Latest / Weeknight Mysteries Podcast / Ep. 83 She Was Three Minutes From Home... Then She Vanished | The Beverly Potts Case

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Ep. 83 She Was Three Minutes From Home... Then She Vanished | The Beverly Potts Case · Weeknight Mysteries Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Weeknight Mysteries podcast. This is a
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: weekly podcast where we talk about different, usually true crime cases,
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: but we also talk about a wide range of mysteries.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: So today, by the way, my name is Juras. I
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: am here with my co-host, Rain. How are you, Rain?
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: Pretty good, as always. How are you?
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: I'm pretty good. Today we're going to be talking about
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: a case that was suggested by one of our listeners
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: and they had left a comment in the YouTube under
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: our last podcast. This listener is at The One Dez.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: And they suggested that we should talk about a very
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: old case.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: 1950s, right?
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a case from 1950s. The disappearance of 10-year-old Beverly Potts.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: 10-year-old girl, Beverly Potts. She went missing in Cleveland back
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: in 1951. She went missing on August 24th. At the
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: time of recording, let me quickly check, it's August 23rd.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: So actually tomorrow is going to be the.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: 75th anniversary no way yeah tomorrow is going to be
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: the 75th anniversary of beverly's disappearance what a coincidence well
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: i think this is why the one that's suggested uh
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: okay makes sense and um i had heard about beverly
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: k beverly's case or at least i've I have heard
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: the name Beverly Potts, but I had never really looked
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: into it. But since we're kind of doing this podcast
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: for some time now, I think Beverly Potts is a
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: missing person name that kind of comes up here and there.
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: I never really knew the details of the case, but
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: I thought that this is a very good time among
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: the upcoming anniversary to delve into her case and talk
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: a little bit about her and what has happened to
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: the child. Have you heard this case before?
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Oh, no, don't ask me. I barely even heard of
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: the cases that we talked about until, of course, you
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: bring it up. But yeah, no.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: So you have not heard about this name?
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: Not once. Not once. I didn't even know it was,
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: you know, quite known in the true crime community.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: I think it's fairly known. I think it's a big
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: case in Cleveland. And I've seen it mentioned as the, basically,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: the biggest.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: Oh, so it's like one of those, for the lack
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: of a better term, legendary cases in Cleveland?
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: I would say so. I would say so.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: Probably the biggest from there, though.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the biggest cult cases. Beverly Potts was
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: a 10-year-old girl, and she disappeared while walking home from
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: a neighborhood festival event, which was held in a park
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: which was less than a quarter of a mile away
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: from her home in Cleveland, Ohio. No trace of her
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: has ever been found, and authorities highly suspect that foul
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: play was committed. reason for her disappearance something bad had
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: happened to her on that friday evening that we will
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: be uh discussing soon this case is regarded as one
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: of the most infamous missing persons called cases in ohio
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: we have several pictures of beverly pots here um i'm
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: gonna read a little bit more about her background i
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: think the most distinguishing characteristic that i've seen mentioned about
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: beverly is the fact that she appeared older than her real.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: Age so i could see that but she seemed she
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: had a very sweet looking face you.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: Know what i mean yeah beverly was apparently considered a
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: shy girl who was um She was not very comfortable
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: around strangers, according to information that we found online. Also,
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: it was described that she was taller than, I think,
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: the kids her age, and she could pass as a
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: 12-year-old instead of a 10-year-old. She looked a bit older
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: than she really was, but definitely was still a child.
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: She was the younger of two daughters. and her parents
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: were Robert and Elizabeth Potts. So she had the older sister.
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: I think her older sister was quite a bit older
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: than her. Her older sister was already working and she
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: was in her early 20s. The family lived in a
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: modest house in a middle-class neighborhood in Cleveland, Ohio. I
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: believe that Robert, her father, was working as a stagehand,
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: I believe, which is some sort of a profession that
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: helps around, I believe, a theater, specifically the Allen Theater
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: in downtown Cleveland. While Elizabeth was a homemaker, so I
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: think she was taking care of the household while Robert
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: was out working. beverly's older sister anita she was 22
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: and she was already uh working as a clerk at
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: the national cash register company so this i took a
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: look a little bit into this company so national cash
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: register company i think it's like one of the companies
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: that maybe not necessarily invented but popularized the cash registers
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: back in the day like you know when there's a
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: store yeah like cashiers have like cash registers so i
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: think this is the company that kind of was producing
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: those you know cash registers yeah so.
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: In total there were only two of them anita and beverly.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah two of them i believe anita was living with
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: uh with the family still you know she was just
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: working already yeah because.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: There's a picture in here i think it was christmas
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: and it seems like there's two other children so i'm
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: assuming those are just probably like playmates So, yeah.
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: We're looking at the picture with some children. So I
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: think this is definitely Christmas. I know that the woman
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: on the right, the oldest one, is actually Anita. I
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: know that Beverly is, you know, the biggest child in
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: the picture.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: On the very left.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: But who the kids are in the middle, I don't know.
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: I thought they were part of the family. And I'm like, man.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: So dad is a stagehand and mom is a stay-at-home mom.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: And they have... Enough money to support four children.
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: I think back in the day in America... It's different.
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: I think it was different. I think you could afford
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: a lot more just on one.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: Salary.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: One income, like family.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: It's crazy to think about, really.
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because now, you know.
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: Barely.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: I don't know how it is in America, but I
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: don't think.
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: How can you even afford a house these days?
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: Well, I guess you can, but it's... Yeah, you need
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: to save a lot. And it's... You have to.
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: You both need to have jobs.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: Both jobs and you can't live lavishly anymore on the side,
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: you know. And then what you're getting is not even
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: that amazing.
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: But, all right. So Beverly was, she was described as
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: a quiet kid, responsible and obedient to her parents.
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: You know, it's kind of crazy because with Beverly's pictures
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: that we have, It's so obvious, her personality, I meant.
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: Like you would look at her pictures and you would see,
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, she seems like a very timid, quiet, shy girl.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can see that.
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: That's a good point. I think I also get that same.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: The same vibe in the pictures alone.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I get the same vibe from the pictures. So
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: she apparently enjoyed music and dancing. According to some accounts... Yeah,
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: she appeared older than she actually was. She attended the
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: Luis Agassiz Elementary School, which I believe has been renamed
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: ever since because Luis Agassiz, this person was controversial. But
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: this is not about him. This is about the case
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: that we're talking about. So she went to the school.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: which was kind of close to her home and to
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: the park where she was last seen on that evening.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: How close are we talking about? Like walking distance?
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: I think definitely walking distance.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: For a kid?
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for anyone. Or at least, you know, take a
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: bicycle out. I think it would be possible to do that.
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: Beverly was an attentive and popular student and she received
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: good grades. She was also described to be timid when
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: in the presence of people. that she did not know,
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: and particularly adolescent or adult males outside of her immediate family.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: So this was mentioned in Wikipedia, that she was apparently shy,
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: a shy kid around strangers. I guess this is one
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: of the reasons why Police suspect, at least I've seen
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: some reports saying that some officers or investigators suspect that
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: her abductor or, you know, a potential culprit, because it
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: is suspect foul play here, was actually someone that she
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: knew at least a little bit. Because it is suspected
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: that if it was a complete stranger, Beverly would have
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: avoided them. That was her personality to avoid strangers. it
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: is suspected that whoever is responsible for what has happened
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: to Beverly was actually someone that she may have known
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: or at least seen before, like potentially a neighbor, someone
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: in that neighborhood.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: You know, I'm actually also wondering, what if it's someone
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: she actually did not know of, a stranger, but that
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: stranger was dragging her away? I'm just wondering, maybe is
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: there a possibility that she would be too shy to
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: ask for help, to scream.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: That's a good point.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: That's a very good point.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: To cause a commotion.
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: You know, that's a very good point.
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: Because it could go either way. It could be someone
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: they completely knew, she completely knew, or it could be
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: someone she doesn't know of, but she's too shy, she's
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: too obedient and timid to, I don't know, scream help.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: That's a very good point, actually. I'm not going to lie.
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: I wonder how often something like that happens in the
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: real world, where a child is about to get abducted,
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: but they're just too shy to make a commotion.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: Or too afraid to make a commotion.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: Or too afraid, yeah, exactly. That's a good point. So
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: shortly after her 10th birthday, Beverly began asking her mother...
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: to allow her to change her hairstyle. At the time,
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: she had a very distinctive foot-long blonde pigtails that she
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: had since childhood. Now she was asking her mom to
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: get a more fashionable, for the time, haircut which would
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: be a banged and bobbed hairstyle Popular with girls at
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: the time, I believe it was a short hairstyle, a
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: lot shorter than what she was already having at the time.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: Her mother eventually allowed her to get this haircut. So
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: at the time of her disappearance, she wasn't already, you know,
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: her haircut wasn't those pigtails that you could see in
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: some of the pictures.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: She would have easily blended in then in this year
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: of children her age.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that definitely makes her visual appearance less
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: distinctive because of it. According to her parents, Beverly had
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: a strict curfew and she would be grounded if she
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: missed the curfew. Actually, one time in mid-August, this is
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: leading up to her disappearance, on that same month, Beverly
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: and her cousin, Amber Lathan, arrived home slightly later than agreed.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: In response, her parents forbade Beverly to attend an upcoming
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: annual performing show, which was going to be held at
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: nearby Halloran Park on August 24th. This is literally the
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: same event where she went missing from, because initially she
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: was grounded, but since she was very interested in the
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: performance arts, And since Beverly was looking forward to this
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: event for some time, her mother, Elizabeth, eventually agreed to
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: let her go to this event in the afternoon on Friday,
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: August 24th, as long as she promised to come back
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: home right after the event. This is actually the event where,
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: you know, Beverly went missing.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: It's called the show wagon, right?
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: It's actually interesting because when I was reading about this case,
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: I was like, what is a show wagon? I'm assuming
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: like someone like walks up to a town square with
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: a wagon and start doing shows. But no, when I
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: Googled it, it's just, it's a thing of Cleveland.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: Okay, it's a Cleveland thing. Mm-hmm.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: Show Wagon is a long-running summer youth performing arts program
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: ran by the City of Cleveland's Department of Parks and Recreation.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: It's a Cleveland thing.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: Interesting. Is it still around? Do you have any idea?
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: No idea. I'm assuming it's still around because I could
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: see some modern pictures and YouTube videos.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: Okay, so this is a specific Cleveland activity. Pretty interesting.
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: It runs from early June through August.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: Very interesting.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: I had to take a look at Cleveland, Ohio as
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: well back in 1951. So Cleveland, Ohio in 1951 was
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: actually a very different city from modern day Cleveland. In fact,
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: it was one of the biggest cities in America. And
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: Cleveland population was almost, I believe, three times bigger than
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: it is right now.
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: Really?
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I always thought that, you.
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: Know, I always thought it was a city, but not
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: that massive.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: Cleveland was apparently a major, major city in the United
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: States in the early 50s. It, I think, topped at
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: the 50s and starting in the 60s, there was a
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: big downturn for the economy in Cleveland. But up until
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: this time, when Beverly Pots went missing, Cleveland was experiencing
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: the best time ever, I believe. Cleveland had roughly 900,000 people,
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: and right now I think it's only 350. So you
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: could see the difference. It almost had a million people
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: in it. It was one of America's biggest cities. Neighborhoods
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: were often strongly defined by ethnicity and immigration. You could
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: find large communities with Polish, Czech, Slovak, Hungarian, Italian, Irish, Jewish,
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: and other backgrounds.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Apparently i wonder if there were lithuanians in.
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: There i think lithuanians were concentrated in chicago i think
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: this is a main like this is well known here
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: in our country that uh chicago is like.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: The lithuanian stronghold yeah in america.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah apparently everyone went to chicago for some reason.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: But not cleveland back in the.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Day no i'm not sure about cleveland in fact um
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: In Cleveland back in the day, in the 50s, many
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: families lived in modest houses or apartments close to the
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: factories where people worked. Streetcars and buses were important ways
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: of getting around, although cars were already becoming increasingly common
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: in the 50s. So that's Cleveland in the 50s for you.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: A very different environment, I would say, from the Cleveland
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: right now. I've been read somewhere that apparently Cleveland right
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: now is in fact getting better. I've seen some articles
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: saying that it's kind of turning around.
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: Was it bad at one point? I look at the
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Google images and it looks good.
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: I think Cleveland, you know, I always had some bad reputation,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: I believe, here and there. I mean, you know, we
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: can only say what we read online.
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and what we know from afar.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but Cleveland was always, I don't know, I've seen
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: some stuff mentioned that it's like not like the safest
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: potentially city in America, but I could be wrong here.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: And the first time I heard about them was through
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: the basketball team.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: Same. To be honest, all of my American geography comes
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: from the NBA specifically. Like I know, you know, here
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: in Lithuania, we know everything. Very well, actually, the geography
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: of America, especially if it has an NBA team. We
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: definitely know something.
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: Do you think you could point it out in the map? If,
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: for example, we're going to give you a specific NBA team,
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: you could point out which state from a map.
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: Absolutely. I could do with all teams. Wow. Okay.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: I can't do that.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So moving forward, now let's jump to the day
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: when Beverly went missing. So this is August 24th, that's
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: Friday afternoon.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: August, so it's still summer-ish.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's actually the end of summer.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Days are still long.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've read that Beverly was supposed to start fifth
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: grade soon. So on this particular Friday in late summer,
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: Beverly ate her supper with her family. Then she assisted
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: her mother with cleaning the dishes. for which she was
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: actually paid a nickel. A nickel is a five cent coin. Afterwards,
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: at around 6.58 p.m. in the afternoon, Beverly and her
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: best friend Patricia Swing, Patricia Swing was her best friend
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: and she was kind of from the same neighborhood, they
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: rode their bicycles to to West Cleveland's Halloran Park. So
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: this is a very close location to her home. It's
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: like literally walking distance, maybe like three or four minutes.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: It's like literally right there. It's like right there.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: It makes sense that it was easy for her mother
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: to let her go if it's just right there.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: It's right there. And the park itself, it's not a
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: big park. You know, when we talk about parks, you
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: would imagine like a big park with like roads, trails.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: This is basically just a small plot of green land.
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't even call it a real, you know, it's
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: a park, but it's not a stereotypical park.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: With fountains and benches.
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: No, it's not that type of a park.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: It's just an open space.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: It's just an open grassy space, in my opinion. and
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: they were going to go there to attend the city-sponsored performance,
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: the show wagon. This location was less than a quarter
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: of a mile from Beverly's Lynette Avenue home, so she
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: was living in Lynette Avenue according to Wikipedia, and it
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: was around a three minutes walking distance away. Beverly was
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: wearing a reddish-pink, Turtle neck shirt, blue denim jeans, a
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: navy blue jacket, and brown Kerry Brookie shoes. Kerry Brookie shoes,
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: I believe, is a store brand, meaning like a grocery
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: store brand or something. I believe it was from Sears.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: If someone could correct me, Sears was like a big
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: store in America at some point. Those shoes were apparently
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: Kerry Brookie shoes or Kerry Brooks or Kerry Brook. Definitely
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: Carrie Brooke shoes. The performance at Halloran Park, the show
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: wagon that we talked about, was apparently an annual jamboree-like
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: event jointly sponsored by the city. And you could see
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: a lot of youngsters from Cleveland perform their talents, either dance,
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: do amateur magic, or acrobatics. Beverly and Patricia were believed
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: to have arrived at the event at 6.58 p.m. that day.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: I have a picture here on our file, a map.
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: I'm going to be showing this map also on the
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: YouTube channel for the listeners that would like to take
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: a look. It's this particular image, and I just marked it.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: Oh, it's just right there.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: Halloran Park, the school that Beverly was going to, and
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Lynette Avenue. We don't know exactly in which house on
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: Lynette Avenue Beverly lived.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but no matter which house in that street she
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: was living in, it's very close to the park.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: It's very close. So I think I just wanted to
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: paint a picture how close this is for our listeners.
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: Would you say it's around 10-minute walk?
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, it was described that it's a three-minute walk. Oh.
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: So it's really short. Halloran Park was the only large
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: playground close to Beverly's home, and the park was apparently
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: opened six years prior, in 1945. It was a popular
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: recreational location for local children, young couples, and families. The
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: park was considered dangerous in the afternoon, however. It was
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: apparently unsafe and dark in the afternoon and there would
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: not be any kids running around anymore in the evening.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Visibility was very limited, apparently, because the long trees covering
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: the streetlights made the park dark and the park was
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: also frequented. By the local vagrant population at night or something.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: So it's a.
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: Local what now?
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Vagrant population.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: What does that mean?
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: Vagrant is like a, like I would say like a
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: person without a permanent home, like a homeless person.
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: Okay, okay.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: Who like does all the jobs here and there and just,
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: you know, a person struggling.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, that makes sense that it's probably their place to
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: rest at the end of the day.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, or meet a location for them. I even took
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: a Google Street Picture view of the location. To me,
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: I went back as much as I can. So the
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: earliest Google Street View available for the Halloran Park is
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: actually 2007. To me, in 2007, it looks just like
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: an empty plot of land.
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: Why does it look so vintage-y from 2007?
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: That's how Google Street View came. car camera looked like
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: i believe.
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: If you would tell me this was like 1990s i.
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: Would believe you yeah i do see what you're saying
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: it could be like from the 80s or something yeah
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: but this is 2007 i don't assume it was any
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: different to be honest back in the 50s to me
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: i would just assume it looked similar i went back
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: in time on the google satellite image as well as
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: much as i could So I think the most I
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: could go with Google satellite image was maybe this was
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: the 90s, I believe. So in the 90s snapshot, we
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: could also see that the layout of the whole neighborhood
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: is the same. So I think we could say that
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: the neighborhood is probably looking similar to what it looked
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: like back in the day. According to Beverly's best friend, Patricia,
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: who joined her on this day, The two of them
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: only spoke to two 13-year-old girls who were familiar to
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: them at the event. They did not speak to anyone else,
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: according to Patricia. At around 8-10 p.m., the girls decided
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: that they would be returning their bikes back home because
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: there was a huge crowd of people, I believe like 1,500
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: people in this little park, for the event. So maneuvering
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: with bikes was too hard. They returned home. the bikes
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: back home and walked back to the park. Apparently, they
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: returned at 8.30 p.m. to the park. Now, 15 minutes later,
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: at 8.45 p.m., Patricia told Beverly that she should return
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: home already because she promised her parents she would be
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: back before dark. Now, in response, Beverly said that she
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: had permission to stay for the entire event so she
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: decided to stay, and Patricia left on her own. Patricia
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: returned at around 8.50 p.m., and she later told investigators
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: that as she was walking home, she saw Beverly in
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: the crowd watching an onstage dance performance. But Beverly at
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: this point decided that she's going to remain at the event,
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: for the whole duration. By 9.30 p.m., the event had
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: ended and around 1,500 people at the park started to
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: return back home. At this time, a 13-year-old boy whose
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: name is Fred Krause, he saw Beverly. He knew Beverly
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: because he was from the neighborhood. He recognized her and
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: he saw Beverly across the park walking diagonally, you know,
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: like cutting through it in a northeastern direction, which suggests
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: that she is heading towards her home because she would
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: be living in the northeast direction because that's where Lynette
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: Avenue was at. And she was about 150 yards, which
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: is roughly the same amount in meters, across from the
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: corner of the street. So she was still in the park,
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: but she was kind of like getting close to the street.
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: So what Fred Krause did, he literally just passed her
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: with his bike and he just sounded the horn of
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: his bike.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: And I also read somewhere that, you know, Fred could
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: have easily mistaken if it was Beverly or not, but Apparently,
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: Beverly had this distinctive walking. Like, she walks kind of
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: like a duck-like. You know what I mean? So apparently,
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: her feet were pointed outwards, I meant, when she walked.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: And that's how Fred, the boy, was certain it was her.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen that as well. That's a good point. So,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: we know for a fact that Beverly, at around 9.30... So, she... Beverly...
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: What does this tell us? Basically, if I'm reading the
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: situation correctly, this tells us that Beverly... Something must have
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: happened to Beverly after... that event.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: But is was she walking diagonally towards her home direction.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: I believe so because she was walking in the north
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: eastern direction which is literally the direction of lynette.
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: Avenue so right now i'm kind of assuming that she
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: the agreed time when she would go back home is
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: 9 p.m right or when the show ended which was
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: scheduled around 9 p.m it.
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: Was supposed to end around 9 p.m but.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: It ended at 9 30 yeah so i'm assuming that
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: maybe she was she was already aware that it ended
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: so late it was already dark so she was cutting
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: corners to go back home.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: She wanted to go back quickly that's what i'm assuming
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: that's a good point I think that could be a
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: possibility that she was trying to go back home as
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: quickly as possible.
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: But there were a lot of people in this event, right?
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: Apparently, 1,500 people.
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: That's a lot of people.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: That's a lot of people. Other witnesses reported seeing a
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: girl that was resembling Beverly, okay? Resembled Beverly. And she
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: was walking near a... And this is interesting now.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: A girl.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: So people saw a girl that looked like Beverly walking
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: near a stationary, battered and crudely painted black 1937 or
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: 38 Dodge Coupe with a smoking noise muffler and recently
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: repaired fenders on West 117th Street Apparently speaking to the
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: two young men inside the vehicle. So this is a
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: very specific.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: Sighting with a very specific car.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: So actually what I did, I fed the description to AI.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: And I have an image here. You could go a
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: little bit down. Will you see the car? Yeah, you
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: see the car. This is literally what we got when
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: I fed the description to Of the vehicle to AI,
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: maybe you could describe it. What do you think about
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: the car?
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: As a non-car person, I would just say that I
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: would recognize this car immediately. If I see it once,
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: I see it again in a week, I'd be like,
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: oh yeah, that's the same car I've seen.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and this is a very old school car. This
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: is like from a car that was made in the 30s.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: This is like before World War II cars. So this
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: is one of those.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: kind of cool looking right cool.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: This right now would be cool so it's a very
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: old school car um but back in the day i
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: think it was definitely more common.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Are there cars like this here still nowadays i know
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: it's going to be like a collector's item or whatever
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: but i wonder if there's still actually some functioning cars like.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: This definitely absolutely but there are collector items i think
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: at this point um so i also went on maps
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: and i kind of pinpointed we'll also show this on
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: the YouTube video as well, of this podcast, The Arrow,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: where I believe this must have taken place.
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: Can you show me that again one more time, please?
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like this. It's literally the map right above the
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: AI-generated car image. And just to kind of paint a
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: better description to our listeners, The 117th Street where this
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: sighting happened, it's literally the street adjacent to Halloran Park.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: So Lynette Avenue intersects with the 117th Street at some point.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: So it's not like, you know, the sighting was made
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: in some different streets, some far away. This could have
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: been very... It could be very likely that this was Beverly.
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: The only concern I have about the credibility of this
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: sighting is that Beverly was mentioned that she was not
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: known to, you know, interact with strangers. Unless the people
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: in this car were not strangers.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: I wonder if, for example, she would interact if it's just,
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: you know, a person asking for directions. I'm just curious, like,
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: is she... One of those very obedient kids who were like, okay,
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: I need to help out this person. He needs help.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: Or is she one of those children who's like, oh,
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: I'm so shy. I don't want to even talk.
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: This is a good point, what you're bringing. We don't
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: know this. We don't know.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Because as a kid, I was kind of like her.
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: But if someone asked me for direction, I would talk.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: I would be like, oh, yeah, just please go straight ahead.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you would feel uncomfortable, but you would still do it. Okay,
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: that makes sense. So apparently multiple witnesses had seen the
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: sighting and they placed the sighting anywhere between 8.30 p.m.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: and 9.30 p.m. So this is a big, this is
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: a really big time range.
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: It's an hour.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: It's an hour.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: A lot of things could have happened.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: So it's 8.30. Remember 8.30 is the time when Beverly
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: and Patricia returned without their bikes, right? Up until 9.30 p.m.,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: which is the end of the event. So if it
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: was 8.30, I would argue that it's probably not Beverly because,
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: you know, she was with Patricia at this point. And
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: I would assume that if it's anything before 9.30, I'm
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: also not sure how relevant that would be because we
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: know that that neighborhood boy, Frank Krause.
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: Fred, I think.
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Fred Krause, he had seen Beverly at 9.30.
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: But what if it wasn't Beverly?
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: If it wasn't Beverly, then I think it just could
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: be some random girl. Because remember, Beverly apparently looked older
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: than her age. This could have been just an older girl.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, with the same haircut as it was a pretty
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: common haircut back in the day.
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, more fashionable haircut. And one of the final sightings
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: of Beverly happened at around 9.45 p.m. This is a
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: very damning sighting, okay? This is the wild sighting. It
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: happened at 9.45 p.m., 15 minutes after the event had ended.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: It happened on the intersection of West 110th Street and
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: the Baltic Avenue. This sighting was reported by an unidentified
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: woman who informed investigators that she had seen a dark-colored
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: 1948 coupe driven by a man she estimated to be
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: in his 40s speeding north on Baltic Avenue with an
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: obviously distressed child in the back seat with her hands
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: bound behind her back, trashing and repeatedly shouting, I want
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: to get out. So this is already wild.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: This is damn indeed.
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: This is already wild. So this 9.45 p.m. sighting already
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: happened in a different location. It already happened in Edgewater neighborhood.
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: It is already quite far away from Halloran Park. It
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: is to this particular location. This intersection is 2.3 miles
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: away and it is a seven minute drive. So it
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: is still very possible that this could be Beverly or
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: And that she is getting abducted at this time, I
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: believe it is possible because it would only take seven
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: minutes to get there.
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: Wait, what was the time when Fred saw Beverly?
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: I believe it was 9.30.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: Okay, so roughly around the time when the show ended
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: and she probably was trying to cut corners to get
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: home quicker. Yeah. And within that time and 9.45, someone...
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: could have potentially picked her up and drove over there
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: where the car was last seen.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a possible outcome.
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: Last seen is possible, right?
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: I mean, logistically, it's possible.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: Yes. All right, we're back from a small ad break.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: Ad break?
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we don't even have any ads and people didn't
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: even notice that there was a break.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we basically just eat some buns.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but hopefully we will get some ads going eventually.
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: But now let's keep going. So now let's talk about
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: the disappearance. When Beverly did not return home by 10 p.m.,
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: her family called Patricia, the friend that attended the event
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: with Beverly. And they were told by Patricia's parents that
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: Patricia actually returned already an hour ago. And she returned
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: alone and apparently she said that Beverly was still at
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: the park alone. So Beverly's father and her older sister
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: immediately started searching the area. The park and the surrounding
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: streets were checked. At around 10.57 p.m., roughly an hour
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: after they started to search, When they have not found anything,
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: they called the police and the officers arrived and they
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: started investigating. A routine inspection of the property revealed that
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: the child was not at the home and they could
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: not find her anywhere. On top of that, her piggy
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: bank still contained all her savings, which also included the
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: nickel that she had earned the previous evening. Police launched
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: an intense search effort. They started by searching the local vicinity.
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: They questioned friends, acquaintances, and individuals known to have been
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: at Halloran Park. By daylight, a statewide manhunt was implemented. Apparently,
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: numerous suspects were detained and interrogated over the following weeks.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: We don't know exactly who these suspects were, Beverly's family
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: members were cleared. They were cleared of any potential involvement.
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: Police determined that Beverly's home life had been stable and
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: by all accounts happy, and there appeared to be no
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: reason for her to have ran away voluntarily. Investigators actually
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: learned from Beverly's mother, Elizabeth, that on August 24th, Beverly
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: was actually anticipating a family trip to an amusement park
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: in Cleveland, which was supposed to take place the next
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: morning after her disappearance. So it really seemed that there
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: was no reason for Beverly to run away on this
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: particular day. So it was clearly something terrible must have happened.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: And why would she run away? It seems like a
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: very ordinary day.
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: Exactly.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: Helped her mom and her mom allowed her to go
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: to the show wagon, had fun with her friend Patricia.
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: I don't think there's any reason for her to just
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: run away. No?
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: Well, I think that is the conclusion, that this is
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: not a runaway.
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: Obviously. So we have some several sightings that have taken
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: place on this day. So we have multiple, I believe, sightings.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: Let's actually see what we have. So First sighting that
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: we can talk about came from an off-duty police officer,
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: George Worrell. He was at Halloran Park and he informed
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: police that he had seen two young men, aged between
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: 17 and 20, at the event, openly leering at young
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: girls watching the performances. Leering is an unpleasant, side-long look
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: or grin that shows unwanted desire, slyness, or hidden malice. Okay,
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm talking about. Like, leering, like looking
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: at girls in a really creepy way.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: Staring. Staring. So this is how I would describe it.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: So apparently this police guy, ex-off-duty cop, reported this. These
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: two young men walked behind the stage and out of
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: George Worrell's sight shortly before the end of the event.
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: Beverly's classmate Patricia Nagg had also reported seeing a young
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: man repeatedly thrust his hips back and forth in a
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: manner simulating intercourse as he had stared at her. So
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: this was.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: That's just nasty.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: We have some nasty reports coming out of this event.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: None of these three young men were ever identified. But we,
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: I guess, amongst the many people there, we had some creeps.
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: Creepy guys. Do you think it's just creepy and, you know.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: Excited boys, potentially.
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: I wanted to say the word... Yeah, I don't know.
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: I don't know if you could say that on YouTube.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: Probably not. Yeah.
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: Probably dummies, basically.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we know what you're talking about.
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: I mean, we're not making an excuse for them, but,
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: you know. It could be just disgusting, but potentially harmless.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: Yes, potentially harmless or potentially... Not harmless. Not harmless. Anything
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: could happen here. But these are the, I guess, creeps
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: that were reported at the... At the event. But now
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: we move to an actual arrest, okay? Arrest of, I
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: would even say... Wait, wait, sorry, sorry. Okay, sorry.
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: Before we move on. Yes. Maybe I am wrong, but
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: wasn't there... Oh, no, I was wrong. Because I think
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: I read somewhere that it could have been potentially a
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: woman who had abducted her because she was less trustful
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: of men than women.
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but what was your point?
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: Sorry, I thought there was a woman in there. There wasn't, right?
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: Amongst the creeps?
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like, was she seen with a woman? Probably not.
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: Probably mixed it up.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: I don't think she was seen.
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: Probably it was a theory. Yeah, sorry. Go ahead.
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: I don't think she was seen with a woman. But now,
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: this is where we move to the arrest. The arrest
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: of one of the most, I would say, personally, for me,
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: this is the guy that looks, out of all the
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: people that were named... This looks like the most, I
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: would say, credible and the most interesting, at the very least,
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: person of interest, William Slates. William Slates was arrested. Okay,
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: so this is what we have. On August 29, five
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: days after Beverly's disappearance, media reported that police arrested a
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: strong suspect in the case. William Slates, a 25-year-old unemployed former,
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: I believe, military serviceman who lived with his widowed mother
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: on West 116th Street. This is a street that is
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: a bit farther down from Halloran Park, but I wouldn't
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: say it's extremely far away either. William Slates had being
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: previously arrested in 1949 for making, let's just say, advances
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: towards an eight-year-old girl in a local movie theater. That's terrible.
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: So this is a former military guy who was, I
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: think he was dishonorably, You know, not honorably discharged, but
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: dishonorably discharged from his service in the military because of
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: this action. He was making advances towards an eight-year-old girl
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: in a local movie theater. So this is a big-time creep,
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: William Slates. His name was given to authority. So the
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: incident with the eight-year-old happened, I believe, before Beverly went missing.
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: But still, that's terrible.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: He's a big-time creep, right? So William Slate's name was
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: given to authorities by his neighbor. And you know why?
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: Because the neighbor reported that he had abruptly boarded up
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: his home and left the neighborhood the day after Beverly
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: went missing. So this is already weird.
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: Why was he acting so obviously weird?
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so this is not it. Not all of it.
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: Before he left, William had borrowed a friend's car. When
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: police searched his home, they found a loaded. 25 caliber
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: weapon in his drawer. William Slates was quickly traced to
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: a hotel in Columbus, and returned to Cleveland. Columbus is
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: another major city in Ohio. Although two of his friends
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: gave conflicting accounts of his movements, so basically two of
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: his friends were asked what was, you know, William doing
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: on this day, and they couldn't really give a consistent statement, apparently.
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: What he was doing on the day when Beverly Potts
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: went missing. He also, William himself, his... His polygraph indicated
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: deception when he was asked about Beverly. And he was only,
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: I believe, this was the main reason why they released him,
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: because his 17-year-old girlfriend, you know, this creep, also had
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: a 17-year-old girlfriend. She provided an alibi. She claims that
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: on that particular evening, they were making out in a car.
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: in Edgewater Park on that particular evening. And apparently this site,
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: this alibi, it was not verified. It was unverifiable, but
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: apparently it was enough. Okay, apparently it was enough. Interesting.
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: It was enough for them to let go of this guy.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: So I think we're going to circle back to this
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: guy a little bit when we talk about the other
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: suspect here. But I will say this guy, William....
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: He's looking very suspicious right now.
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: William Slates is very suspicious.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: With what we know so far.
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. So following Beverly's disappearance, her parents stated that
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: they believed that she was abducted and being held against
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: her will. While a police artist made the sketch of
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: Beverly depicting her and how she looked on the day.
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: When she went missing and what she was wearing. Yes,
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: we both see that sketch.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: It looks like her. Looks like a storybook version of her.
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: But hey, it's good enough to know what she looked
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: like that day. Actually a very good depiction.
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: We have a very good depiction of her. And by
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: the week following Beverly's disappearance... numerous potential suspects have been
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: eliminated from the investigation. This is where we jump to
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: the theories portion of the podcast. So in the days
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: following Beverly's disappearance, investigators consider two possible reasons for abduction.
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: It's either ransom or S.A. Let's put it that way, S.A.
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: or ransom. So the mail was intercepted and apparently they
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: found no information or no letters that indicated that someone
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: was going to ask for a ransom. So I think
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: naturally police started leaning towards S.A. Three months prior to
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: Beverly's disappearance, okay, this was May, May of that same year,
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: three months prior, a five-year-old girl from Lakewood neighborhood in
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: Cleveland named Gail Ann Michelle was missing. abducted from a
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: local department store gail was found abandoned but unharmed 18
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: hours later um so they are thinking that you know
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: is there a potential connection it's actually quite interesting because
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: i was able to google gail and michelle and you
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: could you know and this woman i think she passed
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: away last year you know uh and you could see
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: You could read her obituary. It's interesting that, you know,
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: you could find these people. It's real people, you know
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: what I mean? Unfortunately, Gail must have went through something
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: traumatizing at some point in her life, you know?
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: But this was not the only thing that happened leading
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: up to the disappearance of Beverly Potts. Apparently, there was
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: a whole bunch of bad stuff. Like, this was apparently
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: a terrible area helleron park the same month two underage
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: girls had been s aid in helleron park what the
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: hell same month and just weeks before beverly's disappearance three
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: local women had been s aid in locations close to
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: the pot's home so so we have how many we
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: have just just In the same month or like literally
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: within a month of Beverly disappearance, we have at least
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: five different incidents of SA in the neighborhood. This has
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: to be in one month. So this area has to
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: be like crazy dangerous.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: But I wonder if it only happened like after Beverly
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: disappeared or was it the beginning of it somewhere around
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: that time? Or did it used to happen even back then?
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: Because as a mother, I don't think her mom would
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: let her go outside at night knowing that there's a
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: lot of, like, you know, SA going on, no?
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: That's a good point. I don't know if it was
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: widely reported.
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if it was, like, historically, right, like that.
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: No, but this was within the same month.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I know. Like, for example, like, I don't know,
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: at the beginning of the year, there were already, like,
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: a lot of reports of Young children, young girls being
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: at a site. I don't think her mom would let
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: her out of her sight.
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: So it seems like it intensified in this neighborhood.
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: It seems so.
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: And this could very well likely mean that one of
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: these are related to Beverly. That's what I was thinking
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: as well.
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: I'm really sorry. Read it quickly.
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: I wonder if it's... It's just within the park, right? Well, no.
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: One is... Two in the park and three in close
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: proximity to her home. Yeah.
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: I wonder if it somehow correlates to the people who
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: are staying in the park at night.
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good question. I also wonder.
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: So, two days after her disappearance, which was August 26th,
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: two days after Beverly went missing, all known... S-offenders with
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: or without predilection for children residing in Cleveland's West Side
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: were also questioned, all of them. They rounded all of
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: these guys up and they talked to them about what
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: they were doing on the evening of August 24 when
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: Beverly goes missing. And all 65 individuals were eliminated.
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: 65?
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they rounded up 65 offenders.
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: That are just known.
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: What about the unknown?
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: 65 offenders were eliminated. That's a big, big number.
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: That's a big number.
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Beverly was known to be shy, especially around men.
• 54:29
  Speaker 1: She was cautious of any strangers. Many senior investigators theorized
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: that she was lured into a nearby house. or a
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: car on her way back home by someone that she
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: knew or at least known of. They speculate that the
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: perpetrator could have offered something like a babysitting job or
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: requested help with something, which Beverly did not turn down.
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: So this is what the senior police investigators are arguing.
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: And one particular theory pursued was that Beverly had been,
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: killed by a neighbor, okay, someone in the neighborhood, and
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: that her body was buried within or upon the grounds
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: of one of the properties, either on or near Lynette Avenue.
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: which the child had passed as she was walking back
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: home from Halloran Park. So I took a little bit
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: at Lynette Avenue. I took some screenshots of Lynette Avenue.
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: It looks like a very regular suburban neighborhood in America.
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: I feel like we've seen this before, like this neighborhood
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: in just somewhere else.
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I can't even, like if you showed me
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: this and yeah, that's like, I don't even know where
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: this is, like which north, south, east, west America.
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: This could be anywhere, right?
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: I feel like we've seen this neighborhood before. So it's
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: a very stereotypical American neighborhood, I would say. Do you
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: think there's a chance? You see how many homes in this.
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: Do you think there's a chance at 9.30 p.m. on
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: a Friday, someone lures Beverly into their home? Someone that
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: they knew?
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: Maybe not in this neighborhood. Mainly because nobody reported a
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: sighting of her in that street walking home. The last
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: reported sighting of her was still within the park and
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: potentially further away. In a vehicle. Potentially.
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: Well, the girl in the vehicle, right? I just want
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: to emphasize. I don't think that who reported it said
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: it was Beverly.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: It was just the potential.
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: Just a child. Any child.
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: But with the hands bound behind her back. That's pretty odd.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: That's a different... That's a different situation. Yeah, that's a
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: horrible scenario.
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like there's no way it's a dad and a
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: kid showing a fit.
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: No, that is a major crime that is taking place.
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: So if this 9.45 p.m. sighting is real, we have
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: not only Beverly.
• 57:07
  Speaker 2: We have someone else.
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: We have another child which is about to get killed.
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: Let's be real here. That sounds like a major crime.
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: It is taking place as well at the same time.
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: But I don't think there was any other missing person,
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: missing kids like that.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: So would you say it's most likely Beverly? Or potentially
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: like a higher chance.
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: It was Beverly? I think it's either Beverly. I think
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: it's either the lady didn't know what she actually saw.
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: Or I think the lady is lying.
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: To get some attention.
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: To get some attention. So it's either real. And if
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: it's real, I would say... I mean, it has to
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: be Beverly Hills.
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: It has to be. No other reported missing children.
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: And it was so close to Halloran Park.
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: So that sighting is so crazy, actually.
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, going back to the topic of the neighbors
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: abducting her, I don't think so. Mainly because, I don't know,
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: there has to be some sort of reported sighting. It
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: was only 9.45. People still walk outside.
• 58:05
  Speaker 1: And on a Friday.
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: And on a Friday at that. after a big event
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: at the park. If she was walking there and someone
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: abducted her, or a neighbor, she was walking back with
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: the neighbor, someone would have saw it.
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't say it's completely impossible. I do agree with
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: you that there's a lot of possibility that someone would
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: have seen it, but I also think it's possible. You
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: remember in Cleveland, we had this, I believe it was Cleveland,
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: We had the women that were abducted and kept in
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: a basement for many years. So things like this happen.
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I can't remember it. The only case
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: I could remember where a woman was kept for years
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: in a basement was in Austria.
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know what you're talking about. But this is
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: literally the.
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: We talked about this probably.
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but this is the Cleveland version of that case.
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: Sort of. So we had some... I believe it was Cleveland.
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: I believe it was.
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: It was also, I believe it was in Cleveland. and
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: that case so and that neighborhood was similar maybe it
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: was a bit more run down the neighborhood than Lynette
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: Avenue but it was still Cleveland I believe so we
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: know bad stuff goes down in Cleveland.
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: You know what bothers me a lot about this case
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: is the fact that there were more than a thousand
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: who attended this event. Cleveland was a massive city, but
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: also this showcase event features children from five to 17
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: who would dance, sing, do poetry, do some sort of
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: like kid stuff to show off and like, you know,
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: to perform. But you know what attracts these?
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: Pervs and pedos so i was a little bit bothered
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 3: like is there a possibility of someone some disgusting person
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: i'm not even saying a guy it could be a
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 3: girl i don't know.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: Who traveled to cleveland to go to that particular event
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: knowing that there would be a lot of children in
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: there and a lot of people.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: I mean it could be the case right This is,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: I keep going back to, I sometimes mention this. It's like,
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: I also feel like children beauty pageants are so weird.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: Because I would say, I would say people organizing beauty
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: pageants or something like that should really take a look
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: who's in the top row out there. You know what
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: I'm saying? Looking at, because no one, because look, no one.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: Are you even interested in watching one?
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: Listen, listen. No one, was ever realistically excited about a
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: child's beauty pageant. No one cares.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't care.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: No, no, obviously no one cares. But if someone goes
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: to a beauty pageant unrelated to any of those kids,
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: red alert.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: You think so?
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: Red alert. You have an offender.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: That's true. If you're not related to any of the children.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: If you go to a child beauty pageant, And you
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: have no red alert.
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 2: No, but maybe some people actually find that entertaining. You know,
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: adorable children dressed in a massive ball gown like walking around.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know, man. I don't see it. I think
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: it's actually a really dangerous environment to expose your kids
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: like that. But that's a different topic. So now let's
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: go a little bit back.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: And that's mostly our opinion. Please don't hate us. Maybe
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: you like children beauty pageants in an innocent way.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: Maybe, yeah. So let's jump to the family statement, what
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: he said. So one week after Beverly had disappeared, the
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: Potts family actually issued a public appeal to the abductors,
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: stating that they have accepted the likelihood that Beverly is
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: no longer alive. And they were only asking for the
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: people responsible to write or telephone them and tell them
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: where they could find Beverly's remains. No one really responded
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: to this family's appeal. And then we have some further,
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: later developments that took place. So I guess the first
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: significant and very, very, very, very interesting, very kind of like,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: it's not even nice to think about, but this is
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: a very interesting development that took place in September of
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: that same year. So literally the next month, I believe
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: this was, September 4th, so this was, I believe, only
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: like a week and a half later, something like that,
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: a warehouse worker named Henry Palmer, he saw a human-shaped,
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: cloth-wrapped form measuring approximately five feet, which would be like
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: a child's height, floating in the Cuyahoga River. behind the
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: building where he was working. Henry saw what he believes
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: to be human hands and feet protruding from the edges
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: of this bundle. His sighting was corroborated by another person,
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: Miss Ada Scrovan. So, Ada, she saw a similarly wrapped package,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: which she claimed It has been bound with rope. Now,
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: the most interesting thing about this is that both of
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: these individuals reported the sighting separately. I don't even know
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: if they know about each other. So two different people
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: reported seeing a human-shaped package floating in the river. And
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: Henry says he saw hands and feet.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: That's creepy.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: When they tried to look for it, They couldn't find it.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: In 1954, three years later, police arrested, there was another
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: interesting link, a very dark, very dark link. Police arrested
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: a middle-aged man, a 20-year-old woman, and a 24-year-old man
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: on charges of selling graphic content. Let's put it this way.
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: Children?
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: No.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: Not necessarily.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 1: Just in general. One individual depicted in the images was
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 1: a pre... Sorry. Prep... What is this word? Pre-pubescent? Like
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: pre-puberty girl, okay? I don't know how to say it.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: Bearing a resemblance to Beverly Potts. Although the individual's He
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: insisted that the child was not Beverly Potts. Her parents
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: initially believed otherwise before changing their minds. There was someone
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: peddling some graphic pictures. Let's put it this way, sexual
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 1: manner pictures. And it included some, I guess, CP probably.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: And one of the pictures of CP looked like Beverly.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: And even the parents... assumed it was Beverly for some time.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: But then if it's not Beverly, then who is it
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: in those pictures? Are they saying that there was CP images?
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 2: That's already a red flag.
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: That's terrible, regardless of who it is. Then the next
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: development happened way later. Now we're moving to 1973, an
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: anonymous tip to authorities from an unnamed Chardon woman. Chardon
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: is a town in Ohio quite close to Cleveland. Chardon
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: women claimed to have known Beverly Potts as a child.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: Someone from Chardon said that they were Beverly's childhood friend.
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: And this individual claimed that Beverly's body was buried in
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: a grease pit of a former auto repair shop. So
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: this is where you drive a car, but there's like
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: this pit where someone could go kind of in it
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: and look at the car's bottom.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: The tip led to a search of what had once
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: been the inspection pit of an auto body shop on
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: West 52nd Street. However, this search proved negative. This street
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: is not necessarily super close to Halloran Park, but it's
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: in Cleveland. And the next development was in 1980 when
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: two retired Cleveland police detectives, James Forrest and Robert Shankland, okay,
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: revealed that back in 74, they had received a tip
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: from a local attorney with a client whose brother had
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: supposedly confessed to abducting Beverly Potts. So it was a
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: lawyer who said that his client's brother confessed, if that
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: makes sense. The detective subsequently found and questioned this brother
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: who said that Basically, he admitted to having lived near
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: Halloran Park in 1951. He said he was living there,
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 1: and he said he had a habit of picking up
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: and assaulting young girls there. The man did not remember
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: abducting Beverly Potts in particular, but said that he had
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: flashes of memory involving a girl named Beverly.
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that's already terrible.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 1: That's terrible. The two detectives were convinced that this guy
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: was guilty, but the county prosecutor's office refused to pursue
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: because lack of evidence. But this guy, from what I
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: just read, feels like a major creep. He said he
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: was assaulting girls next to Halvorn Park in the 50s.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: I don't know. So this Halloran Park really looks like
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: a very dangerous place right now. Now we move to
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: another development. This was a bizarre development. This was so bizarre.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: I think you also read about it, but let me
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: just quickly read it. 1994, there was a couple who
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: were renovating a house in Midwell Avenue, Cleveland. They discovered
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: several pieces of yellowing notebook papers alongside the man's shirt
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: beneath all carpeting upon the stairs. So basically, you know,
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: they were renovating, they found some stuff. The author of
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: this note identified herself in this note, you know, like
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: the couple were fixing their home and they found a
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: note written by Anna Hynek, Anna Hynek, in her note,
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: in detail, expressed true facts, according to her, surrounding the
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: abduction and murder of Beverly Potts, which Anna Hynek insisted
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: had been committed by her then-husband Steve. Steve was 40
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: at the time of Beverly's disappearance. Anna Hynek further alleged
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 1: that her husband was the Potts family milkman, and according
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: to her, Her husband had previously assaulted Beverly's mother, Elizabeth,
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: and was likely Beverly's biological father. This is going crazy.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: So how she described how Beverly died is apparently that
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: there was a drug overdose and Steve, her husband, decided
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: to remove of Beverly's body so so somehow steve was
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: giving drugs to 10 year old beverly and beverly but
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: why this is where it's all gonna end before her
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: husband had dismembered the child's body she saw him trying
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: to burn her body in the i believe it was
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 1: uh in the basement furnace and uh and and she
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 1: caught her husband steve She caught her husband, Steve, trying
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: to burn Beverly's body. And then when Anna Hynek was
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: traced by police and questioned, she was 83 at this point.
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 1: She was a senior citizen at this point, but back
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 1: when she wrote the letter, maybe she was a bit younger.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: And she admitted that she wrote the letter, the note,
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: but she said that all of it was false. She
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: had written and hidden the letter in 1953, two years
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 1: after Beverly's disappearance, solely as a revenge fantasy against her
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: abusive husband. Furthermore, by the time of the husband's death
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: in 81, she forgot about it.
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: So damn lady, that's a very detailed revenge novel and
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: why would you even write that and hide it? Like
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: just burn it.
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 1: Could you imagine when you buy an old house and
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: you renovate it, you could probably find some old weird stuff.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: yeah people hide some weird stuff and then you just
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: forget about it so this lady legit wrote this and
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: the thing is.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: But why include beverly in that freaking revenge novel.
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: I think beverly's case was a big deal in cleveland
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: and she just was so mad at the husband that
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 1: she that she wrote this note and hit it.
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 2: I don't get it i'm sorry She.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 1: Wrote the note and then some random people in the
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: 90s found it.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: So the question here is, was it real? Was she
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: making an excuse when she was interviewed? Or was it
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: completely in her, I must say, bonkers head?
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: I think she was just really angry, so she wrote that. No,
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 1: I don't think it's real, right? Or do you think
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 1: there's a chance that Steve actually did it?
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: It's just too detailed. Like, why would you make up...
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: You're already angry at your husband. Don't you want to, like,
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: forget about him for a bit?
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 2: Why even, like, write this graphic, odd, criminal, terrifying thing?
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: And before we move to the suspects here... Wait, wait.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: Before we actually move forward, what do you think about it?
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: About the notes?
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: Oh, I think it's what the lady... The senior lady said,
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: I believe, is true.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 2: But don't you think it's a bit odd?
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: I think she was just really mad. And she just
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: wrote it. I believe that.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: Or maybe she wrote it with the intention of sending it.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 2: Because the dude was abusive. Like, you know, to make
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: his life miserable. And then she hid it and, like,
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: probably forgave him. And forgot about it.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: I don't know what the... I don't know what the...
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: purpose of it was but i do believe that she
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 1: was just really you know she was not having a
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: good life probably with this steve apparently steve wasn't a
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 1: good guy so.
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: She just why write this horrible thing i don't get
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 2: it like write down my husband is annoying my husband
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 2: is stupid write those things like but why write this
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 2: story involving a kid.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: Kidnapped a kid and kid and the kid.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: Od'd Yeah, and then burned her body.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: And I caught him burning his body in the basement.
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, in the basement furnace. Why does it have to
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 2: be so graphic, so detailed if it's not real?
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: She was real emotional, you know?
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: I don't get it still.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 1: I think she was real emotional. She just did it.
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 1: And I think I don't suspect that it's a real
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: from what I'm gathering here. It's not actually, you know,
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 1: it's not real.
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 2: I just find it so odd how she could write
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: the whole story about a fake story just because.
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: She's... So what are you saying? Are you saying it's
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: a real story?
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: I think it needs to be investigated on a bit more.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: Ah, so you think it could be real.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because I'm trying to put myself in her shoes. I,
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 2: for example, have a husband and I'm very angry that
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 2: her husband is abusive. I'm going to write down about
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: my experiences. no like you're.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: Not gonna invent like a whole.
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: Um like there's a for example a missing kid here
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 2: in lithuania it's massive i'm not gonna write down about
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: that kid and how my husband um she od'd because
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 2: of my husband and blah blah blah i'm gonna write
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: down my husband is terrible he hits me he scolds
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: me whatever Those are the things I'm going to write down.
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to invent some sort of story involving
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: a missing kid who's most likely... Who's innocent. You know
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: what I mean?
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 1: I could see how people would do it, though. What?
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 1: I could see how you wouldn't do it, but I
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 1: could see how someone would do it. Like, the right
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 1: person would do something stupid like this.
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: They would. It's crazy.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 1: You just need the right stupid person to do it.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean? I'm not saying this lady
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: is stupid because she... This... Anna Heineck, she may have
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 1: really been abused by Steve.
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: But allegedly.
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: Or maybe she, yeah, I could also see it, like,
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: she wrote it with the intention of, like, sending it
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: to the police or something, like, dropping, like, a tip, like,
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 2: a fake tip so the husband would have a bit
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: of a hard time.
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 1: But I guess what you're saying is true that maybe,
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: maybe I shouldn't or, you know, everyone shouldn't just write
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: it off. Mm-hmm. Maybe this Anna... We need to do
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: more research. Maybe this Anna Heineck is actually hiding something.
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: There must be some reason why she wrote it. I'm
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: not saying that it's real. I'm not saying that it
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: could have been completely nothing. But it feels like it
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: just was dismissed a bit too soon, too early.
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 1: I guess I could see... your point i definitely could
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: see your point i wonder how much investigation they did into.
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 2: Maybe they did maybe it was really nothing just so.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: Weird for me yeah so in 2000 you know there
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 1: was something happening in the year of 2000 uh a
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: series of handwritten letters were being sent to the editorial
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 1: office of the cleveland plane dealer perpetrating to be from
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: an elderly man who claimed that as he was terminally
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 1: ill and in the twilight of his life, he wished
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: to confess before his death to assaulting and murdering Beverly Potts.
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 1: According to this author, Beverly's murder was not planned, as
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 1: he had only wanted to assault the child upon luring
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: her into his vehicle, although when Beverly had begun screaming,
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: he had struck her into unconsciousness Before proceeding to assault her,
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 1: upon realizing that his blows had inflicted fatal injuries, he
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 1: had then thrown her body in the river from where
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: he speculated that her body drifted into Lake Erie. Investigators
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 1: strongly questioned the authenticity of these claims. This skepticism increased
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 1: as several sentences and claims contained in successive letters to
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 1: follow had evidently been copied from previous hoax letters and
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: false claims made by previous suspects, leading to speculation that
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: the author may have been a retired police officer who
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: was just being a weirdo. The anonymous author pledged to
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 1: turn himself in on the 50th anniversary of Beverly's disappearance,
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 1: but shortly beforehand he wrote again and said that he
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 1: is entering a nursing home and would not be able
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: to honor his promise or reveal his identity. Extensive investigations
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 1: failed to turn up any clues about who this guy was.
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: They think he could have been a weirdo police guy.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 1: And investigators believe the letters to have been a distasteful hoax.
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: Wouldn't it align though with the sightings of... of that
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: lady who saw a kid with her hands tied behind
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: her back screaming I want to get out of the
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 2: car and then eventually the the floating bag human shaped
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 2: bag in the river with hands and feet I.
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 1: Think it wouldn't align with the first sighting because in
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 1: this apparently hoax letter from the year 2000. The author
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: says that they knocked the kid unconscious. They knocked Beverly unconscious. However,
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: only then they realized that Beverly had passed away and
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: then they threw her body out.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: Maybe there's a possibility that he drove her first into
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: a secluded location.
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 1: And then, okay, okay.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: I think so. It could have been completely a hoax.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: Actually, you have a good point. Like, this does.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 2: Aligned with a couple of the sightings, yeah?
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a couple of other clues.
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 2: Like someone could have drove her to a secluded location
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 2: trying to do the do and then smacked her into,
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this does actually... You have a good point. This
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: would align with some of the previously mentioned clues that
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 1: we have here.
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: But since the investigators did an extensive research about it
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: and said that it was a hoax, then I think
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: we should believe them.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: I would also believe in that.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. They have way more resources than us.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 1: As always they do, you know. And this is the
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 1: part where I think now I would like to jump
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 1: into the suspects that were mentioned. So the first obvious
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 1: suspect that we have to talk about here is William
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: Ross Slate, remember? Or the weirdo 25-year-old former police serviceman
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: who lived with his widowed mother. Remember that guy who...
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 1: left and boarded up his house where was his mom
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: though yeah where did the mom.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 2: Go that's true boarded up the house what happened to the.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: Mom did he just board up the mom inside so
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 1: this guy is a major creep he was i think
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 1: he was attempting to wait let let me let me
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 1: get back to this guy so this guy right listen
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: up he had previously been arrested in march 49 two
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 1: years before for making advances towards an 8-year-old girl in
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: a local movie theater, resulting in him being placed on
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 1: a year's probation and dishonorable discharge from armed forces. This
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: guy messed up. He's like a big-ass creep.
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: You have to bleep that part out.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry about that one. William Slates is known to
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 1: have fraudulently borrowed a friend's car. I don't know what
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 1: that means. The day that Beverly went missing.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: Fraudulently borrowed. So, like, stole for a bit.
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 3: Stole?
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: Or, like, borrowed with no permission.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: Okay. Police... Oh, okay, okay. That makes sense. Police traced
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: phone calls that he had made to his 17-year-old girlfriend's home.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 2: 17-year-old girlfriend?
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he had the 17-year-old. Just the same girlfriend that
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: provided the alibi that they were making up. So, you know,
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 1: police traced his phone calls to the girlfriend's home. and
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 1: they located him in a hotel in Columbus, Ohio, and
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 1: then he was returned to Cleveland. Two of his friends,
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 1: Dale Smallwood and Fraser Jenkins, provided varying and conflicting accounts
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: of his movements on the evening of Beverly's disappearance, and
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 1: William Slates himself was unable to explain his abrupt, decision
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 1: to leave cleveland so they asked him why did you
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 1: leave cleveland and he had no explanation a polygraph test
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 1: indicated deception when he was asked about beverly but.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: Those tell us nothing because they're not really reliable yeah yeah.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 1: I agree with that and no physical evidence was found
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: to link him to the case he was released from
• 1:22:52
  Speaker 1: custody when his girlfriend provided an alibi that they could
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 1: not verify.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 2: But the girlfriend's 17, though. She's still a minor. Isn't
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 2: that already illegal?
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 1: I don't know how it was back then. I guess,
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: can you be like girlfriend, boyfriend, if someone's 17 and
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 1: you're 25, but you just say, oh, we don't do nothing?
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: Is that legal? I don't know.
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Sounds wrong still.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: Sounds, yeah. But I don't know. Maybe that's legal. So
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: I tried Googling this guy. I tried to find more
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 1: information on William Ross Slate's. And I didn't find anything.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: If you put his name into Google. Nothing comes up.
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 1: So I don't know what to make of it. But
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 1: to me personally. This is hugely strange. His neighbors called
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 1: him in. So I think this guy is very interesting
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 1: for me. Because he lived nearby. He did some weird stuff.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 1: Literally the next day after Beverly went missing. And he
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: is proven to be a. offender so so i believe
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 1: that he is definitely a person of interest in my
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 1: opinion what do you think about this.
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: Guy i think yeah i think he's very sketchy very
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 2: sketchy very and the fact that he's in a close
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 2: proximity it's it's terrible.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: Then we move to another guy that i don't really
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 1: think is very likely but i have to mention maybe
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 1: some of our listeners will think otherwise this is frank
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 1: davis Frank Davis was a 52-year-old ex-convict at the time
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 1: of Beverly's disappearance. He was arrested in the early hours
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: of November 15, 1955, so several months after Beverly went missing,
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 1: as he was attempting to extort ransom from the Potts family.
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: This guy was apparently fake, claiming that he had kidnapped Beverly,
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 1: Beverly and I was asking for money. So he had
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 1: begun contacting the Potts family on November 9th. So this
• 1:24:59
  Speaker 1: is already when the family already assumed that Beverly's dead.
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 1: On November 9th, maybe he just figured out that, you know,
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 1: oh man, there's an opportunity for me to get some money.
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 1: So he started calling the family, claiming to be holding
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: Beverly captive. At first he was demanding $ 25, 000 back in
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 1: 50 money. And he, for him to release Beverly. And
• 1:25:24
  Speaker 1: he said that Beverly was already very sick. And if
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 1: he doesn't get his money, he will kill Beverly.
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 2: What a cruel person.
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 1: So Robert, Beverly's father, successfully negotiated the price down to 5,000.
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 1: So that was already interesting that this guy who held
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: Beverly captive for a month, right? Now, only now starts
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: asking for money. And then he's like, okay, I'm gonna
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 1: drop it down to five. And then he said that
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 1: he would need this money, 5K, and that he would
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 1: only accept this deal, transaction, if Beverly's mother, Elizabeth, would
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 1: show up, I believe, to the Terminal Tower, which is
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: a famous landmark, I believe, in Cleveland downtown.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 1: But Robert actually called the police and told them about
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 1: what's happening. So Frank Davis insisted in his call that
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 1: Elizabeth should deliver the ransom money to 750 Prospect Avenue
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 1: at 5.30 a.m. An undercover detective who dressed up like
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: Elizabeth took a yellow cab to the caller's instructed destination.
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 1: In the early hours of November 15th, And shortly after,
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 1: Frank was arrested. After several hours of interrogation, Frank admitted
• 1:26:52
  Speaker 1: to the extortion attempt, claiming he had been strapped for money.
• 1:26:55
  Speaker 1: He denied any knowledge of the abduction and was formally
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 1: cleared of any involvement by police. Frank later pled guilty
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 1: to blackmail and extortion, and he was actually paroled in 1957.
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 1: So he got to get away with it pretty, only after,
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 1: you know, like what, six years in prison. So what
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 1: do you think about this guy? This is why I
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 1: immediately mentioned that Frank Dale to me looks like just
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 1: an opportunist extortionist.
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I do think he's just a cruel guy. Very cruel.
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 2: Taking advantage of such a vulnerable family. But I don't
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: think he was the one who did it.
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 1: Me neither. Would you say that William is more interesting?
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: There's no question about it.
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely.
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 1: Definitely. We have another person, Harry Lee Rush. Let me
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 1: quickly remember why this guy was here because I already
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 1: a little bit forgot, but Harvey Lee Rush was an
• 1:27:54
  Speaker 1: impoverished 47-year-old drifter and Cleveland native who had relocated from
• 1:28:02
  Speaker 1: his home city of Cleveland to Los Angeles in the
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 1: spring of 1951, so this was before Beverly went missing,
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 1: he was already in Los Angeles apparently, where he sporadically
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 1: worked as a hospital attendant. He briefly became a suspect
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: in Beverly's case in December of 1955, 40 years after
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 1: Beverly's disappearance, after he was arrested to public intoxication in
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 1: Los Angeles. According to his official three-page confession, Harvey Lee
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 1: admitted to murdering a girl in his home city Cleveland,
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 1: whom he claimed, to have met at a puppet event.
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 1: He claimed to have buried the girl in a shallow
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 1: grave beneath a bridge spanning the Rocky River. So he
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 1: was admitting to a murder. He was arrested for public
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 1: intoxication and he was now admitting to murdering kids. The
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 1: discrepancies in his case were immediately apparent to Cleveland police.
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 1: He incorrectly described his victim as being 12 instead of 10,
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 1: and he incorrectly described Beverly's appearance. Moreover, he could not
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 1: give the girl's name or a consistent description. However, Harvey
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 1: Lee previously lived close to Potts' home in the 40s,
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 1: so he had some connection. He apparently lived in the
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 1: neighborhood at least a decade before Beverly went missing. Despite
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 1: several skepticism from senior investigators, he was extradited back to
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 1: Cleveland on December 15. He recanted his entire story almost
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 1: immediately after he was extradited to Cleveland. He said that
• 1:29:46
  Speaker 1: he confessed merely as a way to ensure his return
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 1: back to Cleveland. Upon disproving Harvey Lee's confession, they were
• 1:29:54
  Speaker 1: legally unable to detain him. So this guy literally just
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: seems like he was drunk in public in la then
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 1: he got arrested he said oh i killed beverly uh
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 1: they sent him back to cleveland he's like no i
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 1: didn't i just told you that so you would like
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 1: send me back to cleveland that's.
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: A smart way to do it though cruel but smart
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 2: way to do it yeah so it's just You know,
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: it's kind of crazy because in this case, maybe it
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: was such a massive case that maybe a lot of
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 2: people are taking advantage of it.
• 1:30:28
  Speaker 1: By the sound of it.
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 2: By the sound of it. And I also read somewhere
• 1:30:31
  Speaker 2: that they received so many tips about Beverly. But, like,
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 2: I don't know, hundreds or maybe even a thousand. But
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 2: none of them are... real?
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: I don't think they are. We have another... I think
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: this is the last specific guy. I think this was more... Oh,
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 1: this was more interesting. I don't necessarily find it very likely,
• 1:31:01
  Speaker 1: but this is more interesting. Do you know William Henry Redmond?
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 2: I don't think so. I only know of the one William,
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 2: the first one.
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 1: So this is another William. William Henry. In January of 1988...
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: William Henry Redmond, an Ohio native and former carnival truck
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 1: driver and ferris wheel operator with an extensive record of
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 1: child assaults, convictions relating to young girls.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's crazy knowing the fact that he's a carnival worker.
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: Carnival worker and he has convictions relating to young girls
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 1: dating back to 35. He was indicted... for the April 25th,
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 1: 1951 murder of 8-year-old Jane Mary Althoff in Pell, Pennsylvania,
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: in a town called Traynor. So this is a month
• 1:32:05
  Speaker 1: before Beverly Potts disappears.
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 2: And he's a carnival guy. That means he travels. Yes.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and apparently there's no mistaking this. William Henry definitely
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 1: murdered the eight-year-old Jane Mary because Jane's body was discovered
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 1: in his carnival vehicle and his fingerprints were discovered at
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 1: the crime scene. However, he had fled the state by
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 1: the time of discovery of her body and assumed a
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 1: new identity. And he was able to live with new
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 1: identity again. Until 1988 when they found him in Nebraska.
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 2: It's kind of, it's terrible, but it's also kind of
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 2: cool to think about. Like back in the day, it's
• 1:32:46
  Speaker 2: way easier to like, you know.
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 1: Hide your new identity.
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like go as far as you can and start anew. Yeah.
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 2: Because right now it just seems impossible with all the CCTV,
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 1: It would be harder in my opinion. Yeah. By the
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 1: time that they questioned him about Beverly Potts' case in 1988,
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: William Henry was terminally ill. He was informed no further
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 1: charges would be brought against him if he confessed to
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 1: Beverly Potts' murder and revealed the location of her body. However,
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 1: he refused.
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 2: He refused? What does that mean?
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 1: He refused to make a statement admitting or denying his
• 1:33:26
  Speaker 1: culpability in the case. so he refused to make a
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 1: statement admitting or denying. Although investigators were unable to prove
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: his whereabouts on the day of Beverly Potts' disappearance, the
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 1: circumstances surrounding her abduction are different to other confirmed and
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 1: suspected victims of William Henry, who simply abandoned his victims'
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: bodies with little or no attempt to concealment. William Henry
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 1: died four years later in 1992, He had an extraordinary
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 1: history of sexual violence against children. He reportedly began offending
• 1:34:04
  Speaker 1: as a teenager. In 35, he assaulted two girls in
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 1: Ohio and subsequently accumulated additional assault-related convictions and arrests. He
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 1: worked as a traveling carnival worker and Ferris wheel operator.
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 1: This is so bad because for his sinister... desires his
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 1: employment was like like suited him well you know yeah
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 1: and uh he was yeah so it's like.
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 2: A diabetic working in a in a bake shop.
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 1: So for me i do think that there is a
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 1: it's it's interesting this guy is definitely uh a psychopath
• 1:34:49
  Speaker 1: killer definitely but i think there's not enough like evidence
• 1:34:56
  Speaker 1: connecting there's nothing and.
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 2: I actually would agree that like if only beverly was
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 2: found in a way in such a way that the
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 2: others were i would be more confident to say that
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 2: it probably is this guy but it's we never found beverly.
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 1: We never never did and i would say this is
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 1: uh yeah so we have i think one of the
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 1: last things that we should also circle back really quickly here.
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 1: Remember I talked about how an attorney called about his
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: client's brother? Remember that?
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 1: So this is an unnamed individual, first became known to
• 1:35:38
  Speaker 1: investigators as a suspect in 74 when a letter was
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: sent to a Cleveland lawyer by a client who named
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 1: his own brother as the individual. Like, Oh, so it
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 1: was a client of a... So it was basically not
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 1: the lawyer informing police, but it was a client informing
• 1:36:02
  Speaker 1: his lawyer about his brother, if that makes any sense.
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 1: According to the author, his brother had an extensive history
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 1: of assaulting female children and had fled Cleveland in 66
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 1: after being indicted for abducting two young girls. but had
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 1: recently returned to Maple Heights. Maple Heights is a neighborhood
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 1: within Cleveland. It's on the other side of Cleveland. It's
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 1: quite further away from Halloran Park. Apparently, this suspect had
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 1: also recently confessed to his... Sorry, so this brother had
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 1: confessed to his sibling to having kidnapped and murdered a
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 1: young girl close to Halloran Park in the early 50s.
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 1: An investigation into the suspect's background revealed numerous arrests for
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 1: child assault, including time served in the Ohio penitentiary for
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 1: the sexual abuse of a young girl in 1951. On
• 1:37:06
  Speaker 1: the same year, he was arrested approximately three weeks after
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 1: his brother had sent the letter to authorities. and freely
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 1: admitted to having resided close to Halloran Park. So he
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 1: wasn't hiding. He said, okay, yeah, I was living in
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 1: Halloran Park in the 50s. And he would frequently prowl
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 1: the district in search of underage girls to assault. Halloran
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 1: Park is like the worst place for a child in
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 1: the 50s. It was like, It was the worst place
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 1: in America for a child in the 50s from the
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 1: looks of it. One of the detectives to question this
• 1:37:46
  Speaker 1: individual was Robert Shanklin. Isn't this the same guy from
• 1:37:51
  Speaker 1: the other? Oh, yeah.
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 2: Oh, no, no.
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 1: Robert Shanklin. Sorry. This is the same. Yeah, this is
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 1: the same guy. He would later recollect the suspect had
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 1: divulged the details of the crime only. someone who had
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 1: been there could have known. So basically, this guy who
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 1: was talking to detectives, apparently he said stuff that was
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 1: not public information about Beverly Potts' case, and the records
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 1: of the vehicle he had owned in 51 matched eyewitness
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 1: descriptions of one of the cars sighted in the vicinity
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 1: of Halloran Park at the estimated time of Beverly Potts' disappearance. However,
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 1: investigators were unable to find sufficient evidence to charge this individual.
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 1: Beyond his age being in his 50s by 1980, no
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 1: further details of this individual's actual identity are known. So
• 1:38:41
  Speaker 1: if he was in his 50s in 1980, he would
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 1: have been in his 20s. This is a young creep,
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 1: just like William Slates, right?
• 1:38:51
  Speaker 2: But younger. Wasn't William like 25?
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, William Slates. They could have been the same age, actually.
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 2: No, I believe William was 25 and his girlfriend was 17.
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 1: So to me, it really comes down... Yeah, you're right.
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 1: So to me, it really comes down to the way
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 1: I see it. And I could be wrong here, but
• 1:39:10
  Speaker 1: just my immediate impression is that William Slates is very
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 1: interesting for me.
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 2: Same.
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 1: Because William Slates... And he's.
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 2: Just right around the corner. And the time when he
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 2: just fled is just very suspicious. Why specifically?
• 1:39:30
  Speaker 1: And this other guy. This other guy may be even
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 1: more interesting. The guy from Maple Heights. The guy whose
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 1: brother wrote to a lawyer. So the brother must have
• 1:39:44
  Speaker 1: suspected something. Why else would he write to the lawyer, right?
• 1:39:47
  Speaker 1: And this guy, when they investigated, he had apparently an
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 1: assault case in the 50s. Wait, look, this guy is... Look,
• 1:40:00
  Speaker 1: this is what we have on the guy one more time. Okay.
• 1:40:05
  Speaker 1: He had been serving in Ohio Penitentiary for SA of
• 1:40:11
  Speaker 1: a young girl in 1951. So what? This is crazy.
• 1:40:15
  Speaker 1: This is crazy. And he was arrested approximately three weeks
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 1: after his brother, blah, blah, blah. He said he was
• 1:40:23
  Speaker 1: living in and around Hell Run Park. And he knew
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: information that was not publicly available. And his car matched
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 1: the car scene at the thing. Man, if I had
• 1:40:42
  Speaker 1: to say something, I would have to say that this.
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 1: Mysterious Maple Heights guy is more my number one suspect.
• 1:40:56
  Speaker 1: Because he literally served for SA on the same year,
• 1:41:01
  Speaker 1: lived in and around that area, drove a car similar
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 1: to the one seen during the disappearance of Beverly Potts
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 1: and admitted to be a prowler. Yeah. This is my guy. Mm-hmm.
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 1: And I think even detectives were like, this is it.
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 2: True, that's true. I agree with you.
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 1: I mean, everyone's weird in this case.
• 1:41:23
  Speaker 2: Definitely, but I agree this last one is sounding very suspicious.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 1: So at this point, I kind of ran out of things.
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 2: Or it could be someone completely different. Someone who was
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 2: never identified just got away with it. It's so unfortunate
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 2: that Beverly was maybe out there or maybe buried in
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 2: someone's backyard.
• 1:41:45
  Speaker 1: So, to me, it seems that there's so much information
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 1: in this game.
• 1:41:49
  Speaker 2: Oh, so many, actually. I was trying to read about this, these, like,
• 1:41:53
  Speaker 2: potential culprits. And I'm not going to lie. I kind
• 1:41:57
  Speaker 2: of lost... I kind of got lost in it. And
• 1:42:02
  Speaker 2: I was like, okay, maybe Yudas knows way more. Everything's
• 1:42:06
  Speaker 2: very confusing and, like, too many details.
• 1:42:09
  Speaker 1: I agree. There's so much different names here.
• 1:42:13
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 1: I think that's what I would be leaning towards, that
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 1: this Melloran Heights guy is the most interesting for me.
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 2: Same here.
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 1: I think William Slate also, with him leaving and boarding
• 1:42:26
  Speaker 1: up his house and not having an explanation why he
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 1: did it. And then I tried to Google him and
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 1: I couldn't find anything about him. So I don't know
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 1: what to make of it in general.
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 2: He's probably dead by now, right?
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 1: In general, yeah, he probably is dead, I would say.
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 2: Being 25 at the 90s.
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 1: He could be a very old man. I would also
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 1: say that to me it looks like, at least my
• 1:42:53
  Speaker 1: first impression, is that Halloran Park was a very.
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 2: Terrible place for children.
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 1: A dangerous environment. So I don't know what to make
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 1: of it. I will say thank you very much, the
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 1: one Des, for suggesting this case.
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 2: This was a very interesting case. Unfortunate, but very interesting. Yeah.
• 1:43:12
  Speaker 1: What do you think about the whole case? What would
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 1: you lean towards?
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 2: I'm leaning towards the last guy, same as you. And
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 2: I'm also leaning towards someone who was completely unidentified. Mainly
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 2: because that event was kind of famous and the fact
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 2: that it's mostly centered around children, I have a feeling
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 2: that it attracted so many disgusting individuals.
• 1:43:41
  Speaker 1: I would like to ask our listeners to chime in
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 1: here a little bit. What do you think? Maybe there's
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 1: something we missed. I also think there's probably enough to
• 1:43:52
  Speaker 1: investigate something more specific, again, regarding Beverly's case. So I'm
• 1:43:57
  Speaker 1: not saying that we should never return.
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 2: Or maybe we could try to find a case similar
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 2: to Beverly's within the area, if there's anything.
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 1: So it was that case where the young girl was...
• 1:44:10
  Speaker 1: abducted but returned 18 hours later um who is that
• 1:44:16
  Speaker 1: guy what happened there i know that the woman now
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 1: you know who grew up she actually died last year
• 1:44:23
  Speaker 1: so i'm not sure how much uh she provided on
• 1:44:26
  Speaker 1: on her background i'm not sure how much she wouldn't
• 1:44:29
  Speaker 1: know she was five yeah how much she would even
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 1: remember she probably doesn't remember anything i.
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 2: Also feel so bad for patricia You know, Beverly's friend.
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 2: She was the last person with her. And she was
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 2: so young. I wonder if she carried the guilt growing up.
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 2: She definitely did.
• 1:44:47
  Speaker 1: That's a good point.
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: Terrible.
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 1: It definitely must have affected her. But I think let's
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 1: wrap the podcast up. I would say thank you guys
• 1:44:57
  Speaker 1: for listening to the podcast. Thank you for tuning in.
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 1: Please leave your thoughts and suggestions for the podcast and
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 1: how we can improve things. And we will talk to
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 1: you on the next one, guys.
• 1:45:07
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much for listening. Please be safe out there.
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 2: And we'll see you very soon.
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 1: Bye, guys.
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Bye.