Latest / The Bechdel Cast / Raiders of the Lost Ark - 100th Episode Spectacular!

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Raiders of the Lost Ark - 100th Episode Spectacular! · The Bechdel Cast

0:00
Speaker 1: On the Dog Cast, the questions asked if movies have
0:04
Speaker 1: women in them? Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands?
0:08
Speaker 1: Do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef invest start changing
0:13
Speaker 1: it with the Beck del Cast. Do do Do Do
0:17
Speaker 1: Do Do Do Do Do Do Do keep going do
0:21
Speaker 1: do Do Do do do do do? You know something horrible?
0:24
Speaker 1: But when I was watching this movie, every time, I
0:27
Speaker 1: was expecting the NFL team, you know, the one that's like,
0:34
Speaker 1: it's close enough, there's a lot of brass and it
0:36
Speaker 1: precedes men fighting. That's true. So you're like, but I
0:39
Speaker 1: was like, that's not his song. I was like, actually,
0:43
Speaker 1: in one of the most famous movies of all time,
0:46
Speaker 1: it turns out to do this a song. Hey, everyone,
0:49
Speaker 1: welcome to the Beck dol Caret. Hello, I'm Caitlin Dronte.
0:52
Speaker 1: I'm Jamie Loftus, and here we are for our one
0:56
Speaker 1: hundred episode. This is where you put in the crazy
1:00
Speaker 1: frog music. Cue ding ding ding ding. You know? Okay? Well,
1:07
Speaker 1: oh crazy frog heads, is that there will know? So
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Speaker 1: this is our hundredth episode of the Betel Cast. If
1:12
Speaker 1: this is your first time listening, I'd recommend maybe make
1:16
Speaker 1: this not your first episode. Yeah, because this is our celebration.
1:19
Speaker 1: We're probably gonna be a little more casual. No guests today, guests,
1:23
Speaker 1: we're raw dogging it, baby, because I don't know. We uh,
1:27
Speaker 1: we've been doing We've been doing our hundred episodes almost
1:30
Speaker 1: two years. We've got a lot to reflect on. Yeah,
1:34
Speaker 1: and also I have ten pages of notes for this movie.
1:38
Speaker 1: I mean, what would be more fitting. It's the celebrations.
1:41
Speaker 1: You have to take twice as many notes as you
1:44
Speaker 1: normally would. Um, so before we get started, this will
1:48
Speaker 1: probably be a slightly looser episode that you're used to,
1:51
Speaker 1: and it'll just be the two of us, so hopefully
1:55
Speaker 1: you want to hang with us for a little bit.
1:57
Speaker 1: This is like kind of closer to what our bonus
1:59
Speaker 1: episodes are, like yeah so good or Matrion. Yeah, if
2:03
Speaker 1: you like more to chill gals, just kind of tune
2:06
Speaker 1: the ship there. Uh no, actually cut that out. But
2:12
Speaker 1: we do have a movie, like we have a task yes, okay,
2:15
Speaker 1: for the sake of consistency. The Bechdel test was the
2:19
Speaker 1: idea or podcast is built around. It is a media test,
2:24
Speaker 1: a test applied to media, usually to movies and television,
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Speaker 1: that requires there be a scene that has two female
2:32
Speaker 1: characters with names that speak to each other about something
2:35
Speaker 1: other than a man for a total of at least
2:38
Speaker 1: two lines of dialogue. That's our standard. Does it happen frequently? No?
2:45
Speaker 1: Listen on there, you start the demo today. I always,
2:50
Speaker 1: I always initiate the demo. Okay, Hey, Jamie in our episodes,
2:57
Speaker 1: which when's your favorite doubt? Doubt? Uh? That passes? Yeah,
3:04
Speaker 1: that passes. What I could have said to make it
3:06
Speaker 1: not passes. John Patrick Shanley what a genius. Okay, I
3:10
Speaker 1: wish All for Melina had been in it, but fortunately
3:13
Speaker 1: Segue Alfred Molina's first major film credit is the movie
3:20
Speaker 1: we're discussing today. It's one of Caitlin's favorites. That's right,
3:24
Speaker 1: Raiders of the Lost Arc. Before we get into it,
3:36
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna get a little heartfelt here for a second,
3:39
Speaker 1: and I think this will continue to pass the Bechdel
3:41
Speaker 1: test because I just wanted to say, Jamie, first of all,
3:45
Speaker 1: I've had such a fun time recording. Really it's been.
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Speaker 1: It's technically when you include our bonus Matreon episodes, it's
3:54
Speaker 1: been over a hundred. But of our regular released episodes
3:57
Speaker 1: that are available on you know iTunes, Spotify, wherever you
4:01
Speaker 1: get your podcasts. This is our hundred one. I have
4:06
Speaker 1: had so much fun talking and laughing with you. When
4:10
Speaker 1: you track our progress from episode one two now, it's
4:16
Speaker 1: there's so many different categories of progress. Oh my gosh. Yeah,
4:20
Speaker 1: there's I feel like there's like progress of like our
4:23
Speaker 1: understanding of talking about gender and blind spots that I
4:28
Speaker 1: think we definitely had two years ago that we're working
4:32
Speaker 1: on more now. And there's also the very heartwarming I
4:37
Speaker 1: think track of like we've gotten like mentions of this
4:41
Speaker 1: from listeners before, like you can sort of tell the
4:44
Speaker 1: point where we become like really good friends, and that
4:48
Speaker 1: warms my heart too. There's so many I love you, really,
4:54
Speaker 1: we're glad that we do this. Me too. Fun. I
4:56
Speaker 1: have so much fun with it, and I learned ship
4:59
Speaker 1: all the time. I genuinely think that like doing this
5:02
Speaker 1: show and having like the need to like I mean
5:06
Speaker 1: for us, especially like to watch media critically or we're
5:11
Speaker 1: not doing our job correctly has informed like everything else
5:16
Speaker 1: that I do, and just sort of a general way
5:19
Speaker 1: of perceiving the world in the past two years has
5:22
Speaker 1: has changed. And we didn't I mean, we were talking
5:26
Speaker 1: about this podcast pre election but the fact that our
5:29
Speaker 1: show came out pretty much I think, like maybe a
5:32
Speaker 1: week or two after the election to it's been a
5:36
Speaker 1: doozy of two years in terms of like, I think
5:40
Speaker 1: that there's stuff like at the beginning of the show
5:43
Speaker 1: that we just didn't even have language for or wasn't
5:45
Speaker 1: really discussed that much that now we do. So our
5:50
Speaker 1: conversations we have gotten so much more sophisticated as time
5:54
Speaker 1: goes on. But also we still regularly call into question
5:58
Speaker 1: the consistency of beetlejuice come. So have our conversation has
6:02
Speaker 1: gotten more sophisticated though, and to be fair, but okay
6:07
Speaker 1: for using that example, and you know, I love when
6:10
Speaker 1: we do. I'm already regretting bringing it up. Well, you
6:13
Speaker 1: could think about it in terms of discourse. It took
6:16
Speaker 1: us a whole year to even mentioned beetle juices come
6:20
Speaker 1: because we as a culture simply didn't have the language.
6:23
Speaker 1: It was just embedded so deeply that we assumed that
6:27
Speaker 1: we didn't know what he came and we and it
6:29
Speaker 1: was a taboo. We didn't think about it. It took
6:32
Speaker 1: us a whole year of the podcast, nearly eleven months
6:35
Speaker 1: till October of twenty seventeen to be so bold as
6:40
Speaker 1: to say, does he come dry scaps or wet scaps?
6:43
Speaker 1: And that's why people listen for this exact discourse specifically,
6:48
Speaker 1: and then also just because we are you know, we're
6:51
Speaker 1: bringing up these conversations, giving people the language that they
6:56
Speaker 1: need to discuss come of all genders. Well, most of
7:01
Speaker 1: that conversation, until we started talking about beetle juices come
7:04
Speaker 1: most of it past the becto tests. So yeah, let's
7:10
Speaker 1: talk about Raiders of the Lost Art. Dude, that's for
7:18
Speaker 1: football soccer. Sorry, that's a soccer. So what is this movie?
7:23
Speaker 1: It stars my least favorite character. I was going to
7:28
Speaker 1: say Alfred Molina, but he's not the star really, I
7:31
Speaker 1: mean in terms of men I respect. The spectrum is
7:36
Speaker 1: represented in the first scene of this movie. Before we
7:40
Speaker 1: get there, Caitlin, please tell me what is your history
7:42
Speaker 1: with Raiders of the Lost Art. I would love to
7:44
Speaker 1: tell you. I would say that I first saw this
7:46
Speaker 1: movie when I was probably nine or ten. All three
7:51
Speaker 1: of the original trilogy of Indiana Jones films were on
7:57
Speaker 1: VHS at my house, and as soon as I discover them,
8:00
Speaker 1: I never looked back. I have seen this movie, probably
8:06
Speaker 1: a good thirty times, I would say, yep, I would
8:10
Speaker 1: say I've seen Last Crusade even more than that, because
8:13
Speaker 1: that is I would still call it my favorite. But
8:15
Speaker 1: I'm beginning to appreciate more and more that Raiders is
8:18
Speaker 1: a better film. Um templea doom I've never been that
8:21
Speaker 1: fond of, and it is not aging well at all.
8:25
Speaker 1: That's also one that the female lead is by far
8:29
Speaker 1: the least strong, right, the least strong, the not to
8:32
Speaker 1: detract from the cause, but the most annoying and the
8:36
Speaker 1: least active. As I've said many times, part of feminism
8:40
Speaker 1: is being able to openly acknowledge when you do not
8:43
Speaker 1: like another one, right yeah, so yeah, definitely the weakest
8:48
Speaker 1: one and until Crystal Skull rears its ugly head in
8:53
Speaker 1: whatever year that was two thousand eight or something like that, which,
8:57
Speaker 1: by the way, was my first date ever boy where
9:02
Speaker 1: I brought like my date, but also my best friend Peter,
9:05
Speaker 1: because I was scared. I know, I know, so basically
9:10
Speaker 1: to some up, I I love this movie. I still
9:14
Speaker 1: love this movie. We will unpack all the reasons that
9:16
Speaker 1: there are to not love parts of this movie, but
9:20
Speaker 1: I'm gonna stand by this movie and say that it
9:24
Speaker 1: is great, even though I already have a good idea
9:27
Speaker 1: of what nipple rating I will give it, and it
9:29
Speaker 1: is not high. But even so, I love this franchise
9:34
Speaker 1: and it is definitely in my top five favorite franchises
9:38
Speaker 1: and movies of all times. So that's where I'm coming from.
9:42
Speaker 1: Cool my history with this movie. I feel like we
9:46
Speaker 1: should have our own Bingo card out for this episode
9:49
Speaker 1: to see it, to make sure we hit all the
9:51
Speaker 1: right notes. This movie saw last night, and then I
9:56
Speaker 1: wasn't going to watch it a second time, but then
9:58
Speaker 1: I was going to go to the d m V
9:59
Speaker 1: this learning, and then I sucked it up, so I
10:01
Speaker 1: just watched it again, watched it twice. Good, good, good,
10:04
Speaker 1: We're growing Yeah, yeah, I did not grow up with
10:07
Speaker 1: this franchise. I also didn't grow up with a Star
10:09
Speaker 1: Wars franchise. I don't know. I don't really know why
10:12
Speaker 1: that was. You would think that I would have encountered it,
10:16
Speaker 1: but I just didn't. We weren't we weren't a big
10:19
Speaker 1: movie household. We weren't a big but we were like
10:21
Speaker 1: a big Disney movie household. We were a big cartoon household,
10:25
Speaker 1: which I think influenced the direction of my life. But
10:29
Speaker 1: we were we were more of a TV household than
10:31
Speaker 1: a movie household. Um, so I just never really watched it.
10:34
Speaker 1: Mostly watched holes, which we should do it upside um,
10:37
Speaker 1: but I never watched it. And then as I grew older,
10:40
Speaker 1: I mean, as as you know about me, action movies
10:43
Speaker 1: just kind of weren't my thing. And then, as I've learned,
10:46
Speaker 1: actually directly via this podcast, Harrison Ford also is very
10:50
Speaker 1: much not my thing, and so I had little incentive
10:53
Speaker 1: to watch this movie until I mean, this movie feels
10:57
Speaker 1: important to do canonically. And I will say I was
11:00
Speaker 1: expecting to come in, you know, just swinging my labia
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Speaker 1: around like loose PASTRAMI being like, I hate this movie,
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Speaker 1: this movie sucks whatever, But I have I have more
11:15
Speaker 1: conflicting feelings about it than I thought. There were parts
11:17
Speaker 1: of this movie that I liked very much. I mean,
11:22
Speaker 1: and by that, I mean I loved the Alfred Molina
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Speaker 1: scene and he's so handsome. Does it pass the Bechtel
11:30
Speaker 1: test if Harrison Ford grabs the front of Alfred Molina's pants? No,
11:36
Speaker 1: it passes the Bechtel test. When Alfred Molina steals from
11:39
Speaker 1: Harrison Ford and leaves him to die, it doesn't pass
11:44
Speaker 1: the Bectel test. But now from Molina dies obviously what
11:48
Speaker 1: a crazy I mean? And I didn't like that was
11:51
Speaker 1: his first movie ever and he's on screen with a
11:54
Speaker 1: huge movie star for a long time. I was like,
11:57
Speaker 1: he's just so gift and he didn't crack under pressure.
12:00
Speaker 1: He gave the performance of a lifetime. He never God,
12:03
Speaker 1: I would like, literally give a finger to see him
12:07
Speaker 1: as Tavia. But yeah, what are you gonna do? So
12:10
Speaker 1: writers of the Lost Arc? So I'll do the recap
12:14
Speaker 1: of the story of Writers of the Lost Arc, because like,
12:18
Speaker 1: not really that much happens. A ton happens. What are
12:21
Speaker 1: you talking about? There are some scenes that go on
12:23
Speaker 1: for a long time, but fun. Okay. So we're in
12:29
Speaker 1: the mid nineteen thirties. We meet Indiana Jones. He is
12:35
Speaker 1: an adventurer who mostly steals sacred artifacts from indigenous cultures.
12:41
Speaker 1: But we love him, love him. I think the greatest
12:44
Speaker 1: piece of acting here is us believing that Harrison Ford
12:47
Speaker 1: could be a teacher. Okay, I know you hate Ford.
12:52
Speaker 1: I not as an individual, I hate his characters. He
12:55
Speaker 1: seems he seems like a perfectly fun guy. So we
12:59
Speaker 1: meet Indiana Jones. We see him trying to take a
13:03
Speaker 1: golden idol from a tribe in South America. But who
13:07
Speaker 1: else is there? Well, Cepedo a k a. Alpha. It's
13:14
Speaker 1: his big day and he recovered in Tarantula's for part
13:19
Speaker 1: of the city. Jeeves is cool and he is you
13:23
Speaker 1: can tell he's like, I'm not sold on this franchise,
13:26
Speaker 1: but I'm a young buck who needs an opportunity. I
13:30
Speaker 1: can see what's going through his head. What if there
13:33
Speaker 1: is maybe there's a universe where he has those tarantulas
13:37
Speaker 1: on him. He gets bitten by one because one of
13:39
Speaker 1: them is radioactive, and that that's what makes him become Doc.
13:44
Speaker 1: I love that. Oh it's like the twenty three Years Sleeper.
13:50
Speaker 1: And then he wakes up one day and he's Doc Doc. Okay,
13:54
Speaker 1: that's Cannon. Now that's Cannon. It's as Cannona's dry scaps baby. Okay.
14:00
Speaker 1: So Alfred Molina is there. So is this character named
14:03
Speaker 1: Belloc who is Indiana Jones's rival, and he takes the
14:07
Speaker 1: idol from him because he's friends with the indigenous culture
14:10
Speaker 1: that Indiana Jones is trying to steal from. Then we
14:13
Speaker 1: cut to a classroom because Indiana Jones is also a
14:16
Speaker 1: professor of archaeology. The teacher who can read. Sure, Look,
14:21
Speaker 1: he's an academic, he has he has more degrees than
14:24
Speaker 1: I do. He's wearing glasses. I'm like, this is fucking lazy,
14:28
Speaker 1: but fine, Yeah, Harrison Ford can read and he has glasses. Sure,
14:32
Speaker 1: I only have a master's degree in screenwriting. I don't
14:35
Speaker 1: like to bring it up, but it is from Boston University.
14:37
Speaker 1: He's got a PhD from Chicago. A doctor. He's a doctor,
14:44
Speaker 1: Dr Jones. Doctor I know, and I love anytime someone
14:47
Speaker 1: says doctor Jones. It is the best doctor Jones songs.
14:55
Speaker 1: Mr Jones, what, oh my god? Have you never heard
14:57
Speaker 1: that song? No, it's like the Amy Weinhouse song Me
15:01
Speaker 1: and doctor Chill. Alright. Anyway, So he's at his university,
15:08
Speaker 1: he's teaching the kids about archaeology, and then he gets
15:12
Speaker 1: approached by a couple of army intelligence guys who have
15:16
Speaker 1: intercepted a communicate from the Nazis, and the Nazis are
15:19
Speaker 1: looking for the headpiece to the Staff of Raw, which
15:23
Speaker 1: is a thing that's going to help them find the
15:25
Speaker 1: Ark of the Covenant. It's another piece of indigenous art
15:29
Speaker 1: that Harrison Ford needs to steal so that more evil
15:34
Speaker 1: white guy doesn't get it right, but it's not suggested
15:38
Speaker 1: that perhaps this is something an indigenous adventurer could do.
15:42
Speaker 1: Only Harrison Ford could do it, and in this scene
15:46
Speaker 1: he's the best, and he says things as if he's
15:48
Speaker 1: read a book before. Sure, doctor, look he's got a PhD.
15:53
Speaker 1: And I believe it's Hitler PhD candidates. God damnit. Hitler
15:59
Speaker 1: is looking for the art because he wants to weaponize it,
16:02
Speaker 1: so Indiana Jones has to find it before he does
16:04
Speaker 1: so that that can't happen. So Indiana goes to Nepal
16:08
Speaker 1: to get the headpiece from Marion Ravenwood, which is her dad,
16:14
Speaker 1: her dad, and then yeah, he Indiana Jones learns that
16:18
Speaker 1: her quote he died it was like an old professor
16:21
Speaker 1: of his and he and Maryan have a history which
16:25
Speaker 1: we will talk about, but it was a child. Yeah. Well,
16:31
Speaker 1: there's there's too much to say now, so we'll get there.
16:34
Speaker 1: So then some Nazis coming to steal the headpiece. They're
16:37
Speaker 1: not successful, so then Marian partners up with Indie by
16:42
Speaker 1: the way, after he immediately comes back triggers her and
16:46
Speaker 1: then burns down her small business. And now they're working together. Okay,
16:52
Speaker 1: So then they go to Tannis, which is a city
16:55
Speaker 1: where the arc is thought to be. They meet up
16:58
Speaker 1: with Indiana's friend Salah, a white guy. Yeah, yep, we'll
17:03
Speaker 1: get there as well. And then they figure out what
17:07
Speaker 1: the markings on the headpiece mean, and then they make
17:09
Speaker 1: sure their staff is the right height because Bellock's staff
17:13
Speaker 1: is too long. They're digging in the wrong place. Oh no,
17:16
Speaker 1: They go to the map room to figure out the
17:18
Speaker 1: right spot to find the arc. So indeed, he starts
17:22
Speaker 1: digging and they find the Well of the Souls, So
17:25
Speaker 1: so they're they're in the Chamber of Secrets and then
17:27
Speaker 1: they find the arc. But Belloc shows up and he's like,
17:30
Speaker 1: that's nine nine nine. So Bellock takes it and he
17:35
Speaker 1: loads it onto a plane and then there's a big
17:37
Speaker 1: fight sequence and then they're like, no, let's put it
17:39
Speaker 1: on a truck. And then there's another big there, like
17:41
Speaker 1: we need to have a battle scene on every mode
17:44
Speaker 1: of transportation or the movie can't end. Have we yet
17:48
Speaker 1: passed the point where Marian is kidnapped? And then Indy
17:52
Speaker 1: shows up and he's like, actually just gonna leave you here. Yeah,
17:57
Speaker 1: I glossed over that part. There's a big fight sequence.
18:00
Speaker 1: It's in a market scene. Maryon gets kidnapped and then
18:03
Speaker 1: she thought to have died, and then he right after
18:06
Speaker 1: he figures out the spot where the arc is. He
18:09
Speaker 1: goes into a tent and Maryan is there. She's bound,
18:11
Speaker 1: she's gagged. She's like, get me out of here, and
18:14
Speaker 1: he's like, no, I have to go get an arc curse. Yeah.
18:19
Speaker 1: Then she is taken to the Well of the Souls
18:23
Speaker 1: and gets dumped in there with Indiana right and then
18:26
Speaker 1: they have to escape and that's when they go on
18:28
Speaker 1: this wild goose chase of going after the plane and
18:31
Speaker 1: then the trucks, and then they get on a boat.
18:33
Speaker 1: At one point there's some kissing. It's very cool. By
18:37
Speaker 1: the end of the movie that they all end up
18:38
Speaker 1: on this island where Belloc performs this ritual to make
18:42
Speaker 1: sure that the arc works. I guess he's doing a
18:46
Speaker 1: test run before he gives it to Hitler. Shares ghost
18:50
Speaker 1: comes out of it and all their heads exploit their
18:53
Speaker 1: faces melt off. Indiana is like, don't look at it,
18:58
Speaker 1: and then don't like a Shares go and then that
19:02
Speaker 1: is pretty much the movie. Yeah, I I liked it
19:06
Speaker 1: more than I was expecting. Well, I mean, if you
19:07
Speaker 1: like movies like you know, The Mummy or National Treasure,
19:11
Speaker 1: those movies don't exist without this movie. So that's true.
19:14
Speaker 1: And I love National Trushre I know you do. I
19:17
Speaker 1: love the I feel like I've said this a million
19:19
Speaker 1: times too. But the Daylight savings time, plot, plot contrivance, gorgeous, beautiful.
19:27
Speaker 1: Why wasn't there that? I think that's what this well,
19:31
Speaker 1: speaking of time, I think it's time to take a
19:33
Speaker 1: quick break. But then we'll come back and we'll talk
19:36
Speaker 1: more about raiders Do Do Do Anywhere? We're back now, So, um,
19:52
Speaker 1: there's a lot, there's a lot here. This is one
19:54
Speaker 1: of the movies that takes place in a world where
19:57
Speaker 1: women barely exist, says all of early George Lucas. Basically
20:04
Speaker 1: where up until like three years ago, you wouldn't know
20:09
Speaker 1: that George Lucas had really met a woman before, and
20:13
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, you know, the less evolved
20:15
Speaker 1: he was, the more women would appear. But whatever, this
20:18
Speaker 1: is very much. I mean I think that this is
20:21
Speaker 1: and George Lucas has involved in both projects obviously, but
20:24
Speaker 1: like this is like comparable to Leia in some ways
20:28
Speaker 1: of like we're given one female character she does a
20:32
Speaker 1: lot of stuff. She's relatively active within bounds. I would
20:37
Speaker 1: argue that this movie would never empower Maryan to the
20:40
Speaker 1: point where she didn't need Indy, which I think that
20:44
Speaker 1: in that way, she's kind of a weaker character than La,
20:47
Speaker 1: because I think that, like, it's clear that she would
20:49
Speaker 1: be okay without the guys, but Marian, like, there are
20:53
Speaker 1: clear limitations to what the movie will allow her to
20:56
Speaker 1: do before she's taken captive basically, but there's no one
21:00
Speaker 1: for her to talk to, no one for her to
21:02
Speaker 1: talk to, and yeah, as you said, not that much
21:05
Speaker 1: for her to do more than I was expecting. It's
21:08
Speaker 1: interesting with Mary And there were some points where I'm like,
21:12
Speaker 1: I can't imagine that this was done super intentionally as
21:16
Speaker 1: like a meta text thing. But for the sake of argument,
21:20
Speaker 1: there are scenes where you know, this is so common
21:23
Speaker 1: in any action movie, where Harrison Ford is tossing her
21:26
Speaker 1: to the side, getting her out of harm's way, throwing
21:29
Speaker 1: her the piles of hay, but then Marian will get
21:33
Speaker 1: up and start fighting again and then help pick her
21:36
Speaker 1: up and toss her away again. And it was interesting
21:39
Speaker 1: because I don't think it was like super intentionally done
21:42
Speaker 1: of like Indiana Jones is very much a typical action
21:46
Speaker 1: hero of like my lady can't get harmed, You're not
21:49
Speaker 1: got to keep her safe. But unlike you know, like
21:53
Speaker 1: Mary Jane Watson caught in a web for the climax
21:57
Speaker 1: of another Alfred Molina classic. Uh, Marian keeps getting up
22:02
Speaker 1: and keeps trying to fight, and and like she has
22:05
Speaker 1: fighting that goes beyond like the standard woman one bunk,
22:10
Speaker 1: one panda the head. Wow, she did it. Like she
22:13
Speaker 1: doesn't have multiple battle victories, Yeah, which I wasn't expecting. Sure,
22:18
Speaker 1: and let's go through them. Let's talk about her sort
22:20
Speaker 1: of role in this story. So and well, before we
22:23
Speaker 1: do that, I just want to kind of give a
22:25
Speaker 1: quick overview of her character. Um. So, when she's introduced
22:29
Speaker 1: on screen, she is beating a man in a drinking contest,
22:34
Speaker 1: so we know she she's not like the other girls,
22:37
Speaker 1: right she We know she can hold her liquor, which
22:41
Speaker 1: is a skill that will pay off later in the movie.
22:43
Speaker 1: So at least that's set up for our specific purpose.
22:46
Speaker 1: We know that she's the daughter of a famous archaeologist
22:49
Speaker 1: and she has traveled the world with him, but she
22:52
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily seem to have any specific career ambition of
22:56
Speaker 1: her own or interest in archaeology, which is fine, which
23:00
Speaker 1: is fine, but it's a small business owner. But also
23:02
Speaker 1: she doesn't really seem to like that because she says,
23:06
Speaker 1: I'm stuck in this dive. I can't you know, I
23:08
Speaker 1: want to get out of here. And we know that
23:10
Speaker 1: she's had a relationship with Indiana Jones in the past,
23:15
Speaker 1: which is a whole other conversation. I would say, even
23:19
Speaker 1: though she is sort of presented as like not like
23:21
Speaker 1: the other girl's kind of character, I do and I
23:24
Speaker 1: have always admired her for being tough and self sufficient,
23:29
Speaker 1: self sufficient she you know, doesn't take ship from anyone. Yeah,
23:34
Speaker 1: I know, it's it's pretty surface level. The thing there
23:38
Speaker 1: is like it's weird because again it's like eighties convention
23:43
Speaker 1: of like surface level empowerment. But even the way she's
23:48
Speaker 1: presented of like she is able to sustain a life
23:52
Speaker 1: on her own, but it's not anywhere close to the
23:56
Speaker 1: level of like satisfaction she could get out of life
23:59
Speaker 1: with Indiana je And so there's like a level of
24:01
Speaker 1: like when he arrives and sweeps her off into adventure.
24:05
Speaker 1: It's not that she was waiting for him to show up,
24:07
Speaker 1: but sort of, you know, like like he's definitely the
24:12
Speaker 1: catalyst that turns her world upside down exactly makes it
24:16
Speaker 1: exciting again, which yeah, is it's not great, but I
24:20
Speaker 1: would say overall, she's presented as a smart, capable character
24:25
Speaker 1: who advocates for herself. But the trouble is that the
24:28
Speaker 1: story rarely gives her an opportunity to do anything that
24:32
Speaker 1: has much of an impact on the narrative for the
24:35
Speaker 1: for the time it's coming out. It's not bad, but
24:39
Speaker 1: there's still a lot of shortsightedays around it. I would wonder,
24:42
Speaker 1: like how much of an influence the success of Leah's
24:46
Speaker 1: character had on the way this character was written, because
24:49
Speaker 1: Leiah predates her by a couple of years. Yeah, so
24:51
Speaker 1: the first Star Wars movie came out in ninete. This
24:54
Speaker 1: movie came out in one. Okay, So yeah, I mean
24:58
Speaker 1: that's good, and that's I mean, her character is more
25:02
Speaker 1: complicated to analyze than I was anticipating. Yeah, because as
25:06
Speaker 1: much as it not like the other girl tropes kind
25:08
Speaker 1: of bug me, there at least grounded in this story
25:12
Speaker 1: where it skills that she, like you're saying, needs later.
25:15
Speaker 1: I guess this is like the in between level of yes,
25:18
Speaker 1: we are acknowledging that a woman can sustain a life
25:21
Speaker 1: on her own, but she can't truly experience the joy
25:24
Speaker 1: of life without a man's And then if for taking
25:30
Speaker 1: it all the way back to the Mummy episode. In
25:33
Speaker 1: that movie, we see we see the Rachel wife's character
25:40
Speaker 1: having really important knowledge the greatly in fact, the direction
25:45
Speaker 1: of the story which Brendan Fraser needs to be able
25:49
Speaker 1: to carry on with his quest. Whereas in this movie,
25:53
Speaker 1: while she does some things and makes some active choices,
25:58
Speaker 1: there's nothing that she can sure beats that's crucial to
26:01
Speaker 1: the narrative because Indiana Jones has given all of the
26:05
Speaker 1: necessary information and knowledge and you know, problem solving skills
26:10
Speaker 1: to you know, make all the important moves of the
26:13
Speaker 1: story because he can read. Don't forget Indiana Jones character
26:19
Speaker 1: who canonically can read and has a doctorate. Anyways, So yeah, oh,
26:26
Speaker 1: I also just wanted to make a comment on the
26:28
Speaker 1: actress who plays Marian She Allen. Yes, she doesn't end
26:33
Speaker 1: up doing a whole lot of stuff by choice after
26:35
Speaker 1: this movie, I would just like to throw out there,
26:39
Speaker 1: no judgment, just wanted to put it out there. She
26:41
Speaker 1: does marry a man named Kale, a grown man named Kale.
26:47
Speaker 1: Karen and Kale, Karen and Kale. That's something people had
26:50
Speaker 1: to say seriously when making plans. So that's just all Kale.
26:56
Speaker 1: So yeah, do you think Cal and Karen are around
26:58
Speaker 1: if you knew Kale first? In any case, just a
27:01
Speaker 1: little bit of gristle for you to chew on for
27:03
Speaker 1: our hundredth episode. You bet you? Okay, back to talk
27:07
Speaker 1: about Yeah, let's talk about her role and major contributions
27:11
Speaker 1: in the story. So we see her for the first
27:14
Speaker 1: time in the bar in Nepal. Some bad guys come
27:19
Speaker 1: in and threaten her. They use violence as a way
27:21
Speaker 1: to turn her business down. In reality, she would have
27:25
Speaker 1: to stay and at least get the insurance money, not
27:28
Speaker 1: leave that day. Anyways, Indiana has to come in and
27:32
Speaker 1: save her. There is a fight. She does a couple
27:36
Speaker 1: of things, like she hits a guy with a log head.
27:39
Speaker 1: She drinks whiskey out of a barrel. This was That
27:42
Speaker 1: was the first thing where I was like, she's more
27:44
Speaker 1: active than I thought she was going to be. But
27:46
Speaker 1: she still wasn't that like she could. She couldn't have
27:49
Speaker 1: won the day on her own for sure, and then
27:52
Speaker 1: as opposed to Oklahoma, Oklahoma Smith my favorite actor movie hero. Personally,
28:01
Speaker 1: I'm partial to Utah, Pennsylvania, Johnson Pennsylvania, Johnson is great?
28:09
Speaker 1: Where's Johnny Utah? And all of this point break Okay, anyway,
28:16
Speaker 1: choose its crews favorite action hero. Okay. So by the
28:22
Speaker 1: end of this scene, Indiana Jones is doing most of
28:24
Speaker 1: the fighting, but Marian does shoot the last bad guy
28:29
Speaker 1: who was about to kill Indiana Jones. I'd argue this
28:32
Speaker 1: is a little trophy of the woman did something. Yeah,
28:37
Speaker 1: so she saves him, but it is like, oh, wow,
28:40
Speaker 1: look at it, look at look at what a woman.
28:42
Speaker 1: I guess that I could I think that, And I
28:44
Speaker 1: think that that is partially used as like a reasoning
28:47
Speaker 1: to the audience of like, oh, she is a realistic
28:50
Speaker 1: person for him to take on as a partner, which
28:53
Speaker 1: there's a pattern of the way she's treated in this movie.
28:57
Speaker 1: I feel like almost the movie never well, it does
29:01
Speaker 1: make a decision eventually, but it goes back and forth
29:03
Speaker 1: several times of like if we're thinking chessboard, is she
29:08
Speaker 1: a pawn or is she an actual player in the game,
29:12
Speaker 1: Because there's multiple times where she's used as a pond
29:15
Speaker 1: she treated like an object to move the plot forward.
29:18
Speaker 1: There's that moment where what's the name of that character,
29:21
Speaker 1: katanga u Katanga has her on the boat and it's like,
29:25
Speaker 1: I think that, you know, we could sell her as
29:27
Speaker 1: a prostitute once we get off the boat, and that
29:29
Speaker 1: moves the plot forward and gets what needs to happen
29:32
Speaker 1: in the scene to happen, but only because she's treated
29:34
Speaker 1: as an object. Same dale whenever she's randomly abducted. That
29:39
Speaker 1: just adds steaks by her being there. But then there's
29:42
Speaker 1: other moments where her skills and presence are necessary to
29:47
Speaker 1: the plot moving forward, and the movie just kind of
29:49
Speaker 1: goes back and forth, and never I think that it
29:53
Speaker 1: settles on the decision that she is a pawn, because
29:56
Speaker 1: by the end she is wearing like a wedding dress
29:59
Speaker 1: and it's to be rescued. But for for a while,
30:03
Speaker 1: it's back and forth. And then one more quick thing
30:07
Speaker 1: about the bar scene is that at the end of
30:11
Speaker 1: that she makes the choice to accompany him on She's like, like,
30:17
Speaker 1: you got more than you bargained for. I'm your goddamn partner, right,
30:21
Speaker 1: so so I'm not getting tired of it personally me either,
30:33
Speaker 1: and Prior to that, you know, we see her interacting
30:35
Speaker 1: with like the Nazi guy who's like, I don't know
30:38
Speaker 1: what kind of people are used to dealing with, but
30:40
Speaker 1: no one tells me what to do in my place,
30:42
Speaker 1: she blows smoke in his face, you know, So she's
30:46
Speaker 1: more headstrong considering the era, considering the genre, and also
30:52
Speaker 1: considering the fact that these movies were based on these
30:56
Speaker 1: sort of adventurer cereals from the nineteen thirties. I have
31:01
Speaker 1: not watched that media personally, but I would wager that
31:06
Speaker 1: those did not treat women very well, and if it
31:10
Speaker 1: was a woman in the story, this is probably progress
31:12
Speaker 1: built upon that. Yeah, I would imagine. So if you,
31:16
Speaker 1: if you are familiar, as as the audience listening to us,
31:19
Speaker 1: if you have seen those, you know, adventure cereals that
31:23
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones movies are kind of inspired by, let us know.
31:27
Speaker 1: But again, I would hazard to guess that the women
31:29
Speaker 1: in those stories were just kind of tossed around and
31:32
Speaker 1: not allowed to do anything or damsels in distress the
31:35
Speaker 1: whole time. So yeah, but you know, more progress could
31:40
Speaker 1: have been made than it was. I agree, Yeah, I
31:46
Speaker 1: would be shocked if this wasn't somehow an improvement on
31:49
Speaker 1: the source material, but you know it's still an idea one, right, right, right.
31:55
Speaker 1: So the next sequence is the one in the marketplace.
31:59
Speaker 1: They are now in Cairo, h Indiana Jones calls her
32:05
Speaker 1: stupid because there's a monkey that's their friend. Now, Indiana
32:09
Speaker 1: Jones is enough, right, but yeah, but he's like, oh,
32:14
Speaker 1: do we need the monkey? And she's like, it's got
32:16
Speaker 1: your looks and he's like, and your brains and she's like,
32:20
Speaker 1: I noticed that she's smart, so um, and then that
32:23
Speaker 1: fights scene breaks out. As soon as the fight breaks out,
32:26
Speaker 1: you see Mary and picking something up and like starting
32:29
Speaker 1: to hit a bunch of bad guys with it. It
32:31
Speaker 1: seems to be an aluminum pan that would not inflict
32:35
Speaker 1: much damage, but hey, it's what was right there. But
32:39
Speaker 1: it's more the same thing that we see in the
32:41
Speaker 1: first fight scene at the bar, where Indiana Jones is
32:44
Speaker 1: doing most of the fighting and she is not doing
32:48
Speaker 1: nearly as much. He says to her pretty early on
32:52
Speaker 1: to get out of there, and then he throws her aside.
32:56
Speaker 1: She falls on the ground. A little later on, picks
32:58
Speaker 1: up a frying pan and hits a guy over the
33:00
Speaker 1: head with it. But this is something that. I feel
33:03
Speaker 1: like we see a lot where if women in a
33:05
Speaker 1: movie are allowed to participate in a fight scene, they're
33:09
Speaker 1: usually not given actual weapons. No, no, the well, and
33:13
Speaker 1: then very often I think that they end up using
33:17
Speaker 1: domestic items to fight, which is like a weird subtext
33:23
Speaker 1: of like, oh, well, they would never have just have weapons,
33:27
Speaker 1: and so they you know, you know how to use
33:30
Speaker 1: this pot, They've they've cooked many things. Let's let's have
33:34
Speaker 1: her fight in her language. Like what yeah, totally absolutely
33:38
Speaker 1: agree with that. Or another example of what happens when
33:41
Speaker 1: women are fighting and fight scenes is she will wrap
33:45
Speaker 1: her legs around a guy's face and then pussy slam
33:48
Speaker 1: him on the floor. Yeah. Yeah, so those are usually
33:53
Speaker 1: the two options. Rarely do we see a woman wielding
33:57
Speaker 1: a gun and being skilled with a gun. Now is
33:59
Speaker 1: this something as a hater of guns, do I want
34:04
Speaker 1: to see women firing of guns all the time? Not necessarily,
34:08
Speaker 1: but because men get to do it so much right,
34:11
Speaker 1: and we see so little of women doing it in
34:14
Speaker 1: action movies. It's a very noticeable disparity. Uh. And then
34:21
Speaker 1: I honestly like I did lose track of the fight
34:23
Speaker 1: scenes because it's just not a language that I speak,
34:27
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, there's he's gonna win, Like why are
34:29
Speaker 1: we He's going to win, but we have to see
34:31
Speaker 1: him struggle before he wins and fights. But you just
34:34
Speaker 1: love it. But he's gonna win and we don't know that.
34:39
Speaker 1: But intellectually we know, but emotionally we only twist in movies.
34:44
Speaker 1: Ever that's ever happened is in School of Rock when
34:48
Speaker 1: they lose the Battle of the Dance. That's the only
34:52
Speaker 1: Act three twist. You never see it coming. So the
34:55
Speaker 1: rest of the sequence plays out where she after she
34:59
Speaker 1: makes a few failed attempts at fighting, she hides in
35:03
Speaker 1: a basket, then gets captured, gets loaded onto a truck,
35:07
Speaker 1: and is thought to have been killed in a big
35:10
Speaker 1: truck explosion. And then she disappears from the movie for
35:14
Speaker 1: about fifteen minutes and doesn't appear on screen again until
35:19
Speaker 1: Oh no. But it's to build suspense, doy, so she
35:26
Speaker 1: appears on screen again whenever Indiana Jones finds her in
35:31
Speaker 1: a tent where she is tied up, she is bound
35:34
Speaker 1: and gagged and he's like, hey, there you are. I
35:38
Speaker 1: thought you were dead, and she's like, give me out
35:40
Speaker 1: of here, cut me loose, and he's like no, that
35:45
Speaker 1: would be too says that they'll be on me. That's
35:49
Speaker 1: gonna risk you dying. The only thing that's more frustrating
35:53
Speaker 1: than a woman needing to be constantly rescued as a
35:57
Speaker 1: woman almost being rescued, and then the guy being like,
36:01
Speaker 1: actually not, and then they still end up together. It's
36:06
Speaker 1: just not a cute thing to do. I don't care
36:08
Speaker 1: what this movie tells me to feel. I don't think
36:09
Speaker 1: it's cute or charming. I understand. God damn it. He
36:13
Speaker 1: just left her with Nazis, right, And then we cut
36:16
Speaker 1: to a scene where the Nazis are talking about torturing
36:19
Speaker 1: her to get information out of her, which I think
36:23
Speaker 1: it would have been an improvement on the story if
36:26
Speaker 1: she was given information about the medallion that she not
36:30
Speaker 1: that I wanted to see her tortured, but if if
36:33
Speaker 1: she had had Because they get the medallion and there's
36:36
Speaker 1: these markings on it that they need to have interpreted
36:38
Speaker 1: so they can figure out how high the staff of
36:40
Speaker 1: raw needs to be. It would stand to reason because
36:43
Speaker 1: she's been in possession of this thing for so long,
36:46
Speaker 1: because her father was a noted archaeologist who was an
36:49
Speaker 1: expert on this very ark of the Covenant, Tannis staff
36:54
Speaker 1: of raw stuff. You would think that maybe she would
36:57
Speaker 1: have along the way acquire heard some information about this,
37:02
Speaker 1: but because the movie God Forbid a woman knows anything,
37:07
Speaker 1: that doesn't become you know, world cannon. Until at least
37:12
Speaker 1: the early two thousand, women didn't know facts. But then
37:17
Speaker 1: we talked about this on the tomb Raider episode because
37:21
Speaker 1: we can very easily liken lot of craft tomb Raider
37:25
Speaker 1: to Raiders of the Lost Arc. And even in that movie,
37:29
Speaker 1: where we have a female protagonist who is driving the story,
37:32
Speaker 1: she is given most of the information she needs to
37:35
Speaker 1: propel the story forward, usually by men. So it's not
37:39
Speaker 1: even though that she knows the stuff or has a
37:42
Speaker 1: waited or like even it's not because it's like sometimes
37:46
Speaker 1: it's uh Mary Sue situation where it's like, how would
37:50
Speaker 1: she have known that? Radically? But it's like she could
37:53
Speaker 1: have sought out that information and found it, and we
37:56
Speaker 1: could have had her be actively looking for like that.
37:58
Speaker 1: But no, bret In staid, a bunch of you know,
38:00
Speaker 1: guys come up to her and they're like, hey, here's
38:03
Speaker 1: the information. You know. Anyways, See he's like, who is
38:08
Speaker 1: that and why is he? In Sagg now like that's insane.
38:15
Speaker 1: So after she realizes that Indiana Jones is not going
38:18
Speaker 1: to cut her loose and rescue her, she takes matters
38:23
Speaker 1: into her own hands, to her credit, so what she
38:27
Speaker 1: does is she tries to outsmart and out drink Bellock
38:32
Speaker 1: so that she can try to escape, because her whole
38:34
Speaker 1: plan is to get him so drunk that he can't
38:37
Speaker 1: chase after her whenever she tries to run away, and
38:41
Speaker 1: there's a knife that she threatens him with and it
38:44
Speaker 1: almost works until and he's mad. He's got a coat hanger.
38:53
Speaker 1: But she made that Nazi so mad with her knife
38:59
Speaker 1: and she's, oh shit, that not he pissed, and then
39:04
Speaker 1: she is made or maybe this already happens, but at
39:07
Speaker 1: some point in this scene, she is made to put
39:10
Speaker 1: on a sexy white dress basically like a virgin. We
39:15
Speaker 1: it's a wedding dress like it's just as she's putting
39:21
Speaker 1: this on, Belloc is spying on her, which means that
39:24
Speaker 1: the audience is spying on her while she's changing. And
39:30
Speaker 1: that's another sneaky moment where it's a moment of blatantly
39:34
Speaker 1: objectifying a woman, but the bad guys doing it, so
39:37
Speaker 1: you don't have to feel bad about participating, which is
39:41
Speaker 1: like not dog does not happen. It works, right, So
39:44
Speaker 1: that scene concludes with them taking her and then throwing
39:48
Speaker 1: her into the Well of Souls where Indiana Jones is
39:52
Speaker 1: already hanging out. This seems fun. At this point. We
39:57
Speaker 1: haven't seen Alfred Billina for well over an hour, and
40:00
Speaker 1: we're getting frost right there. You've had to pause and
40:04
Speaker 1: watch Shock a lot for a while. I had to.
40:07
Speaker 1: I had to keep pausing and watching a whole other movies. Yeah, um,
40:11
Speaker 1: watch all a feud in the middle of this. So then, um,
40:17
Speaker 1: she's in the tomb in that scene starts with an
40:20
Speaker 1: upshot of us looking up her dress while she's dangling
40:23
Speaker 1: from a statue, and then they now need to escape
40:27
Speaker 1: from this tomb, the snake tomb. The snake tomb. That's right,
40:30
Speaker 1: So she is less scared of snakes than Indiana Jones,
40:34
Speaker 1: but she's still shrieking at the top of her lungs
40:36
Speaker 1: throughout the entire scene. If we need to remove snake
40:39
Speaker 1: stigma as a future snake owner, let's normalize women with snakes.
40:45
Speaker 1: I guess I still don't support this snake things. Too late,
40:53
Speaker 1: I gotta Terry, Um, I need to fill it. So
40:55
Speaker 1: they're trying to escape, and of course Indiana Jones is
40:58
Speaker 1: doing most of the escape ing. She's mostly just squealing
41:02
Speaker 1: about snakes. Uh. This could have been an opportunity to
41:06
Speaker 1: because she has like because Indiana Jones has a crippling
41:10
Speaker 1: fear of snakes in the whole tomb is slithering with them.
41:14
Speaker 1: So this could have been an opportunity to make her
41:16
Speaker 1: more active and to have her be the one because
41:19
Speaker 1: she's not so petrified, being the one who is actively
41:22
Speaker 1: doing stuff to find an escape route. But of course
41:26
Speaker 1: that does not happen. So Indiana Jones he's doing he's
41:31
Speaker 1: whipping stuff, he's crashing through a wall. Um, he's doing
41:35
Speaker 1: all manners stuff. He's occasionally that that theme we all
41:38
Speaker 1: know and love starts to play in the crowd will
41:44
Speaker 1: go wild. And as my friends pointed out, because I
41:47
Speaker 1: watched this recently with Nolan, Alex and Jake and sorry
41:51
Speaker 1: everyone for hanging out with men, but that was the
41:55
Speaker 1: reality of the situation. So shouts out to my friends.
41:58
Speaker 1: But um, I think it was my friend Nolan who
42:01
Speaker 1: pointed out that he is an archaeologist and yet he
42:05
Speaker 1: is destroying an ancient historical site. Oh, he has no
42:10
Speaker 1: regard for the culture he's supposed to dearly love like
42:14
Speaker 1: and that's I mean, that is perhaps one of the
42:17
Speaker 1: more realistic elements of the nineteen thirties being presented, because
42:21
Speaker 1: like it's so well documented of like British it's it's
42:24
Speaker 1: like super fucking colonial ship of like if you're an archaeologist,
42:29
Speaker 1: it's basically sanctioned fievery because you're white. That maybe is
42:35
Speaker 1: the most historically accurate, just like he wants one thing
42:39
Speaker 1: and he'll burn down any other piece of ancient history,
42:43
Speaker 1: and archaeologist should probably be more comfortable around snakes. There's
42:47
Speaker 1: just a lot of like he's a very least an
42:50
Speaker 1: unethical archaeology. Yeah, there's there's no doubt about that. Also
42:55
Speaker 1: in this scene, because she's now in her in a
42:58
Speaker 1: wedding dress, he's where did you get this dress? From him?
43:02
Speaker 1: And she's like, I was trying to escape, no, thanks
43:04
Speaker 1: to you, And he's like how hard were you trying? Right,
43:08
Speaker 1: I'm like, dog, you had the opportunity to rescue me
43:12
Speaker 1: from a serious So she's like, well, where the hell
43:18
Speaker 1: were you? And then instead of answering, he rips off
43:21
Speaker 1: the bottom two feet of her dress for the torch. Yeah,
43:25
Speaker 1: and then they throw a bunch of skeletons at her.
43:29
Speaker 1: She's screaming, and then they get out of the tomb,
43:32
Speaker 1: so she is rendered I would say, more inactive in
43:36
Speaker 1: this scene than probably any of the other scenes she's in, which,
43:40
Speaker 1: as you pointed out, it's pretty inconsistent with like sometimes
43:43
Speaker 1: she's like doing stuff and it's in it's helping, and
43:46
Speaker 1: it's you know, further in the cause, and at the
43:48
Speaker 1: time she's completely damseled. So the next scene we come
43:51
Speaker 1: upon with her is the fight scene at the plane
43:57
Speaker 1: where she does some I would pretty cool stuff here.
44:01
Speaker 1: She hits the pilot with some wooden blocks who was
44:06
Speaker 1: trying to shoot indies, so she saves him there, and
44:09
Speaker 1: then she gets in the plane and shoots a bunch
44:11
Speaker 1: of bad guys with like the big gun. Um. But
44:15
Speaker 1: then she gets trapped in the plane and he has
44:18
Speaker 1: to save her, and then she is not on the
44:22
Speaker 1: screen again for a while because there's a big chunk
44:25
Speaker 1: of the movie where he's on a truck and he's
44:27
Speaker 1: punching Nazis. That scene certainly was long, but it's so good. God,
44:34
Speaker 1: I love it. The only thing that occurred to me
44:37
Speaker 1: during the truck scene was like, Wow, he must have
44:39
Speaker 1: really a high quality pants because anyone else's pants would
44:42
Speaker 1: have just, you know, totally deteriorated. He's dragging along at
44:46
Speaker 1: like seventy miles hour, so you know, good on his pants. Guy,
44:52
Speaker 1: they don't like pants. As far as I got into
44:56
Speaker 1: being engaged in that scene, hey, let's take a quick break.
45:02
Speaker 1: We'll put a pause on the conversation and we'll come
45:04
Speaker 1: back after the break. That's all breaks work. Yes, do
45:11
Speaker 1: do Do Do Do Do Do. It's hockey night in Canada,
45:23
Speaker 1: da Sweet saying on me, I can't believe you don't
45:32
Speaker 1: know that song. Oh my god. Okay, so we're back
45:35
Speaker 1: and this is the hundredth episode. Okay, so we're we're
45:40
Speaker 1: finishing up Marion's moments of activity. Yes, so the next
45:44
Speaker 1: scene we're gonna take a look at. Here is the
45:47
Speaker 1: scene on the boat. Well, first, before Marion even gets
45:51
Speaker 1: on the boat, she kisses Sala on the mouth to
45:55
Speaker 1: thank him, right, and he has a horny connection, which
45:59
Speaker 1: is her choice, but also as weird, like Indiana Jones
46:04
Speaker 1: doesn't kiss him on the mouth to thank him. So
46:09
Speaker 1: that part I mean it was stupid, but I don't know,
46:13
Speaker 1: Like Indiana Jones, he's so like, you know, all of
46:17
Speaker 1: his male friendships, he literally like kind of no homos
46:21
Speaker 1: his own friend when his friends like I'll miss you,
46:23
Speaker 1: and then Indiana Jones like that's clearly too much emotion
46:26
Speaker 1: for him. He's like you are a friend, like you
46:28
Speaker 1: are a good friend, and then you're like okay, so
46:31
Speaker 1: also only going to get so he would never say
46:34
Speaker 1: he missed someone, sure, But also in the very beginning
46:37
Speaker 1: with Alfred Molina, whenever he's like grabbing onto his pants
46:40
Speaker 1: and then pulls them to the other side of this
46:42
Speaker 1: like crevice. They've kind of like got their arms around
46:45
Speaker 1: each other, and then Indiana Jones pushes Alfred Molina away
46:49
Speaker 1: because do you know you're being embraced by a god?
46:55
Speaker 1: And second of all, I'll go on record to say
46:59
Speaker 1: I would get guarantee that we're talking Cannon. All of
47:03
Speaker 1: Harrison Ford's early characters are homophobic, not a question in
47:06
Speaker 1: my mind. I don't think Harrison Ford is really an
47:09
Speaker 1: ally to it or his character. Sorry, I don't know
47:12
Speaker 1: anything about him as a person, but all of his
47:14
Speaker 1: characters are part of like they're like rogue is charm is.
47:19
Speaker 1: They're not an ally to literally anyone. Uh. And I
47:23
Speaker 1: want to talk about him as like, you know, a
47:25
Speaker 1: man's man, but we'll get there. Oh yeah, there's some
47:30
Speaker 1: not the worst perpetrator of toxicity in the whole world,
47:33
Speaker 1: but you know it's certainly a purp, yeah for sure.
47:37
Speaker 1: So then they get on a boat. She puts on
47:38
Speaker 1: another sexy white dress, which she wears for the rest
47:41
Speaker 1: of the movie pretty much until the very last scene.
47:44
Speaker 1: And then she spends that whole scene trying to take
47:46
Speaker 1: care of Indiana Jones, for which he is not grateful. No,
47:51
Speaker 1: which is I think falls into the man's man's persona
47:54
Speaker 1: of like I don't need anyone to take care of me,
47:56
Speaker 1: independent man, blah blah blah. And this is kind of
47:58
Speaker 1: like a familiar scene too, of like the warriors wounded
48:02
Speaker 1: and now the woman must be his nurse. And it
48:05
Speaker 1: reminded me I was thinking immediately of that scene from
48:09
Speaker 1: Beauty and the Beast after the Beast has rescued Bell
48:13
Speaker 1: from the wolves and then she you know, heals him,
48:16
Speaker 1: and at first he's really mean to her, but then
48:18
Speaker 1: by the end it's like there's something here, kind of
48:22
Speaker 1: like the exact same road map for this scene because
48:26
Speaker 1: until this moment on screen, we have not seen them
48:30
Speaker 1: be Oh no, we have seen them be romantic. He
48:33
Speaker 1: kisses her, I think, whenever he finds her in the tent. Yeah,
48:38
Speaker 1: like there are moments, but it's just like, this is
48:41
Speaker 1: the first moment where he isn't totally nagging her, right,
48:47
Speaker 1: And it's also one of their first like private moments
48:50
Speaker 1: that they're not in grave danger. Right, it's like a
48:52
Speaker 1: quiet moment. So yeah, he's not quite as much like
48:57
Speaker 1: peacocking around. But even then still it's you can tell
49:02
Speaker 1: that this character is so steeped in his own masculinity
49:05
Speaker 1: that acknowledging that he needs help from another person pains
49:09
Speaker 1: him greatly. Also, his own physical fallibility is upsetting to him,
49:15
Speaker 1: which we find out in this scene as well, which
49:16
Speaker 1: I thought was like kind of an effective choice of like, Okay,
49:20
Speaker 1: at least Indiana Jones has an insecurity that we are
49:23
Speaker 1: now aware of. I didn't know that before, so that's something. Yeah, Oh,
49:28
Speaker 1: I forgot to mention that, you know, they kiss on
49:32
Speaker 1: a boat, not on like Hydros Titanic. They but but
49:37
Speaker 1: the spark simply isn't there. And then The next thing
49:42
Speaker 1: that happens is the Nazis invade this boat and then
49:47
Speaker 1: we you talked about this scene already where Indiana Jones
49:50
Speaker 1: hides but Marian gets captured, and then the ship captain
49:54
Speaker 1: Katanga is like, hey, let's keep her because she's got
49:58
Speaker 1: value where we're headed. And then the Nazis are like, no,
50:02
Speaker 1: she's our property. Yeah, like literally, she's property in this
50:07
Speaker 1: And then Indiana Jones gets on a submarine, but I
50:11
Speaker 1: don't think he goes inside, so I think we're meant
50:14
Speaker 1: to believe that he just like somehow hangs on the
50:16
Speaker 1: outside of a submarine for what seems like a journey
50:19
Speaker 1: of like several hundred miles. Sure, I'm like, I don't know.
50:25
Speaker 1: The rules of this world are very unclear. I mean
50:29
Speaker 1: probably a little bit on purpose. Where like there's one
50:32
Speaker 1: point where Indiana Jones gets literally shot, but it doesn't
50:35
Speaker 1: seem to slow and by that much. He gets shot
50:38
Speaker 1: and then punched in that bullet wound, right, and then
50:41
Speaker 1: he's like I'm fine, and he like later he's like, aoie,
50:47
Speaker 1: but give me a little kiss. It's like this, but whatever,
50:50
Speaker 1: it's an action movie, right. So then we arrive at
50:55
Speaker 1: the island where So this scene is interesting because in
51:00
Speaker 1: many action movies, the female lead is tied up at
51:04
Speaker 1: the end um usually so the male hero can save her.
51:08
Speaker 1: But an interesting thing happens in this movie where the
51:10
Speaker 1: male hero is also tied up and ends up being
51:14
Speaker 1: very passive during the climax of the movie. It's so
51:16
Speaker 1: weird how shares goes really steals. I thought that was
51:21
Speaker 1: interesting as well. I mean, and it ends up kind of,
51:25
Speaker 1: I guess, being a wash because no one really does anything.
51:30
Speaker 1: You kind of just trapped and they're like, well, just
51:32
Speaker 1: don't open your eyes and let's just power through the
51:34
Speaker 1: end of this movie. Yeah, it's kind of I don't know.
51:38
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess I don't feel one way or another.
51:40
Speaker 1: It's not as bad as like the normal Tolby mcguarth
51:44
Speaker 1: throwing Kurs and Duns out of the frame, or it's
51:47
Speaker 1: not as bad as specific Rim where the female protagonists
51:50
Speaker 1: launched out of the final scene via submersible, or like
51:54
Speaker 1: in Twilight whenever Bella's one's like I'm just going to
51:57
Speaker 1: pass out for the climax of my own story right,
52:00
Speaker 1: or the time she likes sleeps for three months because
52:03
Speaker 1: a breakup. I don't know, but I think ultimately it
52:07
Speaker 1: just ends up being just kind of an unusual choice
52:11
Speaker 1: to disable both of your protagonasts for the sure, I mean,
52:16
Speaker 1: I guess that. I mean, I'm grateful for the world
52:19
Speaker 1: that we have those face melting, head exploding shots. I'm
52:22
Speaker 1: glad that ghost looks like share. I guess that you
52:25
Speaker 1: don't really need anything outside of that. I don't know
52:27
Speaker 1: that was that was kind of I mean, yeah, because
52:29
Speaker 1: of the Nazis bring their own demise upon themselves, so
52:34
Speaker 1: it was interesting, not not a usual climax to an
52:38
Speaker 1: action movie. So I would say my overall thoughts on
52:43
Speaker 1: her participation in the story, what's her participation grade, Well,
52:48
Speaker 1: it's it's not very high. She she needs to be
52:51
Speaker 1: saved no less than probably five times throughout the story,
52:55
Speaker 1: if not more. She is I would say, more act
53:00
Speaker 1: of and kind of more headstrong than a lot of
53:03
Speaker 1: female characters in similar roles in similar movies. But that's
53:08
Speaker 1: not saying much because usually women don't get to do
53:12
Speaker 1: anything in these types of stories. And I think when
53:15
Speaker 1: it comes down to it, there's a lot of pluses
53:17
Speaker 1: to this character, but ultimately the writing of her is
53:20
Speaker 1: very inconsistent where the movie doesn't know how much they
53:25
Speaker 1: want or there and when she's there, the rules of
53:29
Speaker 1: how much she's allowed to participate it seemed to be
53:32
Speaker 1: very limited. I don't know that I could stay as
53:35
Speaker 1: sistinctly what she wants, Like what does this character want
53:40
Speaker 1: besides to not work at a dive bar? Like there?
53:45
Speaker 1: We don't really know, like where the goals for Indiana
53:49
Speaker 1: Jones couldn't be more clear, to the point where it's
53:52
Speaker 1: like I wish there was a little more but with
53:55
Speaker 1: Mary and it's like, well, what does she want? And
53:58
Speaker 1: I don't think that the movie really gives that a
54:00
Speaker 1: lot of consideration. Oh not at all. Yeah, I mean
54:03
Speaker 1: most kind of you know, romantic interests aren't given any
54:07
Speaker 1: sort of specific goal, especially you know, action movies like this.
54:12
Speaker 1: Some of them do and that's and that's great, and
54:14
Speaker 1: I think that should happen more often. But yeah, the
54:16
Speaker 1: movie doesn't give it a second thought. So speaking of
54:19
Speaker 1: their romantic relationship, here we here, we go there, I mean,
54:26
Speaker 1: I don't there's multiple ways to interpret it. Is the
54:29
Speaker 1: best I can say. Where sometimes when people say child,
54:35
Speaker 1: they mean a younger version of a person, because she says,
54:39
Speaker 1: I mean, it's also unclear how old her character is
54:41
Speaker 1: supposed to be. I think the actress is about thirty,
54:44
Speaker 1: but I don't know how old her character is supposed
54:46
Speaker 1: to be. But she references ten years since they first hooked.
54:51
Speaker 1: So let me break this down the scene where they
54:56
Speaker 1: first interact on screen together in the movie, which is
54:58
Speaker 1: when Indiana Jones walks into her bar in Nepal. She says,
55:04
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones, I always knew someday you'd come walking back
55:07
Speaker 1: through my door. What are you doing here in Nepal?
55:10
Speaker 1: And he says, I need one of the pieces your
55:12
Speaker 1: father collected, and then she punches him in the face, right,
55:17
Speaker 1: which is another That was the other thing I wanted
55:19
Speaker 1: to cite as like not like the other girl's move. Yeah, well,
55:24
Speaker 1: let me talk about that real quickly, because I would
55:26
Speaker 1: say in movies that it's like, oh, she's not like
55:28
Speaker 1: the other girls. There are other women too put her
55:32
Speaker 1: up against. And because there are no other women, I
55:34
Speaker 1: don't think the movie is actively doing that. I'll counter
55:38
Speaker 1: that with the type of character India's, which is, you know,
55:43
Speaker 1: I think it's made clearaters very early on, like he's
55:46
Speaker 1: the eternal bachelor type character. And why is he an
55:50
Speaker 1: eternal bachelor because he can't find a woman who can
55:52
Speaker 1: match him, you know, And so that's I think little
55:56
Speaker 1: things like that are meant to indicate, like here, like
55:59
Speaker 1: Indiana finally meets his match. I don't know. It sounds
56:03
Speaker 1: like that sort of tapers off as the series goes along,
56:07
Speaker 1: but as far as I can tell, because this is
56:09
Speaker 1: the only Indiana Jones movie besides The Child a Buff
56:12
Speaker 1: Bonus one that I've seen, and to me, it seems
56:16
Speaker 1: like the character was like, you know, he's like in
56:19
Speaker 1: his late thirties and is still single, unusual especially for
56:22
Speaker 1: the thirties, and it's like he's just he's a he's
56:25
Speaker 1: a professional, and he doesn't have time for relationships and
56:29
Speaker 1: unless it's some lady who can really keep up with him,
56:32
Speaker 1: so that I don't know, Yeah, I see that. Um okay,
56:36
Speaker 1: So back to back to this what's about to become
56:39
Speaker 1: a very upsetting conversation. So she punches him. She says,
56:43
Speaker 1: I learned to hate you in the last ten years.
56:45
Speaker 1: He says, I never meant to hurt you. She says,
56:47
Speaker 1: I was a child, I was in love. It was
56:49
Speaker 1: wrong and you knew it. He says, you knew what
56:52
Speaker 1: you were doing. It's not good. He says, look, I
57:00
Speaker 1: did what I did. You don't have to be happy
57:01
Speaker 1: about it, but maybe we can help each other out now.
57:03
Speaker 1: And then she's like visibly exasperated, and she says, do
57:07
Speaker 1: you know what you did to me? To my life?
57:10
Speaker 1: This is the scene that plays out on screen. Let's
57:12
Speaker 1: examine a conversation between the director Steven Spielberg, George Lucas,
57:18
Speaker 1: who is sort of the creative mastermind will say behind
57:22
Speaker 1: the movies, and Lawrence Kasden, the screenwriter of the film
57:27
Speaker 1: honestly rather than not. But we have we must. So
57:30
Speaker 1: this is a kind of spitballing meeting that they're having.
57:33
Speaker 1: They recorded it, and then this is from the transcript
57:36
Speaker 1: of the recording. So so I'll be kasidin, you'd be
57:39
Speaker 1: George Lucas, and I'll be Spielberg. Okay, I'm going to
57:42
Speaker 1: pretend Kasiden is British, so watch out everybody. So Kasdin says,
57:48
Speaker 1: I like it if they already had a relationship at
57:50
Speaker 1: one point, because then you don't have to build it.
57:52
Speaker 1: Org Lucas says, I was thinking that this old guy
57:55
Speaker 1: could have been his his mentor he could have known
57:57
Speaker 1: this little girl when she was just a kid, hadn't
57:59
Speaker 1: a fair there when she was eleven and he was
58:02
Speaker 1: fulty two. He hasn't seen her in twelve years. Now
58:04
Speaker 1: she's twenty two. It's a real strange relationship. Spielberg says,
58:08
Speaker 1: she'd better be older than twenty two. Lucas says he's
58:12
Speaker 1: thirty five, and he knew her ten years ago when
58:14
Speaker 1: he was twenty five and she was only twelve. Lucas
58:17
Speaker 1: is stuck on twelve. He says it would be amusing
58:22
Speaker 1: to make her slightly young at the time Spielberg and
58:25
Speaker 1: promiscuous she came on to him. Lucas says, fifteen is
58:30
Speaker 1: a right on the edge. I know it's an outrageous idea,
58:32
Speaker 1: but it is interesting. Once she's sixteen or seventeen, it's
58:35
Speaker 1: not interesting anymore. But if she was fifteen and he
58:39
Speaker 1: was twenty five, and they actually had an affair the
58:41
Speaker 1: last time they met, and she was madly in love
58:43
Speaker 1: with him, and he she has pictures of him, says Spielberg,
58:47
Speaker 1: and the conversation, My god, that is George Lucas. So
58:53
Speaker 1: Lucas wanted him. He negotiates, He's like, fine, I guess
58:59
Speaker 1: we can't do a of in but I'm not going
59:01
Speaker 1: above fifteen like Jesus Christ. So it is unclear what
59:09
Speaker 1: they settled on because they never articulate what actual age
59:12
Speaker 1: Marion rave Wentz character is. Karen Allen was thirty at
59:16
Speaker 1: the time of the movies, but I'm assuming the character
59:18
Speaker 1: is supposed to be playing younger, right, So because Harrison
59:22
Speaker 1: four is always supposed to be playing younger, and and
59:25
Speaker 1: because she says I was a child it was wrong
59:28
Speaker 1: and you knew it because she says that to Indiana Jones,
59:33
Speaker 1: I'm guessing they went with the fifteen narrative, but not
59:36
Speaker 1: over literally sets the parameter of like she cannot be
59:41
Speaker 1: of consenting age or it's not hot. That's literally what
59:44
Speaker 1: he says, right, it's it's horrifying. So my guess is
59:50
Speaker 1: she is a teenager. She's fifteen. Also, it is unclear
59:56
Speaker 1: what happened between them, but I think we can assume
59:59
Speaker 1: that they had sex and that he statutory raped her.
1:00:02
Speaker 1: Everything I could find in the original marketing and reviews
1:00:04
Speaker 1: of this movie referred to them as former lovers. I
1:00:08
Speaker 1: think it's safe to say that's insane. I was. I
1:00:12
Speaker 1: was so ready to give a little leeway. God, God,
1:00:17
Speaker 1: George Lucas, you fucking freak. So this is horrifying this
1:00:23
Speaker 1: once you realize this, because it recontextualizes their whole relationship,
1:00:29
Speaker 1: because we realize that Indiana Jones is a statutory rapist
1:00:34
Speaker 1: and that he had sex with a child, and she
1:00:40
Speaker 1: is the love interest for the rest of the movie.
1:00:42
Speaker 1: She agrees to keep hanging out with her rapist. And
1:00:45
Speaker 1: then this is a trauma. This is literally a trauma
1:00:49
Speaker 1: victim who he shows up after ten years and burns
1:00:53
Speaker 1: her building down. So, okay, recontextualize. This is a full
1:00:59
Speaker 1: on nightmare. Yeah, where you're your rapist shows up after
1:01:03
Speaker 1: ten years. Now he's a successful archaeologist, he's learned to read.
1:01:09
Speaker 1: He and then he refuses, like if someone you've raped
1:01:15
Speaker 1: is kidnapped by Nazis and you're the only one who
1:01:19
Speaker 1: can save them, save them her own rape, hast refused
1:01:24
Speaker 1: to save her from Nazis. Yeah, and and schoofy is Okay.
1:01:30
Speaker 1: She cares for him and kisses him and they are
1:01:33
Speaker 1: in love at the end. And the end in the
1:01:36
Speaker 1: fourth movie, The Fucking Piece of Ship that is a
1:01:38
Speaker 1: Kingdom in the Crystal Skull, they get married at the end. Okay, Yeah, this,
1:01:43
Speaker 1: uh who Okay, So the child line was red flag,
1:01:47
Speaker 1: but I I sort of instinctively gave it a pass
1:01:50
Speaker 1: of like she was she's clearly younger than him, but
1:01:54
Speaker 1: I didn't think it was a literal rape situation. I
1:01:57
Speaker 1: thought it was like she was. I. I mean, I
1:02:00
Speaker 1: guess I'm giving Georgia the costumes credit and like she's
1:02:02
Speaker 1: between the ages of like seventeen and twenty one where
1:02:05
Speaker 1: she's naive, but it's not a crime. She was a
1:02:09
Speaker 1: consenting party to this. But that is not well shit wells.
1:02:15
Speaker 1: And here's what is also extremely upsetting to me that
1:02:19
Speaker 1: as a kid who's watching this movie all the way
1:02:22
Speaker 1: up until I would say a few years ago, the
1:02:25
Speaker 1: implications of that conversation did not even register with me.
1:02:29
Speaker 1: So no, I didn't. I bet that with most people
1:02:33
Speaker 1: they did, it wouldn't. Yeah, I didn't notice them as
1:02:36
Speaker 1: being probably like that whole conversation. Didn't notice it as
1:02:38
Speaker 1: being problematic until probably like four years ago, and then
1:02:42
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, Indiana Jones, my hero
1:02:44
Speaker 1: is a statutory rapist. And I didn't think anything of
1:02:48
Speaker 1: it until recently. Sentence that, Yeah, that is very that
1:02:54
Speaker 1: is bone chilling, and it just goes to show how
1:02:58
Speaker 1: strongly ape culture is ingrained in just culture everything, and
1:03:05
Speaker 1: how movies like this reinforced and normalize rape culture, and
1:03:09
Speaker 1: and and and that conversation alone should be like studied
1:03:13
Speaker 1: because it's so it's such a weird enabling conversation where
1:03:18
Speaker 1: Lucas is clearly the one pushing the narrative of like,
1:03:21
Speaker 1: no younger, younger, younger, and then the other guys are like, well,
1:03:24
Speaker 1: maybe like older, and then he's like, nah, not legal though,
1:03:29
Speaker 1: and then by the end they've sort of become complicit
1:03:31
Speaker 1: of like, okay, not legal but not eleven. Like it's
1:03:36
Speaker 1: just such your duds enabling other dudes kind of conversation
1:03:40
Speaker 1: where yeah, there's one guy who's clearly the wrongest. Damn
1:03:45
Speaker 1: George Lucas, Holy shit. I mean, I knew you wouldn't
1:03:50
Speaker 1: allow more than one woman to appear in your movie
1:03:53
Speaker 1: is prior to two thousand and fifteen, but this is
1:03:56
Speaker 1: a this is a loop. I am deeply disturb by this.
1:04:01
Speaker 1: So all of my just for clarity, all of my
1:04:04
Speaker 1: notes on Marian were taken without this clear knowledge. Yes, right,
1:04:11
Speaker 1: but that's sort of how I experienced this movie. I
1:04:13
Speaker 1: think a lot of people experienced this movie where you're like, oh,
1:04:16
Speaker 1: you know, he's he's condescending. He might neg her every
1:04:19
Speaker 1: now and then, and we know that there's some history
1:04:22
Speaker 1: to their relationship, but overall he's punches Nazis, so he
1:04:26
Speaker 1: can't be a bad guy. And then you find out
1:04:30
Speaker 1: about this conversation and then you realize that she's intended
1:04:33
Speaker 1: to be probably fifteen at best, and the Indiana Jones
1:04:40
Speaker 1: is a statutory rapist. Can we talk a little bit
1:04:43
Speaker 1: about the Indiana Jones school of masculinity? Yes, Um, it's
1:04:48
Speaker 1: weird because I don't think that his character brings anything
1:04:52
Speaker 1: to the table of toxic masculinity that is necessarily new
1:04:56
Speaker 1: or even unfamiliar to most of a movie audience. Um,
1:05:01
Speaker 1: but it really does hit all the points where he
1:05:05
Speaker 1: has his no home a moment, a staple of toxic
1:05:09
Speaker 1: masculine characters. He has a moment where he outright refuses
1:05:14
Speaker 1: to be emotionally vulnerable in front of both a woman
1:05:19
Speaker 1: and a male friend, which I think is like a
1:05:21
Speaker 1: quality of toxic masculinity that isn't spoken frequently enough about.
1:05:26
Speaker 1: Of like he can't even be honest with his own
1:05:29
Speaker 1: male friend because he's just so whatever. There is countless
1:05:34
Speaker 1: moments where he's straight up the game, nagging, nagging, nagging,
1:05:37
Speaker 1: and it works. It happens even worse in the second
1:05:41
Speaker 1: movie and Temple of Doom. Well, and that the second
1:05:43
Speaker 1: movie is the one where his love interest tries to
1:05:46
Speaker 1: leave at the end and he whips her. It is
1:05:47
Speaker 1: like no, and she's like, I love you. One of
1:05:50
Speaker 1: the most most insane. I haven't seen that full movie.
1:05:52
Speaker 1: I've seen that scene a million times and it hurts
1:05:55
Speaker 1: my feelings. I feel personally attacked by that scene. Yeah,
1:05:59
Speaker 1: I mean it seems subtler in this but all the action,
1:06:05
Speaker 1: like nothing is subverted by Indiana Jones. In terms of masculinity.
1:06:10
Speaker 1: It sounds like maybe some action hero tropes are subverted
1:06:14
Speaker 1: by him at this time in history. I would say
1:06:17
Speaker 1: the main one is that he's also an academic, so like,
1:06:21
Speaker 1: you know, he's he's a he's a rugged. Well here's
1:06:24
Speaker 1: he like makes mistakes. That was something that I read
1:06:26
Speaker 1: was like that he doesn't do everything perfectly every time.
1:06:30
Speaker 1: It makes some more relatable. Yeah, like, for instance, he's
1:06:34
Speaker 1: a rapist and you know he's imperfect. But that's the
1:06:38
Speaker 1: thing though, like he is so many people's idea of
1:06:43
Speaker 1: what like an awesome male hero is in a story
1:06:48
Speaker 1: to the extent that I did kind of a little.
1:06:51
Speaker 1: I sourced it out to Facebook and I said, what
1:06:53
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on Indiana Jones as a character, especially
1:06:58
Speaker 1: earlier in your life? And I had to respond is
1:07:00
Speaker 1: from people saying I had the biggest crush on him.
1:07:04
Speaker 1: I wanted to be exactly like him. I studied archaeology
1:07:08
Speaker 1: or anthropology in college because of him. I went to
1:07:12
Speaker 1: the University of Chicago because he went there. I but
1:07:16
Speaker 1: he is such an iconic hero to so many people
1:07:20
Speaker 1: because he is sort of like the height of He's handsome,
1:07:25
Speaker 1: he's got a cool outfit. He punches people, and he
1:07:27
Speaker 1: whips his whip around. He rides horses, he drives trucks.
1:07:31
Speaker 1: You know, he's doing all this stuff. But he's also
1:07:33
Speaker 1: he cleans up real nice and he's a professor. He
1:07:36
Speaker 1: can self puzzles. He's pragmatic, you know, so it's like
1:07:39
Speaker 1: all these he has a sense of humor. He's very
1:07:41
Speaker 1: smooth with women. Think this exact same conversation with some
1:07:45
Speaker 1: small alterations apply to har and Solo, where it's the
1:07:49
Speaker 1: same like rugged, constantly nagging women hero and again I
1:07:54
Speaker 1: think that part of the reason these characters get away
1:07:57
Speaker 1: with being the way they are outside of clearly the
1:08:01
Speaker 1: time they were written in is because the villains are
1:08:07
Speaker 1: so egregiously bad that you don't notice, like you'll you'll
1:08:11
Speaker 1: give the hero a pass on literally anything if they
1:08:15
Speaker 1: defeat War two Nazis, like, yeah, of course we're going
1:08:20
Speaker 1: to root for someone to punch Nazis. However, because the
1:08:25
Speaker 1: bad guys are so bad, I think that it just
1:08:28
Speaker 1: conditions and audience to not examine the hero really at all,
1:08:32
Speaker 1: or like let him get away with far more than
1:08:34
Speaker 1: if you know. And these aren't my favorite movies either,
1:08:39
Speaker 1: but like the Nolan Batman movies, you think more about
1:08:43
Speaker 1: like is Batman actually that good of a guy because
1:08:47
Speaker 1: he and the villains he's up against are more frequently
1:08:50
Speaker 1: his equals and have more nuance, And when both sides
1:08:55
Speaker 1: are you know, presented with nuance, you will examine your hero.
1:09:00
Speaker 1: But that's not the approach this movie takes at all.
1:09:03
Speaker 1: This movie doesn't really want you to examine the hero
1:09:05
Speaker 1: too much. He looks nice and he punches Nazis and
1:09:08
Speaker 1: that's all they need you to know. So that realization
1:09:13
Speaker 1: really puts a damper on how much you can really
1:09:17
Speaker 1: like Indiana Jones as a character. So there's a lot
1:09:22
Speaker 1: to reconcile with this for me, and I would hope
1:09:25
Speaker 1: for other huge fans of this movie because on the surface, it,
1:09:31
Speaker 1: you know, just seems like a cool action movie where
1:09:33
Speaker 1: there's this like this rugged, handsome guy who's punching Nazis
1:09:37
Speaker 1: and and he's saving the world and all this stuff,
1:09:40
Speaker 1: and then is a red flag if he's in the
1:09:44
Speaker 1: movie in a leading role, it's a red flag. And
1:09:49
Speaker 1: especially we refer you to the pop culture detective video
1:09:54
Speaker 1: essay entitled Predatory Romance and Harrison Ford Movies, which examines
1:09:58
Speaker 1: how people specially young men watching primarily I believe Star Wars,
1:10:04
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones, and boy Bade Runner. But those are three
1:10:08
Speaker 1: huge fucking franchises that are to some extent all still
1:10:11
Speaker 1: around today, and Harrison Ford is still involved in all
1:10:17
Speaker 1: of them and no one cares. So that's fun and
1:10:22
Speaker 1: I love that. Shall we Shall we talk about the
1:10:26
Speaker 1: use of brown face in this I hear and I
1:10:30
Speaker 1: wonder if you can confirm this for me that this
1:10:32
Speaker 1: movie of the three is not the most egregious one correct,
1:10:36
Speaker 1: That would definitely go to Doom. We would need to
1:10:41
Speaker 1: do an entirely other episode on Temple of Doom just
1:10:44
Speaker 1: to unpack every horrible, problematic, racist thing that happens there.
1:10:48
Speaker 1: But this movie, which I also didn't quite fully realize
1:10:53
Speaker 1: until watching this on Amazon Prime, and it does that
1:10:57
Speaker 1: fun little thing where like the actor who's in the
1:11:00
Speaker 1: scene will pop up and it shows what character they're playing,
1:11:04
Speaker 1: and then you click on that that guy and then
1:11:07
Speaker 1: you see, oh wait, this person he's white and he's
1:11:10
Speaker 1: not playing a white person. The same for I believe
1:11:13
Speaker 1: he's credited in the movie as Arab swordsman. Yeah, that
1:11:18
Speaker 1: is also a white man in a very egregious instance
1:11:24
Speaker 1: of brown face. Let me just kind of quickly go
1:11:27
Speaker 1: through the different locations and the racist stuff that happens
1:11:31
Speaker 1: at each one. So characters who are not white in
1:11:36
Speaker 1: this movie are either usually played by white people or
1:11:40
Speaker 1: are just background extras. They're not given any significant screen
1:11:44
Speaker 1: time or characterization or anything like that. Um, And nearly
1:11:48
Speaker 1: every scene in this movie takes place in a country
1:11:50
Speaker 1: whose population is made up of mostly non white people.
1:11:54
Speaker 1: So keep that in mind. So first we open, We're
1:11:57
Speaker 1: in South America. What country in South America? He doesn't
1:12:00
Speaker 1: give enough to tell you it doesn't care. The presentation
1:12:05
Speaker 1: of and I'm pretty sure they are referred to as
1:12:07
Speaker 1: natives in this scene is ridiculous. It's like, it's just
1:12:14
Speaker 1: they go to such lengths to make the indigenous people
1:12:19
Speaker 1: of they don't care what country, seem like they don't
1:12:22
Speaker 1: have minds of their own. They will do whatever. The
1:12:25
Speaker 1: first white guy who comes along says, they're they're made
1:12:28
Speaker 1: to be dumb. They're made to stylistically look very primitive
1:12:33
Speaker 1: in a way that even forties is not at all.
1:12:36
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess we don't know where we are,
1:12:37
Speaker 1: so how could we know? It could be deep in
1:12:40
Speaker 1: the Amazon where you know, Western culture hasn't reached this tribe,
1:12:44
Speaker 1: but they're made to seem like there. It's it's it's
1:12:48
Speaker 1: glorified set dressing, which comes up again and again in
1:12:53
Speaker 1: all movies. But like, yeah, like the indigenous people of
1:12:58
Speaker 1: wherever we happen to be are largely treated as set dressing,
1:13:04
Speaker 1: as people to be killed by Indiana Jones. Boy does
1:13:07
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones kill a lot of brown people in this movie.
1:13:10
Speaker 1: Blankets stated, not even getting into brown face. It's awful,
1:13:15
Speaker 1: and also his whole objective is to take something from
1:13:18
Speaker 1: their culture and bring it back to Western white America.
1:13:22
Speaker 1: So then we are in Nepal and all of the
1:13:28
Speaker 1: native Nepalese characters are in the background. There are no
1:13:33
Speaker 1: major speaking roles for them. All of the major speaking
1:13:35
Speaker 1: roles are relegated to white people. There is a character
1:13:38
Speaker 1: who is credited as Ratty Nepalese. Awesome. He is played
1:13:44
Speaker 1: by a white man named Malcolm Weaver in Yellow Face Better.
1:13:50
Speaker 1: There's also a character called Mean Mongolian. He I didn't
1:13:55
Speaker 1: do enough research on that character, but the fact that
1:13:57
Speaker 1: there's a character called mean Mongole what else do you
1:14:00
Speaker 1: need to know other than it's It's just I mean.
1:14:03
Speaker 1: And then his best friend Sala is one of the
1:14:08
Speaker 1: most agreed to choices, playing a Welsh white man named
1:14:14
Speaker 1: John Reese Davies. Um. He later plays Gimli. That's true,
1:14:18
Speaker 1: literally gimlely playing a non white character. Awesome. Also, don't
1:14:24
Speaker 1: forget he made a bunch of anti Muslim remarks in
1:14:28
Speaker 1: two thousand four. He is also a Brexitter, so he
1:14:34
Speaker 1: and then we've got the Arab swordsman. Um, I'm sorry
1:14:37
Speaker 1: really quick for Salau. The John Yes, Darby Dave Davies.
1:14:42
Speaker 1: John Es Davies keep trying to not say that, and
1:14:48
Speaker 1: I said it. John Reith Davies was not the first
1:14:51
Speaker 1: choice for Salo. Do you know who the first choice
1:14:53
Speaker 1: for Salo was? Was it another wiker? Daniel de Vito
1:14:57
Speaker 1: was the first choice for Salo loss for the culture? Um? Yeah,
1:15:04
Speaker 1: And then there's some confusing ones. I think alf Molina
1:15:09
Speaker 1: exists in an uncanny valley of this world where he
1:15:13
Speaker 1: is of Spanish Italian descent, but you know he's playing
1:15:18
Speaker 1: a South American character, so you know he's still of
1:15:21
Speaker 1: exclusively European descent, and the character he's playing seems to
1:15:25
Speaker 1: be a native of South America, I think, without a question,
1:15:30
Speaker 1: and is also falling into sort of that trope of
1:15:34
Speaker 1: like the selfish, tricky native who he is presented as
1:15:40
Speaker 1: a guide, a subordinate of Indiana Jones. And then the
1:15:43
Speaker 1: first chance he gets, he's he's a liar and a
1:15:46
Speaker 1: cheat and he's going to sneak off and he'll be
1:15:48
Speaker 1: punished and killed. And that is exactly what happens, just
1:15:53
Speaker 1: for a moment of levity. For Millina was born in Paddington, London.
1:15:57
Speaker 1: I know he said it before. It's worth repeating, Wait,
1:15:59
Speaker 1: I didn't know that he really, he's frosts are past.
1:16:04
Speaker 1: It's part of why he's so pure. Oh my god,
1:16:07
Speaker 1: born in Paddington. But Alfred Molina loves marmalade sandwiches. I
1:16:13
Speaker 1: get along really well with geminis. This makes so much
1:16:16
Speaker 1: sense anyways, So I do feel a little better after
1:16:21
Speaker 1: saying that out loud. So if you yeah, the situation
1:16:25
Speaker 1: with Alfred Molina, it would appear that he is in
1:16:29
Speaker 1: brown face as well. I would. I would argue he
1:16:32
Speaker 1: is in brown face. And that seems to be almost
1:16:35
Speaker 1: a blanket rule of this movie, with possibly a few
1:16:39
Speaker 1: small exceptions of brown people of often unclear. We don't
1:16:45
Speaker 1: always know where we are when we do people that
1:16:49
Speaker 1: are actually from there, our sidelined and brown people was
1:16:54
Speaker 1: speaking roles are white people in brown face? Correct? Uh?
1:17:00
Speaker 1: And then in the scenes in Cairo especially, there's a
1:17:05
Speaker 1: whole fight that breaks out where a bunch of Arab
1:17:08
Speaker 1: people are attacking Indiana Jones for reasons that have never
1:17:12
Speaker 1: entirely been clear to me. Yeah, but it makes it
1:17:16
Speaker 1: seem like, oh, the people are just so violent that
1:17:21
Speaker 1: if they see a Westerner they're just going to freaking
1:17:23
Speaker 1: try to hit him right, which is another like common
1:17:26
Speaker 1: I think that even goes back to like a stereotype
1:17:29
Speaker 1: that's referenced in at and like the first line of
1:17:31
Speaker 1: Aladdin where it's like where they cut off your ear
1:17:34
Speaker 1: if they don't like your face. Just irrational violence, which
1:17:39
Speaker 1: is just fearmongering for Western white America is Indiana Jones
1:17:44
Speaker 1: is justified in stealing from these people and killing these
1:17:48
Speaker 1: people and ruining their history because they're bad and they
1:17:53
Speaker 1: are stupid and they don't know what they're doing. It's
1:17:56
Speaker 1: bad because then we cut to the scene where they're
1:18:00
Speaker 1: as a character who is credited as Arab Swordsman and he's,
1:18:04
Speaker 1: you know, slinging a sword around. We're saying the one
1:18:06
Speaker 1: who gets shot. He yeah, he gets shot because Harrison
1:18:09
Speaker 1: Ford had diary at that day and couldn't do the
1:18:12
Speaker 1: fight choreography movie Magic. I hate it. I hate it
1:18:16
Speaker 1: so but hey, you guessed it. That character of the
1:18:20
Speaker 1: Arab Swordsman is played by he's white white guy named
1:18:24
Speaker 1: Terry Richards. One of the only non white characters who
1:18:27
Speaker 1: speaks is Katanga, who, for Harry Potter fans also plays
1:18:34
Speaker 1: Kingsley shock Ball. Yes he dies. I didn't put that together.
1:18:39
Speaker 1: But totally um, well worth noting about that is that, yeah,
1:18:43
Speaker 1: so they're on the boat. We see several black Africans
1:18:47
Speaker 1: on this boat. They are the few people of color
1:18:51
Speaker 1: with speaking roles. But guess what they're pirates are They're
1:18:54
Speaker 1: still bad guys. I mean, I mean, yeah, pirates, you know,
1:18:58
Speaker 1: the ones known for raping and stealing. Uh. Not to
1:19:02
Speaker 1: be fair, Indiana Jones is known for those two things
1:19:05
Speaker 1: as well. Uh so really, perhaps they're just cut of
1:19:09
Speaker 1: the same cloth. But yeah, it's like, Okay, these are
1:19:12
Speaker 1: only these are the only non white characters that we
1:19:15
Speaker 1: were allowing to speak, and they're like, hey, let's sell
1:19:19
Speaker 1: the only female character into prostitution. Well, yeah, you know,
1:19:27
Speaker 1: I can't remember when I was like there's some nuance
1:19:29
Speaker 1: to this. I honestly no longer feel that way. Yeah,
1:19:33
Speaker 1: feel that way that I've got. Really there's a there's
1:19:36
Speaker 1: a storm brewing in my head about I mean, yeah,
1:19:40
Speaker 1: I I mean, and I have no attachment to these
1:19:44
Speaker 1: so it's yeah, yeah, um. A few lost things I
1:19:48
Speaker 1: wanted to bring up is that, as with many action
1:19:51
Speaker 1: movie franchises, the hero gets older, but the love interests
1:19:57
Speaker 1: stay the same age or in some case as they
1:20:00
Speaker 1: get younger. So talking strictly about the actors that play
1:20:06
Speaker 1: the female leads in these movies, so not the character's ages,
1:20:14
Speaker 1: but the actor's ages. At the time Raiders of the
1:20:17
Speaker 1: Last Arc comes out, Harrison Ford is thirty nine years old.
1:20:22
Speaker 1: Karen Allen is thirty not the worst, not not too
1:20:27
Speaker 1: big of an age difference, a nine year age difference,
1:20:30
Speaker 1: not not too bad. Now in Temple of Doom, Kate
1:20:33
Speaker 1: cap shot thirty one. Um, but Harrison Ford is forty two,
1:20:39
Speaker 1: so he's now eleven years older than her. Here's the
1:20:42
Speaker 1: real kicker, Alison Duty actor who she plays the female
1:20:50
Speaker 1: lead in The Last Crusade. Now she eleven or she's twelve?
1:20:55
Speaker 1: She is was never clear. Harrison Ford is forty seven hot,
1:21:00
Speaker 1: Alison Duty is twenty three. So oh I, I'm exhausted.
1:21:08
Speaker 1: The one exception is in Crystal Skull when Karen Allen
1:21:12
Speaker 1: reprises her role as Marion raven Wood and she and
1:21:17
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones get married, and that is that. But um,
1:21:22
Speaker 1: sure there's I mean, we don't have time to talk
1:21:25
Speaker 1: about all the problematic elements of the other Indiana Jones movies.
1:21:29
Speaker 1: Rest assured there are many, and I don't know, if
1:21:32
Speaker 1: we'll do episodes on them in the future, we'll see.
1:21:34
Speaker 1: But there's a lot to unpack there as well. Yeah,
1:21:37
Speaker 1: this so overall, I think, honestly, like the discussion of
1:21:43
Speaker 1: this movie has made me like it less. I started
1:21:47
Speaker 1: off on the fence, and now I'm off the fence
1:21:52
Speaker 1: on the side of I don't ever want to see
1:21:54
Speaker 1: this movie again. Well, that's what happens because when you
1:21:57
Speaker 1: just watch something at face value and you forget about
1:22:01
Speaker 1: all the problematic things that go into the development and
1:22:05
Speaker 1: the making of these movies because you're not aware of
1:22:08
Speaker 1: that because you're just watching the movie. You're having a
1:22:10
Speaker 1: good time. There's punching, and there's action scenes, and there's
1:22:13
Speaker 1: big step pieces, and it's a story that I would
1:22:16
Speaker 1: argue is fairly well crafted. There is, you know, the
1:22:19
Speaker 1: cinema thought was put into it. I mean it was like,
1:22:22
Speaker 1: how old was the character when Arison Ford first fucked?
1:22:26
Speaker 1: Or was she eleven? Or was she twelve? There's a
1:22:28
Speaker 1: lot of stuff to unpack. George Lucas is known for
1:22:31
Speaker 1: his world buildings, so this level of attention to perverted
1:22:34
Speaker 1: detail really admirable. I want to throw a brick at someone.
1:22:38
Speaker 1: I'm like, what the fuck, dude? Yes, so happy one
1:22:44
Speaker 1: episode we started in such high spirits. Okay, let's does
1:22:48
Speaker 1: it pass well real quick? Uh, A few last things.
1:22:52
Speaker 1: If anyone who's is paying attention to the anagrams of
1:22:56
Speaker 1: of my name, Caitlin Durante, I've got a few relevant
1:23:00
Speaker 1: ones for this movie to just to bring some levity
1:23:03
Speaker 1: back to the conversation. So for this one, you have
1:23:06
Speaker 1: to suspend your disbelief for the spelling of the plural
1:23:11
Speaker 1: of the word tarantula, and you have to assume that
1:23:14
Speaker 1: it's tarantula laid on me. If you recall the scene
1:23:18
Speaker 1: where Alfred Molina is covered in Tarantula's um, just consider
1:23:23
Speaker 1: that the name Caitlin Darante anagrams too nice tarantula D.
1:23:28
Speaker 1: So yeah, some tarantulas. We got some good dick out there,
1:23:31
Speaker 1: and they're they're so okay. So that trrent okay, So
1:23:35
Speaker 1: we're okay, Yeah, we should be acknowledging tarrant D. Yeah,
1:23:42
Speaker 1: tarrantual i D. And then even more relevant is the
1:23:46
Speaker 1: fact that Caitlin Darante anagrams to Indiana clutter. So there's
1:23:52
Speaker 1: a whole clutter of problematic ship that happens in Indiana Jones.
1:23:57
Speaker 1: Perhaps more pertinent than everything is that this movie does
1:24:01
Speaker 1: not pass the battle test. No, it comes closer than
1:24:06
Speaker 1: I thought too, because there is a quick scene where
1:24:10
Speaker 1: Salah's wife says to Mary, his wife, his wife, they're
1:24:16
Speaker 1: at Salah's house. There's a monkey there. Marian says, what
1:24:18
Speaker 1: an adorable creature. Sala's wife says, then it shall be
1:24:21
Speaker 1: welcome in our house. Marian says, no, you don't have
1:24:24
Speaker 1: to keep it here just because of me. The thing is,
1:24:28
Speaker 1: we do not learn Sala's wife's name, so that conversation
1:24:32
Speaker 1: does not pass. I checked. Yeah, yeah, that's a that's
1:24:36
Speaker 1: a miss. Honestly, I would be more upset if it did,
1:24:39
Speaker 1: by you know, the skin of its teeth. I think
1:24:42
Speaker 1: that it's it is for the best that it doesn't,
1:24:45
Speaker 1: right because there are so The only scene where you
1:24:48
Speaker 1: see a clutter of women, if you will, we move
1:24:51
Speaker 1: in clutters is the scene at the very beginning when
1:24:54
Speaker 1: he is in his classroom, and because he's such a
1:24:58
Speaker 1: man's man and a ladies man, the only people taking
1:25:02
Speaker 1: his class are a clutter of women, and one of
1:25:05
Speaker 1: them even has I Love you written across her eyelids.
1:25:09
Speaker 1: So um, it just it's like, Oh, look, how cool
1:25:12
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones is he? I wonder if he ever abuses
1:25:15
Speaker 1: that power dynamics. Oh wait, I guess. I guess. Also,
1:25:21
Speaker 1: there is a queer icon in this movie, and that
1:25:23
Speaker 1: is boy who gives Dr Jones and apple as he's
1:25:27
Speaker 1: dismissing class. So I think queer icon boy that he
1:25:32
Speaker 1: moved on doesn't doesn't pass. Honestly, I'm glad it doesn't pass.
1:25:36
Speaker 1: I wasn't tread. I'm not trying to give this movie
1:25:38
Speaker 1: any more points. Well, speaking of, let's write, all right,
1:25:44
Speaker 1: the hundred nipple bestow upon. Okay, I'm gonna give this
1:25:50
Speaker 1: one quarter nipple if you just isolate Marion's character. And
1:25:56
Speaker 1: we say this for a lot of action movies where
1:25:57
Speaker 1: if you isolate the one female character, she seems fairly
1:26:02
Speaker 1: smart and competent and capable, and if she was given
1:26:07
Speaker 1: her own movie that she was the hero of, she
1:26:10
Speaker 1: could probably do a pretty good job. However, because she
1:26:17
Speaker 1: is a grape victim and framed pretty much only as
1:26:23
Speaker 1: the romantic interest with no other real involvement in the story,
1:26:29
Speaker 1: Because she is put in situations where she has damseled
1:26:34
Speaker 1: several times, you know she's she's held captive and she
1:26:38
Speaker 1: has to be saved, and the few times we see
1:26:40
Speaker 1: her doing something active in the story, it doesn't really
1:26:45
Speaker 1: make that much of a dent because it's usually Indiana
1:26:48
Speaker 1: Jones pushing the story forward. And the fact that when
1:26:51
Speaker 1: the people who were developing this story thought that she
1:26:55
Speaker 1: should be eleven whenever Indiana Jones had sex with her
1:27:00
Speaker 1: and then completely ignored the fact that it's so obvious
1:27:04
Speaker 1: that men wrote this because yeah, they don't even consider
1:27:08
Speaker 1: that she is a rape victim who then, according to
1:27:11
Speaker 1: the story, later goes on adventures with him and then
1:27:14
Speaker 1: later marries him. I have an ulcer like I I can.
1:27:18
Speaker 1: I can no longer endure what this movie is foisting
1:27:22
Speaker 1: upon us. Yeah, it's real upsetting, and the fact that
1:27:27
Speaker 1: there's just so much brown face and yellow face and
1:27:31
Speaker 1: the way that indigenous cultures and the way that non
1:27:34
Speaker 1: white people are treated in this movie is just horrendous.
1:27:39
Speaker 1: And this, honestly, I love us. I love our show.
1:27:46
Speaker 1: I love the hundredth episode. I feel like kind of
1:27:49
Speaker 1: sick to my stomach right now. This makes me genuinely
1:27:53
Speaker 1: like it's it's just so frustrated how little so many
1:27:59
Speaker 1: cultures have to latch onto as media that they can
1:28:04
Speaker 1: stand by with a clear conscience. Uh, and that's sort
1:28:08
Speaker 1: of what our show maybe, I mean, I guess we're
1:28:10
Speaker 1: ending kind of on a somber note. I'm giving it,
1:28:12
Speaker 1: I'll give I'll give it a quarter nipple as well.
1:28:15
Speaker 1: Uh for letting a woman exist within very specific parameters
1:28:20
Speaker 1: that white female, hetero rape victim can exist in this world.
1:28:25
Speaker 1: But that aside, and I'm giving it to the tarantula. Uh,
1:28:30
Speaker 1: but that aside, I mean, or a hundredth episode. On
1:28:33
Speaker 1: a somber note, it really is like some some days
1:28:37
Speaker 1: it's it sucks just to think of I mean, and
1:28:41
Speaker 1: it is fun and at least interesting to navigate. Okay,
1:28:46
Speaker 1: this is for you. I mean, this is a piece
1:28:48
Speaker 1: of media that meant a lot to you and influenced you.
1:28:52
Speaker 1: I think I became as interested in anthropology as I
1:28:55
Speaker 1: am because of these movies. There you go, and so
1:28:58
Speaker 1: it's like, there are you can race positive effects that
1:29:02
Speaker 1: this piece of media has had in your life, and
1:29:04
Speaker 1: that is like worth exploring. And and so it's kind
1:29:09
Speaker 1: of impossible because media shapes who we are so much.
1:29:11
Speaker 1: It's it's it is impossible to completely divorce yourself from
1:29:15
Speaker 1: a piece of media, because it's already shaped who you
1:29:18
Speaker 1: are in some ways. And then like looking at in
1:29:21
Speaker 1: the face is super important and we need to do it.
1:29:24
Speaker 1: But sometimes it's just like I need a mice hard lemonade,
1:29:29
Speaker 1: which I didn't mean what if this was an ad?
1:29:34
Speaker 1: This is just a two hour way down That's what
1:29:41
Speaker 1: I grab. You know what a world too? Oh I do?
1:29:49
Speaker 1: I feel a little bit sick. It's just it's upsetic.
1:29:52
Speaker 1: Everyone has so little to feel good about, and the
1:29:56
Speaker 1: things that we turn to to feel good about are
1:29:57
Speaker 1: also bad. So cheers to a hundred. Maybe this is
1:30:03
Speaker 1: the burden we bear though. As the host of the
1:30:05
Speaker 1: Bechtel Cast, puke, We're we're going to get more golfs trivia.
1:30:10
Speaker 1: I'm going to cause plays, Luke. So I'm gonna I'm
1:30:13
Speaker 1: gonna go full Paris tonight. I'm gonna be just gonna
1:30:15
Speaker 1: be like on it. I'm gonna be a student. I
1:30:19
Speaker 1: love my homework. Let's get out of here, honestly, thank
1:30:23
Speaker 1: you for listen. We love our We love you guys. Oh,
1:30:26
Speaker 1: I guess let's send the episode as we normally would. Yeah,
1:30:30
Speaker 1: let's okay, let's take a deep breath everyone with us,
1:30:35
Speaker 1: And yes, there's a lot to be upset about, especially
1:30:40
Speaker 1: in regards to this film that I unfortunately still enjoy
1:30:45
Speaker 1: and we'll watch, but because it's like it's a part
1:30:48
Speaker 1: of you, it's a part of me. But I guess
1:30:51
Speaker 1: feel comforted in acknowledging and recognizing how problematic it is.
1:30:55
Speaker 1: And I hope it didn't shape me for the worst.
1:30:59
Speaker 1: It's kind of hard to tell sometimes the impact that
1:31:02
Speaker 1: media has on you. I did take four anthropology classes
1:31:07
Speaker 1: in college because I loved these movies so much. But
1:31:12
Speaker 1: I it's listen. I mean, Tanya Harding is my hero,
1:31:16
Speaker 1: used to be my hero, and she's like, alt right,
1:31:20
Speaker 1: we all have our crosses, she's not she's all lives matter,
1:31:24
Speaker 1: she's whatever. Whatever. Everyone has these things, and it's just
1:31:30
Speaker 1: we encourage you to just have conversations about it and
1:31:36
Speaker 1: don't feel guilty or like you have to bear the
1:31:39
Speaker 1: burden of something that shaped you when you were very young.
1:31:43
Speaker 1: It's understandable, it happens to us all. But also don't
1:31:46
Speaker 1: shy away from having the discussion. And uh, you know,
1:31:50
Speaker 1: if if you're not sober and you're you're you're willing
1:31:54
Speaker 1: to uh you know, crack open a Mike's hard when
1:31:57
Speaker 1: you have these discussions, we we hear the battle can't
1:32:00
Speaker 1: occur to that enough. This is a whole two hour
1:32:03
Speaker 1: episode has been an advertisement for my talk Lemonade. Thank
1:32:06
Speaker 1: you so much for listening to the backtel Thank you.
1:32:08
Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at
1:32:10
Speaker 1: betel Cast. You can rate and review us on iTunes
1:32:14
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcast. You can go to
1:32:17
Speaker 1: our website becktelcast dot com and we would highly recommend I.
1:32:20
Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this episode, if you enjoyed just the gals,
1:32:24
Speaker 1: the gals kicking it and unpacking some stuff, we encourage
1:32:28
Speaker 1: you to sign up for our Patreon ak Matreon that
1:32:32
Speaker 1: is Patreon dot com slash becktel Cast. For five bucks
1:32:36
Speaker 1: a month. You get too full sized bonus episodes with
1:32:40
Speaker 1: just Caitlin and myself in a more kind of like
1:32:44
Speaker 1: chill format. It's cash usually we're literally so it's also hot,
1:32:51
Speaker 1: so when you think about it, you're silly not to
1:32:53
Speaker 1: sign up. That's so true, Jamie. And also we are
1:32:58
Speaker 1: going to be doing a couple live shows on the
1:33:00
Speaker 1: East Coast coming up. We're gonna be doing a mini
1:33:04
Speaker 1: East Coast tour starting with Saturday, November three, We're going
1:33:08
Speaker 1: to be in Philadelphia at the Good Good Comedy Theater.
1:33:12
Speaker 1: Then on Sunday, November four, we're going to be in Washington,
1:33:17
Speaker 1: d C. More details to come with that show. And
1:33:21
Speaker 1: on Monday, November five, we are going to be in
1:33:24
Speaker 1: New York City as a part of the New York
1:33:26
Speaker 1: Comedy Festival. We're doing a show at Baby's All Right
1:33:30
Speaker 1: in Brooklyn, So we'll be posting updates and ticket links
1:33:33
Speaker 1: on our social media and on our website Backtelcast dot com.
1:33:37
Speaker 1: Go to the live appearances tab and we will have
1:33:40
Speaker 1: more details posted there. Also, we have another live show
1:33:44
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles at The Ruby on Saturday, November ten
1:33:49
Speaker 1: at nine pm, so keep abreast of the information via
1:33:54
Speaker 1: I did via our Twitter and Instagram. We will post
1:33:58
Speaker 1: the updates there. And I'm going to be in Boston
1:34:02
Speaker 1: doing stand up from October seventeenth through the two so
1:34:07
Speaker 1: check out my website Caitlin n dot com slash shows
1:34:10
Speaker 1: for more details on that. I'm also going to be
1:34:13
Speaker 1: teaching a screenwriting workshop on October at Improv Boston, so
1:34:19
Speaker 1: come on down to that if you want to learn
1:34:21
Speaker 1: from someone who does have a master's degree in screenwriting
1:34:25
Speaker 1: from Boston University. But again, I hate to bring it up.
1:34:28
Speaker 1: Check that out. Check out our live shows if we're
1:34:32
Speaker 1: coming to a city near you and we would love
1:34:36
Speaker 1: to see you there. Yeah. I think that about does it. Also,
1:34:41
Speaker 1: one last thing, go to our merch store t public
1:34:45
Speaker 1: dot com slash feedback doecast. You can buy and send
1:34:50
Speaker 1: us your picks. We love seeing your picks wearing the march.
1:34:52
Speaker 1: That makes us very happy. Yes, we love. We love
1:34:55
Speaker 1: posting it to our indeed, so yeah, grab your feminist icon, queer, i,
1:35:00
Speaker 1: et cetera, shirts, notebooks, phone cases, mugs, anything you want
1:35:05
Speaker 1: on TI Public and Jamie, thank you so much once
1:35:10
Speaker 1: again for being here with me. Thank you for being
1:35:14
Speaker 1: my friend, and thank you for helping the world navigate
1:35:20
Speaker 1: through this hellscape with your many pages of notes and
1:35:25
Speaker 1: your color coding. And I love you. I love you.
1:35:29
Speaker 1: Let's go to Gilmore Girls trivia. Do it right everyone, Bye,