Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / SUSPECT CLAIMS PTSD AFTER 'FINDING' MADDIE SOTO 13, 'ICE COLD, BLUE LIPS'

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SUSPECT CLAIMS PTSD AFTER 'FINDING' MADDIE SOTO 13, 'ICE COLD, BLUE LIPS' · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a murder suspect now claiming
0:09
Speaker 1: he he has PTSD post traumatic stress syndrome. After he
0:16
Speaker 1: finds Mattie's Soto, just fourteen years old, he finds her
0:22
Speaker 1: already ice cold with blue lips. This revealed and a
0:27
Speaker 1: stunning secret jailhouse recorded call. He's also whining about his
0:33
Speaker 1: mattress and his food, and we learn as he's whining
0:37
Speaker 1: to mommy and daddy on the phone, he actually blames
0:40
Speaker 1: Maddie's mother, Jin Soto, for her daughter's sex abuse and murder.
0:47
Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. Thank you for
0:49
Speaker 1: being with us.
0:50
Speaker 2: I think to do just a mess with the Honestly,
0:52
Speaker 2: this places silty and untanned carrying one little sins pastiable link.
0:57
Speaker 2: It surrounded like crazy es at a time.
1:00
Speaker 1: Oh, it's not the Rists, not the Rits. You're charged
1:05
Speaker 1: with murder, Stephan Stearns, the murder of a fourteen year
1:09
Speaker 1: old little girl. Hello, I know you're watching the jailhouse
1:14
Speaker 1: TV on your phone. According to police, thousands of images
1:20
Speaker 1: of fourteen year old Maddie's Soto were found naked, being
1:24
Speaker 1: raped and more. Okay, that's you, and now you're complaining
1:28
Speaker 1: about your mattress, going so far as to give the
1:33
Speaker 1: jail a one star review on yelp. What are you thinking?
1:42
Speaker 1: The stories are changing? And all I can say is,
1:45
Speaker 1: thank you Heaven for technology, or I would never be
1:49
Speaker 1: able to hear what Stephan Stearns is claiming, for instance,
1:53
Speaker 1: that his girlfriend Jen Soto, she's the one to blame
2:00
Speaker 1: for little Maddie's rape and sex abuse and so much more.
2:04
Speaker 1: And he's now saying, wait for it, that he found
2:08
Speaker 1: Maddie's body ice cold, her lips blue.
2:13
Speaker 3: Listen, just see.
2:14
Speaker 4: Her pale face and through lips, and how I was
2:17
Speaker 4: cold she was And it's crazy.
2:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember seeing my brother when he had passed away,
2:25
Speaker 3: and this is the last thing I remember seeing him.
2:31
Speaker 4: So there, you know, it's just you can tell, yes,
2:37
Speaker 4: you can my dad.
2:38
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just.
2:41
Speaker 4: When we're gone, really really truly gone. It's just there's
2:46
Speaker 4: nothing you can do coming back.
2:48
Speaker 1: Well, you could get the death penalty, you could do that.
2:51
Speaker 1: But whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa whoa. Okay with me an
2:54
Speaker 1: all star pound, it makes sense of what I'm mean.
2:55
Speaker 1: And I've got a ton of these deal house calls.
2:58
Speaker 1: I don't know if I can even get through them,
3:00
Speaker 1: because each one is a bombshell. This is going to
3:03
Speaker 1: be hard. But Joe Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, I'll give
3:06
Speaker 1: him the whole intro in a moment, but just one word.
3:10
Speaker 1: What was this girl's cod cause of death? One word?
3:13
Speaker 5: Yeah, with strangulation Nancy up close and personal with his
3:17
Speaker 5: hands wrapped around her neck.
3:19
Speaker 1: Shannon Butler joining me, investigative reporter WFTV Channel nine, in
3:24
Speaker 1: this jurisdiction in Florida, Shannon, there's so much in these
3:28
Speaker 1: jailhouse calls and I cannot wait for them to be
3:30
Speaker 1: played in front of a jury. From giving the jailhouse
3:33
Speaker 1: a one story view on Yelp for their food and
3:37
Speaker 1: Mattress whining about the lights, it goes on and on,
3:41
Speaker 1: blaming Jen Soto, Mattie's mother, for her sex abuse and murder.
3:47
Speaker 1: But now and I find more probative, Shannon, he's giving
3:50
Speaker 1: more stories about how Maddie was killed. And the reason
3:55
Speaker 1: I went to Joe Scott Morgan for Pete's saint. He's
3:58
Speaker 1: a death investigator a thousand K under his belt is
4:01
Speaker 1: because you hear him on the jailhouse call stating that
4:06
Speaker 1: when you find them that way that's really going to
4:09
Speaker 1: stay with you when you find them that way, and
4:13
Speaker 1: they compare the mom and dad compare Mattie's murder to
4:18
Speaker 1: an elderly uncle or brother passing away from old age.
4:24
Speaker 1: Mattie was strangled dead, likely after being raped. What is
4:30
Speaker 1: this guy thinking?
4:31
Speaker 6: Well, and according to him, he knew that right, because
4:33
Speaker 6: he also says on these calls that he had seen
4:35
Speaker 6: her autopsy. But what he could not explain, even to
4:38
Speaker 6: his parents when they tried to ask some questions, was
4:41
Speaker 6: what happened between eleven PM when she supposedly went upstairs
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Speaker 6: with him in that bedroom and what happened at dawn
4:48
Speaker 6: where he now says he found her. So the parents
4:50
Speaker 6: kind of asked, well, you know what happened. He's like, well,
4:53
Speaker 6: you know, I don't know. I just came back in
4:55
Speaker 6: the room. I can't sleep at night, so she started
4:58
Speaker 6: with me in the room. Then I up and walked
5:00
Speaker 6: around the house because you know, I can never sleep,
5:03
Speaker 6: And when I came back, that's how I found her.
5:05
Speaker 6: Could not explain all of those hours before he now
5:09
Speaker 6: says he found her body, which is a story, by
5:11
Speaker 6: the way, that we had never heard. We've heard a
5:13
Speaker 6: few stories from him. But this was the first time
5:16
Speaker 6: we heard that too.
5:17
Speaker 1: Shanna Butler, joining US investigative reporter WFTV. I am beside myself,
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Speaker 1: not only that this fourteen year old girl died in
5:28
Speaker 1: her own home with her mom snoring away in the
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Speaker 1: next room or a few rooms over, but could you
5:35
Speaker 1: just give everyone a refresher a nutshell, a cliff note
5:41
Speaker 1: on what was found on Stearns's own cell phone after
5:45
Speaker 1: he tried to wipe it up all its information.
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Speaker 6: Oh, horrifying images of abusing Madeline Soto since she was eight, nine,
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Speaker 6: ten years old. That's the video videos that they found
6:02
Speaker 6: on his phone. He tried to get rid of him,
6:04
Speaker 6: He didn't. That was, you know, obviously immediate red flag
6:09
Speaker 6: for law enforcement. And now to say, you know, I
6:12
Speaker 6: didn't have anything to do with any of this. She
6:14
Speaker 6: slept with me, None of this, you know, happened. I
6:16
Speaker 6: had left, and you know, I guess he must have
6:19
Speaker 6: forgotten that they had lots and lots of video of
6:22
Speaker 6: what happens in the evening.
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Speaker 1: You know, it's amazing to me, and I'm gonna play
6:27
Speaker 1: in just a moment how his mom totally enabling him,
6:31
Speaker 1: saying this was forced on you. You were set up and
6:37
Speaker 1: actually telling him, yeah, you have PTSD because you found
6:40
Speaker 1: her body. Okay to Phillip Dbay joining me up, Philip,
6:46
Speaker 1: we're not in court. Okay, you don't have to impress
6:49
Speaker 1: a high pain client. So don't throw any Latin phrases
6:53
Speaker 1: at me. Let's not make anything up. Just spinning out
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Speaker 1: a whole cloth. What kind of a sick freak not
7:00
Speaker 1: only repeatedly rapes a child and over but films it one.
7:06
Speaker 7: Who engages in what I call virtual porn. That would
7:10
Speaker 7: be the defense because they have to prove, according to
7:13
Speaker 7: a case from the US Supreme Court dating back to
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Speaker 7: two thousand and two called Ashcroft, that.
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Speaker 8: It is a live person.
7:20
Speaker 7: You're looking at me like I'm nuts, but that is
7:22
Speaker 7: a valid First Amendment defense.
7:25
Speaker 8: How are they going to lay a foundation?
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Speaker 1: Well, Jackie, I need a nitro glistening peel, and I
7:31
Speaker 1: need it right now. Okay, First Amendment, right to free speech.
7:37
Speaker 8: Correct political cultural That.
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Speaker 1: May in California, but I guarantee you it's not going
7:45
Speaker 1: to work in Florida. Did you just say virtual porn
7:48
Speaker 1: could be a defense.
7:50
Speaker 8: I'm sorry, Well, to the sex crimes.
7:54
Speaker 1: Why did I open Pandora's books and ask him a question.
7:58
Speaker 9: Never mind a race erase, Let's go back to the
8:01
Speaker 9: jail house calls, guys, while Dobay Steve's in his own
8:07
Speaker 9: juices coming up with a zaney defense of virtual porn.
8:12
Speaker 1: Let's listen to more of Stephan Stearn's jail house calls. Now.
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Speaker 1: In this one, he is blaming Jen Soto, Mattie's mom,
8:23
Speaker 1: And yes, there's a lot to be said about her,
8:27
Speaker 1: but how can you blame her for Maddie's rape and murder?
8:32
Speaker 1: But but just listen, you know, Stepan, I can't help
8:35
Speaker 1: forget the feeling that none.
8:37
Speaker 3: Of this that was on the phone with a surprise.
8:41
Speaker 4: She was awareness that certain feelings towards with Yeah, well
8:47
Speaker 4: why you She used to joke about it, you know
8:51
Speaker 4: Ford an electric conspect you better not leave me for
8:56
Speaker 4: my daughter? Was your older like Ted ask about an
9:01
Speaker 4: age and most uber meaning comments on me and talk
9:04
Speaker 4: about me together and jiggle and talk about how nice
9:10
Speaker 4: I loved it was. It was not an appropriate situation.
9:15
Speaker 1: Like murder is okay? Wait that just I can hardly
9:19
Speaker 1: piece this apart. Shannon Butler helped me. I got to
9:22
Speaker 1: bring in a shrink also to explain what, it's an
9:24
Speaker 1: electric complex. But I'm not a shrink, neither of you.
9:28
Speaker 1: You give me the facts. Did you hear what he
9:30
Speaker 1: just says? The mom says, basically, Jen Soto set you up,
9:36
Speaker 1: that she was quote aware of Maddie's feelings about me
9:42
Speaker 1: and the mom this. Deborah sterns, well, then why would
9:45
Speaker 1: she send her in there to sleep with you?
9:48
Speaker 10: Like what?
9:49
Speaker 1: Like it's it's Jim's fault and I'm certainly not defending
9:52
Speaker 1: the mother. He says. She used to joke about it,
9:56
Speaker 1: you know, call it Electra and warn me I could
10:00
Speaker 1: never leave her for her daughter. What is he talking about, Shannon?
10:06
Speaker 6: Well, remember there's all these conversations about how Jena always
10:10
Speaker 6: thought this was kind of a Woody Allen situation and
10:14
Speaker 6: that that could happen. So it was very clear that
10:17
Speaker 6: Jen Soto had some indication that something was just not
10:22
Speaker 6: right in this relationship, but for whatever reason, that did
10:26
Speaker 6: not change her. Letting you know, Madeline Soto sleep with him,
10:31
Speaker 6: sleep with both of them. It is so bizarre to me.
10:36
Speaker 6: And this is what, at least here in Orlando, all
10:39
Speaker 6: the viewers get so upset over this. When they hear
10:41
Speaker 6: stuff like that, they immediately believe that Jen Sodo had
10:44
Speaker 6: to have known something and that nothing's happened in that case. Right,
10:49
Speaker 6: she is not charged with anything, And people just can't
10:54
Speaker 6: understand how a mother would joke about anything like that.
10:57
Speaker 1: And even when I hear, we go, why why why?
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Speaker 1: Shannon Shannon, Shannon Shannon, hold on, you're jumping on the bandwagon.
11:05
Speaker 1: And yes, I've got huge problems with gen Soto, huge
11:10
Speaker 1: sending her daughter off to sleep, and this was much
11:13
Speaker 1: younger than fourteen alone with her living boyfriend. But she
11:19
Speaker 1: Jen Soto may have been wrong. Well, forget it, she
11:23
Speaker 1: was wrong. That's a whole other can of worms. Maybe
11:27
Speaker 1: they haven't charged her because they want her testimony. I
11:30
Speaker 1: don't know what they're doing. And of course she hasn't
11:32
Speaker 1: been charged. She's innocent until proven guilty. I'm talking about
11:39
Speaker 1: the murder. Tom Smith is joining me, former NYP detective.
11:46
Speaker 1: I'm beside myself. Oh guys, if you want to find
11:49
Speaker 1: Tom Smith, he is co host of the gold Shield
11:53
Speaker 1: Show at goldshieldshow dot com. Why I've got a dead
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Speaker 1: fourteen year old girl body dumped. Video has emerged of
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Speaker 1: what we believe is Stephan Stern's dumping her limp body
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Speaker 1: Another bombshell tonight is that dcomp enzymes from dcomp are
12:16
Speaker 1: found on the front seat of the car where he
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Speaker 1: Stephan Stearns had Maddie buckled in like they're riding to school.
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Speaker 1: She decomped onto the front seat. Yeah, explain that, sterns
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Speaker 1: how are you gonna blame Jens Soto for that? And listen,
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Speaker 1: Tom Smith, I'm not defending Jen Soto. I'm talking about
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Speaker 1: the murder and Stephan Stern's blaming her. I mean, it's
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Speaker 1: always like this, It's always this pointing the finger at
12:53
Speaker 1: somebody else.
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Speaker 11: Right, this is a monster, bottom line, end of discussion,
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Speaker 11: where he the life of this young girl and just
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Speaker 11: blames everybody else for his actions. He's very well aware
13:06
Speaker 11: what he did and how he did it, but tends
13:08
Speaker 11: to let's deflect to this and that. I mean, he
13:11
Speaker 11: is a flat out monster. And the other part of this,
13:14
Speaker 11: like you said, this girl was surrounded by people that
13:17
Speaker 11: enabled him to do this, and she was the poor
13:20
Speaker 11: victim in this case. Mom, this guy's parents all having
13:24
Speaker 11: an understanding of what was going on and let it
13:27
Speaker 11: happen and inevitably just took her life.
13:30
Speaker 3: You know.
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Speaker 1: Philip D. Bay A veteran trial lawyer out of LA County.
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Speaker 1: Don't you just love when you find out what your
13:39
Speaker 1: client's really thinking on jail house calls. It's not like
13:43
Speaker 1: they don't know they're being recorded. Every thirty seconds or so,
13:46
Speaker 1: there's a recording that states you were on a jail line.
13:49
Speaker 1: Everybody knows what's happening, but yet they still blab Yeah.
13:53
Speaker 7: I don't know where that whole phenomenon comes from, except
13:56
Speaker 7: to say that they think that if they change their
13:58
Speaker 7: original story into multiple iterations of how it could have
14:02
Speaker 7: gone down, that they're saving their hide. But the truth
14:05
Speaker 7: is they're creating multiple inconsistencies and points toward guilt. I
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Speaker 7: tell every client the initial consult don't talk to anybody.
14:13
Speaker 7: Don't talk on the phone about your case. You have
14:16
Speaker 7: to just talk about the weather, talk about your favorite holiday,
14:20
Speaker 7: talk about how much you miss everybody, but don't get
14:22
Speaker 7: into the facts of your case.
14:24
Speaker 8: Otherwise you know what happens.
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Speaker 7: I get a terabiede of data on an external hard
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Speaker 7: drive that I got to listen to from the DA's
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Speaker 7: office and then have to sit out and lock up
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Speaker 7: and play for the client. And what does it really
14:36
Speaker 7: amount to? Additional inculpatory evidence.
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Speaker 1: Hey, Anna Sonoda, question to you, Anna Sinoda, child's six
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Speaker 1: abiece and grooming expert, social worker and author of Duck
14:49
Speaker 1: Duck Groom. Can we just get real for a moment
14:53
Speaker 1: about what this little girl just just turned fourtean. This
14:58
Speaker 1: is like thirty six hours out after her thirteenth birthday party,
15:01
Speaker 1: after her fourteenth birthday party, right, she just turned she's
15:06
Speaker 1: practically thirteen. What she went through on a nightly basis
15:12
Speaker 1: with her mother down the hall snoring away. This is a.
15:15
Speaker 12: Horrific case, Nancy, and it has been since we started
15:19
Speaker 12: discussing it over a year ago when she was first missing.
15:22
Speaker 12: What we have to remember is that cases like Maddie's
15:26
Speaker 12: are happening across this country every day. And what we
15:29
Speaker 12: can do and what we can help share with your
15:31
Speaker 12: audience and your listeners is that predators seek out single parents,
15:37
Speaker 12: often single mothers, who have multiple vulnerabilities, whether it's as
15:43
Speaker 12: work schedule, whether it's insecure finances. And Stearns took advantage
15:49
Speaker 12: at every single turn because he knew that he wanted
15:52
Speaker 12: access to or Maddie, and unfortunately, tragically she was the
15:57
Speaker 12: victim through and through in this case. It's my understanding
16:01
Speaker 12: that Jessica has that Jennifer excuse me.
16:05
Speaker 13: Has immunity from within.
16:08
Speaker 14: This case, and she is giving as much information to
16:12
Speaker 14: the police and investigators in order for Stearns to face
16:16
Speaker 14: the full face of justice here in this case.
16:20
Speaker 2: Well, I discovered her.
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Speaker 1: In the state that you were in after everything with
16:24
Speaker 1: doing so, Philip debay, why didn't he call nine on one?
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Speaker 1: If you just found her quote ice cold with blue lips,
16:41
Speaker 1: why do you think it was a better idea to
16:44
Speaker 1: dress her up in school clothes and strap her dead
16:47
Speaker 1: body into his car and drive around like he was
16:49
Speaker 1: taking her to school and then throw away her laptop
16:52
Speaker 1: and her backpack and throw her body in a densely
16:55
Speaker 1: wooded area when he could have just called nine one one, thoughts.
16:58
Speaker 7: The only arguments that he and Avail himself to is
17:01
Speaker 7: that he was trying to protect the mother. That they're
17:03
Speaker 7: believe it or not, there was still some type of
17:05
Speaker 7: feelings toward the mother and he didn't want her to
17:07
Speaker 7: get into trouble, and certainly he did not want to
17:10
Speaker 7: be accused of doing anything to the child.
17:13
Speaker 8: So what do you do. The first thing that comes
17:14
Speaker 8: to mind is you ditch the evidence. If you will.
17:18
Speaker 7: And in this particular case, it happens to be the
17:20
Speaker 7: remains of his child, and he was in panic mode.
17:23
Speaker 7: And what do you do in panic mode? You don't
17:26
Speaker 7: think things through. You do things sort of off the cuff,
17:29
Speaker 7: like an amateur. And he got caught.
17:32
Speaker 1: Okay, so hold on, are you actually going along with
17:35
Speaker 1: this theory filed debay that he found Maddy did no.
17:38
Speaker 7: Not in the least. But if I had to defend him,
17:40
Speaker 7: that would be the argument. Believe me, this man would
17:43
Speaker 7: not want me on his jury. But I'm just saying
17:47
Speaker 7: that if I were commissioned by the court to defend him,
17:50
Speaker 7: I would argue to the jury that he had no
17:52
Speaker 7: hand in her death, had nothing to do with it,
17:55
Speaker 7: and point the finger to a third party culprit.
17:58
Speaker 8: And who would be the easy dupe in this case,
18:00
Speaker 8: the mother.
18:01
Speaker 1: Okay, you would actually say that to a jury, even
18:03
Speaker 1: though you believe it's a lie.
18:05
Speaker 7: There is no room for political correctness in a criminal trial.
18:09
Speaker 7: If you're going to worry about what the public, what
18:12
Speaker 7: the court.
18:12
Speaker 1: I'm not asking what the public thinks, I'm asking you.
18:16
Speaker 1: Could you argue that to a straight face with do
18:18
Speaker 1: a jury when you believe in your heart, he did.
18:22
Speaker 8: It, of course.
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Speaker 7: Look, my beliefs, my personal judgment do not shade or
18:27
Speaker 7: color how I defend a client. All I need to
18:30
Speaker 7: know is that my theories are supported by sufficient evidence.
18:34
Speaker 7: If they are supported, I think it would be legal
18:36
Speaker 7: malpractice not to present it on the client's behalf and
18:40
Speaker 7: leave it in the hands of a jury to decide what,
18:42
Speaker 7: if anything, to do with it. But to just leave it,
18:45
Speaker 7: I could see an appellated attorney all over it on appeal,
18:48
Speaker 7: especially if he's condemned for murder.
18:51
Speaker 1: Guys, we're talking about Stepan Stearn's secret jailhouse calls just
18:57
Speaker 1: revealed now here. He seems to blame Maddie's murder on
19:04
Speaker 1: lack of boundaries and poor quote sleeping arrangements.
19:09
Speaker 4: Listen, you know always had an issue with boundaries. She
19:15
Speaker 4: never respected any boundaries that I tried to say. You know,
19:17
Speaker 4: I be gotten argument on more than one occasion about
19:20
Speaker 4: just sleeping arrangement. So I know what baker, you know,
19:23
Speaker 4: keep sleep her own room and said you hear this
19:27
Speaker 4: way for me to wake her up.
19:28
Speaker 1: When you hear me, and hold on, Joe Scott Morgan,
19:34
Speaker 1: help me. Joe Scott Morgan is joining me. Professor Forensics,
19:37
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon,
19:42
Speaker 1: star of a hit podcast series Body Bags with Joseph
19:46
Speaker 1: Scott Morgan. It goes on and on. Joe Scott, do
19:50
Speaker 1: you hear this. I don't know how many child murder
19:54
Speaker 1: cases you have dealt with, but Stephan Stearns, charged in
19:58
Speaker 1: Maddie's Soto's murder, says, I beg the mom make her
20:04
Speaker 1: sleep in her own room, and so I raped her.
20:08
Speaker 5: It's beyond bizarre. When you begin to think about this
20:12
Speaker 5: and over and over and over again, think about it
20:15
Speaker 5: is from an evidentiary standpoint, this guy has literally literally
20:20
Speaker 5: documented his steps up to the gallows. When you begin
20:24
Speaker 5: to think about this, over all of these years, relative
20:26
Speaker 5: to these horrible images that have been recovered, and then
20:30
Speaker 5: we have to get to this point where he is
20:33
Speaker 5: finding her, finding her cold, her lips are blue, these
20:38
Speaker 5: sorts of things. I'll tell you why her lips are blue,
20:41
Speaker 5: because if in fact, we are to believe and I
20:44
Speaker 5: do what the medical examiner said, that this is an
20:47
Speaker 5: asphyxial death viz. A VI strangulation, that means that she
20:52
Speaker 5: would have become cyonautic as hands perhaps his, were wrapped
20:56
Speaker 5: around her throat and squeezed the life out of her.
21:00
Speaker 5: So her lips are in fact going to turn blue.
21:02
Speaker 5: It's not just as a result of decompositional changes. You
21:06
Speaker 5: have this that's going on, and we still don't know
21:09
Speaker 5: everything relative to the autopsy report. One of the things
21:13
Speaker 5: that they're thinking about, and they have expressed concern, and
21:16
Speaker 5: I use that terming quotes, is the highroid bone. There's
21:20
Speaker 5: something that they're seeing with the hyoid bone and Nancy,
21:23
Speaker 5: as you well know, generally the only way that a
21:27
Speaker 5: hyoid bone becomes fractured is by applying direct pressure.
21:37
Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace Scott. Whenever anyone says highoid bone,
21:46
Speaker 1: I feel it's important that we show where the hyoid
21:51
Speaker 1: is if you could.
21:52
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's the only non articulating bone in the body.
21:55
Speaker 5: That means it doesn't connect to any other bony structures.
21:58
Speaker 5: It's sole purpose, Nancy, is to anchor the tongue in
22:01
Speaker 5: the back of the neck or in the back of
22:03
Speaker 5: the throat. So it's right in this and it's it's
22:06
Speaker 5: kind of we describe it in forensicology as being bird shape,
22:10
Speaker 5: all right, but it's kind of in a horseshoe shape
22:12
Speaker 5: and it anchors the tongue in the back.
22:14
Speaker 1: Of the throat like a wishbone. It kind of.
22:17
Speaker 5: Does, only without the little stem on it. Okay, but it.
22:20
Speaker 1: Looks more's not really attached to any bonds. It's not
22:23
Speaker 1: like the hip bone connected.
22:24
Speaker 8: To that's the leg bone.
22:25
Speaker 1: It's connected just hanging there.
22:27
Speaker 5: Yeah, it is. And it's got two horns, two well,
22:31
Speaker 5: two major horns and lesser horns that are up here.
22:34
Speaker 5: And when it's snapped, you can see these little fracture
22:37
Speaker 5: lines and there'll be focal areas of hemorrhage in there
22:39
Speaker 5: as well. They're seeing something there, Nancy. This is repeated
22:43
Speaker 5: over and over again relative to the highwaid bone. They
22:47
Speaker 5: have concern about it. That means direct pressure would have
22:50
Speaker 5: had been applied in order to fracture this thing, and
22:53
Speaker 5: that means coming in with a sea clamp or throttling
22:57
Speaker 5: this sort of thing in order to choke the life
22:59
Speaker 5: out of this job.
23:00
Speaker 1: So, guys, not with what Joe Scott said all correct
23:04
Speaker 1: time might have from what we've been able to glean
23:06
Speaker 1: from a word about the autopsy report. What is Stephan
23:11
Speaker 1: Strange's response he says, no one respected my boundaries, and
23:18
Speaker 1: then he blames the whole thing because Jim Sooto didn't
23:25
Speaker 1: give him any privacy. You have got to hear this.
23:30
Speaker 4: He didn't have any privacy, you know, just for ourselves.
23:34
Speaker 4: And she was suggs, Well, maybe you should go to
23:36
Speaker 4: see United States. Taking it was like a twin bed
23:39
Speaker 4: and I know six plus seaton. You know, why would
23:44
Speaker 4: I want to do that because of sleeping, our begging us.
23:48
Speaker 4: You should have broken up for a long time ago
23:50
Speaker 4: into the business.
23:53
Speaker 2: Hell yeah, I think they do just a mess with
23:56
Speaker 2: the honest with This place is silthy and untanitary and
23:59
Speaker 2: one little fans factory will blank it s out of
24:02
Speaker 2: my crazyes all the time.
24:04
Speaker 3: Well, it's not the risk.
24:06
Speaker 4: We're all very happy to you reunited anything lunch since
24:08
Speaker 4: we've all.
24:09
Speaker 2: Seen each other.
24:10
Speaker 4: And there's no reason that I want to have taken
24:12
Speaker 4: all of that up for literally no reason hurt or.
24:15
Speaker 10: And this, no there is.
24:19
Speaker 4: But there's jealousy on the other side too. I mean,
24:22
Speaker 4: he told you, I hope you don't need You've.
24:24
Speaker 2: Heard my daughter that tells me that she was thinking about.
24:27
Speaker 3: That for a while.
24:28
Speaker 1: Guys, we are getting a treasure trove of evidence. Just release.
24:33
Speaker 1: These are secretly recorded jailhouse calls. Now, I don't know
24:35
Speaker 1: how secret they are, because typically in jailhouse calls, you
24:39
Speaker 1: hear on the line the caller and the receiver of
24:43
Speaker 1: the call can hear a recording stating that this is
24:46
Speaker 1: a call from a CI correctional institute. Everybody knows they're recorded.
24:50
Speaker 1: I guess they think the prosecutors just won't make the
24:52
Speaker 1: effort to listen to them. Well, guess what they did.
24:56
Speaker 1: Joining me now, special guest, Barry Hutchinson, twenty six year
25:00
Speaker 1: years in LA now owner of Barry and Associates Investigative Services. Barry,
25:06
Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. Barry. Here, we hear
25:09
Speaker 1: it goes on and on and on. We hear Stefan
25:13
Speaker 1: Stearns and mother Deborah Stearns stating Jen Soto had been
25:21
Speaker 1: thinking about this for a long time. They're basically trying
25:26
Speaker 1: to blame Jen Soto for her daughter's murder. Did you
25:31
Speaker 1: hear that?
25:31
Speaker 3: I think that this whole family is so screwed up?
25:35
Speaker 3: I guarantee you.
25:36
Speaker 1: Barry Hutchinson, I don't care. I don't care who has
25:41
Speaker 1: a history of what we're at the innoceus guilt phase.
25:48
Speaker 1: This is going to a trial. I don't care who
25:53
Speaker 1: wet their bed when they were three years old, don't care.
25:56
Speaker 1: I care who killed this little girl, who ra her
26:00
Speaker 1: repeatedly and murdered her. Now we hear Stephan Stearn's claiming
26:07
Speaker 1: that jen Soto, the mother, had been quote thinking about
26:12
Speaker 1: this for a long time. We see where he's going
26:15
Speaker 1: with this.
26:16
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, he's going to try to point the accusatory
26:18
Speaker 3: finger toward her, you know, to a certain degrade, to
26:20
Speaker 3: take some of the heat off him. But you know what,
26:22
Speaker 3: when you've got a dead body on video leaning to
26:24
Speaker 3: the left and of vehicle that's been seen, and then
26:27
Speaker 3: you have a cadaver or dog get a hit on
26:30
Speaker 3: trace chemical for a decomposition, I think there's a couple
26:34
Speaker 3: of males in your coffin their palth.
26:35
Speaker 1: Well, you know, debate. You actually have a little bit
26:38
Speaker 1: of a leg to stand on in that there's a
26:42
Speaker 1: way for this guy to escape the death penalty. I'll
26:45
Speaker 1: tell you what I think it is. The jury will
26:49
Speaker 1: be angry at Jenston, and they may partially blame her
26:54
Speaker 1: for ignoring the fact right under her and no just
26:57
Speaker 1: rubbing her nose in it that Stephan Stearns, her live
27:00
Speaker 1: in boyfriend Mooch, does he even have a job, was
27:04
Speaker 1: sleeping with her daughter every night. The little girl says
27:07
Speaker 1: she wanted to go live in the woods. Wonder why
27:12
Speaker 1: so the jury, right or wrong, may partially blame Jinsoto
27:18
Speaker 1: for the situation and reason, well, she's not getting convicted,
27:25
Speaker 1: I sure as hgl and not sending him to the
27:28
Speaker 1: death penalty.
27:29
Speaker 7: I agree with you one hundred percent on that they're
27:32
Speaker 7: not even assuming that they think mom had a hand
27:35
Speaker 7: in it by looking the other way with you know,
27:39
Speaker 7: blissful ignorance and blind fate, whatever.
27:41
Speaker 8: You want to call it. He is the one on trial,
27:45
Speaker 8: not her.
27:46
Speaker 7: His only other hope to be spirit of death is
27:49
Speaker 7: the new law in Florida where they allow for an
27:51
Speaker 7: eight to four verdict in the penalty phase to execute
27:55
Speaker 7: if they come back let's say eight to four or
27:58
Speaker 7: nine to three or some other non unanimous split that
28:02
Speaker 7: could spare him death.
28:04
Speaker 1: Guys, there's more of Stefan Stearn's whining, and I haven't
28:07
Speaker 1: even gotten him whining about his mattress and the food.
28:11
Speaker 1: So far, he's been blaming gen Soto for Maddie's death,
28:15
Speaker 1: and we're all angry. The gen Soto allowed a situation
28:19
Speaker 1: where her daughter slept night after night after night with
28:22
Speaker 1: her mooch living boyfriend, but to blame her for the
28:26
Speaker 1: murder itself is a whole another thing, And that sounds
28:30
Speaker 1: like what he and his mommy and daddy are cooking up.
28:34
Speaker 1: Remember the mommy and the daddy not charged with anything.
28:37
Speaker 1: Oh and I haven't even got to them claiming that
28:40
Speaker 1: he has PTSD because he found the body. I mean, really,
28:44
Speaker 1: but that said, listen to this.
28:47
Speaker 4: I wish I had done the correct thing to begin with.
28:50
Speaker 4: You know, I wish on downstairs and shaking her away
28:54
Speaker 4: from a cold nine one all day. Had I wish
29:00
Speaker 4: she had too, maybe she could have been saved. But
29:03
Speaker 4: you know, I'm sure true beyond that.
29:07
Speaker 1: Dave Mac joining me, Crime Stories investigative reporter who has
29:10
Speaker 1: poured through every one of these recordings word by word,
29:16
Speaker 1: Dave Mac, can you believe what you're hearing? I wish
29:19
Speaker 1: I had found her, end quote, shaken her away and
29:22
Speaker 1: call nine to one one? Yeah, why didn't you? They
29:26
Speaker 1: are feeding into it. The mommy and the daddy are
29:29
Speaker 1: basically feeding your baby boy on a silver spoon, a
29:34
Speaker 1: whole plateful of bs.
29:36
Speaker 10: Yep, And I think that we're seeing that played out
29:39
Speaker 10: where he, for some reason, is trying to snow job
29:43
Speaker 10: his parents just and believe that they're believing him. And
29:46
Speaker 10: that's when when his mother says, you know, are they
29:49
Speaker 10: are they treating you for PTSD after what you've found?
29:52
Speaker 10: I mean, they're living in a real fantasy world, Nancy.
29:54
Speaker 10: This is only something that a child, and I mean
29:57
Speaker 10: a child talks to their parents like this. But we're
30:00
Speaker 10: dealing with somebody who supposedly an adult grown up man
30:04
Speaker 10: and two adult grown up parents, and they're acting like
30:07
Speaker 10: with the six year old who got caught cheating in
30:10
Speaker 10: first grade on his spelling jets.
30:11
Speaker 1: Man, you put it better than I could have, Dave Mack, So, Dave,
30:15
Speaker 1: listen to this. His new story is evolving, and Debay,
30:20
Speaker 1: prick your ears up on this, because this is where
30:22
Speaker 1: the defense is going. There's a whole new story about
30:27
Speaker 1: how Maddie died in China, you know, on the Wizard
30:30
Speaker 1: of Oz when Dorothy catches the wizard working the machines
30:35
Speaker 1: and he says, don't look at the man behind the curtain.
30:39
Speaker 1: I guess they want the jury not to remember all
30:42
Speaker 1: the rape videos of this little girl on stuff on
30:45
Speaker 1: Stearn's phone and that hyoid bone being broken or dislodged,
30:51
Speaker 1: like Joe Scott Morgan was just describing. Yeah, don't look
30:54
Speaker 1: at that, look at this. Listen to the new theory emerged.
31:00
Speaker 2: He was in a different part of the house. Yeah,
31:04
Speaker 2: she wasn't with you.
31:05
Speaker 4: Well, she had going to be with me earlier the night,
31:10
Speaker 4: but I left her alone for quite a while, so
31:15
Speaker 4: I was pretty she talked her around and you know,
31:17
Speaker 4: haunting right now, what can I.
31:19
Speaker 1: Do crime stories with Nancy Grace?
31:31
Speaker 10: Were you awake when she went when her came into
31:34
Speaker 10: the room with you?
31:36
Speaker 11: Yeah?
31:37
Speaker 4: And she was fine when she came into your room?
31:39
Speaker 1: What what not at night?
31:40
Speaker 4: Was that hitting eleven or show?
31:42
Speaker 2: I'm not sure? Okay, so she was fine.
31:45
Speaker 10: So what happened between eleven.
31:47
Speaker 3: And whenever you found it?
31:50
Speaker 4: Oh that's the really other.
31:51
Speaker 1: Question, that is the main question. So Dave Matt is
31:57
Speaker 1: he true? Is he actually going to say she came
32:00
Speaker 1: into my bedroom because they just don't have boundaries, They
32:04
Speaker 1: didn't respect my privacy. And then he goes outside to
32:08
Speaker 1: breathe in the night air, right, and he comes back
32:11
Speaker 1: and she's dead, and instead of calling nine one one,
32:13
Speaker 1: and she's cold. By the way, Joe Scott Morgan's gonna
32:16
Speaker 1: have a field day with the fact that she was
32:17
Speaker 1: already cold to the touch. He finds her call to
32:20
Speaker 1: the touch and then decides instead of calling nine one
32:22
Speaker 1: one that he'll just dress her for school's trapper, body
32:26
Speaker 1: in the car, drive around, and then dump her body.
32:28
Speaker 1: Is that right, Dave.
32:30
Speaker 10: Mac That is what he's shoveling.
32:32
Speaker 3: But I found something fascinating in the way he's.
32:35
Speaker 10: Talking to his parents, because he tries to pull them
32:38
Speaker 10: back into things they remember from him as a child,
32:41
Speaker 10: like when he talked about how he had left her
32:43
Speaker 10: alone for a while, and he mentions walking around the
32:46
Speaker 10: house and he called it haunting around the house as
32:50
Speaker 10: I like to do. He's trying to relate this so
32:53
Speaker 10: it's something that they can understand and identify with and
32:57
Speaker 10: believe him because to anybody else, look his story, You're
33:00
Speaker 10: going this is total dyes. But his parents, he can
33:04
Speaker 10: milk these moments of past and president and blur them
33:08
Speaker 10: together so that they're like, hey, yeah, I want to
33:11
Speaker 10: believe my son. I want to believe he's telling the truth,
33:14
Speaker 10: and that's where he gives them those bits that make
33:17
Speaker 10: no sense to us, but that they can hold on to.
33:19
Speaker 1: Oh, the devil is in the detailed stern, please keep talking.
33:24
Speaker 1: Listen to this.
33:26
Speaker 4: Well, I discovered her in the state she was in
33:34
Speaker 4: after everything was having done. So I mean, I obviously
33:36
Speaker 4: I can't get into detail, but no, I was not
33:39
Speaker 4: aware that she had passed on. And you know, I'm
33:44
Speaker 4: looking down throughout the night, and I was not in
33:48
Speaker 4: the room the whole time.
33:49
Speaker 9: Mm hmm.
33:50
Speaker 1: So he wasn't aware she was passed on, yet he
33:52
Speaker 1: found her a call to the touch with her lips blue.
33:55
Speaker 1: Now the dad realizes the story is not yelling listen,
34:01
Speaker 1: and it was just not like you.
34:02
Speaker 4: You know, you just suddenly feel someone's goes to pass
34:05
Speaker 4: away from them. You know, it's to discovery. And he
34:10
Speaker 4: wasn't leave in those same room with you. Well, I mean,
34:13
Speaker 4: she was in the room that I started him. But
34:14
Speaker 4: you know, I'm looking towns forout the night, and I
34:16
Speaker 4: tend to wander around the house, she fiddle around on
34:19
Speaker 4: my phone and step out trying to feel the nice
34:23
Speaker 4: cool night air and all that.
34:25
Speaker 1: There we go with a nice cool night air again.
34:28
Speaker 1: Karen stark. Do you hear him? Later on he even
34:31
Speaker 1: suggests that someone had drugged Maddie, and he clearly indicates
34:40
Speaker 1: that would be her mother. How much more blame can
34:44
Speaker 1: he heap on other people? Claiming he was wandering around
34:47
Speaker 1: the house and while he was wandering, he came back
34:49
Speaker 1: in and found her bed.
34:50
Speaker 13: Let's be perfectly clear. What's going on here is a
34:54
Speaker 13: cover up and denial. How does he explain the fact
34:57
Speaker 13: that he took all those photos, the ones that were
35:00
Speaker 13: on his phone, and try to erase them to make
35:03
Speaker 13: sure nobody would find them. Why would he get rid
35:06
Speaker 13: of her possessions. He's just passing along the blame and
35:11
Speaker 13: his parents are going along with it, I hypothesized, because
35:15
Speaker 13: it's their son, so they're trying to make sense.
35:19
Speaker 1: Out of it.
35:20
Speaker 13: But all of this trying to shield the fact that
35:24
Speaker 13: this is a monster, a murderer, that he actually killed
35:29
Speaker 13: this girl. And he's saying, as an adult that somebody
35:33
Speaker 13: was forcing him to sleep with her, to be with her,
35:36
Speaker 13: encouraging it, and he had nothing to do with this
35:40
Speaker 13: mature man who's become an infant and totally innocent. We
35:46
Speaker 13: know that that is not true.
35:48
Speaker 4: Well, I'm assuming that they are treating you for PTSB
35:52
Speaker 4: because you found the body, not to mention everything.
35:56
Speaker 13: Else that went along with that, treating with.
35:59
Speaker 4: Her or anything except my flood pressure.
36:03
Speaker 2: Well, they need to do the PTSD because you're not needing.
36:07
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I keep telling myself that to maintain
36:14
Speaker 4: myself chasing questioning God, I have nothing.
36:17
Speaker 1: Now listen to this. Does anybody know the meaning of narcissist?
36:24
Speaker 1: Here we hear Stephan Stearns asking his parents to dump
36:27
Speaker 1: money into an account for a trust fund for him
36:30
Speaker 1: for him after they die.
36:33
Speaker 4: Shall prospect her. It's going to be difficult to come by.
36:36
Speaker 4: I might need some sort of resources to help me
36:38
Speaker 4: get back up my sheet immediately until I can work
36:40
Speaker 4: out being the coop situation.
36:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know what that would be.
36:45
Speaker 3: But because maybe we may be we may be gone
36:49
Speaker 3: by the time you get out.
36:51
Speaker 4: I don't know any way, we might be able to
36:54
Speaker 4: sit up sort of a trust truck or.
36:55
Speaker 1: Something, a trust fund. Dave, Matt, what did I just you.
37:00
Speaker 10: Know, I just heard more and more bs lies between
37:05
Speaker 10: Sterns trying to sell a bill of goods to his parents.
37:07
Speaker 10: But something that I'm caught with, Nancy is how a
37:10
Speaker 10: couple of times during the course of these thirty five
37:13
Speaker 10: phone calls, he actually sterns mentions hurting his defense by
37:18
Speaker 10: saying something or giving too many details. And if we're
37:21
Speaker 10: truly seeking the truth, and he's truly an innocent man
37:24
Speaker 10: who did nothing wrong, that type of truth is something
37:28
Speaker 10: you want everybody to hear. So you would be saying
37:31
Speaker 10: these details for all the world to hear, because you're
37:34
Speaker 10: an innocent guy. They got the wrong man. You know,
37:37
Speaker 10: anything would do, but he keeps covering up. He can't
37:40
Speaker 10: even tell the truth to his parents because he sold
37:42
Speaker 10: them a bill of goods that they're buying into Our
37:44
Speaker 10: baby boy would never do this. It's her fault. The
37:46
Speaker 10: evil girls in his life, the females in his life,
37:49
Speaker 10: did wrong, and he's the victim.
37:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember Karen start how he was talking about
37:54
Speaker 1: how Maddie who's thirteen, and her mother ogled him and
38:01
Speaker 1: admired him and made a big fuss about him. It's
38:05
Speaker 1: their fault, I mean narcissism. He wants his parents, who
38:09
Speaker 1: are retired, to set him up a trust fund of
38:13
Speaker 1: their money to support him when he gets out and
38:16
Speaker 1: after they die. That's what's his that's what's on his mind.
38:20
Speaker 13: Well, of course, Nancy, there's no guilt there because he
38:23
Speaker 13: can't feel. But all he's worried about is what's going
38:27
Speaker 13: to happen in his future. Let them infantilize him and
38:31
Speaker 13: feel like they have to take care of him. It's
38:34
Speaker 13: all so typical. I can't think of a single sexual abuser, really,
38:39
Speaker 13: somebody who rapes children who doesn't wind up saying that
38:43
Speaker 13: the children wanted it, that it's perfectly normal, it's okay
38:48
Speaker 13: to do this, and he fixed the bill.
38:50
Speaker 1: Well, you're right, Karen Start Barry Hutchinson twenty five years
38:55
Speaker 1: in LA now chief investigator Barry and Associates. Barry he
39:00
Speaker 1: actually said she started it talking about the little girl.
39:04
Speaker 1: Maddie started the little station.
39:07
Speaker 4: You know.
39:08
Speaker 3: The whole thing just sounds so sick, But you know,
39:11
Speaker 3: that's a commonality in these abusers. You know, they, like
39:14
Speaker 3: you said earlier, they always try to circumvent guilt of
39:19
Speaker 3: their self by saying that somebody else is the one
39:22
Speaker 3: that initiated the contact, or they're the ones that initiated
39:25
Speaker 3: the abuse. It's just the way that these pedophiles think,
39:30
Speaker 3: you know, and it makes me sick, literally, I mean,
39:35
Speaker 3: child abuse cases like this. I mean, that was the
39:39
Speaker 3: one thing in all my career and law enforcement that
39:41
Speaker 3: used to bother me the most whenever you had, you know,
39:43
Speaker 3: cases like this where you know there's an innocent victim
39:46
Speaker 3: that's a child, and you feel like you're sitting in
39:49
Speaker 3: a chair with your hands and your arms tied. You
39:51
Speaker 3: can't do anything about it as an investigator looking at
39:54
Speaker 3: this pos sitting across from you at a table, knowing,
39:58
Speaker 3: damn good and well that you feel like just choking
40:00
Speaker 3: him to death right there at that point, but you can't.
40:04
Speaker 3: And yet they have the audacity to sit there and
40:08
Speaker 3: try to put this whole BS story on you to
40:10
Speaker 3: make you feel sorry for them, and we have to
40:13
Speaker 3: kind of play along with it and be a good
40:14
Speaker 3: actor to try to extricate information from them that's going
40:18
Speaker 3: to put them away for the rest of their life
40:20
Speaker 3: where they can't do it to another child.
40:22
Speaker 1: Scott Morgan, have you seen it all now, Stefan Stearns.
40:25
Speaker 1: Once I trust fund set up my mommy and daddy.
40:28
Speaker 5: Yeah. One of the most glaring things is that when
40:30
Speaker 5: his dad actually said, well we might be gone, did
40:35
Speaker 5: you hear that? And then he just continues on with
40:39
Speaker 5: this through line of all about him. He didn't pause
40:42
Speaker 5: for a moment and say, well, my god, that's horrible.
40:47
Speaker 5: Please don't say that that you're going to be gone
40:50
Speaker 5: or the mom's going to be gone now. And that's
40:51
Speaker 5: not what it's about. It's about him, you know, moving forward,
40:55
Speaker 5: and he's going to need money when he gets out,
40:58
Speaker 5: to get back on his feet. And you know, that
41:02
Speaker 5: shows you the level of callousness. And he's doing this
41:05
Speaker 5: to his parents, how much more so, how much more
41:08
Speaker 5: so Nancy a thirteen year old little girl that he's
41:12
Speaker 5: been victimizing, allegedly lo these many years. He's that callous.
41:19
Speaker 5: He's that very callous. He's not genetically connected to her, Nancy.
41:23
Speaker 5: He just views her as something that is disposable. And
41:26
Speaker 5: as we found out, she was kind of tossed away
41:29
Speaker 5: like rubbish, wasn't she?
41:30
Speaker 1: Manny Soto was not disposable. Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend,