Latest / UK Column Radio / David Miller: Iran’s resistance to Zionism is critical | Jerm Warfare

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David Miller: Iran’s resistance to Zionism is critical | Jerm Warfare · UK Column Radio

0:30
Speaker 1: My name is Jim. This is Jim Wolfe the Battle
0:33
Speaker 1: of Ideas. You were actually dismissed from Where's it is
0:39
Speaker 1: a brit is a Bristol University in twenty twenty one. Yeah,
0:43
Speaker 1: what what happened?
0:45
Speaker 2: Mm hm? And do you want the longer the short version?
0:48
Speaker 2: So what essentially I'd started there in late twenty seventeen.
0:53
Speaker 2: In February to those eighteen, I did a lecture in Islamophobia,
0:57
Speaker 2: which I've done many times before, in which I spent
1:01
Speaker 2: approximately two and a half minutes discussing the role of
1:04
Speaker 2: Zionists and Zionism in encouraging Islamophobia. We know it's two
1:09
Speaker 2: and a half minutes because the tape of it was
1:11
Speaker 2: subsequently leaked to the Jewish News and it's still online.
1:13
Speaker 2: You can go and listen to the terrible things that
1:15
Speaker 2: I said in those two and a half minutes. And
1:19
Speaker 2: essentially I was making the arguments that I've made before
1:21
Speaker 2: everywhere else, which is that you know, there's a specifically
1:24
Speaker 2: Zionist form of Islamophobia, that the Zionists encourage Islamophobia as
1:29
Speaker 2: a matter of national policy, foreign policy objective. And so
1:33
Speaker 2: two anonymous students complained there was a process whereby the
1:38
Speaker 2: university rejected their complaint. Then someone else was drafted into
1:43
Speaker 2: complain by a Zionist lobby group who was the head
1:46
Speaker 2: of the Jewish Society in the university, which is in
1:49
Speaker 2: the UK as part of the Union of Jewish Students,
1:52
Speaker 2: which is a formally Zionist organization. That complaint was rejected.
1:56
Speaker 2: The university then said, oh, you might want to appeal,
1:59
Speaker 2: but you might want to win until we introduced the
2:01
Speaker 2: IHR definition of anti seventies and she said, oh, yes,
2:05
Speaker 2: I would like to wait, and then they introduced the
2:08
Speaker 2: IRA and she appealed and they then took the appeal
2:12
Speaker 2: under the new rules, of course, which is completely unjust.
2:15
Speaker 2: But in any case, they found, after a long nine
2:19
Speaker 2: month investigation by an external QC now a case that
2:24
Speaker 2: I'd done nothing at all wrong, but nothing I'd ever said,
2:26
Speaker 2: because they look back to materials that I'd said some
2:30
Speaker 2: ten years before i'd even been at the University of Bristol.
2:32
Speaker 2: Nothing I'd never said. No a paragraph, not a sentence,
2:35
Speaker 2: not a comma was anti Semitic. So they said, well,
2:37
Speaker 2: nothing to say, You're in the clear. And I said, well,
2:41
Speaker 2: can you tell people that I'm in the clear, that
2:44
Speaker 2: you've determined that I'm not an antisemi because the press
2:49
Speaker 2: are still reporting that I am. And they said, oh, well,
2:52
Speaker 2: I'm not sure about that. So after six weeks I
2:56
Speaker 2: went on a public meeting and I said, as some
2:58
Speaker 2: of you will know, and these words are burned into
3:02
Speaker 2: my brain, some of you will know, I've been attacked
3:03
Speaker 2: and complained about by the head of the Bristol Jewish
3:06
Speaker 2: Society and the president of the Union of Jewish Students
3:10
Speaker 2: Science Organizations as a result, et cetera, et cetera, and that,
3:14
Speaker 2: of course led to all sorts of other harassment of
3:17
Speaker 2: the university by Zionist organizations, by internally by science staff,
3:24
Speaker 2: and of course more than one hundred members of the
3:27
Speaker 2: House of Commons and House of Lords who wrote to
3:30
Speaker 2: the university demanding that I be dealt with properly. And
3:33
Speaker 2: so they investigated me again and concluded that I hadn't
3:36
Speaker 2: done anything wrong, but nevertheless that I had brought students
3:40
Speaker 2: into conflict and therefore that was enough to sack me
3:43
Speaker 2: for professional conduct. I took them to a tribunal. I won.
3:49
Speaker 2: The tribunal said that wasn't the reason they sacked me.
3:52
Speaker 2: That the reason they sacked me was that I had
3:53
Speaker 2: anti Zionist views which they thought were not appropriate and
4:00
Speaker 2: therefore that that was wrongfully dismissed. And in addition to that,
4:06
Speaker 2: they court concluded that Antizionist views or the type I
4:10
Speaker 2: espoused and wrote about in the case were and should
4:13
Speaker 2: be protected as philosophical beliefs, as worthy of respect in
4:19
Speaker 2: a democratic society, to use the terminology and the Equality Act,
4:22
Speaker 2: and that established the principle that anti Zionist views are
4:27
Speaker 2: worthy of respect in a democratic society, should be protected
4:29
Speaker 2: and you can't be sacked if you're an anti Zionist,
4:32
Speaker 2: and of course since then many people have been sacked
4:35
Speaker 2: from being anti Zionist. The university took the tribunal to appeal.
4:42
Speaker 2: We heard the appeal last November and we are still
4:45
Speaker 2: waiting for the judgment, which should have come out some
4:47
Speaker 2: three months ago. But the judge is the new president
4:51
Speaker 2: of the Employment Appealed Tribunal. He's very busy, no doubt.
4:54
Speaker 2: But also he said that part of the reason it's
4:57
Speaker 2: taken so long is because there were so many grounds
4:59
Speaker 2: of appeal lodged by the University of Bristol with their
5:03
Speaker 2: comically incompetent legal team. So we're waiting to see if
5:08
Speaker 2: that the court will uphold the finding of the lower court,
5:13
Speaker 2: and that will of course give me a second decision
5:16
Speaker 2: of a UK court and we'll wake it a binding
5:18
Speaker 2: precedent in law. So we're hoping, of course that that
5:21
Speaker 2: will be the case. I fully expect that will be
5:23
Speaker 2: the case, but we have to see.
5:25
Speaker 1: David, you should know better, I mean, how do you
5:27
Speaker 1: criticize the chosen people?
5:30
Speaker 2: Well, I mean the thing is that you know, as
5:34
Speaker 2: I've said many times, I didn't start off by thinking
5:37
Speaker 2: I'm going to studies ionism. I started off really after
5:41
Speaker 2: the illegal invasion of Iraq and looking at propaganda post
5:47
Speaker 2: nine to eleven and started to look at Islamophobia. Why
5:50
Speaker 2: was there this big up search and anti Muslim commentary
5:52
Speaker 2: in the media and elsewhere. And of course that took
5:55
Speaker 2: us to examining not just the media's coverage, which we've
5:59
Speaker 2: done number of occasions, but also looking at the way
6:02
Speaker 2: in which elite ideas and policy ideas about Islam were
6:07
Speaker 2: mobilized by, in particular by policy related think tanks like
6:12
Speaker 2: the Henry Jackson Society or at the Policy Exchange. And
6:16
Speaker 2: it was only when we looked at who was funding
6:19
Speaker 2: these organizations that we came across a whole list of
6:23
Speaker 2: funders which were all charities which were named after individuals.
6:28
Speaker 2: There were family charities essentially, and we didn't understand what
6:32
Speaker 2: they were, and so we looked at what else they
6:36
Speaker 2: funded as well as funding Islamophobia. What else were they funding,
6:39
Speaker 2: And it turned out, which I wasn't anticipating, It turned
6:43
Speaker 2: out they were funding the IDF and illegal settlements in
6:47
Speaker 2: the West Bank. And we're like, oh, it's the Zionists.
6:51
Speaker 2: These people are Zionists. And so that of course led
6:54
Speaker 2: us to think about Zion's family foundations and how they
6:59
Speaker 2: fund the genocide fun Zionist groups in the UK and
7:02
Speaker 2: many other places as well, and that started us off
7:06
Speaker 2: into studying Ziism directly. And of course it wasn't very
7:10
Speaker 2: long after that started that we started to be accused
7:13
Speaker 2: of being anti Semitic. I remember the first time, I
7:19
Speaker 2: think it was the first time I was accused of
7:21
Speaker 2: being anti Semitic was when I let it be known
7:24
Speaker 2: that I had invited to my home in Glasgow an
7:29
Speaker 2: author who was touring his new book around Scotland, and
7:32
Speaker 2: he came and stayed with me for a few days
7:34
Speaker 2: while he toured around Scotland and this author was terrible,
7:38
Speaker 2: terrible anti Semite. Obviously that meant that I was an
7:40
Speaker 2: anti Semite too. And of course the author was an
7:44
Speaker 2: anti Zionist Jew called Joe Cavell, who's a good friend
7:47
Speaker 2: of mine, he's now dead, who wrote a book called
7:49
Speaker 2: Overcoming Zionism. Fantastic book people should go and read. But
7:52
Speaker 2: that was the problem was I was putting up a
7:55
Speaker 2: Jew in my house who was a friend of mine,
7:57
Speaker 2: and that made me an anti Semite. I thought that
7:59
Speaker 2: was fantastic.
8:01
Speaker 1: But even if let's just say you are anti Semitic,
8:05
Speaker 1: so what.
8:07
Speaker 2: Well, look, I think that there's a there's a whole
8:09
Speaker 2: misunderstanding about what anti Semitism is.
8:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so what is it?
8:15
Speaker 2: Oh? Well, I mean, I mean this is something I'm
8:18
Speaker 2: writing about at the moment. But that the Zionists say,
8:23
Speaker 2: let's put this back to in particular to a book
8:26
Speaker 2: by Bernard lewis Key, Zionist ideologue who wrote a book
8:29
Speaker 2: called Semites and Anti Semites. He says that anti Semitism
8:34
Speaker 2: has always been just about racism against the Jews, creating
8:39
Speaker 2: the Jews is a race, and being racist against the Jews.
8:42
Speaker 2: Now as it turns out, that's not actually correct. The
8:46
Speaker 2: term anti Semitism comes from the Semitic languages, and the
8:51
Speaker 2: Suebmitic languages, of course are Arabic, Ancient Hebrew, Arabic, Phoenician,
8:57
Speaker 2: and a number of others. And when people started to
8:59
Speaker 2: understand and different language families, they started then to say
9:04
Speaker 2: that people who spoke these language families were effectively a race.
9:07
Speaker 2: And one particular guy who study this who is the origin,
9:14
Speaker 2: it said, of anti Semitic thought, because he said the
9:18
Speaker 2: Semitic languages and the people who speak those languages are
9:22
Speaker 2: in an inferior race compared to the Arians and the
9:26
Speaker 2: Aryan languages. So it said that he was the first
9:30
Speaker 2: anti Semite, and in fact he was the first person
9:34
Speaker 2: ever to be accused of being an anti Semite by
9:37
Speaker 2: a particular other author some five or six years later,
9:40
Speaker 2: who used the term anti Semitism for the first time.
9:43
Speaker 2: But this is completely wrong. This is the complete misunderstanding.
9:48
Speaker 2: So let me try and explain as quickly. So this
9:50
Speaker 2: guy ran On is the French guy who who wrote
9:53
Speaker 2: this first of all, But the Semitic languages, yes, he
9:56
Speaker 2: regarded people who spoke those languages as being an inferior race.
10:02
Speaker 2: But he didn't regard those who spoke Yiddish, the Ashkenazi Jews,
10:07
Speaker 2: he didn't regard them as Semites. They are civilized people.
10:12
Speaker 2: So he spent all his life studying Hebrew and the Jews,
10:17
Speaker 2: and he was a Judeophile. He wasn't an anti Semi.
10:21
Speaker 2: The person who accused him of being anti semi and
10:23
Speaker 2: who invented the term of anti Semitism was not the
10:26
Speaker 2: person who everyone thinks invented the term. People think that
10:29
Speaker 2: the term was invented by a guy called Wilhelm Marr
10:32
Speaker 2: who was a bit of a Nazi, But actually he
10:35
Speaker 2: didn't invent the term. The term was invented by this
10:37
Speaker 2: other guy called Steinstreiber, who invented it in I think
10:41
Speaker 2: eighteen sixty, who called Renong said that renng was had
10:45
Speaker 2: anti Semitic prejudices. Now I find this out the other day,
10:49
Speaker 2: and I then thought, who is this guy, Steinschreiber. Why
10:53
Speaker 2: did he think this? Why did he think that rend
10:55
Speaker 2: actually was including the Ashkenazim in his definition of the whites.
11:00
Speaker 2: And it turns out that thirty years before he wrote
11:04
Speaker 2: the term anti Semitism for the first time, he had
11:07
Speaker 2: set up in eighteen forty two a secret Zionist organization
11:12
Speaker 2: to pursue the Jewish homeland. I mean, truly extraordinary. So
11:16
Speaker 2: the term anti Semitism was invented by a Zionist in
11:21
Speaker 2: order to say that people were racist against the Jews
11:24
Speaker 2: and completely neglected the fact that Renauld was an actual racist,
11:28
Speaker 2: but he was mainly racist against Muslims, against the Arabs.
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Speaker 1: Amazing, these are just labels. I mean, this is just
11:35
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying I dislike black people, but they'd
11:38
Speaker 1: say I do dislike black people, and I'm accused of
11:41
Speaker 1: being racist. Okay, now what Well.
11:43
Speaker 2: We can think what we want to think. But of course,
11:45
Speaker 2: the force of the term racism, you know, has a
11:50
Speaker 2: particular force in the Western indeed in the Global South,
11:55
Speaker 2: in relations specifically to colonialism and slavery and the the
12:00
Speaker 2: depredations following that in neocolonialism in the post World War
12:04
Speaker 2: two period. But look, the prejudice, if I can put
12:11
Speaker 2: it like that which Jews face today, to the extent
12:13
Speaker 2: that they do face prejudice, it's not a form of racism.
12:16
Speaker 2: They don't get racism has to be And all these
12:20
Speaker 2: dictionary definitions have this as part of the definition, it
12:22
Speaker 2: has to be institutionalized and run through and by and
12:27
Speaker 2: led by the state. And that's why we refer to
12:31
Speaker 2: racism as something which is institutionalized in society against black people,
12:37
Speaker 2: against Muslims, et cetera. And for a period when the
12:40
Speaker 2: conflict in Ireland was against the Irish. So you don't
12:43
Speaker 2: have to be have black skin or brown skin to
12:46
Speaker 2: be the victim of racism. You can have white skin.
12:48
Speaker 2: But nevertheless, the Jews don't face that. The Jews don't
12:50
Speaker 2: get stopped and searched and detained under the Terrorism Act
12:56
Speaker 2: when they come in and out of the country. They
12:57
Speaker 2: should do for being involved those of them who are
13:00
Speaker 2: involved in the genocide, but they don't. It's the Muslims
13:02
Speaker 2: who are the bear the brunt of that. And Muslims
13:05
Speaker 2: of course face the biggest discrimination, not just in terms
13:08
Speaker 2: of state racism and being arrested and attained, but in
13:11
Speaker 2: terms of life outcomes in the UK. For example, that
13:14
Speaker 2: the poorest religious group in the UK are Muslims. The
13:18
Speaker 2: richest great religious group in the UK by some distance
13:23
Speaker 2: are the Jews are average. So the Jews don't face
13:27
Speaker 2: racism today. And so this nonsense about anti Semitism is
13:30
Speaker 2: a term which is used simply for any prejudice that
13:32
Speaker 2: that might be against Jewish people, or indeed any criticism
13:36
Speaker 2: of the State of Israel or its genocidal policies or
13:39
Speaker 2: the support for its general side of policies by almost
13:43
Speaker 2: all not not all, but almost all Jews in the diaspora,
13:48
Speaker 2: as they call it.
13:49
Speaker 1: That's what Norman Finkelstein said on My on My podcast.
13:51
Speaker 1: He said that the term is used basically to silence
13:55
Speaker 1: any criticism of the State of Israel.
13:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. Well, I'm I mean that's a process
14:01
Speaker 2: which the Zionists have been doing for a long long time.
14:04
Speaker 2: I mean even before the creation of the State of Israel.
14:08
Speaker 2: You can see evidence of the attempt to weaponize antisemitism.
14:11
Speaker 2: I mean they Anti Defamation League set up, of course
14:14
Speaker 2: in nineteen thirteen, one of the key organizations today to
14:18
Speaker 2: weaponize antisemitism. And there's another organization like it in most
14:22
Speaker 2: other Western countries. There's Lecra and Likree. For in France
14:26
Speaker 2: there is the Board of Deputies and the Community Security Trust.
14:29
Speaker 2: In the UK there's a Community Security Organization. In Australia,
14:32
Speaker 2: tons of these organizations. So the idea was set up
14:35
Speaker 2: in nineteen thirteen, and already by the nineteen forties it
14:37
Speaker 2: was systematically spying on Arab Americans and indeed collaborating with
14:42
Speaker 2: the FBI. But it's only really since the creation of
14:49
Speaker 2: the Global Forum for Countering Antisemitism that the State of
14:53
Speaker 2: Israel has spent significant resources on trying to reshape the
14:58
Speaker 2: idea of what anti Semitism is. And so, of course
15:03
Speaker 2: it started in the seventies with the famous speech by
15:08
Speaker 2: the former Foreign Minister of the ENTITY about a ban
15:11
Speaker 2: who made a speech in the US, I think seventy
15:14
Speaker 2: three it was made about seventy four is published where
15:17
Speaker 2: he talks about the new anti Semitism, where so what
15:20
Speaker 2: he's trying to say is there was this there were
15:22
Speaker 2: the Nazis, and they were racist against the Jews. But
15:24
Speaker 2: now what we face is a new kind of antisemitism
15:27
Speaker 2: from the left and from the Palestinians. And so they
15:30
Speaker 2: had to find a way to make they what was
15:33
Speaker 2: regarded as racism by the Nazis into something which could
15:36
Speaker 2: be applied to the left and to critics of Israel.
15:39
Speaker 2: And that's what they've spent a lot all the time
15:41
Speaker 2: since then doing. And of course that's what the International
15:45
Speaker 2: Holocaust rememberents. The liance working definition of anti Semitism is
15:48
Speaker 2: it's a direct product of Israeli foreign policy and put
15:54
Speaker 2: in place in order to discipline all of us who
15:57
Speaker 2: would criticize the Zionists or indeed Jewish supremacist ideas wherever
16:02
Speaker 2: they might be found.
16:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, just for clarity. I mean, I've got Christian friends
16:07
Speaker 1: who call themselves Zionists. When we talk about Zionism, what
16:10
Speaker 1: exactly are we talking about.
16:12
Speaker 2: So Zionism is. I mean, I think that there's a
16:16
Speaker 2: lot of nonsense talked about this, and a lot of
16:18
Speaker 2: people say, oh, it's too complicated, We shouldn't use the
16:20
Speaker 2: word Zionism because it's a very complicated thing, and people
16:23
Speaker 2: have different meanings about it, and sometimes that's in their
16:26
Speaker 2: heart and it doesn't really mean killing all the Palestinians.
16:29
Speaker 2: And I say, well, let's be clear. There is an
16:33
Speaker 2: agreed definition of Zionism which really the Zionists don't disagree with,
16:39
Speaker 2: and that is Zionist movement is a movement and an
16:42
Speaker 2: ideology which believes in setting up a Jewish state in
16:47
Speaker 2: the historic territory of Palestine. That's it. That's the definition.
16:50
Speaker 2: Now you can think it's a good thing, as the
16:52
Speaker 2: Zionists do, and you can say, oh, well, we're returning
16:55
Speaker 2: to our historic homeland and there's been an unbroken Jewish
16:59
Speaker 2: and involvement and life in the Levant for three or
17:04
Speaker 2: four thousand years, and really all we're doing is we're
17:07
Speaker 2: indigenous to the Levant. Now, they can say all that,
17:11
Speaker 2: but the core of it is that they wanted to
17:13
Speaker 2: set up a Jewish state. They believe that's right. We
17:15
Speaker 2: believe it's wrong. And you know, anti Zionists believe that
17:19
Speaker 2: Zionism is inherently racist, that they must by definition be racist,
17:23
Speaker 2: it must be genocidal, because you can't set up a
17:26
Speaker 2: Jewish state in the Levant without ethnically glensing and genociding
17:31
Speaker 2: pushing out the people who live there, which of course
17:33
Speaker 2: they did most markedly previously in nineteen forty eight with
17:37
Speaker 2: the Knackbar, and then of course in the last three
17:40
Speaker 2: or four years, a second Knackbar is in process, which
17:44
Speaker 2: they themselves say when they are, when they want, when
17:48
Speaker 2: they come on, when they come online, and brag about it,
17:51
Speaker 2: and they taught people that there's a second knack Bar
17:54
Speaker 2: that's coming. So look, Zionism is a very very simple
17:57
Speaker 2: thing it's about. It's a racist ie the effort to
18:00
Speaker 2: set up a Jewish state in the Levant. Now, it
18:04
Speaker 2: doesn't matter if if you're a cultural Zionist or you
18:08
Speaker 2: or you're not a political Zionist, or you don't like
18:10
Speaker 2: nit and yeah who all those people who believe that
18:12
Speaker 2: there should be a Jewish state in the Levant are Zionists,
18:15
Speaker 2: and that's Jewish Zionists. And of course, as you say,
18:18
Speaker 2: Christian Zionists. And of course, as everyone says, there are
18:22
Speaker 2: many more Christian Zionists in the world than there are
18:24
Speaker 2: Jewish sciences. True, but I think there's a misunderstanding about
18:28
Speaker 2: that as well, which is that For example, Ilan Pappy,
18:32
Speaker 2: the famous anti Zionist author, wrote a book recently called
18:36
Speaker 2: The Ten Myths.
18:38
Speaker 1: You also at the Ten Myths of Israel.
18:40
Speaker 2: No, No, the Zionist Lobby. He wrote a bigger book
18:43
Speaker 2: about the history of the Zionist lobby in the US
18:45
Speaker 2: and the UK. His argument in there, essentially without distorting
18:50
Speaker 2: it too much, is to say that that they it
18:53
Speaker 2: was Christian Zionists who invented Zionism, and that they taught
18:57
Speaker 2: it or gave it to the Jews. Now that's actually
19:01
Speaker 2: not correct it's not correct that Christian scientist invented Zionism.
19:05
Speaker 2: Jewish science invented Zionism at least four hundred years before
19:09
Speaker 2: the first Christian scientist came along. There was settlement in
19:14
Speaker 2: what's now called historic Palestine in twelve eleven, not in
19:19
Speaker 2: eighteen forty two, which there was as well, But in
19:21
Speaker 2: twelve eleven the three hundred Rabbis famously made Aliyah I
19:27
Speaker 2: ascended to Palestine to create a colony, and have been
19:32
Speaker 2: significant waves of a colonization by Jewish scientists ever since.
19:38
Speaker 2: Even though though the Desionist movement itself of course didn't
19:41
Speaker 2: formally get started until the eighteen nineties.
19:45
Speaker 1: I didn't know that there was a secret war being
19:48
Speaker 1: waged against Iran by the British. This is absolutely fascinating
19:52
Speaker 1: because when we talk on a day to day basis,
19:55
Speaker 1: it's always Israel or America versus Iran.
19:59
Speaker 2: Iran was a Briti British colony and the purpose of
20:06
Speaker 2: this was of course to steal Iran's oil, and they
20:11
Speaker 2: had a client regime there, the Shah, and there was
20:15
Speaker 2: a revolution of sorts where the President Mussadec nationalized the
20:22
Speaker 2: oil and as a result, the Americans in the British
20:27
Speaker 2: launched a coup against Mussadek. Now, the CIA were reluctant
20:33
Speaker 2: to do this, and it took six a long time
20:37
Speaker 2: to convince them that they should come in on the act,
20:40
Speaker 2: and in nineteen fifty three they launched their coup reinstalled
20:45
Speaker 2: the Shah, who, of course, you know, ruled with British support.
20:49
Speaker 2: And if you go to if you go to Tehran,
20:52
Speaker 2: there's a museum they are called the Museum of Holy Defense,
20:55
Speaker 2: which is their name for the Iran Iraq War. And
20:59
Speaker 2: in the open in part of the museum, outside that
21:02
Speaker 2: there's all these British tanks, which of course were supplied
21:04
Speaker 2: to the Shah, Challenger tanks which was supplied to the
21:07
Speaker 2: Shah by the British, and they supported them militarily. And
21:14
Speaker 2: when the Islamic Revolution happened in nineteen seventy nine, that
21:19
Speaker 2: of course the Americans were in the lead, and it
21:23
Speaker 2: was the Americans that they were in conflict with. And
21:25
Speaker 2: of course there was the hostage crisis when some radical
21:29
Speaker 2: students invaded the US embassy and held the people in
21:35
Speaker 2: the embassy hostage. I mean, it's a fascinating story actually,
21:39
Speaker 2: because when they went to the door of the embassy.
21:43
Speaker 2: The climbed over the fence and they went to the
21:44
Speaker 2: door of the embassy and the staff tried to keep
21:46
Speaker 2: them talking for an hour and a half I think
21:49
Speaker 2: it was. And meanwhile upstairs, the CIA people in the
21:53
Speaker 2: embassy were busy shreading all the documents that they could
21:56
Speaker 2: before the students got in. Eventually students got in and
21:59
Speaker 2: they they kind of being students. They spent a long
22:03
Speaker 2: long time taking the material out of the shredder and
22:07
Speaker 2: pasting it back together, and then they published it in
22:09
Speaker 2: a twenty five volume book of all the different documents inside.
22:15
Speaker 2: I've been to that. It's now a museum of CIA misinformation.
22:20
Speaker 2: But the British all the way through this have been
22:23
Speaker 2: involved in trying to Iran along with the scientists. The
22:27
Speaker 2: British indeed were involved in the assassination campaigns against Iranian
22:32
Speaker 2: nuclear scientists. Again at that same museum, when I first
22:36
Speaker 2: went there in twenty twenty three, they had a display
22:40
Speaker 2: of the cars of at least six of the nuclear
22:43
Speaker 2: scientists who were assassinated, all of them in their cars
22:46
Speaker 2: which were shot up or bombed, and the actual cars
22:48
Speaker 2: they were, the bloodstains on them and so these were
22:52
Speaker 2: assassinations done by the Massage, Yes, but six appear to
22:56
Speaker 2: have been involved in these assassinations, and indeed they also
23:00
Speaker 2: so we're involved in xfiltrating a Mosad agent who have
23:04
Speaker 2: been recruited from within Iran, and they exfiltrated this person
23:07
Speaker 2: and they got him across the English Channel in a
23:10
Speaker 2: Robert Dinghy with other genuine Iranian refugees. So MI six
23:16
Speaker 2: has been involved in this for a long long time.
23:18
Speaker 2: And of course, as people will know from understanding, a
23:23
Speaker 2: thing called operation sort of the thing called the Killer
23:26
Speaker 2: What Network, which was the way in which the Mossad
23:29
Speaker 2: started to cooperate with Western intelligence agencies after the early seventies.
23:36
Speaker 2: And so I six and the CIA and other Western
23:39
Speaker 2: intelligence agencies, including the Five Eyes, which of course is Canada,
23:43
Speaker 2: Australia and New Zealand, the US and the UK have
23:47
Speaker 2: been involved in collaboration with Mossad since the seventies, and
23:50
Speaker 2: that's part of the reason why the designs have such
23:54
Speaker 2: a whippand over foreign policy. And the Six have continued
23:58
Speaker 2: to be involved in this all the way through and
24:03
Speaker 2: just recently what's happened. And I've just been writing some
24:08
Speaker 2: stuff about this recently, there's a unit inside the Foreign
24:13
Speaker 2: Office in the UK which has been there effectively since
24:17
Speaker 2: twenty fourteen in response to the annexation of Crimea by
24:22
Speaker 2: the Russians. And this is a covert operation which is
24:26
Speaker 2: there to attack Russia and to undermine Russia, involving all
24:31
Speaker 2: the British intelligence agencies, and that has recently, in twenty
24:37
Speaker 2: twenty three it morphed into a separate covert propaganda operation
24:46
Speaker 2: called the Information, Threats and Influence Directorate inside the Foreign
24:51
Speaker 2: Office and it expanded its remit from just Ukraine and Russia, Iran,
25:02
Speaker 2: China and indeed Gaza and Palestine. So they are involved
25:05
Speaker 2: directly in the propaganda against Iran just now. And of
25:09
Speaker 2: course we also know that they British are involved directly
25:13
Speaker 2: in the attacks on Iran they've been in the last
25:15
Speaker 2: few months. I mean, I am in Bristol in the
25:20
Speaker 2: south west of England and if you travel from Bristol
25:24
Speaker 2: to London, you go along the M four motorway which
25:27
Speaker 2: takes you all the way to London, and there are
25:30
Speaker 2: two military bases. They are. The first one you come
25:33
Speaker 2: to is called Fairford, which is relatively widely known and
25:39
Speaker 2: that's where the heavy bombers from the US, the B
25:43
Speaker 2: fifty two's and the b ones take off from with
25:46
Speaker 2: their bunker buster bombs and their smart bombs and their
25:49
Speaker 2: dumb bombs to attack Tehran and Isfahan and Kissam Island
25:56
Speaker 2: and all the places that they've attacked, targeting military targets,
26:01
Speaker 2: as they would say. But of course the result is
26:03
Speaker 2: that is a tax on civilian infrastructure, civilian casualties, many
26:09
Speaker 2: thousands of civilian casualties. As we know. The second base
26:12
Speaker 2: that you come to, which is twenty five miles away
26:15
Speaker 2: further along the motorway, which is much much less known,
26:18
Speaker 2: is called RAF Welford, and it's run by the United
26:21
Speaker 2: States Air Force. It's allowed to be there by the
26:24
Speaker 2: British government obviously, and it's the second largest USAF arms
26:29
Speaker 2: dump in the whole of Europe. It's a massive arms dump.
26:33
Speaker 2: It used to be in the airfield. There's no airfield anymore.
26:36
Speaker 2: But there's hardly anyone in the country knows about it,
26:39
Speaker 2: that this is actually involved directly in complicity in the
26:44
Speaker 2: bombing of Iran, And of course we suspect also that
26:48
Speaker 2: there will be special forces involved on the ground, but
26:53
Speaker 2: we don't know too much about that.
26:56
Speaker 1: A great website, Swiss Policy Research as got an article
27:00
Speaker 1: about the US and British involvement in the seventy nine
27:05
Speaker 1: revolution saying that they actually supported it because it would
27:10
Speaker 1: have it was going to protect oil interests.
27:13
Speaker 2: I don't believe that's true. I mean, on the contrary,
27:16
Speaker 2: I mean they didn't. I mean they supported the Shah,
27:21
Speaker 2: and they still support the Shah. If they could bring
27:23
Speaker 2: him back in again, they might do that, although, of course,
27:26
Speaker 2: probably what they want what the Western approach, well, look
27:30
Speaker 2: the a Zionist approach to this, which is that they
27:32
Speaker 2: want to destroy the Islamic Republic and they want to
27:34
Speaker 2: bulcanize Iran. They want to encourage secessionist movements in Blakistan
27:41
Speaker 2: and in Kurdistan, et cetera. And of course these are
27:43
Speaker 2: some of the people who they recruit. The Courage in
27:46
Speaker 2: particular quite often have been amongst the recruits which they
27:50
Speaker 2: most had pay and arm. And that's of course the
27:54
Speaker 2: people who were on the streets on the sixth and
27:57
Speaker 2: sorry the seventh and eighth of January this year assassinating
28:01
Speaker 2: police officers and besieg and indeed sometimes assassinating their own
28:06
Speaker 2: people on their own side who are rioting or whatever.
28:09
Speaker 2: So I mean, I don't believe there is a sport
28:12
Speaker 2: for the Islamic Republican. Indeed, I believe that the Islamic
28:14
Speaker 2: Republic is the foremost anti imperialist country in the world,
28:20
Speaker 2: more anti imperist than China, more anti impuist than Venezuela
28:24
Speaker 2: and indeed Cuba. And it's only by the Islamic Republic
28:29
Speaker 2: of Iran winning in the battle with the zion Is
28:31
Speaker 2: that we will have the possibility of peace in the future.
28:34
Speaker 2: I think, otherwise we will be submitting to what I
28:37
Speaker 2: believe will be zion as the empire.
28:40
Speaker 1: Is that why Iran seems to be isolated, Yes, I.
28:44
Speaker 2: Think that's right. I mean the you know, the the
28:47
Speaker 2: strategy which Iran has fought has been to encourage those
28:51
Speaker 2: who believe in resistance against Ionism. And of course that's
28:55
Speaker 2: meant Hisbola in Lebanon, the sad government, as it was
28:59
Speaker 2: in Syria, the Iraqi resistance, and of course not forgetting
29:04
Speaker 2: the Anzirella in Yemen, and that became a formidable fighting force,
29:10
Speaker 2: and that was one of the key things which the
29:12
Speaker 2: Zionis have acted to try and dismember. They tried to
29:15
Speaker 2: dismember it in Lebanon, they helped to bring down the
29:20
Speaker 2: sad government to install Isis effectively in the government of Syria.
29:24
Speaker 2: And of course they've only recently the US has on effectively.
29:29
Speaker 2: Zionis instructions kidnapped the one of the heads of the
29:33
Speaker 2: popular mobilization units in Iraq, the Iraqi Resistance. So it's
29:39
Speaker 2: only around that stands between the work, you know, between
29:44
Speaker 2: between civilization and what would be I believe, a thousand
29:49
Speaker 2: year Reich Empire for the Zionis. I mean, they're already
29:54
Speaker 2: expanding into Lebanon, into Syria. Yes, Why well, because they believe, Well,
29:59
Speaker 2: first of all, they've always believed in the greater Israel.
30:02
Speaker 2: And it's just the kind of concept which until about
30:05
Speaker 2: two years ago people would say, well, that's a conspiracy theory.
30:08
Speaker 2: They don't they don't really want to do that. But
30:10
Speaker 2: of course they've always believed that, and you can see
30:11
Speaker 2: that back in the in the memoirs and the diaries
30:14
Speaker 2: of Hurt Soul, of all the other science leaders in
30:19
Speaker 2: Japatinski as well. They've always believed that the land of Israel,
30:23
Speaker 2: that's Israel, extends all the way from the river to
30:28
Speaker 2: the sea and to the next sea. So it includes
30:31
Speaker 2: half of Egypt, part of Turkey, all of Lebanon, all
30:35
Speaker 2: of Syria, half of Iraq, all of Jordan. And that's
30:38
Speaker 2: what they've always wanted to do, to create effectively an empire,
30:43
Speaker 2: a transnational empire in West Asia. But actually Greater Israel
30:49
Speaker 2: isn't it enough for them. They also want to control
30:52
Speaker 2: the whole of West Asia. They've said this, Netanyahu has
30:57
Speaker 2: been saying this, talking about being a regional super power,
31:00
Speaker 2: et cetera, in the last few months. So that's why
31:03
Speaker 2: they've of course had the Abraham accors that. That's why
31:05
Speaker 2: they have the close relationship with the United Araom Emirates
31:08
Speaker 2: and to some extent with the Saurea's, although there's some
31:11
Speaker 2: difficulties in that relationship at presence, and they want to
31:14
Speaker 2: expand to the whole of West Asia. But the strategy
31:17
Speaker 2: also has been to subvert and infiltrate every other country
31:24
Speaker 2: that has the possibility of interfering with their activities. So
31:28
Speaker 2: that's why there's a huge scientist movement in many countries,
31:33
Speaker 2: twenty or thirty or forty countries formal Zionist movements, and
31:36
Speaker 2: then of course there are all sorts of other ways
31:38
Speaker 2: in which they try and infiltrate other countries. In the
31:41
Speaker 2: UK there is no mainstream party which is anti Zionist.
31:45
Speaker 2: Every mainstream party is Zionist. Same in the US, same
31:48
Speaker 2: in France, same in Germany. And that's because of Zionist infiltration.
31:52
Speaker 2: And that's a long term process which involves many different
31:56
Speaker 2: methods and activities, but it's been effective and really very
32:00
Speaker 2: difficult now too to have the even the possibility of
32:04
Speaker 2: seeing something which is even formally anti Zionist and have
32:11
Speaker 2: any any political support in any of these countries.
32:13
Speaker 1: It is quite effective. About a year ago, I was
32:15
Speaker 1: driving in an uber in Dubai and I was chatting
32:19
Speaker 1: to the driver and he said that you are prohibited
32:23
Speaker 1: from flying a Palestinian flag in the UAE.
32:27
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, it's it's getting it's getting worse and
32:32
Speaker 2: worse all over the world, isn't it. I mean, there
32:35
Speaker 2: have been people just in the last few days in
32:38
Speaker 2: the UK who have been arrested for using the term
32:41
Speaker 2: intofada or talking about, you know, being anti Zionist. And
32:46
Speaker 2: so there's an attempt by the police and the prosecution
32:50
Speaker 2: authorities in the UK too to to take their line
32:54
Speaker 2: from Tel Aviv, which is that there is no difference
32:57
Speaker 2: between anti Semitism and anti Sionism. The anti zion is
33:00
Speaker 2: always antisemitism. And so if you talk about free Palestine
33:06
Speaker 2: or from the reversion of the Sea, or into Fada,
33:09
Speaker 2: you are by definition being anti Jewish. And the police
33:11
Speaker 2: are now starting to arrest people and have them in
33:14
Speaker 2: for conversations on the basis not that they are being
33:21
Speaker 2: ruded about Zionists, but that they're being rude about about Jews.
33:24
Speaker 2: And of course you know the two are not the
33:26
Speaker 2: same thing.
33:29
Speaker 1: How did this happen?
33:31
Speaker 2: Well, it's a long term process. I mean that there's
33:35
Speaker 2: lots of different elements to it. Okay, So the Zionist
33:38
Speaker 2: colony is unusual as settler colonies goal in the sense
33:44
Speaker 2: that it doesn't have a metropolis from which they all came.
33:49
Speaker 2: They were part of societies across the world, Russia and America, whatever.
33:53
Speaker 2: And in the settler colony usually what happens is that
33:56
Speaker 2: the settlers become more and more extreme, and that the metropolis,
34:00
Speaker 2: well you know, sees the settlers is acting and it's
34:05
Speaker 2: interests in general, the metropolis wants to be a little
34:07
Speaker 2: bit more cautious and doesn't quite understand why the settles
34:11
Speaker 2: are getting so extremely You saw that in South Africa,
34:13
Speaker 2: you saw that in Northern Ireland, and you see that
34:17
Speaker 2: in Palestine. But the difficulty is that there's no restraining metropolis.
34:22
Speaker 2: In fact, if you look at the what's called the
34:24
Speaker 2: diaspora ee Jews who live all around the world, they are,
34:27
Speaker 2: if anything, just as genocidal as the ones who've gone
34:31
Speaker 2: to Israel, maybe a little bit less. But there's no
34:35
Speaker 2: restraining force coming from Jewish or organized jury in the
34:41
Speaker 2: US or CARD or the UK against what's happening in
34:47
Speaker 2: occupied Palastine. Now, so that's part of the story. But
34:51
Speaker 2: the other part of the story is that is the
34:53
Speaker 2: fact that there is this diasper. There are Jewish populations
34:57
Speaker 2: all around the world. Now, of course they make up
35:00
Speaker 2: really small proportions of the population, even when even in
35:04
Speaker 2: the in the largest proportional they have in the population,
35:07
Speaker 2: which is in the US, is two percent. In the UK,
35:11
Speaker 2: it's zero point four percent. In other countries it's less.
35:16
Speaker 2: So how is it that a population which is so
35:18
Speaker 2: small proportionally is able to exert this kind of influence. Now,
35:24
Speaker 2: so you can think about this as being well, it
35:26
Speaker 2: must be to do with Israeli foreign policy and is
35:29
Speaker 2: really intelligence and all that sort of stuff, And of
35:31
Speaker 2: course that is part of the story, but that's not
35:35
Speaker 2: that's not all of the story. Actually, you also find
35:38
Speaker 2: that what what what happens is that the Zionists are
35:42
Speaker 2: able to have a sort of pipeline of radicalization. They
35:47
Speaker 2: get their young, very young, and they bring them into
35:50
Speaker 2: the idea that they deserve to live, that they have
35:54
Speaker 2: a birthright, it's the word terms they use to live
35:58
Speaker 2: in palastline. So they starting England with this formerly in nurseries,
36:03
Speaker 2: in primary schools, in youth groups, in student groups and
36:06
Speaker 2: young adult groups. At the age of sixteen, every due
36:09
Speaker 2: in the West is offered a free trip to Palestine
36:14
Speaker 2: to encourage them into believing that they have our right
36:17
Speaker 2: to steal Palestinian land, and then cut to encourage them
36:21
Speaker 2: into becoming settlers and or to joining the occupation forces.
36:26
Speaker 2: So they have a whole set of programs for that.
36:28
Speaker 2: And this is overseen by the Zionist movement in every
36:31
Speaker 2: country in which there is a formal Zionist movement, in
36:33
Speaker 2: the UK, in France, in Germany, in the US, in
36:36
Speaker 2: Latin America, in Australia and South Africa as well of course,
36:41
Speaker 2: so that's part of the process, but there's also it's
36:44
Speaker 2: also to do with and this is the thing that
36:47
Speaker 2: people don't like you saying normal. Finkelstein has said this
36:49
Speaker 2: a few times, and he gets away with it because
36:52
Speaker 2: he's Jewish, he's allowed to say that. But it's also
36:55
Speaker 2: to do with it the infiltration at the level of
36:58
Speaker 2: politics and final and media throughout the society. And that's
37:02
Speaker 2: and that's the Jews are able to do that mostly
37:05
Speaker 2: humor Zionists because they are on average wealthier than anybody else,
37:09
Speaker 2: on average, wealthier than white people, certainly wealthier than than
37:13
Speaker 2: Hindus or Muslims or Sikhs or whatever. And so that
37:18
Speaker 2: that when when that that happens, you have a kind
37:23
Speaker 2: of economic decision making apparatus which actually does take decisions
37:29
Speaker 2: in favor of supporting Zionism, firstly through for example, setting
37:34
Speaker 2: up what I mentioned earlier, Zion's family foundations. So they
37:38
Speaker 2: set up foundations to give money to zions groups in
37:41
Speaker 2: the country which they're in, and also to give money
37:43
Speaker 2: to to the IDF, to the settlements, to all sorts
37:49
Speaker 2: of other Zionist causes actually in occupied Palestine. But they
37:53
Speaker 2: also are involved in into in decision making in the society,
37:56
Speaker 2: and I mean economic decision making as well as political
37:59
Speaker 2: decision making. So if you look at the the world's
38:01
Speaker 2: top billionaires, there are something like corn to Forbes, twenty
38:05
Speaker 2: seven hundred billionaires, and the Duwis make up ten percent
38:11
Speaker 2: of that, with a global population of zero point two percent.
38:14
Speaker 2: So there's a massive over representation amongst the top billionaires,
38:20
Speaker 2: six of the top ten billionaires, six of the richest
38:22
Speaker 2: ten people in the world of Jews. Now, there's not
38:27
Speaker 2: a single one of them who is anti Zionist. That
38:29
Speaker 2: people will say to me, all, well, what about George Soros. Well,
38:32
Speaker 2: I say, you know, George Sorris is a Zionist. They
38:34
Speaker 2: might be a liberal Zionist. They give a million dollars
38:37
Speaker 2: to J Street in the US, but there's not a
38:39
Speaker 2: single one of them who is anti Zionist. And that's
38:42
Speaker 2: a kind of outsize economic clout. And that process is
38:47
Speaker 2: repeated through the media, in the film industry, in pornography,
38:53
Speaker 2: in politics, all the way through. That's what I would
38:57
Speaker 2: call that is infiltration and what I've called the cardinal
39:03
Speaker 2: principle of the Zionist movement, which they encoded when they
39:07
Speaker 2: had their first World Zionis Conference Congress sorry in nineteen
39:12
Speaker 2: fifty one in Jerusalem, where they decided this is the
39:17
Speaker 2: interesting thing, they said, the Zionus movement was set up
39:20
Speaker 2: to create a Jewish state in Palestine. So in ninety
39:23
Speaker 2: forty eight they did it. Ninety fifty one they have
39:25
Speaker 2: the first Congress, World Zius Congress. Since then, and there's
39:29
Speaker 2: a motion put that they will abolish the Zionist movement
39:32
Speaker 2: because they've reached their goals and they will move forward
39:36
Speaker 2: without Zions Movement, and it will I'll be folded away.
39:40
Speaker 2: And that motion is defeated with no votes in favor,
39:45
Speaker 2: and they decided to continue the Zius movement. And of
39:47
Speaker 2: course that's the purpose of the Ziis movement, as they
39:50
Speaker 2: set out in what they call the Jerusalem Program. This
39:53
Speaker 2: is something which is public, it's not a secret. Is
39:56
Speaker 2: the purpose of this is to spread Zionism throughout the
39:59
Speaker 2: world wherever there are Jewish populations, to spread it into effectively,
40:04
Speaker 2: to infiltrate societies for the benefit of the Jewish date
40:07
Speaker 2: in palaesline. So that's a large part of the argument
40:11
Speaker 2: about what about how they are able to exert such influence.
40:16
Speaker 1: Is the United States just another province of Israel, or
40:20
Speaker 1: is Israel the province of the United States.
40:23
Speaker 2: Well, people get hit up a bit this, especially people
40:27
Speaker 2: on the left. They say, well, it can't possibly be
40:29
Speaker 2: the case that the Zionists are able to influence US imperialism.
40:34
Speaker 2: It's obviously the case that the US imperialists are in charge.
40:37
Speaker 2: The tale doesn't whack the dog. There's only a small
40:39
Speaker 2: number of people in Israel, or even if you include
40:42
Speaker 2: the Zionist movement or the Jews in America, or it's
40:46
Speaker 2: still only a small number of people. And you know,
40:49
Speaker 2: I think that that argument has had more strength thirty
40:55
Speaker 2: or forty years ago, but actually we live in a
40:59
Speaker 2: different world now. And what's happened as a result of
41:02
Speaker 2: this long term infiltration process is that the decisions which
41:05
Speaker 2: are taken by the US government, or the French government,
41:09
Speaker 2: or the German government or even the UK government, which
41:13
Speaker 2: are seen by people as being in the interests of
41:16
Speaker 2: US imperialism with British imperialism, actually these decisions are taken
41:20
Speaker 2: by people who are believing and car carrying Zionists, or
41:24
Speaker 2: who have been infiltrated or bought off by car carrying Zionists.
41:27
Speaker 2: And you can see that with every single Western state,
41:32
Speaker 2: less so with Spain to some extent, but the other
41:36
Speaker 2: main Western countries, I mean, the Prime minister of our
41:38
Speaker 2: countries is he is a Zionist without qualification, and is
41:44
Speaker 2: perfectly clear that they take decisions in favor of the
41:48
Speaker 2: interests of Zionism and not in favor of British national
41:51
Speaker 2: interests or US national interests, whatever they might be. And
41:54
Speaker 2: of course what's happened is that there's been an infiltration
41:56
Speaker 2: of the political administrative structure, starting in the nineteen fifties
42:02
Speaker 2: with famously with a guy called and it actually goes
42:05
Speaker 2: back for that, but let's start with nineteen fifties with
42:08
Speaker 2: a guy called James Jesus Angleton, who was the head
42:11
Speaker 2: of counter intelligence and the CIA, and he was the
42:14
Speaker 2: official contact point between both the Shinbte, which is Israel's
42:18
Speaker 2: internal intelligence agency, the Mossad, and the CIA, and he
42:24
Speaker 2: was effectively a Zionist asset and agent inside the CIA.
42:29
Speaker 2: He's the only American intelligence official to whom there are
42:33
Speaker 2: two memorials in occupied past nine today. And that process
42:38
Speaker 2: of infiltration and turning people and spying on the US,
42:42
Speaker 2: supposedly its greatest ally is something which has continued ever since,
42:46
Speaker 2: so that you find by the time you get to
42:48
Speaker 2: the nineteen eighties that the neo Conservatives read Zionists, some
42:53
Speaker 2: of our Christians, but mostly they're Jewish, had started to
42:56
Speaker 2: exercise significant influence on the Reagan administration. And by the
43:00
Speaker 2: time you get to the second Bush administration and the
43:04
Speaker 2: invasion of Iraq, and Iraq was invaded for the Zionists,
43:07
Speaker 2: and the people who took the decisions were not Americans
43:11
Speaker 2: just do what the Zionists wanted. They were Zionists inside
43:14
Speaker 2: the government, Wolf of Wits and Pearl and all those
43:18
Speaker 2: people who who had got key positions in the Department
43:23
Speaker 2: of Defense, in the CIA, and the State Department, in
43:26
Speaker 2: the Treasury Department, and of course in the White House.
43:29
Speaker 2: And that has not less than since then. We know
43:31
Speaker 2: that you can point to the people who are around
43:34
Speaker 2: Trump at the last time and this time, and you
43:37
Speaker 2: can say that, yeah, of course there's some Christian Zionists there,
43:39
Speaker 2: a couple of them, Hexeth for example, and Rubio and others.
43:43
Speaker 2: But the main people who are around him, who who
43:47
Speaker 2: advise him, who are close to him, who fund him,
43:50
Speaker 2: are Jewish Zionists, including Forces, his son in law, who
43:53
Speaker 2: is completely able to evade all responsibility and accountability because
43:58
Speaker 2: he doesn't have a formal position. Now that this is
44:01
Speaker 2: an indication that this is not the interest of the
44:06
Speaker 2: US or US well certainly not the US workers which
44:09
Speaker 2: are being influenced here. It's the interests of the Zionists.
44:12
Speaker 2: And the Zionists have a wet hand here, which people
44:14
Speaker 2: I think are start starting to realize, but it takes
44:18
Speaker 2: a lot of pressure on their ideas for them to
44:21
Speaker 2: to get around to the to understanding the depth of
44:26
Speaker 2: the occupation that there is of the governments of the
44:29
Speaker 2: West by the Zionists.
44:31
Speaker 3: What was JFK's position, Well, as everyone knows, JFK was
44:36
Speaker 3: critical of the Zionists, and that that's why some people
44:38
Speaker 3: say it's likely he was he was whacked by the Mussat,
44:42
Speaker 3: you know.
44:42
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't have a view on that. I
44:45
Speaker 2: haven't done the research on it. It's certainly the case
44:48
Speaker 2: that you know the famous JFK film by Olivestone, and
44:50
Speaker 2: Olive Stone believed that the CIA done it, and he
44:54
Speaker 2: argued with people about that. But of course let's remember
44:56
Speaker 2: he had someone in there as a producer to the
44:58
Speaker 2: film are Non Milkan, who was most sad. So, I mean,
45:03
Speaker 2: you know the thing is that people who are critical Zionism,
45:07
Speaker 2: the massive pressure is put on to get rid of them,
45:11
Speaker 2: to move them away. You just see what happened with
45:13
Speaker 2: Thomas Massey, the largest spending ever on a congressional primary.
45:18
Speaker 2: And that's how the Zionists operate. They brit no surrender.
45:21
Speaker 2: And of course we see the same happening today in
45:24
Speaker 2: Latin America. We see that the hon Jura's Gate scandal,
45:27
Speaker 2: where Argentina and Honduras and the US are acting together.
45:33
Speaker 2: It appears from the leaked emails and messages on behalf
45:37
Speaker 2: and at the behest and funded by the Zionists. Just
45:41
Speaker 2: truly incredible to see that. And you see that wherever
45:44
Speaker 2: you go, the specific role that the Zionis play in countries.
45:49
Speaker 2: You wouldn't think they have anything to do with.
45:53
Speaker 1: Our country. South Africa has a somewhat strained relationship with Israel.
45:57
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know to take it into court, c
46:00
Speaker 1: but it seems to me that it was just symbolic.
46:03
Speaker 2: Well, look, the ICC and the ICG are not going
46:06
Speaker 2: to liberate Palestine. The people who will liberate Palestine will
46:11
Speaker 2: be the Palestine resistance and their key supporters and their
46:15
Speaker 2: key military supporters, as everybody really should know by now,
46:18
Speaker 2: are the Islamic Republic of Iran and the rest of
46:21
Speaker 2: the access of resistance. If it wasn't for the Islamic
46:23
Speaker 2: Republic of Iran, there would be no palastline resistance of
46:27
Speaker 2: the sort which we now see, of the sophistication that
46:30
Speaker 2: we now see, we wouldn't. We wouldn't have Hesbola with
46:33
Speaker 2: the first person, drones destroying Makawa tanks and Israeli basis
46:39
Speaker 2: and is really commanders. None of this would have happened
46:42
Speaker 2: the infrastructure of that without the Islamic Republic of Iran.
46:45
Speaker 2: And I speak to people on the left who who
46:48
Speaker 2: on whom I agree with about almost everything on Palestine
46:51
Speaker 2: and even on Zionism, but they bulk at the question
46:55
Speaker 2: of the Islamic Republic of Iran. They say, oh, well,
46:58
Speaker 2: it's a re actionary, religion ridden state and you and
47:07
Speaker 2: I tell them. You know, I said this to someone
47:08
Speaker 2: the other day that's quite quite prominent left. He said,
47:10
Speaker 2: you should go, go and go and look. You know,
47:13
Speaker 2: you don't have to come to the same conclusion as me,
47:16
Speaker 2: but go and have a look. It really isn't what
47:19
Speaker 2: you what you think it's like at all. I mean, really,
47:21
Speaker 2: it is not at all like that. And actually, if
47:24
Speaker 2: you want to liberate Palestine and defend human civilization against
47:27
Speaker 2: the depredations of the Zionists, then you have to do
47:30
Speaker 2: it by force of arms. The ICG and the ICC
47:33
Speaker 2: is not going to do it. Of course, all credit
47:35
Speaker 2: to the South Africa for taking the cases I think,
47:38
Speaker 2: but there is also, of course, let's remember a strong
47:42
Speaker 2: Zionist lobby in South Africa, and it's important to becognizant
47:47
Speaker 2: about that. Let's remember the case of the Goldstone Report,
47:50
Speaker 2: where Judge Goldstone was actually physically threatened and his family
47:55
Speaker 2: were threatened. I actually find some of his family threatened
48:00
Speaker 2: him h to climb down on his finance, which of
48:03
Speaker 2: course he duly did. So there's there's Zarist movements all
48:07
Speaker 2: over the place, and of course South Africa is a
48:09
Speaker 2: really good case where you actually had Jews take up
48:12
Speaker 2: arms against the apartheid regime as part of them, compete
48:16
Speaker 2: with h and leading and leading members of the armed
48:21
Speaker 2: wing of the African National Congress. And you don't you
48:24
Speaker 2: don't see that kind of anti colonial activity in Palestine today.
48:29
Speaker 2: There were due some Jews, not very many, but there
48:31
Speaker 2: were some Jews took up arms against the French in Algeria.
48:34
Speaker 2: Mostly the Jews were on the other side with the
48:36
Speaker 2: Pied Noir and the colonists, and of course they had
48:38
Speaker 2: to leave when the Algeria Revolution was successful. But look,
48:42
Speaker 2: the way in which this operates is is something which
48:46
Speaker 2: people have not understood. The power of Zionism to organize
48:51
Speaker 2: and to be disciplined, and to to have a pipeline
48:54
Speaker 2: of indoctrination, radicalization and grooming of the young people becoming
49:02
Speaker 2: strong believers in genocide and the defense of genocide all
49:05
Speaker 2: through their lives is something which I think nobody who
49:09
Speaker 2: is who comes either from a secular background or a
49:13
Speaker 2: Christian background, really understands very well. I think the Muslims
49:17
Speaker 2: understand it a little bit better.
49:20
Speaker 1: In terms of world politics. How important is Iran's resistance.
49:25
Speaker 2: Well, I think that if Iran loses that we face
49:30
Speaker 2: a massively expanding Zionist empire. I mean, the Zionists know
49:35
Speaker 2: that they've only got really a couple of years. Well
49:38
Speaker 2: Trump's there, it's their best chance to expand as fast
49:41
Speaker 2: as they can. And that's why, of course they're pressing
49:44
Speaker 2: Trump to start bombing again. Trump's reluctant. His military guys
49:48
Speaker 2: have told him it's not a good idea, that they
49:50
Speaker 2: haven't got the capacity, that they can't do it. But nevertheless,
49:55
Speaker 2: the Zionists are trying to push as far as they can,
49:58
Speaker 2: and they won't of course agree to any any agreement
50:01
Speaker 2: which has made, even one which they signed themselves. They haven't.
50:03
Speaker 2: They haven't kept to the terms of the agreement in Gaza.
50:06
Speaker 2: They've occupied extra parts of Gaza, as Natanyahu candidly admitted
50:11
Speaker 2: the other day. They still have trying to push further
50:16
Speaker 2: into Lebanon. They are occupying an extra part of the
50:18
Speaker 2: south of Syria, and they won't pay any attention to
50:21
Speaker 2: any agreement, even if they sign it themselves. So that
50:25
Speaker 2: is an expansionist and an eliminationist political movement which wants
50:30
Speaker 2: to expand its control everywhere, and unless it's defeated, it
50:35
Speaker 2: will have much more power than we can even imagine.
50:39
Speaker 2: And it's the only people who can defeat it are
50:43
Speaker 2: are led by the Islamic Republic of Iran, the access
50:45
Speaker 2: of resistance. Sure, I'd love it if they if they
50:48
Speaker 2: cutter joined in, or if we got some support from
50:52
Speaker 2: Oman or even Bahrain, and there were revolutions there and
50:58
Speaker 2: there was a much wider access of resistance, but there
51:02
Speaker 2: isn't at present.
51:04
Speaker 1: I've got a friend who's Jewish and he asked me
51:06
Speaker 1: the other day, I'm a Jew and I want a homeland.
51:11
Speaker 1: Why is that such a bad thing?
51:13
Speaker 2: Well, what on earth is that? I mean, this is
51:17
Speaker 2: the thing. What is the homeland for the Jews. The
51:21
Speaker 2: Jews are not a nation. The Jews are a religion.
51:23
Speaker 2: Christians don't have a homeland. They live all over the world.
51:27
Speaker 2: There might be states where there's lots of Christians and
51:29
Speaker 2: there's a Christian majority, just like there are states where
51:31
Speaker 2: there's Muslim majorities. But there is no such thing as
51:34
Speaker 2: as a homeland for Muslim Muslims or for Christians, nor
51:38
Speaker 2: is there for Jews. This is the fundamental mistake which
51:41
Speaker 2: has been made even by anti Zionist Duwes. I think so.
51:44
Speaker 2: I mean, I've just done a piece for the UK
51:47
Speaker 2: call Them magazine on the Bond. The Jewish labor bound
51:50
Speaker 2: famously anti Zionist labor movement, which was involved in the
51:56
Speaker 2: in the revolutionary movements led by Lenin, and in nineteen
52:01
Speaker 2: oh three they came to the Congress of the RSDLP
52:04
Speaker 2: Lenin's party and they said, we want to be the
52:07
Speaker 2: only representative of the Jewish proletariat in the party. And
52:11
Speaker 2: Lenni said, no, this is a Zionist argument. He got
52:15
Speaker 2: that they were anti Zionists, but this is a Zionist argument.
52:17
Speaker 2: The party must represent all workers, not just fractions of
52:21
Speaker 2: the workers. And they had a vote and they lost
52:23
Speaker 2: that vote. But the people who are today saying, yes,
52:27
Speaker 2: I don't agree with the state of Israel, and I
52:29
Speaker 2: don't agree with a homeland for the Jews, but I
52:31
Speaker 2: do believe that the Jews are a people or a nation,
52:34
Speaker 2: and that they have certain rights in that regard. No,
52:36
Speaker 2: they don't have rights as a nation. They have rights
52:38
Speaker 2: as individuals, a human being, and indeed as a religion.
52:42
Speaker 2: But you know, the homeland thing is a slippery slope
52:46
Speaker 2: towards genocide.
52:48
Speaker 1: Can it not be argued that they on ethicity? He
52:50
Speaker 1: argues that they're a lot more than just a religion.
52:54
Speaker 2: Well, what does that mean? I mean that this guy
52:57
Speaker 2: ran on who I mentioned before, he did this thing
53:00
Speaker 2: in the eighteen sixty where he talked about the Semitic languages,
53:03
Speaker 2: and they said the Ashkenazi Ashcanasm were not Semites, they
53:09
Speaker 2: were civilized, so he distinguished them from the Arabs. And
53:14
Speaker 2: he then went on later in his life, I believed
53:16
Speaker 2: twenty three years later he did this famous talk or
53:20
Speaker 2: the Jews of Nation or our Religion, and he showed
53:24
Speaker 2: perfectly clearly that actually the Jews who became the leaders
53:31
Speaker 2: of the Zionist movement, the Ashcanasm from Eastern Europe, have
53:36
Speaker 2: virtually no connection to the Levant. They virtually don't have
53:40
Speaker 2: any ethnic or or cultural connection even to the Levant.
53:46
Speaker 2: And he said this back in eighteen eighty three, and
53:49
Speaker 2: of course it's an argument just being buttressed again by
53:52
Speaker 2: in two thousand and eight by a guy called Shlomo
53:55
Speaker 2: sand who's at Tel Aviv University, who wrote the book
53:58
Speaker 2: called The Invention of the Jewish People, and he goes
54:01
Speaker 2: through it in great detail. He says that you know,
54:02
Speaker 2: the Tartars, they were converted, the people in the Upper Caucasus,
54:08
Speaker 2: the Kazars or whatever, they were converted, and there's actually
54:11
Speaker 2: really very little connections. So the people who are who
54:14
Speaker 2: have the Semitic DNA to talk in that kind of
54:17
Speaker 2: reductions way are the Palestinians. I mean, it's it's obvious
54:23
Speaker 2: there's no ethnic relationship between the different sorts of Jewish
54:27
Speaker 2: people that there are in the world. That Siphardim again
54:30
Speaker 2: don't come from the Levant. They come from North Africa
54:32
Speaker 2: and from Southern Europe. So it's not an ethnic group. Dislikes,
54:38
Speaker 2: they're not an ethnic group. They are all sorts of
54:39
Speaker 2: And you know, indeed, let's look at the flasher the
54:43
Speaker 2: arguments they had inside Israel about whether they could have
54:46
Speaker 2: Ethiopian Jews, and they're like, on the one hand, the
54:49
Speaker 2: Ashkenasima opposed to this because they're black and we don't
54:52
Speaker 2: want black people. On the other hand, they have to
54:55
Speaker 2: make the argument that they're just like us, that the
54:57
Speaker 2: same ethnic group as us, because they're Jews. Of course,
55:00
Speaker 2: it's a nonsense. They're just the same religion.
55:03
Speaker 1: So somebody accuses me of being anti Semitic, is a
55:06
Speaker 1: fair response to that, Well, no, I'm not anti Semitic.
55:10
Speaker 1: I've got nothing against the Arabs.
55:12
Speaker 2: Yes, I think that's right. Yes, but this requires a
55:18
Speaker 2: lot of deconstruction still. I mean, I'm going to write
55:20
Speaker 2: this stuff up, but there's a lot of misunderstanding about this,
55:24
Speaker 2: which is being you know, of course consciously encouraged by
55:26
Speaker 2: the Zionists.
55:28
Speaker 1: How can I follow your work?
55:30
Speaker 2: So I'm on x form with Twitter at tracking Underscore Power,
55:36
Speaker 2: I'm on Substack at tracking Power, I'm on Instagram, and
55:41
Speaker 2: I run an organization called spin Watch spinwatch dot org
55:44
Speaker 2: and also the wiki website where we put up profiles
55:48
Speaker 2: of tons of organizations called powerbase dot info.
55:53
Speaker 1: Just by the way, your knowledge on South Africa is
55:56
Speaker 1: quite good. Have you been here?
55:58
Speaker 2: I have, yes. I was in South Africa in was
56:04
Speaker 2: it two thousand and four? I think yes, in two
56:07
Speaker 2: thousand and four, which is where I met the terrible
56:10
Speaker 2: anti Semitic Jewish person Joel Cavell, actually at International Sociological Conference. Yes,
56:16
Speaker 2: I went to Durban and to Cape Town and to
56:20
Speaker 2: Joe Burgh and to kaya Leica and Soweto and various places.
56:25
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, on that note, David Miller, thank you for
56:27
Speaker 1: joining me in the Drangers.
56:29
Speaker 2: Thank you.