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Transcript

IT'S A GO: LINDSAY CLANCY TO BE RE-TRIED IN 3 TOTS STRANGLING DEATHS · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Tonight, it's a go.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: Lindsay Clancy will be retried in the strangulation deaths of
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: her three taught children.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Good evening. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: want to thank you for being with us.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: It never ends with a so-called killer mom, Lindsay Clancy.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: The killing of her children, which was thinking about herself
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: and exercising and her own well-being.
• 0:32
  Speaker 4: Prosecution still has the burden of proving that she did it.
• 0:36
  Speaker 4: And they chose not to use that so-called confession to
• 0:40
  Speaker 4: do that.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: In the last hours, Lindsay Clancy, so-called killer mom, back
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: in court. There will be a retrial, according to prosecutors,
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: but this is a tiny taste of what we witnessed.
• 0:55
  Speaker 5: You don't bring.
• 0:57
  Speaker 6: Your background into a jury room and suppress it as
• 1:03
  Speaker 6: was done in this case.
• 1:04
  Speaker 5: This gentleman, Mr. Duransville.
• 1:06
  Speaker 7: I'm going to stop you right there.
• 1:08
  Speaker 5: No, you're not going to stop me.
• 1:09
  Speaker 7: Well, no, I am.
• 1:10
  Speaker 5: No, you're not.
• 1:10
  Speaker 4: All right, then this hearing's, you know, because there's no need.
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: to bring out that juror's name.
• 1:16
  Speaker 5: If they're all over the internet.
• 1:18
  Speaker 4: That's through the internet. That's through other people. There's no
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: need here in this courtroom to use that. Everyone else
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: is referred to either as juror Doe. And if you
• 1:30
  Speaker 4: want to refer to him, that's the way he's to
• 1:32
  Speaker 4: be referred.
• 1:33
  Speaker 5: That's all. He's got more face time than I do.
• 1:35
  Speaker 8: Well, that's, you know, that's, but that's not through this.
• 1:38
  Speaker 5: Wait a minute.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: Did I hear Clancy's defense attorney, Kevin Reddington, reprimand the judge?
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: You don't bring.
• 1:52
  Speaker 6: Your background into a jury room and suppress it as
• 1:57
  Speaker 6: was done in this case.
• 1:58
  Speaker 5: This gentleman, Mr. Duransville.
• 2:01
  Speaker 7: I'm going to stop you right there.
• 2:02
  Speaker 5: No, you're not going to stop me.
• 2:03
  Speaker 8: Well, no, I am.
• 2:04
  Speaker 5: No, you're not.
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: All right, then this hearing's, you know, because there's no need.
• 2:09
  Speaker 4: To bring out that juror's name.
• 2:11
  Speaker 5: It's all over the internet.
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: That's through the internet. That's through other people. There's no
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: need here in this courtroom to use that. Everyone else
• 2:21
  Speaker 4: is referred to him either as juror or no. And
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: if you want to refer to him, that's the way
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: he's to be referred.
• 2:28
  Speaker 5: That's all. He's got more face time than I do.
• 2:30
  Speaker 8: Well, that's, you know, that's, but that's not through this,
• 2:33
  Speaker 8: the rulings I made.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: Straight out to Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Did
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: I just hear Kevin Reddington tell the judge, no, I
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: will not stop. Did he just backtalk, reprimand the judge
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: on the bench? He did.
• 2:52
  Speaker 9: Nancy, it was shocking. And it so shocked the judge
• 2:55
  Speaker 9: that he almost called an end to things. It was
• 2:58
  Speaker 9: over the name of the holdout juror. Now, I know
• 3:02
  Speaker 9: that name's been leaked, but Nancy, this is a big
• 3:04
  Speaker 9: deal for anybody who's ever thought about having to sit
• 3:07
  Speaker 9: on a jury. How do you give your own personal
• 3:10
  Speaker 9: thoughts and opinion based on what you've witnessed in court
• 3:13
  Speaker 9: when you know that if you're the one person who
• 3:16
  Speaker 9: doesn't go along with the rest, they're going to rake
• 3:18
  Speaker 9: you over the coals for all the world to see?
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it was crazy.
• 3:23
  Speaker 9: I didn't think attorneys could do that to a judge
• 3:25
  Speaker 9: and get away with it.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: Joining us, veteran trial lawyer who has had to deal
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: with so many judges, he can't even count them, Randy Kessler.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: Randy, listen to this.
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: Everyone else is referred to him either as juror or adult.
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: And if you want to refer to him, that's the
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: way he's to be referred.
• 3:43
  Speaker 8: That's all.
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: He's got more face time than I do.
• 3:45
  Speaker 8: Well, that's, you know, that's, but that's not through the
• 3:49
  Speaker 8: rulings I've made.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: Kessler, has Reddington finally lost his mind? He could be
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: held in contempt for that. I'm surprised he wasn't.
• 3:57
  Speaker 5: He could.
• 3:57
  Speaker 10: And aside from his own reputation, his own being in
• 4:00
  Speaker 10: contempt of court, you respect the robe. The last thing
• 4:03
  Speaker 10: you want to do is antagonize the person that you're
• 4:05
  Speaker 10: asking to decide in your favor. We've learned that a
• 4:09
  Speaker 10: long time. You may not like the judge, you may
• 4:11
  Speaker 10: not like the person, but you respect the position. That's
• 4:14
  Speaker 10: the ultimate authority in the courtroom.
• 4:15
  Speaker 7: And when the judge says, I'm going to stop you
• 4:17
  Speaker 7: right there, you say, okay.
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: Have you ever been held in contempt?
• 4:23
  Speaker 7: No, I've been close, but I've not been held. You're kidding.
• 4:27
  Speaker 7: I've totally been held in contempt.
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: And you should have seen the fleet of public defenders
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: that ran into the courtroom to see me held in
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  Speaker 2: contempt and get fingerprinted.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: They were so happy. I don't know how they found
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: out so quickly.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: That said, I'm very surprised that Reddington kicked it off
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: like that because it's only going to hurt his client.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: I mean, you and I both practiced in front of
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: judges yesterday. that apparently hated us or didn't like your client,
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: for instance, and gave you H-E-L-L throughout the entire trial.
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: I've certainly had that happen to me.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: And you just sit down and shut up until you're
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: making a valid legal claim.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: Not this.
• 5:14
  Speaker 7: No, this blows me away, right?
• 5:16
  Speaker 10: Why would you antagonize the person that holds your client's
• 5:19
  Speaker 10: life in their hands?
• 5:20
  Speaker 7: Literally.
• 5:20
  Speaker 10: I mean, this person is the one that can decide
• 5:23
  Speaker 10: if there's going to be another trial or Is there
• 5:25
  Speaker 10: going to be dismissal? And to start off by saying,
• 5:29
  Speaker 10: you're not going to tell me what to do. Sorry,
• 5:31
  Speaker 10: that's the judge's job. The judge runs the courtroom. The
• 5:33
  Speaker 10: judge governs the courtroom. That's the judge's environment. You do
• 5:36
  Speaker 10: not tell a judge, no. When a judge says, I'm
• 5:39
  Speaker 10: going to stop you right there.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: That's why they're the judge.
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: And sometimes you just have to eat a dirt sandwich
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: and sit down and shut up. But That's not the bombshell.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: The bombshell is the state announces there.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: Will be a retrial.
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: But apparently, Kevin Reddington, Clancy's lawyer, tried to make it, again,
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: the Reddington show.
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: Everyone else is referred to him either as juror or adult.
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: And if you want to refer to him, that's the
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: way he's to be referred.
• 6:08
  Speaker 5: That's all. He's got more face time than I do.
• 6:10
  Speaker 8: Well, that's, you know, that's, but that's not through this,
• 6:13
  Speaker 8: the rulings I made.
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: That's from our friends over at East Idaho News in
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: the courtroom.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: Okay, right there, Robbie Harvey joining us, investigative journalist and
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: star of The Robbie Harvey Show on YouTube. Why is
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: he saying that? He's got more FaceTime than I do.
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: This is not about FaceTime. This is about trying this case.
• 6:35
  Speaker 11: Yeah, and I don't like the message that's being sent
• 6:37
  Speaker 11: to the next jury. I mean, we're essentially telling the
• 6:40
  Speaker 11: next jury, That, hey, you better have an attorney once
• 6:43
  Speaker 11: this thing is over with, because if you don't rule
• 6:45
  Speaker 11: the way that I want you to, we're going to
• 6:47
  Speaker 11: come after you and we're going to publicly humiliate you
• 6:51
  Speaker 11: in front of the judge and in front of the world.
• 6:53
  Speaker 11: This is a sad state. And look, I think Reddington
• 6:56
  Speaker 11: did a good job for Lindsay during their first trial.
• 6:59
  Speaker 11: I mean, he was one vote away. from getting their way.
• 7:03
  Speaker 11: But now he's sending the message to the next year.
• 7:05
  Speaker 11: And to be honest, Nancy, I wouldn't want to be
• 7:08
  Speaker 11: on the jury seeing all this for the next trial.
• 7:11
  Speaker 7: It's intimidating.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Kessler, you're a veteran trial lawyer, the former chair of
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: the ABA family law section.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: That's the American.
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: Bar Association, author of Divorce, Protect Yourself, Your Kids and
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: Your Future and more. Kessler, why is Reddington making this
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: the Kevin Reddington show and complaining that the holdout juror
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: got more, quote, FaceTime than he Reddington got? Is that
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: what it's about for him?
• 7:37
  Speaker 10: Maybe he's figuring I've been around the block a long
• 7:39
  Speaker 10: time and this is my time to cash it all
• 7:41
  Speaker 10: in because next time he's in trial, you know, this
• 7:44
  Speaker 10: judge and mostly any judge is going to say none
• 7:46
  Speaker 10: of those shenanigans. When we interview the jury, we are
• 7:49
  Speaker 10: not going to have any of that in my courtroom, Mr.
• 7:50
  Speaker 7: Reddington. He's now changing his reputation.
• 7:53
  Speaker 10: If his reputation wasn't like this already, You got to
• 7:55
  Speaker 10: be careful when you do stuff like this.
• 7:57
  Speaker 7: But this is it. He's he's going all in on.
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  Speaker 7: I'm going to burn all bridges.
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  Speaker 5: I don't care.
• 8:01
  Speaker 7: I'm going to do whatever I can to get this
• 8:02
  Speaker 7: client a dismissal. And you know what?
• 8:05
  Speaker 10: To his own detriment, I think in court, you know,
• 8:07
  Speaker 10: next time he's around, judge is going to be a
• 8:09
  Speaker 10: lot more careful with his objections, with the way he postures,
• 8:11
  Speaker 10: with what he says. They may want to say, I
• 8:13
  Speaker 10: want a preview of your opening statement before I let
• 8:16
  Speaker 10: you go from now on. If you're going to act
• 8:17
  Speaker 10: like that in the last case that I saw on
• 8:20
  Speaker 10: Nancy Grace, you know.
• 8:21
  Speaker 6: And his attorney from Houston is sitting in the back row.
• 8:24
  Speaker 5: Well, that's great, too.
• 8:26
  Speaker 9: But, you know, we don't need this.
• 8:29
  Speaker 5: Okay, fine.
• 8:29
  Speaker 6: Let me continue with what was not given to you
• 8:33
  Speaker 6: at the time the jury form was submitted. Because I
• 8:36
  Speaker 6: know in your rulings you say that anything that came subsequent,
• 8:41
  Speaker 6: that was discovered subsequent, such as the juror who indicated
• 8:47
  Speaker 6: that this individual... was on his cell phone. He was
• 8:53
  Speaker 6: scrolling through his cell phone. I know that you are
• 8:57
  Speaker 6: very familiar with the Superior Court rule that requires a
• 9:01
  Speaker 6: Superior Court judge to instruct the jury that they are
• 9:07
  Speaker 6: not to have cell phones or electronic devices in the
• 9:13
  Speaker 6: jury room or during the trial.
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: That's from our friends over at East Idaho News in
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: the courtroom. Last time I looked, Randy Kessler, it's not
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: against the court rules of procedure to have your lawyers present.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: Reddington is referring to Tyler Cox and Ed Palchik sitting
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: in the back of the courtroom. Those are the holdout jurors, lawyers,
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: and he needs lawyers. I'm going to be very surprised
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: if multiple lawsuits aren't filed on his behalf, including a
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: potential lawsuit. disbarment claim against Reddington. So why is he
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: pointing out the fact that the holdout has lawyers in court?
• 9:57
  Speaker 7: You know, it's something personal with him. It must be.
• 9:59
  Speaker 10: Because the truth of the matter is your only question,
• 10:02
  Speaker 10: your guiding principle should be the next thing I say,
• 10:04
  Speaker 10: does it advance my client's cause? Does it advance my
• 10:07
  Speaker 10: client's case? Pointing out that there are lawyers for the juror,
• 10:11
  Speaker 10: the lone juror, does not help Lindsay Clancy. It maybe
• 10:14
  Speaker 10: makes the lawyer feel like, oh, I'm a little bit
• 10:17
  Speaker 10: outnumbered or there are other people watching or a judge,
• 10:19
  Speaker 10: shame on them. I don't know where it gets him.
• 10:21
  Speaker 10: It doesn't get his client any further down the path,
• 10:23
  Speaker 10: in my opinion. It probably came out because he was angry.
• 10:27
  Speaker 10: It was in the back of his mind. He couldn't
• 10:28
  Speaker 10: turn it off and it just came out. And he
• 10:31
  Speaker 10: probably regrets having said it because it doesn't really help
• 10:33
  Speaker 10: his client that any.
• 10:34
  Speaker 7: Of us can tell.
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: To Dr.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Janie Lacey joining us, psychotherapist, CEO of Life Counseling Solutions,
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: author of How to Heal from a Toxic Relationship. and
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: star of Let's Talk About It with Janie Lacey.
• 10:47
  Speaker 11: Dr.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Janie, why does this have to be the Kevin Reddington
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: show in court?
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: Isn't this supposed to be about his.
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: Client, Lindsay Clancy, who, P.S., the banner, the headline is
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: Clancy is set to be retried. In case you were
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: wondering if a plea was going to go down or
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: if the state was going to just drop the whole
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: thing and turn tail and run, that ain't happening. That
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: sound you just heard from East Idaho News. Why is
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: it all about him, Janie Lacey? Now he's attacking the
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: holdout's lawyers. And I learned firsthand, if you speak out
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: against Reddington, he will blast you.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: Okay, fine, bring it on. But why does it have
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: to be this way, Janie?
• 11:25
  Speaker 12: Well, in my opinion, Nancy, this is all about his ego, right?
• 11:29
  Speaker 12: This holdout juror, I'm assuming from his standpoint, was the
• 11:32
  Speaker 12: block to him winning this trial. So when we have
• 11:35
  Speaker 12: an ego that enters into the courtroom, then that ego
• 11:39
  Speaker 12: is pointing out to the very thing that prevented him
• 11:42
  Speaker 12: from winning this case. And I think, you know, Nancy,
• 11:45
  Speaker 12: that's the part that we don't talk enough.
• 11:46
  Speaker 7: About is this jury, right?
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: They're ordinary people.
• 11:49
  Speaker 12: So I agree with one of the panelists of what
• 11:51
  Speaker 12: is this going to say to the next panelist, the
• 11:54
  Speaker 12: next jury that's going to be on this trial? I mean,
• 11:57
  Speaker 12: they give up weeks of their lives. They sat through
• 11:59
  Speaker 12: autopsy details, a mother's psychiatric collapse with no training and
• 12:04
  Speaker 12: And no one's saying anything about that. And they're watching
• 12:08
  Speaker 12: the lawyers argue about the room that they deliberated in,
• 12:11
  Speaker 12: and they're about to be a part of this case potentially.
• 12:14
  Speaker 7: That's what I'm seeing. This is a circus, Nancy.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: That's from our friends over at East Idaho News in
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: the courtroom. And in the last hours, Reddington and his
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: team submit all YouTube news appearances and podcast clips of
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: the lone juror, the holdout, or his reps speaking on
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: the case.
• 12:34
  Speaker 6: I've already got clips that I could play now, but
• 12:39
  Speaker 6: I'm sure the DA would object and you'd probably sustain it,
• 12:42
  Speaker 6: so I won't play the clips in the courtroom. I
• 12:45
  Speaker 6: have the request for the ABC News interview of the individual.
• 12:50
  Speaker 6: It was broadcast on September 10th of 26.
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: I have the video and the transcript that I would offer.
• 12:57
  Speaker 6: I have, as the next exhibit that I would offer,
• 13:00
  Speaker 6: would be the impanelment Expert excerpt of July 22nd, 2026,
• 13:04
  Speaker 6: which was the voir dire that I referenced in the
• 13:09
  Speaker 6: course of the argument, Your Honor.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: Dave Mack, Crime Stories.
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: He is submitting YouTube podcast clips and more from either
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: the holdout or his lawyers that they keep showing.
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: That would be Tyler Cox and Ed Polchick. By the way,
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: they are not idiots. I have spoken with them at length.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: They're pretty sharp. And Reddington is somehow roping them into
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: all of this. YouTube clips? I mean, why?
• 13:47
  Speaker 9: Well, it's because what Reddington wants to do is he
• 13:50
  Speaker 9: wants to out this juror that prevented him from getting
• 13:53
  Speaker 9: a victory. So he's doing everything he can to show
• 13:57
  Speaker 9: every interview, everything that's been said by the juror or
• 14:01
  Speaker 9: his attorneys, his mouthpieces, so that they can somehow... All
• 14:05
  Speaker 9: I can think of is just shame him because Reddington
• 14:09
  Speaker 9: wanted the judge to investigate this juror. Because the juror
• 14:12
  Speaker 9: did not vote with the rest of the jury... Reddington
• 14:15
  Speaker 9: wants this guy examined so that the next jury, I guess,
• 14:19
  Speaker 9: will go the way Reddington wants.
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: Whoa, whoa, whoa, there's Reddington.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: He's fit as a fiddle and wearing his sunglasses. Okay,
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: must be really bright that day. The star, the celebrity lawyer,
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: Kevin Reddington, blasted after court by the holdout's lawyers. This
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: is from our friends at East Idaho News.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: You know what, Randy Kessler?
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: You better be ready to tangle with a rattlesnake if
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: you start up with Tyler Cox and Ed Palchik. Because
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: I suspect there's going to be a bar complaint and
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: an attempt to have Reddington disbarred.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: Do I think this is going to rise to disbarment?
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: No, I don't. But who knows the mind? the Bar
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: Association or that Supreme Court who would make that decision.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: A lot of people file bar complaints. They're peeved about
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: their settlement. They're peeved about their case. It doesn't rise
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: to a legitimate complaint or a disbarment. But Cox and Polchick,
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: they are standing by and seeing what's being done to
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: their client, the holdout juror. And did you hear Reddington
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: say he's submitting YouTube clips?
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: You think this judge cares about what's happening on YouTube?
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: That judge doesn't care.
• 15:41
  Speaker 10: No, he's given them a lot of weaponry to go
• 15:43
  Speaker 10: after him for a civil lawsuit, right?
• 15:44
  Speaker 7: All this stuff.
• 15:45
  Speaker 10: You know, we've got to protect jurors, right? That's the
• 15:48
  Speaker 10: whole reason the system works. You know, you don't want
• 15:50
  Speaker 10: to have a judge making the decisions. You want to
• 15:52
  Speaker 10: have 12 of our peers. Who's going to want to
• 15:54
  Speaker 10: sit on the jury anymore? And, you know, maybe it's
• 15:56
  Speaker 10: Kevin Reddington, you know, trying to change the trial. The
• 16:00
  Speaker 10: trial is no longer about Lindsey Clancy. He's putting the
• 16:02
  Speaker 10: system on trial. He's putting the legal system that we have.
• 16:06
  Speaker 5: Does.
• 16:06
  Speaker 7: justice work in America? Did the jury system work?
• 16:10
  Speaker 10: Maybe that's clever to put the system on trial so
• 16:12
  Speaker 10: we're not thinking about what really happened.
• 16:13
  Speaker 7: And maybe that's a distraction, but he's also a defense lawyer.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: Is that why he's doing this? I think you just
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: hit the nail on the head, Kessler.
• 16:20
  Speaker 7: It may be because.
• 16:21
  Speaker 10: The more we talk about the system, we don't talk
• 16:23
  Speaker 10: about the horrific facts that his client perpetuated.
• 16:26
  Speaker 7: That's, you know, it may be clever like a fox.
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: Let's do exactly that, Kessler. You're right.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: This has been the Reddington Show all day long in
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: that courtroom. Well, it's not tonight. Straight out to a
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: renowned chief medical examiner, Dr. Kendall Crowns, the chief medical
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: examiner in Tarrant County. That's Fort Worth. Never a lack
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: of business in the morgue there. He is the star
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: of a hit podcast, Make Him in the Morgue on YouTube.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: He is the esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: Medicine at TCU and has performed literally thousands and thousands
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: of autopsies.
• 17:11
  Speaker 7: Dr.
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: Crowns, thank you for being with us tonight. Could you
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: explain what this case is all about? What happened to Cora, Dawson,
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: and Callan?
• 17:24
  Speaker 13: What this case is all about is all three of
• 17:26
  Speaker 13: those children that you just mentioned were strangled. to death
• 17:30
  Speaker 13: with an elastic exercise band. Each one of them had
• 17:34
  Speaker 13: the band wrapped around their neck and then tied off
• 17:37
  Speaker 13: behind them, essentially strangling them, cutting off blood to their head,
• 17:42
  Speaker 13: causing them to asphyxiate, which means no oxygen was able
• 17:45
  Speaker 13: to get to their brain. So they eventually died from
• 17:49
  Speaker 13: brain death. Each one of them probably struggled for a
• 17:54
  Speaker 13: few minutes to seconds with the elastic bands around their neck.
• 18:00
  Speaker 13: One of them made it to the hospital still alive,
• 18:02
  Speaker 13: which means there was probably a little bit of oxygen
• 18:05
  Speaker 13: still getting through, but not enough to prevent severe brain damage.
• 18:10
  Speaker 13: So each child was strangled with an elastic exercise band
• 18:14
  Speaker 13: and then had it tied around their neck and left
• 18:17
  Speaker 13: for dead. So that's what this trial is about, is
• 18:19
  Speaker 13: the strangulation of three children with elastic exercise bands.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: Dr. Kendall-Crowns, what do you mean? that the oxygen had
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: been cut off, but some of it was making it through.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: From where to where? I think you're talking about Cowan,
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: the baby, that was still alive, or at least his
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: heart was beating when he got to the hospital.
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: So, right.
• 18:45
  Speaker 13: From where to where is essentially the bands are across
• 18:49
  Speaker 13: the neck, so it's compressing the carotid and jugular vein,
• 18:53
  Speaker 13: the carotid artery and jugular vein, which takes about 11
• 18:56
  Speaker 13: pounds of pressure for the carotid, for the jugular, And
• 19:00
  Speaker 13: that's being done by the ligature, which consists of the
• 19:04
  Speaker 13: elastic exercise band. These are tied around the neck. The
• 19:08
  Speaker 13: thing is about an elastic exercise band is there's a
• 19:11
  Speaker 13: fair amount of give to them. So she would have
• 19:14
  Speaker 13: had to put a lot of pressure on them to
• 19:17
  Speaker 13: get them tied off to get the neck constricted enough.
• 19:21
  Speaker 13: And what I think happened is why the baby survived
• 19:24
  Speaker 13: is it was maybe because his neck is so small.
• 19:27
  Speaker 13: that she wasn't able to get the loop tight enough
• 19:29
  Speaker 13: that he was still able to get a little oxygen
• 19:32
  Speaker 13: through it or a little blood through to his brain,
• 19:35
  Speaker 13: but not enough to survive. But that's my assumption is
• 19:38
  Speaker 13: it was such a small loop that she probably didn't
• 19:41
  Speaker 13: get a significant enough pressure that he was still getting
• 19:44
  Speaker 13: a little bit of blood to the brain, but not
• 19:47
  Speaker 13: enough to survive. And that's probably why he was still alive.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: To Dr.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: Janie Lacey, psychotherapist, CEO of Life Counseling Solutions, Reddington, in
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: the light of all of the pain his client has caused,
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: he's making it all about himself in court. It's all
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: the Kevin Reddington show.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: It certainly is.
• 20:13
  Speaker 12: And I'm glad that you showed that clip of Patrick because,
• 20:17
  Speaker 12: you know, I can't even imagine Nancy and I'd be
• 20:20
  Speaker 12: careful about anyone who claims that they can. But I
• 20:23
  Speaker 12: think about Patrick, what he's carrying. I mean, he's the
• 20:27
  Speaker 12: father who lost all three of his children. He's also,
• 20:30
  Speaker 12: or was the husband of a woman who was charged
• 20:33
  Speaker 12: and a man who by every account was trying to
• 20:36
  Speaker 12: get her help. And on top of it, you know,
• 20:38
  Speaker 12: strangers online accusing him of the crime itself. I mean,
• 20:41
  Speaker 12: when families are just pulled in two directions like this,
• 20:44
  Speaker 12: I mean, anger and love, I mean, they show up
• 20:47
  Speaker 12: all at the same time and it's confusing and it's exhausting.
• 20:49
  Speaker 12: And And Patrick has said he doesn't see her as
• 20:52
  Speaker 12: a monster, right? So he's also seeking answers about her care.
• 20:56
  Speaker 12: And those can both be true. Wanting accountability from the
• 21:00
  Speaker 12: system doesn't mean he stopped caring about Lindsay, who was the.
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: Mother of his child.
• 21:04
  Speaker 12: And, you know, that's what I see right now, Nancy.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: So far, no response from the state other than them
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: stating in court, Lindsay Clancy will be retried.
• 21:18
  Speaker 7: Well.
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: The holdout jurors, lawyers, did not take it laying down.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: That's false.
• 21:25
  Speaker 14: That's not what the questionnaire bears out.
• 21:28
  Speaker 7: That's false.
• 21:29
  Speaker 14: That's not what happened.
• 21:30
  Speaker 8: That's a lie.
• 21:32
  Speaker 13: Where did he get this from?
• 21:33
  Speaker 7: I don't know.
• 21:35
  Speaker 8: From his diseased mind?
• 21:36
  Speaker 7: I don't know.
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: I really don't know, but I can tell you what
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: the truth is. By the way, you guys saw Michael's interviews, right?
• 21:45
  Speaker 14: You saw his interview with Kayleigh. You saw his interview
• 21:48
  Speaker 14: with Ray Marcel. What did Michael say on those interviews?
• 21:53
  Speaker 14: He said, I had no doubt. He said, I followed
• 21:57
  Speaker 14: the law.
• 21:57
  Speaker 8: I followed the law.
• 21:58
  Speaker 14: What I'm concerned about now is I'm concerned that nobody's
• 22:01
  Speaker 14: going to want to be a juror.
• 22:03
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 22:04
  Speaker 11: Would you want to be a juror after this?
• 22:07
  Speaker 8: The implications of this.
• 22:09
  Speaker 7: Are really far reaching and disturbing.
• 22:13
  Speaker 8: I also would, I've said.
• 22:14
  Speaker 14: This before, I would strongly encourage people to reverse the
• 22:17
  Speaker 14: situation and just think about it if it was 11
• 22:20
  Speaker 14: to 1 in favor of the district attorney's position.
• 22:24
  Speaker 8: Right, what would that look like?
• 22:26
  Speaker 9: People feel comfortable with this if it was the state.
• 22:31
  Speaker 7: Leaning on a juror.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: Back to Randy Kessler joining us, veteran trial lawyer out
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: of the Atlanta jurisdiction.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: That's a really good point Paul Triggs is making right there.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: What if the rules were reversed.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: And the juror was being attacked by prosecutors for not
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: voting guilty?
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: Hell would freeze over before that was allowed. Right.
• 22:55
  Speaker 7: Defense lawyers would be up in arms.
• 22:57
  Speaker 10: You know, Nancy, I see eventually down the road after
• 22:59
  Speaker 10: this case is behind us and there are bar complaints
• 23:02
  Speaker 10: or complaints being made by lawyers or victims or the juror,
• 23:05
  Speaker 10: juror Doe, that maybe the state bar, maybe they issue
• 23:08
  Speaker 10: an advisory opinion because, Lawyers need to know where are
• 23:11
  Speaker 10: the limits? Has he crossed the limit? Is this going
• 23:14
  Speaker 10: to affect and taint the system? Are we going to
• 23:17
  Speaker 10: have a bad jury system from now on because people
• 23:19
  Speaker 10: are afraid they're going to get Reddingtoned? There's going to
• 23:21
  Speaker 10: be a new verb that's going to happen to them.
• 23:23
  Speaker 10: They don't want to have that happen to them. So
• 23:25
  Speaker 10: I imagine we're going to get some guidance out of
• 23:27
  Speaker 10: the bar, out of the bar associations, maybe out of
• 23:29
  Speaker 10: the Supreme Court in Massachusetts. But there's got to be
• 23:32
  Speaker 10: something that tells future lawyers where the boundaries are. Is
• 23:36
  Speaker 10: this over and above? We all feel like it's over
• 23:38
  Speaker 10: and above and You don't do this to a jury.
• 23:40
  Speaker 10: You don't put people on trial when they were the juror.
• 23:45
  Speaker 7: I mean, that's just got to happen.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: You just stated that there has to be a framework
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: and clear instructions about what lawyers can and cannot do.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: In what world, right now, without your black and white
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: letter of the law instructions to lawyers, where is it
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: okay to name a juror in open court by name?
• 24:11
  Speaker 7: No, it's not.
• 24:12
  Speaker 10: And if the judge says you don't do it, you
• 24:13
  Speaker 10: don't do it. That's, you know, we always have this
• 24:15
  Speaker 10: tension between zealous advocacy. We have the duty to advocate
• 24:18
  Speaker 10: zealously and God knows Kevin Reddington is zealously advocating for
• 24:21
  Speaker 10: his client, but there are limits. You don't break the
• 24:24
  Speaker 10: bounds of advocacy. You don't break the morals. You don't
• 24:26
  Speaker 10: break professionals. I mean, you definitely don't break the law.
• 24:28
  Speaker 10: And if a judge instructs you not to do something,
• 24:31
  Speaker 10: you don't do it. You ask permission, you appeal, you
• 24:34
  Speaker 10: ask permission from the higher courts, but you don't just
• 24:36
  Speaker 10: go rogue and start doing what you want to do.
• 24:38
  Speaker 10: And is he crossing the line? This judge is going
• 24:40
  Speaker 10: to make some decisions, and then the bar is going to.
• 24:42
  Speaker 7: Make some decisions.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: And apparently, Kevin Reddington calls for backup.
• 24:47
  Speaker 15: This is not simply making judicial decisions about credibility about witnesses.
• 24:54
  Speaker 15: This is, Your Honor, making the potential credibility determinations about
• 24:59
  Speaker 15: jurors and whether they are or are not being candid
• 25:02
  Speaker 15: with the court and deliberating in good faith.
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: Excuse me. I'll lose this.
• 25:08
  Speaker 7: I apologize. But didn't I do that? Didn't I bring,
• 25:12
  Speaker 7: didn't I do a voir dire?
• 25:14
  Speaker 8: Didn't I bring the jurors in? Didn't I swear them in?
• 25:17
  Speaker 8: Didn't I ask each individual one, not just that one juror, because.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: We didn't want to, certainly as you stated, the concern for.
• 25:26
  Speaker 8: Coercion is something I have to worry about. So you
• 25:31
  Speaker 8: say I should have done it a second time.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: That has just happened in the courtroom, that from our
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: friends at East Idaho News.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: Back to you, Kessler.
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: The lawyer who is second fiddle to Reddington, that's defense
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: attorney Mark Weinberg, is arguing, telling the judge what he
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: should have done, and the judge says, wait a minute,
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: I did do that. When it all went down in
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: the original trial, Kessler, there was a complaint that the
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: holdout was not deliberating.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: What it really boiled down.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: To is the holdout wouldn't change his vote. So, The judge,
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: and this is what I would have asked the judge
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: to do, bring in the jury, voidire them, question them
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: one by one so each one's answer would not taint
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: the other one about what's going on back there.
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: And then bring them in en.
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: Masse altogether and re-instruct them on reaching a verdict if
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: they can, what is reasonable doubt, and any other applicable
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: jury instructions And the judge has to read it. They
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: can't do it off the top of their head. They
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: can't ad lib. That's flirting with a reversal. The judge
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: reads the law straight from the jury charges, pieces of paper,
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: which come straight from the criminal code.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: So there'll be no mistake. That's what I would have
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: asked for.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: And that's what the judge did, yet they're still beating
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: a dead horse. Right.
• 27:04
  Speaker 10: And this judge is giving a lecture about courtroom etiquette.
• 27:06
  Speaker 10: He's restoring the professionalism to the courtroom, to the environment.
• 27:09
  Speaker 10: He could have said, I did that. What do you
• 27:11
  Speaker 10: call me, an idiot? Instead, he said, didn't I do that?
• 27:15
  Speaker 7: Here's exactly what I did. He's creating the record.
• 27:17
  Speaker 10: It's all in the record to prove that he did
• 27:19
  Speaker 10: exactly what is being complained about. But he does it
• 27:21
  Speaker 10: in a polite way. It's an endearing way. And he
• 27:23
  Speaker 10: restores our faith in the system that the person in
• 27:26
  Speaker 10: charge is not saying, I'm right, everybody.
• 27:28
  Speaker 7: Else is wrong. He's saying, didn't I do exactly what
• 27:31
  Speaker 7: you're asking me to do?
• 27:32
  Speaker 10: And he says in such a calm, efficient, effective way
• 27:36
  Speaker 10: that we just can't but admire, can't help but admire
• 27:38
  Speaker 10: this judge and the way he's handling this guy who's
• 27:40
  Speaker 10: being aggressive with him and basically accusing the judge of
• 27:43
  Speaker 10: not doing his job.
• 27:44
  Speaker 7: The judge did his job.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: The Kevin Reddington show aside, today was critical in seeking
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: justice for Cora, Dawson, and Callen because we learned there
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: will be a retrial to Robbie Harvey, investigative journalist and
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: star of the Robbie Harvey show on YouTube.
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: What happened?
• 28:05
  Speaker 11: Well, the prosecution has made it clear that they plan
• 28:07
  Speaker 11: on retrying Lindsey Clancy and they're going to go after
• 28:10
  Speaker 11: murder just like the first time. And I think part
• 28:12
  Speaker 11: of the problem that Reddington is having here is during
• 28:15
  Speaker 11: the first trial, he saw this massive surge of support
• 28:19
  Speaker 11: from women wearing pink outside of that courtroom. And now
• 28:22
  Speaker 11: that that trial is over and now people are speaking out,
• 28:25
  Speaker 11: the holdout jurors speaking out, we saw this surge of
• 28:29
  Speaker 11: angry people. America was angry. that she almost got off,
• 28:34
  Speaker 11: that Lindsey Clancy was almost found not guilty. I think
• 28:37
  Speaker 11: Reddington feels like he's losing support in the public eye,
• 28:41
  Speaker 11: and he's running out of options here. I think this
• 28:45
  Speaker 11: second trial is going to be very different, and I
• 28:47
  Speaker 11: think the prosecutors, in my opinion, are loving what they're
• 28:51
  Speaker 11: seeing right now, are loving what Reddington is doing, and
• 28:54
  Speaker 11: I feel like they believe they've really got Lindsey and
• 28:57
  Speaker 11: Reddington up against.
• 28:58
  Speaker 7: The ropes right now.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Kessler, what's happening in court right now is not helping
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: Lindsey Clancy's case. Reddington may be getting plenty of, quote, FaceTime,
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: as he calls it, but they're looking down the wrong
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: end of a barrel at a retrial. The state has
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: come out and said, we're going to retry the case.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: And I don't know of any specific statistics that I
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: would believe anyway about whether a retrial helps the state
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: or the defense, but generally speaking.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: I believe it helps the state, and this is why.
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: The state has to hand over everything, practically everything, to
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: the defense.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: Under the rules of discovery.
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: The defense does not have to hand over everything to
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: the state. They have to hand over witnesses, addresses, and
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: phone numbers if they've got them, scientific evidence. But they
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: don't have the same burden of discovery that the state has.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: Once the trial goes down, the state knows all of
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: those secrets. They've seen the best of. There's no more
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: trial by ambush. There's no element of surprise left for
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: the defense. What do you think? Because today the bombshell
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: is not Kevin Reddington bumbling around in the courtroom.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: The bombshell is there will be a retrial.
• 30:20
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 30:23
  Speaker 10: I think they'll put on a better trial anticipating a
• 30:25
  Speaker 10: lot of the defense's arguments. But you know what? Everyone's
• 30:28
  Speaker 10: beating their chest and they're saying, we've got a good case.
• 30:30
  Speaker 10: You know what the prosecution also saw? They saw 11
• 30:32
  Speaker 10: jurors that didn't want to do murder, right? They saw
• 30:35
  Speaker 10: 11 jurors that were persuaded. There's going to be some
• 30:38
  Speaker 10: behind the scenes. I'm still, would not be shocked if
• 30:41
  Speaker 10: there was a plea well before the trial arrived. A
• 30:43
  Speaker 10: plea to what? They did not win this. This was
• 30:47
  Speaker 10: not a, oh, we were that close to winning. It is,
• 30:49
  Speaker 10: we were that close from losing. We're that close to
• 30:52
  Speaker 10: a mental defense.
• 30:54
  Speaker 7: They almost had that happen to them.
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: Losing, Randy, you're saying the state was one vote away
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: from an NBGRI, not guilty by reason of insanity. That
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: is not a not guilty where she walks free. That
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: is a, she goes back to Tewksbury and she stays there.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: That's what NGBRI is.
• 31:17
  Speaker 5: Agreed.
• 31:18
  Speaker 10: And there's a good chance that they're going to make
• 31:19
  Speaker 10: some plea where they, if I was the state and
• 31:21
  Speaker 10: I was prosecuting, I wouldn't want to risk it again
• 31:23
  Speaker 10: and spend all this taxpayer money after having an 11.
• 31:26
  Speaker 7: To one, you know.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: Why is it you only tune up about taxpayer money
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: when it doesn't go your way? Kessler, I have personally
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: seen you use experts, flying them in all sorts of
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: witnesses at the taxpayer's expense. But now when it's not
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: going your way, you say, Oh, this cost too much.
• 31:50
  Speaker 7: Stop.
• 31:51
  Speaker 10: No, if you know what's going to happen, And you
• 31:53
  Speaker 10: know that the likelihood is, and we already see 11
• 31:56
  Speaker 10: to 1. The first time when you didn't know what
• 31:57
  Speaker 10: the defense was going to say, you already had 11
• 32:00
  Speaker 10: to 1 where you were about to get that mental
• 32:02
  Speaker 10: defense victory. And I consider it a victory for the
• 32:05
  Speaker 10: defense because they were not arguing that she's innocent, that
• 32:08
  Speaker 10: she didn't do this. I think that they're going to
• 32:10
  Speaker 10: find some way to plead this out and get her
• 32:12
  Speaker 10: the help she needs and get her out of the
• 32:15
  Speaker 10: public eye.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: She's already getting the help she needs. Well, what about this?
• 32:20
  Speaker 7: We'll get her in jail.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: Another bombshell.
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: Tonight, I understand, Dave Mack, that Lindsay Clancy has been
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: complaining that she's having bad dreams behind bars. She is, Nancy.
• 32:32
  Speaker 9: She is having a lot of nightmares behind bars every
• 32:34
  Speaker 9: time she goes to sleep. She's picturing her children, who
• 32:38
  Speaker 9: she made sure will never be seen again. She says
• 32:42
  Speaker 9: that she wakes up thinking about the fact that her
• 32:46
  Speaker 9: children are gone. horrible dreams where when she goes to sleep,
• 32:50
  Speaker 9: where she's crying, she's frightened and nervous about the possibility
• 32:53
  Speaker 9: of another trial. That's another thing that's really bogging her
• 32:56
  Speaker 9: down right now. And she remains on a constant suicide watch.
• 33:00
  Speaker 9: So she's always got an eyeball on her at all times, Nancy.
• 33:03
  Speaker 9: It's kind of weirding her out.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: You mean when she's having specially prepared meals and playing
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: Mahjong and Jim Rummy?
• 33:10
  Speaker 7: Yep.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: She's not in jail. She's not in prison. She's in Tewksbury.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: It's a mental facility.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: Robbie Harvey, she's crying because her children are gone.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: Well, whose fault is that, Harvey?
• 33:25
  Speaker 11: Well, and they're worried about her self-harming herself. And I
• 33:29
  Speaker 11: think this is, in my opinion, another win for the prosecution.
• 33:33
  Speaker 11: Because if you remember, during the trial, the focus was
• 33:36
  Speaker 11: on the medical experts and how much they were changing
• 33:39
  Speaker 11: her medication. Patrick Clancy says that she was up to
• 33:43
  Speaker 11: nine medications prior to the murders. And now, as you
• 33:46
  Speaker 11: just stated, Nancy... She's getting the treatment she needed. She's
• 33:50
  Speaker 11: getting pre-prepared food. She doesn't have to worry about bills
• 33:53
  Speaker 11: and things of that nature. And she's still having these thoughts.
• 33:57
  Speaker 11: Are we going to blame the medical professionals that are
• 34:00
  Speaker 11: treating her now? Is that what we're going to do?
• 34:02
  Speaker 11: So I think this is, again, I understand the 11
• 34:08
  Speaker 11: to 1, but I think the prosecution is in the
• 34:12
  Speaker 11: advantage right now.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: All that was present on September 4th was a note
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: that indicated a disagreement on how to weigh the evidence.
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: But that is the deliberation process. So why are we here?
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: Not because of the questionnaire. The defense read it, had
• 34:31
  Speaker 3: the ability to question it, and chose not to, and
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: accepted it. Not because of a phone. Every juror was
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: allowed to keep one. Not because of anything any juror reported.
• 34:44
  Speaker 7: Before the mistrial.
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: No, we are here because juror Doe did not vote
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: the way that the defense needed. So after the mistrial,
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: the defense went looking into the one juror who stood
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: between them and the outcome that they wanted.
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: That's Heather O'Connor working along with Tyler Cotts and Ed
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: Pulchik representing the holdout juror. You know what's happening here
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: is complete obfuscation. They're saying, look here, not here. Look
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: at the holdout, Gerard, not.
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: At the three children. I'm not doing that. I want
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: to see them. I want to see the three children.
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: As we look at them, Dr.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: Kendall Crowns, it took time, plenty of time for them
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: to be strangled, asphyxiated, dead. because of the nature of
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: the elastic exercise bands. She, Lindsay Clancy, had to pull
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: and pull and pull and tighten and tighten and tighten
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: to kill her children. They don't want us to look
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: at this. What happened to these three children, Dr. Kendall Crowns?
• 36:08
  Speaker 13: Again, as she's placing the elastic exercise band around her neck,
• 36:12
  Speaker 13: she's going to have to put pressure into the back
• 36:14
  Speaker 13: to pull the band backwards and then tie it and
• 36:17
  Speaker 13: knot it, which is not an easy thing to do
• 36:19
  Speaker 13: with the elastic bands, and have enough constriction on there
• 36:23
  Speaker 13: to block off the jugular at minimum and the carotid,
• 36:27
  Speaker 13: causing no blood flow or minimal blood flow to get
• 36:31
  Speaker 13: to the brain, resulting in the brain dying slowly of
• 36:34
  Speaker 13: anoxia or lack of oxygen. And they'll probably be conscious
• 36:38
  Speaker 13: with the band wrapped tightly around their neck, trying to
• 36:40
  Speaker 13: pull it off for a few seconds, maybe 10 to
• 36:43
  Speaker 13: 15 seconds, 20 seconds at most before they pass out.
• 36:48
  Speaker 13: And then they're laying there slowly dying for another three
• 36:53
  Speaker 13: to four minutes before they're completely brain dead. It's not
• 36:56
  Speaker 13: a quick death. They won't be conscious the whole time,
• 36:59
  Speaker 13: but they do have several minutes that they're basically dying there.
• 37:04
  Speaker 13: And then you have to add into the process of
• 37:06
  Speaker 13: their mom pushing them to the ground and wrapping these
• 37:10
  Speaker 13: bands around their neck. So you have that part of
• 37:13
  Speaker 13: it as well.
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: We wait as justice unfolds. And we remember an American hero,
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: Deputy Sheriff Greg McGowan, Blount County Sheriff's Tennessee, shot and
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: killed in the line of duty, leaving behind a grieving fiance, Leah,
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: and children, Kelly and Caden. American hero.
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: Deputy Sheriff Greg McGowan. Thank you to our guests, but
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: especially to you for being with us tonight. Nancy Grace,
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: signing off for tonight. But I'll see you tomorrow night.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: And until then, good night, friend.