Latest / The Paul Barron Crypto Show / Banks & TradFi Declare CLARITY War vs ETH & SOL🔥GRAYSCALE Zach Pandl INTERVIEW🚨

Transcript

Banks & TradFi Declare CLARITY War vs ETH & SOL🔥GRAYSCALE Zach Pandl INTERVIEW🚨 · The Paul Barron Crypto Show

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: All right, so let's jump into it today.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: We're going to be talking about how banks are putting
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: on the pressure for clarity. They also have some new
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: friends that we'll talk about and get into all of that.
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: We'll have a special guest for you before we start, though,
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: I do want to thank our sponsor, and that is Tangent,
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: where you guys can get into self custody. Maybe it's
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: for your first time. We have a lot of new
• 0:19
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• 0:22
  Speaker 2: done self custody or tried it.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: This is the way to do it.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: So first go over to tangent dot com, get in
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: on the three card set is what you want. That way,
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: you've always got that extra very easy to set up.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: One of the most secure platforms out there in terms
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: of building a self custody model. So all you have
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: to do hit our linked down below. It's going to
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: give you a little bit of a discount and the
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: discount stacks on top of the current discounts available. So
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: use the code and it does help the channel. Let's
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: go to before I bring on Zach Pandel, I want
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: to go to a clip real quick, and this will
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: explain a little bit more around where the ABA is
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: and why they're panicking.
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: Take a look to be sure.
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: We think there are opportunities to strengthen this bill further,
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: and I think you'll continue to see advocacy from us.
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: But yeah, that's the It's come a long way.
• 1:10
  Speaker 5: So just to push on that a little more, Brooke,
• 1:12
  Speaker 5: did banks get what they wanted?
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: Or is this.
• 1:14
  Speaker 5: Compromise vague enough that coinbase could find a way around
• 1:17
  Speaker 5: it just within a few months Coinbase for example, Sure.
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: So.
• 1:21
  Speaker 4: Unfortunately, I think it is a little too vague at
• 1:24
  Speaker 4: this point.
• 1:25
  Speaker 6: But if tokenized deposits are so compelling, it seems still
• 1:28
  Speaker 6: like every bank is launching a stable coin strategy rather
• 1:32
  Speaker 6: than a tokenized deposit product. Is the banking industry building
• 1:35
  Speaker 6: the thing? It says at once.
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: The banking industry understands those strengths and is very eager
• 1:41
  Speaker 4: to implement them and to better meet our customers' needs.
• 1:45
  Speaker 5: Brooke, I'd want to switch gears. Just about thirty seconds
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: left here. The FED recently granted crack in a limited
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: purpose master account. It's the first crypto from to get one.
• 1:53
  Speaker 5: You've called it quote putting the cart far ahead, so
• 1:56
  Speaker 5: far ahead that the horse will will never catch up.
• 1:58
  Speaker 5: What are you specifically worried about?
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: Access to the payment system is a very important privilege.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: So I think the clarity issue is that innovation is
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: what they're worried about, because being able to stay up
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: with innovation, especially as it starts to grow so quickly,
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: is the issue. So I wanted to bring on Zach.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: Panel comes in from Gray Scales, been with us before.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: How are you, Zach?
• 2:22
  Speaker 7: I'm great, Paul, Great to see you. Great to be
• 2:24
  Speaker 7: back on the program.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: Hey, Zach.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: We've been covering a few things that continue to kind
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: of push against clarity.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: We had a video we did not too.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: Long ago, Elizabeth Warren going at it her of course,
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: attack has been through the occ going after these banking charters.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: Why do you think that the banks have not just
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: finally said, hey, listen, we're going to be able to innovate,
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: We're going to be able to build new products, We're
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: going to be able to keep our customers with all
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: this great new problem.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Why do you think they haven't done that yet?
• 2:55
  Speaker 7: Well, look, I think they're not ready to lay down
• 2:57
  Speaker 7: their arms at this late stage. And I think the
• 3:01
  Speaker 7: resistance to clarity reflects how important this piece of legislation
• 3:06
  Speaker 7: can be what it means for the digital assets the industry.
• 3:09
  Speaker 7: You know, this is going to unlock tokenization, This is
• 3:12
  Speaker 7: going to unlock decentralized finance, allow institutional capital to be
• 3:17
  Speaker 7: building on all of these blockchains. It's a hugely important
• 3:20
  Speaker 7: thing for the crypto industry. I think the banks get that.
• 3:23
  Speaker 7: You know, they don't necessarily want that competition. They'd like
• 3:28
  Speaker 7: to keep control over these parts of the financial system.
• 3:31
  Speaker 7: Clarity is going to bring in new competition and bring
• 3:34
  Speaker 7: benefits to users, to asset issuers, to bring efficiency to
• 3:39
  Speaker 7: the financial system. That's why we want it, and I
• 3:42
  Speaker 7: think that that's why it's going to happen.
• 3:44
  Speaker 8: Ultimately.
• 3:44
  Speaker 7: This is the right set of policies for the United
• 3:47
  Speaker 7: States financial system, and I think we're going to see
• 3:49
  Speaker 7: a bipartisan vote to get this piece of legislation over
• 3:52
  Speaker 7: the line.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: All right, So you have the banks clearly in opposition
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: here of almost everything when it comes to Clarity.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: And an interesting.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: Participant that we've talked about before is the DTCC. I
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: want to play a clip for you because their CEO
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: sounds like he's doing a little bit of the Italian
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: Goodfellas plan.
• 4:12
  Speaker 9: Take a look, let's be a little honest with each other.
• 4:16
  Speaker 9: There's some hype around this. When the early conversations on
• 4:20
  Speaker 9: blockchain focused on disintermediation, this thinking was premature at best,
• 4:27
  Speaker 9: and I'm being very polite about how I say it.
• 4:30
  Speaker 9: DTCC will serve as the connector and common ledger for
• 4:34
  Speaker 9: the financial system.
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: The digital highway.
• 4:37
  Speaker 9: Begins with us.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: That's a fact.
• 4:40
  Speaker 9: We will safeguard liquidity from fragmentation, and I cannot stress
• 4:44
  Speaker 9: that enough. We have got to keep an eye to
• 4:48
  Speaker 9: make sure assets are not disaggregated, and I firmly believe
• 4:52
  Speaker 9: that we as an industry have got to stay focused
• 4:55
  Speaker 9: on that, and we feel very strongly about that, and
• 4:58
  Speaker 9: DTCC is going to do everything can to make sure
• 5:01
  Speaker 9: that the industry does not fragment. That is not good
• 5:05
  Speaker 9: for anybody. DTCC will be operating twenty four x five
• 5:09
  Speaker 9: and is the center of gravity for blockchain innovation and
• 5:12
  Speaker 9: digital asset adoption. Financial institutions need to take action right
• 5:17
  Speaker 9: now if they want to participate in this journey. So
• 5:21
  Speaker 9: here are some of the questions we're discussing. Which wallets
• 5:25
  Speaker 9: and l one networks do you want to use? And
• 5:27
  Speaker 9: are you prepared when our tokenization service launches in October,
• 5:32
  Speaker 9: which blockchain use cases are most important to your organization,
• 5:37
  Speaker 9: But no matter what, keep in mind, DTCC will be
• 5:40
  Speaker 9: your strategic partner, all.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: Right, So kind of throwing down the gauntlet here in
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: terms of how they envision this working. When you look
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: at tokenization and the use of many of these l
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: ones out there, do you think that the DTCC is
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: in a position right now to kind of dictate these
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: terms out to the end of city because it feels
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: to me like this is still a very open opportunity
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: for many different companies.
• 6:05
  Speaker 7: You know, Paul, that is a fascinating clip. I think
• 6:09
  Speaker 7: that the DTCC and other institutions at the center of
• 6:14
  Speaker 7: the financial system are in a position to help shape
• 6:18
  Speaker 7: this over the short run. I do think that the
• 6:21
  Speaker 7: financial system is not totally ready to move to full decentralization,
• 6:27
  Speaker 7: and some of these institutions will help shape the short
• 6:29
  Speaker 7: run outcome. But also in that same clip, you see
• 6:33
  Speaker 7: the limits of what the current model offers. The DTCC
• 6:37
  Speaker 7: will operate, he said twenty four to five, you know,
• 6:40
  Speaker 7: leaving two seven of the week for other systems to
• 6:45
  Speaker 7: operate and help provide liquidity for the financial system. So
• 6:49
  Speaker 7: Over time, we are going to move to open architecture
• 6:52
  Speaker 7: blockchains like Ethereum, like Solana, and to the vision of
• 6:57
  Speaker 7: decentralized finance, and I believe that we will ultimately significantly
• 7:02
  Speaker 7: disintermediate certain institutional players, potentially including parts of the custody ecosystem.
• 7:10
  Speaker 7: But over the short run, the DTCC has a certain
• 7:12
  Speaker 7: important role to play, and I think these institution centric
• 7:16
  Speaker 7: blockchain frameworks, things like Canton, that the DTCC is partnering with,
• 7:21
  Speaker 7: have some runway over the short run as as a
• 7:25
  Speaker 7: first step towards our tokenized future.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: In the beginning, there was also what was it, alta Vista. Yeah,
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: in the beginning there was alta Vista. Does anybody get
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: that joke? Do you know what I'm talking about?
• 7:39
  Speaker 7: Look, I think that that's a good I think that's
• 7:40
  Speaker 7: a good metaphor, Paul that you know, when you saw
• 7:43
  Speaker 7: the Internet build out, there were things that help shape
• 7:46
  Speaker 7: the onboarding of people online platforms and things that helped
• 7:50
  Speaker 7: with that process, and ultimately we moved away from that
• 7:53
  Speaker 7: to a more open architecture system. My thesis on blockchains
• 7:57
  Speaker 7: will be similar to that.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: All right, oh cool.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: Here's a clip though, Zach where they actually go. It
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: feels like they're going directly at DeFi.
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: Take a look.
• 8:08
  Speaker 10: For example, people often talk about decentralized finance or DeFi.
• 8:12
  Speaker 10: Our view is, if you are performing functions that are
• 8:15
  Speaker 10: akin to acting as a broker dealer or another regulated
• 8:19
  Speaker 10: intermediory VENU creation order routing, seeing non custodial wall providers
• 8:25
  Speaker 10: DeFi user interfaces and automated market makers, you should be
• 8:29
  Speaker 10: required to register. You need to go through a proper process.
• 8:33
  Speaker 10: It's broadly consultative, not through an ad hoc and no
• 8:36
  Speaker 10: action or exemptive relief process that that should be a
• 8:39
  Speaker 10: narrowly defined time bound has some guardrails around the customers
• 8:44
  Speaker 10: that can access at least in the initial phases and
• 8:47
  Speaker 10: transaction volume to avoid price and liquidity fragmentation around the markets.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: So what they're simply saying is DeFi no good. We're
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: basically trying to kill it. That itself is a bad thing.
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: I want to back this up with one more clip,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: then I'll get your comments on this. This is hester
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: Paris kind of talking about this very issue. She was
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: actually kind of harassed a little bit by the DTCC
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: in reference to this.
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: Take a look.
• 9:12
  Speaker 8: You know, as you mentioned, I think We submitted maybe
• 9:16
  Speaker 8: a dozen letters now at this point to the Crypto
• 9:19
  Speaker 8: task Force that she leads, and then every time we
• 9:22
  Speaker 8: submitted a letter, she came back with more questions that
• 9:24
  Speaker 8: we had to submit another letter.
• 9:25
  Speaker 11: And I think your letters always come back to, well,
• 9:27
  Speaker 11: there's someone behind that software, and we need to put
• 9:31
  Speaker 11: a regulatory thumb on that someone.
• 9:35
  Speaker 8: Whether it's the person developing the software or the entity
• 9:38
  Speaker 8: where that person is, there is somebody who's accountable. So
• 9:41
  Speaker 8: I think that's also sort of a foundational principle.
• 9:44
  Speaker 11: Is that may be something that you and I don't
• 9:46
  Speaker 11: see exactly the same way, But if Mary and Joe
• 9:49
  Speaker 11: decide they want to do a peer to peer transaction,
• 9:52
  Speaker 11: that's a decision that they're making. And I don't we
• 9:54
  Speaker 11: shouldn't stand in the way of people doing what they
• 9:57
  Speaker 11: want to do unless we have a good reason to
• 9:59
  Speaker 11: do that. And I don't think there's any there's any
• 10:02
  Speaker 11: reason that there shouldn't be peer to peer trading. But
• 10:05
  Speaker 11: I think most of it is going to be involving
• 10:08
  Speaker 11: some kind of intermediary and then it's just figuring out
• 10:11
  Speaker 11: how we've got to attach the regulation.
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: HESTER is always so nice in basically saying shut the
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: f up. You don't know what you're talking about. What
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: do you think is especially we've got the Crypto Task
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: Force leader right there taking a look at this and saying, hey, listen,
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: this is going to happen. It's really two different people
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: trading out here. It has nothing to do with the
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: software side of it, which is exactly where DeFi is heading.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Would you agree on her position or do you kind
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: of side with.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: The DCCC here.
• 10:42
  Speaker 7: Look, I think hester purs is exactly right on this topic,
• 10:45
  Speaker 7: and you know our view, and I think the right
• 10:47
  Speaker 7: view is let's let the users decide. You know, if
• 10:51
  Speaker 7: decentralized finance platforms are going to lead to lower liquidity,
• 10:55
  Speaker 7: then users are not going to use them. If they're
• 10:58
  Speaker 7: not going to have the effective price discovery, then traders
• 11:02
  Speaker 7: are not going to use these platforms. And so if
• 11:04
  Speaker 7: they are kind of weak platforms and not as effective
• 11:09
  Speaker 7: as centralized exchanges, then there's nothing for these players to
• 11:12
  Speaker 7: worry about. The reason that they are concerned is that
• 11:15
  Speaker 7: these are effective ways to intermediate savings and investment in
• 11:19
  Speaker 7: the financial system and create new efficiencies and create new
• 11:23
  Speaker 7: benefits for users. That's why they're going to be broadly adopted,
• 11:26
  Speaker 7: and that's why we need a clear regulatory framework around them.
• 11:29
  Speaker 7: That's exactly what we are getting. I think these are
• 11:31
  Speaker 7: somewhat last ditch efforts to prevent the legislation from getting
• 11:35
  Speaker 7: over the line. I don't think they're going to get
• 11:38
  Speaker 7: the job done, and then we are going to get
• 11:40
  Speaker 7: this comprehensive regulatory framework for DeFi and other parts of
• 11:43
  Speaker 7: the industry.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: I mean, we were watching a little bit of a
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: spat between Canton and Sui over the weekend on X
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: and yet you've all in there kind of hitting because
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: they were talking about market making and they were pointing
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: directly at Sui, and of course so Dania came back
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: and said, hey, we're not doing any of this.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: We've worked basically see or excuse me.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: Suite has zero VC allocation still vesting, which is kind
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: of the reference. And of course Canton Holly partner with
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: the DTCC.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: Here.
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: There might be a little bit of turf battle clearly
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: setting up here in the world of DeFi, especially as
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: we start to see tokenization and really Main Street and
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Wall Street kind of converging at the same time. So
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: intriguing stuff to watch for sure. I want to leap
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: over to Ethereum. A little bit you guys put out,
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: Actually you put out the statement hearers, and this was
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: in reference to the staking model that needs an update.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: Tell me a little bit about where you think this
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: is heading and why it needs the update in terms
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: of the supply cut.
• 12:48
  Speaker 7: Absolutely, and I'll say at the outset, this is a
• 12:51
  Speaker 7: somewhat wonky topic. So just to try to get the
• 12:54
  Speaker 7: key things across. Look, Ethereum should be scarce. These are
• 13:00
  Speaker 7: assets that are commodities, and they're valued when they're in
• 13:03
  Speaker 7: high demand, and when they're scarce, you know, demand and supply,
• 13:07
  Speaker 7: just like other commodities. And I would like to see
• 13:10
  Speaker 7: ethereum have maximum scarcity or as little possible supply.
• 13:15
  Speaker 10: And so by.
• 13:15
  Speaker 7: Changing the staking model, we can reduce inflation on the
• 13:19
  Speaker 7: Ethereum network and increase its scarcity. We think that that
• 13:22
  Speaker 7: will increase the value of the asset ether over time.
• 13:27
  Speaker 7: Now there's other dimensions of this story and things that
• 13:30
  Speaker 7: are motivating it. We want to avoid concentration and tail
• 13:34
  Speaker 7: risks among staking service providers. We want to account for
• 13:37
  Speaker 7: the fact that the burn mechanism on the Ethereum blockchain
• 13:41
  Speaker 7: is not quite as intense as it once was in
• 13:43
  Speaker 7: the past. These are the things that are motivating this discussion.
• 13:46
  Speaker 7: But the key thing to get across is that scarcity
• 13:49
  Speaker 7: means more value for the token, and these changes would
• 13:52
  Speaker 7: bring greater scarcity to ether.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: All right, So scarcity versus yields really is what you're
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: talking about here. Institutional love yields, and that's one of
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: the reasons we've seen so much activity in ETH in general.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Do you think that is a long term view for
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: eth more of a scarcity play versus the opportunity to
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: go in the direction of just higher performing yields to
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: traditional markets. I mean, if you look at a money
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: market and kind of compare that yields matter the most.
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: What are your what's your opinion on that?
• 14:23
  Speaker 7: I think that framing versus money markets is a great
• 14:26
  Speaker 7: way to think about it. The key difference is that
• 14:28
  Speaker 7: a money market has a one dollar value and it
• 14:31
  Speaker 7: holds that value. Ethereum may pay three percent to staking ward,
• 14:35
  Speaker 7: but is an asset that has sixty to seventy percent
• 14:38
  Speaker 7: annualized volatility, So it's mostly the price changes that drive
• 14:42
  Speaker 7: your returns. Ethereum staking reward rate at three percent today,
• 14:47
  Speaker 7: for example, is about one day's price volatility, so it's
• 14:51
  Speaker 7: a pretty small amount of yield compared to the price returns.
• 14:55
  Speaker 7: I think absolutely Ethereum should steer in the direction of
• 14:58
  Speaker 7: being a maximally sk scarce asset, more along like the
• 15:02
  Speaker 7: lines of Bitcoin, and there'll be yield opportunities on chain
• 15:07
  Speaker 7: through liquidity provision, from lending platforms, through stable coins and
• 15:12
  Speaker 7: tokenized assets. You know, there'll be different ways to provide
• 15:15
  Speaker 7: yield to on chain, But for Ethereum the asset, I
• 15:18
  Speaker 7: think you want a platform that is neutral, that is
• 15:21
  Speaker 7: censorship resistant, and that has a scarce token. That's what
• 15:25
  Speaker 7: our view is that these changes are warranted today.
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: What about ether rewards versus if we get rate hikes.
• 15:32
  Speaker 7: Rate hikes challenge the value of every asset because they
• 15:35
  Speaker 7: sort of raise the hurdle rate for everything in the economy,
• 15:39
  Speaker 7: whether it's a money market fund, or it's an equity
• 15:41
  Speaker 7: or a bond or a crypto asset. So higher rates
• 15:45
  Speaker 7: are generally going to be a headwind for several different
• 15:48
  Speaker 7: parts of the crypto ecosystem. Now they will be a
• 15:51
  Speaker 7: tailwind to certain things, especially stable coin issuers. So a
• 15:56
  Speaker 7: business like circle or tether, they make more money when
• 15:59
  Speaker 7: rates that go up. We estimate that circle makes about
• 16:02
  Speaker 7: one hundred and ninety million dollars more per year for
• 16:06
  Speaker 7: every twenty five basis points that the FED funds rate
• 16:10
  Speaker 7: or the Fed's interest rate is higher for the year.
• 16:12
  Speaker 7: So you'll see some things will face a headwind from
• 16:14
  Speaker 7: higher rates. I think ethereum bitcoin know they will be
• 16:18
  Speaker 7: held back partly by higher rates, and other parts of
• 16:21
  Speaker 7: the crypto ecosystem will receive a tailwind, especially stable coin issuers.
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: Do you think that is going to occur?
• 16:28
  Speaker 7: I think that the Fed is probably on hold for
• 16:31
  Speaker 7: the time being. I think probably rate cuts are off
• 16:35
  Speaker 7: the table right now because inflation is just too high.
• 16:39
  Speaker 7: And rate hikes, I think are still relatively unlikely because
• 16:43
  Speaker 7: most of the inflation is coming through oil prices and
• 16:46
  Speaker 7: gasoline prices as a result of the Iran conflict, and
• 16:49
  Speaker 7: that's something that could reverse relatively quickly. So I think
• 16:52
  Speaker 7: the right approach, and probably what we're going to see
• 16:54
  Speaker 7: from the Federal Reserve is just to stampad for now,
• 16:57
  Speaker 7: watch how this plays out, and then make a clearer
• 16:59
  Speaker 7: decision later in the year. My guess is rate cuts
• 17:02
  Speaker 7: slightly more likely than rate hikes.
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: Okay, let's jump over to Solana real quick, I'm looking
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: here at what MERT's talking about. It says he's kind
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: of talking about right here, good morning to everyone. Have
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: voted against reducing Solana issuance to collect rent. And then
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: you look at another tweet he had right here. The
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: ether guys didn't execute it well, but the idea was right.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Anything not seen as money has a fundamental ceiling on valuation.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: So you look at that and you kind of see
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: where Solana is heading. Do you agree with this, first
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: of all, of how issuance is being kind of proposed
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: out to the communities here as a potential reduction.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: What are your thoughts?
• 17:40
  Speaker 7: I would encourage people to think about this topic like
• 17:43
  Speaker 7: traditional commodities. You have gold, you have silver, you have copper.
• 17:47
  Speaker 7: These are all assets that have different amounts of functional
• 17:51
  Speaker 7: use as commodities, and maybe different amounts of monetary or
• 17:55
  Speaker 7: store of value premium on top of that, and they're
• 17:58
  Speaker 7: all a little bit different. I think bitcoinum Salana, they're
• 18:02
  Speaker 7: all a little bit different in that regard. Bitcoin does
• 18:04
  Speaker 7: not have all that much functional utility in the context
• 18:07
  Speaker 7: of its network, but it has a lot of store
• 18:10
  Speaker 7: of value properties. Solana has a lot of functional utility
• 18:14
  Speaker 7: Salana has millions of users and thousands of transactions per second,
• 18:17
  Speaker 7: So maybe it's more like copper, not quite as scarce
• 18:20
  Speaker 7: as gold, but a commodity that can have lots of
• 18:23
  Speaker 7: value in the context of tokenization and decentralized finance growing.
• 18:28
  Speaker 7: So these are different assets taking different approaches. In general,
• 18:31
  Speaker 7: I think the rising tide is going to lift all
• 18:34
  Speaker 7: these boats. All of these leading assets in crypto are
• 18:37
  Speaker 7: going to benefit from regulatory clarity over the coming years,
• 18:41
  Speaker 7: including both Ethereum and Solana and several others.
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: Staying on Solana, I got to look at the purp
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: activity because Purpse volume continues to explode right here. When
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: you look at Solana and the Purpse possibility here in
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: terms of a market, what do you see right now, Zach?
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: Do you think this is going to be the beginning
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: of something really, really big and they start to basically
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: take away from what has been you know, really kind
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: of controlled by other chains.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: What are your thoughts?
• 19:10
  Speaker 7: Look, I think the Purpse story is being run away
• 19:13
  Speaker 7: with by hyper liquid at the moment, you know, clearly
• 19:16
  Speaker 7: dominating that story among decentralized projects. But Solana is different.
• 19:20
  Speaker 7: Salama is a very diverse ecosystem with all kinds of
• 19:24
  Speaker 7: things going on, perpetual futures, real world assets, stable coins,
• 19:30
  Speaker 7: decentralized physical infrastructure, something I think is very interesting and
• 19:34
  Speaker 7: where Solana also dominates meme coins, NFTs. You know, it's
• 19:38
  Speaker 7: a huge ecosystem, a big tent with so many different
• 19:41
  Speaker 7: types of users. I think that that's Solana's strength. It's
• 19:44
  Speaker 7: a diverse platform, all happening on a single layer one
• 19:48
  Speaker 7: that's very cheap, very fast, great architecture, and great infrastructure
• 19:53
  Speaker 7: like wallets and DEXes. I think Solana is in a
• 19:55
  Speaker 7: great position, even if some other chains are gaining some
• 19:58
  Speaker 7: traction in narrow U cases like perpetual futures.
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: Well, and let's kind of compare this because I've got
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: a clip here of Solana and it's really kind of
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: the Solana Jupiter concept here and why it's exploding. Jup
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: has continued to make a lot of advancements on this,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: but I want to get your opinion on this clip.
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: Take a look.
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: Perpdex has been growing like crazy, all time high. It's
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: new all time high on Solana. RWA's two point eight billion,
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: growing over twelve x. My favorite part of this though,
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: ninety eight percent of all tokenized equities. Spot trading is
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: happening where is happening on Solana obviously, But the next
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: step where things start to get really interesting is a
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: partnership that we've entered into at Jupiter with Securitized and
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: Jump Trading. Massive deal. My hunch over the next six
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: to twelve months, tokenized equities is going to be one
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: of the biggest talking points on Bloomberg, CNBC and everywhere else.
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: It's Jupiter at the lead of the pack. There the
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: biggest news of cross crypto.
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: Bitwise they have more assets under management than all of
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: the TVL on Solana. But the market with Athena, Jupiter,
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: Len and Bitwise live right now race five hundred million
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: dollars in a week.
• 21:02
  Speaker 8: Yeah, I wont know what happens.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: This is like our biggest win so far.
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: Is doing great.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: Couldn't be happier.
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: If you're watching this, we need more USDG. It's been
• 21:13
  Speaker 3: fully maxed out that it's all vacuumed up. So please
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: if you're watching this in your USDG, go deposit.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: Clearly they're pumping their own bag there. You know that's
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: cash with Jupiter. But the point he's getting at I
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: think is valid, and that is their fast growth. There's
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: an opportunity here that I think this market will continue
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: to push on. So it's going to be interesting. I
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: think we've got a battle underway when it comes to
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: the purpse market.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: For sure. Who would you.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Say at what's happening right now in Jupiter versus what's
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: going on with hyper Liquid, who would you say wins
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: this in twelve months?
• 21:46
  Speaker 7: My view in twelve months is that hyper Liquid is
• 21:49
  Speaker 7: the purpse winner and Solana is a tokenized equities and
• 21:52
  Speaker 7: stable coin payments winner. I think they're both a little
• 21:55
  Speaker 7: bit different, optimized for different things. I think there's room
• 21:58
  Speaker 7: absolutely for both ask that's in institutional investor portfolios and
• 22:02
  Speaker 7: that's generally the recommendation that we make both huge use cases.
• 22:06
  Speaker 7: I think each chain has a different set of edges.
• 22:09
  Speaker 7: I give Hyperliquid the edge on purpse. I think Solana
• 22:11
  Speaker 7: has a lot going for it on token is equities
• 22:14
  Speaker 7: and stable coin payments. Those are the things I'm most
• 22:17
  Speaker 7: excited about in the soul ecosystem.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: All right, Zach, you're always you're very political there. I
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: love you with your answer.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Like that, So I'm going to go and take you
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: into the lightning grounds so we can get some hard
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: answers going. And that is the Iran war pauses clarity
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: progress and kills it.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: What do you think?
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: Yes, No, basically the Iranian war pauses clarity progress and
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: it's over.
• 22:43
  Speaker 7: I think that clarity is going to pass.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, all right, So you say no, not going to happen.
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of with you. I think it's going to
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: go through. Let's get into this. Robin Hood will happily
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: migrate everything to dtcc's chain or do you think they'll
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: stay home with their new chain, the robin Hood chain.
• 22:59
  Speaker 7: I think they stay DeFi and they continue to build
• 23:02
  Speaker 7: on their own chain.
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: I'm with you on that one. Solana Jupe Net Phoenix.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: I think you answered this earlier and Gito jt X
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: eat away at hyper liquid market in the next twelve Now,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: that would be all all four of those so versus
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: the one.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: Do you think that would be the case?
• 23:19
  Speaker 7: Look, I'm gonna say no. I think I think hyper
• 23:21
  Speaker 7: liquid does have great game in the purpose industry, and
• 23:25
  Speaker 7: I think hyper liquid will increasingly compete with traditional futures
• 23:30
  Speaker 7: exchanges like the CME. I think that that's the angle
• 23:33
  Speaker 7: that that ecosystem will go.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: Wow, if you're you're there, I'm gonna go ahead. I'm
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: gonna go opposite. I think I think they do eat
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: away at hyper liquid, but I'm listen. I think hyperlicids
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: have obviously done something. I think many people are trying
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: to figure out. Are they the early mover? Because remember
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: first time first movers often win how these markets shake out,
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: and hyper liquid has been in a good spot for sure,
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: so you.
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: Might be right.
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: We're going to go back and look at that one
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: in about a year and see who is right. Privacy
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: chains don't matter unless there's users.
• 24:05
  Speaker 7: Well, nothing matters unless there's a user, So I have
• 24:08
  Speaker 7: to agree with that, But I think privacy chains absolutely matters.
• 24:12
  Speaker 7: Z Cash a very important asset for a team grayscale
• 24:16
  Speaker 7: and something that I think has lots of further upside here.
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let's go into this and bigger threat to crypto
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: right now, Banks or DTCC in Citadel.
• 24:25
  Speaker 7: Look, I think let's say banks. Although I'm going to
• 24:29
  Speaker 7: say that all of these entities are going to get
• 24:31
  Speaker 7: on the crypto bandwagon pretty soon, I'm going.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: To go the opposite. But I do agree with you.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: I think eventually they finally succumb to the pressure, and
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: I think eventually these markets, the question is how well
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: do they migrate into the new era is the real question,
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: and that's something we will see, hopefully in the.
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: Next six to twelve months.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: Grayscale and Bitwise should have been first to wrap stretch.
• 24:58
  Speaker 7: Look, I don't know how to answer the failed versus
• 25:00
  Speaker 7: who cares. What I would say is that I would
• 25:03
  Speaker 7: like to make sure that investors understand where yield comes
• 25:07
  Speaker 7: from and in all products, and that they understand the
• 25:10
  Speaker 7: risks of these products. And that's what I've been trying
• 25:13
  Speaker 7: to do with my own work, is just to make
• 25:15
  Speaker 7: sure that the retail investors especially are fully aware of
• 25:20
  Speaker 7: the risks and the yield sources of the investments that
• 25:23
  Speaker 7: they're making.
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna go no answer on that one. Vault curator
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: race begins for asset managers.
• 25:28
  Speaker 7: True, Yes, vault curation race has already begun.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: Well, we've got some big ones too that are starting
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: to brew. Solana will be the first to figure out
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: the trusted private markets and SPVs.
• 25:40
  Speaker 7: Oh, that's a tough one. I am going to say,
• 25:44
  Speaker 7: you know, I don't know. Maybe maybe I think in
• 25:48
  Speaker 7: the middle. If you wish you watch the answer this one.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of with you. I just don't know, but
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: I think they got it. I'm going to go actually
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: a little bit more toward yes. But it's it's that's
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: a tough one, which hits all time highs first, Eth
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: or Solana. What do you think with all of the
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: things that happen on ethereum. You've got Glamsterdam coming out
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: in the fall. Possibly we could get past this Iranian
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: thing macro starts changing. Does Solana get the edge up
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: or does Eth get the.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: Edge up again?
• 26:19
  Speaker 7: Paul, you're making me choose between my children here a
• 26:22
  Speaker 7: little bit. I'm going to say ethereum in this case,
• 26:26
  Speaker 7: mostly because it is the second largest asset after a bitcoin,
• 26:33
  Speaker 7: and I think slightly more institutional capital will go to
• 26:36
  Speaker 7: ethereum first.
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: Post clarity, even I'll go opposite just because I should,
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: but I will say this, You have to worry about
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: the inflationary comparison, I think because obviously Solana continued to
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: build up to get.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: To an all time high. That would be something.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: So timing is very critical for that because otherwise that
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: you know, percentage of inflation starts to increase over a
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: longer period, which could happen you know, we could see
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: all time highs later this year. It could also see
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: twenty seven. Many people kind of point it to twenty
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: twenty seven.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: When you look.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: At the midterms and where Clarity is, you feel, where
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: are you putting the Clarity odds right now? Zach in
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: a percentage kind of like a poly market, the Zach
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: poly market.
• 27:16
  Speaker 7: The Zach odds are at least eighty percent at this point.
• 27:20
  Speaker 7: I feel pretty good about it. I think the two
• 27:22
  Speaker 7: Democrat votes in the Senate Banking Committee were very important
• 27:26
  Speaker 7: to signal that this can get bipartisan support on the
• 27:28
  Speaker 7: Senate floor, which is the key hurdle.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, with also brooking Tillis for sure. Well, I think
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: the concern right now is still those wild cards in
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: the Senate that could come out and just end up
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: messing up everything. And then I'm still worried about what
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: we're going to see in the midterms if we do
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: get pressure and this doesn't get through in this particular
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: cycle before midterms happen, because that could really spoil things
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: for crypto. I think down the road, if Clarity does
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: not hit right now, while we have the what do
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: they call it strike while the iron is hot, kind of
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: situation for.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: Sure, exactly Zach. Thanks for coming in today.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: We'd love to have you and all your candor around
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: where these markets are heading, but appreciate you stopping it.
• 28:09
  Speaker 7: Always great to see you, Paul. Thank you.
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: If you like this video, like and subscribe, drop a
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: comment down below, and also join our free private member group.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: The link is in the description.