Latest / Skin Anarchy / Exploring Epigenetics W/Hannah Went, Founder of Everything Epigenetics

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Exploring Epigenetics W/Hannah Went, Founder of Everything Epigenetics · Skin Anarchy

• 0:01
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• 0:57
  SPEAKER_03: Hey guys, welcome back.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_03: I just wanted to mention before the episode starts that we are really, really working hard on getting top picks out.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_03: It will come out um right before your shopping starts, the holidays for most of you.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm really excited because we have finalized our science of skin winners for this year, and um a lot of them actually are, you know, they're really working on things that are in conjunction with epigenetics.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_03: So just to preface this episode, I wanted to mention that, and also I wanted to mention that I actually wrote a medical journal paper on epigenetics and epigenetic modifications, which I would love for you guys to read if you have the time.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_03: It's a really great paper.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: It's a review-style paper, so it's not too hard to dive into.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but uh if you want to check that out, you can go to my LinkedIn profile.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_03: It's listed under my LinkedIn profile, and you can definitely check it out.
• 1:50
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• 2:47
  SPEAKER_03: Hi guys, welcome back to your favorite podcast.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: I hope, fingers crossed, skincare anarchy.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome to the show.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_03: My name is Ekta.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_03: I have a wonderful founder with us today.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_03: She is a leader in the field of you know what I consider to be the next frontier for aesthetics and for um anything skin health related, um, as well as, you know, just health related because this impacts the whole body.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_03: But, you know, I'm really, really excited to introduce her to you and also talk about the the topic here, which is epigenetics.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: So without further ado, uh please welcome Hannah Wendt, founder of Everything Epigenetics.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome to the show, Hannah.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thanks, Ecta.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Super excited to be here today and appreciate the introduction.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: Lots to to chat about.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: So uh excited to dive in.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_03: And likewise, I am very, very excited.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_03: I want to get started, Hannah, with learning about you and your journey and your history and just your you know, your career path, because I think that's very important for us to kind of start off with, if that's okay with you, if you could walk us on memory lane.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Of of course, yeah.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, unfortunately, pretty traditional upbringing, nothing, you know, that's gonna surprise anyone is is why I say unfortunately.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um always remember loving science as a little girl, right?
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: I I've had that passion, actually wanted to go into some veterinary work, um, you know, had my my undergrad degree actually begin as animal science, then said, wait a second, let me just change just to general biology, keep my doors open, um, see, see what else I can, you know, get into and and dip my toes in.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, became really interested actually in uh genetic counseling.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I know that's still a really early career.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's a lot of development in that field itself, but yeah, I thought I I wanted to go down that path, go to genetic counseling school, you know, get get a master's and and you know, work in a traditional hospital setting.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that route kind of took took a turn.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and instead, I just graduated with that general biology degree.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, um ended up loving a position I took once I graduated and and kind of stuck it out.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that was actually at an inner um a um, what what should I call it here?
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: More of a very unique compounding pharmacy.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: So they worked in the preventative medicine space, that anti-aging space, interventional, you know, treatment plans and protocols, uh, really focusing on treating people who are healthy.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: So that was where I had kind of my aha moment.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, oh my gosh, this field exists.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, right.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: We we treat healthy people and and actually take this preventative approach.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: So we were, you know, the the fourth fastest growing company in healthcare in the nation, um, really grew that company super, super quick.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I took another position, um, creating a nonprofit called the International Peptide Society, really specializing in peptide education for a lot of the healthcare providers we work with at the pharmacy.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_03: I love that name.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's cool as hell.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, this is where I get into the epigenetic part, though.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, those peptides became a lot more regulated by the FDA.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that became a lot less fun for us.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um sold that company and started true diagnostics.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: So we always had actually this epigenetic methylation testing in the back of our head as a way to quantify the effectiveness of these peptide products that we are using because it's really quick, you know, real-time feedback data that I'm sure we'll get into later on.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: But instead of waiting for a 50-year longitudinal trial to, you know, show if something maybe works or maybe doesn't work, the epigenetic methylation testing allows for this quicker feedback um for clinical trials.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: So we always had this idea in the back of our mind, and it really, you know, came to fruition um around uh 2020 in July was when we ran our first sample.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: So we built the lab from the ground up here in Lexington, Kentucky.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so you know, have have stayed here since since school.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: And um as of actually maybe six months now, which is kind of crazy to say, I also created um a little little passion side project, if you will, called Everything Epigenetics, where I, you know, have my own podcast and and and website really trying to educate people on epigenetics and interviewing and speaking with a lot of the um postdocs or you know PhD researchers doing uh epigenetic methylation research and how it can be used in, you know, almost every facet of medicine.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_04: Sorry, I was muted.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't I I didn't mean to like pause there for a minute, but um uh yeah, no, I think that's really fascinating.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, what's interesting is that I find this feel to be just you know, it's it's as if, and I'm gonna use this analogy, and I know you're gonna get it, and I hope the listeners get it as well.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um, is that I feel like epigenetics for the longest time was put into the same box as palliative medicine was.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_03: You remember when palliative medicine first came out, and it was like people thought it was like the the thing, like we researchers, we knew that palliative medicine was a lot more than just like, for example, providing like hospice level care to people, you know what I mean?
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like providing like that.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_03: I felt like when palliative medicine came out, no one understood it.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_03: And so what they did with it was dumb it down and they made it into what something it's not.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: And so when I look at epigenetics now, I see that we are going towards that as an industry, as a beauty industry, especially.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_03: And it really bothers me because of exactly what you said, which is listen, you know, this is something that you like, you're obviously involved, right?
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_03: You're you said you talk to the researchers, you talk to the postdocs, and I love that because I think that the missing link in these kind of like budding fields, and especially like, you know, cutting edge fields, is the fact that you're not talking to the right people.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, what's funny, Hannah, it's it's really, really interesting to me because I speak to doctors every day.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_03: I am a doctor, I am a physician, but I'm also a researcher.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_03: And I always tell them, I say, you know what, if you're a dermatologist, if you're a surgeon and you have not done your homework and you have not done bench research, you have no right to speak on these topics.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_03: And the reason I say that is because if you don't understand the molecular like biology, the actual nitty-gritty cell biology stuff, then you should not even be like talking about this.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_03: And I see that a lot in this industry, which is why I'm bringing it up, is that people are talking about epigenetics like it's a buzzword.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: But in reality, it is not a buzzword.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_03: It is a very complicated, you know, field of science, as you know very well.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it's it's something that we need to really understand as a as not only in industry and industries, but as consumers, is that, you know, this is real stuff, guys, you know, and it's also a different level of genetics.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's another thing, you know, and I would love for you to speak more on that because I think this idea of like what epi genetics, like the actual word, what it means, it needs to be clarified by a professional because there's a lot of misinformation.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I'd love for you to take us down that road if you could, and just give us like a really nice overview, you know, of how you see it to as a field, how you see it overall in terms of the principles.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, I would love for you to do that.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, definitely.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: No, I think that's a great starting point.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and totally agree with you on what you just said.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: You're you're preaching to the choir here, right?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Epigenetics is this huge, huge trend.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's this big, you know, fad going on right now.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone, um, and and here's here's kind of what bothers me the most about it, too, is they quantify biological age testing.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, or the they say it's equivalent, I should say, with epigenetics.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: And we would be doing epigenetics a huge, a massive disservice if we said it could only measure your biological age outcomes.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: So um leading then into the definition of epigenetics, epi is just a Greek prefix.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: It actually means above, where we're looking above the genome.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, your your typical genetics is going to be your genome, your sequence, your A's, T's, your C's, and your Gs, epi meaning above is that we're looking at DNA modifications on top of that stagnant genomic layer.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, there's things like DNA methylation, there's histone modification.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I believe the list actually keeps expanding.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: I think they're up to maybe six or seven now different epigenetic modifications.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but usually the one that people are going to be studying and what a lot of research are transitioning to is going to be DNA methylation.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: So what DNA methylation is, is you know, we're not talking again about MTHFR gene or COMP T gene.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: We're just talking about a single addition of a molecule of a methyl group of a CH3 being attached to a CPG that's going to stand for a cytosine guany nucleotide combination and phosphate bond holding them together.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: So if you have that methyl group present, that means that the gene is being less expressed.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: So it's turned off.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um and you know, vice vice versa, if that methyl group is not present, the gene is being more expressed or turned on.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's acetylation, right?
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the opposite.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: Just the the the opposite there.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um so so yeah, and and you know, it's very site specific, um, meaning methylation is not good or bad.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on the outcome you're looking for or looking at.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: So an easy example I like to give people when when introducing this topic as well is, you know, you want your cancer genes or your oncogenes to be methylated and turned off, but you want your uh tumor suppressor genes, of course, to be turned on.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, there's there's different things we've been learning about through the research called these epigenetic adaptogens or epigenetic modulators that um can actually maybe help turn things off or or on again, depending on the situation.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_03: No, I think that's a really, really great uh way to start us off.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_03: And thank you for that because I agree with you 100%.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_03: You know, for everyone listening, you know, just to add to everything Hannah is saying and also like just, you know, add my two cents is that I've also been doing my own research since I was very, very young in epigenetics.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that it's really important.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_03: I love what you said, Hannah, about the histone stuff because I recently published a review article, uh, very extensive review article, actually, about histone um, you know, directed epigenetics and epigenetic modifications.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: And I find that the literature is still lagging.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_03: It's that's what I'm seeing.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's still lagging behind.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: There's not enough information.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_03: There's not enough information beyond methylation.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: And that, you know, methylation is something that can occur very easily, right?
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, methyl groups are some of the easiest groups when it comes to, you know, if you're talking organic chemistry, if you're talking chemistry in general, they're the easiest groups to add on and take off because they're not very, they're very unstable.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, when it comes to the actual nitty-gritty of understanding epigenetics, I think it's important to educate the audience about how, you know, what are the things that will lead to the methylation of your DNA?
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_03: You know, what are those things?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: Whether that is that UV damage, is that uh, you know, topical products you might apply, is that environmental factors?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I mean, in your opinion, what are those things?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_03: What are some of the big hallmark, you know what I mean?
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_03: Like uh, I guess you could call it, you know, whatever you want, causes, reasons, you know, whatever you could uh offer us in terms of that.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for for sure.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, so many things, right?
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I'll I'll slip in a little fun fact before I get started here, but even looking at your, you know, DNA methylation data, your your raw, they they call it an IDAP file.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and right now you you can measure commercially uh about a million different methylation positions and markers.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that being said, if we had a raw data file, we can even tell you down to the zip code where you're located because the methylation is so specific to the person.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that kind of leads me to my my first point of, you know, something that can actually affect the DNA methylation is going to be your uh exposure levels, right?
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: We know that different toxic loads and chemicals and and you know being being exposed to different types of environments can be responsible for, you know, adding or taking away methylation, thus turning certain genes on, turning certain genes off to a different extent.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so you know, even in environmental toxins exposures, we we can't necessarily pick up where we live, um, but there are things we can do to help reduce that load.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, things like switching uh uh out all of our plastic containers for glass in in the house, drinking out of glass bottles and getting rid of, again, the plastic bottles, getting a water filter for your water filter, getting uh, you know, different air purifiers and and um air filters as well, um, looking at labels, right?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Doing kind of a uh re-up of using clean ingredients.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: And Echo, you probably know this better than I do because of all of your work in the space that you're in.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: But I did hear from someone um who I think was a trustworthy source.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it was it was Kayla Barnes, um, who's a big biohacker in the space.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: But she said, I think um that women in particular put about 175 different chemicals on their body or their skin every single day, including their hair.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um but I was just like, whoa.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, okay, yeah, maybe, you know, subconsciously I knew it was happening, but I was like, wow, you know, with makeup, um lotions, et cetera.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, maybe not opting in for like more of like a bath and body works lotion, but opting in for just coconut butter, right?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Or coconut oil or I don't know, something that has, you know, one ingredient.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so being more cognizant of again, kind of the the environment we're putting ourselves in.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that leads to to other things too, such as, you know, stress, diet, hormones, different drugs.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, sleep has a really big effect, you know, your your movement of the body working out.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, funny enough, um, overexercising in particular, the the athletes that we test in the Olympians um that we test, they have uh, you know, really, really increased longevity-based aging biomarkers because they're putting way too much stress on their body and their methylation processes.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: So um, you know, they're they're having way too much oxidative stress.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's a kind of kind of a an insight.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: People are either like, oh yeah, that makes sense, or they're, you know, super surprised by it.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_03: No, I think you made some really excellent points.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_03: And wow, that's I did not know that.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_03: That's a really interesting fact that you shared with me, with the which is the amount of chemicals that women are, you know, on average putting on our on our skin.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I I think it's so relevant to really, you know, sit back and think because you know, we have had such it interesting movements, right?
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_03: Especially in the in the industries of beauty, wellness, you know, skincare, uh, all of that, right?
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_03: Uh together.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_03: We've had this beautiful, beautiful yet complicated movement of what is clean beauty?
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_03: What is does it mean?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: What does it mean to be minimalistic?
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_03: You know, what a what does all of that encompass?
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, we have so many differing opinions on this, but really, you know, I always uh, you know, like you, Hannah, I look to science, right?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_03: We look to science for answers, and the science says, whatever the least amount of crap you can put on your face, that's the answer.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: You know, like that's really what it comes down to.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: And I, you know, I hate to say it like that, but it's true.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I know women who still are doing like 15-step routines, and I'm sitting here wondering like, do you know what happens when you put that much chemical on your any part of your body?
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's directly into your bloodstream, dude.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_03: I don't care what anybody says.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: Capillaries are called fenestrated capillaries for a reason.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_03: They're when you call something fenestrated, it means it's got holes in it.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_03: So what happens is things leak in and things leak out.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_03: So when you're putting that much stuff on there, it's going directly into your bloodstream, and that's going directly into your systemic circulation, which is gonna immediately impact your DNA.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: It's immediately gonna impact, you know, what's inside of your nuclei of the cells, you know, it's going to have an impact.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_03: And one of the scariest parts, Hannah, for me, and I don't know if you agree or not, but is this idea of using nanoparticles and things like sunscreen and you know, all of these chemicals are now becoming more and more complex because we're moving to the nano-level and the nanoscale.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: And that is really scary because even something like gold, which is a great chelator, by the way, you know, for so many different things, that is going to end up having a real severe impact down the road.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I know that skincare companies and beauty companies love using these brand new technologies, but it really the question and and it it begs to, you know, it begs you to question whether we should be doing that.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean, at the end of the day, because epigenetics is a very multifaceted field.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_03: It can't be answered in one, you know what I mean, in an hour or whatever.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: It has to be thought about in such a multifaceted way that I feel like we're almost doing injustice to the knowledge that we already have.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_03: So I would love to get your opinion about that in terms of the beauty industry and you know, all of these emerging technologies.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_03: I know like I had mentioned uh nanoparticles, but you know, there's stuff like exosomes, there's stuff like all this different stuff, you know what I mean?
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_03: Like delivery systems.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, oh gosh, there's yeah, so much to talk about there.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and and oh, more that I want to, you know, do some searching about and researching now.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I'm kind of, you know, the the best thing you can do is of course, you know, ask the the right questions.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I I even need to dive in a little bit deeper here um in in my own studies.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, you know, and I'll I'll be the first person to tell you.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm obviously obsessed with epigenetics.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, my my company's called everything epigenetics, um, but I will be the first to tell you that epigenetics is also not the answer to everything, right?
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: We need to look on this at a multi-omic base level and perspective.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, you have your genome, your metabolome, your transcriptome, your proteome.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so so again, using those together and um taking a multifaceted approach when looking deeper into health, I think is is what we need to do.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but again, like like we've been chatting about here, epigenetics does look to be kind of the first place to start and and dive deep into.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, I mean, from from kind of a skin and aging perspective, there are so many things being created.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there are actually epigenetic skin aging clocks.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you can look, you can take a little sample of um uh, you know, your your dermis layer of the skin, you can get a little bit deeper for better insights as well, with like a little piece of sticky tape.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: And we can look at that DNA and we can even give you um, you know, information on your ability to get wrinkles or your, you know, how much collagen you may need, or what makeup brands look and what skin care actually works best for your skin type according to your epigenetic markers from your DNA.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of work going into the field from a lot of different beauty brands and things of the sort.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: We, you know, true diagnostic or our epigenetic methylation testing company, we're you know, always trying to collaborate and currently working with people right now to actually commercialize a skin aging algorithm based on DNA methylation.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so so that's that's one piece.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: The the second piece is um we do have uh uh exclusive licensure to an algorithm called Deningden Pace.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's uh from Deningden, New Zealand, uh is is why it's called that weird name.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: But it basically tells you how quickly you're aging biologically for every one chronological year.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh super interesting.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: By far the golden standard if you're ever measuring any type of if if you're wanting to know anything about your longevity, this is by far the algorithm that you want to use to measure, you know, the effectiveness of interventions before and after.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'll I'll send you this as a follow-up, uh, Ecta, so you can see it.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: But there's an image that shows people who have a slow pace of aging, an average pace of aging, and a very fast pace of aging.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: And they're all the same age in this picture.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: They're 45 years old chronologically, but the people who have a faster pace of aging look like they are 30 years older chronologically.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, it is insane.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: So, and you know, that's the idea of phenotypic variation where we're aging in all of these different ways and we're actually able to put the proof behind the pudding now.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: So um, even our aesthetic-based clinics that we work with, um, we encourage them to do this type of longevity-based epigenetic biomarker testing because again, you can do all the filler, the um, I don't know, Botox, whatever, um, to look younger.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: But if you actually treat the epigenome from the inside out from an aging and longevity perspective, you can appear to look younger as well.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_03: Wow, that's really fascinating.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, what that makes me think of, Hannah, is people I've known personally, like whether that's family members, whether the friends of family members that have lived to be like, you know, beyond their centennial years.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_03: They've lived to be so like had healthy lives.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_03: You know, my grandfather, my maternal grandfather, for example, you know, he was um uh very, very old, you know, he was uh past 100 years old.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_03: I believe he died at the age of 109.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: And it was not because of natural causes, it was because he hit his head on something.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_03: And it was like it makes yeah, and it makes me wonder, like, and this man, let me tell you, that he grew up in rural India, bro.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: Like he grew up in like on agriculture land, you know what I'm saying?
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_03: Like he was in the sun all day, every day, no UV production, you know, protection, no SPF, none of that.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_03: And this guy lived to be say with my maternal grandmother, she was the same way, and it just makes me think, and it they're not the only ones.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, you know, you see people like this all the time that have like, you know, agricultural backgrounds, or like, you know, some sort of a background that you would think, like, you know, oh my god, there must be so much damage on your skin, or there must be so much damage on your body because you have such harsh lifestyles.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_03: But in reality, what we're starting to see is that there's a huge gap here in the science where we're not accounting for, you know, what we would normally call statistically as outliers, but in reality, they're not outliers.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_03: They're people from different parts of the world that are not experiencing the epigenetic shifts in their aging as we are in urban urban populations.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_03: So that really makes me think, you know, in terms of where is it that the value of epigenetic um, you know, kits and you know, aging uh devices or analyses, where does that really fit in?
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: Because at the end of the day, you know, you can you can figure out what your epigenetic age is, right?
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: But then I'm gonna ask you, how do you reverse that?
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_03: Because at the end of the day, you still haven't studied, yeah.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_03: I don't mean you, I mean like you know, the science community.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um still haven't studied, we haven't studied these individuals who are living in various countries all over the world who are living to be very old, they are living to be very healthy and old, you know, and they are living on, for example, their food choices, you know what I mean?
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like what they're putting in their body, what they're you know, consuming, what kind of products they use on a daily basis.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_03: They they're most of the time they're not even using shampoos and conditioners because that there's no availability, you know what I mean?
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_03: There's no accessibility to that stuff.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: So it again goes back to your point of we're putting, if women are putting 170 plus chemicals on our body, well, no wonder we're aging faster, you know, no wonder because we're we're literally modifying unnecessarily what doesn't need to be modified.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_03: And so, yeah, it's it's a really interesting feel to me.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I would love to learn, you know, um, what is it?
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, have you guys seen any data like in particular about certain chemicals or maybe certain things that are really um contributing to this like methylation process?
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_03: Or have we not gotten there yet?
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, in terms of what contributing, can you say that one more time?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like like what exact chemicals are like maybe uh contributing more, or what kind of chemicals might be contributing more to this epigenetic, you know, um like fastening of aging, you know, like just in if you know.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't know if that data is even it exists or not.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just you know curious.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it definitely exists, yeah.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, oh I had such an interesting conversation um on my podcast.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's not published yet, but uh his name is Dr.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Michael Skinner.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: He is out of Washington uh State University or Washington University, I believe.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um he basically found and coined this term, it's called epigenetic transgenerational inheritance.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_00: So it is a mouthful, but basically what that means it refers to the transmission of epigenetic marks.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: So changes in your gene expression, remember that do not involve alterations in your DNA sequence from one generation to the next.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: So this phenomenon can occur through the germline, your sperm or egg, and affect the development and health of future generations.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: So that is exactly uh the work that he does, basically meaning, you know, what can we learn from past generations and in passing these um kind of signatures down, right?
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because we know if our if our great great grandmother smoked cigarettes, it's actually going to affect our epigenome.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um and yeah, it's it's crazy.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, from I mean, we can get into this, but from a policy standpoint, you know, government policies actually don't regulate generational effects.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so this is, you know, not really uh regulated kind of at all.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: But some environmental toxins um that Dr.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: Michael Skinner has studied, just to name a few, are things like agricultural uh fungicide.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, there's I'm gonna butcher the these names, but um, ones like uh vinclozolin, uh methyloxychlore, uh DDT was a huge one.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, plastic compounds like BPA, and phthalates, uh, lead, arsenic, jet fuel, glyphosate, um, you know, ethanol even.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and these things are are being put on our foods and you know, being you know, dropped into the atmosphere.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: So, so funny story about the DDT, real quick.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, when when we had the malaria outbreak, they treated people who had malaria with DDT.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: Comes and that that was about 50 years ago.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: No, I know my mom's my mom was treated with DDT and her eyes, her eyes literally shrunk because of it.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's really it's scary.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: And sure it helped them, you know, it helped with the malaria, but they didn't realize how toxic it was.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Turns out, people who were pregnant during that time and um, you know, had that DDT and then they were affected, you know, this is why, and one of the reasons researchers are looking that, you know, that especially in the States, we may have an obesity epidemic now.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because DDT can actually um increase the risk for people to become obese by turning on and off certain genes.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: So it's again one of those, you know, connections that's not just a coincidence.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: There's actual science and backing behind it.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, check out Dr.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: Michael Skinner's work uh to anyone listening if if you're interested.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, it is just fascinating.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, he's he's uh a founding director of the Center for Uh Reproductive Biology at Washington State University.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_03: I love that.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, actually, I I know of his work uh very well.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_03: I just think that it's uh it's important for us to really, yeah, like you said, you know, for everyone listening, you guys need to also know of his work.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like you need you need to look into this stuff because it's very, very real and it's true, it's true.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_03: Everything you said is true, you know, and I it's it's something about, you know, just you have to educate yourself.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_03: And if you're not able to do that, and if you're not, if you don't know where to go, like you have to start looking into the science.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_03: Dig deep.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_03: Find the people who are pioneering things, find the people who are, you know, really at the forefront of this game, like he is, you know, and like you are.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_03: Like you guys are really actually trying to educate the public.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I can't, you know, commend you enough for that because, you know, normally I would talk to somebody about epigenetics and they'd look at me with the most retarded look on their face, like they don't know what I'm talking about.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_03: But it's like, you know, we live in a world now where if you don't understand what these words mean, and if you don't even understand like the basics of them, you're not gonna understand your own aging process, and you're gonna keep on buying products and chemicals and sunscreens and whatever it is, and you're gonna end up, you know, looking terrible by the time you're 50 years old, you know, and at 50, you should be still looking like you're 30 years old.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_03: I don't care what race you are.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_03: People always say, you know, things like you know, they use phrases like, oh, black and brown people don't age, they don't get wrinkles, you know what I mean?
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_04: Blah, blah, blah.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_03: I don't agree with that.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_03: I think it has to do with the way that you live, and I think it has a lot to do with your environment, you know, and I yeah, no, I am not an expert, you know, like doc, like the professor you mentioned, and I I'm definitely not trying to be.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_03: I just I'm trying to convey to our listeners that you have to understand that your biology and your physiology is a very complicated thing.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_03: And so for you to not do due diligence by it, like if you if you assume that just putting topical products on your face is going to make you look 30 years younger, you're absolutely wrong.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, that's that's like not even close to like true.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_03: And you know what's interesting, Hannah?
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_03: I had recently interviewed the founder or the CEO of Novos.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_03: I saw that.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_03: I loved that interview with him.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_03: I loved it because it was like, you know, we finally were talking about a topic like you and I are, where it's like, you know, you guys, everything co go, you know, everything becomes from the inside out.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_03: Your body works from the inside out, it doesn't go from the outside in, you know, and it does in terms of like damage, but in terms of healing, it's inside out.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_03: And so what we talked about in that interview um is very, very um similar to what you and I are discussing here.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_03: I think we're taking it a little step further, where the idea was there are certain things that can help reverse the signs of epigenetic aging.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_03: And those molecules work on the level of mitochondria, they work on the level of things that are so hard to get to normally.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_03: So for you, you know, as a cons as consumers, as businesses, as entrepreneur, entrepreneurs or big conglomerate companies, for you to be pushing things, you know, out there to the world that are just redundant, you know, and they're just things that are not going to have any kind of real impact on aging or aging well, I should say.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, it's really a disservice, you know, it's a disservice.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that, you know, the education behind all of this and the knowledge behind it, it needs to be funded.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_03: That's really where I'm going with all this ranting, is that we need to create a fund.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: And I've been screaming from the rooftops, Hannah, since I started skincare anarchy, kid you not.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_03: I have been talking to VCs about this.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_03: I have been trying to get the word out.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_03: We need to create a fund that the NIH isn't the only resource for money.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I mean?
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_03: In the sense of like fund the people who are doing the work, fund the people who are actually trying to understand epigenetics.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_03: Because right now, the the sad truth of it is, and I know because I stood on NIH committees, they're not funding this research.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_03: NIH doesn't care right now about this, they care about cancer.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_03: So the people who are getting the money are oncology people.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: They're the ones who are getting the money.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_03: It's not the epigenetics and the geneticists, they're not getting it.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_03: And the the problem with that is even cancer is linked to epigenetics.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: So we you see how that snowballs after time?
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like, we're not getting funding, we're not getting the you know, knowledge we need.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_03: And then we're now dealing with it's like the preventative side is not even being addressed.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_03: So then we're dealing with management, you know what I mean, from the clinical perspective.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_03: So I really, I mean, for me as a consumer, even I really urge everybody like you need to do your homework around this and invest in products that are actually healing you from the inside out.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_03: Um, now, next thing, Hannah, I want to ask you.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, I know I went on a rant there for a minute, but like I want to ask you that uh about, you know, just some some advice.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_03: I want you to give us advice because I know that there's a lot of information, but in a digestible way, if you could tell us and our listeners, you know, what are some good practices that you've seen through your work, through the company, you know, everything you guys do that um normal consumers can adapt into their lifestyle to, you know, reduce their epigenetic load?
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: Great question.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and and funny because I was gonna kind of lead into this just because of everything we've been talking about.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: But the um I probably I'm gonna, I'm just gonna make the statement.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've definitively done probably more report reviews on people's epigenetic aging, biological aging, um, than anyone else in the world.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, probably more than anyone else would like to.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, usually working with healthcare providers, of course, on interpreting these results and helping them kind of unravel the pieces of of the puzzle for their patients.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I say all the time, the people who live in Ohio, and I can say this because I'm from Ohio, um, or like, you know, Indiana, and they live on a farm and they live that quote unquote simple life where they're getting, you know, probably 10, 20,000 steps every single day.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: They're eating their own foods, they're growing their own foods, they're very, very low stressed.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they're, you know, again, moving their body, they have the best bylaw changes.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's really no secret to it.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, that's why, you know, when you're talking about more of the farm life and everything, it kind of brought my thought back to the statement that I'm making right here.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but really the lifestyle factors go a long way.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm under the impression that, you know, if you're not getting the lifestyle factors right, one, you're probably wasting your time.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and you're probably spending way too much money on supplements, medications, and procedural-based interventions, putting, you know, acting as a bandage to really um not address that root cause or or why you may not be seeing the results that you want to see.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so, so yeah, again, from lifestyle perspective, I mean, things like, you know, insulin sensitivity, um, keeping a healthy weight, lower alcohol consumption, you know, no alcohol consumption whatsoever, really, um, if you can help it, um, you know, no smoking, uh, again, diet, things like caloric restriction, Mediterranean-based diets we see working really well.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, you know, quality, quantity sleep, you know, less stress.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, the list can go on and on, you know, um, decreasing that that toxic load as well.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: So though those are kind of some some examples of what people can do.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_00: Again, you know, uh modifying your lifestyle and everything in moderation, right?
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you have to know what you're willing to give up.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: If, you know, maybe again, you you know, you you know yourself better than anyone else, is what I'm trying to say.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: Know what you're willing to give up.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, make it your lifestyle, make it a habitual routine, make it who you are and live for the life you you want, right?
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_00: Where we are in control.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_00: That's so powerful is people don't realize, you know, if if they're not happy, if if they're not seeing results they want, we can make a change.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and it may be harder, but you know, we can we can work towards that and work towards those different goals.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_03: By the way, I'm from Ohio as well.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_03: I grew up Are you really?
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm uh I'm a bear cat through and through, man.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: Wait, I think I may have noticed that when I was like, yeah, looking at, I don't know, website, whatever.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm from north of Dayton, Ohio, a really small town called Pikwa.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, wow, that's so you're yeah, you're very close.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_03: Uh my family is actually in Westchester, and I I grew up in Ohio as well.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_03: And I know what you mean because when I left Ohio and I went, you know, you know what I mean?
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_03: Like you go into the big cities and you go international and whatever, and you start to notice your body changes, right?
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_03: Like you start to notice things change, you know, your environment changes, obviously, but you also start feeling different.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_03: And you know what's crazy?
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_03: As soon as I went to New York City to start my work life, like my I was doing my residency at the time, and I went to New York City, and I remember thinking, my whole body feels terrible.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_03: I feel terrible, you know.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_03: I feel different, I don't like it.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's not that, you know, New York there's anything wrong with New York City, love the city, love it, you know, and I am all about it, but there is a definite change that occurs because you're going from a place like, for example, Ohio, where you're really not getting exposed to these like ridiculous levels of environmental stressors.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, let's be honest.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_03: We have mostly farmland around here, you know, croplands and you know, crop fields and whatever.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh and it's not it's not nearly as it is in like London, New York City, Chicago, LA, you know, you're you're not getting that.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_03: I even lived in Miami for some time.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_03: Same situation, you know, and I remember every time I would come home, which would be, you know, back in Ohio, I would feel different.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_03: Like air felt cleaner, you know, the air felt like I could breathe again, like I could actually be normal.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_03: And those feelings, even though they were like visceral, you know, just sensations I had in in certain moments, they had nothing to do with my genetic, you know, uh fingerprints, you know, at all.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_03: But at the end of the day, I could still feel it, is my point.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_03: And so I really love what you said, which is, you know, and no hate to any big cities, but you really have to think about what are the people in the smaller states and the more agricultural-based states, like, you know, what are they feeling and and and what are they looking like, you know, in terms of their genetics compared to, you know, someone who grew up in Manhattan, someone who grew up in Brooklyn, someone who grew up in Chicago, you know, like these are really, really important uh pieces of data that we need to collect.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_03: And then after we have that data, start utilizing it, you know, start creating products that are made for people like that.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_03: I would love to see someone come out with a skincare line that is specifically made for people who live in very urban, you know, based population centers, cities, whatever you want to call it.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, you know, I would love to see skincare lines based on that, supplement lines based on that, you know what I mean?
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like just more uh like for, you know, like just customization is my point, right?
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_03: Because at the end of the day, that's the goal is preventative medicine.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: And we could do that if we just start really honing in and utilizing this data.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I I definitely resonate with everything that you said, and I think that's such a good point.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, I think my next question is really um about the data, you know, in terms of like, you know, I know that we have a lot of, you know, people in the US that are very open to, you know, contributing to clinical trials, contributing to studies, but what has it been like, you know, from your experience, really surveying the world when it comes to this topic?
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_03: You know, has have you seen a lot of work being done, you know, on a global level when it comes to surveying for epigenetic modifications?
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_00: In in terms of, I guess, research or commercially?
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_04: Sorry, I don't know why I keep getting muted.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_03: No, you're okay.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, you did you mean more?
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_03: I meant I mean uh research and like research, and I guess you could uh yeah, translate into commercially.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, sure.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, that's a really good question.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, I do, I I really see it becoming the like gateway into learning more.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, a couple examples of of that, you know.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we just actually had our um friends uh from Cornell visit last week, uh Michael Corley and Lish.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we actually published uh True Diagnostic published our first paper with them looking at DNA methylation and COVID-19 longitudinal analysis and frontiers.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_00: Super awesome paper.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I can send it and you know, people can check it out if they want to read it.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but when they came to visit, and something that resonated with me is they they said, and and they're really infectious disease specialists over there at Cornell.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_00: The one thing they said that resonated with me was, you know, everyone we know, and they're they're very, you know, popular in the space, Wicked Smart is transitioning from looking at the transcriptome in terms of infectious diseases to the epigenome.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_00: The epigenome is where the answers lie.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: They once thought it was the transcriptome.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_00: And again, like I said, we need a multi-omic approach, still need to look there, but they really think a lot of the answers are going to be in the epigenome.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: So that was just so, you know, rewarding um, you know, to hear that, you know, we're focusing on the right area, we're diving into the correct things to um discover more about um, you know, how these markers work and how how they're being affected.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_00: So that's one good example.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, true diagnostic in particular, we have about 30 clinical trials going on at any given time.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: Those are going to be more interventional based, looking at things like hyperbaric oxygen chamber therapy, looking at things like uh hormone replacement therapy, bariatric surgery, a lot of different supplements, um, different diets.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: We just did a study, you know, with Stanford, for example, on um looking at twins and uh omnivore omnivores.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: Versus carnivore-based diet, which is some really cool, cool results that should be coming out soon.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I mean, I see I see this just growing very fast.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we've been working on a multi-omic-based clock with Harvard since we opened in 2020 that will finally get published, hopefully, this year after we've gone through a lot of data analysis, you know, looking at uh a multi-omic approach using, again, the genome, epigenome, metabolome, uh, untargeted proteomic analysis, a little bit of the transcriptone and the phenome, so your phenotypic outcomes.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but we are able to predict any of those things I just said just by looking at your DNA methylation profile.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: So my point is epigenetic methylation testing is expected to overtake your conventional biomarker testing, your hormone panel testing in the next decade or so.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's pretty definitive.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think we'll definitely see that change, but I think we're just gonna see it uptake on a different level as it relates to to anything.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be so much more cheap.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be quick.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's really gonna be that one-stop shop 360 look at your underlying biology.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_03: I love that.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_03: No, I love that so much, and I and I'm really happy to see that.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_03: And also, you know, I agree with you with the transcriptome thing.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_03: You know, we went from just, you know, DNA RNA to microRNAs to, you know, um just all this different stuff.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_03: And now we're finally coming down to okay, it's actual, you know, chemical groups that are about the problem.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, it's it's always evolving, and I'm really actually waiting for the viriome to come into play as well because I actually did my uh capsulum on virol in virology.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_03: And so it's I'm very interested in that because after COVID and all that shit that's happened, I'm I'm interested to see what happens uh for us in the long run in cohort studies when it comes to that, because the viruses that we are constantly being exposed to are having a huge impact as well on our genetics, and so I'm very curious to see how that data fits in overall because I think that's gonna make a huge impact as well, especially post-COVID.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_03: You know, so that's that's really, really interesting stuff.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_03: Um, uh, but yeah, I mean that's it sounds really cool.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I and I wish you the best.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you're doing really great work, and you know, um, I would love to have you back anytime to learn more about the, you know, the findings and the cool new data that you uncover.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think this is such a great topic, and we could never know enough, you know, about this is my really my honest opinion.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, at the end of the day, consumers have to understand there's a whole world world of science and scientists out here, you know, that are working day in and day out to help us understand our bodies.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_03: And we have to support that, you know.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_03: So everyone listening, I really support, I really encourage you to please support, you know, everything epigenetics to really support Hannah's work, to support her team's work, and obviously the people that she also collaborates with, you know, if you have any questions, if you want more clarification on any of the topics that were discussed here, please reach out, let us know, send me an email.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_03: You guys have my email address.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_03: I will definitely send everything along to Hannah and her team, and we'll we'll get you some answers no matter what, you know.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_03: So um, please reach out and also if you love this episode, leave us a rating, a written review, five stars, please, if possible.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_03: No hate.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_03: Hopefully, you don't hopefully you love my episodes, but um, I would love that.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_03: And Hannah, thank you so much.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_03: This it's it's been an honor to host.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_00: I just appreciate all the kind words again.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_00: We we need education behind epigenetics, and we need uh, like you said, consumers to understand.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I couldn't have said it better myself.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_00: And just uh thank you so much for having me.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_00: Really appreciate it.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah, no, the honor is truly mine, and thank you for coming on to the show.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_03: And for everyone else, I will be back next time.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_03: Hey guys, so I hope you love that episode.
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• 48:49
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