Latest / First Thing Today with Joe Thomas / "Affordability" (Thursday, January 29, 2026, Hour 4)

Transcript

"Affordability" (Thursday, January 29, 2026, Hour 4) · First Thing Today with Joe Thomas

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I've always felt the nine most terrifying words in the
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: English language are.
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: First Thing Today on the Talk Media Network by Joe Thomas.
• 0:13
  Speaker 3: I'm from the government and I'm.
• 0:14
  Speaker 4: Here to help.
• 0:15
  Speaker 5: Jeword said, steal me, step me a day at least
• 0:20
  Speaker 5: for work, when the sun comes up, drops a kid
• 0:23
  Speaker 5: to school.
• 0:26
  Speaker 6: Joe has everything, a dream, all the.
• 0:28
  Speaker 7: Treasures, needs.
• 0:31
  Speaker 8: No one that Joe's as smile, He only as.
• 0:38
  Speaker 9: Joe.
• 0:39
  Speaker 6: Thank you for letting me be of service to you
• 0:41
  Speaker 6: this morning. You know our deal. I will tell you
• 0:46
  Speaker 6: what went on last night. I will tell you what
• 0:48
  Speaker 6: I see in the evidence left behind in the debris field.
• 0:52
  Speaker 6: And then I want to hear how it's impacting you
• 0:55
  Speaker 6: where you are at four three four eight eight two
• 0:58
  Speaker 6: four to one seven. You can text message because I
• 1:02
  Speaker 6: know how mornings are, and it's easier just to shout
• 1:05
  Speaker 6: something at voice to text and then hit send than
• 1:08
  Speaker 6: his call and you wait and he's talking about something
• 1:12
  Speaker 6: else and you got to get in there. But yeah,
• 1:15
  Speaker 6: I appreciate the conversation. That's what I live on. That's
• 1:19
  Speaker 6: you know, the experience. What's the coffee chain that American
• 1:23
  Speaker 6: runs on? Duncan I personally run on conversation? The more
• 1:30
  Speaker 6: I can talk to people, the better it is. So
• 1:33
  Speaker 6: please if you can, or send emails to JT in
• 1:38
  Speaker 6: the Morning Radio at gmail dot com or see this
• 1:42
  Speaker 6: one earlier we were talking about the data centers. I
• 1:46
  Speaker 6: can't believe you're picking up for the electric utilities. Joe
• 1:49
  Speaker 6: just bachel them like everyone else you know. And it's
• 1:52
  Speaker 6: not the electric utilities are ready to be sainted or
• 1:58
  Speaker 6: anything like that. But in this particular instance, they're not
• 2:02
  Speaker 6: the bad guys. The bad guys aren't the data centers.
• 2:05
  Speaker 6: And the bad guys aren't the electric utilities outside of
• 2:09
  Speaker 6: the places where they lobbied to get politicians in place
• 2:14
  Speaker 6: that would sign on to the Green New Deal, and
• 2:17
  Speaker 6: prior to the Green New Deal, all the other global
• 2:21
  Speaker 6: climate change nonsense that had them shutting down electric power plants.
• 2:28
  Speaker 6: That's why the grid is in peril, not because data
• 2:31
  Speaker 6: centers exist. Data centers were coming anyway. And all the
• 2:36
  Speaker 6: people who signed into these Clean Economy Acts and two
• 2:39
  Speaker 6: thousand and fifteen and two thousand and fourteen and all
• 2:44
  Speaker 6: these climate change and the powish Climate Accord stuff, you
• 2:47
  Speaker 6: all knew. You all knew there were data centers. You
• 2:52
  Speaker 6: all knew this was coming. And if you didn't, your
• 2:55
  Speaker 6: willfully negligent in your representation of your government, of your
• 3:02
  Speaker 6: government service. But I think in a lot of cases
• 3:06
  Speaker 6: you had the fix in because it made people money.
• 3:11
  Speaker 6: This is why I've said earlier. Read Chris Horner's book,
• 3:15
  Speaker 6: The Politically Incorrect Guide to Global Me.
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: Do we have my copy in the studio somewhere?
• 3:22
  Speaker 6: He details how this all began in a boardroom at Enron.
• 3:28
  Speaker 6: And certainly nobody can sit there and tell me that
• 3:31
  Speaker 6: anything good ever came out of a.
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: Boardroom at Enron.
• 3:34
  Speaker 6: Right the GE and the California Electric Utilities Management, the
• 3:41
  Speaker 6: government officials say, and how can we get more Californians
• 3:44
  Speaker 6: to buy solar panels?
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: And it began right there.
• 3:49
  Speaker 6: Chris knows. He was one of the lawyers in the
• 3:51
  Speaker 6: room when have happened. He ran screaming to start whistle
• 3:56
  Speaker 6: blowing to it. Where's his whistleblower protection?
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: Anyway?
• 4:00
  Speaker 6: I digress on the first things list this morning, brought
• 4:03
  Speaker 6: to you by first three in the morning coffee. Tom
• 4:06
  Speaker 6: Homan is in Minneapolis, and here are his demands. He
• 4:10
  Speaker 6: has given these to both Mayor Jacob Frye and Governor
• 4:13
  Speaker 6: Tim Waltz. Have state and local law enforcement commit to
• 4:16
  Speaker 6: tourney illegals into federal authorities to make local police help
• 4:21
  Speaker 6: federal authorities.
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: Track down and detain the illegals.
• 4:24
  Speaker 6: Number three partner with federal authorities to quote protect American
• 4:28
  Speaker 6: citizens in the rapid removal of all criminal aliens from
• 4:32
  Speaker 6: our country. President Trump has begun a new Department of
• 4:37
  Speaker 6: Justice office called the Office for National Fraud Enforcement. We've
• 4:44
  Speaker 6: had a law in the books for decades called the
• 4:46
  Speaker 6: Fraud Against Taxpayer Act. Apparently they never had anyone set
• 4:51
  Speaker 6: aside to look for it. Colin McDonald's the first person
• 4:55
  Speaker 6: to lead that department in the Department of Justice. Talks
• 5:02
  Speaker 6: are involving the United States, Greenland, and Denmark began yesterday.
• 5:06
  Speaker 6: Danish Foreign Ministry said three parties are looking to come
• 5:10
  Speaker 6: up with a diplomatic answer to how the US will
• 5:15
  Speaker 6: help NATO in overseeing operations in the Denmark Protectorate. Federal
• 5:24
  Speaker 6: Reserve opted to stand pat on interest rates, keeping them
• 5:27
  Speaker 6: at three point five percent to three point seven five
• 5:32
  Speaker 6: percent in their benchmark rates. The nurse at Virginia Commonwealth
• 5:38
  Speaker 6: University is looking for a job this morning after she
• 5:40
  Speaker 6: posted a series of videos in her now deleted TikTok account,
• 5:45
  Speaker 6: but was shared by the famous ex influencer Libs of
• 5:49
  Speaker 6: TikTok as the nurse in hospital rooms explained to her
• 5:55
  Speaker 6: viewers that this was how you could grievously injure ice
• 6:00
  Speaker 6: agents with a hypodermic needle or some x lax. And
• 6:05
  Speaker 6: the administration has signal limits to its support of data centers,
• 6:10
  Speaker 6: he said. We embraced data centers, but not at the
• 6:13
  Speaker 6: price of raising costs for consumers. And the FBI has
• 6:17
  Speaker 6: searched the offices and collected evidence at the Fulton County
• 6:21
  Speaker 6: Elections headquarters in Union City. And those are our first
• 6:25
  Speaker 6: things this morning. First Free in the Morning Coffee is
• 6:29
  Speaker 6: a bespoke blend of coffee roasted just to the tastes
• 6:32
  Speaker 6: of me and my wife and people who we've made
• 6:35
  Speaker 6: it for love it as well. Smooth, that's the thing
• 6:38
  Speaker 6: we love about it. And it also supports a school
• 6:42
  Speaker 6: and an orphanage in Uganda.
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: So get yours.
• 6:46
  Speaker 6: It's called First Free in the Morning Coffee. You go
• 6:49
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• 6:53
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• 6:56
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• 7:01
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  Speaker 8: help can be the first step toward recovery. Doctor Joseph Liberto,
• 7:09
  Speaker 8: national Mental Health Director for Substance Use Disorders with the
• 7:13
  Speaker 8: US Department of Veterans Affairs, has more.
• 7:16
  Speaker 10: May is Mental Health Month and VA is committed to
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• 9:02
  Speaker 1: I'm Andrew Saul, Commission of SOLI Security. I'm here to
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: warn you about telephone scammers pretending to be government employees.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: Some of these scammers may say threatening things like you
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: will be arrested if you don't make payments or provide
• 9:17
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• 9:21
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• 9:26
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• 9:29
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• 9:33
  Speaker 1: your personal information like your social Security number or bank account,
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: or send money in any form cash gift cards, wire transfers,
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: or prepaid debit cards. Report the call. To our law
• 9:46
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• 9:51
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• 9:53
  Speaker 4: Share this information with your friends and family.
• 9:58
  Speaker 12: Hiryboddy, I'm Jack. It's always a boy. Growing up on
• 10:01
  Speaker 12: a farm in Tennessee, I've been fascinated with animals. I'm
• 10:04
  Speaker 12: not only in alle of their beauty and kindness, but
• 10:06
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• 10:09
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• 10:13
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• 10:15
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• 10:24
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• 10:36
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• 10:55
  Speaker 4: Go to American Humane dot org to learn more.
• 11:00
  Speaker 9: Oh brah, that's buzzed. Oh yeah, yeah, he's starting with
• 11:03
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• 11:05
  Speaker 5: And now a speech. I just want to say that
• 11:08
  Speaker 5: friendship is about heart, art and brain.
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: Who's with me?
• 11:13
  Speaker 9: Good thing is he knows when he's buzzed, and my
• 11:15
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• 11:18
  Speaker 4: Somebody call me a ride.
• 11:19
  Speaker 14: Love that guy, me too, know your buzzed warning signs,
• 11:23
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• 11:25
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• 11:26
  Speaker 15: Whom did you know.
• 11:29
  Speaker 13: That more than half our household energy costs go to
• 11:32
  Speaker 13: heating and cooling. Energy efficiency isn't just good for the environment,
• 11:37
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• 11:40
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• 11:44
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• 11:47
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• 11:51
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• 11:58
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• 12:01
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• 12:04
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• 12:07
  Speaker 13: things you can do. Lower your thermostat in winter and
• 12:10
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• 12:14
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• 12:17
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• 12:21
  Speaker 13: out FTC dot gov slash green, a tip from the
• 12:24
  Speaker 13: Federal Trade Commission, the nation's consumer protection agency.
• 12:29
  Speaker 16: As a family member or friend, you may be the
• 12:32
  Speaker 16: first to notice when a veteran you love has been
• 12:35
  Speaker 16: going through changes. Things like withdrawing, drinking more, or increased
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• 13:08
  Speaker 2: The first thing Today by Joe Thomas on the Tunk
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: Media Network. All naturally, I'm free of artificial intelligence.
• 13:20
  Speaker 6: So it is an essential and it's part of the
• 13:26
  Speaker 6: Fabian construct, which is take over the things that you
• 13:30
  Speaker 6: need and then insist and Thomas Edison was one of
• 13:34
  Speaker 6: the great Fabian fundraisers and supporters because.
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: It made him money.
• 13:40
  Speaker 6: And in the world of electric transmission, we have this story.
• 13:45
  Speaker 6: President Trump is saying, hey, listen, I just don't want
• 13:49
  Speaker 6: it to hurt ratepayers, and everyone's taking it up.
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: Oh, Trump's going after the data centers. No he's not.
• 13:55
  Speaker 6: He just says, data centers can't make it more expensive
• 13:59
  Speaker 6: for or the ratepayers. Don't please the headline writers around
• 14:04
  Speaker 6: Donald Trump. You know, that's what this program has been
• 14:08
  Speaker 6: saying all along, much to the chagrin of people in
• 14:11
  Speaker 6: Virginia who you know, it's the Pinata of the month club.
• 14:14
  Speaker 6: It's beat on the data centers, even though seventy percent
• 14:17
  Speaker 6: of all Internet data comes through our flagship state of
• 14:21
  Speaker 6: Virginia at some point. And what's really most of the
• 14:26
  Speaker 6: government officials are mad about is they don't get a cut.
• 14:30
  Speaker 6: They don't get a taste, and they want a taste,
• 14:34
  Speaker 6: because that's what these Fabians are all about, is control.
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: Of all these utilities that we use.
• 14:42
  Speaker 6: And we've got to guess because it's all about this
• 14:45
  Speaker 6: affordability mantra that they're wearing heading towards the midterms. It's
• 14:50
  Speaker 6: all about I will make things more affordable, which means
• 14:59
  Speaker 6: they'll subsidize it more, which will make it less affordable.
• 15:05
  Speaker 6: But I wanted to share this story. We have a
• 15:07
  Speaker 6: healthcare story as well.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: Doctor.
• 15:12
  Speaker 6: Oh gosh, my notes? Where's my notes? Sometimes you do
• 15:16
  Speaker 6: this without a net sometimes and you wind up paying
• 15:21
  Speaker 6: the price. Luckily, unlike trapeze artists, the price I pay
• 15:31
  Speaker 6: is just an awkward moment where Jeffrey Singer, Doctor Jeffrey
• 15:36
  Speaker 6: Singer is joining us from the Cato Institute where he
• 15:39
  Speaker 6: writes for them. He's also a practicing position, but on
• 15:42
  Speaker 6: these costs, let me tell you the story. And for
• 15:45
  Speaker 6: everyone who told me, no, that's not going to happen,
• 15:47
  Speaker 6: you can't do that, shoe. I've brought up the story
• 15:52
  Speaker 6: of Nicola Tesla before because Nicola Tesla posited that companies
• 15:59
  Speaker 6: could set up towers in your community from which they
• 16:05
  Speaker 6: would transmit electrical signals to receivers that you would carry
• 16:10
  Speaker 6: with you, and they would take this electricity in through
• 16:14
  Speaker 6: say an antenna, and do things with it. And Thomas
• 16:20
  Speaker 6: Edison said, that's crazy talk. Me and the government, we've
• 16:23
  Speaker 6: got a tax scheme out here where we're going to
• 16:26
  Speaker 6: run electric lines under the streets and into everybody's house
• 16:29
  Speaker 6: so that we can plug them all into a grid.
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: And that's how we're going.
• 16:33
  Speaker 6: To distribute electricity, because that's much better than shooting it
• 16:36
  Speaker 6: through the air. As a matter of fact, I've got
• 16:39
  Speaker 6: an elephant that's five years past its life expectancy and
• 16:43
  Speaker 6: is about to die anyway, and I just shot it
• 16:46
  Speaker 6: full of sodium pentathol to bring on a cardiac arrest.
• 16:50
  Speaker 6: But now I'm going to put him next to one
• 16:52
  Speaker 6: of Tesla's generators and he'll die, and I'll film it
• 16:55
  Speaker 6: because I'm Thomas Edison, and everyone will say I'm scared
• 16:59
  Speaker 6: of a electricity transmitted through the air. Now, the only
• 17:03
  Speaker 6: people scared of electricity transmitting through the air are Fabian
• 17:07
  Speaker 6: Republicans who get mad because there's conservative talk radio going
• 17:12
  Speaker 6: over those airwaves. Because once distributing electricity became incompatible with
• 17:19
  Speaker 6: what the cronious economics of the time paid to be
• 17:24
  Speaker 6: part of Thomas Edison's cult, Nicola Tesla said, well, I
• 17:30
  Speaker 6: I don't know. Somebody else used this and they said, hey,
• 17:34
  Speaker 6: maybe we could broadcast sound over it.
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: But I want to share this story because every.
• 17:40
  Speaker 6: Time I bring this up, oh, child that would never announce.
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: It's never happened.
• 17:43
  Speaker 6: So m ROD is a company. MROD is a New
• 17:48
  Speaker 6: Zealand company that it transmits electricity to users in their
• 17:58
  Speaker 6: homes in New Zealand without wire.
• 18:07
  Speaker 4: Power Co, new.
• 18:09
  Speaker 6: Zealand's second largest electricity distributor, will test the MROD technology
• 18:15
  Speaker 6: and has been testing it for the past couple of years.
• 18:19
  Speaker 6: Companies plan to deploy the prototype wireless energy infrastructure across
• 18:25
  Speaker 6: a one hundred and thirty foot expanse and it's grown
• 18:28
  Speaker 6: from there. Rectifying antennas pass microwaves of electricity from one
• 18:37
  Speaker 6: waypoint to the next, a solution well suited to New
• 18:41
  Speaker 6: Zealand's mountainous terrain. Wireless antennas are the medium like cable,
• 18:49
  Speaker 6: meaning that their task is to simply connect an electrical
• 18:53
  Speaker 6: supply to the customers. So they are tesla's life has
• 18:57
  Speaker 6: come to pass. They are transmitting electtionlectricity to consumers who
• 19:02
  Speaker 6: liked their homes because yes, they have electricity in New Zealand.
• 19:10
  Speaker 6: Power their computers, charge their cell phones and all of
• 19:13
  Speaker 6: that through electricity transmitted through the air. And then what
• 19:18
  Speaker 6: that does is it democratizes it. It takes it away
• 19:21
  Speaker 6: from the centralized electric utility. How many radio stations do
• 19:28
  Speaker 6: you have in your town? Twenty thirty and I would
• 19:34
  Speaker 6: be willing as long as sufficient bandwidth was made available
• 19:39
  Speaker 6: for my program on frequency modulation. That if, like they
• 19:45
  Speaker 6: did with television when they needed the TV broadcast spectrum
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: for I don't know, surveillance sh.
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: They said it was for emergency communications. So we'll go
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: with that.
• 20:00
  Speaker 6: But if they say to me, Joe, yes we can
• 20:02
  Speaker 6: transmit electricity, we are breaking up the big electric utilities.
• 20:07
  Speaker 6: You can set up a tower in your home base
• 20:10
  Speaker 6: and shoot electricity out to whoever wants to buy it
• 20:13
  Speaker 6: from you, and you can put a meter on it
• 20:16
  Speaker 6: and you can I'd give up my spot on an
• 20:22
  Speaker 6: AM band or if they needed FM, or if they
• 20:27
  Speaker 6: just needed sidebands on these I do it to democratize
• 20:33
  Speaker 6: electric distribution. Hell yes, I've been making this case for
• 20:38
  Speaker 6: probably twenty years now, and there they are in New
• 20:42
  Speaker 6: Zealand doing it anyway. That's just one of the places
• 20:46
  Speaker 6: we can fix these centralized CONTs. Doctor Singer, thank you
• 20:51
  Speaker 6: for joining us. So your work at the Cato Institute,
• 20:54
  Speaker 6: and you have a new blog post out there that
• 21:01
  Speaker 6: I think is right in the wheelhouse of all of this,
• 21:08
  Speaker 6: which is titled the System that rewards excess, the incentives
• 21:14
  Speaker 6: behind over diagnosis, over treatment, and polypharmacy, which I like
• 21:20
  Speaker 6: to almost sounds like something I need pharmaceutical treatment for.
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: But I appreciate you taking some time out with us
• 21:28
  Speaker 6: this morning. We're coming up on the news. You're doing
• 21:31
  Speaker 6: okay this morning.
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: Thank you. Happy to be here. I'm doing great. I'm
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: a warmer climate than you are at the moment.
• 21:38
  Speaker 6: Well, I think any place is a warmer climate than
• 21:40
  Speaker 6: we are right now. So I'm going to indulge you.
• 21:43
  Speaker 6: I got monologuing again. My listeners love it when I
• 21:46
  Speaker 6: get monologuing, so I ate up some of the time here.
• 21:49
  Speaker 6: But if you indulge me, we'll come back after the
• 21:52
  Speaker 6: news at half past and get into this post The
• 21:54
  Speaker 6: System that rewards excess.
• 21:57
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• 28:01
  Speaker 2: Who was the fun in that first thing? Today? We
• 28:17
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  Speaker 2: in that first thing today? By Joe Thomas on the
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• 28:42
  Speaker 6: Yeah, maybe some ivermectin, but yo, sh Shall we go again?
• 28:46
  Speaker 6: Another red flag on YouTube Jeffrey Singer, Cato Institute. Since now,
• 28:51
  Speaker 6: we've spent a good bit of time on affordability issue
• 28:55
  Speaker 6: number one, which the Democrats are are vilifying the electric
• 29:01
  Speaker 6: usage at the data centers, which is a lie. Let's
• 29:05
  Speaker 6: get into your column which is amazing. I read a
• 29:10
  Speaker 6: system that rewards excess, the incentives behind over diagnosis and polypharmacy.
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: To know where did you all begin?
• 29:20
  Speaker 6: You're digging into this, Jeff.
• 29:23
  Speaker 22: Yeah, sure, well, it's basically the point I'm making these
• 29:27
  Speaker 22: is the underlying third party system in which both the
• 29:32
  Speaker 22: patients and the doctors are sort of taken out of
• 29:34
  Speaker 22: the feedback group that normally.
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: Is in place.
• 29:39
  Speaker 22: When people are buying and selling services. So it was
• 29:43
  Speaker 22: inspired by a recent study gun by the Wall Street Journal.
• 29:46
  Speaker 22: They got data from centers for Medicare and Medicaid services,
• 29:51
  Speaker 22: and they found that the United States has a very
• 29:55
  Speaker 22: high rate of over prescribing.
• 29:58
  Speaker 14: And that kind of.
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: Sparked an interest among me and my colleague about pist
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: of Levanco of.
• 30:05
  Speaker 22: My research associate into digging further into we found that
• 30:09
  Speaker 22: according to a Commonwealth Fund survey that came out this
• 30:12
  Speaker 22: past summer, the United States leads the leads peer nations
• 30:17
  Speaker 22: about ten other peer nations that we were compared to
• 30:20
  Speaker 22: in the number of seniors on multiple prescriptions and fifty
• 30:24
  Speaker 22: four percent of seniors have four more prescriptions. We also
• 30:27
  Speaker 22: trail We have the fewest number of seniors are no
• 30:30
  Speaker 22: prescriptions out of all the countries.
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: And for years, the medical societies, the medical profession has.
• 30:39
  Speaker 22: Understood that what we call polypharmacy, which is being on
• 30:43
  Speaker 22: five or more medications at the same time, particularly in seniors,
• 30:47
  Speaker 22: is associated with a higher what we call senior morbidity,
• 30:50
  Speaker 22: you know, complications of the.
• 30:52
  Speaker 4: Drugs, and in some cases, some of these drugs may
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: even accelerate dementia.
• 30:59
  Speaker 6: Let me ask you real quick, Jeffrey. Who are the
• 31:01
  Speaker 6: other countries in this cohort of similar economies? I mean,
• 31:07
  Speaker 6: are we talking about European countries? Are we talking about
• 31:11
  Speaker 6: other American countries?
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: Who? Who were these other nine countries countries with with
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: you know.
• 31:18
  Speaker 22: From an economic standard living point of view, comparable US.
• 31:24
  Speaker 22: So it included the UK, Switzerland, Sweden, New Zealand, the Netherlands, Germany, France, Canada, Australia. Okay,
• 31:32
  Speaker 22: in our blog post you could see we actually have
• 31:35
  Speaker 22: a cable published.
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: You could see them all compared.
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 31:39
  Speaker 22: And polypharmacy doesn't necessarily mean you don't need to be
• 31:43
  Speaker 22: on five or more mets. I mean some people are
• 31:46
  Speaker 22: have enough illnesses with it, you know they have to be.
• 31:48
  Speaker 22: But speaking, we try to. We doctors that are are
• 31:54
  Speaker 22: encouraged to keep your prescriptions down as minimal as possible,
• 31:59
  Speaker 22: particularly seniors, because of the association with problems and the
• 32:03
  Speaker 22: Wall Street Journals study using data from Medicare Part D
• 32:07
  Speaker 22: found that out of the forty six million Medicare Part
• 32:11
  Speaker 22: D participants, seven point six million of them that's a
• 32:15
  Speaker 22: considerable number, had eight or more prescriptions eight actually yeah, yeah,
• 32:23
  Speaker 22: and more than half of them had panel more prescriptions.
• 32:27
  Speaker 22: Four hundred and nineteen thousand had fifteen or more prescriptions.
• 32:31
  Speaker 22: And then there's a thing called the Beers List b
• 32:33
  Speaker 22: Eers A doctor Mark Beers started this in the early
• 32:36
  Speaker 22: nineties and now it's constantly updated by the American Geriatric Society.
• 32:41
  Speaker 22: And this is a list of medications that doctor clinicians
• 32:44
  Speaker 22: are encouraged to avoid prescribing unless absolutely unavoidable because they
• 32:50
  Speaker 22: have been associated with a lot of morbidity and seniors.
• 32:54
  Speaker 22: For example, benzodiazepines like Valiant, they have it's their doctor's
• 33:01
  Speaker 22: encuraged not to prescribe that there is some evidence that
• 33:04
  Speaker 22: might even accelerate dementia in series.
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: Gaba pent in, even Bennetgerl is not recommended in the seniors.
• 33:11
  Speaker 23: So what.
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: But the Wall Street Journal people found was that.
• 33:17
  Speaker 22: The three point six million of the seven point six
• 33:21
  Speaker 22: million on multiple medications had well I'm sorry, yeah, at
• 33:28
  Speaker 22: four hundred and nineteen thousand had at least one prescription
• 33:32
  Speaker 22: among their prescriptions that was on the Beer's List, and
• 33:35
  Speaker 22: three point six million people had sedatives that that were
• 33:39
  Speaker 22: on the Beer's List. And Gaba Penton, which is another
• 33:45
  Speaker 22: Beers List medication, prescribed to five hundred and sixty eight
• 33:49
  Speaker 22: thousand seniors. Muscle relaxes and BENDA were to three hundred thousand,
• 33:54
  Speaker 22: and Benzo azekas about one hundred and fifty thousand. So
• 33:57
  Speaker 22: the point is there are a lot of just a
• 34:00
  Speaker 22: I'm not expecting listeners to memorize all these numbers, and
• 34:02
  Speaker 22: if you.
• 34:02
  Speaker 4: Want to see them, they're in our blog post.
• 34:04
  Speaker 22: But but the bottom line is there awful lot of
• 34:07
  Speaker 22: seniors who have prescribed way more than five medications, and
• 34:12
  Speaker 22: a lot of times these are medications that.
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: That that they shouldn't probably beyond.
• 34:18
  Speaker 22: Now, we what we looked at in our blog post
• 34:22
  Speaker 22: was that this Wall Street Journal about a year earlier,
• 34:25
  Speaker 22: did another UH investigation that found that there's a tremendous
• 34:29
  Speaker 22: amount of upcoding in the in the Medicare system. And
• 34:34
  Speaker 22: you might yeah, and and in fact, there's news about
• 34:37
  Speaker 22: it today, so UH and this was a big investigative report.
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: It led to a government UH investigation of United Healthcare.
• 34:45
  Speaker 22: So the Medicare advantage plans, but not just Medicare advantage
• 34:49
  Speaker 22: in the health system in general, there's you get paid
• 34:53
  Speaker 22: better if your patient is sicker. When we doctors bill
• 34:58
  Speaker 22: for up even for consultation different codes uh that that
• 35:03
  Speaker 22: illustrate different degrees of difficulty, and the higher the degree
• 35:07
  Speaker 22: of difficulty, the better you get paid. And so one
• 35:10
  Speaker 22: way in which the third party payers medicare in particular
• 35:14
  Speaker 22: judge that is by the number of diagnoses. So there's
• 35:17
  Speaker 22: an incentive for us to when we're killing out the bill,
• 35:22
  Speaker 22: to list on on the on the patient's chart as
• 35:26
  Speaker 22: many diagnoses.
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: We're not lying, but but we're we're kind of mentioning
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: things that we might not have mentioned.
• 35:32
  Speaker 6: That's that's stunning to me to hear, because there are
• 35:35
  Speaker 6: so many people out there that that you know, report
• 35:39
  Speaker 6: on these things and they get immediately cornered out into
• 35:43
  Speaker 6: the world of conspiracy theorists and things like that. Of course,
• 35:46
  Speaker 6: here on this program, you're safe because we consider ourselves
• 35:49
  Speaker 6: conspiracy analysts. Bob, who actually is a pharmacist listening in
• 35:54
  Speaker 6: Moscow this morning, not not Idaho and not Iowa, but
• 36:00
  Speaker 6: in Russia this morning, listening online. I appreciate it, Bob.
• 36:03
  Speaker 6: So you're a pharmacist, is what doctor Singer saying is true.
• 36:08
  Speaker 24: It's absolutely true. Way back in the mid early two
• 36:12
  Speaker 24: thousands to mid two thousands, I worked at a veterans home,
• 36:17
  Speaker 24: and I had excellent doctors in the building. I worked
• 36:19
  Speaker 24: with doctor Lackner, doctor Kyle, and we're able to get
• 36:23
  Speaker 24: the people's medicines down from over thirteen to fifteen per
• 36:29
  Speaker 24: residents down below ten by working together, the doctors listened
• 36:35
  Speaker 24: to the pharmacists listen to me, and we're able to
• 36:37
  Speaker 24: get the patients off medications that were duplicates.
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: Well, what does that do?
• 36:42
  Speaker 6: I mean, you know, because to me, it just it
• 36:45
  Speaker 6: frightens me because I know that a lot of these
• 36:48
  Speaker 6: pharmaceuticals they have impact on things like liver and kidneys,
• 36:53
  Speaker 6: so you can't stay on them too long. And so
• 36:57
  Speaker 6: you hear about something you're saying thirteen down down from thirteen,
• 37:01
  Speaker 6: it's got to be damaging other parts of their body though, Bob, Well.
• 37:07
  Speaker 24: The problem is in America, the medical system has been
• 37:11
  Speaker 24: trained at Okay, it's one blood pressure medicine doesn't work,
• 37:15
  Speaker 24: we had a second one. If the second one doesn't work,
• 37:17
  Speaker 24: we had a third one. But in reality is okay.
• 37:22
  Speaker 24: If you've added the first one and it didn't lord
• 37:24
  Speaker 24: to what you wanted, you've ordered a second one and
• 37:26
  Speaker 24: did Lord, you need to weave the person off the
• 37:29
  Speaker 24: second one before you start the new one, because obviously
• 37:33
  Speaker 24: the second one is doing absolutely nothing. But doctors don't
• 37:36
  Speaker 24: take the time, and a lot of times they won't
• 37:39
  Speaker 24: listen to good pharmacists that have that have a true
• 37:43
  Speaker 24: pharmacology background like I do, and understand the mechanisms of
• 37:47
  Speaker 24: the drugs.
• 37:49
  Speaker 6: Right, So you're actually you're you're not following a good
• 37:53
  Speaker 6: medical procedure. I appreciate it, Bob, thank you, sir. I
• 37:56
  Speaker 6: appreciate it. I hope you have to take one quick thing,
• 37:58
  Speaker 6: all right, hang out, hang out.
• 37:59
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  Speaker 20: first date?
• 42:56
  Speaker 9: Sure?
• 42:57
  Speaker 14: We'll probably stay together.
• 42:59
  Speaker 8: Probably, it's been twenty three minutes.
• 43:02
  Speaker 7: Since I ate. I can probably swim.
• 43:06
  Speaker 5: You should wait thirty minutes.
• 43:08
  Speaker 15: Okay, I'll tell me what to do?
• 43:09
  Speaker 4: Can it bar.
• 43:12
  Speaker 11: Cramp?
• 43:13
  Speaker 6: I have a cramp?
• 43:16
  Speaker 8: I can probably hit the green from here?
• 43:19
  Speaker 7: Probably?
• 43:24
  Speaker 8: Can I get a mulligan.
• 43:26
  Speaker 6: Ready to go?
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: Hey?
• 43:27
  Speaker 20: Are you sure you're okay to drive?
• 43:29
  Speaker 19: Yeah?
• 43:30
  Speaker 8: I'm pretty sober.
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm probably okay.
• 43:35
  Speaker 21: Probably okay isn't okay, especially when it comes to drinking
• 43:39
  Speaker 21: and driving. If you're drinking, call a cab, a car,
• 43:42
  Speaker 21: or a friend. Buzz driving is drunk driving? A message
• 43:45
  Speaker 21: brought to you by NITSA and AD Council.
• 43:48
  Speaker 20: You know the legal drinking age is twenty one. You
• 43:50
  Speaker 20: may also know this law protects teens. Find out more
• 43:54
  Speaker 20: at Don'tserve Teens dot gov. A message from the We
• 43:57
  Speaker 20: Don't Serve Teens program and the Federal Trade Commission.
• 44:08
  Speaker 13: It was the challenge.
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: On a need to know basis, because you need to
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: know the first thing today.
• 44:17
  Speaker 8: Doctor doctor didn't even new that gotta case.
• 44:22
  Speaker 6: I love it, you know, but you know that's the
• 44:31
  Speaker 6: point is, Doctor Jeffrey Singer is on with us. But
• 44:34
  Speaker 6: Bob in Moscow, our pharmacist friend, had a quick thing
• 44:37
  Speaker 6: before we were heading right. Thank you for hanging on, Bob.
• 44:39
  Speaker 6: What it was your last thought?
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: Go ahead?
• 44:42
  Speaker 24: The quick thing is, look at the number of people
• 44:44
  Speaker 24: that are that are dying on hospice. They take them
• 44:46
  Speaker 24: off the majority of their medications and they start feeling better.
• 44:50
  Speaker 24: Why is it they're on too many medications?
• 44:52
  Speaker 6: You know, that's funny you mentioned that. I mean it's
• 44:54
  Speaker 6: purely anecdotal. But one of my wife's best friends, her
• 44:57
  Speaker 6: mother was on hospice. I think it's coming up on
• 45:01
  Speaker 6: four or five times. She has liver cancer, so like, well,
• 45:05
  Speaker 6: we're just going to keep her comfortable and then she
• 45:06
  Speaker 6: gets better, and it is very.
• 45:11
  Speaker 24: Because she's on medicines that are affecting the liver. They
• 45:13
  Speaker 24: take them off those medicines. Her liver isn't straining as bad,
• 45:17
  Speaker 24: so she's fealing better.
• 45:18
  Speaker 6: It's an amazing world. Listen to your pharmacist or you know,
• 45:22
  Speaker 6: if the pharmacist is allowed to say anything to you,
• 45:24
  Speaker 6: I appreciate it. Bob, you have a great morning.
• 45:27
  Speaker 24: Hey, have a great weekend.
• 45:28
  Speaker 6: By and I don't know any movies. Should probably find
• 45:32
  Speaker 6: some compounding pharmacists to sponsor the program because I love,
• 45:36
  Speaker 6: you know, the world of the compounding pharmacists, because of
• 45:39
  Speaker 6: their independence and what they can do for you. Anyway,
• 45:43
  Speaker 6: so doctor Singer and wanted to ask, so who is
• 45:45
  Speaker 6: you're talking about upcoading, You're talking about overdiagnosis, So who's
• 45:49
  Speaker 6: driving this agenda?
• 45:51
  Speaker 3: Who's pushing this on the doctors?
• 45:55
  Speaker 4: Well, it's it's a combination.
• 45:56
  Speaker 22: And first of all, medicare their pain mint system, which
• 46:02
  Speaker 22: generally gets kind of that serves as a template for
• 46:06
  Speaker 22: private insurance commercial insurance companies to us as well.
• 46:09
  Speaker 4: The way in which they reimburse.
• 46:11
  Speaker 22: Is based upon the number of services you provide and
• 46:16
  Speaker 22: the degree of difficulty of the patient you're taking care of,
• 46:21
  Speaker 22: and the difficulty is usually determined by the number of
• 46:25
  Speaker 22: diagnoses the patient has. The person who has, you know,
• 46:28
  Speaker 22: four or five different medical problems is a more challenging
• 46:31
  Speaker 22: patient than a person who has no medical problems aside
• 46:34
  Speaker 22: from the one they came into the doctor for. So
• 46:37
  Speaker 22: that it's the system in place, plus the fact that
• 46:40
  Speaker 22: the overlong majority of the payment is from a third party,
• 46:45
  Speaker 22: so there's no incentive for the patient who's not directly
• 46:49
  Speaker 22: paid for most of this stuff.
• 46:50
  Speaker 4: It's the third party that's getting the bill and paying
• 46:53
  Speaker 4: for it.
• 46:54
  Speaker 22: There's no incentive for the patient to say, wait a minute,
• 46:56
  Speaker 22: how necessary is it for me to have this? And
• 47:00
  Speaker 22: no incentive for the doctor to to to take a
• 47:04
  Speaker 22: lot of time to go over a person's medication list
• 47:08
  Speaker 22: and say, you know, you don't really need to be
• 47:10
  Speaker 22: on this one that some other doctor prescribe for you.
• 47:12
  Speaker 22: Let's get rid of that, because you know, they don't get.
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: Paid for that. They get paid for prescribing, right, not
• 47:19
  Speaker 4: for deep prescribing. It is also the problems. The third
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: part is.
• 47:23
  Speaker 6: There a lot of and I see these boy, these
• 47:27
  Speaker 6: are the TV ads out there. You know, if you
• 47:31
  Speaker 6: have all sort of colitis and you're feeling this way, well,
• 47:35
  Speaker 6: this prescription drug will help with that.
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: I see.
• 47:39
  Speaker 6: And I'm sure the Super Bowl coming up will be
• 47:41
  Speaker 6: supported in part by all these ads for adjunctive products.
• 47:48
  Speaker 6: You know, if you're being treated for high blood pressure
• 47:50
  Speaker 6: and you feel this, get this and it will help.
• 47:53
  Speaker 6: That is a lot of what you're talking about, this
• 47:56
  Speaker 6: polypharmacy driven by medication that are prescribed to treat the
• 48:02
  Speaker 6: side effects of other medications.
• 48:05
  Speaker 22: Well, when it comes to a lot of those commercials
• 48:08
  Speaker 22: that you and I both see, if you notice, they
• 48:10
  Speaker 22: mainly are for the side effects of psychiatric medications, and
• 48:13
  Speaker 22: a lot of psychiatric medications have a lot of side effects.
• 48:16
  Speaker 22: But that's kind of like a complicated because on the
• 48:19
  Speaker 22: one hand, the Supreme Court has said, and I agree that,
• 48:23
  Speaker 22: you know, you have the right to commercial free speech.
• 48:26
  Speaker 4: Providing you're not lying or you know, defrauding people.
• 48:29
  Speaker 22: So firemasudent companies have a right to tell people, hey,
• 48:32
  Speaker 22: we have this new product out there, and people have
• 48:34
  Speaker 22: a right to hear it. And not only that, I
• 48:37
  Speaker 22: think from a standpoint of patient economy, it's good for
• 48:40
  Speaker 22: the patient to be aware of this so they could
• 48:42
  Speaker 22: bring up with their doctor or the healthcare provider. Hey, listen,
• 48:46
  Speaker 22: I heard about this new drug. Do you think that
• 48:47
  Speaker 22: would help me in this situation? It kind of also
• 48:50
  Speaker 22: keeps the doctors on their toes because they have to
• 48:52
  Speaker 22: keep up to date. But the part of the complicating
• 48:56
  Speaker 22: factor is that this new product that's being average because
• 49:00
  Speaker 22: it's you know, it's on patent. It just was approved
• 49:03
  Speaker 22: by the FDA after maybe ten years of trials, and
• 49:07
  Speaker 22: so they have a few years to charge real high
• 49:10
  Speaker 22: for the patent expires and they recouple or research.
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: And development costs, so it's really expensive.
• 49:15
  Speaker 22: Well, the patient isn't concerned about that because the Medicare
• 49:19
  Speaker 22: party or the insurance company whatever, they're gonna pay for it.
• 49:22
  Speaker 22: So that and the doctor as well isn't concerned about
• 49:26
  Speaker 22: it because when the doctor prescribes it, the third party
• 49:29
  Speaker 22: payer is going to pay it. So so that's the
• 49:33
  Speaker 22: part that in that respect, that's part of the problem
• 49:35
  Speaker 22: because if you were paying it for it directly, Let's
• 49:38
  Speaker 22: say you were you were cash pay and you said, hey, doc,
• 49:40
  Speaker 22: I saw this new drug advertised.
• 49:42
  Speaker 4: I think this will be a good one for me.
• 49:44
  Speaker 22: Your doctor, knowing your cash pay might say to you, well,
• 49:47
  Speaker 22: that's a good one, but that costs like, you know,
• 49:49
  Speaker 22: five hundred dollars a dose, And what you're thinking right
• 49:52
  Speaker 22: now is you know ten dollars a dose, and it's
• 49:56
  Speaker 22: it works pretty well, I would stick with this before
• 49:59
  Speaker 22: we go to that.
• 50:00
  Speaker 4: Oh.
• 50:00
  Speaker 22: Absolutely, thank you for pointing that out to me. Right,
• 50:03
  Speaker 22: nobody has those type of conversations. I'm a surgeon, and
• 50:06
  Speaker 22: when when I when surgeons recommend when i'm when I
• 50:10
  Speaker 22: see a patient that I need, let's say, an expensive.
• 50:13
  Speaker 4: Imaging study at an MRI to help me get some
• 50:17
  Speaker 4: more information before I could make a recommendation to my patient.
• 50:20
  Speaker 22: My patient never asked me how much is the MRI?
• 50:24
  Speaker 22: Is there anything less expensive that would just the same answer.
• 50:27
  Speaker 22: My patient just asked me discovered by my insurance. So
• 50:30
  Speaker 22: that's part of the problem.
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, is some of it.
• 50:33
  Speaker 6: And I remember a story once about I think it
• 50:37
  Speaker 6: was ulcer medications that you know, ulcers had transitioned from
• 50:42
  Speaker 6: surgery surgically prepared to pharmaceutically prepared. I believe you know
• 50:48
  Speaker 6: some of you were talking about muscle relaxers. Some of those,
• 50:52
  Speaker 6: along with physical therapy I think, are often prescribed in
• 50:57
  Speaker 6: exchange for orthopedic surgeries. Are some of these what seemed
• 51:04
  Speaker 6: like expensive pharmaceuticals replacing even more expensive surgeries in a
• 51:11
  Speaker 6: lot of cases, so statistically it would look like something
• 51:16
  Speaker 6: you know.
• 51:17
  Speaker 4: Yes, that's the case.
• 51:18
  Speaker 22: In fact that that's an argument that's made, and it's
• 51:21
  Speaker 22: a good argument. I mean, there's some situations where like,
• 51:24
  Speaker 22: for example, a new drug that could you know, cure
• 51:27
  Speaker 22: somebody from hepatitis B or hepatitis C. You know, it's
• 51:32
  Speaker 22: expensive because it took a long time to develop it.
• 51:35
  Speaker 4: It's you know, and it's expensive to make.
• 51:41
  Speaker 22: And the argument is, yeah, but by curing this person
• 51:44
  Speaker 22: of hepatitis C, you're saving in the long run of
• 51:46
  Speaker 22: fortune because otherwise this place would go on to get
• 51:49
  Speaker 22: their roses and all sorts of complications of.
• 51:50
  Speaker 4: That right to cast you a lot more. So, there is, yeah,
• 51:53
  Speaker 4: definitely some trade offs involved here. But the unfortunate.
• 51:57
  Speaker 22: Situation is that the person who's you know, the patient
• 52:01
  Speaker 22: who is the one who's getting.
• 52:04
  Speaker 4: Consuming the product, is usually not involved.
• 52:07
  Speaker 22: In making any of those this tradeoff decisions, because the
• 52:10
  Speaker 22: trade off decisions are between the person's taying to gill yeah,
• 52:14
  Speaker 22: and the person who's selling the product.
• 52:15
  Speaker 4: The person's staying bill is a great deal of time,
• 52:18
  Speaker 4: not the patient.
• 52:19
  Speaker 6: Right, Dodtor Singer Again, it's Cato dot org where you
• 52:22
  Speaker 6: find is research. We're out of a day here. We've
• 52:25
  Speaker 6: burned our day up so much more I want to
• 52:27
  Speaker 6: talk to you about on this as well, but thank
• 52:29
  Speaker 6: you for writing the piece. Kato dot org is where
• 52:32
  Speaker 6: you find that doctor Jeffrey Singer on with us this morning.
• 52:35
  Speaker 6: First thing today, We've got to put our toys away
• 52:38
  Speaker 6: and come back for you tomorrow at five am Eastern.
• 52:42
  Speaker 6: I hope you enjoy and thanks a lot, and remember
• 52:45
  Speaker 6: it's about you, not me. Four three four eight A
• 52:47
  Speaker 6: two four two one seven. So long and thanks for
• 52:50
  Speaker 6: all the fish.
• 52:51
  Speaker 19: Crime across the country is at an all time high.
• 52:54
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