Latest / Who Did What Now With Katie Charlwood / 016 - Anne of Cleves - The Ugly Queen

Transcript

016 - Anne of Cleves - The Ugly Queen · Who Did What Now With Katie Charlwood

0:00
Speaker 1: You're listening to an air wave media podcast. Washing is unique.
0:06
Speaker 1: The opportunity for students is amazing. I wanted to be
0:09
Speaker 1: around that level of excellence. I have a passion for service.
0:12
Speaker 1: Learn more and apply at wsome dot Education. That's WAUSM
0:17
Speaker 1: dot Education. Hi everybody, and welcome back to RADED. What
0:33
Speaker 1: now the history podcast that is not your history class
0:36
Speaker 1: with me? You're a slightly unwell host. Katie Charlewood spectacle addict.
0:42
Speaker 1: I'm reader of books, and when I say spectacle addict,
0:45
Speaker 1: I mean that I am addicted to glasses and spectacles,
0:48
Speaker 1: although I do enjoy a good spectacle because history is
0:52
Speaker 1: full of them. Welcome back if you are a regular listener,
0:57
Speaker 1: and uh, welcome if you're new here. If you hear
1:00
Speaker 1: a cat crying in the background, no you don't ignore her.
1:04
Speaker 1: She's in heat and is being really annoying. So Binkie
1:07
Speaker 1: hasn't made any meals or any kind of noise, like
1:11
Speaker 1: for about two months, like she's made zero sounds, and
1:14
Speaker 1: now that she's in heat, she's like, like, we thought
1:17
Speaker 1: the cat had gone mute. So it is Women's History
1:21
Speaker 1: Month and as such, I am working my way through
1:24
Speaker 1: all of the six Tudor Queen's Queen concerts. Whatever, It's fine.
1:30
Speaker 1: You don't necessarily need to make that distinction here. If
1:33
Speaker 1: you want to hear the story from start to finish,
1:36
Speaker 1: you can start with Catherine of Aragon. So I've got
1:38
Speaker 1: Catherine of Aragon, amberleyn Jane Seymour. Those are already up
1:42
Speaker 1: at the minute, and we are about to go on
1:45
Speaker 1: to the next. Why we are on Anne of Cleaves.
1:50
Speaker 1: I'm very excited about this one because Anne of Cleves
1:53
Speaker 1: is so often just referred to as like the ugly one. Oh,
1:58
Speaker 1: it's not even true. It bugs me so much, Like so, yeah,
2:04
Speaker 1: and then after this we have two more queens to
2:06
Speaker 1: I told you I was gonna get them all out
2:07
Speaker 1: before the end of the month. We're gonna do it.
2:09
Speaker 1: We're gonna get there. I am of the opinion that
2:12
Speaker 1: each queen deserves her own episode, because I am second
2:15
Speaker 1: tired of just being like Catherine of Argon gets one
2:17
Speaker 1: episode and Berlin gets one episode, and then everybody else
2:22
Speaker 1: gets shoved into the same one, and like, no, I
2:26
Speaker 1: don't like that. So now you know what, before we
2:28
Speaker 1: get into this, we're gonna we're gonna do a sidebar. Sidebar, right,
2:32
Speaker 1: when you have a social media account of any kind,
2:35
Speaker 1: whether it's for TikTok, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, whatever exists, whatever
2:41
Speaker 1: you use, first of all, listen to the Sage weirdo.
2:45
Speaker 1: She speaks the truth. So you don't owe anybody an explanation.
2:50
Speaker 1: You don't owe anybody anything, like if you make a
2:53
Speaker 1: point or or you have an opinion that people disagree with,
2:57
Speaker 1: you know, and I'm of the opinion, and I kind
3:00
Speaker 1: of go both ways, you see, in more ways than one,
3:05
Speaker 1: because like half the time, I won't deal with the
3:08
Speaker 1: gober bitches, like they're unworthy of my time, and you know,
3:12
Speaker 1: I just don't deal with them, like, and they don't
3:16
Speaker 1: directly impact to affect me, so they were relevant and
3:18
Speaker 1: I just don't bother. But sometimes, like say, for example,
3:22
Speaker 1: when I made a post regarding victim blaming and misogynistic rhetoric,
3:28
Speaker 1: you know, and somebody was like, oh, you ditched this
3:30
Speaker 1: video for Clout, and it's like, well, no, I didn't,
3:33
Speaker 1: because I think the video only had nine thousand views.
3:36
Speaker 1: And it's like, if I wanted clout, there were easier
3:39
Speaker 1: ways for me to do it. If I really wanted clout,
3:42
Speaker 1: I would drag I mean I'm going to. But if
3:45
Speaker 1: clout was what I was, after all I'd have to
3:48
Speaker 1: do is a video on like the Magdalen laundries or
3:52
Speaker 1: talk about how vicious John Paul the Second was like,
3:55
Speaker 1: it's not a difficult thing for me to do. But
3:57
Speaker 1: the thing is, I don't want to do that. Here's
4:00
Speaker 1: the thing. I love history, and if you don't pay
4:02
Speaker 1: attention to history, you are doomed to repeat it. And
4:05
Speaker 1: all throughout history we have people saying that like evil
4:10
Speaker 1: winds when good people stand back and do nothing. So
4:14
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call it people on their homophobic, racist, misogynist bullshit. Absolutely,
4:21
Speaker 1: Like I have a place of privilege because I look
4:24
Speaker 1: like a big bucket of mayonnaise, and I am relatively
4:27
Speaker 1: eloquent when I choose to be. I have a third
4:29
Speaker 1: level education, and also I'm cute, bitches. I am actively
4:34
Speaker 1: trying to be good to myself and not put myself down.
4:37
Speaker 1: It's kind of the end of the game here. So
4:41
Speaker 1: that was my point. So yeah, sometimes I'll respond. And
4:44
Speaker 1: as I was, you know, having this back and forth
4:46
Speaker 1: with this fella, I was like, no, you know what,
4:49
Speaker 1: you're not listening to me. You're not taking on board
4:51
Speaker 1: what I'm telling you, and you're deliberately attacking me to
4:54
Speaker 1: avoid the conversation that's happening. You're trying to detract and
4:59
Speaker 1: distract from the bigger picture, which is misogyny and victim blaming.
5:04
Speaker 1: And so I was like, well, you know what, block,
5:06
Speaker 1: you owe nobody anything on your social media. You don't
5:09
Speaker 1: necessarily owe somebody an explanation. No is a full sentence,
5:14
Speaker 1: you know, And people do not have a right to
5:17
Speaker 1: your time or your attention. You don't have to do that,
5:21
Speaker 1: especially when they're being dicks. And when you have social media,
5:24
Speaker 1: sometimes it's better to just report delete in block, Bye bye,
5:30
Speaker 1: motherfucker you're irrelevant. Like say, for example, after the Mother
5:33
Speaker 1: to Raise a video which got like three million views,
5:36
Speaker 1: I started getting death threats to my Instagram and people
5:40
Speaker 1: were writing out these paragraphs and essays, and you can
5:45
Speaker 1: generally tell by the first sentence how it's going to
5:48
Speaker 1: go and how they're they're speaking. So and whenever I
5:52
Speaker 1: see stuff like this, this kind of hate mail come
5:56
Speaker 1: into my inblox, I read the first couple words of
5:58
Speaker 1: the sentence and I'm like, oh, okay, this is take meal,
6:00
Speaker 1: and I delete it, so that entire essay that they
6:03
Speaker 1: spent all this time writing, that they put so much
6:07
Speaker 1: effort into writing that probably took them somewhere between twenty
6:10
Speaker 1: minutes and an hour to do the thing that they
6:12
Speaker 1: worked so hard on, determined to make their opinion and
6:16
Speaker 1: shove their opinion at me and threaten me or whatever
6:19
Speaker 1: they wanted to do, and I just deleted it. It's
6:23
Speaker 1: gone into the ether, never to be seen again. That's
6:26
Speaker 1: how little their opinion means to me. Like bye bye,
6:29
Speaker 1: But anyway, I know what you're thinking. Quit that gibber
6:32
Speaker 1: jabber in fact me. Well, let's get our source on.
6:35
Speaker 1: Shall we we have Anne of Cleaves, Henry the Eighth,
6:39
Speaker 1: Discarded Bride by Elizabeth Norton. The Marrying of Anne of
6:43
Speaker 1: Cleave's Royal Protocol in Early modern England by Ritha m. Warnick.
6:49
Speaker 1: The Six Wives of Henry the Eighth by Alison Ware.
6:52
Speaker 1: The Treasury of Royal Scandals. The Shocking true Stories of
6:55
Speaker 1: History's wickedest, weirdest and most wounded Kings, Queens, sars, popes
6:59
Speaker 1: and Emperors by Michael farkaher and oh And Anna, Duchess
7:06
Speaker 1: of Claves, The King's Beloved Sister by Heather Darcy, and
7:10
Speaker 1: of course we had little perus on Smithsonian dot com,
7:14
Speaker 1: Britannica dot com and biography dot com. So let's talk
7:20
Speaker 1: about Anne, the Duchess of Cleaves. So Anne of Claves
7:25
Speaker 1: was born Anna von kieh Okay. Now, remember it is
7:30
Speaker 1: the past, and just like most women of the past,
7:33
Speaker 1: we do not have an accurate birth date. So Anne
7:37
Speaker 1: of Cleves was born sometime between the twenty eighth of
7:42
Speaker 1: June and the twenty second of September in fifteen fifteen
7:46
Speaker 1: in Dusseldorf, the Duchy of Berg and the Holy Roman
7:49
Speaker 1: Empire modern Germany. Really, she was the second daughter of
7:54
Speaker 1: John the Third of the House of Lamark, Duke of
7:57
Speaker 1: Ulick clavesperg Count of Mark and Ravensburg, and his wife Maria,
8:05
Speaker 1: Duchess of Yulickberg. John the third her father. He was
8:09
Speaker 1: influenced by Erasmus and he had and he was like
8:13
Speaker 1: middle of the road when it came to Reformation. So
8:15
Speaker 1: he was on the side of the Schmalkaldic League. I'm
8:19
Speaker 1: sorry for schmoke Aldick, schmokel Dick, the Schmokeldick League, which
8:23
Speaker 1: were like a military alliance of Lutheran princes within the
8:28
Speaker 1: Holy Roman Empire in like the mid sixteenth century, and
8:31
Speaker 1: they were in opposition to Emperor Charles the Fifth of
8:34
Speaker 1: the Holy Roman Empire. When John died, AND's brother William
8:38
Speaker 1: became the Duke of Ulick Clevesburg, known as William the
8:42
Speaker 1: Witch in fifteen twenty six. In fifteen And has two siblings,
8:48
Speaker 1: an elder sister, Sibyl and a brother William. In fifteen
8:52
Speaker 1: twenty six, Sibyl, her older sister, she marries John Frederick,
8:57
Speaker 1: Elector of Saxony, head of the Protestant confis Federation of Germany,
9:01
Speaker 1: and how some would considered to be the champion of
9:04
Speaker 1: the Reformation. In fifteen twenty seven, when Anne was eleven
9:09
Speaker 1: years old, she was betrothed to Francis, who was nine
9:13
Speaker 1: years old and the heir of Antoine, Duke of Lorraine.
9:17
Speaker 1: This was a very brief engagement.
9:19
Speaker 2: It was basically considered an unofficial betrothal and was like
9:23
Speaker 2: officially canceled in fifteen thirty five. So the Duchess Maria,
9:28
Speaker 2: her mother was a strict Catholic and her brother was Lutheran.
9:33
Speaker 2: And I heard up at this and her father he
9:37
Speaker 2: was having.
9:37
Speaker 1: This dispute over Girderland with Charles the Fifth, which made
9:42
Speaker 1: the family of Cleaves really suitable allies for King Henry
9:46
Speaker 1: the eighth, you know, after the whole Tree of Nice,
9:48
Speaker 1: and then the Italian War of fifteen thirty six to
9:52
Speaker 1: fifteen thirty eight between King Francis the First of France,
9:55
Speaker 1: you know, the horn Dog, and Charles fifth, the Holy
9:58
Speaker 1: Roman Emperor and King of Spain. So they were trying
10:01
Speaker 1: to get control over these territories in northern Italy, so
10:05
Speaker 1: like the Duchy of Milan and things like that, France
10:08
Speaker 1: invading northern Italy and then Spain invading France, which resulted
10:13
Speaker 1: in the Truce of Nice, and this basically ended all
10:16
Speaker 1: the hostilities. The Truce of Nice made Anne of Cleave's
10:19
Speaker 1: family a really suitable ally for Henry the eight against
10:24
Speaker 1: because her father John the third of House Lamark had
10:27
Speaker 1: this dispute over guilderland with Charles the fifth yari yari yaa.
10:31
Speaker 1: So while the Italian War is going on, it's like
10:33
Speaker 1: fifteen thirty seven and it's decided that Henry really needs
10:37
Speaker 1: to move on with his life and get a new wife.
10:39
Speaker 1: He's got his heir and now he needs a spare. Effectively,
10:43
Speaker 1: so John Hutton. He was the ambassador to Mary of
10:45
Speaker 1: Hungary and he had been sent to the Low countries
10:49
Speaker 1: to see about possible alliances for Henry with the Habsburgs
10:53
Speaker 1: or their allies, and there wasn't really that many options. Ferdinand,
10:57
Speaker 1: King of the Romans, his daughters were too young, same
11:00
Speaker 1: with Emperor Charles and Mary of Hungary she had no kids.
11:05
Speaker 1: Isabelle of Austria was already married. And then Christina of Denmark,
11:10
Speaker 1: who was only sixteen, she had already been married and widowed.
11:14
Speaker 1: And John Hutton had mentioned basically in passing that the
11:16
Speaker 1: Duke of Cleaves he had a daughter, but quote there
11:22
Speaker 1: was no great praise of her personage or beauty, so
11:26
Speaker 1: Anne wasn't really considered at the time. And then so
11:29
Speaker 1: at this point they were looking more like for Christina
11:32
Speaker 1: of Denmark or Marie of Guys, But yeah, those fell through.
11:36
Speaker 1: In January fifteen thirty nine, the Treaty of Niece comes
11:39
Speaker 1: into play, and with this Treaty of Niece, Henry needed allies,
11:44
Speaker 1: and to top it all off, Pope Paul the Third
11:47
Speaker 1: reissues the Bull of Excommunication against Henry, and March fifteen
11:53
Speaker 1: thirty nine, Henry finally agrees that negotiations could begin. Regarding
11:58
Speaker 1: Anne of Cleaves is like, yes, please and thank you.
12:03
Speaker 1: It was actually pretty difficult for any of Henry's envoys
12:06
Speaker 1: to get like a very good view of what a
12:10
Speaker 1: looked like or what she acted like. The etiquette at
12:14
Speaker 1: the court was pretty strict, and Anne and her sister
12:17
Speaker 1: Emelia wore these so like the headgear they were wearing
12:22
Speaker 1: apparently it made it very difficult to actually see her face.
12:25
Speaker 1: But Henry was like, okay, send me, send me, send
12:30
Speaker 1: me a pener and Hans Holbein, the younger, he pops
12:33
Speaker 1: off to Durn and paints portraits of Anne and Amelia,
12:37
Speaker 1: and because Henry was actually considering both of them, and
12:40
Speaker 1: Henry stated that he wanted the portrait to be as
12:43
Speaker 1: accurate as possible and not to flatter them. So while
12:46
Speaker 1: they're in Claves, Holbein's getting the portrait done and some
12:49
Speaker 1: of the envoys are there and doctor Watton, who's leading it,
12:53
Speaker 1: he basically says that the pinter got a really good
12:55
Speaker 1: likeness of Anne AND's mother was like really really strict.
13:00
Speaker 1: It was noted and commented on by the envoys, and
13:04
Speaker 1: they also mentioned that, you know, the girls had received
13:08
Speaker 1: quite limited education, which was more to making her like
13:13
Speaker 1: a very economical, a thrifty wife for a nobleman. They
13:17
Speaker 1: never thought she was going to be, you know, a queen,
13:19
Speaker 1: so she wasn't prepared for that. And as we've seen
13:23
Speaker 1: with Henry, he had very particular tasts. He liked intelligent women.
13:29
Speaker 1: He just but just didn't like them to be smarter
13:32
Speaker 1: than him, which was a shame. Shouldn't be that hard
13:35
Speaker 1: and fairness. But like nobody thought, hey, maybe he likes
13:37
Speaker 1: this kind of thing. Maybe this isn't going to work.
13:40
Speaker 1: And yeah, like one thing that's sort of very much
13:43
Speaker 1: in English society at the time was women would learn
13:46
Speaker 1: to play instruments, you know, music was a big thing.
13:50
Speaker 1: They were then dancing things like that, and Anne didn't
13:53
Speaker 1: play a lick of music. Wasn't a thing. She could
13:56
Speaker 1: read and write in German, but she couldn't speak any
13:58
Speaker 1: of the languages, but it's generally seen that she was
14:01
Speaker 1: smart enough to be able to learn other languages. They
14:04
Speaker 1: didn't think it was going to be an issue. It's
14:06
Speaker 1: really funny because Anne is seen as quite somber, because
14:11
Speaker 1: Germany is seen as like a big drinking place, like
14:14
Speaker 1: alcohol wise, and neither Anne nor her brother were heavy drinkers.
14:19
Speaker 1: You know. She was pleasant and polite and graceful, and
14:24
Speaker 1: she had even learned She heard the kinglet cards, so
14:29
Speaker 1: she learned card games, you know, for him. She thought,
14:32
Speaker 1: well that's something. So all the accounts leading up to
14:36
Speaker 1: her heading to England, before she gets there, when she's
14:39
Speaker 1: on the ship traveling, they all generally say that she
14:42
Speaker 1: has grace and dignity, and that she's very excited to
14:46
Speaker 1: learn about her new home. The way everyone eats, she's
14:51
Speaker 1: very much trying to be the best she can be
14:55
Speaker 1: for her new journey, her new life. Yeah, so Thomas
14:59
Speaker 1: Cromwell over sees the whole marriage treaty and the negotiations
15:03
Speaker 1: and this gets signed on the fourth of October of
15:06
Speaker 1: fifteen thirty nine, on New Year's Eve, it's all stormy
15:10
Speaker 1: and shit and arrives at Rochester Castle in Kent. And
15:15
Speaker 1: on New Year's Day Henry Henry does this thing. Okay,
15:20
Speaker 1: this is what happens, and this is like the funniest
15:23
Speaker 1: So New Year's Day Henry mad into this whole chivalry thing.
15:28
Speaker 1: He decides he's going to meet her in disguise with
15:32
Speaker 1: a bunch of his men and stuff. Right, The chivalric
15:35
Speaker 1: tradition of meeting your betrothed in disguise is this whole
15:39
Speaker 1: thing about demonstrating true love because the brig to be
15:43
Speaker 1: is supposed to see through the disguise and recognize her beloved.
15:46
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah blah blah. It would be a very
15:48
Speaker 1: common story in England tradition and things like that, but
15:52
Speaker 1: in Germany, no, this wasn't a thing, so she would
15:56
Speaker 1: be very unaware of this tradition in this sort of
15:58
Speaker 1: cultural act. So Anne's in her chamber, she's looking out
16:02
Speaker 1: into the courtyard. There's bill baiting going on. It's a big,
16:05
Speaker 1: fancy fun time for everybody. So Henry, So Henry comes
16:09
Speaker 1: in and he's dressed by a lowly person, effectively, he's
16:13
Speaker 1: dressed like what he thinks a general person looks like.
16:20
Speaker 1: And you know, he brings her token from the king.
16:22
Speaker 1: It's a gift. She's looking out the window and he
16:25
Speaker 1: grabs her like they say embrace. He embraces her. But
16:30
Speaker 1: when someone touches you and you don't want them to
16:32
Speaker 1: touch you, they grab you and he kisses her and
16:36
Speaker 1: she's like what no, And she is completely disinterested, Like
16:41
Speaker 1: if this was a lady from you know, the English
16:44
Speaker 1: court one. She probably would have recognized Henry anyway, and
16:48
Speaker 1: at this point he was no longer the beautiful man
16:52
Speaker 1: of his youth, you know. But like ladies of the
16:54
Speaker 1: English court, they would be aware of this scenario.
16:58
Speaker 3: But Anne's from Dusseldorff, Like, this isn't a thing, this
17:02
Speaker 3: chivalric notion that Henry is obsessed with, and even more
17:07
Speaker 3: so now that he's aedging and he's got that ulcer
17:10
Speaker 3: on his leg and he's getting a bit dodgy, she
17:13
Speaker 3: is just so not into it, like she's like, no,
17:16
Speaker 3: thank you, and.
17:17
Speaker 1: She pushes him away, freezes up, and then she sort
17:20
Speaker 1: of keeps looking out the window like I'm gonna look
17:22
Speaker 1: over here, weird person who keeps touching me. She is
17:25
Speaker 1: completely disinterested in Henry, and Henry cannot fucking stand it.
17:32
Speaker 1: If you hear a cat now you don't, I'm being dramatic, Binkie, No,
17:35
Speaker 1: don't even like whether it was embarrassment or shyness, or
17:40
Speaker 1: the fact that she or the fact that you know,
17:43
Speaker 1: it's a strange man grabbing you and kissing you when
17:47
Speaker 1: you're on your way to meet your future husband. That
17:50
Speaker 1: Henry sees this as a rejection, so Henry storms off.
17:55
Speaker 1: As we've discussed before and especially especially the in the
18:01
Speaker 1: Anne Boleyn episode, Henry was a narcissistic, megalomaniac, misogynist just everything,
18:09
Speaker 1: everything has to be his way. He is so obsessed
18:12
Speaker 1: with being right, to being the manly man, the wanted man,
18:16
Speaker 1: and with all the injuries and everything else that's wrong
18:19
Speaker 1: with him, and he's gaining weight and it's all putting
18:23
Speaker 1: his concept of the strong, handsome, young viril man he was.
18:29
Speaker 1: That's all gone, and he is fighting to feel the
18:34
Speaker 1: same way when he as he was when he was
18:36
Speaker 1: a headstrong young lad. So he storms out, going, I
18:40
Speaker 1: like her, not like her, not like So he just
18:43
Speaker 1: starts talking about how ugly she is and who's going
18:46
Speaker 1: to fucking argue with the king? Like even if we
18:48
Speaker 1: remember back when Catherine of Aragon their wedding was initially
18:53
Speaker 1: arranged and he was like fourteen years old, going nah,
18:56
Speaker 1: don't wanna, and Henry always liked to choose him his
19:00
Speaker 1: own bread like he wanted to pick her. He wanted
19:02
Speaker 1: to court her directly, and the political motivation for marrying
19:07
Speaker 1: and that would have already put him in a weird
19:10
Speaker 1: place like he didn't like that. He wanted it to
19:13
Speaker 1: be his way, He wanted it to be his choice,
19:17
Speaker 1: like he resented any form of agency being removed from him,
19:20
Speaker 1: and so he would look for reasons not to marry her,
19:24
Speaker 1: like initially anyway, and then when the rejection happens, when
19:28
Speaker 1: she puts him away in what could have been like
19:33
Speaker 1: if she had been, oh my, it is my true love,
19:36
Speaker 1: then that might have been a better base from which
19:40
Speaker 1: to start. But considering Henry's impotence, him to say, Henry
19:49
Speaker 1: is storming out. He's like, I like her not, I
19:53
Speaker 1: like her not. So Henry starts talking about her appearance,
19:57
Speaker 1: and he says that you know, he had been she
19:59
Speaker 1: been flattered by the painting. Here's the thing, by all
20:03
Speaker 1: account by all accounts, the only way I can put
20:06
Speaker 1: this is in the Middle Ages, a pear shape was
20:09
Speaker 1: the perfect shape. And Jane and Catherine had all been
20:14
Speaker 1: rather slim built. You know, they all had small chests,
20:19
Speaker 1: and they were smaller, and Anne was taller than average,
20:21
Speaker 1: and we knew this. So she just didn't look like
20:24
Speaker 1: a typical english woman. She was curvy, which a point
20:27
Speaker 1: I'll get to in a minute. Henry seems to be
20:29
Speaker 1: the only one that has this opinion. I don't want
20:33
Speaker 1: to fat shame Henry the Eighth, but Anne had more
20:36
Speaker 1: reason to complain than he did, That's all I'm saying.
20:38
Speaker 1: Henry is mad. He's trying to get Crommell to like
20:42
Speaker 1: cancel the wedding, but Thomas Quemmell was like, this would
20:45
Speaker 1: be a major fuck up if you did, it would
20:48
Speaker 1: be a massive diplomatic incident. England frankly could not afford
20:53
Speaker 1: to lose the Allies. So Cromwell receives blame for the
20:58
Speaker 1: Holboyd portrait. And they don't meet officially until the third
21:03
Speaker 1: of January on Blackheath outside the gates of Greenwich Park
21:06
Speaker 1: or there's like the big grand reception going on. I
21:09
Speaker 1: fancy he's still trying to get Cromwell to find a
21:12
Speaker 1: legal way out of the marriage, despite King Henry's very
21:17
Speaker 1: very vocal disapproval and misgivings regarding Anne in the marriage.
21:23
Speaker 1: They got married on the sixth of January fifteen forty
21:27
Speaker 1: at the Royal Palace of Placentia in Greenwich, London, by
21:31
Speaker 1: the Archbishop Thomas Crammer. When Anne arrived in England, she
21:34
Speaker 1: basically conformed to Anglicanism. You know, this was very much
21:38
Speaker 1: expected because you're supposed to royal princesses generally, you're supposed
21:42
Speaker 1: to go there and adopt the name and culture of
21:46
Speaker 1: their and AND's wedding ring has God send me well
21:51
Speaker 1: to keep engraved on it, which is pretty nice. So yeah,
21:54
Speaker 1: they got married. All that was left was the king
21:56
Speaker 1: to do his duty. He had an heir, he needed
21:59
Speaker 1: a spare. But we have to remember that he is
22:02
Speaker 1: has the ulcero's leg. He's not as fit as he
22:05
Speaker 1: once was, and he was suffering from bouts of impotence.
22:08
Speaker 1: Like this, Between Henry's bouts of impotence, his impatience and innocence,
22:15
Speaker 1: the marriage is never consummated. So, okay, they're in bed
22:19
Speaker 1: and he had run his hands over her body, and
22:23
Speaker 1: he feels that her belly is soft and her breasts
22:27
Speaker 1: are loose, loose, and so he starts complaining like she
22:32
Speaker 1: can't be a virgin, she's no made. So this whole
22:35
Speaker 1: thing is he's running his hands over her body and
22:38
Speaker 1: he is so repelled by it that he is incapable
22:41
Speaker 1: of doing anything. Because of course that's to blame and
22:44
Speaker 1: not him, So he's their complaining to Cromwell, going on
22:47
Speaker 1: about she's not fair and she's not virgin, she has
22:51
Speaker 1: evil smells about her. Everybody smells. It's the Middle Ages,
22:56
Speaker 1: it's all I'm saying, anyway, sure, And also it's probably
22:59
Speaker 1: his ulster's leg that's smell. And I'm just saying, the
23:03
Speaker 1: only time Henry has been near a woman with fuller
23:07
Speaker 1: breasts would probably be post childbirth. The kind of woman
23:12
Speaker 1: he was with. Even in his letters to Anne Boleyn,
23:14
Speaker 1: he mentions her little duckies and small breasts and so
23:19
Speaker 1: that's what he likes. He likes a small breasted so yeah,
23:23
Speaker 1: so on and so forth. He's complaining that his bride
23:26
Speaker 1: was indisposed to excite and provoke any lust in him,
23:30
Speaker 1: and he could never be stirred to know her colneally,
23:32
Speaker 1: and he leaves her as good a maid as he
23:35
Speaker 1: found her, and honestly, I think this really helped her.
23:40
Speaker 1: And then on Anne's side, so Anne is praising the
23:43
Speaker 1: king as a husband, as a kind husband, having away
23:47
Speaker 1: chat with the Countess of Rutland, and she tells her
23:50
Speaker 1: that and like and this is like February fifteen forty
23:54
Speaker 1: and she basically tells her that when he comes to bed,
23:56
Speaker 1: you know, he kisses her and he takes her by
23:58
Speaker 1: the hand and he says good night, sweetheart. In the
24:01
Speaker 1: morning he kisses her and says farewell, darling, like he's
24:04
Speaker 1: always very polite to her and kind and and Lady
24:08
Speaker 1: Rutland basically says, girl, you get to do more than that.
24:13
Speaker 1: Otherwise there isn't going to be a Juky York Like
24:15
Speaker 1: the juk Yorky would be despair. I think a sexual
24:19
Speaker 1: relationship between Anne of Claves and Henry the Eight would
24:23
Speaker 1: have put her in a situation where she would not
24:26
Speaker 1: have been looked upon favorably by Henry. But the fact
24:30
Speaker 1: that she was so innocent, and you know, I think
24:33
Speaker 1: that really really helps solidify her as a non threat.
24:38
Speaker 1: And the fact that because she was so innocent, she
24:40
Speaker 1: couldn't judge Henry and she never spoke ill of his
24:44
Speaker 1: sexual prowess because she had she had no knowledge, she
24:47
Speaker 1: had no consideration, she had nothing. So she was perfect
24:49
Speaker 1: in the way that she couldn't put him down in
24:51
Speaker 1: the ways that mattered to him the most. So Henry
24:54
Speaker 1: and Anne they put on this good front every time
24:56
Speaker 1: they go to like banquets and events. They are showing
24:59
Speaker 1: strong side by side, but all the while in the
25:02
Speaker 1: background Henry and his lawyers and so on and so forth,
25:07
Speaker 1: he has got them looking over the treaty and the
25:10
Speaker 1: marriage contract to try and find some kind of loophole
25:14
Speaker 1: for him to end the marriage. Even though Henry was
25:17
Speaker 1: not super keen on AND's appearance, her quote unquote queenly
25:22
Speaker 1: manner and dignity were always because she had been so
25:27
Speaker 1: I don't want to say subservient, but because she had
25:30
Speaker 1: been so willing to learn about England and found the
25:33
Speaker 1: best way to assimilate in English culture and the best
25:37
Speaker 1: way to be to serve the king. And she had
25:40
Speaker 1: this dignity and queenly manner. And is writing to her
25:44
Speaker 1: family saying that she's very happy with her husband, and
25:47
Speaker 1: yet they're going to tournaments and celebrations and all public
25:53
Speaker 1: events and being raised the way she was in Germany.
25:57
Speaker 1: She didn't have the courtly refined mints. You know, she's
26:01
Speaker 1: seen as a bit of an embarrassment to the tutor court,
26:04
Speaker 1: regardless of how eager to play she was. So yeah,
26:09
Speaker 1: she's twenty four and he's forty eight, so he's twice
26:12
Speaker 1: her age. So Anne of claims is the same age
26:15
Speaker 1: as Mary, Tudor Henry's daughter, and the two of them
26:18
Speaker 1: actually strike up a friendship, and it sort of shows
26:21
Speaker 1: how likable Anne was because Mary is a staunch Catholic
26:26
Speaker 1: and she's not into reformers or anything like that. Anne
26:30
Speaker 1: is also mad about Elizabeth. She loves Elizabeth. She said
26:34
Speaker 1: that to have Elizabeth as a daughter would have been
26:37
Speaker 1: a greater happiness than for her to be Queen. I
26:41
Speaker 1: might have been eager to please, and she might have
26:43
Speaker 1: been a caring and considerate wife, and she may not
26:47
Speaker 1: have the quote unquote sophistication required for Tudor court, but
26:51
Speaker 1: she wasn't an idiot. She was perfectly aware that her
26:55
Speaker 1: lady in waiting, Catherine Howard. Here her is definitely more
26:58
Speaker 1: petite and lemmar and more aligned with the English style
27:03
Speaker 1: of beauty at the time, which wouldn't be hard because
27:06
Speaker 1: she was still a teenager. But that's neither here nor there. Initially,
27:10
Speaker 1: Anne does complain to the you know, the ambassador for
27:14
Speaker 1: Duke of Claves, but she kind of realizes that she
27:18
Speaker 1: just has to be okay with the situation. She had
27:20
Speaker 1: to reconcile it because she was very aware of her
27:23
Speaker 1: situation and where she was. So by the twenty fourth
27:27
Speaker 1: of June fifteen forty, Anne is ordered by the council
27:31
Speaker 1: to remove herself from court and fuck off to Richmond Palace.
27:36
Speaker 1: And while she's there, she finds out that her marriage
27:40
Speaker 1: to Henry had been called into question because this is
27:44
Speaker 1: what they ran with. Henry the eighth was concerned about
27:48
Speaker 1: her previous engagement to the Duke of Lorraine and had
27:52
Speaker 1: therefore refrained from consummating the union and is not happy,
27:57
Speaker 1: but she's a pragmatist, like she is very aware of
28:01
Speaker 1: the situation. Cromwell is in the Tower of London. He's
28:05
Speaker 1: being held, he's arrested for treason and so he has
28:08
Speaker 1: to provide testimony regarding the marriage to support the nullmen.
28:14
Speaker 1: An ecclesiastical inquiry is commissioned and at gagglea counselors, they
28:20
Speaker 1: arrive in Richmond in early July, you know, to chat
28:23
Speaker 1: to Anne. Anne is so shocked, you know, this whole
28:26
Speaker 1: whirlwind of events because remember Henry does this, He's like
28:31
Speaker 1: very kind to consider it, and he shows affection and
28:33
Speaker 1: he says he's on your side, and then he turns
28:35
Speaker 1: around and being the fucking prick that he is, stabs
28:39
Speaker 1: in the fucking back. Anne, completely shocked, faints and when
28:44
Speaker 1: she's recovered, so once she gets up, the first thing
28:47
Speaker 1: she does is she refuses to consent to get inquiry.
28:49
Speaker 1: She's like, what the fuck? No? Fuck that for a
28:52
Speaker 1: game of soldiers not But then she has a little
28:55
Speaker 1: think once she's calmed down a little bit, when she's
28:58
Speaker 1: reassessed the situation and thinks, oh shit, Catherine of Arragon
29:04
Speaker 1: banished and spurned Anne Boleyn beheaded, and both of them
29:09
Speaker 1: had dealt with an assassination of character, had already been
29:13
Speaker 1: publicly rejected by the king. She then agrees to the
29:18
Speaker 1: inquiry and the marriage is annulled on the ninth of
29:22
Speaker 1: July fifteen forty. The annoma gets confirmed by Parliament three
29:26
Speaker 1: days later, and Anne writes a letter of submission to Henry,
29:31
Speaker 1: offers herself up as a humble servant and refers to
29:35
Speaker 1: His Majesty's clean and pure living with her. So basically
29:39
Speaker 1: her compliance is rewarded. Henry grants her Richmond Palace, blitchingly
29:45
Speaker 1: manner and in quite a large annual income. She gets
29:49
Speaker 1: to keep all her royal jewels, plates, are goods, and
29:53
Speaker 1: loads of stuff to furnish all her new properties. She
29:55
Speaker 1: gets the status becoming an honorary member of the King's
29:59
Speaker 1: family known is the King's sister and so she would
30:01
Speaker 1: be above old women in Land except for his wife
30:05
Speaker 1: and his daughters. Later on, he also gives her possession
30:08
Speaker 1: of Heaver Castle, which was Anne Boleyn's home. So Henry
30:12
Speaker 1: marries Catherine Howard on the twenty eighth of July fifteen
30:16
Speaker 1: forty like less than a month later, and to show
30:19
Speaker 1: there's no hard feelings and to be respectful again a
30:23
Speaker 1: very compliant servant of the king, and then dances with
30:27
Speaker 1: Catherine Howard after she marries Henry eight like this, and
30:32
Speaker 1: by fifteen forty two, and as we know that marriage
30:35
Speaker 1: didn't work out, she gets beheaded and there's pressure for
30:39
Speaker 1: the king to remarry again because he still doesn't have
30:43
Speaker 1: his spare AND's brother is now the Duke of Eulick Clevesburg,
30:48
Speaker 1: and he's like, hey, maybe you should remarry Anne. Eh,
30:53
Speaker 1: like she's a good wife, and Anne she really hoped
30:56
Speaker 1: that she would be reinstated as queen. Effectively, she had
30:59
Speaker 1: so any signs of resentment after being publicly humiliated and rejected.
31:07
Speaker 1: She was a regular visitor to court. Henry had also
31:11
Speaker 1: visited her a bunch of times and they even exchanged
31:14
Speaker 1: New Year's gifts in fifteen forty two. He had no
31:17
Speaker 1: intention of ever getting back with her. That just no,
31:20
Speaker 1: that was just in no situation for him. By placing
31:22
Speaker 1: her in the position of sister, it actually made it easier,
31:25
Speaker 1: I think for him. But Anne was bitterly disappointed when
31:30
Speaker 1: he marries Catherine Parr, stating that, you know, Katherine Power
31:34
Speaker 1: wasn't even as pretty as Anne was. We can see
31:37
Speaker 1: this in jayways. It was either all for shure she
31:40
Speaker 1: was living comfortably with all of the benefits of being
31:44
Speaker 1: a queen, but none of the disadvantages of being married
31:47
Speaker 1: when aging bloated and quite tyrannical king. But also Anne
31:52
Speaker 1: was publicly rejected and she had no real role in England.
31:57
Speaker 1: But she couldn't exactly return to Cleaves because because if
32:00
Speaker 1: she did, she would return penniless, she would be dependent
32:02
Speaker 1: on her brother, and she would be shamed and ridiculed
32:06
Speaker 1: for being an unworthy wife to equate to a king.
32:10
Speaker 1: And so because of Henry's initial statements of you know,
32:13
Speaker 1: the first night of him saying that she wasn't made
32:16
Speaker 1: rumor goes around that you know, she had a child
32:20
Speaker 1: and this, like Henry has this investigated, but there was
32:23
Speaker 1: like zero evidence this ever happened. Like no, and she
32:28
Speaker 1: doesn't really have freedom. I mean one, it's the middle
32:30
Speaker 1: fucking ages. No woman has freedom like her servants are
32:34
Speaker 1: expected to report on her movements. The letter she writes
32:37
Speaker 1: to her family are monitored. You know, Ann's mother raised
32:42
Speaker 1: her to be frugal, but she was terrible with money.
32:46
Speaker 1: She was she was often in debt. So when Henry
32:50
Speaker 1: dies in fifteen forty seven and nine year old Edward
32:55
Speaker 1: takes the throne and status quickly declines the king's counsel.
33:00
Speaker 1: They kind of see her as a non person and
33:02
Speaker 1: a drain on the resources, and they just take back
33:05
Speaker 1: two of her manners that Henry had given her. So
33:07
Speaker 1: she's a he. And she's like, you know what, fuck it,
33:10
Speaker 1: Let's love life the best I can. And she turns
33:13
Speaker 1: her house at Have into this kind of like a
33:15
Speaker 1: miniature court. She receives esteemed guests from across the kingdom,
33:19
Speaker 1: including Princess Elizabeth, and through all of these guests, she
33:25
Speaker 1: keeps up with what's going on at court and gets
33:28
Speaker 1: invitations to visit court herself. So when Edward dies and
33:33
Speaker 1: Mary the First comes to the throne, Elizabeth and Anne
33:37
Speaker 1: get a place of honor at Mary's coronation, and in
33:41
Speaker 1: the procession to Westminster Abbey, Anne and Elizabeth walk together
33:45
Speaker 1: directly behind the new Queen. So, because Anna and Elizabeth
33:48
Speaker 1: are both sort of because they're both Anglican Reformists, there's
33:52
Speaker 1: a rumor spreading around that, you know, they're conspiring against
33:56
Speaker 1: Queen Mary and her Catholic regime. Mary was like, no,
33:59
Speaker 1: Anne is doing no such a thing, so Ane, in
34:01
Speaker 1: typical fashion, she just she leaves court pretty soon after
34:06
Speaker 1: Mary gets the thrown and spends most of her time
34:09
Speaker 1: out by like Chelsea or hea her and she's gonna,
34:13
Speaker 1: you know, just live her life quietly. When Anne's health
34:17
Speaker 1: starts to fail and she's just outliving her life out by,
34:21
Speaker 1: and she starts getting ill. When and as this happens,
34:25
Speaker 1: Mary lets her stay in Chelsea old manner. So Anne
34:29
Speaker 1: starts dictating her last will and testament. So she mentions
34:33
Speaker 1: her brother, her sister, her sister in law, Princess Elizabeth,
34:37
Speaker 1: the Duchess of Suffolk and the Countess of Arundel, so
34:40
Speaker 1: in her will it names nearly all her servants individually.
34:46
Speaker 1: She left keepsakes to both of her stepdaughters and Catherine,
34:50
Speaker 1: the dowerder Duchess of Suffolk, which was a really brave
34:53
Speaker 1: move because Catherine had actually gone into exile during Mary's reign.
34:59
Speaker 1: But the reason Anna left something for her was because
35:02
Speaker 1: Catherine was one of the first people to welcome her
35:05
Speaker 1: when she got to England. When it came to her servants,
35:07
Speaker 1: Anne had bequested that Mary and Elizabeth employ her servants
35:12
Speaker 1: in their households so they had somewhere to work. And
35:15
Speaker 1: all of her servants they never had anything bad to
35:18
Speaker 1: say about her. It was she was generally love and
35:22
Speaker 1: on the sixteenth of July fifteen fifty seven, at the
35:25
Speaker 1: age of forty one, Anne of Cleaves past away and
35:29
Speaker 1: she is buried in Westminster Abbey on the third of
35:32
Speaker 1: August fifteen fifty seven. It really shows you how sensible
35:36
Speaker 1: and of Cleaves must have been. I mean, granted, she
35:39
Speaker 1: outlived all of the other of Henry's wives and probably
35:43
Speaker 1: had a better ending than most of them. She managed
35:46
Speaker 1: to stay in everybody's like good graces. Like so she
35:50
Speaker 1: had seen. She had been publicly rejected by the king,
35:54
Speaker 1: she had properties taken off of her by Edward the sex,
35:58
Speaker 1: she survived taking the throne and instigating a Catholic regime.
36:04
Speaker 1: And apart from the initial statements regarding her looks and
36:09
Speaker 1: her beauty afar from that small pocket of insults, nobody
36:13
Speaker 1: really had a bad thing to say about her. She
36:15
Speaker 1: was well liked. So what did we learn today? Sometimes
36:20
Speaker 1: pragmatism is more important than principle if you want to survive.
36:25
Speaker 1: What did we learn today? Sometimes pragmatism is more important
36:30
Speaker 1: than principle if you want to survive. I'm not sure
36:35
Speaker 1: I could take such a public rejection as well as
36:38
Speaker 1: and died. You were not to blame for an old
36:41
Speaker 1: dude's impotence. Male order brides are people too. That's it.
36:46
Speaker 1: Not fuck that, you know what, That's what it is.
36:47
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, but that's oh my goodness, I sorry, but
36:52
Speaker 1: I just like realized that those political marriages when they
36:56
Speaker 1: get a princess from another like region or country or
36:59
Speaker 1: whatever to come over Maria King or prince or whatever
37:01
Speaker 1: the hell it was at the time, Like, that's a
37:04
Speaker 1: male order bride ye ol day style, Like what the fuck? Okay, yeah,
37:09
Speaker 1: if you like today's story, feel free to go on
37:13
Speaker 1: to Apple Podcasts and rate and review five stars. You
37:18
Speaker 1: don't have to say anything about the podcast. You can
37:20
Speaker 1: say round and round the Rugged Rocks, the Ragged Rascal Run.
37:24
Speaker 1: That's our story of Ann of Cleaves. But anyway, I
37:27
Speaker 1: am gonna go, So until next time, Adios au revoir
37:32
Speaker 1: of Waiaz My Friends,