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Lifetime of Life Lessons Chaim Sieger’s Legacy of Leadership · None of Your Business Podcast

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It's not every day you get to sit with a legend, someone who
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was considered the OG in the industry.
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Actually, the first Test I failed, not sorry to say,
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because of all those people who failed tests, don't feel bad.
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The first one was marrying my wife, but the second best
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decision was to go back to work. You inspired many people, myself
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included, when I was younger and I was like, you know, in my teen
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years I already knew then I want to be in healthcare.
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I treat every employee, if it's in the kitchen, housekeeping,
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nursing, it doesn't matter. I treat them like they're
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family. Money is means a lot but it's
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not everything. Quality of life is much more
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important. None of your.
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Business Oshi. None of your business, Michael.
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It's the None of Your Business podcast hosted by Michael
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Anoshi. Welcome back everybody to
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another amazing episode of the None of Your Business Podcast.
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We're glad you're here. Please don't forget to
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subscribe, comment, get involved.
1:04
We are produced by the Prime Source team and we're excited
1:07
every day to be part of your journey and you being a part of
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ours. You know, I always wondered
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who's better off someone that owns 3 nursing homes or someone
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that owns 30 nursing homes? And I think in this episode when
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we introduce Heim Zieger, we are going to find out what it's like
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to own 3 nursing homes, but not just for a couple of years, for
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over 40 years. Crazy.
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Anything in life that you do for over 40 years is significant and
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somebody to operate for that long and to stick to just three
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facilities and not be at 50 a hundred at this point, there's
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got to be a certain strategy behind.
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It and as we'll see soon, he sticks to the same car as well
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and it's gonna be fun to watch check it out.
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It's not every day you get to sit with a legend, someone who
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was considered the OG in the industry, someone who could tell
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us what was the nursing home industry like before I was born.
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I'm sorry to put an H on you, but introducing replying seeger,
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please. You could just give us a quick
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introduction of who you are, as much information or as little
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information as you'd like. OK, I'm I started that my job as
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a bookkeeper in the new Vanderbilt nursing home in 1974.
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Wow, that's Mr. Schoen. Yes, Mr. Shawn.
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Henry Shawn. No, no, his father-in-law was
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the owner, Mr. Heisler. And from bookkeeping slowly,
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yeah, I learned the business and so forth and so on.
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And my father name was Michael Tenenbaum, and he had several
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nursery homes. And the famous.
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Michael Tanner OK and and actually he saw something in me
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that I didn't know I have to be an administrator.
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So he made me take a course which you had to those days it
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needed only a high school diploma and I had a high school
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diploma and I went to take the course, 100 hour course.
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And then I took the test. Actually the first Test I
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failed, yes, not sorry to say because of all those people who
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failed tests. Don't feel bad.
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It happens. It happens to all of us and and
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the future could be even better. So the the second time I took
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the test, I passed and I became an administrator.
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So we had a nursing home called Leiden Nursing Home and I became
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the administrator at the age of 22.
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Wow, that's very young. Yeah, it's young, but right,
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People do it when they're young too.
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Anyway, so the story is I was administrative and I definitely
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didn't feel comfortable being an administrator of a nursing home
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at 22. But I had good people.
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I hired good people, good book bookkeeper and good DNS.
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Every department, at least I had that talent to pick out who's
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good or not. And we worked that out and for
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good 15 years we ran light nursing and we did quite well.
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Then all of a sudden the regulations started to change
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and became more stricter and I was grandfathered in because my
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rooms were like 80 square feet and they needed 100 square feet
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for a room. And driving to work one day, I
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saw two blocks down a nursing home going up.
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From scratch for a building and. Launch at 280 beds facility.
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So I figured 280 beds for brand new facility, but the new
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regulations and everything, how can I compete with 120 bed old
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nursing home? So I did my research and I found
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out that these people who I know are building next, you know,
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three blocks away. So the first thing I did and
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have a meeting with them. So you learn in business, you
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don't show your vulnerability, how much you need it.
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So I was playing a little bit hardball and so forth till I
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came up with this idea. I'm going to sell this nursing
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home real estate and transfer 120 patients.
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The first day I opened up. So you don't start off with
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seven patients and build it up and you have to pay rent and
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your costs are going up. I started off with 120 patients,
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which was a big thing for them because they can only collect
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the full rent only after 100 patient gun comes in.
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So I was a asset to them too and it worked out a good deal.
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And that's how we got this 280 bed facility.
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So we ran it for quite a few years.
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We filled it up and was everything was so so working out
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with the regulations. Later on my son-in-law took over
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and ran the nursing home very good, kept it going and I
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started to feel like I don't have to come in every day
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anyway. So we started to be like a semi
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retired. So we've learned to 12:00 and
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then I was an Uber driver for my wife the rest of the time.
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So with the time came in, my son-in-law, thank God turned in,
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went into dialysis and home health care.
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And after 15 years or 20 years working there, he said I can't
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do all three, it's too much to do dialysis and this.
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So I listen to you. You did a good job while you
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were here and now I have to make a decision.
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Hire administrator or take my old license and go back out of
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retirement was one of my best decisions that I made.
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The first one was marrying my wife, but the second best
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decision was to go back to work. So I had what to do and I
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started being more active and that made me feel better,
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younger, stronger, healthier and no more Uber drivers.
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She takes a Uber. Driver, now you're a busy man.
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Can't be. I can't do both right?
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Right. So she is learned to use the
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real Uber and slowly but surely we build it up to a Five star
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facility for the last five years, which is very hard.
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Anybody in the nursing home industry would know Five Star is
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really the top. Especially in New York.
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In New York. And we're not talking about
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Google five star, we're talking about Department of Health Five
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Star, yes. So you have to have like 5
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categories at least 5-4 and 5:00 and 4:00.
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So we did everything. Staffing and survey was 0
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deficiencies and the first year was like a shock.
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You know, it's doing very good. So then we learned five Star
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nursing home is not just your five star.
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Everybody wants to come to your nursing home.
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So my census went up drastically to a point of 280 beds.
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We did 27275. Wow, which was very good,
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extremely well. Then the insurance company and
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you'll how do you find a nursing home in New York that the
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insurance goes down, they're all going up, more claims, more
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other problems. Thank God it worked out very
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well that the insurance company came down like with $50,000 a
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year. The next year, another 25
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instead of going up and the other nursing homes.
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So prices come down. People want to deal with you,
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but the biggest thing is everybody from around the county
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or Brooklyn, Queens wants to come to this nursery.
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So we started being full and I always told my admissions,
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people believe me. Being full is very good, but has
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its disadvantage too. What's that?
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The hospital wants to send you patients and you can't take
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them. You're turning them down.
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They turning him down and they're the families wanted so
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they have a problem because they don't get paid if they're a
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certain amount of days they have to get the patient out otherwise
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they. Right.
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The hospital stops getting paid after a certain amount of days,
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so they want to get him out right away.
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Yeah, they want. You're holding them back.
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You're costing them money. And all of a sudden the families
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are saying you wanted me out, but I want to go to the New York
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Center, I want to go to this nursing home.
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So it was a little bit like till they found out it's true, I'm
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full. What do you want me to do?
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So it worked out that I said to admissions, don't worry by
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Monday you'll have two or three vacancies, tell them you'll fill
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them. Don't worry, you'll take the
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patient and usually over a weekend you lose a patient or
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two when you're 280. It happens the older patients,
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sick patients. So, so as as we're sitting here
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today and being when this convention that I'm coming to.
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First time coming to you can. No, it's the second time.
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Two years ago, I was here too. The first time I came, I took my
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son. He came into the business.
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I said I'm taking you to E cap, which I never go and never come
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for two reasons. One reason, you'll see all the
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new vendors, you'll see all the new gadgets out there.
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Maybe you can use it. That's the reason why it's made
10:40
for. But the second reason is more
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important than the first. When we landed, I took him to
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the other part of the airport and I told them, I need one
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thing. You have to promise me never do
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what I'm going to show you now. And he looked at me like, what
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could it be in the airport? What does it have to do with the
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nursing home? I told them, you see these
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planes, all these private planes, they came to this place
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with a private plane. Never do I ever want to see that
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from you. Never mind a waste of money.
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You want to fly business by business.
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You're coming from Lakewood from here, from there with private
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just promised me that then the trip was worth it.
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Well, because you don't splurge for nothing.
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Waste of money. Waste of money.
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Well, she your story matters. Let's talk is the slogan for our
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newest sponsor, the Serenity Center, which is a clinic for
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therapy and many other types of services that people need for
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mental health challenges. And I have to tell you that I
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did not want them to be a sponsor of ours until I tested
11:45
them myself. And I sat down as a session paid
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by my insurance with the leader, Mordecai Weinberger.
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This person who has a radio show, he has live Zoom
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conferences with hundreds of thousands of people tuning in
12:00
every single week. The reason why they do is
12:02
because he is amazing. I sat with him for over an hour
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and I got the most out of it. And let me tell you, I did a lot
12:10
of talking, he did a lot of listening.
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And I learned that the Serenity Center is a clinic that provides
12:15
a service for a therapy that's led and supervised by Mordecai
12:20
Weinberger. And I see why they're so
12:22
successful. And it's just something that,
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you know, we need to mention more of.
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And I want the community of Rockland County and even beyond
12:29
to know that if you need therapy, don't wait and push it
12:32
off because it might be too expensive or you may not be
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aware of the perfect therapist. Go to Serenity center, try them
12:39
out. Insurance will most likely cover
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most if not all the charges and you will get top level service.
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Sounds like a no brainer to me. What else should you do with
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that money? Help other people with that.
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You can give suckers you can. There's plenty things to do than
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to fly for two hours with a private plane that you came with
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a private plane. So that message, thank God.
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You ever flew one applied? I flew Sandy.
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I was in Florida and Sandy hit New York.
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It just left Florida and I had your side and I was there.
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But who knew that it's going to last so long And all of a sudden
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I had your side, Chavez and I, I didn't have even my shoppers
13:21
clothing. So I called a friend, a hitch
13:26
fund friend. I said I'm in trouble.
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The airlines are not flying till Thursday and who knows how much
13:32
longer. She said, don't worry.
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He gave me a number, a name. And just like I would say
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anybody who flies business class, let's say to Israel, very
13:43
hard to go back to coach. It's just.
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Once you get accustomed to the fine things in life, it's very
13:48
difficult. So it was a but I had to do it
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because I had to be back for the your side.
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So we flew fly. We flew with a private plane.
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And I want to tell you something.
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It's very hard not to do it again, but I don't do it.
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I did it. Yeah.
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So I, I, I got the taste of it, but I control myself.
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That's definitely not the right way to bring up a family or
14:13
friends of but what it can cause.
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So that's where I am. So I saw the 1974.
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I was, I was out of the business of day-to-day operations in the
14:27
2000, but I came back. You came back.
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I'm curious, how did you transition from being an
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administrator in the building? Your father-in-law gave you that
14:36
job. He encouraged you to take the
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the the certification to become an administrator and you got
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that job. How did you suddenly become the
14:43
owner of that facility? How did that happen?
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With the years I had, there was a partner there, owner there
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names are not important part of the family.
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And he also was getting a little older and he said that you know,
15:00
I want to sell it and my father had a part of it and the his
15:04
part I bought. So I got my father's part and
15:08
his part. So I became the owner from the
15:10
administrator. Where did you get the money to
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to buy? It my father-in-law.
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Oh, so he helped you? So your father.
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Helped you with half the money of the price he he owned.
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So he gave me his half plus the other half was it was those days
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a nursing home bed went for about $2000 stop it $2000 a bed
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and today certain people are getting $300,000 a bed.
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So all our places that we had and we had less than $5000 a
15:43
bit. I have to just say replying
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congratulations to what you've done so far.
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It's amazing. I love hearing this story and
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thank you for telling your son two years ago to come.
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And now I understand why when I offered him a private jet back
15:55
to New York, he said no, no, I'm just kidding.
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But I, I just want you to know I met him then two years ago and
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we spoke, we spoke and nice guys.
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You guys became a client from that.
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So yes. So thank you for that and for
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tonight, thank you that's. Where we met, that's where we,
16:08
that's where. We originally met and tonight we
16:09
got Ribisi who got you up here. So we, we really appreciate you
16:12
coming in. I think he should come into the
16:14
broadcast because how do they ever admit you see?
16:17
You see, you see was one of our first guests of our.
16:20
Party he was. He was one of the Trail Blazers
16:22
of this podcast. This story for today OK last
16:25
night we're sitting and eating and all of a sudden you know my
16:29
wife and my son and the wife went to get food you know plate
16:35
it was sure they went to get the place and the table is empty.
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All of a sudden this guy comes down sits down I said I have no
16:43
problem you're sitting here but they're going to come back so
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don't worry I'll get out so it says who are you so it says well
16:53
if you don't know me by face it says what you know who I am and
16:58
he we started to talk and we started to have fun we lasted
17:02
for two hours. Who knows more people in this
17:06
place and I text a few people. You better say no when you come
17:12
here and visit here. And he had original in the
17:15
beginning was pretty close, but then all of a sudden he took.
17:19
Off. Then you realize it's not the
17:20
80s anymore, no. By the way, I'm shocked to learn
17:24
that you and UC Cherns only just met.
17:27
I mean. Last.
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Night I I I thought this was a joke no no I thought you guys
17:30
know each other for years the way you guys were talking to one
17:32
another I. Want to say something?
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I have AI have everybody has a lot of friends, Good, bad, ugly.
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Don't you know what? They're friends.
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I always was looking for a friend.
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That is that's my level of friendship.
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I'm sometimes a too good a person and they get burned and
17:50
then you have a person that brags, Then you have a person
17:53
that doesn't again or whatever. This guy was a all around guy.
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I zapped him, he zapped me. It was so good that he made my
18:04
trip here worth everything. You made your one connection
18:07
here. This was a success for you.
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Yes. Yes.
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By the way, Han, I want you to know, And Michael's probably a
18:11
little surprised because I'm wearing this fancy suit, right?
18:14
And I'm wearing it for you, OK? I feel like this is a a big
18:18
moment because Michael, you don't know this.
18:20
I'm wearing my black button. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
18:22
OK, go ahead. I know Hi, I'm for many, many
18:26
years. He doesn't know me very well.
18:28
I was a little boy growing up and I remember him in the Shrull
18:32
where where I davent OK my father davent in the Shrull and
18:35
he davent there as well. And he always had this
18:39
eloquence. He always had this class when he
18:41
carried himself, when he walked around with his fancy bechashaw,
18:44
the beautiful designed bechashaws.
18:46
I remember and I also remember that you always had the nicest
18:51
car in the driveway like you. You can always count on what
18:54
heims you could driving these days, you know so and you're
18:57
also a nice person, like you were friends with everybody.
19:01
You you didn't have this ear about you that you know, you're
19:03
not good enough. I can't talk to you not talking.
19:05
You're not good enough to talk to me.
19:06
Like you're pleasant, you're really nice and fun fact which
19:10
people may not know about you is you're an avid tennis player.
19:13
You've been playing tennis for a very, very long time.
19:16
So that's one of your passions. Do you still get to play?
19:18
Do you still do it? Yes, I just did it today too.
19:21
Over here. Here but but the but now I need
19:24
the pro to teach me again get back into everything.
19:28
But it was a passion and and Sundays and I used to go to I
19:33
live in Sunday in the summer I go to Monte.
19:36
I have a house there and I played tennis there.
19:40
So the beginning was hard you know but that then that's
19:44
realizing better to play with four people than two.
19:47
He cuts down your your running some of them.
19:51
Yeah. So tennis was is a good spot for
19:54
me. It keeps me a little bit in
19:56
shape because you have to run a little.
19:58
You have to bend down a little bit, you know, otherwise you're
20:00
lazy. Yeah, it's tough.
20:02
Time you inspired many people, myself included, when I was
20:06
younger and I was like, you know, in my teen years, I
20:09
already knew then I want to be in healthcare.
20:12
You know why? Because the guys like you guys
20:15
like Matthew Ornstein, guys like Mandy Gold, these guys were in
20:18
the business when it was not so hip to do it.
20:21
Not everybody was in the business back then.
20:23
And it just seemed like they were very passionate about what
20:27
they were doing. And, and it was like a little
20:29
small community of people that I knew I wanted to be a part of
20:31
it. And you didn't know then, but
20:33
the younger generation, guys like me, we were watching, we
20:36
were observing. And look what happened today.
20:38
I mean, look around. Are you shocked by how many
20:40
people, how big this has gotten this industry?
20:42
I tell you I don't brag about it because don't get you anywhere,
20:47
but I took my wife along for the first time to this occasion, so
20:54
and my son so she was shocked sitting by any meal.
21:00
How many people come by and say those words.
21:03
I don't want it to get to my head or anything, but I did a
21:08
shit up with my younger son and went to see the platoonium.
21:12
You know, you go with the hussy with the voice.
21:14
Yeah, the other side's family. Other.
21:16
Side's family. So I walk in and I said, oh, I
21:18
said, oh, you're the he's above of them.
21:20
It's the same thing like us. And he said you're, I said to
21:24
him, oh, you're the, you're the. You're.
21:27
He said what? You don't know me, that this is.
21:32
I said no, I know your name and I didn't know you.
21:35
She said you whenever you pass me, you say you're Chavez, you
21:39
say hello. I was sure you know who.
21:43
Like you were my friend. Because I feel I really the same
21:46
thing in the nursing home. I'll get to it.
21:48
I feel being nice to somebody who's tall, short, fat, ugly,
21:54
actually poor, rich, you're a human being, right?
21:58
And it doesn't cost to be nice. It doesn't cost you money.
22:01
It doesn't. Even you could be a guilty
22:03
honor, but when it comes to this be.
22:07
Nice. You're, you're an anomaly in
22:08
this way. I wish everybody was like that.
22:10
But there are people who they get to a certain status in life
22:13
and they just feel more distant from other people.
22:16
And you're not one of one of those people.
22:19
I'm very curious, very curious about this.
22:22
You have been doing this for, I don't know, 40 years, 50 years
22:25
are a freaking long time you're doing this for you have not
22:29
expanded. Like you're not somebody that
22:31
owned 40 nursing homes, 70 nursing homes.
22:33
And today you see that much more commonly where people don't
22:37
stop. They don't go four or five, then
22:39
they go 10. They're never happy, it seems
22:40
like. But you, you always stayed the
22:42
course. I'll tell you what's the why
22:43
haven't you done that? Why did you not go that there
22:45
my? Model is that when you're making
22:48
enough and you're having a good family and you're having a
22:53
normal life, you want to sleep at night.
22:55
You don't want to have all this Marlboro, Nacosa, Marlboro
22:58
dongles you have that. I've like, for instance, if I
23:02
fly, if I fly business class, I can't fly in two seats.
23:07
If I eat with a goat fork, I can't eat with two goat fork.
23:11
I am very happy to be a normal person if it gets to you and you
23:18
think you own the world. Maybe I can give more Sudoku if
23:23
I had more money. But I have AI, have a good life,
23:28
you know, happy wife, happy life.
23:30
I have a happy family, all my children are and they see it on
23:35
me. Money is means a lot, but it's
23:38
not everything. So I'm very happy and
23:42
unfortunately I, you know. So this wasn't by design.
23:45
This wasn't because you didn't feel like it was a good business
23:48
proposition. You just didn't.
23:50
You didn't want more. You were content with what you
23:52
had and your nursing homes were making money.
23:55
You're right. There's a lot of people that
23:56
have 50 nursing homes and they aren't, they're not profitable.
23:59
But yeah. But the truth is the having a
24:03
lot of nursing homes, you're not, you're having a lot of
24:06
inspections, you're having a lot of problems.
24:09
I get my problems, but the manageable, I just wanted to
24:13
have a better life than better money.
24:16
It's maybe the wrong thing for certain people to understand,
24:20
but I'm very happy. Yes, I have a nice car.
24:22
Why? I figured everybody can splurge
24:25
on everything. I don't splurge on nothing, only
24:27
what I need, just the car. Car.
24:30
I traveled 50 minutes a day each way.
24:33
I figured I want to have a nice comfortable car.
24:36
It was my crave since I was a small child.
24:39
Yeah. What was your favorite car?
24:41
Right now it's a Range Rover. Yeah, everybody else's.
24:44
OK, Can I ask you a question? I'm very curious about this.
24:46
I'm sure a lot of people are very curious about this.
24:49
But nursing homes, we know, you know, they can make a good
24:52
amount of money. They can lose a good amount of
24:53
money as well. In your best year, in all your
24:57
years that you operated, what was the most amount of money
25:01
that your nursing home generation created in profit,
25:03
net profit you walked away with in your best year.
25:06
I'm not going to ask for your average throughout your career.
25:08
I'm not going to ask last year, your best year.
25:11
What did you make in your best year in your in one nursing
25:13
home? The one nurse we have in
25:14
Brooklyn. No, you mean in Queens?
25:17
In Queens, yeah. Well, I tell you the truth, I
25:19
would love to tell you, but I don't think first of all,
25:23
today's time. Yeah, the ones who went in the
25:25
last 10. Years no, not today's times and
25:27
told me the last 2530 what's the cab?
25:29
What kind of what kind of nursing home make if it really
25:31
is through well, you're running a tight trip.
25:33
You have a full bed, full patients, full everything.
25:35
It can go anywhere. It depends how you run it.
25:38
OK, you can run it to the ground too.
25:40
Yeah, I mean full. We've seen that run.
25:42
It well, and first of all, patient care has to be #1 spend
25:47
all your money on patient care like this.
25:50
The family's happy. The lawsuits are less.
25:53
They don't have what to complain.
25:55
Staffing. I have a model also in the
25:58
nursing home and that my, I feel it's so right.
26:02
I wish everybody would do it. I treat every employee if it's
26:06
in the kitchen, housekeeping, nursing, it doesn't matter what
26:10
the religion, what race, doesn't matter.
26:13
I treat them like their family. I say good morning to them.
26:18
I I go on the floors and they all know me, the patients and
26:21
everybody so And then if they're need of money, I give them
26:26
money. What do you mean?
26:27
If they need the money, you. Get in other words, let's say
26:29
like this winter nurse's aide came over her boiler broke down,
26:35
she needs X amount of $1000 just to face she don't have it.
26:39
So she got a loan from from you from me personally nursing home
26:43
every week deducted the amount that she can afford.
26:47
She came directly to you, directly to me.
26:49
She felt comfortable enough to come to you.
26:51
I don't have, I don't have secretaries and I answer my own
26:55
phone. I maybe sometimes it's hectic,
26:59
but they knock on the door and they're here.
27:01
They don't need clearance or anything.
27:03
If I'm busy, I say 5 minutes or so.
27:06
So the hospital and the admissions, the social service,
27:12
they all work as a team and they work so much better because they
27:17
know how I. Treat them.
27:18
I have to ask you go down memory lane.
27:20
You're talking about 30-40 years ago.
27:21
What was different that's glaring then, then now?
27:25
Regulations. Regulations are killing every
27:29
industry. For instance, in the good old
27:32
days, you can patient care was the most important thing.
27:36
It's important now too. Today they don't look at your
27:39
patient, they look at documentation.
27:41
Did you document? Did you do this?
27:43
Did you do that? Another regulation, another
27:46
thing, it's almost impossible to do both.
27:49
You only have X amounts of time a day to do things.
27:54
So if you are good to people, they work extra to get that.
27:59
That way. Much better the families.
28:03
First of all, a nursing home should not have a odor.
28:07
We have we specialize in and there's accidents that happen
28:12
from time to time, but they clean it right away up accident
28:15
meaning of patients. So there's no odor on the floor.
28:18
So when a visitor comes to see which is going to go, they say
28:23
I've been this is this is stench.
28:25
There's a smell here. It smells good.
28:28
What's your secret of keeping it smelling good?
28:31
We have a few floors that are sicker patients.
28:35
We have like you ever been in the wolf in Israel?
28:38
Sure. Can you have a smell?
28:40
We have a machine. That sure built into the system
28:42
built. Into the system gives you a
28:44
fresh smell. Nice.
28:46
But that also can cover up a smell.
28:48
So what are you doing? It doesn't.
28:49
Eliminate the smell. Masks the smell.
28:50
We. Trained the staff and there are
28:53
times that there's a problem, yeah.
28:54
But we trained the staff that when it comes into a situation
28:59
that you know something's wrong in this room, got to clean it up
29:02
right away. Don't let it stay long.
29:03
Don't let it go out throughout the building.
29:07
So it helps a lot and it's proven.
29:10
It has proven that it's worth to be a five star nursing home for
29:15
five years is not easy task. Today they want you to have
29:19
staffing ratio of 3.5, whatever it is.
29:23
And it's very hard because people don't want to do this
29:26
type of job anymore. And, and during COVID, don't
29:29
ask, you know, we, we were suffering during COVID a lot
29:33
because they made us take in COVID patients.
29:37
Forget I'm not mentioning the governor's name, whoever it was,
29:41
but they made us take in or you're going to lose your
29:43
license. We were trying to keep COVID
29:45
out. Right.
29:46
That governor has since denied those allegations, by the way.
29:49
I just want to mention that. Might be running for mayor so
29:51
I'm going to be quiet about. It we may still need him when?
29:54
We might still need him. You don't want to cut your
29:57
bridge. But anyway, the point is, so it
30:01
took a a toll, took about 45% of the patients were out finished.
30:08
So it was really a losing proposition.
30:11
I would say that one of the few real good things that President
30:15
Biden did for the nursing homes industry.
30:20
I'm curious to hear what this is going to be.
30:22
I forgot the initials again. Don't get me wrong, he gave a
30:25
lot of money PPI to make sure you stay in business to to
30:30
overcome this 50 this percentage at your loss right.
30:34
So those are one of the few things that I would say Hashem
30:38
gave us Biden for a few years to able to rebuild our business and
30:43
keep it flowing. It continued very well.
30:47
So that's one of the pluses. You don't know when it comes and
30:50
when it goes. It's the PPP loans.
30:53
Yeah, but then they gave us loans.
30:54
Not repayable. Yeah, not loans.
30:56
They gave us money. Forgivable loans.
30:58
Yeah, forgivable. Do you know what TikTok is?
31:01
What what TikTok? Yes, I heard about.
31:03
It you heard about it. I heard about that.
31:05
They want to dis discontinued spying and so you.
31:10
Heard about the politics behind it, but do you know what it is?
31:12
Have you ever used it? Have you ever gone on to TikTok?
31:14
But I know about. It OK, it's like an app like,
31:17
you know, Instagram or one of those.
31:19
So there's people that become famous on TikTok.
31:22
They do a lot of good content and a lot of people tuned in to
31:25
watch them and they sign up to subscribe for their channels and
31:29
they become they get paid for it eventually, right.
31:31
So there's a very famous influencer, a very famous guy on
31:34
TikTok, and he always puts out a lot of content, but he has his
31:37
one theme. This is what he normally does.
31:39
He goes over to successful people, people who are not just
31:42
successful at a young age or people that are older and have
31:46
had a lot of success and have seen a lot of things.
31:48
And his motto is he believes that people that became
31:51
successful for a long time, at one point in their life, they
31:54
weren't successful. Nobody is able to have success
31:57
for an extended period of time. There's UPS, there's downs.
31:59
So he walks around to people that look like they're
32:02
successful and they're older. He asks them, have you ever been
32:05
broke before? And what did you do when you
32:08
were broke? How did you get out of that?
32:09
What what, what did you tell yourself at the time?
32:11
What did you do? I want to ask you that Question
32:13
Time. Have you ever been broke before?
32:15
Have you ever had no money? You were in debt, You owed
32:18
people money? Have you ever been in that
32:19
situation in real? Honestly, I had never been
32:22
broke, but I had been in a lower echelon.
32:26
Let's say I wouldn't go on trips so the money is not coming the
32:31
same way like it was. You tightened your.
32:33
Belt, I tightened everything. I lived normal, but I tightened
32:38
everything. One area I said I'm not
32:41
tightening and that was sudoku. I didn't have so much money, but
32:47
I had to continue this because I knew this is going to turn
32:51
around one day and this is what's going to help me.
32:54
And I really put it for, for that reason, Hashem turned me
33:01
around. But I did have my ups and downs.
33:03
Yes, a lot. That's beautiful message by the
33:05
way, and I appreciate it. We so appreciate you coming on
33:07
here by the way, especially at no one really knows this 11:00
33:10
at night people. Think it's like in the middle of
33:12
the day right now. We're doing this podcast.
33:13
They don't, really. Someone that plays tennis on a
33:15
daily basis, this is. After hours of keep going, what
33:18
time do you usually go to bed at night?
33:19
What time you usually? Go to sleep around. 11 OK, so
33:21
we'll let you go in a minute. Pretty reasonable.
33:23
Before I let you go, you know, again, you've been through so
33:25
much and you're you're giving us such great insight, right?
33:27
And I really appreciate it. There are so many young people
33:30
going into the industry. We're learning about this now,
33:31
right? So if you can go back to your
33:33
younger self, what would you tell yourself?
33:34
What to look out for? Something that you know.
33:37
I wish I would. If I if I would start now, Yeah,
33:39
yes. Knowing what you know now is
33:42
going to be your final quote. Knowing what I know now and
33:45
seeing what's happening with the young generation going into the
33:49
business, paying so much money, I'm saying right now I would
33:54
never do that, never do that because Medicaid, Medicare,
33:58
privates, forget about HMO's at a snap of the finger.
34:04
Things change overnight. All of a sudden the governor
34:07
decides I'm running out of money, I need to give it to the
34:10
immigrants, I don't care what the reason is.
34:12
And all of a sudden they cut your rate so you can suffer for
34:15
a while, but it doesn't get back and you don't try to do it.
34:20
They want you to do everything right.
34:22
So my advice for the young generation, don't jump in when
34:28
you don't know what you're going to go into and don't go wild.
34:32
Unfortunately, I have friends that they went in and they
34:36
bought 25 nursing homes in in Florida.
34:40
They all lost the money after two years.
34:43
Not every governor, not every state has the same reimbursement
34:48
system. And if a state is dying to hurt
34:52
or see some anything going on, they just cut you.
34:55
Down, yeah. So you know, if anything turns
35:01
bad, you have less, you survive. You know, the state of Illinois,
35:06
like four or five years ago, before COVID, the state of
35:08
Illinois sent out a memo to all their health care providers.
35:12
So sorry guys, but we don't have any money right now and we're
35:16
freezing everything for the next like 8 months.
35:19
And they didn't ask people for fruition.
35:20
There was no vote that was taken.
35:22
They were just letting them know that we just don't have funds
35:24
right now. We're in a deficit.
35:25
We need a bailout from the federal government potentially.
35:28
Right now there's no money. So what happened was everybody
35:30
was no more Medicaid, which means that their cash flow was
35:33
really hurting in their buildings.
35:35
So whoever didn't have that, that that extra money with that
35:39
a hard time surviving, they, they had, you know, so you got
35:41
to adapt in this business, these things could turn very quickly.
35:44
That's. Why when you buy a nursing home?
35:47
This has been for for a long time.
35:50
They, they, they catch, they, they follow you.
35:54
To be the character, you have to pass character and competence
36:00
first. Then you have to be financially
36:03
feasible. Why?
36:05
Because if a bad day comes or Medicare check don't come for
36:09
two months, they need you to have your backing and you're
36:12
doing so. Imagine you have 25 nurses to
36:16
go. You got approved, they had
36:18
partners, whatever. And things turn bad.
36:22
You're out. You're selling him, you're
36:25
selling it $0.10, you're finished.
36:29
So when you have one or two or three or you sold out the rest,
36:34
you're in a better shape. Yeah, and I'll tell you one
36:37
quality over. Quantity.
36:40
Is much more important than flying on a private jet, believe
36:45
me. Trust me if if anything of AI
36:48
teach my. Let them go one time in a
36:50
private jet. Yeah, OK, One time.
36:52
Just to get a little taste of what it's like, right?
36:54
Right. I want to say people who don't
36:58
pass this along and they think, yeah, money is everything,
37:03
right? It's it's a wrong way of
37:05
thinking. Or at least that's my.
37:07
Way, by the way, Kevin O'Leary, who was the keynote speaker at
37:09
the event tonight, he said he said something very similar, he
37:12
said to de risk your children, right for their future.
37:15
Don't give them a position where they're so comfortable that
37:18
they're not going to know how to fend for themselves.
37:20
At some point, you're doing them a disservice, definitely, if
37:22
you're not treating them in that way.
37:24
So I think there's a lot of merit.
37:25
The other hand, I must admit I have a couple of good friends
37:29
that wanted to make it big and they made it big in the same
37:34
industry and they made it big. But if you think I'm jealous of
37:38
them for one minute, you are wrong because I know what it
37:42
means. You know, I read an article
37:45
recently in one of the magazines saying the most hardest job in
37:50
the United States is being a nursing home minister.
37:54
Is that's really job? That's the hardest job.
37:57
Listen, not weightlifting or not the most.
38:01
Difficult job, yeah. You are on call 24/7 365 and
38:07
you're responsible, right? If something goes wrong, if I
38:11
don't have good people, they're calling the fire department.
38:14
Might try. I used to say this years ago.
38:17
If there's a fire, you call the fire department.
38:19
If there's a leak, you call the plumbing.
38:21
So far and so far, it's not so simple like that.
38:24
Who calls what calls Shabbos where?
38:27
You have to have the right people in the right time so
38:30
things go well, You're right. It's the best thing around.
38:34
If you know what, you know what to do, You know what?
38:37
I'm sitting very close to you. I can tell you you're in great
38:40
shape. We really appreciate you coming
38:42
on tonight. I appreciate.
38:43
You look like you're 32. What?
38:45
You look like. 3535 maybe? I did not know that when going
38:49
to events that we're going to have opportunities like this.
38:51
So you're helping us embark on an amazing journey.
38:54
This has been an amazing episode.
38:55
Thank you all for joining Prime Source Production team Stefan,
38:58
Great job as always. Before we wrap up here, we need
39:01
to wrap up. I agree.
39:02
But I do want to have one more question if I go because
39:05
Michael, I'm sorry, but there's not many opportunities I have to
39:08
agree with someone I. Agree, it's just a legend.
39:11
In our industry, a legend in our industry.
39:14
I mean you paved the way for so many other operators and you've
39:18
been doing things in, in such a with longevity.
39:21
I mean you've been around forever.
39:23
I mean, there's very few people like you, like you're a national
39:25
treasure in our community, in our industry.
39:28
OK, push. It that far just take.
39:30
It I'm going to I'm going to be a little bold and I'm going to
39:33
push for another 5 minutes over here but I want to ask you,
39:36
you've seen so many people cycle through your nursing home.
39:40
You've seen people come and go hundreds, thousands of people,
39:43
right? Any stories that ever happened
39:46
that stand out with any of the patients that came through a
39:49
friendship that you formed with someone let.
39:52
Let me go back in the early 1970, fours and 80s and that
39:56
when the patient got sick and went to the hospital, guess who
40:00
visited the patient, The administrator, the nurse.
40:04
We went lunchtime to the local hospital where they went and it
40:09
was family oriented. It was patient care.
40:12
Patient comes in through the door.
40:14
Welcome back. We're losing that.
40:17
No, you're losing that by a lot today.
40:20
They're like going to their bookkeeper.
40:21
You keep saying the word bookkeeper.
40:22
It doesn't go unnoticed and we're down a patient over here.
40:25
Like that's what they're thinking about.
40:27
But you were actually going out to go visit that page like they
40:30
were like part of your family. It was part of the family.
40:32
There's no not. There's no time.
40:34
The hospital don't even want you to come.
40:37
It's just a different world. But I want to tell you, I have
40:40
my son come in the business. He makes the rounds if he
40:44
doesn't visit certain patients every day.
40:47
They say, where's Moshi? Where's Moshi?
40:49
You know, we're trying to bring back that.
40:52
So you're asking me for a story, which I must say, a story from
40:57
one patient in a nursing home. I'm excited.
40:59
This patient was a Jewish patient, so he before he passed
41:07
away, we worked very strong with him that he should, he had
41:11
signed to be cremated and we worked very hard that it
41:17
shouldn't, that he should don't do it.
41:22
Yeah. And for those listening, just to
41:23
give a little context, for a Jewish person to be cremated is
41:27
a terrible thing. We believe in burying the body
41:31
intact and we do everything in our power.
41:34
If you find out that someone's going down that path to try to
41:36
dissuade them and do whatever it takes to get them not to.
41:39
So just wanted to put. That out the story.
41:41
So we reached out to his brother.
41:44
I saw this other state and never visited him and the brother said
41:51
I have nothing to do with my brother.
41:53
He he's going to be cremated and there's nothing to do about it.
41:57
Let's make a short story. We worked so hard that we got
42:02
him to be buried fully, no cremation and he wounded up in
42:09
the cemetery which is father's 2 graves away.
42:13
By chance, by chance, nobody even knew until after.
42:16
Nobody even knew until they buried.
42:18
You're kidding. I'm not kidding.
42:19
He ended up in the same cemetery a couple of graveyards away.
42:23
Yes, that was our like, wow, we did something good, you know.
42:28
Then there was one more story. They took the body of this
42:32
patient, which Jewish to another and my other nursing home and
42:37
they picked it up and they said where you bury him in the
42:40
cemetery? Who gave you, you know,
42:43
something went wrong. We got the body back and the
42:47
people, what's that organization that buries?
42:53
They opened up the body. I mean the, you know, to make
42:56
the tahara and they had a cross on it.
42:59
It was ready, doomed to go to a Catholic or whatever cemetery
43:05
and and we saved it. So bottom line is we don't just
43:10
do patient care. We tried to do it the most
43:15
respectful way that even after death, we follow through.
43:20
So I wish the young generation learns because you can't.
43:25
You can't learn everything. But experience is 10 times more
43:29
than reading up and taking tests and going to seminars.
43:33
Experience, if they would just listen from experience.
43:37
What makes it, what breaks it, what makes a five star nursing
43:41
home? And we hope to continue.
43:43
Things are getting harder and harder.
43:45
Everybody should understand patient care is #1 and be nice
43:49
to people no matter what. Which religion.
43:52
Be nice to people and May God bless you all and have a happy,
43:57
happy life. Amen.
44:00
Thank you. That's amazing.
44:02
Amazing. Fantastic.
44:03
Wow. How did you guys know?