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42: Failure is Feedback w/ Dan Martell · Harder Than Life

• 0:00
  I'm Kelly Siegel and this is Harder Than Life, a podcast about self-love, self-awareness, business and health. We tell outrageous stories and boil everything down to simple, practical advice you can start using today. Let's get living.
• 0:15
  I say this often because there are only so many Harder Than Life episodes spots available, but there are no coincidence, and I'm certain God put you, Dan, on my social media feed for a reason. Today's guest story is even more bananas than mine. I seriously believe...
• 0:32
  I'm staring at my brother. Dan Martell's story of resilience is second to none from being in a high speed chase by the cops at age 15, a failed attempt at police assisted suicide to now being a serial entrepreneur,
• 0:47
  husband, athlete, and all-around badass. His, quote-unquote, pass-the-torch attitude is precisely, as I say with the if I can do it, anyone can. This author and investor now focuses on Software as a Service Academy helping CEOs buy back their time. Dan Martell, where have you been all my life? And welcome to the Heart of the Life podcast.
• 1:10
  Well, thanks for having me, Kelly. It's crazy. Even as you read it, I'm just, you know, I'm brought back and just incredibly grateful for the life I get to live today. It's definitely a different one than the one I grew up in.
• 1:24
  I resonate with so much of your material. I was trying to say nothing before we got on. I meant what I said in the intro. I don't know how I found you. You sent me all these things. I said, come on the podcast. I love your content. You sent me all these things you need me to do. I don't think we did it. And then all of a sudden you just booked. And I'm like, there's a reason here. And all of a sudden I'm doing the show prep.
• 1:45
  Wow, we are aligned and I cannot wait to dig into this. What is your story? Why does your story matter? Because if I didn't, I just learned about you. If I don't know about you, my audience doesn't. So let's introduce the Heart of the Life audience to Dan Martel.
• 2:01
  Yeah, I mean, today people know me as the, you know, I've won entrepreneurial awards. So I was named top entrepreneur in Canada. That's where I grew up, it's where I'm from. You know, I've invested in 60 plus companies as an angel investor in the tech space. I run a hundred million dollar, essentially holding company where we buy software companies. I run the largest CEO coaching group for software CEOs. Like my whole life I've been the software guy, built and exited three software companies myself.
• 2:31
  Um, but where I started, you know, and I think this is where we connect on that level. It's like, I, I grew up in a really challenging spot. My mom was an alcoholic. I'm the second oldest of four. My dad wasn't around very much. He was in sales and ended up getting addicted to drugs when I was 13. I started hanging out with guys twice my age, learning stuff I should never been learning and got to a place where I ended up in a juvenile detention twice. Um,
• 2:57
  And the second time I was so adamant that I didn't want to go back that I had stolen a car and I had a handgun sitting next to me. And I told myself if the police stopped me, I was going to point the gun and have them take my life. And I ended up on a routine roadblock, just took an exit off a highway and the police were checking driver's license and insurance. And I pulled over and when they asked me for my stuff, I just took off and I.
• 3:22
  I got into this crazy high speed chase going way. I mean, the fact that I didn't crash sooner, but I ended up in this neighborhood and I saw an open garage door and I thought maybe I could hide out, close the door and run out the back. Maybe I've watched too many cop movies, but I ended up coming into that driveway with so much speed. It wasn't even wearing my seatbelt and I smashed into the side of the house and I could hear the police getting closer and I went for the gun.
• 3:50
  And for whatever reason, it got stuck and I kept pulling on it, pulling on it. And the cops grabbed me, threw me in the back of the cop car and
• 4:00
  That was the beginning of a complete transformation. I ended up in an adult prison for six months. And it was a guard named Brian that that literally changed my life. I got I got in a fight and got put in the hole for three days. And on the third day, Brian opened the door and told me to follow him and
• 4:22
  When we were walking back to the unit, we actually went past the guard unit or past the cell block into the guard unit, which I'd never been in. And he sits me down and he says to me, he goes, what are you doing here? And I go, what do you mean? I mean, I got in a fight with Kirk and he goes, no, not that. He goes, what are you doing in this place? And I was like, well, I got in a high speed chase and guns and he goes, no.
• 4:47
  He goes, Dan, I've been working here for almost 10 years, and I've seen a lot of kids come through. And I got to tell you, you don't belong here. And in that moment, Kelly, there was just like this belief that he had in me that I definitely didn't have in myself. I thought I was less than nothing. I thought I was a piece of crap. I thought I had zero self-worth. I mean, my whole life, I was just getting in trouble. And here was this guy telling me that, like, he thought I was better. He's like, I watch you do your...
• 5:14
  you know, try to do your classwork and stay out of the prison politics and just like stick to yourself. And he goes, I just don't understand why somebody like you is in this place. And that that seed got planted in.
• 5:27
  I was fortunate enough about a month later, I got released to a rehab center that literally saved my life. I did 11 months in a therapeutic community, and it was there that I kind of built my personal value, like my self-worth. I understood my emotions. It was just a really beautiful place. And yeah.
• 5:47
  helped me rebuild the relationship I'd lost with my family, my brothers, my sisters, my parents. And it was at the end of that program, I was helping Rick, this maintenance guy, clean out one of the cabins because it was built on an old church camp. And I discovered this old computer and a yellow book on Java programming sitting next to it.
• 6:07
  and just followed the book. And so it's so crazy now, cause like this is my world, but I just, I followed chapter one and in about 20 minutes I got the computer to say hello world.
• 6:18
  And I got hooked, like software became my new addiction. And honestly, entrepreneurship became the personal development program that I needed in my life. And that's just what I've been doing my whole life. And the biggest thing I'm most proud of, the business success, cool, you know, the private planes and the supercars are all fun. But, you know, I still, to this day, I was just there four weeks ago talking to these kids and I've been doing it for 20 some years, 26 years now.
• 6:45
  just sharing my story and I always make a commitment to them. And I can't make this to everybody, but to the kids that go to this special place, if they get out, stay sober for a year and reach out to me, I'll help them make their dreams come true. And that's, that's what I'm here to do. And then, yeah, my whole life on the internet to try to help people that are on their journey. And that's who I am. Well, that's what I was talking about in the intro, the police assisted suicide. That's by pulling that gun and then expecting them to shoot you, man. That's I'm so glad it didn't happen. And I'm so glad that it got stuck.
• 7:15
  So much to unpack there. You were 15 when this happened. What's the driving age in Canada? I thought it was 16 as well. Oh, yeah. I didn't have a driver's license. Oh, so you didn't have a license either. What was your drug of choice? Yeah.
• 7:30
  I did everything. I always joke that my drug of choice was not feeling. So if you told me you had a handful of pills, I wouldn't even ask you what they are. And I'd probably swallow them. But I did everything from, you know, a lot of marijuana to drinking obsessive amounts to cocaine to acid.
• 7:50
  mushrooms. I mean, Kelly, when I tell you, I like, I literally just didn't want to feel, I would just wake up every day and the mission was get fucked up. And that's just what I did for a long time. You know,
• 8:07
  You know, we matter. I told you I was going to get choked up. I knew it. So much of that resonates with me. It's, you know, I was, my parents were alcoholics and never around. And when they were around, they would beat on me. And it's, that's why I'm a big guy. And it's the people that go through hella adversity that come out and do really great things. So I'm really glad that I met you. And we're going to do a lot of work together. And
• 8:31
  So during the show prep, I was shivering and it's just still now, you know, I've already happened. We're freaking eight minutes into this thing. So much to unpack. Let's start with what changed my life since it seems to be a major part of yours, alcohol. You quit drinking 10 years ago when your wife told you she was pregnant. Why? Why?
• 8:53
  Well, I should never start drinking again. I mean, I was sober, sober for three years, four years after rehab, you know, and I just thought, you know, I haven't done drugs since then, but I just thought maybe, you know,
• 9:06
  I could be a casual drinker, but I just, I never was. Like I would drink, I would quit, I would drink, I would quit and nothing ever good came out of drinking. I mean like zero, I mean never, like when I look back, it's like, yeah, that was maybe funner, but it like nothing positive came from it. And I was just, when I would drink, I just wouldn't be a good person, right? I wouldn't get violent, but I would just be rude. I would be short, I'd wanna,
• 9:33
  you know, go see what, like, I just didn't want to be with the people I was with. And I just knew that if I didn't quit that over the next 25 years, this is the math I did. And what happened was we were on a baby moon in the Bahamas. And, you know, I went to the liquor store when I came back, she goes, are you throwing a party? Cause I looked down and there was like, you know, hundreds of dollars worth of alcohol. She's like, why do you have all this? And I'm like, well, we're here for a week. Um,
• 10:01
  And the first night I got drunk and we got in a fight and I was just like, this is so stupid. And I, and I just said, I'm done. I'm done. You know what? I'm not drinking anymore. I'm never going to drink again. I made the decision and I poured everything down the drain. And I remember her response. She just looked at me and said like, sure. And cause I mean, it wasn't the first time I'd said that, but I don't know. There was just something in that moment where I just, I,
• 10:31
  I made the decision. I don't drink. I'm not a drinker. I will never drink again. If I drink, it will, it will take my family from me. I, I, I created that identity. I locked those two things together. Um, and I've never drank. It's, it's actually 11 years, uh, this past May and, um,
• 10:52
  You know, the, the, the simple thinking behind it is over the next 25 years, if I have alcohol in my life, there's a good chance that I'll do something to create pain in my family. I mean, it's just my, my parent, my mom was an alcoholic. Her parents were alcoholics. My dad's parents were alcoholics. Like there's a, like, what more of a sign do I need to know? I knew better. I went to rehab for freak's sake. So I just decided enough was enough. And yeah.
• 11:18
  And just haven't turned back. And I would say my wife probably took her like three years of me literally. It was almost like she was waiting for the shoe to drop. She's like, you know, you're going to your brother's bachelor party. You're not going to drink. Or you're going to this big event. You're not going to drink. And I'm just like, babes, I don't drink. It's like, I don't think about it. I don't do it. I mean, I spent a week with Richard Branson and everybody there drank. And I just got really good at drinking.
• 11:44
  making it look like I was drinking. So I'd like talk to the waitress or I would do different things, but yeah, man, it's just, um, it's funny. Cause like, I've probably inspired hundreds of people at this point to just quit drinking because it does just, just, it doesn't make sense. Like, why would you drink poison? I mean, let's just talk about the, the real biological reaction to our bodies. You know, I think I don't do it, but I mean, if people want to smoke weed, they can, I think that's a way better approach to, uh,
• 12:14
  you know, to whatever they're trying to deal with. But I'm just, I'm all about living life. I want to feel, I want to feel the good. I want to feel the bad. I want to, I don't want a blocker, right? Man, I love you. I feel everything you're saying.
• 12:30
  I have questions, but I'm still trying to get composed. I tell people I quit cold turkey as well. Same thing. I just was doing a self-assessment every time something bad happened in my life. There was alcohol involved. And I just said, this is not working for me. And I walked away cold turkey. I didn't go to rehab. I didn't do anything. Just set it down. We're coming up on five years now.
• 12:54
  And since I've done that, I'm a better father, a better businessman, launched a podcast, wrote a book on it. There's just the low, the highs are so much higher and the lows are so much higher. And I tell people, well, they say, well, I don't have a problem. I didn't have a problem either. I just...
• 13:16
  I had a big tolerance, but every single time there was a correlation there. And then I say to them, well, let's talk about the contrast. How long have you not drank? And then let's compare it to how long you have drank. And I drank for a long time, 30 years. And then I've been quit for five. So it's, I can, I was a great partier, like something you were too. And I was, I'm even better at being sober.
• 13:42
  And I don't even know if I call it sober because I don't work a program. I just choose not to drink. Now, to get from that point, and this is where I'm going to ask, I'm getting to a question. To get to that point where I chose not to drink to get to the point where I don't even think about drinking, I passed through hell. So to start, to get from a good place to a better place, you got to go to a worse place. I went through hell. And you know where that hell led me to is...
• 14:05
  than beating that I took from my mother that was hammered when I was nine years old on my ninth birthday. And I just recently processed that. And when I let that thing loose, an EMDR therapy, life got real, real good. So talk to me about some of the modalities. Because if you grew up doing what you were doing and thinking, well, one of the things you said, you don't matter.
• 14:30
  That is learned behavior that has to be unlearned. So talk about how you unlearned that and what, for me, I say it took violence. Violence to be on. So tell us, the listeners, what you did. Yeah, I mean, I think it was, there was no clear thing. When I look at how I went from drug addict, depressed,
• 14:56
  no self-worth to today where I feel like I'm living this blessed life and I'm full of gratitude and that I am truly a child of God and an expression of possibility. It was a bunch of stuff, but you're right. It was like three steps back, two steps, three steps forward, two steps back.
• 15:19
  And, um, the things that supported me was studying other great people's lives. You know, that's why I'm a big avid reader. I've read over 2000 books in my life at this point. I, I just feel it's such a beautiful trade, right? For 20 bucks, you can, you know, six hours of your time, you can, you can really get to know somebody and understand their, their success principles. Um, yeah.
• 15:42
  I did a lot of therapy. I've always had unlimited budgets for two things. One, my fitness and my health. Not always on the health side. That's kind of a newer thing. But the other one for sure I've always had, which is an unlimited budget on education. I'm feeding my mind. And I got that from my dad. When I got out of rehab, my dad made a commitment to me. He said, if I buy you a book on computer programming, as long as you finish it, I will buy you the next book. And he gave me an unlimited budget
• 16:11
  on my personal education. And this is all self-taught. And I've just continued that with myself and with my kids and people I, I care about. It's just, it's just,
• 16:21
  Over the years, I think those books led me to then seminars, right? And going to personal development programs. I started my first one was Millionaire Mindset with T. Harv Eker. And what was cool about that was my brother ended up buying his high-level program. My brother's two years younger than me. And I was 26 maybe at the time, 27. So he would have spent tens of thousands of dollars as a 25-year-old starting entrepreneur. Yeah.
• 16:49
  And, you know, we ended up spending the next three years together doing all of his programs. It was called Quantum. And it was like we travel around. There was like Warrior. There was marketing, guerrilla marketing. There was all these different events. And everyone had different people teaching different things. So, I mean, I've done Tony Robbins, you name it. I mean, I've invested a lot in myself. And then personal coaching. Like, again, I just have an unlimited budget in investing myself.
• 17:18
  Um, so a lot of these coaches use different modalities. Like, uh, I think it's internal family systems, IFS, um, you know, uh, energy work. I've done, I've done a lot of energy work, spiritual work, um, uh, forgiveness stuff, retreats, um, a lot of meditation. I just, to me, it's, it's just all one thing, right? It's, it's, there's.
• 17:45
  There's trauma that needs to be identified. And that's why I love having kids, is kids act as a mirror for you as a parent to be a better person because they will show up as you show up, right? And so like, even on that one, I just, I learned a long time ago, like my goal in life is very simple, is I wanna become the person I needed most in my darkest days. So every day I asked myself, who would I have listened to?
• 18:15
  And I try to
• 18:19
  to just show up as that person. And that's why I do a lot of work with at-risk youth today because I've got that feedback loop all the time when I show up. It's funny because I used to show up in my, I had an SUV and I did have a supercar but I never wanted anybody to know. And then the day I show up in the McLaren, all of a sudden the kids lean in. Oh, it's kind of like, whether you like it or not, you gotta meet people where they're at.
• 18:48
  And it's kind of funny because like I didn't listen to the adults back when I was a teenager because I thought they were full of shit. I'm like, you've not been where I've been. You're trying to tell me how to get out of this hole, but you you haven't been stuck in this hole. So like, I appreciate you want to help me, but I just don't trust what you're saying, because how could you know?
• 19:07
  And when I show up, and even because I wasn't willing to show my success, I wasn't meeting them at the level. So just even that idea of becoming the person that you needed most when you're struggling the most
• 19:21
  is just such a great North Star. Cause like literally every day I go like, would I listen to me? And this is funny cause even on like the fitness stuff, cause I love watching your reels. You know, I think most people don't even listen to themselves. You know, you have parents. I get calls all the time from parents going like, can you talk to my kid?
• 19:38
  And I go, I don't think I need to talk to your kid. I need to talk to you. Like, you're like, why don't they listen to me? It's like, you don't listen to you. I can tell by the, look at the way you look or look at the way you're talking or look at the language you're using. And to me, that's what...
• 19:53
  That was the process of becoming what I call the 10.0 version of myself. Not becoming, but at least striving to become that person. Is every day waking up and knowing there's some aspect of my psychology, of my physicality, about my energy levels that I could get better at. And I'm on a journey to improve. And while I do that, and this is the big difference, I think, between you and I and most people out there that don't do this.
• 20:20
  Share that with the world. Give yourself to everybody else. Like, be misunderstood. Like, when I started sharing stuff on the internet, people were like, what are you doing? But I knew that I was speaking to the 15, 16, 17-year-old version of me that I may never have the privilege of meeting in person, but I definitely have the opportunity to support and influence. Yeah.
• 20:45
  Who are you? It's like in my head. I say to myself, I wish that this person, this 47-year-old vessel, would go back in time and put his arm around 17-year-old Kelly and go, dude, if you just do this, this, and this, you will skip to the front of the line and you will not have the headaches that you're about to do. And I just, you know, we didn't, it sounds like both of us are the same.
• 21:16
  Or even any mentor. And at that point, I had such a chip on my shoulder. I just couldn't. I wouldn't have listened to anybody. You wouldn't have listened. There might have been, though. There could have been. Maybe, Kel. I mean, this is an interesting concept. This is why I love the question is who would you have listened to, right? Like maybe somebody? I don't know. I'm still trying to figure out. I don't know if I would have been as open to.
• 21:40
  I definitely know that the people that were sharing at the time, it took, it was very few people. It wasn't until I got into rehab and I met like, you know, Herc who is like an Italian from Montreal who worked in the Hells Angels and like, you know, spent 20 years in prison for trafficking heroin. When he told me to smarten up, I listened because he'd been worse than where I was at.
• 22:01
  But yeah, the most adults, definitely not my parents. And I love my parents. They just didn't know. I mean, my dad's never read a book on personal development in his life, even to this day. Because it was just not a thing they did, even though it might have been around. It's just fascinating to ask yourself, anybody listening, just like, who would you have listened to? And if it's like very rare, that's the rare person you should become.
• 22:29
  I love it. So I have so many questions here. Did you still talk to Brian, the guard? I haven't talked to him in a while, but I did reach out to him. It took a while. As you can imagine, it's not easy to get to a correctional officer as a previous inmate. But luckily, one of my caseworkers, it took like four years for me to finally. But this is what was funny when I when I finally met up with him. He didn't really remember the conversation. And I'll tell you why, Kelly.
• 22:58
  is I think Brian had that conversation with quite a few kids. But there's a lesson there, Dan, and it's you never know who you'll have the effect on, so keep talking. Well, this is why I literally just punched me in the heart a little bit when I said that because, yeah, I think we all have the power
• 23:21
  to believe in somebody else. And it could be as little as recognizing a waitress at a restaurant to a dad in line at the airport to a business partner or just somebody in the street that you're just walking by. When they do things, if it's on your heart, I just think a lot of times we don't share it, right? We see it, we think it, but we never say it.
• 23:44
  And Brian, his personality was like, I'm just going to speak to these kids as the potential I see inside of them, what I call the Jesus inside of them. He spoke to who they could be, not who they were for the reasons they were there. And I just think that...
• 24:03
  That's just, it was actually kind of cool that he was like, I don't know what you're talking. Like he kind of downplayed it. I was like, no, Brian, like you, you, you told me this and it, and it made me go down a completely different path because I, I, you believed in me.
• 24:19
  And he's like, well, I just, I believe in a lot of the kids, Dan, and you were definitely one of them. And I was just like, that's cool. I don't know. So I've used that in my life for my, like, it's one of my favorite things. Every night, not every night, but often when I put my kids to bed, I literally ask them if it's okay if I tell them about them. Like, if I grab my son, I'd say, can I tell you about you? And Noah would be like, oh, man. And I'd be like, no, let me tell you about you. Let me tell you about you.
• 24:45
  you know, how brave you are for like going to camp with kids twice your age or, you know, for just how creative you are. And I just think it's such a cool idea that if we go through the world to tell people about themselves, the person we see.
• 25:02
  that costs nothing and could have the biggest impact out of everything. It might be bigger than anything I ever do in business. Actually, I know it will be. If every day I wake up and I just make a commitment that when I see something, when something speaks to my heart, and I see somebody do something remarkable, that I tell them about it, it bugs my wife sometimes. Sometimes I'm like, oh, that dad's a great dad. I'm going to go tell him. Renee's like, can you just leave it alone? I'm like, no, look at it. He's got six kids. Mom's not there. He's going through the thing. Like...
• 25:31
  That's impressive. And look, he's not upset and they're all freaking out. I'm like, I'm going to go tell him that he's doing an awesome job. I just think that could be the best thing I've ever done in my life.
• 25:41
  You know, I'm working on recently receiving that. You could tell me that I'm great. And even all the work I've been through, and I still have struggled receiving it. So you'll hear me say I received that. So it sinks in. You know, the years and years and years of abuse, man. It just, it takes a while. It takes a long time to. Yeah, it's hard. It's hard to believe. You said you had son Noah. How old is Noah? Noah.
• 26:06
  I got a 10 and 11 year old. They're 11 months apart. So they were the same age about three weeks ago. What's what's the other one's name? Noah, then Max, mighty max, max and Noah and 10 and 11. That's interesting. About to get real interesting. I have a 14 year old daughter and you said everything you've said, it's just, it's given me the willies. Um,
• 26:30
  So the only person in the world that can really trigger me is my daughter, but you seem to be doing a really good job of it today. My daughter can trigger me. It's when she does things that I would have literally killed anybody to be able to do, like go to camp. You said camp. She went to camp this summer for 48 days. And I didn't want her gone for 48 days, but she goes there and becomes a better kid, better girl, better leader. So being able to send her to camp,
• 26:58
  just makes me feel good. I worked real hard in the tech business. Tech has paid well. So, you know, you said that fitness and health and education, you have an unlimited budget for. Obviously, I do. I work out.
• 27:13
  I'll pay any kind of money to work at any gym. I just got back from LA and I went to Gold's Gym on the beach. I think it was $50 or $100. I didn't care. It didn't matter. But remember back in the day, I had an unlimited budget for booze and having fun. So I bought a house in Florida on the water with a pool, with a boat, with half of my drinking money.
• 27:45
  So yeah, it was out of control. So the things that you say are really, really resonating with me. And then the reading. I read a book a week too. And I don't know how. And I have a question about your book here and a couple. We're going to pivot a little bit, talk about you started a tech company at 24 years old. So did I.
• 28:03
  I was just going to say what motivated that and why, but you kind of said a little earlier, you got that Java book. Is that literally what motivated you? Yeah. I mean, I started writing apps at 17. After I got out of rehab, I taught myself how to code. And then I just started building stuff. And then I got the internet. I mean, this is 97. 97.
• 28:27
  And I started building web apps. I built a vacation rental site for my dad and a bunch of friends of his that had cottages. I built a site for all my friends to upload their photos from their digital cameras. You know, kind of like- You were interested in it.
• 28:42
  I was just building stuff. Yeah, I built a CD burning app. I mean, this is, you know, back in the day when, you know, you could put 200 songs on a CD and there was an app store. Like, I didn't want people on my laptop or on my computer. So I built an app where they could, like, you know, go through all the songs and create a playlist and then burn it. And I charged them 20 bucks a CD. So it's like I just built tools for myself. Kind of like if I was a woodworker building furniture for my home.
• 29:08
  And, you know, then I tried a couple of companies and I didn't understand the business side of it. I just, you know, I thought if you build it, they will show up, which unfortunately is not the case.
• 29:17
  And it wasn't until I was 24 that I finally hired a mentor or coach, this guy named Bob. He was an E-Myth certified coach. As I read the book, The E-Myth, and I said, well, that's the thing I'm missing. And Bob taught me the business side. And I went from two failed startup companies to doing almost a million in my first year. I mean, it was dramatic. I always had...
• 29:40
  the drive right i'm an intense guy you know and i feel like where's that from though hold on i have the same thing where is that serve i always tell people i think it's from survival as a in my childhood is it what's yours i have that too i that's why i can't coach or i don't coach because i cannot teach people that maniacal drive that i have to wake up and the moment my feet hit the
• 30:06
  Go. Yeah, I think for me, it might have been my ADHD. Like I had severe ADHD, like hyperactive, like couldn't sit still. They put me on Ritalin when I was nine, like massive dose, like 30, 40 milligrams a day. And that calmed me down, which is weird because Ritalin is a kind of like speed. But I think there's that. And then there was initially it was the what I call dark energy. Like I would I would build.
• 30:33
  stuff to prove people wrong. Like when I started, it was like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna be successful. Cause like literally growing up, my friends were not allowed to play with me. Like anytime we spent time hanging out was in the woods behind the house, down the ravine, you know, building tree forts where the parents couldn't see us. And then they'd have to lie because I was the bad kid in the neighborhood. And
• 30:56
  So I think once I got sober, I just wanted to prove everybody wrong. I never was going to be academically successful. I hated school, but I knew that technology and the internet, that there was a chance I could do something there. And what was funny, and this is crazy, Kelly, even after I sold my first company at 28 and became a multimillionaire,
• 31:22
  the parents still thought I was a drug dealer. Like they, I remember going to my buddy's house and I hadn't seen his parents since I was 16. And he goes, he goes away. His mom talks to him. He comes back. He goes, I'm sorry.
• 31:35
  My mom really doesn't want me hanging with you. And I go, why? Like I'm 28, this is 12 years ago. Like what's going on? And he goes, I don't know, man. I think she read about you. She just thinks she's selling drugs still. And I'm like, you know what? It's cool. Like I understand that they have their own story, their narrative.
• 31:54
  It is what it is. You know, and if you can't be my friend because your mom tells you you can't be at his 20 year old, that's your thing. That's not my thing. But I just, yeah, I just went on this. I got this drive back then to prove people wrong, prove my dad wrong, you know, prove everybody that ever doubted me. But then that actually started eating me up inside because it's a dark energy. It's like diesel fuel, right? It's got a lot of torque. It can get things going. Right.
• 32:21
  but it doesn't burn clean. It's not like, you know, electric energy or kind of like a cleaner burning fuel. And because of that, it can only get you so far. So what I've done, and there's moments where like you talked about violence, like dude, there are moments where violence is the answer. Like, shut up.
• 32:40
  attack, right? Like I always say, run to the problem. You know, like, what are you doing? If you're, if you're, if you have an issue and you told me you woke up at 8am and you didn't wake up at three to attack the problem, you don't understand what I'm talking about. However,
• 32:54
  I've learned in my gray hair, at least, my old age, that the light energy is more of a pole, right? And it just, it burns cleaner. It's more expansive. It's more about opportunity and creation. It's not about scarcity, which I think the dark energy that I was using for a long time, it's heavier, that dark energy. This is lighter, right? I've been able to shift and understand almost like different tools in the tool chest
• 33:24
  when they're appropriate, right? And I probably spend 80, 90, 85% of my time in this kind of more future focused, inspirational, aspirational kind of mindset. But when it's required, I definitely know how to turn on the gears to attack problems and get it done and rally the troops. So I don't know where it comes from. I think it was initially...
• 33:49
  to run away from something. And then now it's to run towards something. And I've just gotten addicted to personal expansion. Like that, like my new addiction is just, and it's been for a long time, like 15 years, I've been consciously aware of it, that I am here to expand. And,
• 34:09
  that is, I, and I truly believe every human is here on earth to do that. I think it's why we're born into this, this cool world is to kind of work through these issues to become better. So you have more to give other people. I mean, it's the, the universal law of reciprocity. It's like, give, give more. Most, most people that want to be successful, Kelly, and you know, this, they don't give a lot. Like, isn't it funny? It's like,
• 34:35
  They're like, well, how do I have more health? Well, go give health. It's such an interesting equation. If you want more of something, help other people get it.
• 34:45
  So people are like, what do you mean? I go, what do you want in life? They're like, well, I want more money. It's like, cool, help me make more money. And if you help me make more money, you will have more money. Well, I don't know how to do that. I know, because you don't have anything to give. You haven't become valuable to the world you live in, to your community. So same thing with fitness. It's like, it's so funny if somebody was overweight and they go, how do I get healthy? I go, go help your friends get healthy.
• 35:11
  How's that going to help me get healthy? Well, because you're human and right off the bat, when the words come out of your mouth to try to convince your body to get off the couch and go for a walk, you're going to probably think to yourself, maybe I should do that first, right? And it's just this beautiful energetic reciprocity that happens when people think that way. So that's why I'm addicted to it is I want to help a lot of people. And I know that by doing that, it makes me a better person, which gives me more capacity and more to give. And it's the way the world's designed.
• 35:40
  I know it's no surprise that I call myself a learn-it-all, and I'm addicted to the expansion of my being as well. So I'm telling you, my Canadian brother. Hey, by the way, the 28-year-old friend of yours that's still living with his mama can't say shit to you.
• 35:55
  taking yeah using her you're still living but he's still living in his mom's house what come on now you at least bought and sold a company so i just like messing with people you can't take advice from somebody that's not doing better than you in that field so it's like you and i taking health advice or tech advice from a non-techie i always giggle about that so um speaking of which uh
• 36:21
  What's this stuff about you not knowing how to swim, but yet you completed five Ironmans in three years. I've never done anything like that. Talk to me. Well, yeah, I mean, it's funny because I remember I was hanging out with my buddy Nick and we were doing like a vision board exercise. And like, you know, I was 20, 30 pounds heavier than I am today, like not in shape, wasn't even running. And, you know, we're business friends and he puts his vision board together and on there is like Kona, like an Ironman.
• 36:51
  And like, I'm all for thinking big, right? But I remember literally thinking, hey, Nick, you should probably set your sights a little bit more realistic. Like the guy was, the guy had never ran 5K, let alone he had, I don't know where it came. I go, where did that come from? You want to be an Ironman? He's like, yeah, man, wouldn't it be cool to, and I was like, not really. Like there was no part of me that wanted, I'm 6'3", 220 pounds. Like I don't look like that, right? And yeah.
• 37:19
  It was a few years later, we started doing these like smaller runs to kind of hang out and talk. And one day where he convinced me to get a bike. Now I'll be honest. I used to judge the road bikers. Like, you know, those people on Saturday morning when you're going to the market and they're out there on the road in their spandex and they're like, you know, getting their biking on. I used to judge them. I'm like, I would never wear that. And good for that. Right. I used to think they were like bankers or, you know, finance people. I don't know that I had all these judgments. Yeah.
• 37:48
  Um, and you know, we, we, he convinced me to get a bike and the first bike we ever do. Um, I didn't even wear like normal biking. So I was wearing like board shorts or something. And we go for this, uh, 20 K bike. And when we got back, we had a running shoes. He goes, you know, we should go for a 5k run. And I go, cool. You know, I've got the fitness. It wasn't a very big bike. And we went for a run. And while we're on the run, my buddy, Jared goes, Hey, if we would have done a swim at the beginning of this, that would have been a sprint triathlon.
• 38:18
  and it was so weird. Cause like, I think sometimes people just dismiss things that they don't, they've never done before, but like when you're kind of doing it or you get pulled into it and you didn't think about it, it's like hiking a mountain. It's like, well, I could never do Everest, but what if you got invited to do a mountain climb? And somebody said, well, that's a third of Everest. You'd be like, Oh, three more of those than I could probably do Everest. Like it's, it plants the seed. And that's what happened was he, I was like, geez, if we would only, it was only 600 meter swim. It wasn't even that much.
• 38:47
  And that turned into, hey, let's register for this sprint triathlon in a month. And we went to the pool. And I never swam. Like, I jump off cliffs and kind of doggy paddle back to the shore kind of. It wasn't I couldn't swim to save my life. But I couldn't swim. I could just tread water. And I remember the first time these pools are, I think, 25 meters in length. And I go to the other side. And I'm like out of breath. And I'm like holding on to the edge. It's the deep end.
• 39:17
  And I scream across the pool to my friend. I go, how many of these do we gotta do for the race? And he's like, 16. I go, dude, 16 of these without touching the ground? Like, I'm gonna die.
• 39:30
  You know, we did what I do in business. We hired a swim coach and literally brought this guy in and he looked at us. He had his goggles under the water. It's like we're dragging our bodies like he gives us pool buoys and all this stuff. And, you know, over a four week period, I watch a YouTube video as I work with the coach. We go to the pool. I hated it. I still hate it. I don't like swimming. And but it got me down the path of triathlons and it went from a.
• 39:58
  from the initial sprint to a half Ironman. And then we did that the second year. And then a half Ironman turned into a full Ironman. COVID happened. We still ran it ourselves. We paid a guy to come set up the race. There was five of us. Like we didn't let COVID stop us. And then that turned into, to doing the full Ironman in Trombleau in Montreal.
• 40:20
  Um, and, and a few halves along the way to now, like even on the swimming side, I did one of the longest swims, uh, on the lake I live on six and a half kilometers, about five miles, um, as a training workout. Like I don't, I still don't enjoy swimming. Yeah.
• 40:36
  but I can do it. And it just showed me that even later in life, you know, I think a lot of people, I've heard this once that when you turn 40, a lot of your music preferences and your food preferences are kind of locked and loaded. So it's actually really wise for us to allow other people to make decisions for us or recommend things. Because if not, you'll just wake up at 70 and just live the exact same life. And I think the same thing for...
• 40:59
  you know, saying yes to new experiences. Like I don't play a musical instrument, but I would. Cause, and I know I could probably get good enough cause I went from can't swimming to finishing a full distance Ironman. So, you know, we're doing a five mile swim across the lake. So that was, that to me really opened up my eyes
• 41:17
  to the speed you can learn things, especially as somebody who's a learner, right? Like Kelly, you could probably, because you've built this capacity for taking information and metabolizing it and figuring out what the signal versus noise is, where most people might take three or four years to become great at something, you can do it in half the time because you just know how to win. You know how to learn, you know how to execute. And that was a big lesson for me. And how to win is to fail a lot.
• 41:47
  You just made it. Just get out there and do it. You just made it your own point that if you want something, help somebody else do it, your buddy wanted to do this triathlon and the Ironmans, and then you did it. So you made your own point. But, yeah, I always think that failure is feedback. And then we jump, you know, I have – what did I have on there? Jen Cohen said to me once. She said –
• 42:10
  I have a master's degree in falling down and a PhD in getting back up. And then I add to it. So if you knock me down, you had better not be standing there when I get back up, but good luck trying to knock me down because I've been through wars. You know, my whole life was survival. So I always tell people it's tough for me to feel comfortable, be comfortable, being comfortable, uncomfortable. I'm used to my whole life growing up was that all the way up until I quit drinking chaos. Now, I,
• 42:40
  Things get normal. I'm like, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, what's this? That was my biggest issue. I was going to ask you how tall you are because, you know, I'm 5'9 and 2. I vacillate between 215 and 220. When I get 220, I look huge because I'm short. But you look great and keep doing what you're doing.
• 43:01
  I want to do everything you said, but except that. It's like, no. And if we're going to hang out, I know you're going to get me to do something nuts. Cause I saw your, your retreat at your house and we're just going to be friends, man. You're just a good person, a good, you're doing well. And, and you're, you're making a dent in the world. And that's what I want to do. And,
• 43:20
  I forget myself too that I've only been doing this. I launched the Heart of Life brand January 31st this year. So February 1st. We're coming up on September 1st. So two from nine, seven months. Seven months I've been doing this. And I'm like, why am I further along? I was like, dude, give yourself a little bit of grace. It's the dedicating to a decade for me, right? I think anything we do.
• 43:44
  you got to ask yourself, like, are you willing to dedicate a decade to it? And if so, then just, you know, everything at first is always slow. And then there's a point, maybe year two, three, five, it doesn't really matter where it just boom. Like I did my YouTube channel for eight years. I publish every week. I have never missed the week. And it took me eight years to get 100,000 subs. And there were several times along that journey where I was like, why am I doing this? I've got companies to run. I'm busy. I don't want to shoot.
• 44:13
  And I just keep remembering those kids watching. I keep remembering the 17-year-old version of me that, you know, like I'm looking for that. And that's why I showed up. And then now it's like as soon as you hit 100, it's like boom, boom, boom. So like I gave myself a decade. I still got two years. But literally the next two years, like that goes to 300 to half a million just because of the momentum. It just took a while.
• 44:37
  It's going to get really cool in the next, and it may have already happened for you, but by the next year or two, when your kids, when, when they're getting, Oh, your dad's Dan, you know, my, my, I've been doing this seven months and my daughter, all of her friends follow me. All of her friends want to talk to me. The boys come in and they want, they don't even go to when the, to talk to the girls, they come over and talk to me. And we got, we went to dinner the other night, got out of the car and the valet guy says, Oh,
• 45:03
  I follow you on TikTok. She's like, really dad? So she's starting to get embarrassed about it. But I was just in LA and I ran into three different people that recognized me and I was like, this is weird. I didn't do this for that, but I wanna make a difference. So they say that you write a book for your inner child that your inner child needed to read. You wrote Buy Back Your Time and I am sorry. Normally I read all my guest's book prior and I promise I will.
• 45:32
  but commitments kept me from doing it. How could I have bought back my time and give the audience the gist of the book and what inspired you to write it? Yeah. I mean, I love that. I love that philosophy is like you write, you write the book for your inner child. I mean, in many ways I wrote the book to buy back my time. I mean, it sounds funny, but I've been living this life, what I call the integrated life.
• 45:56
  for 15 years, right? Where I deploy capital to buy back my time so that I can go focus on things that are higher leverage. Like that's the equation. When I think of, you know, what is my, you know, in software, we call it an optimization routine. Like what's my North star? It's every day I want to get better. And the only way I can get better is to have time to build
• 46:19
  invest in learning and becoming better. And the only way I can do that is if every day I'm trying to figure out how can I get more time back? So like back, I've never, I mean, there's a list of things I've never done that probably people would find fascinating. Like I don't go to stores. I don't, I don't fill up my car with gas. I don't clean my stuff. I don't maintain. I've got a house manager that manages all of our personal assets, like cars, real estate. Yeah.
• 46:45
  I have an executive assistant that manages 100% of my calendar, my inboxes, my messages. I don't do Slack. I don't do a lot of stuff. I do text message myself. But oftentimes, if it's scheduling, I just screenshot it, send it to my assistant, and we chat. And that's not to brag, just so the people are listening. This is the playback. I've actually heard this several times.
• 47:05
  Some of it's common sense, but most of it isn't. I mean, you just do your dollar figure and you're going to do a better job of explaining it, but you figure out what you make an hour. And if if doing that job can be outsourced at less than that, you outsource it. Right. Yeah. I mean, just for example, Betty, come come say hi. She knows that I always bring her on. But like my lunch just came to my desk. Hey, how are you? Right. And she also helps out with Blaze the dog.
• 47:31
  um what is that food it looks so good i just went next door choked down a burger fish yeah salmon pasta i do i do um my macros so it's it's uh of course you do everything's a number yeah but um yeah so like the philosophy is very simple it's
• 47:56
  like every year you produce an outcome, right? So I truly believe most people try to optimize for their active income. It's really personal net worth is the better metric. Yeah, and I don't share any of this as a brag. I share it as a, because it's kind of like seeing an Olympic athlete. Like you're like, how did he do that? I just, I'll just go there, tell you that stuff. And, you know, and then I also run multiple eight figure companies as a CEO. I have hundreds of employees.
• 48:26
  Over the years, I've gotten really good at understanding where I can invest time to create the most value and...
• 48:35
  that it lights me up, that it literally sets my soul on fire. Kelly, I do podcasts, I don't do a lot of podcasts, but I choose the ones I do very carefully. Obviously your background, your message, and I'm a big fan of your work is why I'm here. But I think people need to consider, like every, I don't have open space, right? In my calendar, and I teach this in chapter five, the perfect week,
• 49:03
  It's allocated, right? But it's also got my family stuff. It's got my personal stuff. It's got my boys trips. It's got my business stuff. It's got my quarterly planning. It's got, it's all there. And then I can play with that. I have a great team that supports. And what I'm trying to do every year is increase my buyback rate. I mean, I teach the formula in the book, but essentially once you know what your hour is worth, then hopefully next year it's worth more.
• 49:29
  But it can't be worth more if you keep doing stuff that ain't valuable. So I always say that million-dollar companies were not built off $10 tasks. There's only so many hours in a week. So our job is to figure out how do we put the same amount of time, because everybody's got the same amount of time, into a place of leverage to get more output.
• 49:48
  Right. And it turns out this is kind of cool, Kelly. There's only four ways to get leverage. Right. Most people don't know this. I call them the four master skills. If you if you were up and coming entrepreneur and you want to become the best entrepreneur, I would argue that if you study these four areas, that that would give you the most leverage. So the first one is code. The four C's. I learned this from my mentors, Naval Ravikant.
• 50:10
  So code is automation, is AI, is software. You know this, you install information systems that has huge opportunities for automation and buying back your time. The second one is capital. You know, takes money to make money. If you give me $10,000, I can turn that into a million a lot faster going from zero to a million, right? So capital is a huge area of leverage. So a lot of businesses are capital constraint. They got to get good at fundraising or your capital stack. The third is,
• 50:40
  So code, capital, content. Yeah, content's huge. So think about this. Standard operating procedures, that's content. Training videos that you've created for your team so that when you onboard them, they go through the first 14 days and they go from zero to here, that's content. This show is content. Huge leverage. If 10 million people watch it or one, it didn't take any extra time.
• 51:08
  Right. So people don't realize that creating SOPs is actually a very good use of your time because you do it once you train people on it. And hopefully you don't have to do that often. They can follow that process to get an outcome. And then the fourth C is collaboration. It's people. Right. If I need to put a roof on my house and I do it myself, well, it's going to take me a lot longer than if I get four people to help me out.
• 51:31
  right? So if I have the capital, because my buyback rates high enough, then it makes sense to trade become a good time trader, your time, your capital for your time. And that's what entrepreneurship is, right? When you're an employee, you trade your time for money. As an entrepreneur, you trade money for time. And when you become what I call an empire builder, you start trading your money for money. And that's the real game of creating wealth. So all I've decided to do a
• 51:57
  really good at being a time trader. And I've been teaching it for a long time to friends and clients over the years. And I had to write the book because I wanted to give it to the world, right? I don't, nobody should have to
• 52:10
  wait for a conversation with me to learn this process. So I put it all in a book and it came out and it continues to sell thousands of copies every week. It was a Wall Street Journal bestseller. It would have been a number one if it wasn't for James Clear at Atomic Habit, but it was number two. And it just blows my mind, just the feedback we've gotten, just entrepreneurs all over the world, just learning how to build companies they don't grow to hate. And that's my big promise.
• 52:35
  Yeah, I love it. You got to rewind that, everybody, and go back to those four Cs. I would add a fifth C, and it's just a simple one. It's consistency. You got to be consistent. That's just in everything. Yeah, momentum. And I get to tell you, just before you went into that, you said something to me, and, man, it made me feel totally loved. It was about that you chose me. It was a hard day. I just –
• 53:00
  I just feel like we're so connected. I want to let you know that when you said, hey, I don't do many podcasts, I'm honored. I want to acknowledge that I receive that and I appreciate that. And it warmed my heart because it doesn't happen very often and I appreciate it. So do you run an EOS type system? It sounds like you do.
• 53:20
  Yeah, I mean, so what's interesting is I've studied all of these management processes, right? MBOs, EOS, scaling up, you name it, I've studied it. Agile is one. I would say if I were to run the company, I would probably use some level of 90-day sprints, not necessarily an EOS. I think EOS works really good for like manufacturing companies.
• 53:45
  Um, but not so much for innovation where there's a lot of change and, and you talked about momentum. So I would say it has similar components like clear accountability and meeting rhythms and scorecards and that kind of stuff. I just think the, the, um, the, the mechanics of it would look a lot different. Um, but the truth is, is I don't run them. So that's, what's fascinating. Even when you said that Kelly, like I have people that run my companies because as a
• 54:14
  I should not even be CEO of these companies. And I'm not like, I might be CEO on paper, but I don't, I've got a CRO and a COO for most of my companies and they manage operations and revenue. And I get the fun part of just getting on calls with them to talk about vision. All of our conversations are rooted in 18 months into the future. And it's a rule I have. Like, I do not talk about the quarter. I talk about the vision. Making good decisions 18 months into the future is actually way more important than talking about
• 54:43
  fires of today. If I have to talk about a fire today, I just didn't hire great people.
• 54:47
  Isn't it amazing how your personal life is exactly like business versus the work-life balance? It's the same because what your decision you make now in your health and if you're going to eat, you just have a fish. If you ate a freaking garbage, it would come back to you. It wouldn't take 18 months, but it would set you up for 18 months later. It would be terrible. So what you put in your mouth and what you do consistently, I got to say,
• 55:15
  If you don't go by his, and I'm so sorry I haven't read the book. I just literally have been running all over it. I will have it read by the next time we talk, and I think that we're going to talk offline because I love what – I just signed up to be a part of Geno Wickman's mastermind. Can't go wrong. I'm in Michigan, so he's here, but I want to know about that 90-day sprint. So I'm going to write that down so we can take it offline because I want to know what that's all about because –
• 55:40
  You know me, you don't know me, but you know, I want things done yesterday. That's the only, I'm patient, but I want things done in half the amount of time that they say it can be done because it'll help more people. So go back, go buy, buy back your time. It's available on Amazon and then follow Dan on Instagram and YouTube at Dan Martell. And then he's on TikTok, Dan V Martell and LinkedIn D Martell.
• 56:09
  I see him. He just popped up. Brilliant. You are. And it's you're worth the price of admission. And I get you for free. So I'm so grateful that you took the time to spend with me. We got we're into this thing in hours and I'm not even done with the question. So I'm going to speed through a little bit more. Are we good on time? Yeah, I think I've just got a buffer between now. Yeah. What's the $50 magic pill?
• 56:37
  Um, yeah, so the $50 magic pill for me is, I call it 50 to fix it. It's, and I've actually evolved it in the book, I just talked about the $50. It's essentially in allowing giving empowering your people to make decisions, right? So most entrepreneurs are actually stuck making all decisions, why they call it a bottleneck, right? Because a bottleneck, it's the constraints at the top.
• 57:00
  Um, and what I do is I try to push decisions to the frontline people. So 50 to fix it is if the problem is less than $50, you just spend the money and fix it. And the rule is you just got to let me know that you did it. Right. And I do 50 to fix it for anybody in the frontline individual contributors. And then it's 500 for leaders. It's 5,000 for, for directors and above, right. Where they have permission and my C level, it's like 50,000 where they can just, um,
• 57:29
  make the decision to spend the money. They don't have to wait. And as long as the, afterward they tell me, and then if they made a decision that I would say is less than optimal, not that it was right or wrong, just less than optimal. Then I coach them on the thinking process behind why I might've went a different path. And we call it a learning opportunity. And that's like, literally, you know, my house manager, Betty, who you guys just met, she, she probably makes five or six decisions every day that for other folks that she might've worked with in the past would always have to get approval.
• 57:59
  She just makes them. And over time, she's gotten really good at making great decisions that don't require me, which is the whole point of hiring people is to delegate an outcome, not delegate a task. I was just gonna say delegate and elevate an EOS. But I love that. What happens with me and I inadvertently...
• 58:19
  push people away from making decisions because I make them so fast. Like my mind thinks at warp speed, I bet you you're the same. Like before there's even an issue, I've already seen the next issue and the issue beyond that. And I'm making a decision, and then I gotta work it backwards and tell people, and I wait a minute, wait a minute, give them a chance to make the decision. So you just made me a million bucks with that 50, 500 and 5,000.
• 58:44
  That's going to be my new rule. I'm going to implement that Tuesday morning when I walk in the office and I'm going to say, here's, here's the, cause they always wonder when they need to bring things to me. Now we have a number on it. I'm going to.
• 58:55
  Well, I'll tell you a funny story about that. I'll tell you, Kelly. I, um, so we have this rule around the company. We teach people on onboarding, et cetera. And I had a, uh, a videographer that needed something from the designer and the designer told him it was going to take him five days, but he wanted it for tomorrow. So he went on online somewhere and paid somebody 50 bucks to get this image done. And
• 59:18
  Then the work got published and the designer saw it and said, well, who did that? And they said, well, I just hired a designer, which caused a kerfuffle. But it actually was great because it demonstrated to the leader responsible for that team that the response time of the team was slow, so much so that the person needed it and couldn't wait. So what's cool about it is that it allows things to move forward. It will surface opportunities to improve.
• 59:45
  And it'll also allow your top players to feel like they're empowered to actually move the business, which is what you want regardless. Did you say kerfuffle?
• 59:56
  I did. I'm Canadian, man. Kerfuffle. I love it, man. I love you. I'm going to come and... Oh, I'm so lucky. Come hang out. Do you do wake surf? Do you know how to wake surf? I will figure anything out, but you will laugh at me because I'm a big guy. Yes, I can wake surf. I just learned it recently, as a matter of fact. I drive a really good boat. I'm really good at driving the boat. I know you only drive like 10, 12 miles an hour. I forgot your kilometers, so it's like 15 kilometers.
• 1:00:26
  what's something you believe in that almost nobody agrees with you on? That you're 100% accountable for everything in your life. The good, the bad, especially the bad. The bad stuff is the things, you know, what it was, one of the late night talk show hosts, he said it, he goes, he said something about like,
• 1:00:51
  I have to learn to love the things that I hate the most that happened to me if I truly want to be alive. Something like that, right? And I think that's the philosophy I would say.
• 1:01:04
  that most people don't agree with me and find it kind of jarring, but it's just, for me, it's, I just, I'm such a believer that I create my reality, that I'm responsible for the meaning I give to everything and that I am, and you are, and we are God and everything. So there is no good or bad. There's just perspective on how I give it. And I don't want to live in a world where I suffer. So yeah,
• 1:01:34
  That belief really is a tough one for folks and I get it, but I'm still going to share that that's what I believe, you know? Wouldn't life be boring if it was always so perfect?
• 1:01:44
  That's what we learned. That's what people, they don't get it, right? It's like you can't appreciate the day without the night. These are big ideas, right? I just read the book, Five Habits of Highly Resilient People, and talked about the reverse bucket list, and I just posted about it this morning. And I said, I took the time to think about the three things that really shaped my life. And I went, whoa, those were huge. And I steamrolled over them. One of them was the death of my father. You know what the last one was?
• 1:02:14
  Quitting drinking. That was the hardest. That was what I said I was the most afraid of, was quitting drinking. And it still gets me flutters right now because I was worried about all the wrong things that weren't right. And I was worried about where would I have fun? Who would I hang out with? I'm freaking on a podcast with Dan Martel right now. The people that I've been able to meet in this industry and doing this good. I wrote a book all because I quit drinking. I was scared to death.
• 1:02:43
  Anyways, I digress. I'm going to speed through these things because we're getting up against it. What single accomplishment are you most proud of in your career? Not the kids, your career. I think launching my YouTube. That's impressive. Yeah, and the reason why is I think if anybody woke up today and found out that tomorrow was their last day,
• 1:03:09
  most people would freak out because there's things that they would have wanted to say or teach people that they just wouldn't have enough time to do. Right. For whatever reason, physical, like physical location or, or even just the ability to think through things to share it in a way that would be digestible. So like I'm so grateful that I started teaching everything I ever learned in a way that can serve my two boys so that today was my last day.
• 1:03:37
  I know they got a whole lot of stuff. They got a whole lot of their dad just sitting around ready to be consumed when they need it most. And it was a big driver for me initially on the content side. I used to always think like, what would I want to teach Max or Noah about this or that or that? And that like the business stuff, the financial is actually not...
• 1:03:57
  That wouldn't be like money's money, but like knowing that I've cataloged, captured, thought through and became a better person on the process of doing that, which made me a better dad for them. It's kind of this cool, you know, reciprocal action. But that's the thing I'm most proud of is starting down the path of sharing everything I know with the world.
• 1:04:21
  Yeah. I know that you are good friends with, uh, Lewis house and he has that question. Like if you've all, you took all your stuff away. Uh,
• 1:04:30
  What content would you want to stay? That's really cool. I know you've got a lot of friends that are in the business, but I can't wait to meet no one in Mexico. They always get a kick out of me because I'm such a big guy. I didn't have a boy. I have a daughter because God had to make me treat women better, and I do now. If you were offered a mulligan in life, what would it be? What would you do over? I wouldn't have dragged my feet after I sold my first company. I drifted.
• 1:05:00
  That's when you were 28? Yeah, when I was 28, from 28 to about 31, I drifted. I went from being, when we talked about being driven and focused and all that stuff, and I'm not saying being a workaholic, although I was, and that's why I wrote the book, is I had to learn a different rhythm and I got it there. But for that three-year period, I took my foot off the gas. It's that momentum, as you say, consistency,
• 1:05:29
  It is the most powerful force in the universe, compounding growth, right? And like, you can't have it if you reset to zero. And I went from somebody who was incredibly effective to somebody who refused to take meetings or have anything in my calendar that's scheduled. And I went the opposite way, maybe because of PTSD. Why I got there, actually, I don't need to think about it. I just decided since then I will never do that again. So if you ask me, I only have one regret in my life and it's that one. What'd you do for those three years?
• 1:06:00
  I just traveled the world and invested in companies, but I was like not... I didn't have a routine. It's almost like I became a bachelor. I moved to San Francisco. I like...
• 1:06:13
  I go to events. I just didn't, I didn't do the things I knew that would, uh, move my life forward. I was more sit around, play video games and do nothing. No, no, no, no, no, I'm not. I don't play video games. I don't play anything that I could get addicted to. Um, so I don't golf. Cause I'd be careful. Like I'd probably get right into golf. So, um,
• 1:06:34
  Yeah, no, it wasn't like I didn't waste my life, but I think that's actually, Kelly, this is what I want the people listening, the high performers, okay? The people that think they're successful. Some people get up the mountain halfway and they set up camp. Like, I know what I'm capable of. I am not close to that. I'm not setting up camp. When I was 28, I set up camp.
• 1:07:03
  And three years later, I woke up. Luckily, I woke up and I looked around and I said, what am I doing? This is not what I was destined to do. This is not what I'm capable of doing. This is not why I'm here on earth. I know better. Get back to climbing. And that is the message I want people to hear, especially those that think they've made it. You didn't make shit. I don't even care who it is. Whoever's listening, I want you to know.
• 1:07:30
  I don't even need to know your situation. If you know that you can do more, then you shouldn't be that impressed with yourself because it's not impressive. Get back to doing it. Go out there and create. Go give yourself to the world. And that was like the only mulligan I would have overdone is that one because I didn't learn anything from it. Being an alcoholic, drug addiction, it forced me, it was the no pressure, no diamonds. It made me better, so I wouldn't take those things away.
• 1:08:00
  drifting is actually the sales job of the devil, right? Napoleon Hill wrote the book, Outwitting the Devil, and he has a whole chapter dedicated to it, that the perfect sales job of the devil is to get people to be convinced that...
• 1:08:15
  things are good enough and you shouldn't aspire to anything more and just drift in life and just be happy and don't do anything. It's like, man, when I read that, I was like, oh my gosh, that was me. Even though from everybody else's external point of view, they were like, oh, he's successful. It's like not based on who I know I could be inside. Like I got to get back out there.
• 1:08:39
  That book's on my nightstand to read, as a matter of fact. I haven't read it yet. Oh, good. Yeah, it's great. It's great written. If you could have dinner with one person who's alive or dead, who would it be and why? Yeah.
• 1:08:50
  I laughed because I said a name the other day with my, my media team and they were like, we can't do a video on that. Cause I'm again, I'll do it. Well, I mean like, just think about like all the, the, the, you know, like some people it's like aspirational Oprah, Tony Robbins, Elon, Steve, John, whatever you throw them out there.
• 1:09:10
  But I think sometimes I like to go to the opposite, right? Like, let's say you think of the most evil person that was ever born in the history of life. I would want to spend time with that person because I always want to go. Like, to me, I already know what I know over here. So if I hang out with people that already know what I know over here, then I'm not learning anything new.
• 1:09:34
  So when you say that, I would think of like, who is a world leader that was a horrible human that created a lot of pain in the world? I would probably want to sit down with that person. Hitler, is that what you're talking about? And try to figure out. What's that? Are you talking about Hitler? I'm not going to say the name, but let's just say it sounds like Rittler. Okay. Or Luton.
• 1:09:57
  Or, you know what I mean? Like, just, but think about these people that, and then, because I think that's,
• 1:10:05
  Again, I'm not normal in the sense that most people would want to talk to somebody aspirational like Steve Jobs. I already kind of read the books. I kind of understand his perspective, right? I've seen him talk. I haven't seen a lot of content from these people. And I would want to sit down and ask them, what did you go? What were you thinking? Like, how did you rationalize this? Because there's probably some leadership lesson in that conversation.
• 1:10:31
  that if I could understand would add a dramatic amount of value to my ability to support other people. That's the thinking, right? It's crazy how much we think alike. I don't want to be around people that think like me. I want to be around people that think opposite of me so I can expand my thinking. There's a therapist that I went to, an emotional intelligent coach, that said, assume positive intent.
• 1:10:58
  I said, well, how could you have assumed positive intent on Hitler? But we if we could have sat down and had and picked his mind in his own mind, he was doing something. I want to know that. So I agree with you. It's it's freaky.
• 1:11:13
  we're on the same wavelength. I say I don't want to hang out with you, but I also, I think our thinking is so different that there's not many of us. So I am drawn to you, my brother. We're getting to the end here. I'm going to speed through a couple of these. If you could create one law, what would it be and why?
• 1:11:37
  Oh, man. That's a good question. I would want everybody to go do a plant medicine called 5-MEO. Do tell them what it is. I know what it is. I've read about it. You know who the biggest person does that? It's Tucker Max.
• 1:11:53
  Yeah, yeah. So I'm not, I'm not, um, I don't do drugs per se. I don't do plant meds. I don't do weed, anything like that. But, um, I did have the privilege of going and doing a five MEO experience and you can search it on. You'll probably come across this thing called the toad or Mike Tyson's kind of made it famous or whatever, but it's called the God molecule. So, uh, if anybody's ever been curious of what it's like essentially to die or to,
• 1:12:24
  That's the way to do it. And I think that if everybody experienced that, they would then come back into their body and go like, oh shit, what do I do with it now? So again, I'm pretty low key on it, but you asked the question, I've never shared this publicly ever. Yeah.
• 1:12:42
  It's not something I lead with, but it's just the truth. When you say, if I could mandate every person to go have a certain experience, that would be the one because once they experience it, they couldn't unknow it. It's a remembering or knowingness. I have my young producer just staring at me going, Did he just say that on the podcast? There's so much depth to you. I thank you for coming on. There's a couple more questions. What's your biggest fear? Yeah.
• 1:13:12
  Losing my kids. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Everything else I've kind of thought through and processed, but. What? You know, every time I hear somebody losing a kid, I'm just like, what? I don't understand that either. You know, we've got all this time. We, we haven't even talked about your daily routine. What's the first thing you do when you wake up and the last thing you do before bed?
• 1:13:33
  Uh, first thing I do is I get up and, uh, get coffee. I like coffee. Um, what time do you wake up? Uh, between four and five. Usually like, I think if I looked at my app, like four 30 is probably the average. Yeah. I would just, just throw a sleeping bag out for me. I'll be over.
• 1:13:50
  I go to bed early though. People are like, what time do you go to bed? I'm like a nine 30. Like I'm early, early to bed, early to rise. Me too. And yeah, the last thing I do is I talk to my wife. We have, we have like kind of a routine where I call it a meta report. She just sits there and tells me about her day. And all I do is say, wow, cool. That sounds fascinating. Like I don't try to fix anything. I mean, I'm,
• 1:14:12
  I'm becoming a world-class husband through a lot of, you know, learning and lessons and whatnot. But yeah, that's the last thing we do is we talk about, she talks to, she tells me about her day. How long have you been married? I've been married for eight years, but we've been together for about 12 or 13. Well, yeah.
• 1:14:32
  The kids are 10 and 11. They're obviously. Yeah. So we were both supposed to get married. Then she got pregnant. Then we planned the year after. And then she got pregnant again. So we said, let's not do that because I don't want a third. Well, what we didn't ask is Dan's a stud.
• 1:14:49
  I bet I love you. I could talk to you forever. We didn't talk about... So in my show prep, there's two websites. There's coaching. There's so many things to do. What's the one thing you want the Heart of the Life listeners to go look at? Besides your social medias. Well, I mean, I would say Instagram. Yeah, like...
• 1:15:09
  I believe in creating value first, right? So go to Instagram, it's free, go watch my reels. Hopefully you're inspired, I educate, I entertain. And then go buy my book. The book is literally two and a half years of my heart. Like I put in, and I'm excited for you to read it because like a lot of people, I think, they don't really write the books. I mean, most people may not know this, but.
• 1:15:36
  In today's world, we definitely have a lot of people that they're not involved in the creation of their books. I literally put two and a half years of my life into it. So, yeah, that's what I would love for people to go check out. Anybody that says I didn't read my book, I have the notebooks, the curly notebooks of the scribbles that I have of writing it. I wrote it on these notepads. I have pages, but I kept them all.
• 1:16:01
  Because it, and plus when you read my book, you'll know you're talking to me. And it's just, and it's just was the most cathartic thing I could have ever done. Like I admit things that are so vulnerable that are so embarrassing. And then now I wrote it three years or it just got published this year, but I wrote it two years ago during the pandemic and I've healed that person. Now I can, it doesn't bother me at all. Is there anything I haven't asked you today that you feel compelled to share?
• 1:16:32
  No, man, you went deep. Yeah. No, I think your audience, they're... And I think everybody wants to live a bigger life. And I think, you know, physically, expression-wise, you know, make their life mean something. And I think that is actually...
• 1:16:56
  You know, it's why when we have kids, we want to create a better life for our kids is because we have this innate desire in our DNA to improve the scenario and situation around us, right? It's kind of cool that that's like built into our programming. So yeah, no, I just hope people took that as inspiration for their journey and know that
• 1:17:17
  you know, don't compare your chapter one to somebody else's chapter 26, right? I've been doing this for 25, 26 years as an entrepreneur. And, and it's not about comparing anyways, just like, go have fun on your own journey. And then that way there's no downside. Like, I don't, like, I love learning from people, but I don't compare anybody because they're not me and I'm not them. Like, I just know what I went through and I just know if I got better today than I was last week. So the answer is yes, cool. Move forward. If not, fix it.
• 1:17:45
  I don't seem a lot like me. I'm done, but I want to ask one more question. Ed Milad always talks about the one in the family, and I'm the one in my family that stopped the cycle of abuse, and my daughter is never going to experience what I had to. I didn't know where I would eat for days. The only meal that I knew I would get is the free lunch at school, and the weekends, yeah.
• 1:18:09
  They didn't have school. So she doesn't ever have to worry about that. How is the rest of your, you said you had a brother. And I believe you said you were second of four. So how is the other, the siblings? Are you the one? Yeah, you brought up Ed. Yeah, so Ed's actually my coach. So I had a call with him yesterday. I worked with him privately. I think he's one of the best people in the world.
• 1:18:33
  Um, yeah, I mean, this is, this is, I just giggle. I'm like, no. Yeah. Yeah. He's, he's, uh, I mean, we're all unique, right? This is what's so cool about this world. Um,
• 1:18:46
  The, the, I, I went and got sober and I will tell you the thing that I would recommend everybody to consider is when you go and do the thing, get your life together. Don't be the tugboat. So what a tugboat is, is you run around and you bump into everybody, tell them how they should change their life because you've got two, three, six months, a year in a different direction. Yeah.
• 1:19:06
  I luckily learned this in rehab. And instead I just went out there and anytime I wanted to tell somebody else how to change their life, I just took it inward and asked myself, how can I be better? Cause if I can get my life so good that those people notice the change and,
• 1:19:24
  that at some point when they're ready to change, they're going to seek out my support. And that's the lighthouse concept versus the tugboat. So the cool part is since I've been sober and got out of rehab, I think it was like three years into it, my brothers got out of getting in trouble, right? My sister ended up getting away from some of the nefarious stuff she was doing.
• 1:19:47
  My brother, when I was 26, I was in a position to write a check for 175 grand so he could start his home building company. Now he runs a multi eight figure real estate empire. OK, he won one of the top entrepreneurs in the world in Canada award. So I won it one year. He won it another year. They told my dad, if my other brother wins it, they're going to give him an award.
• 1:20:12
  If you met our family and we get together every year, every two years, we do this big family trip, the whole family, 16 of us under one roof. If you met us, you would not see any remnants of a family that went through the kind of challenges and trauma that I'm talking about. I don't know why that is, but I have an idea is that.
• 1:20:34
  Somehow God found me and said, hey, you got to go be, as Ed says, the one. And you got to shine your light so fucking bright that people just can't deny it. And when they're ready, they're going to seek out your advice and you're going to have the resources. See, like when my mom wanted to get sober, I had the resources. When my brother needed startup capital, I had the resources. I had the knowledge to support them.
• 1:20:56
  And I think that's what people don't get. They get frustrated with the people that aren't on the same path and they lose weight. You know this, Kelly, people lose, they lose 20 pounds and they think everybody should do the keto or the intermittent fast or whatever. It's like, no, just keep doing you, share your process publicly to the world so they know that you have a process. And when they're ready, they will reach out. And the more you invest in you to be better, when they're ready, you will be more to help them even better. I just think that's a cool way to live.
• 1:21:24
  It's the only way to live. And where were you to tell me that seven months ago? Because I came out.
• 1:21:29
  guns blazing, telling everybody for a good three months. And the moment I went from the tugboat to the lighthouse and I was the lighthouse, that's when all of my followers started happening. And that's when everything started shooting through the roof. So you are a hundred percent spot on, not that you need my approval or my attaboy, but you're remarkable. And I thank you. I am a smarter man today after meeting you. And when we get offline, I want to figure out how I can come see you.
• 1:21:58
  I got to wrap it up. I want to remind everybody that to please rate and share the podcast. I do my best to respond to all the comments on all social platforms. So if you want to see more of something or less of something, leave a comment. Each and every episode is sponsored by National Technology Management, the easiest and best IT company to do business with. Delivering peace of mind with technology every day. Visit TrustNTM.com for more info. Until next week, be harder than life.
• 1:22:24
  Thank you for listening. Please rate and subscribe to Harder Than Life, and let's take this to the next level. Get connected at the links below.