Latest / Between the Headlines: Columbus / Starkville Shifts Gears on MSMS PLUS Sheriff Hawkins Talks Public Safety

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Starkville Shifts Gears on MSMS PLUS Sheriff Hawkins Talks Public Safety · Between the Headlines: Columbus

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: From the opinion page of the commercial dispatch, this is Between the Headlines.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: This is Peter Imes, publisher of The Dispatch.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: One of our hosts of Between the Headlines is the managing editor of our newsroom.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: Typically, we try to keep news and opinion separate, but reporters have a unique insight into the workings of local government, and their analysis can be helpful for readers and listeners.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: The Dispatch remains committed to journalistic integrity, and our reporting will always reflect that.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: And now, between the headlines.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: This week on Between the Headlines, the Columbus campus of MSMS is off the chopping block, at least for now.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: Zach and I break down a newly unveiled memorandum of understanding signed by Mark Keenum and Starkville Octibihaw Superintendent Tony McGee.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: Thoughts on that today.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: Other headlines, we've got the Columbus police officer who fired on a fleeing vehicle where the suspect is charged with simple assault on a police officer.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: And our special guest today, none other than Sheriff Eddie Hawkins.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: Stay tuned.
• 1:19
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  SPEAKER_02: That is BentonsINC.com.
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  SPEAKER_02: This episode of Between the Headlines is brought to you by Bank First, the locally owned bank that makes decisions right here at home by people who understand the needs of our community.
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• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, you are listening to Between the Headlines with your local voiceover for Herbal Essence Hair Products and Managing Editor of the Dispatch, Mr.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: Zach Plair.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: And my name is David Chisholm.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: Zach, it is fancy seeing you here today as Tuesday the rapture was scheduled.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: I know.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_02: And you're still here, and I'm not sure what that says about you.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I would have thought I'd have gone, but you know, no one knows the day or the hour, so I guess those predictions are uh always kind of dumb.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you know, it it's funny how I found out about that because I had gotten sucked into some strange group text that had been put together by an acquaintance and he is a flat earther.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_02: Oh boy.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_02: And he actually believes this insincerity.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, but that's not the scary part.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: People did, man.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_03: They sold their houses and their cars, some people did.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: Dude.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the the scary part about that this guy actually believes that flat earther is based on scriptural truth.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's it's a big black firmament up there.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: Firmament, is that the word?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_02: Firmament, yeah.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's it's like just a really fancy light show that we're seeing.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: Black glass.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: Wild stuff out there.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: Bottom line, use the good book to do good things and um bless people's hearts.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_02: So for today, our our top headlines MSMS being taken off the chopping block, or so it seems, right?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, yes.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_03: Uh so right now we've got the strongest indicator yet that MSMS stays put at Mississippi University for Women.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_03: This came through uh reporting on the uh memorandum of understanding between uh Mississippi and uh Startwall Octavahall Consolidated School District for the new high school facility that they're gonna build, or the new high school campus that they're gonna build over there by the partnership school on university property.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_03: The university confirmed out and out that MSMS is not a part of that construction or design plan at all right now.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_03: Talking with uh State Representative Rob Robertson, who uh is the House Education Committee Chair for that area.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_03: He he represents Yeah, he's he repres he's from Startwill and he's also the House uh education committee chair.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_03: So he's got a pretty authoritative voice on this issue.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_03: He tells the dispatch Thursday that the uh district and the university have been in talks about maybe creating a new specialty school instead of bringing MSMS over to Startville, creating a new specialty school that would um focus on something like engineering or cybersecurity or something like that.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: He is very clear in saying that nothing's been finalized, they're just throwing ideas at the wall right now, but the conversation seems to be veering away from MSMS leaving Columbus and more toward their potentially being a competitive high school 25 minutes away.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_03: I asked him if it was gonna be residential, he said that's a possibility.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_03: Of course, it could also be non-residential, especially school could be either way, but he he said that it's a possibility it could be a residential school.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_02: This is a lot to unpack today because first off, why now?
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, if you're gonna build a residential high school, and when that word comes up, my suspicion is that's at least what he wants to happen.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and why now if he wants that to happen, and and who could blame him?
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's his district, and I think in sincerity he loves children and wants to see educational things.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_03: And he represents his district and and he and yeah, he was seeding him that.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: For for pushing over the frog pond, covering it up.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's at the same spot, the frog pond is still there, just saying.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_02: And Stephen Jones has how many days to move?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, that's that's a part of my liturgy.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um we're we're keeping up with that for sure.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: But but the thing is this it's gotta be paid for and they're approved for$105 million million dollar in bonds.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um I feel like it's gonna be more than that, but if it's gonna be one dollar more than that, they're gonna have to rely upon state appropriations or to increase that amount, correct?
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_03: Um Okay, so the funding mechanisms or in-kind mechanisms that they have in place now through this MOU and what the school board has done, right.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_03: The hundred and twenty-five, uh, the up to$125 million in bonds that'll be paid back through advalorum property taxes in Ictabal County by Tabal County taxpayers.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_03: You've got the property and maybe some in-kind work from the university that has some value as well.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, property's worth a lot of money.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_03: But that's really going to be all that MSU puts toward it capital-wise.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm okay with that.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: I am okay with Mississippi State, a land grant institution saying, hey, here's land, move on out here, here's the title to it.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: So Rob says, yes, we're we're gonna uh pursue, or I'm gonna pursue, some legislative appropriation, and I think that's where this specialty school comes in.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_03: Uh you look at the partnership school that's right beside where they're gonna try to build the high school here.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: The partnership school had a similar funding model where it was university granted the land, taxes raised to build the facility, but there were also because it was going to be incubator school for teachers, uh it was gonna be a lab for teachers that came to Mississippi State.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_03: There were legislative appropriations that went toward helping uh build that facility.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: This time around, I think that the specialty school idea is still alive because I don't think MSMS is leaving Columbus.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think there's a political will for that anymore.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: The people have spoken and the legislature has heard them.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that the State Board of Education put their foot in it when they tried to force the legislature's hand.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: And then the legislature said, Yeah, well, you're not going to tell us what to do.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_03: And the political will for relocating MSMS disappeared with you know no funding for that happening.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_03: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you say it disappeared.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think it was ever truly there except for in one county.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_03: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_03: Well, so now you have this specialty school that you can open up very similar to MSMS.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_03: You know, oh, we need to build a dorm.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_03: Kids from all over the state can come and study, uh, you know, be it a magnet school for engineering or cybersecurity or whatever.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_03: And that's going to be for everybody in the state, so we need some state appropriations to make that happen.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's the justification right now for uh getting state money to to make that project a mega campus, even still.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_03: Like that that's the only thing that I can see as the justification.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_02: A mega campus, as in a state of the heart, a state-of-the-art glass, Taj Mahal, or whatever it's gonna be.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_02: The thing about it is, okay, Tony McGee, is that is that his name correct?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, the superintendent of he said that he wanted it to be state of the art, but he also said that he wanted it to be frugal and good stewardship of tax dollars.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: You can't really have both.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_02: If it's gonna be state of the art.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_03: You can provide state-of-the-art facilities to educate children and it still be frugal and efficient and and good stewardship.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_03: You absolutely can.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: State of the art sounds expensive.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: It sounds like you're gonna build expensive doesn't mean it's not worth it because it's educating children.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, no, no.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: Hang on.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: Let's say we're look at MSMS.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: Look at the crap hole they're sitting in down there with no air conditioner.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_03: Well, that's a that's a mutually those issues are mutually exclusive.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_03: What Starville High School does and what it bonds for itself and what the taxpayers are willing to pay for their school is mutually exclusive from what that was.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_03: What the state has done with MSMS.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: This idea of how it's done and how it's run, that part can certainly be state of the art.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: But the structure, the building, I just listen, I I went to New Hope and and it was in a time period where, well, we don't really have the money to build a new high school right now.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: So they rolled out trailers and we had class in trailers, and I think I'm okay.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: And if you don't build all right, so let's use your New Hope example and and bring it forward where they did build a new multi-million dollar campus out there and the roof leaked for years.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_03: If you don't do it right and you don't do it well, it's still poor stewardship, and you shouldn't do that to the children you're trying to educate.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_02: Leaky roofs are likewise expensive, shall I say.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_03: But I I think some of the other issues that come from you've got a you've got a specialty school that is, you know, engineering and uh math-based, 25 miles away from MSMS.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_03: There's a possibility that you create a couple more problems.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: One, if there hadn't been enough money to fix MSMS up until this point, why do we have money to build another specialty school?
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_03: That's a fair question.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the second thing is, all right, let's just say they concede.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_03: They say, okay, we're gonna fix both up, we're gonna build the one, we're gonna fix the other up, and we're gonna leave everybody alone to their rat killing.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: Are these two schools not competing at this point for the same kids?
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you've either got one of two things.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's either, as you say, a dilution of funds because these the same money is either gonna go to Starkville or to Columbus in this case.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if it's strategic or intentional, but that's the implication.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: Or you've got duplicate efforts, which has similar effects, which I don't think the legislature is gonna have the appetite for that when they're gonna have a session that's gonna have a lot of talk about consolidation.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, this is the consolidation uh session coming up, I have a feeling, and educational freedom.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_03: Uh build a magnet school, build a fancy whatever, but once you start putting bricks and mortar for a dormitory, that's when it begins to get really uh yeah, really sketchy in the sense of um But look, if it enhances education and it increases the uh number of kids that can have a high quality top-notch specialized education in in multiple places, um that's a that's a good thing for the state of Mississippi.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_03: That's a good thing for these kids.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_03: If it is one of these deals where it's like, well, we can't take over MSMS, so we'll just kill it by attrition, that's a bad thing.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_03: Well, that's what it smells like.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: Lots of details, of course, to be hammered out.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just telling you that$125 million is not going to cut it for something that's quote unquote state of the art.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: It I don't think it'll accomplish uh what they're drawing up.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't seen it, but I it just looks like it's gonna cost a lot of money.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: I don't like spending.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: Well, they can spend their money, but don't be talking.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: Well, but that look, you live over there.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, okay, that's your choice.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: I don't live over there.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's why I don't want I you know, I pay my ad valorum for Lowndes County.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_03: $25 million isn't gonna be your problem.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_03: It's the legislative appropriations.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Though$126 millionth dollar will be my problem because if they start reaching into the um special funds and duplicating efforts and diluting, um, it just doesn't smell good.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_02: But hopefully I am wrong.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: Nonetheless, our efforts to keep MSMS here, I think, still need to be in high gear and fully active because we don't know.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: We're just learning about this, we're waiting, and we do not know what the session will bring up.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I th and I will say this if MSMS is if if MSMS's location survives this upcoming session, I think it's secure.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_02: All right, so that's that.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um Okay, any thoughts about um what you think the legislature might be up to?
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: Talk to us about it.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Tips at cdispatch.com.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_02: Up next, we will talk about the Columbus police officer that opened fire on a fleeing a fleeing vehicle or something.
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• 17:05
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• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, Zach.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: For this next segment, we're talking about something that is in an ongoing investigation.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: So we don't want to jump the gun.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and we want to um be sure to clarify that this is a um this is alleged stuff and this is a um innocent until proven guilty.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: But Mr.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: Taylor Jackson appears to have attempted to flee a traffic stop, and the officer perhaps thought he was getting run over, subsequently opened fired, and now it has been turned over to MBI.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: Is that correct?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yep, that's that's that's right.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_03: It was on Northside last Friday.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the officer gets out of the car.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: That's when the suspect allegedly tries to run him over.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: Officer fires at the car um in the in the chaos, misses the suspect, and it ends up turning into a foot pursuit where the suspect is uh arrested in some nearby woods.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: For me here, I'm I'm interested to see what MBI says about whether the shooting is justified.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm not going to make any uh attempt to discern that for myself.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: That is a body camp or anything.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, but I mean a couple of things that you're looking at here.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_03: On the one hand, you've got an officer firing a weapon uh at a moving car in a residential area.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: And we don't know at this point if he was shooting at the suspect or at the rear wheels, or do we?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_03: Well, it just says that he he shot at the vehicle and did not hit the suspect.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_03: That's all that we know.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, it's it's gonna be interesting to see what MBI says about whether it was justified for him to do that in those circumstances.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_03: On the other hand, and I think that uh this bears noting, and and and this this does come up very often when you know police in particular are talking about he the moment decisions.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_03: How many important decisions have you or I either one had to make immediately after someone tried to run us over?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_03: None.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_03: I I mean I can't remember one that I had to make.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_03: It's tough.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and and so I certainly um Training.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_03: If yeah, if it if if there's a training issue, let's deal with it.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_03: If it's a policy issue, let's deal with it.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_03: And Eddie on the Yeah, I can't I can't I I can't tell you that I wouldn't do the same thing.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_03: I can't tell you what I would do in a situation in the seconds immediately after somebody tried to run me over, and then you have the added uh responsibility of getting that guy styped.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_03: You I mean, I imagine that the impulse there is to use whatever you have available to you.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_03: So I you know, I can certainly understand that as well.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_03: But you know, if it's a training violation, if it's a policy violation, let's deal with that.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_03: But uh let's keep in mind that uh these types of decisions are decisions that we very often or ever have to make in the heat of the moment like that.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_02: So the the suspect was charged with simple assault.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_02: And that simple assault was upgraded to a felony because it was on an officer.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because it was on an officer.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: He was not charged with aggravated assault, which is harder to prove.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but it it it's kind of interesting.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_02: A motor vehicle is a deadly weapon if you're trying to run someone over with it.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: So in in terms of what he's been charged with, simple assault, even though it's got the um felony attached to it, that is still the lesser of the charges that could have been sent.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you don't want to you don't want to get any kind of assault charge against a you don't want to get charged for any kind of assault against a police officer.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_03: And uh and don't run from the cops, don't try to hurt the cops.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_03: Pretty simple.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: I'm I'm looking at this and thinking about recent events, thinking about the that that poor guy that that got hit and had to go to the hospital for the b the brain bleed.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm wondering, what if the officer shot through the back of that glass and struck the suspect in the back of the head and killed him?
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what kind of a mess would we be dealing with on the streets of Columbus right now if that happened?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's I mean, it's it's tough to think about.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_02: I just uh we need transparency and you know, maybe that uh not maybe, but definitely, that civilian oversight committee, this would be something that they could be looking into right now.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I don't know if it I mean it's out of the city's hands.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: This is a state investigation, this is a Mississippi Bureau of Investigation case.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_02: If it goes to that, then that the oversight committee as it would have stood never would look into it.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_02: Is that what I'm hearing?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I mean this is a uh on a on a policy basis, I imagine CPD is looking into it.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_03: But as far as what comes of the actual investigation and the investigative materials and all of that, that's in possession of the that's in the jurisdiction of MBI.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: Which I imagine would mean the Attorney General's office would be, uh not Scott would be presenting it to the grand jury.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: Today on the program, we are pleased to have a gentleman who keeps you safe all over Lowndes County.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: And if you live in the city, that does include you.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome Sheriff Eddie Hawkins to the show today.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_05: Well, thank you.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_05: I'm glad to be here.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_03: I want to start uh really what's what's been in the news lately or most recently has been this Terra Blanca guy uh getting that federal sentence.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_03: That was that that was a wild and honestly kind of disturbing case.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: Can you talk about talk about a little bit how that how Lowndes County got involved, what that involves, and kind of how all that came together.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_05: Well, uh it was brought to our attention uh that this gentleman was living here in Lowndes County.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_05: And and uh I I think he came to Lowndes County because he was employed by a contractor who was helping build the aluminum dynamics uh processing mill out here.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_05: And uh when he came to town, uh he came to town under an alias.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and he was running from uh authorities in North Carolina.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_05: South South Carolina.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_05: South Carolina, sorry.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_05: And uh we got information that he was living here in Columbus.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_05: So we started an investigation and following up on it and actually identified him uh and where he was at.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_05: And uh we have a uh member of our agency that's assigned to the U.S.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_05: Marshals Federal Task Force, uh the Fugitive Task Force, who uh received the information and received the warrant for his arrest.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_05: And uh we followed up on that and uh identified where he was living here in Columbus, and we're able to uh catch him at home and and make the arrest.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_05: Once we identified him uh and made sure we had the right guy, uh we actually seized a couple of cell phones that he had in his possession and we got search warrants for those phones and we were able to identify uh child pornography that he had in his possession.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_03: And these were young these were young.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_05: These were were young children uh that were being abused and and uh uh he had images of these children on his phone, which is uh, of course, uh a federal violation.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so we presented that case to the federal authorities in the U.S.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_05: Attorney's Office and uh seeked an indictment.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_05: Uh an indictment was handed down and he was uh charged federally on the new charges out of Columbus here.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so uh that's what he was just recently uh pled guilty to and and sentenced on.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_03: These images uh were being were they being like sold on a marketplace or they they were.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_05: He was part of a group that uh explores children and and distributes these images worldwide.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and and people that that are are uh using the dark web in order to, you know, gain access to these type of images for their own gratification.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_05: And and uh you know, every time an image like that is is shared or posted or the delivered or emailed, uh they're exporting, you know, that child again and again.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_05: And uh we're just proud of the work that our guys did to be able to get him off the streets and get him convicted.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, he's been deported before, uh and he made his way back into the country.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_05: And now he's being charged as well for, you know, uh that violation.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Well now after he'll serve his seven years or so, 180 months, whatever it is, here's right, and that's and then he'll go he'll be deported again.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_05: He'll be deported again.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_05: And and uh ICE is is handling that end of it, you know, for the federal system.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_05: But uh what people don't understand, you know, they they hear seven years, that's that's not a long time.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_05: Well, in the federal system, they don't get any good time.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_05: That's day for day that they have to serve in the federal system, uh, which, you know, is uh still not enough time in my opinion for somebody doing these type of crimes.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_05: But once he finishes his sentence here in the United States, he will be deported and sent out of the country again.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and uh of course, with the border being locked down like it is now, we hope that he doesn't regain entry and come back to the United States.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_03: So talking about immigration just generally, uh I know that local law enforcement agencies are um have been asked to or are training to assist ICE in various ways of uh for trying to crack down on illegal immigration and remove the people who have immigrated here illegally, to the extent that you can talk about the sheriff's office involvement in that and how much of that y'all are seeing in this area.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_05: Well, we do see uh problem with immigration here in Lyons County, just like we do anywhere else in the country.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we have uh undocumented residents that are here living in our community that are uh not supposed to be here.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_05: Uh now we do not have uh any of our deputies that are deputized with IES enforcement to be able to go out and and effectively uh make arrest on immigration issues.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_05: Uh however, if one of these individuals commits another offense where we do have jurisdiction to make that arrest, we arrest them.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we determine that they are undocumented, and we take them to our facility at the Lowness County Adult Detention Center, and then we call ICE and say, hey, we've got this guy, he's committed this violation and he's undocumented.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_05: They put a detainer on him, and usually within one to two, three days, he's out of our system and ICE has picked him up and they're deporting him.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so what you're doing kind of goes against that narrative that some people push where you're going out there with a log and busting open the door of a Mexican restaurant and taking granny and putting her in handcuffs.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_05: That that's correct.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_05: We we we don't enforce those uh immigration laws uh uh unless they're committing another violation.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_03: Aaron Ross Powell With the anxiety surrounding immigration enforcement and ICE and you know the narratives that do come from that and the raids that have happened.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: Are y'all seeing on y'all's end when you when you're dealing with trying to get witness statements in certain places?
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_03: Uh are y'all seeing more reticence because of immigration enforcement?
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_05: Well, you know, it's hard to get the community to give us information on crimes generally.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, when when a crime is committed in the community, nobody wants to get involved and nobody wants to say anything.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_05: And you know, we we try to preach to everybody, you know, if you see something, say something, you know.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_05: And uh it's just hard to get people involved, you know.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh I don't see uh uh increase in in information.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_05: Flowing to us because of the immigration issues or anything.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_03: Or a decrease.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_05: It's you know about like it was.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_02: Let me switch gears.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_02: I want to ask you a couple of things.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_02: First off, without naming names, do you do you feel a sense of frustration in the the general policies and procedures and the way things are carried out where the arrests that you make actually make it into the courtroom?
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_05: That can be quite frustrating.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_05: We deal with repeat offenders all the time.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_05: And a lot of times we'll arrest somebody.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_05: They'll get a bond set and they get out of jail on bond.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_05: And of course, we get a lot of criticism from the public, you know, because this person has been arrested, charged, and now he's out on the street, you know, within the R.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_03: But you have a constitutional right to a bond in most cases.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_05: They do, in in most cases.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_05: There's some uh stipulations to that.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_05: If if they're currently out on a bond and they commit another felony, uh they can be held without bond until they go to trial.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_05: Uh a lot of times they can't make bond because they don't have the money or can't afford to post that amount of money, and they sit in jail until they go to trial.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_05: That's frustrating for us because now this guy that had just committed a uh a drive-by shooting or or shot somebody, now he's out walking the streets again.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: And uh So can any of that be attributed to either lack of evidence or a packed court system?
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_05: Aaron Ross Powell A lack of evidence.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_05: Uh let's talk about that a minute.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, a lot of cases we get evidence uh on a on a crime scene and and that's physical evidence that we have.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_05: And and then, you know, uh some things might be circumstantial evidence where you have somebody saying, Hey, I saw this guy shoot little Billy down the street.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_05: And all we have is his word saying, hey, that's all we have.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_05: Uh that's circumstantial evidence we present to the grand jury, and the grand jury says, Well, I don't know if I believe this guy saying that he's the one that shot little Billy down the street, you know.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_05: So that case may or may not get indicted based on the evidence that we are presenting.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_05: Uh however, it's hard to get people to come forward and and tell us information.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_05: Uh a lot of people try to administer street justice.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_05: And uh there's a lot of crimes that happen, you know, uh on retaliation.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_03: This is compounding the problem.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_05: That that compounds the problem.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_05: And and a lot of this crime that's committed uh is coming from these young generations, uh, they can't solve their differences without picking up a gun.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and they they think that uh if somebody posts something on Facebook that upsets them, the answer is, well, I'm just gonna ride by their house and shoot up their house.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and uh there's a lot of innocent people that get shot and hurt over nonsense that you know in these individuals are doing.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_05: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_03: The city police chief uh Joseph Daltrey has has called it the same eight knuckleheads going around shooting at each other all the time.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_05: Trevor Burrus That's a good uh analogy there.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we're dealing with the same people back and forth, you know, from shooting to shooting because of retaliation.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_03: Well, uh one thing that has been brought up time and again in the uh discussion about uh people making bond, getting out, committing other crimes.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_03: Uh there's the length of time between initial arrest and indictment and trial.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um that comes up and the fact that that's a pretty long time right now.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_05: Well, it it is.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_05: And there's different varieties uh variables that that cause that.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_05: Uh say it's a drug case, okay, and we have to take the drugs that we've seized from that individual and we have to send it to the crime lab for analysis.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_05: Uh that analysis sometimes takes a long time because of the crime lab and them being backed up on cases.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_03: But the crime lab here should help with that, right?
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, the crime lab here does help us with that.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_05: And we we have an MOU with the the crime lab, and uh uh we send all of our drugs to the city crime lab here for analysis.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_05: And uh that that process is speeding up a little bit for us and and we're getting it back in a little bit more timely manner than it used to be.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_05: However, it still takes time.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, we can't just go drop it off today and receive the results tomorrow.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_03: That's how that happens on the TV show.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it does.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_05: It happens within an hour on TV, you know.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_05: But realistically, it takes a long time to go through the process of an analyzing these drugs and and getting the results back uh in a format that we can use in court to to uh present to a grand jury or a a jury for conviction.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_03: Well, in the meantime, the the the primary criticism that I hear, higher bonds could solve the problem.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_03: Where do you stand on that?
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_05: I think higher bonds does help in keeping people in jail.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_05: However, they still have a bond that they're entitled to make if somebody can come up with enough money.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_05: And uh okay, we arrest a drug dealer and he gets a bond for$350,000 on whatever charge he's got, trafficking or whatever.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_05: Drug dealers have money.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_05: You know, so they're gonna come up with money to be able to post that bond and get him out of jail.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_05: And, you know, uh they're going through professional bondsmen's that charge them a percentage of what the bond is.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_03: Usually 10, right?
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_05: Well, usually it's around 10 percent.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, I've heard of bondsmen, you know, making a deal and and taking less amount to to get him out of jail, but uh we don't have any control over that.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_05: The bondsmen themselves, they're putting up the bond and uh assuring the court that they're gonna bring this guy back to court.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_05: Uh whatever they charge the individual is is on them.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_05: We we don't have any control over that.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_05: They're controlling him and and making sure that he gets back to court.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: But okay, so if you've got so I know this isn't how the system works, but let's just for hypothetical purposes, you're before all three circuit court judges and they say, look, we we hear you we'll do what what what would be your what would be your solution for the problem we're listening.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um would you say in that case like higher bonds would help, or would you come would you have another solution that you would suggest?
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_05: I think you know, uh harsher sentencing would help deture crime.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_05: You know, uh years ago the legislator passed House Bill 585, and uh if if someone's convicted of a crime now, uh they only serve a percentage of the time that the judge gives them.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_03: Unless it's a certain violence, it's violent.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_05: Unless it's a certain type of crime.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so a lot of times these people that commit these crimes, uh, they anticipate going to jail.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh drug dealers expect to go to jail sometime in their career.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_05: It's just kind of a part of doing business.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_05: You know, they don't look to go to jail and they hope they don't go to jail, but you know, the odds are that someone's gonna catch them at some point and they're gonna go to jail.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_03: And that's over a 20, 25-year career, they may serve five or six in the pen.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_05: Correct, correct.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_05: And and uh if we had harsher sentencing and uh on violations like that, it would deter these type of crimes.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_05: Uh on on your aggravated assaults or your uh domestic violence, uh your uh felony DUIs, you know, uh it seems like they don't get uh enough time in jail to correct the problem, uh, if you will, to deter them from being arrested and coming back to jail.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_05: So uh harsher sentencing would surely help in deterring crime.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_03: And you're particularly you're really zeroing in on drug crime here.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_05: Well, you know, I I ran my whole campaign on fighting the drug problem here in Lowndes County.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_05: And uh, you know, my career was based on drug enforcement.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_03: So You were at the Bureau of Narcotics before you ran for sheriff.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_05: I I worked for the Bureau of Narcotics uh, you know, before I ran for sheriff.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_05: I was with them for 20 years and I I ran the methamphetamine program for the state.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_05: And uh I I saw the the problem that we had with with drugs and particularly methamphetamine throughout the state of Mississippi.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_05: And and here in Lowndes County, the drug of choice by users is still methamphetamine.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we have a huge problem with that drug, and uh the drugs fuel the other crime, uh are property thefts or domestic violences or uh aggravated assaults.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_05: A lot of these crimes are fueled by drugs or drug-related crimes.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh giving an example, the the crime scenes that we go on, if if we've had a shooting, uh we always find one common denominator at that scene, and that's marijuana.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_05: You know, marijuana is a widely used drug, and there's a lot of controversy on should this drug be legal?
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_05: Is it medicine or is it medicine?
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_05: My opinion, and this is my opinion, and I've been doing this 35 years now.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_05: Uh marijuana is a gateway drug.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_05: Uh everybody that I arrest and interview, they always start off using marijuana, usually around the age of 13, and they progressively get into harder drugs that lead them to a life of crime.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_05: Now, does everybody that uses marijuana get involved in other crimes?
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_05: No.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_05: But the ones that do get involved in harsher crimes, they always start with marijuana.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_05: So I see it as a gateway drug, and they progressively get into harder drugs and more violent crime later on down the road.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_05: Which, if we work on the drug problem, it decreases other crime in our community.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_05: So when I was running my campaign, I ran it on the drug problem.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_05: And uh, we've been very successful here in in Lowndes County uh arresting drug violators and and targeting these organizations that are distributing drugs in our community.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: Well, and that was going to be my next question.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_03: How is Lowndes County Sheriff's Office getting at the distributors?
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_05: We have been very successful here uh lately.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_05: And uh we take a lot of our distributors and and major violators uh federally.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh-huh.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_05: I have one of our uh agencies, a captain, and he's running our narcotics division, who is assigned to uh the DEA task force, and uh we have a very good working relationship with the Drug Enforcement Administration, and we take a lot of crimes that are committed here in Lyons County to the federal level.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we get very good prosecution out of these cases, and the sentison is a little harsher uh in the federal system, and it makes an impact.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we we see the impact in our community when we take an organization, and and when I say organization, we're taking 10 to 20 people involved in this one distribution network out of the equation, and they're gone from our community for 15 years or or or better.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_05: Uh that's an impact.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_05: That's a statement, and that sends a message throughout the community.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and we've been pretty successful in in deterring crime, and we've been successful in arresting drug violators in our community and getting harsh or sentencing.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yeah, but uh are you stopping the flow of drugs in by doing this?
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_03: Or are you just I mean, is are the distributors here middlemen or well?
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_05: I I'll say this.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_05: We just recently uh worked on an operation here in Lyndon County where we targeted uh a network, an individual that was uh distributing drugs not only here in Lyndon County, but throughout Mississippi, Alabama, and uh even Tennessee.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_05: We had people that were coming here to buy their drugs and take back to these other communities.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_05: Uh this individual was in uh had a manufacturing process where he was taking methamphetamine and uh he had a pill press and he was actually pressing these tablets out of meth and distributing them statewide and and regionally.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so that was a significant case.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_05: And and we targeted him, uh arrested him and several members of the organization.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and and some of those members have now pled guilty in federal court and are waiting sentencing.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so when we do something like that, it it makes an impact in the community.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_05: And the the other drug dealers who are middlemen or smaller users, they see this and they say, Oh, well, maybe I need to back away from the table.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_03: You know, uh Well, in your mind, and I know that and we've talked to the DA about this, we've talked to judges about this, and and the sometimes on the podcast, other times in the paper, but um intervention programs, drug courts, that type of thing, and and sort of I guess the justice system displaying some degree of empathy for you know the addiction being addiction that needs to be treated.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_03: Uh where do you stand on all of that?
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_03: Where where do you feel like the balance is?
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_03: What are your opinions on uh intervention and treatment versus enforcement and incarceration?
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I'll say this.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we have a very successful program here in Lowndes County.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Judge Kitchens runs a drug court here.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_05: And a lot of our low-level first-time offenders that have a drug addiction problem get sentenced in court.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_05: Uh they'll be arrested for a possession charge and go in front of the judge and get drug court instead of going to prison.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_05: And and that's an intervention.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, once they successfully complete that program, then they get a non-adjudicated sentence and these crimes can be wiped from the record.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_05: And it's been very successful.
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_05: Uh the drug problem that we have in our community is not a problem that we can just arrest our way out of.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_05: We can't put everybody in jail and expect the problem to go away.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_05: You know, uh drug addiction is just that.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_05: It's an addiction.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_05: It's a it's a problem that people have that they uh need help with.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_05: And I'm all about giving somebody a second chance.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_05: I'm all about helping somebody that needs help.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_05: But a lot of times they don't realize they need the help until we actually make the arrest and get them in the court system.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_05: And a lot of times that that's where we have to go with these individuals.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we can go to them and do an intervention and say, okay, today's the day, you're gonna go to rehab, you're gonna get some help.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_05: And they may or may not take that choice.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you can't force somebody to do something they don't want to do.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_05: If they don't want the help, it's not gonna help them.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_05: But if you make an arrest and they see, okay, you're fixing to go to prison if you don't change your life, then the light bulb goes off and they say, Oh, I've got to do something here and get some help, and then we put them in the program, they go through the system and they actually get the help that they need.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: One last little question I want to throw at you.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_02: I've noticed that in the conversation today, DUI has not come into the discussion at all.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I know it still happens, you know, especially after football games and holidays and whatnot, and it's still a danger, but it it seems like marijuana and other things have to some extent taken over alcohol as the as uh the drug of choice for for people that ought not be driving, shall we say.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: And and I I guess my question is with marijuana and other certain substances, you can't do a breathalyzer per se.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so how has your enforcement tactic changed in a way to keep our highways safe?
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_05: Well, you you know, with the legalization of medical marijuana uh here in Mississippi, it it has effectively uh increased a problem with with people using drugs and then getting behind the wheel uh of a vehicle.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, we've we've stopped people and we walk up to the car and we can smell the odor of marijuana coming from the car.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_02: You can smell it before you get out if you're a cruiser.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: We can.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's uh a very distinct smell.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh people describe it as as it smells like a skunk, and and a lot of times it does.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_05: When we walk up to a car and we can smell that coming from the car, you know, we're automatically assuming that the user, uh the driver is has been using marijuana because if we see him weaving all over the road or or you know uh driving erratically and we make a stop and then we walk up to the car and we smell that marijuana.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_02: Or driving 15 miles an hour.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_05: You know.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we we've had people, you know, sir, have you been using marijuana tonight?
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_05: Uh well, yeah, but I've got a marijuana card.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_05: And they think that that card is a get out of jail free card.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_03: Still can't drive impaired.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_05: That's that's exactly right.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_05: Uh when when someone's using marijuana, it impairs the ability for them to effectively drive that vehicle uh correctly, and uh it can cause all kinds of dangerous effects.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_05: And uh impaired driving doesn't mean you have to be drinking alcohol.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_05: It can be under the influence of uh prescription medication or marijuana or some other substance that they're using that effectively impairs the the driving skills of that driver.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_03: And uh under the influence of texting on your phone while you're going to miles an hour down.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_02: Don't even open that can be a good idea.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_02: That is a problem.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_02: That is a problem.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_02: I hope Adderall is not on that list.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_03: Well, uh I know that uh I mean the pressures for uh keeping a full staff with all law enforcement agencies right now is really high.
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_03: How's that hitting y'all on the deputy side?
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_03: And I know that the jailer side, it's hit y'all really hard.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_05: It it has.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, public safety is very expensive.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_05: And uh not only here in Lowndes County, but across the nation, uh law enforcement as a whole is having problems recruiting and retaining officers.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_05: And a lot of that has to do with with the pay that these officers are now receiving.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_05: Uh here in in in Lowndes County, I'm doing everything I can to work with the Board of Supervisors to bring that pay scale up.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_03: Uh but it's not only And just for clarity, what uh what's the what's the entry pay for a jailer, what's the entry pay for a first aid deputy?
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_05: Uh right now, before October 1, because uh we just worked with the Board of Supervisors to increase a pay rate uh uh a pay increase for the uh the deputies and the jail staff.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_05: Uh all county employees uh received a a$2,000 uh a year pay raise, which uh effectively is is a is a small amount uh per hour, but it is an increase to what they're they're receiving.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we pay our deputies uh to start, and this is a a deputy uh that is certified in walking in off the street as a certified role deputy, twenty dollars an hour.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_05: Our jail staff is getting sixteen twenty-five an hour.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_05: Now with the pay scale increase, that effectively is is uh a dollar an hour more.
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_05: Uh right.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_05: So it'll go to twenty-one and then seventeen twenty-five for uh the jail staff.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and that's not enough.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we're in in the golden triangle area, uh we're down at the bottom of the scale as far as pay rates go.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_05: Uh if you start comparing to the the rest of the state, you know, you you get up around uh the Soto County, South Haven, they're they're paying their deputies really, really good money uh to to work up there in that area.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_05: Uh but they're trying to recruit people to come into the the county.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_05: The problem that I have here, uh check take my jail staff for an example.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_05: They have to go through a certification class to be certified as a jailer and work uh in the correctional field.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_05: Uh they're they're certified correctional officers.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_05: Once they receive that certification, uh then they can go out to other facilities and make more money.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_05: Uh there's a federal correctional facility just right across the state line in Aliceville, uh, that right now I was told they're 50 officers short.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_05: And that's a problem for me because once I certify them, now they have the certification, it's very easy for the federal correctional facility to look at this guy and say, hey, we need to offer him a job.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and they pay a lot more than what I can pay.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_05: So that's a problem.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_05: Then you look at my role deputies uh making$20 an hour.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_05: And you got other agencies around us that are paying$25, you know, or better to start.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it's hard for me to retain those officers.
• 53:08
  SPEAKER_05: And then I'm dealing with industry here in Lyons County who's coming to town and and building big facilities and hiring eleven hundred people and paying$90,000 a year to start.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_05: And they're looking for the same guy that I'm looking for.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_05: A guy that can pass a background investigation and a drug test.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_05: You know.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_03: But you but you can't you can't reasonably compete with that.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_03: I cannot ever.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_05: I cannot compete with that kind of uh money ever.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_05: And and that's a problem for not only myself, but every law enforcement uh agency in in the area is looking to try to increase the pay to retain people because we have to have law enforcement officers.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_05: We have to have jail staff to watch the prisoners.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_05: My role deputies, I have uh around 75 uh full-time deputies that we have uh positions for.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I'm a couple short right now.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_05: I I've got some that have retired or left or gone to other jobs uh for whatever reason.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_05: Either it's more money or better work environment, you know, whatever they think they gotta have, they're they're they're doing what's right for their family.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_06: Right.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_05: So it's it's hard for me to retain people at the pay scale that that these deputies are making now.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and uh I've been very fortunate to be able to work with the board and they've been very generous in in helping us with equipment and uh technology and and helping uh that that helps retain people because we we have good cars, we have good equipment, you know, and uh I I try to make a very good working environment for the guys and uh that helps.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_05: But bottom line is they're looking at the bottom dollar, you know.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_05: What can I do to better my family and and myself?
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_05: And it's hard to retain people when we're at the bottom of the pay scale.
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_03: Well, one more question I have for you.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_03: Uh how wild was yesterday afternoon when 911 went out for two hours?
• 55:12
  SPEAKER_05: Oh my goodness.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_05: That was a uh debacle.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_05: We we were uh notified via radio through 911 that all of the 911 lines had been had gone down here locally, and and we were trying to figure out was it an internal problem?
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_03: And it ended up being a three-state problem.
• 55:36
  SPEAKER_05: It did.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_05: It did.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_05: And there was a a fiber line that was cut that ATT uh had an uh an incident with that shut the 911 system down for Mississippi, Louisiana, and part of Alabama.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so it was a huge problem just all of a sudden.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_05: And we were having to reroute calls through the sheriff's office to 911.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_05: And it's it's kind of technical.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_05: Uh the 911 dispatchers do a phenomenal job, and they are the backbone of law enforcement.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, I don't know what we would ever do without these ladies.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_05: They they work hard and long hours and they're short staffed.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh I've been working with the board.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I know Cindy Lawrence, the EMA director, has been working with the board to try to help get these girls a pay raise so that we can recruit more dispatchers.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, they're short-handed right now.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_05: And and fortunately, they've got them a pretty good pay pump right now that's going to help them recruit you know more dispatchers because we have to have them.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_05: That's very important.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_05: And I saw firsthand yesterday how important that was because all the calls that 911 get started coming into the sheriff's office.
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_05: And we had to effectively become dispatchers for a couple hours.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_05: And I was making arrangements, you know, to see who I could come in and work the night shift just to answer 911 calls.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_05: In case it in case it went on longer than what it actually did.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_05: So uh I was about to pull what little hair I have left out of my head because it was hence the need for a second amendment.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_05: What if we can't reach you guys, dude?
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_05: Well, you know, if we lose our dispatchers and there's no one there to answer the phone at 911 when we have an emergency, uh we're gonna have a problem.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_06: You know?
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_05: And we saw that firsthand yesterday.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_05: I'm I'm sure there were people trying to call 911 and they couldn't get through.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yesterday was was uh an adventure.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_05: It it really was.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_05: But I'm glad it didn't last any longer than it did.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_03: Was there a fear, I guess, on the back end that maybe in in the in all of that mess that maybe some emergencies did go unresponded?
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_05: Uh fortunately we haven't heard of any major concerns uh of any uh medical emergency that that somebody needed immediate assistance that didn't get it.
• 58:17
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we did have a couple of calls come in through our agency that we had to dispatch the ambulance to.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and and we were sending deputies to the locations as well to make sure that you know everybody was was taken care of.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it was kind of hectic, you know, because it was happening so fast and we didn't have any heads up or any notice of this.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_05: It was just something that happened, and we had to step up and and do what we had to do to make it uh make it all work.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_05: And uh I'm just glad it didn't last any longer than it did.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_05: Because it could have been really, really uh nerve-wracking.
• 58:53
  SPEAKER_03: Uh or tragic, you know, tragic.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_05: It really could have, yeah.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_03: Was there anything you want to add?
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I I just appreciate you, you know, having me in and and uh I I want you to know we're we're doing everything we can at the Lyons County Sheriff's Office uh to make our community safe and and help our citizens here in Lyndons County.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_02: And uh uh I appreciate the opportunity to come in and speak with you and just you sitting in here.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_02: I I just don't get the impression that I'm in the room that somebody that just wants to arrest people for the sake of hurting people, but you want to help people and you want to make the community safer, safer, safer.
• 59:32
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you so much for what you do.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you, and I appreciate all the the help and everything that the community gives us.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh I I get compliments all the time from you know people in the public about our deputies and them seeing them out and and helping people and uh Well they drive slower than the city cops do, to be fair.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_05: That's good to know.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_02: Ladies and gentlemen, Sheriff Eddie Hawkins.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: All right, well, Zach.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me three things I need to know for this week.
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_03: So school accountability ratings are back and it's a mixed bag.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_03: Lowndes County School District maintained an A rating for the seventh straight year.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_03: Columbus Municipal School District dropped back down to a C.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_03: Number two, the Golden Triangle Development Link has hired a search firm to help find its new CEO.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_03: Jorgensen Pace, based in Greensboro, North Carolina, specializes in recruiting leaders for nonprofits, economic development, and community development organizations, and has assisted clients from all over the country.
• 1:00:34
  SPEAKER_03: Number three, Lee Park's getting a facelift, and it's community driven.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_03: Lee Park.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's over there Park Circle.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Park Circle near 7th Street North.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, they've uh City's renovated the bathrooms as part of its uh parks plan, but the uh thank goodness uh community is coming together, fixing up the playground, cleaning up the place, security cameras, picnic tables, new art.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_03: I just think it's kind of neat to see uh the community uh identify that need and then throw in with their money and their time, and they're having a cleanup day there uh Saturday, 9 to 11 a.m.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, you can you can clean the park and still make the ball game.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_02: So that's a good thing.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I've got a special place in my heart for Lee Park.
• 1:01:24
  SPEAKER_02: My granddad used to take me there to play when I was a young, young child.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_02: And um, yeah, just just thinking about it.
• 1:01:31
  SPEAKER_02: Number one, please fix the restroom because you know, if if the restroom is locked, other things happen.
• 1:01:38
  SPEAKER_02: Just just saying that's that's a problem in and of its own.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_02: The place really wasn't that ugly last I saw it.
• 1:01:45
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it I just hope they don't go overboard with cutting the trees, right?
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's a nice little shady area.
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, I mean, and we need shade.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, pop parks are hot.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's like that's the only reason I don't want to take my kids to it is because it's a hundred degrees outside and the trees are very, very limited.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_02: So, but hey, hats off to the people who have uh who have stepped forward to make that place shine.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_02: We thank all of you for joining today.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_02: Be sure to follow the show and share it and help get the word out, help make the hometown a better place.
• 1:02:18
  SPEAKER_02: As always, send us your comments about anything we've talked about today.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_02: Tips at cdispatch.com.
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_02: You can also follow me on Facebook or X at D Chisholm Double Zero.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_02: Leave us a public comment.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_02: Signing off until next week from Catfish Alley Studio in historic now town Columbus.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_02: Your host has been Zach Player, and I am David Chisholm.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_02: Y'all stay friendly.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_02: We'll keep it real.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_00: Opinions expressed on this show are those of the speakers and not necessarily those of the commercial dispatch.