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The Big O Podcast - Episode #13: Celtics, Pats, & Inside Radio · The Big O Podcast

• Glenn Ordway: Here we are with another episode of the Big O podcast, and it's throwback time back to the old big show days and our buddy Pete Shepherd. Hello, Petey, how are All right, let's start with this whole Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown beef, because neither you or I have been able to comment. And I I I can't do it on Twitter because I put Pete Sheppard: No Glenn Ordway: I did one tweet out there on X, and the problem is people misunderstand what you're saying. You know, you can't Pete Sheppard: Yeah. It's it Glenn Ordway: do it in short form. You just can't. Pete Sheppard: It's it's really, I I I put one tweet out last week about it's just P just everybody relax, honest to God. And then and then you look at some of the commentaries from some of the people on X and and it's not just the ones with twenty-two to fifty-four followers, because I don't care how many people follow you, it's the coward it's it's cowardly. And then you go look at the people who responded to you, Glenn. And I don't like blocking people, but when you see psychotic people and their tweets. And you go back in their history from and there's never anything positive and all they're doing is F bombing, using the C word, this, that, and the other. I just block I don't I don't want them part of this podcast. I don't want you wanna you want to criticize me for whatever. That's on the air per but but but when I go back and look at some of these psychotic people who should be locked up in some sort of a padded room with psychiatric help, you look at their const their their history, there there's there's nothing. There's nothing and I'm just not Glenn Ordway: Well you can Pete Sheppard: saying if you pop, but but I'm I'm I'm in psychotic stuff. So Twitter X has become a lot. It's become really accessible. It really it really has. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I I have a blue Glenn Ordway: You can go to you can go to blue sky where everything is soft and gentle. Used to be. Used to be. Pete Sheppard: sky account, but I don't you I I I don't I I don't use that. I really don't use Instagram. I Glenn Ordway: It's not as soft and gentle as it used to be. Pete Sheppard: no, I don't use Instagram either. Instagram, I don't know, it bothers me. Not that it bothers me, I just don't there's only so much I can do. I'd rather use LinkedIn. X and Facebook. That's it. I don't I don't have time anymore. I don't Glenn Ordway: So okay. Pete Sheppard: have time or the patience anymore for this other stuff. I just don't. Glenn Ordway: Well, it's all it's it's all new technology and you've got to stay current with all of this stuff. Though I must admit, I don't know if you will admit this, when Jalen Brown came back and responded to Tatum the other day with a cap emoji, I had no fucking idea what he was talking about. I had to Pete Sheppard: I d I didn't either. Glenn Ordway: go to the Google machine and find out what it meant. Okay? I had no idea what it meant. And People were commenting about it, and I'm sitting there going, what the hell is a cap? And apparently it meant, you're fibbing, you're lying, you're, making it up, So you didn't know it either. I I figure you didn't know it. So let me let me go back Pete Sheppard: Yeah, I didn't know that either. And I I don't I don't really give a shit. I'm honestly about that stuff. I'm so tired of it. Glenn Ordway: let me go back in this story to the to the start of it, okay? Pete Sheppard: Uh-huh. Glenn Ordway: Because I be talking about X, I had predicted on X last year at the end of the year that they Celtics were going to trade away. Jalen Brown. It became obvious to me. They had two players that were going to be supermax contract guys. You're not paying two wing players $71 million per year. You can't Pete Sheppard: Exactly. Yep. Glenn Ordway: do that. You can pay if you could get a center or power forward guy that plays a different position, and he's your supermax player, like Giannis is, then you do that. And by the way, Pete Sheppard: Which they tried. Glenn Ordway: they try. And unfortunately they weren't willing to give up enough. So this is all bullshit when both of these guys now come out and say, they were blindsided, they didn't know. Everybody knew. Everybody knew what was going on internally within the Celtics organization that they were not going to keep Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: two supermax players. And let's face it, Tatum is the better player. It's not a knock on Jalen Brown. Jalen Brown is a terrific player. And he proved it last year, taking a a pretty shaky roster and leading them on to 56 wins. Okay. Now we saw what they really were when you got to the playoffs. They were beating up on the bad teams and they weren't necessarily having a great record against the really good teams. But Tatum is the better player. So the decision is easy. You keep Tatum, you trade Jalen Brown. My problem with the trade, because I had no issue with trading Jalen Brown because I understood Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: the financial. My problem was you traded him away for the wrong player. You Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: you had to do that Giannis deal. Once you failed to do the Giannis deal, and everybody in the league knew you were attempting to do it, once Brad Stevens failed with that deal, everybody knew what was going on. And now all you did is piss off Jalen Brown. You pissed him off because now he knew you were getting traded. Now Brian Scalabrini came out on his radio show. Yesterday and made a huge mistake. Pete Sheppard: I heard it. Glenn Ordway: And he came out, you're you're you're working for the team scale. Okay. You're Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: doing their games. If you're having private conversations with Brad or with anybody in the organization and they're speaking off the record, if you're not working for the team and doing the games, you can reveal it on a radio show. But if you're doing the games and you reveal what they were telling you privately. You're in trouble. And so Pete Sheppard: Well, remember he's also doing national now too. Glenn Ordway: correct. And last night it was beep, beep, beep, beep, backing up as he had to say, well, no, they really he really didn't demand a trait. Pete Sheppard: Did he really do I I could not I'd be I told you I I could not wanna I was at work last night. I saw highlights of it, I did not hear the broadcast at all. we had obviously we had the World Series Glenn Ordway: He he he totally Pete Sheppard: and a Monday night football game on, but I did not I saw the highlights of the blowout, but I did not hear the broadcast. Glenn Ordway: He flipped. He totally in the pregame show. He came and he said, no, he didn't demand a trade. he had a few things that he was demanding that he wanted from the team. And Jalen Brown has had representatives. I I thought he was doing his own deal. well, we he he didn't he didn't say. But Jalen Brown has already denied Pete Sheppard: What kind of demands do you say specifically? What would what do you think but what do you think they are? Glenn Ordway: all of that, that there were no demands. guess is there was one demand. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: Okay. The demand was if I'm gonna stay with the Pete Sheppard: Trade data. Glenn Ordway: Celtics, I want you to extend the contract and give me the hundred and forty million dollars. Pete Sheppard: Sure. Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: Okay. I want the seventy-one million a year for the two-year extension. Because that's what a normal agent would do. That's what you would ask for. Now it doesn't mean you're going to get it, and they were never going to pay it to them. And I don't think Philadelphia is going to end up paying it either. But so we knew all of that stuff for either one of these guys to come out now. And say they had no idea any of this was going on. Now, I think it's a real stretch to think that Tatum forced this, that Tatum wanted this to happen. I just don't see that happening. It's not in his nature. And how does he gain anything? Because if that gets out, he looks like a total fool. I just don't see Tatum doing that. Now, after they fell through with the deal. In Milwaukee, did the Celtics sit down with Tatum and say, Hey, listen, I think we're still gonna trade Jalen Brown. Where do you think what what player out there do you like that we can get in return? I think that's very plausible, don't you? Pete Sheppard: Absolut absolutely. And he's the star player, star players, superstars, and he is one I are treated differently. So yeah, I'm sure they kinda went. Patriots used to go to Brady, I'm sure, as you know, that's that and other teams do that. That so I'm not surprised at all. I do think though, it ended up being very interesting that and it kind of reminded me of when Bledsoe got traded to Buffalo, you know, they trade Jalen Brown to their arch rivals, you know, it Philadelphia. knowing they're in the same division, same conference and everything else, did he did did they get the best deal by trading him to Philadelphia? Or did I think so either? Glenn Ordway: No. No. No. Pete Sheppard: But they must I I I think Jalen Brown, who I think is an excellent player and he's a way better defender than he gets credit for, I think, as well in the league. But I don't know. For the Celtics to trade him to the 76ers, Do you think that the Celtics feel that that made Philadelphia more of a threat? 'Cause if they did, why would they do that? I don't Glenn Ordway: Because I I don't think they had a choice. So they tried to do the Giannis deal. Apparently the Bucks wanted one additional player. Jalen Brown, I think, was willing to go to Milwaukee. I don't know why, but it would have been a much better deal for the Celtics. And if you've watched Giannis in the first four games, he's playing out of his mind, yet he's 0-4 because his team sucks right now. Pete Sheppard: Yep. Glenn Ordway: And he doesn't have anybody to help him, he's going to be so frustrated this season because the Heat are really going to be bad. They can't defend, they don't have outside shooting. So he creates space and nobody can take advantage of it. So that would have been the perfect deal for the Celtics. It would have been a super max player that plays a different position and brings a different skill level. Once that fell through, Brad Stevens had a problem because there wasn't a a great market for Jalen Brown out there. People didn't look at him. First of all, you're going to have to pay him all that money. So it's not a cheap deal. And there wasn't a great market. Brad Stevens was forced to fa to trade him to Philadelphia because it was the only team that was willing to do business. Because Philly was trying to get rid of Paul George. And Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: so they were willing to take a younger player, same money, and a guy that they thought could fit in better for them. And here's the problem I had with the deal, Pete. I keep on hearing some of the green teamers say, well, if if Paul doesn't work out with Paul George this year, you can just trade him away at the end of next year. Well, you can because he'll be an expiring contract that following year. But any team that takes on Paul George is going to want something in return. And you know what you're going to have to give in return? The draft picks that you got from Philadelphia in that deal. So how is that deal a positive deal? Now Paul George has played well so far. My problem is he only averages playing about forty-eight, forty-nine games per season over the last three years. Pete Sheppard: Well, Glenn, my whole thing with this whole thing because I as I told you even I think off off air before, I I still think the Celtics are gonna win more games in Philadelphia. For this reason, because I think between LeBron and Embiid, it's only a matter of time before they both go down for a long period of time. Paul George, same problem. So I'm looking at it for a two-for-one. Celtics got a two-for-one in this. You know why? 'Cause the odds are greater that Embiid and LeBron James will go down for more games and Paul George for the Celtics. That's my out of the box thinking. He buying any of that. I'm reaching. I'm I'm I I I'm I'm reaching. I'm being somewhat facetious. But yeah, I'm I I'm Glenn Ordway: No, I I I no, I'm I'm buying that all three of those guys are going to go down. They're not gonna play Yeah. They're not gonna play a full season. Pete Sheppard: I'm hoping the k that is that is the case. Cause certainly Embiid and George, that would be a good prop bet. What guy plays more games this year? Glenn Ordway: my feeling with the looking at the Sixers so far, and they're playing much better at a higher level early on than I thought they would. I thought it would take two or three months for them to figure this thing out. But I think people are underestimating what Maxie can bring to the table. He's a terrific player Pete Sheppard: No, he's awesome. Glenn Ordway: and you've got him off the ball now, and it's he's gonna score more, he's gonna be more important to that team because Embiid has been shaky so far in in the process. Pete Sheppard: Whoa, you think? Glenn Ordway: And still loves taking his outside threes from from the wing. I think I Pete Sheppard: He made a couple. Glenn Ordway: think this I think the Celtics will end up with a better regular season record than the Sixers. But when we get to the postseason, I do really like that Philadelphia starting five, Pete. And the three guys they bring off the bench. I like Philadelphia over Boston when we get to the playoffs. I it's great to have 11, 12 guys that can contribute during the regular season because you're playing 16 back. Backs, you get worn out during the year, and you you get to get energy guys in there on a regular basis. None of that plays into the playoffs. You don't play back to backs. You get two, three nights off sometimes in between games, and your starting five is important. Philly's starting five is much better than Boston's starting five. But getting back to the the whole Tatum and Jalen Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: Brown thing, I don't know why Tatum had to go on, and this is where people because Celtic fans did this. They loved Jalen Brown last year. Because they did not expect, as you had pointed out, anything from that team last year. And Jalen Brown brought them a lot of joy. 56 wins. Granted, we know what happened in the postseason. So they fell in love with Jalen Brown all over again. And then they hated the trade. Most people hated the the trade. Most people didn't want to trade Jalen Brown for Giannis. If you saw any of the polls that were out there at the time, Celtic fans were against that trade, which I couldn't understand. Pete Sheppard: Yeah, yeah, but again, I go back to two thousand and eight and I still remember after Matt Castle and they missed the playoffs. Remember how many calls we took after that season, during the offseason. They can trade Tom Brady, they can trade Tom Brady, they can trade Tom Glenn Ordway: Yes. Right, right, right, right. Pete Sheppard: Brady. It's nobody ever wants to get rid of the suit. No one ever, you know, it's different in free agency. When like when Roger Clemens left and all hell broke loose, I can understand that. The Mau Vaughn situation, a couple of other Wade Boggs going in the I can understand some of that stuff. But this I I think the overreaction from fan bases sometimes w without knowing the salary cap ramifications or not no just not just being a fan and I and I get it, passionate about their guy. We're not gonna be better if our guy leaves. you know, I'm not I'm not surprised. But I'll never forget the Matt Castle stuff that we went through Glenn Ordway: Yeah, you're right about that. But there's been a total flip by the the Celtics fan base. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: They love Jalen Brown. They didn't want to trade him away for Giannis, which I would have done in a heartbeat. Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: And then when they traded him away for Paul George, a majority of the Celtic fans were against the deal. They didn't like it because they were still in love with Jalen Brown. And then for some reason, and again, I think it's always about the laundry. I think in the end. People talk about the personalities, they talk about the individual players, but in the end, I still love the laundry. And so what Pete Sheppard: Yeah, yeah. Glenn Ordway: ended up happening as weeks went by, they started to buy into Paul George. He still could be a great player. I know he's 36. I know he's only played 48 games a year for the last three games, three seasons, but I Pete Sheppard: But it'll be different with us. Glenn Ordway: they bought into Paul George and they suddenly have turned on Jalen Brown and they hate him now. He's Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: like an enemy. I think when they play the video at the garden when he first comes into the garden, that that won't be until January. Who knows how much back and forth we have with those with Brown and Tatum between now and January. By January, they may boo the video because fans are so down on Jalen Brown right now. And Jalen made it worse for himself, I think, with Celtic fans, because he responded to Tatum Tatum has got good PR people around him. The documentaries that they put together with his recovery from last year, the rehab Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: or whatever, was slick, had the music, had the emotion. He's got really good people around him who are able to tell a wonderful emotional story. I think that pisses off Jalen Brown. And so When Tatum came out and basically said, I, I have two kids. Basically, I'm the adult in the room. I'm the older, mature one. I've got children now. I've moved on in life. You know, Jalen Brown couldn't help himself and had to come back. And the line was about a beef. There is no beef. This is not Shaq and Kobe. That's what Tatum said. So this was Jalen Brown's response. So he was he was well prepared for this, Pete, because he kept on repeating the same thing. Great family. Does that mean great kids? Or does that mean what Tatum has been accused of before by people around him? A mama's boy and his mama's always around. You we heard that a few years ago. Great PR firm. I already said he does have a great PR firm, but Ram wanted to point that out. And then no beef but land shops, but he better be ready. What? Pete Sheppard: First of all, channeling my my foodie, which that's my hobby when I'm not talking about sports or doing my job at the casino. I love watching food now. I'm offended by the lamb chops and gravy remark. First of all, well no. You put it Glenn Ordway: You don't put gravy on lamb chops. No. Pete Sheppard: be a chimichuri or an o a jus of some sort, or really just salt and pepper, just make sure that it's cooked medium rare. If it's cooked beyond medium rare, you're you should be deported. Glenn Ordway: It sucks. Yeah. Pete Sheppard: but So that's the fur say say peanut butter and jelly. I don't I don't know. Lamb chops and gravy doesn't seem like a great analogy to me if you're gonna make a food analogy. I just maybe steak and potatoes. I don't know. But yeah, you're right overall. The fact that the thing about mentioning the PR firm, that was how many times did you say that? Three times? Four? Three times. Glenn Ordway: Three times. Three times. Pete Sheppard: That's the thing that stood out to me, besides his offensive lamb chops and gravy remark. The the three times with the PR firm was what what what is that? Jay he doesn't have a PR firm. he's he's a sensitive guy and he's he's an activist of sorts in his own right. You know what happened out in California and that was not his fault as far as I'm concerned, and then what happened out there back then, I think during the All-Star weekend. but I think Jalen thinks he's smarter than everybody else in the room. Glenn Ordway: Bingo. I think he just hit it. And I don't think he is. I hear people talk about, well, he taught at MIT. He taught at MIT for one day. Okay. And I've I've I I taught all right, that's a good point. All right. That is a good point. That is a very good point you just made. Okay. And and and I was a guest lecturer for one day Pete Sheppard: Fourier teaches too, right? I'm sorry, Christian. I'm only ki I'm only I was only kidding. I love Christian. Or could that's Glenn Ordway: in Fourier's class. All right. And he taught at Harvard for one day. All right. He speaks well. I think people look at him and if you look at his education, he had one semester at California. One semester, that was it. So he doesn't Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: have a degree and I'm not knocking people that don't have degrees because there are some really smart people that don't have degrees. But I think you hit it. I think he thinks he's a lot smarter than he really is. And I think some people are starting to see through some of that right now. Pete Sheppard: I'm not talking about academics. I'm just talk I'm talking about the way he views not just Tatum and the NBA. I think he thinks he's as Eric Cartmore saying, ha, and he's really down huh. Or halfway he's halfway in between. Glenn Ordway: But I think Tatum made a mistake the other night. People blasted me because again I it was a short little tweet and right. And they blast Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I sa I saw that. I just they don't understand where you're coming from. Glenn Ordway: me. He didn't have to go for three minutes on and on and on about it. What that tells me is it really bothers him. You don't sit there and go on that long about what's happening with Jalen Brown. You you end it very quickly. You sit there and say there's no beef. I've got no beef. I love the guy. Now I called him. He didn't call me back. What can I do? Nothing I could do. Because Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: and he did some of that, but it was the way he delivered the long, slow, and Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: that's just the way Tatum speaks. Sometimes it's in a takes forever for him to get the the point out. And I I didn't think he did himself great. And it shows me, you're right, that Jalen Brown is very sensitive about this because this is how he responded. And it's almost like, okay, you want to fight? All right. It won't be a fight, but it'll be lamb chops and gravy instead. What the hell does that mean? Pete Sheppard: Stop it. Glenn Ordway: So, and these are two guys that have bitched in the past about how the media stokes up stuff, how the media creates stuff that doesn't exist, that it's all the drama and and gossip and whatever. Pete Sheppard: Mm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: And right now, it's the two of them that are creating all of it. It's not the media. The media is just loving it. They're eating it up. And I think the fan base is probably going to start eating it up because it's going to be a war against Philadelphia now and a war against Jalen Brown. And it's probably good for the game. it's TMZ shit, but it's right, but Pete Sheppard: they love it. Glenn Ordway: it's good for the game. But it's not what these two players kept on telling us that they don't enjoy in life. We don't enjoy all that. Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: Shit on the side. We Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: just want to play basketball. No, you don't. Not right now. You're not showing that. Pete Sheppard: No. Either one both of them could have just said to the the same exact thing. I think Jalen is a great player. I think I think Jason's a great player. And I hope we meet in the conference finals. That's what I would have said if it ended it right there. And I'm sure Glenn Ordway: Repeat they Pete Sheppard: that's what the networks want. They want they would love a Tatum Brown in Eastern Conference Finals. That would be great drama if that should happen. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: But Pete, we we we saw it last week or two weeks ago in the in the preseason when Philly was playing in Boston and they were out there on the on the court and they were, not even willing to say a word. Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: Now I don't know why the media didn't ask both of them after the game, did you talk beforehand? 'Cause you said nothing out on the court. Did you have a c private conversation in the in the hallways or anything with with each other? But I so they're giving us Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: indication that there's a real war going on. Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: And it's gonna be great. It's November the 10th. Circle it on your calendar right now. November 10th in Philadelphia. It's gonna be a war. There's no question about it because there's something going on with these two guys. And and and again, I hated the trade. I still Paul George is playing well right now. Talk to me after 40 or 50, 60 games. Okay. Talk to me then. I'm not gonna talk about Paul George right now. His track record is he's thirty-six, he can still defend, he can still hit three pointers, he still is a a a really good player, especially at age thirty-six. His problem, attendance. Attendance is his problem. He can't show up for enough games to help your team in the course of a season. So Pete Sheppard: Totally agree. 100%. And I wanted to ask you what your thoughts about Robinson and because my favorite player on the team the last three years, even when he was kind of like the tenth man, is Kata. And I was so glad they kept him and developed him. I love him. He's my favorite player. He's been my favorite player, besides Tatum and Ivan Brown. But I mean, he's I I love that kid. I love the way he plays. And I was I was afraid that him coming off the bench this year might be psychologically an issue. It hasn't been. he started last year and now coming off the bench this year if it was gonna affect him mentally. I don't think it has, Glenn. Shows me that he's got a lot of maturity. So again, if those if those two can stay reasonably healthy as well, maybe that can if Paul George when he goes down and I use the word when 'cause it will happen, you know, if they can maintain that level of consistency. Glenn Ordway: Okay, so I'll give you the the numbers with Mitchell Robinson. He's averaged Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: playing over the last three years thirty-six games a season. Pete Sheppard: Yeah, another one. Glenn Ordway: So, you know, I know people say, well, Paul George is suddenly going to be healed. He's not going to have any of these injuries he's had in Pete Sheppard: It will be healed. Glenn Ordway: the past. And the same thing with Mitchell Robinson. Well, they might be right, but history tells me if you're polymarket or if you're putting a percentage on it, the percentages are not good. That Paul George is going to play a lot of games this season, or Mitchell Robinson is not going to play a lot of games. I'll say the same thing about Mitchell Robinson. He he's the best offensive rebounder, I think, in the league right now. Okay. Now, he Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: doesn't do an awful lot with it. His only offense is around the rim, but they're getting the ball up on the rim for him, and he's scoring. So, and I love his defense. So he brings a lot to the table except attendance. And if you don't play the games, you can't contribute. And so that's where where I worry about it. I love the way Kata plays because he plays the game hard. I wish he had more of an outside shot. I think he'd be more valuable. It Pete Sheppard: I agree. If he he'd be deadly. Glenn Ordway: and you know, Al Horford was an inside player through most of his career Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: in Atlanta. Last year in Atlanta decided he was gonna go and start hitting threes, work on it, and he changed his entire game. He became a far more valuable player. I think Kate has got to learn that if he does, he's got a much better game to him. I think the reason they're starting Robinson is so that you can't intentionally follow him. Because that's the the strategy with Robinson. That's why I Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: don't like Mitchell Robinson in the playoffs. Because in the playoffs, Pete Sheppard: Brick. Glenn Ordway: you can take him out of the game because he's a forty percent free throw shooter. Think about that, Pete. Pete Sheppard: He was har horrible. Think about last year, how bad it was he was a Mason convention waiting to happen. It's just unbelievable. Brick, brick, brick. Glenn Ordway: Pete, I would I would take I would guess that any high school basketball team in the country, those kids are better than forty percent free throw shooters. He's a forty percent free throw shooter. Pete Sheppard: Remember how bad Shaq was? This guy's ten times worse. Well, yeah, but Glenn Ordway: much worse. no, Shaq hit in the sixties, I think, right? Pete Sheppard: he went through a phase where he was, you know, he was that's why Hack of Shaq happened. So right back in the day because they couldn't make a lot of free throws, but yeah. Glenn Ordway: Correct. But but that's what they do to Mitchell now when the game is on the line. And how do you play him late in the game? How do you hand the ball to him in the last couple of minutes of a game that's in jeopardy? You can't because they're going to follow him, put him at the line. He's Pete Sheppard: Mm. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: going to miss one of the two and maybe both of the two, and you're giving the other team an opportunity. it'll be Pete Sheppard: I think it's a great point. I think it's a great point you made about Cada though and and Hofford. And also don't forget, I remember I think it was eighties eighty-seven, you were still doing the game. But I remember in preseason watching Mikhail shoot making threes. I'm like, what what is that? What hap all I mean Glenn Ordway: Yeah. Yeah, he started developing it late in his career. Pete Sheppard: and he became a really a pretty decent three-point shooter. In fact, so much so remember in the playoff game against the Pistons, they almost pulled off that miracle again that they did the previous year. He made a clutch three in one of the one of the key playoff games and stuff. And he was great. People forget that. At the end of Kevin McHale's career, last two years, that man could shoot threes as well as anybody on the team. Glenn Ordway: Yeah, he had a big series he had a big series against Charlotte. It might have been his last year. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: And same thing with threes. Yeah, he developed threes and because it wasn't part of the game in the eighties. The late eighties, Pete Sheppard: No, not like that. Glenn Ordway: people started to develop it. And now you've got all these bigs that are hitting threes. I mean, Wembayama hits threes all the time now, you know? It's it's amazing. And y that guy's like seven six. No, he's not normal. And yeah, and especially with what Pete Sheppard: He's a freak. He says he's not normal. He's not normal. I don't know what planet he's from. He's just a you gotta figure how does he not win the MVP every single year? With as long as he stays. Yeah. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: Most impactful player. Yeah, he is the most impactful player, I think. And he's still not a complete player yet. I mean, Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: you're starting to see it more and more. but you'll see it. But the November 10th, we're gonna we'll get a lot more on that Celtics Philadelphia thing. All right, Pete Sheppard: Yeah. It's a Tuesday night, I believe. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: Pete, I'm convinced that the Patriots are exactly what I thought they were going to be. They're four and three. I thought they would probably be four and three right now. Because it it wasn't an easy schedule out of the out of the gate. And but if you look at the schedule going forward, I only see maybe two more losses, which would put them at twelve and five for the season, which is pretty much, I think, what I thought the ceiling was for this year. I the schedule was so easy last year, they weren't going to repeat a 14 and and three year. Okay. So 12 and 5 is probably the best. I think they're on target right now for what I thought. Even though I thought they were gonna lose to Chicago before the game, I didn't like that game for them. They had numerous opportunities to pull that game out. They could have easily Pete Sheppard: Yeah, they did. Glenn Ordway: won that game. Pete Sheppard: They could have easily won that game and they be honest with it, they probably should have won the Seattle game. that's that's but if could what should look at the league this year. I will say I had the Falcons plus three, that plus two and a half. That was a funky line on Sunday. But you it just you don't know from week to week. I agree with you. The one thing that's pretty constant, though, on the mo most part is the Thursday night road team on a short week usually does not do particularly well. Yet that was a very entertaining game. Fantastic. Had the interception not happened to Eli Raiden in the other than that, other than that, he played almost, I won't say flawlessly, but really, really well. in that in that game. He ran for a touchdown pass with two other touchdowns. It was just a bad decision to throw that that pass. And they still have an opportunity. Defense still came up with some some big stops. I'm still I'm still waiting for AJ Brown's breakout game. Maybe it comes down here in South Florida. Maybe it comes in Miami this week. Or I think Green Bay at home next week. I'm I'm I'm I'm waiting for him. And I was still a little I wanna go back and just look at the number real quick about The receiving core again with Kyle Williams. I thought a couple of weeks ago he was going to be more consistent. He had Glenn Ordway: What did I tell you? Pete Sheppard: he was targeted one time. One time. don't know if it's Glenn Ordway: What did I tell you? Pete Sheppard: something going on in practice or there's no symmetry going on between him and Drake May. There certainly seemed like there was a couple of weeks ago, and now it's disappeared again. It would be nice Glenn Ordway: I told you. Pete Sheppard: to get both of them on the same page with AJ Brown. And Kyle Williams on the same page out there at the same time, and Drake May in in in tune with both of That's a pretty formidable offense if you can get it going, but Glenn Ordway: I thought it would take time, more than the four or five weeks people talked about with AJ Brown. It certainly is. But he's gotta start putting this together here. this is a golden opportunity for him to do it against a a pretty, weak Miami team. they're not terrible, but close to being terrible, right? Pete Sheppard: even worse. The Jets are worse. Glenn Ordway: Well, I d I thought the Jets were better. I thought defensively the Jets were a little bit better this year. So AJ Brown's got a Click this in. They need him desperately. As for Kyle Williams, I told you this weeks ago. If he's in a foot race on a straight line from A to B, he is going to beat any cornerback in the league. He's just going to outrace them and he's going to get the touchdown because usually it's a long 30-plus yard play. Okay? He's going to do it. But if you the and they're all now blitzing the hell out of Drake May. So if you're putting pressure on the quarterback, suddenly your route. That was your original route is now changing because the quarterback's got to make adjustments and the receiver has to make adjustments. Kyle Pete Sheppard: Gotta be a hot route. Glenn Ordway: Williams does not know how to make those adjustments. He's great from point A to point B with a route, but when you suddenly say, uh-oh, pressure on the quarterback, he's now working it to the right. what do I he can't come back? And you saw a lot of the stuff that Drake May threw last week was all comeback stuff. It was all stuff underneath because that's What was open for him? Kyle Williams cannot do that, Pete. He can. Pete Sheppard: Yeah, Stevenson, Henry, Rare, you got your running back and your two tight ends as your top three receivers in the game last week. Which I don't, sometimes that's gonna happen. Whatever, whatever it is to win, you don't have to have your receivers, catch for 200 yards a game. But even Pop Douglas, he only he had, you know, three catches for 23 yards. But Kyle Williams, AJ Glenn Ordway: He can adjust. Pete Sheppard: Brown, three catches, six targets, only three catches. And he didn't catch a ball till the second quarter, if I'm not mistaken, right? And it was kind of like a low. Eight yard pass. I I d I don't know. I I'm I'm hoping, as you said, that the improvement happens over the next several weeks and maybe it will this week in Miami. Glenn Ordway: Well, the drops were a killer for AJ Brown. And the thing is that that's the type of receiver that you can throw to anywhere in the circumference and he's going to be able to go and get it. That's what makes him better than most of the receivers in the league. Right, exactly. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. He's yeah. Except it's been going through his hands like it did a couple of weeks ago. Or he's dropping balls all over the place like he did like he's been doing, but I Glenn Ordway: All right, I gotta throw I gotta throw this out here, Pete, because I've had so many people, even people in the in the radio industry who have been asking me this question. And so I have reserved and I don't want to say anything or didn't what's that? What is life? Yes. Pete Sheppard: What is life? What is life? Yes. Glenn Ordway: What is life in the radio world these days? I I didn't want to do it on X because again, you can't explain yourself in two hundred and forty characters. So people have been asking me, how the hell? Did WEI win the Marconi for the best sports station in the country when their ratings are in the tank and they're getting beat by their arch rival by three or four to one? And so I will answer it right now. first of all, the way it is it is structured, the criteria, I believe there are three different categories, and each one is a third, a third, and a third. And one of the categories is community service, which means, you know, when you do charitable events and and Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: stuff like that. Well, EEI's done a great job with that. We did it many, many years ago and they have continued the tradition and they have even topped it. Over the last two years, they've raised more money on that Jimmy Funn radio telephone. They've broken records the last couple of years. And Pete Sheppard: Yeah, amazing, amazing stuff. Glenn Ordway: I think there's a lot more corporate involvement in it now than there was in the early days when we were doing it. We were depending on the callers. To call up with $10, $25 bucks, $50. Now there's far more of the big corporations involved in it. And so the money is is getting better. But I commend them because I think EEI's done a tremendous job in continuing Pete Sheppard: Absolutely, yeah. Glenn Ordway: on that tradition of the Jimmy Fund Radio Teleth. So in that, they probably got tens. If you're basing it on a scale of one to ten, they got tens. And then there's a second category with ratings. And if you are elsewhere in the country and you are voting on something like this, the ratings actually don't look that bad because in many cities in this country, most of the sports talk stations are getting three shares and four shares and five shares. They're not getting twelves or fifteens. Pete Sheppard: Well, you're being kind. A lot of them are ones and twos. A lot of them are ones and twos. Look Glenn Ordway: Yes. So the readings right. Pete Sheppard: at some where they are on the dial. Some of them are not even on FM in this day and age. So I think you're being kind Glenn Ordway: Right. Correct. Which is amazing to me. Pete Sheppard: to threes and fours. I mean, that is, you know, that I think that when I was down here for eight years or eight and a half, whatever it was, I think our best, we were number one a couple of times, but we had either high fives or low sixes, and that was like amazing. And I remember Craig talking to me about his man, if you do above a two five in the sports radio, well, you're doing great. I said, I know. I said, E I we were doing fifteens back then and now sports hub's doing twenty somethings. but overall, if you're getting you know what depends on the market and everything else and what the competition is, but if you're getting over a three, you're doing pretty well in a sports radio station. Glenn Ordway: Yeah. Yeah. And Boston is unique. Boston has had the highest numbers for for years. Pete Sheppard: Unique. Boston, Philly, New York is unique. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: Philadelphia's dropped down a little bit. The fans dropped down a little bit. So but I think it if they're voting in other places elsewhere in the country, they look at the ratings and maybe they're not giving them a ten, but they're giving them a seven, okay? Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: And they're not because the sports hub is not was not nominated, and I'll get to that in a second, was not nominated. Therefore, they're not comparing the sports hub's ratings with EEI's ratings, right? they're not going to nominate two in the same city. They're not going to do that. Now I'll give you the third part of it, and is the most valuable. I was nominated four times for major market personality of of Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: the year. And the first year, I think it was in Austin, Texas. I think we were in Austin at the time. And we're sitting at the table beforehand. You have dinner, you know, with all the people from Endom, and we're there with our CEO. And somebody at the table says, You know, good luck, Glenn. I hope you win. And I said, thank you very much. They were just trying to be nice. I said, Thank Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: you very much. The CEO reaches over to me, he said, You know, you've done a great job. He said you should be Proud that you've been nominated, but you're not going to win. I said, What? He says, You're not going to win. I said, What do you mean I'm not going to win? He said, No, it's not our shot this time around in Boston. It's not our turn. I said, What do you mean it's not your turn? And he said, Well, you'll say. And you you'll say. So Pete Sheppard: God. Glenn Ordway: I'm sitting there and I don't know if he's joking or kidding with me. Pete Sheppard: Marissa Tomei Glenn Ordway: Right. If he's joking or he's kidding or what he's doing. So anyway, I wait until my category comes up, and then they get up there and they make the announcement. Major market personality of the year is Ryan Seacrest, Morning Drive, KLR in Los Angeles, California. A CEO reaches over to me and says, The Pete Sheppard: I'm gonna v I'm gonna vomit. Are you serious? I did not know this. I did not know that story. Glenn Ordway: CEO reaches over to me and he said, Yeah, it was ABC's turn. This this guy, Ryan Seacrest, they're pushing him for some. big TV show. And so they need to get him a little bit of publicity. So it's their tur, their start his turn this year, their turn. Maybe it'll be our turn next year. Ryan Seacrest Pete Sheppard: Who was it many years ago that Glenn Ordway: was was was they just had hired him to do American Idol. They had just hired him and they needed a good, as Jalen Brown would say, you need a good PR firm. Okay. You need a good PR firm. Pete Sheppard: Who who was it many, many years ago that told Jim the Wrestling Goon that's cause it's fixed, goof? Glenn Ordway: Fix, you goof. Yeah. Pete Sheppard: That is unb that is absolutely unbelievable. And I and I remember we were we were I'm Glenn Ordway: So in it it does happen. So I think, Pete, it was Odyssey's turn in Boston because they also won with 104.1. They won major market personality of the year. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Yep. Glenn Ordway: And so what happens is, yeah, we we'll make sure Odyssey wins in in Boston, and then, you know, Beasley will win in another market. We'll we'll we'll have them win. So that everybody gets a trophy. Everybody kind of wins. And I'm not again, I'm not knocking EEI. I already told you what they do for charity alone, g you know, gives them some props for for for a Marconi. Pete Sheppard: And Greg also Greg also does other stuff on the side over the years. I think there's been for charity. He does a lot of charity work. His o yeah. But his but I'm saying that Glenn Ordway: Well he does. He has the Greg Hill Foundation, but I don't I don't think that I don't think they include that in the station operation 'cause that is not under the station logo. That's Greg's own own thing. That helps Greg, by the way, when he won it, 'cause he won it Pete Sheppard: All right. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Glenn Ordway: two years ago, I think, and that helped Greg, certainly. Pete Sheppard: But I remember when you got nominated another time and we were all together I thought I think the the the awards were in Philadelphia. And I thought for sure we're all gonna get to go. Me, Andy Bra I thought and we obviously that we weren't allowed to we're not that we weren't allowed, we weren't invited, only you got to go. And you came up Glenn Ordway: It wasn't our turn. Pete Sheppard: sh you it wasn't your turn again, you came up short in in Philly, if I remember correctly. But that's unbeliev Glenn Ordway: It wasn't our turn. Pete Sheppard: that's that is so so who does the who who looks at this? So the so it doesn't even matter. Glenn Ordway: Pete, they all all of Yeah, it is. It they all Pete Sheppard: Some committee out there, this is worse than the college football committee. Glenn Ordway: they all talk and they all say, we need help here, we need help there. it's kind of known in in the business. I didn't know it. I was very naive. I was Yeah, I had no idea by the way who Ryan Seacrest Pete Sheppard: Sounds very socialistic to me. Glenn Ordway: was at the time because he ha w hadn't done anything nationally yet. And he did have pretty good ratings. I'd looked those up, so those ratings were pretty good. Pete Sheppard: What does he do though? What does he do? What does he do on a radio? I know, doing what? here's Lady Gaga Glenn Ordway: He was a disjoc he was a disc jockey in LA. That's how he started. Pete Sheppard: with poker face. What what is that what is that? Glenn Ordway: Yeah. He was always 'cause I did listen to some of the because you they put together each nominee has Pete Sheppard: Yeah, montaging. Glenn Ordway: a reel. They put together a reel of everybody. And he was always the positive guy. he was the happy talk, morning jock, Everything's great. The opposite of Stern, by the way, the total opposite. He was the happy guy. Pete Sheppard: Well now we replaced Dick Clark, right? Well, he does what he also does what New Year's Eve, right? He does the the ball drop. Yeah. I Glenn Ordway: Well he does a bunch of stuff nationally now. He's taken off. He's a big huge star. Pete Sheppard: don't it's not that I hate him. I'm just like I don't know. I sa you know just jockeys in the morning to play music. I don't know. Whatever. Glenn Ordway: Well, it yeah, because they're not my feeling was if you're doing talk, whether it's news talk or sports talk, you're producing forty-five minutes of content. You are producing it yourself. If Pete Sheppard: Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: you're doing a music station, you're right. You've got all these other artists that are that are basically doing 30 minutes of your content. So you're doing maybe 15 minutes of content in the entire hour. Matty Siegel told me this. Pete Sheppard: I'm not saying they're not talented. I'm not saying these people aren't they're obviously very talented. I'm then they're in their in their own right. But Glenn Ordway: No, they are. Matty Siegel is a very talented guy, but but he and I had this conversation many times that Matty would say, I only have to produce fifteen minutes. You gotta produce an hour or or fifty minutes or whatever. So the Pete Sheppard: Well man, we're flat out tell you because I don't know the I don't know this music. I don't know any of these I don't know any of these songs. He told us that on our show all the time, you know, and he's like I don't I don't know the the music. It was like you talk about, you know, current stuff going on in Boston and or, you know, some national stuff. But yeah, very he was the best. Great guy. Glenn Ordway: But Maddie's smart and he has a great personality and he knows how to he knows how to do it. He he did it for years. He was the highest paid guy in that market, in the Boston market for many, many years, Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: making a lot more money than any of us were making in sports talk radio. I can tell you that. He might have been making three times what any of us were making in sports talk radio. Nobody talked about the salaries with the music guys, but Maddie was the highest paid guy by far, wasn't even wasn't even close. Pete Sheppard: But he was a little different than he wasn't your typical morning drive, I'm gonna play music type of guy. There in fact, if not that I listened to I get a chance to listen to whole lot of it, but because I was usually listening to our station in the morning, but he didn't it wasn't like he's playing four or five songs in a row. It's not like the power hour commercial free, you know, Maddie in the Moy. It was nothing like that. It it was an entertaining show. He had a cast of characters Glenn Ordway: Yeah. No Pete Sheppard: around him that was very, very entertaining. Glenn Ordway: Did a great job. Doesn't talk to those characters at all anymore. and the you Pete Sheppard: Yeah. I know. Unfortunately. Glenn Ordway: know, and he did it for a long period of time. To do, Pete Sheppard: Mm-hmm. Glenn Ordway: you know, music like that or sports or anything, you know, into deep into your sixties is very unusual in the market. Everybody wants to get the young demos. So they don't want the older people. And he did it, and then he finally basically got canceled. You know, he said the wrong thing and he got canceled. Pete Sheppard: Yeah, it was Glenn Ordway: Because we were going through that period where everybody was so sensitive. You can't say anything about anybody, even though Pete Sheppard: So sensitive. Pat McAfee is. Before I f can I be can I tell the Christian Fourier story real quick? Glenn Ordway: Go ahead. Pete Sheppard: Because I I love I love him to death. And you got I remember we're doing one show one Christmas. It was the day before we were all gonna take Christmas break. And he comes in, he's like, We're not talking sports today. We're talking, we're just gonna talk Christmas stuff. I went, Christian, first of all, I'm hosting, but I kind of agree with you. Yeah, well let's let's get into the good. But no, the first time we were ever on I believe it was the first time. You were I was doing the postgame show on Sunday night. And I had to do it by myself. It was a late night game. You weren't there. And I even had to do the postgame alone. And I believe the Patriots lost. I can't remember who it was, but it was a Sunday night game we lost. And Christian had come into studio after doing, I think, Channel Seven. He was gonna do the last hour last hour with me and then do the Belichick interview. Because we would do that sometimes. And we'd do the Belichick interview on a Sunday night if we Glenn Ordway: I do remember this. Pete Sheppard: knew we couldn't cut it back to the studio on Monday. So you weren't there. So I had to handle it. The post-game show after a loss, which always sucked. And then Christian comes in for the last half hour with the post-game show and to do the Belichick interview. Bill comes out. I I I know I can't remember. Christian said nothing except hello. Nothing. This is for nothing. And if he denies it, he's lying. no, no, listen. Glenn Ordway: Ski he was scared shitless. No, he has, we've talked about this. Pete Sheppard: So they didn't say. And so we're done and usually those interviews after well, if we weren't out, we're we're at 15, 20 minutes instead of being 45 minutes. So it was 15 minutes with Bill after a Patriot loss. Chris is in the studio. He he says nothing to Bill except hello. So we get done. Hi, Bill. Yes, we'll see you next week. good luck against whatever. Blah, blah, blah. And we go to break. I go, I turn around, I go, what the fuck are you doing? And he's and I quote, and he can I I quote, I didn't want Bill to get mad at me. If he denies it, he's lying. He was great. Glenn Ordway: No, he's he's Pete Sheppard: He was great after that with us. But he was I I don't know if it was because they lost. He was like, I didn't want Bill to get mad at me. It was a year after he got retired. He did. Glenn Ordway: No, he he is he has confessed to me. I brought this up to him I brought this up to him because I did remember listening to it and I brought it up to him and he admitted that he was scared shitless of Bill. He he was scared shitless. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. And it was a year after he retired. I was a great football player, obviously. and I was like Glenn Ordway: Yes. Yes. Yeah. He w he he said he was so used to Bill yelling at him that he was afraid if he asked the wrong question, Bill was gonna yell at him again. Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Glenn Ordway: Like he did when he was a player. that's you know it Pete Sheppard: my God. The the other story, which I forgot to mention too, speaking of being down the studio, and forgive me for going up, but I because I know if I don't get to it, I'm gonna forget. The other big story, do you remember the time that Andy almost sent Bill to the hospital? Bill Belichick. we're in the middle of a break in Foxboro Glenn Ordway: In in Foxborough, right? Yeah. Pete Sheppard: at the studios there. There is a huge studio door that used to open up into our main studio from where the production studio was. Well, there was also some sports stuff or art or something. Bill is standing behind the door. It's it's closed. And he's looking and he's he turns and he's he's like, this is interesting. But and in mid-sentence, Andy comes storming in, boom, like Glenn Ordway: Do remember this? Pete Sheppard: he always did. Andy's big guy, boom, and smushes Bill up against the door. I think he had a lesion on above his eye when it happened, a little Glenn Ordway: Did he? Pete Sheppard: bit. Not that it was bleeding, but and he's like and Bill turns around, he's like, Jesus Christ. And Andy was obviously incredibly mortified. Well, I'm sitting we're sitting there going, is he gonna need a medic? my God. I mean, Glenn Ordway: I do remember this. Yeah. And Bill was Pete Sheppard: he came, it was full wham up against the wall. Glenn Ordway: And it it was interesting because we were worried about Bill because when he walked into the studio originally, you never could tell. From Monday to Monday, one day he'd be talkative, chatty Kathy, and Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: the next the he'd be with his head down, he'd never he wouldn't look you in the eye. And this was one of those days where he was in a great mood. He was talking and whatever. Great mood. Pete Sheppard: Great mood. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: And then when Andy pushes him up aga the door, up against the wall, Bill is like this. And the whole time he's talking, suddenly we're not getting, A happy Bill, a talkative bill. Bill's going like this. He's constantly Pete Sheppard: He needed a blue tent con concussion protocol. Glenn Ordway: yeah, he's constantly looking at the the bump. And my God. Yeah. Pete Sheppard: Andy was mortified. he apologize. It was just but the Glenn Ordway: he apologized ten times and then and it was like Bill wouldn't even listen to him. He would you just ignoring him. wouldn't even say, Don't worry about it, son, it's fine, it's Pete Sheppard: No. Nope. That was li that. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: okay. Nope, nope, Bill would just ignore, Pete Sheppard: Diassi will admit it too is during breaks, we would which were, you know, nine, ten minutes long sometimes down there, and we play Sega Genesis hockey during the break. Glenn Ordway: Yes, I remember that. I remember that. Pete Sheppard: And all Diossi would ever say is Runick. It was the it was the you know the the version of it. That that's all we would do. Runick! Glenn Ordway: So are you are you buying into the to the Bruins? This has been pretty impressive with the the young group of of talent they have. Two West Coast road trips already, Pete, and they've got what, the the best or the second best record in the league right now? Pete Sheppard: I'm very impressed and I I've I've I've got to see a lot of their games. because of because they're on ESPN plus it's been great. But but they but Glenn Ordway: Isn't that great? I same thing with me. You you watch you can see all the Bruins games now. I don't have to spend thirty two dollars a month for for Nesson anymore. Pete Sheppard: Some c somebody come up with a better line than than than Zaka and Pasternak and Pateka right now. What's a better line in hockey than that? Defensively, Glenn Ordway: Yep. Yep. No, they've been great. They've been great. Pete Sheppard: you know, McAvoy and and Lynn Holm as well. Not Elias Lindholm, the other Lindholm, I forget his first name. But goaltending's been terrific. And let's, you know, it's early on in the season, got his first shot out the other night. Yeah. No, I Glenn Ordway: Even the the yeah, it's pretty good. Yeah. No, they've been very they've been very impressive. And it hasn't been an easy schedule, as I said. The traveling has been a bitch for them. And they're looking pretty now, it's the NHL. And so you know, all bets are off because the regular season does not in any way c convert to what happens in the playoffs. Okay. It Pete Sheppard: Means nothing. Yeah, means nothing. Glenn Ordway: it does not. But at least I think you can look at them now. And say they're on the right road to, rebuilding because, they went through that period where they had, the the Bergerons and the the Crates and they had all of these star type of players. they had to rebuild. And I think it certainly looks to this point like it's there's showing some progress here. That's that's what I would say. Pete Sheppard: And one one last thing. I did wanna I did wanna say one thing about the passing of David Moulton, who worked down here at ESPN Southwest Florida at the station. I did, he did morning drive. I didn't get to see him. I only met him one time actually in eight years because our paths just never crossed. The only time they ever crossed was during we did special shows from ten to noon because during March Madness during the first two days because we'd carry all the games and I'd see him in the crossover. But he was a legend down here in Southwest Florida. He and and Mark Miller and he passed and you heard Troy Aikman. Yeah, the last night got choked Glenn Ordway: Got choked up. Yeah. Pete Sheppard: up. David Molten was also one of the big spot, not only on ESPN, it's and all over the place. He he was the eyes of, they have they play they pay spotters to to to make sure that the broadcasters know where the ball is. And David was legendary at it and passing away way too young from from cancer. But I just wanna I just wanted to throw that out there because he's he's legendary down here in Southwest Florida. And Glenn Ordway: Yeah, it was obvious in the in the booth on Monday night when Aikman started talking about him that his death how obviously had a huge impact on Pete Sheppard: Yeah. Yeah. Glenn Ordway: on all of those guys at ESPN. All right, Petey, Pete Sheppard: Yep. Yep. Glenn Ordway: make sure you subscribe. Make sure you like what we're doing. So it it's as Pete Sheppard: It's free. Glenn Ordway: P said, it's free. Okay? What do you want? It it's free. All right, Petey, I'll see you next week.