Latest / Age Defiantly with Mark Young / The Hidden Cause of Cancer Most Doctors Ignore With Dr. Christy Kesslering

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The Hidden Cause of Cancer Most Doctors Ignore With Dr. Christy Kesslering · Age Defiantly with Mark Young

0:00
I came across some literature that I kind of dug into the science, and if you start to go down that rabbit hole, wait.
0:07
People have higher sugars, higher insulin, have higher rates of cancer.
0:12
What are the things that people should be doing now before a diagnosis to never get one?
0:17
Well, what is the data out there? Well, if we use?
0:20
You're listening to the Age Defiantly Podcast.
0:23
We are here at Performance Driven Living, and we're at the Metabolic Health Day Conference hosted by the Metabolic Terrain Institute of Health.
0:32
And I have the distinct privilege, and I'm super excited because I've just met you for the first time today.
0:37
But I think I'm part of your sales team at this point, sadly.
0:41
This is Dr. Christy Kesslerin, and my team puts together these beautiful introductions here.
0:49
So don't be offended that I'm reading your intro. It's just that I don't have the eloquence to say this stuff myself.
0:55
And it reads, today we're joined by Dr. Christy Kesslerin.
0:58
She spent more than 20 years caring for cancer patients as a radiation oncologist in the Chicago area after training at UCLA, Loyola Chicago, and UW-Madison.
1:09
Over time, she saw a pattern. Outcomes weren't just about protocols. They were about mitochondria and metabolism.
1:17
That sent her deep into functional, integrative, and terrain-based medicine, and ultimately into a telehealth practice helping both cancer and non-cancer patients use data to make imagine that,
1:28
to make confident nutrition decisions, her aim now is straightforward, make metabolic health understandable and actionable, so people can feel and function better.
1:38
Dr. Kesslerin, welcome to performance.
1:40
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.
1:42
I told you these intros. I couldn't say that stuff better, so I sell out and read them.
1:47
I love it.
1:48
Well, I'm going to say this. Like, first of all, I hold you in highest regards, predominantly because when I was at a conference with nation winters not too long ago, I said, who would be your recommendation?
2:01
I have a friend who has a parent who's just got a cancer diagnosis, and you were hands down the first name out of her mouth.
2:11
And I thought, okay, well, I trust nation implicitly, and I'm like, so if she recommends you, you're my recommendation.
2:17
And then strangely enough, over the course of the last month or so, I've ended up talking about you to three or four different people who have all come to me because when you've, when you've got, it's funny because between you and a friend of mine who's a functional cardiologist, I feel like I'm head passing out with furls all the time.
2:35
I'm going to start asking for commission.
2:37
Is there any mitochondrial dysfunctions out there, right?
2:40
Yes.
2:41
And it's like, and I get these things, and I'm like, I'm a connector. Like, I'm always plugging people into other relationships. And I'm like, how do I, how do I plug you into something better?
2:50
How do I make that? Who do I introduce you to? And your name just kept coming up over the course of this period. I'm like, I have to meet this person.
2:58
Like, I've never met her. We've text back and forth.
3:01
And when I knew that you were going to be here at the conference this weekend, I told my team, I'm like, she's one of my non-negotiables.
3:07
Nice.
3:08
Like, I have to meet her. And most recently, I will thank you here on camera for the work that you're doing with my sister right now. So thank you.
3:15
You're very welcome.
3:17
She's been through it.
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Pleasure.
3:19
Yes.
3:20
I'm going to ask you, Christie, like, you're a doctor, but a traditionally trained doctor or Western medicine trained doctor and, you know, radiation oncology.
3:30
That's a very specific practice.
3:32
Yes.
3:34
Some point you wiped your hands.
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And it made me not that dramatic.
3:38
But at some point, something happened.
3:41
And I'm always interested in that, the journey, because I know where you are now.
3:46
Yes.
3:47
What was that journey that made you say, wow, I just spent this many years in pro-practice.
3:51
And it's like, I can think of like, Casey Mean's story of, I got through this and just couldn't follow through.
3:57
You did for 20 years.
3:59
Yeah.
4:00
Well, I think that, you know, as with all conventional doctors, we think cancer is a genetic disease.
4:08
It's a familial disease.
4:11
But while we were learning more and more, right, it was this obesity linked disease.
4:16
And so is it about just losing weight?
4:20
Now, personal story after, you know, gaining weight in college and then kind of taking it off and then having a bunch of babies and gaining weight.
4:30
From a weight perspective, I personally started a low carb ketogenic diet 23 years ago.
4:37
So I had been following a low carb diet for my weight.
4:40
And I thought, well, maybe I could start to help these women lose weight.
4:44
Maybe they'll do better.
4:46
So I always talked about, hey, can we cut out sugar?
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Can we cut out these carbs?
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Can we eat real food?
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You know, what can we do to make you healthier?
4:57
But I wasn't the keto advocate.
5:02
I just thought, well, just cut out sugar.
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And what I realized is that doesn't actually work when you have so much metabolic dysfunction.
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And what I started to learn, you know, thankfully, you know, across...
5:14
It erupted.
5:15
This is what you're still practicing as an oncologist, though.
5:18
I'm not.
5:19
No, I'm not.
5:20
The accent.
5:21
Yeah, yeah.
5:22
So I didn't understand cancer as a mitochondrial dysfunction, you know, why do we get cancer?
5:30
But slowly, but surely, even reading other headlines, like, wait, Alzheimer's is type three diabetes.
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That's about sugar.
5:37
Wait, all of these little articles, and I would read the sugar piece into it.
5:43
Like, that's about sugar.
5:45
Wait, that's about sugar.
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Luckily, it came across Dr. Naysha's, you know, patients educate doctors a lot.
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So I had a patient who shared Dr. Naysha's book with me.
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And I went, oh my God, here's a lady that's talking like, like, I had already gone down the low carb, you know, kind of found Dr. Seafreed.
6:05
Then I found Dr. Naysha.
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I read, you know, all of these books.
6:09
And I'm like, yeah, this makes so much sense.
6:11
And so I came across some literature that I kind of dug into the science.
6:17
So what was available in PubMed for, like, have we actually done research and cancer?
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And if you start to go down that rabbit hole, wait, people have higher sugars, higher insulin, have higher rates of cancer, have higher grades of cancer, have higher stages of cancer.
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And those who, or have outcomes, incidents, you name it, there's this link.
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And so I started thinking, well, instead of just telling people to cut out sugar, I should actually start measuring insulin.
6:50
I should actually start educating on how do you lower insulin?
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So I started testing insulin on all of my patients. I started running.
7:00
Not only did I make this packet, but half of my consultation was on radiation oncology, like this is your disease, this is what we need to do.
7:09
And if you want to improve your outcomes and maybe reduce your toxicities, here's some things to think about.
7:15
We need to hand out packets with maybe some recipes, some even some meal plans with a couple of diagrams of data to help them be convinced that insulin mattered.
7:27
I started a support group. I for six years or so, I ran a monthly support group for low-carb ketogenic diets.
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I had mostly my own patients come, but I started to get other doctors patients come.
7:44
I started to have family members come. We had a living well resource center for cancer patients.
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And they tried to be very, I want to call it agnostic, like patients can choose.
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If they want to listen to the doctor that's advocating for a vegan diet, they can go listen to them.
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And they had lots of things with exercise and meditation and yoga and the whole shebang.
8:06
But they said that my support group was the most well-attended of all of their programs.
8:12
And I had a lot of people sad. But when I left, actually, as I was just starting my online business, and we can get to that via transition.
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But I actually continued that remotely. We had switched, I took about a year off because of the whole COVID thing.
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And then I'm like, wait, why am I not doing this remotely? Like we started doing everything.
8:31
So then I'm like, I need to send out, you know, so anyway, so then I started doing it remotely.
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But it's always better in person, you know, relationship.
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The relationship, so I would always do like maybe a 30 or 45 minute talk.
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I would educate with data. I would talk about headlines because, you know, eggs are going to kill you.
8:51
Well, let's look at what they call eggs, you know, bread and flan and ice cream.
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And like, okay, that's not really eggs. It's not what you're picturing as eggs.
8:59
And then, you know, there would be question and answers. And then after the question and answers, I would stick around for another half an hour talking to individuals and answering their own personal questions.
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And it was just really rewarding. I would come out of those with a high.
9:13
What do you think? What do you think? Most people's, I'm too far down this rabbit hole to be objective with the question.
9:20
But what is most people's roadblock in seeing this? Is this, I mean, so it's interesting.
9:26
So this is part of the reason I left, right? So I'm in this conventional medical world.
9:30
And I am having this conversation with every single one of my patients.
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Some of them are like, oh, my God, yes, I've always thought diet mattered, lifestyle mattered, sleep mattered, you know, I'm in.
9:42
And then you would have the one, don't you have a pill for that?
9:45
Cool.
9:46
You know, like literally, I add a nurse as a patient and she, going to have a pill for a ketogenic diet.
9:55
No, there is no pill. It is doing the work. It's healing your metabolism. It's healing your mitochondria. It is about making you a healthier person.
10:02
There is no pill that makes you healthier. None. None. And it's this societal norm.
10:08
If this fast does both.
10:10
But that's also who's in the conventional medical system for the most part, right? They don't understand that there's a potential alternative.
10:18
They, they're just, you have a disease, go see a doctor. If they don't realize the doctor's treating the symptom.
10:24
Now he was speaking my life.
10:25
Not fixing.
10:26
Well, see, so in one of the, one of the things that I talk about a lot is this idea that we retreat symptoms rather than support systems.
10:32
Yes, yes.
10:33
It's like, but support the system. Your body's got a lot of different systems in it and each one of them needs a unique type of support.
10:38
Yeah.
10:39
And if you support them properly, you don't have symptoms.
10:41
Yes. And I would say I don't even think it's that unique. I think.
10:45
No.
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Here's this natural way of living and eating and moving, sleeping.
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And we need to do those things.
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Because that's how you revert.
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But we've horrified the opposite.
10:58
Oh, yeah.
10:59
We've glorified.
11:00
It's like I go, I've worked in hospital.
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I want to go down all the, yeah, I get it.
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You know, the.
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But I went to a hospital recently and the stuff that drives me crazy is I see, you know, doctors and nurses out behind the hospital on their smoke break.
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And I'm like, yeah, I would say we probably have less of a smoking thing.
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We have an obesity crisis.
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Right.
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It is.
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It's crazy.
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It's crazy.
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And then I would.
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But it's no different in the medical community than it is in the general population.
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No, right.
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Maybe worse.
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Maybe worse.
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Right.
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Because they all have the break rooms and they live in blue lights.
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And they, you know, I mean, radiation oncology used to be relegated to the basements everywhere.
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I used to never see the light.
11:38
Well, bet.
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And we've also somehow glorified in the medical profession that working 16 hour shifts and 24 hour shifts.
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It was just right of passage.
11:48
Yeah.
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And working on stop.
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And yeah, here's an interesting thing.
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So I didn't realize that I had some metabolic obviously is losing weight.
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But, you know, needed to lose weight.
11:58
But when I was pregnant, I had a lot of impregnancy associated nausea, which guess what?
12:02
Is the sign of insulin resistant?
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And I found that when I was on call because I had my first child pregnancy when I was in my internship.
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So I'm pulling all nighters when I'm pregnant.
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And I literally was vomiting for like the next 15 hours after a shift like I couldn't control.
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And I'm thinking, yeah, in retrospect, right?
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You can see, oh my God, sleep deprivation made that worse.
12:28
Well, I actually, I had a guest and I podcast a couple months ago.
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And I forget who it was actually.
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I think it might have been Dorby Riker.
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And one of the things that she was pointing out was that even menopausal symptoms are all metabolic related.
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The fixed, fixed metabolic problem and you don't have symptoms from menopause.
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Yes. So I have people who actually contact me that want to see me because they want me to check their hormones.
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And will you advise me on hormone replacement or this or that?
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And I'm like, well, tell you what, let's do some labs.
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And I will check some hormones, but I'm not going to check sex hormones.
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I'm going to check insulin, IGF1, cortisol, TSH.
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And then let's decide what we need to do.
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And I will tell you that I show them right here and all your abnormalities.
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This is what I'm going to recommend that you do.
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And if you're still having problems when I see a next time, we'll think about ordering hormones.
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And guess what?
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They come back and they don't need a good problem solved.
13:25
Do you know who Sandy Martin is?
13:27
Sandy, you may not know she is.
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She's like, that's a big, but she's known him like the biohacking circles and stuff like that.
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I was talking with her.
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She's a good friend.
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And it had her as a guest one day.
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And we were talking about, she wrote a book called Biohacking Begins With No.
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And it was starting by just saying no to the some stuff that other people are saying you have
13:46
to have.
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And her whole journey was that she was in a health crisis.
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And one day she, they were, you know, you need this prescription.
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This is so on and so forth.
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And as her husband was walking out the door to go pick up the prescriptions for her.
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She just said, no, I'm taking none of it.
14:00
There's got to be some other thing.
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And hers was all a mold issue.
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But nevertheless, she was like after she got down this pathway, she's like, you know, I got
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a phone call from, you know, her brother-in-law or somebody or whatever.
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She shared the story when she did it.
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She says, you know, he called me and was like, you know, Sandy, I feel like I should be taking some vitamins.
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What vitamins do you recommend for me?
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And she went truthfully.
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You go to McDonald's every day for lunch.
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Don't call me.
14:26
Right.
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And ask me for vitamin help unless you're willing to just do the basics.
14:31
Yes.
14:32
Yes.
14:33
If you can't do the basics, don't, I mean, you're spraying perfume on the pig at that point.
14:37
Yeah.
14:38
Like, don't do this.
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And eventually, I think it had a breakthrough moment.
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But it was, it was the answer, like, no.
14:43
Yeah.
14:44
There's no point in me giving you medical advice or giving you, you know, health advice.
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You can't change it.
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I can't because there is a concern for the easy fix.
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They're looking for the pill.
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So the vitamin and the supplement becomes the pill.
14:56
Well, it becomes...
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And the...
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Can we...
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And I'm like, oh, because guess what?
15:00
And there are a couple of supplements that I might recommend for deficiencies, for methylation issues,
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right?
15:08
Whatever.
15:09
But I'm telling you, sometimes I'll see them back at the next set of labs.
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And the only ones that got better were the ones that the pill fixed.
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And the actual metabolic markers did not get better.
15:21
And every time, did you do what I asked you to do?
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Oh, well, you know, and there's always some excuse and some...
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And I'm like, listen, back to you, you've got to go against the grain, right?
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This is absolutely swimming upstream when you do this type of work.
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If you fall into the masses, you will never get better.
15:46
If you do what everybody else is doing, yeah, but it was a birthday.
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It was a vacation.
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It was a wedding.
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It was like, whatever.
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I don't care.
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I do all of those things.
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And I still stay on plan.
15:57
So you just need to figure out how are you going to its discipline, its planning ahead,
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it's literally like, what is your game plan for today?
16:07
I read a thing recently and it was like the reason we admire people with great physiques
16:12
is because we look at that and we're like, oh, this person has a great body.
16:15
And it's like male, female, whatever.
16:17
It's not a sexual thing.
16:18
Right.
16:19
It's an admiration because you didn't get that easy way.
16:21
Right.
16:22
You have a good body because you put it in the work and there's an admiration for the work
16:28
that you put in because there is no fast track to that.
16:31
No.
16:32
I want to ask you, like if we talk metabolic health and all this other kind of stuff,
16:35
but I'm curious because one of the things that I tend to talk about and focus on a lot
16:40
is power and words.
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And the power in our belief systems and how belief systems and words and spoken words
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and the energy of the people that you spend your time with and so on affect
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treatment.
16:53
Yeah.
16:54
Treatment.
16:55
Yeah.
16:56
But but affect your your health.
16:58
Yeah.
16:59
And not just your health, but your healing.
17:01
Yes.
17:02
You know, the restoration of that house when it's when it fails.
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What do you find?
17:06
You've spent decades working with patients who who have cancer.
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And we all hear about the, you know, the people who believe they can be healed
17:15
to get healed at a higher rate than the people who gave up die sooner and so on.
17:19
And it's very interesting because I actually brought this up to a client and I actually
17:25
have a couple like this.
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When I recur, I don't, you know, like they're already telling their body to be prepared
17:33
for.
17:34
To do you prepared for round two and then guess what?
17:36
Round two comes and it comes even faster than they thought it would.
17:39
And I'm like, it's because you basically convinced your body that you were going to
17:43
get this again, right?
17:44
And I will say to that conventional medical doctors, sadly, so play into that, right?
17:51
Oh.
17:52
The diet doesn't matter.
17:54
This is going to come back.
17:55
This is in cure.
17:56
Oh, wait, wait.
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I got the best.
17:58
This is eat what you want.
17:59
You just need to keep your weight on.
18:01
Yeah.
18:02
Right.
18:03
And why?
18:04
Because I'm constantly educating the patient, like, let me tell you where that data comes
18:10
from, right?
18:11
Because they don't.
18:12
It's unintentional weight loss.
18:15
Patients do worse.
18:16
Why?
18:17
Because unintentional weight loss means the cancer is going freaking gangbusters, right?
18:22
So it's not about improving your body composition.
18:26
It's not about losing that inflammatory toxic fat on you.
18:32
And gaining lean medicine, sadly.
18:35
Yes.
18:36
They eat, eat cake, eat cookies.
18:39
All the oncology departments always have crud.
18:42
Always.
18:43
I always say that was my claim to fame.
18:45
I really pushed them in our cancer clinic.
18:48
I said, can we at least get the crap out of the oncology department, right?
18:53
Oh, hospital food is the unhealthy thing in Egypt.
18:55
I know.
18:56
So they did put it in the back, just in case somebody really needed something.
19:01
Yeah.
19:02
My grandmother, when she had lung cancer and she passed away from lung cancer and the,
19:07
and I remember like, she got the lung cancer and they were like, well, you know, you're
19:10
going to be going in for surgery because they ended up doing a low back to me and whatnot.
19:13
First round.
19:14
But I mean, they went to and did all this and the doctor just kept telling her to put on
19:18
weight, put on weight.
19:19
That's like, you put on weight.
19:20
But she's putting on weight because, and she really wasn't, but like, she's putting on
19:24
weight because all she's doing is drinking milkshakes three times a day.
19:29
I had a, and trying to explain that sugar feeds cancer is like talking to a wall.
19:36
Yeah.
19:37
Because the doctor said it.
19:38
Right.
19:39
And the doctor will say, no, it doesn't.
19:40
We don't have any data that sugar feeds cancer.
19:43
And I'm like, we don't.
19:44
Right.
19:45
What?
19:46
What's a pet scan?
19:47
What's it?
19:48
Well, that's, you know, and I even had a dietician at one point because she, I think she was eating fruit or pasta or whatever.
19:55
And I, and she's like, well, talk to her.
19:58
How would a cancer know if you were eating, you know, candy or fruit?
20:05
And I said, it, it doesn't.
20:07
Like, that's the point.
20:08
Like, she's convinced that what she's eating is good for her and naughty.
20:13
And I'm like, but what you're eating, that is a meal of sugar.
20:16
And you don't even see it.
20:18
And you're a dietician.
20:19
And by the way, I don't recommend that people stop eating fruit because there's benefit.
20:24
I do.
20:25
And it's depending on the fruit.
20:27
Let me say that.
20:28
If they have cancer, I agree with you.
20:30
Yeah, yeah.
20:31
If I'm talking about like a normal person fruit in and of itself doesn't, it doesn't bother me.
20:36
If it's certain types of fruit.
20:37
Maybe.
20:38
I'm usually that kind of stuff.
20:39
I'm good with it.
20:40
Yeah.
20:41
Again, I will say at that point, dose makes the poison.
20:43
Yes.
20:44
I agree with you there.
20:45
Because I will say of somebody because I had a cancer.
20:48
Now, granted, he didn't have cancer.
20:50
Seeing him and follow up.
20:51
And he decided that he should eat more fruits and vegetables.
20:55
But of course, vegetables don't taste that good.
20:57
So he ate lots of fruits.
20:59
So he ate two pieces of fruit for breakfast, for lunch, for dinner.
21:03
And let me tell you that guy put on so much visceral fat in just a very short period of time.
21:08
I'm like, please stop eating fruit.
21:10
Right.
21:11
Whoever told you to eat, you know, so again, I dose makes the poison, right?
21:16
I have a couple of little issues with your breakfast, whatever, you know, but then I'm, again,
21:21
I'm more of a...
21:22
No, I'm a piece of thing.
21:24
Like, lazy, the animals.
21:25
It depends on the person.
21:27
It depends on the degree of metabolic dysfunction.
21:30
The coffees cases need the least amount of food.
21:35
And we have such, such, such a carbohydrate addiction in this country that I feel like sometimes
21:42
you have to cut it all out.
21:45
Because how do you get over that?
21:47
And I tell them, you know, it doesn't mean you can't maybe go back to a small amount at some point.
21:51
But if all you're doing is craving that, then we've got to approach this differently.
21:57
Yeah, completely.
21:58
And the truth is, it's a non-stop cycle for most people, right?
22:03
And it's like, well, I can have 20 carbs a day or something.
22:06
And then they're reading every label to try to add up to get to the 20.
22:10
But the reading trans fats and the reading net carbs and this kind of stuff.
22:15
Exactly.
22:16
And the packaging has now started feeding to that because net carbs...
22:20
I always say if it has a label, don't eat it.
22:22
Also, also fair.
22:24
Yes.
22:25
But I do watch people that are...
22:27
Well, this one only has a net carb of three.
22:29
I don't.
22:30
That's why I always make them count total carbs because then they do not fall into the processed food trap.
22:39
Correct.
22:40
And exactly where I'm going with it.
22:42
And that is like, people start doing that.
22:44
But once your mindset is in how close to the edge can I get it?
22:48
Yes.
22:49
You're already in the wrong mindset.
22:50
Exactly.
22:51
And that's why in this particular instance, food is a problem for people, though, because it's like like you.
22:56
I've fought my weight for a long time right now.
22:59
I'm chubby and then I'd like to be.
23:01
But for a long time, I've fought my weight and I've also been super thin.
23:05
It's a discipline issue.
23:06
And I know how to fix it.
23:07
That's cool.
23:08
But nevertheless, there's a...
23:11
I find abstinence is just easy.
23:13
But when you talk about like alcoholics anonymous tells you zero.
23:16
Zero.
23:17
Right.
23:18
You're right.
23:19
Narcotics anonymous.
23:20
Zero.
23:21
Sanctivictions.
23:22
Zero.
23:23
Smoking.
23:24
Zero.
23:25
Like abstinence, abstinence, abstinence.
23:26
Yes.
23:27
With carbs, we're like...
23:28
Well, the problem is with carbs, yeah.
23:29
But it's food in general.
23:30
Like you can't abstain from food.
23:31
Right.
23:32
Right.
23:33
You do it.
23:34
Again, we don't typically have a protein addiction.
23:37
And the only accessory have...
23:39
Maybe a fat addiction is because those fats are combined with carbs.
23:43
Yes.
23:44
Most people will not eat two pounds of butter.
23:47
But they might have two pounds of butter on popcorn with...
23:52
So, educating patients, right?
23:55
And educating them to the point where this is what you are going to do.
24:00
And you can't...
24:01
This is one of my pet peeves.
24:03
Okay, I'll try.
24:04
Nope.
24:05
I'm...
24:06
None.
24:07
I'm a marketer by nature.
24:08
You're done.
24:09
You will never accomplish your goal if you say I'll try.
24:11
Right.
24:12
You say I'm going to do it and you make your plans.
24:15
I'm a marketer by nature, Christy.
24:17
And we never use the word try because, you know, try now.
24:21
Nope.
24:22
I don't want to try.
24:23
Do it.
24:24
Try already leaves the opportunity for failure.
24:25
Exactly.
24:26
Exactly.
24:28
And so, the same thing.
24:30
Cancer, right?
24:31
Language banners.
24:32
Like, oh, when this comes back.
24:34
Nope.
24:35
No, this is not going to come back.
24:36
And back to that question.
24:38
The original one about how words matter.
24:40
And that is my personal belief in science backs this up.
24:43
And that is when we speak our words have frequency.
24:47
And our cells listen to frequency because they're affected by them.
24:50
And nobody's words affect me more than me.
24:52
Why?
24:53
Well, because I'm in the closest proximity to me.
24:55
It just makes sense, right?
24:56
Yeah.
24:57
Yeah.
24:58
And it's like, so when I speak my words or even thoughts, especially words, no.
25:03
There's a frequency that's emitted.
25:05
And we've seen that even in the, you know, work of the frozen water and Dr. Moto.
25:10
And they said, like, we've seen all of that happen.
25:13
The words literally create frequencies that impact water much less anything else.
25:18
And I see people who do that as they, well, I'm diabetic.
25:22
You have now told yourselves to always behave in a diabetic way because your body is built for survival.
25:29
And this is my opinion, like your body is built for survival.
25:32
And it uses all of the available data to do what it can to survive.
25:37
And if you continue to speak diabetes over your body, your body will behave in a way that makes it survive diabetes.
25:46
Which means it behaves as if it has diabetes already.
25:49
If we speak those types of things, we cause it.
25:52
And with cancer, I can't believe that it's any different.
25:55
We cancer by and large.
25:56
I tell people cancers are just the rogue cells.
25:58
Again, I read lots of different theories.
26:01
We talk a lot about, again, mitochondria health.
26:04
So what are the things that damage or mitochondria?
26:07
You know, being sugar burners, toxic burdens, you know, sleep disruptions, etc.
26:13
Like all of these things.
26:14
So we know like night shift workers, higher rates.
26:16
But is that really the night shift?
26:18
Is it a circadian biology?
26:19
Is it about because they're eating in the middle of the night?
26:23
What are they eating?
26:24
Most health care workers don't eat great.
26:26
But anyway, I think that there's a lot of theories, right?
26:30
That is cancer.
26:31
Again, I always say cancer is a check engine line.
26:34
It is.
26:35
There are when theory cancer personalities, right?
26:37
The person who can't say no.
26:40
The person who's the people pleaser.
26:42
And they're not living according to their true self.
26:44
They're not expressing themselves.
26:46
They're just doing what everybody else wants.
26:48
There's some that say, okay, this is just a toxicity crisis.
26:51
Like, again, you have so many toxins in your body that the cancer cell,
26:56
your body does not want to kill itself, right?
26:58
We are not made to kill ourselves.
27:00
We are made to heal ourselves.
27:02
We've got to immune.
27:03
But no, right?
27:05
That is something that your body's trying to protect you from something.
27:09
What is it trying to protect you from?
27:11
What is the toxin?
27:13
What is that root cause?
27:15
I feel like it all comes back to that.
27:17
But yes, I do think I don't have too many clients who said,
27:20
oh, yep, I knew I was going to get cancer.
27:22
It runs in my family.
27:24
I don't hear that.
27:26
I hear almost always, oh, I thought I was going to die of heart disease.
27:29
Everybody in my family had heart disease.
27:33
Or as we all think, I was perfectly healthy until now I got this cancer.
27:40
Right.
27:41
But you said earlier, healthy body does not get cancer.
27:44
Right.
27:45
Does the healthy body understands how to eat?
27:47
It did this happen.
27:48
And we need to do the digging.
27:50
We need to do kind of that terrain base.
27:52
Is it metabolism?
27:54
But again, as Dr. Nations put, so much of it comes back to optimizing diet
27:59
and providing the proper macronutrients, micro-nutrients.
28:03
And environmental factors.
28:05
Yeah, absolutely.
28:06
Absolutely.
28:07
So to a listener, obviously your resume speaks for itself.
28:12
You know what you're talking about.
28:13
You do this type of coaching on a regular basis.
28:15
And now I had telehealth practice that is working with people all over the country
28:19
or perhaps the world.
28:20
Or I think coaching people on how to really tackle this metabolic terrain.
28:26
I mean, obviously you come from the other side.
28:28
Yeah.
28:29
So that helps people, you know, I think probably within my sister's case as an example,
28:34
because you've recently set an appointment to help her.
28:36
She's struggled with breast cancer.
28:38
And it's, you know, we need to cut.
28:40
We need to cut.
28:41
We need to cut.
28:42
Now they want radiation and everything else.
28:45
And it's like to her, she's just frozen.
28:48
Yes.
28:49
And all of the good health advice means nothing.
28:51
She's just, she's deer in the headlights shocked.
28:54
And the first thing that I always do with her is look, this is your diagnosis.
28:58
Not mine.
28:59
So I need to be sensitive.
29:01
The fact that you are toggling between two words.
29:04
And I'm not the one who heard that word.
29:06
So I understand the fear.
29:08
I understand.
29:09
But I can't relate to it.
29:11
But I acknowledge it.
29:12
And going through that.
29:14
But it's like to her when I told her about you.
29:17
And I said, look, like you don't have to believe me.
29:20
You don't have to believe them.
29:22
Because them being the surgeons and the oncologists that she's working with.
29:27
Me being a functional practitioner who's just like,
29:30
there's a lot we can be doing before we go deciding that we're just going to use radiation.
29:34
You know, like let me introduce you to somebody who's got a foot in both worlds.
29:38
Like maybe that'll help you feel like you're actually getting that fair and balanced opinion.
29:42
Because no one's, you know, got a bias.
29:45
And I will say that I have a lot of clients who do have their feet in both worlds.
29:52
Because that mentality is out there and so dogmatic that, you know,
29:58
conventional medicine is how you treat disease.
30:01
They can't, they will not sleep at night if they don't do this.
30:06
So what do we do?
30:07
Well, what is the data out there?
30:09
Well, if we use fasting around chemotherapy,
30:12
people in ketogenic states during therapies, if we optimize your health,
30:16
not only will you tolerate treatment better,
30:20
but you very likely will augment it.
30:23
You're listening to the Age Defiantly podcast.
30:26
Well, so funny enough and not funny at all, I suppose,
30:30
but we talked about Craig, who was the father of a friend of mine.
30:34
And I had a meeting with him.
30:36
I don't want to call it a consult, but talked him through some of the basics
30:39
and was like, look, like there's a lot of things we could be doing.
30:42
There's things you need to stop doing.
30:44
And told him, like whether or not you choose to take a chemotherapy approach,
30:48
which is what he was leaning towards and what he's going to start doing.
30:52
So it's an immunotherapy.
30:53
I'm not opposed to it.
30:54
But what I said to him was like, look, here's the list of things that nation
30:58
I went through and made a list of the things that you need to be working on.
31:02
Should you choose chemotherapy?
31:04
It doesn't make these things irrelevant.
31:08
These things too.
31:10
Yes.
31:11
Because you already have poor kidney function.
31:13
Introducing chemotherapy to your system is going to make that worse.
31:17
Here's the things that will support kidney function.
31:20
And these are the things you, you know, he's got multiple myeloma
31:23
and then trying to explain like you're super fatigued right now
31:26
because you're dealing with anemia.
31:28
And the anemia is based on the fact that your red blood cell production is being squeezed out in the bone, right?
31:32
Like, sure, you've got anemia. Got it.
31:34
Yeah.
31:35
Here's the things that will help fix that.
31:37
Yeah.
31:38
Even if you go into oncology, like, you're taking an immunotherapy
31:42
and I'm trying to explain like, and here's the things that will support your immune system.
31:47
Right.
31:48
Like, let's do these things.
31:50
And I've had, yeah, I've had a number of people who I might meet for an initial call
31:56
and then like, and then I'll reach back out like, are you planning on keeping your consultation?
32:03
Yeah, but I wanted to lay it. I just want to get through treatment first.
32:07
Oh, my goodness.
32:08
And I'm like, please, please, please, consider doing this together.
32:12
It would, it, there's really so much data to, and I shouldn't say so much.
32:17
There's enough data and enough anecdotal stories.
32:22
And, but the other side to that with him even, it was like, this is not a,
32:27
I want to, I want to go one level deeper than that and say like, he's a 78 year old man.
32:31
So maybe there's a different story in there.
32:34
But the reality is is doing these things to augment tree.
32:37
And as you said, like, you're going to go on the immunotherapy, which is a form of low dose chemo.
32:42
Great. Got it.
32:44
I think that's great.
32:45
Like, I'm all about doing it.
32:46
But that's going to cause these issues too.
32:49
And here's the steps we can take to offset the potential downsides of that.
32:54
One layer deeper than that for me is
32:59
but you may actually stave off a lot of other health related issues that could come up.
33:04
Cancer is the one we're talking about today.
33:07
But again, most cancer patients have multiple problems, right?
33:10
Exactly.
33:11
Exactly.
33:12
Well, any, now some of them say I've been health problem.
33:14
Yeah.
33:15
They kill, they solve a bunch of problems and possibly just never have problems.
33:19
Right.
33:20
The, ideally, the case is not to kill the cancer.
33:23
The idea is to keep your organism functioning optimally so the cancer doesn't want to be there.
33:28
Yes.
33:29
Right.
33:30
And every other disease too, right?
33:31
Yes.
33:32
So what would be the things?
33:33
Tell me, tell me this, Chrissy, because we can't fix the world.
33:36
No.
33:37
Like, there's not enough sales mission between the two of us to be able to get everybody on board
33:40
is what we're talking about.
33:41
But I think there are some basics.
33:43
Yes.
33:44
There are some takeaways.
33:45
And I love your approach to this.
33:47
Clearly, I'm a fan.
33:49
We'll put links to, to obviously your practice and everything else in this, in show notes and whatnot
33:55
and promote you to the extent that we can.
33:57
But the question is to the average person.
34:00
I don't have a cancer diagnosis.
34:03
One of the things, as an example, one of the things that I spoke about recently,
34:07
I work with cancer check labs.
34:09
I don't know if you're familiar with who they are.
34:11
They actually do a, they do tumor cells, so they do CTC.
34:17
I use the word biop.
34:19
It's not a biopsy, but what they're doing is they're taking CTCs
34:23
and taking those circulating tumor cells and finding the shedding
34:28
and can find the shedding as early as stage zero cancer.
34:31
So I'm a huge fan.
34:33
I use a lot of peptides.
34:35
They're like, I'm a peptide guy.
34:37
I'm a BPC 157, a TB 500.
34:40
I'll use epimoral and test moral and the whole deal.
34:43
I'm a big peptide fan.
34:44
But one of the things, even with Craig that I was talking about,
34:47
was like, you need to cut out the peptides.
34:49
Because they were doing collagen peptides and everything.
34:52
You need to cut out things that are causing cellular growth.
34:55
Recently, I was at JJ Virgins conference and heard Sumit Roy speak,
35:00
who is actually the CEO at cancer check labs.
35:03
And one of the things that he made a comment about was people that he works with with peptides
35:09
that will never recommend peptides unless a person has a cancer screening first.
35:14
Because peptides will grow all cells.
35:17
Cancer, including, it's irresponsible to use peptides without a cancer screen.
35:21
I was like, wow, that's just good information for anybody who's using peptides.
35:27
You're putting in small chain amino acid building blocks.
35:33
They're going to advance the growth of everything for the most part.
35:38
And I was like, that's just good advice to a person who hasn't received a cancer diagnosis.
35:43
Like, make sure you're at zero.
35:45
Like, that's just good advice.
35:47
What else do you think?
35:49
Obviously, a ketogenic diet, you're a fan of.
35:52
Yeah.
35:53
What are the things that you would tell somebody that you see most often that could have been prevented?
35:58
Like, what are the things that people could and should be doing now before a diagnosis?
36:03
To never get one.
36:04
You know, again, it's going back to that basic terrain, right?
36:10
Like, can we avoid toxins?
36:12
How many people do I see that are still using commercial products and don't filter their water
36:18
and still have amalgams in their teeth?
36:20
I just had my removal.
36:21
They share.
36:22
Good for you.
36:23
Is that not the craziest thing?
36:24
Crazy.
36:25
I had an mercury toxicity and couldn't figure out why.
36:27
Why?
36:28
The dumbest.
36:29
The dumbest.
36:30
Yeah.
36:31
Which was causing, like, thyroid dysfunction and, you know, so many efficiency.
36:34
The healing of those things, but again, sleep.
36:38
We're so much on screens.
36:40
Can we have good sleep, you know, hygiene?
36:42
Right, hygiene.
36:43
Can we get outside in the sunshine?
36:45
Can we, you know, maybe not work 16 hours a day?
36:51
And then for our, because the only way that we feel good is when we then go and run a marathon,
36:57
because that's the only way we can generate endorphins, because we're so racked.
37:01
Over stimulated.
37:02
Yeah.
37:03
So I feel like we kind of just have to think about life before it became modern.
37:11
Right?
37:12
I get asked all the time.
37:13
I'm sure you do too.
37:14
And like, so what should I be doing?
37:15
What's your, what's your favorite biohack?
37:17
What's the one thing, then?
37:18
And like, and my response is always the same thing.
37:20
And I'm like, well, I've got three.
37:22
Do you want me to pick one?
37:23
Or can I just tell you all three?
37:24
And I get to go ahead and tell me, mom, I'm like, okay, we'll, we'll start with fasting.
37:28
Because that doesn't cost anything.
37:30
I hear all the time about it.
37:31
It's too expensive to be healthy.
37:32
No, then literally cost you zero.
37:34
Right.
37:35
Like, sleep.
37:36
Yeah.
37:37
Also, cost zero.
37:38
Cost zero.
37:39
Yep.
37:40
And let's walk outside a bit.
37:41
Yeah.
37:42
Also cost zero.
37:43
Right.
37:44
Right.
37:45
If a person could stick to those three things, like get a fasting protocol or something that
37:50
works for you, just whether it's intermittent, which most people do parably anyways, but
37:55
I will typically put a ketogenic diet above fasting.
37:59
And only because, and only because, right, and when I say ketogenic diet, I'm talking real
38:04
food, animal-based, but I will say because I see people fasting and then feeding with food
38:16
that's making them sick.
38:18
Yes.
38:19
Right.
38:20
And we feed.
38:21
We need to be bringing in the nutrients to heal the body.
38:25
Right.
38:26
And again, some people will say, oh, well, that's expensive eating real food.
38:30
I'm like, are you kidding me?
38:31
Like, how many bags of Doritos do you go through or, you know, how many McDonald's meals
38:36
do you buy, which no longer are $5 or $25 or $13 or whatever?
38:40
Seriously.
38:41
So I think that if you are willing to eat appropriately, you can actually do it pretty
38:51
inexpensively.
38:52
And then guess what?
38:53
You feel like a million bucks and you don't spend the money on your blood pressure medicine,
38:59
your diabetes medicine, your anti-anxiety medicine, your antidepressants, your, you know,
39:05
like it's amazing.
39:07
Yeah.
39:08
It's really prescribing, you know, like, and also the Amazon savings because you're not
39:12
shopping in the middle of the night because you're actually sleeping.
39:15
Sleeping.
39:16
Yeah.
39:17
Um, so anyway, I just feel like I will tell people all the time, like sometimes I actually
39:23
want you to eat three meals a day.
39:25
Like I need like your adrenals are so wrecked, like stopped fasting or stopped chronically
39:32
calorie restricting and actually feed your body properly first.
39:37
And then sometimes yeah, we need to pull in more fasting or definitely around chemotherapies
39:42
and things like that.
39:43
But that's one of the reasons I get labbed.
39:45
Sometimes I can say, you are so nutritionally deficient, you know, please stop fasting.
39:50
Like we need to feed you first.
39:51
Yes.
39:52
And that's, you know, calorie restriction is the configuration that everybody gets to when
39:56
they come to weight loss and they're like, or just eat the right foods and your body
39:59
doesn't pertain.
40:00
Right.
40:01
That's okay too.
40:02
Yeah.
40:03
But yeah, it really becomes a matter of discipline for a lot of people.
40:05
And fast, I'm a big fan of fasting because of the triggering of autophagy and the problem
40:09
is I think most people they come off of a fast, they trigger the autophagy, all the garbage
40:13
starts get to clean up and then the first meal off of the fast, they go pull all the garbage
40:17
back in.
40:18
You didn't do any good.
40:19
Right.
40:20
But we didn't clean anything up.
40:21
This was an opportunity to clear the garbage so that the next meal is absorbed.
40:26
Yeah.
40:27
Yeah.
40:28
And I had a cousin who just, he's like, I did a 72 hour fast, oh man, you should have
40:30
seen what I ate when I was done.
40:32
I was like, oh, yeah, I know.
40:34
Oh, not the point.
40:35
Yeah, I know.
40:36
What you think?
40:37
Come on, big.
40:38
But it is.
40:39
I mean, there is data, again, I'm a Walter Longo, not a huge, huge fan.
40:46
He does advocate for what's called a fasting mimicking diet around chemotherapy.
40:50
I'd rather people just fast his fasting mimicking diet is a processed shake.
40:57
He does, you know, he has done bigger programs with, you know, diabetics and let's, or, you
41:05
know, obese and let's do this fasting mimicking diet five days every month for a year.
41:11
And guess what?
41:12
They do improve their metabolism, but at what, I'm like, oh, number one, I think I can
41:18
get better results faster because I looked at his data and, and what are they eating when
41:24
they're eating?
41:25
He, because you're not advocating, are you doing his meal replacement?
41:29
Yeah.
41:30
So anyway.
41:31
So I agree with you.
41:32
I think sleep.
41:33
I think movement.
41:34
Yeah.
41:35
Movement.
41:36
So whatever nature, sunlight, the, you know, the idea of real food.
41:39
Right.
41:40
If it, if it has more than one ingredient, it don't need it.
41:43
It's kind of the rule of thumb, right?
41:44
Right.
41:45
Like it's kind of the way nature made things, we didn't get anything compounded out of
41:48
the ground.
41:49
Right.
41:50
Right.
41:51
Right.
41:52
Right.
41:53
Right.
41:54
Right.
41:55
Right.
41:56
Right.
41:57
Right.
41:58
Right.
41:59
Right.
42:00
Right.
42:01
Right.
42:02
Right.
42:03
Right.
42:04
Right.
42:05
Right.
42:06
Right.
42:07
Right.
42:08
Right.
42:09
Right.
42:10
Right.
42:11
Right.
42:12
Right.
42:13
Right.
42:14
Right.
42:15
Right.
42:16
Right.
42:17
Right.
42:18
Right.
42:19
Right.
42:20
Right.
42:21
Right.
42:22
Right.
42:23
Right.
42:24
Right.
42:25
Right.
42:26
Right.
42:27
Right.
42:28
Right.
42:29
Right.
42:30
Right.
42:31
Right.
42:32
Right.
42:33
Right.
42:34
Right.
42:35
Right.
42:36
Right.
42:37
Right.
42:38
Right.
42:39
Right.
42:40
Right.
42:41
Right.
42:42
Right.
42:43
Right.
42:44
Right.
42:45
Right.
42:46
Right.
42:47
Right.
42:48
Right.
42:49
Right.
42:50
Right.
42:51
And just like you mentioned, I really, really wanted to let some of that range be connected.
42:53
Okay.
42:54
So yeah, this is as close as I just talked before.
42:56
Hey.
42:57
We've been able to replicate like two different areas of these areas.
42:59
I can walk up,
43:00
but I do my best to move them up as the opportunities, you know, become available.
43:03
But yes.
43:04
We'll take .
43:08
And and I say this in also sincerity.
43:09
If it were me with a diagnosis, you'd be my phone call.
43:11
Thank you.
43:12
Nate just says you're the one that believe you.
43:14
Have are guys I encourage you to check out the notes.
43:16
I really, really love this topic around cancer.
43:18
due to dysfunction that happens. It's controllable. Yes. And I think that's the words that people need
43:24
to feel empowered and be part of their own treatment and not be the victim to somebody else and not
43:31
just follow what they're being told. Very highly educated people are telling you what to do when
43:36
it comes to radiation and oncology. Very highly educated people are also telling you that there's
43:41
an opportunity to do something perhaps differently or to augment that care. Both are valid voices.
43:47
You need to treat your own treatment, but it would be foolish not to consider how we can
43:52
holistically support our augment if not entirely treat in this method. So I encourage you to check
43:58
that out. I cast our ex is dot com is your website. I encourage you to go read more about Dr. Kesslery
44:05
and also check out all the information down in the show notes. Thank you for joining us today for
44:09
stimulating conversation about how we can take control of our own lives, especially when we get
44:14
answered diagnosis. Thank you so much and we'll see you next time.