Latest / The Art of Costume Podcast / Labyrinth with Designer, Ava Youssefi

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Labyrinth with Designer, Ava Youssefi · The Art of Costume Podcast

• 0:05
  Hello and welcome to the Art of Costume podcast.
• 0:07
  I'm Mosby Joy Glass. And I'm a goblin named Spencer.
• 0:12
  You would be a goblin. I would be dude.
• 0:14
  I've been dying to hear your thoughts about today's episode,
• 0:16
  which is all about Labyrinth, a classic of the classic as we get
• 0:22
  into our 80s adventure fantasies.
• 0:28
  This movie was a journey, yeah. And to break down this journey,
• 0:33
  I, we actually have a special guest.
• 0:37
  I met this person as one of the costume nerds that listened to
• 0:40
  this podcast years ago and we kind of just became friends ever
• 0:45
  since. I'm obsessed with this person.
• 0:48
  She is a designer, a Milliner, a creative, a genius, a vampire, a
• 0:54
  witch, all the things. I'm obsessed with her.
• 0:56
  And also she just knows a lot about Labyrinth as well.
• 0:59
  Please welcome our friend Ava Yusefi.
• 1:03
  Hi, Ava, so good to see you. Hi, Spencer.
• 1:06
  Hi, Elizabeth. It's so good to see you too.
• 1:09
  I'm so happy to be here. I absolutely love the art of
• 1:12
  costume and I've been a fan for many years, so it's such a
• 1:17
  pleasure to be here with you today and talk about one of my
• 1:20
  favorite movies, The Labyrinth. Very excited to be here in the
• 1:24
  Goblin. City.
• 1:25
  Gosh, we're so excited to talk to you.
• 1:29
  Yeah. Do you remember, Ava, when we
• 1:30
  first met? You like, reached out through,
• 1:33
  like, the podcast and we ended up having coffee and we talked
• 1:36
  about movies that one day we should do on a podcast.
• 1:39
  And one of them you said was Labyrinth.
• 1:41
  And I was like, we gotta get you on one day to talk about
• 1:43
  labyrinth. That was years ago.
• 1:46
  I'm so happy that day is. Here, well, we have a lot to get
• 1:52
  to 'cause this is a wild movie, yeah.
• 1:55
  And this is your first time. It was so Ava, I'm happy you're
• 1:59
  here and know everything 'cause I had never seen Labyrinth
• 2:02
  before. Can I read the text that I got
• 2:05
  randomly this weekend? That's an Espia from Elizabeth.
• 2:08
  I was, I was in the graveyard watching.
• 2:12
  Oh my gosh, what's it called? Science of the Lambs.
• 2:15
  And I randomly get text from Elizabeth.
• 2:17
  This is all it says. Labyrinth is wild.
• 2:20
  I have no idea what I just watched.
• 2:25
  It is very unique. It's quite the favorite dream.
• 2:29
  And yeah, it is. It's it's a lot to take in.
• 2:32
  And I I kept expecting it to make sense, and then it didn't.
• 2:37
  And then David Bowie would sing something that I couldn't
• 2:40
  understand. I would be like OK.
• 2:45
  Yeah, it's it's I haven't seen it since I was a kid.
• 2:48
  Honestly, it's been a long time. I've seen it before I think we
• 2:52
  even had it on VHS and in the Williams home.
• 2:55
  But yeah, definitely was wild. I mean, how many times have you
• 2:58
  seen this one of? AI first found it when I was
• 3:03
  very young at Blockbuster. I remember I was just pulled in
• 3:06
  by the car and I was like, oh, what's this, let's rent it?
• 3:10
  And I took it home and I just, I've never been the same.
• 3:15
  I think most people would say that after seeing that,
• 3:18
  especially in the 80s. Could you imagine?
• 3:20
  Man ground breaking. And The Dark Crystal are films
• 3:26
  that like fundamentally shaped not just my taste in film, but
• 3:29
  I'd say like my full identity. I don't know, something about
• 3:33
  like the dark horror mixed with the absurd.
• 3:36
  And I just feel like Jim Henson is like one of those guys, like
• 3:40
  Miyazaki that has this like very gentle approach to childhood
• 3:44
  storytelling despite the darkness.
• 3:48
  And it just really hits perfectly for me.
• 3:50
  I. Agree.
• 3:50
  Oh my gosh, Dark Crystal. That was to me when I was a kid,
• 3:54
  the scariest movie ever made and I watched it all the time and I
• 3:58
  still would like be in tears almost every time.
• 4:01
  I thought it was. So you've never seen.
• 4:02
  That. I've never, I know, I've never
• 4:04
  seen any of this. This is not playing in the glass
• 4:07
  home. No, it was not I.
• 4:09
  Think the feedback from that one was was like, that's like, OK,
• 4:13
  but we can improve on this by adding real humans.
• 4:16
  And I think it's really gonna connect with that.
• 4:18
  So I'm glad that the addition of David Bowie and Jennifer
• 4:22
  Connelly was made and turned into this beautiful cult classic
• 4:26
  film. And I watched it like several
• 4:28
  times a year. It's one of my favorite films of
• 4:31
  all. Time.
• 4:31
  Yeah, well, with that, that sounds like a perfect transition
• 4:35
  into our episode today. We are obviously talking about
• 4:39
  Labyrinth. Someone give us all a little
• 4:41
  summary. Labyrinth directed by Jim
• 4:44
  Henson. 16 year old Sarah is given 13 hours to solve a
• 4:48
  labyrinth and rescue her baby brother Toby when her wish for
• 4:51
  him to be taken away is granted by the Goblin King Jareth.
• 4:56
  Along the way she encounters fantastical creatures, dangerous
• 4:59
  trials and puzzling illusions that test her courage and
• 5:02
  imagination. And that is Labyrinth.
• 5:06
  That is a very basic summary of Labyrinth I Yeah, yeah.
• 5:16
  If you've never seen it, that's that's the gist of it.
• 5:20
  Let's meet our costume designers.
• 5:22
  We have two of this week. We have costume designer Brian
• 5:28
  Froud, who were also worked on The Dark Crystal and the Dark
• 5:34
  Crystal Age of Resistance. And we have costume designer
• 5:39
  Ellis Fleet, who's just done Labyrinth.
• 5:44
  Yeah, I I looked it up just to see if that was a typo.
• 5:47
  Now this was her claim to fame. She did Labyrinth.
• 5:49
  And Brian talked about kind of how him and Jim came up with
• 5:55
  these ideas when he was being interviewed by Forbes.
• 5:59
  He said it was Jim's idea to mix puppets with people in
• 6:03
  Labyrinth. What I saw immediately was a
• 6:06
  vision of a baby surrounded by goblins, because in folklore
• 6:11
  goblins steel babies and that's what fairies do as well.
• 6:14
  Visually it's just a great image.
• 6:18
  Of course, the mixture of people with Muppets was very
• 6:21
  traditional. For The Muppets, it wasn't a big
• 6:25
  step to do that. For Labyrinth, however, it did
• 6:29
  mean we started to approach it in a slightly different way,
• 6:33
  that we knew what a human being in a landscape rounded by
• 6:37
  puppets, what that energy is like and how that enhances the
• 6:42
  story. And I did think about that
• 6:46
  because I was like, oh, like, this must have been like new for
• 6:50
  them, putting people in. And I was like, no, because this
• 6:53
  it's Jim Henson. It's The Muppets.
• 6:55
  Like he, he's always doing that. Yeah, it's it's it was new, but
• 6:59
  also, I mean, but in the sense that also David Bowie was
• 7:03
  basically singing all these songs and performing for all
• 7:06
  these Muppets as well too. So too, I mean, essentially,
• 7:12
  especially for Jennifer Connelly, like your Co stars are
• 7:15
  Muppets. So that was, you know, a feat in
• 7:18
  itself. There's a lot of great behind
• 7:20
  the scenes like videos you could go back and watch of like David
• 7:24
  David Bowie performing and seeing all the actual like
• 7:26
  puppeteers working all the actual goblins around him too.
• 7:30
  It looks like a hot mess. Honestly, it's a miracle that
• 7:34
  this film came out as amazing as it did.
• 7:36
  I I believe that, Brian said to Den of Geeks on Labyrinth.
• 7:42
  I just did lots of drawings and then we started to develop ideas
• 7:46
  for the script. That changed a lot.
• 7:49
  It was more medieval at one stage.
• 7:52
  Then gradually we started to make prototype work and other
• 7:56
  people came to work on the script and it was, it all
• 8:00
  snowballed from there, which I'm like, I can still see that like
• 8:03
  medieval influence through like the labyrinth.
• 8:09
  That's something that's very indicative of Brian Froud's
• 8:12
  style, and one of the reasons I feel like this film is as
• 8:16
  successful as it is, is that he was the full concept designer
• 8:20
  for the entire thing. So he designed, you know, every
• 8:23
  set, every prop, every goblin, every costume came from his
• 8:27
  mind, and it's just all so beautifully unique and special.
• 8:35
  You could definitely see like a very cohesive image from
• 8:38
  beginning to end. There's a.
• 8:40
  Lot of love and thought put into everything.
• 8:43
  The actual set design is stunning in this movie.
• 8:46
  Yeah, by. The way I know we're a costume
• 8:48
  podcast, but I just like the actual Goblin City when they're
• 8:52
  like hiding in the houses, yeah, it's very impressive.
• 8:55
  No, that's gorgeous. That is gorgeous.
• 8:59
  And we have Alice, who talked about the film to podcasting
• 9:04
  them softly, she said about Brian Frow.
• 9:09
  He brought to me many sketches of costumes from which my job
• 9:14
  would be to create and realize the ideas and also introduce new
• 9:19
  detail or interpretation. My first responsibility would be
• 9:24
  to David Bowie and to Jennifer Connelly, then to the surreal
• 9:29
  costume ball. It has to be said that I
• 9:34
  employed a large team of people from patent cutters, sewing
• 9:40
  technicians, screen print, dye specialist, special effects
• 9:44
  creators, jewelry designers, makeup, hair stylist, amongst
• 9:50
  others. And it is due to their continued
• 9:53
  hard work, originality and independent skills that we came
• 9:58
  to the finished product, which like, that's a lot of.
• 10:03
  Yeah, like they. Much love and respect to the
• 10:06
  entire Jim Henson Creature Shop, their army of production and
• 10:10
  fabrication masters. They.
• 10:12
  Have to be cohesive and that that was a team that had the
• 10:15
  work together. Florida State for it to look
• 10:18
  like this. And I mean, first of all,
• 10:20
  imagine having to your responsibilities are David Bowie
• 10:24
  and Jennifer Connelly. So already you're horrified.
• 10:28
  And then the actual, you know, and I have talked a lot about
• 10:31
  like the labyrinth masquerade events that people go to.
• 10:36
  So I was wanting to see like the connection to like the film,
• 10:39
  like where's that coming from? And then I saw that surreal
• 10:42
  costume ball that Alice is talking about, like, oh, OK, I
• 10:46
  get it now. I get it.
• 10:48
  But we'll talk about that a little bit more later on in the
• 10:51
  program as we are going to take a little break for us to venture
• 10:55
  into the underground, as they say, before we get into the
• 10:59
  costumes of Labyrinth. Hi, I'm Dan, who does all the
• 11:06
  magic behind the scenes. I wanted to say thank you.
• 11:09
  And if you want to support the show even farther, go to
• 11:12
  tpublic.com/user slash the Art of Costume, where you can buy a
• 11:18
  couple variations of our logo on T-shirts, mugs and stickers.
• 11:24
  Also, be sure to leave a like comment and subscribe.
• 11:28
  And if you're an audio listener, leave us a five star review on
• 11:30
  Apple Podcast. Now back to the show.
• 11:39
  All right, everyone, how Are you ready to get into the labyrinth?
• 11:42
  Because we started off with some banger costumes almost quite
• 11:46
  immediately. I just got to say I was really,
• 11:49
  it's been a probably about 25 years since I've seen Labyrinth.
• 11:53
  So like I, I remembered the gist.
• 11:55
  I remember, you know, the songs. I've listened to the soundtrack
• 11:58
  since then, obviously. But when that opening shot of
• 12:01
  Sarah and her, I kind of, I don't know, Renaissancey esque
• 12:06
  dress. Very medieval.
• 12:08
  Yeah, I. Was confused at first.
• 12:09
  I was like wait when? What period does this film take
• 12:12
  place in? And then I saw the blue jeans
• 12:14
  underneath. Then I really melted down.
• 12:16
  I was like I'm so confused. OK, this was #1 of Elizabeth
• 12:22
  being like, what am I watching? Because we have this beautiful
• 12:26
  scene. She's in this park, I assume
• 12:29
  it's gorgeous. She looks gorgeous just like
• 12:32
  that, like pale, like pastel green, the like the goldish tan
• 12:39
  like accents, the little cute flower crown.
• 12:41
  Like she looks so good. And I was like, maybe this is
• 12:45
  like some weird introduction that like, cuz you know,
• 12:48
  sometimes like they'll tell you the plot of the story and then
• 12:52
  like it'll go into it. And I was like, maybe that's it.
• 12:56
  And then she opens up the book and I was like, wait, is she in
• 12:59
  a play? Is she like, is she practicing?
• 13:04
  Well, when we first meet Sarah, she's mourning her late mother,
• 13:08
  who we can infer from Sarah's collection of playbills and
• 13:12
  photos, was a successful actress and theater performer.
• 13:17
  So I think Sarah's way of coping with her loss is by surrounding
• 13:22
  herself with fantasy and make believe in this scene.
• 13:28
  And like in the scenes that show her room, we can see a lot of
• 13:31
  fantasy novels, stuffed toys, posters and slightly medieval
• 13:36
  inspired furniture. And I kind of love it.
• 13:39
  It's giving perpetually living at the Renaissance fair.
• 13:42
  And this beautiful sage green gown is very reminiscent of the
• 13:48
  Renaissance era with the front lacing, the gilded trims, the
• 13:53
  long sleeves. And I feel like it also reflects
• 13:56
  Sarah's personality at the beginning of the story.
• 14:00
  She's very youthful and naive, imaginative, but a little bit
• 14:05
  constrained. So to me, I feel like the gown
• 14:09
  and the flower crown, I'm just, it's conjecture here, but I feel
• 14:15
  like they could have been like stolen from her school theatre's
• 14:17
  costume shop, which followed them home.
• 14:21
  And I feel like it's a very strong choice for her first
• 14:25
  costume that we see her in that really establishes her identity.
• 14:29
  She's stepping into the labyrinth fantasy world, and
• 14:34
  it's like subtly foreshadowing the transformation that she will
• 14:39
  soon undergo. Yeah, it really is a great
• 14:42
  introduction because it really, it gives us the origin story
• 14:45
  with like 0 words. You know, especially seeing that
• 14:49
  bedroom and seeing, you know, the music box with the dress on
• 14:52
  it that she, we see her later in, in the masquerade and I, I
• 14:56
  believe there's even like a picture of it looks like David
• 14:59
  Bowie on her dresser, which might be, you know.
• 15:02
  Or was it a toy? It was a.
• 15:04
  Little sculpture of of him, yeah.
• 15:06
  Yeah. Like if you if you really pay
• 15:08
  attention to the movie, pretty much everything that you see can
• 15:12
  be traced back to Sarah's bedroom.
• 15:14
  Like the Seth's in the later part of the film are inspired by
• 15:18
  MC Usher poster she has on the wall.
• 15:20
  It's really beautifully thought out.
• 15:23
  It's just living in that perpetual state of make believe,
• 15:26
  which I think is very, it feels like being relatable even in the
• 15:29
  year 2025, just us immersing ourselves in fantasy and movies
• 15:33
  and costumes and what not to just kind of take a step back.
• 15:36
  And she's, she's taken several steps back at this point, but
• 15:41
  it's very relatable. I would say before we get into
• 15:45
  our next character, I just have to give or before we get into
• 15:49
  more costumes. Just got to give a shout out to
• 15:52
  the stepmother though, who really brings the period into
• 15:56
  this. So it's suddenly it's like, oh,
• 15:58
  this is an 80s movie when we see the stepmother. 80s power
• 16:02
  dressing. Oh my gosh, her 80s blouse is
• 16:05
  the most 80s blouse I've ever seen in my life.
• 16:08
  Yeah, I I saw her stepmom and I was like, that woman knows how
• 16:13
  to dress like just the most 80s elegance.
• 16:19
  I am a powerful woman. Like 80s thing I've ever seen.
• 16:23
  She's a corporate killer for sure.
• 16:25
  Yes, yeah. And I looked up her character
• 16:29
  name and it's just stepmother. That's that's what it seems.
• 16:32
  So love that. Played by Shelly Thompson by the
• 16:36
  way. But let's get into the costume
• 16:40
  that the very belligerent Sarah starts wearing in the first part
• 16:44
  of this film. She's really quite terrorizing
• 16:48
  this household for the 1st 15 minutes of this film.
• 16:51
  She is. I was like, this is the person
• 16:53
  we're supposed to like. Like, I get it, like.
• 16:57
  She has a she has a mentee. Be the 1st 15 minutes.
• 17:00
  Yeah, crashing out is the word I'm looking for.
• 17:03
  Yeah, like, she definitely, like, has issues to work
• 17:06
  through. Although her stepmother, I'm
• 17:08
  like just you're clearly rich enough, just hire a babysitter.
• 17:13
  He just wants to be asked and respected as she's starting to
• 17:17
  become a young adult. Like, how do you know that I'm
• 17:20
  going to be available to be at home to stay with the baby?
• 17:23
  Maybe I don't want to. Yeah.
• 17:25
  We. I am, but still, you better ask
• 17:28
  me. Let's talk about Sarah's main
• 17:32
  costume that she wears into the labyrinth with that very
• 17:36
  fantastic dress, our vest. I love that vest.
• 17:40
  I'm not sure I love the whole get off honestly.
• 17:43
  The pattern really quite stuck with me the entire time.
• 17:49
  I just thought it was such a great choice and it's obviously
• 17:52
  something that she carries on through the rest of the film, so
• 17:55
  I could imagine the decision making behind this was quite
• 17:59
  stressful. Ava, are you wearing a version
• 18:02
  of this right now? Good catch Spencer, I actually
• 18:07
  am doing a little bit of a Soft Sarah cosplay today.
• 18:13
  This vest is an official Labyrinth reproduction done in
• 18:17
  collaboration with a local Los Angeles designer named Micheline
• 18:21
  Pitt. And so she made and produced
• 18:24
  these and I was so excited to get one.
• 18:25
  I had to wear it today. Yeah, I mean, no better place to
• 18:29
  wear it than our costume podcast.
• 18:31
  Well, it looks incredible. And I, that was probably one of
• 18:34
  my favorite costumes. I also love how she pairs it
• 18:36
  with the jeans though, too. But just somehow the jeans
• 18:40
  really ground it. I agree.
• 18:42
  I, I really love Sarah, like very obvious appreciation for
• 18:45
  historical dress. And I find this like casual
• 18:48
  blend of medieval Victorian and like 80s St. wear with the
• 18:53
  barrel jeans to be just really perfect and indicative of the
• 18:58
  her character and how she's about to transform and embark on
• 19:02
  this hero's journey. And you can't see it in these
• 19:05
  pictures, but she's also wearing a very sensible pair of like,
• 19:09
  leather loafers, which I think will be very comfortable as she
• 19:13
  walks around the underground. Yeah.
• 19:16
  Especially when she. Goes through the.
• 19:18
  The bog of what's it called? The bog of like endless stink.
• 19:22
  The Bog of Eternal Stench. Need a sensible shoe for that?
• 19:29
  You definitely do. I still can't believe they made
• 19:32
  it through that. I would if I was her I would
• 19:34
  have turned back. I've been like, you can keep the
• 19:35
  baby, it's fine. That was the part of film where
• 19:38
  I start to be like, what? This movie is crazy.
• 19:42
  That's where you started. Yeah, this is where I started.
• 19:48
  13 hours to journey to the castle at the center of the
• 19:51
  labyrinth. It's no biggie.
• 19:53
  No, not at all. Not especially when you have
• 19:57
  David Bowie popping up in your brother's room looking like a
• 20:02
  medieval knight. I love the first costume that
• 20:07
  Jareth the Goblin King wears. It is.
• 20:10
  What an entrance. It is, yeah.
• 20:13
  It is like the entrance. He goes from an owl to this very
• 20:17
  blue. I I don't even know how to
• 20:19
  describe it, honestly. There's nothing quite like it.
• 20:22
  I mean, I love the Cape, and the Cape is so very cool.
• 20:26
  Kind of like count like in a ways.
• 20:30
  It's skipping Dracula with the high stand.
• 20:34
  Yeah, it really is. But just like the iridescent
• 20:38
  blue as well too, just also. Such a nice pop of color.
• 20:43
  Yeah. Very glam rock with the velvet
• 20:46
  and the metallic accents and the lace cuffs.
• 20:49
  It's really respectful to David Bowie's rock royalty.
• 20:54
  Oh. Yeah.
• 20:56
  And one thing I think you can tell most in this costume but
• 20:59
  that they did a really good job of in the film in general was
• 21:03
  the layering of like textures and color is just spectacular.
• 21:08
  I. Love the the organically tooled
• 21:11
  leather work on this very like armor looking jacket and the
• 21:16
  gloves and the ridiculously huge villainous collar.
• 21:20
  It's so perfectly over the top. Yes it's at the same time like
• 21:26
  meticulously tailored. I love the sharp lines and it
• 21:31
  just has this like like like the the blue mixed with the black.
• 21:35
  It really leads into like the gothic side of medieval.
• 21:38
  Like the shape of the crust in the front of the jacket kind of
• 21:42
  reminds me of like a stained glass window almost.
• 21:45
  Yeah, absolutely. Or like the the outer stonework
• 21:49
  you would see on like an A medieval cathedral.
• 21:52
  Yes. It's perfect and it gives him
• 21:55
  such like unbelievable presence in that first scene, 'cause he
• 21:58
  just pops up and you're like, he.
• 22:00
  Pops up in like a proof of glitter cloud that explodes all
• 22:05
  around him with like a Beyoncé fan going and his hair and the
• 22:09
  makeup, it's so incredible. That's what I love too, is that
• 22:13
  they were like, look, it's David Bowie.
• 22:15
  And David Bowie, I mean, he's always been hot, but at this
• 22:18
  point in his life, like. David Bowie, David.
• 22:22
  Bowie. So they're like, we're gonna
• 22:23
  lean into this 120%. Come in and be seductive and
• 22:29
  magnetic and alluring and hypnotize you with my crystal
• 22:33
  balls. Yes, Oh my gosh.
• 22:35
  And like the very first thing I was just like, what is happening
• 22:39
  was when he was like juggling the crystal balls.
• 22:41
  Well, I have something to add to that actually, because I was
• 22:44
  fascinated with that because I saw this picture you had of the
• 22:47
  man bear hugging David Bowie from behind.
• 22:50
  And I was like, what is that? And we're actually, we have a
• 22:54
  clip from David Bowie coming up and he brought this up and I, I
• 22:58
  had a look into it. I don't know if I include it in
• 23:00
  a clip, but I was like, why is this man so close to David
• 23:03
  Bowie? Turns out David Bowie is of
• 23:06
  course not the one juggling, which I guess shouldn't be too
• 23:09
  surprising. He can do basically everything.
• 23:12
  Just juggling wasn't on top of David Bowie's list.
• 23:15
  I read that it was Michael Motion, the renowned juggler
• 23:19
  performance artist in the film. He crouched behind Bowie, out of
• 23:23
  sight and out of his hands through Bowie's arms to perform
• 23:27
  the seamless crystal ball moments.
• 23:30
  It was a challenging process requiring close synchronization
• 23:33
  between Michael and David Bowie, so you could actually find
• 23:37
  videos of this poor man trying to do the juggling while using
• 23:42
  David's arms, essentially. Obviously they not.
• 23:45
  Videos are muting too because David is like trying to act and
• 23:48
  have a serious face while this is going on behind him as well
• 23:52
  the arms. Are just flailing.
• 23:55
  It's perfect. Oh man.
• 23:58
  Well, Speaking of, obviously we all miss David Bowie.
• 24:02
  He is an icon. I love David Bowie, I've loved
• 24:06
  his music forever. And I just really, I just felt
• 24:09
  like we couldn't do Labyrinth without hearing like something
• 24:12
  from David Bowie about his experience.
• 24:14
  So I have like a quick, I think it's like maybe a minute and 45
• 24:17
  seconds of just him talking about his experience.
• 24:20
  I figured it'd be fun if we could all watch it together.
• 24:23
  Yeah, let's do it. He first brought me the concept
• 24:28
  on the 1983 tour that I did in America and asked me if I
• 24:33
  consider doing the part, and he showed me Brian Frow's artwork.
• 24:38
  He showed me a copy of The Dark Crystal, which I found a
• 24:42
  fascinating piece of work, and I could see the potentiality of
• 24:46
  making that kind of movie with humans, with songs, with a more
• 24:50
  of a lighter comedy script. Jareth is the Goblin King 1
• 24:53
  feels that he's rather reluctantly inherited the
• 24:55
  position of being Goblin King, as though he really would like
• 24:57
  to be, I don't know, down in Soho or something.
• 25:01
  But he's not his. His thing in life is to be
• 25:04
  Goblin King and he runs the whole place as well as he can,
• 25:07
  and he's kind of spoiled. He gets everything his own way.
• 25:10
  He's a big kid. What has happened is that the
• 25:16
  goblins, without his command, have just gone off and taken
• 25:20
  another baby brother from another girl and he's got to
• 25:23
  sort out the whole situation. Goblin Babe.
• 25:40
  Well. Jim gave me a complete free
• 25:45
  hand. It allowed me to say what I
• 25:48
  wanted and write the things that I wanted.
• 25:51
  Dance Magic gave me a bit of a problem.
• 25:53
  It's a song for the Goblin King and the baby, then Baby said in
• 25:58
  the recording studio. The baby.
• 26:00
  I picked one of the backing singers, Diva.
• 26:04
  I had this cute little baby who couldn't put two goggles
• 26:08
  together and it wouldn't work for me.
• 26:11
  I mean, it just it wouldn't go. I kicked it.
• 26:13
  I did everything to make it scream, but it wouldn't.
• 26:15
  It was it really buttoned its lips.
• 26:18
  So I ended up doing the goggles. So I'm the baby on that track as
• 26:21
  well. I thought, what the hell?
• 26:23
  I've done laughing. No, I might as well cut all the
• 26:26
  way. We're back.
• 26:26
  I never thought in 20 years I've come back to working with no.
• 26:31
  Oh, gosh, that was so much fun. I just, yeah, seen the chaos on
• 26:34
  that set. David Bowie, really, I mean, he
• 26:37
  really acted his ass off when you're working with a bunch of
• 26:41
  Muppet goblins. I.
• 26:42
  Would have been laughing my ass off the entire time.
• 26:44
  Yeah. Yeah, if you remind me of the
• 26:47
  babe. What is going on here?
• 26:51
  Well, we have more giraffe to get into.
• 26:54
  We do because he wears this legging and a leather jacket
• 27:02
  number for most of it and Ellis said about it.
• 27:07
  We had a load of laughs with the stretch trousers over the
• 27:12
  various cop pieces. We also tried many different
• 27:17
  hairstyles and makeup effects before Jim and Brian made their
• 27:21
  final selection. To realize the character and
• 27:25
  then have the creative freedom to add or expand my ideas is a
• 27:29
  costume designer's dream. And like when it works, it
• 27:34
  really is wonderful. And Spencer said something when
• 27:40
  we were talking about doing this episode right before, like, I
• 27:43
  got into, like, researching and watching it.
• 27:44
  He he like, made a comment about the codpieces.
• 27:47
  And I was like, what are you talking about?
• 27:49
  Yeah. Well, OK, so obviously I, I
• 27:51
  managed the art of costume social media and I, I get to go
• 27:55
  see a lot of costumes off them and often and share them with
• 27:58
  the audience. And I got to see this costume
• 28:00
  Pray two or three years ago at the Academy Museum and it was
• 28:05
  incredible. It still is in great condition
• 28:09
  to my surprise. I I just at the time I was like,
• 28:12
  oh, wow, this is a stunning costume.
• 28:14
  I'm right next to, you know, the Goblin King.
• 28:17
  I shared it on social media and the pure amount of comments I
• 28:20
  got on the codpiece really took me about.
• 28:24
  So I actually gathered some. I can share them with you all.
• 28:30
  These are we're talking about David Bowie.
• 28:34
  The first one says, Oh my God, that's why native Texans.
• 28:37
  David Bowie was the first of many awakenings for me.
• 28:41
  King of the COD piece. This was the start of puberty
• 28:45
  for me. They put all the money in the
• 28:47
  top half of the costume, leaving the boys to carry the bottom
• 28:51
  half. That might be my favorite one.
• 28:59
  There's one that just says me right now and it's a pregnant
• 29:02
  emoji. I mean, it's it's really crazy.
• 29:06
  But then of course there's a lot of good ones too.
• 29:08
  Like I would die to see this costume is what someone said.
• 29:11
  Or the costumes for this movie are so unappreciated for the
• 29:16
  detail and iconic design, which I really do agree with.
• 29:20
  I mean, when I think of this movie, I, I guess people don't
• 29:23
  necessarily bring up the costumes first, maybe like
• 29:26
  second or third. And it really is such a great
• 29:29
  feat in costume design. And this costume, even with the
• 29:34
  changing sizes of the codpiece throughout the film, which is
• 29:37
  hilarious. There is so much great detail.
• 29:39
  I mean, we have a shot of the back of it too, That Cape, the
• 29:43
  textile is. Incredible shout out to the Ager
• 29:47
  dyers on this one because the breakdown has done so well.
• 29:51
  The way that this Cape is rugged and worn and cascading down the
• 29:55
  back is really well done. It's a shame we didn't get to
• 29:58
  see more of it in the movie, but I'm actually very blessed like
• 30:01
  you, Spencer, I got to see this costume in person at both the
• 30:05
  Academy Museum and also about a decade prior it was at the
• 30:09
  Seattle Pop Culture Museum in this like fantasy costume
• 30:14
  exhibit that they had there. And, and I too was like
• 30:18
  impressed by the piece. It's in the same costume, but
• 30:23
  it's it's also like, wow, that was a choice.
• 30:26
  It's like comically prominent, especially there's like certain
• 30:31
  scenes where it's like, wow, it's right there.
• 30:33
  Yeah, it's right there. And.
• 30:34
  It might be getting bigger. Very hard to miss, but it it's
• 30:39
  like the perfect example of the film's playful, slightly over
• 30:43
  the top approach to sex appeal and costume design.
• 30:47
  And I am among the myriad of women who can credit this film
• 30:51
  as my first female awakening. There you go.
• 30:55
  You heard comments in here, I just didn't put it up.
• 30:58
  Yes. I'm represented good.
• 31:02
  I was going to say that the jacket is also really beautiful
• 31:05
  and I think that it deserves it's time to shine.
• 31:08
  I love the exaggerated asymmetrical lapel and the
• 31:13
  beautiful shoulder pauldron. And the belt is amazing too,
• 31:18
  especially that custom buckle. It has the same shape that
• 31:22
  Jarrett's amulet. All of which was so beautifully
• 31:26
  thought out and designed by Brian Froud.
• 31:29
  It's the same. So I think that there's just all
• 31:32
  these like really beautiful, delicious little details in the
• 31:35
  costumes that it it. You need to watch it through a
• 31:39
  few times to catch them. Yeah, and I've always been a big
• 31:43
  fan of the shoulder pauldron. You have to me.
• 31:46
  I don't know what it is about a pauldron, but that gets me every
• 31:49
  time. We have some Muppets to get into
• 31:52
  WE. Do and I have to say I want as
• 31:59
  roommate want him and his little dog to just like cheer me on all
• 32:08
  day every day? Yeah, such a fun character.
• 32:13
  Oh my gosh, off I'm Blankie. What was his dog's name?
• 32:16
  Ambrosius, Ambrosius. Ambrosius.
• 32:19
  Yeah, I'm obsessed with that name.
• 32:22
  I laughed every single time he called out.
• 32:24
  Ambrosius and Hoggle obviously was, I guess, adorable in his
• 32:31
  own right. He really gets there.
• 32:34
  Yeah. I just.
• 32:35
  Yeah. Again, huge credit to Jennifer
• 32:37
  Connelly for doing the job she did at such a young age acting
• 32:41
  with these characters. It, it really was incredible.
• 32:46
  And I feel, I feel like Didymus and Ambrosia are very much like
• 32:54
  the ideal of like what she thinks like a knight is.
• 33:00
  And I, it's just like so adorable.
• 33:03
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sordidanus really is giving like
• 33:07
  classic knight archetype. He's dressed in like the mix of
• 33:12
  medieval armor and tattered finery.
• 33:16
  Like a very chivalrous warrior who has raided A child's dress
• 33:21
  up box. Yes, I love this little eye
• 33:25
  patch and the ostrich feather. They make him look so brave and
• 33:29
  dashing, until you notice that his noble seed is this wimpy
• 33:35
  little dog Ambrosius that's always scurrying away from the
• 33:38
  action. It's also comical and absurd and
• 33:44
  yeah, it's really endearing. It's very endearing is the
• 33:48
  probably the best word for it, but I personally was in love
• 33:52
  with Ludo. Of course.
• 33:54
  The big softie obsessed with Ludo.
• 33:58
  Yeah. So very sweet.
• 34:00
  And the whole time I kept thinking, like, do you think
• 34:03
  that's actually like a costume? Like what's going on here?
• 34:07
  Ryan Brown did an interview with Den of Geeks and he was asked
• 34:11
  the question. Something like Ludo must have
• 34:14
  presented real challenges for the creature makers.
• 34:19
  You Draw Something on a piece of paper and then it's their job to
• 34:24
  turn it into a 75 LB costume. Brian's response to this was
• 34:32
  with that costume they had a lot of experience of big walk around
• 34:38
  creatures, big hairy creatures and we really refined it.
• 34:43
  We had all the fur woven, but at the same time we were having to
• 34:49
  explore much more about safety issues on the inside, the
• 34:54
  comfort of it. Jim was always really solicitous
• 34:59
  of the comfort of his performers, so we had to figure
• 35:05
  out ways of making it lighter, keep its expressiveness, get air
• 35:13
  in if we needed to or get them out of it if it was on fire.
• 35:19
  All these sorts of things Jim spent a lot of money trying to
• 35:24
  get right. And there it is.
• 35:26
  It shows up on screen. I'm like, that was quite the
• 35:31
  journey for them, but it paid off.
• 35:35
  Those those suit actors, they really are suffering in those
• 35:39
  costumes. It's really an incredible feat
• 35:41
  of carrying this giant thing on their back while also trying to
• 35:46
  act. And Ludo and also Hoggle had
• 35:50
  animatronic faces that they had to kind of choreograph their
• 35:54
  movements and the movements of the face that someone else was
• 35:58
  controlling off screen. It's it's really so incredible
• 36:01
  the work that they did on these characters.
• 36:04
  I I can't even imagine. That makes it even more
• 36:07
  impressive. Yeah, I'm obsessed.
• 36:09
  I'm so glad we have you here to bring us these facts too as
• 36:13
  well. I think the character.
• 36:15
  Hoggle is the really the most impressive.
• 36:17
  There was a a small little person, a little woman in there.
• 36:22
  And yeah, there's some really great behind the scenes footage
• 36:25
  of her, too, where you can see like, she was really even
• 36:29
  struggling to pick up things with these gloves that Hoggle
• 36:32
  was carrying. And then she would have to
• 36:34
  rehearse her movements to be in tandem with.
• 36:37
  It's actually Brian Henson that voiced Hoggle, too.
• 36:41
  So a lot of work went into making these characters really
• 36:45
  be lifelike and believable. Yeah, which is, I mean, it's
• 36:49
  just incredible. I think a lot of people when
• 36:51
  they think of a movie like Labyrinth or Dark Crystal, they
• 36:54
  don't really talk about the technical achievement that's
• 36:57
  really happening here for a lot of these performers.
• 37:00
  It's it's, it's impressive. Especially because they these
• 37:04
  puppets are like emoting so much.
• 37:07
  Like, like I forgot till we started talking about.
• 37:10
  I was like, Oh yeah. Like Hoggle is, you know, part
• 37:15
  Muppet, basically part animatronic.
• 37:17
  Like I kind. Of like are the wild things are
• 37:21
  part yet? Yeah.
• 37:23
  Yeah, like you kind of forget that.
• 37:25
  Like, oh, they're like putting so much work into this.
• 37:29
  It's not just an actor with great skill.
• 37:31
  It's it's many people with great skill.
• 37:34
  It's funny that you mention Where the Wild Things Are,
• 37:37
  because I was thinking about that story a lot as I was
• 37:41
  watching Labyrinth last night. So and then I really.
• 37:44
  Ludo by the way, not Hoggle. Ludo is definitely where the
• 37:47
  wild things are. Slash labooboo I'd say.
• 37:51
  I was actually just thinking about that.
• 37:53
  Oh. My gosh, yeah, no, that's so
• 37:56
  correct. But that being said, though, I,
• 37:59
  I noticed at the end of the film, it's the very, one of the
• 38:03
  very last credits that says Jim Henson acknowledges his debt to
• 38:06
  the works of Maurice Sendak, who is of course the author of Where
• 38:09
  the Wild Things Are. And I just thought that's so
• 38:11
  interesting. I was like, wow, like he's
• 38:13
  inspired. So then I of course had to
• 38:15
  Google it because I'm insane and I want to know why that was
• 38:18
  there. Turns out there was a little bit
• 38:21
  of legal trouble at the beginnings of Labyrinth, which I
• 38:25
  just found so juicy. So of course, Maurice Sendak,
• 38:29
  who, by the way, good friends of Jim Henson, no love lost.
• 38:34
  They, you know, obviously Jim Henson was very inspired by the
• 38:37
  storytelling of Maurice and vice versa.
• 38:39
  They were good friends. However, Marie Sendak had a book
• 38:43
  that was out caught outside over there, which the story concerns
• 38:48
  a young girl named Ida who must rescue her baby sister after
• 38:51
  child has been stolen by goblins, which obviously sounds
• 38:55
  very quite familiar. So as a film basically got it
• 38:59
  going. Some people were looking at what
• 39:03
  was happening here and they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa.
• 39:05
  Basically we got pull this back, but sounds like instead of these
• 39:09
  legal troubles going any any further, some conversations were
• 39:14
  kind of just had maybe some things were tweaked here and
• 39:17
  there and it ended up with things obviously being OK.
• 39:22
  So I just thought that was very interesting.
• 39:24
  And one way that they kind of paid homage was that
• 39:28
  acknowledgement and Jim Henson acknowledges his debt as it
• 39:30
  works with to the works of Maurice and Dak basically saying
• 39:34
  like he's done some really great work.
• 39:36
  But then, you know, obviously it is a big inspiration to me.
• 39:39
  But then like you said, that begin of this, you know, folk
• 39:43
  tale goblin stealing babies has kind of been going around for a
• 39:46
  while too. So.
• 39:47
  You. Know we could get into that
• 39:50
  forever, but I just thought that was very interesting though that
• 39:52
  you brought that up ABBA as well because.
• 39:55
  That's such a nice homage, I didn't know about that.
• 39:57
  Yeah, I thought it was. I was like, yeah, where the wild
• 40:00
  things are. He's very sweet and tender
• 40:03
  compared to the Wild Things are. Maybe that's where they tweet
• 40:06
  things. I like that he ends up like
• 40:09
  being the scariest looking friend that Sarah makes but
• 40:12
  actually has the softest heart. Yeah, yeah.
• 40:16
  And is the most. Helpful of summoning rocks to
• 40:18
  assist them with their yeah, the goblins.
• 40:22
  That was pretty amazing. That was amazing.
• 40:24
  I was like I need a friend like this.
• 40:26
  Yeah. Just just.
• 40:28
  I'll try calling rocks for you next time.
• 40:31
  You have many skills, Spencer. Well, there is a scene in
• 40:38
  particular that I was dying to see and it was.
• 40:41
  Of course, the masquerade. Yes, I thought this scene would
• 40:45
  be a lot longer. Yeah, right.
• 40:47
  Oh my gosh, me too. I thought this scene was going
• 40:51
  to be a lot more important. This is not what I expect
• 40:56
  expected, but it was just as beautiful as I imagined it would
• 41:02
  be. And Brian talked to Den of Geeks
• 41:04
  about it, saying, I think with Labyrinth it accrues so much
• 41:10
  more when you keep looking at it.
• 41:12
  Again, it's a mysterious film because you think you get it.
• 41:16
  You think it's really quite a jolly romp.
• 41:19
  And yet there are some very dark places in it.
• 41:23
  We're dealing with metaphor. All the characters had designs
• 41:27
  in them, shapes and forms and ideas that give the film depth
• 41:33
  that only emerges over years. I think also the story it tells,
• 41:40
  because it's the story of an adolescent girls mind really,
• 41:46
  and about her growing up, speaks to new generations of people
• 41:51
  when they see the film. It's an odd film if you can put
• 41:56
  it that way. It's sort of odd, but I love
• 42:00
  that because it's like, yeah, like I especially like this ball
• 42:04
  scene. It's almost, I'm like, I bet
• 42:06
  that's how she feels like at school, like just this like lost
• 42:11
  girl. Everyone around her seems to
• 42:14
  know what's going on and she's just kind of like trying to
• 42:18
  figure her way through. Yeah, but then also fascinated
• 42:22
  with the idea that she ends up dancing with the Goblin King as
• 42:25
  well, too, which I think also kind of speaks to like the
• 42:28
  complexities that are kind of happening through this venture
• 42:31
  into the labyrinth as well. Absolutely.
• 42:34
  And that dress, the dress, the dress, the dress that.
• 42:40
  Dress is like almost overwhelming the layers and
• 42:43
  layers of iridescent tulle and the glittering embellishments
• 42:48
  and the huge 80s hair and the the tinsel ornaments, those
• 42:53
  puffed frothy sleeves that like totally swallow her frame.
• 42:58
  I feel like the color was also intentional too, where like the
• 43:02
  white and the pale ivory tones suggest her innocence and her
• 43:06
  purity and her youth. And to me, it also kind of
• 43:10
  recalls Princess Diana's wedding dress that really sparked a kind
• 43:14
  of friend and movement during this time in history.
• 43:18
  Sarah's dress, it's, I feel like it's a symbol for like the cage
• 43:22
  that she's in. She has these like massive
• 43:24
  skirts that are like undoubtedly support with crinolines and
• 43:28
  petticoats that like are literally anchoring her in place
• 43:31
  under the weight of this costume.
• 43:33
  And she's kind of like a Princess trapped in a snow globe
• 43:37
  kind of thing. And she's weighed down by this
• 43:40
  exaggerated hyper feminine ideal.
• 43:44
  And then Jarrett swoops in with this dangerous allure, and his
• 43:48
  his outfit is the total opposite.
• 43:50
  It's got this again, the very sharp tailoring and the decadent
• 43:54
  details, and he's kind of like an 18th century dandy.
• 43:58
  I love the rich velvets and the metallic brocades and the lace
• 44:04
  cuffs and the jeweled accents. And I feel at the same time,
• 44:08
  it's still like the cut is a bit modernized, which brings that
• 44:13
  rock star sort of silhouette that David Bowie was known for.
• 44:17
  And I feel like even his mask kind of reflects his duality
• 44:22
  between him and Sarah. It's kind of elegant and also
• 44:26
  kind of sinister and it shows that his presence is commanding
• 44:32
  and also very, what should I say, dangerous.
• 44:38
  Yeah, he's a predator. I I want to say I also really
• 44:42
  love the masks in this scene. They're they're very, again,
• 44:45
  fraudy and that they're like not just like Venetian inspired and
• 44:51
  flattering, but they're also kind of grotesque.
• 44:54
  I like how the face stretched and the features are elongated
• 44:59
  and their expressions are frozen and it gives that sort of
• 45:02
  uncanny, dreamlike quality. And I feel like there also could
• 45:07
  be in a way like the human personification of the goblins
• 45:11
  in the labyrinth. And there's sort of predatory
• 45:16
  elegance, shows like the beautiful, intoxicating and
• 45:21
  deeply unsettling sort of nature of the goblins and Jareth's true
• 45:27
  intentions with Sarah. Yeah, I, I love the mask,
• 45:31
  actually. And I was just kind of impressed
• 45:33
  that the level of detail was, you know, taken all the way for
• 45:38
  every aspect of the camera. I mean, the camera could have
• 45:40
  pointed to anywhere in the room and you would have saw something
• 45:42
  that was just so incredible. I too.
• 45:48
  Absolutely. I too was mesmerized by Jareth's
• 45:52
  look and I think we have some notes.
• 45:54
  On some of the costumes, absolutely.
• 45:56
  And Alice? She really put a lot of thought
• 46:01
  into Jareth, saying the trickiest pieces were most of
• 46:06
  David's, and they were designed to be highly original and didn't
• 46:11
  always transfer from sketch to actual garment.
• 46:15
  And I'm like, Oh my gosh, if this is what we got this
• 46:18
  incredible cool over the top jacket and just look like, what
• 46:26
  couldn't they do? Like what was so awesome it just
• 46:30
  didn't work out? Yeah, I mean, I even love that
• 46:33
  they add the blue into the hair, which is such like a subtle
• 46:37
  note, but that's one of my favorites.
• 46:40
  I mean, has David Bowie ever looked cooler?
• 46:43
  It's just this is. What?
• 46:46
  We have speaking to you at the same time.
• 46:48
  And so nice. I'll be there for you as the
• 46:51
  world falls down. Oh, so romantic.
• 46:56
  I was so I. I wouldn't.
• 47:00
  I'd be like, we can stay in this ballroom.
• 47:02
  It's fine, yeah. Please don't wake me up, we're
• 47:05
  already in goblin world at this point.
• 47:07
  Like let's just keep going, but I.
• 47:09
  Masquerade bubble with you forever.
• 47:12
  Yeah, 13 hours doesn't seem like enough.
• 47:14
  No, no, especially when you're wearing Sarah's dress, which
• 47:19
  Ellis talked about. She said Sarah's ball gown took
• 47:23
  a lot of sampling and camera test to achieve.
• 47:28
  We wanted her to look like an otherworldly Princess and very
• 47:32
  different to the others at the ball.
• 47:35
  The ethereal effect was create was achieved by many secret
• 47:41
  devices including layers of lace, Lemay and rainbow paper,
• 47:49
  spray paint and broken jewels. And then the entire ballroom
• 47:55
  garments were distressed to look as if they had been dancing
• 48:01
  forever. Hemlines were broken down and
• 48:05
  dust was sprayed into the creases.
• 48:08
  The masks were also present. The masks also present a
• 48:13
  sinister look to the event, don't they?
• 48:16
  The fabric choices for the ladies was chosen to give depth
• 48:21
  and color and also for movement, as you say.
• 48:25
  Although of course all dresses were Trinoline underneath.
• 48:30
  Yeah, I that just picked up like my favorite part of the entire
• 48:35
  thing is how they were aged and died, like Ava mentioned
• 48:38
  earlier, to look as though they've been dancing through
• 48:41
  this ballroom forever. And that just kind of is my
• 48:44
  favorite aspect where it almost feels like like Sarah has been
• 48:47
  trapped in this. Not trapped, but she's been in
• 48:50
  this fantasy, then this escapism for it's it's probably only been
• 48:55
  what, seconds or hours in the real world.
• 48:57
  But as I mean, she's been in this vision for a long time,
• 49:01
  seeing herself at this. Event starting to decay and
• 49:05
  expire. Yeah, it's so cool and spraying
• 49:09
  dust and the creases of these. I mean, talk about the dream
• 49:13
  job. Yeah.
• 49:16
  That is your dream job, isn't it?
• 49:17
  Fun facts, I actually saw one of these gowns go up for sale on
• 49:22
  eBay a couple years ago. The green one that you
• 49:25
  prominently featured. I think they ended up selling
• 49:29
  for like 600 bucks which doesn't even sound like a whole lot.
• 49:33
  600. Yeah.
• 49:37
  I drop that money. Yeah, I do that.
• 49:39
  Oh my gosh. You should have texted us.
• 49:41
  We could have went three ways. Yeah, we.
• 49:44
  Would have dropped it if it were my measurements.
• 49:46
  For sure, right? Well, next time let us.
• 49:49
  Know next time we'll let you know, Elizabeth.
• 49:51
  We should just, we should just be like scanning eBay and like,
• 49:54
  slowly one day we'll open a costume museum.
• 49:57
  Yes, please. They'll also be at the Art of
• 49:59
  Costume podcast studio. But one of my favorite costumes
• 50:03
  was actually toward the very end.
• 50:06
  And when we have the final, shall we say, interaction
• 50:10
  between Jareth and Sarah and the Goblin King appears in this very
• 50:16
  kind of pale, almost ghost like, phantom like costume with a
• 50:20
  whole bunch of layers. And I was just taken away by it.
• 50:25
  I just thought he looked so incredible and so striking.
• 50:28
  Also, there's like a purity about it too, where it's almost
• 50:31
  like you kind of believe the words he's saying.
• 50:34
  Yeah, I I get it, you know, it's just there's such like a purity
• 50:38
  and like a charm to him. And this costume to me really
• 50:41
  sold it 100%. Yeah, it's it's such a striking
• 50:46
  departure from everything that he's worn before.
• 50:50
  Prior to this, he was always very flamboyant and structured
• 50:54
  and commanding. But in this last scene, he
• 50:57
  appears haggard and weak. He's stripped of all those rich
• 51:02
  colors and the strong silhouettes as before.
• 51:05
  And yeah, he does this have this very ethereal, exposed, sort of
• 51:09
  vulnerable quality to him. And I think like, also, Jared's
• 51:16
  makeup has always been a giveaway, but now we can see
• 51:19
  that the white in this costume is acting as a direct nod to his
• 51:23
  connection with the barn owl, his animal form throughout the
• 51:27
  film. The look still has his elegance,
• 51:32
  but he's fading and losing control.
• 51:35
  And on the back, there's actually this crazy structure
• 51:39
  made of bones on the shoulders. And it's, it's so raw and
• 51:43
  animalistic. And I feel like it alludes to
• 51:46
  him, his true nature of being the predator who's devoured his
• 51:50
  prey. And yeah, those, those final
• 51:53
  pleads, he's showing his desperation and real yearning
• 51:57
  for Sarah. And he's like barely clinging to
• 52:00
  his power and to desire and to the fantasy that he's built
• 52:05
  around Slara. And he's slowly losing it and
• 52:08
  unraveling. And with that, I can't even
• 52:12
  believe it, but we're at the end of Labyrinth, so.
• 52:15
  But we're not done yet though. Before we go, we're going to
• 52:18
  take a little break. When we come back, we're going
• 52:20
  to play our two favorite games. All right everyone, we are back
• 52:29
  from the the Underground and back in Sarah's bedroom, so I
• 52:33
  think it's a good time for us to play our two favorite game,
• 52:36
  starting with giving this film a stitch rating, which I actually
• 52:41
  find to be almost quite impossible for a film like a
• 52:44
  Labyrinth ABBA. Do you maybe want to go first
• 52:47
  then, since that might be a little bit more obvious?
• 52:50
  OK, well I'm obviously going to have to give it a 5 because
• 52:56
  probably my favorite top movie of all time.
• 53:00
  I I think that the costume design in the Labyrinth is
• 53:04
  nothing short of legendary. Every outfit is unforgettable
• 53:08
  and it's just one of those films that's earned this cult classic
• 53:12
  status and it means so much to so many people.
• 53:16
  For me personally, The Labyrinth has been endlessly inspiring and
• 53:21
  I'm forever indebted to the genius of Jim Henson and the
• 53:25
  team behind this movie. It's absolutely one of the
• 53:28
  cornerstones of my own design sense, and seeing that level of
• 53:32
  imagination and craftsmanship on screen is what encouraged me to
• 53:36
  pursue a career as a costume designer and fabricator.
• 53:40
  So I will have to give it a 5 out of five stitches.
• 53:44
  There you go. Yeah.
• 53:46
  Elizabeth, I'm very interested to hear your thoughts.
• 53:49
  Yeah, honestly, I'm with ABBA. I I do.
• 53:57
  I was confused but. You loved it.
• 54:00
  But I loved it. OK, well, that's fine actually.
• 54:04
  Like I, I was, I was definitely confused, but I was just like
• 54:11
  continually impressed by it 'cause like, clearly this is a
• 54:17
  movie you have to watch multiple times to get everything.
• 54:22
  But the work that went into it, everyone's performances, like it
• 54:27
  didn't lack anything. I think what I didn't understand
• 54:32
  was just my not paying attention enough.
• 54:37
  And like, you know, I feel like this is like one of those movies
• 54:43
  where like you got to do research about it and like learn
• 54:46
  more and more and I, I think it's a 5 out of five Dang.
• 54:51
  All right, five out, five from Elizabeth.
• 54:55
  Well, now I feel silly because I was going to give it a four.
• 54:58
  Why? I don't really.
• 55:01
  I know. I thought for sure Elizabeth was
• 55:04
  going to go lower than me. That's why I let her go next.
• 55:11
  I yeah. I mean, it's it's a pretty much
• 55:14
  like flawless film, like you said.
• 55:16
  There's really, it's not lacking anything.
• 55:19
  The performances are spectacular at the it's a technical
• 55:22
  achievement beyond its years. Yeah.
• 55:25
  Yeah, the music obviously is fantastic.
• 55:30
  So yeah, I mean, I can't really come up the soundtrack slaps
• 55:34
  that that I've that I've been knew, you know?
• 55:37
  I may not have understood what David Bowie was saying, but I
• 55:42
  was loving. You have to understand.
• 55:43
  You just have to feel it, and you felt.
• 55:45
  It I did feel it. Yeah, so I will not fray from
• 55:49
  the pack and I will give it a 5 as well.
• 55:51
  Yeah, yeah. So honestly off it convinced me
• 55:56
  Well and you not giving it A2 like I thought she was gonna
• 55:59
  get. You thought I would have given
• 56:00
  it A2? I was getting two or three vibes
• 56:03
  from you, not gonna lie. Interesting.
• 56:05
  OK. I'm so excited to play this with
• 56:08
  you as as I feel like you might be.
• 56:11
  You know this this moment has been coming a long time.
• 56:14
  I ready to play our favorite game.
• 56:15
  One costume rule them all. Babe with the power, I'm ready.
• 56:18
  Let's go. All right, hit it, Spencer.
• 56:24
  The one costume to rule them all.
• 56:33
  OK, I'll go first this time. I thought about this for a
• 56:37
  little bit and I ended up going with Jerry's very first costume
• 56:42
  that like almost Dracula, like almost like Peacock Dracula that
• 56:46
  appears you. Love yourself a Dracula look.
• 56:49
  It was, it was the Cape for me. The Cape really, like grabbed me
• 56:52
  right away. Yeah.
• 56:56
  I just, I loved it so much and just it took my breath away when
• 56:59
  he appeared into that bedroom because, you know, I mean,
• 57:03
  Sarah's begging this man to take the crying baby away.
• 57:07
  And he gets there and she kind of wants to be like, no, don't
• 57:10
  take him. But then she sees him and she's
• 57:11
  like, well, but if anyone was going to take him, you know, we
• 57:15
  could see just I. Guess I could chase after you in
• 57:18
  the labyrinth. And I know I have to chase you
• 57:21
  around in the labyrinth for 13 hours, so I just think this
• 57:25
  costume is just so charming. It speaks a lot to the
• 57:29
  character, his royal aspect. But then also, at the end of the
• 57:33
  day, it's David Bowie. I felt like the costume
• 57:36
  designers knew that they had to continue to bring the Rockstar
• 57:39
  quality with all of his costumes.
• 57:41
  Because honestly, Can you imagine going to this movie and
• 57:44
  he was wearing like very pedestrian clothing?
• 57:47
  Everyone would have been like, well, what's happening here?
• 57:49
  If our podcast was around, we would have been like, what is
• 57:53
  this? Why don't we talk?
• 57:56
  Yeah, so love it. That's my one cost rule them
• 57:58
  all. Several honorable mentions, but
• 58:00
  I'll put them in the chat. All right I will go next.
• 58:06
  MY1 costume to rule them all is 1.
• 58:09
  I have seen my entire life and was afraid it would not live up
• 58:13
  to the hype, which is her ball gown.
• 58:18
  Like because even like from Labyrinth, what I knew about
• 58:24
  Labyrinth was that ball gown and David Bowie's hair.
• 58:30
  All I knew about Labyrinth before seeing it, and I was
• 58:35
  like, I, like, all over the Internet, there are so many,
• 58:38
  like, studio pictures of her in that dress where I was like, it
• 58:44
  looks gorgeous. But like, I hope that's not
• 58:46
  just, like, you know, the stage pictures making it look better
• 58:49
  than it actually is. Oh, my gosh.
• 58:52
  So much better. So much better than I was
• 58:55
  expecting. Like, really lived up to what I
• 59:00
  was seeing and then some. So yeah.
• 59:03
  Sarah's fall. Yeah.
• 59:05
  Stunning one Ava, the moment we've all been waiting for.
• 59:08
  What is your one costume to rule them all?
• 59:11
  Well, Spencer, actually, I was going to pick the costume that
• 59:15
  you chose, so I'll have to say that my very close runner up to
• 59:19
  that would be Jareth's final costume.
• 59:24
  I what I really love about that final look is that it reframes
• 59:29
  the character of Jareth. He's not this glittering rock
• 59:34
  star tyrant anymore. He's desperate, diminished,
• 59:38
  pleading, and you really feel for him.
• 59:42
  I just love the diaphanous fabric and how it's blowing in
• 59:45
  the wind and you get to see this vulnerable side of him.
• 59:49
  I feel like the IT reveals the real true nature of Jared
• 59:53
  underneath the spectacle, and all of it amplifies this sense
• 59:59
  of fragile power and emotional unraveling and making his final
• 1:00:05
  confrontation to Sarah with a very intimate and epic finale.
• 1:00:11
  Also, we love a man who yearns, We really do.
• 1:00:13
  Yes, yes. So.
• 1:00:18
  That would happen. We should have you on our Pride
• 1:00:20
  and Prejudice episode or so. Talking about men who years
• 1:00:25
  yearns, Yes, I feel like Mr. Darcy and Dearth would have a
• 1:00:28
  lot to talk about. Oh yeah.
• 1:00:31
  Wow, that is a great connection. But I take pleasure knowing that
• 1:00:34
  you also were gonna pick the Peacock Dracula look too,
• 1:00:37
  because I kind of saw that coming, honestly.
• 1:00:40
  I have a confession to make. In middle school, I dressed up
• 1:00:43
  as Jerath for Halloween, and that was the costume that I
• 1:00:47
  made. Do you?
• 1:00:48
  Have a picture? Brilliant.
• 1:00:50
  You are gonna have to. Share with I wish I did.
• 1:00:52
  I wish I did. I do not, sadly, but you're just
• 1:00:54
  gonna have to imagine it. I can imagine it.
• 1:00:57
  I I bet you even had like the hair going too.
• 1:01:00
  Obviously. The wig obviously was going off.
• 1:01:05
  Yeah, and none of my classmates knew who I was, but my teachers
• 1:01:09
  all knew, and they loved it. Amazing Well, ABBA, it's been
• 1:01:16
  such a joy having you with us. I've been looking forward to
• 1:01:19
  this forever. We actually I was trying to do
• 1:01:21
  this episode the last year and it just didn't work out in terms
• 1:01:24
  of like, you know, our theme mumps that we love.
• 1:01:27
  So I was very much looking forward to this.
• 1:01:30
  We love you. Thank you so much for being here
• 1:01:32
  and being part of our costume nerd cult family.
• 1:01:37
  It's not a not a cult. Never a cult, Spencer.
• 1:01:40
  Never. It's.
• 1:01:41
  Such an honor to be a part of your family cult.
• 1:01:44
  Spencer and Elizabeth. I am a fellow costume nerd and a
• 1:01:48
  die hard Labyrinth fan so I want to sincerely thank you for
• 1:01:52
  bringing me onto the podcast and it was such a pleasure to talk
• 1:01:55
  to the both of you. Yeah.
• 1:01:57
  And where can everyone follow you and see all the great things
• 1:02:00
  that you're always doing? You can follow me on Instagram
• 1:02:05
  and I'm sometimes on Tiktok. My username is Pigment of your
• 1:02:09
  Imagination. All right, and I really
• 1:02:13
  recommend you check out her Instagram and Tiktok because she
• 1:02:15
  does the coolest stuff. I'm just obsessed with your
• 1:02:17
  artistry, your creativity, your designer.
• 1:02:21
  I can't wait till like one day you are this huge costume
• 1:02:24
  designer that we get to interview on this podcast cuz I
• 1:02:27
  couldn't much see that in your future.
• 1:02:29
  It's such a dream come true. Spencer.
• 1:02:31
  Thank you. And I want to invite all of your
• 1:02:34
  fans to come to the Labyrinth Masquerade Ball.
• 1:02:37
  If you're a fan of this film and you're a fan of costume design,
• 1:02:42
  this is really where you can actually step into the world of
• 1:02:44
  the Labyrinth. And people come and they bring
• 1:02:47
  their own designs and their own characters.
• 1:02:49
  And I, myself included, have been going for the last decade
• 1:02:52
  and it's it's the the best party in Los Angeles.
• 1:02:55
  It truly is. It's been going on for nearly 30
• 1:02:57
  years at the historical Biltmore in downtown Los Angeles.
• 1:03:01
  So please come next year and join us.
• 1:03:04
  Yeah, I think it's time. Elizabeth tells me every year,
• 1:03:07
  and Ava, you've told me that's what I'll do.
• 1:03:10
  So next year it has to happen. She said it on the podcast.
• 1:03:13
  Now it has to happen. We're going to manifest it like
• 1:03:16
  we just manifested today. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:20
  And with that, our 80s Adventure Month continues, because our
• 1:03:24
  next episode is one that we've been talking about for a little
• 1:03:28
  bit behind the scenes. And it is.
• 1:03:30
  It is one of the most fun 80s classics.
• 1:03:35
  Raiders of the Lost Ark, the first Indiana Jones film.
• 1:03:40
  Yeah, which I'm very excited about.
• 1:03:42
  And I will admit, I don't know that I've seen this Indiana
• 1:03:46
  Jones. Really.
• 1:03:47
  I know I I've seen Temple of Doom 2,000,000 times.
• 1:03:51
  Huh. I've must have saw Raiders of
• 1:03:54
  the Lost Ark, but I don't remember as much.
• 1:03:56
  So I'm very excited to. I know I've seen the second one.
• 1:04:00
  I saw the one of Cate Blanchett, but you know, whatever.
• 1:04:04
  We don't need to talk about that.
• 1:04:05
  One, yeah, I'm very excited. In the meantime, if you also
• 1:04:10
  want to tell us what your favorite costumes were from the
• 1:04:12
  Labyrinth, e-mail us at theartofcostume@gmail.com.
• 1:04:17
  Follow us on Instagram at the Art of Costume Pod.
• 1:04:20
  So as our TikTok will, you'll probably be seeing clips from
• 1:04:22
  this episode at the Art of Costume as well.
• 1:04:27
  And please leave us a five star text review on Apple Podcast or
• 1:04:30
  rate US on Spotify because it really does help.
• 1:04:33
  Or we'll send a Goblin King to your house to kidnap your
• 1:04:37
  children and hopefully feed them to the goblins.
• 1:04:41
  I don't think they were eating the baby.
• 1:04:43
  They were trying to turn the baby into one of them.
• 1:04:45
  Well, all. Right.
• 1:04:47
  Sure, that's what they want you to think.
• 1:04:49
  All of those little mini goblins are going to be snacks for Jerez
• 1:04:53
  anyway one day. True, that's.
• 1:04:55
  What I'm? Saying again.
• 1:05:00
  Thank you everyone for listening, thank you Ava Yusefi
• 1:05:02
  for being here and we hope you all have a good.
• 1:05:04
  Week, guys. See you everybody.
• 1:05:30
  Music.