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Navigating Conflict with Grace and Truth: The Power of Biblical Confrontation · The Reality Is

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: A couple of years ago I actually posted something on.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I copied it and repasted it.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: If I had an original thought, it scared me to death.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: But it was just simply ways to deal with a person.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: You want to choke, you know?
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Oh, please repost that when everybody needs to see that.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: And what it is is we wanna get combative, and the whole point of the article was we wanna get combative, we wanna fight our way through stuff.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: But there's a biblical way to deal with that, and it starts with love.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: We think of love as this emotional idea.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: Well, there is an emotional side of love, but that's not the biblical love that we're talking about.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: Love is a choice ["The Real Life"].
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Reality is Podcast, where we're here to talk about real life and real faith.
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: And to start off, I just wanna say I really missed having the opportunity to do a podcast with you last week, but if you guys missed the podcast on marriage, you have got to go back and listen to that A great podcast with you and your wife, and I thank you guys for doing that because man some insights of how to have a successful and happy marriage for decades and whatever you're going through, however, your marriage is being challenged at this point.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: If they just take an opportunity to listen to that, that would be wonderful, Thank you.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Thank you for doing that.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: We had a lot of fun.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: It was enjoyable having her on the podcast.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she did tell me, though it is not a weekly thing for her.
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: She's probably never doing it again Until next Valentine's Day.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: She'll circle back, but we need to give her more time, yeah absolutely.
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: It was a real pleasure Missed having you with us.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, but it was great having some time away with my wife.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: It was wonderful, my wife and I being able to connect with each other while you guys were talking about how to connect.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: It was just great.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: So we love that.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: So today we're actually talking about confrontation and this is one of those, I think, sensitive subjects.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: But before we get into confrontation I always kind of like to just chat with you a little bit and talk, and so I was looking at the Olympics were coming up soon.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: The Olympics are coming up soon, and I remember you and I talking about skill versus the actual amount of money it costs to use this equipment.
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: And so I wanted to ask you because, as you look at these Olympic sports, I know you do two of them, not professionally, but archery, because you go bow hunting and rifle you and I were joking about if I bought the most expensive fishing rod you remember this right If I bought the most expensive fishing rod and you had the cheapest equipment possible, would you still out fish me in a boat?
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: Your answer Absolutely, of course you would.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: Of course you would.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: But so I want to ask you about the skill of just say these two things versus the amount of money they're spending on the equipment, like how much skill goes into, say, archery and all these type of things.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Is it the bow?
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: Because, look, I could go to Walmart and I could buy $200 bow, but these people are spending thousands of dollars.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: If I got $1,000 bow, would I out bow you?
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: I don't even know what the term is going on.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: Would I out bow you?
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: It's not out bow, what?
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: do you want.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: I think, if you understand, we go back to even a biblical concept.
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: Ok, it becomes the application of love.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: And so if you get a bow and you use it, you practice, it's all rhythm, it's all routine.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: I have to draw the bow the same way, I have to use same set point, I have to breathe the same.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of factors that go into the work of that.
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: It's the same as if your Bible costs more than my Bible.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if you never use it or if you use it incorrectly, and so it really.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: It just goes back to that.
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: It's the same with shooting.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: It all goes back to, yeah, a better rifle, better optics makes a lot of difference, but the best rifle, the best optics and poor breathing doesn't matter, yeah, and I don't know how to use it.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: It means nothing and I'm glad you brought it back to the biblical context, because that's where I was trying to go with this.
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: It doesn't matter how much the Bible cost or how much you have information about the Bible.
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: If you aren't doing anything with it, if you aren't practicing the things that are being taught in there, it's really no good to you.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: So I'm so glad you went there.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: So confrontation I didn't want this to be a confrontational topic, but we're going to be speaking on confrontation today and I have the dictionary definition.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: It says a hostile or argumentative meeting or situation between opposing parties, and I think everybody listening to this podcast is probably familiar with the Matthew 18 approach to confrontation and I'm sure we're going to get into that.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: But I also believe that confrontation can be helpful or harmful.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: It depends on the situation, and the Bible actually gives examples of both films and we're going to get into that today.
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: But I've given you the dictionary definition.
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: What I want to hear from you is can you give me a more biblical definition of confrontation and what we're going to be talking about today?
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: Well, first of all, when you think about the word rebuke, which is our confrontation, we need to understand that the literal meaning is to criticize someone sharply.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Now, you can criticize someone and do it right and you can criticize someone and do it wrong, and we have to dig into that Now.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Biblically, when we look at the word rebuke in the New Testament, we look at it in the fullest sense of its meaning.
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: It is to reprimand and convict by exposing a wrong.
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: Sometimes that's publicly, sometimes that's privately.
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: We're going to talk about the right and the wrong way to do that.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: There are very, very few times that public rebuke is called for or acceptable.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: There are times, but the majority of the time it's not.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: So when we're talking about the biblical idea, it is to reprimand or convict someone, but it's exposing a wrong.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: And that's not a bad thing.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: In fact, it's a loving thing to actually do that for somebody, because a lot of times they may not even recognize or realize what they're doing has been hurtful or harmful, and the loving thing to do is actually approach them and confront them.
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: Well, proverbs tells us that in Proverbs 27, open rebuke is better than love concealed.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: And it says fateful are the wounds of a friend.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: But then it says but the kisses of the enemy, they're deceitful.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: So, just thinking, when we're talking about confrontation, we're thinking about number one open rebuke is absolutely better than love concealed.
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: So literally what he's telling us there is I can tell you all day long that I love you as my Christian brother, I love you as my friend.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: But if I sit back and look at wrong in your life and say nothing, then that's love concealed.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: And what good is it?
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: And then he goes on to talk about fateful are the wounds of a friend.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: And but the enemy, those kisses are deceitful.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: It's the one that condones your sin, the one that agrees with your sin, the one that goes with it.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: And even in Titus, as we get into the New Testament, the apostle Paul said speak, exhort and rebuke, which tells me all three are necessary.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Thank, you.
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: You have to do them To be a loving brother, sister, christian friend, whatever you call yourself.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: You have to do it.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: But I think a lot of times people see it as especially people such as myself I'm a people pleaser.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: Everybody knows that I'm a joey.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: He's an encourager, he always wants to please people and a lot of times that can be scary for people such as myself to say, hey, there's a sin in this person's life and I need to confront them.
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: But I don't wanna do it because I don't wanna lose out on that relationship that we have with each other.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: And sometimes there's a fear in doing that.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: You know, I think when we're talking about confrontation and I think set the stage early doesn't always have to be sin, sometimes it can be a wrong, it can be the good instead of the best.
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: It can be a lot of different areas.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: Now, obviously, majority of the time when we're talking about, we're talking about sin in someone's life, but it could be the right thing done the wrong way.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Yes, I mean, there's a number of things you can talk about there.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: So scriptural rebuke, though it has to begin in the heart, all right.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: So it is a matter of people pleasing can become detrimental to this.
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: Yes, all right.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: But at the same time, the refusal to can become catastrophic.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: So it's a matter of asking do I wanna be fearful or do I want catastrophic results coming into my life?
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: In 1 Corinthians 16, it reminds us to let all we do be done in love.
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: Yes, All right.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: Wrong rebuking is result of your anger, your pride, malicious action, jealousy.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: I mean we could go on.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: So this is wrongfully rebuking someone.
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: So I'm trying to get the upper hand.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: If you want to call it wrongful, it literally boils down to hypocrisy.
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: So what I'm trying to do is set you straight because it makes me look good.
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: And that goes back to what you said.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: That's pride.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's fleshly desires.
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: Sometimes we do it out of greed.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: I'm just trying to make myself feel better.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to point out something in your life and I'm going to do it lovingly.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: But are you really doing it lovingly?
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: It's like no, I'm just going to let you know that I'm a better person than you.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: Well, I'm going to do it lovingly as much like the doctor saying this will hurt a little.
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: You know how I feel about doctors and so I was actually at the doctor yesterday and I was told this will hurt a little.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: We're going to have to define that word in the future and so not seriously it does boil down to we like to hide behind the cloak of love when there was nothing loving about our action and nothing loving about what we did.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: And so, as we work through this today, I hope everyone will stay with us to walk through this whole idea that just because I say it's loving doesn't make it loving, and so there's some evidence in our life that will produce the fruit of whether it was a loving intent or not.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: And here's the thing I want everybody to pay attention to and listen to as well Confrontation is not wrong.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: No, Don't feel like, oh, it's wrong for me to do this.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: No, it's actually the right thing to do.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: In fact, you've already said it earlier.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: The Bible kind of tells us we have to do that.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: Well, I hope as well we will as we work through this podcast.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: There's one way that I rebuke a brother in Christ.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: And there's another way that I rebuke a unbeliever.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: Yes, all right, and we have to be mindful of that, because who we deal with, how we deal with and as we talk about some principles as we go through this, that's very important.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: When we're talking about a brother, sister in Christ, there's a very right way to do that and there has to be discernment involved in that.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: And so you mentioned Matthew, and in Matthew 18, if your brother, your sister, sins against you, otherwise, if there's a wrong, something that has occurred, the process starts from me going to that individual, not someone to ask if I should go.
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: The individual- Because now you've already started the rumor.
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: He says if I go to that one alone and if they'll hear me, I've gained that brother, that person.
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, and I think if it's done in love, then my desire is not to bring harm to this person, but to make this person better, to help them grow, to help them mature, to help them make amends, whatever the case is.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: And so if this is the case, I go to them individually.
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: But all too often we don't do that.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: So what happens is is I gather three people together to air my grievances and once I've aired my grievances and everybody agrees with me, and now I've gone, now I'm approaching them because everybody's behind me, and now you just went in doing something that I believe was maybe not evil intended.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to say the person was evil for doing it that way, but it wasn't the heart of love and what you were trying to do.
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: Now there may not have been evil doing it, but they were wrong doing it.
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: They were definitely wrong and they were well outside the bounds of scripture by doing it.
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: And you know, when someone's choosing sin then it's detrimental to them and if I see that then I have every obligation scripture to speak into that.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: But I have no obligation and no command in scripture for me to shout it from the rooftops and not deal with it correctly.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: Well, there's the Old Testament and New Testament examples of that.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: One of my favorites in the Old Testament is Nathan.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: Nathan and David.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, right, so it's like it's Samuel, just to paraphrase.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: This is my words, not biblical words.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: But Nathan goes to him and says hey, look, man, I got a story to tell you.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he sets this whole story up for him.
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: And then David's like oh, is this real?
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: Well, well, we need to do something about this.
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: We're going to punish this person and, in fact, we're going to kill that person.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: And then Nathan goes like bro, that's you, doug, yeah.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: And he's like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, what?
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: This is you?
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: And now let me explain it.
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: So, so there was a confrontation that was done one on one, it was done lovingly, but it was done to correct an action that was taking place.
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: He didn't call him out publicly, he didn't do, but it opened his eyes and it showed him.
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness, I was in the wrong here.
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: And then David immediately says OK, I need to repent.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: And you know there's a lot we learned from that, but one of the key things is we get angry at people for being us.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: Thank God, that's the point, right there.
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: I'm mad at that person.
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: That person's you.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: We want to launch into our confrontation and we want to be angry at someone, and yet we do the same thing.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: But and I think we find that in David it's a great account.
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: I mean here here, here.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: Here, david was yeah, we're going to execute this guy, we're going to he was ready to put him the tab, we're going to make a public example out of this guy, and and then Nathan goes well, ok, but we're going to be without a king when that happens.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: And so it is so important that we understand that that whole Christian love begins in our own heart, and so so when I'm talking about confronting someone, I mean I, I have to ask the question is this about me or is it about you?
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and, and there are some principles, there are some ways that that we can really do that.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: You know, I think one of the things I mean, looking back, ok, let's use the Nathan example.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: There was scripture for that.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: I mean, nathan was exactly within God's will, within God's plan and God's purpose for what he was doing, and there was a clear violation of of what God he called us to do.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: And so I think one of the first things you have to ask when you're starting to talk about, is this truly an offense or is this simply my preference, mm?
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: Hmm?
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: Ok, nathan didn't go in there and say you know what you violated, what I think you should do.
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: Ok, very true.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: He didn't go in there and say you know what?
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: You'd be a better king if you were a king of the way.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: I think you should be a king, but what he did is he walked in very clearly with an offense, and so, when we were talking about confrontation, I think the first thing you have to ask yourself is what I'm talking about here.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: It is, is this an offense or is this an opinion?
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: Yes, ok, good point, because I feel like it should go this way and I think it would be best if you did this, and because you're not doing it my way, I want to have a conversation with you about it.
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: Where is that inscription man?
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: There was a joke or some laughing and playing in our Life Group Sunday night and one of the guys said something and someone in the group said, oh so you're going to be a preacher.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: And everybody kind of laughed.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: I said he is bald.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: Well, here, that's all it takes right, you know, in our church that's the first qualification.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: Here is the disqualifying yeah.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: And so you know, on the inside, I mean, we look at outward things that become our preference and instead of the inward reality of is this a sin, does scripture speak to it?
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: And that brings us to another principle.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Okay, so if it isn't an offense that I'm gonna talk to this brother about, or is it an opinion?
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: Yes, all right, if I have an opinion, then I can address it a whole different way.
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: We were talking earlier about having to garden at our house.
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: Yes, we were.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: And your lack of a green thumb is not the aim that you can't grow vegetables at your place, okay, but you've declared that things won't grow at your place, it does not.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: You can say whatever you want, it does not grow at my place.
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: There's some of the finest weeds in your pasture that anybody has in town.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: So don't tell me that.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: And so you know what, when we're talking about having a garden, okay, this is just preference stuff okay, that's exactly.
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: And I said well, this is what I would do.
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm not gonna confront you over that.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: Okay, but we did have confrontation earlier about it.
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, because you were wrong.
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: You know If we're talking about opinion.
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: I've learned that if someone wants to be wrong, I can let them be wrong.
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: And I can go about my business.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: But when we're talking about scripture, it's a biblical matter.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're way past that.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: All right, in Ephesians, chapter four, the Bible tells us that the purpose of this confrontation is to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace.
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, and so the reason I'm even going to speak to you is so we can keep unity, and so the question has to go as we think about that, though, is do I even know scripture well enough to know that this is a scriptural issue?
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: Oh, now, that hurts, you know.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: I don't know how many times I've listened to arguments and I'm sitting there going well, that's a great argument.
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: It's just not in the Bible.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: It's not in the Bible, you know.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: I'm glad your mama told you but it's just not what the Bible says.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: Treat people the way you want to be treated.
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: That's in the Bible.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Well, sort of kind of know.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: Can we kind of get to what it really says?
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: Keep it in context.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: What's it?
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: When you always bring up in church, you'd say, well, anybody will walk into a church for the first time and they will know.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: Well, you're not supposed to judge me.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, it's people's favorite verse.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but in 2 Timothy 2, 15, he tells us to study, to be diligent, to present ourselves to God, approve A workman who does not need to be ashamed because we rightly divide the work.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: So what that simply means is, if I feel like I need to speak to you, and we're being generic, okay.
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: But if I feel like I need to speak to you and in a confrontational conversation about sin, then I need to know enough about scripture to be able to tell you why that sin.
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: Yes, you do.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: I don't know how many arguments that I've refereed over the years, of opinions that are not scriptural arguments.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Okay, so I think that's clear, as we talk about confrontation is, where in scripture am I basing my argument?
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: And so if I don't have scripture for it, we're back to the opinionated argument.
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: But it's not about to say now we're in opinions and this is what I feel versus what the Bible says how it's supposed to be handled.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: But it's also important how we approach the confrontation.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: I think that's extremely important.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: 2 Timothy you're in 2 Timothy 2, if I go to 25, it says opponents must be gently instructed in the hope that God will grant them repentance, leading them to the knowledge of the truth.
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: That's the reason for me approaching you is I'm praying that in my conversation that I'm having with you, god's gonna give you the heart to repent.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: You're gonna realize, oh my goodness, what I did was against God.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: And now I'm repenting and I have the knowledge of the truth to go with.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: But sometimes it doesn't stop there, like you may need to continue confronting that person if you will just having that conversation with them and be willing to say look, man, I'm willing to walk alongside you, I'm willing to come along with you and help you through this, because I see this is where you're struggling Not to just approach somebody.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: Tell them well, this is what I've recognized in your life and you need to deal with it, and then you're out.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: But for me to come to you and say this is what's wrong with you.
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: Now fix it.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: I'm done.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna check that box.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: There's nothing biblical or scriptural about that.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: For me to come alongside you and say, okay, this is the problem and now let me walk with you.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: It's a little thing called discipleship.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: Which is what we preach here, we make disciples who make a difference period.
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: We make a difference in society, but we make a difference in individuals.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: And so the question is am I acting in love?
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: And so, in 1 Corinthians, 13, 1, the apostle began simply by saying I don't care what you do, you're an annoying noise.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: If you don't do it love, you don't do it with love, yep.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: And so if I come, and even though I'm speaking to this person, and I'm speaking truth to this person, if I have a vindictive attitude, if I have a holier than now, I'm right, you're wrong, it doesn't matter what I say.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: At that point I've had people say the right thing to me, but they've said it in the wrong way.
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: And and you're not gonna listen to that.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: No, I'm offended and you've done nothing to help me at this point.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: They could be right at right, doesn't matter.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: You approach to me the wrong way.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: A couple of years ago, I actually posted something on.
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: I copied it and repasted it.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: If I had an original fault, it scared me to death, but it was just simply ways to deal with a person.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: You want to choke?
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Oh, please repost that when everybody needs to see that.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: And what it is is we wanna get combative, and the whole point of the article was we wanna get combative, we wanna fight our way through stuff.
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: But there's a biblical way to deal with that, and it starts with love.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: We think of love as this emotional idea.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: Well, there is an emotional side of love, but that's not the biblical love that we're talking about.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: Love is a choice.
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: It's a choice, it's a verb, it's an action, it's something you choose to do.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: Our men's group, we're actually going through 1 Corinthians 13,.
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: We're going through all the elements of love and we just approached the first two yesterday, because it says patient, long suffering and kind.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Do we approach people with patience and kindness and that's the type of approach you're talking about Like we don't even have to get into the rest of them.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: Are you loving and are you kind?
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Because if not, how do you expect that person to hear you and even want to change?
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: Because if you're telling them this is what you need to be like and they're looking at you and you are unloving and unkind, do they really want to be like you?
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: Do they really want to listen to you?
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: Well, they're not going to, and again, they're going to leave, probably more angry than they was when they arrived, and so it is so important that we speak with that.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: But I also think we have to evaluate the question do I even have a relationship with this person that allows me to speak into their life?
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: Thank you, okay, that doesn't mean that I don't call sin sin, all right, but do I have enough of a relationship with this individual?
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: Do I have a?
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: I mean, as a pastor, I have a pastorial role, absolutely, that allows me to speak into the lives of a bunch of people.
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: But when we're talking about this one-on-one, confrontational conversation of sin in someone's life, settling for good rather than best, whatever the case may be, do I even have a relationship?
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: In Galatians 6-2, I'm to bear one another's burdens, and as you read through that text, it's literally referring to a brother.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: It's referring to someone you have a relationship with, yep, and so if I don't have a relationship with you, then how in the world Am I going to even have this conversation?
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely challenging at that point because and we've talked about this before in the past and other in other podcasts Relationship is key to the majority of things that you want to do, but in order to have a relationship, you actually need to give up something of yourself in order to have a relationship with that person.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: I Use the analogy of being married.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: Hey, my wife and I are married.
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: We've been married for 21 years now but the relationship we have with each other is because we actually spend time with each other, talking to each other, going out, connecting with each other on date nights, doing those type of things.
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: Now, if we just said, okay, once a week, honey, we're gonna get together, we're gonna have our date nights, we're gonna do our thing, and then I'll see you, I'll see you next week and we'll pick up.
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: Well, it's not a relationship.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: It takes time.
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: It takes commitment and their sacrifice on your part.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: That needs to take place.
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: And then, when you have that type of relationship, you can confront someone and say look, man, can I talk to you about something?
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: And they'll listen Because they know you're coming to them Out of love right, well, in, and I think that that that has to be.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: The question is is my goal in in this conversation, restoration or condemnation?
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: Yes, okay, if my goal is restoration, then I'm coming in a Galatians 6-1 mindset, which simply says that I Understand that I need to do this in a spirit of gentleness yeah, unless I myself become tempted, and and so.
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: But if I'm coming in a spirit of condemnation, then I've got all my list of all the reasons you're wrong and I'm right.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and, and I'm gonna tell you right now, we never shame people into into walking closer with God and You're not gonna do it.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: You're gonna drive people further away, absolutely, but you're never gonna shame people into walking closer with God.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and and so.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: And I think in that concept, in that idea of love, in that idea of of Confrontation, I have to ask myself the question when I'm getting ready to have a conversation with someone, would I be willing to have someone confront me in the same manner I'm doing this?
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: You know how would I respond if this conversation was reversed?
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: There's place, tone, attitude, there's all kinds of factors that go into that.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: Again, in Matthew 7 and you may mention of this verse a minute ago, but it is whatever you want men to do to, you do also to them.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: Yep, all right.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: In that whole concept, it's talking about looking at the motives of someone, is looking at how they live.
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: It's looking at what they do.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: It's, first of all, getting the log out of my eye Was dealing with my sin long before I talked to you about your sin, yeah, and and.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: So when we put all this place tone attitude, let me.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Let me tell you I can.
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: I can be as right as rain, but it makes no difference whatsoever If I'm growling that you.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: The whole time I'm saying yeah and and, and I see that I've done that, and and when you do that.
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: Well, I've had it done to me.
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: I've had, you know, pastors sitting me in their office having a conversation with me, mm-hmm, but the conversation and telling me how wrong I was about something, the way they were telling me I was wrong about doing it, made me go.
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: Man, y'all, just don't understand exactly y'all.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: Y'all are out of line.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: You don't understand what it is to be my age, you don't get it and therefore I'm not listening to them anymore.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: I've shut them off.
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: But as I look back, everything they were telling me was right.
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: They were telling me exactly what I need to do, why I need to do it, what was wrong about what I was doing?
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: But I didn't like the way it was being said, and that's key it.
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: They may be right, okay, you can do the right thing the wrong way, yes, okay, and and we'll let people think about that for a moment but you truly can't.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: I may be as right as right can be, but if I choose a crowded room To to pull the confrontation off, yeah, then I've certainly done that the wrong way.
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I may be as right as I can be, but if I choose a time that is that you're already having a bad day, you're already You're.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: I'm the fourth person, okay, and so it is.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: It's time.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: Place, attitude tone.
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: And let me add to that it goes both ways to.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: I had to be willing to hear that I was wrong too.
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: I mean, I Like I said I was wrong, I didn't like the way they approached me, but also my attitude was already closed off and I was hard to hear.
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: But when I was in a right place already to hear, and when I was approached a certain way, it all came together and guess what that did?
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: It made me to repent, find the truth about what was being said and now Move on a path where I can walk the way I'm supposed to be walking with God.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: And you know what they didn't do.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: They didn't leave me there to do it on my own.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: No, and I think that's key, joey, as we're talking about this.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: I mean, yes, you said okay, there were times I was closed in spirit.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: Yes, well, closed in spirit.
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, somebody would want to Help me, but I wasn't ready for it.
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: Yes, all right, and and that didn't make their conversation with me wrong Exactly All right.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: But there's also been times that people have absolutely spoken truth into my life, but they've spoken it in such a way that they're lucky they left the room that I didn't go to jail.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, just being straight up you know it's like okay, dude, keep it up.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, and and and.
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: So when we get to that kind of conversation, I mean, who's winning on it?
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: Satan's winning all the way, exactly.
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: But I have had people speak hard truth In a loving way and the moment they spoke it I was confrontation, yeah, but in the quietness, yeah.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: When they were gone and I was left with no one but me, mm-hmm, I couldn't dispute their words exactly.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: I Couldn't dispute the, the attitude I couldn't respect.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: I dispute the, the way, the place, the time.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: I couldn't dispute the person yeah, now, those are the ones you can't stand.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: Nope, there's no one for me to blame here now.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: Okay, I would rather you do it wrong.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: And then I can say well, I would have listened if he was, and and so yeah.
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: And then you bring a key point you are left alone with God.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's you and God.
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: And now what are you gonna do?
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: cuz you got nothing but facts Yep right, and, and so I haven't thrown my opinion in, mm-hmm.
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: I haven't browbeat you.
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: I haven't left you Publicly exposed and humiliated.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: I haven't left you in a way that you have room to be mad at me.
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I tell people often if you're mad at God, I'm sorry, I hate that.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: I'm not apologizing for that, though.
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: No, all right.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: If you're mad at me because I did it wrong, I'm sorry for that.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, and and and I will always be willing to admit that.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: But, but I'm never going to apologize, because if God Cows it, sin at sin and he hadn't changed his mind exactly and and so we're there.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: You know, I think part of this, as we're talking about Dealing with this confrontation and getting there, I think what we fail to do is own our part of the problem.
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: Yes, okay now, and that's where I was with my sin.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: I didn't want to see what I was doing as wrong, I wanted to see.
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: Y'all just don't understand and I think obviously there's that.
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: And then there's also the part where I feel compelled to confront you about something, but yet I'm as much a part of the problem as you.
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I want you to fix your part.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: I just don't want to fix my point.
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, and you know, I tell people often that perceptions 99% of reality.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Yes, it is.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: If, if I perceive it to be true, it doesn't really matter what truth is now it does matter.
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: Okay, so it matters who is.
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: To a certain extent, I get what you're saying, though but conflict is Rarely, if ever.
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: A hundred percent the other person's fault, all right, and, and so you got on your part of the problem.
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: And so if you and I are in some sort of conflict, then I own my part of the problem.
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I own that first.
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: Own that before God, yes, and so in prayer, I confess my part of the problem, but I also own that before you.
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: So if I'm going to confront you about a conflict that we had, then I begin by acknowledging that when this problem started, I and and I give my part.
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: I'll let you worry about what your part is.
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm just owning my part.
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: But I think the key to that is I go to you, yeah, that's the key right there and and and Matthew 18 is beyond a doubt.
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: There's a process, mm-hmm, and it starts one-on-one and and then there's a process.
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: If one-on-one doesn't work, then then you can start bringing other people in, but yeah, but it goes one-on-one or go direct.
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: In that conversation we have to make, or we have to ask questions, not make statements, and, and you know, we, same as my wife and I talked last week, as joy and I were talking about that, that's all part of any communication process.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: So if, if I come to you and say you, I want you to imagine what would happen if Nathan would have began the conversation with David, I'm glad you did.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: David, you're an adulterer, you're a murderer and you're a sorry individual.
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: Nathan would have had his head cut off.
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: He probably would have and there was nothing he could do about it.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: He was getting you out of the right to do that.
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: That's right, okay.
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: But instead Nathan came and said let me tell you a story.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so he was asking questions.
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: He was, he didn't just go in his face, and I don't know how many times I've seen that myself, where I've been able to just ask someone a question and then circle back that question is well, doesn't that kind of fit what?
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: And then go back to whatever it is I want to talk to him about, but go direct.
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: I think that's just the most important thing and the approach you have every time an elder comes on and all the elders have gone through this book, peacemaker, and so we're bringing a new elder on or he's gonna start going through the process.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: So I'm going through this book once again, so I'm in the middle of reading it and I'm looking at all these principles about peacemaking and it ties right into this whole confrontational thing that we are talking about.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: If it's, if it's at all within me to make peace, I've got to make peace and I'm the one responsible for going to you or whoever to say, hey, here's what's happening, here's what I'm seeing.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: Can we talk about it?
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: You know, my wife and I have this thing.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: It's a circle of conversation.
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: It kind of walks you through how to have a confrontational conversation, but it's a wonderful thing it starts with, in my perception, this is what I see, this is what I'm seeing, this is what's going on, and then, halfway through that circle, you have to start reflecting on yourself, which is the other point you brought up.
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: So now, this is what I'm looking at, this is kind of what I have done to cause this to happen and this is kind of where I need to change and this is what I should be doing.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: And by the time you get to the end of that circle, you've gone through this whole thing and there's nothing confrontational about the confrontation that you're having.
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: Well, it's because you're acknowledging your part, yes, and what I can do is I can tell you how something said or an action made me feel, but I can't tell you what you meant, yeah, and so I can say, joey, when you said this is how I received it.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: Yes, you can't argue with how I received it, no.
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: I can't the only thing left for you to say is well, yeah, that's exactly what I meant.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: Or for you to say man, I'm sorry.
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: Sorry, that was not the intent.
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: That was a horrible job of communication on my part and you and I have had that legitimate conversation right there.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: Exactly, joey, you did this.
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: This is how I received it.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, I'm sorry, it was not meant to be received that way, and you admitted you were wrong and I was right and we moved on.
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: That's kind of how that conversation went.
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: No it absolutely is.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: It goes back.
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: You got to give the benefit of the doubt.
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: Yes indeed.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: Okay, if I come to a conversation with anyone and I come in with a preconceived notion that you were wrong, you were intentional, you were malicious, then I'm gonna tell you right now this fight has begun.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: I got to give them a bit of the doubt.
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: I got to give them a bit of the doubt that you know what they thought they were doing, the right thing.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: You know, I've often looked back in my life at circumstances and situations and said at the time it seemed like a good idea.
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: In hindsight probably shouldn't have done that.
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think all of us can say that.
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: I believe there was a little situation where I was sawing a tree at your house At the time.
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: Boy, was that a good idea.
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: It looked like a good idea.
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: We had the tractor, we had a rope yeah, let's go.
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: But when the tree went across your barn and you were like, get off the tractor, get off the tractor now, we determined it wasn't a good idea.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: We also determined for your life, joey.
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: That's all I heard.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: We also determined.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: It was your fault, not mine.
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: But you know what you got to give someone a benefit of the doubt.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: If you come in just guns blazing, I'm here to set the record straight.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: You're a worm and we both know it.
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: Let me tell you that's not going to do anything, but in order to give them benefit of the doubt, I got to explain to them what I perceived.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: Again, I'm not telling them what they did.
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: This isn't what you did.
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: This is what you did wrong.
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: No, this is how I received what you did.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: And there's absolutely nothing wrong about that.
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: But I also have to be very specific.
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: If you come to me and say, richard, you angered me, I almost said, get in line.
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: Okay, there's the line of angry people forms over here.
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: I mean seriously.
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: If you come to me and you just say you angered me, then that leaves me absolutely nothing to work with.
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: Of course not If you come and you are generic or you're talking in riddles.
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: At least Nathan didn't leave the riddle, the riddle.
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: No, he didn't.
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: He came straight out and said this is I'm gonna tell you a story, what you are.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: Oh, he brought it straight to the point, but I think remember we were talking earlier about people pleasers.
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of times they're gonna beat around the bush and they're not gonna get to the point real quickly.
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: Well, which?
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: yeah, and you got to get to the point sooner or later Actually sooner, but you got to be specific.
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: It means I got to do my homework.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: If it's a biblical issue, then I need to be able to sit down and say you know, here's what I'm seeing.
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: I'm seeing according to the scripture, that scripture, according to the.
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: You know, this is what I see, and I want you to help me understand.
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: Notice how I worded that.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: I didn't say you were wrong.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: I said help me understand how, as believers, we can allow these things in our life.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm just asking you a simple question Help me understand how this is possible and so.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: But I'm specific enough.
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you what the problem is, but I'm gonna give a basis for that problem.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: Now, if it's an opinion, then I'm just gonna say you know what, I'm just seeing some stuff and honestly, in my opinion, I don't think it's the best.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: I don't think it's the best way.
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know what, sometimes that's okay.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: There may be something that is not a clear issue, but it's what I call the gray issues of scripture.
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: You know, there's gray issues in life.
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: Absolutely Everything's not, yes, no, good, bad, black, white.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: It's just not.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: And so there may be times that I have to speak to someone and say, as I look at this, I see nothing good, I see nothing that that is best.
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: But I gotta be specific, all right, but I also have to be clear where I want this to go.
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: You know, I think so often we throw the gauntlet down but we fail to say here's a path to make this better.
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: Exactly, you know you were talking about the wheel of confrontation it ends with how do I make it better?
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: That's exactly how it ends, and what are we gonna do?
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: about that, and if I'm not making it better, then what's my point and my purpose?
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and let's, we could keep going with this, but if there's so much to go with it, let me let me jump real quickly, if I could, though, to the unbeliever.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: Yes, please.
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: Okay, so what about the unbeliever, or the unrepentant believer that refuses to hear me?
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: Yep, okay.
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: How do you handle that?
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: You know there's a person in your life that you are telling them this is what's happening, this is what I'm seeing, and they say, yeah, okay.
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: And then you have to go back.
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: I'm still seeing this, yeah, okay.
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: What do you do at that point?
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: Well, first of all, romans 12, and we start with verse 17,.
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: I repay no one evil for evil.
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: Yes, so you made me mad.
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: Therefore, I get to make you mad.
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you did me wrong.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: Therefore I get to make you wrong.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't do that.
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: And then, in verse 18, he says if it is possible Now, he said that for a reason, it's not always possible If it is possible, as much as depends on me, I'm going to live at peace.
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: Yep, all right.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: So that, literally, is how I have to deal with an unbeliever.
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: I have to say as much as lies within me, I'm not going to compromise what I believe.
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: Nope, I'm not going to walk away from what God calls me to do, but I have let go of a lot of things in my life.
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: Mm hmm, because, if it were possible, I had a.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: I had a neighbor in another state, and that's the truth.
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: But I had a neighbor, a horrible neighbor, a very, very ungodly person but very, very angry person and and so there was a common fence between the two properties.
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: He put a gate in it so he could come onto my property.
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: It literally he put a gate in.
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: That's bold, yeah, so I'm, I'm like dude, I got dogs and and there's a reason, and and he said it's my fence.
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: I said okay, um, I put a new fence up.
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: His gate took him three inches and he ran into my fence.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: I wasn't being ugly, wasn't being mean, I just simply quit tying to his fence.
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: And.
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: I tied to my fence and then, all kidding aside, I actually came about a foot off that and to make sure there was no question, no dispute, I wasn't gonna fight with him about it, but I had a reason for not wanting him there.
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: He was going to get dog bit and then I was going to be responsible.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: You'd be responsible.
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: So, as much as it's possible, live at peace with all men.
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: But then you also have to remember vengeance is God's, it's not mine and it's not for me to seek out vengeance.
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: And so, but the key, the key that we have to deal with and the whole key that we have to live in, is this is absolutely as much as lies within me.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: So when I'm dealing with unrepentant or unbelievers, I have to do everything I can to live at peace with this person.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, you do, but that does not count.
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: Compromise.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: And that's the point I wanted to get to, to make sure that everybody clearly heard we don't accept the sinful things that they're doing and say, oh, it's okay, so I'm going to be at peace with him.
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: What they're doing is wrong.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: I have to and this is where it gets hard.
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I have to step away from this person because I cannot keep allowing them to sin and have them think it's okay for them to do that.
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: Look, you know, I come from a secular background, secular groups singing.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: You know, I have friends, dear friends of mine, that were like brothers to me, that I had to walk away from because they didn't want anything to do with the Christian style of life.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Nor could I say, oh yeah, I'm going to keep engaging in the things that you guys are engaging in and let you think that it's okay and that I condone that or I'm good with that.
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: No, I'm not good with that.
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: Therefore, I cannot continue this relationship that I have with you and I'm gonna tell you that's a hard thing to do when you are close with somebody.
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: But it's not an easy Christian walk at times.
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: But I'd rather be right with God, I'd rather be right with what he's telling me, what the Bible is telling me I have to do, and forsake the friendship, than to say you know what, let me teeter-totter between the both, let me have a part of my foot in the world and a part of my foot in the church, and I can still walk this tight line and I can do both.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna tell you it's a personal testimony you cannot do both.
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: You have to do one or you have to do the.
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: Let me rephrase that you will do the other.
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: Either you have to do one or you will do the other, and there's no in between.
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: Get away from that and walk with God, do what you know that you're supposed to do, even if you have to forsake the relationship of the person that's really close to you.
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: Well, 1 Corinthians 1533, the evil company corrupts good morals Corrupts good morals and if I put the wrong people in my life and I'm feeding into trouble.
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: So I wish we could.
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: Man, I knew confrontation was gonna be one of those that we could go on, and maybe we could do a five part series on confrontation.
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sure.
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: I've got this thing I wanted to call you out on and I was gonna do it on there, yeah, but we are out of time.
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: Look at the time, oh my goodness, we were gonna demonstrate confrontation on but no, we can't do that.
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: Well, we actually had Pestorette.
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: We were gonna line him up and go after him.
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: Well, let's just.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: I know there's so much more you could share, but we are already deep into this thing.
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: Let's just agree on this the reality is confrontation is inevitable.
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: Exactly, it's a part of life.
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: We are gonna have to do it.
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: But the most important thing to realize is the way we engage in confrontation is gonna change the outcome of everything.
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: You know, refusing to engage in confrontation may give temporary peace, yeah.
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: But is that temporary peace at the expense of the person's well-being?
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so I would rather not leave temporary peace and detrimental.
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: It all goes back to this If someone is driving toward a drop-off, I don't think twice about warning them, and I may even have to confront him that his opinion is the road is just fine.
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: And I may tell him the road is fine right here, but when you go around that curve there is no road and it's not fine.
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: And so confrontation is absolutely biblical, it's absolutely necessary, but there is a right way to do it.
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: And I just leave it with this thought and I've said it a couple of times the right thing done the wrong way brings no benefit.
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: Absolutely Well.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for your time.
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: Thank you for giving us this opportunity to talk about confrontation, because it's one of those things I know it was on your heart for a long time to say, hey, can we do a podcast on this?
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: I'm glad we took the opportunity to do that and we want to thank you guys for taking the opportunity to listen to this podcast today the reality is podcast, where we are here to talk about real life and real faith.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: My name is Joey.
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: I'm here with Pastor Richard.
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: I didn't introduce this before, but now I'm introducing this.
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: Now you've made it the whole way.
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: Now you know who we are, and we just want to give you guys the opportunity to join us again next week.
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: We actually have a special guest on next week.
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: Dr Ed Gravely is going to be here talking about the New Testament, and we are very excited about that.
• 52:19
  Speaker 2: So join us next week.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: We look forward to hearing from you.
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: Like us, subscribe, download, let us know that you are there and give us some ideas about topics that you would like to hear us talk about, and we would love to share those on the reality is podcast.
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: For now, we'd like to say God bless you and have a great day.