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too organised to have ADHD? · soulful biz guidance

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SPEAKER_01: Hello,
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SPEAKER_01: hello and welcome to a new episode of Whispers of Inner Power,
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SPEAKER_01: the interview series for sensitive women,
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SPEAKER_01: highly sensitive women in business.
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SPEAKER_01: Today I'm joined by Gabrielle Treynor,
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who is a Gen X ADHD coach and author helping introverted
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sensitive women with ADHD
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SPEAKER_01: or suspected
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to understand their brains,
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build inner calm and confidence to be themselves.
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SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for joining us, Gabriel.
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SPEAKER_01: How are you today?
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SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you for having me, Jessica.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm very well, thank you.
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SPEAKER_01: It's so good to have you.
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You were recommended to me via Claire Venus,
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who was on the series a few weeks ago,
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months ago.
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SPEAKER_01: And so I'm so happy that she introduced me to your work.
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When I read more about what you do,
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I was like,
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this is exactly the type of
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experience and issues and obstacles that I have and that the
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women in my world also have.
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SPEAKER_01: But before I say more, tell us a bit more in your own words.
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SPEAKER_01: What do you do?
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SPEAKER_01: What's the work you do?
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SPEAKER_01: Tell us about you.
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SPEAKER_00: Oh, Claire Venus is just wonderful, isn't she?
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SPEAKER_00: She's a diamond, that woman.
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SPEAKER_00: So yes, I am a coach and an author and a writer.
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SPEAKER_00: I essentially,
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SPEAKER_00: kind of what you read out on the bio,
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SPEAKER_00: I support women often sort of around life,
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SPEAKER_00: but certainly discovering their ADHD later in life.
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SPEAKER_00: So they might have a diagnosis or they might just have an inkling
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They might be sure,
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but they don't need to go for diagnosis,
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you know,
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whatever.
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But at any rate,
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they are identifying with what they are reading and learning
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about ADHD.
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SPEAKER_00: And they have gone most of their life completely oblivious,
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SPEAKER_00: include us to it,
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SPEAKER_00: and then discovering it later in life.
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SPEAKER_00: And it's hitting them like a bit of a sledgehammer.
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SPEAKER_00: And so,
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SPEAKER_00: yeah,
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SPEAKER_00: I support them through one-to-one coaching,
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SPEAKER_00: through my online membership,
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SPEAKER_00: the Quiet ADHD Club.
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SPEAKER_00: And I realized that I have actually been doing this a really long time.
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I just wasn't aware of it because I've been a coach for quite a
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long time,
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SPEAKER_00: sort of eight,
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SPEAKER_00: nine years or so.
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And I have been supporting women with people pleasing and
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perfectionism and
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procrastination and overthinking and overdoing and overwhelm
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and all of those
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SPEAKER_00: things.
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SPEAKER_00: And it was only when I discovered my own ADHD a couple of years ago,
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SPEAKER_00: so at the age of 48,
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SPEAKER_00: pretty late in life,
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SPEAKER_00: that it all just fell into place,
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SPEAKER_00: not just my life,
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SPEAKER_00: but my work.
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And I realised so much of what I had been supporting women with
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is the underlying
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SPEAKER_00: kind of features and the life of an undiagnosed,
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SPEAKER_00: unrecognised ADHD woman.
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SPEAKER_00: That doesn't mean that every person I worked with had ADHD,
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SPEAKER_00: but I think probably a fair chunk of them did.
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but it suddenly just made so much sense that actually this is
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this is what is going
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on here this is what is feeding so much into the perfections
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when the people
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pleasing and all the stuff I just listed so it all just made
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perfect sense it yeah
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it just crystallized everything for me um so yeah so that is
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what I do thank you so
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much for sharing and you already shared a bit of your of your
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journey how you came
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SPEAKER_01: to to do that I think it's um
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SPEAKER_01: Really interesting what you said because,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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you name some of the typical common points that women with ADHD
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have an experience.
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SPEAKER_01: And it's not,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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SPEAKER_01: in my mind earlier,
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SPEAKER_01: before there was so much talk and awareness around ADHD,
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SPEAKER_01: especially female ADHD.
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SPEAKER_01: It didn't even cross my mind.
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SPEAKER_01: Because for me,
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SPEAKER_01: ADHD is like,
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SPEAKER_01: you're going to be hyperactive,
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SPEAKER_01: you're going to be,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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SPEAKER_01: and I'm essentially a very calm
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uh person I haven't been diagnosed it's uh suspected um it came
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to me I mean the
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first time that people were telling me about ADHD I was like no
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like it's not me
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like I'm I'm organized yeah I'm I have systems like I I get
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things done I finished
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my task so it's not I'm not I don't have that for sure um then
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I started to learn
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SPEAKER_01: more about it and it's like everything you named you're like
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, pretty much crossing all of that.
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And I find it sometimes really hard to consider that you might
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have ADHD because
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SPEAKER_01: these elements,
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SPEAKER_01: this experience of people pleasing and procrastinating,
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SPEAKER_01: all of that,
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SPEAKER_01: they're also part of being highly sensitive.
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SPEAKER_01: They're also part of
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SPEAKER_01: Having had to deal with trauma in childhood,
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SPEAKER_01: for instance,
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SPEAKER_01: everything is very interconnected in some way.
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SPEAKER_01: And to me,
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SPEAKER_01: my point of really considering it was reading the book by Gabor Maté,
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SPEAKER_01: Scattered Minds,
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where he mentioned in the very first pages that it has to do
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with something with
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SPEAKER_01: If you grew up with stressed parents,
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SPEAKER_01: for instance,
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SPEAKER_01: or if you were estranged or you had a moment of disconnection,
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SPEAKER_01: especially from your mother as an infant,
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SPEAKER_01: it usually creates something to do with ADHD.
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SPEAKER_01: And he was like, most of the people who have been adopted have ADHD.
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SPEAKER_01: And I was adopted.
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SPEAKER_01: And I was like, huh, let me read the rest of that book.
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SPEAKER_01: Because that starts to make sense.
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SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of talk around it.
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SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of people who are,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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SPEAKER_01: like with everything that becomes in the radar,
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SPEAKER_01: like everyone starts questioning,
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SPEAKER_01: oh,
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SPEAKER_01: everyone has ADHD these days.
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SPEAKER_01: What's your reaction to that?
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SPEAKER_01: Or what's your take on that?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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And it's certainly something that I think could be a real
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barrier for women.
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00: Because I completely hear you on,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: but I can't have it because I'm organized and I have systems and I don't,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm not late for things.
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SPEAKER_00: I don't do stuff.
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and actually what I did when I first started to learn about it
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and little bells
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were beginning to ring in my head but I was thinking that's not
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it I'm just looking
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for excuses to explain my shortcomings and my struggles and
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basically the ways that
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SPEAKER_00: I'm just a bit crap I'm trying to find an excuse for it
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and so I actually started a document essentially listing all
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the ways that I
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couldn't possibly have ADHD because you know I'm organized I
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don't forget people's
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birthdays and then I stopped and thought okay that might be
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because I actually have
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27 lifts and lists and a thousand calendar alerts that could
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have something to do
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with it okay you know what I don't lose stuff I do have
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everything in its place and
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SPEAKER_00: if it's not in its place
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I haven't the faintest idea where it is okay and I basically
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was just going through
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all the kind of you know I don't miss deadlines no but what I
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do is I put it off
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until you know a time before when I then freak out so much
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about the fact that I
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think I'm going to miss it I then now know hyperfocus like a
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mad woman and to you
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SPEAKER_00: know totally dive in and get it all done and then have it done early
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SPEAKER_00: So I was trying to find all the ways like,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: this is actually,
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SPEAKER_00: this is not,
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SPEAKER_00: this can't be true.
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SPEAKER_00: This must just be an excuse.
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SPEAKER_00: And then I went back and looked at my childhood because,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: exactly like you say,
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SPEAKER_00: there can be actually lots of things to do with,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: this perimenopause that,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: that has memory issues,
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SPEAKER_00: executive function issues.
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I then started to look at kind of like,
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all right,
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what's actually the criteria here?
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SPEAKER_00: It's not just listening to other women's experiences.
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SPEAKER_00: It's not the fidgety little boy in school,
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SPEAKER_00: let me look at the criteria,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: chartered,
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SPEAKER_00: let me go back to chartered,
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SPEAKER_00: let me look at all the ways,
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SPEAKER_00: let me remember what names I used to get called,
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SPEAKER_00: whether they were loving names or not,
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SPEAKER_00: but at any rate,
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SPEAKER_00: like my mum called me grasshopper mind,
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SPEAKER_00: which it wasn't a criticism,
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SPEAKER_00: it was a sweet term,
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SPEAKER_00: but grasshopper mind,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: thinking about what did my school reports say,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: all the stuff I struggled with,
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SPEAKER_00: so I really kind of worked at
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SPEAKER_00: First of all,
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trying to find all the reasons I didn't have ADHD and then
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looking at actually what
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SPEAKER_00: was the evidence that there is.
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But I don't know how many women get to that point because
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actually maybe they just
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SPEAKER_00: get so kind of put off by the idea that,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: they have heard family or friends or just read things of people,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: dismissing it,
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SPEAKER_00: rolling their eyes.
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It's,
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you know,
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another bandwagon that jumping on,
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you're just trying to get attention.
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You're trying to be trendy and they never actually get into
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that real sort of
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research and investigation place and therefore give up on it
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when actually it is
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something that could completely be true for them and it could
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explain so much for
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them and it could make such a difference to them if they had
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this understanding
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SPEAKER_00: about them but because of the world's attitudes
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SPEAKER_00: that tell women that,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: no,
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SPEAKER_00: you're the problem,
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SPEAKER_00: actually,
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SPEAKER_00: it's a fault within you,
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SPEAKER_00: and you're just looking for excuses,
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SPEAKER_00: and you're just trying to jump on the bandwagon and be trendy,
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SPEAKER_00: then that just gets in the way of too many women,
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SPEAKER_00: and it really makes me quite cross.
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The other thing is that I think that very quickly sort of
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stereotypes can appear.
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SPEAKER_00: So, you know, we had that fidgety little boy in class.
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SPEAKER_00: That is what everybody,
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SPEAKER_00: and certainly,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: before I started looking into it,
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SPEAKER_00: that was what I thought ADHD was.
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and then I think you have sort of new stereotypes appear
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whereby actually okay so
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you know fine well you know the world will allow women all
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right you can have ADHD
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too and you show up differently but actually what you look like
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is you're very very
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flamboyant you're very colourful you dye your hair you're very
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outwardly chaotic
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you're very you know kind of exuberant and that's actually you
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know here we've got
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another stereotype we now pigeonhole you into this type of
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presentation and again
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SPEAKER_00: it's like well
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SPEAKER_00: What if I don't fit in that?
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SPEAKER_00: That's what I'm seeing.
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And so I can't have it because I don't come across as being
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extremely exuberant and
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SPEAKER_00: extrovert and colourful and flamboyant and outwardly chaotic.
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SPEAKER_00: And like I say,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm organised,
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but actually I'm quite calm and contained and people tell me
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how calm I am and how
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SPEAKER_00: responsible they know she's organised,
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SPEAKER_00: you'll get it done.
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SPEAKER_00: So therefore that can't be me.
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but it's just that you're looking a different way to how other
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people look and that
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perhaps hasn't got as much attention and when I had my
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assessment and I had my
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diagnosis given to me when I closed the laptop the first
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thought that popped into
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my head was where are all my quiet ADHD women that was the very
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first and it wasn't
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SPEAKER_00: where a the it was where a my and it was that sort of
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where is everyone else like me because I can't be on my own
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with this I can't be
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the only one because you're never whatever you've got going on
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you're never the
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only one experiencing this in the planet and I thought where
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are they because I've
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learned from some incredibly wonderful generous women who have
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really shared you
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know in so many different ways and because of them that's how
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I've learned about it
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SPEAKER_00: but they were quite different to me where
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Where are the people where are the women like me who are just
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quietly getting on
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with life inside they are peddling like furious you know that
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those the gliding on
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the water but the the paddling going on underneath is furious
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and getting like to
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the absolute end of the tether but nobody else is seeing that
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and they're not
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exuberant and they're not flamboyant and they're not outwardly
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chaotic they're like
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SPEAKER_00: me they're quite contained and calm
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on the outside but it's all happening on the inside where are
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they they have to be
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out there I want to find those women so that they know that
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they're not alone
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because it doesn't feel nice to be alone with this so that's
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why I started talking
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about it and that's why I started sharing about it and also
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it's the hope to come
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SPEAKER_00: back to your original question where I've meandered off from um
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To hope that that it would help women to realize,
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oh,
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okay,
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actually,
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this could be for me.
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SPEAKER_00: This is not a bandwagon thing.
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SPEAKER_00: This is not a trend thing.
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SPEAKER_00: This is not it only looks one way.
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Actually,
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maybe this is something that does apply to me and I can I could
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get support.
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Yeah yeah I love that I love everything that you said I
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recognized so much and I
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wanted to react to something because as you were saying like I
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just like you I'm
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not necessarily exuberant or anything like that my mind I
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really feel like my mind
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is going in a thousand directions at the same time and I think
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that's why we're
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good at coaching as well because like I see 10 solutions to
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your problem right away
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let's find out which ones are the right for you and sometimes
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it's hard to just be
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you know I don't know to to appear eloquent I think just
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because my mind picks up
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so many things that I write much better than I speak I keep I
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keep saying that but
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SPEAKER_01: when I read some of the of the signs or or
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I don't want to call that symptoms because it's not a disease
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but some of the
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experiences that we have I think that for me I did the same
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thing as you I went
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back to what did teachers say at school and university because
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I was a good student
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you know and I managed my studies and I studied really well at
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university so again
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it can't be me like you were saying but what were they saying
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and there's this this
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SPEAKER_01: recurring
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I cannot put it in another way of you know your stuff but
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you're at the surface you
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know everything a bit and I remember feeling so much shame for
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that like you said
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there's something wrong with me why can't I be more precise and
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in depth with
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everything and I felt really this is me because I'm always in
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the clouds I'm always
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SPEAKER_01: thinking about something else I'm not focused enough I'm not
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I don't maybe care enough to go really into depth into
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everything and I feel for me
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to I think I watched a video of someone explaining that this
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was their experience
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and I was like crying I think for it just made me feel relieved
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and at the same
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time angry you know for having internalized that criticism that
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there's something
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SPEAKER_01: that's flawed within me and so I cannot do better and
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SPEAKER_01: It's about that.
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SPEAKER_01: It's the details.
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SPEAKER_01: For me, it's the details.
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SPEAKER_01: I do a lot of things.
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SPEAKER_01: I am good at what I do, but I won't get the details straight right away.
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SPEAKER_01: Like this is something I do after two.
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SPEAKER_01: So in my kitchen when I cook, it's like everything's open.
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SPEAKER_01: All the cabinets are open.
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SPEAKER_01: And my husband's a bit OCD, so it's like the opposite.
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SPEAKER_01: He's like, why do you always leave such a mess behind?
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SPEAKER_00: Like, this is how my brain works.
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Just open stuff and dig what you need and then you'll figure it
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out,
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you know?
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SPEAKER_01: And this constant being gauged against what is neuro-normal, you know?
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SPEAKER_01: And to be like, oh, this is what I should be like.
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SPEAKER_01: And you're upset with me, but I really, I did my best here.
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it's my best it really is my best and if you believe that I'm
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flawed then I am and
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and that's it right and like you said it's also the thing that
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you don't want to
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enter in like oh this is just another excuse for not doing
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better or for not
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improving yourself but it's really really really hard so thank
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you so much for for
15:33
SPEAKER_01: sharing that once you had your diagnosis um
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What changed for you and how did you maybe further adapt your
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life or business to
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SPEAKER_01: this knowledge?
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I think the biggest thing was recognizing those old stories I
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took on from being
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SPEAKER_00: very little about how I needed to pick a thing and stick with it.
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SPEAKER_00: That was a really big one for me.
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SPEAKER_00: in that I just had way too many hobbies and too many interests.
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Erratic was the word that popped up on my school report more
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than anything else
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because I'd get really interested and excited about a thing and
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then get bored and
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SPEAKER_00: go off it.
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SPEAKER_00: And that was something I got criticized for a lot.
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SPEAKER_00: And so being able to identify that as,
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SPEAKER_00: oh,
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SPEAKER_00: you know what,
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SPEAKER_00: that's not actually a personal failing.
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That's not a character flaw within me that says I'm bad at
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sticking to stuff and
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SPEAKER_00: I'm bad because I don't stick to stuff.
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It's just not the way my brain is wired and there is a good
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reason for it.
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And so being able to recognize stories like that really helped
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me to start dropping
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SPEAKER_00: the shame of,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: actually,
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SPEAKER_00: it's not that I'm at fault here.
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SPEAKER_00: It's that my brain works differently.
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And there are things that I can stick to,
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but they have to work for my brain.
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SPEAKER_00: I have to find ways to to make them work for it.
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SPEAKER_00: And actually,
16:54
SPEAKER_00: you know,
16:54
SPEAKER_00: looking back,
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SPEAKER_00: there are things that I have stuck with for a very long time.
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SPEAKER_00: How is that?
16:59
SPEAKER_00: Oh,
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that's because actually I found lots of interesting ways to
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bring new elements into
17:03
SPEAKER_00: it or to change how I did things or,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
17:06
SPEAKER_00: to make it interesting.
17:07
And the things that I didn't stick with were things that there
17:09
was no maneuvering at all.
17:10
SPEAKER_00: There was no space to change stuff.
17:14
So being able to recognize old stories that I took on that I
17:21
was at fault and to
17:23
SPEAKER_00: learn that actually I'm not at fault,
17:26
SPEAKER_00: that actually my brain works differently.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: And those things were difficult for me,
17:30
SPEAKER_00: not because I wasn't trying hard enough,
17:33
SPEAKER_00: not because I'm not a good person,
17:35
but because the way they were set up weren't working for the
17:38
way my brain is wired.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: Huge difference.
17:40
SPEAKER_00: Could absolutely shed the shame and therefore be able to then say,
17:43
SPEAKER_00: right,
17:44
SPEAKER_00: so here's the thing I want to do.
17:45
SPEAKER_00: Now,
17:47
SPEAKER_00: in the past,
17:48
SPEAKER_00: I would have struggled with it,
17:49
perhaps when I got to a point where actually it's not new and
17:51
shiny anymore for,
17:52
SPEAKER_00: you know,
17:53
SPEAKER_00: say a new thing.
17:55
and I would have dropped it and then I'd felt bad about it or
17:58
I'd have made myself
17:59
keep going with it but it would felt really horrible and hard
18:01
work so instead
18:03
what's going to help me to keep going with the thing I want to
18:05
keep going with but
18:07
do it in a way that is going to keep making it interesting and
18:10
keep my focus and
18:12
make it enjoyable and make it fun and lovely and I want to keep
18:15
doing it how can I
18:16
go about it so it's not like I have you know any of my
18:19
learnings about myself have
18:20
SPEAKER_00: made me go oh well now I can't do that thing or
18:23
I don't have to do that thing because I've got ADHD so I can't
18:26
do that thing oh
18:26
yeah that's not for me it's not that at all it's more like
18:29
right all the stuff I
18:30
want to do all the stuff I need to do how is it going to work
18:35
well with my brain
18:36
not with how I thought I should do it how other people do it
18:40
actually what is going
18:41
to work for me and that just makes everything better yeah yeah
18:46
thank you so much
18:47
SPEAKER_01: for sharing and it immediately you know I'm thinking of
18:51
SPEAKER_01: my audience who are highly sensitive who sometimes have ADHD and who are
18:56
entrepreneurs and we tell you for success you need to be
19:00
consistent you need to
19:01
pick one thing you need to be niche like you do this thing and
19:05
you do it for a long
19:06
enough time which is not six months it's more like six years or
19:08
more to be able to
19:10
get results how do you think then it could be a strength for
19:14
them to tap into
19:16
SPEAKER_01: embracing their brain how can they start doing that?
19:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
19:20
I think that there is a lot that we dismiss that we can
19:27
actually recognise as being
19:29
SPEAKER_00: real value in all the different things we do,
19:32
SPEAKER_00: all the different things we learn about.
19:34
SPEAKER_00: And that actually the side quests,
19:36
SPEAKER_00: the interesting paths we get pulled off to,
19:38
SPEAKER_00: that they're not a waste,
19:39
that there will be something in there that will have fed into
19:42
us in some way.
19:43
SPEAKER_00: It will, you know, it might inspire us in some way.
19:45
It might just be actual knowledge that we now know a piece of
19:47
information we didn't know before.
19:50
SPEAKER_00: It's all experience, it's all feeding in in some way.
19:55
So I'm now on my third career and that used to be a real kind
19:59
of embarrassment of
20:01
SPEAKER_00: something I was ashamed of because I didn't pick a thing and stick to it.
20:03
SPEAKER_00: How can you do that if you're on your third career?
20:05
SPEAKER_00: So I was in publishing for 15 years.
20:07
SPEAKER_00: Then I ran my own stationery business for seven years.
20:10
SPEAKER_01: Love it.
20:10
SPEAKER_00: And then I've been doing my coaching and well-being business for years.
20:14
SPEAKER_00: And it was learning that actually that's just the way my brain works.
20:18
SPEAKER_00: It's not designed to do one thing forever and ever.
20:22
SPEAKER_00: That actually there's real value in it.
20:23
SPEAKER_00: And recognizing that having those other two careers have really,
20:27
SPEAKER_00: really fed into who I am and my business now.
20:30
SPEAKER_00: And just,
20:31
SPEAKER_00: you know,
20:31
SPEAKER_00: the experience and the learning,
20:32
SPEAKER_00: the people I've met,
20:33
SPEAKER_00: the different ways of working,
20:35
SPEAKER_00: all of it has all fed in.
20:36
SPEAKER_00: So whatever you have done in your life, there will be value to it.
20:41
SPEAKER_00: Whatever path you've gone down in your business,
20:43
SPEAKER_00: it will all have fed in to you and your work in some way or another.
20:51
SPEAKER_00: And yeah,
20:51
we do need to be careful that we don't get completely
20:54
sidetracked and actually the
20:55
thing that we need to do that we have made commitments to or
20:58
responsibilities for,
21:00
SPEAKER_00: the thing that pays the bills,
21:01
SPEAKER_00: we don't lose it.
21:04
But it's not like we're going to be bad people for having gone
21:09
off on those things.
21:09
SPEAKER_00: They will absolutely
21:14
I love that reframe it's so freeing to see it this way I've
21:18
changed careers it's my
21:20
third business but I hear that like in myself and in people I
21:25
talk to really this
21:27
again shame but also this feeling of waste you know like oh
21:31
I've poured so much
21:32
SPEAKER_01: energy into learning everything about
21:35
this you know career and now I'm starting something that's
21:38
completely different so
21:39
what I've done before is wasted time and money and what you're
21:43
bringing is
21:43
completely different it's like no it's actually adding to your
21:46
experience so that
21:47
you know in the end everything comes together and when I look
21:50
at you know myself
21:51
what I'm doing now I told you I'm I work with copywriting web
21:54
design and stuff I
21:55
started my career when I was 20 as a language teacher I learned
22:01
languages and
22:01
SPEAKER_01: literature passionate about it I was a
22:04
English teacher for years became a French teacher online
22:07
started my first business
22:08
teaching languages got interested into mindfulness and
22:11
self-development but it was
22:13
too big of a jump so I blended French learning with let's let's
22:18
learn French
22:18
mindfully and I did that business for a while then I jumped
22:21
that chip and then
22:22
became just a coach and then from there started writing because
22:25
you have to write
22:26
SPEAKER_01: when when you're in business I was like but I like that more now and I
22:31
you know but everything is really because now I write for
22:34
people who are coaches
22:36
and in the wellness industry and so I know your audience I know
22:41
the principles I
22:42
have that empathy and I bring my language skills and I bring
22:45
all of it together and
22:47
I love I usually I just have an epiphany right now because I
22:50
think I'm like you
22:51
know yeah it's kind of connected but really I spend so much
22:54
time and I like yeah
22:55
SPEAKER_01: actually everything is feeding into one another everything is
22:58
Bringing you to the next step of yourself and it's not it's not
23:02
a flaw it's maybe a
23:05
evolution of you really oh absolutely everything that you just
23:09
said I'm just
23:10
SPEAKER_00: sitting there thinking to me
23:13
Hearing somebody describe that makes me think wow this woman is
23:17
knowledgeable she
23:18
is so experienced look at the curiosity that this woman has
23:21
look at the creativity
23:22
look at the resourcefulness the resilience the fact that she's
23:25
trying all these
23:26
different directions she's done all these different things my
23:28
goodness the woman
23:29
will know so much stuff she has so much experience she'll work
23:32
with so many people
23:34
wow that that is a woman that that i want to be knowing more
23:37
about because that's
23:39
SPEAKER_00: just incredible but i can totally
23:42
Totally imagine in your head you're going oh god I'm changing
23:45
what will people
23:46
think but actually I think wow that sounds amazing what
23:51
incredible journey and wow
23:52
where is this woman going to go what else what's next I'm only
23:57
42 you know so much
23:59
SPEAKER_01: can happen
24:01
I love the way you look at it and I'm sure that lots of people
24:10
who are going to
24:11
hear this are going to feel really good about what you just
24:14
said because I know I'm
24:15
SPEAKER_01: not the only one and it just changes the story really of how you
24:21
how you look at yourself and and how you wow it's really cool
24:26
absolutely I mean I'm
24:27
at the moment I'm organizing a literary festival I've never
24:30
organized an event in
24:31
my life and I thought you know what I have this idea and I sat
24:35
in it for ages like
24:36
a good girl thinking no don't go running ahead with it don't
24:38
you know don't be
24:39
spontaneous and you know get carried away exactly I sat in it
24:43
for a while and I
24:44
SPEAKER_00: thought it's not going away I'm gonna do it
24:46
SPEAKER_00: So I'm now organising a literary event,
24:47
which it turns out is the UK's first literary event focused
24:50
entirely on wellbeing
24:51
SPEAKER_00: books.
24:52
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
24:52
SPEAKER_00: So that's exciting.
24:53
SPEAKER_00: Really?
24:53
SPEAKER_00: And I,
24:55
SPEAKER_00: having never done it before,
24:56
SPEAKER_00: but my connections from when I had my own wellbeing book published,
25:01
SPEAKER_00: that's come in handy because that helped me find some of the authors,
25:04
SPEAKER_00: helped me know about publishers and agents and what have you.
25:08
SPEAKER_00: My journalism background is helping me to contact
25:14
magazines and go for press and you know I know what people want
25:19
in terms of when
25:20
journalists are receiving press releases and emails and you
25:23
know that kind of stuff
25:25
when I had my station gift business I used to write press
25:27
releases and and I
25:30
designed stationery and now I'm designing merchandise for the
25:33
festival so all these
25:34
SPEAKER_00: all these things that I learned from all those other careers
25:37
are all now being useful when I'm doing something brand new
25:40
that I've never done
25:42
before and there's still plenty of stuff that I know nothing
25:43
about and I'm having
25:44
to learn but you know I can see that the you know the 30 years
25:48
I've been working
25:49
those different careers are absolutely coming in handy now that
25:53
the experience and
25:54
the skills that I gained then are really making I'm able to
25:58
make use of them in
25:58
SPEAKER_00: this brand new thing that I've never done before that I am trying to do.
26:03
I love that and thank you so much for sharing because you just
26:06
gave me the opposite
26:07
SPEAKER_01: experience of what you had before when I told you my story.
26:11
SPEAKER_01: It's amazing everything you've been doing.
26:14
It's incredible and it just makes me see how when you just put
26:18
the story outside of
26:19
yourself automatically you're in awe listening to everything
26:23
you've been doing and
26:24
SPEAKER_01: how you've reached the point of doing this festival now.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: It's just completely amazing and crazy but we don't have that same
26:32
I don't know all for ourselves we kind of have that judgment
26:35
instead of having that
26:37
look outside look of being like oh you know what it's it's it's
26:42
not just enough
26:43
it's more than enough it's incredible yeah and I think
26:50
sometimes we need to
26:51
actually kind of externalize it yeah to be able to really kind
26:54
of look back at
26:56
SPEAKER_00: everything that you have done and recognize
27:01
SPEAKER_00: The imagination in there,
27:03
SPEAKER_00: the resourcefulness,
27:05
SPEAKER_00: the persistence when you have been learning languages,
27:07
SPEAKER_00: when you've been learning new programming,
27:10
SPEAKER_00: you've been learning all these new skills.
27:12
SPEAKER_00: To actually stop and properly reflect on it and go, hang on a second.
27:19
Yeah,
27:19
I've done a load of stuff,
27:20
but I've done a load of stuff and look what I have learned.
27:25
SPEAKER_00: Look at the skills I have,
27:26
SPEAKER_00: look at the experiences and the people I met,
27:28
SPEAKER_00: the conversations I had and all the things I've done.
27:31
SPEAKER_00: And actually,
27:32
SPEAKER_00: I can see those threads that are being pulled back to all those,
27:35
SPEAKER_00: you know,
27:35
that conversation and those people I met and that thing I went
27:37
to and that thing
27:38
SPEAKER_00: that I did all those years ago,
27:40
I can see now how that actually has filtered into and
27:43
influenced where I am today.
27:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:45
SPEAKER_00: And that thing that I learned, how that has been useful.
27:48
SPEAKER_00: But I think we're so busy.
27:50
A,
27:51
just barreling onto the next thing because,
27:52
oh,
27:52
you and Shiny,
27:53
let's go do the next thing.
27:54
But also so busy kind of turning ourselves off for all the ways
27:59
that we haven't
27:59
SPEAKER_00: stuck with the thing forever,
28:01
that we aren't really stopping to acknowledge what amazing work
28:06
we have already
28:06
SPEAKER_00: done,
28:06
SPEAKER_00: what amazing things we've already done and learned.
28:09
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's important that we do that because I think,
28:12
SPEAKER_00: yeah,
28:12
SPEAKER_00: there's a lot to be gained from that.
28:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
28:15
SPEAKER_01: And like you mentioned earlier, it's also about, you know,
28:18
the beliefs and the judgments that we have internalized and the
28:22
people that we are
28:23
around because if we're not surrounded by people whose brain
28:26
works like yours it's
28:27
also difficult to change this narrative inside you know my very
28:33
neuro normal
28:36
husband you know it doesn't mean badly but he would say you
28:40
know like people ask me
28:42
what you do and I don't know anymore because you change you
28:45
change all the time and
28:47
SPEAKER_01: I'm like
28:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, you know, I do that now.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: It's like, I don't even want to remember.
28:53
SPEAKER_01: I tell them you work online.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: Which is okay.
28:58
SPEAKER_01: It's not meaning, you know, it's not meaning to hurt me or anything.
29:01
But then when you're having conversations with someone like you
29:04
and other people
29:06
SPEAKER_01: like you,
29:06
SPEAKER_01: I feel it could be really be something that helps women like us.
29:12
SPEAKER_01: internalize a more positive story about how our brains work.
29:17
SPEAKER_01: And I want to ask you about your ADHD club now.
29:24
SPEAKER_01: Tell us about it.
29:25
SPEAKER_00: Yes, the quiet ADHD club.
29:29
So this is what I set up when I had that kind of moment of
29:33
where are all my quiet ADHD women.
29:36
SPEAKER_00: and I thought, let's create a club.
29:38
I think I've created quite a few clubs in my various careers
29:41
and I think it stems
29:42
back to that feeling of being outside of the club when I was
29:46
younger and not being
29:47
SPEAKER_00: part of the in-crowd and in-group so I keep making clubs.
29:51
So it's essentially an online membership that I host on Substack
29:55
and
29:57
Within it,
29:57
there are lots of resources in terms of I do these things I
30:02
call explorations.
30:03
They're like deep dive topics where we explore particular sort
30:08
of features and
30:09
SPEAKER_00: challenges of ADHD.
30:11
SPEAKER_00: So it might be about,
30:12
SPEAKER_00: you know,
30:13
kind of dealing with procrastination or finding focus or how to
30:16
rest or we have
30:20
SPEAKER_00: like little challenges.
30:21
SPEAKER_00: So we did the inconsistently consistent project.
30:25
SPEAKER_00: Which was all about kind of challenging,
30:27
SPEAKER_00: I did at the same time as the 100 day project was starting,
30:29
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you're familiar with that,
30:30
SPEAKER_00: where you pick a thing and do it for 100 days,
30:32
SPEAKER_00: which I've done twice and was horchrous by the end of it,
30:35
because doing the same thing for 100 days every single day was
30:38
just beyond.
30:39
So this instead was a project that we did where you could
30:43
choose how long you do it
30:44
SPEAKER_00: for,
30:45
SPEAKER_00: what you're going to do,
30:45
SPEAKER_00: and you could have little breaks,
30:48
SPEAKER_00: you know,
30:48
SPEAKER_00: you decide you weren't going to do it for
30:50
the weekend or whatever so we have all these different things
30:52
we have experts come
30:54
and talk to us about like how to declutter or relationships in
30:58
ADHD how to sleep
31:00
better nutrition hormones all kinds of stuff we have body
31:06
doubling sessions twice a
31:08
week we have an accountability thread we have lots of lots and
31:13
lots of lovely
31:13
resources lots of ways for people to get support and guidance
31:18
to connect to the
31:19
SPEAKER_00: community
31:20
SPEAKER_00: And all of it is completely optional and low pressure.
31:24
SPEAKER_00: None of it is obligatory.
31:26
SPEAKER_00: There's no falling behind.
31:28
SPEAKER_00: There's no keeping up.
31:29
SPEAKER_00: There's no going at any particular speed.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: People can come to every body doubling session or none of them.
31:35
SPEAKER_00: You know,
31:35
SPEAKER_00: it's entirely up to you because,
31:38
SPEAKER_00: you know,
31:38
SPEAKER_00: it's a it's a space for introverted,
31:41
SPEAKER_00: sensitive women.
31:43
So the last thing I'm going to do is say to anybody that
31:45
they've got to come along
31:46
SPEAKER_00: and speak up because that's that's not that's not what we do.
31:49
SPEAKER_00: That's not as introverted, sensitive types.
31:52
So it's all there for people to be able to make use of as much
31:56
as they little as
31:57
SPEAKER_00: they like at any given time.
32:00
um yeah and it's a you know it's a quite a lovely space and
32:02
it's been going for a
32:03
good year year and a half now so there's a real wealth of
32:09
information and resources
32:10
there for people to be able to to just access whenever they
32:14
like and you know you
32:15
can read you can listen you can watch it's a variety of ways
32:18
that you can take it
32:19
SPEAKER_00: all in
32:20
SPEAKER_01: Lovely, wonderful.
32:21
SPEAKER_01: So we can find that, of course, on your Substack.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: I will link it under, it's the Quiet ADHD Club.
32:31
SPEAKER_01: Gabrielle, is there something else you'd like to share with us?
32:34
SPEAKER_01: Maybe a last word of wisdom for our audience?
32:40
SPEAKER_00: I think the last thing I would say,
32:43
SPEAKER_00: and I think it's something that I know is very important to you,
32:47
SPEAKER_00: but we haven't actually touched upon that much there.
32:49
SPEAKER_00: I think it's the whole sensitivity thing.
32:51
and the being called too sensitive and that was definitely
32:53
something that was also
32:54
I think I was told I was too sensitive and that I needed to
33:00
have a thicker skin and
33:01
needed to be less sensitive in a way that people were trying to
33:03
be helpful to me
33:04
they thought that that would prepare me for the the outside
33:07
world but I realized
33:09
SPEAKER_00: how yeah
33:11
and I think a lot of us you know it kind of you know like you
33:14
have to toughen up
33:14
because the world is harsh and you're not going to survive if
33:17
you don't toughen up
33:18
and it was all about how we're the ones that are kind of wrong
33:21
here and we have got
33:22
to be better at being tough not the world the world doesn't
33:26
have to change the
33:26
SPEAKER_00: world is just fine you have to change and I think that understanding that
33:33
SPEAKER_00: sensitivity
33:34
is absolutely not a flaw and if anything I mean I'm not keen on
33:39
the whole kind of
33:40
deciding what's superpowers and what is not but there is
33:43
absolute power in
33:45
sensitivity and I think it can be a complete asset and not a
33:48
liability and
33:49
certainly I think that that for you and I as coaches it's
33:53
invaluable and I think it
33:54
makes us better coaches just you know through being able to use
33:58
our our sensitivity
33:59
SPEAKER_00: and yes it can be overwhelming but I think it's one of those things that
34:03
Understanding that your sensitivity is not a bad thing and that
34:08
you don't have to
34:09
SPEAKER_00: toughen up to deal with the world.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: You know,
34:11
SPEAKER_00: yep,
34:12
SPEAKER_00: there's boundaries and there's understanding where,
34:14
SPEAKER_00: you know,
34:15
SPEAKER_00: you end and other people begin,
34:16
SPEAKER_00: you know,
34:19
SPEAKER_00: handling the empathetic side.
34:22
SPEAKER_00: But understanding that your sensitivity is not a flaw,
34:26
SPEAKER_00: that you don't have to toughen up and that as a sensitive,
34:31
SPEAKER_00: introverted,
34:32
SPEAKER_00: ADHD,
34:33
Woman you are absolutely exactly who you are supposed to be and
34:39
yes things can be
34:40
difficult and yes you need support but there is absolutely
34:42
nothing categorically
34:44
wrong with you in any way shape or form for being those things
34:48
thank you so much
34:48
for for saying that and yes it's um I think it's it's also a
34:53
reminder that there is
34:54
SPEAKER_01: no way for us to toughen up you know it's like
35:01
SPEAKER_01: We can only be how we are.
35:03
SPEAKER_01: It's again a way we are wired.
35:05
SPEAKER_01: Hi, honey.
35:06
SPEAKER_01: Mommy's live on Substack, sweetie.
35:08
SPEAKER_01: Can you please?
35:10
SPEAKER_01: She's gonna be here soon.
35:11
SPEAKER_01: Hi, it's my son, who's five.
35:16
SPEAKER_01: What was I saying?
35:17
That the message you should toughen up or wanting to adapt to
35:22
the world just makes
35:24
us feel inadequate and not wanting to interact with the world
35:29
or feeling like we
35:30
just shouldn't be there or it's not possible for us to live in
35:34
any other way.
35:35
So yes,
35:37
thank you for saying that and reaffirming that there is no need
35:41
to be someone else.
35:42
SPEAKER_01: You can be just
35:44
SPEAKER_01: yourself,
35:44
it's also accepting that there's vulnerability in feeling that
35:48
when we have so much
35:50
SPEAKER_01: empathy and so much care for others,
35:53
SPEAKER_01: you know,
35:54
SPEAKER_01: I wish,
35:55
SPEAKER_01: sometimes I wish I cared less,
35:56
SPEAKER_01: honestly.
35:58
SPEAKER_01: But,
35:59
SPEAKER_01: but at the same time,
36:00
SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't be me and I wouldn't be able to understand the world the way I
36:03
SPEAKER_01: understand it,
36:04
SPEAKER_01: understand the people and bring them this sense of being less lonely,
36:09
SPEAKER_01: because we can then have compassion for them,
36:11
SPEAKER_01: we can then feel
36:12
SPEAKER_01: with them and really understand what they're going through.
36:15
And that comes at the price of being overwhelmed and sometimes
36:22
feeling really vulnerable.
36:25
SPEAKER_01: But anyways, how can we go through life without being vulnerable?
36:27
SPEAKER_01: It's the most beautiful things we could ever do.
36:29
SPEAKER_01: There's no love, there's no community, there's no
36:33
togetherness without that vulnerability so thank you so much
36:36
for for sharing that
36:38
Gabrielle it's been a pleasure to have you on our on our series
36:43
thank you so much
36:43
for your time your energy your wisdom I'll add all your links
36:47
in the replay with
36:49
the description of the podcast if you're listening to this or
36:53
on YouTube or on
36:54
Substack of course and yes I think that's it for today bye thank
36:59
you so much Jessica