Latest / Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves / 171 - Laura Sidall Gave Up a Corporate Career to Chase Sport at 34, and Built a 10-Year Career in Triathlon

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171 - Laura Sidall Gave Up a Corporate Career to Chase Sport at 34, and Built a 10-Year Career in Triathlon · Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: When I decided to turn professional, it was I didn't have again a little bit similar to like, did you know where you wanted to be in your career?
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't have aspirations to be a world champion or to win a race.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know enough about the sport.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: All I wanted at the time was to, if I gave 100% of my attention to sport, how could could I, how good could I be?
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'd never given it that.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'd kind of played netball and done athletics to a relatively high level as a junior.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: But again, it was that hobby.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I got to that stage in my career, I said, I'm going to go full-time into professional sport.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: And if I give it my full attention, how good can I be?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, I'm Ryan Gunsalvers and welcome to a Second Win Academy Podcast.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: A show all about career transition through the lens of elite athletes.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Each week, I invite a guest to the show who shares their unique sporting story.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: Please join me to delve into the thoughts and actions of athletes through a series of conversations.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Don't worry, there's plenty to learn from those of you that aren't particularly sporty.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: Elite athletes are still people afterwards.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: Let's be inspired by the stories of others.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: Laura, welcome to the show.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: It's great to have you on here with me today.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Ryan.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: Good to be here.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking forward to to chatting with you.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: And as I was saying before, I'm happy you're looking forward to it, because I'm looking forward to it too.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: So we should we should definitely be able to have a laugh and talk about your career and well actually, you know, to share what I think is already quite interesting is the path that you have taken or indeed taking, I think open will open up opportunities for many people.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: So thanks for being open to share and have a chat.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sounds good.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: So look, to get us started, why not give us the infomercial you?
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not very good at keeping things short, so it might be a long infomercial.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I'm a professional triathlete.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I say professional triathlete, I've actually just finished my racing career in July this year, but I've been a professional triathlete for the last 10 years, competing over the long, long distance triathlon.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: So four or five hours to nine or ten hours of racing.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um I guess going back to the start, I grew up playing sport from the UK, played all sport at school, but it was very much the hobby.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: I did a gap year in the British Army and then went to study engineering at university, started working in the corporate world, and got a placement with my job at the time to Australia.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: So moved over there, and that's when I got into the sport of triathlon.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: So quite late in life, I think I was age 29 when I first started, and started it still very much as a hobby, but then sort of I guess got more and more serious, but and decided to give it a go and jump full-time into professional sport.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, that was 2014.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: Been doing it for the last 10 years.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: I've been quite nomadic in my life.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: So I've yeah, lived in Australia, New Zealand, Spain, and I'm now based in Boulder, Colorado.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so good that you're able to travel around and and move around, at least at the sport enables you to do that.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: But what was interesting is at the start you introduced yourself as a professional athlete, although you did stop a few months ago.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: So we need a new catch phrase, a new tag for you, don't we?
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: We do, and I'm still trying to work out what that is.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: So any answers on a postcard and any help will be very much uh very much appreciated.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'll be taking notes and at the end we'll see if we can come up with something of this chapter.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Which sounds fun.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: You're talking there about a professional athlete, but you came to the store late, right?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'll ask this one first, but I'm assuming you were in a relatively well paid or at least consistently paid sure.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: But you get paid in the 25th Order of every month.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: What made you take a leap to be to then become a try and become a professional athlete?
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh very good question.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: I was, yeah, obviously I was in the corporate world.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'd moved to Australia as well.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: So my initial job in Australia was on like an expat deal as well.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I had a a very nice expat salary, and we got extra days of holiday.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: It was it was very lovely, obviously, living in Australia in Sydney as well.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um I guess what made me decide.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, sport's always been a massive part of my life.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, I I grew up playing all sports at school, you know, sort of as many hockey, netball, athletics.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: I always tell the story.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_01: I I was on the school swimming team, but we didn't have a swimming pool or we didn't officially have sort of a team.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: But because I was like the sporty kid at school, I we got put on a swimming team, and because I could swim in terms of I didn't drown, um, I always had to do butterfly in our relay team, and I got the team disqualified twice, and I still have no idea what I did.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: But that reflects if people know me as a triathlete, they know that swimming isn't my strong point.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: So that that goes back to that.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I I think so.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: I sport had always been seen as the the hobby though.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: It was never, you know, I grew up in a time when it was never seen as a career, it was just what you did to give yourself additional skills and look good on your your CV and resume when you applied for jobs.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it was only when I went to Australia and um I started doing triathlon when I was over there.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, again, it was still the hobby at the time, but I guess I got more and more into it.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: I got more and more invested, more and more of my headspace and my time was thinking about sport.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: And even though I started as a complete beginner, I got better and better.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I I got to a stage I was I'd won four amateur world championship titles, and then people sort of started saying, Oh, you should you should turn professional.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I was kind of like, I don't know what that means.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so a little bit more exploring, but I I just got to that point of thinking sport is not going to be around forever, whereas the corporate career is or potentially is.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_01: At that point, I was now sort of 34, and it, you know, most athletes are retiring from professional sport at that time, and I was kind of in that like, well, it it is kind of a now or never, never, never position.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Fortunately, sort of the the longer distance triathlon is more suited to, you know, that as you get older, you have more endurance.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_01: So it's sort of kind of better in that way.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: But obviously did miss out on a lot when I was younger.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I just got to that point.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I had a great job, I had a good boss, she was awesome, but I just got to that point of going, if I don't give it a chance now, then I'm still gonna be sort of stuck in this corporate desk job in 10, 20 years' time, thinking what if, and and never having given it a try.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: So it was a bit of a leap of faith, uh bit of a financial calculation on the back of an envelope, see if it was viable.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then I and then I threw the envelope in the bin and ignored it and thought if I if I read if I read too much into that, I'm never gonna make the move.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, that was kind of the the jump.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I was going to say, I I don't know what calculation that could have been that would have actually made financial, long-term financial sense.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: So it was very much then I like you say, you you saw some success, and I'll let you in on a a secret.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I actually I've probably about a similar age.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: 29, I as I moved to Australia for the first time, and I took up yeah, it must just be a Brit coming over the sunshine, thinking, I can go in this ocean and it's warm enough to swim.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: This is this is great.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: Clearly, my swimming deficit was significantly greater than yours.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I didn't I didn't go much beyond doing a a a few triathlons for a bit of fun.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I can yeah, but I can understand how you know you're coming over to to Oz and you you know you just got this next passion then for triflon.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: How but how did you first get into it?
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: So it was actually through friends from work.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: So they found out I was a runner by background, so I'd done running growing up, and at that stage, just before I left to move to Australia, I was doing sort of 400s, 800s.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'd come from a 400 hurdle background, but now it's sort of 400s and 800s.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I started running with a friend from work, and we actually planned to do this big event in Sydney called The City to Surf, but that's a whole nother story about that.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um but yeah, and then through friends from work, they were just saying, Well, we're doing there's a charity bike ride, it's 90 kilometers down the coast in Sydney.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: You start in, you start in central Sydney, you finish down the coast, you get the train back.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, you know, they said, you know, you should you should come.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, great, sounds good.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: Don't have a bike.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: So went and bought a bike sort of the week before, and it was like a hybrid road mountain bike.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: I'm pretty sure it was several sizes too small for me when I look at the photos, like, yeah, flat, flat bar across the top, flat pedals.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, I'm pretty sure the bike shop saw me coming and just sold me like a bike that's far too small.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: I can't remember even.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: I I definitely didn't wear any lycra, but I can't remember what I wore.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, just did this event again, didn't obviously it it was just a a community event, so it wasn't a race as such, but I did just I did really enjoy it, and I found that I guess I was keeping up with some people that looked like they were proper cyclists.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: And because Friends Womwork knew I ran as well, they just suggested, they said, Oh, you should try triathlon.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_01: And because it's so big, it's such a big sport over there, everybody's doing it, and you know, obviously any sport, but when you've got the weather in, like you said, you're swimming down at the ocean and and things like that.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I was looking for something, so I, you know, went online and managed to find a beginner's course uh with a group called Bondi Fit, based down at Bondi Beach, and they actually ran sort of a six-week beginner triathlon programme, which coincided with a local race at the end of it.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, signed up to that and yeah, I guess as like cliche says, the rest is history, just got sucked in and hooked and loved it.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's great.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: So let let's let let's go back a bit because I I want to get some of that backstory of you in the UK.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: You you mentioned earlier about you enjoying sport or growing up as quite a sporty person.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: So was that was that in the family?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: Was this something where you grew up and sport was an integral part of childhood?
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was funny.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: My I mean, my my dad was quite sporty when he was younger.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: I don't remember, I mean, he when I remember him, he was working and he would do what they called in those days keep fit on an evening or he'd go and play squash.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: And I think my mum sort of she was did horse riding when she was a kid, but not anything specifically.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't remember necessarily how it came about.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm the I'm the youngest of four girls.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um my one of my elder sisters was very sporty as well, and I think I just kind of followed in her footsteps, and I I just loved it.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: I just I was the kid that loved watching the Olympics and loved and was sort of obsessed by the athletics and the track and field or the swimming or whatever it was that was at the Olympic Games, but you know, also coming from sort of that background, like I said, school the sport was always the hobby.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it was kind of you went through school and university and you did your exams, you got your degree, you got your your corporate job, um, and it was never seen as that career.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I was probably just a little bit too old because as I was sort of going through the end of my school years and my A levels, they were just bringing in the talent ID um programs because they'd got the Olympic Gate, they'd just got the bid for the Olympic Games in 2012.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: So they were just going in to sort of set up these talent ID programs.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: But I was I was just that like a year or two too old.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I always kind of like that's I mean, I I don't have any regrets, and I def you know, I who knows where I'd have been if I had been younger, but I often think I would have liked to have gone through a a talent ID program just to see where it did it did put me.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it it would have been.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: So academia was always something that you thought you you had to do as you were growing up as well.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we were kind of just I guess it was just, yeah, you went to school and got your exams and got the degrees and kind of worked hard, I came, I guess, came from a family of, yeah, we worked hard and and stuff like that.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I wouldn't say missing out on the talent ID, but you sort of at the time you were thinking, oh, I'd love to do that, but a year or two too old, or is it more as you reflect and you think, what could have been?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: A little bit of both.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: I think I remember being aware of it at the time, of thinking, oh, it'd be good to do that, but I was, you know, you always you had to be under 16 or whatever age it was, and I was too old.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: But then also sort of it's probably, you know, hindsight's that great great vision.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: So it could have been also with sort of looking back and going, oh, I wish that opportunity had been there.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: As we look back at all of these, what is it, turning doors moments, sliding doors, that's it.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: And you and then you're thinking, what's going on here?
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, could it could it have been supposing this and supposing that?
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: But then becomes interesting is so for me, I'm I'm trying to understand, as you finished school, you took this gap year in the army.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: Was that you know what what sort of made you want to take that leap into the army?
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um again, great question.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I have racked my brains to think why the army came up.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: I I I think partly because I I I did sport at school.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: My uncle was in the army, and I don't know if I can't remember if that had anything to do with it.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: I think I knew I wanted to take a gap year.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: I was going on to doing an engineering degree, and that was four years at university, and I didn't want to go straight from school into that four years, so I did want a break, but I didn't for some reason want to do what was then the traditional gap year of you worked for half the year and then you went travelling.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to do something more.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't know.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: And the army gap year, it it still is probably one of the best years of my life.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: We had sort of a condensed four weeks of training at the Royal Military Academy at Sandhurst, where the uh which is the officer training college, and normally the officers get 48 weeks before they go into the army, and we had like this compressed four weeks of shock.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then you were kind of out in out in the real army, so to speak.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, as an 18-year-old female on paper as a as a second lieutenant, I was in charge of you know, 30, 40 men, soldiers who had far more experience than me.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I was in an engineering course.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was in the Royal Electrical Mechanical Engineers.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so but so in terms of like leadership, respect, teamwork, I learned so much from the guys that I worked with.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: I was really fortunate, I had an amazing year, as well as a lot of sport, adventurous training, and all of that good stuff.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I it's still one of the best years of my life.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I've always wanted to do things something slightly different.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: I've never kind of wanted to follow the trend, follow the conveyor belt exactly.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's why kind of I've done things in certain ways throughout my life.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: It it's it's really interesting just that, you know, the decision to go, and he did it without the intention of being long-term in the army.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: It was sort of your gap year.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so it it actually was it was amazing.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: It was a they actually called it a gap year commission, and you had to have a place at university guaranteed before you were able to join.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so the actual aim of it, it was really interesting.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: The aim was that you didn't necessarily recruit you at the end of your gap year or at the end of your then university degree, but it was that you would go into the army, have this fantastic year, you would then go into university, you would always speak favorably of your of the army, you would probably then naturally recruit your friends who would then sign.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: And also then it once you got into a corporate position, if you were in a whatever role that would be, you would always look favorably back on the officers in the armed forces, which it it worked.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: I had a couple of friends who signed up.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_01: But again, that you know, we talk about sliding doors moment.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: I often think what would have happened if I had joined.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like I had friends from that gap year who did then join up afterwards into the army.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I did want to do like the officer training core that they had at university, but it was on a Wednesday afternoon, which was sports afternoon, and it all clashed at the same time as sport.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I kind of had to make this decision, and for that, for that, the sport won on that one.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: Well, so well, what sport were you doing at uni?
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: What what kept you going those Wednesday afternoons?
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uni, I was doing netball, yeah.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_01: And then in my later years at uni, I went back to doing athletics.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, okay, and doing arguably the hardest distance.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, the brutal distance.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: But when you said it, I almost vomited.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: Oh gosh.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny whenever I I think back to those track sessions, or even as a track athlete, when we go to track the track and do a session, the the memory that comes back is sort of after the session, going home and then sitting on the bathroom floor, not sure whether I'm going to vomit or or whatever, because I still feel sick from the session.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: Conversation for another another show, I'm sure.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: But uh but yeah, it is that that training can be quite brutal.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: So look, during then university, during this time, what you were doing engineering course.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: What what aspirations did you have?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: What where did you want your life to take you at that point?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_01: I honestly had no idea.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: I was obviously interested in sport and I did a couple of great summer placements at um Sheffield University in a sports, sports tech kind of department, which was great.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: But I really had no idea what I wanted to do.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't really sure that I wanted to go into engineering afterwards.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I guess I sort of fell into it because I applied for a summer intern with Shell, the oil company, and got accepted for that summer.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: And at the end of that summer, they put you through to the graduate assessment program, and I got accepted and got so got offered a job on their graduate program, and I got offered that job before I started my final year at university.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, when you're doing a four-year degree and then you've got debts and stuff like that, and you're not really sure what to do, and you get offer a job offer, you kind of don't turn it down.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I I honestly had no, I didn't really know what I was going to do afterwards.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: I kind of just assumed I probably would, like I said, sort of follow that conveyor belt and go into industry and and I guess engineering or business in in some form or other.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I yeah, ended up in ended up at Shell.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, okay.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: And is that how you moved, you got a move then also to Australia?
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's how I got to Australia.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_01: I applied for uh they had a program at Shell called Go, which is Global Opportunities, and it was sort of a two-year, two-year assignment, and it was for kind of um, I guess more recent graduates, so younger people in the company, to give them experience and exposure of an overseas assignment, whereas where their professional grade probably wouldn't normally allow it.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I luckily, you know, I think I think somebody suggested it and I saw there was this opportunity in Australia, and I was like, yep, that's the one I want to go.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um and you know, when I went, everyone said, Oh, it's you know, it's only for two years, but I don't think you're gonna come back.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, no, no, no, it's fine.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's two years, I'll be back.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, that that two years turned into seven or or however many, and yeah, didn't haven't been back to the UK since.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that was uh when did I leave the UK?
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_01: End of end of 2007, beginning of 2008.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's so so good how you've you kind of followed your nose and you followed what was interesting for you from that corporate or the that time is a more traditional career.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: And look, I'm in when did I leave England?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: I left England, very similar time, and again, not not moved back yet, still enjoying the blue skies and things like that.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: So this you know, coming in Oz and what what's really interesting is did it did it ever occur to you that you were going from being a student to being in the military, to being in corporate in England, to being in corporate in Australia, did it ever occur to you that you were reinventing yourself for sort of starting again each every single time?
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I guess no, probably at the time.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: I probably wasn't, I was probably sort of too young and naive or not worldly wise at that point.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: But I think now when I look back at those stages in my life and then the way my sporting career has developed, then I'd say yes, I kind of regularly go through this sort of yeah, like you said, reinventing yourself or yeah, change of direction.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's right.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it it goes well certainly to what you're perhaps interested in and and where you've got a gift of of you know of something be it, just the energy of I'll move overseas, why not the other side of the world, literally?
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: So it's just what what do you think was the motivation behind or what is that motivation behind doing that?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: The only thing I I can is sort of when I think about it, is that just not wanting to follow the norm?
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know why.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know whether that's being the youngest of four girls, I don't know where where that fits in, whether that was sort of from my school environment of sort of feeling very much like you were and I would say this is not any pressure from my parents or anything like that, but feeling very much like you're, you know, you're on that conveyor belt of A-levels, jot corporate j university, corporate job.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I I I don't know, something's just always been in me that I've wanted to do something different or not follow the trend.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: And even, you know, even in my sporting career, I've probably done things a little bit different and not often followed the trend.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not saying that now with hindsight, I like at the time I think they were the right decisions for me, or or they were the decisions I made with the information I had available and what my preferences were.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: If I look back on my sporting career, were they the best decisions?
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe not, sort of thing.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I I've always, you know, I probably would have been better.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I I've always, like I said, I've been quite nomadic and moved around, which means I've my coaches tended to be overseas, so virtual.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: I've tended to sort of be training on my own rather with a group.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: And yet at the same time, I've I crave the group and I crave the community.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: So would I have been better and would I have made more of my career if I'd have joined or you know, found a base, found a home earlier in one location, found a group, found a coach that I fit in and then trained with them more.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: Would I have reached, would I have got more out of my potential sort of thing?
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: So um, but at the time, they're kind of the decisions you make, and that's the path, and it's I don't know, some people call it running away from things.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not sure what I'm running away from, something obviously, because I kept changing, changing location and changing direction, but yeah.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it sounds like you kept things fresh, you always gave yourself a new landscape.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: And but it it is interesting, then you do ask yourself, well, if you stayed longer or stayed with the pack or trained.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I suppose I ask you then, when when you think back as being a pro-triathlete, what is it you enjoyed the most about doing that?
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: So when I decided to turn professional, it was I didn't have again, a little bit similar to like, did you know where you wanted to be in your career?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't have aspirations to be a world champion or to win a race.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know enough about the sport.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: All I wanted at the time was to, if I gave 100% of my attention to sport, how could could I how good could I be?
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'd never given it that.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'd kind of played netball and done athletics to a relatively high level as a junior.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: But again, it was that hobby.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: So I got to that stage in my career, I said, I'm gonna go full-time into professional sport, and if I give it my full attention, how good can I be?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: Didn't know what that meant.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: See, on that, I I'm I'm interested to understand why you were asking yourself that question.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_00: What is it that made you ask that particular bit at that moment?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'd played I I'd ran for England as a junior, or English schools, I should say, and I'd got to England netball trials.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: But and I loved sport.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um but I think like I said, it was always seen as that hobby, so I never fully committed to doing it because I never saw it as a career option.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I think being in Australia and having it, you know, sport so much more accepted over there, and obviously just a change of time and generations, because I think it is very different in the UK now.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: I think sort of opened my eyes to say, like, you could you can do sport as a career, and because it was what I what I loved, um that was kind of that motivation to go, okay, I've never given it full attention.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: If I fully invest in it, let's just see what I can do.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so that was kind of that motivation there.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: So you knew you could do more because you it sounds like you almost accidentally won um these world amateur championships by by following, I guess just by engaging and by enjoying and just in just by just doing it, right?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like we had a that group that I joined in in Australia, it was a great group because it was it was more of a training group.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: And Spot Anderson, who's notorious over there in Sydney, he, you know, he ran sessions every morning and every evening of every day of the week.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: And it was a social circle.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: It was my friend, you know, some of my my close friends are still from those triathlon days.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_01: And being a sports mad person, I was just obsessed because I was like, this is amazing.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_01: I can swim and run and bike in the morning, in the evening, before work, after work, all of the weekends, and I'm out in this beautiful country and I'm outside and I'm swimming in the ocean before work and all of this.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: So it was just this incredible opportunity and experience.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: But it was fun because you, regardless of the weather, you know, he always said rain, hail, shine, you knew that your friends would be there at Centennial Park at five in the morning when it was dark with the lights on and the bike and stuff like that.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: So it was always very much fun with it as well.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: So you decided to make this leap.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: You wanted to turn this fun hobby into a serious career.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: And what I have to assume is a late starter for entering um sort of profess any professional sport, but in particular still into Iron Man as well, right?
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: What did you shift in your lifestyle to make it work?
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: So, in terms of like physical things, I moved from Australia to America.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: I went to San Francisco first and I joined a coach there because I wanted I decided that if I was because I was later on in life, um, I didn't have that much time or I had.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: To sort of move things rapidly.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I needed to be all invested.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to go and work with a coach who worked with other professional athletes.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to be immersed with other professionals.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_01: So after a bit of research, I found a coach and went to San Francisco.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: I only stayed there for about two years, didn't particularly enjoy the environment, and so learned that actually your environment is also very key in being successful as an athlete and you know the team and the people you have around you.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that's how I ended up back in the Southern Hemisphere, but in New Zealand.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_01: But I think the shifts, and I know it's still some things that I've struggled with my whole athletic career was going from having the sport as a hobby and a passion to then it's your job and it's everything you do.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: And real and the I think probably the biggest thing is the rest and the recovery.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: Because, you know, obviously when I was, you know, at school and you're playing sports and you're fitting it in and you're doing homework, and then you do the corporate, you're you've got your corporate job, and I was training before work and after work, and then I would work again, you know, and I would be surviving off and literally surviving.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: It would wasn't thriving off, you know, four or five hours that was sleep a night and thinking that was okay.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then trying to translate that into the sport being your full-time job, where actually rest and recovery is part of that job.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: But it was such a mind F for me because every time I I felt I was resting or sitting on the sofa or things, I just felt lazy.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_01: I felt I should be doing something.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: I felt lazy, and I that's always been the hard shift of actually going, no, as a professional athlete, that rest and recovery is so key and important, and it's actually part of your job.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not being lazy, it's actually being responsible uh for getting the best out of you from a performance aspect day to day.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: There are too many stories of bankruptcies, mental health issues, and unfortunately suicide.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it's time to act.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: Every year, we see thousands of athletes that reach a point where they need to consider their life activity sports.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: This might be a retirement, injury, or they need to juggle your careers between sport and a job.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: As a former English professional footballer, I have somehow managed to transition from sport into banking, strategy, innovation, and now life coach, career practitioner, and founder of the Second Wind Academy.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to help those around me find their career second with.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: Find me on Insta or through my new Facebook group, Second Wind Academy, where I'd love to know your thoughts and suggestions.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: How did you adjust to record to being okay with the rest and recovery?
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: I've probably never really have.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's probably also been one of the limit limiters in what I've achieved, but I've had to work really hard on it by sort of trying to change sleep ha sleep habits and just commit to going to bed earlier and making sure I am trying to do rest days properly.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: And the other side of that resting is like the fueling, the nutrition.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: So are you fueling properly before, after the session and in the evening?
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so, yeah, that's it's all that sort of stuff, which I definitely say I'm not, I'm definitely not probably world-class at that sort of stuff, possibly, yeah, limitations in what I could achieve.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: You mentioned just briefly there, because I wanted to try and get this difference between that mental state as a world-class amateur and then a world-class professional.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: As an amateur, you were speaking there about that challenge between thinking, training, and then working and trying to manage that that rest recovery piece.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: Then as an athlete, it's thinking about, well, I need to do rest and recovery, and it's much more all all encompassing.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: When you think about both of those experiences, how do you, how do you, how do you sort of cope with that shift of being off and on and then sort of trying to be always on, but having to switch off at the right times?
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's really hard.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember my first coach when I moved to San Francisco, sort of saying to me, Oh, you need to get a hobby to switch off.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, Well, I sport was my hobby, and now it's my career, and now you're telling me to get a hobby.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: What do I do?
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: Should I get do I get a job as a hobby?
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: Is that the kind of the you know, a corporate job?
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um so it is really hard to do that, but I think it is finding, you know, I think you do still see athletes some athletes perform better when they do have something else in their life, whether that is studying, volunteering, helping other people, even you know, with families and stuff, if they're mothers or fathers and and they've got kids to look after.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_01: So it is just working out that balance and what works for you.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um for me, I guess again, a little bit from the corporate career, I've and also because I just think you know, sports quite it is a very selfish career, and we're very fortunate to get to follow our passion as our job, but you do feel like, you know, what value do you add to the world sort of thing?
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, if I always said during the pandemic, you know, if if all the if all the doctors disappeared from the world, we'd be in trouble.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_01: But if all the athletes disappeared, you know, the world would carry on, sort of thing.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I think I've always seeked or sought out other things where I could add value, whether that was in sport, but so being on different athlete bodies or committees or doing things from that side of things, um, mentoring younger athletes and that sort of thing.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I've always, and that's I guess what I've used to do my, although it's still sports-related, just trying to do that to switch off and compartmentalize from trading to to recovery.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: And so getting that balance, that sort of mental switch off as you described there, sounds like it's quite a healthy thing and that a lot of athletes should be doing.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: So for you though, how did that shift from when you let's say the first two years of the first two years of being a pro through to the last two years of being a pro, how did finding that balance and that external hobby, how did it change?
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: I think part of that was actually so I I changed coach in at the end of 2019, and then I moved out to Boulder here in Colorado at the beginning of 2023 to sort of be, which is where my coach is, and she's got a squad.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the previous years I had sort of had a coach and there was a squad, but we were all sort of all over the place, and we would come together for training camps, but then I did a lot of training on my own and things like that, where and I think then sort of coming to Boulder, and there's so many professional athletes here, and actually seeing day-to-day what others do as professionals and how they balance that with their partners, with their kids, if it is, or or whatever it is, and just that level of I guess, yeah, another level of professionalism.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um and along with the fact my coach now, uh Julie Dibbins, is incredible, absolutely amazing, and so invested in you as the athlete.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, to the good or bad.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_01: So she would, you know, she would sort of give me ultimatums of saying, like, if you don't sort out your rest and you'll get your sleep sorted or your nutrition, then I am not going to give you the training sessions that you want to do.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I can't load you up on the volume that you want to do because you're you can't absorb that training because you're not getting the fueling and the recovery.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_01: So it's sort of like that ultimatum of forcing you.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's again, you you know, we keep coming back to this sliding doors moment.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_01: I wish, like I my first coach I had when I turned professional, he was fantastic for what I needed at the time.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_01: But I do wish I'd have met or started working with Julie earlier in my career, because I think what we achieved in the latter half of my career, when actually I thought I'd only got one or two years left and was wondering if I changed coach at all.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_01: But she sort of gave me this new lease of life and a few more years, and I had some of my best results.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think if I'd have started working with her earlier, actually seen and been in that environment more of what those professionals do, I think that would have, yeah, it would have been interesting to see.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: What what are the key things that were different?
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_01: Just prioritizing.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know whether it's again, it's coming from probably still that ingrained of having sport as the hobby and not the full career.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_01: And so even though it was my career, I think you're always still sort of covering your tracks or and I think there's that fa fear failure as well, failure of not making it, and so you maybe don't fully invest, because then you've got an excuse if it doesn't, you know, you it's protection mechanism.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: Holding back.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think, like I said, there's so many professionals here, and some are the best in the world, and it's interesting to see like some of them are very, very focused and intense, and they don't have anything else outside their sport, and that's amazing, and that's why they are so good at what they do.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think it's healthy and sustainable long term, but at the same time, you can't go too far the other way because then you're not really being a professional, and it is still sort of that hobby, but you're just pretending it's professional.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: So it is finding that balance of what works for you in terms of the focus and the priorities you put on the training, the rest of the recovery while still having that balance of what life is.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: How do you navigate that balance for yourself?
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_01: Sadly.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: Still trying still troubling, travelling.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, it again it's hard.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like I've always had to work at the sleep and the rest and recovery.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: She says at 1am in the morning.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_01: Now I've stopped racing, I've just gone back to all my bad habit.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thing I think sort of, you know, a bit like i in Australia as well, and in Boulder here in Colorado, it's it's such an outdoor place, and there's mountains, and you can go skiing and hiking and riding, and and I want to do everything, and I want to go on that stand-up paddleboard trip, and I want to go skiing for the weekend or this, but it's finding that balance of saying, actually, no, like for the next two years, your focus is to be the best triathlete you can be.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_01: And yes, there's some of that balance.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_01: So, on when you're having a recovery period or a rest period or a break from training, yes, go and do the other things to be active and healthy and feed that mind and body and soul.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_01: But then when you're trying to be a professional triathlete, you've got to make those hard decisions of going, no, I need- I can't go skiing today, or I can't do that trip because it's not helping me be the professional triathlete.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: And that's okay because this is my focus for the next two years, and I've got the next, you know, hopefully 10, 20, 30 years where I can go and do that other stuff.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so it's helping, it was helping to sort of shift your mind of going, yes, there's all these amazing things you can do.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_01: And we're as traathlets, we're active people, we're endurance athletes, we love that, and I love the outside doors and going on adventures.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: But it was just understanding that yes, I can do that, but just not now.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_01: And that now it's gotta be more targeted and specific on swim bike run.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: At what point during your career, pro triathlete career, did you start to realise this is a this is a I'm I'm finishing.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so a couple of times.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: So first when I was coming up to the age of 40, um, because I thought we had to finish at the age of 40.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that's what you did, and you, you know, it was 40 was way too old to be a professional athlete.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: And it was I was I was with my first coach, and that's what I was saying.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_01: I was sort of I wanted to change coach, but I was like, do I, you know, should I really change?
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_01: I'm only gonna have like a year or so left of my career.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_01: Do I want to go through that with a new coach?
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_01: Should I just ride this out?
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I'm very fortunate that I did make that change and started working with Julie and like I said, she gave me this sort of new lease of life, and at the age of 42, 43, I had a couple of the best years of my career in terms of results.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so then I thought, well, I well, I knew I wasn't gonna carry on forever because of age does, but um I I think I then just started getting to a point I was then getting, you know, in the early 40s, and fine one, financially, it's it's hard to keep making it sustainable.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I knew at some point I would need to go back into earning to make a l uh have a sustainable living.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thing that happened was I I was hit by a car.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I'd come off the back of, so the end of 2021, I had a great race, a race in Germany called Challenge Roth, and then went into 2022 and had one of my best years, um, results-wise.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_01: I finished in the top 10 at the World Championships twice in that year, um, which was again sort of something I'd never dreamed of when I first started the sport.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that was incredible.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I came into the start of 2023 still so pumped and so hyped about I still could see where I could improve, and I still felt I was getting better, and my body was still performing and taking on the load of trading, and I could see the improvements that we were going to make or we could make.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I went into this race in Brazil, probably in one of the best shapes of my life.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_01: And the next minute I was on the side of the road having been hit by a car and can't remember anything about it, and ended up having a like a brain bleed and a concussion.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so kept managed to go back to Boulder and sort of had gone from, you know, 30 hours a week of training, incredibly fit, to then like zero and couldn't do anything, which I kind of had never had in my life because you'd always I'd always done some form of sport.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I had a great support network around me again with my coach Julie and a couple of other people.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_01: And we did, I did get back that year and had another, you know, managed to go to the world championships again and had another great performance given considering the build-up I'd had with the accident.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_01: But then since then it was almost like age and everything caught up.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_01: It was like before that I was sort of holding off age and I was felt like I was still improving and my body was still felt young, I guess.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_01: And then almost after that accident happened, it was like everything just caught up with me, and everything's just been more of a struggle to get back fitness, or you have a bit of a niggle, or you can't recover better as well from training sessions, or rather than seeing my times and things improve, they've sort of flattened off now and we're starting to dip.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: So that was part of that realization of going, it's just getting harder and harder.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: Also, you know, there's a there was a there's always a new influx of women in the sport, and they're always raising the level and they're always younger and younger.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_01: You know, half the women I race now are, you know, they're they're half my age kind of thing.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so that so then as well coming back from injury, but you've got to come back at your level and some because the sport's going on.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's moved on.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it was just sort of I got to that point of going, yeah, I love it and I love the training, but it's too hard to get the body and the mind to compete anymore.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I kind of need to do something different, and it's time to move on.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I still want to be healthy and active, and that's the next challenge of trying to work out what that looks like and how you get those same endorphins and how you get that same feeling of feel sensations of feeling fit, but balancing it with you know, whatever else you're doing in life.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so, yeah, that was that.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I probably toyed around with it for a little while, going when is the right time is now.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I think the crash was sort of this probably the start of the end, and a few other sort of things fell out from that that made me go, yeah, I think it's it's time.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_00: What made you pick now?
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_00: What what made you pick a few months ago?
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I came into so I kind of decided that 2025 would probably be my last year, just with I had some sort of repercussions and health issues after the going last year in 2024 after the crash, but I wanted to go out on my terms.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um I wasn't prepared to let someone else dictate my story, which you know, actually as an athlete, if you get to go out on your terms, that's a very privileged position because not many athletes do.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_01: Most people, it's an injury or or something that's ending their career.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I had aspirations, you know, um, it would have been great to go back to Kona and the Iron Man World Championships for one last year, but kind of realised at the beginning of the year, again, just with sort of the the effort of training and trying to get back to those levels of fitness and how that had all changed, that that was going to be a really hard ask.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_01: So I kind of decided that there's a race in July in Germany called Challenge Roth.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's one of my favourite races.
• 49:53
  SPEAKER_01: I've done it every year of my career, and I've had some great memories, and the team are awesome.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_01: So kind of just made sense to then yeah, make that the last race and and end it, yeah, in the middle of the year.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that that's it, like you say, it's a wonderful way to be able to control your narrative and you know go out on as much as possible on your terms.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_00: So when you started to recognise, right, it's July, this is it, everything's sort of leading to that point.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_00: What have you been doing to prepare?
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_01: Putting my head in the sand and ignoring it.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um if that's true, that's okay.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, yeah, you know, it could I I asked the question in all honesty, I suppose, like, how did you prepare?
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, I mean, it it's hard because you you can get advice and and things from people, but it until you go through it yourself, you don't really know what's gonna happen and or how you're gonna feel.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_01: And yes, like for the last few years, and I think like I sort of said throughout my career, I've always been looking to do other things.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_01: So for the last couple of years, I I've always been trying to sort of develop other little projects in, you know, for the for the what if and the what next.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so building networks, making sure I I guess just talking and talking to people and finding out what I would want to do next.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think it was that I want to go back into corporate nine to five, I want to still be in sport, but what does that look like?
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_01: So I was doing things like that for the past few years, but at the same time, then when you come to that point of going, okay, well, come July after that race, I'm not in theory going to be a professional athlete.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_01: So what does that look like?
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's really hard because at that time you're still in training mode for this race.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so, and with triathlon, and I'm sure with any other sport, it's it takes so much energy mentally, not just physically, and maybe more so since the accident, that kind of you don't really have capacity to think, what am I gonna do on the the day after the race or whatever?
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_01: So, whilst I was trying to do lots of work and networking and things like that for the last couple of years, I hadn't really got anything concrete.
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_01: And at the same time, I think there's a need as an athlete to actually detrain yourself and come down because it's been such an integral part of who you are that if you kind of stop cold turkey, there's all sorts of things that come along with that.
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I it's almost like you need to carry on and slowly wean yourself off training or wean yourself to a level of okay, well, what makes sense for me now?
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_01: And what do I want to do, and what can I do with if my priorities and things have changed?
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_00: To what extent have you been able to wean yourself off physically?
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it's been interesting because we sort of after the last few years with my crash, my coach wanted a break as well.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_01: So we had slightly different thoughts of what it looked like after the race.
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_01: I was kind of like, well, I'll still come along to training and I'll still do stuff with the group because I've got nothing else to do for the moment until I sort myself out.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_01: Where she was like, no, that's kind of it.
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, and I understand that.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you also need to go and find like your new community, so to speak.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_01: So for a lot of us as athletes and training, that that was my community, and so you've almost lost, you've lost who you are as an athlete, you've lost your community.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I've tried to sort of take the last couple of months, I've tried to keep moving to some level.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_01: So try to still be riding my bike, running.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_01: I voluntary, voluntarily went swimming, which was quite amazing to most people, but it's not structured, and I've realized that I think probably well, from the background I've had with it school degree or in the military, I need structure and I almost need someone else to sort of give me that structure.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_01: But I've been trying to say, don't worry about it for now, just keep moving and give your mind and body time to rest and recover, because that's what's needed as well.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_01: And give yourself a bit of a timeline and then say, okay, from this date, then we're gonna try and find a little bit more what that routine looks like, what that structure looks like.
• 54:49
  SPEAKER_01: Try and get some form of, I'm not even probably gonna call it training, but exercise routine and plan in place to make it feel like you have that purpose again and you can get those endorphines whilst you're still trying to focus on right what does a career look like now.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_00: During this time, what has been then what's the what's the hardest struggle?
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_00: What's the hardest thing about going through this phase?
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're it's the training piece.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't realise how much I would miss.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh like I knew I knew I would miss it.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_01: I knew, like, are you ever gonna get those same sensations of feeling that fit again?
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_01: But I didn't realise quite how strong that would be, and see it being in still this environment and seeing all the other athletes who are still training those 30 hours a week and and things like that.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's been the hardest thing of going, I still want those endorphins, and I want that sensation, and I want that structure and feeling of training, and I don't know quite what it looks like yet.
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then having the confidence to go and join another group that do bike rides on a Wednesday or whatever, or find a running group where I can go and run that's sort of new and different and a different stimuli.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of how we opened up, you know, as you're describing yourself and you're walking into this new group, and they're like, hey, what should you say?
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, I'm Laura.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_00: All right, Laura, what do you do?
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, totally.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_01: And like, do you want to go through that all again?
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, you know, as adults as well, and I listen to a fair few podcasts, like it's it's so hard to make friends when you're older.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_01: And do you want to have to like go through all of that again and you're just so used to your own little world?
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_01: But at the same time, I know at the same time I know I have to because I need to have create that community again here.
• 57:06
  unknown: Yeah.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_00: How do you pick yourself up the cut to have the courage to go out and do that?
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I don't know, tell me because I haven't done it yet.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think it's well, I'll tell you what, Laura, let me ask you a different question.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_00: When you think then I mean you have lots of things that you still do.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I know I've got to do it because I know the benefit and the endorphins when I do it will be good on the other side.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's a bit like I guess, you know, how do you get yourself up and out the door to go for a run or something like that?
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it the f the hardest bit is putting your trainers on to go out the door.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_01: Once you come back, you get that benefit.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I know that once I do it, I'll probably love it and enjoy it.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I need to see it, you need to frame it as an opportun a new opportunity rather than using it to see what you're what you've lost and what you're missing.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and you know, this is a new opportunity to go meet new people.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still riding my bike, I'm still running, and you don't know what's going to be out there around the corner rather than going focusing on what you're what you've lost, and you're not part of that group anymore, and you're not part of that community, and you're not the athlete.
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's a couple of communities, because this is it's definitely an area we could probably chat, I'll say all night on uh for you as well.
• 58:35
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm interested though because whilst looking for those communities and whilst doing, you know, for yourself, you've been quite passionate and quite vocal about women's sport and being ambassadors in that in general.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_00: So what has what's driven you to be an advocate of fact, what is it you're advocating for?
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_00: But um, but also what's been what's driven you to start doing that?
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it's interesting, you know, I've always been, granted, I was one of four, I'm in an all-girl family, but apart from that, and I went to an all-girl school, but apart from that, like engineering, military has always been predominantly male environment.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I would say I'd never experienced or had any issues with that.
• 59:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think partly because you just didn't know any different, actually, at the time.
• 59:26
  SPEAKER_01: And probably if I look back now on those experiences, I'm sure there were things.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_01: But I've just I don't know.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: I've always had this.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_01: I I guess when I started Taratal and I got connected with a couple of people who were very passionate about promoting the women, women's sport and women's stories, and they saw the inequalities in it, and so they worked hard to try and tell the stories of the female athletes.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I guess I I just got involved because I saw, I believed, and saw.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_01: Or the same.
• 1:00:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've always been.
• 1:00:04
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'm I guess I'm very passionate about it getting anyone to be active, male, female, young, old, like the benefits of being fit and healthy.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's just, you know, daily walking, it doesn't need to be a triathlon, it doesn't need to be a marathon, it's your, you know, your 5K park run or your 5K walk.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't even need to be, you know, just though those benefits mental mentally and physically.
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, for kids, the skills that you learn.
• 1:00:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I just think mentally and physically as a kid, but the skills, the teamwork, the leadership, winning, losing, resilience, all that sort of stuff that you learn as a kid is amazing.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_01: But that carries, that carries through into adult life as well.
• 1:00:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, mental, physical health, but also again, that community and that connection that we all kind of need.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm passionate about that, and that's male, female, young and old.
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I think just also then there is I mean, triathlon is we're very lucky as a sport.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_01: We have equal prize money, we race over the same distance.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but then at the same time, there's still a lot of inequalities in terms of the coverage that the females get, or sponsorship contracts, or um fairness in races and things like that.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I won't go down rabbit holes, which I could do on that bit.
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, just always wanted to, you know, fee we've got some incredible female athletes, and their stories just don't get don't get told, or don't get told in the right way.
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, all the data says that females are lot more relatable to to people, and um yeah, it's just like you wanna yeah, wanna tell the stories of those those professionals and enjoy and enjoy doing that.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_01: I you know, I that's why I I kind of do some commentary work and things like that, because I enjoy being able to showcase how incredible these women, these women are.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_00: Knowing a bit more about your sids, it it sort of brings out a lot of that advocacy for you and your story that you've taken us through, you know, you've you've walked through it in a very pragmatic way, a very sort of sensible, open way.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas when you look at it and when you put it down on paper, you've charted a very a unique path in the way you've gone about doing things.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_00: As you mentioned, school, sport, it's a hobby, the army, engineer, all of that is quite unconventional.
• 1:02:49
  SPEAKER_00: And certainly the fact that I'm talking to you after your you pivoting to a 10-year or so pro career from you know your your mid-30s is is again is you know, it's just not heard of, right?
• 1:03:03
  SPEAKER_00: So certainly very, very rare in in that regard.
• 1:03:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's just been, I've really enjoyed this part of the conversation, sort of just picking your brain on how that's gone.
• 1:03:12
  SPEAKER_00: And but you know, I'm it's it's funny because I could keep going, but I'm actually gonna have to hold it there.
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason why is because it's unfinished.
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I kind of wanted to leave it unfinished because I feel that you are right in the mix of your transition, this this this shift just signing off.
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_00: I think there's so much more to come, and I almost want to finish it with, well, we've got to keep talking.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_00: We need to come back.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's just gotta keep on going.
• 1:03:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: No, so I I think I think that's great, and it's really hard.
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_01: I think and actually sort of be it's been good having this conversation, and actually you sort of relaying back just then of the career, because it's hard when you're in it, either in the career or in the transition, to see that opportunity or to have that positive state of going.
• 1:04:12
  SPEAKER_01: There is still stuff like and I know there's like, you know, it's only one chapter that's closed.
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I'm probably still in a little bit of a grief stage of that chapter and move and moving through those stages of grief.
• 1:04:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I know I'll get to that place where I go, that was a great chapter, but I've still got so many more chapters to write, and I don't know where they're gonna take me.
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_00: And look, as I say to to many individuals that I work with coming through sport, it's like we've got to own the grief, we've got to lean into it, name it, feel it, and use that as as fuel for that next reinvention.
• 1:04:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you've reinvented yourself many times, and you've done that by finding what interests you and sort of keeps you moving.
• 1:05:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so I definitely say, you know, as we are in this this point of of your transition a few months in, it's very much, yeah.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_00: As you say, keep moving, keep taking those steps forward.
• 1:05:13
  SPEAKER_00: But look, Laura, people are gonna be listening, watching, and thinking, well, I want to follow the story now.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_00: I want to I want to be part of this journey.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_00: Where's the best place for them to find you and follow your journey?
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, probably Instagram I'm most active on, which is just at LM Sid.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I am on Twitter, LM Sid All, and I'm on Facebook.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_01: I have an athlete page in personal, but Instagram is probably where I'm most active and yeah, always love people reaching out and and saying hello and if they've listened or what they've picked up, and if they've got questions about triathlon sport, training, coaching, whatever it is, I'm more than happy to to uh um yeah, to engage and and and respond to people.
• 1:06:01
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think that's what I think you asked earlier, you know, what are the things you love, love about the sport?
• 1:06:07
  SPEAKER_01: And one of it was like just the people you meet and the opportunities of of when I have travelled to races and I've loved that aspect of a new location, a new place, and meeting new people and finding out their stories, like what's their why?
• 1:06:21
  SPEAKER_01: Why are they doing the sport?
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_01: Why are they connected?
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_01: What is it that yeah, they love about things?
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, always love people reaching out.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_00: Awesome.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_00: Sid, thanks very much for joining me on the show today.
• 1:06:34
  SPEAKER_01: No worries, thanks, Ryan.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for listening to the Second Win podcast.
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_00: We hope you enjoyed hearing insights from today's athlete on transitioning out of competitive careers.
• 1:06:45
  SPEAKER_00: If you're looking for career clarity for your next step, make sure you check out secondwin.io for more information or to book a consultation with me.
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'd like to thank Claire from Betty Book Design, Nancy from Savvy Podcast Solutions, and Cerise from Copying Content by Lola for their help in putting this podcast together.
• 1:07:03
  SPEAKER_00: That's all from me, take it easy until next time.