Latest / Project Emerald Collective / Reflection and Self-Awareness Power of reflection
Transcript
- Eve: Okay, good morning everyone. So nice to have you here this morning with us. This morning I've got the pleasure of having a really unfiltered chat with Anna. And I'll get Anna to introduce herself in a moment. But for anyone that I haven't ⁓ that doesn't know us, that's just come across this content, my name's Eve and I'm the founder of Project Emerald. And we've recently branched out into the Project Emerald Collective, which aims to share knowledge ⁓ With women from all walks of life that I'm going to be interviewing that will collectively raise our vibration and also empower us to live a more intentional life. Because as we know we only get one shot and let's make it count. So over to you, Anna. So nice to have you here this morning with us. Anna Stover: Thanks Eve and thanks for having me. ⁓ By way of introduction, ⁓ I want to say that ⁓ I'm just turned 63. And I have my own business and based in southern Tasmania. I'm wife and mother to four children, although they're adults now. I've got two sons who are 25 and 28, and two stepdaughters who are 25 and 34, as well as two grandchildren five and two. ⁓ And out there in the world, I'm known as someone who helps people to think clearly. and take that chaos that occurs in our heads and all around us and turn that into something of clarity. So that's probably something that, you know, is good for people to know about what I do and who I am. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. Yes. And you know, that's we're all here to kind of get that clarity and take our power back as women. So you've got so much life experience to share, so I'm so excited to get into the content today. So ⁓ to kick things off, Anna, what does living intentionally mean to you today? Anna Stover: Mm, today. ⁓ well I'd have to say that ⁓ the main the main thing that I can see is that over a lifetime of you know 63 years, it's taken me a long time to even work out how to be intentional in what I do. So a lot of my life was just well, you know, the next situation comes along, the next opportunity comes along, the next problem comes along. But as I've got older and I've done a lot of work on understanding how human Humans behave and act and why we do what we do. And what I'd say is that it takes a long time to work out what it is you should really be intending to do anyway. ⁓ So what that looks like now is a whole lot of reflection, a whole lot of considering what is it that would lead to a satisfactory life, like versus a successful life. So what it what satisfies me right now? And so that That's something to think about is what actually is satisfying because I think in our heads we have success, ⁓ like lots of money, or lots of rep, you know, good reputation or business or whatever it is, but it's often not that. So everything I do now really is quite intentional. Like, is this a thing I really want to do, or am I just doing it because I feel like I should? So that's probably what I'd say about living an intentional life as someone in their 60s. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. And I've just have I've ⁓ recently had a light shone on that word should and I really hate it. ⁓ and I've written a substack article about it actually that's coming out this week. But can we s just stop shoulding all over ourselves? Like if you ⁓ if you're saying should, it's obviously something that you don't actually want to do. ⁓ and it feels like you don't have the power to change it. Anna Stover: Okay. Eve: ⁓ in some aspects, like it's in the too hard basket, but ⁓ yeah, in the article it talks more about ⁓ changing should to could. ⁓ so anyway, we'll just we'll jump back into the interview today. So looking back across your career and life, what lessons have had the biggest impact on how you live your life? Anna Stover: ⁓ gosh. well look I think one of the things is to reflect. You know, so so stuff happens, like good stuff, bad stuff, stuff. You know, we all go through this up and down, and I try really hard not to talk in ⁓ you know saying things like life is a journey, but quite honestly, I cannot think of a better way of saying it. And so in terms of life lessons, And I and we encourage our kids to do this too. Like you there's a lesson in everything, and sometimes it takes such a long time to to unpack what that is because you're so busy beating yourself up or beating the other person up or whatever it is. But I'd have to say the life lessons are you know, everything gets revealed sooner or later, everything makes sense, and the things that are bad or the things that people did to you. There's a lesson to learn in that. Like, how did you come out of that? What did you learn from that experience? You know, no matter what. So I'd have to say the life lessons are to really reflect and to take responsibility for the fact that you're part of it, you know. So I had a relationship that failed, and it's like, well, I was part of that. Like I got something to do with that. Or something didn't go well at work. Well, I've actually got something. To do with that. I'm here. So it's that idea of being responsible for the fact that you're here in this environment and it's got something to do with you. Not like it's your fault, but it's got something to do with you, and therefore you've got some control over it. So I don't know if that's that's answered the life lesson question, but there are lots of lessons to be learned all over the place. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. And I think you touched on the power of reflection, ⁓ which is super powerful in itself. And also giving yourself the pause and the space to have that time to reflect and, you know, learn the lesson or celebrate the win, ⁓ whichever it is. Could be both at the same time. yeah, I think there's power in the pause. Anna Stover: Hmm, definitely. Eve: So which yeah, we touched on this briefly earlier, but how has your definition of success changed over time, do you think? Anna Stover: ⁓ gosh. I can remember thinking success was when I've got a husband, when I've got a house and when I've got babies. Now I had all of those things. That was not success. There was something else, and I didn't know what it was. And I've literally been searching for what is that thing that I'm striving for. I've been searching for that for you know nearly 30 years with all the development work I've done. And I think what I got to is success is kind of whatever you say it is. And ⁓ I did a great training program that talked about forget about the word success and think about the word success. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: Satisfaction or satisfy. So rather than going, ⁓ well, I'll be successful when I'm a millionaire or whatever we want to say, like what what amount of money would satisfy me? And what kind of relationship would satisfy me? And what kind of environment would satisfy me? And what happens when you do that, I in my experience, is there's a sense of peace. Eve: Yeah. Anna Stover: ⁓ because I've done a lot of training with a lot of very, very successfully, globally successful wealthy people, and yet here I am licking living in our little house in you know country Tasmania. I'm totally satisfied. I'm totally satisfied. I don't want to be, you know, a flying around the world in first class, business class kind of person. It's great if you can, but that's not the satisfaction I'm looking for. So I think this idea Of success is this, I don't know, globally agreed thing we all strive for. It's just not true. It's just not true that success can look like whatever you say satisfies you. And I'd have to say, when people start to think like that, a whole lot of stress and you know, shoulds and all of that stuff just drops. Just drops. So that's what I'd say about success. Eve: Mm. Yeah, that's a great reflection. ⁓ and You know, it's not like, you know, these social media lives and these, you know, Instagram perfect lives and you know, have us all thinking that we're not enough. And I'm just annoyed with that. And I just feel like we're so much more than a picture on a social media post. Like there's we've you know, they might be real and you know, you could feel those feelings of, you know, wanting to share that with the world. And that's that's awesome. But how you know the how it has the power to undermine how you're feeling and eat away at your confidence is something that doesn't sit right with me. So I guess you know these real conversations ⁓ that we're going to be having over on the podcast are Anna Stover: Hmm. Eve: about living more intentionally and finding, you know, having yourself having giving yourself that time to pause, reflect, and also get really real with yourself as to, you know, what success does look like for you, what satisfaction does look like for you. And, you know, I'm sure that you wish that, you know, you probably had realized that, you know, younger in your younger years. And I guess Or or not, ⁓ but it's certainly powerful. Anna Stover: Well, if I can say something about that, that if I had recognised that in my younger years, then I would have a different life. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: not not necessarily better just different and recognizing like going through hardships or stresses or whatever however you want to call it if we just had perfect lives we would not develop as human beings and I'm a really great d great believer in we are here on this planet for a reason and I think one of those reasons is for us to Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: Develop ourselves and our souls to be the best that we can be, whatever that looks like. And so I believe now that things get literally thrown in our way to help us get stronger in whatever way that needs to be, develop or evolve, whatever you want to call it, but also get on track. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: So over my life I can see lots of disappointments, you know, the job I didn't get, the relationship that didn't work, the house I didn't buy, you know, all of these disappointments or regrets. But what what I can see now is if you imagine your life is, you know, like a journey on a road, it's like those things got thrown in front of me to go, hang on, Anna, wrong way. You're going the wrong way. Get off this road. Go use you're meant to be going on. that road not this road so whenever I have clients and most of my clients are in are women in their 40s or 50s whenever they're pushing up against something I invite them to consider that that's just a like the universe going this is not your path Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: You know, this job, this promotion, this direction, this relationship, this whatever, this is not meant for you, or you are just meant to develop yourself in a way to overcome that obstacle. But either way, obstacles are there for a reason. ⁓ it's not well, in a way it is personal to you, but not like you're the victim of circumstances, but more like this is something for you to work through. So that's what I'd say about you. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: know if anyone's struggling now with something, it's happening for a reason. Who knows what that reason is, but it's happening for a reason. And I think a lot of the things that happened to me and now I can see part of that was so that at this age and in the work I do with organizations and teams and people, I have a level of experience and empathy, like yeah, I get what you're going through because I had that same thing. You know, like so I've got this experience I can share with people. so that's That's kind of what I'd say about this, you know, difficulties that get thrown at us and we lose we lose our way. So yeah. Hope that was helpful. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. And I think you do know that deep down. But it's just sometimes actually being okay with the uncertainty is the hardest part ⁓ to navigate through. Anna Stover: Absolutely. Yeah, and to add to that, what I f what I find with again with myself and my clients and my family and everyone. When confronted with something, we often we often don't know what to do, right? So it's like we we say that I don't know what to do about this. This is just a mess. This is just chaos. I don't know what to do. What I would say is you don't know what to do because you don't know how to think about it. And we get very trapped as humans into the facts and the emotion and the story and we bunk It all together. You know, ⁓ this is terrible, and ⁓ this has happened, and this. We get very emotionally attached to what has happened. When you can separate that, and honestly, it does take some time to separate the facts from the story and the emotion that you've got running about that. But if you can separate the facts and go, okay, here's what actually happened. This person said XYZ or this. investment failed or I don't know this thing happened now from a very objective factual point of view what can I see about that or what can I do about that but we tend to have this really negative experience or event and then just spin into ⁓ my god I don't know how to fix this and ⁓ this is terrible and now I look like an idiot and what are people gonna we just spin out of control and it's really really unhelpful so So I'm often interestingly, I was thinking earlier, I had a friend ring me once and she said, Can I talk to you? I n I'm trying to make a decision about buying a house and I know I know you can help me. And really, she was just stuck in this story about she should buy this house for her kids, but then she really liked this house and you know, so just thinking objectively about the situation you're in is the bit that's really, really hard for people. I think particularly women because we feel like we carry not only our decision making but you know the entire family or s you know whatever the the broader context is. ⁓ and leading on from that I maintain that one of the most valuable things that women can do is get an older woman and get their help. Now I've had older women all through my life just randomly show up or maybe not but you know the next door neighbour or the woman that I boarded with in my twenties or the lady that gave me massage in my 30s and so on. Always older women I have lots and lots of memories of where older women have helped me in all of these crazy chaotic situations I I found myself in and they helped by just bringing some wisdom to it and some peace Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: of mind to it and some objective thinking because I'm sure you you know the older you get when you reflect back or you're dealing with teenagers or whatever there's a piece there's a part of you that can go ⁓ my god what a drama like you know move on you can get over that kind of thing ⁓ so that's the other thing I would add to this is to get through life and to live a satisfied life find older women that you can relate to Not every older woman is the woman you should be hanging out with, but you know, find an older woman to help you and talk things through. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. And I feel like it's not usually your mum. ⁓ usually Anna Stover: No, it's not your mum. It might be your mum's friend. Eve: ⁓ Mum, I love you, but yeah. Someone that's not so invested in the situation is often yeah. So anyway, that's I guess yeah, that is essentially like what I'm doing with the Project Emerald Collective as well, is bringing in those older women like yourself with that wisdom that we can share collectively and learn and grow and lean on. So thank you so much for that. That's probably why I'm enjoying this conversation so much. Anna Stover: Totally. Totally. Mm. That's and well. ⁓ Eve: Yeah. ⁓ Anna Stover: Well, maybe, but the the thing about life and I look at myself now at sixty-three and I can remember in my forties interviewing one of my older women mentors who was sixty-three and the things she said, I was just like, ⁓ my gosh, I can't believe, you know, that she's saying these things, and I can totally believe it now. finding finding your group, like people call it different things, you know, your tribe, your people, whatever. But Surrounding yourself with people who help, not people who gossip or collude. Like if you've got a problem and you go to your friendship group and you go, ⁓ this awful thing happened, then they're just throwing kind of fuel on the fire. That's not necessarily the group of people that are going to help you get through life. And one of the things I found over the years is where I had friends like that, I tended to just not spend much time with them. Because I came away drained. I didn't come away going, ⁓ that was really good to talk that thing through and now I feel better. I came away going, ⁓ my god, this is just overwhelming. So, you know, keeping an eye out for people that you just connect with and people who lift you up and don't collude. And you know, if you come to them and say, I'm having this issue with my partner, they don't start saying, ⁓ yeah, he or she is a real pain, you know, like that's not helpful. So that's the Eve: No. Anna Stover: But that's the other thing ⁓ that I would add to this is is to to live a satisfied life, you actually need help. You don't always have to pay for it, but you do need help. You literally cannot live a satisfied life without help. It just doesn't work. I've tried it. It's really it's really painful. Eve: Yeah. Well, yeah, and it's it's isolating as well. Yeah. Anna Stover: Yeah, and you're in your own head. Like, you know, I read somewhere, don't ever believe anything you think. And I think it's true. We we just roll around in our own head and create this big mess, ⁓ and then wonder why we can't see the future. Hmm. Eve: Yeah, I heard the saying recently, you can't see the jar when you're inside it. Anna Stover: No, that's exactly right. You can't. ⁓ and I would say it is my training and practice. Like, you know, we go to the gym or we practice a sport or we practice a craft, but we don't practice what we let in our head. ⁓ and I was having this conversation the other day with one of my kids, is we we indulge the drama, we we really strengthen that looping in our head versus going, okay, yes, valid, and cutting that. Eve: ⁓ Anna Stover: ⁓ thought process and it and I've practiced for years and years doing that and still I get hooked in and I have to keep saying to myself remember remember this will actually make sense it will all it will all sort itself out stop telling yourself it's a mess etc etc and it eventually it works but it's a practice it's like a muscle you have to develop that kind of muscle if you want to move yourself in a in a way that that you feel drawn to Yeah. Eve: Yeah. What kind of tools have you developed over the years that help you with that? Anna Stover: well, one of the I mean, I've got all sorts of random things I do and they might not directly relate to that, but one of the things that I've been doing ⁓ each year for probably twenty odd years is to sit down and reflect on the past year. ⁓ and to a few things. Acknowledge what happened in that year and what I'm proud of. and acknowledge what I learnt. And one of the things I do is I keep ⁓ it's a it's a life phases tool through the work of Rudolf Steiner and I keep track of the things that happened in that past 12 months that ⁓ Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: are memorable. You know, like it's thing it's obvious things like, you know, someone died or someone was born or I moved house or I got a different job. But more than that, it's what kind of illnesses did I have, what kind of insights did I have? Which people did I meet that impacted me. And when you start keeping track of that kind of thing, you you develop a history. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: And you can actually start, you can do it now from early as you remember. You can think about what do I remember from my first year of life, what do I remember from my second year, etc. etc. And it's that work that we call biography work that helps you start to strengthen that capacity to go, ⁓ my life has gone up, down, up, down, up, down, up, down, up, down, and it will continue to do so. And what am I what am I seeing? What it where do I fall off the rails? And so as an example, I know for myself doing that work that you know as a young child I got in trouble at school, right? Most of us did, and that authority of the principal. Speaking to me and you know, being in trouble, that that feeling has popped up over and over and over in my life. And so now it pops up. If I've got a meeting with a client who might be like the CEO or the general manager or someone in authority, my brain automatically falls back into, ⁓ my god, I'm in trouble with the principal. And so there's this practice of me. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: going no Anna you are not in trouble with the principal yeah but those those early events in your life are still there Eve: Yeah. We've moved on from that. Anna Stover: You know, sometimes the five year old is still running my life. So there's this practice of almost stepping back from your thinking and going, What am I what am I telling myself up in here? So there's this consciousness of thinking that's really, really important and reflection because you can really only see your life from you know, looking backwards, like in a rear vision mirror in a car. You really can't make sense of life looking forward. Eve: Yeah. Anna Stover: to reflect back in order to look forward. So that's just some of the tools. Writing things down helps, talking to someone to to unpack your thinking really helps. They're the sorts of things that I do. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. And I guess having the awareness that you are not your thoughts. Anna Stover: I guess. We think we are. We think we are. ⁓ yeah, so I've done a lot of work around unpacking the way humans think. ⁓ they you know, like whatever's in my head is reality, it's actually not. It is really not. Eve: Yeah, that's really super powerful to have that realisation but also to then have that awareness moving forward so that you know you have the power the agency over your thoughts. Anna Stover: Yeah, yeah. And and we all think differently. So I know that I'm not good at thinking through certain things, but I know someone who is, and they're my in a way the other part of my brain. So I did do some training over the last 10-15 years, which was all about, you know, we're really good at thinking a certain way, like I'm really good at taking chaos and organizing it, but I'm not really good at big picture, strategic, anything's possible kind of thinking. So I have a group of people who are, and I go to them. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: When I need to think like that, and they literally help me think like that. So having this surrounding yourself in an environment of health is really really important if what you want to do and what you want to satisfy in your life is something that you can't do on your own. So that's something else to think about. Eve: Yeah, absolutely. Were there moments when you realized you were living according to other people's expectations rather than your own? Anna Stover: moments yeah pretty much my whole life ⁓ I think I think up until I was in my 40s which is not unusual in your 40s that you really start to take stock of what's been going on but yeah up until my 40s I was very much you know find find a man to marry have kids do this do that you know do all of these things that I thought Eve: No. Anna Stover: I thought people expected of me, including the entire, you know, the culture. ⁓ and it was really in my 40s that I started to go, actually, all of the way that I've constructed my life actually doesn't really work. Like it doesn't it doesn't serve what I'm here to do. I'm just not quite achieving what I can feel I'm here to do. And of course, at that time in my 40s, I still didn't really know what I was here to do, but I knew what I wasn't here to do, and it wasn't quite. That so something had to shift. ⁓ so yeah, that and that idea of expectations. Again, I I would say if I think about the expectations of others that I lived by, some of those were quite explicitly spoken, like you should not do that, you should do this, and some of those were just made up in my head. Eve: Yeah, okay. Anna Stover: You know, I just made stuff up that I thought my mum would expect me to do this or my boss would expect me to do this or my husband or whoever would expect me to do this. When in actual fact a lot of it was just made up and turned into a should. Eve: Yeah, right. Okay. And did you get intentional to realize like how did that come about where you realized had that moment of realization that you were living to other people's expectations? Anna Stover: It was it was in it was in some training that I was doing and one of the exercises we did was to write down all the shoulds. You know, write down all the shoulds, you know, in terms of your relationship, in terms of your money, in turn like everything you can think of where you are shoulding. Write all of those down. Eve: Okay. Anna Stover: And then and then the next part of it was to just see how ridiculous that was. Right? To see things on paper and get them out of your head, that's one of the main tools I use with people. But when you see on paper all of these crazy shoulds that you have been living against, you sort of have a bit of a laugh, but then you're also a bit cringy going, ⁓ my goodness. But then you start to look and go, what that's the standard that you created. You know, you created this standard called I should be the perfect mother, or you know, I should be cooking nutritious meals for my kids every day, or I should never lose my temper, or I should always be, you know, keen to have sex with my husband, or I should always be this or I should always be that. They are just these standards that I've was trying to live to over the top of a reality. Like what's really going on here? So it was that kind of exercise to really unpack. The shoulds from actually what's my intention underneath that? Like, my intention might be, you know, I want to be the best mum that I can. Well, that doesn't necessarily mean I have to cook a nutritious meal every night and do this and do that for my kids. It actually means I need to be the best person for myself first before I start giving everything to my kids. So it was really that process of getting emptying my head onto paper and I would recommend anyone who's stuck on anything just empty it on paper because when it comes out on paper there's a space in your head to look at it very objectively and not just keep looping. Eve: Yeah. That's so powerful. It'd be great ⁓ if after this ⁓ session you could send through five journal prompts ⁓ to me so that I can include it for the audience. Anna Stover: Three. ⁓ god. Okay. Mm-hmm. Can do. Writing a note. Get it out of my head. Eve: Great work, Anna. What role has confidence played, do you think, throughout your life and career? Anna Stover: Well, it's all bound up with everything I've been talking about. You know, when you're living the shoulds, then you're not particularly very confident because I don't know about you, but all those shoulds I had, I wasn't very good at achieving them. ⁓ and confidence I would say for me, I I really got confident when I understood my value. And I understood the contribution that I could be I could be in any situation. And up until I understood that, I just always felt like, ⁓ you know, I shouldn't I shouldn't say anything or I shouldn't do anything. I should just keep my head down. So it's very much again this consciousness of of what you bring, you know, what skills you bring, what what you're naturally good at. And again That's one of the things I work with my clients about. It's like, what are you doing every day that you are just so good at you don't even have to think about? And when you start to get clear on that, you become really confident. And like you heard me say a minute ago, I know I'm not good at thinking of really big out-of-the-box strategies, and I'm confident about that because I'm not pretty. Eve: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: pretending anymore that I should be good at that. I'm actually going, ⁓ man, I'm not good at that. I'm not good at small talk. I'm not good at this and I'm not good at that. And then there's a level of confidence, but I'm really good at this thing. So I'd say that about confidence and until Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: You start to wrap your head around that. I don't know that you can ever feel truly confident. And again, confidence is just a story in your head, but still it's pretty strong. ⁓ and there's a lot of ⁓ underlying stories that you're bringing from your childhood, you know, like I'm not good at maths, which is not true, but I've been carrying that for my whole life. Yeah, so that's that's my thing around confidence, I would say. Eve: ⁓ yeah. Yeah, that's a really good way of looking at it actually. ⁓ letting go of the things that you're not good at ⁓ and focusing on those that you are good at. ⁓ and I guess living your life not by expectation but ⁓ by intentionally creating it is gonna bring you confidence as well. Yeah. Anna Stover: Mm. Yeah. And creating it from what will satisfy you. Yeah. What will satisfy you. Exactly. 'Cause what satisfies me, not the same as anyone else. Yeah. Totally. Eve: Yeah. I know that's different for everyone. Yeah, awesome. so how my next question, how do you how do women sometimes lose themselves as they move through different life stages? Have you experienced Anna Stover: Hmm. Well, I've got an I've got an answer that you might not like, which is did we ever really find ourselves? ⁓ so how do we lose ourselves? Well, I kinda again, I believe that when we come into this life Eve: Yeah. Anna Stover: We have a purpose. We're here for a reason and it's like we forgot it. So to me, life is about remembering why we're here. Eve: Mm. Yes. Anna Stover: And all of the tools and the practices that I've been talking about today are all part of remembering why I'm here. And at each of the different phases of life, there's you know, there's there's something that we all go through. Like in our 20s, we are it's called the age of adventure in the in the biography life phases work that I do. The age of adventure, and everyone can think about anyone who's been Yeah. and is older now can reflect back on your twenties and kind of have a little bit of an internal chuckle and go, ⁓ my god, what was I thinking? I was here, I was there, I was like, my brain was all over the place. I didn't know if I should do this or that or whatever. There's lots of questions. And every phase of life there is a different, I guess a different focus that just arises within us. So what I was focused on in my twenties, I am not focused on that anymore. I honestly don't care anymore. And the same with your 30s and your 40s. So things shift. And so rather than saying, you know, women lose themselves, I think what's going on is we're trying to find our true purpose. Like, why are we here? And all these other things have got in the way ⁓ of why we're here. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: And I guess sometimes sometimes in our darkest moments, whatever they look like for each of us, there's that question arises, like, what the hell is this all about? Like, I'm exhausted or I'm sick of this or I'm over this. I don't know what to do. And that's those moments of you're here for something. What is it? Hmm. Eve: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I certainly had a lot of years like that. ⁓ so can you give any advice ⁓ you know, to our audience of how to rem like the powerful some powerful techniques to help you remember? Anna Stover: Well, the first question I usually ask people, and most people go, ⁓ my goodness, and that is, think back to when you were nine years old. Or eight. Eight or nine, right? Think back to that time of your life when you were eight or nine. What did you want to be when you grew up? And most people have a memory of something they wanted to be when they grew up. So if I think back to that period of my life, I was very clear and I've got this picture in my mind. I wanted to be a teacher. Now I became a teacher and I hated it. Alright? But if I think back as an eight, nine-year-old in the 1970s in country New South Wales, Australia, what I really wanted to do. What I knew deep down inside me that I wanted to do was called teacher because there was no word for, you know, mentor, coach, organizational development, like those words didn't exist in my environment as an eight-year-old. So I ⁓ had it in my head I wanted to be a teacher. And Eve: Hm. Anna Stover: It has evolved in that over the years, you know, I was a s I was a teacher and I really, really did not like it. And then I ended up becoming a consultant in the Department of Education and I really did like that. And then I moved into being a corporate trainer and I really did like that. So as I moved through my life, it evolved more into what I'm doing now, which is literally teaching managers how to manage, is what I say I do. I'm still a teacher. It's just not in that eight-year-old's mind. ⁓ as a school teacher as such, because I didn't have any other word for it. So when I ask that question of people that I'm working with, they'll often tell me, it's really common that they'll tell me it was something like a priest or a nun, right? Because they grew up in a in a Catholic school or a you know religious environment in the 70s or the 80s. But when they unpack it, it's the beingness. So for instance, a a client recently who said she Wanted to be a nun when she was nine, she said, but actually I can see now what I meant by that was nurturing and caring for people. Eve: Yeah, right. Anna Stover: ⁓ and a man I worked with said he wanted to be a priest, and he said, but I can see now, like I wanted to be like a scholar. I wanted to study because priests were always reading the Bible. So it was that image or that thinking of being a scholar. What other word can you attach to it in the 70s? Well, priest. So that's where I'd urge people to look. What is that thing? Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: That you really were in love with when you were eight or nine. I've had someone go from being an auditor to a florist because she saw that she actually wanted to be a florist. Lots of examples. So that's a place, that's a really simple place to start. And if you if if you can, ask your parents if they're still around, ask your siblings, like what did we do when we were that age? Like what was I into at that age? Eve: Yeah, right. Yeah, right. Anna Stover: Mm. Eve: Yeah, and it might not necessarily from what you're saying, it might not necessarily be ⁓ you know, the title that you gave it at the time, but it's the qualities that you were drawn to. Anna Stover: Yes, yes, exactly. Yes, yes. And I had an image in my head of putting a blue book on the table with some pencils. And when I do ⁓ my Women of Wisdom programmes, I will typically give them a blue book with pencils to do some drawing. So it's like I the day I did it, I went, ⁓ my goodness, there is my nine-year-old's memory of putting this book with pencils on the table in front of someone. ⁓ Eve: Gosh, that's so cool that that actually came to fruition and you know, you had lots of twists and plot plot twists and turns to get there. Anna Stover: Mm-hmm. Yeah, well it only t yeah, it only took like fifty years, but Eve: Well, at least you got there. Do you think it was meant to take like looking back, do you think it was meant to take that long? Anna Stover: Yeah, that's right. ⁓ and the crafting ⁓ totally, totally. Absolutely, absolutely. Because I you know, I I was a teacher and it was that I just didn't like that. Just wasn't it. But I kind of learnt the mechanics and I was terrible at it. And then I in the in corporate training I learnt content. You know, like corporate training is knowledge. It's just content. It's not implementation. It's just content. So then the next job I had was the failed practice as a manager, the content, and then I had an opportunity to put it together and train an entire organisation into how to be a manager. And then it started to evolve from there. And as well as the training that I'd done through Rudolf Steiner and his philosophies, it all came together. So all of these threads through your life, they all start to weave together if you're conscious of them. And that's why this reflecting on what do you remember from each year of life is really valuable because it starts to grab the threads. Eve: Mm. Yeah. Yeah, okay. Anna Stover: And you know, you start to weave those together to go, ⁓ this is all about, you know, this kind of thing. Eve: Mm. So and you're looking at the good and the bad of the previous year or years? Anna Stover: It the the language that is used is the trials and the triumphs. So, you know, if I think back the past year just off the top of my head, illness and what did I learn about that versus you know success in a particular ⁓ program I did with a client. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: You know, so it's things like that. But it's also it's not the physical stuff so much. You know, it's also like, ⁓ I I experienced a sense of peace around being a grandmother. Or, you know, those inner the inner life that we have that we often don't focus on because we're so materialistic or physical in what we're looking at out in the world. There's a whole lot of other stuff going on inside. So I'm often looking at, yeah. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: Now that that issue I had with that person's kind of just dissolved or I can feel myself less attached to that thing or that issue. Eve: Yeah. Yeah, time has the power to do that. I've found Anna Stover: Exactly. And that's why this reflecting on life is is so valuable. ⁓ I think the easiest way to describe it is you know if you see a movie and they're picking a lock and they're going click, click, click, and it's all kind of gradually clicking into place, that's my experience of looking back. Every time I look back through ⁓ my biography or life phases, I see something different. And I always laugh because I go, ⁓ my god, I forgot all about that. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: You know, and you you s you see it out in the ⁓ environment now, particularly in the news, where there's historical things that pop up for people. Because you bury stuff. You just bury stuff and you forget about it. You literally forget about it. And I've got examples of where I forgot about stuff. Not necessarily bad, just forgot stuff and went, ⁓ wow, why did I not even think of that before? And it's it's kind of like it just wasn't time to reveal that. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: So there's lots of things in your life that is that are useful to think through, but you've forgotten them. Eve: Mm, true. I find it powerful actually to look through photos on my phone occasionally, just random years. Anna Stover: Yep, yep, exactly. Yeah. And if you if you were to take that and to start to, you know, list down you know, the people that you were friends with and the things you were doing and the concerns that you had, you start to see a picture of like, ⁓ gosh, I'm always, you know, for me, I'm always thinking I'm in trouble, or I'm always, you know, drawn to these kinds of situations, or I always do well here, or this illness keeps popping up. What's that all about? Mmm. Eve: Mm. Yeah. Again back to the power of reflection. Anna Stover: Absolutely. And reflection in a constructive way, not a gosh, I'm hopeless, you know, I you'd think I'd learn this by now. Like not to beat yourself up. All of those Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: trials or things that went wrong or not wrong but you know all of those difficult situations there is a lesson in there and I know I had a really difficult workplace situation a few years ago and I knew there was a learning in there and you know it took me three years to get to the bottom of it. Three years and I went searching I searched so hard to work out what that was about and in the end what I worked out was This difficult situation was simply someone saying something that deep down I believed about myself that was true. And I just could I was just angry and I knew it wasn't them, but I could not get to the bottom of it. And eventually, through a whole lot of you know insights into different things, it suddenly dawned on me, ⁓ Eve: Yeah, right. Anna Stover: I actually think that's true about myself. That's why I'm so upset. Finally freedom. Yeah. I know I'm probably making it all sound like hard work. Eve: Yeah, right. Yeah. No. It's I mean, I guess it all leads to the satisfactory like the satisfying life. The reflection. And I guess uncovering those beliefs about yourself is only of is only really gonna be a good thing so you can move through it and yeah, move on and something better. Yeah. Anna Stover: Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, totally, totally. Hm. Eve: ⁓ so share with us your advice on you know, what what ad what would be the advice that you'd give women who feel disconnected from who they are or are uncertain of necess or uncertain about what comes next? Anna Stover: ⁓ well it's all of the things I've talked about. But I would say take time. Now You know, I'm from an older generation. I'm almost a baby baby boomer. So when people say, ⁓ you know, I need some space and I need some time, my brain kind of goes, ⁓ my goodness. But what I would say about that is take some time without your phone, without anything, and just go out into whatever bush you've got, you know, go out into the garden, go out into nature somewhere, and just be. And don't try and solve anything. Just kind of let it let it come. And if there's grief, let it out. Like there's there's, you know, it's worse not to cry than to cry. Like, let out all that grief and all that frustration. And just try not to fix it. But just see what you see. Like, what do you really want in life? And I think the thing that often stops us is. The second we see what we really want, our mind straight away goes, Yeah, but you can't afford that, or yeah, what about the kids? Or yeah, like shuts it down immediately. But don't don't try not to shut it down, but just go, what is it that I really that I really want? And there's this lovely question I ask my clients and myself from time to time, which is if you could do anything. without fear of failure, what is it you would do right now? What is it that you would do? And often what it is that you would do in its raw declaration isn't possible right now. But often it is. Often it is. So you know if you're not sure what to do next take some time out and think constructively, objectively. Also seek The help of an older woman who's not going to collude, you know, an older woman who can just listen and assure you that it's actually okay. Because the way, in my experience, we all go through these same questions. So when I say to a 56-year-old woman, you know, it's typical that you're asking yourself, is this it? Is this my life? Is this what I've come to? And they Yeah, that's exactly. Eve: Mm. Anna Stover: What I'm asking. So there's really common questions that arise in all of us in these different ages. Listen to those questions. It's really normal that they come and then work out through thinking clearly what is it you want? What would you do if you could do anything? Eve: ⁓ Yeah, absolutely. Anna Stover: Hmm. Eve: so share with us ⁓ what you've learned about making decisions that are aligned with your values. Anna Stover: Well, first you have to know what your values are. And I I took a long time to work that out. And I don't know that it's an easy thing to do. So I I tend to just lean more into what would satisfy me. And then how am I going to behave around that? and so I think Eve: Mm. Yeah. Anna Stover: understanding what I really want and then making decisions that are aligned with that. Because when I didn't have any clarity about what I really wanted, like I I just said yes to anything that came along without without thinking about it. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: so getting clear what you want, getting clear on what you've got, what you've done got, you know, in terms of finances, having visibility of your finances, have visibility of everything in your life, and then start to think about, well, what is it that I really want so that I can make decisions aligned with that. versus decisions that just I feel like I'm pressured into. Like I was a classic for being pressured into buying something I didn't need simply because there's a person in front of me, you know, wanting to sell me something. So yeah, I I don't know. That's that's probably what I'd say about that. and, you know, it's kind of a modern way of thinking to say what are your values. I would say, you know, Yeah, it was just really hard to work out what my values were. Hmm. Eve: Mm. And did they come through reflection? Anna Stover: Yeah. In terms of of I guess what I value, it came through this very objective thinking about what's happened, where am I at? What are my intentions for the future? What do I really want to do? And then that's where that's where it arises. I mean, there's lots of different ways to think about things and lots of different words or names we give things. But in the end, it comes down to like what are you trying to, what are you trying to do? Like what in your heart of hearts are you trying to do? What what it what's calling you? And what's the best way of getting there? Mm. Eve: Mm, powerful. So can you share with us ⁓ habits, practices and routines that have helped you stay grounded and connected to yourself? I know we've chatted about journaling ⁓ reflection But are there other things that you and also walking in nature which are all, you know, such great tips and really should be like incorporated into our daily life, I I think. ⁓ but any other ⁓ habits or tips you can share with us? Anna Stover: Hmm. Yes. ⁓ I just have to make a little scribbly note so I don't ⁓ I don't forget my thinking here. Look, one of the things is that I'm now married to someone who is committed to this kind of intentional conscious living in the same way that I am. And One of the things we do, I should say he does it really, he organizes for us to have a monthly date, he calls it. And he and his good friend AI have created based on a a model, but they've created a series of questions. So every month he sits down or we sit down together and we work through just like maybe four or five questions. And what that does is it obviously cements our relationship, but it gets me clear on what's important to me. You know it it kind of brings me back to center. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: And we've been doing that now probably I'd have to say nearly a year, I can't remember, but that is one practice is to really pause and talk about things like trust. Or ⁓ you know, what's important in terms of fun, or what's important in terms of you know, all sorts of things. Like there's nothing not covered in these questions. So that's one practice. The other practice is I have what I call ⁓ study groups, and one of them is a group of four women. We all have different specialties in terms of our natural abilities, we all Live in different parts of Tasmania, and we talk at least monthly about our intentions and seek help from each other. So this is a group of women who empower each other. So if one of us gets on and we're in tears, then we help that person work through whatever it is. Or if someone jumps on and goes, Okay, I've got to do this thing and I really don't know what to do next, then that group helps. And so We hold each other to account, but more than that, we care for each other in a very uplifting, empowering way, and you know it's very inspiring, and we all say that we've been doing that for six years now. All of us say that what we've got in our lives now is very much ⁓ supported by that. And then I have another study group that I meet fortnightly. This is this is not just women, it's men as. Well, and again, the same thing: like, what are you up to? What help do you need? And this is you know the group that's helped me charge what I charge, or talk to clients the way I talk to them, and things like that. So that that's another practice I have, and it does force me to get myself on top of something. Like I go, ⁓ god, I told them I'd do that thing and I haven't done it, or I told them I'd come having thought about something and I haven't. Yet thought about it. So it does keep me moving and being conscious of my own development and evolution, I guess I'd say. So that's excuse me, that's just three things I can think about. and I also have taken on drawing or colouring or painting, but doing something creative just sits out on the table, and when I've got half an hour, I just sit down and do something. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: ⁓ because I've always, if I look in my life phases, I've got this thread of creativity through my life. So picking that up and making sure that as much as I can I'm doing something creative. And it helps relax and think. So they're just some of my practices. ⁓ I'm sure I could think of more if I thought about it. Eve: Yeah, they're excellent. Yeah, I mean they're all really good and I haven't heard them before. ⁓ yeah. So thank you for sharing. ⁓ so if you could go back and speak to younger Anna, what would you tell her? Anna Stover: ⁓ great. Mm. I'd say do your pelvic floor exercises. Can't stress that enough. ⁓ look, I had to write something down. What did I write down? I gotta have a look at my notes because I've got so many things to say. I can't even see what I said. What would I say? ⁓ Eve: Yeah. That's big question. Anna Stover: ⁓ look it is and I know they always ask that. ⁓ here. I just wrote yeah. Well, I think Well, it would be, look, it'll it'll all work out. It will eventually work out. But surround yourself with the support that's going to help you. And that's really hard because all through my twenties I think I was searching for that and I didn't really have it. But that's ultimately what I'd say to myself. Find the people that can help you. Hmm. And it'll all actually it'll turn it it'll turn out okay. But of course I wouldn't have listened. I probably wouldn't have listened. Eve: Yeah, love that. ⁓ goodness. ⁓ and what have you stopped caring about that you wish you'd stopped caring about sooner? Anna Stover: Boy. what have I stopped? Stuff. Buying stuff. I know I have a lot of stuff, but I've had that stuff for a long time. But yeah, I've stopped caring about shopping and buying stuff. I was a child of the 80s. I knew how to shop. I had shoes of every different colour. I yeah, stop buying stuff. ⁓ because what I can see now is and I still do it when I'm feeling a bit down, I go, ⁓ I might go up shopping. And then I go, no, you're not. Like stop it. So I feel like, you know, I don't know if other people are like this, but I feel like shopping and getting stuff was what I did over the top of not dealing with what I should have been dealing with. So I think that's what I've stopped caring about is stuff. ⁓ and as you get older, my mum's in her late 80s, and so she's get she's getting rid of her stuff, and of course, she's giving her stuff to me, and I'm saying to my kids, this stuff will all be yours one day, and they're going, I don't think so. So we end up with all this stuff, like yeah. So I've stopped caring about stuff. Mind you, I'm still struggling to get rid of my stuff, but I'm definitely not bringing more stuff in. Eve: Well, I know a good resale platform to on your clothes on. Anna Stover: You do. You do. Yeah. Eve: what gives you hope for the next generation of women? Anna Stover: ⁓ well, I look at my two stepdaughters, I look at my son's friends and girlfriends, and I look at some of the clients I've had women in their th in their twenties and thirties, and I go, seriously, they are so much more conscious and aware than I ever was. Like just so much more conscious of who they are, what they want. ⁓ they make way better decisions I think than I ever made. So I do see that you know the world you know sometimes I despair like how they what's how's this gonna end. But I can I can definitely see that there's inspiration in younger women. And ⁓ you know if they get the right support around them It'll be fine. It'll be fine. And look, you know, just picking up on the social media thing, you know, it isn't real. It's just not real. And it's so subtly demoralizing and even I avoid LinkedIn because LinkedIn's a bit like that. So I I'm really good at flicking through Instagram and Facebook and laughing and going, ⁓ my god, like look at that. That's just crazy. But LinkedIn that still triggers me. Like all these people doing all these amazing things, I should be doing something else. So I don't think it matters what it is when we start looking online Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: it happens. There's these there's these triggers. But I think for for young women, if they can continually assess that very objectively, and get that it's not reality, I think they'll do well. Eve: Yeah, that's awesome. And finally, what does taking back your power mean to you? Anna Stover: Again, it's one of those things that statement wasn't even invented when I was young. You know, like so I go, ⁓ God, I don't even know what that means. I think, and I I did have a thought about this. Now, what did I write when I thought about that? Because there's so many things in my head. I think I touched on it earlier. To me, power is being able to organise yourself or your environment. To me that's what I think power is, right? And not having power, again for me, comes back to our inability to think clearly or accurately about the situation. Eve: Mm-hmm. Anna Stover: So if you think about a conflict with another person, we'll often say, ⁓ you know, I'm powerless in this conflict, or I'm powerless against them. If you actually step back and and look very objectively at the facts of that and go, well, actually it's because they said this and I made that mean that, and then you start to unpack what's really going on, then it's to me, it's accurate thinking that gets your power back. thinking accurately and then working out from that what to do. And I've used that many many times in situations where I've felt powerless and I've gone, hang on a minute, I've just gone into my head here. Now let's back it up and work out what am I saying I'm powerless about? And what is that what is that really? So that's how I would respond to that getting your power back. Like what makes you think you don't have it? Eve: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I love that. Again, reflection. Anna Stover: It's always reflection. And I guess the the environment of the world is not reflection. It's moving forward really, really fast. Eve: Mm-hmm. ⁓ Anna Stover: Don't the and I even had someone who was a potential client once and she said, Well, I don't really want to look at the past, I want to look at the future. And I'm like, Well, go for it. But if you don't reflect on the past, you you can't just make up new things on top of nothing. You have to unpack the past because it's flawed. The future without looking at the past is flawed. ⁓ so yeah, I think it's really important to look at the past. Eve: Yeah, amazing. Thank you. I've got so many ⁓ words of wisdom from you today and I'm so, so happy and grateful to be able to share this ⁓ with our audience. So thank you, Anna. ⁓ I really appreciate your time today. ⁓ how do people find you if they do want to work with you or f ask you follow-up questions? Anna Stover: Well thanks. You're welcome. So I have a website, Anna Stova, just like my name, I'm thinking my name will show up like I've got here. It's Anna Stova Consulting. dot com dot au or you can find me on LinkedIn. ⁓ and really the way I work is we just have a chat. You know we have a chat and we work out what it is you might need and can I help you and if so what might that look like so there's no you have to do it like this or you have to do it like that or it costs this or it costs that none of that. It's really just a conversation. Eve: Awesome. Thank you so much for sharing so freely and all yeah, all the wisdom that you've shared with us today. Yeah, until next time. Thank you. Anna Stover: Thank you. Well thanks Eve. It's been great. It's been really good to unpack some things. Eve: Yeah, I bet. Thanks, Anna. Anna Stover: Thank you.