Latest / Theatre Life with Ben Kercheval / Molly Fonseca: Making Theatre for Austin’s Marginalized Voices

Transcript

Molly Fonseca: Making Theatre for Austin’s Marginalized Voices · Theatre Life with Ben Kercheval

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: There it's it's part of a long trajectory of small plays done on the cheap in the pony shed.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a long history of a lot of people that are like immediately connected when someone says, I did a show at the pony shed.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I too did a show at the pony shed.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: There's a shared trauma about the pony shed.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_02: There's a shared, yes, yes.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: But it's it's such a tender, beautiful little spot.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, like that whole outdoor area at the Vortex is so special and so loved and curated and magical.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_02: So magical.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I think it's a bright of passage for a lot of small producers in town that you have to do a show at the pony shed.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_01: Hi everybody, and welcome back to Theater Life, a podcast for theater people, by theater people.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Ben Kircheville, and my guest today is an actor, director, producer, playwright, instructor, and co-artistic director of Broad Theater, an Austin-based company producing shows by and for marginalized communities.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Together with Broad Theaters co-founder, Annika Leckvin, her creative ventures such as I'm Still Leaving and A Woman Manages Her Anxiety have been featured among Frontera Fest Best of Fest winners on two separate occasions.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: Her recent directorial credits include Falling Down, the Mountain of Great Storms, and A Doctor's Visit.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: And she's director for the upcoming production of Steel Magnolias at Penfold Theater, running February 5th through March 7th, 2027.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: Please welcome to the Theatre Live Podcast, my Molly Fonseca.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, Molly.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, Ben.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: That sounds so impressive when you say it all like that.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: That's because I have it all written down to make sure that I don't forget anything.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: I that's been sort of a reoccurring thing throughout the episodes.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: Is anyone who I have on, they're like, wow, that introduction was so impressive.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, well, all I'm doing is reading your credits.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: So no, thank you.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love it.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: Good job on that.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we do not have uh your better half of broad theater on with us today.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Annika is in San Diego at uh I was struggling with this before we were talked about this, but UCSD, uh, University of California, San Diego.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: Is it for a playwriting master's that she's going for?
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_02: She got her MA in theater pedagogy and dramaturgy about a year ago from University of Houston and said that's not enough.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: And now she's getting her MFA in playwriting at UCSD.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, and that's a good program, from what I understand.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_02: One of the top theater programs in the world.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: So um very proud of her.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: Go, Annika.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: She's here in spirit with us, even if she's not uh here on the podcast.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I want to start with that because uh, like I said, she's the other half of broad theater.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_01: You two met in 2019 uh during a run of the production of junk.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: So I I just want you to take me back to that starting point.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh what was the concept of launching broad theater?
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: But then also you never know who you're gonna come across uh in your theatrical travels, I guess, so to speak.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: So when you come across someone who just you feel like you're on that same creative wavelength, how do you kind of know when all those pieces are starting to connect and you go, that's the person I want to start this venture with?
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so I don't know.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: My my career's had a couple of different phases in the theater world.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I got my MFA in acting uh and moved to Austin um with an ex to start a theater company in 2009.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: And starting a theater company has always been my dream.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that didn't work out for a lot of different reasons, most of them being being 25 or 26 and you know, making all those dumb mistakes.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_02: But um after that failure, I'll use that word uh very intentionally.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sure.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, hey, look, we everyone fails, right?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: Failure is just the launching point.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and uh I just kind of stopped doing theater a lot.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I had been really thought that would be my thing and um didn't quite know how to handle that failure.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: Didn't know, you know, I hadn't lived in Austin for very long and um kind of felt like I maybe didn't fit in and maybe wasn't meant for it.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: And so I stepped back in a major way and started working in nonprofits, um, trying to get my student loans forgiven as part of the public service loan forgiveness program.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so I started doing a lot of nonprofit administrative work.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, depression's a real thing when you're not living in your full truth, and uh did like a show a year to try to keep that monster at bay, which is what I used to like actually say and believe, which is like, how do I shut up this voice inside of me that wants to do more theater?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, one play a year, that'll make it be quiet.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: And uh I met Annika working on one of those plays.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I worked for Street Corner Arts pretty often at that time, and um yeah, we were both actors then, and um I had started seeing a therapist.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I had just gone through like an awful friend breakup.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'd lost like my core community of friends like overnight because I decided to quit drinking, and that kind of caused some complications in that friend group.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: And um I said to my therapist, like, what what what do I do to start rebuilding these people in my life?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, do something that brings the people you want in your life to you.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, I only know how to make a play, and she said, do that.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: So um when I started working on that production, Annika, you know, she's about 10, 11 years younger than me, and um she she was signing all of her emails, signing off with her um degree from UT, which is a woman and gender studies degree, and I have a women's studies minor, and I just kind of liked that she was like putting it out there in a way I never would have put it out there.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: And we, you know, one night there was like 12 dudes working on this play, and it was like me and her and maybe one other woman, and we would sit backstage and just kind of talk about just how frustrated we were with roles for us, and like we're not too unique looking people, we're not people, you know.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_02: I I we both present as white women, so like why are we so unhappy with the roles?
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: And like in that particular play, you know, I was like breastfeeding on stage and being the wife, and like she was a secretary in a short skirt, and we were like, there's gotta be something more than this, and so um I just asked her to work on a play with me as like a summer project, something that we could do for fun.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: She wanted to learn about producing plays.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: I had produced like two plays with my old theater company, and you know, I told her we needed a fake theater company name uh in order to look more legit.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_02: She suggested broad theater.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then by the end of that play, you know, that summer, we were like, this is something, and I think we could keep doing this if we wanted to keep doing this.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: And so we just kind of like slowly started building that and building our friendship, which I think is also like really core to broad theater, is that like you know, we're not faking that we're super close friends, and yeah, that that's first for us.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_02: Our friendship is always first, and um, you know, like building that collaboration with someone, building skills with someone, you know, like when we met, we both were like, I am an actor, that is what I do.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: And over time, you know, she's become a playwright, I've become a director, we've become producers, you know, it's like whatever we needed to become for the theater company to work, we have become those things because we had a really safe place and a really safe person to try and build something with.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: So we really took that time.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: And the pandemic, of course, kind of affected things too, but it didn't stop us and it didn't stop our friendship, which I think is still key.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I would imagine that the idea of wearing a lot of hats that you're not used to wearing is a lot easier, or maybe not easier, but certainly the the courage to to go out and do that is a lot greater when you have someone on the other end of it who is like, I also am not totally sure what I'm doing, and we're we're just trying to figure this out together.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: That's and people would be really surprised that a lot of getting art off of the ground is just doing it.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_02: I know, I know.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: And like I think, you know, when people meet us now, I always kind of laugh because I'm like, they probably think we're very similar.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's not that we're not very similar, it's just that we have very separate strengths and and challenges, right?
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and so I think like in any relationship, you know, you need someone who can do things that you can't do.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: You need someone who is willing to challenge you and say, like, I don't think you're right, and I'm gonna fight you on it.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: And at the end of the day, you know, we have Annika and I have really developed a lot of communication skills around how do we disagree, how do we find our way back to each other?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_02: Because again, friendship first and and like how do we support each other when we don't always see eye to eye, you know, and and have really, I feel like let that become a part of of how we work together so that when conflict happens, and of course it's gonna happen, you know, we're prepared and we know, like, okay, we know how to talk about it, we know how to say, I still love you, even if I don't agree with you, you know, and it's really been a huge help when things get really hard.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, in talking to collaborators on this show, the power of no is more important, I think, than people realize.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like if you if you surround yourself with yes all the time, I don't think it's gonna the quality of what you're putting out is it not even just the the show or the art that you're doing, just the processes of how to get there are are gonna be all kinds of maligned and stuff.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_02: And then again, knowing how to receive that no and and knowing how to like keep moving on even after this conflict, this like headbutting has happened, you know, you can't carry that resentment.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_02: If you're working on you know a three-month project where you're in constant communication, like you have to let that shit go and you have to learn how to like keep moving forward even after it's happened.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: What was the name of your first theater company?
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_02: Uh it was called Sustainable Theater Project, and it went on to have a very uh successful life in Austin, and my ex um was very successful and has gone on to work on Broadway and things, and so and I think that played a part in kind of like my major step back because again, like I was ashamed and I felt like this other person was so much bigger than me and had was so much more charismatic, and and all of these things, all these stories that I built inside my head, and and and I think like a lot of what I really care about and really focus on at broad theater is how do we find people who maybe don't have all of the opportunities handed to them in our community?
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: How do we find actors who maybe are coming back to the stage?
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: Even when I'm working for like the palace or other theater companies, I'm always more interested in someone who's being really brave and walking into an audition, not someone who comes all the time, not someone who gets hired all the time.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what is your story?
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: What is it about this play that brought you out?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you've had a family, you've had a baby, and this is your first time coming back to an audition since college.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like connecting with people and hearing about why they're here.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that, you know, that time away doesn't mean that they have less skills.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't mean that they're less deserving, it doesn't mean that they want it less.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_02: It just means they had additional barriers to them getting work, and I want to help them break down some of those barriers, and that's really important to me with broad theater.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good point.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: There are a lot of people, and and I include myself in that.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: I took almost 20 years off away from it.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: My source of that was I just got to college and I was like, oh, I'm just not good enough.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just not I'm not talented enough.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: And some of that might have been a little bit true.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um you get to a bigger pond, you know, there are people who are they have all three skills, right?
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_01: They can sing, they can dance, they can act.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: I was not one of those people.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um also I don't know, I like you know, 18, 19, 20 years old, and I and I don't know when you backed off of it.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: I would probably guess maybe in your you know twenties or whatever, but like just who you are at that age and maybe like what you're castable for and what you can it just it's just your life experiences, how that translates into what you bring to characters later on.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's different when you come back to it and you've lived a little bit and you feel like you have something to offer, and also you might be more okay with who you are, more okay with the the parts of you that are good, more okay with your limitations, and and all of that comes through when when you're building your characters and you're and you're acting on stage.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um if you're okay with it, I I want to talk a little bit more about that decision on your end to kind of step back.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: I I think it's really interesting.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um that whole idea of depression's real.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: I felt it.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: I I know exactly what that feels like.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the things that I mean we called them failures?
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the failures that you look back on now that you go now that I'm doing this again?
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: I I learned so much from these things that at the time I thought were maybe too much to overcome.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, great, great question.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, people is huge.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: Finding finding your community and knowing that like the people that you're working with have your back and you have theirs, and that's a real real safe place to be and being honest with what you need.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you know, this time like today is like really wild to me because like again in 2009 or 2010, about when I stepped back from acting, um, and even though I was still like doing a show a year or like teaching a class a year, you know, I was always kind of ashamed to call myself an actor.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: And then when even when Annika and I started working together, I quickly became the director, right?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: And then I've been pretty much directing ever since then.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_02: And it's wild to me that I'm sitting in Denver, Colorado on an acting contract.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I'm looking at my calendar for 2027 and I'm acting in three more shows.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_02: And it's I haven't like processed that yet.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't like, you know, because it's so vulnerable, it's so scary.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like the play that I'm doing out here in Denver is always a boy, and we did it at ground floor theaters.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_02: So even this experience has been so amazing to come back at it and say, like, okay, two years ago, I don't know, I was going through some stuff when we did this.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_02: It was almost three years ago.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and I wanted another shot at this.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: I wanted to try it again.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: I wanted to like take what I've learned, directing new plays specifically, and be able to apply it to this experience.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_02: And it's been so scary.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: I I it's just, it's I forgot how hard it is.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: I I forgot how hard it is to like be on stage every night.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like, again, depression's real.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: I just found out that my job that pays my bills, they're ending my contract a few days ago.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: So it was like, I'm super depressed.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm super like anxious to get back to Austin because there's just like a lot of variables.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like, and then going on stage and being like, oh God, okay, here's I gotta like just let that shit go and I gotta stay focused on it, you know.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: But again, that safe people and being honest with where you're at with people is so important, and I didn't I didn't know that I could advocate for myself.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't, you know, in 2010, even when like when I was studying theater, you know, we didn't have intimacy coordinators.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: I have a lot of baggage around being touched, um, and a time when a actor spit in my mouth on stage um during a kiss and Jesus, what?
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like just wild shit like that.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that like maybe when I was 25, I was like starting to feel these feelings of like, I don't know if this is right.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I would talk to the director, and you know, a few times I was encouraged to just not affect someone else's performance by having my own feelings.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um and I can see how all of that played into my feelings about acting.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_02: I can see how all of that made me feel like it was an unsafe place, not just in how I was being touched, but also how I was being talked to, how I was being treated, how um I was being looked at, you know, what parts I was going for, you know, like a big thing that in that like 10 plus years where I stepped back from acting, I had said to my a big reason why I stopped auditioning so much.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, certainly was because I had this larger-than-life person in our community that just made me feel so unimportant and so small, but also because like I started saying to myself, I'm not gonna audition for wimp for roles where I play the prostitute with a heart of gold who gets shot and killed.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna get assaulted on stage.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna play the mom who screams her fucking head off and who everyone looks at and everyone hates, and no one for a second considers what's going on in that person's and that character's real life.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: How much of that is also a just a traditional player musical, right?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like how much of that is just written into, baked into the fabric.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: You you can't play, you can't be in glass of menagerie and play Amanda when you say I'm not gonna play a screaming mom.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's the quintessential script.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_02: You can't be in Tennessee Williams, you can't be in uh Arthur Miller, you know, like that just takes those all off the plate.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's what I did.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then I started saying, not only am I gonna have these kind of requirements for the role with a theater company, I want to walk into a room and have another female person who is any role but the costume designer.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so then when I added that extra qualification on top of it, my roles and opportunities shrunk so much more, even.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so then I kind of found Street Corner Arts who had who did plays where there were interesting parts and complicated parts for women, and they had they hired other directors and other designers that were women, and so I felt really comfortable in that space.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, that's again that plays a huge role into broad theater and what we do and and how we work.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_02: Create the exact space that I wanted when I was an actor, and to like again make sure that people walking into the room feel safe.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: That's so huge.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's so huge to me.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and building out a team too that res you know resembles and and takes on those ideals too.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: How did you end up doing that?
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's obviously you and Annika are co-founders, but then you have you know, uh whatever, five, six other people, something like that.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you can't throw it.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: There's there's a handful of other people who are involved as well.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, our board members and our company members are kind of similar.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we're trying to figure out like Brad Theater is still like in its infancy, so we're still trying to figure out how all of that works together.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but yeah, there are people who've come out and wanted to work with us.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_02: And again, like when we were very, very small and doing just Frontera Fest pieces, you know, you would put out an audition notice, even if you were paying people and only get three people responding, you know.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: Then we're using word of mouth and people that you've worked with in the past that you thought were aligned and that you would like to work with again.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_02: The old adage, which I still believe talent gets you hired once, your personality gets you invited back.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: Because Annika had been acting a lot more and a lot more often with a lot more theater companies.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_02: She'd work for Hyde Park Theaters, she'd work for Bottle Alley, um, Street Corners.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: So she had a lot more like recent contacts and people that she liked and wanted to continue working with.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so then we just kind of started building off those relationships, and like we were really lucky that like everyone that we met and worked with early on wanted to continue working with us, and um we were all like really aligned.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: And so now it's like Mars and Ariane who've been with us from the beginning, um, and then um adding Alicia and Mia and Shelby and these other folks who really stepped up.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I'm always kind of like looking for people who want to learn more, want to do more.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: You know, if you want to act, that's cool, and I'm I can definitely make an opportunity for you.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: But like, are you interested in other things too?
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like, do you want to know how the how the batter gets made or how the cake gets baked, you know?
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: And um, then like let's talk.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you're interested in doing more, then I yeah, like let's see what else you.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Want to learn and see where we can fit that into what's going on because to me it's about how can we keep our artists here in Austin?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_02: I think Austin has a huge artist problem, honestly.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um in what way people leave, people come to Austin to train, they use it as a practice ground, or they're like hobbyists and they want to create something cool and that's awesome.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_02: I also want to create cool things, but I want to make Austin on the map in the national theater scene.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_02: We don't have a Lort, you know.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: When people talk about Texas, they talk about Houston and the alley and they talk about Dallas, but like I want to be part of the national conversation.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: So how do we keep artists here?
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_02: How and you know, and Annika's an example, she's in San Diego getting her MFA.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: So we lose people to programs, they've moved to New York, they don't want to come back.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: I get it.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know, so I want to create opportunities that keep people paid, trained, and working and staying in Austin.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: What's the curation process like then for getting scripts for broad theater productions?
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's sometimes I know it's like Annika will write it, or maybe you will write it, but then you also get local playwrights or you know, semi-local as well.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: So what what's the process then for getting the types of stories that you go?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: This represents what broad theater is trying to do.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone wants to know that.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: So far, we've been really lucky in that all the scripts have come from recommendations internally.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: And not only that, as the theater company's kind of grown and we've been learning, it wasn't always our intention to do new plays and new play development.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: We had kind of thought we would maybe just do one new play a year and then like have, you know, the hot new play that everyone's doing regionally that we would also want to produce, you know.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: And um the reason why we did a doctor's visit, um, Annika's second play that we produced was because we had The Rights to Gloria by Brendan Jacob Jenkins, and um I was slated to direct it.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_02: And um I looked at Annika and I said, This play is hard, it's uh pretty unfun.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um and she was like, Oh, it'll be fine, the actors will have fun.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, No, I'm talking about me.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I want to have fun, I need to be involved in this process and this play about, you know, a murder suicide.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: And and I was just like, I just can't, I just can't do it.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_02: The world's too ugly, the world's too hard, and and so we kind of shifted gears quickly and were like, let's just do a doctor's visit because it's written and and you know, I liked it, and we I'd been part of the development process for it prior to when it was with GFT rights, and so we just ended up tossing it in there because we needed a title real fast.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: Um, which was great.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like it was also I definitely had fun and all the things that I wanted out of it, got it.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but other than that, you know, I mean MS is a remount, um, not a remount, it's a retelling of that story um that I've written and performing.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um and Austin has so many playwrights.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_02: Austin, we've so many, I mean, like I feel like a part of it is is UT and the MFA writing program, but again, people come here to train and learn and try new things out.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I feel like we just have so many wonderful playwrights.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: So scripts have come as recommendations to us from the community.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we still get sent scripts often.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you know, as we're still kind of growing, I'm I've been tasked with trying to figure out what that will look like for 2028, as far as like I would like to do more of a call and kind of vet scripts and all of that um in kind of a larger way for 2028.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: So um TBD on that.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I do want to dive into MS a little bit.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: I I know that you wrote it after your diagnosis.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: I would imagine it's gone through some iterations.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Annika ended up acting in it, was it seven years ago or or you know, whenever it was.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_01: And now you're you're kind of revisiting it again with MS again.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: So w what's been the timeline of the iterations of this and just getting back to the beginning of it, like I'm guessing this is a way for you to compartmentalize and figure out, you know, how you're how you're dealing with this in a just in an outlet that you know how to do.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, well, I was diagnosed with MS when I uh uh in 2003, I was 20.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_02: Wrote like a 25, 30 minute version in grad school in 2006.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um we took like a I didn't have very good graduate experience.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: I got two things out of it, a one-person play performance class and a love of teaching, which I kind of built my career on, those two things.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_02: So I guess I got out what I needed.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_02: But um, we took a a one-person play class, and I just I loved it.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: It was, I'm sorry, my kitty cat's gonna join us.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was gonna say if you need to let your cat in, you can totally let your cat in.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'd rather have the cat than them.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: There it is.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but so yeah, and when I moved to Austin, um, that's the first thing I I did here was the MS at uh Frontera Fest and got Fest of Fest and all of that fun thing.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: So um yeah, and really felt like it was a way to kind of do some healing on parts of that story that I hadn't quite healed and had never really felt that it was finished though.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: That was always a feeling that I had with it.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so in 2019, when Annika and I first collaborated, it was like, here's a small script that we can rewrite together, um, make it kind of work for another voice, because it's it's me and it, I say my name, I say also things about me, you know.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_02: So we kind of took it in 2019 and like broadened it in a way for her to be able to perform, and I directed it.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_02: And um that was awesome, and we met a lot of people from the MS community, a lot of folks came out, uh, you know, we learned about accessibility and spaces and all of that, working on that production.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then it kind of went away from me for a while, but then I my my personal multiple scrolls journey has been a little bit different than what's in the play, and that like I was on medication for I was on a daily shot uh in the fat every day for about five years, maybe.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um I got off of it when I moved to Texas and um lost my health insurance when I turned 26.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: Uh was no longer on my parents' insurance.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_02: So um I was really lucky in that I didn't have any relapses in about 20 years, any known relapses, right?
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um multiple scrolls is a little tricky because sometimes you can have a relapse in a dark part of your brain where there's no outward uh visible signs of it, and sometimes even signs of it can be hidden, which is in the play.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: Like I kind of lied about some stuff that I knew was going on because I didn't want to go back to the doctor.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but then I don't know, about three years ago I had a relapse that someone noticed, and I had to get a neurologist again.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: And that experience of coming back to my diagnosis uh as a 40-year-old um has been really hard.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_02: I kind of thought like, I've done this play, I've like checked it off my list, I've like dealt with the grief of this whole thing, you know, but now it's um so much has changed in medicine too.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like there was a moment when the doctor, like, there's all these like physical tests that you have to go through because a lot of it's like your physical body's response, and you know, are your side equal sides of like your muscles and stuff?
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: Are they um the same?
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_02: So you get like a lot, you get touched a lot in your physical exam.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_02: And so this moment where the doctor put her hands on me and I'm supposed to like pull or push down on her, like respond to her, and like I just hadn't done that movement in my body in 20 years, and it was like she touched me and I gasped and just burst into tears, you know, and I was just like, wow, I feel like I'm 20 years old again.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_02: I feel every bit of anger and resentment towards this process.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_02: I hate the doctors, I hate the nurses, I hate me, I hate my parent, you know, like everything.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it all just triggers, it all comes out.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I just I was so taken aback by that.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_02: And not only that, like again, like the MRI machines are so much stronger than they were 20 years ago.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to do um a lumbar puncture, there's a blood test now, and it was just this whole like change, this whole different experience.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so I found myself like again late at night, plunking it back at the script, you know, waking up at two in the morning and being like, I think that there's something here about time, I think there's something in here about growing up more than there was before.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_02: And so um I just ended up rewriting it and rewriting it and rewriting it in the past like year.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_02: I've probably finished about three drafts of it to get it to a place where I feel good about it now.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_02: And um, and so much of it is about like again taking back my voice, finding myself back on stage again, and like I'm so grateful that Annika was able to like carry this story forward, but now it's time for me to take it back, and it's my story again.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I think a lot of that has to do with this whole growth, this whole story of like being a 25-year-old and all the feelings and the depression and all the things I went through, and coming taking a step back from theater and then finding broad theater.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_02: And now I'm like, I finally feel safe enough to like get back on stage and have this story told out of my mouth and say my name and all of these things, it all is part of the same trajectory, I think.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: On a personal level, there's probably a catharsis to it, but then also just from an effectiveness standpoint, there's just a truth that you're able to tap into that and I'm I have no doubt that Annika did a great job when she did it.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's different, it's different.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's a different and and you kind of redid the story in a different way.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: Just you changed a few couple of the things, it just okay.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: This is the way that Annika can tell it, right?
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: This is how that version is gonna work with her.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's just gonna be different than if it's coming out of your mouth.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: And that's okay.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's just a different, different type of story.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm curious about this.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: This is a little bit of a kind of a lighter note on this, but I know you performed it or Anika performed it at the Vortex in something called the pony shed.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: I've never been there.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: Can you please explain what that is and if it's as awful as it sounds?
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't mean that in like a disrespectful way because any stage is a good stage, but I'm just curious about performing in something called the pony shed in August in Central Texas.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm wondering if that's an insane thing that that she had to do.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_02: There it's it's part of a long trajectory of small plays done on the cheap in the pony shed.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a long history of a lot of people that are like immediately connected when someone says, I did a show at the pony shed.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I too did a show at the pony shed.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_00: There's a shared trauma about the pony shed.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's a shared, yes, yes.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: But it's it's such a tender, beautiful little spot.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, like that whole outdoor area at the vortex is so special and so loved and curated and magical, so magical, you know.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so the pony shed has like it's just it's got a lot of allure, it's got a lot of character.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_02: There's like whole windows on one side of it, it's adorable.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: It can seat about 20 people, maybe.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: If that's it out, is it outdoors or indoors?
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_01: Or is it that like that?
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, there's no AC, there's nothing.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_02: There's there's nothing.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's you know, you have to provide every single bit of light and sound uh and AC in there.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I don't think we could have done it this summer out there.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um, like, you know, I think the heat might is just too unmanageable.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's too unmanageable for me uh at this point in the you know what's happened with global warming and all of that.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_02: So um, but yeah, it it was really special and you can really make it your own.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: And it's you know, it's a I think it's a bright of passage for a lot of small producers in town that you have to do a show at the pony shed.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know uh how many different offbeat places you've performed or put on theater.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_01: Is there a power ranking or like a a Mount Rushmore of kind of like you said, right of passage places in Austin where it's like you can technically do theater there.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um well, funny you should ask.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I mean, I think the pony shed is is yeah, definitely a rite of passage because you also have to learn a lot to produce in that space because you have nothing.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: So you have to figure out like how to put everything in there, you know.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but there's a lot of places that are gone now, too.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: I think of and a lot of places that had really special bathroom situations that are just no more in Austin, you know.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I even think about like producing at Hyde Park and um the parlor used to be across the street, this like heavy metal pizza bar place that like everyone used to go up and hang out with.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I remember that place.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: So like the loss of those spaces is just really hard.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but the reason why I said that's a good segue is that I'm I can share now.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_02: Uh me.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, do it.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have do you have breaking news that we can have on this podcast?
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh let's do it.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: Uh myself and Roy Lazarets, who um was working with Dirty Gold, and they had a little spot on the east side, um, but they uh decided to stop Dirty Gold earlier this year.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_02: But um Roy and I signed a lease on a space on the east side and we're calling it Tape Machine.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_02: And it's we're getting it up and running.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_02: We hope we're having a couple of small events there in November, and a couple of things are happening in December there as well.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_02: And then we are hoping to have it up and running as like a really nice smaller option for independent artists for small companies, not just theater.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_02: You know, um, Roy has a really awesome background in programming with comedy and improv in town as well.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_02: And so he's got, you know, some stand-up comedians, some improv shows that are gonna be coming in, but it's really gonna be a place where people can try anything.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we were we're gonna have a couple of different cost structures, so how people can pay for it, allowing people to pay for it out of ticket sales and bar sales, as opposed to like having to pay upfront for your rental, which for broad theater has is a huge barrier for us.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um so yeah, I'm really excited to like be again, like find something that was is a pain point for me personally and has been a challenge as an independent producer in town, and say, like, okay, I'm in a position now where I can actually do something about this and make it easier for people who want to create art, try art, build their skills, stay in Austin, keep working, keep producing here in town, have a place where they know they can do it on the cheap and where they feel supported and safe.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's what we hope Tape Machine will be for folks.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_01: Is that one of the barriers for keeping people, talented people in Austin, as opposed to going somewhere else, consistent spacing?
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, like it's it's hard.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it's hard because there's so many different yes, there are a lot of there's I'm not gonna say a lot, but there's some theaters in town, there's some theaters that you can rent, but think um, I I struggle with like how do we fill this space?
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_02: So, like, yeah, broad theater could and would love to be able to produce a ground floor theater.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_02: I can't fill a hundred-seat house yet.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: So for me, ground floor theater is is a little further out.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's why we've been producing at Hyde Park because it's a 60 60 seat house.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, we just did a show at the Rosette, um, which we won't do again, but you know, that theater had a modular setup so we could take and put in chairs as we needed.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, so there's just like all these different options.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: But if you're someone who wants to produce something maybe with 20, 25 people, you know, you're kind of looking at a non-traditional space, you're looking at a backyard, you're looking at your house, you're looking at, you know, where do you go for that?
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so that's again like kind of what we're hoping for Tate Machine, but then rehearsal space is just its own other huge mountain.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: And like, you know, for broad theater, we again we prioritize the free spaces that the city allows, and there's like three of them, right?
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_02: But you're capped on hours.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: So then we're kind of like, okay, where do we go?
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_02: But that then we're in the mix with all the other 80 theater companies in town, and where do we go?
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_02: And again, I just I I have a personal ethos where we're not gonna rehearse in people's homes.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_02: To me, that's not a safe option.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like, we might do a read-through, but like it's just like a whole mix of other things that I don't want to get involved with when you start rehearsing in someone's house.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_02: Again, I know that it can be safe.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_02: I just, it's a thing I don't want to have to deal with.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, yeah, I mean there is there's absolutely a a factor of like you need to be able to separate it out a little bit and and have a place that you can go to and work, and it's not it's it's not so much like is it a safe space in terms of are people welcome or comfortable there?
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's just also that's your home.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: You want to be able to separate this have that be your home.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_02: A hundred percent, yeah.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't want my cat crawling on people who don't like it and all of that stuff.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it's just I find the rehearsal, our rehearsal costs for falling down the mountain like ballooned.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: It just it was just out of control.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: So again, it's like how do we allow for people to to make the work that they want to work, but provide them with the resources that they need to make that happen?
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_02: And that's just a huge gap, I find in Austin specifically.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_02: It might be that way in other places too, but I live in Austin, so yeah, care about it.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: I I would imagine there's some crossover for sure.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_01: And and to your point about you know, the size of of the production, and and look, every production, no matter how indie wants to sell a hundred or two hundred tickets a night.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, every single every single one does.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but they're not always built or advertised or you know, whatever the reason is, there it's just it's not always happy.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: Your your house, your house size for what you're doing, if it goes well, you're gonna get 25 people a night.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_01: That's just the way it's gonna go.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_01: And but when you're dealing with bottom lines, which for as much as we love the craft, everything's always gonna come down to a bottom line.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's the reason why rehearsal spaces are tight, it's the reason why theaters are limited, it's just it's a it's a cramming of spaces because everyone has to watch out for well, what's gonna sell a hundred or a hundred and fifty tickets or whatever versus what's gonna sell twenty-five.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but not everything is meant to necessarily be, you know, a hundred or a hundred and fifty tickets or whatever.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_01: So it's uh it's a constant battle.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh congratulations on getting the space.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's amazing.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_01: So are you gonna try to do like a I don't know what a full season for broad theater looks like, but are you gonna try to have something as close to that as possible by 2027, or is that more like a 2028 thing?
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well, in 2027, we're producing two shows.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, our funding is kind of developing right now, is growing.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_02: So right now, you know, it's kind of like we're picking shows that um fit the amount of funding that we can anticipate we'll receive.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um so 2027 is is kind of a I hope it will be a financially um stabilizing year for us so that we can have a better idea of what our budget size will be for each season going forward.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: So um for me, a full season is two shows, just because that's kind of what we can afford to do right now.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: Not and not just financially, like people resources is a huge part of that as well.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, and also losing Annika this year um is a big question mark as far as like I need to hire at least two producers.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm acting in a show, which means I'm not producing or directing, so like I need to be able to hire some producers that can manage more so that I can do what I need to do as an actor.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um so you know, all of that kind of plays into like a full season for us, but yeah, the dream would be able to get to a point where we could do four shows a year.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but right now that seems more like maybe a 2030 goal than 2028.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, goals is goals.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I'm sure you'll get there eventually.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_01: I saw uh uh falling down the mountain of great storms back in, I guess that would have been maybe September or maybe late August.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, late August.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um very good.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um we you and I had talked on the phone a little bit before uh before doing this recording that you know look, theater comes in all shapes and sizes, right?
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's meant to do different things.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um if you want to go see 42nd Street up at Georgetown Palace Theater, it's great.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: 42nd Street's awesome, you know, you'll it'll you'll get what you want out of that.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: But if you want something else, if you want to walk away feeling something a little bit different, falling down the mountain of great storms was a was a great way to do that.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, I I think I thought about it just on the drive home.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: Just like, you know, how did that how did this make me feel?
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: What did I did?
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_01: I get this, did I understand this?
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_01: Did I what do I think about that?
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: I and uh and I like that.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_01: I I like I like theater that that makes you think.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_01: And uh certainly broad theater, you all are are heavily vested in making that happen.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um we'll end on that note I'd like to thank my guest, Molly Fonsesca.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_01: You can find her on Instagram at her name Molly Fonsesca and at Mollyfonsesca.com.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_01: Be sure to visit broad theater.com for all information about their upcoming 2027 season, maybe even how to donate, help them continue to do great work out there.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_01: Be sure to follow all of our socials on Instagram, on Facebook, on X and Blue Sky, and on TikTok at TheaterLife Pod.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to follow Theater Life on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube so that the next conversation finds you and find everything at theaterlifepodcast.com.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: New episodes drop every two weeks.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: So until then, I'm Ben Kirchhoffal.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_01: See you next time.