Latest / The Insurance Growth Lab / How Nick Golubitsky Uses AI and RevOps to Transform GTM
Transcript
- Nick [0:00:00]: I'm not gonna give you that Ai is gonna replace sales reps. Nick [0:00:03]: Right? Nick [0:00:03]: I think that's a buzz. Nick [0:00:04]: People say that to get clicks, but we always have someone review it. Nick [0:00:08]: I think it's very important that they make sure the information is accurate. Nick [0:00:12]: Ai is only as good as what you give it and it always will be. Callan [0:00:18]: Welcome to The Insurance Growth Lab. Callan [0:00:19]: Where we go deep on the growth campaigns and strategies driving real results in the insurance Street. Callan [0:00:26]: I’m Callan Harrington founder Flashgrowth and in each episode, I sit down with marketing and growth leaders from carriers and shirt tech and top brokers to break down one specific initiative, whether it's how marketed a product, scale a channel or solve a specific growth challenge. Callan [0:00:43]: It's no fluff, just tactical insights you can apply in your own company. Callan [0:00:47]: Welcome back everyone to the insurance growth I'm Callan Harrington and today, I'm joined by Nick Golubitsky. Callan [0:00:58]: Nick is the Vp of revenue operations at GreenSlate. Callan [0:01:02]: And if that name sounds familiar, I've definitely brought him up on previous shows as him and I've worked together for over eight years. Callan [0:01:09]: And within those eight years, we've worked at multiple different insured techs, including Bowl penguin, Smart harbor, safe chain, and the one consistent thing about Nick is his passion for Rev ops. Callan [0:01:21]: So I've been looking to get him on the show for a long time because he is an absolute Rev ops expert. Callan [0:01:28]: And the reason why the timing right now is so interesting is that we went deep on Ai in the go to market space. Callan [0:01:35]: More specifically, how he's actually using it. Callan [0:01:39]: I've talked about this in previous episodes, but there's so much fluff out there on how Ai is being used in go to market. Callan [0:01:45]: So I wanted to bring someone on that's actually using these tools daily. Callan [0:01:49]: We also talked about how we got here where he thinks that things are going in the coming months. Callan [0:01:56]: And if you've ever wondered at all about how people are using Ai to improve their go to market emotions, then this is the episode for you. Callan [0:02:05]: Our goal was to cut out what's real from what's fluff, what's actually able to do today versus what's coming the next few months, and we talked about all of that. Callan [0:02:15]: So with that, let's get to the show. Callan [0:02:24]: Nick, finally on the show. Nick [0:02:25]: It's exciting. Nick [0:02:26]: This is crazy. Nick [0:02:27]: This is a crazy evolution, and I don't know how I'm gonna sound. Nick [0:02:30]: Let's see He'll see what happens. Callan [0:02:33]: You know, that is the first time Callan [0:02:35]: when the guests game on and it just said as we're rolling. Callan [0:02:37]: You know, I don't know how We'll see. Callan [0:02:40]: I don't know. Callan [0:02:41]: Who knows? Nick [0:02:42]: They sound good. Nick [0:02:42]: May sound bad. Nick [0:02:42]: Who knows? Callan [0:02:44]: What, you know what? Callan [0:02:44]: Maybe this might be a five minutes episode So our audience members maybe don't know this. Callan [0:02:50]: But they could probably pick up very quickly on the report that we have. Callan [0:02:53]: You and I have worked together for, honestly, almost pushing ten years now at multiple different companies in the insurance world, Bolt Penguin, Smart Harbor before that save chain in kind of the title insurance space. Callan [0:03:06]: So many years together, an area that I wanted to start this off with just in general was, you know, you really came on first as that Salesforce administrator. Callan [0:03:16]: And that evolved into sales ops. Callan [0:03:19]: And then you kinda took on the marketing ops. Callan [0:03:22]: And then it became Rev ops, which has obviously been a huge buzz word for the past couple of years. Callan [0:03:27]: In your eyes, you seen this from the full the full game. Callan [0:03:31]: Right? Callan [0:03:32]: From the beginning the end when all this tech really started to get putting in there. Callan [0:03:35]: What do you think was the biggest shift throughout all of that? Nick [0:03:39]: I think that's a great question. Nick [0:03:40]: One of the most powerful things for me when approaching any of these businesses and helping them understand what that... Nick [0:03:47]: Shift or that moment is is when you bring it all together. Nick [0:03:51]: When it's not just sales ops. Nick [0:03:52]: When it's not just marketing ops. Nick [0:03:54]: Right? Nick [0:03:54]: Because I started, like you said, just sales ops, then I did some part odd stuff, so it became marketing ops. Nick [0:03:59]: But then when the full picture really comes together, it just unlocks so much. Nick [0:04:03]: Right? Nick [0:04:03]: There's so many different things you can do with the data that you get, and the customer journey and really just aligning it and putting it all together. Nick [0:04:10]: Mh. Nick [0:04:10]: That's the unlock. Nick [0:04:11]: Right? Nick [0:04:12]: That's the shift where some people go from... Nick [0:04:14]: Oh, I just needed someone help me with my sequences. Nick [0:04:16]: And set up some sales reporting. Nick [0:04:18]: Yeah. Nick [0:04:19]: When I'm just like, you can do way more than that. Nick [0:04:21]: They just... Nick [0:04:21]: That's when they get into it. Callan [0:04:23]: I'm actually kinda curious. Callan [0:04:24]: How did you break? Callan [0:04:25]: I think that there's a stigma on Rev ops that that's the Salesforce administrator, or that's the hubspot administrator. Nick [0:04:33]: Saw it last week. Nick [0:04:33]: I saw it on Linkedin last week that someone said I forget who wrote it They're just, like, don't get trapped in just being the help hubspot administrator because right now, that's what's happening. Nick [0:04:41]: I mean, it's people forget that strategy and architecture should be that base layer for Rev ops to understand how to build Hubspot. Nick [0:04:50]: Right? Nick [0:04:50]: I always get called an army of one. Nick [0:04:52]: Usually, at the some of these companies that I started, I didn't have a big team, you know, I had to not only influence strategy of what we're gonna do, but then execute it. Nick [0:05:01]: So that execution layer actually becomes who you are because it's the last thing you're delivering it. Nick [0:05:06]: You know, that's how I've always viewed it, and I try not to get trapped in that. Nick [0:05:09]: So iteration for me is, like, execute, iterate, strategize and be like, oh, this is why we got the results we did. Nick [0:05:16]: Right? Nick [0:05:17]: And to not get trapped as a Salesforce administrator or Hubspot admin. Nick [0:05:21]: Right? Nick [0:05:22]: I think that's how you do it. Nick [0:05:23]: You just keep iterating and you don't just deliver. Nick [0:05:25]: You give them what you believe to be the outcome of your recommendations. Callan [0:05:30]: So essentially, you have to tie an Roi to everything that you're doing? Nick [0:05:33]: Yes. Nick [0:05:33]: And that's extremely difficult. Nick [0:05:34]: I always say, like, marketing attribution is one of the hardest things to do. Nick [0:05:38]: I never even take it this up further for Rev ops. Nick [0:05:40]: Right? Nick [0:05:41]: Everything in the go to market Org is usually tied to a revenue number. Nick [0:05:45]: Right? Nick [0:05:45]: It's these people... Nick [0:05:46]: There's a c. Nick [0:05:47]: There's Lt tv. Nick [0:05:48]: There's all these different factors, but Rev ops, I'm not making calls. Nick [0:05:52]: I'm not sending emails. Nick [0:05:53]: Well, you know, we'll get into that conversation now I am with Ai. Nick [0:05:56]: But you know, it's it's really interesting. Nick [0:05:58]: We're tied to the overall growth of the business. Nick [0:06:01]: Right? Nick [0:06:01]: That's how I've always approached it that we should be bonus or commissioned or whatever to moving that needle all the way to success. Nick [0:06:08]: And that is not necessarily being like, we launched x y z enable last quarter, it led to this, but the just the overall growth. Nick [0:06:17]: The overall mentality, things that shift and how we're working, how we're reporting on data, it's not a dollar number, but overall, you should see up into the right in a scalable way. Callan [0:06:28]: You know, it's interesting because it's like, if you don't have somebody in there that's a huge champion of Rev ops. Callan [0:06:33]: Now I would argue in this coming era, pretty much everyone's gonna be a champion of Rev ops because Ai and Rev ops are gonna go hand in hand. Callan [0:06:41]: I mean, Rev ops is the one that's gonna be executing on a lot of this Ai. Callan [0:06:44]: It was always difficult for me to justify the Rev ops expense. Callan [0:06:49]: It's one of those things kinda like polarized sunglasses. Callan [0:06:51]: Right? Callan [0:06:51]: If you don't wear polarized sunglasses. Callan [0:06:53]: You put polarized sunglasses on, looks the same as any other sunglasses. Callan [0:06:56]: You wear polarized sunglasses all the time, you take them off, You put regular sunglasses on, like, whoa, that's a world of difference. Callan [0:07:02]: A lot of times, I think that is kinda rev up, especially when you bring Rev ops on early Like if it's there from the beginning, you've set the expectation, this is just how things go. Callan [0:07:10]: When that's gone, it's totally different. Callan [0:07:13]: If you found that to be the case? Nick [0:07:16]: Yeah. Nick [0:07:16]: It's, like, when you go on vacation and no one's texting you or calling you that something's broken, you actually did a good job. Nick [0:07:21]: Right? Nick [0:07:21]: So it's kind of related right to that where when it starts at the beginning, you think it's normal. Nick [0:07:28]: Yeah. Nick [0:07:28]: You think this is just how the business runs. Nick [0:07:30]: But the moment it breaks or maybe your robust person leaves for a new opportunity or something like that. Nick [0:07:35]: And suddenly, your sequence enrollment goes down. Nick [0:07:39]: Your marketing and your Drip campaigns aren't, like segmented to the right audiences like they used to be so your open rates are going down. Nick [0:07:44]: You're just like, what's going on? Nick [0:07:46]: Did something happen, and it's just like, oh, suddenly, the person that was actually keeping all of your t's crossed and I dotted. Nick [0:07:53]: Like, you just don't know what's actually going on. Nick [0:07:55]: And that's difficult. Nick [0:07:56]: That ties right back into the Roi thing. Nick [0:07:58]: It's hard to measure all these things Callan [0:08:00]: Well, it's like... Nick [0:08:01]: I don't even know if I answer that question. Nick [0:08:02]: Right? Callan [0:08:02]: No. Callan [0:08:02]: I mean I I don't think it's... Callan [0:08:04]: I don't think there is necessarily a right answer. Callan [0:08:06]: Right? Callan [0:08:06]: It's like, I'm gonna give one last example. Callan [0:08:08]: We've already done two analogy, so I figured a third would, it only be Callan [0:08:13]: to do it there Callan [0:08:14]: as well. Callan [0:08:14]: You've heard me say this many times. Callan [0:08:15]: Right? Callan [0:08:15]: To me, Rev ops, the closest example I can give on what it feels like when you have good Rev ops. Callan [0:08:21]: It's the first time you went to a luxury car, and you went eighty miles an hour, and it felt like you were going for. Callan [0:08:27]: Right? Callan [0:08:27]: You should get twice to production with the same amount of effort. Callan [0:08:31]: Like, that's the way that I kinda think about Rev ops personally. Nick [0:08:34]: Yep. Nick [0:08:34]: And it's completely correct. Nick [0:08:36]: And I think the future area of that is, it's gonna go from double to triple to Quadruple, and it's gonna be all aspects of your business. Nick [0:08:41]: It's gonna be your finance team, your data team, anything, like, not even considering go to market. Nick [0:08:48]: It's gonna be everything that is just... Nick [0:08:50]: The Rev ops role is going to make that experience of driving that car, just completely flawless. Callan [0:08:58]: Yeah. Callan [0:08:58]: We'll save that for the insurance finance lab. Callan [0:09:00]: But for today on The Insurance Growth Lab, I wanna dive into a campaign. Callan [0:09:04]: And, you know, one of the things that I've been talking about quite a bit is that There's so much in everyone's saying. Callan [0:09:13]: There's a ton of hype around Ai. Callan [0:09:14]: But the reality is in the insurance world, it hasn't just came in and up ended how people go to market. Callan [0:09:20]: But I do think that people need to be aware of it. Callan [0:09:23]: Now you've had a ton of experience in the insurance world in one of the areas I wanna dive into is a campaign that you had talk to me about, and this is an interesting campaign because it's the competitor's campaign. Callan [0:09:33]: We're not gonna identify those competitors publicly on this podcast, but I wanna talk about this a little bit because I thought this was a super interesting campaign using multiple different tools. Callan [0:09:43]: That's one thing I also get all the time that I'd love to talk about is that people are like, if you could use one Ai tool what would it be. Callan [0:09:48]: It's not really just one Ai tool. Callan [0:09:50]: It's an ama inauguration of multiple tools that handle different pieces. Callan [0:09:54]: In the future, maybe that is. Callan [0:09:56]: There probably could be one that dominates everything, but we're not there yet. Callan [0:10:00]: I don't think. Callan [0:10:00]: So let's start to dive in. Callan [0:10:02]: Walk me through, like, when did this get to you? Callan [0:10:04]: I'd love to walk through your process on how you took a campaign, and then added these pieces, like you said, like, marketing coming up with the main campaign, but you're making this campaign better. Callan [0:10:16]: Let's start there. Callan [0:10:17]: What was brought to you originally. Nick [0:10:19]: Yeah. Nick [0:10:19]: And making it the campaign better It's an interesting statement. Nick [0:10:22]: It's more of you know, just iterating and making sure that, like I said earlier, nothing is siloed to marketing. Nick [0:10:29]: Right? Nick [0:10:29]: That's where my vision comes in. Nick [0:10:30]: I understand what sales is doing all these different things and fitting it in. Nick [0:10:33]: So when I heard of, you know, our new Google Ads campaigns and all these things that we were doing, My immediate question was how do we do handoff offs? Nick [0:10:43]: How do we get the right data out of those and make sure they're qualified and make sure that the salesperson immediately responds within five minutes. Nick [0:10:51]: And all those normal questions that any Rev per ass in any org. Nick [0:10:54]: Right? Nick [0:10:55]: Even speaking without tech. Callan [0:10:56]: And real quick. Callan [0:10:56]: Just to clarify, this is an enterprise. Callan [0:10:58]: This is going geared towards enterprise level. Callan [0:11:00]: Okay yeah. Nick [0:11:01]: This is geared towards enterprise level companies and anything below that. Nick [0:11:04]: I mean, it's since it's just competitors. Nick [0:11:06]: Right, that it varies. Nick [0:11:06]: But mostly enterprise. Nick [0:11:08]: Right? Nick [0:11:08]: So with that being said, I mean, there's a lot of different aspects to it. Nick [0:11:12]: Right? Nick [0:11:12]: Every tool is siloed. Nick [0:11:14]: It's Google Ads, and then we use Help hubspot as our Crm, and what's in between that? Nick [0:11:18]: There's a clay layer for qualification or integration and any sort of outreach on the back end with any enable tools with sequences or anything like that. Nick [0:11:26]: So putting it all together is where, in my opinion the success comes from. Nick [0:11:30]: So When something comes in through our Google Ads and they call or fill out the form. Nick [0:11:35]: Right? Nick [0:11:35]: It ends up coming to right to Callan [0:11:38]: our Hubspot. Callan [0:11:38]: Okay. Callan [0:11:38]: So the forms that the Google ads are pointing to that form goes drops in immediately to ops hubspot. Nick [0:11:46]: Yep. Nick [0:11:46]: Easy with the integration there? Nick [0:11:47]: It's nice native. Nick [0:11:48]: And then after that, there's the layer of, do we need to immediately qualify this or did we ask the right questions and get all the right answers. Nick [0:11:54]: Right? Nick [0:11:54]: Because sometimes things come in, they maybe they fill everything out or whatever it is. Nick [0:11:57]: And for those people that actually answer all of our questions, They're within our budget ranges and all those different things, it goes right to developing that content that goes right out to them. Nick [0:12:08]: Right? Nick [0:12:08]: Email that asks them to schedule. Nick [0:12:09]: That email is a template Callan [0:12:12]: or you have Ai generating that email based on what was said. Nick [0:12:16]: Yeah. Nick [0:12:16]: So right now, we have a template. Nick [0:12:17]: We've been testing whether to include that Ai layer, which becomes really fascinating. Nick [0:12:23]: Right? Nick [0:12:23]: And it you have to make sure you get it right, where within Hubspot, and this thing with like, all these different tools and all this stuff. Nick [0:12:31]: It helps hubspot, we have the prospecting agents. Nick [0:12:33]: Right? Nick [0:12:33]: So we don't have to go outside of our system or procure a new system or increase cost or anything. Nick [0:12:37]: We can just go ahead and drop it into the prospecting agent if we want to. Callan [0:12:42]: So that's an interesting question. Callan [0:12:43]: Why? Callan [0:12:44]: It's like, Hubspot and Salesforce have a lot of. Callan [0:12:46]: I we use Hubspot because hubspot I feel like goes deeper on a number of these, what I'll call features of, like, a sales enable tool or conversational intelligence whatever it may be. Callan [0:12:55]: Not to say Salesforce isn't either? Callan [0:12:56]: They definitely really are But I feel like Hubspot took a... Callan [0:12:58]: I think, this is very much a bigger part of their business model. Callan [0:13:01]: Why used the native hubspot instead of whatever that category leader is that could integrate with Hubspot. Nick [0:13:09]: It's just as good. Nick [0:13:10]: Really? Nick [0:13:11]: The only thing that matters is your custom instructions. Nick [0:13:13]: Your brand. Nick [0:13:14]: If you put in what you want it to get out, you'll get it in any of these systems. Nick [0:13:20]: Right? Nick [0:13:20]: I think that some of them are really good at writing. Nick [0:13:23]: But that's not really necessary. Nick [0:13:25]: Like, I'm not writing a exquisite novel. Nick [0:13:28]: Right? Nick [0:13:29]: Like, I need an email is novel. Nick [0:13:31]: Particular. Nick [0:13:31]: I need an email that goes out that understands who just filled out my form. Nick [0:13:35]: That's all I need. Nick [0:13:35]: Right? Nick [0:13:36]: So if you drop it into the prospecting agent. Nick [0:13:38]: And a lot of people don't know this Prostate agent is a beta tool right now, but I've been using for a while, and I I think a lot of other people have. Nick [0:13:44]: It's able to go ahead and take that domain, take the person's name and just research them on the spot in one tool. Nick [0:13:50]: What I used to dude put something in clay run the clay agent through my Open Credit so I save some money. Callan [0:13:57]: Which Clay? Nick [0:13:57]: Clay it used to be just a data enrichment tool. Nick [0:13:59]: I'll put it like that. Nick [0:14:00]: Right? Nick [0:14:00]: But now it's a full fledged. Nick [0:14:02]: Imagine Microsoft Excel that's connected to the Internet. Nick [0:14:04]: That can just do everything you need in a row based format. Nick [0:14:08]: Right? Nick [0:14:08]: I've have ten rows. Nick [0:14:09]: I can enrich all of them. Nick [0:14:11]: I can have an Ai search and add a billion different things to it. Nick [0:14:15]: And then the best part about Clay. Nick [0:14:16]: I can integrate it to any system I want. Nick [0:14:19]: Mh. Nick [0:14:20]: Any of them with their credits or with your own credits. Nick [0:14:23]: Right? Nick [0:14:23]: Like I just said, we have an open Ai playground. Nick [0:14:25]: So we use our open Ai credits. Nick [0:14:27]: Because it's just cheaper. Nick [0:14:27]: It's just cheaper that way. Nick [0:14:29]: I have to say that for the Rev people. Nick [0:14:30]: Otherwise, they're gonna stupid me. Nick [0:14:32]: You know, always use your own keys. Nick [0:14:33]: Always use your own keys. Nick [0:14:34]: So other than that Right Callan [0:14:36]: what that means. Callan [0:14:37]: But what does Nick [0:14:38]: use your own keys? Nick [0:14:38]: But use your open Ai license key because it costs you less in the long run. Nick [0:14:42]: That's the clay Sorry, Clay, But they use their own credits and it cost you more. Nick [0:14:45]: That's all No. Nick [0:14:46]: It's a super Callan [0:14:47]: cool tool. Callan [0:14:47]: What I'm hearing the crux of all that is that the clay tool is very interesting, and it could do really cool stuff. Callan [0:14:53]: But you are trying to get as much on what I'll call your core platform, which is Hubs And even hesitant even say Crm because it's more of a core platform than there's anything else. Nick [0:15:03]: At this point, and it with Clay, you know, they have their... Nick [0:15:06]: They call it they scope it. Nick [0:15:07]: It's all scoped to your business model and everything you do. Nick [0:15:10]: I mean, that's their... Callan [0:15:11]: Know that, but I love that. Callan [0:15:11]: Yes. Nick [0:15:12]: It's Maybe I'm not getting any of the whole thing. Callan [0:15:15]: You... Callan [0:15:15]: Well you sold mason. Nick [0:15:16]: Yeah. Nick [0:15:16]: So and it's... Nick [0:15:17]: With that being said, it's just like, now we're going two different directions here and just to be clear, the processing agent and the clay side. Nick [0:15:23]: Right? Nick [0:15:23]: Both can achieve your same outcome. Nick [0:15:25]: And before the prospecting agent, which is Clay. Nick [0:15:28]: Right? Nick [0:15:28]: You could qualify there, you can tell it to look these people up and find your Ic and not find your Ic, but, like, qualify based on your And your persona and all these different things with their tooling. Nick [0:15:39]: And you used to before asking the cla agent, their Ai agent to do that. Nick [0:15:45]: You could integrate to any tool you want that there's a myriad of them that will help you find your All without Ai, all that stuff. Nick [0:15:51]: But now it's just instead of having to pay and log in and do things and other tools. Nick [0:15:56]: I just, like, put it as a clay column, and it just does it for me. Nick [0:16:00]: It's very simple once you get the hang of it. Nick [0:16:02]: Like I said, we run in a couple different directions, but With the prospecting agent, which I think is the best tool that everybody should be experimenting with right now. Nick [0:16:10]: Like I said, if something comes in in a form. Nick [0:16:12]: Mh. Nick [0:16:12]: That prospect agent will research the company, we'll research the person and then we'll write an email for you and send it if automatically if you wanted to. Nick [0:16:21]: We always have a person obviously checking. Callan [0:16:24]: So oh, so this is the template they're referring to? Callan [0:16:26]: Or are you talking about that's what you're starting to test out. Nick [0:16:28]: Yeah. Nick [0:16:28]: Starting test down all avenues. Nick [0:16:30]: And I believe it can be done Smb mid market or enterprise. Nick [0:16:33]: I mean, some of the things that puts out are better than emails. Nick [0:16:37]: I've seen salespeople write No offense. Nick [0:16:38]: But like, you know, some of these things that come out is just... Nick [0:16:42]: I don't even know how it found that in five seconds. Nick [0:16:44]: Right? Nick [0:16:45]: Like, for sure. Nick [0:16:46]: The time and efficiency gains and this is like, what you're talking about earlier is, like, the tech just leads to efficiency gains. Nick [0:16:52]: If it's used correctly, that's what it is. Nick [0:16:54]: It's not gonna solve all my problems for me. Nick [0:16:56]: It's going to put in the right information that this person if they submitted a form and taking the green slate example here is, If they won an Emmy last year. Nick [0:17:06]: The agent found that and put that into the email and just said, congratulations on your win, that's so personalized. Nick [0:17:13]: That doesn't read as, oh, I got an auto response from before. Callan [0:17:18]: Right how strong is it gotten? Callan [0:17:19]: Because, like, when this first started, it wasn't that great? Callan [0:17:22]: No. Callan [0:17:22]: How is it now? Nick [0:17:23]: It improves week by week. Nick [0:17:24]: And when you're talking about the business models and talking about hubspot specifically versus Salesforce, Hubspot iterate and improves their stuff. Nick [0:17:30]: And they release it to the public via a beta tag or not? Nick [0:17:33]: Week after week. Nick [0:17:34]: So you're always on the front layer of the best version of the tool in my opinion. Callan [0:17:39]: Okay. Callan [0:17:39]: So let's pull back. Callan [0:17:40]: The lead comes in from the ad. Callan [0:17:42]: A template is created. Callan [0:17:43]: Is that template automatically sent or does somebody review that four sending. Nick [0:17:47]: No. Nick [0:17:47]: We have somebody reviewing it. Nick [0:17:48]: And I think, you know, I'm not gonna give you that Ai is can replace sales reps. Nick [0:17:52]: Right? Nick [0:17:52]: I think that's a buzz. Nick [0:17:53]: People say that to get clicks, but we always have someone review it. Nick [0:17:57]: I think it's very important that they make sure the information is accurate. Nick [0:18:01]: Ai is only as good as what you give it, and it always will be. Nick [0:18:05]: And we've come up with, like, an acceptance rate. Nick [0:18:07]: Right? Nick [0:18:08]: If it's ninety percent of the way there, it's good to go. Nick [0:18:10]: Mh. Nick [0:18:10]: Right? Nick [0:18:10]: If it's not a hundred percent accurate, but it's ninety percent, How do you know that? Callan [0:18:14]: How you know if it's ninety percent accurate accuracy hundred. Nick [0:18:16]: Like, if the sales rep is reviewing it right? Nick [0:18:18]: And says this looks good. Nick [0:18:19]: This, you know... Callan [0:18:20]: Oh, you're saying they're just giving a stamp instead of having to rewrite them? Nick [0:18:23]: Yeah. Nick [0:18:23]: Just don't rewrite it It's only a bunch of time. Nick [0:18:25]: Right? Nick [0:18:25]: They're inbound anyways is they're interested. Nick [0:18:27]: They're warm. Nick [0:18:27]: Right? Nick [0:18:28]: We wanna make sure we get them on a call. Nick [0:18:29]: We wanna make sure we talk to them. Nick [0:18:30]: Yeah. Nick [0:18:31]: We wanna start the relationship. Nick [0:18:32]: Right? Nick [0:18:32]: We don't wanna just keep going back and forth and all this stuff. Nick [0:18:34]: So that's where it's... Nick [0:18:35]: Yeah. Nick [0:18:35]: We always keep that layer. Callan [0:18:37]: So that email gets sent out what else does that process look like, yeah. Nick [0:18:42]: Where where Callan [0:18:42]: Rev ops is tied into it. Nick [0:18:43]: Right. Nick [0:18:43]: So that person comes in. Nick [0:18:45]: They obviously, attached to the company. Nick [0:18:47]: The Crm is automatically updated with all that. Nick [0:18:48]: Nothing new there. Nick [0:18:49]: Right? Nick [0:18:50]: The domain comes in creates the company creates the contact. Nick [0:18:52]: But the next layer is enriching all that. Nick [0:18:54]: Making sure we get the right demographic, data and demographic or and whatever you wanna call it to make sure at the end, for the reporting for last month, we know that inbound. Nick [0:19:04]: We got this in the mid market. Nick [0:19:06]: We got this in the enterprise. Nick [0:19:07]: This came in at the independent level, at the small business level. Nick [0:19:10]: Right? Nick [0:19:10]: Like, that all is automatically enriched with Clay. Nick [0:19:14]: Right? Nick [0:19:14]: I think that there's a couple other tools I don't wanna to out to, like, accounts scout that replaced hubspot, basic enrichment that was gone for a while that they actually just brought back because there's such a big flow. Nick [0:19:24]: But other than that, I was using clay because a Clay can waterfall multiple providers like Zoom and phone, like all these other ones to get the best data and then also do a no bounce. Nick [0:19:34]: Like, make sure the email is valid for anything else they find or anything like that. Nick [0:19:38]: Right? Nick [0:19:38]: That's next layer. Nick [0:19:39]: Make sure the accounts built up, it can classify the company. Nick [0:19:43]: Right, for us, we wanna know if it's, like a studio or a production company or if they are independent. Nick [0:19:47]: Right? Nick [0:19:48]: Try to classify that automatically with the Ai tool there in clay. Nick [0:19:51]: And really just build it out and make sure we're equipped to handle their business and know more about them than they think we know. Nick [0:19:57]: Right? Nick [0:19:57]: I think that used to be creepy. Nick [0:19:59]: I think people used to be like, you know I'm on your website you just gave me a call It's no longer like that. Nick [0:20:03]: People like to be known. Nick [0:20:04]: Right? Nick [0:20:04]: They like to hear their name. Nick [0:20:05]: They like to see their accomplishments and now all this stuff, and that's the best thing you can do. Nick [0:20:09]: You just put that information in and either you manually with the sales rep, you know, it's quick to talk about it and just move them forward. Nick [0:20:15]: Right? Nick [0:20:15]: And build that relationship. Callan [0:20:17]: So now you're essentially enabling that sales rep with more information. Callan [0:20:21]: That they can bring up when they do get them on a call. Callan [0:20:24]: Yep. Callan [0:20:24]: One of the areas that I I wanna dive into and this is kinda just naturally going down the buyer's journey here is I've heard you talk about conversational intelligence and you say how that's kind of the gateway to all of these. Nick [0:20:37]: Yeah. Nick [0:20:37]: Which is interesting. Nick [0:20:38]: Why is that? Nick [0:20:39]: It's absolutely the gateway drug for sales teams for marketing teams for people for Ceos or just, like, wanting a quick glance at a company and understand where they're at. Callan [0:20:50]: And real quick... Callan [0:20:50]: Can you define conversational intelligence? Nick [0:20:53]: Yeah. Nick [0:20:53]: So it's just... Nick [0:20:53]: When you're on a meeting and you see the seventeen blocks of note takers on there. Nick [0:20:57]: Right? Nick [0:20:57]: They're all automatically putting in just the transcript and things like that into the system. Nick [0:21:02]: They're logging it for you? Nick [0:21:03]: The sales rep doesn't have to go in and mark completed and do all these different things. Nick [0:21:07]: Right? Nick [0:21:08]: It just all just automatically put on the account record or contact record or whatever it is, and it then pulls out the next level, which is your terms, your tracking keys, like all those things that you want to, pull out from a conversation, like, pricing or authority or any of, like, you know, the sales methodology stuff. Nick [0:21:25]: Mh. Nick [0:21:25]: You can automatically just pull all that out. Nick [0:21:28]: Right? Nick [0:21:28]: And that's the biggest part, you know, Gong was the leader in it for a while where they would just... Nick [0:21:32]: You get off a call and you know exactly what you need to see. Nick [0:21:36]: You don't have to go into the company record and fill out your sales admins band. Nick [0:21:40]: Right? Nick [0:21:41]: It can automatically now put it all that all in. Nick [0:21:43]: Right? Nick [0:21:44]: And that's that conversation intelligence that just pulls it out, puts it in, plugs it in and you waste snow times. Nick [0:21:48]: All efficient, tech gains once again. Callan [0:21:51]: Alright. Callan [0:21:51]: I'm a salesperson by nature that many sales roles. Callan [0:21:55]: Is that making the salesperson lazy? Nick [0:21:58]: No. Nick [0:21:58]: Why? Nick [0:21:59]: Because, I love that. Nick [0:22:00]: That was a very adamant not. Nick [0:22:03]: Absolutely. Nick [0:22:03]: And as you know, I've worked with a ton of sales people. Nick [0:22:06]: The job is not easy. Nick [0:22:07]: The thing they hate the most. Nick [0:22:08]: Is me. Nick [0:22:09]: They hate me. Nick [0:22:10]: They hate the systems. Nick [0:22:11]: They hate the required fields. Nick [0:22:13]: They hate all these different things that waste their time when they can be selling. Nick [0:22:18]: And so that's why... Nick [0:22:19]: Like, they not making them lazy. Nick [0:22:21]: It's making them focused and better at their job. Nick [0:22:23]: The targeted things that they need to talk about, so they don't flounder. Nick [0:22:26]: Right? Nick [0:22:26]: Rep can be onboard way faster now without saying weird things on calls that are irrelevant. Callan [0:22:32]: Why is that? Nick [0:22:32]: Because the training, they can easily pull out what's important to the customer when you just generate a report of, like, last quarter calls, and what was the thing most talked about on everything on all these calls? Nick [0:22:45]: Train on it. Nick [0:22:46]: You immediately know what to train on. Nick [0:22:48]: Because that's all they talk about. Nick [0:22:49]: Right? Nick [0:22:49]: And it used to be, yes, We have this methodology. Nick [0:22:51]: Let's go through training camp. Nick [0:22:53]: Let's go through all the objection training. Nick [0:22:54]: Let's go through all of these different next step options. Nick [0:22:58]: But now it's just like, this is what was popular last quarter. Nick [0:23:01]: Let's train on the exactly these things and get to these scenarios. Callan [0:23:05]: Okay. Callan [0:23:05]: So do you think the playbook is dead? Nick [0:23:08]: No. Nick [0:23:08]: We created a nice playbook this year. Nick [0:23:11]: Right? Nick [0:23:11]: And it took a lot of iteration. Nick [0:23:12]: It took a lot of heads down work from leadership and all this time spent. Nick [0:23:17]: It's not dead. Nick [0:23:18]: I just think it evolves way faster than he used to? Nick [0:23:20]: What do Callan [0:23:21]: you think the evolution of the playbook is? Nick [0:23:23]: I think it's it's funny. Nick [0:23:24]: I mean, in the Crm, in Helps hubspot, for example, they just another beta future. Nick [0:23:29]: I feel like I'm a sales rep at this point. Nick [0:23:31]: Here's the the playbook, the playbook beta future, that they're improving on daily that can automatically recommend things while you're on calls and doing that. Nick [0:23:40]: So if that's always up to date. Nick [0:23:41]: Based on all of your conversations that happened last month that an Ai could definitely just write new playbook and be like, hey, this is the most touch upon topic last month. Nick [0:23:51]: Leadership doesn't you have to waste their time anymore. Nick [0:23:53]: They don't have to be there from oh executive won't like that or whatever it is because, it listens and understands what they want already. Nick [0:24:01]: You know, that's interesting. Callan [0:24:03]: And why I say this is it gets back to something you said earlier where enrichment, it used to be something that was, like, I remember what I would use enrichment, and we were doing this way back in the day. Callan [0:24:16]: In the insurance world is kinda tough and meaning, like, because the numbers that you care about are, like, if you're selling to agencies. Callan [0:24:23]: What's their split between commercial lines and personal lines? Callan [0:24:25]: What's their direct written premium of the agency? Callan [0:24:28]: What's the Pi? Callan [0:24:29]: How many quotes are they doing? Callan [0:24:30]: How many commercial quotes are they doing? Callan [0:24:32]: How many personal lines quotes that are doing? Callan [0:24:33]: That's that information. Callan [0:24:34]: Now if you've been in the industry long enough, if you know there are some good data providers that you can buy that information from, but that was hard to a get in mass. Callan [0:24:44]: Right? Callan [0:24:45]: Unless you're actually having the conversation, which we did, we would build an amazing database because we have these conversations we fill these things out. Callan [0:24:50]: But enrichment outside of that was really just so you can help better segment as a whole. Callan [0:24:56]: So so we didn't really ever do. Callan [0:24:58]: It didn't really have a need to go out and use... Callan [0:25:00]: We used every data provider. Callan [0:25:02]: You possibly could. Callan [0:25:03]: And do you remember I did. Callan [0:25:06]: Okay. Callan [0:25:06]: I'm gonna give Callan [0:25:07]: a quick side story here. Callan [0:25:08]: We found one of the data providers with insurance agencies. Callan [0:25:12]: You could do a copy. Callan [0:25:13]: They would put all the information out there of but Callan [0:25:16]: deemed to download the credit. Callan [0:25:17]: So you could copy so many pages. Nick [0:25:20]: We're we good get a trouble Callan [0:25:21]: You... Callan [0:25:21]: I don't think what I think page over. Callan [0:25:23]: Shut. Callan [0:25:23]: So I put a team of interns on going through every single page, and then they ended up shutting her account down because we were going through too many pages too fast all from the same Ip address. Callan [0:25:36]: Alright. Callan [0:25:37]: So sign. Callan [0:25:37]: I'm gonna get back to the actual point. Callan [0:25:40]: Getting all of that information, which could seem like overkill. Callan [0:25:43]: When you're saying Clay gets all these different sources and get all these different data points. Callan [0:25:48]: That's actually not overkill when you consider how conversational intelligence can say if this has all these ones that have these thirteen data points when this was said, this is what matters. Callan [0:25:59]: Is that essentially what you're saying? Nick [0:26:01]: It's only overkill on a resource level when you think about it is because how many people would have had to look at this stuff and understand it and be mathematicians all this different stuff, that's when it's overkill. Nick [0:26:13]: Yep. Nick [0:26:14]: When your salaries are just comp piling on one project and you're paying all these people for the same thing. Nick [0:26:19]: And now it's not overkill because you don't even think about it. Nick [0:26:23]: It's just gonna do it. Nick [0:26:24]: Well can provide you those insights and that's one of the most important things where A lot of people always like, okay. Nick [0:26:30]: We have all this data. Nick [0:26:31]: We have all these things. Nick [0:26:32]: We can generate insights manually people, obviously, the experts can get the high level stuff, the niche stuff, then we also have everything else that can come out of like an Ai assistant. Nick [0:26:44]: Right? Nick [0:26:44]: And taking those and putting them into action, that's where now the focus can be. Nick [0:26:50]: We don't have to spend this time on the collection and the building and building a deck for x y z over and over again, instead just implement. Nick [0:26:59]: Just change it. Nick [0:27:00]: We know that's what's happening, and we collect it at a fast rate. Nick [0:27:04]: Just change what was wrong or iterate or make it better or focus in and dive in on a market. Nick [0:27:08]: Like, just do those things. Callan [0:27:11]: Makes total sense that the evolution of the playbook is in why you think conversational intelligence so important is because you could take those conversations and have a Bread crumb trail as to what actually happened. Callan [0:27:20]: But beyond that, It's kinda like, we had ten deals that that had a positive result, and these were the key things that were said on there, and they meet this criteria. Callan [0:27:29]: So when a new lead comes in the door. Callan [0:27:31]: That criteria is met, this is what we're going to serve them up essentially. Nick [0:27:36]: Yep. Nick [0:27:36]: And I'd love to pay an analyst for that, but now I don't have to. Nick [0:27:38]: Yeah. Nick [0:27:39]: Right? Nick [0:27:39]: Because now, this is why a conversation intelligence is that gateway drug. Nick [0:27:42]: Because after you see from a conversation what you can pull out and understand in ten seconds. Nick [0:27:46]: Now from these ten one deals from rep a. Nick [0:27:51]: You can just ask the new hubspot agent that is the close one trends and pull it all out. Nick [0:27:57]: Pull out the averages, pull out their talk time. Nick [0:27:59]: Pull out all these... Nick [0:28:00]: What resonated, what was the testimonial or quote that was said on these deals? Nick [0:28:06]: Like, deal of, I'm not even talking about one meeting. Nick [0:28:08]: Right? Nick [0:28:09]: I'm talking about the entire customer record for the deal. Nick [0:28:11]: What is the thing that was most brought up over and over again or a factor that led to this closed deal? Nick [0:28:17]: I've seen that agent pull wow. Nick [0:28:20]: There is this one quote and it was mentioned multiple times throughout the month? Nick [0:28:24]: That's crazy. Nick [0:28:25]: Is that does that quote really have that much power. Nick [0:28:28]: Right? Nick [0:28:28]: That's when you can get to questioning. Nick [0:28:29]: Should we put a blog around this? Nick [0:28:31]: Should we immediately take this meeting put it into content remix and Hubspot. Nick [0:28:35]: What's content remix? Nick [0:28:36]: Hubspot has this new thing in their marketing hub. Nick [0:28:38]: I feel like I'm a sales rep? Nick [0:28:39]: Jesus. Nick [0:28:40]: Where you can put in files or content or blog whatever you wanna call it, and they can just create seven different assets for you like a landing page and add an email. Nick [0:28:52]: Anything you want, and it creates it in five minutes. Nick [0:28:54]: And if you take that and generate a blog around and why was successful, Why is important? Nick [0:28:59]: Your marketing team now has all this power to just continue to influence the conversation faster than ever. Callan [0:29:06]: Can you get all these without conversational intelligence? Nick [0:29:09]: I'd say you can. Nick [0:29:10]: But it goes back to my point earlier where what you put in is what you get Yeah. Nick [0:29:14]: If you don't have the actual and you don't have this real data, and you don't have this real these real conversations, you're gonna have swap out, and I hate Ai swap. Nick [0:29:22]: It's funny, but it's bad. Nick [0:29:23]: It's the same people that say they can replace entire sales teams, that's just s and garbage where it's, like, it's not relevant. Nick [0:29:30]: I think that when it's all under one roof, this gets back to the point of, like, there's all these awesome systems. Nick [0:29:36]: There's all these new leaders and there's complexity that's doing this and this and that and all these different things. Nick [0:29:41]: But if it's all in one place, you actually get that what Salesforce was calling a long time ago, Customer three sixty. Nick [0:29:47]: You can actually understand from every single angle, your customer, and then just replicate that further faster because it's all in one place. Nick [0:29:54]: I don't need a data analysis tool or a team to put together a deck to understand these things. Nick [0:30:01]: I can just get reports and insights that I can immediately action instead of waiting over and over again. Callan [0:30:07]: And one of the things I I I'd like to dive into is let's go back to one of those companies that we worked at in the past in the insurance space. Callan [0:30:15]: What would you have done differently. Callan [0:30:17]: Right? Callan [0:30:17]: You know, the last insured tech that we were at together was little over five years ago. Callan [0:30:22]: What would you do differently? Nick [0:30:24]: With today's tools without today's? Callan [0:30:26]: With today's tools as they stand in today, not where it's gonna be in three to six months. Callan [0:30:29]: I wanna talk about that. Callan [0:30:30]: Yeah. Callan [0:30:31]: But with today's tools as it stands today? Nick [0:30:34]: It's a very interesting question. Nick [0:30:35]: I think that if we go back to bull penguin? Nick [0:30:38]: We had incredible people. Nick [0:30:40]: We had incredible resources, incredible tech, incredible product. Nick [0:30:42]: What we could do now that we couldn't do back then is everything at scale faster and more efficient. Nick [0:30:49]: Exactly what the product was offering are like, everything's more efficient easier to use all these things internally, we could... Nick [0:30:56]: From a customer success perspective who loves to talk about that. Nick [0:30:58]: I worked with a team there and you, and we develop these things that we wanted to be proactive to our agents. Nick [0:31:05]: We knew that's important. Nick [0:31:06]: We didn't wanna be one of those reactive companies. Nick [0:31:09]: We wanna make sure we're always on top of their feedback. Nick [0:31:11]: What was working and what wasn't working. Nick [0:31:13]: So we had a manual process in Salesforce. Nick [0:31:15]: I created a custom Qb, quarterly business review. Nick [0:31:19]: Object that would prompt our customer success team to reach out. Nick [0:31:22]: Right? Nick [0:31:22]: Into they had some questions and but they could see all of our data since our warehouse warehouses integrated Salesforce, but imagine that today where instead of them having to understand and look through the data. Nick [0:31:35]: And because you don't know data team for a company like that size is big enough to help all of those customers and create a nice deck for every single one. Nick [0:31:44]: Yeah. Nick [0:31:45]: Now, you can. Nick [0:31:46]: Now when our customer success manager would go into that conversation with that agent, they know every single thing about them. Nick [0:31:54]: They know every time they use the product to what success to what metric, who when where how to me that's so important because everything seems to be moving to a relationship based model. Nick [0:32:07]: Everyone always says it was before beforehand. Nick [0:32:09]: Right? Nick [0:32:09]: But then, obviously, there's quotas and there's quantities and how many calls can you make. Nick [0:32:12]: But now it's like, if you can get that one important call with your customer and really just tell them where they were successful and where they weren't, and you didn't have to have four people on a data analysis team to tell them that. Nick [0:32:25]: That's incredible. Callan [0:32:26]: Are you doing this today? Nick [0:32:28]: Yeah. Nick [0:32:28]: So we're doing it today. Nick [0:32:30]: In I would say more of an exploratory phase. Nick [0:32:33]: We're we're in the middle of a transition to become the best proactive company we can be in our space. Nick [0:32:40]: Right? Nick [0:32:40]: We have one of the best products. Nick [0:32:42]: We definitely have the best service just something our customers always tell us. Nick [0:32:45]: Right? Nick [0:32:45]: Well they're always coming back to us and they... Nick [0:32:47]: The relationships and everything that they build. Nick [0:32:49]: They... Nick [0:32:49]: That's number one thing they say. Nick [0:32:50]: They... Nick [0:32:50]: We're always responsive and all on all these things. Nick [0:32:52]: So I'm smiling because it's funny because internally, right? Nick [0:32:55]: We pride ourselves on a lot of different things, and it's... Nick [0:32:57]: The people there, obviously, everyone works so hard and gets things done for their customers and our customers and it feels like a big happy family at this point. Nick [0:33:04]: But, anyways, so if we can go into those conversations with our bigger clients to earn more wallet. Nick [0:33:11]: Share, for example. Nick [0:33:12]: Mh. Nick [0:33:12]: Right. Nick [0:33:13]: We're more equipped now because we know their health. Nick [0:33:15]: We know what they've brought to us in the past. Nick [0:33:17]: We know how much their usage has been. Nick [0:33:19]: Right? Nick [0:33:19]: And speaking in general terms here. Nick [0:33:21]: It's building those for us. Nick [0:33:23]: Building those relationships with all these value ads of, like, we know this is where we're were talking about last time. Nick [0:33:29]: And here's where we think we should go next and being proactive on all that and how we can help you and all these other facets of business that out to the products and services that we offer that are extremely value add, but that's not their main focus. Nick [0:33:42]: If we can offer those at a timely place, we're like, oh, shit, They're gonna save us money here. Nick [0:33:47]: Oh, my god. Nick [0:33:48]: I don't have to worry about this, and think god they brought this. Nick [0:33:50]: I even know what existed. Nick [0:33:51]: Right? Nick [0:33:51]: Just being proactive on all those things. Nick [0:33:53]: I think is that next level? Nick [0:33:54]: And I and removing their fast. Nick [0:33:56]: Right? Nick [0:33:56]: What did the key is... Callan [0:33:58]: You said this In this, I think would be a big competitive advantage is it is being proactive but it's being proactive in value added. Callan [0:34:06]: A lot of people are proactive. Callan [0:34:07]: Right? Callan [0:34:08]: They'll reach out ahead of time and they'll send all sorts of stuff that nobody cares about. Callan [0:34:11]: And again, like, this is one of the biggest challenges in the insurance space is, like, you take an independent agent, Independent agent has thirty different carriers. Callan [0:34:19]: And many of those carriers are all being proactive, but it doesn't hit the mark, or I would actually say even more importantly, the right content doesn't get to the right person. Callan [0:34:29]: For example, it's like, if I'm sending out something, I'm gonna speak broadly, but really, it's gotta go way more narrow than them. Callan [0:34:34]: Well, actually Narrow. Callan [0:34:35]: So if I'm sending out a piece of content that specifically for surplus lines contractors in Ohio. Callan [0:34:43]: It's a national agency and I send this to everybody, nobody's gonna care. Callan [0:34:47]: Like, nobody cares at all. Callan [0:34:49]: Right. Callan [0:34:50]: And it's not to say that I'm not knocking the content itself. Callan [0:34:53]: The content could actually be phenomenal. Callan [0:34:55]: And when sent to the right person at the right time, what... Callan [0:34:58]: I'm here you say, That's when the magic happens. Callan [0:35:01]: Is that fair? Nick [0:35:02]: Yeah. Nick [0:35:02]: It's anticipating their needs. Nick [0:35:04]: Right? Nick [0:35:04]: We've always talked about that. Nick [0:35:05]: And it's like, that sounds like such a mystical statement. Nick [0:35:08]: Oh, how am I supposed to... Nick [0:35:09]: We have to this... Nick [0:35:10]: I don't know what they want. Nick [0:35:11]: But, like, you really do. Nick [0:35:12]: You have all the data in your database. Nick [0:35:14]: Just round it up and execute on it now. Nick [0:35:17]: Right? Nick [0:35:18]: Like, that's the efficiency speed of getting the right content to the right person at the right time. Nick [0:35:23]: I mean, the ohio example. Nick [0:35:24]: I mean, that's just, like perfect. Nick [0:35:25]: Right? Nick [0:35:26]: You can make these emails in these things that can dig through your integrated data warehouse and understand that not only is this segment in Ohio for these lines, they need to see this, but why don't we just include a merge field that includes how much they explored it or used it or quoted with it or whatever you want. Nick [0:35:46]: Right? Nick [0:35:46]: Put that in the email with a tag now. Nick [0:35:48]: Because that's just like a normal tech gain without even Ai. Nick [0:35:51]: But they tighten that up to including in there, your peers are doing x y z at this level. Callan [0:35:57]: That's power. Nick [0:35:58]: Because you have all the data because you provide this certain, like, and put that in the email as well. Nick [0:36:01]: Right? Nick [0:36:02]: Now you could just do all those things and once again, it's no longer a drain on resources, and it's no longer a side priority because you can just put in a couple prompts and gotta. Callan [0:36:12]: That piece right there. Callan [0:36:13]: I know that agents sees want that ability. Callan [0:36:16]: What are the peers doing, what's the coverage amount, things like that that's super powerful. Callan [0:36:21]: So I wanna talk a little bit about... Callan [0:36:24]: You know, if you look out the next six months to a year? Callan [0:36:27]: What is the number one thing you're most excited that you think will be ready at that point and how do you wanna implement that? Nick [0:36:34]: I mean, this stuff evolves so fast. Nick [0:36:36]: I mean, the other month, half the stuff I'm talking about in helps hubspot you can do? Nick [0:36:41]: It's just crazy. Nick [0:36:42]: I think that what I'm most excited about is the evolution of Rev ops role. Nick [0:36:48]: Right? Nick [0:36:48]: Where recently he, it came out, it was just like, there's a new title on the block. Nick [0:36:52]: It's go to market engineer and granted, I bet those people are all great, but it's all the same thing. Nick [0:36:57]: It's still Rev ops continuing and no hate it, by the way. Nick [0:37:00]: But, you know, Rev ops needs to evolve, like, they always have with these new tools in an enable it features. Callan [0:37:09]: Yeah. Nick [0:37:09]: And serve up exactly like we're talking about to our customers. Nick [0:37:13]: Serve up internally. Nick [0:37:14]: Rev ops customers internally a sales rep, marketing people. Nick [0:37:17]: Customer success owners like, serve up to them how to make them better at their job and that they can eat dinner peacefully at night and not worry about what's going on tomorrow. Nick [0:37:26]: Right? Nick [0:37:26]: That's what I'm excited about where Rev ops can really just start shining even more than they already do in the best companies is it's no longer Hubspot admin that also builds a couple decks for the sales pipeline rei imagination. Nick [0:37:41]: They're contributing to the decks at the top level and what the insights are, and my team does this great right now. Nick [0:37:47]: My guy, just puts all this stuff together and the value of all those, if you actually read those bullet points, I know there's sometimes a lots to get to in board meetings. Nick [0:37:54]: But when you actually read those bullet points and understand the trends and going on in your company. Nick [0:37:58]: That stuff is so good. Nick [0:38:00]: And if we can do that faster, more efficient with our tone with what we're focused on, that's what I'm most excited about. Nick [0:38:07]: And to speak less broadly about all that, because I could all be perceived as plus. Nick [0:38:10]: Right? Nick [0:38:10]: I'm just like talking to talk. Nick [0:38:11]: Using the tooling that's coming out. Nick [0:38:15]: And we kinda touched this in the beginning, using the tooling and actually kinda central it into where you live. Nick [0:38:21]: It's not spare tools, nail it down to Clay, Hubspot. Nick [0:38:25]: In your digital marketing or whatever it is. Nick [0:38:28]: Right? Nick [0:38:28]: Putting it all in one place and making it that single source of truth for real is the next level of helping your customers become better. Nick [0:38:37]: And why you actually provide value in what that value is. Callan [0:38:40]: Yeah. Callan [0:38:40]: I love that. Callan [0:38:41]: That makes it way easier at the end of the day. Callan [0:38:44]: When you've got marketing customer success and sales all working out of the same platform. Callan [0:38:49]: The data that either... Callan [0:38:51]: They're gonna start to get much better at Bi internally. Callan [0:38:54]: But if not, use any of the Bi tools. Callan [0:38:56]: The dad is all. Callan [0:38:57]: It's gonna be coming from one spots a lot easier. Nick [0:38:59]: Yeah. Nick [0:38:59]: And I've worked with a ton of, who are now my good friend, sales reps that have become Rev ops people. Nick [0:39:04]: And that's like the evolution because it's you start seeing all this stuff, and you're like, wow, this is so cool. Nick [0:39:09]: This is awesome. Nick [0:39:10]: If I can do this for someone else to help that sales rep become even better at their job and people like them and they're not spewing Bs, you know, sometimes sales kinda over promises, you know, what? Callan [0:39:22]: Just to be clear. Callan [0:39:23]: He'll never over promise. Nick [0:39:26]: You know, But now we're no longer doing that. Nick [0:39:28]: We're actually just if the product is good enough at any company, and you're actually selling to its values, but it's all relevant to the customer. Nick [0:39:35]: You're not just bla on about random stuff in Ohio for someone who's in New York, like, that's so important. Nick [0:39:42]: I think it can be specific, and I do wanna mention this. Nick [0:39:46]: I was thinking about this during this conversation. Nick [0:39:47]: I think that a lot of tooling or strategy or architecture ideas is always from top down. Nick [0:39:55]: Right? Nick [0:39:55]: Which is it's warranted. Nick [0:39:56]: It's obviously these are the experts they're founding the company. Nick [0:39:58]: They know what they're talking about. Nick [0:39:59]: But sometimes something that gets lost is what the sales reps actually need and care about? Nick [0:40:05]: To do what overall strategy is. Nick [0:40:08]: And now Rev ops as a role in the future can help do their ultimate goal, which is translating that business into tech tech into business. Nick [0:40:17]: So Rev ops is gonna have to be more involved at the strategy and architecture level at the top just as they're involved at the execution layer for the team that's actually using the tools. Nick [0:40:29]: Right? Nick [0:40:29]: They're bridging almost all functions at this point. Nick [0:40:32]: And the best Rev people I know already do this. Nick [0:40:34]: But it's gonna be easier. Nick [0:40:36]: And when I think about training and leadership and other Rev people coming up in the space, they have such an incredible place to start. Nick [0:40:42]: They can start with all these Ai tools. Nick [0:40:44]: And then mold the man and fit them in to where businesses need them. Nick [0:40:48]: It's no longer like a guessing game of like, oh, I think we should do this. Nick [0:40:52]: You can just kinda look it up, kinda execute on it because most likely your company already using House Outside Salesforce just use those tools that already exist. Nick [0:40:59]: And be really successful. Nick [0:41:01]: You know, I remember having to dig through the trail heads and dig through all these random places to find dynamic lookup up roll up summaries, like, to make roll ups. Nick [0:41:09]: But now it's like three buttons. Nick [0:41:11]: In hubspot. Nick [0:41:12]: You can just tell it. Nick [0:41:13]: I need a roll up, and it just does it. Nick [0:41:14]: Right? Nick [0:41:15]: It creates the fields for you. Nick [0:41:16]: So Rev ops as a role in the future. Nick [0:41:19]: You have to embrace all these things and actually put them into you. Nick [0:41:22]: You can't just talk about them over and over again without any proof. Nick [0:41:26]: I think that's one of the big things on Linkedin right now is, like, I made this N eight flow and it did x y z and comment to get it. Callan [0:41:34]: Like, all this stuff. Callan [0:41:35]: Right? Nick [0:41:36]: That s. Nick [0:41:36]: Like, I bet those people have really good ideas and stuff, like, like, but you have to actually be implementing it and Execution is one of my favorite parts of job anyways. Nick [0:41:45]: So it's more hands on, but it's also just so strategic and you can be so influential, and you can move up the latter faster in my opinion. Nick [0:41:54]: If you're really understanding what's driving a business to success, they're gonna want you in every conversation. Nick [0:41:58]: And that's something I've always wanted. Nick [0:41:59]: Right? Nick [0:42:00]: And that's why I've always operated the way I did to try and get my foot in the door on those conversations. Callan [0:42:05]: I definitely hear what you're saying. Callan [0:42:06]: And actually, it's a good segue that the last question I have for you is If you could have a conversation when you were just starting out in all of this stuff, What advice would you give that person if that person was starting out today. Callan [0:42:18]: Be a little more confident. Nick [0:42:20]: There was a lot of things I remember in my beginning days. Nick [0:42:22]: There's a lot of other people influential people that I still talked to today. Nick [0:42:25]: That always told me like this is good stuff. Nick [0:42:28]: And it always felt like there's the next question of why didn't you give it to me already. Nick [0:42:34]: You know? Nick [0:42:34]: And it's so the people who are starting out it, It's very important to me. Nick [0:42:38]: I feel like being a mentor is one of the greatest things you can do in your career, just explore it. Nick [0:42:43]: Just do it implement it, run a test on it, and then bring it to your boss, your leadership, skip a level if the guy is not interested. Nick [0:42:52]: Right? Nick [0:42:52]: Like, tell them, hey. Nick [0:42:53]: I was able to do this. Nick [0:42:55]: Should we just try this everywhere else? Nick [0:42:57]: That's what I would tell myself because even at the time back then, obviously, no Ai add tools to turn my week long job into ten minutes, But, you know, it's it's now it's just... Nick [0:43:07]: You have so much power. Nick [0:43:08]: And if you know how to correctly do stuff, you can also do this stuff for free. Nick [0:43:14]: Right? Nick [0:43:15]: You can explore things you can ask companies, hey, can I mess with this? Nick [0:43:18]: They'll give you a login, all this stuff, and it's so interesting. Nick [0:43:22]: You can provide so much value to a business. Nick [0:43:23]: If you also just explore it yourself and bring it to leadership and say, instead of having an idea and bringing it up in a meeting, bring the solution. Nick [0:43:31]: Bring the actual thing. Nick [0:43:33]: Don't say, I can replace my entire sales team. Nick [0:43:36]: Just just do it. Nick [0:43:38]: You know, Yeah No. Callan [0:43:41]: Yeah. Callan [0:43:41]: I don't navigate advocate for that. Nick [0:43:46]: No. Nick [0:43:46]: Absolutely not. Nick [0:43:46]: But it's just really interesting. Nick [0:43:48]: I think that's what I would tell myself. Nick [0:43:49]: That's why I saw everyone who's looking to break in somewhere or move up or provide more value. Nick [0:43:55]: Just do it. Nick [0:43:55]: I mean, obviously, don't talk to legal. Nick [0:43:57]: They're not gonna let you. Nick [0:43:58]: But Callan [0:43:59]: we'll we wrap there. Callan [0:44:00]: That's a good place to wrap. Callan [0:44:01]: All roads lead to legal. Callan [0:44:06]: I knew he'd get to legal at some point or other. Callan [0:44:09]: All jokes aside, Nick this was a ton of fun this time flew past. Callan [0:44:13]: I'm sure we're gonna have you back on the show. Callan [0:44:15]: I'm very interested to see how these different campaigns evolve. Callan [0:44:19]: We revisit this in three to six months. Callan [0:44:21]: I know it's gonna be a whole different world, but thanks for coming on today. Nick [0:44:24]: Yeah. Nick [0:44:24]: Of course. Nick [0:44:25]: I really appreciate it, and it feels like they'll start very first official conversation after ten years. Callan [0:44:30]: It was the same conversations. Callan [0:44:31]: We always had this record. Callan [0:44:32]: Awesome, man. Callan [0:44:34]: Thank you. Callan [0:44:35]: Yep. Callan [0:44:35]: I hope you enjoyed nick and conversation. Callan [0:44:45]: I love nerd out on all things Rev ops. Callan [0:44:48]: And I could honestly probably talk about it all day. Callan [0:44:50]: You wanna learn more about Nick, you could find him on Linkedin in the show notes. Callan [0:44:54]: Also, if you like this episode, you could find me on Linkedin to let me know. Callan [0:44:58]: And if you really wanna support the show Subscribe to us on Youtube or give us review on Apple podcast or Spotify. Callan [0:45:05]: Every time you do it, it is very much appreciated. Callan [0:45:09]: So thank you for listening, and I'll see everybody next week.