Latest / Skin Anarchy / Crafting A Simplified Skincare Routine With Skin At Work’s Two Step System

Transcript

Crafting A Simplified Skincare Routine With Skin At Work’s Two Step System · Skin Anarchy

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of Sakan Energy.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm such a lovely guest today.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: I am so excited to chat with him because, you know, as you guys know, the industry is really like cluttered right now.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I think we talk about that a lot on the show, and you know, it's something that's becoming even more prevalent.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: So when I find brands that are really truly doing this approach of minimal products, but like really packed with efficacious ingredients and the results speak for themselves, I'm just I'm over the moon every time.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, with that preface, I want to introduce you guys to Thomas Smith, who is the CEO of Skin at Work and has been in the industry for over 30 years and has so much experience.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: So welcome to the show, Thomas.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to be hosting you and chatting with you guys.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thank you so much.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thrilled to be here.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: I listen to the podcast all the time, and I have to say I have turned on so many people to it because I think you guys have a real unique position, how you present digestible, really bite-sized pieces of information that everyone can take something away.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, people without scientific backgrounds, like my mom, she's always like, Did you hear what Dr.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: Etka said last week?
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, Yes, I heard that.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I just think what you guys are doing is so stupendous and really needed right now.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh, thank you so much.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: That warms my heart and it means the world coming from someone who's really seen this industry, you know, inside out.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you Thomas, we have such a you know vast experience here.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I I want to learn from you, you know, in this episode because I know that, you know, there's a lot I don't know.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I just look at brands and I'm like, I'm experiencing the brands and understanding them, but then there's so much behind the scenes that goes into creating one.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: And now that you've created your own brand, I'd love to learn about that journey and just really everything that you've taken from your experience and applied to your brand.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: So if you don't mind, could you give us a little bit of like a background story on like what got you into beauty and skincare and this whole industry?
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, sure.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like you said, I've been super fortunate to be in the business for 30 plus years, really.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: Most all of it in skincare.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: Silly story my mom loves to tell people that I started as a cosmetic stockboy in Denver.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I guess I didn't choose skincare.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Skincare chose me, but I've been around, let's say, for three decades.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: So the first decade in New York City at Saks and Sephora, where I was, I managed cosmetics in the Fifth Avenue store.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: I was a buyer at Sachs, and then I had the privilege of opening the very first Sephora in the country, which was a super wild ride.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: And then I spent a decade in Colorado, which is where I'm from, making handmade products for the incredibly dry skin there.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that climate just terrorizes skin.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: So we made them in our own warehouse and we sold them in our own stores, and we worked that up to 29 stores, and it was a super blast, you know, your arm and mixing butters and just what a fun ride that was, too.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then here in in in Los Angeles, where I really think it's kind of like the hotbed of innovation these days in the beauty industry.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I spent some time at Murad, then with Meaningful Beauty Cindy Crawford, and then I spent the last four years learning all things brow with the master of brows on Stasia, Beverly Hills.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: That's like, I mean, you literally have worked with like epic brands.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's crazy.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: How was how was opening the first Sephora?
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what was that experience like?
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I mean, it's epic, but like Yeah, it really, I mean, it really was.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: And my gosh, there was so much anticipation for that launch.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: I I think in my entire career, I don't recall seeing that much press for an introduction in the entire time.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: People were riveted by the brand coming into the marketplace.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of people don't remember actually, but in the beginning, you know, the big brands were very focused on their department store businesses.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: So they were not going to come into Sephora right at the beginning.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that was kind of a nice opportunity because we had lots of European brands and lots of small brands.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: But I would say what the US team has done over the last 25 years has been nothing short of miraculous because they have transformed that Sephora experience.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because remember, it was all fragrances practically, right?
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: Fragrances tiny little skincare section, tiny little color section.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of that was because those big brands were like, I'm not gonna upset the Apple card by coming in.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, just little by little that US team, and now they kind of, I mean, they would probably not humbly say or humbly say it, but they would probably not take credit for really transforming the Sephora experience for the entire globe because they're such a huge juggernaut now.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean, like, I feel like Sephora has just become, you know, during like for me, you know, coming into adulthood, like it was just like like it wasn't on my periphery, and then it just was like everywhere.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's like overnight, I felt like it was just the store, you know, to go to.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I just I even now it's funny you mentioned fragrances because now what they've got to like have fragrances under lock and key now.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, look how far we've come, you know.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: And and the skincare aisles are just flooding, you know.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I mean it's it's kind of crazy, but that's that's amazing though that you were there for that beginning phase because I always wonder about these retailers that do carry, you know, beauty products and especially like the older ones.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: I know you have a lot of experience with sax as well.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how did how did that compare to like what you see now with Sephora?
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just curious, like your opinion, like what was that experience with sax as compared to like what you see now in retail?
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it was the 90s.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it was like work hard, play hard nineties, and it was it was New York City.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, to be frank, I was country come to town just trying to keep my head above water because I I moved there to be in the executive training program.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: But those really were hallowed, the hallowed halls of retail, you know, it being done in in the traditional sense.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel kind of very lucky to have gone through that, right?
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: Because there was a six-month training program.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, nobody gets training for six months anymore.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: And oftentimes we expect people to do these jobs, but we haven't told them how to do it or what goes into it.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel very fortunate to have lived through that.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: And the nice thing was is you know, there were no phones back then.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: So, and the consumption was just everything was luxury.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we used to go to crazy fabulous parties.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: I remember one time for a fragrance launch in Kashmir, it was called Kashmir was the name of the fragrance.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: We literally had elephants on the sales private party because you know, without phones and without digital, everything had to be larger than life.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And those were fun heady days.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, people would come in and just, you know, buy 48 of something.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: It was just bonkers.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, oh my gosh.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I I can't imagine, but you know, I feel like I kind of I wish a part of that would come back a little bit, you know what I mean?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think there's a special like magic to shopping in a department store and getting like just lost, you know what I mean, and like amazing products that you want to try and things you want to experience.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I know like, you know, a lot of us can relate to it, like, you know, going and trying your favorite fragrances or you know, your favorite you know, face cream or whatever it might be, or having someone do your foundation match for you.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's an experience, you know what I mean?
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I feel like when I think of facts, I always think of like great memories as a consumer as well.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: So that's crazy that you guys had such a and those people were trained to the hilt, right?
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, so we could probably get into this later, but you know, they knew all the contraindications of every single product because you know, they went to skin school every day.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, every day was a lunch where they would learn, and every day was a breakfast where they would learn.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: So these people back in the day knew so much about every product on the floor that it it was staggering.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think, you know, people who shop these days have that luxury.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's just maybe that's that that that experience still exists in department stores, but it's tough to get it everywhere else.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, and you know, I actually wanna like I wanna dive into your brand because I really love what you've done, you know, because I'm I'm a huge believer in like I believe in luxury and I believe in all of the fluff that we kind of you know indulge in, I think as consumers.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: But when it comes down to like skincare, like I don't know.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: I I think for me, even with that retail experience, that was always like a beauty thing for me.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: It was never like I've never been a skincare person that like goes and buys like 50 products, you know.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: So when I when I came across your line and I tried it and I've been using it, by the way, you're not listening, I've been using it pretty consistently.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's really refreshing to have something that works and I don't have to worry about am I exfoliating my skin?
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_01: Am I nourishing my you know what I mean?
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to dive into skin at work and I I want to hear all about that, you know.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: If you could tell us how you really started it, you know, what was the journey?
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you for the kind words about the product.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: We we are very fortunate.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: We do hear that a lot, but it's it's very gratifying because of course it's you know, it's your baby.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: I would say kind of the why behind skin at work was over the last, let's say, 10 years, right?
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: The the skincare industry has really exploded with new ideas, new products.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: There's a bigger tent of inclusivity, right, which has been super amazing and the and just a massive proliferation of so many SKUs and so much choice.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: But what I hear in our helpline and what I hear from friends, family, everyone around me is that amount of explosion has really become positively confounding for people.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: And even me, like I get overwhelmed by the amount of choice that's outdoors.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: So when I go to, let's say if I go to a dinner party or I go to a family gathering, and when people find out what I do for a living, the conversation always goes there because everybody wants to talk about skincare.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I get it, right?
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because it it's fun, it's colorful, there's there's so many things that you can buy, etc.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: But what they will say to me is, you know, can I use this thing with that thing?
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if I use this with that, is it gonna blow up my face?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or can I use this with no and I hear that like all the time.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so I will always sit down with them and with their phone or whatever, and we'll just make this bespoke regimen.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: Ask them about their their behavior, their skin type, et cetera.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, by the time it's all done, you know, I send them away and say, here you go, like this is it.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: But like two weeks later, I'll get a text message and they'll say, Hey, I saw this new vitamin C thing on Instagram.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Can I put that thing, you know, into the regimen?
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I I would, I'm always like, eh, like, we've got to stop this madness a little bit because it just the amount of time, money, and confusion that's spent on it is really kind of, you know, just way more than people can absorb.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought, how can I create the simplest?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: And when I say so, I mean the simplest, like one step plus your cleanser and SPF, and one step in the evening, this routine that is, you know, that's basically foolproof.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: My mom can use it, my sister, my peeps, and selfishly me, because I am a lazy skincare person.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like I want the most.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like TJ Maxx, right?
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: I want the max for the minimum amount of yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really how skin at work was born.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I mean, I I think that, you know, you you're really onto something there because I think, you know, from what I've seen and experienced as well, you know, personally, is that yes, there's a lot of ingredients, you know, out here.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people are using, you know, products.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like I know plenty of friends that have 10-step routines, you know, and they have like their vitamin C serum, their niacinamide serum, their whatever serum, like lipids or whatever, you know, and I'm like, that's fine, you know, but here's the here's the deal though.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing you put on after the first layer, like other than if it's like a serum, is my point.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like if it's anything like serum-based, is going to actually be utilized by that top layer of skin cells.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: So like it's very rare for like products to like, you know, and Thomas, I know you you know this, but just for the listeners, you know, it's very rare.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like, if you're putting a coat of something on your skin and then you pile on something else, and then another thing, those other things are not penetrating through that first layer, you know, because if it's a good product, and that's the whole fundamental is like I just I think that your like your products have been working really well for me personally, I know, because that's all I use.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like if I'm using, you know, the protagonist, which is the day serum, right?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's what I'm using.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then I put my SPF on top and that's it.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I know that everything in there, all of the ingredients that you have are actually touching my skin cells.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where I for me, I get lost, right?
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: From a consumer standpoint as to like where our psychology kind of went wrong as consumers, you know, in the sense of like, where did we get this notion that we need 10 products when in reality you need ingredients that are well, you know, made like well blended together in a way that they're actually working synergistically and in one formula.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's really what we need.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: And somehow we strayed from that.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I want you to talk a little bit, if you could, about that is this idea of blending different ingredients in a way that, you know, how was that process, like the formulation process, really?
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I'm asking.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think what you're saying is is 100% valid.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think certainly I am not here to tell somebody that if they love luxuriating in a long routine and that really, you know, the the ritual of that is is important for them, you know, I say have a ball at that.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's not meaning it's not our tribe, but there's plenty of products out there for that.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think our thought process here is there's only a certain small segment of the population that is actually going to research how all of those ingredients work together and you know, look at YouTube videos and whatnot.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: But the vast majority of people now are getting their information from an eight-second video.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: And that, you know, what they say is a little knowledge can be dangerous.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, what we wanted to do was really, first of all, take the element of people having to be their own skin scientist out of the equation and having to first of all do all the research about all these things, but then try all of them in various combinations to make sure that they there are no contraindications.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: And the kind of where we're coming from is we're gonna do all that work for you.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: So we're grouping all of the ingredients that you need for the day, everything that we we like to say gives your skin the main character energy, right?
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: So you can get up, go, you know, just face the world, and that is brightening, tightening, smoothing, soothing, and plumping.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the five major ones.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: Plus, we, you know, reduce the appearance of pore size.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: We also do some depuffing, et cetera.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, but those are all the things that you would do if you're going to get a zoom on a Zoom call or just get out of the house.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then we grouped all of the other fabulous ingredients and benefits into the night product to help you rest, prepare, and repair, right, from either the day that just occurred and then for the day ahead.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: And really all the guesswork is taken out of it for you.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: And we've, you know, over three years' time made sure that all of these ingredients are not only complementary, but their action is harmonious in the formula.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: So you literally don't have to worry about it.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Now, of course, in Knockwood, we haven't, you know, nobody ever wants an adverse reaction, but there's no total guarantee on that.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: But we've done all the homework for you.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: No, I feel like that's the thing, is like it's it's so, so cool to hear that you've done that homework because oftentimes I think a lot of what's fueled on social media, like you had mentioned the eight-second clip thing, and that really resonated with me because I I completely agree with you.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like how are you going to like sum up science in eight, 10, or even 30 seconds?
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's very difficult, especially when it comes to, you know, not only like like any kind of adverse reactions that may be caused.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm sure you heard about the whole benzyl peroxide thing that's been going on.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's like those kind of things, like pe when we talk about things like breaking down or things that are reacting with each other or whatever, you need like extensive knowledge there, you know?
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so when a brand does their homework, it's I feel like truly a service to your customers.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that consumers should vote for that with your dollars.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're when half the time when you're really supporting a brand, you're also supporting all of that research that went behind creating those products.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm such a believer in that, you know, because I feel like I don't want to worry about that as a consumer.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to worry about is this going to make me have a like, you know what I mean, like a rash or something the next day, or am I gonna have atopic, you know, reactions or whatever, you know, that might be my concerns, but I don't have to, I don't want to have to think about that as a consumer.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: So I really appreciate that you said that because I think sometimes in this kind of culture that we've created of single ingredient, you know, like focusing on single ingredients, we've missed the mark of that effect that happens when you combine them.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: And whether it's synergistic or whether it's adverse effects, we are not talking about any of that.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like that happens in the lab.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: That happens at the manufacturing level.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: It happens, you know, behind the scenes.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so oftentimes we're not even going and having these conversations about hey, is niacinamide compatible with XYZ ingredient?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, is vitamin C unstabilized form compatible with, you know, whatever antioxidants I'm putting in here?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so that kind of stuff, like it's very, very important.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: And it just never comes to the limelight, in my opinion.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I I'm totally with you on that.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's funny, I I had this best friend when I lived in New York City.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: She had this pill book, and it was like a two-inch thick, maybe three-inch thick book, and it was basically every pill that existed, right?
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_00: And what would happen if you take this pill with that pill, and it would show, you know, all the contraindications.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: It was really like at the time I didn't appreciate it, but you know, but you know, what we really need now is a book like that for skincare.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if I wasn't doing skin at work and I had all the money in the world, I'd start a nonprofit and make that book because I think people need a reference guide, and and one doesn't really exist.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: And the irony here is that everybody's skin is getting angrier and angrier because of all the things that they are, you know, mixing on their face.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, one of the big trends of 2024 is that everybody's you know coming back to launching a sensitivity line, but it's sort of like, you know, which came first, the chicken or the egg?
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: Do we really have that much sensitive skin?
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: Or are we just like blowing our face up with you know, with all of these ingredients, and we're just not sure how they're they're going to react on their face.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: So that I think is something that we that we've got to rein in probably a little bit, and and we need to protect consumers.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's the number one thing I heard you say with Christina and I think she's from from Kraft the other day, right?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: Which is do no harm.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_00: We need to make sure that consumers are protected by the things that we do as well.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, a hundred percent.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_01: And you know what's crazy?
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: Although it's not crazy, it's actually like so logical in medicine.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: What you were mentioning earlier about, you know, like a book being in place, we have that.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Any any medical doctor or any scientist, anyone who studied medicine will tell you like there are multiple resources that you reference before you prescribe.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like, if I were to prescribe a patient a drug, I would go and make sure I know that if anything else they're on, they're not gonna react.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: There's no good, there's not gonna be any kind of adverse reactions, there's not gonna be anything that's going to amplify another drug, you know what I mean, that they're on at the time, any interaction.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like that level of like basically checking and rechecking is already there, but we haven't brought that over into the skin space.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know why, because the skin is an organ, you know, it's still medicine, in my opinion, that we're we're kind of like, you know, in a real way, like we're in that realm still.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: I know it's not FDA regulated, but that doesn't mean that there's no responsibility that should be taken, you know, from the the side of both consumers and brands about things like education and stuff.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I I'm very like very aligned with what you said.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like, yeah, do no harm.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: At the end of the day, you can't make anything or make a product or recommend a product if you even suspect that there's going to be some harm involved in this.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's like an ethical responsibility that I think all brands should have.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm yeah, I I just love that you're you're keeping that in mind when you're crafting your brand.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: I I really appreciate that, you know, as a consumer that you're doing that as a brand founder.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: I I I appreciate you saying that.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, competition certainly has probably pushed everyone to maybe push the envelope, you know, whether it be ingredients or claims or whatnot.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: I was I've always been very fortunate to work at some very buttoned-up legal, you know, corporations where, you know, there's always this healthy push-pull between marketing and legal, right?
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: I remember I would always, you know, take this new product into legal and prepare for weeks and be like, this is gonna do this and this product does that.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then legal would just eviscerate, you know, everything that we were saying.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: But really, you know, this gal named Jen, she she was, you know, almost my nemesis.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: But now I really appreciate her because she taught me so many important lessons for protecting consumers with regard to your products.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: So, and I only wish everybody, you know, had the luxury of that type of education as as they, you know, make claims to customers and say, you know, this product will do that.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really, you know, like we said, Skin Network is really trying to, you know, do all of that for you and give you really peace of mind.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's the other thing too.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: I c I call it skincare freedom, right?
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: But it's really the ability also to just release the your worry and concern that these things have been managed for you.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: No, it makes total sense to me.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to actually dive in a little bit to the products because, like I said, you know, I've been using them, I've been loving them.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: They're so nice and they feel so wonderful on the skin because I'm, you know, I've said it many times on the podcast, I'm not a huge makeup person, so I don't wear makeup.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I don't want to scare my patients, so I don't want to wake, you know, walk in with a full face.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: So usually my routine is like, you know, very minimal in the morning, SPF.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: And the protagonist, the day serum that you've created, I mean, it's really nice for I think like skin of color because it's it's very like balancing for me.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I really believe in things like exfoliation and you know, nourishing at the same time, like gentle exfoliation.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like it's you know, it's just a beautiful balance of that along with just the nourishing aspects.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_01: So could you dive into that a little bit, like the formula of it?
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_01: Because I just want to learn like all of the hero ingredients, like how you pick them and why that they're in there.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, sure.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so as I mentioned before, we really, I really wanted this product to to be, you know, to live up to its name, right?
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: To be a force for positive change, which is what the protagonist in any story does by, you know, giving you this main character energy.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: And we do, I mean, we're very blessed.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: We hear so many people who who email us on the helpline and say, you know, I'm I'm hardly using makeup at all, right?
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just throwing on a little mascara and I've just never felt so confident in my skin.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so that is obviously, you know, very heartwarming.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: But every we we basically have five ingredient clusters in both products.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: And each cluster is meant to give you some immediate gratification because let's face it, you know, I want to see something, I'm gonna see something right away, something that makes me say wow.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then there are ingredients in each cluster to give you an additional wow for at least six to eight, sometimes 12 weeks time, like in the night product.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_00: So we have the brightening cluster, which has, I'll just give you that one as an example.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: Otherwise, I would I'd bore you all day and geek out.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: But so the brightening has niacinamide in it, which of course is not not new, I'm sure, for any of the listeners, but we really believe in the right amount of niacinamide, like 10%, you know, can lead to purging in your you know skin.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so we want to make sure that you get enough to get the wow, but not too much to create any irritation.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: So that's gonna give you your immediate benefit.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: But we also have wuhuyu in there, which is an ancient Chinese herb that will give you beautiful tone and also stimulates microcirculation, and then turmeric for a nice topical brightening effect.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, again, when you look in the mirror right after the first application, and I I like to say it's three days to wow with the protagonist, you're you're gonna see something.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, in three weeks' time, it's gonna unfold like a beautiful, you know, flower will, and you're gonna continue to see changes and improvements.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: And each one of the clusters does that very thing, mostly because you know, I'm lazy.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: I want to see immediate gratification.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: So, so that's done selfishly for me.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: But also I want your skin to be healthy.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: And when you get to that six and eight week mark, what you're gonna see is less of the superficial wow, and you're gonna start to see the health of your skin really radiate and come through.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, well, that's why I'm glowing then the courtesy of the of those ingredients because I've I've noticed that myself.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, this is really nice, like it gives you like a very like natural, just healthy appearance.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, your skin looks like it has gotten what it needs and your cells are happy.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's really what my skin feels like when I use it.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I that's why I asked you, like, this is it's amazing.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: I really, really love it.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the immediate wow factor is definitely there.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I, you know, rare like I try a lot of brands, you know.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: So when I am sticking to one, it's usually because of that.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna lie, that instant wow, and then it's staying there.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I've definitely noticed in my own skin that it is, you know, it it does make you glow.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: It does make you look more radiant because it just feels like your skin is healthy, you know.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I've I've I've noticed as well.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna pay you to license that quote.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I'm happy to share it with anybody.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, honestly, I I I don't like I think that it's it's interesting because you know, some brands will say, like, and it's fine to say this, that but a lot of people will say, well, 30 days is what it takes, you know what I mean, before you see any results.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I understand that there's value there.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: But I really believe in the power of like you know, but for lack of a better term, instant gratification with skincare because it's topical.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I think with the topical products, you should have something that really reels you in.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_01: And with this, like one of the things I really wanted to ask people is my skin is so smooth when I use it.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like I literally like feel it afterwards, like once I've applied it, and it just feels like velvet, like it feels like velvet on my skin, and I'm just like this is perfect, you know what I mean?
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so even if I were to do makeup or put any makeup on top, it's not going to stick to my makeup, it's not gonna make it look like it's sinking into my pores.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: It just makes my skin so soft and like I don't know, I don't know how to describe that, but yeah, soft.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm very curious.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like, is there something in there that's meant for that?
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like for the smoothing aspect, because it's very, very apparent when you use it.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I call I call that the shocking softness.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's when that was like one of the things I'd put on the mood board when we started developing when this product was coming out of my brain probably about four or five years ago.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: But part of that is what you said earlier, which is the the gentle and persistent exfoliation, exfoliation that you get every single day, whether it's uh there's prickly pear in there, there's yellow bin, there's banana, mango, all of those pulps are giving you that level of softness on the daily.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: And we do, we've been very fortunate.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of makeup artists have said, you know, they're using it as a primer, even though it doesn't have silicone.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it has no silicone in it, so there's none of that in it, but it just that softness that you're talking about.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: And and you have no idea, like when I get off this call, I'm gonna do a total like jig dance because I'm gonna look at my mood board and go, yeah, the shocking softness that's coming through.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm so happy.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, it's it's really, really it's kind of yeah, it is shocking actually, because when you touch your skin, you're like, oh my god, like did I just go get a facial?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: Why is my skin so soft?
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it is quite shocking, but in the best way.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I feel like the night one is like that too.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_01: They're both like that.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like I never feel like I usually when I put on a moisturizer or any kind of you know, serum, it just sinks in, then you're like, okay, well, it's there.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's working.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: I know some somewhere it's working.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: But with this, I just love that.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that, you know, it just goes such a longer way than just, hey, I did my skincare today.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it it really makes you feel good.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I I love that you put something in there for that smoothing effect because it's very, very important.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, also, too, the thing I was after is, and you mentioned this earlier, is I hate feeling cake, what I call cake layers of product on my skin.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so before I created Skin at Work, I was you, I was doing seven steps to get the impact that I wanted, like from the protagonists, you know, all of those products that made up that that impact that I was looking for.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: But I have the hugest in that I really do not like it when products migrate into my eyes.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: So if you wear contacts, you know, probably, you know, for you as a doctor too, it's like you do not want things to impede your performance in the afternoon.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it would get my contacts, and then I'd have to take them out, put my glasses in.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: So that was the other thing, too, with regard to the texture of this product, is not only did I want that shocking softness, but I wanted it to stay put because literally my it just makes me bonkers crazy to have to like use eye drops to push it all out.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: And so that is also, you know, the impact that we're looking for.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad you mentioned that because that's literally my number one peeve with eye creams.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: I can't stand eye creams for the most part because literally because of what you said, because I I actually wear glasses myself.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I fully understand the contact lens thing because I, you know, I wear contact sometimes with mostly glasses, and I literally cannot like function if my eye feels like there's something creeping in or if there's something around it, you know, that's just like too heavy.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think a lot of times like people kind of give me, you know, heat on this where they're like, well, there's some great eye creams out there.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, well, if I have a great moisturizer, I don't need an eye cream, you know?
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just gonna use a little bit of it and just bring it over the eyes, and that's kind of what I do with you know, the protagonist in the morning.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'll just like rub a little bit on my under-eye and also on top of my lid, and it works perfectly fine, you know.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, that's another thing.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's very, very multifaceted and multi-use.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: Very cool.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's a provocative thing to say, and and you know, beauty editors will say it in private too, but a lot of people just don't believe in the incremental value of an of an eye cream.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I am definitely one of those people, like, and I've been fortunate, right?
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: I've probably tried every luxury eye cream in the last 30 years, and I will always like be faithful, maybe for seven days, maybe 10 days, but inevitably I have like this graveyard of eye creams sitting around until they expire because A, I'm too lazy to do the extra step.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: But also, I just don't think I know it's provocative to say, but I just don't think it's worth it, really.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: And we designed both of these products and then we clinically tested them for safety around the eye, just so you wouldn't have to do that.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: So there are ingredients back to the ingredient thing in in there, is there are ingredients there to manage the gentle of the excuse me, the delicate skin around the eye and to give you those impacts from a depuffing perspective, from a you know, uh mitigating the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: And we tested it all the way on the brow bone and close up, you know, on the lid as well as underneath the eye, so that you can get this full what I call the tighten effect, right?
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_00: So when I tell people about applying product, I always say you have to think about it like a fitted sheet.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: So when your sheet is like when your fitted sheet is wrinkly in the center, you don't go in the middle of the bed and fuss with the wrinkle.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: What do you do?
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_00: You pull the corners.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_00: So if you lightly tap product up here on the brow bone, you will lift if the product has the right ingredients, right?
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_00: You will end up with a slight lifting effect because you're pulling the corners.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I recommend that with the neck too.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: I always say, don't forget the back of your neck.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you're only treating the skin that you can see, you really also want to treat the skin that you can't see, because again, the back of your neck is like the fitted sheet.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: So firm that too.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_00: So it really pulls everything together, right?
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's a tired analogy, right?
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: But your skin is one whole organ.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: So treat it all.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: Don't just treat the things you can see in your Instagram.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I there's so much logic though, in what you said, like scientific logic, because you know, we never talk about this, and this is like it's kind of a sidetrack, but I just to mention, like for anyone listening, like when we look at the muscles like under your skin, like any muscle, right?
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_01: Anywhere in your body, there's an insertion point for that muscle.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: And what that means is like usually muscles will insert onto like bony prominences on your skeletal skull structure.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_01: And the reasoning for like the value of that is that when you're targeting a muscle, right, at that place of insertion, you're gonna cause that effect of like contraction of its fibers or like, you know, basically that lifting effect that we're really like wanting when we go get some sort of aesthetic procedure.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: That's happening because you're doing it at that point, which will cause all the fibers to constrict in a in the natural way that they're usually found.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_01: So this topic extends deep into even aesthetics, you know what I mean?
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's a very, very relevant point that you made because you know, it's just how the body works.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's just how it works, you know?
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so I really believe in the the concept of, you know, you're right, go on the periphery, go on the bony prominences, you know, make sure that your skin is like like, you know, when people do gasha, for example, this reminds me of guax because you know, a lot of people will tell you you might be doing your gasha wrong because you're not going and going in the direction that you're supposed to go with the fibers, but then also you have to like kind of wiggle it at that bony area that like where the muscle inserts, and that's why because when you simulate the source of where those fibers originate from, you're gonna lift your whole face.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: So the same thing applies here, you know what I mean?
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like the skin's the same way, it's laying very, very closely to all of the structures underneath, and that it's you know, it's bound to work the same way.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I yeah, I definitely believe in that.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's so much like scientific backing to that, you know, to that kind of like theory of thinking of it like that.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_01: So, but yeah, I wanted to, I wanted to actually dive in a little bit further because I know you know with night creams, we like this is a conversation I hear a lot, and it's you know, with night routines, just go ham, you know, like go it.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't matter, it's the night routine, blah, blah, blah.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, okay, that makes sense.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_01: But how many of you out there have like time for 15 steps even at night?
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so like that's something I really want to get your opinion on, Thomas, is this idea of like we kind of say for the nighttime, it's okay.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to be minimalistic.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_01: So how like how did that like, you know, kind of play a role?
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like, because I know you have, you know, your night, the night product is phenomenal as well.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's got multiple, you know, ingredients in it.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: So when you were crafting it, how did that come into play?
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like the whole idea of the night routine.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I always say the the best night routine is the one that you're going to do faithfully.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, selfishly, I created one product because I I don't like a long protracted routine.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm usually one of those people who pushes it, pushes my day to the very end and I just fall into bed, right?
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I wanted something that I would actually do.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: But if you are somebody who really loves the ritual of a long routine, I would say, you know, have a ball.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: Just, you know, and to your point before, like, you know, it's highly likely that not all of those things will penetrate the skin.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_00: But if it if it's good for your mental state, then, you know, and it makes you helps you prepare and gives you a good night's sleep.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm like, go for it.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_00: What we wanted to do really was put all the ingredients in that would repair your skin from the damage that happened all day, whether that's smoke, pollution, you know, all the all the free radicals that are bombarding your face all day long.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: And then, to your point earlier, is really prepare you for the day ahead.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: So we we get in there, you know, a lot of stuff to mitigate the appearance of pigmentation because you need to repair that during the evening.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of stuff for firming, there's tightening in there.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: We're repairing your moisture barrier.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: We are soothing your skin with all sorts of soothing agents, and there's tons of cholesterols and fatty acids in there to really give you that plumpness, the hyaluronic acid.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, really, it's if you think about the day and everything that you faced.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: My idea here was let's do everything we can to reverse that.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_00: And then, you know, it's almost like the way sleep repairs your body internally.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_00: We wanted to do that topically for you for so you could face that next day.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, I mean, I think that's really important.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: I like that you you approached it with this repair concept.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what were some of the things that you found to be like really, really important when it comes to like nightly repair of your skin, as far as ingredients go?
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_00: So we really are loving the trannexemic acid that is in the in the product.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's in there at 5%.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_00: There are studies out there that show that trannexemic acid is as effective as a prescription strength of hydrokinone, but obviously without the negative side effects.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: So that's a really important one for us because as you know, you really you're going to encounter sun during the day, and it's good to have pigment mitigation, you know, on the regular, not just when you see it, but to manage it all the time.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you do, you're also going to get that amplified radiance the next day, right?
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: Your skin won't have to work as hard to get that beautiful sort of glow from within.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: So that was really important to me.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: Certainly, moisture barrier repair is incredibly important, especially as somebody coming from Colorado.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like when you walk outside, your skin is being terrorized by 4% humidity or 6% humidity.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: So we've really heard from our dry skin clients in the desert southwest and anywhere where it's hot all the time, like Texas, that all of that moisture just basically leaching out the second you walk out the door is really being protected and it's helping you keep what you've got, right?
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: It puts it all in there and then it helps you keep it throughout the day.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_00: So that was really important for us.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then also, you know, peptides for firming, algae for tightening, to really, and actually, when you put the timekeeper on, we always like to say helps you take a little time off.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_00: You can almost feel that tightening.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_00: I hear that all the time on our help email.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: People will say, I don't know what it's doing, but I can feel it.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that's wonderful to hear, right?
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: Because the algae is giving you that almost tightening, astringent effect.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_00: And all of those things are working together to just give you that real wow moment and and help you repair during your sleep.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: No, that makes sense.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I like that it's got that because you know, at the end of the day, all I'm really worried about is like, am I gonna wake up with skin that's ready to go or not?
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and it makes your morning routine that much easier.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_01: So now that it works really well.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: I love the night, the night cream as well.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I again with the smoothing effect, it's like just it's heaven.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like it just feels so good.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's very well made.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, huge hats off to you.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I really love the brand.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think that the thought that you've poured into it, into each of the products is just extraordinary.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm so happy to see that like there are founders out there that are thinking about us, you know, as consumers, in the sense of like we sometimes we don't know what ingredients we need.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_01: But if you find a product that like this that's really working for you, like it makes you realize, like, okay, well, this works for me, you know.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like if if somebody's never used, you know, a certain asset or you know, one of the ingredients you have in there, it's a great experience to find out this is actually something that works for me, you know.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm I'm a huge fan.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_01: I really, really commend you for the line.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's wonderful.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, we're lucky we have kind of three tribes, right?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: We have the we have me on the tribe, you know, who wants something that gives you the max for the minimum.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: But we also have those people who, you know, love a long routine, but who sometimes have a busy morning.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: You have a Zoom call that got in your way, and now you don't have time for the long routine.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_00: So reach for the protagonist because you know you're gonna get everything you need, and then you could, you know, sort of go back to your long routine when you're not as busy or if you just want to fall into bed.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: So it really has, I think, a lot of appeal for a lot of different people, is what we're finding, which which is obviously very gratifying.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_01: And one more thing I wanted to like actually ask you was to speak to some of the the male consumer base because your products are so great for for men, I feel like.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think, you know, when I showed it to my fiance, he was like, Oh, there's only like two stops.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, Yeah, you use one in the morning and one at night.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_01: And he was like, Oh, I love that.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like his immediate response was like, I'm already loving this, you know.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_01: So what was did you keep that in mind, like when you were making it, like the the men out there that are finally getting into skincare?
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we we weren't really thinking about gender specifically with regard to the formulation, or at least I wasn't.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_00: I was really looking for an archetype who wanted to, you know, go out there and seize the day and didn't want to have to think too much about their skincare.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_00: That was kind of the primary motivator.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: But I will say that about 20% of our customers are male.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: And if you've spent any time in any big, you know, skincare business, you know that's a very, very high percentage because it usually hovers in the low single digits for if it's not a male specific line.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: So we feel incredibly fortunate about that, especially because guys are loyal.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they're as we say in the business, right?
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_00: They're they're less product promiscuous.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_00: When they find something they like, they will just stick with it.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that's but also it's great to hear that guys are really enjoying the fact that that it is so simple.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_00: And we hear that from fitness people.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we have a huge following in the financial community because they they want the best that they don't have any time.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_00: We hear that from doctors and derms.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: So really we we start with that archetype, but we're very lucky to have so many guys in our in our customer file.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: I love that so much, and I'm so happy that you have that because every time I see, you know, men coming around, especially I say men because it's usually, you know, in that in that category that you know, you it's harder to sell skincare, you know, a skincare routine to men.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I just love it every time, you know, any of my friends or colleagues, you know, will say, hey, I this is something I'm actually using, you know, a skincare product they're actually using.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always like, oh my God, okay, we have broken through, you know, like we're we're getting places now.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really cool to see that.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_01: But that's wonderful to hear that you guys have such a you know a strong customer base and in you know in that category.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_01: So that's wonderful.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Congratulations for that.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thank you.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I I'm just super happy, you know, that that you know, more males are getting into taking care of their skin.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, that's the the biggest win of all here.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: And if we can make it, if we can lower the barrier for entry, then all the better, right?
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because that will that will make the tent bigger for the number of people who will actually do it.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's just a matter of like getting like, you know, getting the word out there, getting people to actually start doing it.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_01: And then exactly what you said, it's just gonna catch fire on its own, you know, and that's gonna be so wonderful because, you know, we I know Durham's always, you know, preach about SPF, which I agree with.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of people, especially like, you know, my friends and colleagues, I've seen them get on board with the SPF thing.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: But when it comes to, you know, there's also an aspect of treating your skin on the daily for all the guys that might be listening out there, you know, it's you do have to actually also treat it, you know, under your SPF.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_01: And this is such a phenomenal option, you know.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: If you're it no matter who you are, if you don't have a lot of time, you know, and you don't have the the capacity in your in your schedule to think about what products you need and what ingredients you need, skin at work is literally the ideal option for you.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I really urge you guys check it out.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_01: Let us know what you think.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_01: If you have any questions at all, please chime in and let us know.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_01: But Thomas, thank you so much.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: This has been such an honor to host you and learn from you because I really love Skin at Work.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's a great brand.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, for anybody out there who's listening, especially the guys, if you want to try the product before you buy it, we do have what I call trying is believing.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_00: Just sign up for our email program and we will send you two free, juicy size samples so that you can you can see how much you will love Skin at Work without having to make a big financial commitment.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you so much for having me.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I I can't wait to hear what you're gonna talk about next.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm really excited, you know, for everyone to try it.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: And and thank you so much for everyone listening.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be back next time.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
• 46:03
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• 46:07
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• 46:10
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• 46:50
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• 46:56
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• 47:02
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• 47:07
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.