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Transcript

Garden Guardian Interview · The Harvest Season

• 0:00
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: [Music]
• 0:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All right. Hello, everyone. Hi, listeners. This is probably already in the middle of an episode, but it's probably going up later. So they're not what else is on.
• 0:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But well, hello with me today. I have a very, very special guest. One Mr. Liam, I guess is okay. Say your last name because I guess, okay, Alan Miller. It is on your Twitter like handle and stuff.
• 0:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, absolutely.
• 0:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
• 0:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So okay. Well, hi. Okay. Why don't you introduce yourself to it?
• 1:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Well, thank you very, very much for having me and thank you for getting two
• 1:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: varies before the special guest. I really appreciate that level of
• 1:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: admiration. I don't know.
• 1:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : What one of those berries was for me specifically?
• 1:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Very, oh, one of the, okay, fair enough. Very flattering though, but yeah,
• 1:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: my name's Liam. I am currently an independent video game developer.
• 1:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I suppose, but my last game was a couple of years ago.
• 1:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I live in Tokyo currently with my wife.
• 1:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I used to stream and podcast and do videos on the regular for many years in the past.
• 1:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Hm hm hm hm hm hm hm hm hm hm just a few.
• 1:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: At a couple places, super best friends play, and rising super stream being the main ones.
• 1:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, that's pretty much me now.
• 1:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I guess right now I just work on games as much as I can, and I write a blog, and I occasionally
• 1:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Post-Kirby Airrider.
• 2:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Thank you for having me.
• 2:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [laughs]
• 2:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : We'll get there, we'll get there.
• 2:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's so my pleasure.
• 2:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So I mean, you know, that's great intro.
• 2:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I say you're underselling yourself for folks
• 2:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : not familiar, super best friends as well.
• 2:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean, I'm biased 'cause I've always been a huge fan
• 2:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : that was quite the little channel
• 2:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : you guys had going there, but and perhaps more relevant
• 2:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : our audience. You, Jamie, great.
• 2:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And that's part of the reason I brought you on because we taught cottagecore and that's
• 2:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : quadgcore enough because you're you're guarding plants. It's it's it's maybe not full
• 2:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : on farming, but you're a growing plant you're collecting fruit. We'll get there. But I mean, that's
• 2:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, thank you, I appreciate it.
• 2:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : that's impressive in its own.
• 2:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was really hard.
• 2:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Even though the game is so small,
• 2:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it was still a lot of work.
• 3:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was my first published real game.
• 3:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Mm.
• 3:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I've made little game jam things before,
• 3:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but that was a lot.
• 3:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I do think it's funny,
• 3:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the approximating it to cozy games
• 3:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and cottage core and farming and stuff,
• 3:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. The.
• 3:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: because...
• 3:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: really, like, it's an action game.
• 3:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It is, like, totally just straight up an action game,
• 3:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but it is farming themed and, like, there was a...
• 3:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: there was a Steam sale a little while ago
• 3:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that was the, like, farming Steam sale or whatever it was.
• 3:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah there you go
• 3:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I kind of looked both ways
• 3:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I hit the Apply button, like, "Ooh."
• 3:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And Valve accepted it, so it would...
• 3:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I sold some units in the farming sale, so it, you know,
• 3:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it's adjacent.
• 3:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You don't do any...
• 3:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's just a action game, but I'll take what I can get
• 3:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : or -- well, I mean, hey, it's 20 -- 25, possibly 6 when people are listening to this.
• 4:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But how did your course spaces really change, right?
• 4:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Because I mean, for so long, before Stardew, really, it was all the harvest moon and
• 4:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : the story of Caesar, right?
• 4:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And, you know, they were not -- maybe not formally -- but you knew what to expect, like,
• 4:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it was very clear what they were doing, but -- but I mean, it's -- it's -- it's exploded
• 4:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's so much since Stardew.
• 4:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And I'd say since 2020 is COVID, it just continued to kind of mushroom.
• 4:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 4:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : How we've covered Picross, because Picross has done like Story of Seasons.
• 4:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so we talked about that because it's adjacent enough.
• 4:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 4:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, it's true. It's true what you say though before Stardew. It's it's challenging to think of like significant games
• 4:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That are not harvest moon rune factory
• 4:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Story of seasons that sort of stuff like I think the biggest one that comes to mind predating
• 5:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Stardew is probably residue, right like shop simulation
• 5:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And like, yeah, that's this part of the thing. Like, we see we're starting to see that
• 5:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But like yeah, yeah after Stardew changed the game
• 5:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: For real. Yeah
• 5:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : connective tissue to other genres, right? Like, like you say you're an action game, but I mean,
• 5:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : look at look at Sock enough rice and ruin that's literally hybrid one part farming one part sick
• 5:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 5:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : character action. Um, so, you know, the lines are blurring. Um, and, and when we hear our
• 5:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh-huh
• 5:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : overseas in love, genre talking, blurring lines and not making any sense. But yeah, there's a. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yep. That's that's oh, yeah. I mean, have you played spirit fair? Yeah, yeah, I believe so.
• 5:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I feel like that's how it is a lot now.
• 5:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: A lot of cozy games have different styles of gameplay, or a lot of non-farming games incorporate
• 5:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: farming, or that sort of stuff nowadays.
• 5:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: No, I haven't-- I'm by Thunder Lotus, right?
• 6:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I've seen quite a bit of it that's actually-- I believe-- made in my hometown of Montreal
• 6:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh
• 6:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I believe so.
• 6:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: They always present at our local events, so I-- they best be.
• 6:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm pretty sure they are, though.
• 6:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, what a-- what a cool game, and I totally get where you're going with that, you know.
• 6:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I like yeah, I mean it's not a farming game, but it has farming in it and it's very
• 6:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: No.
• 6:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm.
• 6:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Dodge core, but also that's a lot of things
• 6:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, you know that just yeah like you said, they're so much stuffs adding in what not
• 6:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean hell even technically animal crossing is farming in it now
• 6:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Always always been there
• 6:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I guess that's the other big one. Yeah
• 6:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Planting trees. Yeah, money trees
• 6:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, oh yeah, right fruit trees that is type farming there you go as workers you're right
• 6:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah
• 6:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Recently, I was playing Hades - that's got a garden accounts, right? No, I don't
• 6:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, hey, oh, dude, I'm pretty sure
• 6:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Forget it. There's a silk song episode come out. There's people want to talk about silk song and then they're we're fine
• 7:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : One thing we love doing here is finding the the thinnest excuse to cover
• 7:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was just whatever it takes to get it on.
• 7:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Whatever it takes absolutely
• 7:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: On show, hmm, I like that.
• 7:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, that's that's how we roll here. Um, so yeah, I know but I mean
• 7:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I've played Garden Guardian which it's boiler for people. It's great game. You guys check it out
• 7:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hm-hmm. Thank you.
• 7:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And it it a lot of it is something is just the vibes and it it's still like
• 7:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's a quick game where you have to be paying attention and you have to be responsive
• 7:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But it does something about protecting your plants from bugs just feels so
• 7:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's not just the word is tain and cozy, um, it evokes as soon
• 7:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm not here to promote Garden Guardian, but I will, I will happily, oh, okay, good, well now I am here to promote Garden Guardian. No, but I'm certainly not here like to sell it strictly, but like, yeah, that that feeling you're talking about like I definitely was like a goal. I actually grew up on a farm as a kid.
• 7:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : we're feeling in another game.
• 8:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I am.
• 8:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: My parents divorced and was young, my granddad had a farm, so whenever I was with my dad, farm life, right? And you know, one of the things that I remember was, you know, having to treat our extensive gardens and crops and also protecting our chickens, because chicken hawks would just come and just kill them, just kill them in the pen, they'd take them away, they'd eat them there.
• 8:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mmm. Yeah. Yeah.
• 8:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I probably should have put a warning on that but like yeah, they you know, that's a real thing and
• 8:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [Inaudible]
• 8:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And that was something I kept thinking about in Garden Guardian was the the the anger I feel towards things trying to steal the plants
• 8:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 8:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I've been working so hard on even though they're just you know, they're just living beings trying to get by but I still feel a certain a certain guilty
• 9:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Iron where it's like I need you out of here now permanently, but also like I get it. You don't know any better. Anyway, um, I'm I'm glad Garden Guardian in parts some of that
• 9:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, no, yeah, no, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 9:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: energy in practice because I was definitely thinking about that when I was making it running down to the coop when you see chicken hawks circling just so you could make a big enough
• 9:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, thank you.
• 9:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Ruckus to keep him out. Yeah, yeah
• 9:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You said, oh, oh man, I'd love you to meet, uh, Tony, one of our,
• 9:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Pope Rotating co-host. She's an entomologist and works at work.
• 9:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : She has plenty of analyze stories, and growing up in the American,
• 9:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : spending the most good portion of my life in the American South, I've had plenty.
• 9:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You're maybe not plenty, but a handful of wildlife encounters myself,
• 9:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm. For sure, yeah.
• 9:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : so that's always a fun topic here.
• 9:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But we'll get to garden garden, because I want to deep dive into that.
• 10:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But before that, let's talk some other fun stuff.
• 10:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : What have you been up to lately?
• 10:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 10:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And when you play and watch and whatever you want to do, tell me what's going...
• 10:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Lately, uh, I have been playing a bunch of games actually. I picked up Metroid Prime for yesterday
• 10:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, we're trying to just drop today like on recording. Yeah.
• 10:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That just very nice
• 10:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I've been really really enjoying that. I've only played for like two three hours
• 10:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But boy, it feels it feels just like Metroid. I love me love me and Metroid the
• 10:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't know if you've heard of or discussed the npc's who chat with you who follow you around and stuff
• 10:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, oh, I've heard of it I've heard
• 10:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's it's interesting. I definitely can't say that I like love every line that's been put to paper for the characters
• 10:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 10:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But the vibe I get from it is like it reminds me of old action movies like aliens and stuff
• 11:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Have where you have that sort of extended cast that that's getting picked off by the monsters kind of
• 11:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 11:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's that's what it does seem like also that like I heard that my knee-jerk reactions are the first things I heard
• 11:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : We're like concerning I felt like but after hearing a bit more like the kind of the different personalities
• 11:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I definitely see what you mean
• 11:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, it's I see why people felt that way and I like I totally get it
• 11:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I mean, there's always been dialogue and conversation in a lot of mature games
• 11:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But usually it's like constrained to like between moving to areas or whatever whereas like very early you meet this guy named Miles
• 11:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And he's he's he's chattering to you, you know, he's he's
• 11:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Shocked that Samus is here and he doesn't understand why he's been brought to this place and he's like he's a goof
• 11:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: He says stuff that's goofy.
• 11:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There was one good joke where I was like, oh, that's actually like I laughed.
• 11:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I didn't say, oh, that's actually funny. I just laughed. I just skipped the analysis.
• 11:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh.
• 12:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, yeah. Um, so I, I, you know, I think it's definitely a question of execution.
• 12:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No.
• 12:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, cause like I said, even I don't love every line that's been put to paper.
• 12:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So if that's where I'm at and I like them, I definitely see why some people feel so fiery about it.
• 12:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And maybe maybe a more, uh, precision engineered script could have delivered.
• 12:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: something that everyone would have liked, but I'm, I'm just glad that I'm playing it. And I'm like, few, this doesn't bother me actually.
• 12:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I actually am like, totally fine with this. Cause it didn't. Yeah, didn't love the NPCs in Metroid Prime 3 so much.
• 12:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : sick that's great
• 12:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And other than that, like, when playing some other Switch 2 titles, uh, Hyrule Warriors came out recently and Kirby Air Riders, I've been plugging away at.
• 12:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. Before we keep, okay, we'll get to curvy around
• 12:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : people know me. And so we'll get to that. But okay. Hyrule warriors. Okay. I played the original one.
• 12:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : The one on that came out, we originally. And that game, that was a, that was a real treasure for me and my brother.
• 13:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like we, that was a shut off your brain grind out shit and unlock stuff.
• 13:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mmm.
• 13:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 13:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm.
• 13:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: A time vampire, eh?
• 13:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, he little bit, but it it was also just
• 13:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's like, for real, my wife and I had a similar experience.
• 13:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, but I mean part of it was like
• 13:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There was so much to unlock and there was a lot of love put into that game because you know there was so much
• 13:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There's just so much content all the characters at it was insane
• 13:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I did play the other one the breath of the wild one
• 13:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Mm.
• 13:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But it was dance which one, so very slaggy.
• 13:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And didn't hit the same. But tell me, what are your thoughts on this?
• 13:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Oh yeah, yeah.
• 13:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, so I also love the original
• 13:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and it's expanded releases after and like you,
• 13:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: my wife and I played a ton of co-op.
• 13:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Did you use the like cool split screen,
• 14:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: not split screen, but like where one person's on the TV,
• 14:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah yeah yeah we did right wow the Wii U was ahead of its time
• 14:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: one person's on the game pad?
• 14:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - So good.
• 14:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like both people having a full screen, stellar.
• 14:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, for real, a little kind of,
• 14:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yeah, on the Switch version, you lose that.
• 14:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You can only do local, which my wife and I always kind
• 14:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 14:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of thought was a little sucky and age of calamity.
• 14:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We liked it well enough, but it didn't fully capture
• 14:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the magic.
• 14:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We both really liked Breath of the Wild,
• 14:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: so it was nice to see a little bit more of that world,
• 14:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, you're right exactly
• 14:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but it wasn't all the way there.
• 14:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Actually has more recaptured the magic.
• 14:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think I still kind of like the original better.
• 14:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Whoa! Maybe.
• 14:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Maybe 'cause it just hit us at the right time
• 14:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and like it's gonna be hard to beat that nostalgia,
• 14:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but the new one is definitely, I think,
• 14:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: just categorically better than age of calamity.
• 14:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't think there's a single thing
• 15:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: where I look back at age of calamity,
• 15:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I think that's better actually.
• 15:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The performance is also significantly,
• 15:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a way better.
• 15:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The one feature that we really, really liked at all,
• 15:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like the Law, excuse me, is on Switch 2,
• 15:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: they have this new thing called Game Share.
• 15:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You familiar with it?
• 15:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah, the DS download play of the today.
• 15:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, where you stream the game
• 15:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to the other switches, right?
• 15:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: My wife and I have taken to playing
• 15:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: age of imprisonment in bed where I've got my Switch 2,
• 15:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and she's right next to me with her Switch Lite,
• 15:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and we do the game share.
• 15:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And it is so much better than either of us expected.
• 15:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It is not flawless.
• 15:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There are milliseconds of lag, but the consistency you get from a connection that's like the devices
• 15:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Hmm. Yeah.
• 15:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like basically three to three feet apart is it's so good that that's just how we've been playing
• 16:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the game and so you both get a 30 FPS image and the stream receiver gets a
• 16:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: shockingly good version of it, we really didn't expect that we thought it would be more compromised,
• 16:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: we thought it would be less consistent and indeed when we tried to play it in the living room
• 16:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: with the switch to docked all the way over there and her sitting on the couch, we did get drops
• 16:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: here and there which was like we considered like we were we just played split screen at that point
• 16:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but if you're like really sitting next to someone both playing in handheld,
• 16:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : mm-hmm
• 16:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: damn it's a good experience so that has really recaptured some of the magic of the original for us,
• 16:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: putting our own screen and having to communicate what we need the other player to do and stuff like
• 16:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that we were really enjoying this one much better than the second one which we liked enough but
• 16:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 16:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: this is this is better.
• 16:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Nintendo, capturing the magic of playing with people in person in 20, 25 when the wild gods have done.
• 17:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: crazy
• 17:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Crazy, yeah, yeah, best local multiplayer game and the best online one too if you
• 17:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: If you look to the side a little bit, yeah
• 17:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yep. I will, um, okay, but that sounds fantastic. I'm definitely much more keen. I like,
• 17:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : hey, I honestly forgot, as your imprisonment came out, maybe because other stuff was coming out,
• 17:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's been a good year for games, but.
• 17:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But hearing that does does excite me because yeah, hearing it's a little more close, it's higher than the age of calamity. That's that's good stuff. Although I and I just checked to confirm I will one one ding against imprisonment. No play will has to. That's.
• 17:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah definitely yeah no playable has to but I don't know if you know like I
• 17:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: mean I don't want to drop light spoilers but I'll drop the lightest spoiler
• 17:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like one of the main main main characters is a Korok like he's a new
• 17:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No.
• 17:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: original Korok voiced by Pro ZD I think I'm pretty sure my white
• 18:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: said that she read that he does the voice so I trust that and he at the beginning
• 18:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of the game there are like two parties do in the story separately and he this
• 18:16
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 18:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Korok this original Korok character who is awesome leads one of those two
• 18:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: parties so you don't get has to but you do get a new original Korok character
• 18:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: leading the story in part, which is pretty fun.
• 18:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : pretty good. All that is pretty good and I love prosody. I think he's one of the
• 18:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, he's great.
• 18:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : funniest guys on the internet. But, you know what? I didn't even have to
• 18:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : sum- you don't have to sum me with that. I joke and say that but I mean this game
• 18:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : has been narrow. That's all I need!
• 18:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, she's her moveset is like super like it's super amusing her moveset cuz she uses all of the
• 19:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Zona like zonidivices and stuff like that
• 19:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, that's cool.
• 19:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So there's like one of her you know in the game when you break an opponents like guard you you do like a finishing move on them
• 19:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: right
• 19:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, right.
• 19:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Her her finishing move involves like
• 19:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: manually spinning this rotating thing to hit a ball that sl-
• 19:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: times into the opponent, like the kind of thing you would do to solve a puzzle in tears of the kingdom, you know?
• 19:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Rube Goldberg as an old I love that that's great
• 19:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. Yeah, Minner's moveset is super baller actually, but if, you know, one of the things I also really like about it a lot is I felt age of calamity struggled a little bit to make me that interested in a lot of its characters.
• 19:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Certainly there were a few where I was like, okay, yes, I'm here for herbosa.
• 19:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Every hour of the day, herbosa and regu can just stay on the screen because they are interesting, but like, I'm not that here for the rido ones like I didn't find the rido characters that compelling and you know, Bo as well didn't find them. I don't find them all that interesting side on I love, but you know, so age of imprisonment is one of the reasons it's fun is because although it has some characters from cheers of the kingdom you do know.
• 19:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh yeah!
• 20:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I mean, I think of that.
• 20:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It has it most of the characters are all new original characters and each each of the four each of the tribes has a new leader character who you have not seen in tears of the kingdom or breath the wild and those characters are charismatic protagonists and each of them has to like, like right hand guys basically.
• 20:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So you get you get three from each tribe and the right
• 20:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : mm-hmm oh that's fun okay sure
• 20:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: guys are much less developed but but you still get the main the main new ones for each tribe who are like
• 20:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: just bonafide new goes that making there's a new Gerudo here's a new Goron etc you know the you know the
• 21:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: play the the news or a chief 10 I particularly like her I think she is is great she's cool so you know
• 21:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, that is true.
• 21:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Big, big positive in my eyes.
• 21:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Having like all these characters, you know, I said you didn't see them in tears of the kingdom.
• 21:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That was actually kind of wrong because you do see them in the mat. Yeah, wearing their masks, right?
• 21:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You see them in the flashback right the the sequences
• 21:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, but you never get their names even I don't think
• 21:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: In this.
• 21:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: No, no names, no faces. So, so yeah, so technically you do see them.
• 21:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 21:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's true, but they weren't developed characters back that now for the most part,
• 21:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Right right yeah
• 21:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: they have their masks off in this game and you speak to them and they have names and faces lives.
• 21:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 21:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's cool
• 21:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So it's still a mousseau game. The story only goes so deep and we have not finished it yet,
• 21:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, of course
• 21:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but it's lovely and sexy Ganondorf is on display for like from the beginning.
• 21:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : The real draw the absolutely
• 22:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah for real. Um, so, uh, yeah.
• 22:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All right, that's good stuff
• 22:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so are you ready for oh?
• 22:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: What, what, can I ask what have you been playing lately before we, before we jump over to what I know you've been playing?
• 22:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, well, yeah, okay. We'll go get there. Okay. Um, so I've been I've been a bit fairly busy this past week or so
• 22:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So I picked up Marvels.
• 22:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'll snap again a fair good amount I believe if I recall correctly you are a hard aficionado slash part game aficionado slash fiend like me
• 22:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. I love card games. I've fallen off in recent years because like doing TCGs at the same time
• 22:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh
• 22:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 22:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: as everything else has been too much for me. But card video, particularly narrative card video
• 22:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, yeah
• 22:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: games, you know, stuff like Chain of Memories and Mega Man Battle Network and Lost Kingdoms and
• 22:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, why is move I didn't make that mistake. I heard didn't make that smart choice. I made them sick of keeping it
• 23:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: stuff like Big Time, Big Time, my jam. Marvel Snap, I played, I played quite a lot near launch.
• 23:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I deleted it from my own protection because it's, it's good. Yeah, it's good.
• 23:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's tough. It's tough. They, they getcha hooked easy. Anyway, yeah, go on.
• 23:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So
• 23:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 23:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And so, yeah.
• 23:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean, I fell off. I had my first break like last month because I just got busy with my stuff. It wasn't like intentional or anything. I stopped lying for a few weeks.
• 23:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Um, but then they added man spider. One of my favorite Marvel characters all the time because it's the stupidest idea and I love it so much. I'm so I got back in because I wanted that man spider goodness.
• 23:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But anyways, um, yeah, that game's been running for a while too almost three years. I think if not longer. I don't really exactly.
• 23:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But it's it's at a point where the card pool is so large that, you know, the meta game is is pretty stable. There's one or two dominating strategies, but, um, by and large you can kind of play what you want. Yeah, yeah, it is hard. And they're very good at balancing every like two weeks or so. They'll make nerfs and buffs and whatnot. But, um, it's.
• 24:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hard hard for that not to happen
• 24:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 24:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I've heard I have a I have a friend here in Japan who I often speak to who's still he's been playing since launch and
• 24:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hm.
• 24:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I he's other YouTube guy you may have heard of mother's basement Jeff
• 24:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, and and he tells me sometimes about the the nerfs and stuff and like the tweaks people get angry because their cards
• 24:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 24:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the numbers on the--
• 24:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: on their cards change, which I find funny. Yeah, you're right, by the way, three years. You pretty much nailed it. So, uh, I find that so funny the numbers on the cards changing. Like, don't get that on paper so much, but.
• 24:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I didn't realize you were in cons talking with mother to be I forget his name
• 25:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : His mother's basing my brain, but oh, I love him so much Jeff. Thank you. He's great. Oh
• 25:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Jeff. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he's good friend of mine. So anyways, I cut off your Marvel snap story. Go ahead.
• 25:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Love Jeff
• 25:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, no, that's fine. That's fine. I love that. No, I mean just yeah, that's that's the big thing
• 25:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I've been playing on they they're doing a season right now on
• 25:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Weapon X like specifically the weapon X program, so we're gonna get
• 25:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like there's weapon X Wolverine. We know what the helmet and the
• 25:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Cyclops might or whatever
• 25:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Wolverine's finally in the game.
• 25:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yep. Yes. Yes
• 25:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Finally.
• 25:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, yeah, sometimes they've been doing this here and there where they'll kind of revisit a card in a new form or something like that
• 25:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : They did it for a tip fantastic for when the movie came out. They did like all new versions
• 25:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You're like first-step versions of the cards just the separate cards
• 25:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So is that just like a new skin for them or did they also do like new new cards for them?
• 25:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Amen.
• 25:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, no, no, it says I'll write new cards like weapon X Wolverine is just an outright new card
• 26:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh cool. Oh
• 26:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Wow, I see yeah, he's got the helmet on and stuff. Uh awesome damn that looks really
• 26:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 26:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So yeah, it's so yeah, and X-Men seasons are always fun because they're not afraid to you know dig deep and pick out weird picks and whatnot
• 26:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 26:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : They have what's the key arrow the character
• 26:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I know in my brain is spike because I watched X-Men evolutions
• 26:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 26:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Next one up. Yeah, yeah
• 26:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 26:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, but that's yeah, so that's been fun. Oh, I'm just just picking them all so I'm just the game
• 26:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I can and they're so quick. You cannot get a gaming, you know like five minutes, so
• 26:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's it's dangerous for that reason. Yeah
• 26:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I totally get what you mean.
• 26:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 26:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So let's see so that that's been going on I'm
• 26:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, not too much. Oh wait. Oh, you know, no
• 26:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There is one other one
• 26:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm. No, no.
• 26:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so my my one of my you know what I'm I'm ashamed the most of my loz I'm ashamed my love you go and
• 27:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sonic one of the other ones that that the I mean
• 27:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Have you ever played any of the mohoyo games?
• 27:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh, yeah, hoi-o-verse, yeah.
• 27:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Liam
• 27:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, we oversee. Yeah
• 27:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I played an embarrassingly large amount of gench impact.
• 27:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I played a little bit at launch bounced off it,
• 27:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: did not like it, thought it was way too derivative.
• 27:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 27:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And then I came back around when Inazuma came out,
• 27:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I played a lot until up until Natland stuff.
• 27:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And then Zennel's.
• 27:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: On zero, I played my wife and I both played daily for almost exactly a year.
• 27:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 27:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think we realized it was the first anniversary and we were like, "Oh my god, we're spending
• 27:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: each like half an hour plus a day on this game."
• 27:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And so we both went complete cold turkey on it.
• 28:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Despite really enjoying the combat, I really think that game has very fun combat and very
• 28:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: be bad writing.
• 28:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 28:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think it has worse combat and very worse writing.
• 28:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So first one. So my sister was the first one that you get to, she's
• 28:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So what's your what's your Hoyover's drink of choice?
• 28:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : started genshin near launch, I think. And I agree. It was very, very derivative at first.
• 28:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But I think it has kind of grown. But like, it's still probably the worst of the big three.
• 28:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like, we make the joke that she logs in to just do polls and not even play the statement.
• 28:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I have a friend who does that. She pays for the the welcome moon pass and I think like I don't think she plays most days
• 28:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I get it. So she also plays Hongkai. That's like her main thing now.
• 28:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She just signs in gets her gets her hit
• 28:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 28:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 28:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I was eyeing Hongkai for a bit because like the turn-based thing appeals to me. But then when Zen
• 29:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : less came in, oh, I was I was in Zen less is my drink of choice. And they just dropped the new
• 29:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. Yeah.
• 29:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : season and what's nice
• 29:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : so I think I've dropped maybe 20 30 bucks on the game since it came out like you said it's it's a game that incentivizes you to play daily and I have much to to my own
• 29:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : trigger and but
• 29:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I'm very happy. I didn't spend a dime on Zenless.
• 29:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but like
• 29:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah, yeah
• 29:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I, for Genshin, I only bought the beginners pack when it first launched,
• 29:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, uh-huh
• 29:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and then after that, I became morally opposed to paying money for Gatcha Games.
• 29:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, no, no, I generally
• 29:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, I, like...
• 29:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I am too, but I move this, there's just like one one splurge, but yeah, yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And so like, and here's the kind of thing because not all these the gameplay fun and they continue to to release new characters that I find fun.
• 29:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, oh, don't worry, I'm not judging you for it or anything.
• 29:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: These are machines created to adapt.
• 29:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't fault anyone for paying into it, that's what they're for, that's what they're designed.
• 30:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But, you know, being again shined or a gacha gacha.
• 30:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I think he's coming out in like two weeks.
• 30:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 30:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There's a character named Bonway.
• 30:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : He's a robot lion man with orbs kind of like Zenyatta.
• 30:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 30:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I seen this guy.
• 30:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And he, oh my, he just looks so cool.
• 30:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'm partial to anyone who just fights with their fists and this is one of them.
• 30:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, yeah
• 30:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, I'm off.
• 30:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So I'm all... Yeah, that's...
• 30:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Probably the least clothed character so far. He's only got a hoodie good for him
• 30:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's true. And it's wrapped around his waist.
• 30:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I support
• 30:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I support getting getting guy fans service in these games
• 30:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, absolutely. Oh, absolutely.
• 31:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, that's...
• 31:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So yeah, it's endless. It's dropped.
• 31:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And then they continue to play it.
• 31:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's... I enjoy it enough.
• 31:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But...
• 31:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay.
• 31:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So the listeners at home, they know me.
• 31:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : They know, I'm...
• 31:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : one of the greatest champions of curvy air ride and sequel curvy air riders.
• 31:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : What they don't, maybe know, is that there are three other people on this earth who I acknowledge loving the game as much as me.
• 31:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's it
• 31:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : One is my sister Melanie, who grew up playing with me. Second is Masahiro Sakurai.
• 31:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mmm that makes sense
• 31:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And, yep, and third is you, Mr. Liam, because I am well aware how partial you are to this game.
• 31:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Thank you. Hey, I really appreciate it. It is one of my long time regrets that we didn't do an elaborate air ride video on best friends
• 31:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You're welcome.
• 31:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's one of those ones that I always look back on and I'm like, why didn't that happen? I don't know
• 31:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah.
• 31:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I don't... Oh my gosh.
• 31:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't know. I don't know. And if it did then I've just shut it out of my memory, but I don't think it did
• 32:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I believe, well, he said there was a recorded video, but it was one of the few that was lost if I recall.
• 32:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Right, that's true. We did do something and I think I think cranky construct
• 32:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I think I heard that tape bit.
• 32:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't know what he goes by now, but I think he had made an animation for us and everything
• 32:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, what?
• 32:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's crazy that you remember that. Yeah, like a little animated opening. It's crazy that you remember that cuz that totally jogged my memory and
• 32:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I have an unhealthy amount of memory things of various new topics, but yeah, thank you
• 32:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Damn
• 32:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, air ride kicks ass, man. You're you're you're right to acknowledge its greatness
• 32:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I love I love that people didn't understand there
• 32:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: ride the first time and so Nintendo and Sakurai just went we're gonna make you understand this time we're gonna
• 32:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : What one of my favorite memes I've seen because I've been you know, I've seen a lot of traction from the new art medium that is Kirby a writer, but I've seen a meme here there
• 32:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 33:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Back to the future. I assume you've seen back in the future
• 33:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yes, yeah. Oh, I see where you're going with this. Yeah
• 33:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, so if you remember it
• 33:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I've one of my favorite memes is Marty at the end of his guitar song
• 33:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, I guess you aren't ready. You aren't ready for this and you see pervy air ride original with the 50
• 33:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 33:16
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Metacritic score, but your kids are gonna love it and you get air riders at the 80.
• 33:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, for real
• 33:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, it's it's so true, but you know, it's it's it's man the reviews
• 33:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: For air ride. I've always found interesting because I have a hard time faulting
• 33:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Any reviewers for scoring the original low, you know if you if you were if you were if you had that game plopped on your desk back then and
• 33:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You didn't get a review guide back then it wasn't so common and you didn't have friends around to play with and you had
• 33:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Best a couple weeks to review it. I could totally see how someone would come away from that game
• 33:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Being like there's nothing going on. There's like unless you become addicted to solo city trial
• 34:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, but it was, I can, you're right, you're right.
• 34:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like I you know what I mean it seems ripe for like a tough tough situation a tough game to review
• 34:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Especially if the attitudes of gaming at that time, like I absolutely see that.
• 34:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Now that I think about like, I've never like, it was absolutely for me to part by never thought about how much.
• 34:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But like I said, my sister enjoys it as much as I do and like I think a big part of it was because
• 34:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it's so much together. One of our favorite things was just doing free try, free run in city trial, just running around the city and just, you know, just running around for machines and having fun. It was, it was a sandbox basically.
• 34:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: for real. That was the f**king VR chat of its time. Everyone, everyone running around with Kirby,
• 34:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like doing the pitalyest platforming, attempting to climb up the skyscrapers with the poor feeling jump.
• 35:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. That was it. That was the Fortnite hangout spaces of its time. Was you and three friends
• 35:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Trying to fight for the control of the sky island.
• 35:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You get it. You get it.
• 35:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: or one sibling.
• 35:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: F***ing around city trial infinitely.
• 35:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 35:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, god.
• 35:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's so nostalgic.
• 35:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh my gosh.
• 35:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's funny because it makes me think of nowadays there are so many experiences that are like, quote-unquote, "liminal spaces" and stuff like that.
• 35:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And like that city trial experience, like playing with no timer, no rules, that's what that feels like to me.
• 35:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, Mark Zuckerberg and his billions of dollars
• 35:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Couldn't make this.
• 35:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : with his meta versus Kirby era, right?
• 35:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, for real, eh?
• 35:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's such a...
• 35:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm glad you had that experience as well because I had that same experience with my friends and my sisters as well.
• 35:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, oh, I'm so glad you got it.
• 36:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, magical.
• 36:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, it's the most specific feeling,
• 36:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but it's great, magical.
• 36:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, for real.
• 36:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so, and now here we are,
• 36:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : where the sequel to reality.
• 36:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 36:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, let's, I mean, you recorded, I think you recorded your reaction. You were watching a direct if I recall and you recorded it.
• 36:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 36:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, yeah my my YouTube channel has become nothing but Kirby Air Ride videos the last five videos or Kirby Air Rider videos, so yeah
• 36:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay. So I, I've said this to people that have heard this on the show already, but I'm going to repeat it to you because I just want to describe my reactions.
• 36:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But, okay. Actually, no, no, what was in the office? I was in the office. It was like 9 a.m. I was in my office job, but I was watching the direct any care at this point at that time.
• 36:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: hahaha
• 36:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And so you see the trailer start and it's Carvy on the warp store, right? And so, you know, in turn, I think I was chatting friends on Discord. I'm pretty sure I was. I was just, you know, snarkily saying, Oh, is this the new Smash Bros?
• 37:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And then it lingers on curvy.
• 37:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And so I think it's not smash because it's a new curvy project, but it feels too soon for a new curvy game.
• 37:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So I again snarkily say is this the curvy air ride sequel?
• 37:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And then the second the exhaust like pipes form on the warp star.
• 37:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : My hands just go up to my mouth and I have to hold back the screen because I'm in the office.
• 37:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It is because I realized
• 37:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it actually was, and I had to legit fight some tears back watching that trailer because I couldn't believe it, I couldn't believe it, I couldn't believe it, it was really great.
• 37:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, so good.
• 37:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I never, I never really thought it would happen.
• 37:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, after, after Neer Automata was announced years ago,
• 37:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 38:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that was the most explosive reaction I ever had to a trailer.
• 38:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 38:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That really like got me.
• 38:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Uh-huh.
• 38:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 38:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was so specific at the right time of my life,
• 38:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and God, I wish I had a recording of that, but I don't.
• 38:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But that, that was the one that hit me at a level
• 38:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that I don't think I'll ever see again.
• 38:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And getting lucky with Streets of Rage 4
• 38:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and Neo the world ends with you.
• 38:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh my gosh, that was a good one, too.
• 38:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know, I've come to a state of mind where as long as that director is like still in their position
• 38:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah, I guess so.
• 38:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I just don't count anything out anymore. Everything's on the table. So for me, I didn't consider Air Ride 2 to be an
• 38:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: impossibility, but I just thought like outside of Japan, it wasn't really a hit. So probably not, you know,
• 38:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: probably we'll just see it appear on the GameCube app.
• 38:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That'll be and I'll be happy enough with that, just being able to play the GameCube one.
• 38:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
• 38:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I didn't really see it coming, but I'm very glad it did honestly.
• 39:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I was very, I was also very happy, maybe not as explosive as you, but very happy about it.
• 39:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : we see we're fortunate that soccer I had that fire burning in him just like a
• 39:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'm glad it was such a moment for you though honestly.
• 39:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a good feeling.
• 39:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I saw these years, that's really the best.
• 39:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Because it's so interesting, because I would have clocked that the other way, I would
• 39:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 39:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: have thought, "Oh, Sacher, I want to take another go at it."
• 39:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Absolutely, right
• 39:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I
• 39:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, evidently he did want to take another go at it, he accepted, but I would have thought
• 39:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 39:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 39:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: he would have been the origin point of that.
• 39:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, the theory I subscribe to was that this was his
• 39:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, I'll do smash again, but you give me one game
• 39:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm. Yeah.
• 39:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's that's what I envision it, but yeah, that though he described that they came to him which boggles my mind
• 40:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, here's here's open. Maybe cheap. Oh, it isn't dead
• 40:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's, um, it's so interesting because like they came to him, like, knowing that they had
• 40:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mario Kart, like, you know, coming out just earlier. Well, you know, at the time, both of these
• 40:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: games were years away, right? But like, knowing that they kind of, and ending up releasing next
• 40:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to each other in some way and they still did it, super interesting.
• 40:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 40:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think he even made a joke about that in one of his presentations on it.
• 40:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I believe he did and
• 40:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But yeah, I'm glad that whatever led us down this timeline, I'm glad that it happened.
• 40:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, and and an important thing like a little more objectively about air right that I don't think we
• 40:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's past around enough is is if you look back a lot
• 40:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, Sakurai has a very stylized approach to his games with the checklist.
• 40:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And the menus and what the a lot of that you can see in air ride like you can really feel the genesis was there
• 40:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like it was kind of forming first and melee and stuff, but I think it really solidified there
• 41:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I agree, AirRide to Brawl, you can really see the close evolution there, whereas Melee is still a little bit more normal with the menus, like they're stylish, and you can use the C-Stick to look around a little bit, but yeah, AirRides, the real genesis of the menus that I think his wife designs, if I remember right.
• 41:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yep, absolutely
• 41:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 41:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh really, it's so cool
• 41:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So they weren't married at the time, but they started working together at how, and she still...
• 41:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like, supervisors and does the menu designs, so it's like, so you're not wrong to attribute it to Sakurai, but it's the other Sakurai, because that is now her. That is now her last name.
• 41:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : dang. That's a keeper. The other side. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that no. Yeah. I was about to say it's
• 41:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But definitely, like, their style of menu is so good. I mean, you saw that I ripped it really hard for Garden Guardian. Yeah, yeah.
• 42:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : so good. It influenced other games that we might talk about. But will we?
• 42:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, we could talk about that later for sure, because that's real. Yeah.
• 42:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. We'll get to there. Yes. Okay. Um, but all right. So, I mean, that that's the preamble. Tell me what are your thoughts on
• 42:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm I'm really happy with what it turned out to be which
• 42:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Not really a hot take, but like air riders feels to me more like curvy air riders like a curvy air ride 1.9
• 42:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know like it doesn't it's like there's a bunch of new content
• 42:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's quite a bit of new content, but also all of the old stuff is back like all the old tracks are here
• 42:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : because soccer I
• 42:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, right all the old tracks are here
• 42:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The game the control model feels pretty much identical to how it originally was, you know, the only thing we're really missing is the original city trial map, which is a bummer
• 43:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I would have I would have liked to see that, but
• 43:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I really kind of like that it feels like so much like the original, I guess it's so faithful
• 43:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Again, I would have been perfectly content if they had just put the GameCube one out and that's
• 43:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: one had just been new stuff, but re-imagining and bringing over all the GameCube stuff as well,
• 43:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm really satisfied with that.
• 43:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Pretty much everything I like, like all the new vehicles are interesting, being able to
• 43:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: transform one of them.
• 43:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The Vampire Star being able to power itself up by hitting opponents.
• 43:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like a lot of cool new interesting stuff there.
• 43:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: new city trial map is great.
• 43:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm not sure about it.
• 43:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm not sure about it, but it's just not my bag, so I'm probably never going to touch that and that's fine.
• 43:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And the other riders, I felt spoiled having however many vehicles and just Kirby in the previous game.
• 44:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 44:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm not willing to pick anyone other than Kirby, because for me I just think of the vehicle pick, like I'm very boring like that right now.
• 44:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean that I mean that's that's perfectly fine and understandable because the I mean really the the weapons gameplay wise mechanically it's the the the the vehicles that matter like that then all the characters have a few differences but it's the vehicle.
• 44:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I need to broaden my horizons on my rider picks for real because I have not been exploring.
• 44:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the specials are the thing that I really need to get my head around because that's
• 44:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 44:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a whole world, but I do agree that the vehicle, yeah.
• 44:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, absolutely. But I mean one thing I do love that because it's reaching a wider audience people not just in this game specifically but they're getting a taste of this cast really robust what I feel cast of Kirby characters.
• 45:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh-huh.
• 45:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know people learning Rick has cut is all on the rage now. You know star man rocky just just these rent little dudes.
• 45:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I get in some love and time in the light line line I'm very very happy. The roach I don't know why but I always get excited to see the roach maybe it's just because I like the hat like yeah yeah yeah I agree I haven't never played squeaks quack either but I love him when he's included so yeah.
• 45:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I don't even love the roaches game, but like the roaches funny, and I love the roaches name. I always it's
• 45:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Starman's the one for me where I'm like I want to play as you I actually think I still haven't unlocked Starman
• 45:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I really want to play as Starman
• 45:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Star man okay two things about starment one have you seen his special.
• 45:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Know I well, I might have seen it in like the sacrifice presents thing, but I don't remember like I do not know
• 46:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah yeah he he he literally just starts supermanning like he just starts flying.
• 46:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, that's great I I like Starman a lot because I think that
• 46:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That first experience you get with the jump power fighting cracko is
• 46:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 46:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 46:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: such an iconic an incredible Kirby moment, and it's just like a really powerful moment in in the canon of like Kirby gameplay experiences
• 46:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: jump just like even though Kirby has such incredible
• 46:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: vertical movement in the first place when you use jump and you get to an area that encourages you to continue going up and then you get to a boss like precision engineered to be targeted with jump like man it's satisfying so star man and cracko they they occupy like a really strong place in my love for Kirby stuff. Love it.
• 46:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, it's so good.
• 46:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Absolutely. And hey, cracko made it too high.
• 46:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Is that on the bosses?
• 47:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, the other thing with Starman in city trial, if you you hop off the vehicle,
• 47:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hm. No kidding. That's really cool actually. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 47:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : he actually does jump higher than everyone else.
• 47:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's great.
• 47:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, no, I mean, it's soccer. I write detention of detail, man.
• 47:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So there's no jocker there, but.
• 47:16
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's fantastic. Yeah, so the cast it's so fun to have all these characters and, and you know, would soccer just as a screw it. They can all have copy abilities with it. It's great.
• 47:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, that was that was amusing. I was wondering that when he was presenting the new characters like oh how did they how did they handle this?
• 47:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I mean I think just waving the hand and being like what ever I think that was the right call honestly, so yeah
• 47:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
• 47:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The the only thing that I'm like oh, I'm not sure I like this change is
• 47:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: in the original air ride you had to press you press the a button to press your vehicle against the ground, right and
• 47:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah
• 47:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So if you wanted to hit a boost panel or like a switch on the ground, you had to press the a button
• 48:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 48:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to to to to physically touch it and I always really liked
• 48:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: in the first air ride. There's this really
• 48:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mechanically beautiful relationship between the vehicles and the things on the ground because you if you fly over a boost panel for anyone who hasn't played
• 48:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Mm-hmm.
• 48:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Kirby air ride you do not boost you have to hit the break button
• 48:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The A button to smush your vehicle onto the ground and when you're
• 48:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: vehicle touches it, then you get the boost. One of the things that's so
• 48:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: beautiful mechanically about this relationship is there's like a class of
• 48:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: vehicles, the bikes, that are always touching the ground and air-go, they just
• 48:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: get the boosts for free. That was like a really fun thing, like having to
• 48:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: understand how to use the different vehicles and timing your your A button
• 48:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: presses for successive panels. I was quite surprised when I played the new one and
• 48:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I saw that that's been removed and now you you just have to fly over them
• 49:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: in order to get a boost. I don't think it is like so far from a deal-breaker. This
• 49:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 49:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is like just like a nitpick. Yeah, I always really admired that that design
• 49:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: element in the original, so I was disappointed to see it go, but it really
• 49:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: doesn't matter. So now for anyone who hasn't played it when you fly over a
• 49:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: boost panel, you're just boost and that's it's fine. It's fine. It doesn't it doesn't
• 49:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and I think it's a function. I think it's a function of the higher speed
• 49:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The bother me, I swear.
• 49:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm so unbothered.
• 49:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Sorry.
• 49:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : because that's one big thing for me like it does feel a lot faster and maybe
• 49:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : that's just compounded by the fact that you know you have more racers so
• 49:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : the game feels more chaotic overall but yeah that doesn't bother me either
• 49:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but just like it is different.
• 49:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And then there's something charming about the slower pace of the original, especially when you play the old course like you're just blasting through them.
• 50:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yeah, you wisdom. To your credit, though, I think that's a great observation. You're right,
• 50:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: maybe the faster movement speed was a contributing element there, because that's kind of what I
• 50:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: liked about it, was you ate a time, you're pressed, right? But admittedly, now you're going like what,
• 50:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 30, 40% faster, so like, you're right, that's a tougher mechanically for everyone to be able to
• 50:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 50:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: handle, so yeah, I hadn't thought of that.
• 50:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, um, my one great thing about the old courses. So my my brother Calvin who didn't exist
• 50:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: hmm.
• 50:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : When the first air ride came out as of course been playing with me and my sister
• 50:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And and you know, so some of the new courses he he got a winner too because you know
• 50:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I was you know courses learning in the new speed and whatever but anytime we hit the old courses
• 50:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Smoke, it's just left in the test because smelling in and I just know these courses just
• 50:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm
• 51:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Blodge deep in our brains
• 51:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. I totally know what you mean. I played a little bit with my wife and just like,
• 51:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: when you hit that bump in checker nights, like everything's, everything's right in the world.
• 51:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 51:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You're right back there when you were a kid. Like, yeah. Man.
• 51:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's been you're going down the grind rails for me and there's like the cities in the right. Oh, oh good
• 51:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. Yeah. Man. The nostalgia comes right back.
• 51:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Absolutely
• 51:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think it's really interesting. I didn't obviously, we can't open up switch to games and rip their files
• 51:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: or anything yet. But watching the trailers and comparing it to footage, like, I'm 99% sure they use the
• 51:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: exact same geometry for the, um, for the old stages. Like, they only updated the textures.
• 51:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I think that's been bad. Like, that they still have a little bit of a lower,
• 51:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, yeah. I, I agree. There's like, even just looking at like the outline on the minimap, either the just like simpler courses, you know, like just simpler shapes.
• 52:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: lower poly feel even if the art has been overhauled.
• 52:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 52:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's great. Absolutely. Oh, you know what? They're okay. So that's like general air ride, but there is one other change. I'm not grumbled, it's, it's, I definitely feel it's more old.
• 52:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : man. Like I just want the old way back. City trial. Like I don't want, I don't want anyone to be able to chew just deal with the game that you're handed. If you, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you get, you know, you have your sick Rex wheelie bike, but you get the flying mini game tough off.
• 52:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: [laughs]
• 52:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Random, random stadium.
• 52:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, so like I I I probably feel the same way as you which is like
• 52:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yes, and also no because like because yes like it's really hard to beat that like you and your friends
• 52:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Quick.
• 53:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Play through a round of city trial and one of you just gets you have a maxed out Hydra and you can't do
• 53:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [laughs]
• 53:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know like
• 53:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I agree like that's hilarious
• 53:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I must admit my
• 53:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: initial reticence to the change to like pick your stadium is offset by like understanding that like oh there's
• 53:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a lot of like fun strategic value at the end that like wasn't present in the original because it's like oh my
• 53:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There is no
• 53:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: vehicle could crush it this but also this one maybe and and so I like I totally see both sides of it and I
• 53:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 53:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think I'm totally on board with you, where I miss.
• 53:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I think it's two things like
• 53:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Option like giving people more options is always generally a better idea. So I get the I acknowledge that like I
• 53:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 53:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And it's probably more appealing to most people to be able to choose their game.
• 54:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But like you said, there's a sort of that little mind game when you're picking a game.
• 54:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sometimes it's even not just like what you're good at, but you saw oh no, there's like two or three other wing stars in this.
• 54:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 54:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'm good at fly, but I don't know if I'm that good at flying.
• 54:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Let me pick another one.
• 54:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But what's nice, at very least, it's nice that the variety of the mini games has been updated enough to support that.
• 54:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Um, because, you know, all the other classes.
• 54:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But we get a lot of fun stuff, including all these bosses. He's thrown so many fun, like additions in there.
• 54:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. The new bosses are cool. I forget the names of these two events, but the avoiding the
• 54:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: laser hallway and the switches, like pressing the switches, I think those are great additions. Yeah,
• 54:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, the beam thing. Yeah, yeah, pressing the buttons. That's a great one
• 54:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, they are
• 54:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yeah, big time. The new bosses is dope because like versus DDD was already really cool.
• 54:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : absolutely
• 55:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So having...
• 55:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a bunch of them now. So good. And they still come out rare enough that it's special kind of when it happens.
• 55:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, it is, and you know, even when it does come out, you know, who's it gonna be? Is it gonna be the the Robo Did is it gonna be nightmare?
• 55:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm.
• 55:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, and you never know. It's it's fun. It's great
• 55:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm.
• 55:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 55:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Um, and you know different vehicles dude differently against them. Oh, it's fantastic. Oh
• 55:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. I'm still making my way through road trip mode,
• 55:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: because I've been doing a playthrough of that, uh,
• 55:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Uh-huh
• 55:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and so I've only been playing it when I have the opportunity to.
• 55:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to record so I've I've finished it once I got the normal ending. Have you have you
• 55:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: gotten at least that far? I want to make sure I don't say anything. Let's.
• 55:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, well, okay. Well, here's the thing the switch to is actually my brothers. I don't have the switch to myself
• 55:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Ah okay okay see you see. Mmm it's funny how that goes.
• 55:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But the game is my
• 55:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But yeah, yeah
• 55:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But so like and I'll unplay or whatever because I'm working and he's in college
• 56:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's more free time than I do so as like, you know, go ahead
• 56:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You can play road trip mode or whatever. I'll get to it when I can so we so he's played it
• 56:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So I'm familiar with everything I haven't played it myself, but I'm familiar
• 56:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : with Story in LORWISER, whatever so, speak freely.
• 56:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Okay, cool. I will speak relatively freely. I've been playing through that and it's been really fun to
• 56:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: encounter the bosses for the first time in that context. Not all of them have like a grand
• 56:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: presentation or anything, like sometimes you just get to the end of an area and it's like,
• 56:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: "Oh, nightmares here." And you're like, "Oh, okay, I guess nightmares here." But it's still fun
• 56:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: getting introduced to these bosses in this solo setting where it's like, "Yeah, figure it out."
• 56:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 56:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, nightmares specifically, I lost a couple times because I was not respecting just how much
• 56:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: damage he does. But yeah, the bosses are, I find, quite enjoyable actually. Like Kirby Air Ride
• 56:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 56:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is really suited to combat despite how, like, unwieldy it is. Like, you know, there's evidently
• 57:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 57:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a ton of work put into making combat still feel fun in this weird car setting. And the bosses feel
• 57:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 57:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: super great to fight against.
• 57:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the- since you haven't played it, I won't ramble too much on this, but the- the new mode is really cool.
• 57:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's like- it's like if they took, um, Super Smash Bros. 4 Nintendo 3DS's classic mode, and they, like, super elaborated it out to, like, a- a long enough story thing.
• 57:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 57:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm. Yeah
• 57:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know, it took me, like, three to four hours to finish it the first time I want to say- I played through on hard, um,
• 57:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: which is totally managed.
• 57:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think you'd totally be able to manage hard, but it's nice. It's not going to blow you away or anything like that, but it is a fun addition to the line up of modes.
• 58:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It definitely provides a solidly different experience, and the final boss was very cool.
• 58:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: One of the other legendary air ride machines there. I thought that was a very cool sequence that I did not.
• 58:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's just so big.
• 58:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. It's a huge.
• 58:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That mode is cool.
• 58:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: When you finish it, you get access to New Game Plus, which is the only way to unlock the true ending and stuff like that, or whatever it's called.
• 58:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : frequent curvy fashion.
• 58:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And in New Game Plus, you unlock an additional difficulty called very hard, which uncharacteristically, I cowardly.
• 58:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You're going to take forever if I have to deal with this, but very hard removes your ability to pay money to retry events that you fail, and you actually have to back up in the level to the last real checkpoint, and I was like, "Oh no, that's going to slow me down so much.
• 59:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure. Yeah.
• 59:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm just not going to do this during the playthrough."
• 59:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It definitely seems like there's enough meat on these bones.
• 59:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't think anyone should buy this game for single player play and expect it to blow them away.
• 59:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I definitely think anyone who does buy it, you got a nice little depending on whether you want to see the true ending, a nice little 3-6-hour campaign, which is cool.
• 59:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah yeah I agree and and again one of the the other nice bits of this having
• 59:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's not just better than nothing, it is genuinely a good one.
• 59:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : go fairly large appeal um you know some people by Kirby standards this is I
• 59:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : fairly light story I would say yeah right
• 1:00:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, I mean boy one of those cutscenes going hard, but yeah, it is reasonably light. I get what you mean
• 1:00:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but a lot of people are seeing these cutscenes though and and getting a taste
• 1:00:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : like oh Kirby goes this hard and
• 1:00:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know, it's interesting cuz like my wife pointed this out
• 1:00:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But she was like, you know, most curvy games only go this hard in the last like
• 1:00:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 20% in the last like bit but in road trip where the campaign the normal ending is only like two three hours
• 1:00:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like yeah, you see the fucked up stuff within our two, you know, like you get right to it. It's great
• 1:00:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean, I mean, heck, even, you don't even have to touch the mode, you just tried the galactic
• 1:00:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Nova course, you see them genociding, you're playing it.
• 1:00:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Sure. Yeah, Galactic Nova is just like this planet in particular. Yeah, Galactic Nova a little trickster guy, little awful, awful planet star, and he's got, I haven't finished Kirby Planet Robot actually. I'm really hoping that those rumors of a rerelease are true, but that game has a, a sibling planet to Galactic Nova, right?
• 1:00:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and then you go kill as hard.
• 1:00:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 1:01:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it yeah I yeah I think I don't remember the fully the Lord but I think it's
• 1:01:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Apparently who is also a big asshole, but I don't, I don't know.
• 1:01:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : actually like for the robot like theme of mechanization it's like an upgrade
• 1:01:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : through Nova actually I think or it's Bay and or it's based off him or
• 1:01:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : something like that but regardless yeah they the idea is right it's in some
• 1:01:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : sort of no but upgrade to Jason thing.
• 1:01:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: cool. I really want to play that game. I played Triple Deluxe and I was so, I came away
• 1:01:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: from it so, eh, that I ended up skipping Robobot, which seems to have been a big mistake,
• 1:01:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, it was I mean I enjoy triple deluxe a lot, but probably because it'd been lost
• 1:01:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: so.
• 1:01:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I had sunk my teeth into a proper curvy like that, but
• 1:02:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But you know, I'm robo. Yeah, but robo bot is
• 1:02:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Triple Deluxe is fine. It's fine. Oh
• 1:02:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : chef's kiss
• 1:02:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Man, I really hope those rumors are true
• 1:02:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh
• 1:02:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : If I didn't even know there's rumors, but oh, I'm so excited. Oh, um
• 1:02:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's
• 1:02:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Furby carbier riders, and I'm trying to think like there's
• 1:02:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's only I had to talk about the game for a good a little bit
• 1:02:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But does is there any other thoughts that you
• 1:02:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, I got, boy, I got, I got topics, a really fun topic in Kirby Air Ride is like,
• 1:02:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you know, in like the Anglo sphere. So if you go on Twitter or your gaming form of choice and you
• 1:02:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Uh-huh.
• 1:02:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: discuss Kirby Air Ride, there's a lot of people who are like, this game was ass actually.
• 1:02:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yes.
• 1:02:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 1:02:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: This game reviewed badly, this game sold badly, etc, etc. So obviously I disagree with them.
• 1:02:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 1:02:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But one thing I find very interesting is the difference in reception between
• 1:03:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: English countries and Japan, because I live in Japan right now, and I have had the luck to
• 1:03:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: talk to some Japanese gamers who like Kirby Air Ride, and everyone here likes it, and it
• 1:03:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: reviewed well, like unambiguously well. It is a well-regarded game, and at retro game stores,
• 1:03:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it's one of the most expensive, like, normal games in the library. Yeah, and when I say expensive
• 1:03:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Really? Hm.
• 1:03:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of normal games in the library. I mean like I
• 1:03:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: know I'm not counting games with like Pokemon boxes like
• 1:03:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: really limited stuff. Just the normal stuff. And
• 1:03:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, oh my gosh
• 1:03:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and GameCube game prices are a lot lower here. The market has
• 1:03:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: not been ravaged by collectors. But this that game commands
• 1:03:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like 7000 yen price tag here, which is quite a bit. That's
• 1:03:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: more than path of radiance here. The region locking really
• 1:03:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Wow, that's that's all right yeah
• 1:03:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: saved their asses on having the market destroyed, so.
• 1:04:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But Kirby Airide is like, that's a well-regarded game, whereas in English countries, it has a downright mixed, um, memory, or, you know, like mixed reputation, I should say.
• 1:04:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I find that so interesting.
• 1:04:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, that's why we get the angry Kirby in the U.S. on the box, it's
• 1:04:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, right?
• 1:04:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm sad we didn't get angry Kirby again, I should go graffiti on my cover.
• 1:04:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But that's I mean
• 1:04:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like I mean obviously you're out there in Japan, but I'm huge. We a boo-too. Everyone knows this. Oh, yeah
• 1:04:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, it sounds about right to me
• 1:04:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I always just find that an interesting thing anyway that like the the sentiment is just so different around it here
• 1:04:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, well, I mean, I feel like curvy in general like you
• 1:04:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 1:04:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Repain it has a lot of love for curvy
• 1:04:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Right like you you can see that from my way here in the States. No, not as much. It's a little more niche
• 1:05:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, here, here he definitely feels like
• 1:05:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: one of Nintendo's A-listers.
• 1:05:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And, well, not that he's not an A-lister,
• 1:05:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: either in North America,
• 1:05:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but he doesn't, you can see Mario stuff at stores
• 1:05:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: in North America, Zelda stuff, too, everyone known again,
• 1:05:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but Kirby slightly below that.
• 1:05:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But in Japan, I mean, yeah, yeah, Kirby stuff all over.
• 1:05:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean, you guys have the cafe.
• 1:05:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I mean, I think there's two Kirby cafes even.
• 1:05:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Probably.
• 1:05:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I haven't been to either sadly,
• 1:05:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but I would like to.
• 1:05:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, I would as well.
• 1:05:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, yeah, um, other, other Kirby Airrider thing, uh, man, those amoebos are really expensive,
• 1:05:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: eh?
• 1:05:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, okay. I wanted to bring this off since we're here. Talk about the merge
• 1:05:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: They're so expensive.
• 1:05:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's bad. It's really bad in the U.S. I don't know how bad it is in Japan, but it's bad out here
• 1:05:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's bad.
• 1:05:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, yeah, what's the U.S. price?
• 1:05:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Again, exactly, 'cause I don't, I don't know.
• 1:06:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So oh, okay, so I have to double check, but I will say this I
• 1:06:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, actually, that's a good idea, double check.
• 1:06:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Went I went I will say this I went to a big box store
• 1:06:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh-huh.
• 1:06:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Target while my camera break big again
• 1:06:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : you know, which is generally MSRP. That was 50, 50 USD. Yup.
• 1:06:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:06:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: $49.99.
• 1:06:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Man, that's rough.
• 1:06:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm checking the MSRP here because a lot of places in Japan,
• 1:06:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: cool thing, electronic stores, they sell below MSRP
• 1:06:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to try to compete, which is awesome.
• 1:06:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [laughs]
• 1:06:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like the Kirby iRide, the game itself,
• 1:06:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I got it for like 800 yen cheaper,
• 1:06:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: because that's just what electronic stores do anyway.
• 1:06:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [Laughter]
• 1:06:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Okay, so the MSR
• 1:06:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: here is 6600 yen for the Kirby's, which in normal financial times would be like 60 US dollars, but because the
• 1:06:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yen's so in the toilet right now, it is 4266. I had a touch cheaper, but still significantly more
• 1:06:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 1:07:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: expensive than the like, this is like double the price of most, most amiibo's nowadays.
• 1:07:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:07:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, and
• 1:07:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Feels me because like that was a big fan of me, but when they came out I have many many of me, but more than I should admit
• 1:07:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I, I also have quite a few and I still partake, I, yeah.
• 1:07:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I do - I will partake - but I mean it's not just curvy right like the best
• 1:07:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I think obviously switch to is coming out like the way
• 1:07:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it's just been jacked up by ridiculous numbers for many reasons, I guess, but I haven't bought well
• 1:07:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I haven't gotten one of the Kirby amigo, but when the Kawasaki amigo drops at the wagon star, I'm gonna break. I know I'm gonna break
• 1:07:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: [laughs]
• 1:07:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:07:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh, he's got the hop star, I think,
• 1:07:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is what he's got in, for the amoebo.
• 1:07:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : We see the hop start thought it was wearing a...
• 1:07:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, usually Kawasaki goes with the wagon, right?
• 1:07:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like you're totally right,
• 1:07:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but I think the amoebo is the hop star.
• 1:07:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the new one.
• 1:07:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'm looking this up. Oh, it is hopstart. Okay. You're right. You're right. Okay. Well, either we
• 1:07:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, you should.
• 1:08:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But you're totally right to associate him
• 1:08:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: with the wagon star 'cause that's, yeah.
• 1:08:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:08:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Anyway, sorry, go on.
• 1:08:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, but it's I mean first what's chef Kawasaki who's one of my favorite like side characters and
• 1:08:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm.
• 1:08:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : The functionality of being will swap them is pretty good. So I'm probably gonna crack with color
• 1:08:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:08:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I really think, like, fundamentally,
• 1:08:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that's why these things cost, like, as much as they do,
• 1:08:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 'cause the brass tax of it is you are getting to amoebo.
• 1:08:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It is. Yeah.
• 1:08:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know what I mean?
• 1:08:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, it fundamentally, it's to amoebo.
• 1:08:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: When you look at the two amoebo sets,
• 1:08:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: they cost quite a bit more.
• 1:08:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but the presentation of the Kirby
• 1:08:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: ones where they are only usable as a pair really changes the optics of that right because even though in your brain you know there's you're getting two amiibos they don't work or look good without the other half.
• 1:08:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : it does, they don't
• 1:08:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So it's it's really quite unfortunate and like even as I say that I'm on Nintendo's website looking at the latest amiibo sets.
• 1:09:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So Nintendo Blade 3 and Splatoon 3 sets where you got two amiibos in each of those sets. You know those are only forty four hundred yen which is still
• 1:09:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 1:09:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: only two thirds the price. So they're I've seen them in the stores and they are quite nice amiibo but even as someone who still buys amiibo I I can't and it sucks because I look at that wing star and I'm like oh my god it looks so good but
• 1:09:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 1:09:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Right, right. Like it's not only this curvier I
• 1:09:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : sequel out, but I could buy a Winkstar merch and one of myself. And I'm not getting it.
• 1:09:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, I -
• 1:09:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I was the same same here. I can't bring myself to do it.
• 1:09:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, bites and like I look at you know one of the ones that that I find crazy is like you know
• 1:09:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I look at you know Kirby and Waddle Dee at 6600 yen and then I look you know just to the left of them on the shelf
• 1:09:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I see the new Metroid Prime four Samus riding the Viola motorcycle which is a very large amiibo and that's 3500 yen
• 1:10:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That is only like 55% of the
• 1:10:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: price I mean I know it's not too amoebos but in terms of plastic girth and it is it is totally right there with it and it's hard for me to understand why the price is specifically so jacked on these it's I know Nintendo has like I don't love the switch to era of pricing for Nintendo I think the console is expensive but like whatever reasonable but I don't love the other.
• 1:10:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah.
• 1:10:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, yeah, of course
• 1:10:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:10:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know increases we've seen but like these Kirby amoebo are though I think these are the worst price changes we've seen on any Nintendo things since switch to launch and I find it brutal cuz I like you I'm like fingers on the glass like what do I do staring longingly into the eyes of waddledy and wingstar? Badanity excuse me bandanity
• 1:10:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : The accessories the game
• 1:10:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Bro, boy!
• 1:10:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and then you know like like to twist the knife more you know these work
• 1:11:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : better when you have more than one cuz then you can do the swat
• 1:11:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : to move here yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
• 1:11:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah.
• 1:11:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Right, like the functionality is so nifty,
• 1:11:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but you're totally right,
• 1:11:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: unless you go 100 bones in the hole,
• 1:11:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you, all you can do is take them off and be like,
• 1:11:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: huh, and then put them back on, right?
• 1:11:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, yeah, it's, it, like, I think.
• 1:11:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So one thing that I think is true,
• 1:11:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is that it probably would have been a very hard sell
• 1:11:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to sell them separately.
• 1:11:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that the vehicle separately from the riders.
• 1:11:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Because I think they would have run into problems. I think like the hop star would probably be less popular and
• 1:11:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh yeah, yup, we're in Tennessee, which tells, just tells for a bit.
• 1:11:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Bandana D would probably also be less popular than yeah
• 1:11:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Plus only having one
• 1:12:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know
• 1:12:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: They don't look good on their own. They don't really stand even the the riders
• 1:12:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't believe they stand properly on their own either because they don't have a real base
• 1:12:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, like, I'm willing to believe that there was probably a conversation.
• 1:12:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: In Nintendo that was like we should let players mix and match and buy them as they want but like the finances of that don't make any sense to me because you just end up in a situation where you have a bunch of the less desirables.
• 1:12:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:12:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know when you end up with with when Nintendo ends up with an overstock of 400,000 hop stars, you know, like it's so I don't want to I don't want to come off like I'm like caping for Nintendo's price increases because I do not like.
• 1:12:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That but I it's it's like it's the realities of of these Kirby ones are brutal in all directions and I hate it.
• 1:12:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:12:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, I mean, it's it's brutal. Yeah. No, and I mean, I'm in the same book
• 1:13:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Look at us two world's biggest fans of this game the series and we are buying the the amoebo the merch that we could have on our desk shelf right now
• 1:13:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: If bites, and if they were like, I'm looking at the other new amoebos.
• 1:13:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So like, Donkey Kong from Bonanza and then Samus and Cylex from Metroid Prime for the normal
• 1:13:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Samus, not the motorbike one, those cost 2,500 yen, which is higher than amoebos used to cost,
• 1:13:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:13:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you know, a while ago, but, you know, when I look at that next to 6,600 yen for one of these guys,
• 1:13:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yes, yes, and honestly like even if it was just 10 USD cheaper just 20% like
• 1:13:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 30 bucks.
• 1:13:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : 30 or 40 even 40 you know 40 even 40 I
• 1:13:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh, sorry, sorry, right, right, right, 40 bucks.
• 1:13:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah, 20, 20 apart.
• 1:13:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Sure.
• 1:13:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Could I think I could stomach it, you know like
• 1:13:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think so too, like bearing in mind,
• 1:13:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like, yeah, it's just because we're such big fans.
• 1:13:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like for me like me specifically, I don't I don't think that would be a good price
• 1:14:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:14:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But me specifically I could study get out for it
• 1:14:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: No.
• 1:14:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:14:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, at least like when I'm rationalizing,
• 1:14:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like I'm getting two parts,
• 1:14:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it's not as brutal as like,
• 1:14:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 300 yen for a bottle of bandana D
• 1:14:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that I don't really want that much, you know?
• 1:14:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 1:14:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'll be curious if when Meta Knight
• 1:14:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and Kawasaki launch, if people may be start swapping,
• 1:14:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: trading amongst each other
• 1:14:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: because these things are so expensive.
• 1:14:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So for that person who just wants Kirby on a shadow star,
• 1:14:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, but just I mean keep an eye on me when you know Starman on the transform star releases and I just break again
• 1:14:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: don't need Meta Knight, but yeah.
• 1:14:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I have to I have to imagine they're not going to do more like I I
• 1:14:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, I don't either five seems like a good number
• 1:14:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think there's only four I think it's only these four right so
• 1:14:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Now there's there's five there's Kirby bend in
• 1:14:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Are there five?
• 1:15:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : a d d d or you think you print missing d d and don't forget that's the one where the the amiibo
• 1:15:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Meta Knight Kawasaki. Oh, yeah, there's DDD right. Sorry. You're right. There are five
• 1:15:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : actually transforms to the tank yep yeah
• 1:15:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Which is neat that is neat that is genuinely neat you're right there are five might be
• 1:15:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, I can't imagine
• 1:15:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think the prices are just gonna do the min. I can't imagine they're gonna do well enough to justify but we'll see
• 1:15:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I will say this, the Street Fighter and Miibo that came out, they were 35 USDs fairly high priced.
• 1:15:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:15:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : At one point, at least on Amazon, they were marked down to 15 USD, which was more standard.
• 1:15:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 1:15:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, there's hope, there's just limbo.
• 1:15:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We didn't get that experience in Japan,
• 1:15:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but I did see that that all American retailers
• 1:15:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 1:15:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: had a significant price drop on the Street Fighter ones.
• 1:15:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 1:15:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I, yeah, those ones had an unusually high price as well,
• 1:15:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, and I-
• 1:15:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, they are. Yeah.
• 1:15:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: even though they're quite large and nice,
• 1:15:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: they were a bit too much.
• 1:15:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'm looking at Nintendo's Amiibo page right now
• 1:16:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: upcoming Rosalina and Mario, the Galaxy ones.
• 1:16:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:16:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And those have 4,000 yen price tags,
• 1:16:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I'm like, oh, they're really big amiibos,
• 1:16:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 1:16:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but like looking at their bases, they're huge,
• 1:16:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but still, still, I, I yearn for the days of Smash 4
• 1:16:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: launching with 999 US amiibos.
• 1:16:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh my gosh, it's 10. Yeah, 10 years. Do you leave us so good?
• 1:16:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, March space is fucked up.
• 1:16:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't give a f**k--
• 1:16:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I like it for that way
• 1:16:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - I like it.
• 1:16:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Stop.
• 1:16:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah.
• 1:16:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Ah, for real.
• 1:16:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so that's okay, that's correct
• 1:16:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Mm-hmm.
• 1:16:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, I'm happy, I finally will sit down, so I want to get exhausted about it, and I'm more than happy too
• 1:16:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think, I think I got, I think I got most of my thoughts out. I mean, yeah, yeah. Definitely,
• 1:16:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, me too, I think so too
• 1:16:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: just didn't want to let it go without talking about those amoebos.
• 1:16:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, and true to curve, yeah
• 1:16:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Everyone, everyone I talk to in my life about the amoebos, they go like,
• 1:16:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yeah, I don't buy amoebos anymore. They're too expensive. So what's different about this one?
• 1:17:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Wow, yeah, I knew
• 1:17:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, but me too in the same position
• 1:17:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I'm like, you're right, but you shouldn't say it. Anyway, so I'm glad I had someone to
• 1:17:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: talk to who's also like struggling anyway. Now.
• 1:17:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Let's bear very specific
• 1:17:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And I just want to point out true to true to the curvy air ride experience
• 1:17:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mean, no shade whatsoever, but we just spent one an hour talking, you know, you want that or whatever
• 1:17:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Whatever length of time we taught and we didn't mention top right.
• 1:17:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah bringing bringing in the actual vehicle and I think was a smart call and the map feel good, but but it's top right.
• 1:17:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I didn't didn't at all. I was literally thinking like should I bring up top ride like just just now when you said was there anything else it's better
• 1:17:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: They made it better. They did they did more
• 1:17:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 1:17:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, oh dude when I was playing when I was playing
• 1:17:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Roadtrip and I got to a top ride
• 1:18:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: level where my currently equipped vehicle was
• 1:18:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the swerve star, I was not prepared for how that feels like the first time trying to use the swerve star and top ride.
• 1:18:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : DIE!
• 1:18:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But like that was genuinely such a really fresh feeling curvy air ride experience.
• 1:18:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah. That was, that is a good one. Absolutely. Okay. One, one more small note. Actually,
• 1:18:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, highly recommend it. Shoot, shoot.
• 1:18:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'll on that note. Um, I think like, okay, it's been a while since I've touched the original
• 1:18:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : air, right? So maybe just because my memory is outdated, but I think he balance fixed some of the
• 1:18:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : balancing some of those machines on those original machines, bulk star. Right.
• 1:18:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, you reckon
• 1:18:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Rocket star, they feel feasible. Yeah.
• 1:18:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah bulk star when I started my playthrough, I kept referring to it as a lumber and piece
• 1:18:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And but like getting to use it again, I'm like oh wait hang on a formula star as well
• 1:19:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, I
• 1:19:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I feel like formula star is more viable now
• 1:19:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, it feels like fun. I feel like formula is almost the best star now. You can go so fast
• 1:19:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Formula is strong that was what I used in like the last boss race stage
• 1:19:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And swerves. Yeah, yeah
• 1:19:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I was like I just need to crush these straightaways, and it just did it right away. So, yeah
• 1:19:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Anyway, you're right
• 1:19:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And swerve stardin nerf just just a hair to you know where it can other machines can't be with it
• 1:19:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Swerve star was disgusting. I once won a money match at Magfest one year
• 1:19:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, oh
• 1:19:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it was, uh,
• 1:19:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: swerve star on machine passage against another guy.
• 1:19:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, I mean that you mean you mean the swerve star map that that map
• 1:19:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The swerve star map. Yeah, he was good. It wasn't like a total stomp,
• 1:19:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but like I always remember that fondly. So yeah, um,
• 1:19:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:19:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah.
• 1:19:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: yeah, swerve star was like kind of kind of too much in the original.
• 1:20:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, so yeah, good job, sucker. You fixed the ones that were kind of funky.
• 1:20:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm definitely, I feel a little sad that it's like, I don't feel quite as
• 1:20:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: ridiculously powerful with it but it's understandable and it's where it
• 1:20:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think so. I think so. I still... I still hate writing. Turbo, though.
• 1:20:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, God.
• 1:20:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, it's it's a little weird. Um, okay. Well, all right. Okay. There you go, folks. Welcome to the
• 1:20:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Kirby here.
• 1:20:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's not.
• 1:20:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, but now let's, let's, let's move on to our, I want to talk about guarding Guardians for real because.
• 1:20:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm. Sure.
• 1:20:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Putting it from my perspective as is someone who followed you for, you know, here's on super best friends and streams and whatnot.
• 1:20:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And you know, I've always known you to be a passionate guy about games and game design and so on. And so seeing you take the plunge into making the game is very exciting.
• 1:20:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Certainly, right.
• 1:21:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And I mean, "Spry Snow" and "Game Devs Hard,"
• 1:21:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : like I saw "Her Journey" and "It's Hard."
• 1:21:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And I guess, I guess, you know,
• 1:21:09
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : "Elevator Pitch" for the listeners,
• 1:21:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : what is guarding Guardian?
• 1:21:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It is a, it's a, it caught me five bucks,
• 1:21:16
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : USD on the Switch, right?
• 1:21:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So that's the, like, I'm just putting the scale,
• 1:21:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : 'cause that's, you know,
• 1:21:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I think that's a measuring stick of sorts,
• 1:21:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : like, for games, I think it's fair.
• 1:21:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I priced it that way, I think feeling like it was a small game, so you're not wrong to feel that way.
• 1:21:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah, yeah.
• 1:21:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's not bad.
• 1:21:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's by no means a bad game, quite satisfying.
• 1:21:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I've enjoyed it, my games that I've spent more on, absolutely.
• 1:21:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And the gameplay is both the legally distinct term,
• 1:21:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : use LCD games.
• 1:21:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Health CD yeah, yeah, it fundamentally it comes from my love of game and watch games and
• 1:21:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, it's a gaming watch game.
• 1:21:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, and you know, I did my best to design an original game and watch game because a lot of
• 1:22:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's lots of game and watch games out there more than almost anyone
• 1:22:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It could ever possibly remember and there's lots of LCD games out there and a lot of them
• 1:22:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Sort of copy each other's homework and like you know, the game will be arranged vertically or horizontally
• 1:22:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But there a lot of them can be quite similar to one another and so it was it was actually like a really good
• 1:22:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There. They are.
• 1:22:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: game design challenge because like
• 1:22:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Game and watch games are so concise like there's so little and I really wanted to kind of like respect the rules
• 1:22:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I didn't want to have like a scrolling screen or I wanted to to design something that
• 1:22:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: existed in the same.
• 1:22:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: In the same conversation and they didn't have to be a little but this game is kind of different because it's you know it cheats in such and such way or what have you.
• 1:22:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 1:22:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So it was a really tricky exercise actually like making a game with such tight design limitations that still felt fresh and different from other game and watch games.
• 1:23:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I mean as a as a kid I the first game I ever own.
• 1:23:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And was game and watch gallery to my mom bought me a game boy color and game watch gallery to.
• 1:23:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Too specifically. I had that one too. That was a good one.
• 1:23:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: To specifically such a good game I played the hell out of it and I eventually played three I didn't really play four ever but to remain like a sort of beloved game and when I was when I went back to college a couple years back.
• 1:23:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I did too.
• 1:23:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:23:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: During our last semester it was like pandemic we were all doing class from home and stuff.
• 1:23:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There was like a series of classes at the end where we were just kind of like going over some stuff that I kind of like kind of knew already like some sort of boilerplate kind of like here's how to save your game here's how to.
• 1:24:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was good information for those who didn't know it in the class but I had a little more experience so I you know.
• 1:24:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, bad student that I was, at some point I like picked up my game.
• 1:24:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I started playing Game of Watch Gallery to, uh, during a couple of my lessons where I was like, "Okay, I kind of know what's going on."
• 1:24:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, and yeah, at some point during that experience, like, I mean, I always loved playing this game, and I still did, and I was like, "I should just make a game. I'll just make one of these."
• 1:24:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So that's the genesis I was curious.
• 1:24:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, that's the Genesis. Game of Watch Gallery to specifically playing it, well, having a lifetime is worth of affection for it,
• 1:24:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: during the tail end of my, uh, college program, engineered, or like, targeting game development. So, uh, it became like, "Okay, I'm going to make like a quick, like, month, month-long, development version of this game."
• 1:25:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, and it'll be what it's going to be, and at the end of the, well, before the end of the month, I was like, "Oh, this is actually like, quite fun."
• 1:25:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like this is actually like a really surprisingly good.
• 1:25:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Game and Watch game, so I was like, well, I should take this to its conclusion.
• 1:25:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I should really elaborate this out into like as full a game and so the development idea behind it
• 1:25:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: kind of changed a little bit. So from the beginning, the one development idea I had was I wanted to
• 1:25:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: take advantage of like a couple limitations being gone. I know I said like I didn't want to
• 1:25:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: this might be viewed as a cheat. But in old LCD games, you know, characters can only occupy
• 1:25:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like fixed positions on the screen. And they sort of like appear and they move in like in steps,
• 1:26:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you know, from position to position on the screen. And so I wanted to take advantage of
• 1:26:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the fact that characters could move without having to take like these fixed steps. And I also knew
• 1:26:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I wanted an element of resource management.
• 1:26:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Not because I think game and watch game fans are like hurtin' for resource management.
• 1:26:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [laughter]
• 1:26:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But because it's not an element that I see in Game and Watch games very much.
• 1:26:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You see that in like oil panic?
• 1:26:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: A little filling up Mr. Game and Watch bucket, you know.
• 1:26:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You see that in oil panic, you know, filling the bucket and managing that.
• 1:26:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And you see it in like cement factory.
• 1:26:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But not too many Game and Watch games incorporate resource management.
• 1:26:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So that was like a big thing as well.
• 1:26:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: collecting the food from the bugs that you shred.
• 1:26:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : because yeah the bugs yeah well I mean the resource management in gaming watches
• 1:26:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, go ahead.
• 1:27:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : stress that's what it really is magic is stress yeah yep yep
• 1:27:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Right, yeah, just increasing speed, yeah.
• 1:27:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was fun to like thread the needle
• 1:27:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of like the normal stress of game and watch games,
• 1:27:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but also like manage your resources.
• 1:27:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: for anyone who hasn't played it, you.
• 1:27:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the enemies approaching your plants in order to collect food for your plants, you basically feed the plants, the guts of your enemies.
• 1:27:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And by feeding the plants, they grow and you can pick them for additional points.
• 1:27:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a really fun little balancing act. If you carry too much food, your character slows down, and you need to either feed it to your plants, or you need to dump it all on their own.
• 1:27:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and just throw away all the food you've collected, just to get your speed back.
• 1:27:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, that's what I refer to as the coward button.
• 1:27:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, well, ideally, ideally you never press it. Ideally, you feed every food as soon as you possibly can, but it's easier said than done sometimes, right?
• 1:28:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:28:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, no, no.
• 1:28:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, it's...
• 1:28:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I say people know I'm a hard-nose for, it's hard challenges or what.
• 1:28:12
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's what I say.
• 1:28:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But no, it's appreciated that you have an option to just drop it because, you know, that's a good idea.
• 1:28:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, I try to never use it as well.
• 1:28:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I really kind of like the purity of it
• 1:28:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: just being like a D-pad.
• 1:28:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But early on, I was like, I need to have this option
• 1:28:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 'cause it's too abrasive when your movement gets slowed down.
• 1:28:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's too abrasive to not have the choice or anything.
• 1:28:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So yeah, so that was like what the initial design idea was.
• 1:28:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's just I wanted to add some resource management
• 1:28:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I wanted to have like, you know,
• 1:28:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like accommodate for enemies being able to.
• 1:28:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So that led to the enemies also sort of making a mess on your screen with how they run at different speeds and stuff like that, which is tougher on the old game and watch games because you have to like the whole game's logic has to move in steps.
• 1:29:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So you could have an enemy who moved every one step and then an enemy who moved every two steps, but they're still fundamentally moving at pretty similar, you know,
• 1:29:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, there's a tempo right?
• 1:29:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: there's a very rigid tempo and this says a much looser tempo, which I thought was fun.
• 1:29:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It is I think that
• 1:29:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And once I decided to thank you, once I decided to elaborate it out to like a fuller game, the the guiding light was like, okay, what if Nintendo made Game and Watch Gallery 5 for the Nintendo Switch at the time?
• 1:29:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: What would what would that look like in my mind? And a part of that process was like...
• 1:29:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: just thinking about it from their perspective. So there's some stuff that like didn't make the cut for me. Like I think nowadays it would be 3D art Nintendo does use a lot of 3D art mostly, so it'd be 3D which is fine.
• 1:29:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh yeah. Yeah. The... (laughs)
• 1:30:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But that was something that right away I was like, I can't afford to do that. That's not happening. So my buddy did the art with me and he did an amazing job, but neither of us could do 3D stuff.
• 1:30:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that that that wasn't on the table, but the main thing for me was like if
• 1:30:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: one thing they would almost certainly add is like a bunch of to do for
• 1:30:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: each of the games because you know you go back to the Game Boy ones and even
• 1:30:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Game Boy Advance one, Game Watch Gallery 4 and like fundamentally like the
• 1:30:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: thing to do is get high scores in each game and that's it and that's great
• 1:30:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you can sync a lot of hours on that if you're into it but if you're not the
• 1:30:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: type of user who enjoys that experience, if you're more of a type of
• 1:30:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: user who likes to make permanent progress or unlock things or work their way through something.
• 1:30:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The Game and Watch gallery games and Game and Watch games, indeed, I think are probably quite
• 1:31:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: unsatisfying for you. And so I felt like Nintendo would probably do that. They would
• 1:31:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: probably make an effort to make each game have a variety of things to do. So that turned into
• 1:31:17
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: things to unlock and
• 1:31:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: sort of mission types there's so so the game that I made Garden Guardian it has that endless mode which is like the classic experience and
• 1:31:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: then it has
• 1:31:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the trials mode where you have
• 1:31:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Six sets of three levels
• 1:31:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: increasing in difficulty and varying and objective and
• 1:31:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: My feeling was like you know when intent it if Nintendo made a game watch gallery five
• 1:31:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Obviously, they're gonna have like a bunch of games
• 1:31:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I only had the...
• 1:31:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: band with to make one realistically, you know, and designing this was definitely tricky,
• 1:31:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: because the Game & Watch design space has been so thoroughly explored.
• 1:32:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I kept it to just making one game and elaborating it as much as I could for what was realistic.
• 1:32:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I feel satisfied with how it came out.
• 1:32:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Even me, personally, starting from a new save, it takes me like...
• 1:32:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: an hour and a half to two hours to, like, unlock and do everything.
• 1:32:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Except for, like, one thing that's, like, tied to play time that requires two hours of play time.
• 1:32:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It still takes a reasonable amount of time to do it all.
• 1:32:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'm very satisfied with where it came out, because I was somewhat concerned.
• 1:32:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I wouldn't be able to get this thing the last half an hour.
• 1:32:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But, you know, it lasts, and it's good, and I've played an in order to...
• 1:32:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I still play it regularly. Like, I really enjoy playing it on my switch light on the train.
• 1:32:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I love seeing the scores on Steam.
• 1:33:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, there are a couple people who still play it.
• 1:33:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There are some people who have psychotic scores, and I love it.
• 1:33:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Some people have posted scores.
• 1:33:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think someone has over 9,000 points in one of the mode, which is crazy.
• 1:33:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh my goodness.
• 1:33:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't think I've ever posted a score.
• 1:33:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like 3,000, and that already was a slog. It takes a long time even to get to that song anyway.
• 1:33:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, oh my gosh
• 1:33:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Thank you for letting me rattle off about the inception of the game, but...
• 1:33:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, no the good stuff that's what I want to hear about
• 1:33:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So so I want to share some my thoughts from you know the other side the consumer the player
• 1:33:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : so
• 1:33:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : For such a small game, there's there's a lot to unpack because you know, it's just the one-game plate
• 1:33:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : mechanic loop, but it's so well designed and satisfying.
• 1:33:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I have it tired of it, and like on this show, we review a lot of games that we very quickly can tell this isn't going to last long. We're not enjoying this, et cetera, et cetera.
• 1:34:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And because again, game development is hard and there's so many different bits and pieces that can go wrong or or be weak in one area, sometimes a game can be really good and still have one big flaw, but the other areas are good enough.
• 1:34:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and so on, but this game like it's it's such tight package like it runs well it plays well like and again, maybe that's my similar bias of having played the game and watch kids games and I was younger, but you presented the unlockables with the art, the trial missions to set, you know, clear objectives, I think all that plays really really well.
• 1:34:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and it's it's such an easy game to pick up and just play for a little bit to you know, we get a tight score try to be to mission or whatnot.
• 1:35:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So it's really well done and you had enough sense to bring other people on board, you didn't do the the concern day thing solo, diving massive game.
• 1:35:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: hahaha
• 1:35:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I mean yeah, I needed help
• 1:35:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and and.
• 1:35:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and I think the folks who pitched in all that a great job the the visual presentation, which is such a strong element or such a deciding element for so many games, especially feels like on this show the cottage course space.
• 1:35:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I mentioned a bit earlier when I talked about like it you you frame it in this huge protecting your little garden trying to grow fruits and you're killing bugs to to let it you know.
• 1:35:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : grow and pick up fruits and and that I you hit the you head out of the park with that that cozy feeling of tending to your garden and you know just protecting it it's it's almost relaxing despite the stress or speed that you know that some of the levels can get to and whatnot.
• 1:36:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But it's a lot of those game in launch games were actually put this oftentimes felt very.
• 1:36:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And it's a very divorced from the suppose it scenario you're in right like game in watch parachuting I don't I don't know why he's parachuting you I'm just pushing.
• 1:36:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh sure, yeah. Yeah, you're not wrong about that.
• 1:36:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Parachute is weird, isn't it? Yeah.
• 1:36:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I'm just moving the the controls whatever I'm just I just want the the points I know what it's supposed to do, but here you you really feel the like it's living up to the name garden guardian and a lot of that charm is also carried by the the our our.
• 1:36:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : um snippy shear every the last
• 1:36:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Snippy, yeah. Snippy shrubs. Snippy shrubs, yeah.
• 1:36:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : nappy snippy yeah yeah that's what it
• 1:36:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : um whoever is that your designer is that one of your friend or the other people
• 1:37:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : worked on it um because that that's an A plus did
• 1:37:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, yeah, so the accreditation, my friend Phil,
• 1:37:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: he, Phil Dragash, you can find him anywhere.
• 1:37:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: He did all of the, like, art for the game
• 1:37:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: with very few exceptions.
• 1:37:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 1:37:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So the menu art, I did 100% of the menu art,
• 1:37:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It shows which I say lovingly
• 1:37:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but, thank you.
• 1:37:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I did the menu art, but heated 100%.
• 1:37:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: He did 99%. I had one friend come in to, there's an unlockable classic UI layout that makes it look like an older game and watch title.
• 1:37:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, that's cute, I haven't gotten that much.
• 1:37:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I had a friend who did the classic UI thing, but other than that, Phil did all the art, and he did the design.
• 1:37:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We worked very closely on the design, though. I was literally watching him draw, so it was a very collaborative process.
• 1:37:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Nice.
• 1:38:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, what a very great design Snippy is a fun, I believe,
• 1:38:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : is that the correct term for a little goat girl, I think, is that what she is.
• 1:38:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: um she so like right like a fawn is like that greek uh like myth thing right uh and in our so we
• 1:38:18
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:38:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: didn't really like define it hard the guiding light for me was like this was supposed to take
• 1:38:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: place i'm like a savanna so she was supposed to be like a gazelle girl so yeah yeah yeah you're not the
• 1:38:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Oh, that's why her horns are kind
• 1:38:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : in that shape. I see it now. I was okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 1:38:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think
• 1:38:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: first person to say fawn cuz like it the game never lays it
• 1:38:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: out, and it's not like a million percent clear enough, but that's also why the her appearance
• 1:38:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like her her coloration varies a little bit. Yeah, uh, that's
• 1:38:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, I get that makes a lot of sense now and I think some of the the artworks that you unlock or you know, you get a better view of her
• 1:38:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I think it really feels
• 1:39:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You see the idea of like you know, go person or whatever more but now you say in poly. Yeah, I totally see it because the the horns are
• 1:39:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Are very much indicative that I get it and and you get the little ants fighting them off in the Savannah. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense
• 1:39:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yeah, yeah.
• 1:39:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the, I'm glad you spoke about the gallery
• 1:39:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: getting you a better look, 'cause I'm very,
• 1:39:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: very happy with how the gallery turned out
• 1:39:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : The gallery is so good
• 1:39:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: in terms of content.
• 1:39:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The, yeah.
• 1:39:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I mean for it so for people who will hopefully play like he
• 1:39:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's the gallery's you're more or less reward system as you clear objectives and you know
• 1:39:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Is that trophies you get little artworks and you get a little comment from snippy on them and oh, it's it's so cute
• 1:39:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's great. I adore it. Some of the artworks are very very cute very fun
• 1:39:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I like the one where she's sharing the cake.
• 1:39:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : or whatever the ants and the bugs. That's a fun one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, okay.
• 1:39:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the first anniversary art, I think, was what that one was.
• 1:40:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the art gallery, it's presented with these drapes on the side, and the way Snippy gets up to explain stuff when you prompt her.
• 1:40:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was very inspired by Game of Launch Gallery, Mario walking between stuff and the gallery aesthetic.
• 1:40:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'm very happy with how that turned out.
• 1:40:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's great.
• 1:40:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Only regret with the gallery is I think I would have liked a menu like a grid or something instead of having to just scroll through them all, but that's a small potatoes. Honestly, I'm very otherwise very happy with it.
• 1:40:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I mean like for switch. I think it is
• 1:40:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I think so too. And one thing that I'm really happy about with the gallery is like Phil and I are great friends and we became friends through, like, Broadway.
• 1:40:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And he was a fan of our old YouTube channel, but we really became friends working on projects and like, he, when he throws himself into a project, he gets so into it and like, a lot of the illustrations in Garden Guardian are just concept pieces. But there's a bunch of them where Phil would, I just be the weekend and Phil would send me a picture of Snippy that he drew. And he's like, what do you think? And I'm like, this is cute. And he's like, yeah.
• 1:41:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Anyway, we just ended
• 1:41:26
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's a literally just fan art in the game.
• 1:41:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: up with a bunch of the art, there's a bunch of art that has different looking styles,
• 1:41:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and it's all fill, actually they all have credits attached, then you can see who drew
• 1:41:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: what.
• 1:41:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, he drew snippy and a bunch of different styles and presentations just for fun.
• 1:41:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, I was wondering if that was one person or not, I didn't pay attention to that, that's impressive.
• 1:41:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So most of it is.
• 1:41:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is a set there's a
• 1:41:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a bunch of art I don't know I want to say like less than 10 pieces that are like guest pieces so a couple of my friends I commission them to draw a piece of art for the game just to like so I could have a bit more stuff in the gallery.
• 1:42:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And it's one artist I follow who I thought suited it and then there's a selection of art that is fan art that after the fact.
• 1:42:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, that's so cool!
• 1:42:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's not a lot of it because it was not a super duper popular game sadly.
• 1:42:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: One of them in particular that I thought was so cool. This is guy on twitter.
• 1:42:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I won't say his username in case he doesn't want me to put it out there, though he has credited in the game with it.
• 1:42:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: He made a 3D model of one of the enemies in the game with a little animation.
• 1:42:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Wow.
• 1:42:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And when I decided, like, oh, I want to put some fan art in the game, I worked with him to get it in the game.
• 1:42:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So in the gallery, the initial silhouette looks like every other thing where it's just
• 1:42:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I haven't seen that. That's so cool.
• 1:42:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a silhouette, but when you unlock it, it's actually a 3D model that rotates and animates,
• 1:43:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I made a whole 3D model viewer just for that one piece of art, which was really way too
• 1:43:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: much work for what it was, but I'm so satisfied with the result when I look back at it.
• 1:43:16
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, that's so cool.
• 1:43:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I'm rambling here, but I'm really glad you thought the gallery was neat because it was
• 1:43:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, it's fantastic.
• 1:43:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: really nice.
• 1:43:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: those features that I look at, like when I'm working.
• 1:43:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm working on newer projects and I'm like, how do I ever make something feel that lovely again, you know?
• 1:43:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : well okay well first I want to go back to snippy for a second hats off to Elle's
• 1:43:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, anyway, yeah, please, yeah.
• 1:43:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Elle's Beth he spent it if I've grown that correctly fantastic add addition to the
• 1:43:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:43:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : voice to making it charming very very critical
• 1:43:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She crushed it, like, I had, so I've known Elspeth for years before that because she did, like,
• 1:43:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like, voice acting and streaming and stuff, and I had listened to, I had worked with her a little on a project before where she actually did some music for me.
• 1:44:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's not really something she does, she like stopped doing it, like, during after that project because it wasn't really vibing with her as, like, a thing to do.
• 1:44:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But, like, I continued to be friends with her and I had heard her, like, voice reels and stuff.
• 1:44:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And when we were designing this character, I was like, who could do this sort of, like, nasally high?
• 1:44:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Perky, like, happy character, and she came to mind, plucky, right? That's the word, plucky.
• 1:44:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Flucky
• 1:44:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, as people on this show. No, yeah, she did as people on this show
• 1:44:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: See you next time.
• 1:44:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, I am a big fan of
• 1:44:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Flucky protagonists like little girls. I don't know why
• 1:44:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : But just several games
• 1:44:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's sakuna
• 1:44:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There's a game called Mika and the witches mountains, but anyways, but yes, I'll fuck it
• 1:44:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Mm-hmm.
• 1:44:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Mm-hmm.
• 1:44:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She crushed it.
• 1:44:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She, like, I sort of said,
• 1:44:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I like this clip in your voice reel.
• 1:45:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Can we get something like this and this and this?
• 1:45:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And like, I had like no notes.
• 1:45:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like she came back with like the test audio,
• 1:45:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's done.
• 1:45:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and it sounded just like the snippet you hear in the game.
• 1:45:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And she just, she just like hit it out of the park
• 1:45:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: on the first go.
• 1:45:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I was like, oh, wow, okay.
• 1:45:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Well, that certainly went well.
• 1:45:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She made it easy and she was yeah, that was really good. I was very glad to finally get to work with her on something and like bring that through to the end
• 1:45:23
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:45:33
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: She adds I think
• 1:45:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: one of the big successes from my perspective is that I feel like snippy's personality really like permeates every area of the game from like gameplay to gallery
• 1:45:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and Elspith all the little voice clips of which there aren't
• 1:45:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: as many as you might think, they really punctuate it so well. I was really happy.
• 1:45:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : They do I fully fully agree, and nominal phenomenal work
• 1:46:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So yeah, I mean like I
• 1:46:07
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Again, it's kind of a oh, you know, here's here's here's the thing
• 1:46:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I thought I mean, it's small and scale perhaps a game
• 1:46:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : We could say although I spent a lot of time playing it and I have a tired of it, which is quite testament to your work
• 1:46:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but
• 1:46:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : the one criticism I would have and this is a loving criticism I've had for many games what more
• 1:46:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm
• 1:46:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Have you ever had thought of you know and and you know that that's
• 1:46:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, yeah
• 1:46:37
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : More trials more enemy types or maybe another game and watch have you given thought to
• 1:46:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Either adding more here or sequel
• 1:46:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Yes, yeah.
• 1:46:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: - Well, I'm incredibly flattered that you liked it,
• 1:46:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I'm glad that there are dozens of people
• 1:46:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like you out there who really enjoyed it a lot,
• 1:46:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: 'cause I like it so much,
• 1:47:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I was so worried when I put it out
• 1:47:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that nobody's gonna give a shit about this game,
• 1:47:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and I'm glad it did reach a couple freaks out there.
• 1:47:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So in regards to like, more.
• 1:47:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, yes, and I'm like super down to talk about it, uh, some stuff, very much scuttled, but other stuff. Yeah. So like more for this game.
• 1:47:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, the, there was, there were two other enemy types.
• 1:47:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, one of which got cut early for good reason and one of which I regret and I would have liked to feature it.
• 1:47:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, but it would have been a lot of works. The first one was a projectile enemy who came onto the screen and shot a projectile.
• 1:47:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, towards down the lane. And the problem was, although like, although that would be kind of like visually different, like, it was a little unclear how snipy was supposed to interact with them.
• 1:47:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, in the first place. Um, yeah, so that was kind of an early idea that kind of went nowhere. It was just a little different and I was, I was trying to figure it out, but like, it, and it wasn't meaningfully different.
• 1:47:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah, that's my first thought. Like, "How's that going to be going to guard against this?"
• 1:48:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So it was still something just coming down the lane, right? So, uh, so that one got cut early. Um, and that was actually like part of the process of like, coming up with the enemies was realizing that like, although not having the limitations of game and watch is super real, like the, the game's design is very limiting in terms of like what you can do with enemies. You know, like they, all they can really do is like walk forward and they have to,
• 1:48:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: again, eventually get to snippy so she can engage them because she has like, you know, she can't move off of her place base. Um, so like, you know, the standard move forward, they like pause, then move forward really fast. And then the bruiser enemy who you have to deal with twice ended up being like the ones that stood tall as like, really understandable, functional things. And it became really, it became evident really quick that like it was going to be very difficult.
• 1:49:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: To design another enemy that stood up to these three. So the projectile one was the one that I took the most seriously otherwise and after scuttling that, I was like, you know what, threes a nice round number. I'll just, I'm just going to move on from enemies because those guys are good and they make a good team. They feel good next to each other, I think. Um, the fifth enemy, the one that I regret, sorry, I just bumped my desk. Um, the one that I regret,
• 1:49:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but like, it would have taken a lot more work is I really wanted to have like a boss monster that would occupy the left side of the screen and. Yeah, I would have liked to have that an oversized boss monster that fills the left side of the screen that use, I'm not a hundred percent sure, but uses appendages or something to attack lanes in a variety of ways and patterns. Um, and that one would
• 1:49:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That feels like a natural progression.
• 1:50:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: involve like more involved patterns. So it would like do all the lanes from like top to bottom or bottom to top and you'd have to like keep up with it, you know, or it would do, you know, anyway, different patterns that you'd have to like respond to properly. And after you did, after you were able to respond effectively enough, you would get an opportunity to do like a finishing move like out of like revengeions where she'd like leap across the screen and like slice it. Um, I
• 1:50:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: really wanted to do something like that, but it was hard. It like, okay, it would have been a lot of art for Phil, which, you know, Phil, Phil also wasn't working for free and he was, you know, we, we work together very well and money is not an issue between us, but like, you know, I needed to be cognizant of like this game's no budget because it was all out of my pocket. Right. Um, but even just doing a basic version of it would have been a lot and.
• 1:50:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah, yeah, should have just done like a three frame judgment cut.
• 1:51:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like I, for better and for worse, like I, I really am a bit of a perfectionist and often that is for the worse, but in, you know, in this game's finished state, I'm sure you can see that everything is quite polished and getting that enemy to a, a level of polish where it would, it would really, um, stand tall as like a fun, cool boss enemy. Uh, would have been tough. And the other thing was like, does this 100%
• 1:51:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: suit snippy, this big leap across the screen, final attack, kind maybe. But it was it was
• 1:51:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: something that I would have had to massage and like work on a little bit to try to get it to like
• 1:51:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you know fit as far as the like narrative design of the world goes. It was like a little too
• 1:52:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: actiony and so for all of those reasons it ended up not happening. Mostly for budgetary and work
• 1:52:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: reasons. I also did all the animation.
• 1:52:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : door right my the I agree fully you know
• 1:52:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: for the game. And that was a lot as well. So I do feel that the roster is really strong. The three enemies complement each other really well.
• 1:52:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But yeah. As far as making more trials and stuff, it's something I've thought about like going back to Garden Guardian and adding more content to it.
• 1:52:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I'm in, to be honest, I'm in like a tough spot with Garden Guardian because there's some stuff I want.
• 1:52:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I want to add to it. I would really, above all, want to add other languages to it. It's only in English right now.
• 1:52:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And like, so like, I regularly meet people in Japan and they're like, oh, I want to play your game. It's on the switch, right?
• 1:53:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And it's like, oh, yes, but you can't buy it on the Japanese shop. I routinely meet people who, like, I have to say, yeah, you got to get it on Steam and it's only going to be in English.
• 1:53:05
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Nah
• 1:53:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm bilingual, right? Like, I'm French, I'm from Quebec. And so that was always something I was cognizant of. But like, when the game was originally made as this smaller project, I didn't put all the hooks in for language stuff.
• 1:53:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And like, I tried to assess that before the last major update and it was overwhelming to put them in retro, spectra retroactively. So.
• 1:53:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, how can it be just copying the code
• 1:53:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and based it in the Google Translate.
• 1:53:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Boom, done, right?
• 1:53:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, no, definitely the text is the smaller problem. But like, for example, the, all the nice menu buttons, they have like text that animates on them. And like, that wouldn't fit all the other languages, for example. So there was, there's a variety of like challenges there. And anyway, when I was assessing this stuff, I was like, discussing with like a close friend of mine. He helped me publish this on Switch. It's published under his company on Switch, actually.
• 1:53:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:54:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And, you know, he gave me a bit of advice that I think is true, but it's like a painful bit of advice. And he's like, this game isn't selling at some point you have to move on. Like, at some point. Like, adding more, like he's like, I totally respect and love how much you want to keep adding to this game. But like, it's a lot of work for you. And like, it's very minimal return. And actually, like, I'm not sure
• 1:54:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: try to get into this, but like, I'm very glad the game did break even. And like, it broke even. That's, yeah, a lot of people don't get that. You know, so, but the budget wasn't high. It was like $3,500 Canadian dollars out of my pocket. And that was like with friend rates and stuff. You know what I mean? Like, you know, I think all said,
• 1:54:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, bro, even honestly, I think that's impressive. I like it. It's yeah, yeah
• 1:55:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 1:55:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm incredibly proud of this game. And I love it. And I still play it personally because everybody on the project gets residuals because that's how I set it up. Personally, I've only probably grossed made like $6 or $700 Canadian dollars on it. And yeah, every time, every time someone buys the game of the money that, you know, gets through payment.
• 1:55:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - You should be, it's fantastic.
• 1:55:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yay!
• 1:55:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, listeners, the onus is now on you.
• 1:55:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: processors and Steam or Nintendo. 40% of it goes to me. 40% of it goes to Phil who did all the art.
• 1:55:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And the other, the remaining 20% is split with all of the people who worked on the game.
• 1:56:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Which has not been much for them. Sadly, I'm sure you can work those figures backwards and see that
• 1:56:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: they've made very little in residual. They did get paid upfront just to be clear. But yeah,
• 1:56:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, sure sure sure.
• 1:56:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the residuals have not been as good as I ever thought.
• 1:56:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I believe in that.
• 1:56:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I believe that everyone who works on something should have equity in it.
• 1:56:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, good on you boy. What a concept.
• 1:56:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, yeah, yeah, I know.
• 1:56:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We also, I shouldn't brag about this.
• 1:56:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I shouldn't, but I will.
• 1:56:31
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, you probably should actually
• 1:56:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We also like, well no, that's a specific thing.
• 1:56:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: We also like donate a bit of money to planting trees with every game.
• 1:56:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Add there you go
• 1:56:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like, I shouldn't brag about that because it's not.
• 1:56:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No
• 1:56:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: point. I feel so icky even bringing it up like that. But yeah, it is cool. I'm proud
• 1:56:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I
• 1:56:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I get what you mean, okay, you know, I find all bragging and selling for you. I get what you mean, but that ain't no, so that's good
• 1:56:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : That's good. That's good cool
• 1:56:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that we're doing that. And I more than anything, I hope other developers will see that
• 1:57:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: we do that. And think, oh, hey, we can afford to donate, you know, a little bit off every
• 1:57:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: sale. That was how I got it. I saw another developer doing that. And I was like, hey, yeah,
• 1:57:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's not going to break the banks.
• 1:57:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: For me, you know, but like the economics have been rough.
• 1:57:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : well. Yeah.
• 1:57:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Game sells for $5, right?
• 1:57:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So 30% of that goes to steamer Nintendo.
• 1:57:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So you're down to 350 left.
• 1:57:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And then there's usually some little other fees like payment process, well steam handles
• 1:57:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: payment process.
• 1:57:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's other stuff anyway.
• 1:57:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So you get like maybe 3 30 per unit when it's not on sale.
• 1:57:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I get 40% of that.
• 1:57:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So like per unit, I'm seeing less than $2, you know, like it's, yeah, gosh, yeah, she's quite
• 1:57:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, so start doing the math on to see how much Liam needs. How many copies needs to be sold for Liam to get the Kawasaki Amiibo?
• 1:58:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a few, um, 6600 yen.
• 1:58:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So like less than $2 a piece, but you'd still need to sell, yeah, like 30 to 40, maybe 40 copies
• 1:58:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to be safe.
• 1:58:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, it's the economics of rough.
• 1:58:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And that was a really interesting and tough experience for me.
• 1:58:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: When the game launched, it was actually four US dollars.
• 1:58:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was cheaper because I had done a survey with a bunch of people,
• 1:58:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a bunch of students in my program and new students in the program,
• 1:58:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: where they like did a play test and I got a bunch of great feedback.
• 1:58:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I also surveyed on price and like the price survey was really depressing.
• 1:58:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: cuz like I
• 1:58:45
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I was surprised that people were like yeah, I'd pay like two dollars for this. I'd pay like I
• 1:58:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Was like two dollars you guys are in this game design program really and that's and
• 1:58:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Let's go! (laughs)
• 1:58:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I you know, I priced it at four which I felt
• 1:59:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like I I wanted it to be around like four five six dollars in the first place cuz I I
• 1:59:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : you know
• 1:59:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like the idea of making art that everyone can enjoy
• 1:59:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sure, well, I mean
• 1:59:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I think I actually still went to.
• 1:59:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: love because that bit me in the ass, you know, it was like at the time I was making even even less and I've raised it to five when the switch version came out and also on PC after that, but even that has unfortunate knock on effect. Sorry, you were about to say something.
• 1:59:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah. Bye. Yeah.
• 1:59:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : No, I just like from again from my perspective consumer gamer perspective
• 1:59:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Like I will say when you're under tent like ten and under becomes a very like I think it's very easy to scale like
• 1:59:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know from
• 1:59:57
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Not paying four dollars for a game. I have no problem paying five dollars. I can like never think of a situation where I wouldn't want that
• 2:00:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Um and even
• 2:00:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : going up to ten right like if it's maybe for nine for sure if you're single digits you're fine I think but um so that's just some food for thought but I get it like it's it's tough that's that's a whole you know the economic part of it racing and all that.
• 2:00:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mm-hmm, I definitely think overall I went too low and like I don't think I can do that again
• 2:00:24
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So yeah I think you could have done higher. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
• 2:00:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, I think so too. I'm not planning to change garden guardians price at this point
• 2:00:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But like yeah, it is what it is
• 2:00:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The other thing the really bad knock-on effect is like when you price that low like when you're at five dollars
• 2:00:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like imagine how the economics get when you want to put the game on sale
• 2:00:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you want to put that game half
• 2:00:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah
• 2:00:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: off not even making a dollar per unit, so some developers have the strategy of pricing
• 2:01:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a little higher than they like and counting on the sales to get them.
• 2:01:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: What they actually want, and I get it.
• 2:01:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah, now I get, I think so too.
• 2:01:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I definitely think that the next game whenever I've managed to finish another game, I'd still like to price under $10
• 2:01:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: bearing in mind, the scope.
• 2:01:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I don't think I can go that low again, like I think that was a mistake.
• 2:01:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I was a very well-intentioned mistake, but it bit me in the ass a little bit harder.
• 2:01:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Well, I mean, as an engineer,
• 2:01:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : we have the Agile,
• 2:01:42
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : that edge of fail faster,
• 2:01:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : not that I'm saying this was a failure,
• 2:01:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 2:01:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but learn from your mistakes.
• 2:01:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You get better, you improve, right?
• 2:01:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, I'll go, yeah, yep, yep.
• 2:01:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, absolutely.
• 2:01:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And this is just another one of those learning experiences, you know,
• 2:01:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to continue on your question from before, if you're still interested, um,
• 2:02:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yes. Yes. Yes.
• 2:02:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: about making other game and watch games or what have you, right?
• 2:02:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So the, there's like two that I have in mind.
• 2:02:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: um the one that I wanted to make and
• 2:02:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: kind of wanted to wanted to make it right after but it proved to be not the right project to work on at the time was I wanted to make a follow-up game to garden guardian that is like a companion piece to it that would have been like very similar so like like similar menus I would have reused a lot but it would have been it would have starred
• 2:02:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: snippy's girlfriend who has only mentioned a couple times in the art gallery snippy's girlfriend
• 2:02:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and is intended to be an albino lioness and she has a she has a big mane and she is a chef and she so it would have been a cooking themed one instead of gardening and all of her cuisine is made using like the fruits that snippy grows and stuff like that
• 2:02:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Ooh, I like that.
• 2:03:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [music playing]
• 2:03:13
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, that's so good.
• 2:03:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um,
• 2:03:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Spanding the snippy cinematic universe here. I love it.
• 2:03:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So the two games were, yeah.
• 2:03:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, the two games were kind of meant to go together, and I didn't really
• 2:03:24
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: envision anything beyond that really.
• 2:03:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, but I wanted to do that and I worked on it a little bit,
• 2:03:31
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but I was so burnt out on Garden Guardian at the, like at the time.
• 2:03:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Like I had, I had worked on it.
• 2:03:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It took about, it took a bit over a year to get the game out, uh,
• 2:03:42
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: which is crazy for a game of that scope,
• 2:03:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I worked my ass off to go.
• 2:03:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to get it to like the level of polish that it's at.
• 2:03:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah, that's about to say, that's crazy.
• 2:03:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's very polished though, and that took a lot out of me,
• 2:03:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: especially the menus was tough.
• 2:03:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But arguably, I spent too much time on the game.
• 2:03:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But that's besides the point, which
• 2:04:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is that I was a little burnt out on that style of game.
• 2:04:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sure, sure.
• 2:04:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sure, sure.
• 2:04:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And the idea of plunging back into this code base
• 2:04:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Muh-huh.
• 2:04:08
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to make a direct follow-up was tough.
• 2:04:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I also hit some early design roadblocks.
• 2:04:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: In the process of making a game-and-watch game around cooking,
• 2:04:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that really holds up.
• 2:04:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So that's still something that I have that pin on the wall
• 2:04:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: metaphorically.
• 2:04:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Okay.
• 2:04:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I'd be interested to get around to that at some point.
• 2:04:30
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Right.
• 2:04:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The other thing that I would like to make at some point
• 2:04:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: is as far as game-and-watch games go.
• 2:04:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I would like to make like literally another go at go.
• 2:04:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't know if I would call it garden guardian to but like garden guardian ex or whatever.
• 2:04:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I would really like to do that game.
• 2:04:53
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's glam. It's right there. It's guarding Guardians. Snippys cut.
• 2:04:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: What is it?
• 2:04:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Snippy's cut.
• 2:05:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So, so like I guess what I shouldn't be so mysterious.
• 2:05:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I guess what I mean about not making it a two is like I want to.
• 2:05:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I don't want it to just be like a direct like sequel kind of.
• 2:05:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I want it to like take
• 2:05:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a different tack kind of. I have some out there thoughts for it.
• 2:05:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Are you saying this is a garden guardian remake, but with the capital like in final fantasy remake
• 2:05:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, like a like a gritty reboot kind of vibe kind of jokey vibe. No
• 2:05:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: No, I have various thoughts on it
• 2:05:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I've thought about just like a straight garden guardian - as well
• 2:05:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I really if I could do it - I would really want to like get 3D art in there so I could do a lot more
• 2:05:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: With the animation side of things
• 2:05:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's a limitation for me, right? Like if I
• 2:05:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Want to put something in the game. I need to work with Phil to make 2D art
• 2:05:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And then animate it but like there's only so much I can do with the 2D art that's provided, right?
• 2:06:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I
• 2:06:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: If I got a nice 3D model of snippy if Phil helped me design it and then I could work with a 3D artist to get a nice 3D model of snippy
• 2:06:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I would have a lot more latitude to put a lot more animation and stuff into the game
• 2:06:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So so I if I made like a sequel I would want to like have 3D art and try to push things a lot more
• 2:06:25
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah
• 2:06:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So those are my thoughts for like
• 2:06:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: future game and watch games. I'm not presently working on a game and watch style game. I'm working on something different, but
• 2:06:33
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, that's the next follow-up question. What are you working on? What is cooking?
• 2:06:38
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm working on something a little different right now. I'm sure you've
• 2:06:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Some people have noticed that garden garden garden was quite a while ago. It's a couple years ago now granted that switch version took an extra
• 2:06:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: While to materialize so it's not like I stopped working on garden garden after the launch date
• 2:06:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, I've, like, worked on a lot.
• 2:06:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a lot of projects over the last few years and, like, I've had a lot of, um, you've heard
• 2:07:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of the idea of, like, post-launch depression with, like, games for game developers, you might
• 2:07:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I'm sure right right yeah
• 2:07:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: have, anyway.
• 2:07:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But, like, I had a lot of that.
• 2:07:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Garden Guardians launch did not go as well as I hoped, like, uh, I hoped.
• 2:07:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I had hoped I would be able to move a thousand units in the first month, was the thought.
• 2:07:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it only moves.
• 2:07:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and then on switch, I was like, okay, 300 in the first month, and it sold like almost 200.
• 2:07:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And so like, I went through a lot of sort of like, I was pretty depressed about the results.
• 2:07:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Even though I broke even, which was nice, and people pretty much, everyone who, well, everyone
• 2:07:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: who reviewed the game seemed to like it quite a bit, and I got very few refunds on Steam.
• 2:07:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like I think Jen...
• 2:07:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I didn't really pause it if I was towards the game, but the main thing was like most of the vibes were just nothing. Like most people weren't playing it, you know, like even a lot of close friends of mine. I don't begrudge them, but like didn't play the game, didn't touch the game. You know, like I felt like I didn't make something exciting enough that even people close to, you know, necessarily liked it. Only people who were real freaks for Game and Watch, so it was...
• 2:08:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sure sure
• 2:08:21
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, right
• 2:08:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It was challenging cuz I was really happy I really
• 2:08:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: reached people, but I was also really sad because there were people I wanted to reach that I didn't.
• 2:08:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And after, you know, spending so much time and money and energy on it, it was really hard that most of the user response was just silence.
• 2:08:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And then there was a small amount of like extreme happiness, which I'm so grateful for cuz like it really made all the difference.
• 2:08:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : - Yeah.
• 2:08:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And there was very, very little negative, so I was very pleased with
• 2:08:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that, but as a result, I know I'm kind of like taking a little while to get to the answer here.
• 2:09:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I worked on a lot of projects over the past few years that started and stopped
• 2:09:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and haven't meaningfully gotten off the ground. Now that I've made a game,
• 2:09:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I understand how much work it takes to get it for nothing to game
• 2:09:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: and then from game to the standard that I want to hit, where it's very, very polished
• 2:09:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: fun. So I am currently working on a project that I feel really good about.
• 2:09:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a very simple action game where it's kind of inspired by like NES titles,
• 2:09:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: like single screen action NES titles, where you will control a character
• 2:09:50
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: who has a variety of objectives within a stage. And there's a gimmick,
• 2:09:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's a gimmick. I don't want to give away the gimmick sadly, which is like the core thing so I
• 2:09:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : sure sure sure
• 2:09:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: think I have, I think I have very little to actually say, but it's supposed to take place in a darker world, not as much like levity and lightheartedness, something a little more like something a little more like Baroque or shadow tower that is supposed to be like a world of violent, and so that's what I'm plugging away at now, this mysterious world of violent pixies.
• 2:10:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, so I don't know.
• 2:10:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: think Shin Megami Tensei, Killer 7, or what would the other hang on? I have a list of
• 2:10:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh snap.
• 2:10:39
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Shin Megami Tensei, Killer 7, Discroom, if you know that indie game, and I can't believe I'm
• 2:10:49
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: not remembering this list of all things, Bangayo, definitely Bangayo, and also the
• 2:10:55
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: achievement grid from Kirby Air Ride. Specifically, specific
• 2:10:59
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : of course. Yeah. Yeah. The single I, you know what the single one is. I think I agree
• 2:11:00
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: the one from the first game, because I really like the one, the single grid. As opposed to the...
• 2:11:10
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : with you there. Like, yeah. It's just the stringliness. Like, it's a V-go, right? Yeah.
• 2:11:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Something about it. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So, if you've never played the indie game
• 2:11:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: disc room, I highly recommend that, because that's like, that game sometimes feels like what if we took the
• 2:11:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: achievement grid and
• 2:11:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: from Kirby Air Ride and we made it a level selector. It's pretty cool. So anyway, I'm working on
• 2:11:36
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All that sounds red. No?
• 2:11:37
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: that and I'm really sorry I don't have more to divulge but like it's actually really early in
• 2:11:44
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: development and I only even spoke to Phil about it for the very first time yesterday. So like...
• 2:11:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, oh dang that is really early. Okay, I mean, hey, sure sure sure sure. Well, I mean, at least I'm I'm certainly waiting for it to be to pray through your next entry because I mean guarding Guardian has clearly shown you
• 2:11:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's really it's really... I've been working on it for a couple weeks but like it's really early
• 2:12:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm positive so I don't want to make any promises but I'm trying to make this.
• 2:12:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and put a lot of care and effort and polish into your game,
• 2:12:22
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and just hearing about the struggle with financial success and whatnot.
• 2:12:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm really happy you felt that way because I definitely think that's true, but yeah, yeah.
• 2:12:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's so hard because it's certainly not our reflection on you.
• 2:12:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You know, that's a whole other world of PR marketing sticking out and, you know, the games.
• 2:12:52
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's a tough crowd right now. We'd say that because I mean even here just in the cottage course space, like the number of games coming out is just ballooning and how do you stand out? It's really, really tough. Mm-hmm. Now.
• 2:13:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's wild. It's wild. Everyone says this, so it's not like it's like a crazy observation,
• 2:13:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but you can't slack on the marketing at the end. You can't assume that you have a certain amount
• 2:13:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: of Twitter followers or whatever that's just going to work out. I don't want to say that that's what I
• 2:13:25
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah. Yeah.
• 2:13:27
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: did, assuming that just because I had Twitter followers that would work out. But like I did so much
• 2:13:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: on that project, like relatively solo. It was not a solo project. I think most solo projects are
• 2:13:39
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, right, right.
• 2:13:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: not actually solo projects, to be honest, but hot take. But you know, I did most of it, like 90% on my own.
• 2:13:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Ooh.
• 2:13:50
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's short, isn't it?
• 2:13:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And by the time I got to release the idea of like running an extended campaign was not, I mean,
• 2:13:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it was not appealing. And like, the plan became, okay, I'm going to announce, and it's going to
• 2:14:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: two weeks after. And I thought if I do it so tight, like maybe I'll be able to. I didn't need this game
• 2:14:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: to sell 10,000 units. I didn't need this game to sell, you know, but I just need to, you know,
• 2:14:18
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: drum up the slightest amount of excitement for it. And I didn't, my two-week campaign did not
• 2:14:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: go as well as I'd hoped in any way. I like did not, I was like, I'll edit the trailer myself.
• 2:14:29
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I shouldn't have done that. At the end of the project, I was so done. And the budget was so
• 2:14:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: which was tough. So like hiring someone to do a good trailer, even among the people I know that would have been,
• 2:14:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: you know, I should have done it in retrospect. But it was, I didn't have the energy left to succeed
• 2:14:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : off.
• 2:14:48
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: at this, that marketing this game. And I think that bit me in the ass. So hopefully next time,
• 2:14:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'll have more for some. Can I, yeah, can I share an amusing anecdote about Garden Guardian?
• 2:14:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : learned and might play all means. Yep, go for it.
• 2:15:02
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Cutting a trailer for Garden Guardian was a pain in the app.
• 2:15:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And I was so exhausted by all the circumstances.
• 2:15:11
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Heh heh heh heh
• 2:15:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, yeah
• 2:15:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's why the trailer came out so, so slap-dash, honestly, because I don't really want to do this.
• 2:15:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I got to do it and I'll do my best.
• 2:15:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: This massive problem and I was like, okay, and I ended up like basically phoning it in, which is so unfortunate, because I didn't phone anything in for the actual game itself.
• 2:15:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Uh-huh, right. It's clearly in hot.
• 2:15:47
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, but...
• 2:15:47
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, look, me can still fix this.
• 2:15:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Soaksong is still hot. Reach out to Team Cherry. Get the colab going, re-skin the bugs.
• 2:15:58
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: God.
• 2:15:58
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Boom.
• 2:15:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hollow Knight, Hollow Knight Edition, Garden Guardian Hollow Knight Edition.
• 2:16:01
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : There you go.
• 2:16:03
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, there you go.
• 2:16:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Man, I, yeah.
• 2:16:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's so funny.
• 2:16:07
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I, I, I thought about like adding hats to the game at one point. Team Fortress 2 changed the game.
• 2:16:15
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But hats never happened, but that would have included hats for the bugs, of course, so.
• 2:16:20
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh
• 2:16:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: One problem I ran into when I was adding features post-launch, because I added quite a few.
• 2:16:28
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Was that like adding stuff to the menus was too labor intensive, because the menus are pretty nice.
• 2:16:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So I was like, oh, I can't add a new button to the main menu, huh? Like, that's actually like removing a button and replacing it with a different shaped one and adding a new one next to it.
• 2:16:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's actually too much work, huh? Like, I can't realistically do that, and I, I myself a little bit in that regard, which is why the extra's menu has totally uniform buttons, because it became, it was the only place where I could like, put stuff in.
• 2:17:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Mm-hmm
• 2:17:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Score
• 2:17:05
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: The first game I ever made a menu for, by the way. And that, I think, shows in my mistakes. I did a good job, I think, but my mistakes are definitely ever.
• 2:17:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Sure, well, I mean you still killed it
• 2:17:14
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : You did
• 2:17:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, just call up either the the people does the menu for persona games or or soccerize wife take your pick
• 2:17:23
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah. I'll call Ms. Sakurai, I've got, if only, if only, if only, if only. I'm happy with how
• 2:17:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: it turned out. And genuinely, I did not expect to get to talk about it so much tonight, and I'm
• 2:17:36
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: really grateful that you wanted to, because I always feel like I have a lot to say about it, and I'm
• 2:17:43
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: very proud of it, and it's nice to speak about it.
• 2:17:45
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : as as you should be like it's so I should I put this like again it's it's game and watch
• 2:17:54
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : s games so a little smaller in scale than say full farming game but I can't stress enough like
• 2:18:00
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : how you can feel the polishing quality on this game right um and it just when because we look at
• 2:18:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : a lot of games on the show and so it's it's tough I get I don't mean to throw shade on anyone
• 2:18:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I think you you you set a high bar for what you put out
• 2:18:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Thank you. I'm I'm really glad you think so and I'm I to be honest. I'm terrified of that bar
• 2:18:29
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : mmm yeah oh yeah yeah I get that I get that
• 2:18:30
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a
• 2:18:32
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a
• 2:18:35
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's a problem now. It's like I spent spent such a long time to put the bar so high and now I have to do better with less money
• 2:18:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah.
• 2:18:44
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [chuckling]
• 2:18:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Oh, no
• 2:18:48
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All up the Hollow Knight people.
• 2:18:51
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Call up the hall on at your right, you're right, but no, well, thank you. I'm really glad. It's very flattering to hear
• 2:18:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's literally a pair of guys.
• 2:18:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: literally right
• 2:19:01
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: But I'm I'm so glad that you enjoyed the game. I'm so glad that there are dozens of people out there who did
• 2:19:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : And hey, well, like listeners, all seriousness, like I suggest you check it out.
• 2:19:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: There's dozens
• 2:19:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's an easy buy and an easy recommend you'll get enjoyment out of this game, I guarantee.
• 2:19:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Thank you.
• 2:19:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: You know, I really didn't have the impression we were going to talk about Garden Guardian
• 2:19:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: all that much tonight, so I'm just very flattered by the whole thing.
• 2:19:27
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Oh, I mean, like, oh yeah, no, that was more or less the point of my duty to our cottage
• 2:19:34
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : core nature and I always find it fascinating.
• 2:19:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : What are you going to talk to developers in the whole creative process.
• 2:19:43
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All right, but that said, though, is there anything else you'd like to plug to add to say to our audience, where to find you, not to find you, find other things, whatever you want to say.
• 2:19:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Hmm. Well, the main plug, the most important plug is always garden garden for sure. I was actually,
• 2:19:56
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : the absolutely on switch and steam
• 2:19:57
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I did actually have that in mind, but that's on, that's on Switch and Steam. It's also on itch.io,
• 2:20:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: but like, buy it wherever you like the best. Um, the, yeah, um, Steam version has great Steam deck support.
• 2:20:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Switch version just kicks ass. I, I did the port myself actually. I'm really proud of it. It came out really well.
• 2:20:15
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : It's great, ooh what you should be because that's always well in this space that's always that's often a problem to switch forward
• 2:20:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: It's not a given, eh? Like, you know, you do need to opt even even a game like Garden Guardian there were some optimizations. I had to make
• 2:20:34
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: uh, and I I used to had the opportunity to work on some Vita games in the past that never never shipped sadly
• 2:20:40
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : that's the go home on that's our goal when do we get guarding Guardian on the
• 2:20:41
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: uh, but I
• 2:20:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Garden Guardian on the Vita man. It was one of those things I wanted to do, but it wasn't realistic. So, you know
• 2:20:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Vita
• 2:20:53
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, but anyway, I did.
• 2:20:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Optimization stuff back then. So I'm thankful I did.
• 2:20:59
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, other than that, um, I occasionally write on a little blog, you can find at rising superblog, which is rising super dot blog is the website.
• 2:21:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm currently writing a, uh, I write basically reviews, but they don't have scores on them.
• 2:21:19
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, I guess that still counts as review. I did two with scores, because when you get a key from someone, they kind of expect
• 2:21:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I'm currently writing an article on the recently released fire emblem shadows, the, uh, mobile social deduction game, which I've enjoyed quite a bit in spite of its problems that are maybe only evident to people who play it for longer than, you know, one match in this game sucks.
• 2:21:35
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [laughs]
• 2:21:46
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : [Laughter]
• 2:21:46
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, other than that, I mean, I have a near dead YouTube channel called rising super stream.
• 2:21:54
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Uh, I really only...
• 2:21:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: do, like, reaction videos to, like, Nintendo Directs and, uh, recently some Kirby-Air Ride videos.
• 2:22:04
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: And you can find me on Twitter and Blue Sky at Liam Allen Miller.
• 2:22:04
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Hey, keep that going. That's so hot.
• 2:22:09
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: So...
• 2:22:10
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah.
• 2:22:11
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's me.
• 2:22:12
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Garden Guardian's the number one thing.
• 2:22:14
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Um, and if...
• 2:22:16
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: If you enjoy it, if you enjoy anything I ever made, I will feel very flattered.
• 2:22:20
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Cause I'm...
• 2:22:21
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I feel like I'm just...
• 2:22:22
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: I feel like I've just had, um...
• 2:22:26
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: been so lucky to be able to entertain people.
• 2:22:32
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : All right, well, thank you so much, Liam for coming on and chatting to the point where I'm clearly losing my books.
• 2:22:40
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: That's no problem. Oh no.
• 2:22:41
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Um, that that is irrelevant to this conversation. I've been sick and I think it's hitting me right now, but, um, that it's fine. It's my, um,
• 2:22:51
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : but I, this is a fantastic chat. You heard of folks go, go, finally a mallet Miller up in, in the tweeters and the blue sky. Go check out guarding Guardian more than anything. I cannot.
• 2:23:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : I would recommend enough. Um, and since presumably this is and the episode, uh, unless all you're going to cut it out, I don't know, but, uh, until next time listeners have a good harvest.
• 2:23:15
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: The Harvest Season is created by Alma Henry, with support from our patrons, including our
• 2:23:25
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: pro farmers, Kevin Stewart, Analisa.
• 2:23:29
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: Our art is done by Micah the Brave, and our music is done by Nick Brutus.
• 2:23:34
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: Feel free to visit our website, harvestseason.club for show notes and links to things we
• 2:23:39
  0503BB9B-BDF7-4CB9-BD09-E8B91317FC95: Theme Tune: discussed in this episode.
• 2:23:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, one of the things on this podcast, we do a site show called The Green House where we talk about non-cottage court, whatever, just anything we want.
• 2:23:56
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Is there such a thing? Is there such a thing outside of cottagecore?
• 2:24:02
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, what?
• 2:24:06
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Other media out there in the world is the listeners of this podcast having their innocent ears exposed to
• 2:24:08
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Well, look, sometimes it's Eurovision, there's annual Eurovision episodes.
• 2:24:13
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: a lot? Right, right.
• 2:24:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : One of my favorite episodes of The Green House was one of the co-hosts, his name is Johnny.
• 2:24:28
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : He's a lot more pragmatic and maybe cynical, I guess, about things. He's a little harsher on judging media.
• 2:24:38
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : So, like Sonic games, he's fairly harsh on. So, one of my favorite episodes of The Green House was just going down the list of Sonic characters introducing him to the art.
• 2:24:49
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : and having him rate the characters without knowing who they were really.
• 2:24:52
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Mmm, that's a good little premise.
• 2:24:55
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Yeah, that was a fun time. We both at least agreed cream and cheese were like, you know, S5 star tier. So, I felt good about that.
• 2:25:03
  D211A3EE-9975-4DC0-A619-9C737CB9C459: Liam: Yeah, those hold up
• 2:25:06
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay. Anyway, so, I brought that up because we go through long session sometimes when we'll do an episode and then a greenhouse and they'll take a break. But so, it's totally fine.
• 2:25:17
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : Okay, but let's
• 2:25:19
  E02CEF00-6127-4A29-BAFF-94FB576CC849: Kevin : let's get back to it.