Latest / Story Scaling / The Art of the Interview with Kyle Kellams

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The Art of the Interview with Kyle Kellams · Story Scaling

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: We are PodcastVideoscom.
• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Our goal is to educate, enlighten, engage and entertain.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: We believe in the power of love and transformation through storytelling.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Welcome back everybody.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: This is Story Scaling.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: I'm Dan Kraft, the editorial director here at PodcastVideoscom, and joining me today an old friend, a fellow journalist of many years.
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: Kyle Kellams is the news director KUAF, the producer of Ozarks at Large with our local NPR affiliate, 35 years now 35 years at KUAF, yeah.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: And 40 in radio, 40 in radio.
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Okay, now you've got to do the math 42 in radio.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Wait radio.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, now you got to do the math.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: 42 in radio Wait, well, a long time.
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: How many interviews have you conducted Ballpark?
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: Do you have any idea?
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: And we're not talking unique individuals Like if I've interviewed someone.
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: Just how many people have you stuck a microphone in front of?
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: Oh gosh, Dan, it's got to be.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: Just how many people have you?
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: stuck a microphone in front of.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Oh gosh, dan, it's got to be, and this will be one of those things that wakes you up at three like, oh no, but I'm going to guess at least 15,000.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: I would say that's probably minimum, and I know you've interviewed me several times.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: Yes, I've interviewed you a couple of times.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: You know radio print, sit down that happens, and a bigger market than it was then, but a smaller market when you were doing two or three stories a day.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Sure, three different beats.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: And some of those stories were one interview, some of them were five.
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, absolutely.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: So there's an art to the interview.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: Yes, and it's not as simple as get the interview before the TV camera shows up, because then everybody climbs up, right, although that is a good tip.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: Yes, really, the TV cameras show up, the people climb up.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: Radio show up the microphone didn't scare them as much as the camera did you bring a camera and lights, and for many people I think it's a little bit more ubiquitous now than it used to be.
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure it is Now that we have them all on our phones.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: Right, but I do know that there are still people that come into our studio or that I go to and they go.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Oh, thank goodness, this isn't video, it's one less element.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: So I have a bit of an advantage there.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're worried about what they're wearing and how they look Exactly, and I just had a little notepad that I could stick in my pocket.
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: Right, I use the bigger ones now.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: They still tease me about how old school that is around here.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: It's cool, but there's an art interview and you usually, if your studio is still set up the way, I remember you had a swinging arm with a mic that sat about right here.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we have a studio with table stand mics.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: Some people get kind of intimidated by having that mic, of course, up in their face.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: How do you bring in somebody who's either, you know, is intimidated by it or who's so rookie, so fresh, so unused to being interviewed that it throws?
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: them.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: Oh, I got several thoughts about that.
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: First, I think you think about.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: To me it's like going to the dentist.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: The dentist is going to see 12, 15 people that day.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: This is what she or he does.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: You may be nervous because you only go to the dentist every six months or when a tooth is hurting.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: Just remember, first of all, that this is something for most of the people you're talking to, unusual, so just be aware of that.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: I don't do live interviews.
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: All of ours are recorded.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: So if I see someone's particularly nervous, I mean you got a chance to flow in.
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: I don't have to get something I'm going to use right away.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: You're not live streaming to use the parlance no no, no, so this will be edited.
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: So if someone comes in and they're particularly nervous which I don't see as often as I used to- Again, I think, because of the ubiquity of things, just all sorts of content.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: People have cameras stuck in their face a lot more often now.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: But the first thing I do is I set a level, like make sure my level is the same, audio levels are the same, and so I'll ask three questions what's your name, what's your title, what's the first movie you ever saw in a movie theater?
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: And that, and I always get oh oh, and the name and the title you need for you and for the editors.
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but luckily we'll spell your name too.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: Yes, because if I'm not the one Right, if I'm not the person editing the interview or writing the intro of the tag that will go on the air later, it's just easy to have that information there.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: So that serves a purpose.
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: We got it from you because I'm not doing this edit.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: Exactly, Exactly.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: The third question what's the first movie you see in a movie theater that breaks the ice, and often I'll then have a couple of minutes of conversation just about that.
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: If someone well, it was John's.
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: It's a very soft opening.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: Yes, and I have no intention to using any of that.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: If I see someone still a little bit nervous, I'll hold back the questions.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: I want to make it into the interview.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: Let's just develop a rapport.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: I also sort of start sliding them in as they get more comfortable.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: And because I want it to be a conversation, right, I want us kind of like what you and I are doing.
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: We're not really thinking about this being an interview.
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: We're two people who've known each other a long time and we're talking.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: And we know we're both comfortable with interviews and interview.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: But I think if you just establish a sort of a safe pattern like we're just going to, and most of my I don't do investigative journalism I'm trying to get stories, illicit information out of people, so it's not at you.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: There's not a lot of gotcha.
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: No, you're not Getting in someone's face.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I want to have a conversation.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I want to have a conversation with someone, and I may know that this is probably only going to be six or seven minutes on air.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: Maybe it's going to be 15.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: But if they've got the time, I'd love to go 20 or 25, just to get enough of what I want.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: Sure, because it may wander in unexpected directions, right, right, that's.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: One thing I learned is that when they say something, you just figure out a follow-up question real quick.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: If you think it's going to be interesting, chase them down that road for a minute.
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: Well, and I'm so, I may have two prepared questions and then the rest.
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: I'm just going to listen and react.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: I may hear them say something and think I want to go back and talk to them about this, and so I'll come back to it, but but I don't want it to be wrote.
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: I want again a conversation.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: So have two or three ready.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: Some touch points, some, you know you want to cover it before the cameras roll.
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: Right, be willing to go with where they're going to go.
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: I mean, you want to direct it, of course, and if you're talking to someone about their startup or their invention, that's where you want to get to.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: If they start going off on something else, you want to go back.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: You want to come up with a way to circle it back in.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: You know, I know how much you're going to, how much is of your process is editing, so I feel like I can edit a lot.
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: So if someone's rambling, I don't want to necessarily turn them off.
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: I want them to feel comfortable, but I need to use that.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: You can get them in the back end of that Right.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: Well, and now we're editing.
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: Whether it's audio, whether it's this video, it's all digital Right.
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: Nobody's cutting negatives here.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: No.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: No.
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: Boy that was.
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: I do not miss the razor blade and the tape.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: I don't.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: No, no Page markups, right?
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: No, yeah, wow.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: So Go back to the microphones for one second.
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: Obviously the people watching right now people listening probably can't tell either way, but the people watching realize that there are no microphones here.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: We're not wearing lapels that are popular, uh, for you know your traditional tv folks or talk shows.
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: We have our shotgun mics that are up out of out of frame and they're they're highly directional.
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: They point right at us and they come for the sound that's right in front of them while they kill the sound out here.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: This has proven, at least in our limited use here since we opened in February, that there are people who are too nervous about having the microphone in front of their face, who do not notice these.
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's correct.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: Who do not notice these?
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's correct.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: So, as you mentioned, ours are pretty much right there, which is the standard that you kind of still see on some of the video podcasts.
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: I was watching Bill Maher and they don't have microphones that I can see Whatever that thing is he's doing now.
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: But I do realize people.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: It's unnatural for most people to have a microphone in their face.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: That's why I just try to disarm them and, like a doctor with a good bet, if you're going to get a shot, people giving you the shot will try and distract you.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: They'll make small talk.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: So just try to disarm through the conversation.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: Sure, yeah.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: We don't deal as much here, much like you don't with the real adversarial, the, with the real adversarial, the tough interviews.
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: There's no what we used to call the angel of death, where you have to go talk to the family, ask them about their dead relative.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: Those are never the day after it happened or the night after.
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Because we had deadlines.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: Right right those were.
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: I never looked forward to those.
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: No.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: You had to be a special kind of psychopath yourself.
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: That was how you how do you select a guest Before you even sit them down?
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: How do you pick the one that's going to be in front of that?
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: I'm curious to a fault.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: So are you doing something that's unusual?
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: Are you doing something that is, you know, beneficial to others?
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: My favorites are the people that are passionate about something that the rest of us might not even know existed.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: I look for passion, curiosity, commitment to what you're doing isn't unusual.
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: Now we also have sit shows a week.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: Each one's an hour.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: There is an element of you fill the show too yeah, you need a local hook, you need a timely hook.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: There's got to be a reason to have it yeah, I mean on the show that will be on the Ozarks at large.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: It will be on the day after we're doing this.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: We talked to the two U of A students who have launched Queer South, a zine about being queer in the South, hence the name we're talking to Kind of like podcastvideoscom given that name.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly Right at that point.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Right, People are trying to figure out what it is.
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: Dj Sheep who's opening for Deadmau5.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: Deadmau5 is going to be at the Momentary a couple days after this.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: Yes, that Deadmau5.
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah to this.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: Yes, that Deadmau5.
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, in Bentonville, right, and he's a fellow who splits his time between Bentonville and Serbia and he started DJing when he was in his late 50s and now he's opening for Deadmau5.
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: So we might still have careers.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: Exactly exactly.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: So I mean, those are two really obvious hooks right there.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, um and those are hooks that will bring your show, whether it's live or packages, a podcast later out, to a much broader audience.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: If you can get enough traction to get a dead mouse reference, that will yes, who you're I mean, wearing those are two large is incredibly old school in that it's like oof, I'm going to sound old.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: It's like Life Magazine, okay.
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: Okay, when you pick up a Life Magazine, there will be politics, there will be all these things.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: We're not searching for a niche audience.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: Our hope is there are going to be enough interesting people that you'll learn something along the way that you weren't expecting.
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: We can curate so much of what we do now that we don't have a lot of surprise, and we hope to surprise you.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: And that's less about the art of the interview.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: There is the art of media creation.
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: Right there, I got us all.
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: Oh, no, no, that's perfect.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: It doesn't matter how comfortable you are interviewing your guests if they're not doing anything interesting or if nobody cares, right, exactly, kyle.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I think that's the art of the interview.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: What else Can I tell you?
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: One more thing, oh, yeah.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: All the secrets.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: This isn't a secret, but this is something I fully share.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: I interview a lot of writers, and writers get interviewed a lot, and they get interviewed a lot by people who haven't read the book and that's it.
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, if you're books, take time to read, yes, and if and so many people in journalism are overworked, or I read the books and I want them to know that.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: But I don't want to just sit down and say, hey, I read the book.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: I will pick something up that's rather obscure from the middle of the book and mention that, and not in a brainy way, but it lets them know oh, he read this, he's into this and you can see, let's talk.
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: So let people know that you're interested in them and this isn't just something you're doing by rote.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: And if you have to drive a long way to get to them, you don't even need to read the book totally ahead of time, because now you can audio book it on the way there.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: That's true.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: I've done that.
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: But yeah, and that's one last thing I would say about the art of the interview, respect for who you're talking to Do prep.
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: Let them know that you spent time because they're spending time with you.
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they can walk away at any moment.
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: They don't have to do this for you, right.
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: And you know some people, if it's a writer, there's some publicity, there's a lot of women for them, yeah, but make it worth their time and make it worth your time and then ultimately make it worth your viewer or listener's time.
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: Take it.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that actually makes what we do seem easy.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: Well, as long as we've been doing it in trouble.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: Exactly so, kyle, I appreciate it.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: I hope the viewers, the listeners, do as well.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: Just a little bit of an idea on how to be interviewed.
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: It's the one thing that really hasn't changed in content creation over the years is that you have to have a topic and a subject.
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: Thank you, dan.
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: Thanks, this has been a blast.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll do it again for sure.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: So, guys, this is Kyle Callum Once again.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: He's the news director at KUAF local NPR affiliate here in Northwest Arkansas and producer of Ozarks at large.
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: I'm Dan craft, the editorial director here at podcast videoscom.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: Don't forget to check out the website you know the name and sign up for the newsletter, where you'll get industry tips, tech reviews and insights from industry insiders, just like Kyle.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: Thanks everybody.