Latest / RunThrough Trails / #Ep 49 - Sophie Vecchione | Running Physio, RED-S & Women's Health

Transcript

#Ep 49 - Sophie Vecchione | Running Physio, RED-S & Women's Health · RunThrough Trails

• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, so welcome back to the Run Free Trails Podcast.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Beth, and I am your host.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Today we have got the amazing Sophie with us on the episode.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: So she is a running physio, a trail runner in herself as well, who's taken on races such as UTMB Art Futrician 20K, Ultra Expedira 50K.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: She's a passionate physio that has got a really, really amazing Instagram page focusing on staying healthy while running, having a holistic approach to running, and also treats athletes in our own clinic, also being part of really, really cool projects that have done incredible, really inspiring things in the running world.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm sure we will touch on all those projects throughout the podcast.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: How are you, Sophie?
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'm good.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, good.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: Surviving the English heat wave that seems never ending.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I actually can't believe this summer.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like I was hoping for a nice summer, but this has taken it a bit far.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: I'm saying that the what are the chances that I'm pregnant in a heat wave?
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I I love the heat normally, but yeah, this year I'm ready for autumn.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I can imagine, well, I can't even imagine being pregnant in a heat wave.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: That it sounds horrific.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um no, no, thank you.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, do you want to introduce yourself, Sophie?
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why running and how did you get into becoming a running physio?
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh, it's a bit of a funny one because I I used to hate running.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, like my family think it's various because I literally despised it.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: I used to play, I used to be a swimmer, um, and I used to play netball.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and basically, like I'd always like I live when I lived in London, all my housemates did park run, and I used to like get dragged along and like honestly not not enjoy it at all.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: But it was like my once-a-week run.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: And then basically during kind of classic COVID story, um, me and my husband decided to buy a camper van, renovate a camper van, um, and go traveling, take some time out.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: I was in the NHS, which obviously you know a lot about.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I just yeah, I needed a break from that after COVID.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: So we we basically decided to go traveling with our dog around Europe.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I have always loved hiking.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I hiked to Everest Space Camp back in gosh, like 2016 or 2017.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but when I was away, I was like, I'm gonna need like I'm the kind of person who will go a bit stare crazy if I don't exercise.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, right, this is my time to get into running.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then yeah, I I basically contacted Lewis Roblin because I saw on Instagram he literally just started coaching.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I know you're probably gonna have loads of athletes contact you for like big events, but I just want again, I just want cons to consistently run.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then yeah, and then kind of the rest is history in terms of running.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: And and then yeah, I've you know been a physio for a while now, and then as my kind of passion for running grew and like endurance running grew, uh I kind of started to see all of the not so nice areas of of endurance running and the things that happen.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and I met Really McGregor at um why we run and and we really hit it off and was talking a lot about reds, and then it's kind of all just you know, like those, you know, those things in like like the sliding door theory where you're like you've just gone through certain doors and it's kind of led to you to be in this this like great place.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: So um yeah, it's a bit it's a bit of a random one, but it's obviously love what I do now.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that is really cool, and it's it's so nice how we've all just like randomly fallen to the sport.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm actually the exact same.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: I got forced to go to Park R and hated it.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: My family find it hilarious that I love running now because I used to absolutely hate it and now look where we are.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: Chatting on a podcast about it, obviously, did not predict that at all.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: I imagine past Sophie also did not predict that at all.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um but you just talked about then because I know you specialise in Reds and you've worked with Renee McGregor.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: For people that don't know what Reds is, are you able to explain a bit more and kind of what's your work being with Renee McGregor?
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I guess start with Reds.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: So um red stands for relative energy deficiency in sport or sometimes syndrome.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and essentially it's where there's a mismatch between um energy that you basically there's not enough energy in your system for daily life, so just being a human, eating, walking around, thinking, um, with the addition of and with the addition of the energy you use on top for exercise.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: So um it's uh I mean as a clinician, it's an absolutely fascinating condition because it essentially can affect every single system in your body.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: So um the big one for runners is your bones remodeling system.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: So we're seeing lots of stress fractures, um, but it can affect like fertility, females and you know, often lose their menstrual cycles, um, it can affect, you know, it can cause urinary incontinence, like it literally can affect everything.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: And um, so yeah, as I said, Rini and I met at Why We Run, and we were talking like obviously that, you know, she is the expert in reds, and um, we just started talking about it, and the more I read about it, the more and the more I saw, because obviously I think you the more you talk to people in the endurance space, you start to like notice things.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then she asked me to join her team as as the team physio.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I've been working with her for three years now, I think, um, which has just been amazing because obviously learning off her and the rest of the team.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um and yeah, now I try and through Instagram, which is the other thing that's hilarious, I never thought I would have a social media account for like work or whatever.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: But um yeah, I really I'm I'm genuinely so passionate about kind of trying to raise awareness for it and help people um have longevity in their running because obviously I see a lot of people in the extremes who are who are in quite quite bad shape and have to stay out of running for a really long time.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, whistle stop of Reds, I really know that's really helpful.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: And if you haven't seen Sophie's Instagram page for, you can just see the passion in the page.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: So we'll definitely link it in the description.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: So please check it out.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: So obviously, reds is a lot to do with fueling, um, and I appreciate obviously it affects the body as well.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think a lot of people, when they think of reds, they think of like dietitians, and that's the people they should go to.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: So what's a physio's role in terms of supporting someone with reds?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so no, it's really it's a really good point because I think, yeah, most of the time people think of fueling, um, because obviously red's essentially is underpinned by low energy availability.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: So um essentially lack of carbohydrate intake or like poor timing of carbohydrate intake.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but the other the flip side of Reds, which we're learning a lot more about and we're seeing a lot more kind of clinically, so like within Rini's clinic and through my clinics, I um where I work, is this kind of chronic underrecovery because sometimes it's not sometimes people actually are eating not too badly, but they're just they're just not recovering enough, and that's where their body starts to break down.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: So my role um as part of the team, and obviously when I work with athletes, is trying to like establish a really good training program, so making sure that they do have recovery in there and you know, looking at their lives, because a big thing is you know, your what the recovery you will need will be very different to the recovery I need, and the recovery I need at the moment is very different to the recovery I needed, you know, last year.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I really try and kind of like you said, like be holistic and think of the person as a whole and try and kind of really nail their training so it works for them.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then I guess on the flip side is yeah, so with reds, often, and often what what often brings people to get a diagnosis of reds is they have a stress fracture or they've had kind of multiple tendon injuries that just aren't getting any better.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, so then I'll work with them from a rehab, return to running, like more traditional physio role that that you would imagine.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: So no, it's really interesting, and I think it is scary because I think I don't know, it's just I know stress fractures are on the rise, but it's scary, I think, because social media is also so big that you're just seeing it everywhere.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I know, like, well, a lot of us all know that over the start of the year it was very much like every big influencer it felt like was getting a stress fracture.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it really did like if you didn't know what reds was, you did by halfway through this year.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: So, in terms of getting, well, let's say it was a stress fracture or getting diagnosed with reds or anything, what are kind of the key milestones to recovery?
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: Or I know everyone's recovery looks different, but what are the kind of key things to help either prevent regs or recover from reds?
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I guess I guess the key things to prevent reds are like those two pillars, like I said.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: So one is um carbohydrate, carbohydrate intake and carbohydrate timing.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: So some of the things that the guys recommend is like never training fasted, like never skipping breakfast, breakfast generally is such an important meal.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, making sure that you always and training fasted can mean like even if you go out for a run pre-lunch, like and if you've not eaten anything since like seven o'clock, like that's still training fasted.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: So always having something before you exercise, um, and always having something like you know, ideally within 30 minutes to an hour post exercise.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um and always having like regular snacks.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's one of the big things people don't seem to realize is kind of not going more than you know, a couple of hours without some form of carby snack if you're someone who's very active and being very physically active as well.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then obviously fueling fuel fueling on your runs as well.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: Basically just fueling, eat loads, eat as much as you can.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the other side, like I said, is recovery.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I in someone who where running isn't their full-time job.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: So the most for most people it's our um hobby, although sometimes it can feel like a full-time job, but generally speaking, if it's a hobby, um, having at least one rest day is is my advice.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I mean, uh, some people, you know, you know, maybe someone like yourself who's on a ward and you know is doing night shifts, then we might change that sometimes to be two rest days.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: But I would say making sure that you have minimum one day a week where you're you genuinely are just trying to not move that much.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I've started calling them adaptation days because rest seems to have this really negative connotation, like everyone seems to, you know, the the driver.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we we all compare everything with elites, don't we?
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: And elites train twice a day, every day, you know, don't really have a day off.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: But obviously that I they have huge rest windows in the day when they're not doing their jobs, so they can that that's why that works.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: So um, yeah, I try and say it's an adaptation day because it genuinely is a day that you like fill up your glycogen stores, like your your muscles and your bones get to adapt without any extra additional load on them.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, they're kind of like that's like the basic level of avoiding reds.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: No, I love that.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I love the fact that you just call that adaptation day because it's so true.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: Because when I wasn't coached, um, I used to like see something on social media and I was like, oh, I've not done that.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: And when you think about it, you're like, okay, I need to get my interval session, I need to get my easy run in, I need to get my gym in, I need to get my stretching in, and then the long run, and then when you look at it all, you're saying, like, oh wait, that's my week full.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so easy to then see something else on Instagram and be like, oh, I'm done plometrics, let's add that in.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's so important to like kind of reframe it and be like, it's not a rest day, it's an adaptation day.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: I've not heard that before.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just it's just as important as your training.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: I think people often forget about the fact that when you exercise, you're causing damage.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like you don't adapt when you exercise, you adapt after you exercise.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: And and having a day of adaptation is just as important as your tempo session.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: And ultimately, you know, potentially even more so, because if you are overtraining, um, you're not going to be making any of the adaptations you want to, anyway, because your body's not able to.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: So it it's yeah, like I always say to people, like it don't think of it as a negative, think of it as just another day of the week, like like your tempo or your long run or your strength session.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's just the day that people don't enjoy when people just love getting out.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I never know what to do with myself on a rest day because that normally my rest days are work days, but when I get a rest day when I'm not at work and I'm like, what do I do?
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm so used to just like getting up, eating my breakfast, go on a run.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's only like, oh, I don't know what to do with myself.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: I've got a rest day tomorrow at home, and it's too bad.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: I've got a long to-do list, but I'll be lost in the morning.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I love the phrase that you only benefit from the training you recover from.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I just think, yeah, if you don't recover, then it's almost like what's the point of doing it?
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: I know you do it because you enjoy it and stuff like that.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_01: And it's one of the one of the biggest signs in Reds is kind of um plateauing performance, or like you just feel like you're not improving, or all your sessions feel sluggish, and it and it is literally because you're you're doing more damage than good, like your body's just like I can't, like you're doing all this stuff, and I actually can't get stronger from it.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: So performance starts to decline, and yeah.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, really interesting.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, in terms of like your page, I absolutely love it because quite often I think you're not afraid to kind of say things that potentially some people aren't gonna like hearing, or it's controversial, and I think it's lovely because like other, I'm not saying this like other videos bad or anything, but like it's just nice to hear someone being like raw and honest.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: What are the kind of things that you wish trailrunners knew or you wish trailrunners did that you think are like super important and sometimes actually a a lot easier than we think we could be implementing on our life?
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh, yeah.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_01: I um I guess about the adaptation stuff and and not being afraid of it's it's like less genuinely is more sometimes.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I I and I do think I that's why I guess I am the way I am on my social media page, because I just feel like otherwise you just everyone gets this barrage of um, you know, like running influencers and or even just your friends that have running accounts where you're you only ever post you exercising, so it seems like people are just the norm is that you should be doing more, and and that's why I'm I'm trying to kind of break through that noise a little bit and just be like, no, like it is good to to you know take days off.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the biggest things I talk about is like exercise dependency, because that is something that I mean I I wish for everyone to know about and like know the signs about because there is a very fine line between loving running and it being your passion and it being your hobby and it adding to your life.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I work with a lot of people who have, you know, like like an alcohol addiction, they have an exercise addiction, and it it really is it it can have such you know huge negative impacts on their physical physical life, their you know, social life, their their mental health and stuff like that.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: And it there's a I the I keep I think I just see the more and more people where that that line is almost getting crossed a little bit.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I'd you know, I'd love for people to know about how to almost pick that up and how to, you know, because I see people on social media all the time and I'm like, oh, there's probably a little bit of an addiction going on there.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: But obviously, a lot of people don't see it as that.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_01: They see it as oh, they're so driven, or oh, they're so gritty, or I hate that.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: I hate the whole um, you know, like push through no matter what mentality.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like, which, you know, yes, when you're doing an event, when you're in the race, like, you know, it's it's important to have that that grit or whatever you want to call it.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: But like in normal life, like listening to your body is so important, and you really shouldn't when you're in your training, you really shouldn't just be pushing through no matter what.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I guess those kinds of things, like listening, like you know, knowing your body, knowing your health, um, knowing when exercise maybe is becoming a bit too much of an addiction, um, and being okay with taking a day off and and it not like ruining your day.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: I love days off now.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: I like have my Kindle, you know, I go and get a coffee, get a pastry, enjoy it.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, it's so true.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, I think it's hard because sometimes like government information and stuff like that, I think people just see exercise as, oh, it's good for me.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, and I'm not really sure there's enough campaigns that are saying actually rest is important too, fueling is important too.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: I get very annoyed when I see about different, not always government, but sometimes government campaigns about how much we should be eating and stuff like that, but then they're also telling us to exercise, and then I'm like, that's conflicting because that's not enough for how much you're telling us to exercise and stuff like that.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for an average person who might go on a jog two times a week, it might be okay, but then you're telling us that we need to get out every day, and I'm not really seeing the actually we need to stop.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: And if you've got a nine till five or you work shift work or whatever, it can be incredibly hard to do all these things, balance it, and have like a holistic approach to your life.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I, you know, I think that's such again, like such a good point in that I think it's very hard when you're in the running space, like you're in this really tiny bubble of people who exercise an awful lot, and actually, if you kind of helicopter view it, like the general population is sedentary, like the general population, you know, doesn't move enough and and you know, maybe over consumes food or you know, poor quality food or or whatever.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like, like you said, yeah, like all the messaging is for those people, whereas our small subset of people, it's it's kind of like yeah, it's basically the complete opposite.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, no, no person training for like a half marathon or a marathon should be consuming 2,000 calories a day.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like it should be, you know, arguably double that.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's hard when you're when you're getting such mixed messaging and and the the constant thing of like exercise is health, which yes, it is, but as we've said, there's almost like there's a darker side to that too.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's finding that happy, happy medium.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's so true.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I never see disclaimers, that's what I want to see.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like a disclaimer, like this is applicable to, or this might be applicable to a kind of thing.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_00: So obviously, you run yourself as well, although I know you're taking a bit of a break now with pregnancy and stuff like that.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: So, kind of your running, what makes you love trail running?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I just love being in nature.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: I like as cliche as that is, I think for me, I so like I was very competitive when I was younger with swimming and netball, and you know, used to train, you know, up to 11 times a week.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like I had that time in my life where sport and getting PBs and getting to, you know, having certain goals was like my whole life.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I think uh in adulthood, what I've loved so much about trail running is like I don't do it competitively now.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like running for me is just like, yes, challenging my body, like I loved training and doing the ultramarathon and I want to do more, but like for me it's just about like enjoying movement and being in nature.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I you know, I'm not quite about how much I hate road running.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I honestly like I I get no enjoyment about going out and running up and down the roads, although I'm gonna have to change that because I don't think like a fully off-road buggy exists.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: So my poor child's gonna be like going up and down a mountain, but um, but yeah, yeah, for me it's just like finding new places, finding new trails.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like I honestly, I was talking to someone about it the other day, like because one of the things I'm I miss the most because of because I've had to stop running, is like when you you climb up like a hill or a mountain, you know, I I mean ideally a mountain, but I live in Oxfordshire, so a big hill.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and you just like see the landscape, like for me, that is just yeah, that's why I love it.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I've and I I'm so fortunate and probably similar to you, but like the trail running community is so great, and I've made some absolutely incredible lifelong friends through it, and I and I just love that side of it, everyone is so kind and welcoming and no pressure, and yeah, I just love it.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: No, literally, that would be my exact answer.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's the views, the people, the places, it is just so, so, so nice.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just nice that, like, yeah, although we sometimes think that trails are really far away, there are basically trails everywhere, and it's so nice exploring and finding all these different places.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm addicted to Strava, Strava route planning.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: Finding out where the next new route is and where can I go and explore?
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: So, for other runners that maybe experience the same, I saw on your Instagram about how pregnancy and having to stop running a bit earlier than you thought you were going to, and stuff like that, has obviously been quite a big challenge.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: Could you maybe talk about your pregnancy journey if you're happy?
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: How runny has kind of affected that and just for other women that may be experiencing the same?
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I very naively, again, because of social media, like I thought I would be one of those women that were like ran into the hospital to like deliver my baby, like straight off the back of the trail run.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but essentially I I'm just unfortunate and my placenta is low lying, um, which means that you can't do any high impact, um, you can't do too heavy lifting, so I've had to stop CrossFit.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, which yeah, like definitely has been a challenge because, like I said, it's for me, um like move like you know, classic like movement and and being out in nature is obviously so important for me.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: And also that sense of like identity, like my page is all about trail running, and I've not been able to post about trail running um for a really long time.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_01: So um yeah, it definitely has been hard.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_01: And like I, you know, there's definitely I definitely am like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna have to completely start from scratch, obviously with a new postpartum body.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_01: So it's gonna be things are gonna be different.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, so that's definitely been definitely been a challenge, but I think the the thing that I've found the most helpful is just like finding something else.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I've you know I've got back into swimming again, like I, you know, swam as a child, like I said, up until university.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: So um that has been so amazing because it's just finding new different ways to be able to safely move your body.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean, strength training, I'm clutching on.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: I just I don't think I've ever been less motivated to strength train in my life because as most runners are, like it's not fun, you're you or you don't find it as fun.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I love to CrossFit from a I had I go to an amazing, it's not like a clique CrossFit space, it's just all ages, all abilities is just really nice.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um so yeah, I'm still trying to do some form of strength training, but yeah, I would just say if there's anyone else out there who's kind of going through the same, is like there's still lots of stuff you can do, like even my um my best friend Chloe, who is ridiculously I don't know how it's happened, but she's due the day before me, which is like matchmade in heaven, yeah.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: And we do all our runs together, so like we've just been going for walks and like going to the same places we would run, but have just been walking it.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I think just maybe think about what it is that you love about running, like what we've discussed, like the people, the views, um being out in nature, and then just find different ways of of um of achieving that still, and and it's not the end of the world.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I think I was like, oh no, but you know, I've realized it's fine, like you know, I'm just going my body's just going through a phase right now, and its goal is making a human, which still blows my mind.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I still don't understand how it's even possible.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it's actually crazy, and it's so true though, it does actually like it feels embarrassing to say to people that don't run that not being able to run feels like the end of the world, like it really does, like it just like that is the thing that you love and you can't do it, and it's annoying because you feel like you should be able to do it, but you can't, and it's like I'm guessing it's not the same, but it's kind of the same as getting injured and stuff like that.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, especially when you feel fine in yourself, you're just like, Why can't I do this?
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, but it's nice that you found other things, and it's so true.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: There's always something, and it's finding out the reason why you love that to then take it into something else.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's not gonna be the same, but it will fix the gap.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, you can always find a middle ground.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, always, like even if it's or you can find something completely different.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: You do know what I mean.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I feel like some people might be like, actually, you know what being hiking or walking in trails is too tempting.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm gonna take up crochet.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: But like, yeah, there's always something that you can you can still find passion everywhere.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: So um, it's just yeah, knowing that it's short-term, like you said, same as an injury, it's a short-term thing.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna come back from it, you've just gotta make sure.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: I think the key thing is making sure you come back at the right time, like, and not trying to force it, which is what I see so many times with injuries.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: My friend Elena, she's been incredibly patient with an injury, and she was like us, very heartbroken that she couldn't trail run, and she's now doing trail running photography, and like it's going incredibly well, her photos are incredible, and it's like, yes, the injury is not ideal, but it's led her on this path that she never would have done otherwise, and all these incredible opportunities.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: So it's just finding, like you said, it doesn't have to be trail running related.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: It might be that you become a crocheter and you've made six new jumpers for your wardrobe or whatever it is.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_00: But sometimes injuries or pauses in your running journey can sometimes be a positive thing.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: Although it didn't feel positive at the time, all these things will come from it, you'll learn so much, come back stronger, do things that you haven't done before.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: I love that that she's done that.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a good yeah, way of like still being involved, but in a different, in a different sense.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: And great for me because she's basically become my personal photographer.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_00: So perfect.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: Love that.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great deal for me.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um so obviously right now you're not running quite as much as you want to, but have you got any goal races or things that you're just like bucket list?
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: I need to do that trail.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, so I'm I'm desperate to go to Utah.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: I just think like run, I I really want to run in places that aren't like where I've run before.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I love being in like the Alps and up in mountains like that, but I just think Utah just looks it looks like Mars, like it just looks like a completely different planet.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: So any race in Utah, or even not a race, just go and run in Utah is a big goal.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I really at some stage will definitely do one of the UTMB races in finals week because I just I just need to go onto that big blue arch.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I don't know, I don't know which one it will be.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um but yeah, I feel like everyone, like you know, having been out there, you've obviously been out there as well for that week.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_01: It is just magical.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I was supposed to be going this year and obviously now I'm not.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, I would love, I would love to do one of those.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I'd love to do some of um, you know, like the Antarctic, like even just like half marathons, just that like basically just like a bit more of an adventure.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, I don't have I don't really have like time goals or you know, anything like that.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like for me, it's just like having a cool adventure somewhere.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I'd love to do like, yeah, one of the Antarctic races or something like that.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: You're the second person that's come on the podcast now.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's said Antarctica.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's a popular place now.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: And Utah just looks so cool.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it does.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: It looks insane, and it's not really a place that you go on a holiday, like you're not really gonna go to a resort in Antarctica.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's so cool that trail running takes us to places like this.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: And Utah's such a good amateur, I had not thought about that.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: And most people are like, Oh, yeah, I wanna, you know, go to Shaman, I want to do this.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I like that.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna have to look at Utah Utah.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, do it, it literally looks insane.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's stuck, like the landscape is just stunning.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_01: My husband's always like when I did the um the Ultra X in Madeira, I was like, But do you want to go to Madeira?
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: And he was like, Why?
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: So now I'm like, we need to go to Utah.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: Family holiday?
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I ask all the guests to bring a piece of trail running news.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_00: So um, what is your trail running news, Sophie?
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I guess it's it's it's personal trail running news um that um me and my friend uh Juliet Denny are putting on our first women's only trail running event, which you both are very kindly coming to and talking on our panel.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I think as you probably can gather, I'm so passionate about trail running, and I really want like well, Juliet and I just really want to make it as accessible as possible to every single woman, and we want every single woman, or you know, anyone who identifies as woman to feel safe on trails.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, we're that is on September the 13th.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_01: So if anyone wants to come, either wants to travel trail running, or we're gonna have lots of different workshops and um learning how to route map and like you know, stuff like that, and also people that just love trail running.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's like sneaky uh self self little drop in there.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, we're so we're so excited about that because we, as I said, we just wanna, we wanna, we want as many women to love trail running as much as we do.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: And too many people are roadrunning nowadays, so exactly, gotta get more people on the trails, and I really love the fact that you're doing things like route mapping and stuff like that because those are the skills that Instagram doesn't teach us or not necessarily coaches teach us and stuff like that, and you kind of have to figure it out yourself.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're not like me addicted to travel route maps, it can be hard to figure out like what how to plot a route, how to safely navigate, and what's a good trail and what's not necessarily gonna be the best trail to run on and stuff like that.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, no, I'm so excited for the event.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's gonna be a really, really good day, and I'll make sure it's linked below to get tickets, and this episode will be out in time that you'll definitely still have plenty of time to get tickets.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: So that is perfectly exciting.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um so my piece of trail news is kind of an update on Sophie Grant.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_00: I've mentioned it in previous episodes.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: So for those who don't know, she was running the length of the Alpina Trail, which is the whole length of the Alps.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: It starts, or I've actually forgotten where it starts, is it Innsbruck?
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, no?
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: Or I don't know.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: No, I can't remember.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, it starts somewhere, I think in Austria, um, and then it runs all the way to Monaco, and it is like over 2,000 kilometres with absolute crazy end elevation.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: And the previous record was 35 days, which was well held by a man, and now Sophie has got the record, it is official, she's done it in 29 days, which is just actually crazy.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the last day, I think she only had an hour's sleep because she was on to do it in 30, and then she just basically smashed out, and she actually had to do a diversion as well, which made it even longer because of wildfires, but it's still okay because the route was technically longer.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, and the crazy thing is whenever I see her in interviews, or you know, like she was saying the other day on a story that she's just sorting out a van, she's just walking around.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if I'd just done that, I'd be on the ground for at least a few months.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: I yeah, she and I just love that she is so, like you said, like just humble and grounded and just such an awesome, inspiring woman and human being.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, on it, like the body really blows my mind.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like the fact that anyone I like, I think in those scenarios, like your body just always say to people, it's the same with like multi-day ultras.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_01: I think it just at one point, like just goes, okay, I'm just gonna give up telling you I'm sore now, and like I've just appreciated that this is what we're doing because yeah, like you said, how is how is she just functioning like a normal person?
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: I would have been crawling across that finish line.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um but yeah, seriously, seriously, so so awesome.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_00: She was like moving so well as well towards the end.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like you wouldn't know, you would just if you ran past her and didn't know what was going on, you'd just think she's out on a morning trail run.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's actually crazy.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: And she was averaging, well, I don't know the exact average, but from her like Instagram post, it looked like averaging around 60k a day with like 4,000 metres elevation, which yeah, I've been broken after one day, alone 29 days of her.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: She's yeah, there's certain people that are just superhuman, and I feel like she has clearly shown that she is in that category of just being superhuman, because yeah, like it's just her body is yeah, I I mean that like you know, I'd love to achieve that level of adaptation, but I don't think it's gonna happen, unfortunately.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: But we can we can let people like her be the pioneers for for pushing women forward, or let her have this fastest known time.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, don't worry, I'm not coming for it anytime soon.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: But I also just love her message behind it because she's kind of saying that she's not expecting everyone to go out there and you know get a fastest known time.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's just like giving women the space to know that they can do hard things and go out there, enjoy the trails, and yeah, I just think it's a really cool way of doing it.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, amazing.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well done, Sophie, basically.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, not sorry, not you, Sophie, other Sophie.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_00: Although well done to you too.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I'll take it.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: Great name, great name.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, so thank you so so much for joining, Sophie.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_00: This has been an incredible conversation.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm really excited for She Comes to Trails and hopefully we'll see lots of you listeners there.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thanks for having me.