Latest / Karl and Crew / Hope after Infidelity with Jill Savage & Evidence for the Resurrection with J. Warner Wallace

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Hope after Infidelity with Jill Savage & Evidence for the Resurrection with J. Warner Wallace · Karl and Crew

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  S1: Broadcasting from Chicago, across North America and beyond. It's Carl
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  S1: and crew. Come as you are an experienced guide. Overcome
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  S1: what seems impossible and live as you never imagined. Start
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  S1: your morning with a laugh.
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  S2: Practical from the Bible. Tips and tricks to kill. Not
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  S2: tricks but tips and tricks.
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  S3: Tips and tricks to kill. Tips and tricks.
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  S1: Delivering the truth daily.
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  S4: All of my attempts to, you know, prop myself up
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  S4: with achievement in good works. Well, God wasn't impressed by that,
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  S4: even if other people were.
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  S2: The gospel changes everything.
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  S5: Freedom in Christ. Man, it's like that backpack of cement
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  S5: just falling to the ground.
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  S1: Now from the call of Hope Studios, this is Carl
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  S1: and Crew.
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  S6: What a day, what a day. So much going on globally.
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  S6: Oh my goodness guys this has been a roller coaster
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  S6: here these last few weeks with everything going on in Iran.
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  S6: By the way, Lana Silk, we're going to have her
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  S6: in here Friday. Let the dust settle on this supposed
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  S6: ceasefire and then get a perspective. I think one of
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  S6: the things that's interesting to me is I just look
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  S6: at the lay of the land with everything that's happening
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  S6: in Iran is the thing that gets left out from
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  S6: everyone is what are the Iranian people thinking?
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  S2: Yeah.
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  S6: Part of that is due to the fact that you
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  S6: can't talk to them. Uh, one, uh, really, uh, really
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  S6: sweet follower of Christ that I follow on social media
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  S6: a little bit. She hasn't even been able to talk
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  S6: to her family in a month. No communication whatsoever. And
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  S6: she has all the backchannels. So when you've got a
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  S6: total shutdown of communication, it's hard to know what in
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  S6: the world is going on. So we're going to let
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  S6: the dust settle a little bit here about 48 hours.
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  S6: Get Lana silk in, get a feel for what's going on.
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  S6: But I'm most interested in. What did the people of
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  S6: Iran feel about what's going on there? We know that
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  S6: there's a hunger and a desire. Even Lana Silk said
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  S6: that she thought that ultimately regime change was going to happen.
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  S6: And they're hoping that for Christ's followers there who have
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  S6: paid a horrific price, along with any citizens that rose
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  S6: up against the current government. And I think one of
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  S6: the best things for me is when I see things
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  S6: like this is what's what, what do people feel? What
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  S6: are what are they feeling? What's happening here? I don't
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  S6: know if there's a little bit of hope dashed as, uh,
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  S6: the prospects are pretty high. And, you know, this is
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  S6: where we got to be biblical on this one. Guys,
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  S6: I think any notion that you're going to get, uh, a,
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  S6: a dominant regime in some of those countries that is
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  S6: going to be somehow God fearing is inherently flawed because
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  S6: the scriptures are clear that it's going to be Iran
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  S6: in particular that's going to come against when for the
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  S6: battle of Gog and Magog. My goodness, they aren't going
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  S6: to be favorable toward Israel. No one is. We got
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  S6: to remember, it's weird. It's like we have this bifurcated perspective.
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  S6: Even Christ followers, it's like, all right, this is how
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  S6: the end is going to go down. And maybe now
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  S6: between now and then, we're going to we might have
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  S6: some cycles of history. We don't know when the Lord's
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  S6: going to come, but at the end of the day,
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  S6: there's not going to be warm fuzzies toward Israel or
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  S6: toward Jesus Christ. He's going to be maligned right to
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  S6: the end, no doubt about it. So we've got interesting
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  S6: days in front of us here. Really interesting days. Father,
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  S6: I stop right now to pray for the people of Iran.
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  S6: We think of men and women, boys and girls. We
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  S6: think of people that are up and. Oh, let's see
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  S6: here time wise. It's coming up on noon, I noon,
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  S6: I guess, over there. Uh. Their world is so uncertain.
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  S6: And yet. God, you are certain still. And Lord, we
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  S6: find all over Scripture those who put their faith in
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  S6: Jesus Christ will ultimately not be disappointed. And so, Lord,
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  S6: we pray for the awakening that is happening, the revival
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  S6: that's happening, that you would increase it and that you
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  S6: would protect men and women, boys and girls. Lord, we
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  S6: live in a world that with such violence and such injustice.
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  S6: And we praise you that one day you will hold
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  S6: the scales and you will balance it all out. We
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  S6: don't know how you're going to do that. And there's
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  S6: obviously a cry in our soul because we're image bearers
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  S6: for justice. But Lord, we do pray that you would be.
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  S6: And I thank you that as we pray, you are
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  S6: above it all, you are again not wringing your hands.
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  S6: You are sovereign over all things. You rise up and
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  S6: you take down and you are good. So, Lord, through
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  S6: it all, uh, allow people that are far from you
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  S6: to come to you. And I pray that you would
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  S6: quicken spirits and that there would be this prevenient grace,
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  S6: a revival of prevenient grace, that the remnant in Iran
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  S6: would grow strong. And Lord, as we sit in really
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  S6: the lap of luxury relative to what our brothers and
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  S6: sisters go through around the world, would you remind us
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  S6: to pray often and to be locked at a heart
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  S6: level with them today? Our brothers and sisters in Iran
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  S6: and in harm's way all around the globe. And Lord,
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  S6: just give us a perspective that sees you as sovereign
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  S6: over all things as you are and will be careful
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  S6: to give you the glory. I do pray for revival
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  S6: in our country, Lord, that we would take hold of
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  S6: these moments of freedom that we have and that we
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  S6: would be unashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ. I
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  S6: thank you how you've proven to me in the last
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  S6: even three, four days, how there are people who are.
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  S6: Fearful enough of you, God. And that's the beginning of wisdom.
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  S6: They're fearful enough of you that if they just had
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  S6: a fair shot at the gospel, they would surrender their
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  S6: lives to Jesus, who you sent out of love so
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  S6: that we would know you, that we'd be saved from
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  S6: our sins. So, Lord, we just humble ourselves under your
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  S6: mighty hand today. And we thank you that you are
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  S6: good and that you are God. There is no one
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  S6: like you. And Lord, I thank you that one day,
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  S6: as you promised in revelation 21, There will be no
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  S6: more tears. There will be incredible community. There won't even
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  S6: be any kind of proving ground. Because we'll have nothing
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  S6: to prove. Nothing to gain, nothing to lose. We'll be
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  S6: with you in this entrepreneurial building and having new conquering
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  S6: things that are based on a whole different kind of
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  S6: way of life that that will be this eternal reward
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  S6: of being with you. And Lord, what's amazing is, and
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  S6: I'm blown away by this, is that that reward has
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  S6: nothing to do with us. So keep us at a
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  S6: point where we realize that we are what we are
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  S6: by the grace of God. That's it. And that this
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  S6: is all about Christ in us. The hope of glory.
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  S6: The hope of glory. So Lord, as we're focusing on
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  S6: hope this week, I just pray that we will be
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  S6: true to your word, that we will not try to
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  S6: squeeze out hope in circumstances or in our status, or
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  S6: in satisfaction that we can get from this earth. Lord,
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  S6: help us to see even those moments of satisfaction, uh,
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  S6: as from your hand. And I praise you for that.
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  S6: In Jesus name, Amen.
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  S4: Amen.
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  S6: God is good all the time. Coming up here in
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  S6: a moment, uh, there's a powerful passage of Scripture. Have
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  S6: you ever noticed how. Oh my goodness. I had a
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  S6: wild day yesterday. I had a I had a day.
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  S6: I don't want to get into details about it, but
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  S6: it was like, oh boy, what are you doing here? God.
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  S6: And then it hit me late in the afternoon, early evening,
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  S6: that God is in the business of forcing us by
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  S6: his grace, right back to dependence on him. And he
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  S6: loves us enough to show us our need for him.
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  S6: Isn't that terrific?
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  S7: It's freeing. It's terrific. And sometimes really painful. Yes.
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  S6: Isn't it? Isn't that something, guys? Isn't that. I mean,
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  S6: isn't that something? God loves us so much, he will
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  S6: allow circumstances, um, physical challenges, spiritual warfare, all of it
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  S6: is is designed that we might cling to him. And
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  S6: if we can remember that, that would help us, wouldn't it?
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  S2: It would. That would certainly help us. I wish, I
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  S2: wish I could be reminded to cling to him through
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  S2: like parties that were being thrown for me. And so,
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  S2: you know, just really nice things. But you're right. I
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  S2: often learn to cling to him most through the difficult
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  S2: stuff of my day.
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  S6: Yeah. And, and a real sign of maturity is probably
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  S6: what Joe Clausen, my dad embodied. Uh, you know, he
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  S6: was great. He he never spiritually, uh, he never spiritually. Uh,
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  S6: how do I say this? Kind of, uh, rebuked me
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  S6: or anything to get the grace of God embedded into
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  S6: my head. But I remember one time coming off of, uh,
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  S6: off of a stage, I speaking to a few thousand
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  S6: people and my dad was one of my elders at
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  S6: a church in Alaska. And it was one of those
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  S6: services where no joking, I was telling prompted by the spirit,
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  S6: I had a manuscript in front of me, but it
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  S6: was the nuances of little words that the spirit was
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  S6: guiding me in, and I could see palpably, tangibly the
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  S6: Spirit of God moving, and anyone that was there felt
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  S6: the Spirit of God. Now it could be that the
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  S6: temptation from Satan. And clearly it's that that we would
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  S6: somehow attach something to ourselves, right? Sure, man, I did
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  S6: pretty good.
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  S2: You did a great job up there.
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  S6: And I really did good. I mean, I was at a,
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  S6: I was at a devo here on Monday. That Ali
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  S6: did for the whole team. And she did such a
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  S6: tremendous job.
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  S8: She did.
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  S6: She did a tremendous job. But the danger in that
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  S6: in all those things is you can start thinking, I'm
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  S6: not I'm not.
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  S7: Talking.
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  S6: For you at all, Ali, but sure it for any person,
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  S6: you come off of something like that and you go, man. Yeah.
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  S6: And there's this. If you head down that path of boy,
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  S6: I did a good thing there. Now am I, am
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  S6: I diminishing that we we are vessels that can be
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  S6: used for the glory of God? No. That's awesome. But
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  S6: it's all about the direction of our rejoicing. And the
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  S6: more we're inclined to look up to God and say, oh,
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  S6: thank you. So I came off the stage and it's
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  S6: literally one of these stages where you don't walk down
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  S6: toward the people, you walk out the back because you
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  S6: got another service loading up here soon. And I walk
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  S6: out the back. And here in the kind of the
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  S6: dim glow of backstage. Here's my dad greeting me. And
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  S6: he had scooted around the back and he held that
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  S6: fist up in front of him and he said, oh, oh, Carl. Oh, Carl.
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  S6: God gave you great freedom and liberty. I said, yeah, dad,
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  S6: he did. And it was good to have dad back
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  S6: there because Satan was back there, too, and he was
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  S6: baiting me to think you're pretty good. He did all
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  S6: right up there. But dad was there to hold on
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  S6: to that moment. And if you can hold on to
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  S6: that moment where you see that great cup of coffee,
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  S6: where you see that kid that's doing something great on
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  S6: the court or in mathematics or something like that. And
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  S6: you can redirect all that glory and praise right back
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  S6: to God, not to your fancy footwork or your great parenting.
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  S6: But isn't that something, Ali? Yeah.
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  S4: It's true that temptation is always there to whether things
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  S4: are going really well or things were in a tough spot.
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  S4: The temptation is always to direct our gaze to ourselves.
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  S6: It's always there.
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  S4: Always there in every circumstance, in every season, whether it's a. Oh,
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  S4: I'm so great or a woe is me. We can
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  S4: become self-focused in a heartbeat.
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  S6: So I want to pull a dad on you and
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  S6: Ali and tell you, oh, God gave you great liberty
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  S6: and freedom and clarity of speech on Monday when you
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  S6: gave that devo to our whole staff. Man, he did Ali.
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  S6: And he did, didn't he?
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  S4: Praise God.
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  S6: Isn't that.
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  S4: Sweet? Praise God. Yes.
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  S6: Isn't that sweet? Okay, coming up here in a moment. Uh,
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  S6: where does where's hope derived? Well, we've said in a person.
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  S6: But what if I told you it's the whole Trinity?
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  S6: They all got a hand in this deal. Father. Son.
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  S6: Holy spirit.
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  S4: That's good to know.
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  S6: Isn't that good to know? They're ganging up on us
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  S6: for hope, Ali.
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  S4: That's the best kind of gang up.
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  S6: It's tremendous. And so we're going to break it down
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  S6: for you straight ahead.
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  S1: He was running from God, but God's love brought him home.
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  S1: Carl is in the crew. It's Carl and crew on
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  S1: Moody Radio.
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  S6: Uh, it's cool man. Uh. Romans 15, getting near the
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  S6: end of the sticky pages in the book of Romans.
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  S6: Maybe don't hang out there a lot, but it's this
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  S6: roundhouse celebration of Paul writing this letter to the Gentiles saying, man,
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  S6: you've got this great salvation. It's so good. Let me
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  S6: just cherry pick. Rejoice, O Gentiles, with his people. Praise
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  S6: the Lord, all you Gentiles, and let all the peoples
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  S6: extol him. Then it says something really, really powerful here
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  S6: in verse 13. This caps off this roundhouse of celebrating
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  S6: the salvation that we have. It says this May the
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  S6: God of hope fill you with all joy and peace
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  S6: in believing, so that by the power of the Holy
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  S6: Spirit you may abound in hope. Father, son, Holy spirit
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  S6: at work here. Ali.
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  S4: Okay, so may the God of hope fill.
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  S6: The God of hope.
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  S4: Fill you with all joy.
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  S6: As in believing, right?
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  S4: So that by the power of the Holy Spirit you
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  S4: may abound in hope.
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  S6: Yeah, this is fascinating. So just some core theology. God
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  S6: loved the world so much that he sent his Son
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  S6: that by believing in him you may have life in
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  S6: his name. Now that's John 316. But then you go
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  S6: further on into the gospel of John, and what do
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  S6: you find? You find that the Holy Spirit now is
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  S6: our great advantage, and he's here to help remind us
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  S6: of truth and to fill us up to overflowing with
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  S6: the presence and power of God. This is so cool
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  S6: because let me just break this down for us here quickly.
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  S6: There's a lot of words that have been spoken by
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  S6: great theologians about this verse, but at the end of
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  S6: the day, hope is not circumstances, right? Good or bad. Ali.
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  S4: Correct.
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  S6: Good or bad, it's not circumstances, but may the God
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  S6: of hope fill you. So that's, that's, that's the thing
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  S6: right there. May fill you with all joy and peace
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  S6: in believing, believing in. Because the context here is believing
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  S6: in Jesus Christ, the Savior of the world for salvation
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  S6: that we find in him, so that by the power
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  S6: of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. So
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  S6: the presence of hope is found in Jesus by believing
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  S6: in Jesus sent to you by the father, and that
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  S6: the only way that we're going to abound in hope
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  S6: is to be filled up with the Holy Spirit. So
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  S6: the only question here is what we come back to
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  S6: time and again. How in the world are we filled
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  S6: up with the Holy Spirit? Some of you feel like
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  S6: you're low on the hope factor today, and maybe you've
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  S6: been on a mad dash looking for something to squeeze
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  S6: a little hope out of. It's found in the father, son,
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  S6: and Holy Spirit filled up to overflowing with this hope.
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  S6: So let's break that down straight ahead.
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  S1: You're listening to Curl and Crew on Moody Radio.
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  S6: May the God of hope fill you with all joy
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  S6: and peace in believing so that you may have power.
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  S6: The power of the Holy Spirit may abound in in hope.
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  S6: What an amazing thing. Uh, we're talking about hope rising
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  S6: all week long, and there are. From Douglas Mu to, uh,
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  S6: John Stott, you name it, this verse has been absolutely
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  S6: hammered by commentators because here you find father, son, Holy
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  S6: Spirit working together. But here's six little bullets that will
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  S6: kind of help you kind of identify what's really going
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  S6: on here. The spirit produces hope. How? By anchoring you
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  S6: in the truth. We go back to John 14, John 16.
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  S6: What do we find, man? The Holy Spirit's going to come,
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  S6: and he's going to remind you of everything that I've spoken.
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  S6: Primary function of the of the spirit of the living
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  S6: God is to get us anchored in truth. Why is
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  S6: that so important, guys?
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  S4: Oh, because if you don't have an anchor in truth,
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  S4: then you are going to be swayed by how you
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  S4: feel at any given moment, what your circumstances suggest, what
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  S4: other people say, what culture says. You will be like
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  S4: a leaf in the wind, kind of blown about.
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  S2: Truth is the one thing that doesn't change. Yeah. In life.
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  S2: So that's where hope should be grappled in.
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  S6: Yeah. Otherwise we're going to be left to circumstances and feelings.
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  S6: And that's dangerous.
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  S2: That's very dangerous.
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  S6: Theologians agree. It's then assuring your identity and lifting your perspective.
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  S6: In fact, Douglas Moose says that let me try to
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  S6: grab this quote here. This is pretty cool. Here. Let
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  S6: me try to find this thing quickly. If I could, uh,
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  S6: Douglas Moose says hope is rooted in the objective promises
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  S6: of God. This is why it's so important to be
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  S6: in the Word of God, right? I mean, the objective
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  S6: promises of God, you gotta hold on to those things.
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  S6: And then settling in your heart and overcoming fear and
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  S6: connecting you to Christ hears. At the end of the day,
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  S6: the Holy Spirit is going to remind us of what
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  S6: Jesus said. Settle our hearts because we go through all
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  S6: these circumstances and situations. But the richest among us focus
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  S6: on the promises of God, the truth of our identity,
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  S6: the future hope of glory. And that's the only that's
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  S6: the only thing that hope can flow from.
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  S4: And when you think about it, you know, you think
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  S4: about times when maybe my hope was shaken or low.
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  S4: And when I've gone to people in my life who
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  S4: I know are mature in their faith and who are
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  S4: grounded in Scripture, that's what they that's what any wise
• 20:04
  S4: believer will point you to.
• 20:06
  S8: Yeah.
• 20:07
  S6: Every time. Every time you find someone that is rich
• 20:13
  S6: in faith, they are anchored in the promises of God.
• 20:16
  S8: Yeah.
• 20:17
  S6: They are not swayed by the conditions of the world
• 20:23
  S6: or the situations that we're in. There's something in their heart, soul, mind,
• 20:29
  S6: strength that is almost transported to another place. So today,
• 20:37
  S6: get your. If you're lacking hope, let the Holy Spirit
• 20:40
  S6: guide you to the word. Get anchored in the promises
• 20:43
  S6: of God. Look at the future. Revelation 21. Those tears
• 20:48
  S6: are going to be wiped away one day. We have
• 20:50
  S6: hope for today because we have hope for tomorrow. That's
• 20:54
  S6: the beauty of it. And this isn't bubble gum. This
• 20:57
  S6: isn't smoke and mirrors. This is truth anchored in Scripture.
• 21:01
  S6: And all you have to do is look at the
• 21:03
  S6: life that God's changed in you to believe it. If
• 21:06
  S6: he's got the power to raise you from the life
• 21:10
  S6: in which you live, to the life you now live,
• 21:12
  S6: he has hope for tomorrow.
• 21:14
  S1: Want to hear that again? Just download the Curl and
• 21:17
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 21:20
  S6: It's Carl and crew. Oh my goodness. We should be
• 21:23
  S6: in Fuego here right now. Ali. Um, every line should
• 21:27
  S6: be filled. So let me give you some basis for this.
• 21:30
  S6: This is so great. May the God of hope fill
• 21:34
  S6: you with all joy and peace in believing. So this
• 21:37
  S6: is a picture of father, son, and Holy Spirit here.
• 21:39
  S6: May the God of hope fill you with all joy
• 21:42
  S6: and peace in believing in Christ. The context of Romans
• 21:45
  S6: 15 is come on, rejoice, O Gentiles, with his people.
• 21:49
  S6: Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles, and let all the
• 21:52
  S6: peoples extol him. Because we've been grafted in to this
• 21:56
  S6: great salvation found in Jesus Christ. So it goes on
• 22:00
  S6: so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you
• 22:03
  S6: may abound in hope. So you gotta ask the question,
• 22:06
  S6: what's the primary function of the Holy Spirit is to
• 22:08
  S6: guide us into all truth. He's the comforter. This is
• 22:11
  S6: what we find in John 14. It's to our advantage
• 22:14
  S6: that he comes. He is speaking. He is here, and
• 22:18
  S6: he leverages the Word of God in a way that
• 22:21
  S6: gives us hope, that transcends circumstances. Now, if that ain't
• 22:25
  S6: something to celebrate, I don't know what it is.
• 22:28
  S4: Well, I mean, because circumstances change readily. You know? And
• 22:34
  S4: have you ever been in, like, a good, like a
• 22:36
  S4: season where things are going really good and you're kind
• 22:38
  S4: of like waiting for something to happen that shakes everything
• 22:42
  S4: up because you feel like it can't be this good
• 22:44
  S4: for this long.
• 22:46
  S6: Yeah. Yeah. And that's why even in, in, in dry
• 22:51
  S6: times and in harvests, we've got to stay anchored in truth.
• 22:55
  S4: Absolutely.
• 22:56
  S6: All right. What's the question.
• 22:57
  S4: We're asking you. What promise are you holding on to
• 23:00
  S4: that gives you hope in every circumstance. 805. Five 578. 98.
• 23:06
  S6: Yeah. Give us a call right now. Let's light them up.
• 23:08
  S6: We're going to go lightning round 800 555 7898. Uh, Desiree,
• 23:14
  S6: I believe first time caller from Florida. What do you say?
• 23:18
  S9: Hi. Good morning. I am standing in the hope of
• 23:22
  S9: Genesis chapter 26. Okay. The Bible said that God told
• 23:25
  S9: Isaac to stay in the land. And so my word
• 23:29
  S9: that I'm standing on this morning is that the condition
• 23:33
  S9: of the land has nothing to do with the word
• 23:35
  S9: that God receive God's Word, supersede the condition of the land.
• 23:41
  S9: Because Isaac stayed and because he stayed, the Bible said
• 23:45
  S9: that he planted in the year of famine, and he
• 23:49
  S9: was able to reap not because of the condition of
• 23:52
  S9: the land, but because of the Word of God.
• 23:55
  S6: Boom, sister.
• 23:57
  S9: On that this morning that the that God is mightier
• 24:01
  S9: than the famine. And I'm so grateful this morning for
• 24:04
  S9: that word that has been solidified in my spirit.
• 24:07
  S10: Oh, that is so good.
• 24:10
  S6: That is.
• 24:10
  S10: So good.
• 24:12
  S6: This man, you're digging in the word sister. That's. That's
• 24:16
  S6: not a magnet verse on a refrigerator. I'm not Pooh
• 24:19
  S6: poohing those. That's just good theology. Yeah. What do you say?
• 24:22
  S6: 800 555 7898.
• 24:26
  S2: You know, for me, I've been holding on to this
• 24:29
  S2: one lately. Psalm 1819, it says, he led me to
• 24:33
  S2: a place of safety. He rescued me because he delights
• 24:36
  S2: in me. And this is something that I've held on to,
• 24:40
  S2: because it shows me that Jesus rescued me not out
• 24:44
  S2: of some weird sense of obligation, I created him. I
• 24:49
  S2: need to, you know, save him. No, he saved me
• 24:51
  S2: because he delights in me. He takes great pleasure in
• 24:55
  S2: who I am. And I think that's important because even
• 24:57
  S2: though we don't say that, we think it's a sense
• 25:00
  S2: of obligation. Sometimes we live like Jesus doesn't delight in
• 25:04
  S2: us in his creation. No, he delights in you. You
• 25:07
  S2: are his son, his daughter, and he will rescue you
• 25:09
  S2: because he delights in you.
• 25:11
  S6: Beautiful man. What promises are you holding on to that
• 25:14
  S6: give you hope in every circumstance? What are they? 800
• 25:20
  S6: 555 78. 98. Give us a call.
• 25:24
  S1: He was sharing the gospel on the radio and then
• 25:27
  S1: he got saved. Young thunders in the crew. It's Karl
• 25:31
  S1: and crew on Moody Radio.
• 25:33
  S6: All right, going to the phone lines here. Asking you
• 25:36
  S6: a question. What promises are you holding on to that
• 25:38
  S6: give you hope in every circumstance? Annalise. First time caller
• 25:43
  S6: from Bermuda. Oh, I love that island. You got a
• 25:47
  S6: you got a great spot. Oh my goodness. Good morning
• 25:51
  S6: to you.
• 25:51
  S11: Thank you. Good morning.
• 25:54
  S6: What are you holding on to.
• 25:56
  S11: For we know that all things work together for our good.
• 26:00
  S11: To them that love the Lord to the called according
• 26:03
  S11: to his purpose. And I am one of them. So
• 26:06
  S11: no matter what situation I am in, I know that
• 26:08
  S11: all things are working for my good.
• 26:11
  S3: Yes.
• 26:12
  S6: Yeah. Oh, Annalise. Annalise, I gotta tell you something, sister.
• 26:18
  S6: Not only do I hear that in you, but when
• 26:21
  S6: my bride first went to Bermuda, we were blown away
• 26:25
  S6: at the community of faith there that were genuinely rock
• 26:29
  S6: solid in Jesus. There's there's a bunch of Jesus followers
• 26:33
  S6: on your island there, sister.
• 26:35
  S11: Ah.
• 26:36
  S6: Yeah. Oh. Oh, beautiful. All right. Well, good morning to you.
• 26:39
  S6: By the way, what's the temperature in Bermuda this morning?
• 26:43
  S11: Oh, it was 60 degrees and it's been raining since yesterday.
• 26:46
  S11: It should be raining until Friday.
• 26:48
  S6: Well, see, that just proves it's rainy in Bermuda. And
• 26:52
  S6: Annalise has got it going on with God here this morning.
• 26:55
  S6: Not just.
• 26:56
  S4: The sunshine that's producing the.
• 26:57
  S6: Hope. Romans 828. Awesome stuff. Way to go, Annalise. Let's
• 27:02
  S6: go back to the phone lines here.
• 27:04
  S4: Let's go to Mark, first time caller from Indiana. Good morning. Mark.
• 27:07
  S4: What's the promise that you're holding on to that gives
• 27:09
  S4: you hope in every circumstance?
• 27:13
  S12: It is he who began a good work in me
• 27:17
  S12: is faithful to complete it.
• 27:18
  S6: Amen. Philippians one six, man. And he's it's his work. Mark,
• 27:23
  S6: how freeing is that, my man?
• 27:26
  S12: You know, it. Um, no matter what I'm going through.
• 27:31
  S12: You know, if it's a high or a low, if
• 27:33
  S12: I'm struggling, I can always go back to that. Uh,
• 27:38
  S12: because he his work in me is a mystery. You know, uh,
• 27:43
  S12: there's things that I don't understand, but he understands. And
• 27:47
  S12: so I just go back to that and it just, uh,
• 27:52
  S12: all the anxiety about any struggles just goes away.
• 27:55
  S10: Boom, brother, boom, boom, boom.
• 27:58
  S6: Awesome, man. That's why we call you the boom crew.
• 28:01
  S6: Let's get at least one more in here.
• 28:02
  S4: Ali Francis, first time caller from Murfreesboro, Tennessee. Tell us
• 28:06
  S4: we got about a minute for you. What's that promise
• 28:08
  S4: you're holding on to it.
• 28:11
  S13: Verse 90, Psalm 91, verse two. And it's a rewording
• 28:15
  S13: of it. Lord, you are our refuge. We trust you
• 28:19
  S13: and we are safe. Five years ago, my husband was
• 28:21
  S13: thrown into emergency surgery and I was told he may die.
• 28:26
  S13: He may never walk again, or my baby able to
• 28:29
  S13: fix it. And I had nothing there. No Bible, no nothing.
• 28:32
  S13: Nobody could see me because it was Covid. And I
• 28:36
  S13: hung on to that verse through three emergency surgeries. And
• 28:39
  S13: yet again, another one, two and a half years later,
• 28:41
  S13: and I'm still hanging on to it.
• 28:43
  S6: Oh, Frances.
• 28:44
  S8: I.
• 28:44
  S6: See you're one of those rock solid, unshakeable women of
• 28:49
  S6: God because you got your feet on the rock, and
• 28:52
  S6: that's beautiful. How beautiful is this, guys? I have this hope.
• 28:57
  S6: 10th Avenue North get anchored in the word of God.
• 29:01
  S1: He's a sports fanatic with a stat for anything you
• 29:04
  S1: can think of. Young Thunder is in the crew. It's
• 29:09
  S1: curl and crew on Moody Radio.
• 29:11
  S4: Well, when you think about marriage, there is a segment
• 29:15
  S4: of the population that grew up always planning what their
• 29:18
  S4: wedding would look like. Maybe eyeing dresses and floral arrangements
• 29:23
  S4: and picking out names for children when they were a
• 29:27
  S4: child themselves. I had a best friend like that growing up.
• 29:30
  S4: My next door neighbor. She had names picked out when
• 29:33
  S4: she was probably about 12 or 13 years old. But
• 29:36
  S4: then there's another segment of the population that looks at
• 29:39
  S4: marriage and thinks, that seems like a lot of work.
• 29:42
  S4: A lot of trouble. And I don't know if that's
• 29:45
  S4: for me. I tell the story of my husband, who
• 29:48
  S4: had a friend who had been dating a woman for
• 29:52
  S4: a while, and he said, why don't you just. This
• 29:54
  S4: was my husband to the friend. Why don't you just
• 29:57
  S4: go ahead and get married? And he goes, you know what?
• 29:59
  S4: I just don't think I'm. I don't think I'm ready yet.
• 30:02
  S4: I'm just not ready for marriage. And then my husband
• 30:05
  S4: gave me the kicker, the part that really knocked me back.
• 30:07
  S4: I said, well, how long have they been together? And
• 30:09
  S4: he said, 17 years. I said, 17 years. Jill Savage,
• 30:15
  S4: our guest right now. You've got you've got people on
• 30:18
  S4: all sides of this one, people who are ready for
• 30:21
  S4: marriage before they're even through puberty. And then you've got
• 30:24
  S4: people who go, yeah, I'm gonna keep this train moving
• 30:28
  S4: along where I can just stay with this person for
• 30:31
  S4: a long time. And it's just a piece of paper, right?
• 30:34
  S4: Jill Savage, our guest. What do you say to that?
• 30:37
  S14: Oh my goodness. But you're right. People swing from one
• 30:40
  S14: side of the spectrum to the other when it comes
• 30:43
  S14: to marriage, for sure. And are any of us ever
• 30:47
  S14: ready for marriage? Ali. I don't think so. Let's be honest.
• 30:51
  S14: I don't think any of us are. I don't think that, honestly.
• 30:54
  S14: I think very few of us read the fine print
• 30:57
  S14: on marriage, which is like, you know, hey, this is
• 31:01
  S14: going to require dying to self. This is going to
• 31:04
  S14: require giving of yourself. You know, we all say the words,
• 31:08
  S14: or at least most of us, for better or for worse.
• 31:11
  S14: But do we really think worse will happen? I think
• 31:14
  S14: that often we have stars in our eyes.
• 31:17
  S4: Jill Savage, author, blogger, international speaker. She hosts the No
• 31:21
  S4: More Perfect podcast. She's been featured on focus on the Family, crosswalk,
• 31:25
  S4: Family Life Today, Today's Christian Woman magazine. You know, I'm curious,
• 31:30
  S4: what kind of expectations did you go into when you were, uh,
• 31:35
  S4: getting married? You were engaged to be married to your husband, Mark.
• 31:38
  S4: Did you expect. Were you in sort of that happily
• 31:41
  S4: ever after fairy tale vibe?
• 31:44
  S14: I was, I was, and I, I had a couple now,
• 31:49
  S14: it's funny because if you ask both of us, I
• 31:51
  S14: had a few unrealistic expectations. My husband had a whole
• 31:55
  S14: truckload of unrealistic expectations. Um, and that, you know, fueled
• 32:00
  S14: some of the challenges that we later faced, which I'm
• 32:03
  S14: sure you and I will talk about. But there were
• 32:06
  S14: two for me, big ones. One is I did not
• 32:10
  S14: expect us to argue and disagree because I didn't ever
• 32:15
  S14: see my parents do that. And so I didn't. I
• 32:20
  S14: know whether they did that behind closed doors, whether one
• 32:23
  S14: of them was just so much of a pleaser that
• 32:26
  S14: that they didn't incite that kind of disagreement. But that
• 32:30
  S14: didn't happen for us because we had our first argument
• 32:32
  S14: on our honeymoon. So that blew that expectation out of
• 32:36
  S14: the water. And then the second one that I struggled
• 32:39
  S14: with is I really thought we would think more alike.
• 32:43
  S14: And again, I'm thinking that this probably came from me seeing,
• 32:47
  S14: you know, this very peaceful marriage that my parents had.
• 32:51
  S14: And I assumed they thought more alike. Now, I've come
• 32:56
  S14: to know over the years, they didn't. They learned how
• 32:59
  S14: to handle that in different ways. But, um, that surprised
• 33:03
  S14: me big time. I just thought, our brains don't even
• 33:06
  S14: work the same.
• 33:07
  S4: Yeah. Jill Savage, our guest right now. You've been very
• 33:11
  S4: open and honest throughout your years of ministry about the
• 33:14
  S4: biggest struggle that your husband and you walked through. Talk
• 33:17
  S4: a little bit about that for our listeners.
• 33:20
  S14: Yeah. Well, when we had been married 28 years, let's say,
• 33:24
  S14: particularly for my husband, that had been 28 years of
• 33:29
  S14: disappointment because of his expectations. And it honestly wasn't even
• 33:35
  S14: about marriage. Like he was disappointed in God. He was
• 33:39
  S14: disappointed in marriage. He was disappointed in people. And so
• 33:44
  S14: he was in a not good place. And in the
• 33:48
  S14: midst of all of that disappointment and and at that point,
• 33:52
  S14: his perspective was, you know, everybody else is a problem.
• 33:56
  S14: I'm not the problem. Everybody else is a problem. And
• 33:59
  S14: so he couldn't get a, you know, find any place
• 34:02
  S14: where he had contentment. And so he thought, well, you know,
• 34:05
  S14: the answer to that is I need to find contentment elsewhere.
• 34:10
  S14: And even though that went against what he deep down believed,
• 34:16
  S14: he was in a place. And when he tells the story,
• 34:20
  S14: he often uses these exact words. He was in a
• 34:23
  S14: place without hope. And when he was in a place
• 34:27
  S14: without hope, then it caused him to start to say, well,
• 34:32
  S14: I'm going to have to take care of this myself.
• 34:34
  S14: I'm going to find the happiness I'm looking for. And ultimately,
• 34:39
  S14: he had an affair, and that affair went on long enough.
• 34:43
  S14: About eight months. Nine months, that actually he began to
• 34:47
  S14: realize there wasn't hope in that. And so that became
• 34:52
  S14: an awakening for him to go, wait a minute, I
• 34:57
  S14: don't even think this is the answer either. However, as
• 35:01
  S14: you can imagine, by that time it had blown up
• 35:04
  S14: our family. It had blown up my heart. Um, it
• 35:08
  S14: was a really dark, difficult season.
• 35:11
  S4: You know, you mentioned that he had lost hope. Did
• 35:15
  S4: you when you became aware, obviously you knew that you
• 35:18
  S4: could see that he was struggling in his faith in his,
• 35:22
  S4: you know, sense of purpose, sense of identity. Did you
• 35:26
  S4: have hope that things could be repaired or did you
• 35:29
  S4: go to a place of hopelessness too?
• 35:32
  S14: Thankfully, I stayed in a place of hope. I was
• 35:35
  S14: in a place of deep pain. So don't confuse us.
• 35:40
  S14: I mean, I probably cried more in those nine months.
• 35:43
  S14: I've cried and I've cried in my entire life. So
• 35:46
  S14: it was deep pain, but I always had hope that
• 35:51
  S14: he could. He could, um, make a u turn. I
• 35:56
  S14: had hope that God was at work. I absolutely had
• 36:01
  S14: hope that our marriage could be restored. But there were
• 36:06
  S14: many seasons that I thought like, I trust that God
• 36:10
  S14: is pursuing. Mark. I don't know if I have hope
• 36:14
  S14: that Mark himself will actually respond to the pursuit. So
• 36:20
  S14: I never lost my hope in Christ. I believe that
• 36:23
  S14: God was at work and that if Mark would respond
• 36:27
  S14: to that work, to his word, his pursuit of him,
• 36:31
  S14: that things could turn around. But I wasn't so sure
• 36:35
  S14: if he was actually going to respond. And as I said,
• 36:39
  S14: it took just a little under a year. And finally
• 36:42
  S14: he did. But that doesn't always happen for everyone, you know,
• 36:46
  S14: because you have to have a person that is willing
• 36:49
  S14: to even hear the tiniest bit of the Holy Spirit's
• 36:53
  S14: call on their life.
• 36:55
  S4: Jill Savage, our guest right now coming up, she mentioned
• 36:57
  S4: that here's the Cliff notes version. The is that her
• 37:02
  S4: and her husband, Mark, have been restored and are doing
• 37:04
  S4: ministry together, but I'm going to ask her to take
• 37:07
  S4: us a little bit on that journey that took them
• 37:09
  S4: to get to the place where they are today. Maybe
• 37:11
  S4: you're listening today. Maybe it's not been infidelity, but it's
• 37:14
  S4: been something else that has caused you to feel hopeless
• 37:18
  S4: in your marriage. Hope is on the way. More with
• 37:20
  S4: Jill Savage coming up.
• 37:22
  S1: Want to hear that again? Just download the Curl and
• 37:25
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 37:28
  S4: Well, marriage is the greatest gift, but it can also
• 37:32
  S4: be one of the greatest challenges. One of, I should say,
• 37:36
  S4: the greatest gift that God gives us is His Son.
• 37:38
  S4: He gives us himself, he gives us salvation, and he
• 37:41
  S4: gives us someone to walk through life. With this covenant
• 37:45
  S4: we stand before God. We make a commitment not just
• 37:48
  S4: to another person, but to God himself. To love, to honor,
• 37:52
  S4: to cherish. It's the marriage I think sometimes Jill Savage,
• 37:56
  S4: our guests right now, I think sometimes we forget what
• 37:58
  S4: marriage really is about, that it's more than just the
• 38:02
  S4: uniting of two lives together, that this covenant actually represents
• 38:06
  S4: the relationship between the Church and Christ, right?
• 38:11
  S14: Yes, exactly. And what did Christ do for the church?
• 38:16
  S14: He gave his life. That's the dying to self that
• 38:20
  S14: marriage really brings about. You know, the subtitle of Gary
• 38:26
  S14: Thomas's book, Sacred Marriage is what if marriage wasn't really
• 38:30
  S14: designed to make us happy, but to make us holy? And, man,
• 38:33
  S14: that right there speaks so much to the fine print,
• 38:38
  S14: you know that I was talking about earlier. But most
• 38:41
  S14: of us think it's designed to make us happy. And
• 38:44
  S14: you know what's a beautiful thing? Um, and that book really, uh,
• 38:49
  S14: in the midst of this hard season for my husband,
• 38:53
  S14: which started bubbling up a year before the affair happened, and, um,
• 38:58
  S14: he had started to read Gary's book and it had
• 39:01
  S14: really made him angry. I mean, he just really he
• 39:05
  S14: didn't believe that no marriage is supposed to make us happy.
• 39:08
  S14: And when Mark actually surrendered, which, by the way, his
• 39:14
  S14: surrender date was 14 years ago, Easter Sunday.
• 39:17
  S4: Wow.
• 39:18
  S14: So this week for us really always has a lot
• 39:24
  S14: of deep meaning because it was the beginning of that turnaround.
• 39:29
  S14: But about three months after Mark surrendered and made the
• 39:33
  S14: U-turn and and eventually moved back home, he came home
• 39:37
  S14: one day from work. And, you know, he'd really been
• 39:40
  S14: pursuing holiness. And he came home one day and he said,
• 39:43
  S14: I had a realization today. And I said, what's that?
• 39:46
  S14: And he said, I realized I'm actually happy. I'm really happy.
• 39:51
  S14: And that was the byproduct of the holiness. That was
• 39:56
  S14: the byproduct of the surrender. That was the byproduct of
• 40:00
  S14: saying it's no longer my way. My will, my way.
• 40:05
  S14: It's now God, your will your way. I'm going to
• 40:08
  S14: do things your way. And the byproduct was the happiness.
• 40:12
  S4: Jill Savage with us this morning. Author, blogger, international. Speaker,
• 40:16
  S4: I'm sure that the question you probably get asked most
• 40:20
  S4: often when people learn about you and your husband's journey, uh,
• 40:24
  S4: the period of infidelity where Mark was away from your
• 40:27
  S4: whole family. How did you get back to a place
• 40:31
  S4: where you're not just married, not perfect marriage. I know
• 40:35
  S4: from your no more perfect series that you're not about that,
• 40:38
  S4: but where you are happy in the Lord.
• 40:41
  S14: Yeah, absolutely. You know, it does take time. One of
• 40:45
  S14: the biggest things, especially for the person who betrays, is
• 40:50
  S14: they think that if they just make a recommitment, they
• 40:54
  S14: say that they're sorry, they promise they won't do it again.
• 40:57
  S14: Then we should just be able to move forward. That
• 41:01
  S14: isn't the way it works when you are rebuilding trust.
• 41:05
  S14: In fact, we like to say that there's like kind
• 41:08
  S14: of a, a way to think a formula for rebuilding trust.
• 41:11
  S14: And that's consistent change behavior over time. And that equals trust.
• 41:16
  S14: And so you can't shortcut it. Um, and we like
• 41:19
  S14: to also think of it as if you imagine a
• 41:22
  S14: bathtub and the bathtub when you get married, the water
• 41:26
  S14: is full in the bathtub and that water represents trust.
• 41:29
  S14: And when something like infidelity happens, the bathtub drains and
• 41:34
  S14: you can't say, I'm sorry, I'll never do it again.
• 41:37
  S14: Please forgive me. Then your partner forgives you, and then
• 41:41
  S14: you just. That fills the bathtub. That's not the way
• 41:44
  S14: it works. You actually have to fill the bathtub one
• 41:48
  S14: tablespoon at a time.
• 41:50
  S4: Wow.
• 41:51
  S14: And that takes time. And so for us, it took
• 41:55
  S14: about 18 months. And what did that look like? It
• 41:59
  S14: looked like counseling. It looked like lots of conversations. Where
• 42:05
  S14: there was patience, there was kindness. There was compassion. That
• 42:10
  S14: meant pushing accountability, which meant like, if my husband was
• 42:13
  S14: going to be late coming home from somewhere, he would
• 42:16
  S14: call me and say, hey, this is what's going on. Um, I'm,
• 42:20
  S14: you know, this is where I'm going to be. It
• 42:22
  S14: was sharing locations. All of those kind of things. Puts
• 42:27
  S14: the water back in the bathtub. Those are all tablespoons,
• 42:31
  S14: even sometimes quarter cups of water. And it just takes time.
• 42:36
  S14: But it is possible.
• 42:38
  S4: You know, I'm going to throw another analogy at you.
• 42:41
  S4: But a lot of times in marriage it's not the
• 42:43
  S4: big blowout I think of a tire. It's the slow leak.
• 42:47
  S4: And you have people listening who are in marriages where
• 42:50
  S4: maybe there's not been some big issue of infidelity. There's
• 42:53
  S4: not been a big anything. It's just over time. You
• 42:57
  S4: have two people who look at each other and go,
• 42:59
  S4: I don't really know if I love this person anymore
• 43:03
  S4: and I am not even sure that I know them.
• 43:06
  S4: What do you say to people who feel kind of
• 43:09
  S4: quietly hopeless? There's no big something to point to. They
• 43:12
  S4: just don't feel it.
• 43:13
  S14: Yeah, that happens in so many marriages. In fact, it's
• 43:18
  S14: probably one of the main causes of what we call
• 43:20
  S14: silver divorces, which is when people get divorced after being
• 43:24
  S14: married 30, 35, 40 years. And we talk about that
• 43:29
  S14: in our No More Perfect Marriages book, and we call
• 43:31
  S14: them the slow fades. And a slow fade is a
• 43:36
  S14: slow erosion of connection. And what I would say is
• 43:43
  S14: the slow fades can be identified and they can be
• 43:46
  S14: stopped if you can just learn what they are. If
• 43:50
  S14: you can get the help to begin to turn around
• 43:54
  S14: some of the mindset that has contributed to those slow fades.
• 43:59
  S14: And an example of this, actually, is that my husband
• 44:02
  S14: was experiencing the slow fade of unrealistic expectations. That's one
• 44:06
  S14: of them that we identify in our No More Perfect
• 44:09
  S14: Marriages book. And that slow fade of expectations moved him
• 44:13
  S14: from discontentment to discouragement to disillusionment, to disconnection. And even
• 44:22
  S14: if the affair hadn't happened, so that he was then
• 44:25
  S14: primed for the affair, even if that affair hadn't happened,
• 44:29
  S14: we would have been at a crossroads where he was
• 44:32
  S14: very disconnected because his expectations were unrealistic, and there were
• 44:39
  S14: some other dynamics playing out. I had the slow fade
• 44:44
  S14: of emotional shutdown. I grew up in a buck up family,
• 44:49
  S14: so you just kind of buck up and you just
• 44:52
  S14: kind of put one foot in front of the other.
• 44:55
  S14: But what that did is it kept me emotionally distant.
• 44:59
  S14: And that was contributing to our disconnection. So we both
• 45:03
  S14: had areas we needed to work on. And that's ultimately
• 45:07
  S14: what Mark and I love helping couples do is find
• 45:10
  S14: those areas, understand them, and then get to work on
• 45:14
  S14: turning that dynamic around because it can be turned around.
• 45:18
  S4: Jill Savage, I know you're listening and you're going, oh, okay,
• 45:21
  S4: where can I get more? She mentioned a couple of books,
• 45:25
  S4: the No More Perfect Marriage. There's also one for moms.
• 45:29
  S4: I want you to get connected the podcast as well.
• 45:31
  S4: Just text perfect to (800) 555-7898. You'll find lots of resources
• 45:37
  S4: available on her website. Text perfect to (800) 555-7898.
• 45:44
  S1: Walking closer to Jesus every day. You're listening to Carl
• 45:48
  S1: and Cru J.
• 45:49
  S6: Warner Wallace. I'm dying to know this. I've never asked
• 45:53
  S6: you this. What's the coolest cold case you ever broke on?
• 45:57
  S6: The smallest fragment of evidence to break that case wide open.
• 46:02
  S15: Oh, gosh. Um, well, I had a case one time
• 46:06
  S15: that I. We broke because the guy left a piece
• 46:08
  S15: of shoe foam at the crime scene, and it sat
• 46:11
  S15: there for 30 years. No one could figure out what
• 46:13
  S15: this piece of foam was. And it turns out he
• 46:15
  S15: was the kind of guy who didn't untie his boots,
• 46:17
  S15: and he would just slip them off and on, and
• 46:20
  S15: he wore out the back of the boot. And when
• 46:22
  S15: he was kneeling down after he had killed this girl
• 46:24
  S15: to take money out of her purse, his heel rose
• 46:28
  S15: up on the back of his boot and popped out
• 46:30
  S15: the foam. And it was laying at the crime scene,
• 46:32
  S15: and it was. And people were looking at that for
• 46:35
  S15: years and couldn't figure out what it was. And we
• 46:37
  S15: ultimately found the boot. Uh, this is 30 years later.
• 46:40
  S15: We found the boot where the foam came from. And
• 46:43
  S15: it also showed that every other pair of shoes he
• 46:45
  S15: had was messed up that way. So he just had
• 46:48
  S15: this pattern, you know? And sure enough, that was that
• 46:50
  S15: piece of foam. Ended up being the deal killer for him.
• 46:54
  S6: What do you guys do when you find evidence like that?
• 46:57
  S6: Is it just high fives all around? I mean, that's
• 47:00
  S6: got to be pretty exhilarating.
• 47:02
  S15: Oh, no, it definitely was. I'm feeling from the very
• 47:05
  S15: beginning was if I can just put this to this
• 47:06
  S15: guy in any way, if it came off his shoulder,
• 47:09
  S15: if it came off his backpack, we just got to
• 47:10
  S15: figure out where did this foam come from? Because it
• 47:12
  S15: was clearly not part of the crime scene. So it
• 47:14
  S15: wasn't part of the scene before the crime. So. So
• 47:17
  S15: we knew it had to belong to the suspect. So
• 47:19
  S15: when that happens, it was as a matter of fact,
• 47:21
  S15: that case was not my first cold case, but it
• 47:23
  S15: was the case that ultimately convinced that our our, our
• 47:26
  S15: agency to open up a cold case team for about
• 47:29
  S15: a decade.
• 47:29
  S8: Wow.
• 47:30
  S15: It was good.
• 47:31
  S8: Okay.
• 47:31
  S6: Anyone else glad I asked that question.
• 47:33
  S8: How about them apples? That's fascinating.
• 47:35
  S6: So now you get this regenerated J. Warner Wallace who?
• 47:39
  S6: God just rocks your soul. What in the world spurred
• 47:43
  S6: you on to take this? Really trade tools of the
• 47:47
  S6: trade and apply it to this newfound faith. And in fact,
• 47:51
  S6: you leveraged it before you even came to Christ, right?
• 47:54
  S15: Oh, absolutely. Like anybody else, if you're somebody who, let's
• 47:57
  S15: say you're just a historian or you're a teacher of philosophy, okay, well,
• 48:01
  S15: then when you come to the Gospels, you're reading it
• 48:03
  S15: through that lens. That's who you are. So the same
• 48:05
  S15: was true for me. I was I had this skill
• 48:07
  S15: set about eyewitness accounts and people will say all the
• 48:10
  S15: time to me, well, these aren't eyewitness accounts. Well, look,
• 48:14
  S15: when we have an eyewitness, we don't just give them
• 48:15
  S15: a piece of paper and tell him, write down your account,
• 48:18
  S15: we interview him and we write the account. And so
• 48:21
  S15: what you have is a supplemental report written by a
• 48:24
  S15: detective who's basically quoting what the witness says. Well, same
• 48:28
  S15: thing is happening with Luke. He says, I'm talking to
• 48:29
  S15: the eyewitnesses and servants of the word, and I'm writing.
• 48:33
  S15: The account doesn't have to be written by the eyewitness
• 48:35
  S15: in order to be an eyewitness account. That's just the
• 48:37
  S15: nature of all of our supplemental reports. So. So I
• 48:41
  S15: just knew that was a process I could apply. And
• 48:43
  S15: you guys have been talking about hope. And this is
• 48:46
  S15: the thing that I think is fascinating. Well, yeah, we
• 48:48
  S15: can go to the scriptures for sure and talk about
• 48:50
  S15: what the scriptures say about hope. And that's what we
• 48:53
  S15: should be doing. But isn't it interesting that the Bible
• 48:55
  S15: describes the world the way it really is? And what
• 48:58
  S15: it describes about hope we know is true, even if
• 49:01
  S15: we didn't have a Bible? There are studies now that
• 49:04
  S15: have shown how some people have more hope than others,
• 49:08
  S15: and what it is that gives them that hope. And
• 49:10
  S15: often it is. It is really a view of the
• 49:12
  S15: world that includes some sense that we have an expectation
• 49:18
  S15: of a life after this one. Yeah. As a matter
• 49:20
  S15: of fact, people who have a sense that we will
• 49:23
  S15: live beyond the grave thrive, and they have much more hope.
• 49:28
  S15: They behave differently, even under critical illnesses. And of all
• 49:32
  S15: the ways that this happens, Christianity is the best. You
• 49:35
  S15: know what they call it? They call it the persisting self.
• 49:38
  S15: People who have a strong view of what is called
• 49:42
  S15: the persisting self after you die have a better sense
• 49:46
  S15: of hope, especially as as they're aging. And so, for example,
• 49:50
  S15: other views have a sense that you might have a
• 49:53
  S15: life after this one, but you don't persist. The you
• 49:56
  S15: that you know. So for example, if you're a Buddhist,
• 49:59
  S15: they don't believe in the existence of self at all.
• 50:02
  S15: According to Buddhism, your sense of self is just an illusion. Yeah. Right.
• 50:05
  S15: And that's why for that reason, you're not going to
• 50:07
  S15: extend beyond your mortal existence because they don't have a
• 50:10
  S15: sense of self. Hinduism argues for a reincarnation of self.
• 50:14
  S15: So yes, the self, there's another version of self, but
• 50:17
  S15: it's not you. That's why it's not the persisting you
• 50:21
  S15: that moves on. It's a reincarnated, a completely different self.
• 50:26
  S15: Of course, atheism offers for no persistent self beyond the grave.
• 50:30
  S15: But what does Christianity offer? It offers this sense that
• 50:33
  S15: you will still be you. The you that you know
• 50:36
  S15: will persist beyond the grave. That's so. And so. It
• 50:39
  S15: turns out that sense of persisting self is what the.
• 50:43
  S15: You know what non-believers call it. But the reality of
• 50:46
  S15: it is, is we believe there is a persisting self
• 50:48
  S15: and that's why we thrive. It. We should. Now look.
• 50:50
  S15: Does that mean every Christian is going to thrive? No.
• 50:52
  S15: There are lots of Christians you and I know who
• 50:53
  S15: don't have hope. And it's likely because they are not
• 50:56
  S15: leaning in to what Scripture teaches. So there's a connection,
• 51:00
  S15: like you said before we started talking here between your
• 51:03
  S15: sense of how much do I know about Scripture? What
• 51:05
  S15: does Scripture teach and how does it affect the way
• 51:08
  S15: I live?
• 51:08
  S8: Yeah.
• 51:09
  S4: J Warner Wallace, our guest right now, he's a Dateline
• 51:11
  S4: featured cold case, homicide detective, popular national speaker, podcast host,
• 51:16
  S4: best selling author, cold case Christianity. You know, you mentioned
• 51:20
  S4: a couple of different worldviews, religions, belief systems. And one
• 51:24
  S4: thing that I've heard you say often, which I think
• 51:25
  S4: is really helpful for understanding your perspective, that when you
• 51:29
  S4: ask people why they believe anything, whether they are an
• 51:33
  S4: atheist or a Buddhist or a Christian, surprisingly, people give
• 51:37
  S4: very similar answers. Tell us what those answers are and
• 51:41
  S4: why that is important for us to understand?
• 51:44
  S15: Well, the answer is. Sadly, the most popular answer is
• 51:46
  S15: I was raised that way. But the second most popular
• 51:49
  S15: answer is probably in some ways not much better. You
• 51:52
  S15: can be raised some way and not be raised in
• 51:53
  S15: the truth. I mean, that's clearly most of us who
• 51:55
  S15: would say we were atheists for years, but that was
• 51:58
  S15: probably our situation. But the second popular answer is, well,
• 52:01
  S15: I've had an experience that demonstrates for me that this
• 52:04
  S15: view of the world is true. I prayed a prayer
• 52:06
  S15: was answered. I had something that seems to me to
• 52:08
  S15: be so unlikely it could happen by natural causes that
• 52:12
  S15: it had to be God. But the problem, of course,
• 52:15
  S15: is that everyone who believes in any version of God,
• 52:18
  S15: that is still their most popular answer too. So if
• 52:22
  S15: we're going to say it was my experience, well, this
• 52:24
  S15: is what my my Mormon friends would do. They would
• 52:26
  S15: go door to door on their missions trip, and at
• 52:28
  S15: some point they're going to share their personal experience. Well,
• 52:31
  S15: of course they would have to do that because you
• 52:33
  S15: cannot share the historical accuracy of the Book of Mormon
• 52:37
  S15: because it's not historically accurate. I know I say that
• 52:39
  S15: in a show like this where so many of us now, um,
• 52:43
  S15: so many people who are raised LDS would say, well,
• 52:47
  S15: we're Christians too. But to be honest, the dividing line
• 52:50
  S15: for Christianity is, well, do you believe in the triune
• 52:52
  S15: nature of the Godhead? Yeah, because the triune formulation, the
• 52:56
  S15: Trinity is the deal killer. It separates us from from Mormons,
• 52:58
  S15: from LDS, latter day Saints. And we would say that
• 53:02
  S15: that's outside the boundary of what we believe as Christians. So,
• 53:06
  S15: so they really are a different group. And they would
• 53:08
  S15: say that they came to their experience because they read
• 53:10
  S15: the Book of Mormon. They prayed about it and they
• 53:12
  S15: had an experience that demonstrated it was true. That's why
• 53:15
  S15: we have to be very careful of unchecked experiences. We
• 53:19
  S15: have to measure the experience against something that we know.
• 53:23
  S15: Whatever worldview you hold, if you want to think that
• 53:25
  S15: Buddhism is true, fine. Then you're going to be measuring
• 53:27
  S15: your experience against the scriptures of Buddhism. So you have
• 53:31
  S15: to measure our experience against something. And that's why I
• 53:35
  S15: think we have to do more than just have an experience.
• 53:37
  S15: We have to know what is biblically true, isn't it?
• 53:39
  S6: Yeah. Just a quick comment. Isn't it fascinating, Jay Warner,
• 53:43
  S6: that you can take a Greek article, a a god
• 53:46
  S6: and twist the entire Trinity in a heartbeat, my friend.
• 53:52
  S15: No, there's no doubt about this. And I've been podcasting
• 53:54
  S15: about this year because I think that this idea is,
• 53:57
  S15: is Jesus just the the most important first creation of God,
• 54:02
  S15: or is he God incarnate? And if he's God incarnate,
• 54:05
  S15: that creates all kinds of problems for monotheism, unless the
• 54:08
  S15: Trinity is true, right? So, so we have and it
• 54:11
  S15: makes sense because your experience, it turns out the thing
• 54:13
  S15: that defines us as humans largely is our sense of
• 54:17
  S15: desire for relationship and community. Well, why do we have this? Why?
• 54:21
  S15: It seems sometimes like you'd be better off if you
• 54:23
  S15: could just figure out how to, to be independent of
• 54:25
  S15: the relationships that hurt you. But the reality of it
• 54:28
  S15: is you have no, you're created in the image of
• 54:30
  S15: a Triune God who has been in relationship from all eternity.
• 54:35
  S15: If Allah is God, he would only know about relationships
• 54:38
  S15: once he creates something to relate to. In other words,
• 54:41
  S15: he would have to learn about love. When he creates
• 54:44
  S15: the first object he could love. But this isn't true
• 54:47
  S15: for for Yahweh. He's been in a triune love relationship
• 54:51
  S15: from all eternity. That sense that you have, that you desire,
• 54:55
  S15: that kind of relationship is in you. Because we are
• 54:58
  S15: created in the image of a God who is love.
• 55:02
  S15: And that's what the Trinity explains, that passage when we
• 55:05
  S15: say that God is. It's not that God learned how
• 55:07
  S15: to love or God could create love, it's that God
• 55:10
  S15: has been in this love relationship from all eternity.
• 55:14
  S6: Let us make man in our image. Okay? Coming up here, J.
• 55:18
  S6: Warner Wallace, we're going to throw you a fastball here.
• 55:21
  S6: You're a cold case guy. You can handle it. Give
• 55:23
  S6: us the top five evidences of the risen Jesus. I'm
• 55:27
  S6: just hitting them cold, guys. He'll have it. He'll handle
• 55:30
  S6: it straight ahead.
• 55:32
  S1: Celebrating the unstoppable gospel.
• 55:35
  S2: It's not that I've got to fill in these check checkboxes.
• 55:38
  S2: So he's okay with me, but it's that I get
• 55:40
  S2: to stand close to him so that I can experience
• 55:43
  S2: the life that he has for me.
• 55:45
  S1: You're listening to Carl and Cru.
• 55:47
  S4: Well, marriage is the greatest gift, but it can also
• 55:51
  S4: be one of the greatest challenges. One of, I should say,
• 55:55
  S4: the greatest gift that God gives us is His Son.
• 55:57
  S4: He gives us himself, he gives us salvation, and he
• 56:00
  S4: gives us someone to walk through life. With this covenant
• 56:04
  S4: we stand before God. We make a commitment not just
• 56:07
  S4: to another person, but to God himself, to love, to honor,
• 56:11
  S4: to cherish. It's the marriage. I think sometimes Jill Savage,
• 56:15
  S4: our guests right now, I think sometimes we forget what
• 56:17
  S4: marriage really is about, that it's more than just the
• 56:20
  S4: uniting of two lives together, that this covenant actually represents
• 56:25
  S4: the relationship between the church and Christ, right?
• 56:29
  S14: Yes, exactly. And what did Christ do for the church?
• 56:35
  S14: He gave his life. That's the dying to self. That
• 56:39
  S14: marriage really brings about. You know, the subtitle of Gary
• 56:44
  S14: Thomas's book, Sacred Marriage is what if marriage wasn't really
• 56:48
  S14: designed to make us happy, but to make us holy?
• 56:51
  S14: And man, that right there speaks so much to the
• 56:56
  S14: fine print, you know that I was talking about earlier.
• 57:00
  S14: But most of us think it's designed to make us happy.
• 57:03
  S14: And you know what's a beautiful thing? Um, and that
• 57:06
  S14: book really, uh, in the midst of this hard season
• 57:11
  S14: for my husband, which started bubbling up a year before
• 57:14
  S14: the affair happened. And, um, he had started to read
• 57:18
  S14: Gary's book and it had really made him angry. Um,
• 57:22
  S14: I mean, he just really he didn't believe that no
• 57:25
  S14: marriage is supposed to make us happy. And when Mark
• 57:29
  S14: actually surrendered, which, by the way, his surrender date was
• 57:34
  S14: 14 years ago, Easter Sunday.
• 57:36
  S4: Wow.
• 57:37
  S14: So this week for us really always has a lot
• 57:43
  S14: of deep meaning because it was the beginning of that turnaround.
• 57:48
  S14: But about three months after Mark surrendered and made the
• 57:52
  S14: U-turn and and eventually moved back home, he came home
• 57:56
  S14: one day from work. And, you know, he'd really been
• 57:58
  S14: pursuing holiness. And he came home one day and he said,
• 58:02
  S14: I had a realization today. And I said, what's that?
• 58:05
  S14: And he said, I realized I'm actually happy. I'm really happy.
• 58:10
  S14: And that was the byproduct of the holiness that was
• 58:15
  S14: the byproduct of the surrender. That was the byproduct of saying,
• 58:19
  S14: it's no longer my way, my will, my way. It's
• 58:24
  S14: now God, your will your way. I'm going to do
• 58:27
  S14: things your way. And the byproduct was the happiness.
• 58:31
  S4: Jill Savage with us this morning. Author, blogger, international speaker,
• 58:35
  S4: I'm sure that the question you probably get asked most
• 58:39
  S4: often when people learn about you and your husband's journey, uh,
• 58:43
  S4: the period of infidelity where Mark was away from your
• 58:46
  S4: whole family. How did you get back to a place
• 58:50
  S4: where you're not just married, not perfect marriage. I know
• 58:54
  S4: from your no more perfect series that you're not about that,
• 58:57
  S4: but where you are happy in the Lord.
• 59:00
  S14: Yeah, absolutely. You know, it does take time. One of
• 59:04
  S14: the biggest things, especially for the person who betrays, is
• 59:09
  S14: they think that, um, if they just make a recommitment,
• 59:13
  S14: they say that they're sorry, they promise they won't do
• 59:15
  S14: it again, then we should just be able to move forward.
• 59:19
  S14: That isn't the way it works when you are rebuilding trust.
• 59:24
  S14: In fact, we like to say that there's like kind
• 59:26
  S14: of a, a way to think a formula for rebuilding trust.
• 59:29
  S14: And that's consistent change behavior over time. And that equals trust.
• 59:35
  S14: And so you can't shortcut it. And we like to
• 59:38
  S14: also think of it as if you imagine a bathtub
• 59:42
  S14: and the bathtub when you get married, the water is
• 59:45
  S14: full in the bathtub. And that water represents trust. And
• 59:48
  S14: when something like infidelity happens, the bathtub drains. And you
• 59:53
  S14: can't say, I'm sorry. I'll never do it again. Please
• 59:57
  S14: forgive me. Then your partner forgives you, and then you just.
• 1:00:01
  S14: That fills the bathtub. That's not the way it works.
• 1:00:04
  S14: You actually have to fill the bathtub one tablespoon at
• 1:00:08
  S14: a time.
• 1:00:09
  S4: Wow.
• 1:00:10
  S14: And that takes time. And so for us, it took
• 1:00:14
  S14: about 18 months. And what did that look like? It
• 1:00:18
  S14: looked like counseling. It looked like lots of conversations. Where
• 1:00:24
  S14: there was patience. There was kindness. There was compassion. That
• 1:00:29
  S14: meant pushing accountability, which meant like if my husband was
• 1:00:32
  S14: going to be late coming home from somewhere, he would
• 1:00:35
  S14: call me and say, hey, this is what's going on. Um, I'm,
• 1:00:39
  S14: you know, this is where I'm going to be. It
• 1:00:41
  S14: was sharing locations. All of those kind of things. Puts
• 1:00:46
  S14: the water back in the bathtub. Those are all tablespoons,
• 1:00:49
  S14: even sometimes quarter cups of water. And it just takes time.
• 1:00:55
  S14: But it is possible.
• 1:00:57
  S4: You know, I'm going to throw another analogy at you.
• 1:01:00
  S4: But a lot of times in marriage it's not the
• 1:01:02
  S4: big blowout I think of a tire. It's the slow leak.
• 1:01:06
  S4: And you have people listening who are in marriages where
• 1:01:09
  S4: maybe there's not been some big issue of infidelity. There's
• 1:01:12
  S4: not been a big anything. It's just over time. You
• 1:01:16
  S4: have two people who look at each other and go,
• 1:01:18
  S4: I don't really know if I love this person anymore.
• 1:01:22
  S4: And I I'm not even sure that I know them.
• 1:01:25
  S4: What do you say to people who feel kind of
• 1:01:28
  S4: quietly hopeless. There's no big something to point to. They
• 1:01:31
  S4: just don't feel it.
• 1:01:32
  S14: Yeah, that happens in so many marriages. In fact, it's
• 1:01:36
  S14: probably one of the main causes of what we call
• 1:01:39
  S14: silver divorces, which is when people get divorced after being
• 1:01:43
  S14: married 30, 35, 40 years. And we talk about that
• 1:01:47
  S14: in our No More Perfect Marriages book, and we call
• 1:01:50
  S14: them the slow fades. And a slow fade is a
• 1:01:55
  S14: slow erosion of connection. And what I would say is
• 1:02:01
  S14: the slow fades can be identified and they can be
• 1:02:05
  S14: stopped if you can just learn what they are. If
• 1:02:09
  S14: you can get the help to begin to turn around
• 1:02:13
  S14: some of the mindset that has contributed to those slow fades.
• 1:02:17
  S14: And an example of this actually, is that my husband
• 1:02:21
  S14: was experiencing the slow fade of unrealistic expectations. That's one
• 1:02:25
  S14: of them that we identify in our No More Perfect
• 1:02:28
  S14: Marriages book, and that slow fade of expectations moved him
• 1:02:31
  S14: from discontentment to discouragement to disillusionment, to disconnection. And even
• 1:02:41
  S14: if the affair hadn't happened, so that he was then
• 1:02:44
  S14: primed for the affair, even if that affair hadn't happened,
• 1:02:48
  S14: we would have been at a crossroads where he was
• 1:02:51
  S14: very disconnected because his expectations were unrealistic, and there were
• 1:02:58
  S14: some other dynamics playing out. I had the slow fade
• 1:03:02
  S14: of emotional shutdown. I grew up in a buck up family,
• 1:03:08
  S14: so you just kind of buck up and you just
• 1:03:11
  S14: kind of put one foot in front of the other.
• 1:03:13
  S14: But what that did is it kept me emotionally distant
• 1:03:18
  S14: and that was contributing to our disconnection. So we both
• 1:03:22
  S14: had areas we needed to work on, and that's ultimately
• 1:03:26
  S14: what Mark and I love helping couples do is find
• 1:03:29
  S14: those areas, understand them, and then get to work on
• 1:03:33
  S14: turning that dynamic around because it can be turned around.
• 1:03:37
  S4: Jill Savage, I know you're listening and you're going, oh, okay,
• 1:03:40
  S4: where can I get more? She mentioned a couple of books,
• 1:03:43
  S4: the No More Perfect Marriage. There's also one for moms.
• 1:03:47
  S4: I want you to get connected the podcast as well.
• 1:03:50
  S4: Just text perfect to (800) 555-7898. You'll find lots of resources
• 1:03:56
  S4: available on her website. Text perfect to (800) 555-7898.
• 1:04:02
  S1: A basketball mom who's mastered the dad joke. Ali is
• 1:04:07
  S1: in the crew. It's Karl and crew on Moody Radio.
• 1:04:11
  S6: You want it? And you got it. It's time right now.
• 1:04:15
  S1: Making herself laugh no matter who joins her. It's time
• 1:04:19
  S1: for Ali. Thinks it's funny. Yes.
• 1:04:23
  S4: Are you excited, Carl?
• 1:04:24
  S6: Oh, we need it.
• 1:04:26
  S4: Back for another round of Wednesday. Jokes for you. What
• 1:04:31
  S4: do you call. Um, well, first of all, do you
• 1:04:34
  S4: like potatoes? Before I. Before I give you. What's your
• 1:04:37
  S4: favorite way to see potatoes prepared?
• 1:04:41
  S6: Oh, fried in lard. Give them to me. Salted.
• 1:04:45
  S4: Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Like like a diced potato. Like
• 1:04:49
  S4: you just fry the whole potato.
• 1:04:51
  S6: No French fries. Slice them up.
• 1:04:53
  S2: Fry the.
• 1:04:53
  S3: Whole potato.
• 1:04:54
  S2: I like the idea of just dropping a whole potato.
• 1:04:57
  S3: I have a shortcut. This thing.
• 1:04:59
  S4: What about you, young thunder?
• 1:05:01
  S3: Yeah.
• 1:05:01
  S4: French fries. Uh. Super dry. Yeah.
• 1:05:03
  S16: French fries.
• 1:05:04
  S2: What kind of French fries? Shoestring. Curly.
• 1:05:08
  S16: Okay.
• 1:05:08
  S4: Waffle fries are my favorite. Oh, yeah, but I digress.
• 1:05:12
  S4: So potatoes actually have different personalities. If you were to
• 1:05:15
  S4: sit down and talk to three potatoes, you would get
• 1:05:19
  S4: three totally different personalities.
• 1:05:22
  S6: And stuff here.
• 1:05:22
  S4: All you do. I mean, this is stuff you really
• 1:05:24
  S4: need to know. What do you call a potato that
• 1:05:27
  S4: has a tendency toward being a little reluctant, a little
• 1:05:32
  S4: reluctant potato, also known as a hesitate.
• 1:05:40
  S2: I like hesitating.
• 1:05:43
  S3: Do you?
• 1:05:44
  S2: I do, I really do.
• 1:05:45
  S3: Oh, come on, that's.
• 1:05:48
  S2: Incapable of.
• 1:05:49
  S3: Liking it. Hesitate. Oh, okay. Glad Karl enjoyed that reluctant potato.
• 1:05:57
  S4: Karl, a little hesitate.
• 1:05:59
  S6: Come on. That's outstanding.
• 1:06:01
  S3: It is good.
• 1:06:01
  S4: Next. Next up, a little a little story. Time for you.
• 1:06:04
  S4: I took some vacation days, and I. I went in
• 1:06:08
  S4: for a deep tissue massage at one of those fancy spas,
• 1:06:11
  S4: you know, like, try to get some of that neck
• 1:06:14
  S4: and shoulder tension out because, man, a lot of times
• 1:06:17
  S4: sitting behind a mic neck, shoulder muscles get a little tight. So, I,
• 1:06:21
  S4: you know, I asked for the person with like real
• 1:06:23
  S4: strong hands because I want like a really get in
• 1:06:26
  S4: there and break up some of that tension. Yeah. So
• 1:06:28
  S4: I was a little surprised when the first thing they
• 1:06:30
  S4: did was sprinkle some cocoa powder on my shoulders. It's like,
• 1:06:34
  S4: this is a little strange. And then they come at
• 1:06:38
  S4: me with cheese.
• 1:06:39
  S3: Wow.
• 1:06:40
  S4: Mascarpone cheese. And I was really shocked. And then they
• 1:06:44
  S4: offered me a shot of espresso in the middle of
• 1:06:46
  S4: the massage. I didn't realize it was a tiramisu.
• 1:06:56
  S2: That's crazy.
• 1:06:58
  S4: That was a little crazy.
• 1:06:59
  S3: Oh, that's a.
• 1:07:00
  S4: Little.
• 1:07:00
  S3: Crazy.
• 1:07:01
  S6: Around Mccready's barn.
• 1:07:02
  S3: But you know what? She got there.
• 1:07:04
  S4: I got there. I that one I thought was funny
• 1:07:06
  S4: because it's a little out of the box. Text jokes
• 1:07:09
  S4: to 805, five five, 78, 98. Go around Mccready's barn.
• 1:07:14
  S4: It's worth it. Text jokes to 800 555 7898. Just
• 1:07:20
  S4: text jokes.