Latest / Beyond The Blood: A Horror Movie Commentary Podcast / The Spider Labyrinth (1988) W/ Ryan Verrill from The DiscConnected

Transcript

The Spider Labyrinth (1988) W/ Ryan Verrill from The DiscConnected · Beyond The Blood: A Horror Movie Commentary Podcast

• 0:25
  Speaker 1: All right, what is up? Everyone? Welcome back to Beyond
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: the Blood, a horror commentary podcast. I am your host,
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Chris Higgins, and I'm here today with my co host,
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: who's currently in the catacombs of Budapest, Chuck. How are
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: you getting Wi Fi down there? I must ask.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: I wish I could tell you, but I'm kind of
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: a little creeped out. I'm not a big fan of
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: spiders to begin with, and they're just everywhere down here.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Please send help.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: You send help right now, Like, why are we recording
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: this podcast? We need nine to one one to.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: You immediately right now exactly.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: And also what you say said, get on it, all right,
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: I'll call them right now. They'll be there in four days.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: All right. It's we're setting the American Police today this time.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: But we also have another guest with us today. I'm
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: super honored to have to have this as our first episode,
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: like actually covering a movie. He was not only on
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: the commentary track for this movie, but he's been a
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: huge influence for me, a massive influence in the physical
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: media space. So I want to welcome Ryan from the
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: discconnected What's up man?
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: A whole lot but honored to take time to be
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: here on one of the first episodes for you.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you, man. You are not into catacombs. You
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: are in I think you're in Antarctica right now.
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: Essentially in Antarctica. It's been a rough weekend in the Midwest,
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: and my toes are still very much frozen and have
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: been since Saturday morning.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: That's that's not good, man. We need to get you.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: We need to get help to Chuck. We need to
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: get you some heat I need. And I'm like complaining
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: right now because the window I'm sitting in front of
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: has like a very light like leak in the bottom,
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: so I have a very slight breeze blowing on me.
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: And I was like, I should complain about this, and
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: then I thought softly about your situation and decided not to.
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: So yeah, man, I mean, we appreciate so much of
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: you being here, man, thank you for taking the time
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: to do it.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: Of course.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, there we go. So of course, today everybody
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: saw the title we're talking about nineteen eighty eight's The
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: Spider Labyrinth and this was put out I believe in
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty three. Correct this lay Friday title, yep, Black
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Friday title from seven this was I knew nothing about
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: this when this came out. Just to make it abundantly clear,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: I usually know something about stuff that I'm buying, Uh,
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: you know, whether it's like the tiniest detail. But I
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: knew I knew nothing, and to be one hundred percent honest,
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: when I was placing my Black Friday order. Part of
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: the thing for me was the fact that you were
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: on the commentary track. Because I want to I want
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: to support my friends, you know what I mean. So
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: I wanted to buy it for that reason. But also,
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: I believe a couple of months before this came out,
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: I was actually on your show and you said you
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: were working on something with Severn, but you couldn't tell
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: me what at the time.
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: And then this came out and it was it was awesome.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: So what I want to know off the bat, before
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: we really dive into this movie, how how the hell
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: out of all this stuff Severn puts out? Did? Did?
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: Did you? And I do want to say, Will Dotson
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: it's also on the commentary track for this how how
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: did this come together?
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: This is this is kind of an incredible story because
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: I don't think we have said this too much yet
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: because this is not. This isn't the first commentary we recorded,
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: but this was the first thing that we ever did
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: on a disc that was released publicly. And not not
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: only are we on the commentary, but we have a
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: visual essay on this disc as well. And to get
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: both of those at once on a company like Severn
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: to be your first outing is kind of crazy, Like
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: I expected to need to work there a little bit more.
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: But truth of the matter is I have known a
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: couple of the guys at Severn for years before we
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: were on this disc. I had David Gregory and Andrew
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: Furtado on my show. Andrew Ertado and I have been
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: in Facebook groups for movies for years. We've chatted about things,
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: God since like right when he started at seven. Actually
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: it's probably when we started talking. But this one is
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: hilarious because it played last year in or not last
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: year's twenty twenty five now in twenty twenty three at
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: that seven pop up event that they do every like September,
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: I think is when they do it, and they announced
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: this as one of the titles that they have had
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: most requested since they've been a company, and they were
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: putting this out finally it was gonna be in Glorious
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: four K and I got word because I post all
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: the announcements for The Disconnected that night that they were
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: doing this, and talked to Andrew briefly about it while
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: he was at the event, like we were messaging while
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: he was standing there and introducing titles and stuff, and
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: he said, yeah, we have like nothing on this disc.
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: We got to try to figure this out before Black
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: Friday because we want this to come out soon. And
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: I said, I mean, we could definitely handle this. We're
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: working on a couple other commentaries. We would be thrilled
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: to put our hat in the ring for this. He says, yeah,
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: why not, Let's try it out. Let's see if we can.
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: We can try to get you on the commentary. I said, well,
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: let's do a little bit more. I think we can
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: do a visual essay too. He said, yeah, why not.
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: We need more for the disc. Let's get both of those.
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: And so literally, like the night they announced this publicly
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: to the world is the night that Will and I
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: got offered to do the commentary, and so immediately we
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: got to work on this. Because they were releasing this,
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: I'd like, we're talking less than ninety days later, and
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: that is a really quick turnaround to do a commentary,
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: a visual essay, Q see everything and then get it
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: in for authoring so that it can be manufactured to
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: deliver quick enough for everybody to get in their hands
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: after without causing a riot like they do after every sale.
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: And somehow it got pulled off.
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: So yeah, that's that's like the definition of shoot your shot. Yeah,
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: it's like it shouldn't have worked that way, but it
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: ended up, you know, working out gloriously.
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: Well, we'll talk about it, I'm sure, but it was
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: a really dumb decision to do it that quickly. But
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: we'll get there.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: So, you know, to me, I picked this up, I
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: watched it. I loved it, hence why it became the
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: kickoff episode for this show. The movie that that that
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I wanted to cover. And I went to Chuck and
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: I was like, hey, I really want to do this.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: I have a friend who was on it who will
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: come on the show. I really want to put this together.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: And he bought it. So, Chuck, I want to ask you,
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: the first time you got this and you threw it on,
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: what were your thoughts after that first viewing of it?
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: After that first view and I was basically like now,
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: like I said in the introductory episode, was like, what
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: the hell did I just watch? What did Chris make
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: me by and get myself into? I did not expect
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: any of that. I didn't even read the back of
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: the movie when I got it, So I just want
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: to completely blind and Yeah, it was a trip, man,
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: it was a trip. It is it is, And there's
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: a lot of funny stuff that we'll get into with
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: this movie as we move on, especially because to anybody
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: listening to this whom might know what this is but
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: has never seen it, and you're going to use this
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: episode to kind of decide whether or not you're going
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: to dive into it, it's one hundred percent worth the
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: the blind by and the blind entry into it, because,
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: as we'll go on to talk about, if you were
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: to simply go on to IMDb and look up the
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: cast and crew, you're not going to see much going
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: on pretty much anywhere. You're not going to see much
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: in the cast, You're not going to see much in
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: the crew. So on surface level, it doesn't seem like
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: there's a lot going on here, but there's actually a
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: ton and arguably for a movie coming out of the
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: late eighties.
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: I think this is more well made than what a
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: lot of other seasoned Italian I think American filmmakers. We're
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: doing like there's a lot to love here, I think,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: and you know we're going to get into that, and
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: hence why it's this first episode. So this one, this
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: episode is going to play out a little different because
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: we're not that lucky to on every single episode have
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: on somebody from the commentary. So you know, we don't
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: want to bore Ryan to death, but we do want
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: to do this movie justice and dissect it and hopefully
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: give people who do love this movie an episode that
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: they can love and introduce this to the world in
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: a new way. So I want to start off with
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: some of the key players. And another warning, I'm gonna
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: repeat the warning that Ryan actually gave on the commentary.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: I'm probably gonna a lot of names on this we
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: we all are. I'm sorry. I'm an American from the
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: East Coast, from New Jersey, of all places. I'm probably
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: gonna butcher a lot of these names. So to anybody listening,
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: if you're if you're gonna come at me, that's fine,
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: I'll take it. I'll just ignore you. But let's let's
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: dive into this. So this was directed by Jean Franco Jianny.
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: Is that that is exactly it? Yes?
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: All right, okay, so I dove into this guy's history.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: He has a lot under his belt, but nothing that
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: I recognize, a lot of TV work. Ye, nothing that
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: that stood out to me, even in the slightest But
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: just to kind of like sum up, each of these
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: positions did good work, did good work here. So it
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: seems like this is so hard because it's not like
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: we have a dense history to really like dive into here. Yeah,
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: you know, there's there's just not much going on. I mean,
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: there's there's a couple. But this this movie somehow also
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: had four writers and it's not specified anywhere online if
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: these they're just labeled as screenplay by, so we don't know.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: There's no story credits, there is no draft credits, there's nothing.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: And this was written by all right, let's see, let's
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: give it the old the old try. We have thank you,
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: we have Ricardo Agno, I'm gonna try, Brian, if you know,
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: correct me.
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: We have I want to hear all of them.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: First, we have to Nino survey. We have I'm gonna
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: say Caesar for Gony and and then I'm gonna say
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: Jean Franco Manfreddi.
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: That I mean fairly close for all of them.
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, okay, all right, cool.
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: I believe it's Cesar and not Caesar, but that's fine.
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: Csar, Okay, okay, all right, my apologize, my apologies. Thanks
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: for bringing him up though, because of the writing merits,
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: he has the most working with Sergio Martino on multiple projects,
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: so that's really cool.
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: You know.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: There's now we're starting to get into some more recognizable names.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: But the next name to me is the most recognizable,
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: being the physical media whoror that I am. This movie
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: was actually shot by Nino Celeste. Do you say, Celestie?
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: What do you say? I just say, okay, all right, perfect.
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: So this was shot by Nino Celeste. And I recognize
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: this name because of the recent Houses of Doom set
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: put out by Cauldron, because he actually shot both of
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: the Lucio Fulci movies on there. So he shot u
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: Sweet House of Horrors and the House of Clocks. House
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: of Clocks is great. Sweet House of Hers is not
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: very great in my opinion, but that's for that's for
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: a different episode. But again, does good work. This movie
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: is shot incredibly well, which we'll dive into. Here's a
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: fun one. This movie was composed by Franco Piersanti Okay.
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: That's I think it's pier santiya. And honestly, the score
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: for this is beautiful.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes, especially the the the the musical kickoff of
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: the jazz track which will which'll talk about, which I
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: don't know if that was his track or if that
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: was licensed music for the time, but yeah, the jazz
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: tuned to the red Cadillac driving into the city is beautiful.
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: And then, last, but not least, we have an editor
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: of significance here. We have Sergio Montanari. Of course he
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: edited Django, so a heavy hitter in this cast. But
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: this area, like we've said before, doesn't give us a
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: whole lot of room for discussion because for a movie
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: so well made, the talent is not as deep as
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: you would think. Like watching this movie, you would have
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: no idea that pretty much most of the crew is
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: sort of low key, not really a ton of big projects,
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: some friends, stuff like that. So it was interesting to
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: dive into that and hear you guys talk about that
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: on the comments.
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: Ay especially, Yeah, it was difficult to research because of that. Really,
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: the biggest name, which we haven't mentioned yet is actually
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: the gentleman that did the special effects, and that was
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: fun to build the tree off of him. But this
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: was this was tough when you don't have a lot
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: of background. It is. It's not an easy commentary. I
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: mean there's not I'm not definitely not gonna put anybody
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: down or anything, but there's some commentaries that certainly can
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: come across as essentially a Wikipedia article of each person's history.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: And when you don't have much, you're kind of forced
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: to go above and beyond.
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, So let me ask you man, when you're
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: when you're preparing for an audio commentary. You said during
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: the commentary that you had watched the movie multiple times
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: that week leading up to it. You also talked about
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: how you guys went on essentially Google and read a
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: whole bunch of reviews, ranging from you know, old like reviews,
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: from DVD copies and rips and all kinds of stuff.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Is that on a movie like this, that's the That's
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: pretty much the extent of the research, right, That's all
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: you can really do.
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: This is one of those rare projects where we technically
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: I think are the first English language analysis of this
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: film on record anywhere. That is of note. Like, obviously
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: there's comment sections and people giving two paragraph review after
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: they watch a terrible rip on YouTube, but a lot
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: of times those are just kind of summarizing the plots
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: and you don't get a lot of details out of those.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: But yeah, this is this is tough because I believe
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: we are technically the first English language analysis anywhere in
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: the world on it. So it was it was mostly
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: we're gonna have to go deep dive things. We're gonna
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: have to dive into Google Translate, We're gonna have to
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: dig into scholarly articles that you know, just your everyday
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: person walking down the street doesn't even have access to
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: because I'm not gonna pay for subscriptions or anything like that,
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: which is where it helps that my partner is literally
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: a university professor, so he's got access to a lot
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: of things that I don't. And yeah, he's an incredible researcher,
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: So getting all of his information together and then both
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: of us compiling what we can that we think is
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: important and think will sort of tell the story through
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: the commentary because really we're not there. We don't want
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: to just rehash the whole story, which you really could
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: because there is no analysis of it, so you could
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: just sort of do the classic Well in this scene,
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: you see him doing this, and that means X. We
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: did some of that in the commentary, but really the
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: context that makes this so important is everything else. Even
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: just the timing of doing this at the end of
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: the nineteen eighties is important and that should be stressed
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: quite a bit in the commentary. So, yeah, we had
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: a lot to lean into for sure.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's a lot that we're going to talk
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: about that kind of to me, this movie stands still
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: in a weird place of time, and I'm going to
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: use this as a segue too to move into the movie.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: So just for everybody watching who has seen the movie,
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: the movie opens with it's just a cold open. It
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: opens we have two kids playing what I thought was
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: hide and seek until I saw a toy gun and
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: I was like, oh, I've never played hide and seek
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: with a gun before. You know, it's just one of
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: those weird thoughts. But we have two kids that are
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: playing hide and seek. Our main who turns out to
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: be our main character. He hides in a closet. It's
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: one of those weird separate closets, is not built into
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: the walls. I almost like a what's the chest from Insidious?
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: You know, like Insidious in the kind.
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like one of those weird closets. He hides
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: in the closet. His friend or sibling, it's never never
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: said who that is locks the door and he begins
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: freaking out, stuck in the closet. And this is where
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: we're introduced to a pretty interesting element of this movie.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: We're gonna get into the next kind of key player.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: He looks into the corner and we see a massive spider.
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: And this is no run of the mill typical corner
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: of my closet spider. This is a full on tarantula,
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: probably even bigger than a tarantula, but for a movie
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: from nineteen eighty eight. The effects artist who worked on
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: this as well as cemetery manaed a whole bunch of
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: extra Servio Stiviletti. I think I said that name right, Okay,
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Sergia Civiletti. The use of stop motion effects in this
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: movie is incredible, and you see that right away with
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: this opening effect. And I want to ask because I
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: don't know how you guys feel. Nineteen eighty eight. I
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: know this is you know, this is kinda I feel
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: like end of the the prime era of stop mooche
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: of kind of this is when Phil Tibbett is kind
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: of heading into Jurassic Park and he's kind of getting
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: the threat of Hey, look we're going to be or
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: a Phil. I'm blanking on his last name right now,
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: one of the biggest stop motion effects artists in the world.
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: Are we talking about Phil tip It?
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I'm just talking about Phil tip and Jel
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: just because he's one of the largest. So at this
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: point all my history on stop motion effects is pretty
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: much with him and his story moving into you know,
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: was it like nineteen ninety two ninety one with Jurassic
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Park and research going on for the effects for that
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: eighty eight is not far off. We're only a couple
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: of years from stop motion pretty much almost being eradicated.
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: So for nineteen eighty eight to feature a movie from
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: nineteen eight eighty eight to feature these effects, it is
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: really cool to me, really really cool, and it's part
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: of the charm of this movie because moving forward, those
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: are going to be the primary effects style. This isn't
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: like a one off thing. The rest of the major
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: practical effects for this movie are in stop motion form,
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: so I think it's an interesting little little time capsule
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: for that. Chuck, how did you feel about the stop
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: motion effects? Were they? Did they fit? Did they feel
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: a little old timy?
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: Like?
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: How did these work for you?
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'm a big fan of stop motion in general,
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: so I've thought they fit perfectly well with the movie,
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: with what they were trying to go for. I was
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: a big fan of it.
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, there's an eeriness to it because to me,
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: the opening scene, the first thing I thought of was
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: the fly, the.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: Ending of the fly that and just like you know,
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: like I said earlier in the episode, I'm verified as spiders,
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: so seeing them move in that stop motion like you
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: know movement that they do creep me out even more.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy because that opening shot you have,
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: you have the you know, the forefront of the frame
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: is the spider or the front of the frame is
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: a spider, and then you can tell the rear projection
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: to get to complete the shot. So it's really cool,
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: like the stacked effects there, it's really really cool when
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: it worked really well. But it's a it's a crazy
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: kick off of this movie because we don't know at
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: pretty much any point in this movie if this was real,
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: if this is as you guys stay in a commentary
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: of premonition, if it was just simply a nightmare. We
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: don't know, because we instantly cut to our main character,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: Professor Allen Whitman. He's played by Roland I do say,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: why Bengo with Bengo?
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: We Bengo?
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but I accented the y pretty heavy there. Yeah
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: with Benga. Sorry, no, not with okay we Benga Okay, okay.
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: Uh So he he wakes up. He comes actually screaming
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: out from a nightmare because his phone is ringing and
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: he's he's receiving a call from a character simply titled Priest,
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: and Priest tells him, Hey, we got you a substitute teacher.
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: Don't worry about going in. We need you in the office.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: To sum it up, that's not how this movie's written,
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: but you know this, sum it up. We need you
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: in the office. We got you a substitute teacher. I
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: don't know about you, guys, those were the best days
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: of school when your teacher was run like five minutes late,
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: You're like, where's our teacher? And then all of a
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: sudden a sub walked in. Hell yeah, all four.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: Of that cardon and the TV with some national geographic
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: videos to watch. Oh nice man, those were the days.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: And this, uh, and this part of the movie is
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: actually where I have a couple of my first talking
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: points notes he would like to get into that. So
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: after yeah, so after he wakes up from the dream,
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: where I could say, before he wakes up from the dream,
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: you guys mentioned that the closet is basically like a
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: portal to the nightmare unconscious, which I thought was, you know,
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: pretty cool, because as soon he sees in that closet
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: and sees the spider, he wakes up from that nightmare,
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: basically not really knowing that he's about to go into
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: another nightmare, another spiderweb.
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yes.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: And then also there were references of two books behind
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: the main character after he woke up from the bed,
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: one being The Promised Land The Adventures Encounters in Wild America,
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: and the one that I was focusing on is The
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: Thorn Birds, which I will I don't know, maybe I'm
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: looking a little too far into it, but I'll get
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: to that at that point of the movie. And I but, uh,
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: the thorn bird, for someone that knows, is a mythical
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: creature that supposedly searches for a perfect thorn from the
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: moment the moment it hatches when it finds that thorn
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: and impales itself and sings for the first and last
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: time in its life. And uh, yeah, I'll get to
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I'll get back to that when we get to that
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: point of the movie. Maybe I don't know, I might
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: be looking a little bit too into it.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: But but here's my thing though, And here here's why
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: I love having Ryan on for this because to anybody
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: looking to get into like critical, like really getting into
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: like critically analyzing movies like this, this this becomes important
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: where you have to look in the background. You have
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: to look at things because directors, set designers, production designers
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: there there are always clues hitting in the background. And
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: sometimes it's nothing, sometimes it's everything. You know, you have
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: you have moments like mid Simar where the movie is
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: literally painted on the walls of the the Uh, I
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: don't know the area that they stay in, And if
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: you look at the paintings, you can see the entire
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: plot of the movie. Unfold. And then you have other
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: times where I know, I've listened to interviews with directors
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: and people will do this. They'll bring up some weird
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: thing in the background. The directors like, I have no
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: idea what the hell you're talking about. So yeah, you
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: have like to you know, two sides of it. But
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: in this case, we don't have anything to go off
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: on this movie, so we can only look and say
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: that that these were probably put there for a reason.
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: I would suppose, I would guess.
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: Right, especially if it's something as known as The Thornbirds.
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: I mean, it's literally the best selling Australian novel of
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: all time. So if it's if you're going to reference
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: something in genre cinema, it's got to be something that's
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: well known for an entire nation like that, and because
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: of that, it's something that it will be able to
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: be caught worldwide if somebody sees it.
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, It's not like Professor Whitman wakes up from his
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: nightmare and there's The Hunger Games on his back on
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: his backboard there. He's like, sorry, I was up late
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: reading doing research for my next class on songbirds and snakes.
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean? It just doesn't have the
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: same effect. But this is where this movie kind of
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: gets really gets interesting and strange for me, because it's
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: at this point that Alan gets up out of bed,
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: he goes outside, he greets his neighbor, he gets into
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: his bright red Cadillac, which is, for some reason, such
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: a stark. I did not expect. I thought he was
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: gonna get out and get into like a beige colored Mercedes.
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: Did not expect the bright red Cadillac. We were introduced
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: to the jazz score that we talk about earlier, which
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: is the only time in the movie I believe where
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: we get that type of music. It's very odd. Uh.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: And then we arrived to what is a typical American
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: corporate office and they're in Dallas, if I remember correctly.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: And this is a really interesting point because at this
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: at this time, we're introduced to three characters. We're introduced
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: to Priest. That's that's literally all his name is according
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: to IMDb. Uh. We're also introduced to Chancellor Hubbard, and
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: we're also introduced to Frank am I right on that.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: I think so though sound right, It's just it sounds
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: hilarious describing them like that. It was so odd.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's there's Fry I don't I like just priest,
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: that's my favorite. That's at least his name wasn't father,
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: just just father. But we arrived at the corporate office,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: we meet these three characters, and this is where the
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: plot unfolds. We basically find out that Alan has been
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: heading this research project and everybody reporting back. All the
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: researchers out in the field have reported back except one
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: that is Professor or I'm sorry, yeah, Professor Roth, and
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: he's the only one who has not reported back. He's
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: in Budapest, and the team needs him to go to
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Budapest because they need this research, and Alan has been
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: spearheading this thing. They believe he can go and get
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: the research that he was about to provide in this
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: check in, which was going to be probably one of
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: the most crucial parts of research they were going to get.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, all communication disappears. But
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: there's something interesting that you guys talk about in this scene, Chuck,
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: that you found in the commentary.
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, I believe it was you Ryan that mentioned that
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: the three gentlemen represent the three powers of America, which
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: is religion, education, and capitalism.
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: More more relevant today, than ever. Yeah.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've found that very interesting that you thought of that.
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that and combining that with this I don't know,
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: sort of vague like bubbling under the surface project that
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: we don't know a lot about that's called I think
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: it's called in textas who is the name? That all
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: feels like this weird, you know, conspiracy type of thing,
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: and when you realize, i mean, we've got everybody that's
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: in power working together towards this one project. We don't
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: know what it is yet. That's like one of the
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: most creepy things that we can all relate to because
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: we've heard stories like this our entire lives. We've heard
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: about people controlling some of the outcomes and like I said,
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: more relevant today now than ever, when we've got people literally,
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: you know, swaying elections based on the money that they have.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: It's it's crazy that we can we can see for
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: decades stuff like this planted in popular culture, and it's
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: so obvious that we were going to get to some
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: of these places, just sort of seeing how capitalism were
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: to carry itself out over the years.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and everybody has their hand and everything, you know,
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, the the church, the church gets its due
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: that the funder gets his due, education gets their due
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: in some way, and it's it's just really interesting again,
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: how a movie like this throws in something that can
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: be perceived as incredibly deep and incredibly relevant, because the
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: movie never explores this like further than this, like we
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: will see these characters again, but it's not like we
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: unravel this this plot that involves these three. They're they're
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: just they're just this send off on the Quest, as
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: you guys talk about. So it's really really interesting, and
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: it gets more interesting because it's at this point in
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: the movie where we see a big visual change, because
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: we go from the very clean, sterile offices of Corp
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: America and we jump cut to the stark sharpness and
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: beautiful architecture of Budapest, and also the beautiful architecture of Genevieve,
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: who was played by you like that, who was played
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: by Paola Rinaldi. I guess, I guess it's how I'm
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: going to say it. She is Roth's assistant, and she
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: obviously picks up Alan from the airport, and this is
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: a stark contrast both in setting and in style because
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: we're introduced to a lot of interesting visual change ups
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: in this, especially when we arrive at Roth's building with
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: some of the visual stuff which Chuck you picked up
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: on as well.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: Yes, there was a shift in the movie style with
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: I believe you said was a Dutch angles. There was
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: a color palette swap, get just an overall visual overhaul
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: from what we're where we were just at.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you can see they definitely wanted to make them
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: appear very different. I mean there's there's not really anything
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: that you can say, oh, yeah, this is the same
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: as they were just filming it in Texas. It's all
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: starkly different. I mean going from straight on like single
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: camera shots to you know, somebody literally like getting down
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: on the ground and filming upwards so that they can
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: see the height of the building exaggerated in the background,
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: which wasn't done a single time in any of the
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: setup before this.
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and the Dutch angle is really important because the
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: Dutch angle, just for everybody, anybody listening who doesn't know
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: it's it's it could be the slightest tilt in the
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: in the framing, So it's a slight tilt in the
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: change of the axes. So essentially, in this point when
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Alan is in front of Roth's building or I guess
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: this is kind of like a I guess it's kind
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: of like a complex, because I don't think he's the
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: only building in here. I don't, I don't, I don't know.
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: I guess it's a complex. We're introduced to this really
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: wick a Dutch angle. The camera's tilted and it's very
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: unsettling because it comes out of nowhere and it's instantly alarming.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: We know we're somewhere different, we know things have changed
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: very suddenly. And this style continues on because as we
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: enter Roth's kind of complex in the main area, it's
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: it's stunning. There's a full on tree in this in
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: this courtyard, and we're introduced to we're not introduced, but
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: we see the first of a townsperson. It's a it's
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: a kid on the swing and he is just staring
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: Alan down, unbreakable stare. All of this. It just kind
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: of instantly catches your attention. Nothing before made you think like,
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: oh okay, this is like, this is alarming, this is threatening.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: This is the point where things really begin to change,
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: and it gets even weirder. As we go into Ross's building,
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: we meet his wife in as well, so we meet her.
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: That is Celia Roth. She's played by Margareta von Krauss.
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: Krause sounds right.
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: This is gonna be a running theme this whole entire time.
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: And she's also very alarming the way that she plays
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: his role. It's very very stand up. She's talking about
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: his declining health, how he's sick, and we we believe that.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: We're like, okay, this is why communication has stopped. Clearly
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: he's he's getting ill. But once we meet Professor Roth,
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: who's played by this name, I'm definitely gonna messuf Attilla
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Attila Attila Lote. He was listed as on IMDBA Attila Lote.
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Once we
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: meet him, there's this really weird kind of dynamic where
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: one thing I like about this moment is there there
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: is an idea if you ever work in position of leadership,
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: there is this idea in one that you actually kind
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: of want to avoid for the most part, if you
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: work with people where if you if I was to
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: interview you and I sit in a chair that is
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: seated higher than you are, there's an assumption of power there,
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: or that I am essentially overpowering you by doing that right,
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: this is this is kind of classic psychology when it
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: comes to interviewing techniques and stuff like that. And as
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: we enter into Roth's study area, Uh, there's a staircase
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: that leads down and his wife remains at the top
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: of the stairs. We have Alan who walks down a level,
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: and then we have Wroth on the ground and she's
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: telling him he's acting like he doesn't really know what's
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: going on. And then we have Alan who's acting like he,
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: I mean, this guy never knows what's going on ever
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: at any point in this movie, So he's acting like,
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: we don't know what's going on. She is clearly in
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: a position of power because he is Oh my god,
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: did you hear that lisp come out?
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: Okay?
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: That was that was wild? Uh, Professor Roth. Clearly there
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: there's some sort of dynamic here that is that is
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: very off, and us as the audience, we're just as
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: lost as as Roth is, because we don't know if
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: this is true, is this fake? Like what's happening? And
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: then that all comes to ahead when Roth's wife finally leaves,
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: Roth begins speaking, He goes up the stairs, closes the door,
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: and we really get into the plot of this which
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: he hands over a what is it a tablet that
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: he hands him.
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's the way that I interpreted it.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's like a To me, it's like an
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: Indiana Jones scribe on a Jablin. Right, he hands them
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: the scribe tells him essentially like, hey, get out of here.
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: Stuff's not right here. You gotta get away. Uh. And
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: there's a of interesting stuff that happens in the scene.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: I am a visual guy, right, I love I love
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: interesting camera movements. I love all of that. But there
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: are two shots in the scene that are incredibly out
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: of nowhere that made me unsettled. And they're they're they're
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: wonderful shots. But up until this point, the movie is
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: all pretty static. There's not a lot of movement in
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: the camera. Uh. But there's an interesting shot when Alan
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: is standing in front of Roth, where the camera Dolly's
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: forward passed Alan and it focuses on Roth, and it
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: was just sort of interesting to have this this this
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: sudden cut to this movement, and it does bring a
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: level of a level of just just something unsettling to it.
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: But then there's another shot only a couple seconds later
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: where the camera Dolly's down from the ceiling, and it's
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: it's very interesting it they're they're they're very weird camera
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: movements that do not establish anything else. They're just they
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: just happened to come out of nowhere. But it's kind
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: of part of the charm of this movie. And I
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: feel like as a as a lover of Italian cinema,
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: you kind of get used to that because they do
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: that a lot. There's not a lot of like visual coordination.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: It's just like, oh, hey, here's a cool shot, and
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: then it's edited into the mix, you know what I mean,
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: It's that's just what they do. To me. Watching the
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: movie a second time, it continued to unnerve me, and
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: I kind of I think that there is some sort
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: of meaning behind that, there's a storytelling choice behind that,
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: But I don't know how you guys feel about that.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Maybe I'm looking into it too deeply.
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: Well, that was the trouble with this commentary, because we
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: could we could sit here and analyze every single choice
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: all day and say that it means something. And literally
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: they were just kind of hanging out with four different
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: writers going well, this sounds fun, let's see how that looks,
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: and then it works out and they're like, hey, that's
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: kind of cool, let's just throw that in there. But
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: I mean with I mean, especially with the Italian cinema overall,
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: there's so many times where you watch things and you
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: kind of just have to think, yeah, this made me
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: feel not like scared necessarily and unnerved. Might be even
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: slightly too like strong of an emotion, but at least
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: I just feel like something's off. And by the second
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: or third time that I saw this for research purposes,
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: at least that second or third time, I went, oh,
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: that that camera coming down from the ceiling, it's almost
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: like a spider descending from a web.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah it is. It is because we know, you know,
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: we're gonna get to Roth's fate, but we know. And
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: both times that these cameras move, they move directly towards Roth.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: There is no dolly zoom on Alan, There's no dolly
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: zoom on Roth's wife.
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: It dismisses him entirely.
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, it just both of these shots are on Wroth,
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: and I think it kind of brings some attention to
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: his fate. Like the first time I was like, oh,
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: that's okay, these are interesting. The second time I was like,
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: knowing what's coming. I feel like that that that kind
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: of worked really well for me. But again, you know,
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: maybe we're looking too differently, too too much into this,
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: but it's just it's it's at this point in the
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: movie where things start getting really weird. You have a
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: bogie ball that gets thrown through the window, uh, out
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: of nowhere, which is like, I I didn't even know
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: what a bogieball was up until last summer when my
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: wife's dad made me play bogieball, and right when the
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: right when it came through the window, I was like,
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: is that a bogie ball? Nice? So, you know, just interesting,
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: little fine there. But at this point in the movie,
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: we we meet back up with Genevieve. So Alan leaves
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: and he's got this scribe I'm gonna say with him. Uh.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: He walks outside. We meet up with Genevieve again, who
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: is walking this time she's not driving, uh, And we're
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: brought to the hotel where we're where we meet an
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: incredibly interesting character. Here we run into missus Kuhn in
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: the lobby of the hotel room. Who is this start Like,
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: I mean, her presence on screen is incredibly demanding, Like
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: she's I mean, in the movie, she appears tall, thin,
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: she has that awesome red hair, and she just is
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: very commanding. There's like an authority to her. And right
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: away the moment we see her, we have a couple
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: additional shots of other people in the lobby of the
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: hotel who were staring at Alan. Right away, I'm like, Okay,
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: something's up with this chick. Immediately. Red hair always gives
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: it away. Anyway, red hair to me, you know, there's something, something,
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: something suspicious there. But it's just just the amount of
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: authority that she demanded coming in and kind of Genevieve's
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: reaction to her kind of she you know, you get
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: that feeling of almost like the queen bee, you know,
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: at least that's how I interpreted. I guess, Chuck, we're
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: on the same page with that.
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, of course.
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right, cool. So we're introduced to missus Coon,
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: and this is coming up to one of my favorite
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: shots in the movie, where Alan is up in his
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: hotel room. And as a visual guy, this is when
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: a cinematography for me really works because this hotel room
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: is colored beautifully. We have Alan is at his desk,
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: we have the yellow light of the lamp. But then
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: we have this beautiful blue light coming in from outside
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: into his room, and it's stunning. I can't imagine what
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: I have never seen this on a rip, never seen
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: this on VHS, But I can't imagine that these colors
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: did not you know, that they stood out even one
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: tenth what they look like on I don't even have
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: the four K. I have the blu ray, which is
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: still the four K, you know, restoration just downscaled a
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: little bit. But this hotel room is colored beautifully. Like
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: this is the start to me where we really really
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: really begin to see the talent behind the camera here,
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: Like this is when it's all coming together. And as
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: somebody who really appreciates good lighting and storytelling through lighting
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: and through production design, this to me is when I
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: started thinking about the research that I was doing on
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: our cast and our crew, and I'm like, like, where
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: have these people been? Like there was true effort put
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: into this movie, true effort. I mean, we're coming out
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: of think of Hollywood cinema at this point. The slasher
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: is dying. At this point, you know that genre is
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: running on fumes almost to the point where we're only
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: a couple of years out from it officially being declared
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: dead for a number of years, the Jallo genre, which
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: this is when we start seeing that influence incredibly heavy
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: in the movie. It has been dead for and when
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: I say dead, dormant that the peak has now passed.
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: The jallo genre has been gone for a while. Italian
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: cinema at this time, as you guys say in the commentary,
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: has kind of become extreme. And to look at the
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: people behind this and not see incredible portfolios before this
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: or after this, it is incredible, and to me it's
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: a little bit like shocking and a little bit perplexing
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: because you would think on first glance that this movie
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: was shot by people who would work with you know
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: or you know, people that would work with the best
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: of the best Argento, col G Martine, all those of
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: the world. You would think that's that's who's behind this,
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: But no, we have almost a bunch of unrecognizables.
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: The hard part too with that is it's it's the
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: late eighties and a lot of this Sure it looks great,
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: but by this time none of it is truly innovative.
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: So it's definitely creative to put it together in this
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: order to tell this story. But it's not like they're
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: creating new ways to get these colors on the screen
• 44:21
  Speaker 3: or to you know, feel that claustrophobia in the scene
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: with the sheets that we get later in the film.
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: There's so much that is done in this movie that
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: has technically been done before, and honestly, Italian cinema is
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: kind of known for that. They ate a lot of
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: things that they see elsewhere, and that's how we get
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: like six different Demons movies and you know, the spaghetti
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: western that takes from everything that came before it. But
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: that's not necessarily a bad thing. Is this is truly
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: like a work of art, a great piece of cinema
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: that borrows from a lot of influences. We can see
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: that for sure in so many different ways. That doesn't
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: make it bad. It doesn't. It's not an inherently bad
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: thing that they're taking from some of the masters to
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: put something beautiful on screen because it works.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well you have there's a difference between, you know,
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: just a blatant rip off and paying homage to because
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: I think if you want to think in the modern
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: day context, I think of what Ty West has done
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: with his ex trilogy, his Maxine trilogy, where he did
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: not rip off three different what I considered eras of cinema.
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: He paid homage and it works because it is done.
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: We've seen it all before, but it's done with such
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: respect that we appreciate it. And that's kind of what's
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: happening here, especially if you want to look at late
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: seventies Argento, which I most of the colors pretty much
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: give me from this point moving forward. But the scene
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: here we have a lot of hitchcock and plan ski.
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: When Alan shuts off his light and he looks at
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: his window and sees of Eve, who lives conveniently directly
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: across the way, conveniently has no shades, no curtains, nothing
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: blocking the windows, and of course it's getting changed in
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: a mirror seductively at a perfect angle for Alan to
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: see this. And this is when again we can make
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: all the attachments to the web. You know, she is
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: what better than to influence a young American then with
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: a beautiful woman? Yep, you know they're I don't don't,
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: I don't know of a better way to do that,
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: and she is the perfect And this moment, if he
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: was not attached before, this moment kind of seals the
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: deal because it is done in a seductive manner. But
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: it's this beautiful shot. This this shot is framed so well,
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: and we'll see this again where it's two massive windows
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: and it's framed so perfectly. She's in that bottom thirds
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: of the of the shot. It's it's it's wonderful. It's
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: it's it's so good. That's that's the only way I
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: can He's planned. It's so good. And again this comparison
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: to being in a web. He's slowly becoming attached to her.
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: Clearly wants to do, you know, some things with her.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: You know, he wants that that attraction is there. As
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: you do, as you do, as you do. It begins
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: a storm and Alan decides, I gotta go see Roth.
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: You know, Roth asked him to come back later. He's like,
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: I gotta go see Roth. It's pouring down rain. He
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: goes to leave the hotel. Of course they don't want
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: him to, you know. He runs into missus coutin and
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: as he's running out and stuff. He runs out. It's raining,
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: and this is where we're introduced to a character known
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: as Mysterious Man. That's it Uh, played by William Berger,
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: who gives a great performance as a mysterious man. He
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: is trying to warn him, trying to tell him, Hey,
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: get away from here. This is dangerous. You don't want
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: to be here for you know, Derek, You're getting caught
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: up into web. You don't need to be here. You
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: need to get away. Alan's trying to fight them off
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: leave me alone. But just to kind of talk about
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: Alan for a second, you guys point out in the
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: commentary how this guy never has any idea what's happening.
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: And there is kind of some vocal people on the
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: internet who wrote reviews saying that his performance is bad. Right. I,
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: upon further watches, I do not agree with that. I
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: think this was purposeful. And this is where I say
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: that movies need to be watched more than once, right,
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: because on that first viewing, we as an audience are
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: just as lost as he is. We have no idea
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: what's going on, and my reaction to everything is almost
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: the same as his. What is going on? What is happening?
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: And I genuinely believe that as we dive deeper into
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: this movie, which we're already halfway through, you know what
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: I mean, We're already nearly forty minutes into this movie,
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: that only runs eighty two minutes. Anyway, as the movie
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: goes on and we dive deeper and dive deeper, you
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: kind of question everything about this character because we don't
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: know if this is fate, if this was if he
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: was born into this world to come to the destiny
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: that he is. He's clearly very book smart. He is
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: a professor of Oriental language. Would you guys speak about
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: obviously very intelligent, very BookSmart. But I do think he
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: lacks the street smarts. He doesn't really know. He's socially weird.
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: He's just kind of always seems a little lost in conversation.
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: You know, clearly you guys talk about in a commentary,
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: But I'm going to open it up to you Ryan
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: and to Chuck. What did you guys think of this performance?
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: And do you think he was one of two one
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: of only two actors who were dubbed in this movie.
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: Do you think this performance is intentional or do you
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: think there was some weird disconnect in the dubbing that
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: made it come out weird? Like what is your guys
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: thoughts on this character as a whole?
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: Go ahead, Chuck, I would kind of say it's kind
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: of purposeful because like it was said in the commentary.
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: He's a stranger in a strange land, and he's been
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: sent to this place to uncover what was happening with Roth.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: And as soon as he meets up with Roth, you know,
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: he's given all this information, he's given a tablet with
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: a spider on it. He doesn't know what the hell's
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: going on anymore. So I'd say it was kind of
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: purposeful to be like that sense of just, you know,
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: not knowing what's going on or what to do in
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: this situation.
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, i'd say, I mean, in many situations, there's a
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: fine line between naive and ignorant, and I it kind
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: of sounds mean to say, but I could see this
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: leaning towards both sides at different places in this film.
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: And yeah, I mean, he's certainly naive in the fact
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: that he's just kind of going along with the flow
• 51:04
  Speaker 3: for everything. He's not really a proactive individual. He's very
• 51:08
  Speaker 3: much a reactive individual. But where you see like the
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: general worry he is, he's a researcher. He's an educated individual.
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: He's somebody who's an educator, which means he looks at
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: the situation and analyzes it, and sometimes that means going
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: in with your experiences in your toolkit and that's it,
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: and saying, well, what is happening? What do we have here?
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: Who are main players? How do we respond to this?
• 51:36
  Speaker 3: And Yeah, like Chuck said, when you walk into a
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: situation and you're given a freakin tablet and you're told
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: hide this from people, keep this a secret, and you're like, dude,
• 51:47
  Speaker 3: I don't even know why I'm in Budapest? What is happening? How?
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, how else do you expect him to act?
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: And respond to this? Like? He's not a bad actor, clearly,
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: There's so many things that he pulls off in this
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: movie that a bad actor could not do. Because nothing
• 52:03
  Speaker 3: in this movie, nothing in this movie comes across to
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: me at least as forced. Everything feels earnest, And there
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: are plenty of movies that tried to be earnest that
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: come across as forced that we call bad movies quite
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: often or qualified as bad acting at least because somebody's
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: giving one hundred and fourteen percent when they only really
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: needed to give sixty. This guy's required to give thirty.
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: And because of that, a lot of people, just like
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: the story is doing to us, we feel like something
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: is off those Dutch angles are already making you on edge.
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: And now when somebody's not solving everything and being a hero,
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: your American mind is thinking, well, something's broken here, this
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: doesn't work. That's just not the way the movie was made.
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, And I always think about how I think
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: that a problem with modern day movies especially is you're
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: giving way too much information, like you have exhibitions exposition
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: dumps after exposition dumps, and you just like it ruins
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: the movie when you don't when you're giving the audience
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: too much, right because you no longer have to work
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: to figure anything out. In this case, we're given nothing.
• 53:14
  Speaker 3: There.
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: There is not a single inkling of help anywhere, And
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: to me, that works best and again it justifies subsequent viewings.
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: It makes you want to go back and look for
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: the details and look for all the little clues that
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: are there of kind of like, not not to figure
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: everything out in the first, you know, half hour, because
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: I don't think you can, but to kind of see
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: the subtleties in performance, to see how the other characters
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: in this act are moving alan forward, all the things
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: that are happening. And I think people people do this thing,
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: and I especially find this with like what I would
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: call the letterboxed reviewers, where it's like a one time stance.
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: You know, they watched the movie once there is the
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: final conclusion, and they will never give another opportunity to it.
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: And I don't think that's beneficial to one film criticism,
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: and I don't think that's beneficial to film as a whole,
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: because not everything is made to be understood in that
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: single viewing. And especially when you're going back to this
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: time in cinema, Italian cinema, especially more times than none,
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: the amount of times I'll watch a movie, and it
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: happens a lot with international film films, where I'll watch
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: a movie and the first time I'm like, eh, I
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: don't know, maybe I wasn't in a mood, or maybe
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: I was just in a different you know, a funk
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: or whatever, just wasn't into it. And then a couple
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: months later, I'm like, yeah, let me there is a
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: little bit of a pool to revisit it. Like I'll
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: see something on the shelf and I'll go, yeah, you know,
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: I didn't like that movie, but I got to revisit it,
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: and then I'll rewatch it. I'm like, damn, I love it,
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: really different opinion. So this is one of those movies
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: I think, and especially like in this restoration. Now that
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: we're able to have it on a shelf and pick
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: it up at any time and watching and watch it,
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: I encourage anybody who does give this a go to
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: give it another go, maybe even a third, be like
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: Chuck and I or like you and Will leading up
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: to the commentary, give it a go over and over
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: and over again, because all these little details that you
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: pick up are great and help the movie so much,
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: so so much. And one of the details that I
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: picked up is actually in a scene coming up because
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: Roth is in the rain, he gets away from mysterious
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: man or Wroth, I said, Roth Alan is in the rain,
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: he gets away from the mysterious man. We see a
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: very odd shot of the I didn't notice the police
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: outside of Roth's house. I noticed the amount of people
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: with black umbrellas, which was very odd, and then there
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: was like one white umbrella in the bunch. It was
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: very odd. Like I was like, man, there's more bystanders
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: here than there are police. And at first I didn't
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: even I didn't know that something was wrong that involved police.
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: I just thought there was a gathering outside of Roth's place,
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: and we quickly find that there are police there, and
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: it's because Roth is dead, for lack of a better word,
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: and he is hanging in his apartment surrounded in spiderwebs,
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: not to a point like he's not in a cocoon
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: or anything, but there are spiderwebs on him. There's a
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: really gross effect that they don't focus on. I wish
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: they did of his tongue hanging out of his mouth,
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: and his tongue is clearly like the size of his
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: of his face. They made it very big. I think
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: they knew they were only going to see it in
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: that establishing shot, so you had to, you know, make
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: it bigger. But Roth is dead, and we know, like
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: we're in We're in the thick of it. Shit is
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: going on. The detectives are the detectives questioning Alan because
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: who is this guy we have? We have an American?
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: What'd he have to do with him? He came and
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: see him earlier. Alan's trying to tell him, hey, man,
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: I was here, there was something odd, his wife was here.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: A bochi ball came through the window. The window is
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: no longer broken repared now, yeah, yeah, it's repaired and
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: it just makes them seems like he's losing his mind now,
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: Like just the look he gives after realizing the windows fixed,
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: He's just like what Yeah? And the only the only
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: people who can who can connect him are Genevieve who
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: dropped him off, who she is there as well? You
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: have the wife who is not there any longer. She's
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: just magically up and gone.
• 57:40
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: And everything he's saying is kind of worth questioning. We
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: as an audience know what happened because we saw it,
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: or so we think we saw it. Uh. But yeah,
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: so now there's a lot of eyes on on Alan.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: It's it's it's suspicious. And this is when the web.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: This is almost like, in my opinion, like this is
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: the the surrounding. This is when heians getting in and
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: they're purposely, i think, trying to drive him to a
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: certain point of kind of questioning why he's there, what's
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: going on, get him lost, get him confused, do all
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: of that. So and this come this cuts to, in
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: my opinion, the most fascinating scene of this movie, which
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: is the dinner scene with Genevieve. And just to kind
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: of paint the scene, we have the setup of the
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: restaurant inside of the hotel they are on. There's almost
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: three floor or there's two floors, so they're eating at
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: the bottom. And then we see clearly that around the
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: perimeter there is a lifted area where other people are eating.
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: And the scene is so well done because there's no music.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: At the beginning of the scene, it's simply other eating dinner.
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: Missus Kun is there. But slowly we begin to notice
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: people in the background staring at Alan, and the camera
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: is kind of focusing on the subjects as a as
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: a turn and they look at Alan. But then we notice,
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: which is really cool, that Alan notices they're staring at.
• 59:16
  Speaker 4: Him, like he knows he's staring right back a lot
• 59:20
  Speaker 4: of times, and as the scene goes on, it's very unsettling.
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: But at the same time, Genevieve is trying to get
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: this information out of him. She's she's encouraging him to
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: divulge in her and to build this trust, continuing to
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: pull her into or pull him into her web. Let's
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: build trust, bring me into what's going on. Let's do
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: this together. I'll help you. Meanwhile, everyone his eyes on Allan,
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: and then in the weirdest bit, everybody just gets up
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: and leaves, which is so incredibly unsettling and and strange
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 1: to me. And it shot so well because again, everything
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: is so still. There's no there's no music to amp
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: a anything up. The camera's not doing anything crazy. We
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: have these static shots of people looking at him, and
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: a lot of stuff just kind of happens in the background.
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: We kind of see people get up and leave slowly,
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: and you know, it's a very odd, very very odd
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 1: scene that each well, each time I rewatched this, I
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: just kept enjoying. Like by the third time I watched
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: the movie, I was like, dude, this is this is
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: so cool, Like this is cool filmmaking to me. Yeah,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: it's so it's it's so awesome. And it's such a
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: unique way to tell this story because we're also introduced
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: to Maria, who works at the hotel. And the introduction
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: of this characters is very very quick because Alan goes
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: back up to his apartment. Marie, well, he goes up,
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: He goes back up to his apartment. Uh, their dinner's over.
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: He goes to his apartment, I'm sorry, to his hotel room,
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: and then we have kind of a repeat of the
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: scene earlier where uh, he's up there lights are off.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: He looks out the window, and this time Genevieve is
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: across the way, straight up, naked like not trying to
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: If you thought maybe that first time was accidental, clearly
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: it is no longer, because not only is she full
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: on dude, but she goes to the window and just
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: straight like spread on the window facing Alan in his room.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: And again it shot beautifully like. We have the beautiful colors,
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: the yellows, the reds, the blues of Allen's hotel room.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: We have the perfect framing of the windows. It's very
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: Roman Polanski the tenant. It's very rear window Hitchcock. That's
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: what I get from it. We see the mysterious man,
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: and this is actually my favorite part of it. You see,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: we cut down to the mysterious man who is on
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: the ground and he peers up and sees Alan looking
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: out of his window. We see the mysterious man turn
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: his head and then we see a new Genevieve in
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: her window, and you know, he knows what's going on.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: This mysterious man knows like he's like, Okay, I gotta
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: help this guy, like he's getting pulled in uh. And
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: there is a it's not a knock, the door handle
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: begins to turn very suspiciously. I don't know why she
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: felt the need to just forcefully enter and slowly turn
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: the door knob. But Maria is at the door, and
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: there's an interesting color palette here. I think of the
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: hallway behind her being like a stark red hallway, dark red. Yeah,
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: like if no moment in this movie is more more
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: argento than the next ten minutes in my opinion, And Chuck,
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: I don't know up to this point because I don't
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: have my notes in front of me for your for
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: your commentary bits, anything, anything to bring up in these
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: in these moments we've been talking about.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: Well before entering the dinner scene, there was mentioned that
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: the movie may have taken inspiration from HP Lovecraft's data
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: over in Smith, which we'll find out later on what
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: that would be all about, but let's just say, you know,
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: pounds people acting very strangely and oddly. And also the
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: scene with Genevieve in the window was referenced that she
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: kind of looks like a black widow, if you will,
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: with the dark hair and the red lipstick and the
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: menace and stare.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: Especially the pose with their arms outstretched too.
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: I wonder if this is a case of I always
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: wonder when I watch these rests. Sometimes in my opinion,
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: I think some of these scenes sell what they're trying
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: to do better in lower definition, like lower quality, because
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 1: there's just like a certain charm to it. But all
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: these scenes look so good. This restoration is absolutely incredible.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 3: It's mind blowing.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. And I did not put together in my head
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: the black Widow bit the first time I watched it.
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: I didn't even put together the change in hair. Throughout
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: the movie, I didn't even notice that. But the moment
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: you guys said that in the commentary, I was like, oh,
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: this makes so much sense, and I could see it,
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So it's an incredible scene.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: But to get back to what's happening, Maria knocks on
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: the door to talk to Alan. She's interrupted by missus Koon.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: Maria is sent off, and this is where we kind
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: of see the odd place that Maria stays, which is
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: like the she like stays right off of like the
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: laundry room, the laundry draw ying room, and we see
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 1: her kind of getting ready for she gets ready for
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 1: bed and right outside of her room, which I don't
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: think has a door either. Uh. There is a bunch
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: of sheets drying, and the movie enters a very like
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: dream like quality here because this this doesn't feel real,
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: The setting doesn't feel real. It feels very fantastical. And
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: we're not even into the coloring yet. Because this is
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: the first we're what forty five fifty minutes into the movie,
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: and we're gonna get our first kill, our first victim,
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: which is Maria and she, I believe, if I remember correctly, so,
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: the baji I called the Bagiball. Uh, the Bogiball lands
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: in the hallway she does. She hear a noise and
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: gets up. I forget what gets her to get up
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: out of bed? Does anybody remember?
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 2: Believe it may have just been the botchy ball.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it may have been abound. Yeah, I think that's
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: what gets her up. She goes into she enters this
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: hallway of sheets, which turns out to be, if anybody
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 1: wants to guess it, a labyrinth of sheets, a never
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 1: ending maze of sheets. And she is being chased down
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: by somebody who is reaching at her through the sheets.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: And this is incredibly effective. Like it this to me
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: is a nightmare. I mean, I think of When I
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: think of sheets, I think of Halloween, you know, Laurie
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 1: looking out the window, Michael's down at the drying sheets.
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: And oddly enough, I think of Texas Shaantsawmasker the beginning
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: when the one brother is running from leather Face and
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 1: he is running through the drying sheets, and leather Face
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: hacks off his leg and you have the great blood
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: splatter on the sheets. And so I don't know why
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: that's what my brain goes to. It's just stuck somewhere
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: in my head.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: But we also have a big change in color palette.
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: All of a sudden, we have these very stark greens, yeah,
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 1: painting the scene, and we we get our first glance
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 1: at who is going to be committing these killings. And
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: I don't know how to describe her look. It's it's
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: it's really uh, I don't know, because somebody help. What
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: does she look like like? How how could you describe
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: her appearance?
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 2: It's kind of hard man, It's it's she looks weird
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: with the fangs and the messed up hair and the
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 2: like kind of sunken eyes. In a way, she looks crazy.
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: It's a very unique villain. There's not really anything to
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: compare to. I mean, she's got this like maniacal look
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 3: on her face, and her hair is like matted and
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 3: scraggling in different directions, which you can almost compare to
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: Spider Legs right there. And then she's got this long,
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 3: like black flowing thing that she's wearing, and she she's
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: prepared to dole out her punishment there.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, she's And it's really scary when when she
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: comes out of those sheets and you get that first
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: full view of her. It's it's terrifying, it really is,
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: because she this is where, this far into the movie
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: and we see her very suddenly. There has been no
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 1: build up to this. There's not like, you know, we
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: haven't seen glimpses of it and other nightmares or anything. Nothing.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: It just comes out of nowhere. She's chasing Maria down,
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: taunting her, finally gets her and in what is my opinion,
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: the best shot of this movie, which Severn was smart
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: enough to use on the slipcover, which I rival this,
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: I go back and forth. I rival this with the
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: key scene in the sect, Michael Swabby's the Sect. She
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: gets slashed and she ends up behind a one of
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: the hanging sheets. And her face she's yelling or screaming
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: and her face is pressed up against the sheet and
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: it's such a cool shot with the greens.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 3: Super cool shot.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, flashing onto this and it makes such a haunting silhouette.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: And this is where she gets stabbed in the head
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: through the sheet, and you know, there, there it is.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: You have your first and almost an hour into this movie,
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: finally you have a killer and you have a death.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: So to you, guys, you know, think about like, you know,
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 1: kill scenes always a big topic of conversation. How does
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: the scene work for you?
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 2: I love this scene. I thought that kill was so
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: good I actually rewinded it quite a few times. This
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 2: particular scene in general, the whole feeling of being a
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: what's the word I'm looking for or just suffocated by
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: the sheets and her running around and being chased by
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: this killer. And as said in the commentary, the green
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 2: lighten used to represent evil in a way like an
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 2: old movies one being the wick at Witch of the
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 2: West from The Wizard of Us. But yet that scene,
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: just seeing the knife drive into the sheet and then
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: getting driven even deeper into the head and just watching
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: the blood pour from the sheet was just it's weird
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 2: to say it was kind of beautiful.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 3: It is, though, And what's funny. You know, we've talked
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 3: about her pressing up against that sheet, and it's kind
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 3: of hard to emphasize for those that have not seen
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 3: this yet how much pressing up the sheet kind of
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: undersells it because she is she is slammed against the sheet.
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 3: We're talking so much so that you can see individual
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 3: teeth through the sheet. Yeah, and that's what makes it iconic,
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 3: Like this, this is the first bit from this film,
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 3: is an immediate I will probably never forget this shot.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you know, if I was to go
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: right now into my bedroom and put my sheet up
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: against my face, you're not getting any sort of distinguishing
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 1: features out of it, you know, You're just not going
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: to And to me, it's almost like those I mean
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 1: I used to have when I was a kid. You
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 1: remember those little like toys that had the nails in it,
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: and you would like press your hand against it and
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: you would get a perfect imprint of your hand on
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: the other side. Like that's that's how clear we see
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: details of her face pressing up against the sheet so clearly.
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: I think the only way to achieve this would be
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: to you know, have some type of air blowing up
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: against the sheet against her face, but we don't see that.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 1: I don't see a lot of movement in the sheet.
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: So the only way I think you could really sell
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: this is to pretty much strap the sheet down from
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: the bottom, strap it up from the top, pretty much
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: skin tight, and then throw your body against it. Right,
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 1: That's the only way I can really see.
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 3: And probably have somebody push her from behind too.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, probably. It's it's such a it's such a
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 1: cool shot, and it's it's definitely to me a key moment.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: Anytime I think about this movie, that shot comes to mind,
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 1: that moment comes to mind. It is sort of like
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: the it is uh you know, it's it's on the
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: Severn packaging, It's on the back, it's on the slip cover.
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: As we talked about, it's a pretty iconic moment. And
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: I don't know watching this movie if this is like
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: it's so it's it's so incredibly dreamlike. And I say
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: that because during this Alan hears screams, and he gets
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: out of bed, and he begins kind of exploring, and
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: and we go into the weirdest moment when he he
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 1: finds Missus Koon in this room where we have the
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: establishing shot of the room where the camera appears to
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: be just at the entrance way, and the room cuts
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: and we have a wall in front of us where
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: they're the weirdest looking little doll I've ever seen in
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 1: my life is is sitting there and we have Missus
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: Coon sitting in a chair rocking a baby carriage, and
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: it's it's such an odd moment. And I don't know,
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: can you Ryan, as somebody who I would consider an
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: expert in this, in this scene or in this movie,
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: what do you think this scene is trying to to sell?
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: Like Chuck mentioned, does she sacrificed her baby? I don't
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 1: know how to interpret the scene.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, this is one specifically, when you are looking at
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 3: the entirety of the film, it does stick out as
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 3: a film that's already weird. With the capitol W that
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 3: we mentioned multiple times throughout this this is one that
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 3: is unnerving in like and I hate to use the
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 3: word again, but in weirder way than we've already seen
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 3: throughout the film. This is done in a way intentionally
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: simply with what is in front of the camera to
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 3: make you go, wait what, this is fucking weird and
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 3: it works. You know, you start to feel the claustrophobia
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 3: of a big city. You are stuck somewhere, you don't
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 3: know anybody else. You're now feeling panicked because you've heard
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 3: sounds and you're in this room and this lady that
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 3: you were introduced to just earlier today is in this
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 3: room with this weird fucking thing. Now what? And this
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 3: is one thing that I look back on because there
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 3: are multiple times in this movie that Alan literally says
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 3: to people something along the lines of what are you
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 3: trying to tell me? Or what are you saying? And
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 3: at this moment, he's just awestruck. He doesn't even know
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 3: how to say that, and he is so so caught
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 3: up in everything that he's deciding to do. This is
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: where I see that he's in that crossing line between
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 3: complete ignorance to complete naivety, because what do you do
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 3: after this? Who do you turn to? You're in Budapest
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 3: alone and you just watched you know, you're understanding that
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: people are now in danger. Great, now what? And now
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 3: I'm in this room?
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: Cool?
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 3: Here we go. It's about to go off the rails
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 3: even further.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and to argue against the people who criticize his performance.
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 1: This is not putting time change into the equivalent. This
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: is like less than twenty four hours after the scene
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 1: at the office, when he was even told he's going
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: to be set at the Budapest. I mean, I look
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 1: back at like the last day in my life, and
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 1: I have some moments where I'm like, what the hell
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 1: is going on? So you know what I mean, Like
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 1: at this part, I would be losing my mind. I mean,
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 1: he's pretty, he's pretty uh stoic, I think for being
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: somebody in this situation, especially when right after the scene
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: we cut to him just casually having lunch, you know,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: with with with Genevieve, and again we have Genevieve playing
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: along into into him, trying to unravel this mystery that
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 1: the trust she's really trying to build, the trust she's
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: obviously in on it. There're at lunch, They're at this
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 1: beautiful outdoor restaurant, and again people were staring. The detective
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: shows up. He pulls up and goes to the phone
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 1: booth to make a phone call. It's all very weird
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: and it's a very stark contrast to what we just
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: went through with with Marie's death and to see with
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: missus cooon. It almost feels like he went to bed
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: and had nightmares and then this is like the next morning.
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 1: It just it's it's very strange. Uh. He he needs
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 1: to find this antique shop in his owners try to
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: get information on what Roth has given him, this describe
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 1: and this tablet. So Genevieve says, oh, well, take my car.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 1: It's only so far, you know, go go to the
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 1: antique shop. And he's like, okay, cool. So he hops
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 1: into the car and this scene is so crazy because
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 1: he he's driving around Budapest and every turn he makes
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 1: the road is blocked. And I'm not talking blackhawk down
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 1: tires on fire blocked. I'm talking like fully constructed steel
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: gate blocked off, like in the streets are empty. It's
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 1: so odd, it's almost like a ghost town. The one
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 1: person he does talk to, who clearly we don't hear
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: the dialogue, but clearly he's asking directions and the guy
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 1: shows him some directions. But as Alan drives off, another
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: citizen walks up to him and they look so clearly
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: they're in cohoots with us again. And the scope is
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: now getting bigger. We're seeing that this is this is
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: more widespread. There's a lot more people involved in this,
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 1: and we just have this over and over again. Every
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: turn he makes there is a steel fence blocking the way.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: He's very frustrated. I started getting frustrated for him because
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 1: he's pulling out a map. He gets so frustrated he
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: stops in the middle of the road and gets out
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 1: and opens the map and puts it on the hood
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 1: of the car like I would be so incredibly frustrated,
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: and he eventually makes his way close enough. But this
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: is when we now establish the antique shop. We're at
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 1: the antique shop. We see the antique shop owner the
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: antique shop. As Alan's trying to make his way, the
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 1: antique shop owner gets attacked by our I don't even
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: know what to reference her as as our killer. He
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 1: gets attacked. It's again. She is incredibly creepy, even in
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 1: the bright lit hauls and shop of or the brightly
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: lit you know shop. This is not hidden in crazy
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: colors or anything. And she's strong as hell. I just
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 1: want to say, because she picks him up. Which the
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 1: actor who, yeah, the actor who played him, you guys
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 1: mentioned was a stunt man. She picks him up and
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 1: throws him. It's such a crazy scene. Alan shows up
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 1: within as this is going on, and the front door
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 1: is locked. He needs to find another way. And again
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 1: this is a scene where we have a very rapid
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 1: switch up in visual style because I don't know the
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: direction that he gets to go in this antique shop,
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: but he seems to go around the back and he
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: enters into this like very odd back area and suddenly
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: the camera goes handheld. It gets really shaky, it's extremely
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 1: the colors are pretty much sucked out of the frame.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 1: The contrast is incredibly strong. It's a visual you know
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: when you go into a room and suddenly you know,
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: the temperature changes and things just feel different. This is
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 1: that visual equivalent. So again something is wrong. We're seeing
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: that through the visuals and it's so stark. It's like
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden, there's not been a single handheld
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 1: shot in this whole movie until this moment. Then you
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 1: get two of them out of nowhere. Alan enters the
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 1: shop and this is when we have another mirror scene.
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 1: We actually didn't bring that up earlier, but we should
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 1: have the double We have the elevator, I believe there's
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 1: a scene in the hotel room with a mirror, and
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: then again as we enter the antique shop, we have
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 1: another double moment where he is aligned with a mirror
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 1: and he looks at himself in the mirror and he's
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 1: kind of looking around the shop, finds the antique shop
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: owner dead, pinned up again. I don't know how the
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 1: guy died. He's just stuck on the wall.
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she basically just like penned them up to the
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: wall and then just stab them right through the chest
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 2: and just pend them there.
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, there is a knife in his chest.
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: That's right. I forgot about that detail. There's a knife
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 1: in his chest. And he hides in a closet again,
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 1: we have another closet.
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: With another spider, with.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 1: Another stop motion spider, which is which is great. It's
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 1: so creepy, so creepy. And then I believe if I
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 1: remember correctly, which Chuck you just watched the movie, you
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 1: can tell me he gets his first glance of her.
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: Right he does, yes, Yeah, and that's what that's when
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 2: he goes into a hiding in the closet where he
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 2: also finds another tablet with the spider icon on it.
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes he does.
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: Yep.
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: And again these scenes involving her just feel so out
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: of left field and very out of play, very fantastical.
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is a very different scene
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: than the death, than Maria's death. This is much more.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: There's not really I don't think a bunch of creative
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: choices here. It's just more of like advancing the plot.
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 1: You know, we have to get rid of somebody who
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: could help Alan. She's there just in time. We need
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: him to find another scribe. And reintroducing the closet is
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: nice because at this point in the movie we're approaching
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 1: the end. We need to reintroduce and kind of go
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 1: back to those those those things brought up in the beginning,
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 1: his fear of spiders, the fear of being trapped, all
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 1: of that. So we bring all that back up. Mysterious
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 1: Man shows back up, and this is when we get
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: some of the best production design in the movie, which
• 1:22:43
  Speaker 1: is when they go into the catacombs and Chuck, I
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 1: know you have a bunch of notes. I want to
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: bring up one on the commentary that you talked about, Ryan,
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 1: which is every single time you watched this movie. This
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 1: was shot on the MTV studio lots. The amount of
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 1: effort put in to this catacomb scene from a design
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 1: standpoint is remarkable. There is so much cool stuff in
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 1: the scene. Yep, so much cool stuff. I mean even
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: just when you're entering the catacombs, the beautiful detail everything.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: But when he gets in and we have this tracking
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 1: shot following Allan as he kind of gets a little
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 1: bit deeper and we see bodies, you know, we start
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: to see this is the the layer where nest. Yeah,
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: the nest. And there's so much detail on the bodies
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 1: and the there's webs, not every It's really interesting because
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 1: there are webs in the production design, but not overwhelming.
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 1: This is not like eight legg It freaks our rachnophobia.
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 1: They're there, but it's subtle detail. And as he makes
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: his way down, he ends up in a little bit
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 1: of water where there's a full blown car. Best Smith,
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 1: there's a full vehicle in this set with a body
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 1: in it. And it's incredible. And you talked about Ryan
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 1: how every single time you watch this you find more
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: of those more details kind of hidden around here.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, this whole scene. I mean, I don't know something
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 3: about my life. I've always been fascinated with caves and these,
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 3: you know, little areas that you can just explore like that.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 3: I grew up in southern California near an old silver
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 3: mining town, and one of the things we used to
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 3: do that I loved was every few months we'd go
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 3: just I mean it's not super safe, to be honest,
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 3: we would just go exploring in some of the mines
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 3: and we've happened upon somewhere you could find like literal
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 3: the tracks from mine carts still completely intact, and find
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 3: mindes with like I don't know, eight or nine different
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 3: mine shafts shooting off that are each going straight down
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 3: into the mountain. We're talking multiple hundreds of feet. Uh,
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 3: It's crazy. And this scene truly reminded me of so
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 3: much of that, because every single time that you look
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 3: somewhere else, you find another detail that your eye latches onto,
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 3: And when you think about it, that's kind of true
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 3: in like the nest of a spider or a tarantula
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 3: or something like this, because you you know, you mentioned
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 3: that the spider webs just sort of not taking over
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 3: the whole thing, but being I don't know, like highlights
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 3: and they're they're just they're there to draw your eyes
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 3: to certain things, and everything here feels real, feels dirty,
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 3: feels lived in, feels like this has been festering for
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 3: quite some time.
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels intentional. Everything deserves to be there, and
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 1: everything there is telling the storytt. My question is when
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: you bring up where you grew up in southern California,
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 1: have you ever have you ever had a moment when
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 1: you thought like I should Temple of Doom. You know
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 1: that these mind carts through here.
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 3: If there were mind cards, I would have considered it. No,
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 3: we had the tracks only in no mine car. But yeah,
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 3: I would certainly love to do stuff like that. But
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 3: it's it's so crazy because you're literally going through miles
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 3: and miles of the mountains and some of these like
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 3: I'd love to be able to go back, but you
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 3: just don't remember where exactly you were. It's so difficult.
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Well, look, we're really looking forward to some
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 1: point in the future when Severn releases My Bloody Valentine
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 1: and you can go back and do a onset location
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 1: tour of the Hanniger mines.
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 3: You know, it's hilarious. Is a friend of mine that
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 3: does YouTube, Aaron Pinn. He lived very close to the
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 3: original mines from My Bloody Valentine, and something happened when
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 3: the screen factory was doing their original Collector's edition. He
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 3: had the option to do an on set location of that,
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 3: and the wires got crossed and it didn't end up
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 3: on the disc. But I still wish you would have
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 3: been able to get that done.
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 1: Oh man, that would have been so cool. Shameless for
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: our next episode, My Bloody Valentine, I'm glad we could
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 1: get a head start on that in this one here.
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 1: Fantastic man, love that movie to death. Uh, but let's
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 1: let's get into this ending because we have the reappearance
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 1: of the Bachie Ball, which turns out is not a
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 1: bochie Ball. We have some incredible again stop motion work
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 1: with the the Boci Ball scene where the bochie ball
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 1: opens and it dude, it makes it like even thinking
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 1: about it's got chills thinking of.
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 3: A game here.
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 2: It was very creepy. Yeah, especially just watching a curl
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 2: from the ball.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: Just yeah, it's it's very very gross. There's also the
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 1: mysterious man gets killed here, and it's very interesting the
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 1: way that he is just pulled up from the floor.
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 1: It's it's it's all incredibly interesting and This is the
• 1:27:54
  Speaker 1: point where the movie's kind of moving at one hundred
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 1: miles per hour because everything is falling apart. Allen is
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 1: now full on into the everything. He is making his
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 1: way out of the catacombs. He finds the mysterious man's body.
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: He is freaked out, he continues. When he gets out
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 1: of the catacombs, he runs into our detective, which is
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 1: like odd timing, that's run you know that, It's just
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 1: very odd that we have this very weird encounter with
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 1: the detective. Is the detective gives him a ride, and
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 1: and Ryan, I have to ask what your opinion is,
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 1: because Shuck and I talked about this. The detective drops
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 1: him off, and I don't this doesn't look like his
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 1: hotel room. Does he go to his hotel room or
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 1: does he go to Genevieve's room.
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 3: I mean, that is something that we don't have an
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 3: answer for, I think, But again, I feel like this
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 3: could be one of those intentional things where they're just
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 3: unnerving you. Not only are you in an unfamiliar country,
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 3: you expect to go somewhere back that that you already
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 3: are familiar with, and as a v where you're like, wait,
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 3: this isn't exactly what I was expecting, So now what
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 3: is going on here? And that subverts it even more
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 3: because of course it is the detective. It's one of
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 3: the people that you hope, beyond hope that I can
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 3: expect the inspector to drop me off at the right
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 3: place or to be trustworthy. Well not in this place.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's very at this point, everything feels like
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: Uncanny Valley. None of it's recognizable. We don't know. And
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 1: at the same time, it's very plausible, knowing the scene
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 1: that we saw earlier, that he would know essentially where
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 1: Genevieve lives. You know, she is directly across the street,
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 1: on the same floor. It's very plausible that in the days,
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 1: in the shock of everything that's going on, he does
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 1: end up wandering into her her I don't know if
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 1: it's an apartment conduct whatever it is. He wanders into
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 1: her place and we've never seen the bedroom before. We
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 1: only saw the weird big room with the big windows
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: in the mirror, which right, I don't think she has
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 1: any furniture. I didn't see any furniture, and there's shots
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 1: of her naked. I was I was really trying to
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 1: pay attention to the furniture and the surroundings in those scenes.
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 1: But he he ends up in bed, he's shocked, he's
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 1: in a daze. Genevieve comes in and this is Chuck,
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 1: do you want to go into.
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 2: The hair bit, the hairbit where, yeah, where it's all
• 1:30:22
  Speaker 2: like all wavy and curly like you said earlier, like
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 2: in a like spiderwebs, to add further to her being
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 2: a black widow.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, interesting, little like very subtle indicator that things
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: are changing.
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 2: And on top of that, she's also wearing a black
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 2: robe to even further that detail.
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Well if none of that sells you on
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 1: the spider bit, I'm going to pass it on to you, Chuck,
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 1: to talk about not the love making scene in detail.
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: We don't need after that. We just we just need
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 1: the the the postcloidal weirdness that happens, if you want
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: to go into that.
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 2: So, after that's all said and done, we get a
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 2: shot of Alan on his stomach and Genevieve just decreed
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 2: in a fluid out of her mouth onto his back.
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 2: And what I was getting out of that was, you know,
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 2: to further into her being a spider, which we find
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 2: out like during the shot because we see that she
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 2: has the mark on her arm that she's secreting like
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 2: a spider does when it's going to break down the
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 2: tissue to eat it's prey. Yeah that was yeah, nice,
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 2: cool little detail.
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 1: It's a gross scene. It's that's that's that's gross. And
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I was trying to figure out maybe
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: this is me going to and I was trying to
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 1: figure out exactly what they had her hold in her
• 1:31:47
  Speaker 1: mouth to spit out, because just like a gross thing
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 1: that I think about, I'm like, I'm like, that does
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: not look like yeah.
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 2: That and also this that and the scene with the
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 2: Mystery Man when he gets hung by the spider ladies
• 1:32:02
  Speaker 2: like saliva. Yeah, I wonder if that was like supposed
• 1:32:05
  Speaker 2: to be the same thing.
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 3: Yes, it's like thick goofy lube.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly what my thought was. And then I
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 1: had a brief moment where I was like, I wonder
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 1: what that tastes like.
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 2: I was like, hopefully it was flavored lube if anything.
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 1: So yeah, so you know, now now we're heading into
• 1:32:28
  Speaker 1: uh my, Okay, So I just want to let everybody
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 1: know into give you an insight into my notes here
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 1: because my My notes for this scene are al Alan
• 1:32:39
  Speaker 1: leaves catacombs, picked up by Detective get Aviev. That just Genevieve.
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 1: There's no it's detective, and then just the period Jeaviev
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 1: period weird ass love scene. Those are the extent of my.
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 3: Notes post coitus mouth stuff.
• 1:32:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well here's my next note, which is just just
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 1: spider king and doctrination.
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. The ending of this is superb.
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's so good. It's so good. So Alan gets,
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 1: you know, he wakes up, Genevieva's gone. He wanders out
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 1: of the room, and this is where I kind of
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 1: questioned where this was. I was kind of wondering because
• 1:33:25
  Speaker 1: we're clearly at the hotel at this point. This is
• 1:33:28
  Speaker 1: when it solidifies where we're at, and he wanders into
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 1: a room where our cast of characters that we've seen
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: in Budapest, all of our main players are in the room.
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 1: They all have the mark on their arm, which we
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 1: are terrible. I'm so happy this is episode two of
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 1: the podcast because we completely forgot to say that in
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 1: the weird baby scene with missus Kohon that we see
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: the mark on her arm, which, by the way, I
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: really want to shout out will for his analysis of
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 1: this mark and its comparisons to looking like a butthole,
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 1: which my wife was walking by at the exact moment
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 1: that was brought up, and I was like, I have
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 1: never heard a more intelligent, analytical viewpoint of a of
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 1: a butthole before in my life. But it does look
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 1: like one. I mean, I'm not saying it doesn't, it
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: does have It does have butthole like appearance.
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: Also, real quick, before we get even further into this scene, uh,
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 2: right before this, Alan got into the fight with the
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 2: spider Lady and ended up killing her with the glass shard.
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 1: Oh yes, yes, yes, you're right. I I guess I
• 1:34:36
  Speaker 1: was too caught up in my weird notes.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah it's all good, Yeah, completely Yeah.
• 1:34:40
  Speaker 1: When he walks out of the room, he has the
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 1: encounter with the spider lady. Good, good, good little fight scene.
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: It finally, you know, kills her with the the stab
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 1: in the throat.
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 1:34:53
  Speaker 1: It's it's really interesting to me because it turns out
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 1: that our are our killer, our spider lady killer is
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 1: Professor Ross's wife or I don't know if it's actually
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 1: his wife, but it was that was her. I don't
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 1: know if if Roth got to Budapest and then she
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 1: put on this act or whatever of being the wife.
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 1: We don't really know all that, but turns out this
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 1: was her. And there's also more notes that you guys
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: brought up in a commentary about her hair being straight
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 1: at the actually very very like like almost gelled down
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 1: incredibly military style to her hair or to her head,
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 1: and then contrasts to when she is in this form
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: and it's very quite different. Yeah, I mean, I did
• 1:35:40
  Speaker 1: you guys, Did you guys put that together that that
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 1: was her early on or because I didn't.
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 3: No, Just like we mentioned earlier, this is one of
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 3: those things that subsequent viewings really brings more the more
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 3: that you see them. I mean, you get to the
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 3: end of the movie and you go, wait, that kind
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 3: of looks like and then you connect those dots, and
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 3: then you watch it again you go, oh shit, this
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 3: movie is very different the second time when you know that,
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 3: and then you know, you watch it, I don't know,
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 3: five or six more times and you're taking OCI's time,
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 3: and you see things start to add up and you're like, oh,
• 1:36:12
  Speaker 3: this almost like gibberish story of where we're we're allan
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 3: essentially going into not only through the story. But I mean, honestly,
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 3: and I'm kind of putting this together myself right now.
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 3: Will and I were allan going into the commentary because
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 3: what is the movie telling us? Because there is no
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 3: English translation for any of this, there's no English analysis.
• 1:36:34
  Speaker 3: We're doing all this on our own and hoping that
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 3: it's spoon fit for us, and so we're saying, what
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 3: are you trying to tell us? And we are the ignorant,
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 3: we are the naive, And the more time that we
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 3: spend into it, it gets weirder and weirder, until it
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 3: almost feels like we're faded to tell this story in
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 3: a way. And I appreciated this process so much because
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 3: the little things like the wife and discovering, you know,
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 3: the differences in the hair. It's such a small detail
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 3: that you don't You're probably not going to catch that
• 1:37:07
  Speaker 3: the first three times you watch this movie. It takes
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 3: a while or somebody holding your hand and saying, look, look, look,
• 1:37:13
  Speaker 3: look at this. This is why that's important. And I mean,
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 3: it is such a unique honor to be able to
• 1:37:20
  Speaker 3: say that I was a part of that for a
• 1:37:22
  Speaker 3: movie like this, because this movie is unique and weird
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 3: and original, and sexy in so many different ways and
• 1:37:31
  Speaker 3: like beyond artistic, and to have this be the first
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 3: disc that we were on I still it's like surreal
• 1:37:37
  Speaker 3: for me. It's very almost ethereal, Like the moment with
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 3: you know, the green sheets, all of it is very
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 3: dreamlike still right, I'm just yeah, I'm so glad that
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 3: you guys were affected by this because I loved working
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 3: on this one.
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 1: Well honestly too, same bat here. I mean, there are
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 1: there have been moments in even recording this and I'm
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 1: just gonna be one hundred percent honest for the audience
• 1:38:00
  Speaker 1: that have made it. Ninety eight minutes into this episode,
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 1: this this was like on This was a true I
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 1: saw doing this episode as a true challenge because anything
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 1: we cover from here, everything that we have planned to cover,
• 1:38:15
  Speaker 1: is one hundred times easier to discuss at one hundred
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 1: times easier to break down than this movie is. And
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 1: you know what we're essentially trying to do, Like it's
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 1: anybody entering this podcast is kind of entering like what
• 1:38:27
  Speaker 1: Alan is. It's it's all so odd and so weird,
• 1:38:32
  Speaker 1: and there's so little information about all this to me,
• 1:38:38
  Speaker 1: and I'm sure to chuck too. You know, we talked
• 1:38:41
  Speaker 1: about how we could have started this podcast with anything
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 1: we could have said, like, hey, we're gonna do terrifying,
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 1: very straightforward, very recognizable, very notable. I saw it as
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 1: a bit of a challenge to cover this movie in
• 1:38:56
  Speaker 1: a way because there's so little info, because it's so interesting,
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 1: and you know, to have you on and now understanding
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 1: what that commentary was to you guys, I sort of
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 1: get the same feel out of putting us out here
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 1: in a way with this choice and this title and
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 1: going in because it feels it's so weird to explain
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 1: what's happening in this movie. And you know, while on
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 1: this podcast we have not been as analytical as you
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 1: and will have, this is still I mean, I would
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 1: argue this is probably the deepest discussion this movie's ever
• 1:39:34
  Speaker 1: had outside of your guys commentary, right like, and we've
• 1:39:40
  Speaker 1: barely cracked the surface. I think of what you could
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 1: talk about with this movie and how deeply you could
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 1: go and hopefully, you know, hey, maybe one day in
• 1:39:52
  Speaker 1: this world of you know, books coming out about the
• 1:39:56
  Speaker 1: most obscure films, maybe one day there will be an
• 1:39:59
  Speaker 1: extent of deep dive into this movie, into this topic.
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 1: But it's just incredibly, incredibly interesting. And I hope, my
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 1: hope is that come the end of this show, which
• 1:40:09
  Speaker 1: is coming up, I promise you listeners, there is an ending.
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 1: I hope we don't go through what Alan goes through,
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 1: but I hope that one day I get to experience
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 1: as fucking cool as practical effects as are in this
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 1: final sequence, as we are introduced to is it a
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 1: spider king, It's a spider baby, It's the king of
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 1: this It's wild. There's no way, no way in hell
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 1: to accurately give audio listeners and understanding of the effects
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 1: in a sequence and a transformation that occurs in front
• 1:40:52
  Speaker 1: of Alan as a spider is practically birthed from a baby, Like,
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 1: how do I explain this?
• 1:41:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's hard. Yeah, it's just a picture of baby's body,
• 1:41:08
  Speaker 2: but with a spider's face on the top of its skull.
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 2: And just much like the Baci ball how the spider
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 2: opens up from the Baci ball, the spider God or
• 1:41:18
  Speaker 2: whatever you want to call it, basically does that with
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: this baby's skull. And it's fucking weird.
• 1:41:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's weird, but it looks so good like this does.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 2: It looks really good?
• 1:41:29
  Speaker 1: This is the penultimate build up of all the effects
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 1: that we've seen so far. And you can clearly tell
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: that this is where the money went. This was the
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: you know, the big selling point for the effects. And
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 1: it looks it looks great, I think, I mean, by
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: eighty eight, you know, practical effects are looking pretty damn good.
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 1: This looks really really, I mean up there with I
• 1:41:51
  Speaker 1: think some of the best of the later half of
• 1:41:55
  Speaker 1: the eighties. And I think the scene, what we talked about,
• 1:41:57
  Speaker 1: more of this movie was more known, if more people
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 1: knew about it. Sure, but yeah, coming into the end
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 1: of the movie, we have the I don't know Birth
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 1: of the Spider God. Alan is now imprinted. He is
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 1: part of this uh this cult. Yep, he does have
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 1: the butthole spider mark, as doctor will Dotson has a
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 1: has stated, and and we instantly cut back to Dallas
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 1: and Alan is home, and he is back at the
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 1: corporate offices where he again is going to meet with
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 1: Priest Hubbard and Frank are are are Archery are extremely
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 1: odd pairing of people, uh to give his his report
• 1:42:48
  Speaker 1: and yeah, basically, I mean the only way to really
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 1: say is the only person left standing as a priest
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 1: as he kills both Hubbard and Frank. Priest discovers their
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 1: by in the closet again. We're back to the closet.
• 1:43:04
  Speaker 1: Back to the closet, and Alan emerges from around the
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 1: corner with the same appearance as Professor Ross's wife, with
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 1: the wicked teeth, the sunken eyes, very very threatening. It's
• 1:43:21
  Speaker 1: a very creepy little moment. There's no explanation why he
• 1:43:25
  Speaker 1: killed them. We have no idea what's going on. I
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 1: think this is sort of the buttoning up they sent
• 1:43:29
  Speaker 1: him to, kind of get rid of other people who
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 1: might not be in Budapest who know what's going on.
• 1:43:35
  Speaker 1: I see it as like a cleanup. But then end
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 1: credits roll and you guys, here's a weird commentary question.
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 1: Did you guys purposely end your commentary right at the
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 1: moment of the final shrill he makes.
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 3: I I am a fairly anal editor, I will say that.
• 1:43:57
  Speaker 3: And so a lot of the stuff that we do,
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 3: or visual essays and for commentaries. You know a lot
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 3: of these people that are that are really great at
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 3: audio commentaries. They record their commentary and turn it in
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 3: and then leave it up to the label to time
• 1:44:11
  Speaker 3: it with the film and stuff. I try to deliver
• 1:44:14
  Speaker 3: a fully finished product no matter what I'm doing, and
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 3: so I timed it as perfectly as I could to
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 3: get that done just right. Then. What's funny, And I
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 3: don't think we've mentioned this anywhere, maybe maybe in passing
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 3: on my show at some point, but we actually recorded
• 1:44:30
  Speaker 3: this commentary twice. We weren't happy with it the first time,
• 1:44:34
  Speaker 3: and kind of like we're talking about tonight, there's more,
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 3: there's more understanding, there's more of a rapport with the
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 3: film after you've watched it more than once, and so
• 1:44:44
  Speaker 3: being able to get the flow of it better for
• 1:44:47
  Speaker 3: that second recording it helped the timing of some of
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 3: these things be more spot on. And I really, again,
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 3: I know that this is the first commentary that we
• 1:44:58
  Speaker 3: ever had released publicly, so to be like super proud
• 1:45:01
  Speaker 3: of it and all that is is cool for the achievement,
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 3: but I'm like very proud of how it turned out.
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 3: This is one of those things that it's this is
• 1:45:08
  Speaker 3: a very difficult first commentary to have out there. This
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 3: is one that is very easy to judge because it's
• 1:45:15
  Speaker 3: your first one, and I think we pulled it off
• 1:45:17
  Speaker 3: pretty well. But beyond all that, it's it's a hell
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 3: of a film, and to be on something like this,
• 1:45:24
  Speaker 3: you know, we've been on worst movies since then. We've
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 3: done commentaries for movies that are way worse than this movie,
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 3: and I'm still super proud of it. But it's there's
• 1:45:32
  Speaker 3: something special in like capturing a moment, like you said,
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 3: of ending it right as that shrill hits. It's it's fun.
• 1:45:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean I I was hoping because typically,
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 1: you know, when you watch commentaries to people who have
• 1:45:45
  Speaker 1: watched a lot, you typically the audio will dip out
• 1:45:50
  Speaker 1: when the commentary is going and then you'll have the
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 1: audio peak back up when there's nothing to say and
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 1: so forth. But for the entire running length of Spider Labyrinth,
• 1:45:59
  Speaker 1: you guys are filling it with with with commentary and
• 1:46:03
  Speaker 1: then just for that final moment for the audio to
• 1:46:06
  Speaker 1: create back up. I was like, that's so, I have
• 1:46:08
  Speaker 1: a feeling that was Ryan kind of perfectly, perfectly nailingness.
• 1:46:13
  Speaker 3: So yeah, there's there's some some things we've done like that,
• 1:46:17
  Speaker 3: and you might be able to tell that I loved
• 1:46:19
  Speaker 3: that moment because of our visual essay too. I used
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 3: a couple of the cues in the beginning and the
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 3: end of this to be very important in the way
• 1:46:27
  Speaker 3: that you tell the story, because a lot of these,
• 1:46:30
  Speaker 3: you know, a visual essay is essentially most of the
• 1:46:34
  Speaker 3: time they're like short documentaries. And it's especially true for
• 1:46:38
  Speaker 3: ours is we had like multiple interview subjects in there
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 3: that are very much experts, way more than myself, and
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 3: all I'm doing is taking what they gave me and
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 3: editing it in a way that tells the story that
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 3: I wanted to tell. And that's that's the only part
• 1:46:52
  Speaker 3: that I can control, and so that I want to
• 1:46:53
  Speaker 3: take those emotional beats, like the sound and the music
• 1:46:56
  Speaker 3: here that really in a way manipulate the view to
• 1:47:00
  Speaker 3: react very strongly to some of these sounds, and I
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 3: wanted to hold those intact for sure.
• 1:47:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well you guys, I mean I would encourage
• 1:47:10
  Speaker 1: to kind of, you know, begin heading into the wrap
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 1: up for this episode, I think one thing that people
• 1:47:18
  Speaker 1: who become a fan of this show, I'm hoping that
• 1:47:22
  Speaker 1: we kind of appeal to people who already do love
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 1: commentaries and people who maybe don't, and they can kind
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 1: of use this show as am not as the alternative
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 1: to watching the commentary, but as kind of like a
• 1:47:35
  Speaker 1: cliff notes guide through. You know, I think this might
• 1:47:38
  Speaker 1: be easier for some people to put on in the
• 1:47:40
  Speaker 1: car or in other cases, instead of sitting at home
• 1:47:42
  Speaker 1: and watching the commentary, I would encourage people to use
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 1: the commentary as a tool to better understanding what you
• 1:47:54
  Speaker 1: just watched. And in this case, you guys offered up
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 1: a perfect companion piece to the movie. It is not
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 1: just a guide. I mean we didn't even touch on
• 1:48:08
  Speaker 1: things like how Will talked about this being kind of
• 1:48:14
  Speaker 1: the perfect weird genre film and I didn't really get
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 1: into that because I didn't do My research of the
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 1: weird genre is very limited.
• 1:48:25
  Speaker 3: That's a whole nother bag. Anyways, that that's something that
• 1:48:27
  Speaker 3: we could talk about for another full episode. It's crazy
• 1:48:30
  Speaker 3: what you could go down with that.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so there was there was still so much
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 1: that even you know, we didn't cover. And like we've
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 1: talked about plenty of times, this is a tough it's
• 1:48:40
  Speaker 1: a really tough movie, you know, moving forward, you know,
• 1:48:44
  Speaker 1: we're doing commentaries with directors and you're getting behind the
• 1:48:47
  Speaker 1: scenes stuff, things that really propel discussion, and in this case,
• 1:48:54
  Speaker 1: there isn't much And to anybody who does own this movie,
• 1:48:58
  Speaker 1: who is listening to this, go watch it with the
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 1: commentary because it might open up your eyes to new things.
• 1:49:07
  Speaker 1: And if that's your second watch with the commentary, watch
• 1:49:11
  Speaker 1: it a third time without the commentary and pick up
• 1:49:14
  Speaker 1: on these things for yourself and dive in. Because I
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 1: know that for me and my bookend on this movie,
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 1: I've grown a new appreciation for it that without your
• 1:49:29
  Speaker 1: guys commentary, without your guide, I don't think would be
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 1: would be as firm as it is, because you know,
• 1:49:41
  Speaker 1: you guys did such a good job creating like I said,
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 1: that companion piece. And not just because you're a friend
• 1:49:46
  Speaker 1: of mine. I'm not saying that just because of that,
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 1: but genuinely, even the visual essay, it's the perfect to me.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 1: Bonus features are there to supplement the movie, and you know,
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 1: when you're supplementing, you're adding additional to grow appreciation for
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 1: what you just watched. And and that's exactly what's done here.
• 1:50:09
  Speaker 1: And before I continue rambling on, I'm going to push
• 1:50:12
  Speaker 1: it on to Chuck and just kind of get your
• 1:50:15
  Speaker 1: your kind of bookends on this.
• 1:50:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, Like like you said, Chris, just watching
• 1:50:21
  Speaker 2: the commentary after the first viewing of the film, like
• 1:50:23
  Speaker 2: the second view and watching it with the commentary and
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 2: just taking the notes on what you guys were talking about.
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 2: It's like, you know, hear and everything was so cool,
• 1:50:34
  Speaker 2: very interesting. You guys did a great job. And then
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 2: leading into my third watch of the film, watching it
• 1:50:40
  Speaker 2: while looking over the notes that I took from your
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 2: commentary and just seeing all the things in real time incredible.
• 1:50:49
  Speaker 2: It's just so cool that you guys were picking up
• 1:50:51
  Speaker 2: on all that stuff.
• 1:50:54
  Speaker 3: I'm so glad to hear that. I mean, one of
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 3: the things that we've tried to do in this company
• 1:50:58
  Speaker 3: that we started is do things in a very educational way,
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 3: but in a not stuffy educational way. And there are
• 1:51:10
  Speaker 3: you know, there's a spectrum of commentaries and visual essays
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 3: out there. There are some that are condescendingly academic. They
• 1:51:19
  Speaker 3: definitely look down on the viewer as they try to like,
• 1:51:22
  Speaker 3: this movie is better than you for these reasons, and
• 1:51:26
  Speaker 3: I can't stand that shit. But then there's also the
• 1:51:28
  Speaker 3: commentaries that are, man, look at this movie. It's such
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 3: a piece of shit. Look at this And you can
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 3: hear them like tapping each other and saying, look at
• 1:51:35
  Speaker 3: this fucking idiot, what he's doing on screen. I would
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 3: never want to do that, and being able to share
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 3: nuance behind a film and explain why this movie is
• 1:51:45
  Speaker 3: important or why things are happening on the screen, or
• 1:51:48
  Speaker 3: you know, the film school ideas behind the actual filmmaking
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 3: that we're seeing. That's important, but it's also important to
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 3: be entertaining at the same time. So, I mean, we
• 1:51:58
  Speaker 3: just did an audio commentary for you know, one of
• 1:52:01
  Speaker 3: the most coveted German animation films of all time called
• 1:52:04
  Speaker 3: Feladay that just released through Deaf Crocodile, and there's so
• 1:52:08
  Speaker 3: much that we wanted to be able to talk through
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 3: that we we did throughout the entire commentary. But also
• 1:52:14
  Speaker 3: we're just a kind of couple of idiotic dads who
• 1:52:17
  Speaker 3: like to make dad jokes. So the whole time, this
• 1:52:20
  Speaker 3: is an animated movie about cats, and we're making cat
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 3: puns the entire time. So like we use the word
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 3: sato miao, sachistic. I mean, you're not going to hear
• 1:52:29
  Speaker 3: that in any other audio commentary, I hope not.
• 1:52:31
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, well this is I mean, dude to me, like,
• 1:52:35
  Speaker 1: this is what movies are about. And you know, I've
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 1: been lucky enough to grow a pretty good little following
• 1:52:43
  Speaker 1: over on Instagram of like minded people, and I always
• 1:52:47
  Speaker 1: encourage people to like talk about movies more, talk about yeah,
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 1: like you don't have to look at things analytical, just
• 1:52:55
  Speaker 1: just let's just have cool conversations about movies. And to me,
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 1: it's it's like would when I would search podcasts and
• 1:53:02
  Speaker 1: kind of look through you know, you see tons of
• 1:53:05
  Speaker 1: talk about Halloween and Friday thirteenth and the Exorcist and
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 1: all the big stuff. I kind of always appealed to
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 1: like the weird little things that I had never I
• 1:53:14
  Speaker 1: didn't know much about, Like I, it's just it's such
• 1:53:18
  Speaker 1: an interesting thing. And to me to have a fascination
• 1:53:21
  Speaker 1: with a movie like this, like I'm very like like
• 1:53:24
  Speaker 1: you said with your commentator, I'm very proud of it too.
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 1: I don't want to gate keep this stuff. I want
• 1:53:30
  Speaker 1: to tell people to find this movie and I want
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 1: to encourage people to to give it a chance. And
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 1: you never know where one of your next favorite movies
• 1:53:40
  Speaker 1: are hiding, what genre it's in, what year it comes from,
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 1: you know where it's from. You never know. And to me,
• 1:53:51
  Speaker 1: this past two hours has been so much fun because
• 1:53:54
  Speaker 1: just through this conversation, I've grown to appreciate this movie
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 1: even a little bit more because I've put thoughts out
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 1: that we're just at where thoughts, and they rattled through
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 1: my brain and they exploded out of my mouth and
• 1:54:08
  Speaker 1: some of them made sense. Some might, But when you
• 1:54:10
  Speaker 1: watch the movie then you'll be like, Okay, I can
• 1:54:12
  Speaker 1: see why there was some confusion or some hesitation to
• 1:54:17
  Speaker 1: things that were brought up because I still don't really
• 1:54:20
  Speaker 1: understand a lot of what I saw, and to talk
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 1: about it, it's just a lot of fun. So again, Ryan,
• 1:54:27
  Speaker 1: thank you for coming on. Thank you for doing this.
• 1:54:31
  Speaker 1: I'm going to put a link in the notes for
• 1:54:34
  Speaker 1: this where you can find The Disconnected podcast. It's on Spotify,
• 1:54:39
  Speaker 1: It's on Apple, It's on pretty much anywhere. You can
• 1:54:42
  Speaker 1: find on everywhere. Yeah, it's on everywhere. It's also on
• 1:54:46
  Speaker 1: its streams on it doesn't it streams on YouTube.
• 1:54:49
  Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, every episode for The Disconnected is on my
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 3: YouTube channel too.
• 1:54:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can find me on it. And then actually
• 1:54:56
  Speaker 1: shortly after this, you'll find me on at This is
• 1:54:59
  Speaker 1: going up tomorrow on Wednesday. The next day, on Thursday,
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 1: I'll be on your show, which I'm very excited for.
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 1: So I'll put all those links down below. I'll also
• 1:55:09
  Speaker 1: you know, make sure you link your Instagram. You are
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 1: the go to page for me for getting physical media news.
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 1: You know, I follow a couple others, You're the only
• 1:55:18
  Speaker 1: one I have alerts on for. So yeah, as meaningful,
• 1:55:23
  Speaker 1: be honored. But also I could not end this without
• 1:55:26
  Speaker 1: talking about the Physical Media Advocate, which is the physical magazine.
• 1:55:33
  Speaker 1: You are, You're a partner, You're the are you founder partner?
• 1:55:38
  Speaker 3: This this all started actually for my Patreon. I wanted
• 1:55:42
  Speaker 3: to start a newsletter and the very first one was
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 3: six pages that I sent out digitally just to certain
• 1:55:49
  Speaker 3: patrons of my show. And they immediately said, well, when
• 1:55:52
  Speaker 3: can we have this in paperback because this is amazing
• 1:55:55
  Speaker 3: and I need a permanent record of it. And I
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 3: immediately said, like, my eyes got wide and I started
• 1:55:59
  Speaker 3: dream and then I realized, yeah, it's not realistic. And
• 1:56:02
  Speaker 3: then like six months later, I went, wait, but what
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 3: if it is? And then I started working together with
• 1:56:07
  Speaker 3: people all over the world, and now like I've I
• 1:56:11
  Speaker 3: don't know how I've got here, but I'm turned into
• 1:56:13
  Speaker 3: a magazine editor where I'm collecting articles from people from
• 1:56:17
  Speaker 3: Italy and Los Angeles and Canada and the UK. And
• 1:56:22
  Speaker 3: that's just for one issue. And we throw all these
• 1:56:25
  Speaker 3: things together, combine that with like release date information and
• 1:56:29
  Speaker 3: a list of all the steel books coming out, and
• 1:56:32
  Speaker 3: you know, share some of my most you know, the
• 1:56:35
  Speaker 3: releases coming out I'm personally most excited for. And then
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 3: I'm just like I said, a silly dad. So at
• 1:56:41
  Speaker 3: the same time, I'll like write a mad libs to
• 1:56:43
  Speaker 3: put in the magazine or build up my own crossword.
• 1:56:46
  Speaker 3: And now it's suddenly a thing, and ten to twelve
• 1:56:49
  Speaker 3: times a year you can find a brand new physical
• 1:56:51
  Speaker 3: release of a magazine. And the fact that it's for
• 1:56:54
  Speaker 3: sale and retail stores was crazy enough. And now it's
• 1:56:57
  Speaker 3: for sale and retail stores and multiple countries, and I'm
• 1:57:02
  Speaker 3: at a loss. I don't even understand how this is
• 1:57:04
  Speaker 3: my life now.
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's crazy, man, And I'm the proud owner of
• 1:57:07
  Speaker 1: every single one. I mean, I just ordered what number
• 1:57:10
  Speaker 1: are we on?
• 1:57:12
  Speaker 3: Fifteen was just released, I think, and now I'm building sixteen.
• 1:57:15
  Speaker 3: I'm at the point where I'm building the next one,
• 1:57:18
  Speaker 3: and so it's I'm blurring my own numbers in my head.
• 1:57:21
  Speaker 1: Ye yeah, yeah, Well I will link the Amazon link
• 1:57:24
  Speaker 1: below to get the physical Media Advocate the newest issue,
• 1:57:27
  Speaker 1: which I just ordered has some wonderful art on the
• 1:57:30
  Speaker 1: front of From the Substance, one of my favorite movies
• 1:57:34
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. It's such it's the moment you released.
• 1:57:37
  Speaker 1: The moment I saw the picture of it, I was like, nice,
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 1: I need this just for you know, the art showcase.
• 1:57:42
  Speaker 1: So I'll make sure to link everything down below. Chuck,
• 1:57:45
  Speaker 1: any closing thoughts on the Spider Labyrinth or a physical
• 1:57:49
  Speaker 1: media advocate, I'm wondering how your WiFi is holding up
• 1:57:51
  Speaker 1: down into catacombs.
• 1:57:53
  Speaker 2: The Wi Fi seems to be holding up pretty well here,
• 1:57:56
  Speaker 2: but the spiders are starting to close in a little
• 1:57:58
  Speaker 2: bit faster than they were before. But uh yeah, I
• 1:58:02
  Speaker 2: mean again, you did an incredible job on this commentary.
• 1:58:06
  Speaker 2: Maybe you appreciate the film more. Like Chris said, Third
• 1:58:09
  Speaker 2: Watch was no, it was awesome. It was a pleasure
• 1:58:12
  Speaker 2: to have you on this show.
• 1:58:14
  Speaker 3: It was an honored to be here. Thank you, guys.
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 1: Help us on the way, Chuck. I called please, I
• 1:58:19
  Speaker 1: called nine one one. I paused. I called nine one one.
• 1:58:21
  Speaker 1: They said they'll be there three to five business days.
• 1:58:26
  Speaker 3: But in the meantime to send you more thick lube.
• 1:58:29
  Speaker 1: Yes, oh god, thick loop please, So thank you everybody
• 1:58:33
  Speaker 1: for hanging out and dealing with our first real episode
• 1:58:37
  Speaker 1: of Beyond the Blood of Horror commentary podcast. Like we hinted,
• 1:58:40
  Speaker 1: our February episode is going to be nineteen eighty one's
• 1:58:45
  Speaker 1: My Bloody Valentine. We're gonna be listening to the commentary
• 1:58:48
  Speaker 1: with the director for the unrated cut off of the
• 1:58:51
  Speaker 1: Screen Factory bluerray or four K. It is the same
• 1:58:54
  Speaker 1: commentary for that, and we'll also have a guest on that.
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 1: We'll have my buddy Steve from After Hour Video on
• 1:59:01
  Speaker 1: for that. Do us a favor if you got this
• 1:59:04
  Speaker 1: far and you're still listening, give us a rating on
• 1:59:06
  Speaker 1: Spotify and give us a follow. If you're interested in
• 1:59:09
  Speaker 1: hanging out and talking some more movies. I'll link down
• 1:59:12
  Speaker 1: below Ryan's Instagram, My Instagram, Chucks Instagram. We do not
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 1: have a group Instagram page yet for the podcast, but
• 1:59:19
  Speaker 1: that will be coming one day. Yeah. Outside of that, guys,
• 1:59:23
  Speaker 1: this was a ton of fun. Thank you for hanging out,
• 1:59:25
  Speaker 1: and we'll catch everyone in the next episode.