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The Rock Ampersand Roll Hall of Fame · Stuff You Should Know

0:01
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of I
0:04
Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark.
0:15
Speaker 1: There's Charles w Lix Bryant and Jerry's over there, and
0:22
Speaker 1: this is stuff you should know. The Rock and Roll
0:25
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame edition Tata or as was it Skinner
0:31
Speaker 1: that said rock and or Rolling? Yes, it was. It's
0:36
Speaker 1: a good one. I'm glad you said that, because every
0:38
Speaker 1: time we walk past something one of the Simpsons characters
0:41
Speaker 1: said and their nine hundred million seasons, somebody writes and
0:45
Speaker 1: it's like, how could you possibly not say this? You dummies?
0:49
Speaker 1: Remember that time we got to go to a Simpson's
0:51
Speaker 1: table read probably second or third best day of either
0:55
Speaker 1: one of our lives. Yes, absolutely, that's always what I
0:57
Speaker 1: respond back with. I was like, oh, I'm sorry. Were
0:59
Speaker 1: you at the table Marie we were at when we
1:01
Speaker 1: met Matt Graening and he drew Simpsons characters on our
1:04
Speaker 1: autograph scripts, which I still have. I don't. I don't
1:07
Speaker 1: know if you still have yours. I still have mine, Kidney. Yes,
1:10
Speaker 1: I am kidding you. I can know I tossed it.
1:13
Speaker 1: So you're like, I don't have room for this. Yeah. Um,
1:17
Speaker 1: so Chuck, we are talking about the Rock and Roll
1:19
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame today. We've already talked about the Simpsons
1:22
Speaker 1: on an official episode before too of them. Actually, this
1:25
Speaker 1: one's a little different. This is about rock and roll,
1:28
Speaker 1: the musical genre, which is way more encompassing than a
1:32
Speaker 1: lot of people would like to admit. It turns out. Yeah,
1:35
Speaker 1: we'll get into that. There's a lot there, We definitely will.
1:39
Speaker 1: I it smacks a lot of our remember our disco episode. Yeah,
1:44
Speaker 1: smacks a lot of that. And I now we've talked
1:47
Speaker 1: about this. I don't think you've been. Have you to
1:49
Speaker 1: the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame? No? I haven't. Actually,
1:54
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Cleveland. I'm sorry, but I settled down. I
1:57
Speaker 1: have not. I have not been yet now, and I
1:59
Speaker 1: actually have to say, I don't know that I care to.
2:04
Speaker 1: I know that there are plenty of people out there
2:06
Speaker 1: who love would love to go to that and should,
2:10
Speaker 1: But for me personally, I just I don't care. Yeah,
2:14
Speaker 1: it's not your kind of place. Really, No, it's not.
2:18
Speaker 1: It's not meant for losers like me. No, I don't
2:21
Speaker 1: think that's it. It's it's meant for losers like me.
2:26
Speaker 1: I went, you know, my family or Emily's families from Akron,
2:29
Speaker 1: and so we when they were all living there, we
2:31
Speaker 1: spent Christmas Is there and other holidays there. So we
2:34
Speaker 1: did all the Cleveland things and this was one of them.
2:37
Speaker 1: And um, definitely, it's definitely one of the Cleveland things
2:40
Speaker 1: to do. For sure. It's one of the Cleveland things. Um,
2:42
Speaker 1: it's a place that I want to go back to.
2:46
Speaker 1: I love this in the in the museum in Seattle,
2:49
Speaker 1: like the pop Culture Museum. I can't remember what it's called.
2:51
Speaker 1: What's called the Museum of Popular Culture? Awesome? Yeah, and
2:55
Speaker 1: there's but there's more and then they name. But I
3:01
Speaker 1: love standing and looking at uh, the the original pad
3:09
Speaker 1: of paper where the original lyrics to Purple Hazer written.
3:13
Speaker 1: See that's what I'm saying. I like listening to Purple
3:15
Speaker 1: I couldn't it was originally written on Like I get
3:19
Speaker 1: what people are getting out of this. It just doesn't
3:22
Speaker 1: hit me that way, No, I hear you. I had
3:24
Speaker 1: a bunch of other things I was gonna say I love,
3:25
Speaker 1: But are you gonna say you don't love them? After
3:27
Speaker 1: every one of them? Let's let's find out. I love
3:31
Speaker 1: looking at the outfit that Bruce Springsteen were on the
3:33
Speaker 1: board in the USA cover right in front of me.
3:35
Speaker 1: I love looking it. I could see how you would
3:37
Speaker 1: like that. I don't care about that outfit. I love
3:40
Speaker 1: standing in front of Prince's tiny little purple jumpsuit, cool
3:45
Speaker 1: guitar or Mick Jaggers Uh tiny little ten year old
3:52
Speaker 1: boy sized jeans leather pants so small. They're also small.
3:57
Speaker 1: I thought Mick Jagger was, you know, not point size.
4:00
Speaker 1: Really Okay, I knew Prince was small, but I didn't
4:04
Speaker 1: know that Mick Jagger was as well. That's and we've
4:06
Speaker 1: talked about this. That's why they learned to be musicians,
4:08
Speaker 1: because they can't they're trying to get girls. Well, Prince
4:12
Speaker 1: was a great basketball player too. I don't know about
4:16
Speaker 1: Mick Jagger, but he was show Yes, it's true, so
4:20
Speaker 1: that he played basketball in high school too. Oh man, yeah, no,
4:24
Speaker 1: he for his size, he was a good athlete, I think.
4:26
Speaker 1: But uh, the point is, I really really love seeing
4:29
Speaker 1: that stuff in Seattle. I love seeing Kurt Cobain striped
4:33
Speaker 1: sweater from the video and the broken drumsticks of Dave
4:36
Speaker 1: Grohl and and Chris Cornell's Gibson guitar. Like I loved
4:41
Speaker 1: knowing that that's and this is not just rock and
4:44
Speaker 1: roll memorabilia. Like I like any museum where I'm like, oh,
4:48
Speaker 1: that's the real thing. That's the Declaration of Independence I'm
4:51
Speaker 1: looking at. It's not a copy, that's the one. Um.
4:55
Speaker 1: I really get a lot out of seeing the thing
4:57
Speaker 1: in person, and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame
5:00
Speaker 1: has a lot of things to look at in person.
5:03
Speaker 1: So I don't want to come off like some rube
5:05
Speaker 1: who doesn't care about museums. Like I care deeply about museums.
5:09
Speaker 1: It's just some like pop culture memorabilia doesn't do it.
5:14
Speaker 1: It's as simple as that. I think we've established that, Okay,
5:17
Speaker 1: but I just do. A lot of people would be
5:18
Speaker 1: like joshly and like museums would have dummy. No, we
5:21
Speaker 1: know you like museums. You got engaged in a museum.
5:23
Speaker 1: You like museums so much. That's absolutely true. Thanks for that.
5:26
Speaker 1: I appreciate the backup, chuck. Yeah, and you like like
5:29
Speaker 1: you'll see uh uh the Scream and a million art
5:34
Speaker 1: websites and art history books. But to stand in front
5:37
Speaker 1: of the screen is a different thing because it's the
5:41
Speaker 1: real thing. All right, let's talk about the Rock and
5:43
Speaker 1: Roll Hall of fame itself. Shall we Yes? I think
5:47
Speaker 1: we should start talking first about this because this really
5:50
Speaker 1: kind of summarizes a lot of some people hate the
5:52
Speaker 1: rock and Roll Hall of Fame, not just because they're
5:54
Speaker 1: not into pop culture museums, but they hate the idea
5:58
Speaker 1: and they think it the least rock and thing you
6:00
Speaker 1: can do is vote people into a Hall of Fame, Yeah,
6:03
Speaker 1: which is a real criticism of it. And it's really
6:06
Speaker 1: something that um, from what I've read, the rock and
6:08
Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame, this the rock hall. The people
6:11
Speaker 1: who are in the know, um have has never fully
6:15
Speaker 1: figured out how to how to deal with that paradox,
6:18
Speaker 1: because it is a paradox, like to take like what
6:21
Speaker 1: is rock and roll, which is you know, like in
6:23
Speaker 1: your face, your parents hate it. Um, It's it's like
6:27
Speaker 1: it doesn't follow the rules, and then just like put
6:30
Speaker 1: it behind incredibly expensive like recessed lighting with and protecting
6:35
Speaker 1: it with plexiglass at all that that is the opposite
6:38
Speaker 1: of that, and they've just they just had to move
6:41
Speaker 1: forward as a paradox basically. Yeah. And I should point
6:47
Speaker 1: out too that my love for this stuff is like
6:50
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be behind glass, Like I love
6:52
Speaker 1: being and I'm going to Woodstock, New York in November.
6:55
Speaker 1: I'm gonna drive by Big Pink, where Bob Dylan and
6:57
Speaker 1: the band lived. And I like being at the places
7:00
Speaker 1: is where the things really existed. There's an energy to it.
7:03
Speaker 1: I think, I get why you're going to drive by
7:05
Speaker 1: that house, but I don't care about that. You gotta stop.
7:11
Speaker 1: But this all comes back to Johnny Rotten, Uh, the
7:15
Speaker 1: leader of the Sex Pistols. They were inducted. He wrote, uh,
7:19
Speaker 1: scribbled out on a piece of paper. Didn't go obviously,
7:22
Speaker 1: and he said, next to the Sex Pistols, rock and
7:25
Speaker 1: roll and that Hall of Fame is a pis stain
7:28
Speaker 1: your museum, urine in wine. We're not coming, We're not
7:33
Speaker 1: your monkeys. And so what that was it was a
7:36
Speaker 1: great read. So that's sort of the thing though, That
7:40
Speaker 1: is how some people feel. But to me, the Rock
7:43
Speaker 1: and Roll Hall of Fame is rock and roll because
7:45
Speaker 1: they read that on stage rather than just burying it,
7:48
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like that's rock and roll, ye,
7:51
Speaker 1: And I mean it's had such an enormous impact on
7:54
Speaker 1: world culture, on human culture that like, of course it
7:57
Speaker 1: deserves a museum. And then if you're gonna do like
8:00
Speaker 1: a world class museum. There's just certain things you have
8:02
Speaker 1: to do, and yes, that doesn't fit with rock and roll,
8:05
Speaker 1: but it doesn't mean that you shouldn't have a rock
8:07
Speaker 1: and roll museum. It's just like, yeah, we took this
8:10
Speaker 1: rock and roll stuff and put it under plexiglass, and
8:12
Speaker 1: that's just what you do when you create a museum.
8:14
Speaker 1: That's right. Uh, But we'll talk about more of that
8:17
Speaker 1: stuff later. But let's talk about the history, shall we. Yeah,
8:21
Speaker 1: because the whole thing opened up on September, but it
8:26
Speaker 1: had been brewing since the early eighties. I think thanks
8:29
Speaker 1: to a dude named Ama aired again er Errigen. I
8:34
Speaker 1: think it's air again. I got it the first time
8:36
Speaker 1: and then I doubted myself, but I still got it.
8:39
Speaker 1: That's the point, that's right. So air Again was the
8:43
Speaker 1: co founder of Atlantic Records, UM the biggest name in
8:48
Speaker 1: records in sort of at a certain time. And there
8:51
Speaker 1: it's a yeah, a couple of certain times. He was
8:55
Speaker 1: the son of a um, a Turkish ambassador, but love music. Uh.
9:00
Speaker 1: Co founded Atlantic and with Jerry Wexler and started out
9:04
Speaker 1: in the R and B game. Yeah, did they signed
9:07
Speaker 1: the Drifters, Ray Charles Aretha Franklin, all of whom were
9:11
Speaker 1: like unknown at the time. So that alone is like
9:15
Speaker 1: worth celebrating, Like that's an amazing record label just to start.
9:18
Speaker 1: And then in the sixties they shifted over to rock
9:22
Speaker 1: um and signed Zeppelin and the Rolling Stones and Cream
9:27
Speaker 1: and UM. So just these two incarnations over two decades,
9:31
Speaker 1: Um kind of put Atlantic on the map. I think,
9:34
Speaker 1: like you said, it kept going right, Like, is is
9:36
Speaker 1: Atlantic still around? Oh? It's got to be. I mean
9:39
Speaker 1: it's probably owned by Disney or something, but sure, sure,
9:42
Speaker 1: but it's a storied record label and for good reason,
9:45
Speaker 1: that's right. And so he first hatched the idea of
9:48
Speaker 1: having a museum and a rock and roll Hall of Fame,
9:51
Speaker 1: and he was like, well, of course it will be
9:53
Speaker 1: in New York City, because that's just where you do it.
9:56
Speaker 1: What he didn't know was that, uh, there were these
10:00
Speaker 1: businessmen in Cleveland, Ohio that we're already planning their own
10:05
Speaker 1: rock and roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland. Yes, And
10:09
Speaker 1: when uh Amma Urdigens heard that, he shuddered. I was like,
10:14
Speaker 1: all right, why Cleveland? And I said, well, hold on,
10:17
Speaker 1: Like Cleveland actually has a lot of claim to rock
10:20
Speaker 1: and roll cred for one the local DJ. Allen Freed
10:25
Speaker 1: is widely considered as the person who coined the term
10:28
Speaker 1: rock and roll. That guy came up with it and
10:30
Speaker 1: he was at Cleveland DJ and Eric Agan said, Okay,
10:34
Speaker 1: I'm listening. What else you got? And he said, well,
10:37
Speaker 1: you know it was a very the radio station. Uh
10:40
Speaker 1: w j W that Freed DJ. Dat broke a lot
10:44
Speaker 1: of big acts. You kind of had to make it
10:47
Speaker 1: in Cleveland. Not had to, but making in Cleveland could
10:50
Speaker 1: break you. David Bowie was broke there Rush and we
10:55
Speaker 1: gotta thank Dave Rouse for putting this together. And I
10:57
Speaker 1: also want to thank Dave Russe for saying Bruce Springstein. Yeah,
11:02
Speaker 1: I noticed that. Now. I know it's a type of
11:05
Speaker 1: Dave and you're listening, but it was fun to read
11:07
Speaker 1: He's like, no, I mean the much less known bring
11:10
Speaker 1: Bruce Springstein. Uh. Joe Walsh is from Cleveland. Trin resumes
11:16
Speaker 1: from Cleveland, Ohio. You know I've talked about before in
11:20
Speaker 1: Emily's hometown of Akron, her high school, Firestone is where
11:25
Speaker 1: Devo was from. And Chrissy Hynes keys, Yeah, like that's
11:28
Speaker 1: a heck of a roster to come out of a
11:30
Speaker 1: single high school. Yes, plus also like um, even back
11:33
Speaker 1: long before Divo was around, that same guy Alan Freed,
11:36
Speaker 1: the DJ he uh, He organized and hosted what's also
11:41
Speaker 1: considered the first rock and roll show, the Moondog Coronation Ball,
11:45
Speaker 1: way back in nineteen two. So, and we've talked about
11:49
Speaker 1: it before. I could not figure out what we've talked
11:53
Speaker 1: about the Coronation Ball. Yeah, because we've we've definitely covered it.
11:57
Speaker 1: I'm almost positive anyway. Yes, So Eveland has like some
12:00
Speaker 1: rock and roll credit, so it would make sense that
12:02
Speaker 1: they would be considering rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
12:06
Speaker 1: And it would also make sense that Eric again and
12:09
Speaker 1: and the rest of the Rock and Roll Hall of
12:10
Speaker 1: Fame Foundation said Okay, well we'll think about this. They
12:14
Speaker 1: were skeptical at first, but then they said, how about this.
12:17
Speaker 1: We'll open this whole thing up to voting is to
12:20
Speaker 1: where the site should be. UM, and we'll say Cleveland's
12:24
Speaker 1: one of a number of different cities, Memphis, New Orleans, Philadelphia,
12:28
Speaker 1: San Francisco, and of course New York, which everybody knows
12:31
Speaker 1: New York is going to win. And just whoever gets
12:33
Speaker 1: the most votes will will say that's the city that
12:36
Speaker 1: gets the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Yeah, I
12:38
Speaker 1: get the feeling it was that it was like, Hey,
12:40
Speaker 1: we know we're gonna put it in New York, but
12:41
Speaker 1: this will drum up a lot of publicity, get everyone
12:44
Speaker 1: excited all around the country, even though they're gonna lose.
12:47
Speaker 1: But I think he underestimated two things, the the passion
12:53
Speaker 1: of Midwesterners and the pride of Clevelanders, and o'hien's two
12:59
Speaker 1: put their their city on the map a little bit
13:02
Speaker 1: more than it even was then. And the disinterest of
13:06
Speaker 1: your average New Yorker to take place in a poll
13:09
Speaker 1: or a vote or a petition or a ah to
13:14
Speaker 1: sign their name on something. Yeah, and don't forget this
13:17
Speaker 1: was around the time of balloon Fest eight six, so
13:20
Speaker 1: like Cleveland was really trying. They were trying to find
13:22
Speaker 1: something that that let the world know Cleveland was great.
13:25
Speaker 1: So they actually collected six hundred and fifty thousand signatures,
13:29
Speaker 1: which was more than the population of Cleveland at the time.
13:32
Speaker 1: They got a lot of people behind this idea. Um,
13:36
Speaker 1: and I guess USA today ran a pole in January six, right,
13:40
Speaker 1: and they said, Okay, which are these cities should the
13:42
Speaker 1: Rock and Wall Hall of Fame be in? That's right,
13:46
Speaker 1: And I'm sure they had a colorful graph to declare
13:49
Speaker 1: Cleveland the winner by a landslide a hundred and ten
13:52
Speaker 1: thousand votes in first place. Second place went to Memphis
13:55
Speaker 1: was seventy two hundred. So Cleveland they know how to
13:58
Speaker 1: get people motivated, uh, for civic pride, I will say that, yes.
14:03
Speaker 1: But the thing that probably really got the Foundation's attention
14:08
Speaker 1: was that Cleveland also simultaneously raised twenty six million dollars
14:13
Speaker 1: for the museum to basically say, hey, we're we're quite
14:16
Speaker 1: serious about this. And it would turn out later that
14:19
Speaker 1: the whole thing cost about a hundred million, but Cleveland
14:22
Speaker 1: footed the bill for the whole thing. Yeah, so it
14:25
Speaker 1: was actually, as we'll see, a pretty good choice. Um.
14:29
Speaker 1: And finally it was announced that okay, fine, yes it
14:33
Speaker 1: will be in Cleveland. That's right. But they did not
14:36
Speaker 1: wait for the building to be built to have their
14:38
Speaker 1: first Hall of Fame class voted on and inducted. They
14:43
Speaker 1: did that in New York City, Chuck Berry, James Brown, Ray, Charles,
14:47
Speaker 1: Sam Cook, Fats Domino, the Everly Brothers, Buddy Holly, Jeley, Lewis, Elvis,
14:52
Speaker 1: and Little Richard. And then on the non performance idea
14:55
Speaker 1: had Sam Phillips and Allen Freed. Uh, you had early
14:59
Speaker 1: influencer is Jimmy Rodgers and Jimmy Yancey. And the lifetime
15:03
Speaker 1: achievement that year went to John Hammond, who it didn't
15:06
Speaker 1: look up, but that's got to be the Hammond Organ. Yes, okay. So, um,
15:13
Speaker 1: there was this great quote that day found that really
15:16
Speaker 1: kind of got across, Like even at the outset of
15:19
Speaker 1: the criticism of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame,
15:21
Speaker 1: it said that, um, rock and roll is now so
15:24
Speaker 1: middle class, it was accorded to most civilized honor. It
15:28
Speaker 1: was given a dinner for when writing about the Rock
15:31
Speaker 1: and Roll Hall of Fame, first class induction in you
15:35
Speaker 1: know that that reporter was like, right after they type,
15:40
Speaker 1: I'm so self satisfied, gosh, all right, we're gonna take
15:45
Speaker 1: a break now and we're gonna talk about the building
15:47
Speaker 1: itself and how you get in that thing besides paying
15:52
Speaker 1: money to buy a ticket. Right after this, so Chuck,
16:15
Speaker 1: everywhere I've read is that you have to show that
16:18
Speaker 1: you've signed your name in blood in the Book of
16:20
Speaker 1: Satan to get into the Rock and Roll Hall of
16:23
Speaker 1: Fame and pay thirty dollars, right, is it still thirty bucks.
16:29
Speaker 1: I didn't look that up. I believe, Yes, I think
16:33
Speaker 1: that's about right. Yes, And they have different stuff too,
16:36
Speaker 1: Like like any museum, they'll have temporary exhibits. So if
16:40
Speaker 1: you've been once, I don't think you can't go again, right,
16:43
Speaker 1: they'll let you back in, especially if you're willing to
16:46
Speaker 1: pay another thirty dollars. Yeah, and you'll see new stuff,
16:48
Speaker 1: but supposedly, um, you should not expect to see everything
16:52
Speaker 1: in an hour even too, um and really be able
16:56
Speaker 1: to soak it in. Like I've read that you can
16:58
Speaker 1: zip through the museum and maybe two and a half hours,
17:01
Speaker 1: but you're not getting that much out of it. It
17:03
Speaker 1: depends on how much you want to read the placards
17:05
Speaker 1: and stare it that Jimi Hendrix is purple haze lyrics. Well. Yeah,
17:09
Speaker 1: and there's also lots and lots of videos and archival
17:12
Speaker 1: footage and stuff like that that you can really add
17:15
Speaker 1: a lot to your visit to to sit and watch
17:18
Speaker 1: and listen to. That's right. So when they went to
17:20
Speaker 1: build the building, uh, they enlisted the services of one
17:24
Speaker 1: I am pay Is it pay or pay pay? I
17:28
Speaker 1: am pay um, the architect who just happened to design
17:33
Speaker 1: the expansion of the Louver, which didn't even take that long.
17:39
Speaker 1: It didn't didn't that the second time I've referenced signed
17:43
Speaker 1: that same Seinfeld thing in the last few weeks. No,
17:46
Speaker 1: remember when George pretended to be an architect. Yeah, yeah,
17:49
Speaker 1: and they said he designed the new thing in the
17:51
Speaker 1: Googgenheim and he didn't really even take that long. Yeah
17:54
Speaker 1: I do. I don't remember you referencing it again. I've
17:57
Speaker 1: referenced it recently. I thought it was to you, but
17:58
Speaker 1: it's hard to tell real life. I'm totally with you
18:01
Speaker 1: man these chats these days. But yeah, so he you know,
18:05
Speaker 1: I am pay had a great resume design that glass
18:09
Speaker 1: pyramid at the Louver, and uh went to a few
18:13
Speaker 1: concerts to sort of, you know, get the the gist
18:17
Speaker 1: of what this whole rock and roll thing was all about. Yeah,
18:19
Speaker 1: and apparently, um, he was on acid with lou Reid
18:25
Speaker 1: at the bon Jovis show at the meadow Lands and
18:28
Speaker 1: when he stood up and he said, I've got it.
18:31
Speaker 1: Another triangle is what I'm going to do. Another pyramid,
18:35
Speaker 1: pyramid And he did. It was a it's a pretty
18:38
Speaker 1: iconic building in and of itself. Um, and the pyramid, though,
18:42
Speaker 1: if you hear that he also did the pyramid at
18:44
Speaker 1: the louver, You're like, oh, come on, there's other shapes,
18:47
Speaker 1: but this one is meant to evoke. Especially if you
18:51
Speaker 1: look at the logo or the letter head for the
18:54
Speaker 1: Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Um, they have a
18:57
Speaker 1: pyramid in that, and you see very clearly that the
19:00
Speaker 1: two meant to evoke guitar neck vanishing off into the distance,
19:04
Speaker 1: like you're looking up the neck of a guitar from
19:06
Speaker 1: the body. Yeah. I mean, there's a couple of cool
19:10
Speaker 1: things about it. There's also this central tower and then
19:14
Speaker 1: in front of it a big sixty five thousand square
19:16
Speaker 1: foot um circular plaza, and if you look from above, um,
19:20
Speaker 1: it's really neat. You can look at a picture of
19:21
Speaker 1: it looks like a record uh. And then on that
19:24
Speaker 1: plaza there's like the arm of the record player and
19:27
Speaker 1: the needle uh, and it looks like a turntable, which
19:30
Speaker 1: is really cool. Yeah, it is very cool. So, and
19:33
Speaker 1: it's also like it's a very literal building as far
19:36
Speaker 1: as like what it's supposed to look like goes, But
19:38
Speaker 1: it's also enormous and very nice. It's one of those
19:41
Speaker 1: things where if you research the rock and Roll Hall
19:43
Speaker 1: of Fame. You either come across Cleveland dot Com articles
19:48
Speaker 1: UM rock music um uh, journalism articles or architectural articles.
19:55
Speaker 1: Those are the three groups that basically lay claim to
19:58
Speaker 1: the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. And You're like,
20:01
Speaker 1: I'd fly over it, but I'm not going in. It's
20:03
Speaker 1: not like I wouldn't go in. I don't. I would.
20:05
Speaker 1: I would go in. I just wouldn't get as much
20:07
Speaker 1: out of it as you. Okay, all right, we're getting places. Yeah,
20:11
Speaker 1: it's not like I'm and I certainly don't begrudge anybody going.
20:14
Speaker 1: I'm I'm just saying I won't get as much out
20:16
Speaker 1: of it as you will. It's not like I didn't
20:18
Speaker 1: understand it. I guess what I'm trying to say is,
20:21
Speaker 1: let me see if I'm even put it in different tips.
20:23
Speaker 1: I just I just don't care. I know that's not true.
20:27
Speaker 1: I care. We'll we're gonna crack this code by the end. Okay.
20:34
Speaker 1: Uh So they broke ground opened in ve with a
20:39
Speaker 1: six hour concert. I saw seven and a half. Oh
20:42
Speaker 1: well Springs sign was involved. He did it again? There
20:48
Speaker 1: it is again? Did he really Dave did? Oh? My gosh,
20:51
Speaker 1: did David? It's Springsteen. Oh, that's no TYPEO because I
20:59
Speaker 1: see other ease like his e button isn't broken. It's true,
21:02
Speaker 1: there's one that comes right before the eye. And Bruce Springstein,
21:05
Speaker 1: I can't wait to get his email. Uh. So they
21:09
Speaker 1: have that concert at Cleveland Muni Stadium with Chuck Berry
21:13
Speaker 1: and who is still around played with Springstein and Johnny
21:16
Speaker 1: Cash and Johnny Coogs, Aretha al Green, lou Reid. It
21:22
Speaker 1: was quite an event. Uh. And then I guess we
21:27
Speaker 1: should talk about how you get in because this is
21:29
Speaker 1: where it takes on a lot of heat. Um. Some
21:32
Speaker 1: people say there should be no such thing because rock
21:34
Speaker 1: and roll shouldn't be in a museum, But then other
21:36
Speaker 1: people say the like the voting process and the vagueness
21:43
Speaker 1: of qualifications to be considered are just weird. And it's
21:48
Speaker 1: a popularity contest, and it's gotten a lot of criticism
21:51
Speaker 1: over the years because basically, you have to be at
21:56
Speaker 1: least twenty five years out from your debut album m
22:01
Speaker 1: and you need to have demonstrated unquestionable musical excellence, which
22:09
Speaker 1: is not it's not really great guidance, but it is
22:11
Speaker 1: kind of rock if you think about it, it's kind
22:13
Speaker 1: of rock and roll to be that way, I think,
22:14
Speaker 1: you know, Um, but yeah, that definitely is so subjective
22:18
Speaker 1: that of course it's opened up to you know, accusations
22:22
Speaker 1: of favoritism, sexism, which which definitely seems to be legit
22:27
Speaker 1: only eight percent of the inductees and the Rock and
22:29
Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame or women, and there's definitely way
22:31
Speaker 1: more than eight percent of women rockers or women contributors
22:35
Speaker 1: to rock and roll. So um, it's not that these
22:41
Speaker 1: these allegations or suggestions are just totally off base necessarily, Um,
22:48
Speaker 1: they may be quite accurate. Yeah, I mean, here's my deal.
22:53
Speaker 1: I kind of think it has to be that vague
22:55
Speaker 1: because they would they would get probably more complaints if
22:58
Speaker 1: it was the numbers, if there was an algorithm like
23:01
Speaker 1: you need to have had this many number one singles
23:04
Speaker 1: won this Mini Grammys, which are also subjected by the way, Um,
23:09
Speaker 1: I don't think it can be based on record sales,
23:12
Speaker 1: like it be weird to design an algorithm. I think
23:15
Speaker 1: it has to be kind of vague. Uh. To me,
23:18
Speaker 1: it's a it's an award of longevity in a way, uh,
23:23
Speaker 1: which I do like because you know, twenty five years on,
23:27
Speaker 1: unless you died young, you can still get in like
23:29
Speaker 1: Buddy Holly obviously and people that died young. But you
23:32
Speaker 1: can't have a record that came out twenty five years
23:35
Speaker 1: ago and still be a performer who is not very
23:39
Speaker 1: popular and get in, you know what I mean. Yeah, yeah,
23:45
Speaker 1: you have to have withstood the test of time. And
23:48
Speaker 1: it's easy to pooh pooh this stuff. But like, dude,
23:51
Speaker 1: if there's ever a podcasting Hall of Fame, you bet
23:54
Speaker 1: your sweet. But I want us to be in there,
23:58
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Yeah, And We'll be standing
24:01
Speaker 1: at our our own little display with the microphones and
24:05
Speaker 1: our headphones. I'll be like, I don't care about the
24:08
Speaker 1: microphone and our headphone, and every and most people be going,
24:12
Speaker 1: who are those guys right right now? See that logo?
24:15
Speaker 1: But who are there? You'll find me hanging out at
24:16
Speaker 1: the display being like this one's pretty great. Hey, I'm
24:19
Speaker 1: Josh Clark. It's good to meet you. Thanks for coming.
24:23
Speaker 1: Uh So, Yeah, the vagaries around induction has definitely been
24:27
Speaker 1: a criticism. They come up with a staff comes up
24:30
Speaker 1: with the list of nominees each year. Uh they send
24:33
Speaker 1: that out to a thousand musicians and members of the
24:38
Speaker 1: record industry, historians, music historians, and then they vote for
24:42
Speaker 1: the top picks, and then if you receive at least
24:45
Speaker 1: of the vote, which is five votes, then you were inducted.
24:48
Speaker 1: And that's usually between five and seven performers each year, right,
24:53
Speaker 1: And so the induction process is basically like a museum,
24:57
Speaker 1: the museum version of the hundred greatest bands of all time,
25:01
Speaker 1: hundred greatest albums of all time, and all of like
25:03
Speaker 1: the arguments that that starts. Yeah, that's basically the voting
25:07
Speaker 1: and induction process every single year. Why is this person
25:10
Speaker 1: on this list? Why isn't this person on this list?
25:13
Speaker 1: Why haven't you inducted this person? This doesn't even count
25:16
Speaker 1: as that kind of music. That is exacts the induction
25:19
Speaker 1: process every single year, and everybody's right, Yeah, And I
25:25
Speaker 1: think the Hall of Fame itself is kind of like
25:27
Speaker 1: I don't think they're trying to solve that anymore. I
25:29
Speaker 1: think they're just like, yeah, that's just comes with the
25:32
Speaker 1: territory and stick it in your butt if you don't
25:35
Speaker 1: like it. Probably the wisest thing they could do is
25:39
Speaker 1: approach it from that way. There is a fan vote now,
25:41
Speaker 1: which is great. Um, I don't know if they've always
25:45
Speaker 1: had it, but you can vote online and pick your
25:49
Speaker 1: top five, and the winner of the fan vote is
25:52
Speaker 1: on a fan ballot. And I believe that kind of
25:55
Speaker 1: change things because you know, bands like Rush in Cheap
26:00
Speaker 1: Trick finally getting in the last couple of years, there
26:03
Speaker 1: were a couple of the big ones where people were like,
26:05
Speaker 1: why are they not in there? Like they might may
26:07
Speaker 1: not be the most popular band across all demographics, but
26:11
Speaker 1: like they have some of the most devoted fan bases
26:14
Speaker 1: and have been doing it for you know, thirty years. Yeah. No,
26:17
Speaker 1: there's tons and tons of people that you can say, like,
26:20
Speaker 1: why aren't they in there? Um? Yeah, for sure. But
26:25
Speaker 1: I don't know that the fan vote is actually having
26:27
Speaker 1: much of an impact because I saw that it's added
26:29
Speaker 1: to the other thousand votes, like all of the fant
26:32
Speaker 1: allies adds up to one extra vote. It's not like
26:35
Speaker 1: they can vote in people. No. And I learned that
26:38
Speaker 1: from Dee Snyder, who we were actually on a TV
26:41
Speaker 1: set with at the same time, the lead singer Twisted Sister.
26:45
Speaker 1: He yeah, great guy. Um. He was trying to rally
26:50
Speaker 1: the public to support Iron Maiden this past year, and
26:53
Speaker 1: Maiden got passed up, which is agreed ridiculous, but apparently
26:57
Speaker 1: metal acts like just routinely know by the Rock and
27:00
Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame so much so that you would
27:02
Speaker 1: probably be like, what is going on, Why do you
27:04
Speaker 1: not like metal? Metal is definitely rock and roll for sure. Yeah,
27:09
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, well, we'll get to more of that later,
27:11
Speaker 1: because it is very strange that Judas Priest is not
27:13
Speaker 1: in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Uh. They
27:16
Speaker 1: also hand out other awards, the Ahmed Urigan Award. Um
27:20
Speaker 1: it was the Lifetime Achievement award originally in this for
27:23
Speaker 1: non performers who have had a major influence on the
27:26
Speaker 1: development of rock and roll. So we're talking, uh, Brian Epstein,
27:32
Speaker 1: not Brian Epstein. I think it is Epstein. Uh managed
27:37
Speaker 1: the Beatles, Dick Clark is in lou Adler, Leo Finder,
27:42
Speaker 1: Phil Specter, people like that. Yeah. There's also the Early
27:45
Speaker 1: Influence Award, which is basically like, you're not rock and roll,
27:48
Speaker 1: but you definitely influenced a lot of people who play
27:51
Speaker 1: rock and roll, So people get inducted in that way,
27:54
Speaker 1: like Woody Guthrie definitely not a rocker, but he certainly did,
27:59
Speaker 1: um he influence like Bob Dylan, who's considered a rocker,
28:02
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So, yeah, it's a good
28:04
Speaker 1: way to get in is to just travel in time,
28:07
Speaker 1: release a bunch of records in the nineteen twenties and
28:09
Speaker 1: sit back and wait for your induction after your long day. Uh.
28:13
Speaker 1: Louis Armstrong, Billy Holliday, Robert Johnson, our own les Paul,
28:17
Speaker 1: aren't less Paul like we own him. He's with us. Uh.
28:20
Speaker 1: Then there's the Award for Musical Excellent. This is the
28:22
Speaker 1: artist of musicians and songwriters and producers who was originality
28:26
Speaker 1: and influenced creating music have had a dramatic impact. Only
28:30
Speaker 1: twenty two. They don't do this every year. Um Ringo
28:33
Speaker 1: star Leon Russell, now Rogers the Street Band without Bruce Springstein.
28:39
Speaker 1: Nile Rogers is in there. He was. I was reading
28:42
Speaker 1: about him. He's had one of the most amazing careers
28:44
Speaker 1: of all time. Yeah yeah, I mean if he just
28:48
Speaker 1: did Chic alone, that would be fine. Yep, But he's
28:52
Speaker 1: got you know. That was just a small part of
28:54
Speaker 1: his career. Yes it was. I mean the most recent
28:56
Speaker 1: thing he did was win three Grammys for working with
28:58
Speaker 1: Daft Punk on their most recent album, I guess their
29:01
Speaker 1: last album, There You go. So, there's some things about
29:05
Speaker 1: being inducted um that are kind of anomalous and interesting
29:09
Speaker 1: in in that like you can be inducted more than
29:11
Speaker 1: once in different capacities, right, yeah, yeah, if you're a
29:15
Speaker 1: solo performer and you're in a band like Stevie Nicks
29:19
Speaker 1: is the only woman to be inducted two times as
29:21
Speaker 1: a solo performer and is a member of Fleetwood Back. No, Tina,
29:25
Speaker 1: Tina was inducted twice, and so is Carol King. Well,
29:29
Speaker 1: they are being inducted this year, so technically I got
29:32
Speaker 1: two more weeks before us. I should have known better, Chuck,
29:35
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I think October thirty is so. Carol King
29:39
Speaker 1: was in there as a songwriter, I guess, yeah, I
29:41
Speaker 1: believe so. And Tina with with Nina, Yeah, I had
29:46
Speaker 1: to be yes. Can you believe it they inducted her
29:48
Speaker 1: with Ike before they inducted her as their solo career.
29:52
Speaker 1: Give me a break. I believe that chronologically, But it
29:55
Speaker 1: doesn't have to go chronic chronologically. It says nothing about
29:58
Speaker 1: chronological order. But we'll let me ask you this. When
30:01
Speaker 1: you think Tina Turner, do you think rolling on the
30:03
Speaker 1: river or do you think private dancer private, okay, you
30:08
Speaker 1: think sexy, sweaty saxophone. Yes, solos, yes, totally, alright, fair enough,
30:15
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about one right now, which is why she's
30:18
Speaker 1: in there twice. Eric Clapton's in there three times, not once,
30:21
Speaker 1: not twice, but thrice obviously, Yardbirds Cream and it's a
30:25
Speaker 1: solo guy. All the Beatles are in twice. Yeah, all
30:29
Speaker 1: it's they're the only band all inducted as solo artists. Yeah.
30:33
Speaker 1: I can't think of another band that might hit that mark.
30:37
Speaker 1: Um um. I can't either, because not many people are
30:43
Speaker 1: going to be just as big as a solo performer. No,
30:45
Speaker 1: it's very rare, for sure. Um. And I think it's
30:48
Speaker 1: nice that they gave Ringo his own two in two
30:50
Speaker 1: thousand seventeen. That was great. That was a very nice ceremony.
30:53
Speaker 1: I watched it every year, the ceremonies. Oh sure, I
30:57
Speaker 1: love it. It's it's fun because you know they induct
31:01
Speaker 1: the people. Someone who loves that person is inducting them,
31:05
Speaker 1: so that's always great. And it's always you know, like, uh,
31:09
Speaker 1: somebody might not expect like Harry Styles inducted Stevie Nicks
31:13
Speaker 1: and like I didn't even know Harry styles like Stevie Nicks.
31:15
Speaker 1: In turns out he loves Stevie Nicks. So it's stuff
31:18
Speaker 1: like that. And then they give their speech which is
31:20
Speaker 1: great or a complete uh disaster, which is also fun.
31:25
Speaker 1: So this is from Amanda Patrucius Patrucius, sorry, Amanda um
31:31
Speaker 1: from the New Yorker back in two thousand seventeen, and
31:34
Speaker 1: she said, the televised ceremony proceeded about is expected. Gentlemen
31:38
Speaker 1: with exacting hairstyles, wore sunglasses inside, hugged each other reluctantly,
31:43
Speaker 1: and squinted at a teleprompter. Was like, he just took
31:48
Speaker 1: me there to the induction. Well, what's funny is some
31:51
Speaker 1: of these some of the speeches are really nice and awesome. Uh,
31:54
Speaker 1: and then some of them are uh. Some people are
31:57
Speaker 1: like up there with bands that they broke up with
32:00
Speaker 1: and like they hated each other. Yeah, Like, oh my god,
32:02
Speaker 1: have you seen the acceptance speech for Blondie? I know
32:07
Speaker 1: I saw it live, but I don't remember what was
32:09
Speaker 1: What would happen? Blondie wouldn't let like three or four
32:11
Speaker 1: of the original members play at the ceremony. Debbie Harry
32:15
Speaker 1: wouldn't know, yes, sorry, Debbie Harry would not and one
32:19
Speaker 1: of the original guys begged her on the microphone during
32:23
Speaker 1: his speech, and she said no and kept saying no.
32:26
Speaker 1: It was like no, we're not no, you're not playing tonight,
32:29
Speaker 1: and um, it was really deeply uncomfortable. Fifteen years later
32:34
Speaker 1: watching it on YouTube, I was like, I'm gonna throw up.
32:36
Speaker 1: I'm so so uncomfortable right now. Well, you know, sometimes
32:40
Speaker 1: people don't show up, like Paul McCartney didn't show up
32:43
Speaker 1: for the Beatles induction because supposedly he was in a
32:47
Speaker 1: lawsuit at the time with Yoko and Ringo about something. Um,
32:51
Speaker 1: the Talking Heads managed to get together and play together,
32:54
Speaker 1: like that's the other thing, you know, that's where I
32:56
Speaker 1: was headed. You have your speech and then you play together,
32:59
Speaker 1: usually as the original band. Sometimes if it's like like
33:04
Speaker 1: a journey, you know, Steve Perry didn't sing, but he
33:06
Speaker 1: gave his blessing for the new guy to sing. Sometimes
33:10
Speaker 1: they'll have both, like you know, Guns and Roses will
33:13
Speaker 1: have the two drummers there and they'll take turns Axel
33:17
Speaker 1: wasn't there, you know, not mid song. Uh. And then
33:21
Speaker 1: sometimes people can't get it together at all and they're
33:23
Speaker 1: just like, no, we hate each other. We're not playing,
33:26
Speaker 1: we're not showing up. Um. Sometimes Mike Love will get
33:30
Speaker 1: up there as a member of the Beach Boys and
33:31
Speaker 1: be a crazy freak. Uh just watch his speech if
33:35
Speaker 1: you want to see something very deeply uncomfortable. I can't.
33:39
Speaker 1: He like flat out challenged people on stage. He just
33:43
Speaker 1: got really salty, like halfway through and he's like, I'd
33:45
Speaker 1: love to see I'd love to see the mop Tops
33:48
Speaker 1: the Beatles get up and do a hundred and eighties
33:50
Speaker 1: shows a year, or I'd like to see Mick Jagger
33:52
Speaker 1: get up on stage and do what I do. And
33:55
Speaker 1: it was just and he's a legendary jerk, but it
33:58
Speaker 1: was it was really something else he does not live
34:00
Speaker 1: up to. But to me, that's sort of the fun
34:03
Speaker 1: of watching the ceremony is all these really deeply personal
34:07
Speaker 1: relationships of these people that are suddenly thrust back together. Uh,
34:12
Speaker 1: and do they work it out and are they amicable
34:14
Speaker 1: and cool or not? Bunny Carlos played with cheap Trick,
34:17
Speaker 1: which is cool, they're drummer that left um. But sometimes
34:21
Speaker 1: like Axel Rose in a full on legally statement that
34:25
Speaker 1: not only didn't say like I don't want to come,
34:28
Speaker 1: but he was like, no one is allowed to induct me.
34:30
Speaker 1: No one is allowed to speak for me. I think
34:32
Speaker 1: we have to read it. Chuck, Yeah, read it. It's
34:34
Speaker 1: pretty graty. This was from Axel Rose. I strongly request
34:38
Speaker 1: that I not be inducted in absentia, and please know
34:41
Speaker 1: that no one is authorized, nor may anyone be permitted
34:44
Speaker 1: to accept any induction for me or speak on my behalf.
34:48
Speaker 1: Neither former members, label representatives, nor the Rock and Roll
34:52
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame should imply, whether directly, indirectly or biomission,
34:55
Speaker 1: that I am included in any purported induction of Guns
34:58
Speaker 1: and Roses. Oh man, he really did want to take part,
35:03
Speaker 1: and yet they got back together and they're playing again
35:05
Speaker 1: and seemingly enjoying themselves. What's his problem with Guns and Roses?
35:09
Speaker 1: I mean, I knew they broke up or whatever, but
35:11
Speaker 1: why does he like hate Slash or what's the problem?
35:14
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, he and Slash had problems, and I don't
35:18
Speaker 1: know they worked it all out, but they hugged it out.
35:21
Speaker 1: Who knows what goes on behind these closed green room doors?
35:24
Speaker 1: You know? Wasn't that the song No One Knows what
35:29
Speaker 1: goes on behind green rooms doors? I think? Is that
35:32
Speaker 1: a bob Seekers song. I think so maybe we should
35:35
Speaker 1: take a break. All right, let's do that. All right,
35:36
Speaker 1: We'll be right back and we're gonna wrap this thing up,
35:58
Speaker 1: all right. Should we talk about some of the famous snubs? Yes, definitely,
36:02
Speaker 1: we can just do that for the rest of the show. Well,
36:05
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm looking at the list. I'm gonna go
36:07
Speaker 1: ahead and throw out Alison Chains and Big Star, like
36:12
Speaker 1: throw them out like you don't include them, throw them
36:14
Speaker 1: out like they should be in and they're not. How
36:18
Speaker 1: about wait for this one, Uh, Dick Dale, that's just nuts.
36:24
Speaker 1: That's we talked about that in the Gibson Fender episode.
36:30
Speaker 1: How about the Smiths or m C five, I know,
36:34
Speaker 1: I mean, it gets, it gets weird. It's like, who'sker
36:36
Speaker 1: do to me? Belongs in there? But like they were
36:39
Speaker 1: a very small band in excess was a huge band.
36:42
Speaker 1: Jane's addictions not in the Jane's addiction not being in
36:44
Speaker 1: there's pretty surprising and just objectively wrong for sure. I
36:49
Speaker 1: totally agree. Uh Motorhead, well, Motley Crue, it gets. It's
36:54
Speaker 1: so subjective, it gets so weird because people poo poo
36:57
Speaker 1: stuff like disco and they poopoo stuff like uh like
37:02
Speaker 1: Ozzy Osbourne or metal like he should be in there,
37:05
Speaker 1: Yeah for sure. But that's I mean, that's that kind
37:08
Speaker 1: of gets at the heart of why a lot of
37:10
Speaker 1: people are like, wait a minute, what's going on here? Um,
37:13
Speaker 1: Because like hip hop acts have started to be inducted
37:18
Speaker 1: into it starting in two thousand and seventeen, UM or
37:21
Speaker 1: two thousand seven, I'm sorry with Grandmaster Flash in the
37:23
Speaker 1: Furious five. I think one of the most recent one
37:27
Speaker 1: was jay Z and is that right? And we said
37:32
Speaker 1: earlier that it hadn't happened yet by the time this
37:34
Speaker 1: is out, it will have already. Okay, so this year
37:37
Speaker 1: part of this class, Okay, Tupac got inducted. I think,
37:40
Speaker 1: what do you what do you think about that? One?
37:43
Speaker 1: More Failakuti was nominated this year, but he didn't make it.
37:47
Speaker 1: So there's this guy that um Dave turned up that
37:52
Speaker 1: I think makes a really great case. His name is
37:54
Speaker 1: Troy L. Smith. He works for Cleveland dot Com, one
37:57
Speaker 1: of the triumvirate of writing about the Rock and Roll
37:59
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame and um. He says, look, man, if
38:03
Speaker 1: you are talking about rock and roll, of course it
38:07
Speaker 1: would include hip hop just as much as it would
38:09
Speaker 1: include like alternative or new wave or punk, like they're
38:12
Speaker 1: all branching off the same tree. Because if rock and
38:15
Speaker 1: roll is the trunk, if you go a little further down,
38:18
Speaker 1: the roots of that tree are like blues, jazz, gospel,
38:22
Speaker 1: boogie woogie do walk, like all this stuff combined to
38:26
Speaker 1: make rock and roll. And if you're saying like rock
38:29
Speaker 1: and roll is just a white guy with a guitar
38:32
Speaker 1: somewhere between nineteen sixty seven and nineteen nine, you're talking
38:36
Speaker 1: specifically about rock, and that's actually different than rock and roll.
38:40
Speaker 1: And this isn't the rock Hall of Fame. This is
38:42
Speaker 1: the rock and roll Hall of Fame. So yeah, you
38:46
Speaker 1: could make a really strong case to include not just
38:49
Speaker 1: hip hop but also like R and b um world
38:53
Speaker 1: music like Failey, Cooties, afrobeats, stuff like, like all these
38:58
Speaker 1: people were influenced by the same tree. And that's what
39:01
Speaker 1: Troy Smith is seen. And I gotta say I agree
39:03
Speaker 1: with them on that one. I just have mixed feelings.
39:07
Speaker 1: I do agree, but it's um. Then just call it
39:10
Speaker 1: the Music Hall of Fame, maybe because it's some people.
39:13
Speaker 1: It's weird that like Willie Nelson's not in there, but
39:17
Speaker 1: like another country artist might be like Williams is in there,
39:20
Speaker 1: Johnny Cash. Yeah, like they'll include jazz and now hip hop,
39:24
Speaker 1: but like not metal. It's just I don't know, man,
39:27
Speaker 1: that it starts to sort of fall apart in a
39:30
Speaker 1: way the more you expand it. Because there is a
39:33
Speaker 1: country music Hall of Fame that there's probably I don't
39:36
Speaker 1: know if there's a jazz hall of Fame is there somewhere?
39:40
Speaker 1: I mean like like should everyone have their own hall
39:41
Speaker 1: of fame like every genre? But then where do you stop?
39:44
Speaker 1: Is it like is new way the genre like it is?
39:47
Speaker 1: But is it under the more all inclusive banner of
39:50
Speaker 1: rock and roll? It just it gets really like a
39:54
Speaker 1: cat chasing its own tail at some point. So there
39:56
Speaker 1: was this kind of Twitter just Russian, which means a
40:01
Speaker 1: flame war between ice Cube and Gene Simmons from Kiss
40:05
Speaker 1: when n w A was being abducted. Gene Simmons was
40:08
Speaker 1: pooh pooing the whole thing and ice Cube was defending it,
40:12
Speaker 1: and ice Cube had a pretty good point. He said, Um,
40:15
Speaker 1: the question is are we rock and roll? Rock and
40:17
Speaker 1: roll is not an instrument. Rock and roll is not
40:19
Speaker 1: even a style of music. Rock and roll is a spirit.
40:22
Speaker 1: It's not conforming, it's outside the box. And then he
40:25
Speaker 1: finishes with rock and rolls in w A, which I
40:27
Speaker 1: could not have read that more squarely than I did.
40:30
Speaker 1: But if you go a little further and read Gene
40:33
Speaker 1: Simmons is retort too. He's saying, like, yes, he's criticizing
40:36
Speaker 1: hip hop is not like actual music because they sample
40:39
Speaker 1: and they talk, rather than saying so therefore it's not rock.
40:42
Speaker 1: I disagree with that. But he also says, I'll tell
40:45
Speaker 1: you what, when led Zeppelin gets inducted into the Rap
40:48
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame, then you will have proven your point.
40:50
Speaker 1: And he makes a good case in that situation as well.
40:53
Speaker 1: But it kind of dove tails in with your idea,
40:56
Speaker 1: like should each of them, each genre of music have
40:59
Speaker 1: its own hall of Fame? I don't think so. I
41:02
Speaker 1: think the rock and roll Hall of Fame is a
41:05
Speaker 1: wide enough umbrella that it includes hip hop and other
41:08
Speaker 1: stuff that's not rock. Yeah, that's not a great look
41:12
Speaker 1: to say stuff like that either, though, No, I know,
41:14
Speaker 1: and like like you know, of course there's allegations of
41:17
Speaker 1: racism and sexism and and um homophobism is that a word? Sure? Umho?
41:24
Speaker 1: I think of course, dude, of course, But Um, Amanda, Patricia,
41:30
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Amanda. Um. She says that. Um. She points out,
41:35
Speaker 1: like how much this this ties into that same hatred
41:39
Speaker 1: of disco by the same people who are into rock.
41:43
Speaker 1: But at the time when rock was new, these are
41:45
Speaker 1: the same people who never aged out of that. It's
41:48
Speaker 1: all rock. It's all white guy with the guitar from
41:51
Speaker 1: nine six seven, and that's rock, and that's rock and roll.
41:55
Speaker 1: And that's just not true. That's a type of rock
41:57
Speaker 1: and roll. That's not the all and I'll be all
42:01
Speaker 1: of rock and roll. Yes, that's my take on it.
42:04
Speaker 1: I'll stop saying it. I know I've said it at
42:06
Speaker 1: least twice now, but it's just so true it is. Uh.
42:11
Speaker 1: He saw who was coming in this year. I thought
42:13
Speaker 1: that might get you excited. Who. Well, in the in
42:16
Speaker 1: the performer it's Tina Turner, Carol King, the go Goes Amazing,
42:20
Speaker 1: jay Z Foo Fighters, and Todd Rundgren. But the Early
42:23
Speaker 1: Influence Award, my friend craft work. Oh really they're getting
42:27
Speaker 1: in Huh, they're getting in his early influence along with
42:30
Speaker 1: Charlie Patton and uh and legendary jazz poet Gil Scott Heron,
42:36
Speaker 1: who I totally think Whyatt's Senac should play in a biopic.
42:42
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you mean a biopic. In a biopic, I
42:45
Speaker 1: think why it would crush that role. And I think
42:49
Speaker 1: I've even told him that. Oh yeah, what was his response?
42:52
Speaker 1: I don't think I've told him that, because he would
42:53
Speaker 1: probably be like, I don't need career advice from me.
42:55
Speaker 1: But that's right, zip it why it's famous for saying
43:00
Speaker 1: Musical Excellent Award this year is local j Billy Preston
43:03
Speaker 1: and Randy Rhodes, not bad. Ozzy's not even in there.
43:07
Speaker 1: And then Clarence Avant is getting the Ahmet Ernigan Award,
43:12
Speaker 1: and I don't know who that is, and I feel
43:14
Speaker 1: like I should. I don't either, So so Chuck, they
43:17
Speaker 1: have um purple haze lyrics. I think we've established that
43:21
Speaker 1: multiple times. What else do they have at the Rock
43:23
Speaker 1: and Hall of Fame that would be worth paying thirty
43:26
Speaker 1: dollars to go see? By the way, Clarence uh Avant
43:31
Speaker 1: is known as the Black Godfather, entrepreneur, executive and film
43:35
Speaker 1: producer and American music executive. So I gotta shout him out.
43:39
Speaker 1: You know, they got they got the instruments, they got
43:41
Speaker 1: the out, they got a whole room of clothing and
43:44
Speaker 1: legendary outfits. Uh, they have the handwritten lyrics, They have
43:50
Speaker 1: archival like original master tapes where in listening rooms. They
43:54
Speaker 1: have this really cool thing now that just opened a
43:56
Speaker 1: couple of years ago called the Garage, where it's literally
43:59
Speaker 1: like a garage just set up with a full band
44:02
Speaker 1: and you can go in there. You don't have to
44:03
Speaker 1: know what you're doing, and they'll try and teach you
44:04
Speaker 1: how to play instruments. I just want to wash your
44:07
Speaker 1: hands afterwards. Yeah, well you do now for sure, and
44:10
Speaker 1: you're like or always um and you know, they have
44:13
Speaker 1: a great music education program with working with the schools
44:16
Speaker 1: in Ohio and in Cleveland, so like, like they do
44:20
Speaker 1: a lot of cool outreach and hands on stuff to
44:22
Speaker 1: get people involved. And if you go to the garage
44:26
Speaker 1: the website for the garage and you see like these,
44:28
Speaker 1: you know sort of people you who can tell have
44:31
Speaker 1: never picked up an instrument before playing the drums or
44:34
Speaker 1: playing the bass just a little bit, and like the
44:36
Speaker 1: delight on their faces. It's pretty cool. That's where the
44:40
Speaker 1: museum staff who transgressed are punished. They have to go
44:44
Speaker 1: hang out at the garage and watch that. Oh you
44:48
Speaker 1: get this now they're teaching them the teachers I got. Well.
44:54
Speaker 1: The only other thing I want to point out is
44:56
Speaker 1: the if you're looking for highlights from over the years,
45:00
Speaker 1: that you know, in the end, they had this all
45:02
Speaker 1: Star jam where a bunch of people come on stage
45:05
Speaker 1: and play some songs, and I think probably the most
45:08
Speaker 1: legendary moment that's ever happened, and it was passed along.
45:11
Speaker 1: Uh more recently after his death was that George Harrison's
45:15
Speaker 1: posthumous induction and all Star jam. They were playing while
45:19
Speaker 1: my guitar gently weeps and prints, comes out of the
45:22
Speaker 1: shadows and destroys the stage with a guitar solo that
45:26
Speaker 1: like is unlike anything I've ever seen. It's amazing, and
45:31
Speaker 1: he's just the coolest dude on the planet. He finishes
45:33
Speaker 1: his solo, takes his guitar up and throws it up
45:36
Speaker 1: in the air, and there's, uh, you don't know this,
45:39
Speaker 1: but his guys out there to catch the guitar. But
45:41
Speaker 1: and he struts off stage and Tom Petty's and Jeff
45:43
Speaker 1: Lynn are just standing there like and Danny Harrison like,
45:46
Speaker 1: oh my god, what just happened. That's pretty cool, man,
45:48
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Um, so one long and last thing that
45:51
Speaker 1: the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame tried to expand
45:53
Speaker 1: they finally tried to open something in New York and
45:56
Speaker 1: they did, uh and I think um two thousand eight. Yes,
46:05
Speaker 1: So they finally got that New York outpost, right, chuck,
46:07
Speaker 1: And then within two years it was closed, And they
46:09
Speaker 1: tried another one in Tokyo in two thousand and seventeen.
46:12
Speaker 1: It closed in five months later, and Dave Rouse nails
46:15
Speaker 1: it with this last line. I guess Cleveland really was
46:19
Speaker 1: the right choice after all, wink emoji. Yeah. I mean
46:23
Speaker 1: they need to keep expanding Cleveland because you've only got
46:26
Speaker 1: so much space, you know, Yeah, for sure, but I mean,
46:29
Speaker 1: like it's that was the place to do it. It
46:31
Speaker 1: turns out that that was absolutely correct, So that's good.
46:34
Speaker 1: Sometimes big decisions don't always work out, and this was
46:37
Speaker 1: one that did. And by God, God bless you, Cleveland.
46:41
Speaker 1: We gotta get Jane's addiction in there, sure. I think
46:44
Speaker 1: we also really even more so, maybe need to get
46:46
Speaker 1: like Iron Maiden in there or Judas Priests or both.
46:50
Speaker 1: James was nominated once, uh and didn't get in the
46:55
Speaker 1: war has been nominated three times and hasn't gotten And
46:59
Speaker 1: I don't. That's oh no, no, no, no. Chic has
47:01
Speaker 1: been nominated eleven times and hasn't gotten in that just
47:04
Speaker 1: because it's disco, that is ridiculous. I saw I read
47:09
Speaker 1: an article making the case for weird Al, but then
47:12
Speaker 1: also saying why weird Al will never make it in
47:14
Speaker 1: because he makes seventeen years uh snubbed, never nominated. Maybe
47:22
Speaker 1: someday weird Al. But I also get the impression weird
47:24
Speaker 1: Al doesn't care. Yeah, well maybe he does steep down. No,
47:30
Speaker 1: I don't think so. Okay. Um, since we said weird
47:33
Speaker 1: Al doesn't care, obviously, that means that it is time
47:36
Speaker 1: for a listener. Now. Uh, let me see here, which
47:43
Speaker 1: one should I read? I'm gonna call this lemon song. Um,
47:48
Speaker 1: every morning is to get ready for work. Guys, I
47:49
Speaker 1: like to throw on an episode of stuff. You should know.
47:51
Speaker 1: The excitement that came over me this morning and to
47:54
Speaker 1: my favorite things briefly combined into one is indescribable. Josh's
47:59
Speaker 1: mix up on the lemons and gave me a good chuckle,
48:01
Speaker 1: only because Squeeze my Lemon is of course from the
48:03
Speaker 1: women song, and I can only guess that the song
48:06
Speaker 1: about friendship that he's speaking about is the song friends
48:10
Speaker 1: on led Zeppelin three maybe Uh. As soon as I
48:14
Speaker 1: heard the beginning of the episode toquinently send quickly sent
48:16
Speaker 1: a text over to my dad. He's the reason I'm
48:19
Speaker 1: such a big Zeppelin fan. We both got matching Zeppelin
48:22
Speaker 1: tattoos when I graduated from college, and I am the
48:25
Speaker 1: reason he is a Stuff you Should Know fan. While
48:28
Speaker 1: we don't live close, I'm in Denver and he's in Phoenix,
48:30
Speaker 1: a small moment like this is something that gave us
48:33
Speaker 1: both a good laugh and a reason to chat this morning.
48:36
Speaker 1: And that is from Lauren and Denver. Nice Lauren, thank
48:39
Speaker 1: you very much for that. We love bringing families together,
48:41
Speaker 1: don't we chuck and splitting them apart in evil Factory.
48:47
Speaker 1: If you want to let us not how we brought
48:48
Speaker 1: your family together or split you asunder uh, you can
48:51
Speaker 1: email it to us to stuff podcast at iHeart radio
48:55
Speaker 1: dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a production of
49:00
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit
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49:07
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