Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Full Size Overland Truck of the Year

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Full Size Overland Truck of the Year · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm your host,
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and I am here with the co hosts
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Mattess's of the Matses Matt. Yes, so we have the
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Matt Scott and the Matt Swartz. If it could not
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: be any more confusing, but we're going to talk about something.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: At least his last name is not a first name.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: That's true.
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: He's the only one that's actually legitimate at this table.
• 0:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I didn't realize our initials are exactly
• 0:28
  Speaker 4: what's your mental initial Oh well, I've got a B.
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: Oh, I have a Jay. Okay, all right, all right,
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: so J Matt B. There we go. It's good to know.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: So we're talking about full size trucks. We are.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: So this is the full size Revolution, and we've talked
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: a little bit about full size trucks in the past.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: But Orland Journal is now publishing in our Gear Guy
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty two, which is going to be coming out
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: around the time that this podcast goes live, maybe a
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: little bit before. We've got our full size Overland Vehicle
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: of the Year test where we evaluated the RAM twenty
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: five hundred, the RAM twenty well, the RAM twenty five
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: hundred diesel so commins. We have a RAM twenty five
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: hundred power wagon and they are drastically different. They are
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: super different, which is the only reason why one manufacturer
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: got two slots is because they are. They could not
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: be more different. Other than the fact that the doors
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: look the same, that's about it. I mean, there's really
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: not a lot about those vehicles that is similar. We
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: also evaluated the Ford Tremor, We evaluated the Nissan XD.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: We evaluated the Toyota Tundra, the brand new twenty twenty
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: two Toyota, Yeah, twenty two Toyota Tundra. We've got a
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: broad spectrum of vehicles that we evaluated. There's a lot
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: to say about each one of them, which is why
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: we're going to take the time to make this a podcast.
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: And there's the RAM Tier X. Which one it's the
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: best because I have it.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: I think we're going to take a brief break and
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: we will be right back. This week's episode is supported
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: in part by Icamper. They make innovative hardshell and soft
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: sided riof tents that are designed to survive long term
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: overla use. Their revolutionary X cover won the Overland Journal
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: Editor's Choice Award, eliminating the bulky PBC cover and also
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: allowing for the fitment of crossbars for carrying bikes and kayaks.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: Their Skycamp Mini is another award winning design that provides
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: a hardshell tent in the footprint of a much smaller
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: clamshell model.
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: This is the.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: Perfect solution for smaller vehicles or on vehicles where rackspace
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: is dedicated to other systems. I Camper believes that the
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: best times are those spent traveling discovering the world with.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: Those you love most.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: You can find out more about their quality tents at
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: kamper dot com. Matt has decided that the winner is
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: even after.
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: Released payload, the worst gas mileage exactly and literally some
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: other vehicles we considered, like the TRX.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: We also considered the new Hummer ev Yeah pickup. There's
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: a recently announced Gmcat four X that Matt was able
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: to take a look at person, which is a very
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: compelling option. We were fairly mindful around payload because if
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: we can just all kind of think practically about a
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: full sized truck, like, why own a full sized truck
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: if you're not gaining the benefit of payload or in
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: Matt's case seven hundred horse power.
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: I was just going to barge in and be like wow, exactly.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: So, for the most part, if we're going to look
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: at and this is not true for everybody, and we're
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: not trying to say that anyone listening should only buy
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: a full size if they need payload, because there's other
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: benefits like comfort and stability on the road and towing
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: capability and all that. But for the most part, for
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: the Overlander, the reason why we start to look three
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: quarter ton in one ton is because we want additional payload.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: If the manufacturer offered a three quarter ton variant, then
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: we featured it. So Nissan offers a regular Titan and
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: a Titan XD. We featured the XD. You can buy
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: a Ram twenty five hundred, You can buy a Ford
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: to fifty. With the Toyota Tundra, you can only get
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: a standard Tundras. So that's the reason why half ton
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: ended up in the mix. You would definitely not want
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: to leave the Tundra out. I think so hunters a
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: great one.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: They don't offer any other engine out.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: There's two engines. Yeah, good, good question.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: It's actually a very interesting decision point because they have
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: this new I Force, which is a three point five
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: liter turbocharged engine. If you get it in an eye Force,
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: you get the three point five leter turbocharged engine. But
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: then they bolt on this hybrid drive train which includes
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: an electric motor. So you go from high three hundreds
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: horsepower to high four hundreds horse power. You get within
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: a very close like you know, within fifteen foot pounds
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: a torque of six hundred foot pounds, so you get
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: like five hundred and eighty three foot pounds.
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: Of torque, so you end up that's seventeen. Yeah. I
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: don't do the maths. I went to elementary school.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well yeah, I don't even remember elementary school. So
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: we all have our strengths. I'm actually surprised I got
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: that right. Maybe after another PBR, like what happens to
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: brain cells? One PBR? That's what I want to know.
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: They become much better now, they become more Midwestern, which
• 4:53
  Speaker 3: is why we're drinking PBR when talking about full sized trucks. Okay,
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: I got it. Now it all comes around full circle.
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: Corn Fed.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: This is a this is the very first overland durld. Yeah,
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: corn Fed podcast.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: I think it's actually nice.
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: Oh it is that's Budweiser. Oh yeah, get out of here.
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: What Yeah corn for PBR. No, it's just like regular
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: stuff for PBR. I think corn is natty ice. No, No,
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: that's natural light. I remember when I drank too much
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: in college. That was like the thing is like a
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: beer of our fraternity. It was natty Light natural light
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: because it had corn in it. And I went to
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: school in Peoria, Illinois.
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: Oh maybe gear twenty twenty three needs a cheap Gary.
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: Didn't I do something like that like ten years ago
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: for expedition? You did? Yes you did, Yes you did.
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: It was perfectly I'm still around. It was still was
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: perfectly tining.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I want to go dig that article up exactly.
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: Don't worry. That was in the Juela days. Some of
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: those some of those articles survived and some of some
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: of them didn't. Yeah, So here's here's the thing with
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: full sized trucks remain I've been lucky enough to own
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: like eighty seven full sized trucks, a wide spectrum of
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: automobiles purposes of editorial. Editorial license you just took is
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: what you did. Anyways. So here's the deal. Take the
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: twenty five under thirty five hundred bram. It is like
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: within six inches of dimensions of a JEP Gladiator, except
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: that it's available with like one thousand and seventy five
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: pound feet of torque when inspect appropriately. It has like
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: an eight squillion pound payload inspect appropriately, So unless you're talking,
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: you know, like really technical terrain, which let's be honest,
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: like some overlanders are doing that, but most travelers aren't.
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: Like the capability of these trucks has just become so
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: immense that I mean, look at an AV prospect prospector
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: xl PXL. Sorry, that's a truck on forty inch tires
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: that has ample suspension, Like it's it's great, like it'll go.
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: It's crazy capable pretty much anywhere you want it to go.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: And you have one of commercial drive train and then
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: you have you know, all that payload and all that
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: space that you can actually modify with.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: And another thing we found too, is that they Detroit,
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: let's call it North American manufacturers, they produce so many
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: full sized trucks it cannot get it wrong. They don't
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: dare get it wrong. A bad F one fifty or
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: a bad Super duty is bad for America. It is
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: like so many jobs are linked to the automotive space.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: You know, we all kind of look after the seventy
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: series land Cruiser, you know, some of these overseas utility vehicles. Well,
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: we just get to drive something with more power, better suspension,
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: air conditioned seats, and we'll get moreload, more payload, and
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: we get to pay like half as much. Correct, you
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: can buy a twenty five hundred ram tradesman or around
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: fifty grand. I mean, that's if you want to talk
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: about the bargain of the century, and we'll get into
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: that in a little bit.
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: You know, there's there's in the realm of the diesel trucks,
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: you know that has one of the six sevens. There's
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: a six to seven power stroke which is for and
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: there's the six seven commings for twenty twenty. The six
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: seven commings kind of got refreshed. It's a lot quieter,
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: it's a lot nicer to drive. If you just sit
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: next to a Gen four and what they will call
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: like a Gen four and a half or Gen five,
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: which is what's currently on the market. One is quiet
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: and you can't hear it, and one is like clink
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: clink clink, clink, clink, clink clink, clink clink, that which
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: I still kind of like, I don't know, it's it's cool,
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: but the your quality, build quality and engineering of the
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: rams really went up. Spoard's kind of always been there.
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: I mean Ford six to seven powerstroke. The main difference
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: between those two engines one is a straight six drives
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: a little different drives. The Commons drives more like a diesel.
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: I feel like the six to seven power stroke drives
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: just really nice. It does.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: And maybe we start with the Ford Tremor because it's
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: such a ground break, it's such a groundbreaking product. We
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: always had this power wagon that was this high water
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: mark of capability, but it was always it always in
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: a way, in maybe a very clear way, it was
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: neutered by its payload.
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: So you had this their engine choice. Correct, You had
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: this very large vehicle, extremely capable, with a rich history.
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: It had a fifteen hundred pound payload, and it was
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: only available in the V eight gas.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: If you were in a place or you were the
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: kind of buyer that wanted maximum capability out of a
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: full size, it is no question the most capable choice,
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: but it's unfortunate that it's never been available with a
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: diesel and the way that it's described to me by
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: the RAM engineers is it's very difficult to put a
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: front locking differential with one thousand foot pounds of torque.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Like the size of the differentials have to be so
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: massive to be able to take imagine, you know, because
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: the typical consumer doesn't know this, so they go full
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: lock to the left with a front lock differential and
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: they're stuck in the mud and next thing you know,
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: you're blowing up you joints like they're like they're chick lits.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: So they really are limited in what they can do. Now,
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: in my mind, it's always been they make this excellent
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: three liter turbot diesel, Like, find a way to put
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: that three leader turbot diesel in with the power wagon
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: and then give like an HD version or some like
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: call it the Overland or whatever because they own the trademark.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: It's kind of the maybe yeah, maybe you're right, Yeah,
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: maybe you're right. But to have a solid axle front
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: and rear long travel front and rear locked, small displacement
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: turbot diesel power wagon, to me would be the ultimate truck.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: But it doesn't. They don't make it. They don't make it.
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: That's what makes the Ford tremor so interesting? Is that
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: ten speed that's in them so good?
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: Like it's really good? Twenty five hundred. The RAM side
• 10:02
  Speaker 3: of things has the huge benefit of of AEV. Correct.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: I'll be honest. If AEV made Ford stuff, it would
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: be hard for me to get behind the RAM. Sure stuff.
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: It's just that with Ram you have you have such
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: excellent aftermarket. You have a you know, you have a
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: coil sprung to your end. For it has always always
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: led with drive train, or at least in recent years
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: for sure. Yeah. I mean it's not that the Commings
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: isn't great. I mean it, you know, it pulls like
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: a freight train, and it has that kind of diesel
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: like what is it as it's like a thousand and
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: twenty five pound feet of torque in the standard.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: One thousand and forty five if I remember correctly, in
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: the standard. But then you have instead of a six speed,
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: you have a ten speed.
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: That is the only thing with the RAM that I
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: just got rid of my twenty twenty one Ram. It's
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: a Laramie. Yeah, Laramie twenty five hundred. Yeah, it was
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: the Laramie. You know, I had the comments had all
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: the right stuff. Beautiful truck, really nice, really really handsome trip,
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: really nice, but it just felt a bit with that
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: six speed transmission. It was fine. It just an old
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: trans Yeah, once you go, once you go ten speed.
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: It's like compared to Ford's six speed, which is in
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: like my Earth Rummer, the I forgot the name for it.
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: The RAM trans is worse than that, and that was
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: a twenty eleven trans. I think this started as a
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: five speed and then got an extra gear added, and
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: it's just really long in the tude. That's the one
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: real limitation with the RAM. And then between the RAM
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: and Ford where it gets tricky is that Ram will
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: say best in class torque that is only on the
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: thirty five hundred correct when equipped with the high output
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: engine that comes with the acin transmission. Correct. So if
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: you were in the market, not in the market for
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: a they call them one tons.
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: But you know that used to be like the payload.
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: It no longer translates even closely.
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: We had this conversation the other day. It's like Scott
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: explained to me where those numbers come from, because I
• 11:46
  Speaker 4: can't figure out what it means.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and now it means nothing, right, It means nothing,
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: because like a half ton has way more than a
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: half done. A payload one means a thirty foot toy hauler,
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: one means a seventy five. Yeah, but you know, maybe
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: one of my other b with the twenty five hundred RAM,
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: that truck only has in the eight hundreds. Only yeah,
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: in the eight hundreds of torque, but it has kind
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: of a clunky transmition. It's not as refined to drive
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: around town as the four. You know, what's interesting to
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: me is when I drive a twenty five hundred RAM
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: with the coil sprung er end and the diesel, the
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Cummins diesel, it feels like the best, the most appropriate
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: truck for me to drive. It's really it's really interesting.
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: It's and maybe it's because I'm I'm becoming more of
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: a ludite than I think I am, But there's something
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: so honest about a tradesman with twenty five hundred with
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: a Cummins turbo diesel that motor poles from the bottom.
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: It does. I would almost argue that the Cummins just
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: it does more with less. You know, It's like the
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: Porsche kind of thing, like there's you know, Porsia guys
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: are obsessed with like the Mesger engine water cooled nine
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: to elevens because they just have a certain something. Cummins
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: just have a certain something.
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: True the fact that you could take a fifty thousand
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: dollars tradesman and you could send it to av right
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: from the factory line in Michigan, and you can get
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: a vehicle that is so appropriate for so many different things.
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: I think that's what's the forties for seventy grand. Yeah,
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: you can barely buy a cheap Gladiator, Rubicon or seventy
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: grand right now.
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: That's the thing is that the price like roughly out
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: the door for the prospect Or EXL.
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: I think that's seventeen seven and forty. You may not
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: end up with the Snorkel and a couple other things,
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: but you get the av engin, you get the wheels.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you get the AEV treatment, and you end up
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: with a vehicle for less than the tremor or about
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: the same price of the tremor that will then kind
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: of own the tremor on the trail. In fairness to manufacturers,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: we really try very hard to just test vehicles in
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: their stock state, and because any vehicle can be modified
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: in a way to improve it. Like Matt and I
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: were Matt Scott and I were talking about the Tremor,
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: and like, my biggest beef with the Tremor is that
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: the ride quality is it's not only inconsistent with the payload,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: Like it has about a twenty five hundred pound payload
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: and it feels like it feels like worse than a
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: one ton. The ride quality isn't even consistent with the payload.
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: It's just like totally inconsistent with the segment. It's just
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: very abusive. Well, Ford does these like that. I think
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: that truck has two leaf bacts. Yeah, right, two leaf springs.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: I've always said this, like Ford has some of the
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: best engineering and some of the best or worst accounts
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: that like totally invalidate a lot of that stuff. And
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: that's just one of the areas where they just like
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: totally dropped the.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: Ball with that truck. Maybe or maybe they just expect
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: people to overload them. I'm not.
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: I mean, it would be really interesting to see what
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: their strategy is behind it had.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: The previous generation f twot fifty with the six seven,
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: I mean, honestly, like a lot of the drive line
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: is the same aside from the ten speed, and that
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: thing just rowed so terribly. Yeah, but to be fair,
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: we drove that against the RAM back to back, and
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: the RAM at that time rode even worse.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: I think the coil sprun rear has really helped the
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: RAM in a lot of ways. It's just that that
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: tremor was like, you knew it could get through anything.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: And it even had the optional front winch, so you
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: think about how much that winch weighs. So they put
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: that in the front and it's still it still didn't
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: really help. So like for those that are listening, the
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: tremor is exceptional, and we're going to get to conclusions
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: at the end of the podcast. But the tremor is exceptional,
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: but you need to go into it knowing that you
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: have got to change out the spring rates to your
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: unless you're unless you're to your purpose, to your purpose.
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I was going to say, I think so. The
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: Ross Monster Baha, which was a flatbed camper that I
• 15:29
  Speaker 4: drove earlier this year, is as far as I remember,
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: was built on a tremor platform, and my experience driving
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: it was actually that it was extremely comfortable to drive.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: Oh, I was fully loaded up.
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: It had a large flatbed camper with like an roof
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: that lifted, I mean, bed everything.
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: So was the suspension changed or was it pretty stock?
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: I'm not sure. Yeah.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Sure, Well, I mean that's a really good point. And
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: I think that you're both right in the fact that
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: if you were to put a four wheel camper in
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: it and put a front bumper on it, and.
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, let's not forget that ride quality and payload are inextricably.
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: They are in many ways.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: In many ways, with the exception of air suspension, that's
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: the only way you get around it.
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I would say the same to the ram, right,
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: the ram that I own, when it's empty, it's pretty rough.
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's not terrible. It works.
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: But every full sized truck I've driven so far, when
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: it has a trailer hitched up or a camper in
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: the back, it's way more comfortable.
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: It gets way, it gets way better.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: And so I think that was the one thing for
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: me that there was a couple negatives that I found
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: with the Tremor. It was really unfortunate that you could
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: only get the Tremor in the four door with a
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: six foot bed, like they restrict that package a little
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: bit because the Tremor is a package. It is Therauro
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: Wagon is a model. The Tremor is something that's available
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: from XLT Lariat King Ranch and I don't think it's
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: on Platinum well. And the sad thing is is that
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: you can no longer. The popularity of the Tremor is
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: so high that they've now removed it from the XLT,
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: so you cannot get an XLT Tremor as for twenty
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: twenty two model year.
• 16:58
  Speaker 5: So it's basically an option package that can go on
• 17:01
  Speaker 5: a variety of trims. That's correct now to Ford's credit.
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: If you want to get a rear locker, you can
• 17:05
  Speaker 5: still get a rear locker in any of those versions.
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: You just can't get the front mechanical limited slip torsion
• 17:11
  Speaker 5: style that you can in the Tremor. You can't get
• 17:13
  Speaker 5: the winch package. There's a lot that comes with the Tremor,
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: including an additional lift, much larger tires. It was extremely
• 17:20
  Speaker 5: impressive to me on the trail to all things considered,
• 17:22
  Speaker 5: Yes they do. They change a lot of things in it,
• 17:25
  Speaker 5: and the fact that you can get so front mechanical
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: limited slip with tracks, control, crawl control, hill decent control,
• 17:31
  Speaker 5: all of the off road goodies sixteen point five Winch
• 17:34
  Speaker 5: warn Winch on the front with synthetic line Dura tract tires,
• 17:38
  Speaker 5: like really premium package and it comes in it over
• 17:41
  Speaker 5: seventy thousand dollars.
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: So it's the recognition that you're.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: Getting a lot of payload, a lot of capability, thirty
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: five inch tires from the factory. But then the downsides
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: are you've really got to pay attention to the ride quality,
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: tuning it to what you do. You're limited to a
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: six foot bed, which if you look at like how
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: cool would it be to get a single cab eight
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: foot bed Tremor, you know, you put a scout in
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: the back, or you put some other camper in the
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: back of it. And with that kind of capability, like
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: you get the extended warranty and you never like you
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: never modify it, like it's just you just run with
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: you just drive it because it's so so close to perfect.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: And then the other thing that is noticeably different between
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: the Tremor and the power Wagon, other than ride quality,
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: is the fact that the power Wagon has a disconnectable
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: front swaybar, which keeps the truck very level and extremely comfortable,
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: less head toss off road, so that there is a
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: much a much larger gap in capability between the two
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: than you would expect. Where the tremor has a little
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: bit of a of an ace in the hole, is
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: a bigger tire. So it's surprising that the power wagon
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: is still only available with a thirty three inch tall tire.
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but you get the five loink front end which
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: actually flexes. It does super yeah flex. You know that
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: the Ford has the radius arm front end, which is fine,
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: but it's just it's it's meant to all in tow
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: and it doesn't. It's not. It's not meant to flex.
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: That's That's one of the big difference is between the
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: power wagon and the diesel trucks is it is actually
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: a different suspension architecture. You get the six point four,
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: which has the cylinder deactivation, which I think is really cool.
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: That motor is great. I mean it's you know, comes
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: from the SRT line, but I want to say it
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: has a different caminet, a little bit more low end
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: torqu where you're actually going to use it. And then
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: you get the eight hp ZF transmission, which is fantastic.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: It's using everything from rolls Royce. It's the only thing
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: that rolls Royce and Bentley agree on is that this
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: is the best transmission that's on the market, and you
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: get that in the power Wagon. I also think the
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: interior first really nice. It's it's really nice. Their heritage
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: seventy five year truck is beautiful, which which integrated some
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: of the limited features and things like that. Listen, they're
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: all nice. Yeah, right. I want to say on the
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: super duties you can get massaging seats and you can
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: kind of probably do whatever you want. I think that
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: the which is weird, but I feel that the fit
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: and finish these days on the we're not calling it FCA,
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: We're calling it stillentis stilantis. It's like it's like somebody
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: went on, like, what's the most awkward game we could
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: call a car company corporate name generator dot com and
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: then put in a word cloud in stillanis came up
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: and they're like, oh, yeah, that's great.
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: It's like the combination of synergy and all kinds of
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: really awkward.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: It's it's it's really close to synergy, which, as you've
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: taught me, run for those that are listening, if you're
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: ever about to do business with someone and they use
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: the word synergy. Run run, just hide run. So there's
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: a lot of synergy between the twenty five.
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: Now, Matt Schwartz, you drove the TRX recently and the
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: power Wagon, if I remember, it was available for you
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: guys to drive that day in the cinders.
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: Was it?
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: What were your thoughts on the power Wagon? Not as
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: good as a t.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: Rex, not as fun, let's say that equally as comfortable.
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: I mean, the interior is beautiful on those and I
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: would say comparing the RAM trucks to the Ford and
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: GMC trucks I've been in, I personally I think I
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: like the Ram finish a little better on the inside. Yeah,
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: overall it's just beautifully executed. But just as the overall
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: driving experience with the power Wagon, I mean there was
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: only one power Wagon in our group, I should say,
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: only one that participants were driving.
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: Nina was driving with us and she drove her power Wagon.
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: Sure, so obviously that truck's a little more subdued on
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: the performance side of things than the TRX. It was incredible,
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: and I mean it did everything that the TRX did,
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: albeit a little slower maybe, but yeah, fantastic truck.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: I was so impressed with it. Our crew we did
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: a trip up to northern California and we ended up
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: testing a Nimble vehicle, but we drove a power wagon
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: up there and back and it was a cruiser.
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was such a cruiser if you can
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: get beyond the diesel thing, yeah, which is hard. The
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: power wagon's card I think by nature of the transmission,
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: and I think like.
• 21:41
  Speaker 4: You mentioned, you know, when you compare it to the
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: diesel like that, the difference in the suspension, for instance,
• 21:46
  Speaker 4: I noticed that, you know, because my twenty five hundred
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: Cummins as my daily driver. So to get in the
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: power wagon in an off highway situation with roots and
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: cinders and everything, you notice the articulation difference. You notice
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: just how much different of a truck it is in
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: all ways that I love, except we pull around an
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: eight thousand pound trailer. So for us, the Commons diesel
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: makes more sense than the powerway.
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: Oh totally, yeah, absolutely all right.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: So the next one we're going to talk about is
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: the GMC Sierra twenty five hundred HD eighty four. That's
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: the one you just drove. I just drove it, in fact,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: right before the article was wrapped up, and I've spent
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: some time in the twenty five hundreds before, but never
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: with the diesel. The Duramax. It surprised me. It's got
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: numbers that are kind of close, like nine hundred and
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: fifty foot pounds kind of thing. But it has a
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: ten speed transmission as well.
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: I think it's the same ten speed that's in the
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: Ford that was a co developed transport.
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: It totally could be because they felt so similar in
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: that way. If you blindfolded someone, the only thing they
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: would notice in performance difference between the Ford and the
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: GMC is that the GMC rides a lot better, Like
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: that's the only way you'd note have That's the only
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: way you would know you're in the GMC, because in
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: my mind they were on par as far as performance.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: And it kind of makes sense because the four has
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: a bigger tire, a heavier tire that's trying to turn,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: so there's probably just enough difference between the two.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: I think the GMC looks the best. It looks really sharp,
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: looks really and I am I am not a Chevy guy.
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: I'm from the Midwest and meant that I was assigned
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: a Big three manufacturer at birth. Chevy just isn't that one.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: But I'm sorry, GM. It looks great. It does.
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: The interior is better. The interior is really nice. It's
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: the quietest truck in my experience.
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: They're so quiet.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: Okay, this is for all clarity, Like, if you need
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: to buy something with a lot of payload and you
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: wanted to not destroy your spine, you buy a GMC.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: This thing drives like a half ton.
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Did that have the best ride quality by far
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: of all? Hands down, by far, even better than the Tundra.
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: Don't And I don't know what they do in the
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: cabs of those trucks, but they've just always been so
• 23:48
  Speaker 3: quiet inside. It's been crazy. Every every like GM truck
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: product I've been in, they're the most car like. In
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: the most complimentary way, I could say that it's the
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: only luxury truck brand that exists. It's that's GMC's only
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: purpose is to be the luxury truck brand of GM.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: They build a lot of comfort and they address a
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: lot of noise, vibration and harshness. But what's interesting around GMC,
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: and we've never even considered their products before they started
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: this at four line, because it never really met our
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: expectations for capability. But now when you buy a twenty
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: five hundred HD with the eight four package, you get
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: additional skid plates, you get a two inch factory lift,
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: you get a thirty four inch tall tire, you get
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: a mechanical locking room differential, you get an off road
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: mode in the driver selection mode, hill descent control, some
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: things that I think add to kind of what an
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: Overlander would need. The downside is it has less articulation
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: than the solid axle trucks. Torsion bar front hill, it
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: is an independent yeah, and I think that that's going
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: to change fairly soon. But the architecture of the chassis
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: you're fifteen hundred has the coil does coil over front end?
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: It does. Yeah, it's interesting, it's.
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: Coming still on, Yeah, it's coming. But the current model
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: it doesn't have that. So it's still torsion suspended, fairly
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: limited overall travel, which you do notice like in larger
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: events or once the speed starts to increase, so you
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: start to really notice that. For me, there's just not
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: a lot of aftermarket support either for the GMC vehicles.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: Where and again we've come back to this and maybe
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: in some way we are a fanboy of AV. We
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: don't want to try to disguise a bias.
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: I am a fan. Yeah, we don't want to. I'm
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: gonna I'm going to disclose that. Yeah, we don't want
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: to disguise a bias that works. It's fairly it's exactly
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: it works, and it has worked for a long time.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: They put a lot of thought into the products that
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: they get. Is it's an entire system, correct, that's well integrated.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: The engineering component of it too. I mean, that's sure.
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: I've had some conversations with folks who know a lot
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: more about vehicles than I do, and with AV it
• 25:44
  Speaker 4: always comes back to they approach any kind of vehicle
• 25:47
  Speaker 4: modification from an engineering standpoint. They are going to maintain
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: angles and geometry and all the engineering that was done
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: for the OEM truck.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: And that's why their stuff works.
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: It's so it's so true. And because that was their strategy, Matt,
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: they actually now when they make something, the OEM can
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: decide to now offer it as a factory option. There's
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: no other aftermarket company that I'm aware of. AIRB does
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: a little bit of that.
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: The things that that AEV make, they are built to
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: the requirements of a factory delivered option. So that's why
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: you all of a sudden see a bison come into
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: the planet. And because all of a sudden, all this
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: AEV stuff is now available on the lot at the dealership,
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: which is really unusual. Yeah, so we don't need we
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: don't need to the AEV stuff. This is another AV tangent. Yeah, sorry, yeah, exactly.
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: But when you talk about full sized trucks, you just
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: you just end up going down that road. Yeah, I mean,
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: like a Prospector XL is just like so rad it's
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: the baddest, baddest MF on the road. Like it just
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: it just works well.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: And for a guy who drives a TRX every day,
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: I can you get to say that, you get to
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: say that you get toy that minds faster. Yeah, I
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: mean that a TRX is pretty bad. That's pretty bad ass.
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: So what I found with the GMC is highest payload
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: for a twenty five hundred in the test.
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: What was it? It was over three thousand pounds. Wow, dang exactly.
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: So like stick a camper on the back of it
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: and a bunch of bumpers and everything else, and it's like, eh,
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: so no problem. It has one of the better towing
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: capabilities in the test as well, and then it has
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: the best ride quality. So somehow GM has found a
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: way to make something carry a lot of weight and
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: also ride well.
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: I will give them the most Improved award, Like I know,
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: there isn't an award that I can actually give, but
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: he just did. But I'm giving it, and I will
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: say that GM product like GM trucks specifically, like I
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: think specifically like the fifteen hundred and twenty five hundred
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: sure which is that that is GM trucks. That's pretty
• 27:46
  Speaker 3: much all of them, definitely the most improved. Like they
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: look good, the fit and finish is much better, interior
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: way better.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, when you look at full sized trucks, that three
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: liter ten speed automatic fifteen hundred, pick a Sierra or
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: pick a Chevrolet ZR two or whatever you want to pick,
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: that combo is kind of magic. And then nobody really
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: makes that yet. So the fact that GM is able
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: to stand alone with especially now with the eight four
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: x so you can get front rear lockers, diesel drive train,
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: ten speed automatic, it's actually it's pretty special.
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: It's what we've all been asking for sure, and no one,
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: I'm not saying, no one's buying it, but then they
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: just continue buying forwards and rams. Yeah, except that they're
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: crushing it. They're eighteen. We're glad they're crushing it. They're
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: at four packages crushing. I see so many of those
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: at four. The breeder barge thing. Talk to me, I
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: don't know what you're saying now that the big ones
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: with that seat like fourteen, oh yeah yeah, the Yukon.
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: The Yukon, I call them breeder barges because only people
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: who are on this planet to just have a of
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: kids drive them. But at least now they're like kind
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: of a lift king, got a lift kit, you know,
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: like it's a cool looking breeder barge.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: It's like where as whereas the at four Yukon it
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: looks great and it's got anyway, we don't need to
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: spend a bunch of time on. So the things that
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: I found on the twenty five hundred that I cared
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: for less was the fact that it doesn't have a
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: driver selectable locker. I mean, we're in the age where
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: that is now commonplace. Just give me the button, Give
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: me the button, please, because it actually works. It's the
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: best solution because if you turn it off, the car
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: still has traction control and they can tune it to
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: be aggressive, whereas when you lock it, you stop spinning.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: And even the Thunder now has a rear locking differential.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: So I suspect that GMC is very aware of that,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: because this is an interesting attribute that I found with
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: this twenty five hundred.
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: It has to spin the wheels. It's like the land
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: Rover thing where it's like you're supposed to be You're
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: supposed to be the guys. Yeah, someone shuts you down. Yeah,
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: because GM has the people on the development team that
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: know that. They know that, and someone is just not
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: listening to.
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: It'll come the fifteen hundred eighty four X front rear
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: driver selectable lockers, so they know that that needs to happen.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: Bison the ZR two driver selectable lockers, so they're just
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: moving them through the line. Now when you buy twenty
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: five hundred HD today, lots of wheel spin. They can't
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: they can't intervene with traction control because if you do,
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: then it won't lock the rear. So it's like they're
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: kind of in this catch twenty two of like I
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: need to allow will spin for the rear mechanical locker
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: to lock.
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: Do you think that they're worried about the rear axle strength?
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: No, I mean the rear axle on that twenty five
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: hundred is massive, Like maybe on the fifteen hundred it's
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: more of a concern.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: I don't know that.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: I know that there's a tire size recommended limitation on
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: the fifteen hundred, but on the twenty five hundred it's
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: it's a gigantic flear axle. Yeah, the tractor control needs
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: to have less intervention in order to allow the rear
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: locker to engage. So once they put a driver selectable locker,
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: than the problem solved. That was one thing that I noticed.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: The other thing that's also a bit of a complication
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: is the shape of the wheel wells. They look really handsome,
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: but they're very square and fairly tight.
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: For those of us looking at the YouTube's watch us
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: on YouTube, it's a lot like this Overlain Journal magazine.
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: You see most car company have wheels like that. Wheel
• 31:01
  Speaker 3: wells like this circle goes and goes in here, and
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: it kind of allows it to move up and down.
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: They've done it like this, which means they can fit
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: this tiny little thing and then as soon as you
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: mess with, you know, lift or whatever, it ends up
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: it just doesn't fit. It just doesn't fit. Subscribe now,
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: so that's a challenge with the GMC is the real
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: well opening shape. Chevrolet has addressed that their new trucks
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: are all around reel well opening, so they can already
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: fit a larger tire. No doubt GMC will address that too.
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: But in the current model that we're testing, we are
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: limited to about a thirty five thirty six inch tall
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: tire on a twenty five hundred, which like a power
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: wagon can fit a thirty seven kind of off the
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: off the lot. Yeah. So I mean, let's also let's
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: also take a step back. Let's let's check our tire
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: privilege at the door. Thirty fives are quite large. I mean,
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: I remember when thirty fives were like they were the
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: be's knees. I mean, if you had it, if you
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: had a TJ on thirty five's, you were monster truck.
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: You were you were king of the cornfield. Yeah, and
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: now it's like, are you talking about you, Matt, Yeah,
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: I was the king of the cornfield. I remember that TJ.
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: It was terrible. It's absolutely horrible. It was everything. It
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: was like I went through the built catalog and added
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: at all and then I drove it and it didn't
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: really work. Yeah, you like Scott, Why am I stuck?
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: Why am I stuck? One? I didn't know how to
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: drive in two? Yeah, lockers would have been a good idea.
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: But bro, did you see my light bars? They were sick.
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: They were sick, all three of they're sick. Yeah exactly,
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: this is actually pre light bar. Yeah. I don't actually
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: know if I had any lights.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: You just said thirty five to highlights. Yeah, driving lights.
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: Now. I think I had the hell of five hundreds
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: from Walmart because I really for them. I had those two. Yeah,
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: those two for sure. Yeah, they were like forty seven dollars.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: And a special thanks to this week's sponsor, The Medic.
• 32:45
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  Speaker 1: cooler that you can rely on and enjoy for years
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: to come. All Right, So the next the next vehicle,
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the Nissan Titan XD Pro
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: four X.
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: So here's my biggest thing with us is do you
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: actually have to have a Costco membership card to buy
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: a Nissan? Because I can't figure out why you would.
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: We're going to feel bad if we say all this stuff?
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: Can I can? I just be honest because it was
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: like the worst car I have driven. I didn't drive
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: the XD, but I drove the Titan, the New Titan Titan,
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: and it had some kind of name that you would
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: expect from like a like a Costco, Kirkland Vodka or ram.
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: Maybe it was the Kirkland Edition. It could have been
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: the Kirkland Edition. That's what I called it. Waist banded
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: into it. It was terrible bel crow shoes. I don't
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: know how they can make it that bad, like knowing that,
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was worse than the Tundra coming out
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: that was out, and they knew that they were coming
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: out with a new one. I just don't understand the business.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: I don't know why you buy a Nissan. I'm sorry.
• 34:15
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to be real honest.
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: And we'd be fair to Costco in Kirkland and admit
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: that they're both awesome.
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: That's true, that's true. Yeah, yeah, they're good, like they
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: offer a lot of value. Except for when I drove
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: the Nissan Titan Kirkland Reserve, it was more expensive than
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: like the it was king Ran. It was expensive. There
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: was nothing there. I remember when the XD came out
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: with the Cummings, which is cool, which was really cool,
• 34:41
  Speaker 3: except that when you went to the lot to buy one,
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: they didn't deal on them like you could go get
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: an F two fifty with a sixty seven or a
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: RAM or something for thousands less that had more power,
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: more torque, more payload, more everything. Kind of think that
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: they've just put themselves in the same position, like I
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: don't know how many like rental car fleets buy these things,
• 34:59
  Speaker 3: or how many like corporate lease business car people buy them.
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: I don't get them. I just don't get them. Yeah,
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: and they're very Fender sound systems cool though, and then different.
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: They're so different than the Frontier. So like the Frontier
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: has this legacy of reliability, it's super capable and all that.
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: I think the advantage that an XD has is that
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: you end up with this kind of Japanese build quality,
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: reliability with over two thousand pounds of payloads, So it
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: makes it a little bit competitive. They came out with
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: the car and then the new Tundra hits and what
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: do you do? I mean, I think the challenge right
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: now is it loses the Cummings, which I thought was
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: a gem of a little motor. And so now you've
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: got this four hundred horse power V eight. I think
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: it's five point seven five point nine Durrance, it's what
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: they call it.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, if you just get in it and drive it,
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: it's pretty underwhelming. If you go into trailer mode, then
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: it gives you or if you go into towing mode,
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: it gives you. The transmission starts to wake up a
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: little bit, and there's some things that you can do
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: to make the vehicle feel a lot more sporty. And
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: if I did all of those things and I started
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: to drive it more aggressively than the car started to
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: change my opinion a little bit. But I think the
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: challenges is when you look at the approach angle, if
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: you look at the breakover angle, if you look any of.
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: The attributes that we need, it's it just doesn't hit
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: the mark. It's minor league in the major league. There's
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: nothing wrong with going and watching a minor league baseball game. Yeah,
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: it's really entertaining, it's cool, it's whatever. But when you
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: try and when you try and price it like a
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: major league game, sure like there has to be value.
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: And that's just what I'm not getting from a lot
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: of Nissan's products these days, is that they're pricing themselves
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: in the major league, but they're not bringing their a game.
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, or they become like deeply discounted at the dealership.
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: Give the consumer a reason to go check them out,
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: give them an argument to come consider the vehicle. The
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: limited aftermarket support is also another challenge I think for Nissan.
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: If I was n some.
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: Nissan people out a little bit, a little bit but
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: very limited compared to like a Tundra for example. I mean,
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: if I was, if I was king for a day
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: of Nissan, I would focus on the Titan being the
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: vehicle that the Tundra is not. So I would make
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: it a three quarter ton, make it have payload and
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: towing capability, and I would make it have round clearance
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: and three quarter ton though it is, but I would
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I would just make sure that it was like a
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: real three quarter ton, like, yeah, twenty six hundred pounds
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: of payload and instead of twenty two hundred. And I
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: would make sure that it had a Japanese diesel in it,
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: and I would make sure that it became the vehicle
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: something very different. I think would be a big advantage
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: to Nissan on that. And it's not to take away
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: from the fact that I think a Titan is just
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: a fine, final sized truck. But when you're talking about
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: one of the most competitive automotive segments on the planet,
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: you really got to bring your A game, not your
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: B game.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: So yeah, absolutely ribbon. Right here was a fine beer
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: in eighteen ninety three when it was selected as America's
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: best beer. You would not enter absolute ribbon. You would
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: name modern beer. Competition would not. And that Nissan Titan
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: just does not feel modern. You know, it's got that
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: new nine speed transmission, but it feels a bit clunky.
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: I think that it's slow to shift in Yeah, it's
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: slow to shift. I think the driving dynamics are pretty good.
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: The vehicle feels relatively lively and comfortable. Yeah. But then
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: but then you get like the I always pick on
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: manufactures for this. They get the little molding lines on
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: places like this fake leather plastic, and then there'll be
• 38:24
  Speaker 3: like a line that you can see on the edge
• 38:25
  Speaker 3: where it was molded. Sure, and that's just like I
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: see that. It's like I see that. You would I
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: see that you would? You wouldn't see that. I mean,
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: you get it in ran forwards, but they just put
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: it in like inconvenient places where you touch it, like
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: like on the door handle where you like grab it on,
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: like like why is that so pokey? It's like, ah,
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: it's fully getting my fingerprints. You don't get that in
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: the rams. You don't get that on the Toyota's no
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: at all. It's a really small exam I think that
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: where Nissans make a lot of sense, where the frontier,
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: where the Titan and that kind of stuff is. People
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: buy them, presumably like Costco leases them for their employe
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: as a kirk Own special, and then they get rid
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: of them and they just like fall off the face
• 39:04
  Speaker 3: of the earth with resale, and then they're a really
• 39:07
  Speaker 3: attractive proposition if you're in the market for a used vehicle. Sure,
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: I think that the Titan is a fantastic choice because
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: then the value proposition starts to starts to actually come
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: into play. You had a lot of truck for the money.
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: I want to have a Ram twenty five hundred or
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: one hundred thousand miles for ten thousand dollars less than
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: I paid for it? Or do I want to have
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: a good Nick, easy to service, cheap service Titan for
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: half of that. That's where I really think the Nissan
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: comes comes into its range. And that's tough for Nissan,
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: which is trying to sell new cars exactly. It is
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: very difficult. Does anybody here have a compelling argument as
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: to why they should buy a Nissan Titan over anything
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: else that we've talked about. No, especially since the placemen coming.
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: I would argue as a new car buyer, it is
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: actually the most expensive because it's going to appreciate the most.
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it came in at fifty seven thousand dollars without
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: the diesel. Because the diesel is no longer available. When
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: I looked at the pros and cons on it, one
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: of the pros is it does have a sixty to
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: one low range, so a lot of control, a lot
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: of control off road. You can get a rear locking differential,
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: which is something like you can't get on the RAM
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: twenty five hundred, for example. And then it does have
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: a five year, one hundred thousand mile warranty, which is
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: not surprising because Nissan.
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: Makes quality, reliable vehicles.
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: Fine, yeah, very clearance restricted and a very sluggish drive train,
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: like an uninspiring drive train.
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: But for fifty seven thousand dollars you can get a
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: really nice Tundra. Yeah, you can get a power wagon.
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, you can get a Diesel twenty five hundred Ram. Yeah,
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: you can get a standard Tremor seven to three Godzilla
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: Forwards super duty. Correct. None of these things are in
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: the same league. Yeah, totally unfortunately for Yeah, no, totally different.
• 40:48
  Speaker 3: Like I've met a lot of people from Nissan, they're
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: really nice folks. I hope they crush it with the Frontier,
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: so the frontier looks so I hope they crush it
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: with a Frontier, so then they feel in bold and
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: to do something with a title. Yeah, it's tough, so
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: Tundras next. Yeah, and you're the only one that's actually driven.
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: We talked. We talked through the are going to drink beer? Ah,
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: we talked through the power Wagon.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Power Wagon of course pros class leading capability, super comfortable
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: diesel aside.
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: I would have all of these vehicles. I would get
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: the power Wagon. But what about that fifteen pound payload? Like,
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: how does that sit with you? I'm just curious. It's
• 41:22
  Speaker 3: a valid point, right when you do look at the
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: Tremor with the seven to three, which is going to
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: be basically the same price point as the power Wagon.
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: I just like the fit and finish of the power Wagon.
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: True's off red performance. Yeah, I do think that it struggles.
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: And I mean, like, look at that, look at that articulation.
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: It's pretty nihil in the powerway. I mean, that's just
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: that's insane. That's factory.
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: Don't have the upcoming issue of Overland Journal on your iPad.
• 41:48
  Speaker 3: You can see this in the upcoming issue of Overland Journal.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: Paula, the amazing producer is going to put in some
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: rich media with this. That's gonna be kind of fun.
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: So Paula, Yeah, Paula twenty two for sure, Funny Paul
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: for President twenty two, we talked about the tradesmen. I
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: really I'm a big believer in the tradesman package. You're Lariot,
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: You're Lariot was a really, really nice truck. But there
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: is something about the fact that you can buy this
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: and maybe it's even the name, but like when I
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: see a rubber floor mat.
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's stupid to buy one. It is costing you
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: more money in the long round, do you think so
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: if you make it like like I've done this for
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: almost every full sized truck I've bought, and you make
• 42:27
  Speaker 3: a spreadsheet, right, the market is flooded with X you know,
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: the exls, XLTS tradesmen's like you know, generalizing for most
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: of the markets. When it comes on the used market, okay,
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: are you going to and everything's depreciated down the lariat,
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: the king ranch, the laramie that those kinds of things,
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: with exception of like the platinums and the limiteds right,
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: like the very upper echelon, those do tend to have
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: a bit of a value proposition that drops off. It's
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: it's usually people people want the leather seats, they want
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: that the kind of the nicer stuff. I feel like
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: that's the larger market and that those are the values
• 43:02
  Speaker 3: the trucks that hold their value the most. So that's
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: that's the one thing I always encourage people to look
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: at as not just the purchase price, because if you're
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: financing that the purchase price is you know it's going
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: to be within twenty five to fifty dollars a month,
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: but you actually maybe throwing away more money and getting
• 43:17
  Speaker 3: less of a truck when you go to get rid
• 43:19
  Speaker 3: of it in a couple of years. And people think
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: I'm crazy, but I honestly look at it because like
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: the fifty you're probably you're probably right, the fifty five
• 43:26
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars tradesmen, that's I mean, they do equip those
• 43:29
  Speaker 3: things pretty well. They put a heated steering wheel available,
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: heated seats that they've kind of recognized that these are
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: just basic things that people want these days. They do
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: tend to depreciate more like the power wagon always have
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: a great resal value because they're a power wagon, right,
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: like they are subthing raptors. T Rex is like these
• 43:47
  Speaker 3: desirable trucks. People always want them because they're more desirable
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: and they will pay more for them as they depreciate,
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: more people in the population can afford them. So that
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: isn't that's a super the matscott gaming well thing, but
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: it's also a totally valid argument, particularly if you're not
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: planning to keep the vehicle for that long. I mean
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: the last car that I owned, I drove for twelve years,
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: so like like the g Wagon, I literally drove the
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: wheels off it. I would probably still want the trades
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: without the giant screen. I want the rubber floor mats.
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: I mean, up until twenty eighteen, you could still buy
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: a RAM with a manual transmission, which is awesome, maybe
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: even twenty nineteen, but I mean it's heartbreaking that it's
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: no longer available. I understand it. It is not Ram's fault.
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: It's our fault, like those of us at scale. Yeah,
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: those of us at the table, everybody listening. The autos
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: are just so good these yea.
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: If we don't buy manual transmissions are going to stop
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: selling them. So it's like, it's not the manufacturer's fault
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: that they stopped selling them and.
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: The manuals couldn't handle the amount of torque.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: That's true. They were very limited on that for sure.
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: I remember driving Dave Harreton's like tray bed single cab
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: twenty five hundred manual tran maybe thirty five hundred manual transmission.
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: It was just so joyful because it was so like
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: fit for purpose. But they just not really available anymore,
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: although I do every once in a while, like go
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: on to car Gurus or whatever and like search for
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: that truck because part of me just wants to buy
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: it just because.
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: But I think Mario bought it. Yeah he did. Well, Yeah,
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: breath good, bro, Yeah. Yeah.
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: Dave reached out, He's like, hey, you want to buy
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: my truck, and I'm like, oh, I don't know, and
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: I should have, of course, but congratulations Mario. The tradesman
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: comes in at about a twenty five hundred pounds payload
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: fifty five grand with a diesel motor. I mean, it
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: is just almost free. I mean it's silly to say that,
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: but when you look at how expensive cars are today,
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: to get a Cummins turbo diesel twenty five hundred pickup
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: with full.
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: A million mile truck, it.
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: Is that was that was the most compelling reason for us.
• 45:39
  Speaker 4: I mean, it's just it's the best deal.
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: It's the by far tradesman, I did.
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, and I have a.
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: Tradesman owner here. Sorry for insulting your financial person.
• 45:49
  Speaker 4: Well, it's not insulting, you know. I think I think
• 45:51
  Speaker 4: you made a really good point. You know, if you
• 45:53
  Speaker 4: if you are a car owner who does plan to
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: sell or trade your car in on a somewhat regular interval,
• 45:59
  Speaker 4: that is absolutely a smart thing to consider. Like in
• 46:02
  Speaker 4: our case, I don't think we will. I think we're
• 46:04
  Speaker 4: hoping to keep the truck, you know, pay it off
• 46:06
  Speaker 4: and just own it.
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: And how long have you had your Toyota? We sold
• 46:08
  Speaker 3: the PRIs Yeah, but how long did you have that?
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: Oh man? I mean it was a two thousand and
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: eight and we just sold it this year.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Okay, there you go. Yeah, So like you you're going
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: to get all of that you want out of that tradesman.
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah.
• 46:18
  Speaker 4: And I mean in our case, like I just didn't
• 46:21
  Speaker 4: couldn't afford all the fancy trim stuff. Sure it's awesome
• 46:23
  Speaker 4: to have the like like we've said, like the rams
• 46:26
  Speaker 4: are incredible, the high end ones. But I mean the
• 46:28
  Speaker 4: tradesman is everything we needed. And I have ambitions of
• 46:31
  Speaker 4: once we're done toeing the airstream around pulling the box
• 46:34
  Speaker 4: off and doing a flatpid camper. I mean, sure, I
• 46:36
  Speaker 4: just won't feel bad about like doing that to a
• 46:39
  Speaker 4: higher trim level truck.
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: Totally, we'll get beat up a little bit more.
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: But either way, it is so affordable and for people
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: that are looking at these full sized trucks and thinking,
• 46:46
  Speaker 4: how can I ever afford that? Like the Tradesman is
• 46:49
  Speaker 4: a way into that segment of vehicle, you know, at
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: least it was for us, And it's so cool to
• 46:54
  Speaker 4: be able to get that.
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: I mean, just compare that vehicle to just about anything else,
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: Like it's pretty hard to actually buy a four run
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: for less money than that. I mean, you kind of
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: got to work at it.
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: To buy a Wrangler with some capability for less than
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: that or what that comes with.
• 47:07
  Speaker 3: It's unbelievable. And you have to think that ten thousand
• 47:09
  Speaker 3: dollars of that purchase price is the motor. So I
• 47:12
  Speaker 3: think it's sure. I think it's nine thousand. It's a
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: nine thousand dollar option, yeah, totally, option, totally. I think
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: it's like nine eight hundred and forty dollars or something
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: not that's just building a thirty five hundred online today.
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: It actually kind of makes you question, like, you know,
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: let's huck same company Gladiator. Yeah, Gladiators are now rapidly
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: approaching the seventies. Oh yeah, you buy a Diesel Rubicon.
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: You're there, You're there all day long. Well you're seventy.
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: What has more value? The RAM is designed to haul
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: heavy stuff around and the dimensions aren't that different. Gladiators
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: better around town and sure sure to service. Oh they're
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: and they're awesome, they look great. I mean, there's so
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: many upsides. But when we talk about full sized trucks,
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, and we'll get to that at the end,
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: like our own personal picks. But so when it comes
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: to the pros and cons on that tradesman, you're talking
• 47:58
  Speaker 3: about an exceptional value with the diesel drive train it's
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: really amazing, and a diesel drive train that you can service,
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: which I think is like, that's the I'm rambling. I
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: talked with the two six sevens kind of weird. I
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: owned both at the same time. I had a twenty
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: one twenty five hundred which I traded on the TI
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: re X when I had an opportunity to grab one,
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: and I have my Earth Romer which has the six
• 48:17
  Speaker 3: seven same drive train or same engine that is currently
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: in the modern ones. It terrifies me to change a belt.
• 48:24
  Speaker 3: I think I have to take off like inner cooler
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: tubes and and sure intake and coolant lines and all
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: this kind of stuff to get to it. Wherewith the Commings,
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: it was like there's the injector pump, there's the alternative,
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: there is the starter. Because it's you can see all
• 48:39
  Speaker 3: you can see all the rattley bits. Yeah, you can
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: see them all. Yeah, I think for you know, that's why,
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: like what you're trying to do is driving into the
• 48:46
  Speaker 3: ground like I would much rather in total enter fifteen years.
• 48:49
  Speaker 3: I mean, truthfully, I to service the six seven most
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: of the time. You take the cab off. When my
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: the four to six of them forture, let me declaire
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: for this. When my six seven blew up, they had
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: to disassemble the entire front end of the truck because
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: they couldn't take the cab off because of the earth
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: rummer camper on the back. It was a nightmare. I
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: think there's just so much merit to the six seven Commings.
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: It might not have the highest end torque or but
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: how it makes the power there I think, I mean
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: chime in matt but like there's something to that motor.
• 49:16
  Speaker 4: It's special, like when you push the accelerator down, and
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: especially like when the airstream's being pulled behind it, it's
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: got this like this.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's incredible, I mean a locomotive.
• 49:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and you feel it, like you feel this like
• 49:28
  Speaker 4: low frequency vibration from it, and you're just like, oh yeah, man, yes,
• 49:32
  Speaker 4: there it is. Oh yeah, yeah, no, it's incredible. I mean,
• 49:36
  Speaker 4: we'll pull the airstream. It will pull it at ninety
• 49:39
  Speaker 4: miles an hour if we want. Amazing, but that's safe.
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: But it's just yeah, it's incredible what you're getting.
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a lot and the fact that you so
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: you end up with this Cummins turbo diesel, you end
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: up with a coil sprung rear suspension in the twenty
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: five hundred, and then you end up with the availability
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: of having the av prospect Or package thrown on it
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: and coming in at about the same price as a tremor.
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: So when you just start to actually do the real
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: world numbers, it becomes very compelling. Now they're like anything.
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: There's a con too. I think the lack of a
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: rear factory locking differential is a downside.
• 50:12
  Speaker 3: It's a deal.
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: It has a the off road package, which Matt has
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: in his and you had in Matt, both Mats had
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: in their trucks. It has a limited slip differential, which
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: combined with an aggressive traction control system, is actually very
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: impressive off road. So I don't want it to make
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: it think like the vehicle is not capable, But there
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: is something about the control that comes with having a
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: driver selectable locker that I think is really advantageous. It
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: lacks a rear locking differential annually selectable, and then it
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: comes with a six feet automatic, so you end up
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: with a much less low range crawl control. You end
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: up with these noticeable shifts.
• 50:48
  Speaker 3: You end up.
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: With poor yeah, poor fuel yeah, poor fuel economy compared
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: to the Forward, for example, which the Commons has always
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: kind of won the fuel economy game. So the fact
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: that the engine is veryficient but the transmission doesn't fully
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: take advantage of it, those are some things worth noting.
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: I think on the twenty five hundred.
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: I was actually curious about that, and maybe you can
• 51:07
  Speaker 4: speak to that. But fuel economy across all of these vehicles,
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: what what did the best in terms of fuel?
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: All? Right? I have the chart here. Oh yeah, this
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: guy's got a chart.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: The one that did the very best was the Tundra,
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: which makes a lot of sense. These were our observed
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: fuel economy. So I don't drive there's well like fixed
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: test loop.
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: No there's not. This is like, yeah, this is like
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: what we got when we used it exactly. I assume
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: that you're probably kind of driving like we are. We're
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: not trying to hyper mile. Yeah, there was no attempt
• 51:36
  Speaker 3: to hyper mile. I don't drive fast, but I certainly
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: do not drive slow. In the Tundra, we were able
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: to get eighteen point two miles per gallon in the
• 51:45
  Speaker 3: The one that was a bit of a surprise was
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: the Ford Tremor so and it's it's really about that
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: ten speed automatic. So we got about eighteen miles per
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: gallon in that. Now here's the thing. At the end
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: of the day, they were all extremely close with the
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: ect option of the power wagon. Here we go, Ford
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: Tremor eighteen miles per gallon, Sierra twenty five hundred, seventeen
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: point one, Nissan XD seventeen point five, Ram twenty five hundred,
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: Tradesmen seventeen point eight, Toyota Tundra eighteen point two and
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: then and then the power wagon was fourteen point two,
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: So they probably all cost about the Samue run though. Yeah,
• 52:20
  Speaker 3: well except for the other gas versions. Yeah, the Tundra
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: would be probably the least cost more. Yeah, yeah, the
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: Tundra would probably be the least expensive overall to operate.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: And the Tundra, which we're going to move into that
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: right now. The Tundra is a ripper. I mean it is,
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: It looks good. It is very fast. If you drive
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: it with the eye force, it's very very fast.
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: Like the hybrid, Yeah, with the turbo.
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there are people now that are that are racing
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: it against the four raptors because it's like it's super fast.
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: So the I force hybrid with that makes five hundred
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: and eighty three foot pounds a torque and almost five
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: hundred horse power. It's quick and with that five link
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: where suspension, it just works. So the interesting thing about
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: the Tundra, it's something that I think is important to
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: spend some time on because it's a Toyota product which
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: is very popular with our listenership and our readership. But
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: the Tundra was always just a really good truck. Like
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: if somebody wanted to tow their boat, or they were
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: just they did a lot of like home depot runs,
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: or they had a big family or whatever.
• 53:20
  Speaker 3: The Tundra was always a vehicle that you could soundly
• 53:23
  Speaker 3: recommend to someone that you actually wanted to talk to
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: after the body.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like, there's never going to be disappointed in a
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: Tundra for sure. Toyota is always super conservative on everything.
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: So the Tundras always had terrible payload, like nobody really cared.
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, you're just like, yeah, let's just treat
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: it like a one ton And then somehow they magically
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: survived like those little Toyota pickups that you see totally
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: somebody swapped like a duly rear ax ye totally and
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: then an entire RV on the back of it. Yeah,
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: and that's I mean, you know, you look at CNN
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: at night and here's like, here's a fifty cow plus
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: a rocket launcher in eighty seven dudes hanging off of
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: the back of a highlux. That's the reality of what
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: we see with the Tundras, particularly in the overland space,
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: is that they just load. They don't even pay attention
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: to payload. But there's a pretty heavy one on the cover.
• 54:09
  Speaker 3: Of Sorry Clay, but you did not pay attention to
• 54:11
  Speaker 3: payload on this one. Maybe he did.
• 54:13
  Speaker 4: Have you seen that instagram, Michelle, it's called Toyotas of War.
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: It's so good. Yeah, yeah, I've been featured on it
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: several times.
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: It's so good. Yeah, it's such a great one. Tundra
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: is an all new vehicle. I mean, there is not
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: a single part that's shared with the previous model. So
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the highlights around the Tundra.
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: So the Tundra shares the same chassis as the three
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: hundred series land Cruiser, So like when you start the
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: conversation with the new Tundra is built on the land
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: Cruiser chassis. That's already a showstopper. Yeah, it's already amazing.
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: They got rid of the leaf springs in the rear.
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: They have a five link. You can get an airbag
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: suspension depending upon the model. It's got a locking room differential.
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: Now it's got a TRD pro with additional lift, great suspension,
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: all those other things. It drives very nice and it
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: also drives at speed very confidently, and that is something
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: that in full sized trucks is not always the case.
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: Full sized trucks tend to surprise you a little bit,
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: and that's something that I don't like as an evaluator.
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: I don't like it when a vehicle's like you're hanging
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: it out, you're pushing the limits. You're pushing the limits,
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: and then the limit, yeah exactly, and then things things
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: start to fall apart very quickly that I don't like
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: to see. The Tundra does not do that. The Tundra
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: is predictable, predictable, predictable howling tires. Predictable tires are howling more.
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: It's very neutral. So now you're getting a little bit
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: of oversteer, like I'm talking on the pavement pushing this
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: truck with you at a sports car, and it's extremely predictable
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: all the way and past the limits, which is unusual
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: in this segment. The engine is a joy to drive.
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: People are going to get hung up on the fact
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: that you're going from a five to seven to three
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: point five.
• 55:49
  Speaker 3: Please get over it, because I have seven was so ancient.
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it was just not efficient good It wasn't
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: It was super reliable, like literally throw it off a
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: cliff kind of a motor, but it was never efficient
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: and it never did a good job of moving either
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: the land Cruiser or the tunder around, whereas this with
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: their ten speed transmission, it's just really impressive. I mean
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: it literally is impressive on the road and off road,
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: which I think is a big deal. The fact that
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: the Toyota has come around to making such a powerful
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: engine out of a small displacement. Their EPA Highway is
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: twenty two miles the gallon. You can get it with
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: a hybrid a hybrid drive train as well, which makes
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: it even more powerful. So their premium motor gets better
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: gas knowledge, is faster. I mean, this is it's really
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: like a seven second truck. It's really fast, and people
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: have even done a little better than that. So yeah,
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: compared to the tierrech but people have even done better
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: than that. I mean, like when they're racing them now,
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: I'm just being who I am. The fact that you
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: get multi terrain select relocking differential definitely the best handling
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: truck in the test Land Cruiser kind of underpinnings, which
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: is extremely impressive. But then there's also some cons So
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: you would think that this five link would have better
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: r TA. Nope, nope, it actually has less articulation than
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: the outgoing truck. Oh okay, we found out why, and
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: the reason for it is where they because of the
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: packaging and the were suspension, where they have to put
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: the shocks, the shocks are much further out. So the
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: more inboard you make a shock for one inch of
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: movement of the tire ends up being much less than
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: one inch of movement of the shock. So the further
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: you put that shock absorber out to the tires, or
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: the closer you get them to the tires outboard, then
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: the longer the shock needs to be. So they were
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: limited on packaging. When it came to the land cruiser,
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: they didn't have the same packaging constraints because it isn't
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: a bed and there's an occupant a passenger area. So
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: the land cruiser has a lot of articulation. The tundra
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: has less. So you notice that. So it lifts a
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: wheel pretty easily. It still feels very stable. It's a
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: wide truck. It's not like it's unsettling or anything like that,
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: but you would hope that it would get more articulation.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: So how do they solve that? As Toyota stick a
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: locker in the back and then you don't care. They
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: fixed the problem, which fortunately they did that. Fortunately they
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: didn't say, oh, a tracks going to solve the problem,
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: and because it wouldn't have.
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: But the aftermarket will figure that out. Yeah, And honestly,
• 58:05
  Speaker 3: an outboarded shock is also has some advantages, tons of
• 58:08
  Speaker 3: advantage stability ability. This truckle toe twelve thousand pounds and
• 58:13
  Speaker 3: in the TRD pro variant you end up with a
• 58:15
  Speaker 3: sixteen hundred pound payload. It's the reason why the truck
• 58:18
  Speaker 3: didn't do better in the test is that, at the
• 58:20
  Speaker 3: end of the day, it's not Toyota's fault that it's
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: a half ton truck. It's really not. It's just the
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: fact that there are medium sized trucks, there are mid
• 58:29
  Speaker 3: sized trucks that have nearly the same payload as a Tundra,
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: and so when you look at a ranger that has
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: pretty much the same payload, it makes you realize that
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: Toyota still has a lot more that they can do
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: on the payload front, and if they can take a
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: little bit of a risk and realize that there are
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: going to be customers that need something closer to that
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty two hundred pound payload, so that true one
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: ton payload then they're going to end up I think
• 58:53
  Speaker 3: doing a lot better in this segment particularly. I mean, again,
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: you're the only ones driven this truck. What's the payload
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: on like a I don't know what, what do they
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: call their laramie or they're like, it's not the tird,
• 59:04
  Speaker 3: it's not the performance truck. It's you know, it's got
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: leather seats or whatever. It's you know, the one, the
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: one that most of them to go buy. Oh yeah,
• 59:11
  Speaker 3: So they have a limited edition which is extremely popular.
• 59:14
  Speaker 3: I think they've got some new editions coming out that
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: I can't I don't think I'm allowed to speak to
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: at this point.
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: But so they've got some new Texas edition. Well, they
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: do have a seventeen ninety four which I can talk
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: about that's been released. The seven makes me cringe. It's
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: like pandering to Texans.
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: It's like, ah, you're from Texas, that's an that's an
• 59:32
  Speaker 3: interesting to you a truck freedom Pick it out at
• 59:35
  Speaker 3: the Texas Truck Rodeo and we're gonna take it to
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: Texas State Fair and you're gonna love. You're gonna love
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: this Toyota Tendris. We're even gonna make it in Texas.
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: Except everybody from Texas is from like Cleveland, Ohio or
• 59:47
  Speaker 3: something anymore for sure. Yeah, and Toyota they're from like Torrance.
• 59:51
  Speaker 3: Well they're from Japan. But yeah, well like all the
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: people that used to work for Toyota, well that work
• 59:56
  Speaker 3: for Toyota and Texas now are from Torrance. That's true.
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: But the Texas ruck Rodeo Chevron ninety four read them.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 3: All of this is pandering. You speak lots of pandurin.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 3: It's very valid. The seventeen ninety four comes from the
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: property that the manufacturing plant is on was a ranch.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: Oh and it was the seventeen ninety four. So the
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 3: ranch that thought that was like the Texas Stadium. So
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 3: it's actually it's actually a thing. It's actually a thing.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: Is that in seventeen ninety four the ranch started the
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 1: current manufacturing plant is built on.
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: So it's kind of a cool story. It's a little
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: more cowboys. You should buy this because we're going to
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 3: make you rich when we buy your ranch for our factory.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: Well yeah, Texans, No, it's like Texans no land and oil,
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 1: don't they It's like it's like the King Ranch.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: It's like, I don't think Ford has ever been near
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: the King Ranch. No, they need the King Ranch to
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: breed all of the cows that go into the leather
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: in the King Ranch, I think. So they do have
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: a seventeen ninety four and you get it. You can
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: put a TRD package on it, which is kind of nice.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: So anything you can add the TRD too, So you
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 3: can you can add a real locker to pretty much anything.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 3: But if you want air suspension, you can't get the
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 3: TRD package. So let's say you end up with a
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: seventeen ninety four TRD where it's got all of the
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: fancy stuff and the longer will base you can get
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: a four or six and a half foot bed. Now
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 3: you start ending up in the like fourteen hundred pound
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: payload error. Oh, so it goes down from the TRD.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: It comes to because what I was trying to make
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 3: an argument for was like I wonder if with a
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 3: TRD pro package, if.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: They're the only way you game it is to do
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: an SR five TRD. That's the only way you game it.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: And it's important for everybody listening to know that. So
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: if you want to game the TRD game or the
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: Thunder game, you buy SR five TRD and then that
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: gets you at about eighteen hundred and twenty pounds of payload,
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: which is starting to be very respectable.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: So it's like basically a Ford Ranger.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: It's more than a Ford Ranger to Toyota's credit, and
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: that has not been the case with them. So I think,
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: I mean, maybe you and I want to take some
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: credit for this because we love Toyotas, but we also
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: want Toyota to give us some payload. Maybe maybe they're listening,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: and now you can buy a ton with very close
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: to two thousand pounds of payload.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: That's cool, which is awesome. Down I'm gonna say that's
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 3: all because of me. I'm not gonna give you any credit.
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: I don't even know these people. You brought the beer,
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 3: I've brought established in Milwaukee eighteen forty four, Slack the
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 3: Ranch was in seventeen ninety four. You should definitely buy
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: our pickup Trokes pictures. So Tundra under the pro the
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 3: pros if you're gonna do the Gladiator, Okay, Tundra gets
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: the thumbs up, hundred gets the thumbs up. It gets
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 3: the thumbs up because people are going to still load
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: them to the moon.
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 1: But it's actually ready for that. Now it's still gonna work,
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: and it's gonna work fine. I mean, like those of
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: us who own businesses, we can't do that. But like
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: you know, and anyways, we don't need to go into
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: the payload train for too long to day. But you
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: get a rear locking differential, you get multi terrain select,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: you get the best handling truck in the segment land
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: cruiser chassis. Downsides are you have less articulation than your
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: outgoing model, which is kind of a surprise. This is
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: the craziest thing. You buy a TRD Pro, you buy
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: their off road version of the truck. You do not
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: and cannot get front recovery points. They think it's never
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: going to get stuck or like I mean, and what
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: they said was it's something about arrow requirements or whatever.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: Every manufacturer on the planet has figured that out. You
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: put little covers on the bumper like if it's arrow,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: I get it. Like it's arrow. It's the only way
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: you get to what you're trying to do. I'm not
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: buying it at all. Skeptical ctsy vehicle, and it's rare
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: that I'm that skeptical, but I'm super skeptical. I actually
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: think that they designed an amazing truck and one day
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: they woke up and they're like, oh my gosh, you
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: totally forgot front from recovery points. I mean, that's all
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: I can think of, because it makes no sense because
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: any other truck you look at at four GMC, any
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: of the other trucks you look at it, big red
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: toe hooks on the front. Yeah, if you look at
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: a Tacoma, big red to hooks, I have like a
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: lashing point. It has nothing on the front.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: This is really great information to know because I'm just
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: going to make recovery points for the front of these now. Yeah. So,
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: like all they needed to do is, like in the bumper,
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 3: you create like a little cap if you if you
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 3: buy a Porsche Cayenne or if you buy a you
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 3: know any you know, you the little cap off you
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 3: screw in the little thing. Yeah, exactly. So maybe on
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 3: the Tundra what they do is you have a cap
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 3: and then underneath there is the cool red toehooks. Are
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 3: you skeptical of that? Yeah, I'm not buying. I'm totally
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: not by it.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: That's crucial to have super point supercrude, well, especially when
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: the vehicle is specifically designed for off road use, so
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: you have to engineer in proper recovery.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 3: That's why in Texas we get the seventeen nine to
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: four edition that has recovery point.
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 4: Well, it is a Toyota, so it's going to have
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 4: plenty of aftermarket support.
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so that that's totally valid. It was just it
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 3: was just interesting, Like it's just interesting that that. That's like,
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: you get the locker, you get the you get great tires,
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 3: you get great suspension, Fox suspension, you get all of
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: this stuff, and then there's there's not a single recovery
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: point on the truck other than kind of like other
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 3: than the receiver hitch, which is not optimal anyways. Like
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 3: it's easy to be to be very and they're trying
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: to gratiate it the Toyota because they're TRX kind of thing. Yeah,
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: maybe maybe I don't think so. It has always been
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 3: like a really smart choice, But I think so it's
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 3: always been the man I don't want to say the
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 3: costco version of Raptor, but no, I don't think they're
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 3: even close. I think it's just really capable print.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you would compare, you would compare a
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: TRD pro to a power wagon in my mind, because
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: it's just it's really good. It's a really really good truck,
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: and they're going to sell a ton of them deservedly.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: I would just I would love to find a way
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: to get Maybe they don't call it the TRD. Maybe
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 1: they call it the Overlander in honor of Clay and
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: his involvement or whatever. They call it something that gives
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: us the capability and the capacity that we need. Even
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: even two thousand pounds or twenty two hundred pounds starts
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: to solve a lot of prouestions.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: How does it? And I don't have this in front
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: of me, but how does that stack up to a
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 3: fifteen hundred to a half ton truck? Because it's a
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: half ton truck with a three quarter ton payload? Maybe
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 3: they still think that that means something. Yeah, I have
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 3: a ton three quarter one don I don't know.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: I mean they're they're competitive with a lot of the
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: vehicles on the market, though. The one outlier is the
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 1: Ford F one fifty and it's actually worth talking about
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: for a second before we wrap up. But the Ford
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: F one fifty is this interesting vehicle that you can
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 1: actually speck up to three thousand pounds of payload.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: It's crazy.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: I think we kind of got to put the half
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: the whole idea of what a half ton and a
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 1: three quarter ton means because there is so many there's
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: These trucks have so many options and they can be
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: configured in so many ways. But you could buy a
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: Ford four wheel drive, regular cab, eight foot bed F
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: one fifty with a three thousand pound payload, which is
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: more than your twenty five hundred Matt. Yeah, so it's
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: kind of crazy. So it's totally possible.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 4: Twenty five hundred, it's I think it's between like twenty
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 4: three and twenty four hundred hun ours.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 3: I think on mine it was like it was like
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 3: eighteen hundred. It wasn't it could be because yours was
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: really optioned up. Yeah, it wasn't that much, Yeah, which
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 3: was surprising.
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: It starts to once we add the options and the
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: sun roofs and all that other stuff, it really does
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: take an impact for sure. So we should wrap this up.
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: We should so that' sworts give me your pick. I mean,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: you drive a twenty five hundred tradesman.
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 4: I was going to say this is going to be
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 4: a little biased because I own I own the tradesman.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: Would you buy it again now that you've driven it
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: for six eight months?
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: Absolutely?
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's it's so comfortable, it does everything I want.
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 4: Just it's like it's such a solid choice. I feel like,
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 4: I mean, if we were talking that money was no issue,
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 4: I'd probably still stick in the Ram ecosystem and maybe
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 4: maybe do maybe the power Wagon. But again, like coming
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 4: back to the fact that we're currently living full time
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 4: in our airstream and we're towing it often, I think, yeah,
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 4: I would stick with with the tradesman H five hundred.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: That would be my choice.
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: No, that commins as special for sure. Yeah, Okay, I'm
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: too predictable, you go, Okay, I would pick the tradesman
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 1: and I'd send it to AEV. I would pick the
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: tradesman and send it to AV. Okay, here's the deal,
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: is I Actually what I want is I want the
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 1: Ram truck, but I want the Cummins motor to put
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: out the same amount of power at the six seven
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: Power Show for FD does with a ten speed, which
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: I know is amazing, which which sure is coming, has
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: to be coming. So like I really think for me
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: that you know, there was rumors that it was going
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: to happen. There's rumors that there was going to be
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: you know, an upgraded comments motor that basically the high
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: output motor was going to become the standard engine, which
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: they have kind of done before.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 3: So that's a playbook. Sure, it's already done. Engineering is done,
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 3: and they're going to put an Alison behind it, and
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 3: that would be chef's kiss. These poor manufacturers right now,
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 3: they can they they can't. They can get the chiche anything,
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 3: they can get the chips. It's not just the chips,
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 3: it's everything that's sitting off the you know, offshore right totally,
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 3: So they can't. They don't dare. I mean it kills
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 3: us at Max Tracks. It's like we have so much
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 3: stuff on the water and we don't know if it'll
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 3: show up in six weeks or six months yep. Like,
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 3: how how do you prepare for that? Sure? And then
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 3: how do you forecast for that?
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 2: And how do you.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: Especially for a world that has been tuned towards global commerce. Yeah,
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: you know where Max tracks are made in Australia and
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: they're shipped to the United State.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 3: I only have one part, you know, I have like
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 3: some colors to it. Imagine a car company that has insane.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 3: You know, one hundred different components. It's insane that go
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: into one thing. It'll be interesting. I think that the
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 3: RAM is just going to continue to get better, especially
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 3: with the direction that we've seen that company go in.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 3: They've brought on. The people that are doing their interiors
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 3: are just like super top notch. I have the TRX
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 3: right now. That's the newer style cab. That's why people
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 3: call it the Gen four and a half ram HD
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 3: because it kind of took the fifteen hundred cab which
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 3: won all these awards, like the interior of it, put
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 3: it in the old cab. God, it didn't have to
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 3: retool for all the bodywork and maybe it was the
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 3: Sure Defenders or something like that still.
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: Looks but the body is not dated. In my mind,
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: I think it's one of the more handsome. But eventually
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 1: they'll go to that Gen five cab is kind of
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 1: what people sure the.
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: More squared off shape.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's nicer, it's quieter, it's better constructed, and that
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: to me, that is what I'm really excited for. That
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 3: that'll be my next time I got you, and it'll
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 3: replace the Claudiator and it'll replace the tier because it'll
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 3: just kind of do it all. Yeah.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: I've been driving a full sized truck for almost a
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 1: year now, and I'm kind of sold on it.
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 3: Like it just does.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: It's amazing that I can drive back and forth to
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: work I get if I drive lightly, I can get
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 1: thirty miles of the gallon. Yeah, you've got that three
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 1: liter turbo diesel. I can put a camper on the
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: back of it and go to home depot and load
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 1: it full of stuff. I finally understand the full sized thing.
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 3: It works.
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want to mislead the listener, like
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: I have so much to learn still about the full
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: sized truck segment, but I'm finally beginning to understand the
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: argument for it above other vehicles.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 3: So they're not super maneuverable off road, but if you're
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 3: just but they can be. That's a thing. It's mine's
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 3: continued West rest. For the West Coast, I think it's
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 3: a different argument than the East Coast, where you have
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 3: all of these trees and mud and off rig or
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 3: Pacific Northwest will probably be a problemst Yeah, where we
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 3: are at in the Southwest, or for traveling in general,
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: for traveling, yeah, weh. I could think of no other
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 3: truck that I'd want to do it, And I've done
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 3: it in a land cruise, I've done it in Gladiator,
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: I've done it in a full side truck. I've done
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 3: it in a bunch of different things. It just makes sense.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 3: There's a there's not a local down there that doesn't
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 3: drive those roads of the full sized truck of course
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 3: in tool drive or like nineteen eighty four Toyota Corolla.
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, exactly. Yeah, So that's our picks. Thank you
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: all for listening. The full size truck segment is exciting
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: and it continues to grow and to become more and
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: more capable and more and more suited to overland travel.
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: We would love to get some comments from all of you.
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: What vehicle are you using, how are you using it?
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: What are some of the attributes that you're finding to
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: be even different from what our experience has been. You
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: can reach me at Scott dot a dot Brady on Instagram.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: You can see Matt at Matti Matt Well, Matt Scott
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: and Matt Explorer and then Matt Swartz.
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 3: Yours is Matt.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: It's mt B dot sportsm BE.
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: Dot Schwartz on Instagram. So if you guys want to
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: reach out. You have additional questions or comments, things that
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: we can add into the next segment around full sizes.
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 3: We'd love to hear it. What a very cool segment
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 3: and we thank you all for listening. And I apologize
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 3: to the people of Texas for the accent. It wasn't
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 3: very well done.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: Have a good one and on that bombshell, we will
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 1: talk to you all next time.
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 2: Four