Latest / GenX Adulting Podcast / Episode 31 - The Millennials - Jacob Kirstein - Founder of Chapie and TERA

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Episode 31 - The Millennials - Jacob Kirstein - Founder of Chapie and TERA · GenX Adulting Podcast

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  [Music]Welcome to GenX Adulting and today wehave Jacob with us. Welcome to the studio.Thank you for having me.We're thrilled that you're here.
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  Our first question isalways what year were you born?I'm 1996.Okay, so you are actually a millennial.I think so.Yeah, but you're also a zillennial.So you're a zillennial millennial.What is a zillennial?Is this the same thing that all these guys are?So the other guys are a little younger than him.Okay.Like they were born in 97, 98, you're96. So you're the youngest millennial,but there's a little micro generation of late 90s babiesthat are also like zillennials. Soyou can relate to the older Gen Zs thatare like a year or two younger than you,but you can also relate to themillennials that are like in their early 30s.100%.So you're kind of in between.Yeah.And you have similar childhoods.
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  So most of your childhoodwas spent fairly technology-free,social media-free. You kind of still had that old schoolchildhood experience. You guys had flipphones.I had the sidekick.The sidekick.I love that.There you go.And then Snapchat and Facebook and Instagram all kind ofshowed up high school, right?Yep.So you got most of your formativeyears before all that showed up.Yeah, lots of bike riding and walking around theneighborhood, causing mischief.Yes, but without being tracked.Uh, we had walkie talkies, but we weren't quite tracked.Not by like your parents.Yeah, we just had walkie talkies.Right. So the kids now, you know, there's life 360.You can, there's find my phone, all that. So when they goout, we can see where they are.Like our 15 year old, we know where he's at.All the time.Basically all the time.Yeah.That's pretty wild.Yeah. So you guys didn't have that. So youkind of, when you were out, you were free.I don't know if you guys know this,but I have a younger brother, Josh.Josh, who is 10 and.Oh, no way.He is like living in VR.He's virtual reality.He uses the Oculus all the time.Does he really?Does he?Yeah.Oh, cool.So he's a Gen Alpha.Is that right?Yeah.Gen Alpha.So he's not Gen Z. He's the next one after he's Gen Alpha.Yeah. So he's that next group.It's a pretty wild generation.Yeah.They still do school sports, butlike they don't quite do the same.Like after school, everyone gets on thebikes and rides to each other's house.Now it's like, let's meet up in VR.Really kidding.Yeah.Wow.It's pretty cool.Our youngest is 15 and he has an Oculus,but he doesn't really use it that much.He uses it sporadically, but definitely not socially.No.Yeah.I've won.I haven't found a ton of use for it.It's cool.Yeah.I'm like, this is cool, but.I almost wonder if they use theirs kind of how I knowNathan, our older son, and evenDylan Xbox, they're social on Xbox with their friends.That's exactly how it is.That's probably how it is instead of being on.Are they, do they do Xbox?They do.So they play this game called, Ithink it's called a monkey tag.And he got me to play it once and you have to like use yourcontrollers and climb up trees.And then you like run around this whole like 3d jungle andyou play tag with each other.Wow.So they're like running around in this 3d environment,yelling at each other and playingtag.It's pretty wild.And they're probably playing kids in the UK.Oh yeah.You know, the West coast.So it's like Xbox, but it's just,you're actually standing up and doing things.It's kind of ironic because they're still playing tag.That's actually really cool.Well, that's a big age gap for you guys.And I have an older brother who is 30.Okay.Well, that's more you guys.32.That's more.Okay.That's like a few years.So then you're, your youngerbrother is more like Dylan is to our kids.Kind of a bonus baby.Yeah.In some ways.Yeah.Yeah. The bonus baby.So your brother.I was 17.I think when he was born.Okay.There you go.Nathan was 13.Okay.Yeah.Yeah.So your brother is a millennial.Like he's definitely a millennial early thirties.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.So I always say the millennials,um, got the best of both worlds.You got to experience that old school childhood.Um, and then you did get to experiencetechnology and before technology reallysocial media really took overalmost the birth of social media.It was still fairly innocent.There wasn't the FOMO.There wasn't the getting gratificationfrom likes and all that type of stuff.We had Myspace in middle school.Oh, did you have Myspace?I remember having a Myspace and having aprofile song and seeing people like futureprofile and who your top 10 friends were.Right.Right.That's a big thing.Would that cause drama among friends?Like if anyone was a little bit, yeah, there's a littlemiddle school drama for sure.Like if you weren't top 10, you were pissing people off.Very sure.So, but with Myspace, wasn'tthere more like coding in there?Didn't you have to do a little more work for a little bit?Yeah.Yeah.For like to change your background and stuff, you wouldhave to like download templates.Yeah.Yeah.Do you still use anything socially?Any social media platforms socially?Is it more just for your business?Yeah.I'm on Instagram, Jacob.Kirstine,MyChappie, and Tara, Tara Outdoors.Okay.And we'll put your links definitely in the description.We'll put them right there.We'll put everything.Yeah.We'll put everything on the screen and in the description.Do you find you mainly use it for the business or do youalso use social media socially?I have started posting personally less.I want to post more, but it's a lot of work to post and Ireally have to focus on postingthe best things I can for the business.Yeah.So that's kind of where I take my posting attention to.And then with Chappie, that'skind of a content machine and Tara.So that involves hiring editors andscheduled posts and hiring content creators.Right.So yeah, I mean, social media isdefinitely a big part of my life.Yeah, for sure.For sure.So where were you born?I was born in Miami.Okay.So you're a South Florida boy.Yep.And how long were you down there?I was in Miami, I think, till I was one.Then we moved to Jacksonville till I was three.And then my first memories kind of start when we moved toTampa and I was in kindergarten.Okay.So you've been all over Florida.Yeah.And how long were you in Tampa?I was in Tampa fromkindergarten to the middle of eighth grade.Okay.And did you grow up with both parents?Yes.So my parents obviously started together.Right.And do you know how they met?How did my parents meet?I think it was their parents kind of set them up.Really?Yeah.Interesting.I think they knew each other.Like family friend type things?Or kind of like that.I know.I think the moms talked.Okay.Something like that.They're like, "Your son should meet my daughter."Yep.Okay.Yep.And I guess they hit it off and Ithink they were engaged in six weeks.Wow.Now is this in Miami?Is that where they met?This I believe was in like Miami, Aventura area.And that's where they grew up.That's where they're from.My dad is, he grew up in Montreal, then went to New York.Okay.I think back to Montreal and then to South Florida.Okay.My mom grew up in Miami.So he's Canadian?Pretty much.Okay.Yeah.He doesn't have citizenship, I don't think.Okay.But that's where he, was he born in Canada?He was born in New York.Oh, okay.Then went to Canada.Okay.Yeah.I think he went.Oh, interesting.Oh, so he's an American citizen,doesn't have Canadian citizenship.I'm pretty sure.Yeah.Okay.Okay.Pretty positive.And then your mom's from Miami.Yeah.So they met, they got engaged after six weeks.That's amazing.Yeah.Yeah.I love that first sight and married for 15 years.Nice.Till the middle of eighthgrade and then went separate ways.And that's when we moved.Okay.So when you were growing up inTampa, did you play any sports?Yeah.I played like football and baseball growing up.And then I got into hockey, ice hockey.Oh, cool.Okay. I played ice hockey for eight years.Wow.Wow.Yeah.It was a lot of fun.So you can skate pretty good then.Yeah.Yeah.I still skate.Cool.I rollerblade now.And were you in travel hockey?Because I know that's very involved.I didn't do travel.Okay.Yeah.I mean, part of it was I broke my ankle in sixth grade.What happened?When things started gettingserious in sports, I was skim boarding.And one of my foot slipped off the board, got caught in thesand, and I broke my growth plate.Oh my gosh.And yeah, I was in a wheelchairfor like three or four months.Wow.A wheelchair.Yeah.Not even a boot or crutches?I guess it was eventually we got tocrutches, but it was a cast and wheelchair for likethree, four months.They didn't want to take any chances with that growth.I guess not.It obviously didn't affect you.It was very tall.Yeah, it's so good.But do you still feel any pain sometimes from that area?Barely sometimes.If I go for a run, sometimes it'lltighten up and I got to stretch it out.But it really hasn't been a problem.Not quite like my neck has become a problem.Well, is that age more than anythingelse or did you do something to your neck?I was shoulder pressing about fouryears ago and I ruptured my C6, C7.It's actually a crazy story, the whole thing.So basically, I was scheduled for surgery a little over ayear ago and I was unable to puton a shirt.I couldn't put on my shoes.Basically incapacitated living with pain.Really bad.And I had a ski trip plan that I already bought an EpicPass, I bought the Airbnb and the flights.And my mom flew in because it waslike time for surgery consultation.We went to the doctor's appointment andwe talked about going skiing and he's like,if you go skiing, you could end up in so much pain that youfeel paralyzed for a little bit.Don't go skiing.And I was like, I'm going skiing.Oh my gosh.I'm sure your mom was like, what?Me and my mom went at it.She was very concerned for me.There she was.Right, Felicia.Oh my gosh.Yeah, so.Well, obviously nothinghappened when you were skiing, right?So it was a miracle.Okay.So I'm literally in so much pain at theairport that I'm laying on the floor face up.Uh, baggage claim.I remember I'm thinking, what am I doing?And I'm on the mountain, I'm strapping on my boots.I'm like, what am I doing?And I go for a run and I love snowboarding.Um, so I was like really happy.But my neck started hurting on my second run.So I was like, all right, like instead of, uh, riding, likelooking over my left shoulder,let me try to ride to look over my right shoulder.So riding regular to goofy.And I started riding goofy and I felland I snapped my neck back into place.No way.Yeah.Seriously.That's hilarious.Yeah.It's insane.Yeah.It makes no sense.But now I go to the chiropractor.I was going to say you, you'relike a candidate for a chiropractor.I go to a chiropractor.I love my chiropractor.Yeah.And so it does make sense to me.I go to a Dr.Dan in Boca.If you know him, Dr.Dan.Yeah.I go to Dr.Fanno.Okay.Do you know who Dr.Fanno is?No.No.Yeah.But if you find a good chiropractor, you stay with that.100%.Yeah.You're like, that's my man.100%.Yeah.Or woman.No, it does make sense becausethat's the concept of chiropractic.That's amazing.It was adjusted.You got adjusted on the slopes.For sure.Yeah.It felt so hard.You adjusted yourself.I remember when I fell, I was like, Iwas like, first I'm like, am I paralyzed?And then I was like, my God, I feel great.That's amazing though.And life changing because the pain was done.The week I was going to come back,I was scheduled to have an epidural.Which is an X-ray guided injection to your spinal cord.And then you need that before surgery for insurance.And then following a week after that, I would have hadsurgery and got my disc fused.What a blessing.You've sung the epidurals and stuff, right?Well, when I gave birth.No, but what about like pre chiropractor?No, I did the cortisol shot.Cortisol.Okay.I had lots of those.Yeah, I did one round and it was temporary.And I have a herniated disc anda bulging disc in my lower back.And a few of my friends go to Dr. Fannoand they were like, you need to go see him.I'm telling you.And it was intense.An intense year of, I was on the board where they kind ofstretched you out a little bit.I did laser and, but it changed my life.I'm pain free.And you know what the surgeon likewas like, do not go to a chiropractor.Yeah, they don't.General guidance.Don't go.Oh, there's a lot of people areanti chiropractic and look at it.It saved our lives.I know.Do you still go regularly now then?I go every 45 days.Oh, do you?I try to go once a month.That's what I, that's what I tried to do.I haven't been in a few months becausehonestly, we've been so busy with the podcast,but I need to go in working too.I am, but I can feel it, you know, and you can feel it.Yeah.Yeah.I needed about every 30 days too.Yeah.I can just kind of, I'm like, I need to go.Okay.So I assume that when you'relifting now, you're much more careful.I'm much more careful.The good news is, you know, I was told,never lift anything over my shoulders.And now when I do it, I'm super careful,obviously, but I can do pull ups again.Yeah.I can do a full range of exercises.I had a trainer that helped me kind of strengthen my, myback and neck muscles up here.So.I feel pretty healthy.I'm mostly living pain-free and working out.Yeah.And you know, and skim boards, like those things are crazy.Like I think you hit an age too.You were young, so that's kind of a freakaccident, but I feel like adults shouldn'tbe on skim boards.Probably not.I think it's just asking for like wristbreakage and you know, those, they're fun.Oh, that's the thing at the beach, right?Yeah.You run full speed on your other board.Yes.I think we know someone who did that probably younger thanme, but they broke, I think bothof their, their wrists.Yeah.It's just one of those things you're like, dangerous one.I'm going to pass on that.Okay.So, um, your parents got divorcedwhen you were, what was this 13?I was, uh, I think probably just about 12because it was right before my bar mitzvah.Okay.And, um, you know, they try to work things out before wemoved for probably like a year.Mm-hmm.And then you moved with your mom.I moved with my dad down to South Florida.Boca.To Boca.And then your mom stayed in Tampa.Yep.And what about your brother?He came with me.Okay.And how come Boca?Um, it's a good question.So my dad was, uh, probably a year intohis relationship with, uh, my stepmom.Okay.You know, it was about time to getmarried and she lived in Aventura.Yeah.And I think they just liked Boca.Oh, the schools.He loved Boca high.He thought like it was, you know, it's graded pretty high.So he's like, we'll go here.So where did you go from middle school?I went to Omni for half a semester.Okay.So I, my personal opinion isn't middle school sucks.I think middle school is the worst, um, asa parent and as a child when I was a childand for my children, I can't, and I'mnot saying that's true for everybody,but I think there's a decent amountof people that say middle school is nottheir most favorite time of their life.Um, I can't imagine moving in the middleof eighth grade and starting a new schooland in a new town and a new part of the state after yourparents have gotten divorced.How was that adjustment?Uh, I remember when we sat down and wewere talking about like, should we move?And I had a lot of friends at school and I did like Tampa,but for some reason I was like,let's go almost like too cool for school type of mentality.I don't know where everyone else in myfamily their reason, but my, I think,like, when I think back then it waslike, yeah, let's get out of here, you know,like, um, and things were, were tough.Um, were you kind of ready for a new start?It was, yeah, it was time totime to seek new opportunities.Something had to give.You're like, okay, let's do this.So, um, so yeah, we moved and then, uh, in eighth grade, Iwas just the new kid, you know.And how was that? Uh, did you, wereyou able to make friends or was it tough?Um, it was hard, but I like acting out.I have fun causing reactions and stares.So I, uh, I would do absolutely ridiculous things in class.Um, you know, some, some of myclassmates would remember me just randomly,like in the middle of class, pickingup an eraser and being like, hello,and pretending to be on a phonecall and just shouting things.So I made friends quickly and I,you were like a class clown kind of.Yeah. Okay. Yeah.I hate the word clown. I would like to, um, entertainer.I think you have a mutual class entertainer.He did the same type of similar stuff.I was a good kid.No, but it's probably one of the ways that, um, it brokethe ice and you were able to.Probably coping mechanism too.Yeah, probably.Yeah.Little bit of a defense mechanism and.For sure.The laughter is the best medicine.That's true. That's true.I was just having fun with it.And so, um, from there you went to Boca high.Did you stay friends with some ofthose kids from Omni into Boca high or wasBoca high just a completely new beginning?So I, uh, I used to try to sit at the cool kids tablebecause that was important to me.Um, I was like, who are thecool kids? Let me go sit with them.Yeah.And I would just sit at this table everysingle day and no one would talk to me andI wouldn't talk to anyone and it would be like, I guesslike they'd all be talking the wholetime and I'd just be sitting there.Like, you know, um, and one of thekids, uh, that I'd always sit at this table,ended up going to my high school.His name's Riley and we're still friends today.And he kind of remembered me as a new kid.He would just sit at this table.He's like, he would just sit down and try to chat.Yeah.Just absorb the whatever was going on.Yeah.Well, where else was I?Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.So you know anyone.So you had Riley going into Boca highin a way like you guys knew each other.100%.And then Boca high is a brand new beginning.Yeah.Um, I think Riley and my friend, uh,Naim at the time, uh, also went there.Okay.And how was Boca high?How was your, how was your experience there?Boca high was a lot of fun.Um, I started in robotics class my freshman year and, uh,Matt Gary, uh, one of my closefriends now, we just celebrated his birthday last night andwe became friends and, uh, wewould all like long board down 18th and go to McDonald's.You know, that's just what we did back then.Yeah.Yeah.Now they bike.Yeah.Or they got the hoverboard.Yeah.Yes.Yeah.Scooters.Yeah.Yeah.Did you play sports at Boca high?I played hockey.Oh, okay.Yeah.How was the team then?Um, I think we were all right.Yeah, we did okay.Yeah.They actually did good this year.Did they?Yeah.Yeah.Yeah. That's awesome.I'm happy to hear that.I always forget Boca high has a hockey team until I meet akid that's on the hockey team.Have you seen that new ice rink they put in?No, I haven't been there yet.But do you know where it's at?I've heard about it.Yeah.Looks pretty cool.I've, they do men's league, uh, at night hockey league.My, my dad and my little brother go there.Okay.And they have like the lightof bumper car things over there.Yeah.So where Boca high practices now is down at, I think panthe pan where the Panthers play.I think that's really like sawgrass.I think so.No, no, no, no.They're not practicing there.I bet they're playing games.Yeah.Because Luke, Luke goes down there.I think the Panthers have a down there.Yeah.A different rank.Okay.Now you're, so you're not saying no, just enough facility.Yeah. It's close by.Yeah.Like, I think they, they definitely playgames down there, but I think they practice.That's where, that's where I used to play.I can't remember the name of the rink.Yeah.But I down there, right?Yeah.It's a hall from here.It's like answers.I stand.I think.Yeah.I think that's what they call it.Something like that.Okay.So you played hockey.You were into robotics.Was there anything else you were into during high school?So I also enrolled into drafting and design, which is kindof what shaped the rest of my life.Are you naturally artistic?I like to think so slightly.Yeah.I try.I mean, you either, like none of us are.So I can tell you, I think if you can do that, you are.Yeah.You know.I wouldn't say it's probably my best skill.Um, like campaign.I can't really draw, but I know like good graphic design.Yeah.I know like, uh, I can 3d modelengineering stuff, blocks and squares.Yeah.Yeah.That's artistic.So, so more like the CAD asopposed to freehand type of art.Okay.Yeah, for sure.Yeah.I've made some cool things though.I took a sushi boat and made a wood table out of it.And, uh, nice.I painted some cool things.Yeah.Cool.Oh, so what you did, um, did that kind ofspur and what you wanted to go for in college?Well, it started from that drafting and design, uh, coursewhere, you know, for four, I took itfor four years.Oh, wow.We all just had a ball in there.We'd just be on the computer andputts around and it was very chill.Was it ACE or AP or was it just like one, two, three, four?It was just an elective.That's cool.That was all four years.Yeah.And they taught me about 3d printing and, uh, that's kindof where I was like, okay, I wantto 3d print an invention and make a ton of money.And, uh, and that's kind of like, Ijust got addicted to that concept.And that started in high school.Yeah.Yeah.I was like, well, if I can design anything and I can justprint it and I can make anything.Yeah.And that was pretty early, wasn't it?In the 3d printing?Cause it was that 2013, 2014.They were expensive and slow as hell, I think.Right.Yeah.Yeah.Cause I don't think we'd even really heard of it.I would say your dad made a good choice in Boca highbecause the electives over there,the opportunity for kids.It's incredible.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.It's a really good school.And it led you to what you want to do in college.Their drafting program was awesome.Absolutely.The teacher was awesome too.Mr Coletti.I wonder if he's still there.I think so.I feel like I've heard that name.Yeah.So how did you decide where you wanted to go to college?I had no idea what I wanted to do.I remember people startedtalking about college and that wasn't,I don't think it was talkedthat much about in, in my house.So, you know, I know anything about fratsor sororities or really why college, butI just, I guess I've always had like a really high drive.So I was like, I want to go to Stanford.Yeah.I remember going to thecounselor's office and talking about like,you think I can make it in Stanford?Like what do I got to do?And they sat me down there.Like there's absolutely zerochance you can get into Stanford.I love it though.I love the drive.Yeah.I wanted to do something cool.Yeah.I got a letter in the mail from Embry Riddle and it justhad rockets and airplanes on it.And I was like, well, that'sgotta be the hardest thing I can do.And I like drafting a design.Let me, let me try this.So I went into aerospace engineering.So were you looking for, you saidthat's gotta be the hardest thing I can do.So are you, do you just have a natural, not need, but aninclination to always be challenging yourself?Yeah.I feel like the limits arelike only what you give yourself.And that started at such a young age in high school.Yeah.I'm curious.You moved around quite a bit.Do you remember why you were moving so much?Was like your dad in militaryor your parents in military or?I think my dad switched jobs a fewtimes from when I was one to like five.I think he switched jobs twice, three times.Okay.And then that's just the job moves.And then you said the collegewasn't discussed in your home very much.Did your parents go to school?Yeah.Yeah.Both of my parents have a degree.Okay.So my mom just got her, her master'swhile my parents were getting a divorce.Okay.I helped her.And she stayed in your life, even though she was in Tampa.Yeah.So it started off when theyfirst got divorced, it was 50 50.So I think I was in seventh grade when that all went downand I would go one week at my dad's,one week at my mom's and back and forth.When you were still in Tampa.Yeah.Okay.And then what about when you moved here?When I moved here is just live withmy dad and then see my mom on holidays.Okay.And are you and your mom close?Yeah, we're really good now.Okay, good.Which is great.Yeah.Yeah.Because I'm sure that was hard with the distance.It was tough.Wouldn't recommend it.Yeah.Yeah.No, that's good that you guys.Well, it's funny.You would think you're in the same state, but for peoplewho don't realize that Florida is a big state.Yeah.It's huge.Three and a half hour drive.Yeah.Yeah.And that's if you're speeding.That's if you're going pretty fast.Yeah.Which we all do down here.I made that drive a few times.Yeah.Yeah.So, so where did you pick to go to school to studyaerospace, aerospace engineering?I went to UCF.And they're known for that, right?Yeah.So I got Fulbright Futures andthen accepted into the STEM program.And, and the Excel or sorry, the Excel program.So just like right off the bat, just thrown into advancedmath and meeting different peoplethat were into math like me.It was kind of the first time I met people who had theengineering profile, you know,just kind of math minded.More, more of my type of people, you know,there's not that many engineers and there'sdefinitely not a lot of social engineers.So it was cool to make new friends thatwere interested in the same thing as me.And we would just be up 24 seven, just grinding.Was that the first time that you felt you really hadfriends that were like minded like that?It took a while.I didn't feel that till sophomoreyear when I moved in with my buddy, Sean,Jeffrey and Creed.And that was like the first time my freshman year ofcollege, I was actually severely depressedfor most of it.Really depressed.Were you overwhelmed with theacademic aspect or the social or?I think I just, yeah, I was lost.I was lost.And I didn't really have many friends either becausethere's not a lot of social engineers.So a lot of the people that wouldmeet weren't really my type of people.And then the people who were my type ofpeople were in finance doing frat stuff.And I didn't really want to do that.So I really just spent most of my freshman year in my roomworking on a my first invention,which was a smokeless and odorless vaporizer.There's a lot of utility for that.When you say just for clarification for anybody listening,you mean you're a technical engineer,but you're a social guy.So you're with engineers who probably weren't as social.Yeah.Yeah.Okay.That's what I figured.Yeah, that makes sense.If you have any friends from Boca high that went to UCF.I did, but they did kind of their finance group.Okay.So you kind of were focused on yourpassion that year and use that as your outlet.I was just like, I got to justmake a ton of money from an invention.And this seems like the thing.And then everyone I told it to, obviously a bunch ofcollege freshmen idea was amazing.Yeah.They're like, we'll buy that.They're like, yeah, definitely make that.Did you get it to market and sell it at all?I got, we worked on it for I think six years.It's when it finally wrapped up.Wow.Yeah.Really hard to pull that off, butbasically you hit it and then blow it back in.And I invented like a filterthat was like the size of my thumb.I raised money with an investor.I had a partner to do the electronics.So we had a few working prototypes.Looking back, obviously there's no mistakes and regrets,but I wish I worked on somethinga little more productive, but I did learn a lot aboutinventing and 3d printing and designingfor manufacturing and getting quotes from China.I mean, it set me up for, for chappy.Yeah.Yeah.So, so you worked on thatpretty much your whole freshman year.And then for the next five years, you continued to work onthat as you evolved, did other things.Yep.So your, your sophomore year is whenyou kind of found your people, your grade.So sophomore year, um, part of the STEM or Excel programthat I was in was touring differentlaboratories.Um, so I toured this, uh, center for microgravity researchat UCF and I just came in and wentto the lab director and I was like, I need to work here.And so I got a job and they put me on, um, designing a, uh,CubeSat, which is a satellitethat's like this big, um, whichis like two feet for listeners.Yeah.Yeah.It's about two feet.It's a little cube and, um, theyhad me 3d print the whole mock-up.So I got to use my 3d printing skills.Cool.And then we turned it into a real thingthat went to space over the next four years.No way.Yeah.And what did it do?It studied, uh, particle collisions in, uh, zero G.So we would have like little tiny marblesand different grains of sand that would bein this experiment cell that would shake.And it would, uh, have a camera abovethat would watch how the particles collide.And then they would study how, um, the like transfer ofmomentum between the particleswas different in zero G compared to earth.Cause you can't really study that onearth because there's gravity, but in space,like the particles bounce off each other and, uh, they,they conserve their momentum more.Wow.So how would that information be used?To study how, um, asteroids hit,uh, planets and craters are formed.And then you can project like the size ofthe asteroid just by looking at the crater.That's awesome.I'm just trying to wrap my head around it.I'm envisioning this and I'm thinking, soon the camera though, the camera has to beextreme magnification.It was a GoPro and it was like, Oh, to get out of here.Yeah.Yeah.The GoPro went up into space.What a tree.Yeah.The, uh, the particles, I mean,they were like a millimeter in size.Okay.So, all right.Yeah.I was like a microscopic, I don't know.That's what you think when you hear particles.Totally.So this was your sophomore year.You're working on this.This is sophomore year.Crazy.And then, so what did you do junior year?Junior year I went to space X.Seriously?Yeah.Okay.So how does that happen where, um, your work, you have yourfreshman year, you work, startyour first invention, um, sophomore year, you are part ofsomething that goes into space andthen you end up at space X.What, how did that happen?Um, kind of just back to my drive ofjust trying to achieve outlandish things.Um, I applied to space X my freshman year nonstop, mysophomore year nonstop sophomoreyear.I got interviews, uh, was rejected, but then I rememberedthe interview questions for myjunior year.And, um, I stayed up for like threedays straight preparing for that interview.And I found one of the questions, I thinkit's what got me the internship was like,what do you do if you drop a tool in a fuselage?Like, how do you make sure it's not damaged?And someone posted this question onlineand gave the answer and it's like, check ISO1800 dash D three.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.So I got asked that question and I knew the answer.And yeah.So you leave at UCF.Um, this was for summer.So I flew to LA.They put my car on a train and flew me outto LA for three months and it was awesome.Sure.I was thinking that you might've because Orlando UCF's inOrlando and it's pretty closeto both NASA and space X right on the East coast, but youactually went all the way outto LA.Yeah.So that's where their headquarters were for Falcon nine.So they did operations at the Cape, but they did theirmanufacturing and that was my role.I was a production manufacturer engineer.So you get out there and Iassume they got you an apartment.Um, they, so the apartment story is actually wild.So they pair you with other interns and then you make agroup chat and you find your ownlong-term Airbnb.So I was in charge for our group for theAirbnb and I am about to get on the planeand the Airbnb host cancels areservation, a two and a half month reservation.I've heard of that happening for people.She won't go to Airbnb.She doesn't trust them.It was so bad.We were stranded in LA.The four of us, we had nowhere to go.You guys know each other before this orjust a group chat from all different parts.Did they blame you?Were they like, dude, what the hell?They could have, but they didn't.Yeah.That's cool.Yeah.So I appreciate that.Yeah.Where were they from?All over my, my good friend from there, Dustin was fromupstate New York and then there wastwo others.Okay.And then, so what'd you guys do?Um, so I think we stayed in a hotelin the hood that night for two nights.I think for a week.Yeah.And a week in Long Beach.It was sketchy.Long beaches.It was sketch.I remember we were getting out to go to work one day andthere was someone, it was probably6 a.m. 7 a.m.There was someone like in a, in likea tutu, like fully probably on crack.Yeah.Just ran with a balloon.Just like, like we're writing down.We were like, where are they?Okay.Almost got to go to SpaceX.Yeah.Right.That's crazy.You guys are just these reallysmart kids going to work at SpaceX.And here's the opposite of that.The other, the other spectrum.We ended up getting a greatspot, but it took a week to find.We ended up getting a really solid spot.That's great.And then what did you do there?I mean, what is SpaceX like?So the first day I could not believe I was standing there.And I'm pretty sure I told my manager that which probablynot a great thing to do to be in awe.I had never had a job other than Carabas.You know, the undergraduate research wasn't like a career.That was research at UCF.It's not a job.Right.It's a job, but it's not really like a corporate job.So also these kids were from MIT and,you know, the best engineering schools.And I knew way more than I did.And I probably was there too early.But I remember walking in, you know, youmeet your manager, you meet your group,and you walk in and it's just rocket hardware everywhere.Like crew capsules being built.They had a dragon hanging from thedragons, one of the crew capsules.They had it hanging from the ceiling in the cafeteria withthe char from reentry still on it.And just like pictures of Mars blown up on the wallseverywhere when Mars terraformed.And I mean, you walk in there and you'relike, this is like I'm living in the future.Like what is pretty insane.That's cool.Wow.I can't even imagine.It was really fun.And they had like a full full time coffee bar there.They had gourmet food for everyone.And the culture was just, it wasdifferent for the full time for the interns.The interns had to work 50 hours aweek, not a minute more, not a minute less.And you had to get everything done in those 50 hoursbecause you couldn't work extra time.So that was tough because we were young and we wanted tohave fun and experience California.And we wanted to work 12 hours, four days in a row.And then get off early on Friday and go explore the city.I'd never been to California.So yeah, it was a lot of hard work.And at the same time, I'm still trying to develop the vape.And I had this other product I was trying to develop.So you're still working on your side and SpaceX.Did you learn a ton?Yeah.I mean, I did all sorts of things.I climbed inside the fuselage of a Falcon 9 and created aninspection guide so they coulddetermine different glues andsealants just by shining a UV light on him.I qualified a sealant that protects water from damaging theinside where the barrel meets thewall.There's a crevice and they want them to be reusable.So they don't want water just staying in there.So they created a sealant and I qualified that.I made a drag for the grid fins that help it land.I helped improve a flipping.So the rockets made in sections and they have to work onthe bottom and the top of the barrels.And they were using two cranes.They were picking up a barrel, flipping it, putting itdown, rerigging it on the otherend and then picking it up.And then I was like, why don't you just flip it midair?And they were like, well, we don't do that for a reason.So go figure out what that reason is.And I'm like, I don't thinkthere's a reason you guys don't do it.I just think you haven't thought about it.And I got pushed back for a while, but they ended up doingit and saved them a ton of time.Wow.Did you get recognition for that?No, not much.But how old were you?20?19?20?At that time?Junior year?21?22?Did someone get credit for it?Take your idea and run with it?Not even.No.It's just, I think it's justlike, go and work and go faster.It's wild that, I mean, that's cool thatas an intern, you had stuff expectations.Oh, yeah.Rather than high expectations.Yeah, that's wild.That's awesome.I didn't end up getting a return offer.Did other kids?Yeah.My good friend Dustin did.After doing all those things?Yeah.Yeah.And it's because I screwed up one project.Which project was it?So the rocket lays on rolled rings.And the inside of the rockethas pressure vessels inside of it.And sometimes they'll be more heavy on one end.So it will want to kind of like spin.And so they were trying to add, it's kind of complicated.But up the rocket, they have allthe fuel lines and hydraulic lines.And there's cutouts in the rollrings where those lines run through.So they wanted, there's different versions of the rocket.There's Falcon Heavy and just a regular Falcon.So the raceways are in different locations.So they wanted to create these blocksthat you could clip on to the roll rings.So that you could add extrafriction to the rocket when you turn it.Okay. I don't know if you guys could follow that.I kind of need a diagram.I know, but I did.I followed what you were saying.Yes.So what happened?I know what the heck I was doing at all.I wasted way too much timedesigning and not enough time testing.And I was just so focused on doing itright the first time, which is a big flaw.And I remember in my end of internshipperformance review, they were like, you know,because I was doing differentprojects for different people on the team.And I guess I wasn't communicating wellenough with one of the key stakeholdersabout the status of the project.And I know the blocks came in after I left.I have no idea if they everended up using them or what happened.But yeah, I mean, I could do that project in a week now.It took me almost a wholeinternship to figure that thing out.Was there something you learned fromthat that you took forward with you?Yeah, test quickly.Instead of being so worriedabout preparation and perfection.Yeah, don't be a perfectionist.Fail forward.Yeah.Just keep failing forward.100%.Yeah, that's a great lesson.Yeah, it was a good lesson.Yeah.So are you going to ask something?No, I was just going to say, why doyou think you could do it in a week nowthat took you so long before?Oh, because I haven't stopped thinking about it now.Okay.Yeah.All right.That's an awesome answer.Okay.Did you meet Elon?I walked by him while I was listening to his biography.So they have an executive bathroom atSpaceX where they have a bucket as a urinal.And the legend has it that theytold Elon if he started SpaceX,he wouldn't have a bucket to piss on.So he installed a bucket for everyone to piss in.No way.So I remember repeating the bucket andthen I was listening to his biography.And I was walking back to my desk and I passed him.And I was like listening about his childhood.I'm like, this is weird.Wow.Talk about surreal.Yeah, that was strange.Yeah, that's a moment in life.Yeah, you're not actually allowed to go up and talk to himbecause he's kind of celebrity status.This is 2017 now.I'm sure it's even more strict.Yeah, yeah, yeah.But that's cool though.Yeah, it was pretty cool.Yeah, I think that's really cool.So you spent a summer there.Yeah, yeah.I think it totaled three months.And that was before junior year or senior year?That was junior year.Okay.So then you go back to UCF and you're still doing the samestuff at UCF is when you left pretty much.So we send up the satellite.I think it was my senior year.I started getting into propulsion systems because atSpaceX, that's really what I wanted to do.I wanted to work on the rocket engine.So I tried to get into propulsion systems and we had seniordesign and we made a rocket poweredglider.And I started this, my firstlike website business that flopped.It was called bizkick and it was forfounders to be able to meet each other.Kind of like Tinder for founders.When you say founders, what do you mean?Like entrepreneurs.Okay.So it's kind of, okay.So it's like you just said Tinder for entrepreneurs.Yeah.All these things exist now.Like the smokeless vape, there's a whole company around it.Someone stole the exact idea.It's like the packs, but it'sliterally has a smoke filter in it.It's got two nozzles.It's exactly what I invented.Yeah, there's a whole company around it.And then the Tinder for founders exists too.Do you think those were stolen from your idea?I like to think so.Probably not.I mean, if you invented it though, maybe you still know.Yeah.Just to go back.So when you're at UCF, UCF actually launches satellites.Yeah.So it wasn't in UCF's rocket.They make rockets, but they're all suborbital.But yeah, we sent a satellite up and also was flown out toPuerto Rico and helped them designPuerto Rico's first satellite, which was pretty cool.When was that?I think that was my senior year around.Very cool.How long were you in Puerto Rico?I think a week.I would just go in and just tellthem everything about what we did.Did you get a chance to also see Puerto Rico?Yeah.Yeah.They put me up in a nice spot on the beach and got to drivearound the island a little bit.Nice.Nice.Now, did you spend any time atthe space center here in Florida?Yeah.So when I graduated, I got a job at NASA.Oh, okay.Okay.So wait.Okay.So UCF junior year, senior year,still working on the same stuff.Yep.And then you graduate.I have a super senior year.You have a super senior year?Yeah.I did five years.Oh, super.I never heard it called that way.Yeah, I have an either.A senior year.I like that.That's better than fifth year.Yeah.That's what I did on purpose.I loved college.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.I have a question though.How did you get so smart?I mean, seriously, like you're, this isvery technical stuff you're talking about.It's semi-nebulous for the common folks, right?How'd you get into it?How do you learn it?You know, did you sleep much?Is it just a grind?Is it curiosity?I definitely grinded a lot in college.You know, a lot of people would be outpartying and I would be in my room justworking on the next prototype.But I think it was just, you know, Iused to build Legos when I was younger.I had a whole shelf of Legos.So I've kind of always been this way.I remember taking apart my grandpa's cameras.He would give me his old brokencameras and I would just take them apart.Just like study how they work.And I think it was always this way.So you're born this way.I think so.Just the endless curiosity and thinking it seems like.I think so.Yeah.Math minded.Math minded.Yeah.Because you probably took like thehighest ACE and AP math courses at Boca High.Yeah.Took pre-calc, which I think isthe highest you go in high school.I think they did Calc at FAU, but I didn't do that.And in college, I did differential equations.And the next thing up from that is linear algebra.And then you get a math minor, which I wanted to do.I should have done it.Maybe I'll still do it.What was your degree in?Aerospace engineering.And did you have a minor?I didn't.But it's interesting because so manypeople are like, oh, why do I do this math?It doesn't translate.You're saying it does the advanced math.I love math.Yeah.Yeah.I love math physics.What about reading and writing English?Okay.So it's that one side brain.So which one works better for you?SAT, ACT.Because I know for if you're goodat one thing, you go for the one.So they say I should have done better on the ACT.But I did horrible on the ACT.I did really well on the SAT.On the SAT.Because the ACT is more math and science.Yeah.That's what they say.Yeah.That's interesting.Yeah.I'm not a great test taker, I don't think.Okay.So were your grades in school always registrades?Awful.Awful.Not awful.So A's and B's until high school.Okay.In Spanish.I can barely do English.So Spanish, I got a D in.Is that the class you took with our son, Nathan?I think so, yeah.That was a fun class.And how do we take that?I think I met Nathan in my second year of Spanish.Oh, okay.I think.Because you only have to take two years language, right?Unless you fail or get a D.Right.Then you gotta take three.That's funny.So yeah, I got a D in Spanish.So A and B and everything else.Normally like an A in math, B in writing.And then I think I got a C my senior year of high school.And then all through college, itwas mostly A's and B's and some C's.And I ended up with a 3.000.Okay.In college.Yeah.Yeah.But those are not awful grades.Like when you say awful people are picturing like D's.Yeah, that's true.Yeah.To me, I was like, yeah.Yeah.Well, I mean, at the level that you're thinking probably,and maybe your peers too, thatanyone, it would be straight A's, right?So maybe in your world, if yougot a B, that's like not so good.But for like regular C's.That freaks me out.Yeah.But getting to see your senior year bythen you already have been accepted, right?I think so.Because senior year is kind ofjust like don't totally mess up.Yeah.Yeah.Pretty much all your apps are in.You're just waiting.So as long as you don't totally messup, it's not going to throw anything.100%.Yeah.Yeah.You guys lost me.Were you A's and B's in college or wereyou just talking about all high school?No, it sounds like you were A's and B's.I was A's and B's until likebesides Spanish, got D in Spanish.And then senior year, I got I think my first C.Yeah.Okay.Okay.Got it.And then A's and B's in college, right?In college, I was holding on fordear life and ended up with a 3.00.That's what I thought.You were taking probably incredibly hard classes.And I was working on building a set.I was building a business.So your grades, your college grades don'treflect say your intellectual capacity orbecause you were doing a bunch of stuff.I never went to class.Yeah, there you go there.Yeah.I didn't really like obviously I wantedgood grades, but I didn't go to class ever.Is your brain the type that you can look at something andyou already have it figured outand it's almost like a pain tohave to do it and turn it in?Um, depends on the subject.Math depends on the problem.Okay.Because I know there's kids that are so smart that they getbad grades because they just don'twant to turn it in.So it's like, I already know it.You know, they already have figured it all out.I don't, I wouldn't say that was me.I'm not quite that smart.Okay.Yeah.I wish.When you chose to go to UCF where youknew Stanford was probably the dream, right?But was it, where was that on your bump down?Was it two?Was it 10?It was, um, it was an Ivy leagueschool, but it was where I wanted to go.I got into FSU.Oh, I really wanted to go to UF.You have denied me.Really?Yeah.That's crazy.I know.Yeah.Jeez.Telling me legit though.Oh yeah.Yeah.Especially for what he does.So he has a better aerospace.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.I would think, uh, robot, like, so we toured.UCF FSU UF did the whole thing.I love UCF.Yeah.Um, because you could tell close partnership with thebusiness of the entertainment industryat Disney universal, uh, probably Bush gardens, all therides, NASA space, what 50 miles away orless than a hundred for sure.So you could just, it had a great engineering vibe to me.Yeah.It's, I mean, it was a great engineering school.I learned a lot mostly through building.Um, the classes were solid.I definitely noticed when I got to spaceX that it was not even close and I wasn'tlearning anything.These guys were learning really, um, whichwas not fun, but yeah, I ended up learningit at space X or NASA building.Building is always the best way tolearn, especially for engineers, like hands-onexperience.Otherwise you have no idea what you're doing.If you're not actually building and you're just going toclass, I mean, there was kidswho got straight A's that never built anything.And then, you know, that's your job to build something.Yeah.That makes sense.So you did the super, what'd you call it?Super spring, super summer or super senior senior year.So while you're, when did you applyor what, how did you end up with NASA?Was that your goal?Um, no, it was kind of my nightmare to be honest.Okay.So what did you envision for yourself after graduation?I thought I'd have a product takeoff.I'd be, uh, I'd be in a good position tostart a company and then it would be likea simple product and then I'd roll it intolike a big tech thing, maybe an aerospacecompany flying cars.I wanted to do something really big.And then as you got closer tograduating, um, what made you decide like, were youapplying for jobs or were you juststill focusing on your own thing?I was applying places.I didn't really want to go anywhere.Um, SpaceX said, see you.And, uh, I helped my friend get a job at NASA.I wasn't really looking because I don't know.I just, I couldn't come to grips with thereality that this was actually happening.It really was like my worstfear to have to get a nine to five.Okay.And, um, I helped a friend get a job.I like told him everything I did with the satellite and,uh, he ended up getting a job.And then I was in a position where I needed something.It was like, I don't know, maybe a month before graduation.I had nothing lined up.I'd been trying for months and I'm like,you think you can get me a job at NASA?So he's like, yeah.So I got an interview and then we were bothinterns there started as an internship andwent full time.And then I, uh, my role there was to analyze the, uh,launchpad structures for SLS.So it turned out to be really fun.I loved my time at NASA.I had a great time.And how long were you there?So just under a year, I think.So what were you like 23, 24, 24, rightaround the time I met my, uh, now fiance.Okay.So you're only you're 24 andyou've already worked for space X.You've already invented things and are working on aninvention and you're working for NASA.Do you realize like what, what huge accomplishments allthose are at such a young age?Yeah, I try to do better, um, to givemyself credit because I think that's important.But a lot of the times I just minimizewhat I do and just think about where I want tobe, which isn't totally healthy.No.Would you say back when you were doingthese things or at least working at NASA,were you present and able toacknowledge what a big deal that was?Not at NASA.At space X I knew space X I was like, butyou know what pissed me off is I would goaround in LA and we'd be out to bars.It'd be like, uh, they'd belike, Oh, so what are you doing?I'm like, I work at space X.What's that?Yeah.No, no, no, no, no, no.Absolutely no.And then you tell me you're working onrockets for like, Oh, well it's not NASA.Like, what is it?It's nothing.What a trip.Yeah.I was space X was just starting.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.Right around the beginning.Yeah.Now everybody knows.Yeah.Everyone in the world knows.Everybody knows.So you're at NASA and you're working with your friend.Yeah. Like I had the job and then you met your fiance.Yeah.And what did she do there?So I met her, um, right before my senior design project,which is basically the last day ofcollege.Was she at UCF?Yeah.And we matched on Tinder and,uh, I slid in with, uh, guess what?And she's like, what?And I said chicken butt and she fell in love.I love that.She made me wait a month to meet her.I ended up thinking I was getting catfished.I'm like, this person's not real.So you guys were talking and everything.Yeah.We were talking all the time.I kept telling her, Hey, come to this,come to this, come to this, come to this.Yeah.No, no, no.Can't can't can't.Yeah.And I would talk to my friendsabout her and I'd be like, I'm like 90%.I remember thinking if we don't hang outin the next week, I'm like almost positive.This is not a real person.Right.And I'm with my friends at the pool.And I remember she's like, uh,Hey, I'm out with my friends.Do you want to come meet us?I'm like, Oh my goodness.It's happening.It's like in the office.You watch the office and when they're all like, Oh my God,that was literally me and no onewanted to come with me to downtown.And I just had to know if she was real.Yeah.So I rode to myself, Chuck, Chuck, thelittle vodka, put it in a little Gatorade bottle,took an Uber by myself, 20 minute ride to downtown andwalked in to like 12 of her friends.A brunch.Yeah.A brunch.Oh man.And, uh, yeah, within the first fiveminutes she was, uh, feeding me chicken tenders.I was like, this is it.I love it.Listen, that's the definition of if he wanted to, he would.I tell that to my daughter and herfriends, if he wanted to, he would.A hundred percent.And I'm a big believer in that.Guys, if, if he's interested in you, there's no confusion.Yeah.You'll know a hundred percent.Yeah.And that's the way it should be.I think, you know, games are very common, but thank God wenever had that stage in our relationship.So fortunate.So, so after that, then was itmore frequent to see each other?She didn't make you wait another 30 or 60 days.No, no.Yeah.We, we literally were inseparable.Yeah.I don't think we spent more than, you know, a day apart forsince then.And what are the chances of her also working in NASA?So she didn't work at NASA.Oh, okay.Okay.She worked at the basketball arena indowntown Orlando where the magic play.Yeah.Okay.And do events there.So she hospitality.Yeah.Okay.Which UCF that's great for that.Yeah.That's where you go.So you were, because where were you, you weren't in Orlandowhen you were working for NASA, were you?Did you move?Yeah.No.So we took a shuttle every day.So I graduated.I got the job and I was still in Orlando with my roommatesfrom college and we would take ashuttle to NASA about an hour ride there,hour ride back every morning at like 6 a.m.I'd be up.It was awful.And I'd be in the bus on my laptoptrying to work on my side business.It was so bad.Maybe that's where I got the neck problems from.Yeah.So you're okay.So an hour and that's five days a week.Yeah.Yeah.That's five days a week.And that you did that for a year.Yeah.And you know, I saw so much of NASA.There's so much built out there.You know, I've got to go from thecatacombs, which is like tunnels under the launch padto the top of the tallest launch shower.And you know, like 300 feet in the air.Climbed.I got certified to climb lightning towers.So as a structural engineer.Wow.So they have three lightning towers.I think they're like 350 feet up and I put on a harness andwe're just climbing this ladder.Oh my God.All the way up.That's crazy.It was nuts.Are you not scared of heights?I know.I love adrenaline.I couldn't do it.Yeah, you couldn't do it.I have height issues.Yeah.I'm like going on the roof.Yeah.I was scared of heights until I skydived,which was during my internship at SpaceX.We had like a week off because when I was there, they justdid their launch land for Pete,which is like the first time theylanded a rocket and then relaunched it.So they planned this big party andthen they had like a summer break.The party was insane.Elon went all out, rented Paramount pictures and had likedifferent EDM stages everywhere.Wow.And it was just insane.And then we have summer breakand me and my friend fly to Hawaii.And we're just so on top of the world.It was 4th of July.They had float Tilla or float Palooza or something.And everyone gets on floats and parties in the ocean.And that day there was a rip and we all got taken out likea mile or two miles off the shore.All of us on floats.No.100 people on floats.That's crazy.And the coast guard's just ripping backand forth with Jet Skis rescuing people.This is in Hawaii?He is in Hawaii.I bet you guys were on the news.Maybe.It was like a local story.Yeah, for sure.It was wild.Were you freaking out?Well, there's so many people.We were the Florida kids.We were like, this is cool.Not the straight.No, you were having fun.And I think when there's so many peoplein a situation like that, you're like,okay, they're going to find us.There's so many of us.We're going to be fine.Yeah.And they were watching like theyhad set up a perimeter of Jet Skis.And if you floated past them, you were like pushed back.That is so funny.Yeah.We were being watched, which was good.And there were some like little sailboats and stuff.So we felt pretty safe.But yeah, I mean, you could not swim back.You could not get back.You had to be rescued.Yeah.No.Just a totally different question about Elon.Was he though a good like boss, would you say?Like does he take care of his people?So I never had a direct interaction with him, but I thinkhe's obviously very efficientat what he does.And I think a lot of that isn't based on people's feelings.I think it's probably more based on progress.So I wouldn't be a good person to ask ifhe's a good boss, but he's accomplished a ton.And you said you guys had likea coffee bar and you had food.Like he set up a good work department.Yeah.I mean, he threw crazy parties and we had great food.Yeah.Took care of his people.It's a great answer you gave because he doesn't.It's about progress and the food and the restaurants.It's to keep people around.He doesn't want you going home.That's what's interesting about the interns.50 hours no more, no less.Very prescribed.But I bet the FTEs that they everover there, they had no limit, right?Yeah.They're there all the time.Seven days a week, probably.Yeah.That's their life.When it's, it depends.They have slow seasons and fast seasons.When you have to be there, there's zero excuses.When you have to get somethingstuff done, there's zero excuses.Yeah.That makes sense.So you're an adrenaline junkie besidesskydiving and climbing up these towers.So yeah, skydives in Hawaii.That was the point of that where they filmed Jurassic Park.So I was on top of the world.It was insane.That year is like a movie.Yeah.I can't imagine skydiving either.Have you done anything else that's crazy?Not crazy, but adrenaline.Skydiving is definitely the craziest thing I've done.Yeah, by far.What's it like when you jump out of that plane?So the Will Smith video does areally good job explaining it.It's like you're so scared the whole, I remember the nightbefore just having dreams about it.Just really being freaked out in the day, waking up like,"Oh my God, we're jumping out of a plane today."And I was literally scared.Like not really scared of heights, but I'd get like clammyand planes and didn't love heights.The idea of skydiving was like,"I will never do that."But it was at a point in my lifewhere it was just like fake reality.So let's go skydiving.I'm in that camp.I won't do it.Yeah.I mean, that's how I felt.Yeah.And that's kind of how I feeltoday, especially after doing it.But you're so, so, so nervous.And then you get up there and theguide the whole time didn't love this.Was just cracking jokes about God.And you know, you're praying to God.You're like, "Please keep me safe."He's just cracking jokes thatlike they were funny, but not really.It's almost like, "Shut the fuck up."It was like, "Dude, you're going to get us killed."And then it's like, "All right, you guys ready?"Jump and door opens and you're just up there and you'relooking out the window the whole time.You're like, "Okay, I could jump from here.Okay, I could jump from here.Can we really even jump from here?Like, can we survive?Can we breathe?"They open the door and we were at, I think, 13,500 feet.And you look down and it'sjust like, "How is this even real?Like, how is this even possible?"And you jump and my instructor was too busy cracking jokes.He didn't tell me that you have to look up.If you look down, the wind suffocates you.If you look up, you can breathe and know that.So I'm looking down and I'm likechoking and I fell for probably 20 seconds.I also had a photographer, sothere's some pretty funny footage.And I remember thinking,"If I don't takea breath right now, I'm going to pass out."Like, I was suffocating.Yeah.And somehow at that moment, Ialways get lucky, I got a breath.And then it was just, you don'teven feel like you're falling.Really?You're just on a cushion of air.You're just like, "This is sick."Really?So you were able to be present?Oh, yeah.You didn't like blackout.You can remember.I almost did.Yeah.Yeah. Now, as soon as I was able to getair, I was just like not scared at all.And that's kind of what Will Smith says is like thegreatest things are on the other side of fear.How long did you drop for itbefore you pull your parachute?I couldn't tell you, but probably about a minute 30.Oh, wow.And did you have someone--It was a drop, yeah.Yeah, wow.It's a drop.Someone's attached.You're with someone, right?Yeah.Yeah, I had someone on my way.Oh, you were?Okay, okay.And then once the chute opens, is it a jar?Is it jarring?Yeah, so that's kind of like the moment of faith.That's where everything always goes wrong.So the chute opens, and thenyou're still strangely high in the air.And there's nothing underneath you.You're just kind of like--It feels like someone's got you on ahanger and is dangling you up in the air.And you're just swinging around.And then he was pulling on the handles, and he's like,"Here, you pull here to turn.You pull here to turn."And he's like, "You want to drop a little bit?"And I'm like, "Yeah, let's do it."And he pulls really tight, and we spin, and then we justfall like a couple hundred feet.Oh, my gosh.And I remember we landed, and I'm like, "Oh, my God.That was so fun.Let's go right now again."I almost did it right there again.Oh, my gosh.Have you done it again since?Yeah.Do you think you would again?Maybe for my wedding.Now, is your fiancé into it?She would do it with me.Okay.Hesitantly.Yeah?She said she would do it with me.Yeah. That's cool.Yeah.So, okay.So, you do the year at NASA.Did you see rockets go?All the time, yeah.Okay.I've been so close to rocket launches.They're pretty, they're really cool up close, yeah.I mean, I imagine the things you saw,you just really can't describe to people.You absolutely have to be there to-Yeah, like to VAB, where they built the space shuttle.You know, it's like a 400-foot building.It has its own weather inside it.And-Its own weather?Yeah.It can have like rain in there.Isn't that weird?Yeah.That is, yeah.They can get enough condensationat the top that it rains in there.Is it so they can test things in that weather?No, they don't want that.It's just that big that it-That it gets its own weather.That's what they say.I mean, I haven't seen it, but that's what they say.No, growing up in Florida-Did you have a fascination towards NASA at all?Because I know a lot of kids do.We can see rockets on a clear day from here sometimes.You know what's crazy is they didn't.And me and my fiance were talking about this on the way up.When I was a kid, I had a baseball wallpaper in my bedroom.And my brother had a space wallpaper in his bedroom.And I would always go to his bedroom.And I remember looking atSaturn and thinking it was so cool.But no, I never really thought about aerospace untilEmbry-Reddle sent me that pamphlet.It was like, oh, that looks fun.Challenging thing.You're like, I'm going to challenge myself.So after NASA, was it just a one-year stint?Did you know it was only going to be one year?I didn't.I knew I didn't want to be there too long.As a government job, the pay is not great.So I got an invitation interview atL3Harris from a friend that was working there.And they offered like a 30% bump.And it was back in the industry,where it was a little more fast-paced.You know, NASA is prettyrelaxed, totally different culture.And I wanted something challenging.So I took it.And then I was at L3Harris designing hardware forsatellites for, you know, we did things forComcast and Space Force and different clients.And was that in Orlando as well?That was in Melbourne.Okay.So same area.Yeah, I did not like that.Did you move to Melbourne?I did.So I moved to Melbourne.I got a place.And then that week that I joined the job, COVID hit.And everyone left the office.I was in Melbourne for one week.So you could have stayed where you were.So you could have stayed where you were.I could have stayed where I was.But everything happens for a reason.And I was like, Melbourne, I never got to meet anyone.I'm just by myself.I don't even have to go in the office.Like what am I doing here?And my fiancé then girlfriend waslike 20 minutes north of Boga in Boyan.So she had moved.She moved here.She moved here.To work at the breakers.No, she's from New Hampshire.I heard New Hampshire.Did she come down from New Hampshire to go to UCF?She did.Okay.So she came here to go to school and then stayed.Yep.She started at FAU actually.Oh wow.And then went to two years here and then went to UCF.Okay.And she likes Florida.Yeah, she loves Florida.New Hampshire is beautiful.It's really cool.Yeah, we go visit all the time.It's cold.Yeah.In the winter.It's a bit much.But the summer is in the fall, please.Yeah, it's really pretty.Have you done the fall?Yeah.We've gone up a plenty of times.You've seen foliage.We've gone snowboarding up there.We've done ATVing up there.That's nice.Both days up there.She still has family up there.Yep.Yeah, cool.Yep.So we do Christmas up there.Yeah.Oh, so you get like a real Christmas.Like cold weather and everything.Yeah, it's cool.Like a Hallmark Christmas.Yeah, that's cool.That's really cool.So she moved down here and you're in Melbourne.Yep.So after school, she got a job atthe breakers and moved to Boyton.And I was at NASA and we would go back and forth.Long distance.And then COVID hit and I wouldjust go see her and stayed with her.And then I ended up basically movingin because COVID wasn't going away.We didn't know what was going on during COVID.It was like, how long is this going to be?Is it going to be a week, a day, a month, a year?End up moving in with her and her roommates.And we ended up living together so quickly because of that.Which I think was really great for our relationship.Yeah, I advise anyone who's going to get married to livetogether for at least a year.Yeah.I think it's so important.You learn, you really learn everything.So it's a safety net.It's like, okay, if we can do this, weneed to test this out before we commit.It's a must.It's a must.It really is.It's interesting you're saying it's a must.That's great advice.It is.I've told all the kids that you have to do that.We did.Yeah.Yeah.Because you don't know the other person's habits and youhave to be okay with living with all of them.Yeah.Yeah, absolutely.Have you guys had a pet together yet?Not yet.Okay.I'm excited for that.Maybe next year.Yeah.Yeah.Did you have pets growing up?I had cats.She had a dog.I love dogs.Yeah.Dogs are pretty cool.They are cool.We have three dogs.I want a dog pad.Yeah.Is there a certain dog you want?I think gold.I wanted something super aggressivethat I could train like a German shepherd.Yeah.But that doesn't seem like a great idea.So I think we'll go for a golden.We actually have a German shepherd and he'sonly aggressive if he feels he needs to be.But they're so smart.He's so smart that he's got a very good gauge.So they're not nearly as say volatile as you might think.Yeah.He's he's also a rescue.So he's on a hundred percent German Shepherd.I'd love to meet him.Yeah.Well, we'll let him out before we go.They go nuts because we have threeand you could pick one of the other two.I won't give up my one of them.One of them's a bastard dash downmix and she just barks like people.So it's like she's talking.It's a lot.You saw the little one.We rescued her from Puerto Rico.Oh, very nice.Yeah.I love that you guys rescued them.Yeah.Yeah.That's that's kind of one of my things.Like my kids aren't allowed to buy dogs.They have to rescue.That's great.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.So many dogs that are out inshelters that are just going to get killed.And you can get so sad.Yeah.You can get breeds.You can get breeds.You can rescue every breed has a rescue.So like golden retriever, you couldcontact the golden retriever rescue andpeople get puppies.That's what we'll have to do.Yeah.Any any like it's amazing.People think you can't get a breed,but you can rescue breeds for sure.But our neighbor, she walks the dogthat is he looks like a purebred GermanShepherd that she rescued.Oh, there's tons of shepherds and he rescued.But ours is a black German Shepherd.Have you ever seen a black German Shepherd?Is that like the standard police dog?Kind of.Pretty much.Yeah.Yeah.That's what he but he he has something else in him though.I know most so many dogs down here a pit.Yeah, I'm sure there's something andthey he looks so just like a black German.I like pits.I lived with a pit my sophomore year.Yeah, they're sweet dogs.Yeah, they really are.I mean, unless really sweet, they're very sweet.Like that's their natural temperament.Yeah.I remember my mom was really worried about me.She's like, don't sleep with it.It's too close to your face.Yes.It's going to eat you while you're sleeping.Yeah.Actually, that could be any dog thatcould be any dog that a dog bit Nathan once.And it was like this big.It was a foot.Oh, it happens.Yeah.Little dogs especially.So but that'll be cool when you guys do that.I'm excited.Hopefully next year.Yeah, for sure.So when everything came to an endat NASA, what was your next step?It was L3 Harris where you already said that.Okay.So then how long were you there?I worked there for one or two years.And you were living down here.In two years.Remote.Fully remote.Down here living with her and her roommates.Yep.So as COVID started to end, they started saying, you know,people have to come back to work.It was a big struggle to get people to come back.Yeah.Yeah.So I fought that pretty hard and Iwould go up every two weeks or every week.I was going up, I think two days a week.So one night, so I'd drive up like Wednesday morning andsleep there at a place that's beenlike $60 a night.Super, super dirty and uncomfortable.Awful.So you had it in committed to Elisewhen you first moved to Melbourne.You had it.Oh, thank God.Yeah.Yeah.That's huge.I think I was in for a month.It was like a month to month thing.That's perfect.Yeah.I thought you had left Elise inMelbourne and moved down here.So that's good.You didn't have to do that.Yeah.No, just one month because I never really want, there'snot, I mean, it's just not my type ofplace.Yeah.I get why people like Melbourne,but I like a lot of stuff to do.And I did not want to move there and theyjust kept trying to bring me back there.And eventually one day they were like, you know, so Istarted Chappie and Chappie hadalready had a few good years and theywere like, you have to move back your pursepermanently.It was like a major decision point in my life.And I was like, sorry, but I'm not moving back.So you let that job go.I quit.Yeah.So did you start Chappie during COVID?I did.And can you explain to our listeners what Chappie is?Sure.So Chappie is a vacuum insulated container that preventsall your cosmetics from melting.And we have five different sizes.Our most popular is the Chappie OGthat prevents lip balm from melting.And then it goes on.I'm going to swing to me for a second.That's what this one is, right?Yep.That's OG.Yeah.And then we have a slightly largersize, the plus, which is for lipstick.And then we have the max, whichyou can fit a bunch of stuff in.Excuse me.And a pro and a 10 for pretty much everything.Deodorant, phones.If you're on the boat, you don'twant your phone getting wet or hot.So that exploded.Yeah.That's amazing.So how did you think of this idea?What triggered it?Actually, my first friend fromBoca High in my robotics class,he knew I had been inventing for so long.And I was working at Harris andhe's like, he calls me up one day.He's like, Hey, some girl at dinnersaid there should be a Yeti for lip balm.First thing I thought was that stupid.And I told my girlfriend at the time about it.And she was like, you have to do that.You have to, you have to, you have to make it.And then she told her friend Alec and he called me.He's like, you have to do, you have to do it.So I 3D printed a mock-up of it andI went on TikTok and talked about it.And it got a hundred thousand views overnight.No kidding.Yeah.That's awesome.It blew up.So I was like, Oh my God.There you go.And I had all that experience with the vape and all theother stupid things that I tried.Yeah.That I knew exactly what to do rightafter that and launched it into a pre-sale.Amazing.So how did you figure out what youneeded to make it out of so things won't melt?Well, that idea was always vacuum insulation.That's kind of the idea that was pitched to me.So I just looked for a manufacturer who makes water bottlesand said, can you make a smaller one?Interesting.Okay.So you were going to ask a question.No, I was going to say we were talking a little bit aboutthis and I'm not the biggest chapstick guy,but so many times and we'd be out on like the lacrossefield and your lips start to get chapped.I would bring it in.It's this melted mess and that's the problem that solves.If you throw your chapstick inhere, you don't get that melted mess.Oh, there's so many uses the boat, the beach, the pool.Yeah.But it's like perfect for here in Florida, but now we entersummer in other parts of the country.And not just Florida.Like there's places that are also hotyear round, but then everyone in the summer.No, and I love the deodorant.That's also an issue.Yeah.For gym bags and stuff.Yeah.Go to the gym and then come back to their car in the summerand their deodorant is just liquid.And also phones.You're right.Because your phone will get that thing where it'soverheated and it won't let you use it.Medications too.Like people put their happy pens in the pros.Yes.Yeah.Wow.So when did that really...What year was that when that really startedtaking off when Chappie started taking off?So I launched the presale on my birthday, March 29th, 2021.Okay.And it was pretty much just a TikTok as a Facebook ad and areally rough Shopify website with some3D modeled pictures of it.I was like, let's see if we can sell any.Yeah.And they were selling.So I put it into production and it didn't go as planned.I got scammed.Someone, I guess, hacked the manufacturer's email andpretended to be the manufacturer.This was after like months of talking.No.Were you talking with the hacker, do you think?Or were you talking withsomeone and then became the hacker?They changed the email by one letter andin the middle of talking through emails,I didn't notice.It was like instead of manufacturer at gmail.com ismanufacturer maybe like with the A and U.With two weeks or something.Yeah.And so they sent me the wire info andI sent the pre-order money and bye-bye.I was like, so guys, how's it going?And they're like, we're working on it.And I'm like, you know, a fewweeks later, hey guys, how's it going?We're working on it.A few weeks later, guys, is there any progress?Send me some photos or something.We're working on it.It's going to come.Give us a few weeks.A few weeks later, guys, what is going on?And then I think they just stopped answering.And that's when I realized the letters were switched atsome point in my conversationlike a month or two ago.They were answering all.So what would they would do?They would receive my email, send it to the manufacturer,have the manufacturer respond.They made a fake email on me to have themanufacturer respond, send it back to me.So I was able to communicate withthem through the design process.And it wasn't even that.Yeah.Wow.Do you have any idea of thecountry of origin of the hackers?No.Part of me thinks maybe it was afactory pulling a fast one on me.We produce in China.So it's anyone's guess.It probably wasn't.It probably was a hacker and they could be from anywhere.Yeah.That's crazy.So how incredibly disheartening?Oh my God, it was horrible.So I remember I was at a fork in the roadand it was either invest my life savingsthat I built up through NASA and otherHarris, you know, only a year or two.So not much, but it was everythingI had or returned the pre-sale moneyand lose everything I have anyways.So I filed a report with the FBI, theFTC, the bank, the inter-management bank,the Chinese bank, the Chinese FBI, whatever that was.I filed like so many reports.I was like, I'm going to use my own money.So I put out like a thousand requests.I send my design to every manufacturer in the world.I was like, can anyone make this?And a bunch of people were like, I remember then I gotpaired with a new manufacturer.We were like, we can make it.We can make it.They gave me a quote and then they couldn't make it.They were like, we can't, wecan't bend the metal this type becausechappy's so small.It has manufacturing issues.So the bend radius on the metal makes the metal crack.So they couldn't make it.And like nine months went by.I'm going to be a kid while you're talking.What was that?I'm going to me while you're talking.The little chinga chinga that you can hear.I mean, if you look on your website,it's like perfectly sized for chapstick.Yeah.Yeah.So it is tight.That's interesting.So trying to bend it, it's hard to bend.Yep.Yeah.Interesting.So this manufacturer finally reachedout to me and was like, we can make it.And I was like, okay, how long for a sample?And I told them my story and they werelike, we're going to just send you a sample intwo weeks for free.Two weeks later, I had a sample.Wow.So I was able to tell customers ninemonths later that they were going to shipand we delivered, which was awesome.So you didn't do like a Kickstarter, butyou just did pre-sales on your website.Yep.Yeah.If I did a Kickstarter, Iprobably wouldn't have got the money.Yeah.So how were people about waiting the nine months?They were mad.Yeah.They were like,did you explain to them what happened?Yeah.Okay.I did. I mean, what are you going to do?Many people, many customers.We love all of them, but they have high expectations.Yeah.Yeah.Well, let's keep in mind during COVIDsupply chain issues impacted the entire world.So starting it, you have this great idea.You get screwed by the one manufacturer.When did you, when did you say get that second round withthe manufacturer said they could do it?Then actually saying you the sample was it.It's like six months later afterI, after the pre-sale launched.So like September 2021 or something.September 2021 around when I launched in March, it was bad.I felt terrible.And if I sent the money to another manufacturer for asample and they scan me again, I'd be outmy savings and all the pre-sale money.Yeah.And then I'd have a bunch ofpeople that paid me no product.So is it, is this the same manufacturer you still use?Yep.Yeah.Really, really, really nice person to this day will doeverything they can to make sureChappie successful.That's wonderful.And we probably wouldn't be around without them.I mean, that's the key, right?That's creating a team, a strong teamand your manufacturer is part of that team.Oh yeah.And yeah, I mean, she helped us develop the cooler too,which was kind of like, you know,after Chappie got some traction, I waslike, okay, I want to do something for me.Like, how can I invent something that I would really like?And I spent two years designing this cooler here and shehelped with the manufacturing with it.Why don't you pick it up?You've got to see the cooler.I went online.I was checking it out.That thing is cool.It's going to be rebranded toTerra very soon, but it floats.You know what?Throw it to me.I have a better angle.It's heavy, sir.Okay.Yeah.All right.That is so cool.It's got the speaker in it.So it's called Coolio.So here's the speaker, right?Yeah, the speaker compartments up top.And you can put your iPhone there, I think, right?You can charge through inductive charging on that battery.Yeah, that comes with it.And the side straps carry towels.The whole thing floats, which is my favorite feature.So it floats.Yeah.So you can take it in the water on a boat day and playmusic and swim out to like an island andhave all your cold drinks with you.So the video on your website, where's that filmed at?It looks like it's Boca Lake Boca.We have a lot of videos.Which one was it a boat day?Yeah, maybe.Yeah.Most of the boat day footage is from Miami.I think it was floating around in the water.Yeah, probably Miami.Yeah.Okay, cool.So the speaker is waterproof.The speaker, that's a JBL.It's mostly waterproof.We also sell a waterproof speaker.That's an add-on.But you can float it with the speaker.Yeah.JBL, that's a great speaker.It's a great speaker.Yeah, it's perfectly sized.So we didn't want to put a speaker built in because a lotof people have their own speakersthat they like.Yes.Yeah.So I charge them for a speaker and thenif, you know, it gets wet and it breaks.Oh, so they order it.And then if they want the speaker, you put the speaker.They can add the speaker or you can use your own.Oh, or you can put your own speaker in there.Yeah.I'm doing it just this year by showing it this way.Are you sure?Yeah.Yeah.It looks good.And then those are cup holders.Right.Yep.And it floats.That's what I noticed.The one.So you can put all your food in there.Yeah.Everything.That would be great for moms.If you're listening moms, this would be a great thing.If you, you know, you take your kids outin the tubes and on the things they jump onand you could bring this andbring all the food for the toddlers,the snack food for your kids.That's huge.I love it.I use it every single time I go to the beach.I mean, really what was first of it.I didn't know it floated when I first designed it.Oh, it's funny.I just wanted a really great beach bag that had everythingI needed when I walked to the beachbecause I used to be able to walk tothe beach when we lived up in Boyan.Yeah.I was like, all right.Well, I always forget a speaker.My phone's always dead.I always want to go for a walk on thebeach, but I'm scared to leave my valuables.And I always want cold drinks, but they get warm.So let me build everything into one.It even has a bottle opener, right?Yep.It's got a bottle opener.There's a lock on the top.So that's dry storage up here.Yep.And you can lock, you know, your phone and stuff in there.So you're saying this is dry storage up here.Yeah.You can open up that zipper and kind of peel that open.Oh, yeah.Yeah.Okay.Yep.So there's a phone in there.That's mine.Yeah. So like you're saying, if it was say youand your fiance or anyone, if someone's bythemselves or if like parents want to go out in the waterwith their kids, you could puteverything in here and just bring the cooler with you.Yep.Yeah.That's smart.And the towels on the side and the towel.Yeah.Because there's so many times we'vedone it where we've gone into the water andevery two minutes I'm lookingto see is our bag still there.And even on my local beach, I wasn'teven, yeah, I didn't piece that together.Bring this with you.Bring the cooler with you.Yeah, you can.You're not going to lose allyour shit from some jerk walking by.Yeah.A hundred percent.Yeah.And you can just, you can still be enjoying the water, butyour, and your stuff is thereand you don't have that anxiety.Cause I know, and I know other moms are like this, you'realways looking as the still there.You can never totally relax.So that would just be like, you could just be present.A hundred percent.It allows you to be.Yeah.That I speaking as a mom, that's huge.You could actually probably hug it and help.You actually can.Yeah.Can you?You can use it.I mean, not Coast Guard approved,but you guys have a floatation device.Yeah.So one of the kids could be holding onto that.A hundred percent.Yeah.I've done that multiple times.Brilliant.This is brilliant.I love it.How do you, how do you design this?How do you get this from idea to market?So that's the big leap, I think.A hundred percent.Yeah.And it's not easy and it's been alearning lesson and this is going to be our firstsummer where we're starting to see sometraction where it's like starting to pay offbecause it's until this summer and I've been working onthis, I guess for three years now.It's been not good.Not fun.The product's always been amazing, butthe business element has been really tough.So I started off with an AI design.I was like, uh, as TragedyPT, I waslike, make a futuristic speaker thator futuristic backpack cooler that has aspeaker and cup holders and battery in it.And I came out with like thisdesign and I tried to copy exactly that.And I got my first version and it was terrible because itwasn't thought through practically.Like the speaker was right above the cup holders.So you had to like fiddle your cup in there.And then when you wanted to pull itout, you'd spill it and the sound wouldn'tplay through the mesh very well.It wasn't the right match.It did another iteration, another iteration.There's always something wrong.This went on for a year.I made, I think five or six versions.So this is the final design that eventually, you know, it'sstill, there's always somethingto improve, but kind of the lesson from SpaceX is like, ifit's good enough, let's use it.And I think it's really good.I love where it ended up.And we have another version, anewer version coming out soon.This one actually has some of the upgradeswhere like the hardware would rust becauseit didn't have the right coding on it.So the lock and whatnot and the beerbottle opener wasn't the right material,didn't have the right coding.So we upgraded that.We upgraded the structure of the front.We're going to add drain holes into the drystorage because sometimes you'll be floatingwith it and you'll forget to zipit, which I've done a few times.Water gets in and it's hard to get it out.So, you know, just a little improvements here and there.We're about to produce 1400 newones under the new brand called Terra.No kidding.So it's no longer going to be called Coolio.I don't think so.So originally I had it under the Chappie brand.Okay.And I was like, all right, well,Chappie makes insulated products.What can I make them passionate about?How about a cooler?How do I make the world's best cooler?And then I launched it to Chappie's 50,000customers and turns out people or coolersand chapsticks, there's not really any correlation.I had like three purchases out of 50,000 people.Interesting.I was like, something's not right.So then I broke it off onto its own website and I'm like,Coolio is great for a cooler,but it's not great for a brand.Like I want to build an ecosystem aroundit of outdoor tech is kind of the visionthat I had.And then I moved to Miami and I met this kid named George,who's now my partner on the cooler.And he's an incredible photographer andvideographer and, you know, can really createa really good brand identity.So he came up with the name Terra, and then we came up witha logo and we started sellingthe cooler under the Terra website, where it's branded aslike really awesome travel stuff.And I really like it if it's a cooler alot better than the brand image of Chappie.And how have you guys been doing on the Terra website?It's starting to crush.That's awesome.It's starting to crush.And it's been so when I first came outthe cooler, I wanted to test the concept.So I did a presale sold 100 in like May of 2022 orsomething 23, maybe this was last year.So 24 times a little squish, but yeah, 24 of May.We sold like 100, then I stoppedselling them and I wanted to just produce 500.And that took months.And by the time I had the coolers, it was like September.And if you go on Google Trends and youlook at the search history for coolers,like April 17th, it starts going up.And then by September, it's over.Yeah.So stuck with 400 coolers and they're big.400 of those takes up a lot ofroom and you got to pay storage fees.And because the first design has thebattery included in it from production,when we shipped it from China to here,it's a hazardous good and shipping doubles.So I lost a lot of money with the product.So a lot of learning lessons.Because is the battery something you could do here?Yeah.So we're going to ship them separatelyhere and put them together in the US now.Literally say it was like $20,000.Wow.Yeah.A big mistake.But I mean, that's all part of learning, right?Yeah.As a business owner.So you went, so you've got Chappiegoing and then you started designing this.And now this is going.So since you quit the job in Melbourne, have you only beenworking on Chappie and then Tara?So yep, they went Chappie then Tara.Okay.And now I have three other things.I do way too much.Four other things.Is it all umbrella under Chappie oryou're saying Tara is totally separate?Financially, yes.But operationally, no.And the other three things are all separate too?Four things.Four things are all separate.All separate.So what are the other things you're doing?I'll just touch on all of themand then you can tell me which one.I'm over here fixing my stuff thatthat cooler toss through me for a loop.I even like adjusting things for like a good five minutes.I'm good now.Or you can move the mic a little bit away.At least it didn't hit the sound board.Yeah, no kidding, right?It's well, I mean, this thing's legit.The cooler is totally legit.Like people who are Yeti fans.Yeah, it's got nothing on this cooler.Oh, it's got nothing on it.Nothing at all.The zippers are are legit.The just the quality.Yeah, the quality.And the move your mic.It's good.It's actually an interesting story with thezippers because Yeti's famous for their verythick strip zippers.And so I have them in there because that's one of thethings that I debated upgrading.I'm actually curious.You guys thoughts on this?You have the zippers in there.Yeah, like the new zippers.The really thick ones.Okay.That Yeti has.Yeah.So they have like a special factory that makes thesespecial zippers because they have tobe waterproof too.And so to add it would be$15 for retail.Just and for the zipper just tobuy one zipper for one cooler.It's 15 bucks to me.I'd have to pass that on.Yeah.Yeah.I don't know if it's worth it.Yeah.I think this zipper works pretty well.The zipper is legit.Are you saying it's not waterproof?It is.Okay.It is.It's just people like the really big zippers.Can I show you guys?Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.Go get that.Go get the zipper.I'll come back to me.I'll keep talking about this thing while he's getting it.You got yourself together now.I'm back in action.All right.Let's see these zippers.Okay.All right.So you're saying this is the new zipper.This is like a Yeti zipper kind of.Yeah.Exactly.What's adding the 15 bucks?Is it this little handle?I think it's just the construction of the zippers.Expensive to make.Yeah.I prefer it to be waterproof too.I'm going to test this out.Interesting.This is the first time we've been interacted with.Yeah.This zipper is completely fine.I think so.Yeah.This is a good zipper.That I would replace.Oh, the cooler zipper.That was fine to open.It's like is it worth 15 bucks to have a really big zipper?I don't think so.I don't know.I'll keep talking since we're doing some demo stuff.Yeah.We're doing some product development.I just zipped up the cooler.I mean, this zipper is good.Yeah.Yeah.So I think we'll probably keepit and keep the cost cheaper.It'd be more.It's more.I think it's more of an aesthetic thing.I think it's an aesthetic thing too.I think it's an aesthetic thing because it's that.If you're watching this, let us know what you think.Yeah.This thing's cool too.I mean, there's nothing wrong with this.So if you could negotiate, you know,a better price, it's probably fine.If you're watching on YouTube, we're showing it.Yes.No, any zipper manufacturers lower your price manufacturer.Why is this $15?I could see aesthetically this would be sharp.It is sharper.I think it's definitely sharper.I think aesthetically this, could it not be offered as anupgraded option or is it one of those things?Yes, the whole dogs are cooler though.Well, I'm wondering, could you offer both options?Probably.Yeah.Like have.We could have some with theupgraded zipper and see how it goes.Maybe we'll pre-sale it.If it was me, I would do that.But it's just not like peoplearen't buying it for the zipper.No.So it's hard to advertise.This one's $15.It's just like, excuse me.Yeah.I got this cooler and I love it.And the zipper is probablysomething no one ever talks about.You know, I've got an igloobackpack cooler and I do like it.But it's pretty vanilla.The last thing I'm concerned about are the zippers.I'm more concerned about the fit.Does it fit?Does it leak?100%.My stuff cool for a while.I don't have any of these extra,like the speaker stuff is cool.The iPhone stuff is cool.The charger I was looking on your website.You can put your phone on there and it charges.Yeah, that's amazing.It also has four built-in cables for iPhone, micro-USD.Wow.That stuff's huge.And again, I'm a lax dad guy out on the field.And then a South Florida going at the beach type of person.This cooler is awesome.Especially for the lax field,you could throw that in your wagonbecause we all have wagons.You could easily fit it in thewagon and the width of it is right.I wouldn't go any wider.It would fit vertically in our wagonand then be very, everything's accessible.Well, and you can play music on the fair.Tara has wagons now.Tara has wagons.Yeah, wagons.That's great.I'm telling you because for youth sports, which, you know,is just completely taken off travel sports and all that.Everyone has a wagon.Everyone's on the field.You could play music.Like this is an interactive experience.Or wagons on the come up.I feel like everyone has a wagon now.I mean, I'll tell you withyouth sports, everyone has a wagon.And we have two.And when we travel, even just the two of us,we went to St. Augustine a couple of weekends ago.We bring the wagons because we put all of our stuff in itto take up to the hotel room.So you're not dealing with the cartsat the hotel or you're not slipping.They're great to have.They're great.You just put everything in it.So we, yeah, wagons are definitely a thing.I feel like they're on the right.Yeah.I'd be curious to see your wagon.Because I definitely could give youfeedback on the wagon in terms of,you know, when you go to a lacrossetournament in Orlando, you go to the,what's that place we go to?The field, it's the resort.Omni.The Omni.So the fields are like a half a mile from the hotel.And you got to go down a hill and it's a hike.You got to have a wagon.And the heavier duty, if the wider the tires, it helps.100%.You know, I've got the skinny ones and they're fine,but I get a little wagon envy.But I'm already in.The thick tires are huge.I will say though, real quick to go back to the zipper.I mean, I get it.I get the aesthetic appeal of it.But for that price point, for$15, that's crazy.Cause you have to push that onto theconsumer and it would be more than $15.Probably up to 25.So you're adding $25 to theprice, the cooler for the zipper.That makes no sense.I can't justify it.No.Yet he does.You know, they're coolers with $300.So I think it's something that I couldsee down the line you guys messing with.I think so.Maybe we have a premium version.I like the idea that we could have.Premium version.Cause there are people that willbuy the premium version of anything.A hundred percent.Cause they just want the bestthing, the best of whatever it is.Right.A hundred percent.Why the hell?We don't own any yeti.Well, we own yeti cops.Yeah.Nathan owns a cooler, but no, but what Imean is people will buy the premium option.You know, so if you have four sweatshirtsand they're at four different price points,there's people that willalways buy the highest price point.For me, I'm not really a consumer.I don't really buy anything.Um, so it's always, I would buy this cooler, but it'salways surprising to see people spendlike $500 from a brand thatthey're just now hearing from today.We had a $500 order.They bought two cool coolers, some travel products.I'm like, Oh my goodness.Like they must really like the brand.Yeah.So cool.That's awesome.I mean, that's gotta feel amazing.Especially after now going through two rebranding.You know, we're on the chappy brand.Then we went to cool your brand.Now the terror brand.To see that the brand's cohesiveness and identity isstarting to resonate with customers is reallyrewarding.That's cool.I like Tara.It kind of feels like an outdoorsy word.Yeah.Yeah.It makes me feel like camping or something.It's like a Terraform or Terra, I think like Earth.Yeah.Yeah.I mean, I mean, I could see this at REI being sold at REI.I would, I would hope we could get into wholesale.That's been a really, really big struggle with chappy.It's been very difficult to get chappy into wholesale.Yeah.Chappy as well.All of that for the outdoor stores.Why is that?What's the resistance or friction of the barriers?So our dream store for chappy would be CVS and Walgreensbecause they sell the most chapstick.Yep.And they just, their products that they have up there aresuper well-established brands.Like when you think of front of checkout or the lip balmsection, it's like Burt's Bees.Eos, you know, by front of checkout,they have like chocolate bars and stuff.They have their thing the way they like it.And my product would have to outsell one of those massivebrands that has massive appeal.And I just don't think that they see that.So I think we have more luck in niche retailers.Hair salons love chappy.Surfshops love chappy.Yeah.The cooler, maybe we could figure it out.But again, we'd be takingshelf space from Riddick and Yeti.So I think you really have to push your brand identity sothat people go into the storeand understand what you're selling andwhat your brand is without seeing an ad.Yeah.Yeah.Have you ever done pop-ups?It's just, we probably should,but it's not a scalable thing.So I could do a pop-up and sellsome things, but it requires my time.So maybe I hire someone.It's hard to scale in a pop-up.I was going to ask you, that's one ofthe questions I have for you really is,how are you scaling this?If you think in terms of what phaseyou're in, in terms of a life cycle,where would you say you are?And how do you scale all of this?So chappy is, it grew 20% last year.And it grew 5x the year before.So it had like curve and now we're kind of like plateaued.Yep.The next play would be retail.That would be a big jump for us.Global expansion.Almost got scammed trying to do that.Oh yeah.Lots of scams.You guys got to watch out for the scammers.That's a crazy story.What happened?These guys told me, they guaranteedme like a million dollars in salesover the next three years, expanding to Hong Kong.I had a whole fake company, a bunchof fake employees based out of Israel.And they wanted 15k upfront for their marketing.And then they were going to be mydistributor in Asia and the Mediterranean.And I sent them samples and they had a whole fake review.And the whole thing was fake.They worked with other brands.Other brands were fake.The websites were fake.The reviews were fake.Their LinkedIn's were fake.Everything was fake.But a whole facade you wouldnever know until you dove into it.And yeah, they tried to get$15,000 from me and I almost did it.But you didn't.Thank God.Because there's no way to figure it out.How do you protect yourself from stuff like that?You have to do your due diligence.People are sneaky and evil and they want to harm you.And you just have to make sure that you don't allow that tohappen because it will happen.They're predators.Yeah, there's a lot of predators.And they spend all their time justobsessed with trying to scam people.It's crazy.How could you do that to someone?Why do you think you're entitled to my money?It's absolutely insane.You haven't written any checksto anybody from Nigeria, right?Not yet.Not yet.Come close.So what are the other brands you have going on?So there's four different thingsthat I do other than Chappian Terra.One is an AI app.One is my brother's a doctor, so I'mhelping him launch a supplement brand.Another one is a marketing agency.And another one is coaching e-com.So you're doing all those things right now?Yes.Do you want to say that?Do you want to plug any of those?Or are those still in thebeginning stages and you're not ready?I'm going to go somewhere further than others.So the e-com thing, I'm workingwith one of the best in the industry.His name's Nathan.And he sells a course where we helpyou become successful in dropshipping.So I'm just starting that.I'll have my first students probably next week.Very excited for that.Is that all virtual?Yeah.Yeah.So he has a prerecorded course andthen there's monthly coaching sessions.Wow.What made you get into that?Getting into that?Well, it seems like everyone that I help is better than me.I've had a friend that started amultimillion dollar gym bag companythat I helped him set up everything.One of my interns that I hired for asocial media marketing company in college,because I tried that in collegebefore I knew anything about marketing.Yeah.He became very, very successful in Amazon.So I think people that I help coach and work with do well.And it would be a fun side gig.I'm going to try it for a month and see how it goes.And hopefully I can help a little bit.I've heard and I do a lot of e-books andI've heard you should always have a mentorand be a mentor, at least partially.Yeah.So this will be fun.Yeah.For me, I think.I'm very different than what you've been doing.Very different.Yeah.Very different.It feels like a step back, but Iknow that it's going to help develop me.No, I think it's growth.You know, and it's all a well, you're creating awell-rounded experience for yourself.It should help with the marketing companyto just kind of keep establishing myselfas an expert in the field.Yeah.So the marketing company, is this your marketing company?Me and my friends.So the photographer from Terra anda good friend of mine from Tampa,and now lives in Miami.We all live in Miami.We all have great skills that businesses really need.So we've just kind of worked together.It's kind of a side project, but you know,anyone who needs help, we're here to help.And we have a really, really strong team.What's the name of the company?Specularis.Specularis?So everything that Jacob's talking about, we're going toput the links to in the description.You'll be able to find everything.Yeah.That'll be great.Yeah.So Specularis is the marketing company.And then Go Mode AI.There's the two biggest things.Well, before I do that, let metalk about my brother's thing.Very excited about his thing.He's a doctor, but he's really, really good on camera.And he gets huge audiences on TikTok Live.And he wanted to formulate a pill thathelps people that he talks to on Live.Like everyone complains about pain and stuff.So he came up with an allnatural formulation for a supplement.It's called True Motion.And we just put it intoproduction and we'll be selling very soon.True Motion.And is it for pain?Is it?It's for pain and joints and arthritis.I'm not on the medical side.Yeah.But for people listening, neither are they.So to sum it up, it's to help with pain with your joints,yes, muscle aches and pains, that type of stuff.Yep.Trying to think if I've come across as Live,because what you're saying sounds familiar.It's very possible.The same last name as you?Yep.Yeah.I think I'm, I feel like I maybe have just like, just, youknow, how you see them come up.It's very possible.Yeah.It's very possible.Yeah.Now I will.I hope to answer medical questions for everyone.Yeah.Yeah.I'll have to really keep, I'mgoing to pay some better attention.I'm going to switch him up actually.Yeah.So he's mainly on TikTok.Yeah.Yeah.He's a performer.He's awesome at getting people's attention.I can't do that stuff.I'm not, I'm not great on camera.Well, you're doing fine.You're doing pretty good for yourself overall.And then, and then what was the MPI app?Podcast is also a lot different than going on in the end.This is true.Check this out.Yeah.This is true.This is true.Tough for me.Very true.So he's a salesman.Oh, yeah.Yeah.Yeah.He's an entertainer and a salesman.Yeah.Yeah.Go mode.Go mode is an AI app where it'sgoing to be a marketplace for AI agents.So it's for entrepreneurs andstartups that want to automate their tasks,especially solo founders.So it's like, I want to start a clothingbrand or I want to start literally anything.You can tell your goal to the AI.It'll help you drill down.Why do you want to do it?What niche do you want to do it?How much do you want to make?How short of a time?I'll ask you some questions andI'll come up with a checklist for you.And then you'll be able to either do the task yourself orhave Go mode do the task for youthrough a genetic AI.And we'll be a marketplace where we don't want to be in therace of developing different agents.We want to be the connection to people's agents.So there's a bunch of different companies working on reallygreat agents for customer service,really great agents for graphicdesign, a really great agents for outreach.We want to have all those plugged intoour backend and then hold a front endwhere we store your paymentinformation, your ideal email for account sign up,your ideal password, yourbrand identity, your brand colors,how you like to speak with yourcustomers, how big of risk you like to take.We want it to know you so that it canpass this information on to AI agentsand you don't have to like,redescribe what you're doing everysingle time you have an AI agent.Wow.I think that could be like a billion dollar idea.Yeah.But really, really hard to pull off.And you guys are working on that right now?Yeah, we have the app and desktop version created.And we just did interviews for our UX guy.And we have a really promising candidate to do like,you know, really streamline UX whereyou're not wondering how do I use this?It's just super intuitive.Wow.And we're going to launch.How did you develop the app?Like who did that?
• 1:57:15
  Did you guys?My friend's dad.So the same kid, Gary, who gave me the idea of Chappy.This was his company that he's beenworking on with his dad since college.It was called Atlas.And it was basically like task, like youwrite down stuff that you want to accomplish.And then as you accomplish it,you get like, it's called Ws.It's like in game tokens and rewards.And then it's the social network.So you can see which one ofyour friends is like super dialedand doing what they say they're going to do.And then they had tried to make that work for a few years.And he asked me if I would come on board for marketing.And then we were talking about, youknow, building the ground from that,from the building the app from the ground up.And, you know, now with AI, wedon't have to make to do this anymore.We can have AI do it.So then we were like, all right,let's have AI do a perfect to do list.Wow.And then we had all the tasks andwe're like, well, AI can do these tasks.And then we're like, okay, let's make it a marketplace.And so it's kind of been forming over time as we've beenworking together over the last month.That's amazing.That's cool.So you have all these thingsgoing on and that's you're able to,at a point in your life where you candevote your time to all these projects.Yeah, no kids.It's my only thing that I do.I work, you know, 12 to 14 hours every single day.Probably not every day, but at least three days a week.And I love it.It's stressful, but it's a lot of fun.I'm thinking about selling Chappie, to be honest.Really?Probably sell like 90% of it so that Ican focus on the new brands and reinvest.I mean, but how cool though that you,this is your job is what you've created.It's crazy.It's my dream, you know, and you're 28.29 now.29.So before you're 30, you're able to support yourself off ofwhat you've invented and created.Yeah, it's strange.It's amazing.It's a dream for many people and that you've been able toaccomplish this at such a young age.It's huge.I hope you've taken time to appreciate it.And I probably, I don't know if I never will.I tried to, but I just, you know, Ilook up to Zuckerberg, Bezos, Elon.You're always challenging yourself.Like, why aren't I there?Yeah.Yeah.Well, that's probably what's part of your drive.Yeah.You know, you have insane drive, obviously.I think it's a blessing and a curse for sure.Right.I mean, you probably have to work onthe balance of, do you, do you reset?Do you have time every week where you don't touch anythingof the business and you go touchgrass basically and kind of reset?I work out a lot every day.I do five K's.I do cold plunges every day.But I would say through all ofthat work is always on my mind.Now, does your fiance help you balance?She was a hard worker too.She's, she works a lot as well.She works for the Ritz now.So she, she inspires me.I mean, she was getting her MBA upuntil she graduated like a few months ago.So, wow.She works really hard too.I mean, obviously when we go out, it's, it's nice.I get away from it sometimes.I, you know, I have a lot of fun, but Ipretty, it's pretty much always on my mind.Yeah.Everywhere.It's probably, it's in my dreams.An obsession.My nightmares.You know, what's interesting, just listening to you andyour, I know people that are serialentrepreneurs.It makes sense for you to sell chappy in some ways.You probably started it, you built it.Maybe it's time to sell it andmove on and go to the next thing.Cause you're never going to stop thinking.Right.So it's almost in not that chappy's boringin any way, but I could, I'm this way whereI get into something.I hyper focus on it.I can totally relate to what you're saying.And then I kind of get there andI'm ready to go to do something else.And it, I can see where, I can see where, I can see where, I can see wheremaybe that's your, that becomes your stick.You're a serial starter incubator developer.Sell it.Maybe I don't know.I think so.And I'm still finding out, you know, what I'm doing.Cause I'm not even sure.Hey, you know, neither are we.And we're in our, that doesn't change.I'm here.There's no, there's no thing you get.There's a finish line and there's no point you get.You're like, Oh, I know everything now.A hundred percent.It never happens.That's what I hear.It's all about the journey, right?It is.And I do try to focus on that a lot.Yeah.And, and trying to recognize whereyou're at because before you know it,you're 10 years later and you're like, wait, hold on.What did I just do?So it's, it's taking those moments to take stock.You know, it's important.Yeah, it is.And it's something I need to get better at.Just something in me just always tells me it's not shit.Yeah.To be honest for some reason.And so is that, is that a self-esteem thing do you think?Or is it just you have, so is ita belief in yourself or lack of?It's just, you know, I guess from when I was really young,I kind of had like a death, likelife is not real type of crisis.And I was just like, so what's the point of it?And I just want to make a huge impact for good.And I think that's probably what drives me.And if I feel like I'm not doing that,chappies affected a lot of people'slives, hopefully mostly in a great way.But, you know, so there's a formula Elon talks about.It's how much good have you done?And for how many people you do alittle bit of good for a ton of people.That's great.If you do a lot of good for a little bit of people,that's great.So I guess I'm just always trying tofind the way I can do the most goodand be as useful as possible.And if I feel like I'm not doing that, it drives me insane.So you're finding meaning of lifethrough this in some ways and also self-worth.Definitely.Okay.Yeah.I've never really been able to disconnect from that.All right.So then when you're not doing it,then you're kind of having to stop.You don't have that busyness in your brain.You kind of have to be present,which might be more stressful.It's always like a combination of things.So yeah, like I can detach a little bit.And that's always great.That always feels good, especially with good company, youknow, watching the Super Bowl,you know, there'll be some times, you know, the theme park,die diving.Yeah.There are ways to detach.But yeah, it's partially finding meaning through it.It's partially because I'm just obsessed with building.I love building.And I've always had expensive tastes.Like since I was a kid, I remembermy parents used to always tell me,"You have expensive taste.You're going to be in trouble."We'd go to like Chili's.I'd want like the steak or whatever.Yeah. So I know someone like that.Nathan does that too.We could be at Denny's, you know, whenhe was like 15 for breakfast or something,he'd order the steak.Yeah.It's trying to be crazy because I'mlike, dude, at the steak where at Denny's,it's not going to be that good.And it's a blessing and a curse because the blessing is,yeah, I guess you get the things you like, but the curse isnow you got to find a lifestylethat keeps up with what you like.Yeah.No, it's so true.So, and you know what also may help you balance is,I don't know if you guys are planning on starting a family.For sure.But if you do, children have a way of doing that.Oh, I bet.They do.Yeah.That's coming for sure.Yeah.They have a way of helping you get out of your own headbecause you have to because it's all about them in a way.Not that you lose yourself, but itjust is a natural thing that happensand it kind of brings some balance.I am nervous about it.I'm excited.I want to have like 10 kids.Oh boy.What does she think about that?Doesn't love the idea.She says three.That sounds more reasonable.Yeah.Yeah.It's, you know, I always tell people,I'm, I am a believer.I'm very spiritual.And so I tell people, God madeyou to be that child's parent.And so whatever you do is howit's meant to be because you'respecially made to be that child's parent.I love that.And you have to trust that.You just have to trust that no one elsecan do what you're doing with that child.Except you.Yeah.And it'll come to you.And so whatever you do will be right.It'll be okay.I love that.Yeah.That's really beautiful.Yeah.I also believe in God.I'm, I'm Jewish, but I believeoverall in, in God, not so much.And, you know, this is the only rightway, but there's definitely something more.Yeah.And that also helps with thefeeling that like, we only have this life.And what we do right now is so important.Right.The thought that, you know, there couldbe something after and hopefully there is.Yeah.And faith would make you say, yeah, there definitelyis something after this.Yeah.So that takes that pressure off.It does.I find faith to be a gift, you know, and it's up to eachperson if they choose to use it or not.But I think it's sitting there.And I think psychologically, it's ahuge outlet that people don't use.You really, it really can relieve a lotof anxiety if you give it the opportunity.Yeah.I, I try to get involved as I can.I try to pray a few times a week.Yeah.I always tell my kids, justtalk to God like he's your friend.Like, just like you would talk to your friend.There's no special thing you have to do.We're Catholic.We have all the rituals and wedon't, you have to do all the rituals.Just got something to say.You say it.I read this Passover.I feel so guilty.Well, so, okay.You have a big thing coming up this summer, right?In July.You're getting married, right?September.Oh, it's September.Okay.Okay.Sorry.I'm off by a month.Okay.So you have in the fall.Like, what the hell am I doing?What am I doing?I just totally threw you off.He's like, Oh no, what am I doing in July?Okay.So how long have you guys been engaged?We've been engaged for two years.Okay.And do you want to share when you asked her?It was July.And, but how did that go down?How did that go down?Story.Yes.Everyone loves that story.That is an awesome story.So, um, I told her I didn't want to get engaged for manyyears and I told her family that too.And I remember we were in Canada celebrating and I had tolie to all of them and say, yeah,it's going to be like two orthree years just to throw them off.Yeah.Because I didn't want, I wanted it to be a surprise.And I flew to Europe for her birthday.We're in Barcelona having a blast.And in the morning we're supposed to fly to Ibiza and Ihave someone in a car ready to pick us up,bring us to this cliff.It's like a very spiritual cliff where like all theseamazing things have happened.So they say, and the guitarist will playour song and a photographer and the 10.So it's like 4 30 a.m.in Barcelona and we wake up and we'reback in our bags to get on the plane.I get a text.Hey, I got a flat. I can't make it. I'm like, what?I'm like, excuse me.Oh, no.I had a hotel picked out for us to celebrate the five starhotel that I was going to surpriseher with.Oh my gosh.And wait, you had possessionof the ring still though, right?I did.Okay.Yeah, I had the ring, but I had no transportation.I had no plan.And I had a hotel that I had to explain.Oh my gosh.A five star hotel. That was a surprise.
• 2:09:43
  So I had a hotel. A five star hotel.That was a surprise.So we land in Ibiza and I'mtexting him like, can you rent a car?Like I'll pay for a rental.I'll pay for AAA.Anything.I know.Sorry.Sorry.Sorry.Like, how could you do that?Yeah, crazy.So still crazy to say that that happened.So get to the airport and I'm on the phone with the hotel.I'm like, listen, becausethey're going to say congratulations.Right room is decorated.Oh, listen, change of plans.We're coming.Remove everything from the room.I had like stuff set up in the room.Remove everything from the room.Oh my goodness.Make sure to tell the staff not to say anything.And so we check in and I'm like, it's a birthday gift.It's like a two week early birthday gift.Yeah.Or two days.And she was like, oh, awesome.And I sent her to the spa.And meanwhile, I'm like calling people.I'm like, can we rent the restaurant?Can we do it on the cliff?Can we do it here?Like, how do we get a guitarist?I need a photographer.End up getting the front desk to be my secret photographer,renting the rooftop of the bar.They gave me a really good deal.And they had the guitarist go up there.And I told her we had a reservation.And we go to dinner and we walk up up top.And this is like, honestly, one of the most beautifulplaces I've ever been in Ibiza.And the ocean is just split by two, like 200 foot cliffs oneach side with the sunset comingdown the middle.And it was perfect.I mean, talk about everything happened for a reason.It was so much better than the original plan.And she was completely shocked.That's the best.That is the best.You got her.I got her.Yeah.That's awesome.And then you guys called her family, I'm sure.And it was all.Face time to everyone.Face time to everyone.Yeah, it's exciting.You just pissed off a ton of men.The bar has been raised.Yeah, you just set the new bar.Where are you guys getting married?Santorini.Where?Santorini.Where is Santorini?It's in Greece.Okay, it was Greece.That's my first thing I wanted to say.So you're getting married in Greece.Yep.Santorini.And the Mediterranean.Wow.It should be very pretty.That's amazing.Yeah, we have 60 people coming out with us.Lovely.It's going to be nuts.That is lovely.And that's a perfect number of people.I feel like it's perfect.Yeah, we wanted like 50, 60.Yeah, we had 65 at ours.We got married in Vegas.Nice.We almost did that.Yeah, we did.We had the Golden Nugget Hoteland they shut down the pool area.And we had the wedding there and the reception.But we didn't want a huge wedding.We wanted it kind of intimate andwe had 65 people and it was perfect.It's perfect.I feel like it was nice.It was like everyone you went there was there.100%.Yeah.And you got to spend time just beingpresent and not greeting people all night.150 people.Yeah, yeah, yeah.There's no friends of friends of friends of friends.Right.You knew everybody.What day?Our anniversary is in September.That's why.September 25th.Okay, we're the 17th.So that's really cool.Are you guys ready?Is everything planned?Done?No.The invitations themselves took like three hours.Not three hours, three days.Yeah, I put a lot of way too much time into that.And now we have so much planning to do.There's so much to do.Especially for international.I mean, it's a lot.I guess it's probably the same here.I've never planned a wedding.Yeah, it's a lot.It's a lot.How long are you guys going to be over there?So we're doing five days in Santorini,then we're taking a ferry to Mykonos,and then we might do Oktoberfest.Oh, cool.That's cool.That would be pretty fun.Yeah, yeah, that's awesome.And the weather over there is probablyamazing in September, I would assume.I think so.I think it's supposed to be like low 80s.Yeah, definitely increase.Maybe not Oktoberfest.It might be colder.It might be colder.Yeah, assuming you're going to Germany, I would assume.Yeah, it'll be chilly.Very exciting.You got to bring a mix of clothes for sure.Yeah, no, that's so cool.I'm so excited for you guys.Tara.Thank you.Yeah.Right.Do you have any clothing inyour Tara line for cooler weather?We want to.Actually, yeah, yeah.We have the heated jacket.Yeah, we have the heated jacket.That's how we started.Oh, okay.Heated jacket.It was cool.We coolio and the cooler were separate.And then we were like, all right, let'stry to drop ship something during winterbecause no coolers are selling during summer.Smart.So we tried a heated jacket,heated socks, heated scarf, heated vest.And we had some traction with the heated vest.The hand warmers were selling on Amazon.They were selling like half a million hand warmers a month.Electric hand warmers.Normally, it's like the ones you open.Yeah, yeah, yeah.So they were ripping on Amazon.We tried to sell them.We couldn't sell any.Got a little bit of tractionwith the vest, but I mean, by then,it was like February or winter was over.So are you done with that line?Or do you saw it?We're going to bring it back.We're going to make improvements on allthe products and bring it back next winterand launch a lot earlier in seasonwhere people are buying winter gear.And, you know, we want to be a full outdoor company.It'll be cool.Oh, that's so cool.That is so cool.It's fun.And that's another thing I could seewith travel sports on the sidelines.Everyone wears a vest.I could see the heated.You should try to market some ofthe stuff to travel to youth sports.Travel parents.Yeah, we saw it when we were shooting the heated vest.We were in Miami.Oh my gosh.Very hard to continue.We had to be on the snow.I've never felt so dumb in my life, to be honest.I went to the football stadium park there that they have.And I'm in a heated vest, a snow cap, like jeans.It is like 90 degrees.Everyone's looking at me like nuts.Yeah.And I have the vest turned on.So I'm really getting hot and I'm oncamera trying to sell this thing like it's cold.And I'm just sweating.How could you?I'm sure you had sweat dripping.Yes.Yeah, it was tough.It's a tough.That was a tough thing to do.We're going to have to fly up north.I was going to say next time you visit her family.Yeah. Just bring everything with you.I ended up doing that like late February.So we'll have the content for next year.Yeah, that's good.That's good.Do you have any before I ask my last question?Just to go back, you mentioned you cold plunge every day.What are you using for a cold plunge?I'm about to do a DIY on it.I use a gym.I go to it's at my gym.Okay.It's called Anatomy in SouthBeach and they have two plunges.One's at 45 and one's at 35.Okay.He's obsessed.They're awesome.I was doing it religiously in thewinter because I would just hop in the pool.And that was great.But then it's heated up.But actually, I think I'm going to do a DIY.I'm buying a chest freezer.Yeah.And I'm going to probably do that.I've seen those.Where they seal them up and use them.Yeah, that would be sweet.I want one of those.When I get a house, I'mdefinitely going to get one of those.As I said, as long as you make it look nice on the outside,you got to build something.Yeah.I just don't want it to look like a freezer.Yeah.One of the things that comes tomind is when I'm cold plunging,I'm with you that I never stop thinking.I never stop thinking.That's why I don't sleep wellbecause I just think and it's not all bad.It's just I've got stuff on my mind.For sure.When I cold plunge, if it's cold enough, I get there.I can turn off the senses.Do you feel that at all?Are you still?It's crazy.It's like I can pair the pain tothe pain I go through and work.So it just ties right back to work immediately.I'm like, I can get through this pain.I can get through work pain.So I'm still thinking about where I'm still thinking.Same with running.I'll be running and just dying.And the thought process is if I canget through this, I can get through work.So your brain is not setting down.What's causing you the pain though at work?What?I work a lot.It's horrific.What's that?It's horrific.But what is it though?Like I'll give you an example.Yeah.Of how bad things can go.So.I have to be careful with names and leave names out.Yeah, of course.So we sell seasonal chappies and we havewinter collections and holiday collections.And in December, peak season,a TV show reaches out and says,"Hey, we would love to have you for April."And I'm like, yeah, okay, let's do it.I say, this is what I have in stock.This is my winter collection.And I won't have any like Easter spring colors for April.Can you guys accept this?And it's like ugly Christmassweater, cotton, candy cane, and snowflakes.And, you know, all very, veryChristmas winter stuff for April.They say this.They save $60,000 worth of inventory thatI don't sell during peak season for this.April comes around.We're about to air.Spent like two weeks building the site with the team.Two days before they're like,"Hey, these are Christmas colors."This is spring and Easter.We're canceling your sale.Oh my gosh.Cancel the sale.And now I'm stuck with $60,000 worth of winter stuff.And, you know, a lot of thesebulk purchases I take out loans for.So I'm carrying the interest now for ayear because I can't sell it in spring.Oh my gosh.And to me, I was like, no, like you're not doing this.We're going to figure it out.So I sent them an option for us to doour spring colors that I had coming in.So the show is April 14th.And then my spring colors were coming in like April 20th.Or I'm sorry, this is March, right?Yeah, March.So the show was March 2nd and my collectionwas supposed to come in like end of March.And I'm like, if I rush overnight, shipit and spend an extra two and a half grand,I can get it here in time.They said, yes, show went on.So now I've lost half of my inventory for summer.Now I have to buy more inventory for summer and I stillhave $60,000 worth of winter inventory.Yeah, this stuff, this is all on my birthday, by the way.Yeah, I'm screwing up the dates bad.My birthday is March 29th.So the show was April 2nd.And the inventory was supposed to come in mid-April.And you got it there by April 2nd?Yeah, you asked how could work be that bad.My manufacturer tells me everythingwill be there the day of the sale.Day of the sale comes in.I have everything except for three colors.That is literally half of all orders.Oh my goodness.I'm like, Ziv.Yeah.You told me you're sending everything.I can't ship orders if I don't have everything.I'll have to refund half the sale.So then I have to tell the TV show that Idon't have these orders and I have to geta message approved for customers.I have to overnight ship another batch, spend anothercouple thousand, get that stuff over.Like by the time this is all over, I'm going to break evenand just still be out of inventory.What you're describing is just the pure chaos of running abusiness and being an entrepreneurand having to deal with buyers andsellers and customers and the whole thing.It's a lot.I get it.Yeah.It's a lot.It's a lot and that's why I run until my heart explodes.Yeah.Yeah.Because so much is also out of your control.So yes, for sure.But Jackal Williams has that book, Extreme Ownership.I love that book.I've never heard of that book.I mean, the moral of the story isthere's nothing out of your control.Oh, interesting.Everything is your fault.Oh really?Is that a Bezos line of thinking as well?Do you know?Because if you read anything about the early days ofAmazon, his whole focus was the customer,no matter what the customer.And he would do things where theywouldn't make money just to satisfy the customer.So he's playing that continuous long game.100%.I wish I need to become more customer focused.Sometimes I'm too focused on the business side.But yeah, I mean, the line of thinking islike, it doesn't matter what happens to you.There's always something you could have done.So in my situation, I could have confirmed with them.Are you sure?Like I could have, and I didn't want to do that because Ididn't want them to go back on it.But again, that's something I should have done maybebecause I should have anticipated that.And I should have, you know, maybe had a packing list withmy manufacturer where they could havechecked off everything I told them to send, you know, likethere's always, and then you also,it's also powerful because not only doyou have to take ownership over everything,but you can also really, when you putthings that seem out of your control,because it does seem it's like I didn't do anything.Everyone else is screwing me over.Right.But when you put things in thatlens of everything is preventable,you can start to think abouthow you could have prevented it.Yeah.Have you ever heard of Carl Jung?So he has a theory of the internal locust of control andthe external locust of control.And the internal locust of control is where you are incontrol of your happiness, your reactionsto life. And the external locust ofcontrol is everything else going around you.You react to whatever's going on around you, and thatgauges your happiness and contentment in life.Does that make sense?So what you're talking about is, if I'munderstanding correctly, is the importanceof having an internal locust of control.For sure.And not reacting to this manufacturer andthat TV show and all that, but figuring out,okay, I'm going to go inward and figure out all thesetentacles. What could I have done?What do I have?Yeah. What could I have done or whatcan I do to control each of these things?100%.Each of these situations.So even though there's sometimes there's things you justcan't, no matter what you do.100%.You can't. But at least like you gave some examples.You can start to figure out what you could have done.Yeah. So I'm sure you learned from that.Yeah. I mean, what is the lesson there? A few things.After a while though, it's like, how many lessons, right?It's like, okay, I got it.Dude, on my birthday too.So I just, I mean, not only did that inventory get stuck,but I just lost all the profit and salesthat would have been. So you know, most times it by two.Yeah.Because it's both the negative and I didn't get thepositive. So the Delta is like,was like 140k on my birthday.
• 2:25:15
  I'm supposed to go to abirthday dinner. I had to text all my friends.Hey guys, I'm like devastated.
• 2:25:20
  Honestly, I was devastated.I'm sure.A lot of money.I'm sure.It's a lot. Yeah. It's a lot and out of nowhere.Was that recent?Yeah. It was.Was that just this past birthday?My birthday was March 29th. Yeah.Oh man.A couple weeks ago.A couple weeks ago.That sucks.Yeah, but the sale went on and we made good profit.There you go.Okay.Good.Yeah.Yeah.Two things early. That book there talks, that's the CarlJung book that you're referencing rightthere.Yeah. The one at the end of the cast.What's, you've had some lessons, right? What would you sayis your number one or two big ones thatyou've learned in your entrepreneurial days?It's a good question.The biggest thing is faith.I think faith is so powerful.When you have faith that you'llfigure it out, things will get better.You have potential that you can do it.I think that changes everything.And I think when you start to lose that faith, that's,that's when you start to lose control overwhere your life goes.So keeping the faith that you can figure it out is massive.And you got to hold on to that foryour life because it is tested a lot.Yeah.And the other one kind of goes online.It's just never give up just no matter what.Just keep pushing.How do you hold on to continuing to believein yourself and not care about what anybody,what others think and just continue focusing on your dream?I just, people have always been supportive.People always think it's cool and get inspired by it.So I've never been worried about that.And in terms of like getting myself out there on socialmedia, I have not been as successful.I worry a lot about what people think in videos, mostlybecause they're up there pretty much forever.And then people just judge you.Right.And I'm still working on that.Yeah.But I think it's important not to care what people think.Yeah. It's kind of letting go in a way of eagerness. Yeah.It's kind of letting go in a way of ego and knowing yourintention of what you're putting out thereis real and authentic and coming from a good place.And so you're just going to put it out there and whateveranyone decides to do with it is none ofyour business.It's just you're putting out there and then it's theirs.A hundred percent.So it really has nothing to do with you anymore.And whatever they decide, they're justprojecting from what's inside of themselves.So if they judge you, that's coming from their bad place,but it has nothing to do with you.Yep.Does that make sense?It does.Yeah.Yeah.I try to keep that in mind.Yeah.It has nothing to do with you.That's them.I think I judge myself too.Well, yeah.I see myself on video and like, oh,I talk funny, you know, or something.Yeah.Yeah.It's part of getting past that.That's part of believing.It's ego.And it's part of believing in yourself too.And it's part of your brand andthe culture you're trying to create.It also needs you there to be, to show up.It needs you to show up.That's been really hard for me.Yeah.Yeah.Especially for Chappie because it's like a female audienceand it's really a female product.And then to have a guy come.Yeah.Just I'm not the right face for Chappie.For Tara, I'll probably get a little better at it.Yeah.I guess so.You know, I think that I think you have it in you.I definitely think that youcould sell this to women for sure.Especially if you cover all different bases, like girls intheir twenties that are goingto Pilates or going to the gym orgoing to the beach, going on the boat.And then you have a whole group of moms and that's a wholefamily, the way it ties into family.You know, so it's more, you know, not seeing them asnecessarily like females and relatingto female, but relating to where they're at in their livesand how Chappie can help themin the stage of their life.And that can be men or women,but you're saying most of your.It's like Chappie is like 90% women.Yeah.Yeah.I could see that.We just came out with a carbon fiber Chappie though.So well, there you go.I was like, what's happy with I use?Yeah.Yeah.Well, I mean, Chapp's that those things melt for guys too.It's not like it only.I mean, this is this is part of the product line.Yeah.And this is awesome.I love the bottles.I wish we did like a straw or a chugger cup cap.The cap.So these water bottles talk aboutlessons through entrepreneurship.You know, we had the Chappies.We had the OG, the plus and the pro.And I was like, all right, let's do a water bottle.And I was thinking, let's make thewater bottle look like the Chappie.So it's all on brand.Yeah.But there's no straw and the thing clacks a lot.And, you know, I just there's things I could have donebetter and I bought 2000 of them.So I've had them for a long timeand they're really a slow seller.So now we do buy a hundred bucks worthof Chappies, get a free water bottle.A lot of people love the water bottle for its simplicity.They love that it doesn't leak.It keeps things cold for a long time because it's big.And there's a lot of great things about the water bottle.I mean, it's the only one I use.The fact that it doesn't leak.You know what I also like is I'venever seen one like this this size.This is big.Yeah.It's pretty custom.Yeah.No, this holds a lot.And, you know, speaking as a woman,we have our emotional water bottles,emotional support water bottles we take everywhere with us.And we want it to hold a lotbecause we're constantly drinking.So if it's like one of those smallerones, you're always having to refill it.A hundred percent.Where this actually you could say, okay, yeah, I could,this will last me for what I'mdoing for the next three hours.And because there's no like crazystraw or sipping cup or anything,it's really, really easy to clean.You know, like you have a really clean bottle.Yes.Yes.And you can throw it in a bag.The no leaking is huge.Can't tell you how many things I bought that leaked.It ruins everything.So I love it.You know, I can't wait to use this.So many of these too.I get these from vendors.You know, it's got their logo onit and stuff and they are small.Yeah.And they it's like, okay, three sips and you're done.You're having to find another refill.No, this size is awesome.How many ounces is this?It's a liter, I think 64 ounces or something.Yeah.32 something like that.Maybe 32 ounces.Does it hold vodka?Well, I'm sure it does.Yeah, you can probably fit a bottle in here.That's what the women want.Yeah.Or some white wine.Depending on the day.Yeah, I'm sure you could put a750 milliliter bottle in there.For the bottle.Why not?I would say, I mean, it feels likethis stuff should just sell itself.The whole concept of the melting chapstick is to me is big.The other, the tin you werementioning to hold your deodorants and stuff.It's such a utility.The pro.Yeah, it's such a utility.Makeups not cheap.I know that makeup is not, he doesn't know.Makeups not cheap.And you don't see it all.So you have like expensive lipstick and it's ruined.That's devastating.100%.And it mostly happens in the car.So the pros really good at being in the car.Yeah.Yeah.Have you, have you gone to IWS here down in Deerfield?I used to work there.Oh, really?As an intern.Have you shown them chappy?No, I should though.You totally should.I know.There's another one.There's too much going on.Sometimes I'm like, I'm working on too much.Yeah, no, it's true.It's true.But that definitely.I should definitely get an IWS.You should for sure.And there's another one in Boynton that everyone goes to.That one's cool.Right on A1A.Oh, there's one in Boynton?Yeah, not an IWS.It's a different shop.Nomad.I've been to Nomad.I tried to get in there.Yeah, you tried?No luck.But I tried, I don't know,right when I started the company.Come on, Nomad.Local guy.Come on, Nomad.Let's go.And also IWS.You worked there.Come on.I know.You know, I can totally see this atthe cash register that when you pay,I could see that that would fitin perfect and the water bottles.100%.You were right up there with the chapstick.Someone buys the chapstick.They're going to buy this.Yeah, absolutely.Did you have any other questionsbefore I asked my last question?I think I'm good.Yeah, he gets mad because I go right into my last question.He's like, I had more questions.So now I check.I think I'm good.Okay.So my last question is always,where do you see yourself in five years?Good question.Kids, probably in Boca with a house.I can't wait to watch this in five years.Hopefully running a tech startup.And Tara, that would be the goal and close to family.Those are great goals.Yeah.Those are wonderful goals.Like just close family, financiallyindependent, and pursuing my dream.You know, that's wonderful and appreciating it.Yes.And recognizing it.Hopefully.Yeah, we'll see.Five more years.Every year I tell myself, you know, soon.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Hopefully maybe in five years, you'll see it.I hope so because you should be so proud of yourself.It's amazing what you've accomplishedand it's such a young age and what you'vedone, your experiences between SpaceXskydiving and Hawaii, working for NASA,the things you did at UCF andhonestly figuring out or discovering yourinterests in high school.Very few people do that.You know, a lot of kids just go tocollege and they still don't know whatthey want to do with the fact thatyou in the drafting class, you were ableto find such passion.You know, it's such a journey and you're still so young.So, you know, I'm going to say you're doing a great job.Even if you don't say to yourself, you've done aphenomenal, phenomenal job in life.Thank you.Honestly, you really have.And it's very impressive.I do my best.My proudest accomplishment is my fiance.And that's, there you go.You know what's funny?Good man right there.What's funny to me is you said you're not much of aconsumer, but everything you justdescribed, you're going to be a consumer.Yeah.With the wife, the kids.Yes.Get ready buddy.I'll be a consumer.Oh yes.Especially with children that just never ends.So, and we would love to have you back on in three years,five years, and kind of do a check-inand see where you're at, you know,and where your life is at for sure.That'd be fun.Yeah.I'm looking forward to it.So thank you again.Yeah, this has been great.Thank you guys so much for having me on.Of course.Thanks for coming.Yeah.And we will put links to Chappie, links to Tara, links toeverything in the description.We'll put it on the screen for YouTube off and on.So for our listeners who are interested,you can find where you can buy all of theproducts that Jacob has made and the newthings he's working on and all of that.So yeah.And please leave us any questions or comments.We love to hear from you.And we will see you next time.Bye.Bye guys.