to build a consulting firm that gives small and medium sized consumer goods businesses across South Asia the evidence and strategic support needed in any event. So that's, they did ask if we think their profile is competitive for these schools, if the target list is appropriate, appropriately balanced and which aspects of their profile should they, they emphasize? What do you think?
• 25:56
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, which aspects of profile should I emphasize? So that's actually indicating to me that they haven't applied yet. Right. So they're targeting round two. I would have preferred again to have seen them in round one, but maybe still in round two they can pull this off because I do think they have an interesting profile for Pakistani national. You know, they've obviously got good work experience but across two significant geographies that say significant, probably significantly different types of geographies. So that should really help frame the quality of their work experience, the six years etc. Etc. So they're a little bit further along the spectrum in that regard than let's say the candidate we just talked about. Right. So they're sort of coming up to three years, this candidate, sort of six years, two different significant geographies. They, they've got really good numbers. So that 334 GRE really helps stand out. Again, if our first candidate had that, we might have had a completely different conversation. Right. So they've got the 334 GRE. The GPA, I think, is probably very good at 3, 4. Again, I think it's probably translated, you know, from. From their domestic.
• 27:14
  Speaker A: Right.
• 27:15
  Speaker B: Scaling system, if it was a US gpa, be a little bit more. Less enthusiastic, I suppose. And I think their goals make a lot of sense based off of what they've done, etc. Etc. So they've got a really good sort of through line in terms of what they've done, their goals, why MBA, etc. That should all work out really, really well and I like that. Community involvement, you know, and maybe they can. There might be a little bit of a story in there that's sort of talks about how far they've come, if they've come from a rural upbringing, from Pakistan and now they've managed through university and career to travel all the way through to Japan and doing some significant things. I think that's an interesting story in of itself. So I like this candidate overall, Graham. Again, I wished that they were able to have applied in round one to sort of dot the I's and cross the T's, but they're applying M7 as well as top 16, so fingers crossed. But overall, I like this candidate.
• 28:19
  Speaker A: Yeah, I think, you know. Yeah, clearly. Would it have been better in round one? Perhaps? Yeah, I mean, I. I think that's fair, but otherwise, I do like the profile like you do, and I think that it's. Yeah, it's not every day that you see someone. I. I think there's a. Two things here. One is they're working in Japan, as we already pointed out, is quite unique. But the other thing I found kind of fascinating is that they have a background more on a kind of strategy consulting, kind of quantitative research. And now cpg, which isn't exactly what you might ordinarily see from an Indian or Pakistani candidate who are kind of, you know, engineers, like that, like our first candidate, you know, kind of software engineering. So they have a little bit of a niche on the work side that I think is going to play well for them.
• 28:59
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 28:59
  Speaker A: So in any event. Yeah, but I, you know, I get it all in. I'm not worried about the school selection. Like, there's a nice group of schools here. I mean, are they, you know, they're obviously all pretty good schools.
• 29:10
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 29:10
  Speaker A: But, you know, they're kind of spread across the top 16 with. With some M7, some, you know, some top 16. So I think they'll land somewhere with this list. They just need to buckle down, get it done and get those apps in tell a great story in their file, but. Yeah, I mean, I'm. I find this candidacy to be interesting and. And kind of bold. I mean, it's not every day you see someone you know relocate to a such a different culture from their own. So.
• 29:32
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 29:32
  Speaker A: Yeah. Should make for a good application.
• 29:34
  Speaker B: Very good.
• 29:35
  Speaker A: Yeah. Alex, that's. We've reached the end of our candidates for this week, but appreciate you picking these out, as always. We'll find some time to record an episode next week as well. My US Journeys will continue. I'm heading south. I'll be in New York or maybe Philadelphia. I can't remember where I'll be when we record next, but looking forward to it. So I'll catch up with you next week.
• 29:53
  Speaker B: Nice. Safe travels. Take care, everyone. Stay safe.
• 30:04
  Speaker A: Sam.