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How To Teach Your Kids The Bible (Without Overwhelm) · The Family Teams Podcast

• 0:00
  Any kind of rhythmic living, whatever you do as an action, those are all votes into the person you're going to become. And so if you want to be somebody who has a real great grasp of the story of God and allow the word to really shape who you are, each time you put a little deposit in there, it's kind of a vote in favor of becoming that person who is grounded, steeped and marinated. And it spurs me towards seeking God more.
• 0:27
  Hi, welcome to the Family Teams Podcast. Our goal here is to help your family become a multi-generational team on mission by providing you with biblically rooted concepts, tools, and rhythms. Your hosts are Jeremy Pryor and Jefferson Bethke, and we can't wait to chat about all things family.
• 0:45
  Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. I am joined today by Cameron and Michelle Akrami. They're friends of ours that live down in Rancho Cucamonga, California, which is something I've been spending about a year trying to learn how to say. So I think I got it. Did I say that right? Yes. Hey, you got a bit of an accent when you do, but the words are all there. Yeah.
• 1:06
  Oh man, my Seattle accent is quickly devolving into a Midwestern. I've been here for too long, but okay. So what we're going to talk about today, guys, is so important. I'm so excited that Crommies are here. We're going to talk about how to get the Bible into your family's life. How do you get this into your DNA as a family? What are the rhythms?
• 1:29
  What are the tactics? So we're going to spend the entire month of August in the Family Teams Accelerator talking about this topic. And so if you guys are interested, please go to familyteams.com, check out the Accelerator. We're also going to be giving you guys like a free download from the conversation that I'm having with Ikramis today. So that's going to be at familyteams.com slash Bible. If you go to familyteams.com slash Bible, you can get this. There are tips for how to get this into your family. So there's like the five biggest tips.
• 1:55
  We're going to be looking at some of these things, but in the accelerator, the Akramis have written this amazing playbook that walks you guys through the three major plays that have really impacted their family in terms of how the Bible has gotten more and more into their kind of culture as a family. So this is a question we get all the time. So I'm super pumped to talk to the Akramis about how this has worked for them. So I would love to start, Michelle, why don't you introduce your family?
• 2:20
  Tell us a little bit about y'all, who's on your team, and then we'll start to really dive into how the Bible has impacted you guys. Sure. Well, Kim and I have been married now for 20 years, and we have five children. Oldest is 15, and the youngest is nine. We have homeschooled from the beginning, that's been part of our story, and so we've
• 2:48
  Yeah, we first heard of Family Teams in 2019 when our oldest was nine. So it came at a really good time. And we're just really thankful for all the things that we've been learning and growing in from a lot of you guys. Awesome.
• 3:04
  Well, and yeah, so Cameron and Michelle, we've gotten to know them, and they went to Israel with us. Cameron's been a part of Integrated. April's a part of a discipleship season with Michelle right now. There's been a lot of awesome overlap between our families, and it's been a huge blessing. So I'm excited to kind of dive into this. Also, Cameron and Michelle are the...
• 3:29
  the community coaches for the month of August. So if you guys are in the accelerator, they're going to do a Zoom call the second week of August to talk to you guys about whatever things are, questions you guys have about how to get this into your family. But Cameron, I'd love for you to start and kind of walk me through the story for, you know, as you think about how...
• 3:50
  how the Akramis have approached getting the Bible into your family's culture. I'll start with you. I'd love to hear Michelle's take as well. But give me kind of the backstory for how this developed and evolved for you guys. Yeah, well, we know as Christians and being in church culture that you've got to read your Bible because that's really important. But over the last few years especially, we've gotten really...
• 4:18
  enlivened as we learn more about the history of the Bible and what it is and what it isn't, you know, what it means to read it fully and in context and all of those things, the fact that there is historical context, all of those things have helped us to think, okay, well, this reflects a reality. And the reality that it reflects is really, really important. So as much as a reality that the Bible describes,
• 4:41
  lays out and describes is really important for us to take in and kind of form our lives around. And so, a lot of it has been, some of the challenge has been, it's been kind of a largely personal thing where we've read the Bible on our own and that's been good because we've been on different reading plans over the years. But one of the things that's really been valuable for us has been to engage our kids and family around
• 5:11
  being able to understand as they've gotten a little bit older, you know, when they're three, it's a little different, but when they're 14, 15, you're thinking, okay, I really want you to get this. And so, yeah, so it shifted in that sense to be able to engage with them and have them, you know, really learn and ingest and digest all of the things that we're learning and have them wrestle with the realities, not just learn just the words, but the meaning behind those words and to really wrestle with what it is.
• 5:41
  Awesome. Yeah. And Michelle, how about you? How's this process evolved for you and your role?
• 5:47
  Yeah. Well, as the mom and, you know, as we've been homeschooling, I, you know, ever since our kids were young, I just took that role on, you know, because, you know, often Cameron would be at the office early anyway. And so, I was like, okay, let's do Bible as part of our homeschool day. And so, we did that for a good eight years. And we just kind of together a couple years ago
• 6:17
  do this Bible time with the kids and you and, you know, lead this. And so, I definitely, I was excited and also I had to relinquish that, you know? Like, okay, this is kind of what we've always done. This is how we've always done it. But it's been really neat to see. I really feel that pastoral role as a father, like, it's the anchor almost that time, you know? Like, yeah.
• 6:44
  It's just been such a blessing to have Cameron leading that and the kids to see him, you know, say, yeah, I don't know the answer. Let's dig in together and or, you know, just take wherever their questions are taking them. And, you know, we both...
• 7:04
  give our two cents worth, but it's been such a blessing to see Cameron flourish in this role. I can just see it in him, you know, that...
• 7:15
  Yeah, it's just been really neat. But I definitely had to very consciously take a step back. And I know for sometimes for us moms, that can be a hard step. And just kind of, you know, hush our own preferences on anything or whatever and support him. And however that was. And for at the beginning, like it was getting breakfast for the kids too. So we could all kind of huddle around that as we, you know, changed into this rhythm.
• 7:45
  Awesome. Yeah. I'm curious, Cameron, what was that like for you? I know as fathers, this is a real challenge. If you have a very competent wife who's doing amazing and she's homeschooling the kids and she's thinking about how to get the Bible, isn't it best just to say, oh, good, that's one less thing I have to worry about. Now I can go do something else. More pickleball for me. Yeah. So how did you think about what
• 8:11
  why did you engage? And, you know, I'm curious what you would say to dads who were listening to that going, what is my role in this sort of getting the Bible into the family? I think in general, it stems from, I think dads, I'm sure any dads listening right now are going to maybe, maybe they get this, maybe they're just kneeling it without thinking, feeling this way. It was easy for me to feel overwhelmed and not really knowing where to start. Because I know that
• 8:38
  Dads are looked at, especially in the church. Probably everybody has heard this idea that you need to be the spiritual leader of your family. And you think, wow, that's great. I feel the guilt just falling over me right now as you say that.
• 8:53
  Well, and that's really overwhelming because to lead somebody, you get the idea when we think of leader in a religious sense, we're thinking of somebody on a stage who went to seminary for a bunch of years and has read all of the books that are out there. And so that's really overwhelming. You go, well, I don't know how to do any of that. How do I even start? And so then we don't. And then we've got a wife who's looking at us with expectant eyes because they see that this is important.
• 9:19
  They almost maybe feel freed to just start doing things where dads go, wait, but I don't actually know how to be the spiritual leader. I got freed up in some ways, and I hope that this is an encouragement to anybody listening to say, listen, if you...
• 9:35
  Whatever you do is a measure of leading in the sense of dads have been given some sort of authority and influence just by virtue of being dads. God has just somehow designed it this way. And whatever steps we take, for me, it ended up being, okay, we're going to read a scripture passage, just a passage, at dinnertime.
• 9:59
  Yeah, that's right. Okay. That is leading your family. Now, you can lead in other ways, maybe more expansive ways, but that's a step of leadership. And so I think approaching that is just kind of setting, being free to say, okay,
• 10:18
  doing some leading is leading. And we can then experiment with other things. So I think maybe there's some like the opacity around this. It's difficult for guys because we really don't have a lot of examples of what that means, except for a guy on the stage with a microphone. So how do you do that around a table? And I think it's way more accessible than they probably think.
• 10:37
  Yeah, that's really helpful. Yeah, I would say the most basic way to think about spiritual leadership is you initiate rhythms, a spiritual rhythm. And so I think a simple thing like, okay, I'm going to be the one to initiate a Bible conversation. And it's interesting, like Michelle, you were saying, I think a lot of people do struggle with the collision between a category of full subject.
• 11:05
  um, versus, uh, you know, versus something that is like in, in some other category, you know, spiritual leadership, how, how would you describe maybe the tension or how have you thought through the difference between, cause it sounded like it started out as almost, oh, this is just a part of the homeschooling day. Um, and then when Cameron got involved, did it, did it shift or how did, how did that work for you guys?
• 11:31
  Yeah, it just, I think at first it was in the evening, right? Yeah. Yeah. And then when he saw that it was a regular rhythm for us in the morning, he was like, oh, I think, well, I can't speak for you. Is that kind of, I'll let you say that part. Yeah, I mean, we've wanted to introduce some other rhythms as well. And so our morning has died a little bit. We're trying to get on the same page as a team and start the day out. So for us now, it's a little bit more evolved where we start with kind of a few minutes of exercise together.
• 11:59
  And then we transitioned to that just to wake everybody up. And we're just okay tinkering on this stuff. Yeah. Because I...
• 12:08
  I think they're just wanting to play a greater role. I'm wanting to play a greater role in all of it because there's stuff that I can contribute and I can see their areas as the kids have gotten older where it's more accessible for me to step in. I have more to contribute at this stage than maybe I did. It was maybe a little bit more ambiguous. We could both contribute equally previously, but there's some things that truly...
• 12:29
  I'm able to contribute at this age that, and male because of experience that really are more in my wheelhouse in some cases than in Michelle's. 100%. So that's been kind of a personal thing. I don't know where the strengths lie with parents, but I think in terms of engagement, um,
• 12:45
  Yeah, I think whatever it is, I think that's again using, realizing that we have influence, whether we have specific skills or not, I think our presence and being part of the process is a huge catalyst for whatever we're trying to grow. Yeah, yeah, so important. Yeah, it's important to understand that
• 13:02
  that dads wield this kind of like influence over the culture of the family that's felt in both their act action and in their abdication. And it speaks a lot. And I think to have, it's worth it to get the dad involved especially at this level. So one of the things I know, Michelle, you've thought through is sometimes as moms, there is a desire to get it right. Okay. Well,
• 13:28
  Tell me what the right answer is. So how have you worked through kind of maybe a perfectionistic, you know, challenge to trying to figure out how to get the Bible into the family? Yeah, absolutely.
• 13:42
  Well, a big part of my story is I allowed a lot of social media to influence that area in my life. I would, you know, be on Instagram and see all these beautiful pictures of the moms leading their kids in Bible study or try this Bible study, this one, this Advent calendar, this. I mean, I really had so many moments where...
• 14:06
  I mean, I even had like a small stack of things that I bought that I'm like, okay, I'm going to get to it. And I just had to get that one because I knew it was just going to be the best thing ever for my family, you know? And I really set the bar so high in my own mind for myself and for my kids. So during that time that I was doing that with them, you know, it felt so largely like checking a box as much as I didn't want it to be. And I wanted it to look a certain way, aesthetically even.
• 14:35
  put a candle in the middle. Not that there's nothing wrong with that, but I really did set the bar so high for myself so that if anything went differently, I felt like I was feeling. And then I'm like, okay, why keep going? You know, this is, you know, or if you get crickets, you know, when you're trying to engage with your kids and they just wanna sit there and not engage. You know, I had to really face my idealism straight on.
• 15:02
  And yeah, toss it away. And about the time that Cameron was wanting to lead, it was the perfect timing for us really, because yeah, I was starting to just wrestle with some of those things.
• 15:17
  Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. It's social media, the kind of the picture of the perfect aesthetic of a family studying the Bible. I mean, it's nothing wrong with being inspired by that and say, oh, there's something beautiful. Yeah. I mean, here's an ideal, but for everyone, it's so important to say that's not what happens.
• 15:42
  when you're trying to do this like it's you've got you know kids that are frustrated people are sleepy like you know you're not getting it it's like and so you have to and it seems like one of the one of the ways to overcome some of that is to like double down on the rhythm itself and let it let it slowly evolve and i know camry you thought about like okay there's like part of what we're trying to establish here is is something rhythmic so how describe a little more how that how that's worked for you guys
• 16:10
  Yeah, I like to describe the rhythms, but something that I think is important to note also, and that I neglected to mention a minute ago, is that it wasn't just me realizing, oh, I'm supposed to be the spiritual leader, therefore let me be the spiritual leader. It really had...
• 16:25
  as a dad gotten, where I had a greater vision for fatherhood and I was aiming at a much further goal than what's happening in the next week. And I'm looking now at 80, 100 years out. And so I'm thinking, what do I want to be true of my family? And then that's kind of like pulled me in a bunch of areas
• 16:43
  for greater intentionality. So it's not just, I'm supposed to be the spiritual leader, let me be it. I think that having a greater vision for what family is about, what God has actually designed us for, has made it possible to now spot a bunch of areas where I can act with greater intentionality. And it doesn't even feel like work in the same way.
• 17:04
  Or in other words, it doesn't feel like a toil. It's work, but it's like a good workout kind of work where I feel, you know, like getting done with the gym. I'm sweaty. I'm kind of, you know, muscles are sore, but I feel good. Like something just happened. I moved the needle in some way. Investment. An investment. Yeah. So I think that's an area that's got a rhythmic.
• 17:25
  Rhythms have really been a part of our life in saying, okay, what are the small inputs that we can put in? Realizing that small changes over time end up yielding these big results, kind of like in this book, Atomic Habits. It's so helpful to look at things through that lens, because I would love for us all to sit down, read a Bible passage, and then be set for life.
• 17:48
  You know, and I like the one workout to have it and I be set for life. And just, I really did great on that one. I never have to work out again. But that's really just not how we're designed. And so building in some sort of rhythms,
• 18:01
  makes it so that one, you overcome the, once it becomes rhythmic, you start creating these neural pathways where the willpower needed to start something is way easier. You almost don't have to fight it because you just fall into a rhythm and you end up becoming the person that you want to be just by virtue of those incremental deposits into that.
• 18:21
  So I think that any kind of rhythmic living, those are always, whatever you do as an action, those are all votes into the person you're going to become. And so if you want to be somebody who has a real great grasp of the story of God and allow the word to really shape who you are, each time you put a little deposit in there, it's kind of a vote in favor of becoming that person who is grounded, steeped and marinated. And I think also for a family member,
• 18:51
  Anytime we're able to have little nuggets, we're allowing, it's really gone, I think,
• 18:55
  realizing that it's God is the one who is doing all of the hard work. We're just putting, when we bring the story of God in front of our kids' eyes and our own eyes, we're allowing ourselves, we can't help but be confronted. How many times have you, you know, read a verse even and just gone, oh, wow. And it just points and reveals something in yourself or some other thing. And it spurred me towards seeking God more. So those happening, rather than waiting for some idealistic, uh,
• 19:23
  Chunk, I don't have a problem with reading a big chunk. I read through the Bible in a week. Great. But I think it's the over-timeness of it that ends up yielding because you're able to then kind of match your day against what you're reading. So the rhythm's...
• 19:38
  Our life is rhythmic. We sleep, we wake, we eat. And so having this be a routine part, I think is, one, we're wired for that. And second, we find ourselves making a lot of traction. Even if we're dealing with smaller amounts, but making it rhythmic is, I think, really a key to this. More than having some sort of mountaintop experience. 100%. Yeah, that's really good. Yeah, I think that the big why that we have to embrace as believers in Jesus is,
• 20:07
  is that we are revelation-dependent creatures. God, by nature giving us a book, has shown us that, hey, this is how I want you to understand and grow deeper in your relationship with me. I want you to study this. I want you to understand it. Every word of it is precious. And there was seasons, I was really inspired by...
• 20:30
  looking at times in the Middle Ages when these Jewish communities in Europe were the most hyper-illiterate, not because there's anything unique about them ethnically, it was only because they, as a community and as families,
• 20:47
  They believed more deeply than the Christians at that era that they were revelation dependent creatures. We need the Bible. We need to get our kids into the Bible. And so even amongst women, they were hyper literate because it was like they believed in this where the other people in the culture were much less literate.
• 21:08
  You know, the vast majority were actually illiterate at that time. So, so we, we, we need to get this into us. We need to demonstrate to our family, to our kids that what it's like to, as Jesus says, man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God, that, that eating, that,
• 21:28
  and studying the scripture are spiritually linked, Jesus is saying. So how often do you eat? Well, that's about how often you need to eat from the word, you know, in the same way that breathing is a physical analogy for being filled with the Holy Spirit. You know, you take a breath in every few seconds, like this is a constant part of your life.
• 21:49
  you know, and this like prayer, prayer without ceasing. I mean, this idea is, is really linked to breathing. The word breath and spirit are the same in Hebrew and Greek, but the idea of the Bible and eating, I think are extremely linked in scripture, as Jesus says there. So yeah, this is, this is what we're trying to figure out. How do we, and we eat rhythmically, right? Very few people will eat less than one meal a day, you know? And so that seems like a very basic expectation. Like,
• 22:17
  that there's a minimal amount, but it could even be more than that. So, all right. I want to share with you just a quick story on rhythms that it was an unexpected thing for us. So every Shabbat, I read Proverbs 31 over Michelle. And something that we found that was unexpected on these rhythms was there was a week where after doing this, I don't know, for maybe like a year and a half, where at one point I just, I did a thing where I read half of...
• 22:47
  a sentence and one of our kids like said the other half of the sentence. In other words, without reading it, they just knew it because they'd heard it so many times. Yeah. So then they read the next half of the sentence and then they just said it. And I, so then I have to say like the first word of the sentence. They knew they like, they know Proverbs 31. Yeah. Could be hardest for the rhythmic. I mean, that's like through repetition. That's a little bit different, but that rhythm, I was shocked at how much they have actually absorbed. And that was an unexpected thing. I thought they were just kind of tuned out because really I'm just
• 23:15
  speaking this over Michelle, they were internalizing it. And I think, my goodness, I've got my three daughters here curing week after week this blessing over a woman and what that means for them. So don't underestimate the power of repetition and rhythm in this as well.
• 23:31
  That's powerful. Well, speaking of which, Michelle, I'd love for you to maybe unpack. So a couple of things in the tips that you guys wrote about. Again, if you guys want to grab that, that's a free download, familyteams.com slash Bible. These are the five tips. So there are a couple of them. One of them was Shabbat and the other one was scripture songs. So Michelle, I'd love for you to tease out what are some of the couple of those tips or tools that have been really meaningful for you guys?
• 23:56
  Yeah. So this tip really goes for kids, for people that have kids of all ages. So scripture songs was something that actually my parents did for me when I was young with, I think it was Keith Green, right? Or somebody? No, Steve Green.
• 24:12
  Right? Oh, yeah. Steve Green. Anyway, yeah. But anyway, so scripture songs, there are so many resources out there that people have put verses or even long passages to song, to melodies. And so, there's something about putting those two things together that really cement the
• 24:32
  things in our minds to memorize them. And especially for kids, they're like sponges. Their brains just soak up everything so quickly. And so that was one thing even early on we started doing. And it's been neat to see now that we have older kids
• 24:50
  you know, when we read a passage, they'll just like break out in song like, oh, we know this one, you know, and it's like, wow, okay, all those times that we heard it in the car and maybe you weren't singing and I thought, well, I'm just gonna soak you guys in the word, even though you don't fully understand it right now. Later on, it's hidden your heart. I mean, the Bible says, I think it's Psalm maybe 133 that says, I've hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against God. And
• 25:18
  Just the Holy Spirit can bring that back to our kids. So, this is a really fun and practical thing, not only for kids, but for me. I loved it. Just listening to these, our favorite was Slugs and Bugs. They just had really great music, except to big, long passages of Scripture, and
• 25:37
  You know, where I remember Abby, she memorized the Lord's Prayer at age three, just with her little sweet, you know, three-year-old voice. And I was like, wow, they can just really soak this up. So, that's a really fun and practical tip that is beneficial not only for the kids, but for us adults.
• 25:56
  So cool. Yeah. We need these kind of tools if we're going to get the Bible and we're families. And yeah, I love that. So, you know, so having certain passages you read on the Sabbath, if you guys have a special deal, we talk a lot about that and family teams, I think that's really valuable having like songs that you're listening to and just saturating your family and scripture throughout the day, finding, you know, ways to sort of like be meditating and thinking about scripture in that way. So super helpful. You guys, before we go,
• 26:26
  Any like last things that as we've been talking and I've like kind of bubbled up that you'd want to say to a family who's thinking, man, we really need to start figuring out how to get the Bible into our family. Maybe start with you, Cameron, and then Michelle, if you have anything, last encouragement. Cameron, yeah.
• 26:42
  Just start. Don't have to worry about knowing all the answers. Like you said at the beginning, Jeremy, leading is the initiating of it. That's what you're doing. And waiting for a perfect thing to come along. You open the scriptures, read a verse. If it's a breakfast or wherever you've been doing things as a family, it's just...
• 27:04
  Start with something. You'll discover things that what's working well for your family, what isn't. But it's starting, getting over that hump, you'll find that you can move more easily into stuff. So I think just starting, just grab a verse, open the Gospels and just read it's a narrative, you know, and just begin reading. Excellent.
• 27:22
  And I think if I can speak to the moms, because I've been there, as you see your husband taking this step, or maybe he hasn't, he's really wrestling with that, I encourage those wives to just really pray for their husbands and to be careful not to put pressure, like let the Lord lead your husband in this way. Because I think we can...
• 27:48
  be acting against them when we really are trying to be for them. It comes across perhaps not the way that you want. So, find a way, you know, for me it was like breakfast, you know, kind of helping the kids to get to the table, you know, sometimes. But really just praying and checking my heart. And if there's repentance, I'm not sure if there's a way
• 28:12
  that the Lord shows me that I need to repent of some wrong thinking on my part as the wife, I really encourage you to press into that because that's a part of my story too, that I realized that I was leading in ways that I shouldn't have. And yeah, so there's been a lot of freedom on the other side of repenting, of, you know, kind of mixing up some rules and stuff like that.
• 28:34
  Excellent. Thank you so much for saying that, Michelle. Yeah, this is a team sport. It's kind of hard to figure out exactly how do each of us work and do this thing together. And April and I have been in that dance too. We're going to do a podcast on Bible and our family just to kind of walk through the dance we've been trying to figure out as well. And every couple, this is it. Like we're trying to figure this out and it's challenging, but man, it's so valuable to get into a rhythm that's really life-giving for your family.
• 28:59
  I want to encourage you guys, we know this is kind of the beginning of your journey. If you're like, wow, this is it. We need to focus on this. That's why we created the accelerator. So the accelerator is going to be open now for a couple of weeks to leading up to August. And so if you guys want to jump in there, go to familyteams.com, just click on the accelerator. Like I said, you'll get the playbook during the first week. The second week, you'll get a coaching call with Cameron and Michelle. The third week, you'll get a video from April and I where we kind of
• 29:26
  walk you through sort of a tutorial of how we do this. And then the final, um, uh, the final piece of content we're going to do is a town hall. Um, uh, just where for, with our family, we'll talk through how the Bible has impacted us or any other questions you guys want to ask about family or being, becoming a family team. Um, so we'd love to see you guys in the accelerator. Um, and if you'd like to get that download, just go to familyteams.com slash Bible, and you guys can grab those, uh, those top five tips that, uh,
• 29:52
  Cameron and Michelle are encouraging you guys to consider. So thank you guys so much for being on here. Thank you for the incredible playbook you guys wrote for, for this month and being available to the accelerator families. And yeah, excited for all you guys listening to this, like, like Cameron said, just get started and we wish you all the best and blessings on your family as you try to go deeper into really seeing the Bible impact your family rhythmically. So awesome. Thank you guys so much for jumping on here today. My pleasure.
• 30:23
  Thank you for listening to the Family Teams podcast. If you're enjoying this content or have learned something new, please make sure to leave a rating and review and share with a friend. To stay up to date with our events, new content, and products, you can follow us on Facebook and Instagram at Family Teams.