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MOM BLAMES DAUGHTER-IN-LAW for Grown Son's Stab Death on Florida Vacay · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: He goes on a relaxing vacation with his family to
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Florida and he comes home in a box dead. How
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: did that happen? I'm see Grace. This is Crime Stories.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: and on Serius XM one eleven. First of all, take
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: a listen to this.
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: Deputies from the Dixie County Sheriff's Office show up at
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: the rental home and an extensive search begins, with family
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: members joining deputies. Hours pass as the search covers the
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: canal behind the home and nearby docks and boat houses.
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: David Rainey cannot be found. In the early evening hours,
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: deputies decide to go back to the canal and look
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: one last time. It is during this last look they
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: see the body of David Rainey submerged in the water
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: of the canal behind the house. He's been stabbed have
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  Speaker 3: multiple times in the.
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  Speaker 2: Chest, multiple stab wounds in the chest, and then submerged
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  Speaker 2: in water. Wow, they didn't just kill him once. They
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  Speaker 2: killed him at least two times over. I've got an
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: all star panel to makes sense of what we know
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  Speaker 2: right now. But before I get into other details, regarding
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  Speaker 2: the stabbing death or was it a drowning death, don't
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  Speaker 2: know yet. Before I get into the details about how
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: this guy goes on a family vacation and ends up
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  Speaker 2: stabbing multiple times submerged in water in a canal. What
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: a family vacation. I'm thinking about my family vacations. Let's see,
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: my husband and I took the children on an RV
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  Speaker 2: trip across the country from Atlanta to Nashville, to Saint
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  Speaker 2: Louis to all the way to the Tetons and Yellstone.
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  Speaker 2: Nobody end up stabbed, dead, submerged in water. Thinking about
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  Speaker 2: trips I took with my parents. We go away for
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  Speaker 2: one weekend and be a vacation to get Atlnburg to
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  Speaker 2: see the mountains, smoky mountains. This is so bizarre. You
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  Speaker 2: go on vacation with your family and you end up dead.
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  Speaker 2: It's not like you're going to some far flung location
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  Speaker 2: where you're completely out of touch with your family and
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  Speaker 2: friends back home. Let's say around the world. You're not
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  Speaker 2: going on in African safari where you could actually be
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  Speaker 2: eaten by a lion on vacation. You're not doing a
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  Speaker 2: daredevil vacation where you climb to the top of Mount Fuji.
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  Speaker 2: This is just a family vacation to the beach. He
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  Speaker 2: doesn't drown, he doesn't suffer a death you may associate
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  Speaker 2: with going to the beach. He ends up stabbed and
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  Speaker 2: submerged in a canal. What happens on vacation? Do you
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  Speaker 2: let your defenses down and you don't notice when somebody's
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  Speaker 2: sneaking up behind you? Is that what happened? Again? With me?
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  Speaker 2: An all star panel to make sense of what we know.
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  Speaker 2: But first I want to go to a special guest,
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: doctor jan Gorniac. I love this woman. She's brilliant. That's
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: why I love her. Doctor gen Gorniac, Board certified forensic pathologists,
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  Speaker 2: former medical examiner in Clark County. You know what Clark
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  Speaker 2: County is, right, Vegas. Never a lack of business for
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: the medical examiner in Vegas. Doctor Gorniac, thank you for
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: being with us. This guy, this dad, this husband doesn't
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  Speaker 2: get killed once. He gets killed at least twice over
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  Speaker 2: for I won't know until I see an X ray
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  Speaker 2: if he got a blow to the head as well.
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  Speaker 2: But how do you determine any case like this where
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  Speaker 2: the dad is minding his own business, driving his family
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  Speaker 2: to vacation, is stabbed multiple times, but yet submerged in
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  Speaker 2: a canal. How do you determine what's the real cod
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  Speaker 2: How do I know he wasn't poisoned? First?
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  Speaker 4: That's excellent questions. So a case like this, with so
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  Speaker 4: many possible causes of death, obviously we have to gather
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  Speaker 4: as much information as we can and then plus do
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  Speaker 4: a thorough, thorough, thorough autopsy and then also thorough thorough,
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  Speaker 4: thorough medical history, gather everything we can. But obviously, when
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  Speaker 4: we see somebody with multiple stab wounds of their chests,
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  Speaker 4: that's not a natural death. So with not his high
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  Speaker 4: blood pressure, his diabetes, that killed him. But they probably
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  Speaker 4: didn't know he had those stab wounds until he came
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  Speaker 4: out of the water.
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  Speaker 2: Oh wait a minute, that's something I didn't know. Let
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  Speaker 2: me think about. I mean, unless the knife is still
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  Speaker 2: plunging in his chest like it is for Ellen Greenberg,
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  Speaker 2: she's found with twenty plus stab wounds and a knife
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  Speaker 2: still in her chest. You're so right. I didn't even
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  Speaker 2: think about that aspect. Doctor Gorniac, Doctor Gangarniac. So you're right.
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  Speaker 2: They pull him out of the water, submerged, surely all
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  Speaker 2: the blood has been washed away. They may not even
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  Speaker 2: know he's been stabbed until they get him all the
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  Speaker 2: autopsy table. Wow.
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  Speaker 4: Correct, So yeah, so obviously the body stays in the
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  Speaker 4: water and they have to call out the medical examiner
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  Speaker 4: corner to come and do the investigation. So it was
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  Speaker 4: probably called in as a possible drowning because he's in water.
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  Speaker 4: And then surprise, like you said, even at the at
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  Speaker 4: the scene because obviously hopefully he has clothes on, so
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  Speaker 4: you may not even have seen wounds until you get
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  Speaker 4: back to the morgue and to start the autoposy, and
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  Speaker 4: then you're just like, obviously this is more than a drowning.
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  Speaker 4: So depending on you have to look at the stab
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  Speaker 4: wounds and what internal injuries does he have to determine
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  Speaker 4: which came first. Was it the stab wounds or was
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  Speaker 4: he drowned? But it makes more sense that he was
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  Speaker 4: drowned and then put it, I mean stabbed and then
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  Speaker 4: put in the water. So, but what's the cause of
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  Speaker 4: death depending on the injuries that we see or their
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  Speaker 4: injuries to his lungs or the injuries to his heart,
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  Speaker 4: and he lost a lot of blood and then drowning
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  Speaker 4: what we call is a diagnosis of exclusion, So we
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  Speaker 4: have to exclude everything.
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  Speaker 2: I need to write that down, Dot Guarniac, drowning is
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  Speaker 2: a diagnosis of exclusion. Is that what you just said?
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  Speaker 4: Correct? So that means we have to exclude every other
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  Speaker 4: possible cause of the death before we can say it's drowning.
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  Speaker 4: And then there are soft signs we call soft signs
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  Speaker 4: of drowning. Are the lungs filled with water? If someone
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  Speaker 4: knew that water in their stomach, did they swallow water.
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  Speaker 4: We also looked to see if there's water in the
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  Speaker 4: sinuses in the head. So but based on these injuries,
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  Speaker 4: it appears that the cause of death was the stab
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  Speaker 4: wounds and then he was put in the water afterwards.
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  Speaker 4: So I'm going to be confident in the medical examiner
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  Speaker 4: and the frontic pathologists who did the autopsy that they
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  Speaker 4: didn't see anything associated with drowning. He just happened to
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  Speaker 4: be found in the water.
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  Speaker 2: So okay, Doctor Garniac. Doctor Janegarniac joining me, we'renown pathologists
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  Speaker 2: from a medical excit aminar. You said you look for
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  Speaker 2: soft signs. Guys, for the first thing we've got to
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  Speaker 2: do is determine if we can cod cause the death.
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  Speaker 2: Let me think this through, you know, just a trial lawyer.
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  Speaker 2: So you get the body. They find the body submerged
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  Speaker 2: in water in a canal. They may not have known
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  Speaker 2: at that time when they fish him out that he
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  Speaker 2: has been stabbed. They may not know if there are
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  Speaker 2: blunt force injuries to the head. There may be subdoral bleeding,
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  Speaker 2: bleeding to the brain. They don't know any of that.
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  Speaker 2: They get him to the crime lab, and yes, I
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  Speaker 2: believe he was clothed. That's when they most likely realize
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  Speaker 2: this guy's been stabbed multiple times in the chest at least.
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  Speaker 2: So I thought, Okay, you're saying soft signs of drowning
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  Speaker 2: water in the lungs, the stomach, sinuses, head. When you
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  Speaker 2: say head, you mean in the sinuses that are in
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  Speaker 2: the head.
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  Speaker 4: Yes, correct, the sinuses in the head. Okay, we can
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  Speaker 4: see big water there, but it doesn't mean But also,
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  Speaker 4: like I said, it's an exclusion. So just because we
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  Speaker 4: don't see that doesn't mean it wasn't a drowning. But
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  Speaker 4: we have to put all the pieces together. So but
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  Speaker 4: I would think either way we also call it, you know,
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  Speaker 4: a death in a hostile environment, even if he there
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  Speaker 4: was partly some things of drowning. He died from stabling's
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  Speaker 4: he just happened to be in the water.
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  Speaker 2: What do you do? Take the lungs out of the body,
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  Speaker 2: and then you put them in water and see if
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  Speaker 2: they float. How do you determine if the lungs are
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  Speaker 2: full of water?
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  Speaker 4: Okay, great question. So the lungs are going to float anyway,
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  Speaker 4: because there's gonna be air in the lungs because that's
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  Speaker 4: how we breathe. So those are going to float regardless.
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  Speaker 4: But we weigh them, so sometimes the lungs get heavy
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  Speaker 4: because they're filled with water. And then also when we
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  Speaker 4: cut into the lungs, we can see water coming out.
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  Speaker 2: Oh okay, well, well I gotta write that down. You
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  Speaker 2: cut into the lungs and if water comes out, well okay,
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  Speaker 2: then is there any way water can be in the
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  Speaker 2: lungs if you're dead before you go in the water.
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  Speaker 5: No.
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  Speaker 4: So the thing is, well, let me back up a
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  Speaker 4: little bit. So people don't die instantaneously. So what happens
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  Speaker 4: is people they start to you know, they're in the
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  Speaker 4: process of dying. That means their breathing is slowing down.
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  Speaker 4: So when you're breathing slows down and you're not breathing adequately,
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  Speaker 4: you can get food built up in your lungs. So
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  Speaker 4: that's kind of like the same fool that I'm talking about.
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  Speaker 4: But we can actually, like I said, if people, you know,
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  Speaker 4: inhale water, it'll be much more than that process of dying.
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  Speaker 2: So unless, okay, if you're dead when you go in
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  Speaker 2: the water, if you're already dead, let's just ciph from stablings.
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  Speaker 2: Your lungs don't get water in them. The water doesn't
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  Speaker 2: somehow seep into them. Correct, Okay, so you have to
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  Speaker 2: inhale the water for there to be water in your lungs. Guys,
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: we're finally getting somewhere. We're finally figuring out a little
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  Speaker 2: bit thanks to doctor Jan Gorniak. Hey, you know what, Jackie,
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: could you play that one more time? I want to
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  Speaker 2: make sure I got every word of that one more
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  Speaker 2: time please.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: Deputies from the Dixie County Sheriff's Office show up at
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: the rental home and an extensive search begins, with family
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: members joining deputies. Hours pass as the search covers the
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: canal behind the home and nearby docks and boat houses.
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: David Rainey cannot be found. In the early evening hours,
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: deputies decide to go back to the canal and look
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: one last time. It is during this last look they
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: see the body of David Rainey submerged in the water
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: of the canal behind the house. He's been stabbed multiple
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: times in the chest.
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: Okay, this is in Swanee, Florida, and I want to
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  Speaker 2: make sure about something, Doctor Gorniac. Jen Smith hold On,
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: chief investigative reporter with Dailymail dot Com. That's where I
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: first found out about this case, Doctor Gorniac. This is Florida,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: all right, How do I know stab wounds? I'm not
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: a gator. Don't laugh, because did I tell you what
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: happened with my son and daughter. We were at Disney
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: right outside the Floridian This was years ago. They were
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: only about oh gosh, it was during Top Mom. They
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: had to be like three years old. And we were
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: playing by the water and I let John David go
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  Speaker 2: out in the water up to his knees to throw rocks. David,
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  Speaker 2: my husband, who has done a lot of business in
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Florida with his job, said get him out of the
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  Speaker 2: water right now. And I'm like, no, don't tell me
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  Speaker 2: what to do. Number one, And he went there are gators.
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  Speaker 2: I'm like, there are no gators. This is Disney. Nothing
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: bad happens at Disney. He like, get him out. I'm like, okay,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: I'll get him out. But I'm only doing it because
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: you're crazy. I'm not doing it because there's a gator.
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: Guess what, Like it was less than a year later.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: I think that timing is right. A gator grabbed a
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: little kid in Disney. So how do I know this
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  Speaker 2: is from stab wounds and not a gator? Well, first
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: of all, the gator would have eaten him. But that said,
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: how do you tell the wounds apart?
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: Once again, you have fantastic questions. We have to look
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  Speaker 4: at the characteristics of the wounds.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: I bet you didn't think I was going to ask
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: you about a gator biite, did you?
• 12:30
  Speaker 5: I did not.
• 12:31
  Speaker 6: I did not.
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: Maybe a turtle, but not a gator. So we do
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: have to Like when people are found in water, there
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: could be some animals in the water that will you know,
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: eat on the body. So the difference we can tell
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: the difference between a ante mortem or pre before depth and
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: post mortem wounds just because your body has to react
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: to it. Yeah, like bleed or some swelling and and
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: you're absolutely right if this was a gator bite, I
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: don't think voter found him right. I'm not sure they're
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: just going to bite and then leave, But we could
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: look at characteristics of the wound, and that way we
• 13:07
  Speaker 4: can tell the difference between you know, and then where
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: they are. You know what I mean. It's just not
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  Speaker 4: it'd be difficult for a gator just to get like
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: top teeth into the chest. It's not going all the
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  Speaker 4: way through the body. Maybe at the arm. You know,
• 13:22
  Speaker 4: you can chomp on the arm. I'm sorry to say that,
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: but it'd be difficult just to have wound on the
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  Speaker 4: top of the body and nowhere else to do with.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: A gator bik okay uh, Doctor Corney, I am subjecting
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: you to the same things I subjected medical examiners too
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: when I was trying cases. All sorts of questions that
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: may be completely irrelevant, but if you listen to all
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: of them, you finally start honing in on the real
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: cod the real cause of death. Now who this guy
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: didn't stab himself? Take a listen to our friends at
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: crime online dot com.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: After a lifetime of living on the Atlantic side of
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: Florida and Palm Coast, David and Cindy decided it's time
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: to see how the other half lives. Along the West
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: coast of Florida. They rent a cottage for the weekend
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: along the canal in Sewanne, Florida, one hundred and forty
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: miles from home. Now young adults, the rainy Suns, Bailey
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: and Jack, plus a family friend Jeffrey Sawyer join them
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: for the weekend getaway. But on Saturday, David walks away
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: from the home and doesn't come back.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Okay, let me talk to you about the West Coast
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: and the East coast of Florida. So they live on
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: the Atlantic side and that would be the East coast
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: of Florida, and they want to go over to the
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: West coast now with me. And she's used to answering
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: questions in court. Kelly Hyman renow lawyer, joining us out
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: of Florida. She's also a TV legal analyst. She's the
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: host of Once Upon a Crime and Hollywood, which I love.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: Once Upon a Crime in Hollywood. Kelly Hyman. The difference
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: between the Atlantic Coast and the Gulf Coast its like
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: on the Gulf of Mexico, and that water is much
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: warmer and the beaches are different. They're more like sugar
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: sugar white beaches on the west coast of Florida. Am
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: I getting this bass Ackwards or Am I right? And
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: it's an even milder temperature.
• 15:12
  Speaker 7: That is one hundred percent right. Absolutely, the water is
• 15:15
  Speaker 7: a different temperature and the beaches are different texture as well.
• 15:20
  Speaker 7: You're spot on, Nancy.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: It's beautiful. It's beautiful. And this is how I know
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: that my dad was from a little town hay Cody, Alabama, Okay,
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: which is near a which is near Enterprise, which is
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: near Mobile. That's say, you know where Hey Cody is.
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: I think that's an Indian name. But long story short,
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: he grew up on the Panhandle and we would go
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: there as children. This first time I ever saw the ocean,
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: and it is amazing. So they want to go over
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: and as our friend at crime Online said, see how
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: the other half live on the other side of the state.
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: So they go over and I'm not quite sure how
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: this guy who's there with his family ends up did
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: joining me right now? Chief investigative reporter with dailymail dot Com,
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: Jen When I first found out about David Rainey's murder,
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: I found out because I saw a blurb, a little
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: blip on daily Mail. Tell me about them getting there.
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: And I've seen this. You you're on the water, your
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: rental home, you know, like an Airbnb. It's on the water,
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: but it's canal water. You're not on the the beach.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: They have canals dug and people big enough to take
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: boats back and forth. They have docs and you can
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: be right on that canal and it's really nice. So
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: I'm taking it that's where the rental was correct.
• 16:47
  Speaker 6: Yeah, So the Rainy family already were living, you know,
• 16:50
  Speaker 6: by the beach palmcost, very beachy sort of tone. They
• 16:54
  Speaker 6: were enjoying that kind of Atlantic coastal lifestyle. They wanted
• 17:00
  Speaker 6: to as you know, our friends said, check out how
• 17:03
  Speaker 6: the other half lived. So they go to this time
• 17:05
  Speaker 6: in Sowanni to Dixie County. It's kind of, you know,
• 17:07
  Speaker 6: halfway between sort of Gainesville and the rest of the Panhandle,
• 17:13
  Speaker 6: and they rent a vacation heights for the weekend that
• 17:16
  Speaker 6: at the back of the yard, the very rear of
• 17:19
  Speaker 6: the backyard, there is this canal which you know flows
• 17:24
  Speaker 6: through many of the homes there. It's meant to be
• 17:26
  Speaker 6: this kind of idyllic setting for vacationing. So David Rainey
• 17:32
  Speaker 6: goes with his wife Cindy, their two sons, her young adults,
• 17:37
  Speaker 6: and this family friend. And the plan was to go for,
• 17:41
  Speaker 6: you know, a relaxing weekend in a different part of
• 17:45
  Speaker 6: their beloved state, and of.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Course, completely showered in sunshine. It's beautiful and out of
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: the blue, in the midst of a vacation, he ends
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: up stabbed dead and in the canal. Karen Stark is
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: with me, a renounced psychologist. You've heard of her before
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: on TV, on radio. She's a consultant as well. You
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: can find her at Karenstark dot com. That's Karen with
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: a C. Karen. You know I talked to you before
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: I wrote my last book, Don't Be a Victim, about
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: how when you go on vacation you seemingly let your
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: guard down a little bit because in your mind, you're
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: away from all the stress, you're away from all the danger,
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: the pressure of regular life, and everything's going to be fine.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: Like I was just talking about Disney, I think you
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: let your guard down a little bit when you're on vacation.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: What to what do you First of all, do you
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: agree and second to what do you attribute that?
• 18:39
  Speaker 8: Yes, I agree with what you said, Dancy, I do
• 18:42
  Speaker 8: believe you that you're you let your guard down. I
• 18:45
  Speaker 8: think it's because you're much more relaxed, and it's not
• 18:50
  Speaker 8: your everyday situation where you might be more cautious, you're
• 18:54
  Speaker 8: not aware of your surroundings. But what's very odd to
• 18:58
  Speaker 8: me about this picture, particular story, is that he's left,
• 19:04
  Speaker 8: and he left behind things that you would normally, under
• 19:08
  Speaker 8: any circumstance stances not leave, like his wallet, his glasses.
• 19:13
  Speaker 8: I mean, that is not just being relaxed. That's not
• 19:17
  Speaker 8: being prepared for anything. It's not being you. If you
• 19:21
  Speaker 8: understand what I mean, it's not yourself. It's not what
• 19:24
  Speaker 8: you would normally do, it's not your habit.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: Well, I don't know if I was going out for
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: a stroll if I would take all of that. I
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: don't take my keys in my wallet, you take glasses.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: I may depend if you say glasses, it depends, and
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: if I'm short sighted or far sighted, or if they're
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: reading glasses. I'm not planning on reading a manifesto when
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: I'm taking a walk or a jog, So I don't know.
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I agree with you or not,
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: but I do find it on he didn't have his
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: cell phone, because that's something almost everybody takes everywhere they go.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: So you're right about that, Karen Stark. So what do
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: we know in addition to what Jensmith from dailymail dot
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: com is telling us, take a listen to our friends
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: at crime Online.
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: David walking out of the house so left his glasses,
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: wallet and cell phone behind in their rental home. David
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: still hadn't returned. Cindy calls police an extensive surgeencies and
• 20:15
  Speaker 3: continues throughout the day without success. It wasn't until early
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: evening that same day that deputies found David Rainey's body
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: submerged in the canal in the backyard of the rental house.
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: He's been stabbed multiple times in the chest and was
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: still in the same clothes he was last seen wearing.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: Police said the body was placed in the water after death.
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: David Rainie's death has ruled a homicide, but his obituary
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: says simply that he passed away unexpectedly.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I fought the family with that.
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: Who wants the final article on your life to be
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: you were murdered? Maybe they wanted it to didn't want
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: the whole world to know that he was murdered. Also
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: joining me right now special guests. Former Miami Day Police
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: homicide detective now private investigator in Florida, and you can
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: find him at South fl Florida PI dot com South
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: FLPI dot com. Pat Diaz. Why didn't they find him
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: the first time they went to search? I don't know
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: that they even looked in the canal, But why do
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: you believe they didn't see in the first time they went?
• 21:25
  Speaker 5: Well, this case is interesting, and I'll tell you why.
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: Palmcoast is a busy area of Florida, verificationing in Dixie
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: County to small community. The Sheriff's department is not real large,
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: so you don't have experience investigators out there. Do I
• 21:44
  Speaker 5: think he left his house and took a walk. No,
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: what I think happened is because of the heat in Florida.
• 21:50
  Speaker 5: I've had many cases where people have been stabbed and
• 21:53
  Speaker 5: been dumped in the canal. Initially he went to the bottom,
• 21:58
  Speaker 5: but as they got and hotter, that's when he surfaced.
• 22:02
  Speaker 5: That's why. Initially, the family says, then when they did
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: the initial search, they can't find them. But later on
• 22:08
  Speaker 5: in the day, as the heat grew, I think he
• 22:12
  Speaker 5: came to the surface. And like I said, we're going
• 22:15
  Speaker 5: to a sheriff's office that may not have the expertise,
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: like you know, we have five thousand men in Miami
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: Dad where a homicide unit comes out, so they may
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: not been able to search the canal with boats or
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: have diavers come out, but that would have been the
• 22:32
  Speaker 5: first place you check is with a diverts You checked
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: the canal.
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: Well, you know what, Pat dis, I'm so glad you
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: said that because the Palm County sheriffs and the police
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: have been taking a black eye on that. I've got
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: a lot of confidence in them, even though they're a
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: small outfit that they looked out in the canal, they
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: saw nothing and at that juncture didn't realize that they
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: needed to dredge the canal or send down divers. And
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: you're absolutely right to Jen Gorniac joining us from Clark
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: County the Vegas jurisdiction, Doctor gorniack, He's right. The body
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: would then begin to build up gases and float.
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: So for me, it was he wasn't in the water
• 23:13
  Speaker 4: that long, correct, We don't know.
• 23:14
  Speaker 5: I think he was in the water all day because
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: I think to search they searched earlier and then they
• 23:20
  Speaker 5: found him later at either.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: They may have been in the water since the day
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: before when he left the house, because it wasn't until
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: the next morning that he was reported missing. So he
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: could have been in the water, you know, thirty six
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: hours before his body started to float.
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: And that's true. That seems to go and that's that's possible.
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: And one, I don't know how deep this canal is.
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: Deep enough for watercraft. Watercraft can go back and forth
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: in the canal.
• 23:45
  Speaker 5: Most canals of Florida run fifteen to twenty feet deep.
• 23:48
  Speaker 5: They're pretty they're pretty deep and the water.
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: So that could explain why he wasn't seen immediately. Okay, guys,
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: listen to this.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: The Dixie County Shriff Office ask the public for help.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: There were no leads and the only thing police know
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: for sure is that the death was a homicide. There
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: were also no suspects and no leads coming in. Police
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: also didn't have a potential motive.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: Okay, that's a little known secret. Pat Diaz joining me
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: from Miami Dade homicide detective. When the cops have to
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: ask the public make a public appeal for tips, they're
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: stumped and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: I think there's everything right with it. I'm glad they
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: did it. But when you hear cops saying, hey, if
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: you've seen anything, if you know anything, if you think
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: you know anything, dial this number. That means they need
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: help and they're doing the right thing. Would you agree
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: with that? Pat Das. They're stumped. No leads, no motive,
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: no nothing.
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: Absolutely what they have They have a house and they
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: have a missing witness. So yes, they're looking for that
• 24:54
  Speaker 5: lead with about that person that nobody ever talks about
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: is God. But you also have the house and to
• 25:02
  Speaker 5: do a correct finances on the house it takes a while,
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: so they're going to look for other leaves to help them.
• 25:08
  Speaker 5: So that's the correct thing to do.
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: Of course, you look at the house for clothes, you
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: look at the phone, you look at the laptop, you
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: look at social media, you look at calls, texts. All
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: of that reveals nothing. And now they're making a public appeal.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: So who is this guy? Is there anything in his
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: past that could tell me what happened to him? Because
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: you know, I always say, if you don't know a horse,
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: look at his track record. Is there anything lurking in
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: his past that could put us on the right direction.
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: Listen, David Rainey was a very good athlete in his youth.
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: He had a passion for playing sports and that was
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: passed on to his own children With his wife, Cindy.
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: The couple was married for twenty one years. The Rainy
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: family traveled with sons Bailey and Jack and their baseball teams,
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: making trips to Alaska, Cooperstown, even the White House. Rainy
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: earns a living as a tradesman. After attending Schenectady Welding
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: School in New York. Ranny specialized becoming a wel drimed
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: mechanic on steam and gas turbines. His expertise led him
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: to work for well known companies including Corona Engineering, Siemens,
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: and Ethos Energy. During the lifetime of his career, Rani
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: worked all over the country, from California to Florida.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: Okay, did you hear what Dave mac just said. This
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: guy has ties in New York, got ties in Senectady.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: He's worked all around the country. He has connections all
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: around the country. So that really opens up the investigation.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: So what does the family do? They are actually out
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: helping search for their father, for their husband. They're not
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: just sitting back, They're trying to find him. Listen to more.
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: Five days after their father was stabbed to death, then
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: his body tossed into a canal, the sons of David
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: Rainey started to go fundme Paige. The organizer of the
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: fundraiser is Bailey Jack Rainey. And in the log line
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: where you explain the reason you're asking people to give
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: you money, Bailey Jack Rainey wrote in lua flowers in
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: the Loving Remembrance of David's life, the family asked that
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: a charitable donation be made to his sons, Bailey and
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: Jack for their future. Thank you and God bless It
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: raised just four hundred and seventy five dollars.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Four hundred and seventy five dollars. Wait, okay, that's not
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: a lot of money, Is that right, Jen Smith? They
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: do go funny when I look at Gofunmi's online, they're
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: raising tens of thousands of dollars. They only got four
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: hundred and said, wait, wait, how old are the sons.
• 27:32
  Speaker 6: Old enough to know better? These are young adults. They
• 27:35
  Speaker 6: are done with school. They do not need any more
• 27:37
  Speaker 6: help in the education.
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: Depart Okay, why wait, wait, wait wait, how old are
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: these two sons that are hitting me up for money
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: on GoFundMe in their early one is that you Padiaz?
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: Does somebody just say nineteen and twenty one? Okay, that's Padias.
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: I recognize you for it is Jim Smith? Is he right?
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: Are they nineteen and twenty one? And they are asking
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: for money, quote for their future? Fort how about get
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: a job? How about secure your future like that? I
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: had to start working when I was fifteen? What okay,
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: Jenn Smith explain the guy's finally to me.
• 28:09
  Speaker 6: So the two boys launched this gofund me.
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: The mother's name boys was in his twenties.
• 28:14
  Speaker 6: The sons, the two sons. Then the two sons launch
• 28:18
  Speaker 6: this GoFundMe within you know, five days of their Doug's
• 28:21
  Speaker 6: brugual murder when it's still unsold. And yeah, they're they're
• 28:26
  Speaker 6: asking for money for their future. They don't specify if
• 28:29
  Speaker 6: it's because they want, you know, help to learn a
• 28:32
  Speaker 6: specific trade, or if one of them wants to go
• 28:34
  Speaker 6: to college to do this, or if one of them
• 28:35
  Speaker 6: has a medical bill that needs paying. None of that
• 28:38
  Speaker 6: is provided in the way that it normally would be
• 28:40
  Speaker 6: on a go fundme, you know, for a family in need,
• 28:43
  Speaker 6: and like you mentioned, Wait a.
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: Minute, did you just say a family in need? Hey,
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: don't scam me, Jenn Smith, family in need, Myria rant.
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: They're at an Airbnb on a canal by the beach
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: in Florida. That ain't change.
• 28:56
  Speaker 6: No, that's not what I'm not calling them a family
• 28:59
  Speaker 6: in need. I'm saying it's quite common for a GoFundMe
• 29:02
  Speaker 6: page to be launched for a family in need when
• 29:05
  Speaker 6: they are struck by tragedy, like the ones you just
• 29:08
  Speaker 6: mentioned that raise ten tens of thousands of dollars. But
• 29:11
  Speaker 6: clearly this is not a family in need. These are
• 29:14
  Speaker 6: not young adults who need anything from the public. And
• 29:19
  Speaker 6: you know the fact that they launched it within five
• 29:21
  Speaker 6: days of their father's unsold murder, it raises even more questions.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: You know, I think that Karen Starr, you live through
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: this with me. I think that one on the worst
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: days of my life was when I had to sit
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: at the kitchen table at home and make and and
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: work on my father's obituary. I hate even remembering it.
• 29:44
  Speaker 9: And now these two are trying to get money off
• 29:47
  Speaker 9: at go fundme. They're nineteen and twenty one years old
• 29:50
  Speaker 9: to secure their future. I just, of course, nobody's on trial,
• 29:56
  Speaker 9: nobody's charged with soliciting funds from General US and Open Hearts.
• 30:01
  Speaker 9: But you know what Karen started. I'm sure defense Tree
• 30:04
  Speaker 9: will say that means absolutely nothing, but it means something
• 30:06
  Speaker 9: to make Karen.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: Yes, Nancy, it means something to you.
• 30:10
  Speaker 8: But this is such a very strange I mean, I've
• 30:14
  Speaker 8: been a part of what's going on in your life.
• 30:16
  Speaker 8: This is very strange case though. I mean, I don't understand.
• 30:20
  Speaker 8: I don't understand the go fund me for these adult
• 30:24
  Speaker 8: and they're almost adult but really adult guys. I don't
• 30:28
  Speaker 8: understand an argument where he walks off, whether it's he
• 30:32
  Speaker 8: didn't bring his glasses or his cell phone. There is
• 30:35
  Speaker 8: something really wrong in this tale that the police didn't
• 30:40
  Speaker 8: find him. That it's very strange and unusual that you
• 30:45
  Speaker 8: have this.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: And this money motive, this thread and now is woven
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: even more so, take a listen to investigative reporter Dave Mack.
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: A surprising twist in the unseen murder of David Rainey
• 31:01
  Speaker 3: is a lawsuit filed by his mother, Francis June Archibald
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: of Vero Beach Florida, filed a civil lawsuit in Flagler
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: County against her daughter in law, Cindy Rainey, her grandsons
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: Bailey and Jack Raney, and two others. The lawsuit seeks
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: more than fifty thousand dollars in damages and accuses the
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: defendants of interfering with and mishandling David Rainey's body after
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: his death. The details of the lawsuit aren't known, and
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: the case is still making its way through the courts.
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: Archibald has not common.
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: Jen Smith is with me, chief investigative reporter with dailymail
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: dot Com. Jen Smith, are you telling me that David
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: Rainey's the dead dad, the husband. David Rainey's mother sues
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: his family, her daughter in law and her grandsons, the
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: ones that are asking for money on Go Bummy for
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: mishandling his body.
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that is correct.
• 32:19
  Speaker 6: So we have this lawsuit filed by David Rainey's mother
• 32:22
  Speaker 6: down in Via Beach, which we don't have access to
• 32:25
  Speaker 6: the full set of documents. Obviously that they will contain
• 32:29
  Speaker 6: a lot, But the essence of this lawsuit is not
• 32:33
  Speaker 6: that they themselves were responsible for his death, but she
• 32:39
  Speaker 6: alleged that they were responsible for tampering with the body,
• 32:42
  Speaker 6: dumping the body in this canal, and lying to police
• 32:46
  Speaker 6: about him going for a walk, and for the rest
• 32:49
  Speaker 6: of it. So the fact that the mother, the big
• 32:53
  Speaker 6: boys or these young adult men, their own grandmother, and
• 32:57
  Speaker 6: this woman's mother in law is suspicious of them tells
• 33:01
  Speaker 6: you a lot about how this mother, David Ramie's mother
• 33:05
  Speaker 6: and his fate of the family are viewing the wife
• 33:08
  Speaker 6: and the two sons.
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: David Rainey's wife, Cindy and their two sons, Bailly and
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: Jack Rainey the subject of a civil lawsuit filed by
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: David raine the dad husband mother against them for tampering
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: and mishandling his body. So if they mishandled his body,
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: doesn't that mean that they knew about his death or
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: that the mother in law believes they're the killers. Well,
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: apparently local police agree.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: Listen, it's been more than two years since David Rainey's
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: body was found submerged in water and stabbed to death.
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: Police have no suspects in the murder, but that doesn't
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: mean they've not made an arrest. The Dixie County Sheriff's
• 34:01
  Speaker 3: Office says three of David Rainey's family members have been arrested.
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: David Rainey's wife and two sons were all charged with
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: tampering with evidence, apparently related to the dumping of Rainey's
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: body in the canal after he was stabbed. Investigators with
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: the Dixie County Sheriff's Office traveled to Bonnell, Florida, and
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: arrested Cindy Rainey and Bailey Rainey then traveled to Orlando, Florida,
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: and arrested Jack Raney. Cindy Rainey, Bailey Rainey, and Jack
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: Ranny are being held without bond in Florida. Tampering with
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: evidence is counted as a third degree felony, with penalties
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: of up to five years in prison or five years
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: of probation and a five thousand dollars fine. Police still
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: have not released a suspect or a possible motive for
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: the Rainy murder.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: Okay, let me understand this, everybody on this panel, especially
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: you Kelly Hyman pile on. So the mother in law
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: sues for mishandling the body. Now the mother wife and
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: the two adult sons with tampering with a body. But
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: that's not all. Take a listen to our cut twenty three.
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: David Raney's unsolved murder brought about competing claims for life
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: insurance benefits. This led to Life Insurance of North America
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: to file its own lawsuit, naming David Rannie's wife, Cindy Ranny,
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: sons Bailey Rainey and Jack Ranny, his mother June Francis Archibald,
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: and others. The goal of the life insurance company is
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: to let a court decide who gets the money. The
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: lawsuit mentions the wrongful death lawsuit filed against Cindy Rainey,
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: Bailey Ranny, and Jack Ranny, alleging that each of them
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: unlawfully and intentionally killed David Rainey and then disposed of
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: his body in the canal behind the vacation running.
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: Okay, so, Jen Smith, that's a civil lawsuit, and the
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: insurance company, to my understanding, the life insurance company is
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: suing the whole kitten kaboodle, and they, the life insurance company,
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: is claiming that the wife, Cindy Raney, and the two
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: sons bailing Jack Raney, that they intentionally killed David Nie.
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: They're saying it, but the police are not saying. Do
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: I have that right?
• 36:07
  Speaker 5: No?
• 36:08
  Speaker 6: Not quite. Within this lawsuit, the one that's been filed
• 36:12
  Speaker 6: by the insurance company. They're basically putting their hands up
• 36:16
  Speaker 6: in the air, saying, we don't want to have to
• 36:17
  Speaker 6: pay out this policy twice. Now, this is quite a
• 36:20
  Speaker 6: large sum of money. It's four hundred and seventy five
• 36:22
  Speaker 6: thousand dollars thereabout. Within their case, they make reference to
• 36:29
  Speaker 6: another civil lawsuit, and that other civil lawsuit is blaming
• 36:34
  Speaker 6: the family for the death. Now, we don't know if
• 36:37
  Speaker 6: that is the language that is contained in David Rainie's
• 36:41
  Speaker 6: mother's lawsuits. You know, the earlier when we were talking
• 36:44
  Speaker 6: about that, we don't have still access to. So it's
• 36:47
  Speaker 6: not the life insurance company that's making this allegation. What
• 36:50
  Speaker 6: the life insurance company is saying is while this is
• 36:54
  Speaker 6: you know, being contested, and while we have this active
• 36:57
  Speaker 6: police investigation and these two peaching cleans for the half
• 37:01
  Speaker 6: a million dollar life insurance policy, we don't want to
• 37:04
  Speaker 6: be stuck in the middle. Let the courts decide.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: Okay. So you're saying this life insurance company isn't pointing
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: the finger. They're quoting somebody else who's pointing the finger.
• 37:17
  Speaker 6: That's correct.
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: So they quote that these three are lawfully and intentionally
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: killed David Rainey and disposed of his body in the
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: canal behind the vacation rental. I mean, you know, Pat Diaz, Nan, Yeah,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: hold on here, and you know I'll lose my thought,
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: Pat Diaz. A lot of people would say this is
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: too stupid to be true. They kill him and dump
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: him in the backyard basically in the canal. But you know,
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: a lot of criminals are incredibly stupid. They just they're
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: not thinking strategically, like, Wow, the first place CoP's going
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: to look are out back in the canal. It happens.
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: No, I agree, I agree, especially they're out Remember we're
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: in we're in Dixie County. We're out in the middle
• 38:01
  Speaker 5: of nowhere. That's a perfect solution to get rid of
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: a body, and they could be gone by time that
• 38:09
  Speaker 5: body serves us. It just happened to be depending on
• 38:12
  Speaker 5: a how hot that was that day, the body came
• 38:14
  Speaker 5: up faster and they were able to find it. But yes,
• 38:17
  Speaker 5: that would be the ideal solution.
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: What were you saying, Karen Stark?
• 38:20
  Speaker 8: But it's just odd to me that they're arrested on
• 38:23
  Speaker 8: tampering with the body, but meanwhile they say he's missing,
• 38:26
  Speaker 8: they report him missing, so clearly they're saying they don't
• 38:30
  Speaker 8: know where the body is, but if they tampered with
• 38:33
  Speaker 8: the body, then they knew exactly where the body was.
• 38:37
  Speaker 6: So it's very odd.
• 38:39
  Speaker 8: It's as though somebody came in and killed him and
• 38:41
  Speaker 8: then they tampered with the body exactly.
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: It doesn't make any sense. And of course police are
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: saying they haven't ruled these three out as the killers. Well, okay,
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: I think that's pretty obvious. You know, I need Kelly Hymen,
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: and I need her now. Helped me make sense of this.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: Why is a life insurance company the one publishing the charges? Well,
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: what's happening with the law enforcement?
• 39:04
  Speaker 7: Right, According to the complaint that was filed, there was
• 39:08
  Speaker 7: a huge insurance policy and according to the complaint, the
• 39:13
  Speaker 7: beneficiary was David's wife and the contingent beneficiary are his children.
• 39:18
  Speaker 7: We're talking four hundred hundred and sixty seven thousand dollars
• 39:24
  Speaker 7: that are at stake in this policy. So the insurance
• 39:26
  Speaker 7: company are saying, look, we have this money, we want
• 39:29
  Speaker 7: to give it, but we want to give it to
• 39:31
  Speaker 7: the right person. And going back to the other point
• 39:34
  Speaker 7: when we talk about Florida, about campering with physical evidence
• 39:37
  Speaker 7: in Florida, Campering with physical evidence occurs when a person
• 39:41
  Speaker 7: with the intent to pair the use of evidence, conceal, alter,
• 39:45
  Speaker 7: or just strong that evidence while being aware of the
• 39:48
  Speaker 7: existence of an investigation or criminal proceeding. So if the
• 39:52
  Speaker 7: state proved that, then potentially they've proved the element of
• 39:56
  Speaker 7: campering with evidence.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: You know what I think they're doing. I think they're
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: trying to ferret out who is the least culpable and
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: get that one to roll over on the other two.
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: I think that's what's going on right now. Which one
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: will it be? I don't know, maybe none of them,
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: but they are, I guarantee you scouring through their social media,
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: their phones, their laptops, their iPads, their sell calls, they're
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: pinging them, and they're finding out the movements that these
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: three made leading up to the time that David Reiney
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: goes missing. And frankly, we don't know any went missing.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: To Pat Diaz, former Miami Day Police homicide detective in
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: this jurisdiction of Florida, you said he probably hadn't risen
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: to the top of the water when the cops first came.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: I don't know why. I'm not a doctor, I'm not
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: a water specialist. But how do I know they didn't
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: kill him three days before and stick him in the water.
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: Do I know they didn't hide his body in the
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: fridge and then stick him in the water. I mean,
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: there could be any number of scenarios. How long had
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: this guy really been dead when the wife the widow
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: calls police and to think if they are guilty, and
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: of course they haven't been charged. They were out acting
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: like they were searching for him. I bet they didn't
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: go out like they were looking in that canal. I
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: bet they didn't leave police over there. What about it?
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: Pat? I agree? I agree that most likely either they
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: came upon the body or they were aware of what
• 41:36
  Speaker 5: to happen, and that's why the police can't charge him
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: right now. They had to get rid of the body
• 41:44
  Speaker 5: one way to the other, and that's why they got
• 41:46
  Speaker 5: the tampering, and that's why I think they were charged
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: with that. But I also believe too that there was
• 41:52
  Speaker 5: an extensive there's a expensive crime scene someplace. Anytime you
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: got to Homsteine involved staffing, you're going to have extensive
• 41:59
  Speaker 5: blood all over the place. So there is a crime scene.
• 42:03
  Speaker 5: So they still may be working on DNA trying to
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: match up the DNA they found on the scene. So
• 42:10
  Speaker 5: that's just the beginning. I think it's maybe just the
• 42:12
  Speaker 5: beginning for them. Once they're in custody, they'll get their
• 42:15
  Speaker 5: DNA and they may not have been able to get
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: it back then, so now I have it now. So
• 42:20
  Speaker 5: there's I think the investigations still on, and that's why
• 42:23
  Speaker 5: he said there's still a persons that are interesting.
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: You know, one other fact that we have not mentioned,
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: wasn't a family friend along on that trip? Jenn Smith
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: Daily Mail.
• 42:32
  Speaker 5: There was.
• 42:32
  Speaker 6: Indeed, we have this family friend whose names Jeffrey Sawyer,
• 42:36
  Speaker 6: who seemingly after this has vanished into spinnair. He's not
• 42:40
  Speaker 6: been charged, he has not been named in any of
• 42:44
  Speaker 6: these lawsuits that are flying around, no public comment about
• 42:47
  Speaker 6: what happened, no information about his connection to the family,
• 42:52
  Speaker 6: whether or not he was a friend of Cindy or
• 42:55
  Speaker 6: a friend of the victim, David. We know nothing about
• 42:58
  Speaker 6: this guy, why he was there, whether he himself is married,
• 43:01
  Speaker 6: whether he had any motives involved. There's a huge, huge
• 43:05
  Speaker 6: gazing hole in this investigation when it comes to this guy.
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: Authorities say they have not ruled out the widow and
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: the two adult sons, we wait as justice unfolds, and
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: of course they say they're not guilty. Goodbye sn