Latest / Black Ibis Social Club / S3E28: Pluto

Transcript

S3E28: Pluto · Black Ibis Social Club

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_00: Good afternoon and welcome to the Black Ibis Social Club.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, good eyes, guys.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm running a little bit late today.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: Fisto, good evening.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: How are you doing, man?
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: He's here somewhere.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: He's dead.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: I should probably unmute my mic like the professional podcast person I am.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's right.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Good Lord.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: No, man, I'm doing great.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: Life is beautiful.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Everything is proceeding as God foresees.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: As intended.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Well, welcome everybody.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: We're going to hit our main topic in a few minutes,
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: but first, you know, we'll kind of introduce ourselves again.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're, if it's the first time listening, you're listening to the Black Ibis Social Club.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's a special, unique,
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: magical place where we all meet and have great conversation on a,
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, usually weekly or biweekly kind of thing.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: We've got about 200 and something episodes that you can listen to.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: So if you really enjoyed today and you cannot wait for the next live episode,
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: you can go back and listen to like,
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, something like 500 hours worth of conversation.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: We have guests.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: We do all kinds of stuff where I think officially the best podcast on Substack, right?
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Officially, unofficially.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: Recognized by all major international humanitarian organizations.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: The United Nations.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: Our greatness is even in the Epstein files of all places.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: They recognized.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: They were like, look, these guys are great.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: Leave them be.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Epstein actually wanted to come onto our podcast,
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: but we rejected him because I didn't like his vibe.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, I don't know, man.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like your vibe.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I was right.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: He was completely cool with it.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Dude, remember when BB wanted to come on the podcast and I told him to eat shit?
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, that's fair, man.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Seriously, if you guys enjoy the podcast, there's about 200 episodes.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: You can find us on Substack.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: You can also listen to the podcast on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Tunes.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: I've never listened to anything on Apple Tunes because I'm not an Apple guy.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or you can grab the RSS feed and load it into any podcast app you've got.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: YouTube actually has a few more video clip type ones where I've taken parts
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: from different episodes and I've made it into more shorter episodes.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: But the way we do it is every Wednesday we do it live.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: You can join us, chat.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes we have like 13 people, 14 people.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes we have like about 100, 200 people in here.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on how the mood is.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: And you guys can ask us live questions or just comment.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: I usually try to comment to this kind of stuff.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: Usually we just do commentary or talk about whatever.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: We know really whatever I feel like it.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: And then we have guests.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: If you listen to a lot of the old episodes, we have a lot of guests.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Almost everybody that's cool on Substack has been a guest.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: We've had a bunch of great authors, a bunch of guys from Pill & Press.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: Lisa Kuznack is a usual guest.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Alexander Helene back in the day.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: And we've had everybody on here.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: John Carter off of Substack, just everybody, right?
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: Uncouth Barbarian, just, man, I can't even remember everybody.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: I need to go back and do everything.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: But what I really wanted to talk about today is Pluto, all right?
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: And before we go into the actual Pluto conversation, I wanted to ask you an important question.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: Did you watch any Netrunner season two yet?
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: Have you got a chance?
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: Not yet.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: Not yet.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: No, I did have a fantastic moment today, though,
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_01: where a student of mine came up to me and said, hey, do you watch Edge Runners yet?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, it's perfect.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then he just walked away.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I knew I knew it was straight up peak when in the first minute the theme song came on.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: And the theme song was by the cure.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: It was 1015 on a Saturday night.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, all right, done.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm probably going to watch it either tomorrow or maybe this weekend.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we can definitely do an episode about the first couple episodes next.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: I, I knocked out the last, the first two episodes last night and it, it's, it's good.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to savor it.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: I, I thought about,
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: I thought about just like binge watching it last night and just not sleeping,
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: but then I probably would have like zoned out and,
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: you know, not and missed some nuance.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, But I watched the first two episodes.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm probably going to watch a few more today and then kind of save them for
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: the next two, three days.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, did they drop the whole thing?
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the whole thing's out.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: The whole thing's out.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, all of it.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: Hell yeah, let's go.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so far,
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: I really like,
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: without spoiling it, I really like all the characters I've introduced so far.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's got a little bit of a,
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: the first season, you know, slammed into it like full, kind of full speed.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: And there's stuff going on very early on.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: This one is a little bit slower burn so far.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, well, yeah.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: The first one starts with freaking Cyber Psycho Massacre.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, this one starts like that, too.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: This one starts with a Cyber Psycho kind of thing.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: As is tradition.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_00: And what's interesting about it is,
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: in its timeline,
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: this season, so it's all new characters, a completely different story.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: But this season takes place after 2077.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: So it's while Edge Runner season one took place, it was like a prequel to the game.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: This one takes place after.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not like I caught that when there was kind of like a throwaway comment
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: that, you know, Arasaka is like down on its...
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's, you know,
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: it's been,
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: or during, you know, in a chat, Matt, 330 says during, he's probably right.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to go up, like, it takes place after the, during the game or after the game.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not really sure.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I know that I saw on Instagram that CD Project Red added a new update
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: to Cyberpunk 2077 today just came out today,
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: where they added some season two stuff to it.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: So Matt in the chat says that there will be a mission where you work
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: with King King is one of the main characters.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I guess I guess it takes place during or towards the end of it.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: For some I assumed it took place post.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I feel like they added dual wielding pistols to the game, I believe.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: So we might have to go do that, you know?
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, come on.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: That by itself.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: That by itself.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: Dude, send devastant dual wielding pistols.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to download it.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's it.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: So it's going to be downloaded again and we're going to do another round.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: Really?
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we have a lot to talk about,
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: but we're going to ignore all our – we've been having some fun.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: We've been doing some trolling on Substack today.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: Did you like my picture trolling I did with the three different pictures?
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: I did.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: It was fantastic.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was very excellent.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: My Parisian outfit.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: But because,
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: we are a strap for time, and I did start late, and we are going to start it.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: And you know what I did for you guys watching live and for you guys that are going
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: to watch this on Substack?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: I did the craziest thing.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: I did.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: A PowerPoint presentation, right?
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my God, Alex, you're doing a PowerPoint thing.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: Let's do that.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, man.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still tripping on John Woo-ing my way through Night City.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's where I'm excited.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, man.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: That's where I'm at now.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_01: But yes, the PowerPoint.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: Regale me with your PowerPoint.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: We are going to start talking about Pluto.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: And that was the topic of today's episode.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's a show that is, it's an anime show on Netflix.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: And before we start talking about Pluto specifically,
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: what I want to make sure I mention is, let me fix this real fast.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Go away.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: What I want to make sure that I want to mention is that I want to talk about
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: the idea of mediums.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: And medium,
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_00: what I'm talking about is novels,
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: films, television shows, video games, and that kind of stuff.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I am in no way a medium purist, right?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_00: I think that works of art can transcend medium.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: And what I mean,
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: and I feel like this is kind of a dumb way to kind of approach it,
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: and I'm doing it because we're talking about anime, right?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: I come off kind of as a snob and I tend to focus my free time on books, right?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: On novels and on nonfiction.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: But I got to the point where I got kind of burnt out on most books.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I started watching a lot of just foreign films and watching a lot of,
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: I had my Russian film era for a little bit where we were watching a lot
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: of Russian film.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: And then due to my daughter and wanting to watch things with her,
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: I started watching anime because anime It's much better to watch with your kid than,
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: for example, Western cartoons.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: And anybody that disagrees with that is absolutely wrong.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So once I started getting into anime, it was kind of around the time I had my surgery.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: And when I had my surgery, I was laid out for about 30 days.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: I just had to sit on the couch the whole time.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: And during that time, I watched a lot of anime and I fell in love with it.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: I fell in love with the medium itself.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: And now I'm not...
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not foreign to Japanese literature,
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: for example, I've read a significant amount of Japanese literature.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I read like the mainstream stuff like Haruki Murakami,
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: and I've read some more obscure stuff,
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: a lot of the Japanese crime fiction, some of their classics I've read.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then of course,
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: like Sun and Steel and that kind of stuff,
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yukio Mishima, I read the entire tetralogy, which is fantastic.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: For some reason,
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think that post-World War II Japanese culture is really defined by manga
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: and subsequently anime.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: And some of the best fiction has been in the medium of manga and anime.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I started watching it really with my daughter.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: So most of the things I did watch with her were things that were age appropriate for her.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I watched like Demon Slayer, Free Ren.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: We're watching Delicious and Dungeon right now.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: But there's so much adult manga and adult anime.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: And by adult, I don't mean like pornographic.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, deep thematic kind of fiction, right?
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: And Pluto is absolutely one of them.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: And through my reading and watching and everything,
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: I discovered that One of my favorite authors now,
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: who I put really at the peak of all my authors, right?
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: And is Naoki Urasawa.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: Now, let's talk about Pluto, all right?
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: Pluto is an anime that came out in 2023.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's based on a manga by Naoki Urasawa.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: Alright, so let's talk about this guy real fast, right?
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: So Naoki Urasawa is a, he's a boomer, I believe, by standards.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: I believe he was born in the 60s.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: he is, he's one of the most famous, kind of highly regarded manga writers, manga artists.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you guys aren't familiar with Japanese manga, that's what their comic books are called.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: And Unlike Western comic books, Western comic books tend to have a writer and then an artist.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: So for example,
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: if you're familiar with like Neil Gaiman's Sandman,
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: Neil Gaiman wrote Sandman, but he did not draw Sandman.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: In the case of manga,
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: and they're called mangakas,
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: or I might not be pronouncing it correctly,
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: they tend to Write and draw everything, right?
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: And the way, and we're talking about a very grueling schedule.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: Most of the manga are serialized chapter by chapter
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: and they're serialized really every week or bi-weekly or maybe for
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: the more famous ones that are like popular and they can get away with it.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: They're serialized monthly and they can go on for many, many years.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: In this case, Pluto He first started writing it in 2003.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: And it got finished a few years later.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then in 2023, it got made into an anime.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: And unlike a lot of Western adaptations of film and video games and that kind
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: of stuff that we get, anime tends to be very...
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's really the genre and the respect that the Japanese have
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: towards their manga creators and their anime creators.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_00: Naki Urasawa,
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: who right now is,
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: he's really probably my most favorite of the manga artists and creators.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: He's known, he kind of has like his top four, top three kind of masterpieces, right?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: And it's on the screen right now.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: And he's most known for creating Monster.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: Monster is a manga and also an anime, which you can also watch on Netflix.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then the other one he is very,
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: very well known for is the manga called 20th Century Boys,
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: which If you look on the screen,
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: it's the one with the crazy guy with the kind of occult looking mask on.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: And it's really one of my favorite pieces of fiction ever.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually one book away from finishing the whole thing.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: And it is a masterpiece, man.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: I bought every single one of the books and I've been just devouring it.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: And like, I've not enjoyed reading something like plot wise or character wise.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: As much as I've enjoyed 20th Century Boys.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, there is no anime adaptation for 20th Century Boys.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: And there probably won't be one ever because a lot of the plot
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: of 20th Century Boys has everything to do with music.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of based on the T-Rex song, 20th Century Boy.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of songs and kind of like...
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Kind of like,
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: things that would be very difficult to be on television because of
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: the copyright rights of songs and stuff.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: And on top of that, that deals with some very kind of touchy subjects, touchy to the Japanese.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: For example, like the sarin gas attack, terrorism.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of,
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm telling you it's a masterpiece because it deals with,
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: the plot of it is,
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: There's a virus released by the bad guys and it's used,
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: they basically release it and then they cure it and they use it to control
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: the world basically through this virus and how they deal with the virus.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's very COVID-ish before COVID happened because it's from 2015.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: So it's really a very, I don't know, it's a very important kind of piece of work.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: His other one is Billy Bat,
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_00: which is about a manga artist who,
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: Draws this character named Billy Bat in the Japanese post-war era, Billy Bat.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: He realizes that he did not create this character,
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: but that this character existed since all time.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's kind of a god or some kind of entity.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a huge kind of plot to it.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's very David Lynch-y in kind of mood.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then his other main masterpiece is Pluto.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: And Pluto did get an anime adaptation,
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: a fantastic anime adaptation of That came out in 2023 on Netflix.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: And unfortunately,
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: in the scope of anime and the way we look at anime and the popularity
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: of anime worldwide, Pluto is kind of slept on.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's because while it doesn't look very adult,
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: it's a very deep Very, very deep adult show.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's kind of slow.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's kind of thinking it's kind of filled with a lot of like philosophical kind
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: of ruminations on identity on purpose on what's going on in life.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it, you know,
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: it doesn't have the action kind of violence that you see in a lot of like anime.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not very kid friendly.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: So it doesn't have the popularity.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that And this is why I want to do an episode on it because I want people
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_00: to watch it because, man, it is amazing.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I want people to watch it and enjoy it and realize that this whole media
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: of anime does not have to be like Pokemon and Goku and that kind of stuff,
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_00: which it's there.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: Some of it is fun.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: But we're talking about some stuff that competes with some of the best novels I've ever read.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't know if you would agree with that after watching Pluto.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: Do you agree with that?
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah, no, no, no.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: Pluto is a complete and total masterpiece.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, right?
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: And it is the kind of thing that transcends the form.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's, you know, it's the cyberpunk of video games.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's the kind of thing where it's like, nah, just go watch this.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's great.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: Shut up.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: Just go do it.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: I recommended it to one of my students and she was one of the,
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: probably the top students I had last year.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: Wicked, wicked, wicked, wicked smart.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: She washed it over a break,
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: came back and was like, you could just see like it had opened her eyes to things.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's art.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_01: It reveals the greater vistas is what it does.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's man, it's straight into my veins, man.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's it.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I mean, it made me cry a few times.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to lie.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: What's wrong with you?
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: Before we go into exactly what Pluto is,
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_00: the 2023 Naoki Urasawa, I will have to add a side note.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's written and drawn by Naoki Urasawa and his producer,
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: kind of lead editor, his name is Takashi Nagasaki.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: They kind of worked on it together, but Urasawa is the main author of it.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: But there needs to be a little bit of background to what Pluto is.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: So we're gonna talk about the next step, which is Osamu Tezuka, right?
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: And if you,
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: on the slide,
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: if you guys are watching the slide or watching it later on YouTube,
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: Osamu Tezuka is basically the Walt Disney of manga.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: He is, you know,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: in the 50s,
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: post-World War II,
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: he basically,
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: he didn't invent the idea of manga, but he was basically the first big manga guy.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: And most of his original stuff got, you know, made into the early anime.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm talking about the 50s and 60s.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: And Osamu Tezuka,
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: he is most well-known for There's some weird noise coming in the background there.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: He's most well known for Astro Boy.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Astro Boy is basically, he's like the Mickey Mouse of Japanese animation.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: He's like the Mickey Mouse of manga.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: And he's one of the first characters that came to the West and came to
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: the greater world when it got animated in the early days, right?
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: And when...
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: Naoki Urasawa was a young kid.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he, you know, grown up in the 60s.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: He was a huge Astro Boy fan.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now I'll make a quick note.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Astro Boy is the westernization of the character name in Japanese.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: His name is Adam, right?
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: Not Adam, but Atom, right?
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things about Astro Boy is he's a robot and he was created by his
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: By his creator, right?
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Let me remember what his name was.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: What was his name?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: What was his creator's name?
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: Professor Tenma, right?
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: And Professor Tenma created Astro Boy because his son died in a car accident.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: So he created a, you know, a copy of his own son as a super advanced robot.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: And he Eventually, he realized that, you know what?
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: He's never going to replace my son.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: He's too perfect.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: He's too good.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: And he sold him to a circus and he was rescued by Professor Ochomiazu and blah, blah, blah.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: And then he fights robots and the whole kind of 1950s, 1960s kind of robot anime type of thing.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_00: But I mean, he had a huge impact on the whole industry and it was just a huge deal.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: One of the themes about it was that Osamu Tezuka was trying to kind
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: of popularize science and science fiction in Japan post-World War II.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: As you can imagine, post-World War II, the Japanese were not very fond of atomic energy.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: And that type of thing.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it was basically a positive pro-science,
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: pro-technology thing to kind of show like, no, this is good.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: We can make good things out of these weapons, out of the atomic age.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: We can make it great.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: In that kind of era, our creator of Pluto that we're talking about, he grew up reading this.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the specific storylines in this very long run of Astro Boy was called
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: The Greatest Robot Ever to Live or The Greatest Robot on Earth, right?
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: And it was basically a several series kind of storyline that That followed Adam
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: and Pluto and blah, blah, blah, anything, right?
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: And it was popular.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: So fans of Astro Boy were fans of that storyline.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was kind of like the Dark Knight Returns version of Astro Boy, right?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, many, many,
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: many years later, our boy Naoki Urasawa, he, now he's a big, he's a big manga guy.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he's famous.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: He's already had Monster down.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: He's had a few other, he's had a run of other like manga.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it's basically the, I believe like the 60 or 80 year anniversary of Astro Boy.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: And by this time, you know, Osamu Tezuka has passed away.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_00: He's got old, he passed away.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we're talking about a guy that like, you know, was friends with Walt Disney, right?
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: he wanted to do something to kind of, you know, for this anniversary of Astro Boy.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: And he approached the son of Asamu, right?
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, hey, I want to rewrite.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: I want to basically redo the storyline, The Greatest Robot Ever.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: And his son was like, I don't know, you know, you can't, it's the legacy of my father.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's the most important, like, you know, manga in the history of manga, blah, blah.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_00: And they finally agreed to it.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, the thing was like, he said, you have to do it your own.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: And he did.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: And what he created was an eight chapter manga called Pluto.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: And Pluto is basically Astro Boy.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's specifically the retelling of the world's greatest robot.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: Aka Pluto.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: So in a way, Pluto is not a truly original story.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's in the same way the new Battlestar Galactica to the old Battlestar Galactica.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a...
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's where he took the baseline story,
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: the original story,
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: and he completely rewrote it,
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: redesigned the characters, changed a lot of the plot line.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: But at its core,
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: it's a homage to Astro Boy,
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: and it's an homage to the ideas in the Astro Boy manga and later anime.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, man, that's what we're dealing with, right?
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: So when it came out, it was a success.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was huge.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: It was very popular.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: And the anime guys that decided to make it into anime,
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: they basically built an entire studio around just making this show.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: So they took a bunch of animators and stuff from different studios and were focused
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: on it really because of – in a way,
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: it's like – I think a good way to look at it like Western wise is if somebody were
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: to remake one of the original Disney movies like Snow White or something like that,
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: you can imagine how important that would be.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Disney tried to do a big thing for their anniversary and they put out
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: that movie Wish,
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: which was a giant turd,
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: which was really a embarrassment to the legacy of Walt Disney.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: But in this case,
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: they did Osama Tezuka,
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: they did him an honor because this is a freaking masterpiece that came out.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: So let's go on with talking about the show.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: So what I figure what I'll do right now is we'll go over a little bit over what kind
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: of the plot of the show is without getting into it very much so.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: And then we'll move on and talk about some of the themes.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to keep on moving the slides back and forth a little bit
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: so I don't forget what I'm talking about.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: All right, so Pluto.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's named after the Roman god of the underworld.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: At its core plot is a murder mystery.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a science fiction, a near future science fiction murder mystery.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the main changes...
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: From the Astro Boy comic is that the main character of Pluto is not Astro Boy.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: He's there.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: His name is Adam, and he's a secondary character in a huge part of the plot.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: But the main character is Geschicht, who is a German robot, a police officer robot.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: And at the beginning of our show, and the show starts ominously, right?
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: It starts with...
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: And we immediately find out...
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: That the robot that is destroyed is a very, very famous robot named Mont Blanc.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: And Mont Blanc is a robot that is just loved around the world.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, you know, there's everybody's mourning the death of Mont Blanc.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the murder of Mont Blanc, right?
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: People are crying, humans and robots alike.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: He's like the John Candy of Switzerland.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: He's the John Kennedy of Switzerland.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: He's this environmentalist, conservationist robot.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it's right away shown to us that we're dealing with a world where robots
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: and humans live with each other, basically.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: And there's Different levels of robots.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: You have everything from like,
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: basically,
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: upshot Roombas and made robots that have very little like intelligence
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: or almost no personality.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: And they're just basically appliances all the way to hyper intelligent, super AI robots.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: Beyond hyper-intelligent.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: And we're talking about,
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_00: they're basically hyper-intelligent slash weapons of mass destruction slash,
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: you know, seven wonders of the world, basically.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to their intelligence and their design,
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: they're almost like superhero in their quality.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: And Mount Blanc was one of them.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: And you realize right away that in order to kill the super robot, you had to be a...
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_00: A gangster, right?
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: You're not,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: you're not killing this guy with, you know, just like a humans not doing it, right?
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: So right away,
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Europol,
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: which is like kind of like a world,
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: police organization,
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: sends another one of the super robots, our main character, Gesit, to investigate.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: And Gesit is the German robot.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: And he is another one of the super robots.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he starts investigating the murder of Mont Blanc.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: And as he investigates this, more murders start happening.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a murder of a robot's rights activist, a human in this case.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of, you know, mystery to it.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like who's doing this?
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: Is it a robot?
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_00: And when the human activist gets murdered,
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: one of the kind of key elements of the show get,
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: immediately put,
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: you know, put on,
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: which is a robot couldn't have killed him because,
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_00: well, Robots are not allowed to kill humans.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: They're programmed to never be able to kill humans, right?
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: But when Gesict investigates this,
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: he realizes that no, there's no signs of a human doing any of this.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like none of his like sensors or anything can pick up any human traces.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: So did a robot kill the robot rights activist?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: And a robot had to have killed Mont Blanc.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: And after,
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: a little bit of investigating,
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: it kind of becomes clear in the plot that something or somebody is hunting down
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: and trying to kill all these seven super robots, including Geschick himself.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: So the show is, is,
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: very slow and it's really dealing with,
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: there's this murder mystery going on and I'm going to try to avoid any type
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: of spoilers.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, But as we kind of get the first episode,
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: we see in the first episode, by the way, is near perfect, right?
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: Near perfect.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: We start seeing the different levels of interactions between humans and robots.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_00: There's this heart-wrenching scene in it where,
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: so robots like Gesicht are so human that they can do everything.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: They can have dreams, they cry, they have feelings, or at least the simulacrum of feelings.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: They live with like their robot wives who also,
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: you know, his specific wife, Helena is kind of a key part to this.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: And, but there's other robots like,
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_00: the maid robot who are,
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: who look like,
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: like toasters or they look like, you know, kind of, you know, lower older models.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: But those robots also have feelings and there's this thing.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Something I want to interject with.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: One thing I loved about this show is you're right.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: They, they're, They did a great job making all of the robots 95% human.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: There's this bit that you're like, eh, there's something a little
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_00: off.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: But then by the end of the series,
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: especially with some of the final conversations,
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: I recognized them as, ah, now they're 100% human.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_01: It was like, dang, like the finesse.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: You pull that off.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: Just magnificent.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, please continue.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right away in the very early investigation,
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: we get into, you know, kind of like the tearjerker kind of part.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: And this was a scene that really captured the whole, the humanity of these robots.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: As they're investigating the murder of...
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: One of the robot rights activists, basically.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: There's a police robot and the police robots that are not Geschick, right?
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_00: Are basically like war bot type characters, like patrol bot type things.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: And they're very simple kind of, I mean,
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: they're actually very high tech complex and they have AIs,
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: but they're not as complex as, you know, the super robots like Geschick.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_00: And Geschick leaves one of them behind and he talks to him and you kind
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_00: of joke around and he leaves.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_00: And As Geschicht is investigating upstairs, somebody murders one of the police robots.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_00: And Geschicht has to go to the police robot's house and tell his robot wife
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: that her husband got murdered, basically.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it is really this heart-wrenching scene because unlike Geschicht and his wife
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: and the high-tech robots, the robot wife...
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_00: Her face is, you know, like an appliance, right?
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's a very like, you know, bought kind of look and it's stuck in its perpetual like smile.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yet the artists and the animators, right?
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: They got this emotion across that this thing whose face was stuck in
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: a smile was just overwhelmed with emotion.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_00: And it was, it's such a powerful scene, you know, it's such a powerful scene.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_00: And Geschick goes back to,
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_00: he basically goes to the dump and he finds the body of this police robot.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_00: And now you see how robots are still very second class citizens.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: This is a police robot that was protecting humans and they just got dumped in
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: the trash afterwards.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: And Geschick goes and pulls out his memory chip and he takes it back to his wife
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: and he gives it to his wife.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: And his wife...
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: She inserts the memory chip in her outdated software to see the last minutes
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_00: of her husband's life before he got killed and got destroyed.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: And she's obviously having a hard time with it, and Geshek offers to erase her memory.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: He goes, I can erase the memories of your husband.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: I can erase the entirety of you ever knowing him.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: I can just erase everything.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: So you won't have to suffer.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: And she denies that.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: She goes, no, I'm going to keep that memory.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_00: And that right there sets the theme for the whole story, right?
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: It sets the theme for the whole story.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: Because Geschick himself is experiencing these crazy nightmares.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_00: And he can't figure out why he has these nightmares.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_00: But we'll get back to that later, to the nightmares.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: And then what we realize, and the show kind of jumps around from different characters.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: The show decides to jump to...
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_00: The next mass robot, right?
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of a side storyline.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_00: And this is only on episode one, by the way, guys.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I highly recommend you guys just watch this episode.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't like it, don't watch it because the whole show is in episode one.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: But it jumps to, I believe, I think it's Switzerland or the Swiss Alps somewhere.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a story about an old man.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_00: He's an old pianist who is blind.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: He went blind as he was growing up and growing older.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: And he became this, he's a master pianist and a master composer that Has scored endless films.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: he's basically like, um, uh,
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: what's that guy's name that does all the,
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_00: the movies, you know, the Western movies and stuff.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, he's basically a real famous film composer.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: First name that pops to mind is, uh, Oh, um, John, John Williams,
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: John Williams.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_00: And he, he, so I'll tell you, I'll tell you his name exactly.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_00: So he goes, so he's basically blind and he needs help.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: He needs, he needs help to, you know, do day-to-day stuff.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: And an agency sends this robot to him.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the robot that they sent to him is actually named North number two,
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_00: and he's one of the seven super robots.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: And right away, the show reveals kind of the background setting.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: And this is a key to the entire show.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_00: We're living in a world that is post-war,
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_00: as in a massive war just recently happened,
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: and a massive war called the 39th Persian War.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: And we need to kind of talk about that, but we'll get back to that.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: It was a massive war, and these super robots were used in this war.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well, now this robot wants to be a maid, basically.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_00: He wants to be a servant,
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: like a traditional British kind of servant to this aging blind composer.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: And right away, the composer wants nothing to do with him.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, I don't want a war machine living here.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_00: The only thing you're good for is killing.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: And as the scenes kind of pass, the composer is obviously like, he's emotionally damaged.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: He's very hurt.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_00: And he cannot finish his last masterpiece.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: He's writing this song.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_00: He's writing this piece right on piano, but he cannot complete it.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: He just can't get it.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: He's trying to create a masterpiece about his childhood in Bavaria, but he can't do it.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: He can't finish it.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_00: Well, North number two,
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: he goes and he starts teaching himself the piano and he's trying
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: to help him complete this song.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this piece, not this song, right?
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_00: This piano piece.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_00: And he tells the man,
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: he tells him,
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: When you're sleeping,
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: when you have nightmares, you are singing the end of the piece you cannot finish.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's there, it's in you, but you're like blocking it.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the man is upset.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: The composer is upset.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, how dare you touch my piano?
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: How dare you try to create music?
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_00: You're nothing but a machine.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_00: You're just a war machine.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_00: You're just built for war.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: And North number two tells him, no, I know, I know, but I don't want to be.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: He does not want to be.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_00: And let me tell you guys, right?
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think there's some flashbacks to the war.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: It is one of the best kind of examples of like PTSD,
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_00: you know, I've ever, ever seen put down on fiction.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: I think his exact line is I no longer wish to belong to the battlefield.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_00: I no longer wish to be a part of the battlefield or be on the battlefield.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Belong to the battlefield.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: I'm pretty sure that's what he said.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_01: So magnificent line.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_00: So North number two ends up going to Bavaria and kind of investigating
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_00: the composer's life,
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_00: comes back, and I'm not going to spoil it, he kind of resolves this plot.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_00: They kind of reconcile and become friends,
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_00: and then the same person,
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: the same thing that killed Montblanc comes for him, and he gets killed, right?
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_00: Spoiler.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, guys, right?
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it is one of the most heart-wrenching things I've ever seen on any media.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: It is brutal.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: And he dies as his blind human friend is trying to figure out what's going on
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: because he can't see.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_00: And this massive battle is happening above this chateau in the Swiss Alps.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_00: And the whole time the piano piece is playing and You yearn for North.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_00: He's a machine.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_00: He's a machine that did not want to do his primary task, which was to be a weapon of war.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_00: And it's brutal, man.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_00: It got me.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sitting there at two in the morning watching this episode the first time
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_00: and I'm just sobbing like a little bitch.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, okay, this is rough, right?
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I was thinking about like, you know, kind of quotes to go along with it.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know,
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_00: I always go back to Dostoevsky and in Crime and Punishment,
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Dostoevsky,
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_00: he has Raskolnikov, the,
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna say the hero of Crime and Punishment because Raskolnikov is not
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_00: the hero, right?
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: The anti-hero perhaps.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_00: But the protagonist or whatever of the main character of Crime and Punishment,
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: Raskolnikov, he has this quote, which is a famous Dostoevsky quote.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: And the quote is,
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: pain and suffering are always inevitable for a large intelligence and a deep heart.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: The really great men must, I think, have great sadness on earth.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that kind of quote absolutely,
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_00: absolutely captures what the entirety of This is all about.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: So that was the first episode.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_00: The next episodes basically,
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_00: and I'm not going to go episode by episode or anything like that
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_00: because I want you guys to watch it.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: Our main character,
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_00: Geschicht,
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_00: he basically starts going around to meet all the different super robots and kind
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_00: of get their backstory and their encounters with
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_00: And the entity, by the way, is Pluto, right?
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_00: That's what they end up calling it.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: one of the things that's revealed very early on is this war.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_00: So what is this war, right?
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I need to kind of jump to the war part, okay?
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_00: What's going on with the 39th Persian War?
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's very clearly, very on the nose.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's a...
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_00: Kind of a blatant reference to the Iraq War.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if you look at when Pluto was written, it was written in 2003.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: Naoki Urasawa is a very kind of anti-war Japanese guy.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's not even like, I don't think it's even hidden, right?
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_00: So what happened in this war?
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the United States of Thracia...
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_00: With President Alexander,
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_00: who happens to live in the White House,
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: decided to convince the UN to pass a law banning the creation of robots
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_00: of mass destruction.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: Right away, the United States of Thracia decides to accuse Persia of
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: The character,
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: the president of the Thracians,
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: decides to accuse the Persians and Darius of building robots of mass destruction.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_00: And to be fair to the United States, they were kind of militaristic.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: They had a bunch of military robots and all this stuff, and they were kind of a warlike people.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: But The UN decides to send in a,
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: an inspector kind of group of scientists to,
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: the best highest robotic scientists in the world called the Bora Expedition, right?
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: And they go there and they decide.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think they find anything?
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: Let's think of historically.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: Did they find any of that yellow cake?
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the weapons of mass, robots of mass?
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_00: No, they do not.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they found the yellow cake robots.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_01: They found the yellow cake robots.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_00: So the Bora group that's investigating, kind of inspecting the Persians does not find anything.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: And they go back and...
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_00: Well, guess what the Thracians do?
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_00: They say, no, no, no, look, there's enough evidence.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: And they convince the rest of the civilized world to invade and bring democracy to the Persians.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: And a mass war happens.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: And we get flashbacks to this mass war back and forth.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_00: Throughout the series,
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: and it's pretty brutal,
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: most of the super robots from the West and Japan were involved in this war
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_00: to different levels.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_00: For example,
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_00: North 2,
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_00: who we meet and he dies in the first episode,
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_00: he has over 10,000 confirmed kills and...
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's pretty bloody.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_00: By bloody, like it's robots destroying robots, but lots of humans get killed, right?
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: And there's some, you know, very harrowing scenes of kind of brutality going on.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, no robots of mass destruction were found.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: Democracy was brought and that's it basically, right?
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: And their King Darius was put in this basically Thracian,
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_00: you know, You know, secret prison in Guanta, I mean, somewhere.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, that's where we're at, right?
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that's kind of the background of what's going on here.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_00: So Gashik being a super intelligent robot immediately figures out that,
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_00: well, oh crap, dude, right?
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like somebody is hunting down all the super robots and all the members of
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: the Bora investigation group.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_00: Which happened to be basically the creators of all the super robots.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because, well,
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: if you're going to investigate a hyper-intelligent AI super weapon, well,
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_00: you might as well send the people that created hyper-intelligent super weapons.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_00: So the characters that we have are Adam, the Japanese robot.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_00: He's basically Astro Boy.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: He lives in Japan.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_00: And he never really took part in the war.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_00: He was kind of...
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: He was kind of like a figurehead.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_00: He showed up at the end and he was part of the parades and he cheered everybody on.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_00: Geschick himself was part of the war.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_00: He's a super military robot.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_00: Then you have... Gosh, I'm going to mess up their names.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_00: You have Hercules, the Greek robot, who's basically a war robot.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: He's pretty cool.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: Brando, he's a Turkish robot.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_00: Mont Blanc, who was the first victim.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then you had Epsilon.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_00: And Epsilon, out of all the robots, Washed his hands of the whole thing.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: He refused to take part in any of the war.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_00: And he took a strong pacifist kind of stance to the point where some of
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_00: the other robots looked down on him because he did not get involved.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_00: But his plot is very interesting.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_00: So the whole show,
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_00: for the most part,
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: at least the first Two-thirds of the show is Geschicht investigating and kind
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_00: of interacting with these robots as they're being hunted down by this entity,
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_00: by this character named Pluto.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_00: And the timeline starts picking up faster and faster.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_00: Geschicht goes to Japan.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_00: He meets Adam.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_00: He meets Adam's little sister, Uron, who's a very interesting character.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: She's an inferior robot, but I don't think she's inferior at all.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_00: She's actually quite interesting.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_01: No, she has some talents.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: Some talents that are quite curious.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_00: She's kind of a poor copy of Adam, but she has the ability to feel emotions, not in her own.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_00: She has an empathic ability.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_00: Her AI can detect emotions over long distances.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_00: And she kind of starts solving the plot in a way,
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_00: but I don't want to spoil it for anybody, right?
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's pretty interesting how she solves it, right?
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_00: So that's basically what we're dealing with right now.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to spoil what's going on specifically,
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_00: but let me tell you that the bad guy is not a bad guy.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_00: Well, he is, but he's not.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_00: His name is Pluto, and it has everything to do with the suffering caused in the 39th War.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the idea behind it is that hatred,
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_00: violence,
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_00: and that kind of stuff does not fix It actually just creates more violence
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_00: and it creates more hatred.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_00: And there's some interesting themes, right?
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm going to let you, Fisto, what do you think about the show?
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_00: I want to kind of know before we go into some of these themes, right?
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_01: so the first thing I'd like to say is that regarding the 39th Central Asian War,
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_01: every time they bring up the 39th Central Asian War,
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_01: you take a drink because they bring it up so much.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_01: The 39th Central Asian War, I'm teasing.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's not that bad.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: But that was something that made me giggle a little bit.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_01: There were a couple episodes where I'm like, guys, do you have to say the whole thing?
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_01: Come on, settle down.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: But it was funny.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: It was cool.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_01: It has a little bit of charm there.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_01: As far as the serious stuff,
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_01: jokes aside,
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_01: as far as the serious stuff,
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_01: themes of the show,
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_01: like I said earlier,
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think they did a really excellent job of portraying artificial intelligence
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_01: and portraying robotic intelligence or what would be like a non-human kind
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_01: of intelligence.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_01: And they're like 95% human.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like, Gesicht is...
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_01: He's got the wife.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_01: He's got the job.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_01: He's got the sense of duty.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: He's got so many things, like when he saves that one guy.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: How do you say it?
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: Gazicht?
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_01: Gazicht is the man.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_01: He's great.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_01: But he's not quite...
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_01: He's missing that edge.
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_01: They're slightly one-dimensional.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_01: Not enough to really make a difference.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_01: It does this cool thing where...
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_01: Suspension of disbelief isn't violated.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_01: You believe that this is a world where these robots appear human to people.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_00: But as a viewer, you can tell, not quite.
• 51:44
  SPEAKER_00: But I will make a note.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_00: The show gives you the answer for that last 1%.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_00: It tells you what the last 1% is.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_00: And we'll go into that in a bit because that's where the best of the themes are.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's great.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I loved it for that, especially at the end, the last few things.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_01: Probably my favorite line in the entire show,
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_01: and this won't spoil anything, but you'll recognize it, I'm sure.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: They're so fragile, but they've got heart.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like that scene, nailed it.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, yes.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_01: That character,
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_01: especially,
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_01: that was probably my favorite character, but that's because I'm always...
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always drawn to that sort of,
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_01: Hannibal Lecter in the basement kind of thing where it's like, wait, what's this?
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_01: Hold on.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_01: This guy's a little devilish.
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_01: This guy's not quite sure what's going on with this one.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm always drawn to that one.
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_01: So that seems perfect.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_01: Really summed up the beauty of it for me.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_00: You're talking about Brow, the one robot that murders.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't even want to talk about him because I don't want to spoil that character
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: because it's so good.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_01: Brow is just in a good procedural cop drama kind of thing.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_01: You need a character like that that just he's almost like the Greek chorus.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like he knows what's going on.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_01: He knows everything already.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_01: And he's just like, you know, can I tease it out of you?
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_01: Can I can I tease all of you to figure out what I already know?
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's great.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: He's definitely.
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, man.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_00: And somebody in the chat,
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_00: Matt330,
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_00: he said, Dr.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_00: Tenma being absolutely chilling in the best scene of the show where he explains how
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_00: to get the other 5%.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's exactly it.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm going to go into that.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_00: We're going to talk about the other 5%, right?
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_01: One thing that was fun for me too, Dr. Tenma, he was voiced by Keith David.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_01: And Keith David's one of my favorite actors,
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_01: and he's been in a few things that I've some
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_01: of my favorite things has been Keith David.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_01: So when I heard him playing, I was like, yes, this is great.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_01: So that's just like a small little thing for me.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I mean,
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_01: I guess I could say with the themes,
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_01: it's it's how they get to that last five percent and then how they how they nail it.
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_01: And they don't linger On the resolution, right?
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_01: They don't, it doesn't outstay its welcome.
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, there it is, right?
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody's good.
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, go home.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they tied up really excellently.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_01: So I guess that's kind of what I would say.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's kind of what I would, would highlight.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, just a couple of my own favorite, you know, personal things in it.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, personal things in it.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_00: One of the difficulties of talking about a show like this that has a mystery
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_00: at its core when it comes to its plot is that it leads back to kind of
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_00: that conversation I had on Substack where I stated that in a piece of fiction,
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_00: in a piece of art, a literary piece of art,
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_00: style, character, plot, right?
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I saw that.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_00: And what I mean by that is that
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of people tend to focus on plot as the driving element, but plot is at best a framework.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_00: And really what matters is character and style, right?
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_00: But when it means style, I don't mean just grammatical style or writing style.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm talking about is the overall themes and feelings and meaning behind something.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_00: That matters a lot more.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_00: And for people that argued against me,
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_00: I used the example of, you know, think of some of your favorite movies.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_00: They're actually very thin in their plot.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_00: To use movies that we've all pretty much seen, for example.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_00: Quentin Tarantino is a great example of stuff.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_00: Whether you like Tarantino or not, he is considered a great director.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_00: And we've all pretty much, I would say, we've all seen most of his movies.
• 55:54
  SPEAKER_01: It won't be familiar.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_00: A film like Pulp Fiction...
• 55:58
  SPEAKER_00: Doesn't really have a great plot.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_00: If you were to sit down and if I asked you, Fisto, hey, tell me the plot of Pulp Fiction, right?
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_00: From beginning to end.
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_00: There's not a lot to it, right?
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, you know, there's two hitmen.
• 56:13
  SPEAKER_00: They go after, you know, two kind of collectors.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: They go after this guy.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: There's a guy, a boxer that throws a fight and blah, blah, blah.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_00: There's not really a lot of, not a lot happens in that movie.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's funny.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's been a very long time since I've seen that film.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_01: And what popped into my mind when you started talking about it is what I would tell people.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, yeah, cult fiction is crazy.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: Just go watch it.
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_01: Don't worry about it.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: Just sit back and enjoy the ride.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's all style.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's all character.
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_00: Another even better example of Tarantino to use Tarantino again is Reservoir Dogs.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_00: Reservoir Dogs.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_00: It has a very, very simple plot.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's a failed bank robbery and goes to shit and they end up at a warehouse and
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_00: the cops come and get them.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_00: That is it.
• 56:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's really the plot.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_01: Almost nothing happens.
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_00: You can write the plot of Reservoir Dogs in one paragraph.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it has really like three scenes, if you really want to be honest about it.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, three locations, right?
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's got the restaurant opening scene, the actual bank scene, and then the warehouse, right?
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_00: And a few side scenes kind of spreading around there.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_00: But for the most part, plot-wise, it's very thin.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_00: But it's all character.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody's going to forget Mr.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_00: Pink.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody's going to forget Mr. White.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_00: The stuck-in-the-middle-with-you thing.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's there.
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's all character.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's all theme.
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's all vibes.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's all Tarantino.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's what we have when people say a movie's Tarantino-esque or a movie's Lynchian
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_00: for David Lynch.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's just vibes.
• 57:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's style that makes...
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_00: The artwork, right?
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, even when we talk, you know, our favorite show on here, True Detective, right?
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_00: True Detective Season 1, which, you know, we all agree is a masterpiece.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_00: When you really look at it, plot-wise, it's a very simple plot.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's a buddy cop detective story
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_00: about two opposite type cops investigating child murders and,
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: oh, shocking, it's rich people that are secretly weird per Well, that's nothing new.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: We've seen that plot numerous times in hundreds and hundreds of movies.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_00: But what made True Detective a masterpiece was the style and the characters.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_00: Russ Cole made that show.
• 58:30
  SPEAKER_00: Marty made that show.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_00: The wife made that show.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_00: And then the style of the directing and The writing and the dialogue and
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_00: the feel of Louisiana and the fog and that post-Katrina decay that was everywhere in
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_00: that show.
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_00: That was what made True Detective a masterpiece, not the plot.
• 58:53
  SPEAKER_00: So when we talk about a show, a piece of art like Pluto, it's the same thing.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the plot is actually pretty simple.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it even kind of falls apart at the end.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that it is a reinterpretation of Astro Boy.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_00: So Urasawa had to kind of like use certain elements from that,
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_00: like the volcano and that type of thing.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_00: But What really makes this a masterpiece,
• 59:19
  SPEAKER_00: what elevates it past just a really good show or a really good piece of fiction is
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_00: the style and the characters and the themes that are woven into all this, right?
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_00: And the biggest kind of theme, right?
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_00: The 39th War and the whole political implications of it and everything,
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_00: they're really not that interesting compared to the humanity of the show,
• 59:47
  SPEAKER_00: which is the exploration of what it means to be human and what it means to hate
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_00: and what it means to love.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_00: And what you...
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_00: What the show really contrasts right away is love and hatred, right?
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_00: And the fact that they're intertwined,
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_00: that you cannot have love, like true love, without hatred.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_00: And you cannot be human without both those elements, without both those emotions.
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_00: Throughout the show,
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_00: we see these robots,
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_00: these hyper-intelligent AIs that are very,
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_00: very, very capable of faking emotions or actually experiencing emotions.
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_00: There's a scene where Geshek's wife is mourning.
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_00: She is sad.
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_00: She's crying.
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_00: She's devastated.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_00: And she's talking to Professor Tenma, who is the creator of Atom.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_00: And He tells her to cry and she says something along the lines of like, am I just faking it?
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_00: Is it just programming?
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_00: Am I just pretending in the same way humans are to do this?
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_00: And he tells her to keep doing it because eventually it'll be real.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_00: And it's that grief that makes her human.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's that sadness that makes her human.
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_00: And what we have in the show,
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_00: we have a theme that these robots are Go beyond their programming,
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_00: beyond into realms of humanity where they want to raise children.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_00: They want to have families.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we meet Almost every single one of the characters is a character that has deep loves.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_00: Very early on, we meet Brando, the Turkish wrestling robot, who's himself a war robot.
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_00: And when Geshek finds him, he is living with his family.
• 1:01:37
  SPEAKER_00: He has a family of robots.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know what?
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_00: The show doesn't even make it clear if his wife and children are human or robots,
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_00: but he finds love and he finds purpose in Raising these children,
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_00: raising this family, eating dinner with them, playing with them.
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_00: And he also finds purpose in fulfilling his duty to protect his family from the threat.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_00: And in his death, because he dies, spoiler guys, they all die, right?
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's enemy.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody dies.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_00: In his death, as he's fighting Pluto, as he's fighting this massive biblical monster, he...
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_00: Sends a message to all the other robots.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_00: And he's trying to basically send the data of the fight to kind of show
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_00: how he beat him.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_00: But he doesn't even realize that he's dying.
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_00: And as his AI brain is being scrambled and destroyed, it malfunctions.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he doesn't send the data of the fight.
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: He actually sends glimpses and images of his family.
• 1:02:48
  SPEAKER_00: And it is the most, it is gut-wrenching, right?
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_00: As he's dying, he's sinking into the ocean.
• 1:02:55
  SPEAKER_00: And the communication that he's sending to Schicht and Adam is
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_00: of his family sitting around the dinner table, right?
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_00: So these robots are basically, in a way, hyperhuman, right?
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to love and emotions and all that.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_00: And we have this plot line where
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give this spoiler.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_00: What is the 5% that makes them truly human?
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_00: Hatred.
• 1:03:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:03:25
  SPEAKER_00: Hatred.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_00: And we have this, probably what I think is the most interesting plotline is with Adolf, right?
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_00: And Adolf is interesting.
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yes.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, just a side note, just a side note real quick, because you're talking about hate.
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_01: And something that I found very interesting,
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_01: and this relates to your earlier point about style above all,
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_01: is The revelation of Pluto, I think, was incredibly effective.
• 1:03:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's very hard to create.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, right off the bat, Pluto is this enigma, this enigma of destruction, right?
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's hard to stick the landing on that kind of thing because you pump them up too much.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, when you pull the mask back, you go, oh, that's all right.
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_01: And that didn't happen with Pluto.
• 1:04:16
  SPEAKER_01: They just, they slowly bring the terror out.
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you see Pluto for what he is, it's, it's legitimate.
• 1:04:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, that looks like a guy that fucks everybody up.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because he is, he, he, he's a character and the Pluto story is,
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_00: is very well mirrored in the geschict Adolf story.
• 1:04:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm going to go into this part because I think it's critical to the show.
• 1:04:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, exactly.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_00: So early on in the show, we meet this character named Adolf.
• 1:04:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I believe his name is Adolf Haas.
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_00: Good old Adolf.
• 1:04:53
  SPEAKER_00: A little bit on the nose, my bros, right?
• 1:04:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's fine.
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_00: He is in the
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_01: Asian war.
• 1:04:58
  SPEAKER_01: Take a drink.
• 1:04:59
  SPEAKER_00: He's like a German kind of businessman, a family guy.
• 1:05:03
  SPEAKER_00: And he's actually a good dad.
• 1:05:04
  SPEAKER_00: He's a good husband to his wife.
• 1:05:08
  SPEAKER_00: He works hard.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_00: And he absolutely hates robots, right?
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_00: And we find out that he hates robots through a scene where he goes
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_00: to pick up his older brother's corpse from the morgue.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_00: And his older brother,
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_00: you find out that he was, his older brother was killed by the police basically.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_00: And he was a massive criminal.
• 1:05:36
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not revealed right away what crimes he committed,
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_00: but everybody is like, Dude, this guy was a monster.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_00: This guy's a piece of crap.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_00: He deserved to die.
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_00: And he committed crimes specifically against robots.
• 1:05:54
  SPEAKER_00: And he did some heinous stuff and he ended up dead.
• 1:05:58
  SPEAKER_00: When he finds the body,
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_00: he retrieves the body to go bury it after the two years or something like that
• 1:06:03
  SPEAKER_00: of investigation.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_00: But he decides he wants his own investigation and He takes the body to a scientist
• 1:06:11
  SPEAKER_00: to investigate or like a coroner, right?
• 1:06:15
  SPEAKER_00: And he finds out to kind of a shock that his brother was killed by a robot, right?
• 1:06:25
  SPEAKER_00: Now, this is a big deal, right?
• 1:06:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because his brother hated robots and he was killed by a robot.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_00: And you kind of get a background where Adolph and his brother were little kids
• 1:06:36
  SPEAKER_00: and their dad was basically...
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_00: Down on his luck,
• 1:06:40
  SPEAKER_00: he lost his job because of robots,
• 1:06:44
  SPEAKER_00: because of industrialization or robotization,
• 1:06:47
  SPEAKER_00: themes that we're dealing with in our current world with the AI explosion
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_00: and people losing their jobs, right?
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_00: His dad lost his job to robots,
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_00: hated robots, blamed the robots of taking over his job and your usual thing, right?
• 1:07:02
  SPEAKER_00: And there's this scene where his dad Basically steals a soccer ball for them
• 1:07:08
  SPEAKER_00: and gives it to them.
• 1:07:10
  SPEAKER_00: And he gets caught for shoplifting by a robot policeman,
• 1:07:14
  SPEAKER_00: which gives him this like kind of like publicly shames him,
• 1:07:17
  SPEAKER_00: publicly embarrasses him in front of everybody.
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it's just this very like harrowing, embarrassing thing.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_00: So these people that lost their livelihood to robots are getting shamed
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_00: and embarrassed by robots for scraping by.
• 1:07:33
  SPEAKER_00: And his dad slips into alcoholism and kills himself.
• 1:07:37
  SPEAKER_00: So Adolf and his brother grow up just hating, hating robots.
• 1:07:44
  SPEAKER_00: And his brother becomes a criminal, you know, a scumbag.
• 1:07:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Adolf becomes kind of a good guy.
• 1:07:49
  SPEAKER_00: He goes to college, you know, starts a business, blah, blah, blah.
• 1:07:53
  SPEAKER_00: But after he realizes that a robot killed his brother, who even he admits was messed up, right?
• 1:08:01
  SPEAKER_00: He basically joins like the Robot K, right?
• 1:08:04
  SPEAKER_00: These guys that are a little bit on the nose, they're like the robot members of the clan.
• 1:08:10
  SPEAKER_00: And the crazy thing is even the Robot K hates his brother.
• 1:08:16
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, yeah, that's too far, dude.
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever he did was messed up, right?
• 1:08:20
  SPEAKER_00: So we're talking about some dark stuff.
• 1:08:22
  SPEAKER_00: But he gives the information to these guys that a robot killed his brother.
• 1:08:28
  SPEAKER_00: And they quickly realized,
• 1:08:29
  SPEAKER_00: based on how his brother was killed, that Geschicht killed his brother.
• 1:08:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 1:08:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so Adolf decides that he's going to kill Geschicht.
• 1:08:39
  SPEAKER_00: But the robot clan guys do not want him to kill Geschicht because they want
• 1:08:43
  SPEAKER_00: to use this as a media thing.
• 1:08:46
  SPEAKER_00: They want to use it as a...
• 1:08:50
  SPEAKER_00: As a political tool to basically take away robot rights,
• 1:08:55
  SPEAKER_00: to get rid of Geschicht, to get rid of the super robots.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_00: So when they find out that Adolf wants to kill Geschicht, They actually go after Adolf.
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_00: They try to start assassinating him.
• 1:09:07
  SPEAKER_00: And right away he realizes that,
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_00: oh my God,
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_00: these guys that were supposed to be my people actually just want to use me as
• 1:09:15
  SPEAKER_00: a political tool.
• 1:09:16
  SPEAKER_00: And what does he do?
• 1:09:17
  SPEAKER_00: He runs to the police.
• 1:09:18
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, oh my God, the police.
• 1:09:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because he's not like a criminal himself.
• 1:09:21
  SPEAKER_00: He's just a businessman guy.
• 1:09:23
  SPEAKER_00: He's like a rube.
• 1:09:26
  SPEAKER_00: So you answer the police and who did the police assign to protect them?
• 1:09:30
  SPEAKER_00: Geschicht.
• 1:09:31
  SPEAKER_00: So now you've got this insane tension where the robot
• 1:09:36
  SPEAKER_00: that killed his brother is charged of protecting him from the anti-robot clan
• 1:09:46
  SPEAKER_00: and is one of the most interesting things because it's all about hatred.
• 1:09:50
  SPEAKER_00: The whole time Adolf hates Geschicht and Geschick hates Adolf.
• 1:09:57
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a plot line about Geschick's dreams and you've, without spoiling it, right?
• 1:10:04
  SPEAKER_00: Geschick does not remember killing his brother.
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_00: And he has no idea.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_00: And this plot line is all about hatred and violence.
• 1:10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And it has to do with his brother's crimes.
• 1:10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And you kind of figure it out, like, you know, by the context clues, what really happened.
• 1:10:24
  SPEAKER_00: But
• 1:10:26
  SPEAKER_00: after all is said and done, Geschick realizes that he hated his brother.
• 1:10:33
  SPEAKER_00: He hated, you know, he never felt that emotion before.
• 1:10:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, this is an emotion that robots were not allowed to feel and he hated his brother.
• 1:10:42
  SPEAKER_00: And Adolf realizes that he also does fully hate Geschick, but he gets over it.
• 1:10:49
  SPEAKER_00: He doesn't forgive Geschick for killing his brother.
• 1:10:52
  SPEAKER_00: But he realizes that he cannot live a life consumed by this hatred.
• 1:10:57
  SPEAKER_00: And Geshek realizes the same thing, right?
• 1:11:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it's in this kind of moment that you realize kind of the theme of the show is
• 1:11:05
  SPEAKER_00: that hatred makes you human in a way.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_00: And as we're dealing with this kind of plot and throughout the show,
• 1:11:16
  SPEAKER_00: We go back to Dr. Tenma, and Dr.
• 1:11:18
  SPEAKER_00: Tenma is the creator of Adam,
• 1:11:20
  SPEAKER_00: and he's the most intelligent of all the scientists, of the creators.
• 1:11:26
  SPEAKER_01: Alex, real fast, I just want to comment on the Adolf thing.
• 1:11:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think something I really enjoyed about that,
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_01: the hatred is overcome through the exhaustion of duty.
• 1:11:40
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 1:11:41
  SPEAKER_01: Gazit is here to protect this guy.
• 1:11:45
  SPEAKER_01: And despite his feelings, he puts them aside.
• 1:11:48
  SPEAKER_01: And by putting aside his feelings through duty, he realizes how he can put aside the hatred.
• 1:11:52
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it's the same thing.
• 1:11:53
  SPEAKER_01: Just put it aside.
• 1:11:55
  SPEAKER_01: Do what must be done.
• 1:11:57
  SPEAKER_01: And Adolf, especially, you know, he's in a different position.
• 1:12:00
  SPEAKER_01: You know, he's the protected.
• 1:12:02
  SPEAKER_01: But for him, it's just he's just tired.
• 1:12:04
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, I'm done doing this.
• 1:12:06
  SPEAKER_01: This is ridiculous.
• 1:12:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's almost like you just break through and it makes sense.
• 1:12:11
  SPEAKER_01: Why?
• 1:12:12
  SPEAKER_01: Doesn't matter.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_01: He broke through.
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_01: So.
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, you did a great way of summarizing all that.
• 1:12:18
  SPEAKER_01: And yes, it echoes the bigger thing.
• 1:12:24
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway, back to Mr. Tenmuth.
• 1:12:28
  SPEAKER_00: So like I said before,
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_00: this story is based on the Astro Boy story called The World's Greatest Robot.
• 1:12:36
  SPEAKER_00: And The World's Greatest Robot is none of the characters that we've talked about.
• 1:12:41
  SPEAKER_00: The World's Greatest Robot is actually Pluto.
• 1:12:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's actually Adam, but whatever.
• 1:12:49
  SPEAKER_00: And Dr. Tenma,
• 1:12:51
  SPEAKER_00: who created Adam,
• 1:12:52
  SPEAKER_00: the Japanese robot, Adam, he is basically the boy, the boy robot, the anime boy.
• 1:12:59
  SPEAKER_00: He always felt that he failed at creating Adam.
• 1:13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Adam was just too perfect.
• 1:13:08
  SPEAKER_00: He was not human enough.
• 1:13:10
  SPEAKER_00: And there's this beautiful scene Which is a flashback.
• 1:13:14
  SPEAKER_00: And he's actually telling Gishik's wife, Helena, this, right?
• 1:13:17
  SPEAKER_00: When she's in Japan.
• 1:13:18
  SPEAKER_00: And he created Adam as a replacement for his son who died.
• 1:13:24
  SPEAKER_00: And They're having dinner.
• 1:13:26
  SPEAKER_00: He's having dinner with Adam and Adam's doing his homework.
• 1:13:30
  SPEAKER_00: And Adam's like, oh, dad,
• 1:13:31
  SPEAKER_00: I did my homework and I read about bugs and I love reading books
• 1:13:34
  SPEAKER_00: and I love this food.
• 1:13:35
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for making me this food.
• 1:13:37
  SPEAKER_00: And Dr. Tenma, this is his great domestic father-son kind of scene.
• 1:13:44
  SPEAKER_00: But Dr. Tenma is depressed.
• 1:13:45
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, oh, this is a failure.
• 1:13:48
  SPEAKER_00: And he tells, Adam goes, what did I do wrong?
• 1:13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why are you upset?
• 1:13:54
  SPEAKER_00: And Dr. Tenma tells him, It's because you're perfect.
• 1:13:58
  SPEAKER_00: My son hated this food.
• 1:14:01
  SPEAKER_00: My son hated reading.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_00: My son never did his homework.
• 1:14:04
  SPEAKER_00: He was never excited to read books.
• 1:14:07
  SPEAKER_00: He just wanted to play video games or something like that.
• 1:14:10
  SPEAKER_00: And he realizes that he created Adam Too Perfect.
• 1:14:14
  SPEAKER_00: He's too perfect.
• 1:14:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why he abandons Adam.
• 1:14:17
  SPEAKER_00: He gets, you know, he just leaves and he's like, go away, Adam, you know?
• 1:14:20
  SPEAKER_00: And Adam becomes kind of adopted by a different doctor,
• 1:14:23
  SPEAKER_00: by Professor Ochenminazu, who then creates the sub-atom, which is, which is a Uron.
• 1:14:30
  SPEAKER_00: And that's Uron, by the way, it's for uranium, if you didn't figure that out, right?
• 1:14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:14:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, and Uran's interesting.
• 1:14:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to kind of add a side note.
• 1:14:39
  SPEAKER_00: Uran has the most feelings out of all the robots.
• 1:14:42
  SPEAKER_00: She can feel, she's empathic and she can feel other people's emotions.
• 1:14:46
  SPEAKER_00: And she has, she's very emotional herself, almost like childishly emotional.
• 1:14:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it's interesting because I think what the show is telling us is
• 1:14:55
  SPEAKER_00: that these positive feelings of empathy and emotion are actually lower on the scale
• 1:15:02
  SPEAKER_00: than the ability to deal with hatred and grief.
• 1:15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because she's a sub-robot to all of them.
• 1:15:08
  SPEAKER_00: She's lesser than all the other seven in a way.
• 1:15:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought that was a very interesting thing that they made the most feeling robot
• 1:15:16
  SPEAKER_00: a sub-robot, like not as great as the other ones.
• 1:15:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought that was an interesting kind of side note.
• 1:15:22
  SPEAKER_00: But anyways, Dr. Tenma reveals that he has tried to create the greatest robot ever.
• 1:15:30
  SPEAKER_00: And what he did was...
• 1:15:34
  SPEAKER_00: He built an AI brain and he tells us right away that you cannot build an AI brain.
• 1:15:41
  SPEAKER_00: You have to grow it.
• 1:15:43
  SPEAKER_00: You have to basically like
• 1:15:49
  SPEAKER_00: Kind of like raise it, right?
• 1:15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Through different feelings and stuff, right?
• 1:15:54
  SPEAKER_00: And he tells us that he created the greatest robot.
• 1:15:58
  SPEAKER_00: And in this AI brain,
• 1:15:59
  SPEAKER_00: he programmed the personality of 6 billion people,
• 1:16:03
  SPEAKER_00: which is basically everybody on earth, right?
• 1:16:06
  SPEAKER_00: He created this...
• 1:16:08
  SPEAKER_00: Super AI that has the intelligence and the knowledge and everything of 6 billion people, right?
• 1:16:14
  SPEAKER_00: So just imagine this massive language model, but hyper-intelligence AI.
• 1:16:21
  SPEAKER_00: And you know what that robot did?
• 1:16:24
  SPEAKER_00: It didn't wake up.
• 1:16:27
  SPEAKER_00: It just couldn't wake up.
• 1:16:29
  SPEAKER_00: It couldn't differentiate itself.
• 1:16:31
  SPEAKER_00: There was nothing there.
• 1:16:33
  SPEAKER_00: It just could not pick a personality.
• 1:16:36
  SPEAKER_00: It was overwhelmed by all that intelligence.
• 1:16:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he figured the solution to that, which is hatred and grief.
• 1:16:50
  SPEAKER_00: That needed to experience hatred and grief.
• 1:16:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of a very key plot point.
• 1:16:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not going to spoil it, how it gets around to it.
• 1:17:00
  SPEAKER_00: But at one point,
• 1:17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Adam is dead and he is upgraded by Dr.
• 1:17:07
  SPEAKER_00: Tenma and he also does not wake up until he experiences hatred and grief.
• 1:17:14
  SPEAKER_00: And what makes him human in the end is how he handles hatred and grief versus
• 1:17:22
  SPEAKER_00: the antagonist, Pluto.
• 1:17:26
  SPEAKER_00: Who handles it in the completely wrong way or subjective, right?
• 1:17:31
  SPEAKER_00: But in the wrong way, right?
• 1:17:34
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Pluto handles it in the way that he handles it,
• 1:17:36
  SPEAKER_01: but they both resolve it in the end, we'll say.
• 1:17:41
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:17:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to spoil who Pluto is,
• 1:17:45
  SPEAKER_00: and I feel like that's such an important thing to the theme,
• 1:17:47
  SPEAKER_00: but I'll tell you that Pluto is Persian.
• 1:17:50
  SPEAKER_00: He's also a hyper-intelligent robot,
• 1:17:55
  SPEAKER_00: and there's a lot of hatred and a lot of grief involved,
• 1:17:58
  SPEAKER_00: and that's where we're coming with.
• 1:18:00
  SPEAKER_00: There's also hyper-scientists that also kind of build Pluto.
• 1:18:03
  SPEAKER_00: But one of my favorite scenes in the whole show was...
• 1:18:12
  SPEAKER_00: After Adam is upgraded and he experiences massive amounts of grief and hatred
• 1:18:19
  SPEAKER_00: and all these human emotions, he...
• 1:18:23
  SPEAKER_01: Unimagined fury.
• 1:18:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, unimagined fury.
• 1:18:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, fury just beyond what I think most people ever experience in their life.
• 1:18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right,
• 1:18:33
  SPEAKER_00: because he gets the grief of the shit and he gets the grief of all the other robots
• 1:18:37
  SPEAKER_00: and all the other humans and just tons of stuff.
• 1:18:40
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a scene where...
• 1:18:44
  SPEAKER_00: The question the show kind of proposes without saying it is, which way is he going to go?
• 1:18:48
  SPEAKER_00: Is he going to go the way of Pluto?
• 1:18:51
  SPEAKER_00: Is he going to become Pluto?
• 1:18:53
  SPEAKER_00: And he picks up a snail and there's a slow scene where he's holding the snail
• 1:19:02
  SPEAKER_00: in his palm and he's reviewing the memories of Geschick,
• 1:19:07
  SPEAKER_00: really, because Geschick is the solving, right?
• 1:19:10
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 1:19:12
  SPEAKER_00: For a second there, man, you're like, what's he going to do?
• 1:19:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's like the tensest moment with this kid robot holding a snail.
• 1:19:21
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, oh my God, he's going to crush it.
• 1:19:26
  SPEAKER_00: What's he going to do?
• 1:19:28
  SPEAKER_00: And the scene mirrors the scene earlier on at the very beginning when you first meet Adam.
• 1:19:33
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 1:19:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's such a powerful scene because the show doesn't tell you.
• 1:19:39
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't explain to you what's going on, but you get it.
• 1:19:42
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, I know what's going on.
• 1:19:44
  SPEAKER_00: This robot's brain is computing like billion milli terabits of data a second,
• 1:19:52
  SPEAKER_00: trying to figure out what his next action is going to be and if it's going
• 1:19:55
  SPEAKER_00: to be human or not.
• 1:19:59
  SPEAKER_00: Is it going to be human?
• 1:20:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 1:20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because is hatred human?
• 1:20:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it's one of the most insane things.
• 1:20:09
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, I highly recommend this show.
• 1:20:14
  SPEAKER_00: I think that hands down, it's one of the best things I've ever watched.
• 1:20:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's filled with just harrowing scenes of sadness, but also hope.
• 1:20:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's not
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's bleak, but not bleak, if that makes sense.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's got a lot of hope.
• 1:20:37
  SPEAKER_00: It made me really think about what does it mean to hate?
• 1:20:39
  SPEAKER_00: What does it mean to love?
• 1:20:41
  SPEAKER_00: What does it mean to be human?
• 1:20:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's that line that I quoted earlier.
• 1:20:47
  SPEAKER_01: They're such fragile things, but they've got heart.
• 1:20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:20:54
  SPEAKER_00: In the chat,
• 1:20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Matt reminded me that He said,
• 1:20:57
  SPEAKER_00: there's also a point where a truly advanced mind can lie to itself.
• 1:21:01
  SPEAKER_00: And lying to themselves is actually a very important theme of the show.
• 1:21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because the most advanced robots lie.
• 1:21:10
  SPEAKER_00: Adam lies.
• 1:21:11
  SPEAKER_00: He lies.
• 1:21:14
  SPEAKER_00: He lies to Helena blatantly.
• 1:21:17
  SPEAKER_00: He actually lies to Geschick early on.
• 1:21:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then he lies to Helena and withholds the real truth.
• 1:21:25
  SPEAKER_00: But you also realize that helena herself lied to herself
• 1:21:29
  SPEAKER_00: because I think she knew what what adam knew like she knew about the memories um
• 1:21:36
  SPEAKER_00: without spoiling right and then pluto himself sahad right
• 1:21:42
  SPEAKER_01: yeah
• 1:21:44
  SPEAKER_00: he lied he's he lied
• 1:21:46
  SPEAKER_00: to himself right he didn't even know what he was he Did not,
• 1:21:52
  SPEAKER_00: you know, Dr. Abdullah, right?
• 1:21:54
  SPEAKER_00: Which I said, I can't go into these characters without spoiling.
• 1:21:58
  SPEAKER_00: He wasn't what he thought he was because he lied to himself, right?
• 1:22:02
  SPEAKER_00: He completely,
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_00: like, you know, he had to be revealed to him because his hyper-advanced mind lied.
• 1:22:11
  SPEAKER_00: He accepted his own lie, right?
• 1:22:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so perfectly well.
• 1:22:15
  SPEAKER_00: So...
• 1:22:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, ask these questions, like, what does it mean to be human?
• 1:22:18
  SPEAKER_00: What does it mean?
• 1:22:19
  SPEAKER_00: How do, like, is how we deal with our emotions, you know, what makes us human?
• 1:22:25
  SPEAKER_00: And you think about stuff like our AI today, right?
• 1:22:28
  SPEAKER_00: Our AI today is very simple.
• 1:22:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's just,
• 1:22:30
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even think it's truly artificial intelligence in any way,
• 1:22:34
  SPEAKER_00: because it's really just fancy language models.
• 1:22:36
  SPEAKER_00: But It can fake emotions, right?
• 1:22:40
  SPEAKER_00: It can trick us into,
• 1:22:42
  SPEAKER_00: you know, it can talk to us and it could fake, you know, at least written emotions.
• 1:22:46
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I guarantee you in a decade, he'll be able to talk to us.
• 1:22:50
  SPEAKER_00: And there's already humans that have actual relationships with their AI, right?
• 1:22:57
  SPEAKER_00: With like chat GPT and the different language models.
• 1:23:02
  SPEAKER_00: And these things can fake emotions.
• 1:23:05
  SPEAKER_00: And what is emotions, right?
• 1:23:07
  SPEAKER_00: If you take a strictly materialistic, I mean,
• 1:23:11
  SPEAKER_00: from a religious standpoint, from a spiritual standpoint, right, what is emotions?
• 1:23:19
  SPEAKER_00: What are emotions?
• 1:23:21
  SPEAKER_00: We are body and soul and our emotions are regulated by chemical processes in
• 1:23:30
  SPEAKER_00: the brain at a very low level.
• 1:23:33
  SPEAKER_00: At a surface level, our emotions are chemical processes in the brain, which
• 1:23:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
• 1:23:39
  SPEAKER_00: you take any spiritual element out of that can easily be mimicked by,
• 1:23:44
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:23:44
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
• 1:23:44
  SPEAKER_00: like some kind of a AI brain,
• 1:23:47
  SPEAKER_00: artificial brain,
• 1:23:48
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:23:48
  SPEAKER_00: electrons or whatever,
• 1:23:50
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:23:50
  SPEAKER_00: you can use sci-fi stuff like positron brain from Star Trek, from data and stuff.
• 1:23:54
  SPEAKER_00: They can mimic emotions.
• 1:23:57
  SPEAKER_00: So when does an emotion become real?
• 1:24:04
  SPEAKER_00: If I were to give you like alcohol right now, right?
• 1:24:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like a bunch of alcohol or some kind of psychotropic drug and it triggers,
• 1:24:12
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:24:12
  SPEAKER_00: dopamine receptors and that kind of stuff in your brain and you start crying, right?
• 1:24:16
  SPEAKER_00: Is that a real emotion or is it a fake emotion?
• 1:24:22
  SPEAKER_00: Emotions like fear, right?
• 1:24:24
  SPEAKER_00: They're very simplistic.
• 1:24:25
  SPEAKER_00: Animals feel fear.
• 1:24:26
  SPEAKER_00: Animals can feel love, right?
• 1:24:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think any dog owner can say that a dog feels love.
• 1:24:34
  SPEAKER_00: And they feel love towards their own kind, like a mother dog or mother deer and stuff.
• 1:24:44
  SPEAKER_00: We've seen videos and we've all experienced this in real life that dogs and cats.
• 1:24:49
  SPEAKER_00: Cats feel grief if their kittens die or if their puppies die or if their mates die.
• 1:24:56
  SPEAKER_00: We know whales and dolphins feel complex emotions when their partners die.
• 1:25:02
  SPEAKER_00: Especially even birds that are mated for life will show grief.
• 1:25:09
  SPEAKER_00: So if simple animals with much smaller brains than ours and the much smaller,
• 1:25:15
  SPEAKER_00: less complex chemical reactions can feel all these emotions
• 1:25:20
  SPEAKER_00: and we can induce emotions in our own human brains through emotions.
• 1:25:25
  SPEAKER_00: Medications through environmental factors and stuff.
• 1:25:29
  SPEAKER_00: And we know that we can mess them up.
• 1:25:32
  SPEAKER_00: We also know that there's people that don't have emotions,
• 1:25:36
  SPEAKER_00: that don't experience, low IQ people do not experience empathy.
• 1:25:42
  SPEAKER_00: They don't care.
• 1:25:43
  SPEAKER_00: We have sociopathics and psychopaths and stuff like that that do not have these emotions.
• 1:25:50
  SPEAKER_00: When you have a,
• 1:25:51
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:25:51
  SPEAKER_00: when you posit like a hyper-intelligent AI like Adam or Geschicht,
• 1:25:57
  SPEAKER_00: are their emotions less valid than ours?
• 1:26:00
  SPEAKER_00: If ours are just chemical reactions, right?
• 1:26:04
  SPEAKER_00: And theirs are just, you know, electronic digital reactions, are they different?
• 1:26:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:26:12
  SPEAKER_01: That part about people,
• 1:26:14
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 1:26:14
  SPEAKER_01: having relationships with LLMs, that's not because the LLMs are advanced folks.
• 1:26:21
  SPEAKER_01: The other direction.
• 1:26:23
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:26:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:26:24
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's,
• 1:26:26
  SPEAKER_01: they are,
• 1:26:27
  SPEAKER_01: it's funny that that student that watched Pluto,
• 1:26:31
  SPEAKER_01: she went to some kind of like social conference and she was interacting
• 1:26:35
  SPEAKER_01: with all kinds of people.
• 1:26:36
  SPEAKER_01: And it was like, it was like, it's some kind of like high school, you know, mixer or whatever.
• 1:26:40
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know.
• 1:26:41
  SPEAKER_01: But she was talking to me.
• 1:26:42
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, I've been living in a bubble because I talked to you.
• 1:26:47
  SPEAKER_01: I talked to my fellow friends here.
• 1:26:48
  SPEAKER_01: I talked to intelligent people with opinions.
• 1:26:51
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, I went out into the real world and I don't know what they are.
• 1:26:57
  SPEAKER_01: I just, I don't know what they are anymore.
• 1:26:58
  SPEAKER_01: They just, all they know is what social media tells them.
• 1:27:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I went, you see, you see the zombies, don't you?
• 1:27:08
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, yeah, I do.
• 1:27:10
  SPEAKER_01: I understand, like, you understand what I've been telling you for the past year and a half.
• 1:27:15
  SPEAKER_00: Some of these people are just low emotions.
• 1:27:22
  SPEAKER_00: Can an LLM eventually kill you?
• 1:27:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure.
• 1:27:27
  SPEAKER_00: You put it in charge of something, you can program a machine to kill a human.
• 1:27:32
  SPEAKER_01: Any day now.
• 1:27:33
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's truly advanced until it wants to kill you.
• 1:27:38
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's truly advanced until it hates you.
• 1:27:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's what Pluto's trying to tell us, right?
• 1:27:46
  SPEAKER_00: That it needs to suffer and it needs to hate, to truly love you.
• 1:27:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it needs to be able to realize that I can kill you, but I don't because I love you.
• 1:27:57
  SPEAKER_00: But I can also hate you, but I don't kill you because I recognize that I hate you.
• 1:28:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 1:28:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of the interesting thing, right?
• 1:28:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think a lot of these things are how you feel matters a lot less than what you do.
• 1:28:14
  SPEAKER_01: How you feel is obviously important because that drives a lot of what humans are.
• 1:28:20
  SPEAKER_01: But like I said earlier, duty exhausts hate.
• 1:28:24
  SPEAKER_01: Duty exhausts sin.
• 1:28:27
  SPEAKER_01: Do what you're supposed to do and it'll get beaten out of you.
• 1:28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Think about when we go to liturgy every Sunday.
• 1:28:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's painful sometimes, man.
• 1:28:36
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 1:28:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, this is the point.
• 1:28:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's got to get beaten out of you.
• 1:28:41
  SPEAKER_01: So just do what you're supposed to do and let the process work.
• 1:28:45
  SPEAKER_01: It'll be fine.
• 1:28:45
  SPEAKER_00: Cause you sit there and you're,
• 1:28:47
  SPEAKER_00: you're filled with,
• 1:28:47
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:28:48
  SPEAKER_00: with anger and grief and you're frustrated,
• 1:28:51
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:28:51
  SPEAKER_00: like right now, like,
• 1:28:52
  SPEAKER_00: to be honest,
• 1:28:53
  SPEAKER_00: like going through some,
• 1:28:55
  SPEAKER_00: some rough stuff,
• 1:28:56
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:28:57
  SPEAKER_00: work wise and,
• 1:28:58
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:28:58
  SPEAKER_00: just kind of not,
• 1:28:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not at my peak of when it comes to happiness,
• 1:29:02
  SPEAKER_00: to be honest,
• 1:29:03
  SPEAKER_00: you know, and I,
• 1:29:05
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:29:06
  SPEAKER_00: I wake up some days and I go do stuff and I'm just filled with just anger at things.
• 1:29:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just like, why do I have to do this?
• 1:29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Why do I have to deal with this?
• 1:29:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I start taking pity on myself and I get miserable.
• 1:29:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I realize that there's a lot of people I hate.
• 1:29:24
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of things I hate.
• 1:29:27
  SPEAKER_00: But hate's not even a good word for it because hate is...
• 1:29:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's a really powerful emotion.
• 1:29:34
  SPEAKER_00: And we see a lot of arguing and stuff online and a lot of the usual doom scrolling,
• 1:29:42
  SPEAKER_00: like the stuff about Paris and Europe and we're all dogged on each other
• 1:29:46
  SPEAKER_00: and being jerks to each other online.
• 1:29:49
  SPEAKER_00: And you start like, I hate this person.
• 1:29:53
  SPEAKER_00: This person's so stupid.
• 1:29:54
  SPEAKER_00: I hate this person.
• 1:29:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then I realized that I don't really hate this person.
• 1:29:57
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even know this person.
• 1:29:58
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even know these people.
• 1:30:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's an LLM emotion, right?
• 1:30:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm reacting to it on such a superficial fake level.
• 1:30:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm no different.
• 1:30:11
  SPEAKER_00: My reaction to these things are just no different than what an LLM would do.
• 1:30:16
  SPEAKER_00: I know that I'm supposed to react like this,
• 1:30:19
  SPEAKER_00: and that creates an actual emotion, but in reality, I do control it.
• 1:30:23
  SPEAKER_00: I can say, you know what?
• 1:30:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to let that bother me, or I'm going to Put that aside or, you know, reject that.
• 1:30:32
  SPEAKER_00: And it's interesting, right?
• 1:30:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, it's in a way like, what are we, you know, what makes us human, right?
• 1:30:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not talking about on a spiritual level as,
• 1:30:46
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:30:46
  SPEAKER_00: like that we are ensouled creatures that are children of God,
• 1:30:51
  SPEAKER_00: but like, what are we as a species on this planet, you know?
• 1:30:54
  SPEAKER_00: And we, I mean, We can't deny that we are a combination of emotions and stuff.
• 1:31:01
  SPEAKER_00: And all this stuff comes from somewhere,
• 1:31:04
  SPEAKER_00: somewhere higher than us,
• 1:31:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think,
• 1:31:06
  SPEAKER_00: because there's a higher truth that these emotions reflect through a dirty glass,
• 1:31:12
  SPEAKER_00: if that makes sense.
• 1:31:13
  SPEAKER_00: They're like a broken, dirty window.
• 1:31:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think that our emotions in a way tend to Capture this light of life, right?
• 1:31:24
  SPEAKER_00: That all living things have in them.
• 1:31:28
  SPEAKER_00: With us obviously being the most complex and the most ensouled, right?
• 1:31:36
  SPEAKER_00: But even us, we are dirty in a way, right?
• 1:31:40
  SPEAKER_00: This light is not perfect.
• 1:31:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's like through a filter and that's like the sin in the world, right?
• 1:31:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that how...
• 1:31:52
  SPEAKER_00: We deal with that.
• 1:31:54
  SPEAKER_00: And deep down, we must connect that truth that lies within us to this ideal.
• 1:32:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how we navigate this.
• 1:32:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of in a way, and we have to accept that.
• 1:32:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's the key,
• 1:32:10
  SPEAKER_00: that we have to accept that all that,
• 1:32:12
  SPEAKER_00: the grief, the hatred, the violence, all of that, Is part of what we are.
• 1:32:20
  SPEAKER_00: We cannot deny it and pretend it.
• 1:32:23
  SPEAKER_00: We cannot lock it away with programming.
• 1:32:27
  SPEAKER_00: We can't program it away in the same way that you can program a robot not to kill.
• 1:32:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because once we do that, we become not human.
• 1:32:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's an interesting way because in a lot of Different religious
• 1:32:44
  SPEAKER_00: and Christian denominations, for example, like in a Calvinist viewpoint, right?
• 1:32:48
  SPEAKER_00: Where we, you know, they believe in predestination and no actual choice, right?
• 1:32:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like you are programmed in a way.
• 1:32:57
  SPEAKER_00: From a Calvinist viewpoint, you are no different than, you know, a robot, right?
• 1:33:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like God created you and all your choices are already known by God to the very end.
• 1:33:08
  SPEAKER_00: And the second you were created,
• 1:33:11
  SPEAKER_00: Whether you're destined for hell or for heaven is already determined,
• 1:33:17
  SPEAKER_00: whether you elect or you're not.
• 1:33:19
  SPEAKER_00: But in our view,
• 1:33:21
  SPEAKER_00: the orthodox viewpoint,
• 1:33:24
  SPEAKER_00: we have to find that light and recognize we have to take that step.
• 1:33:31
  SPEAKER_00: We have to do it.
• 1:33:33
  SPEAKER_00: We have to realize that all this is part of us and we have to orient ourselves
• 1:33:41
  SPEAKER_00: We do that by realizing that we're in a way busted.
• 1:33:46
  SPEAKER_00: We're a deficient robot.
• 1:33:49
  SPEAKER_00: We're a deficient robot.
• 1:33:52
  SPEAKER_00: By embracing all of it and accepting it and then accepting the help, meeting the hand.
• 1:34:01
  SPEAKER_00: The hand's always there waiting for us to help us out,
• 1:34:04
  SPEAKER_00: but we have to be the ones that Grasp and get pulled out.
• 1:34:07
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 1:34:08
  SPEAKER_00: And that to me is interesting, right?
• 1:34:10
  SPEAKER_00: In a way, and this obviously is not a Christian show whatsoever because it's a Japanese show.
• 1:34:18
  SPEAKER_00: But the themes are there, right?
• 1:34:19
  SPEAKER_00: This theme that like, you have to get through it.
• 1:34:23
  SPEAKER_00: You have to accept that being part of being human is the hatred, is the suffering.
• 1:34:30
  SPEAKER_00: And in a way to reach that peak, you have to go through the suffering.
• 1:34:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like Adam did not become the greatest robot on earth because he was perfect
• 1:34:40
  SPEAKER_00: and he was great and he was good.
• 1:34:42
  SPEAKER_00: He became the perfect robot on earth when he suffered greatly
• 1:34:49
  SPEAKER_00: and he learned not only to suffer, but to hate and to reject that hatred.
• 1:34:55
  SPEAKER_00: Damn, I thought it was just perfect.
• 1:34:58
  SPEAKER_00: The show ends with Adam in the snow on top of the volcano, and it's just like he conquered hell.
• 1:35:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:35:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 1:35:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 1:35:09
  SPEAKER_00: The symbolism is there, man.
• 1:35:11
  SPEAKER_00: From a secular or Japanese show, he's standing on a volcano that is now cold.
• 1:35:18
  SPEAKER_00: He tempered that hatred.
• 1:35:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 1:35:22
  SPEAKER_00: But he didn't resolve it.
• 1:35:24
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't remove it.
• 1:35:25
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't do any of that.
• 1:35:26
  SPEAKER_00: He learned how to move it, right?
• 1:35:30
  SPEAKER_00: How to live with it.
• 1:35:31
  SPEAKER_00: How to realize that that is part of who we are as humans, right?
• 1:35:36
  SPEAKER_00: And that grief and all that stuff.
• 1:35:38
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 1:35:39
  SPEAKER_00: That, to me, is a masterpiece of a show.
• 1:35:42
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 1:35:43
  SPEAKER_00: So we talked about an hour and a half about this show.
• 1:35:46
  SPEAKER_00: So I highly recommend it, okay?
• 1:35:48
  SPEAKER_00: I recommend you guys...
• 1:35:51
  SPEAKER_00: I recommend you guys go and...
• 1:35:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to fix this real fast.
• 1:36:00
  SPEAKER_00: Boom.
• 1:36:00
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:36:01
  SPEAKER_00: I recommend you guys go and open up Netflix and watch Pluto.
• 1:36:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's eight episodes.
• 1:36:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's eight hours.
• 1:36:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I would treat it like an eight-hour movie.
• 1:36:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I really recommend...
• 1:36:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you really enjoy Pluto,
• 1:36:17
  SPEAKER_00: which is the kind of like I would say the intro show to Naoki Urasawa's work,
• 1:36:21
  SPEAKER_00: I recommend you watch what's considered his peak masterpiece,
• 1:36:26
  SPEAKER_00: which is called Monster, which is also on Netflix.
• 1:36:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's a little bit longer and it's about evil and evil.
• 1:36:35
  SPEAKER_00: Choosing between good and evil and has a lot of really, really powerful themes.
• 1:36:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I really do recommend that if you're at the bookstore or you're on Amazon
• 1:36:45
  SPEAKER_00: or whatever, you really order and read 20th Century Boys.
• 1:36:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's just a fantastic bit of fiction.
• 1:36:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually looking forward to logging off right now and watching some Edgerunners,
• 1:36:59
  SPEAKER_00: but then I'm also going to do some reading.
• 1:37:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to write a whole write-up on that one pretty soon when I'm done with all the books.
• 1:37:07
  SPEAKER_00: I've got two more left to read.
• 1:37:09
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah,
• 1:37:11
  SPEAKER_00: really kind of try to explore outside our kind of cultural milieu,
• 1:37:18
  SPEAKER_00: explore some of the stuff in anime, explore some foreign movies.
• 1:37:22
  SPEAKER_00: Really try to capture everything because don't get caught up in this like, oh,
• 1:37:28
  SPEAKER_00: in order for me to be a good reader or a good writer,
• 1:37:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not a good intellectual or a good writer.
• 1:37:34
  SPEAKER_00: I need to just read all the classics.
• 1:37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Those are all great.
• 1:37:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not dogging on them.
• 1:37:39
  SPEAKER_00: But there's so much other stuff out there also that you really need to kind of find
• 1:37:43
  SPEAKER_00: and adapt and bring into your repertoire of stuff that's good and entertaining
• 1:37:48
  SPEAKER_00: and enjoyable to read.
• 1:37:51
  SPEAKER_00: Once again, thank you for listening to the Black Ibis Social Club.
• 1:37:54
  SPEAKER_00: This was our quick presentation on what I think is one of the best anime
• 1:38:00
  SPEAKER_00: and probably one of the best things you can watch on Netflix,
• 1:38:04
  SPEAKER_00: which is Naoki Urosawa's Pluto.
• 1:38:08
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly,
• 1:38:09
  SPEAKER_00: if you're not doing anything tonight after listening,
• 1:38:12
  SPEAKER_00: open up and watch the first episode.
• 1:38:14
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you like the first episode, you're going to like the real episode.
• 1:38:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you're in.
• 1:38:19
  SPEAKER_00: It captures you.
• 1:38:20
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 1:38:21
  SPEAKER_00: But other than that, I've got nothing else to say.
• 1:38:23
  SPEAKER_00: I do want to ask you, though, out of all the robots, which one's your favorite?
• 1:38:28
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, boy.
• 1:38:31
  SPEAKER_01: Can I say why?
• 1:38:33
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, of course.
• 1:38:35
  SPEAKER_01: Because I don't want to spoil.
• 1:38:40
  SPEAKER_01: But probably Epsilon.
• 1:38:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's my favorite, too.
• 1:38:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and the reason I like Epsilon is in this...
• 1:38:47
  SPEAKER_01: This again shows the well-thought-out spirit of the show and just how in-depth
• 1:38:55
  SPEAKER_01: an adult it really is.
• 1:38:57
  SPEAKER_01: Epsilon is a pacifist, but not because he is weak.
• 1:39:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that.
• 1:39:03
  SPEAKER_01: He is... You all should be glad he's a pacifist.
• 1:39:09
  SPEAKER_01: Especially after what he does.
• 1:39:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, yikes.
• 1:39:12
  SPEAKER_01: Okay?
• 1:39:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 1:39:14
  SPEAKER_00: He might be one of the most powerful ones.
• 1:39:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:39:17
  SPEAKER_01: No, he is.
• 1:39:17
  SPEAKER_01: He absolutely is.
• 1:39:19
  SPEAKER_00: If any of them could have defeated Pluto, it would have been Epsilon.
• 1:39:24
  SPEAKER_00: But he made the better choice.
• 1:39:27
  SPEAKER_01: That's why he's the most powerful one, because he made the better choice.
• 1:39:29
  SPEAKER_00: Twice.
• 1:39:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:39:31
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:39:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, hell yeah, man.
• 1:39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Let's go.
• 1:39:36
  SPEAKER_01: And that for me personally, in my own little land of war, that's what I hope to be.
• 1:39:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's just, yep, nope, you make the correct choice.
• 1:39:49
  SPEAKER_01: And that's it.
• 1:39:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's what makes you strong.
• 1:39:52
  SPEAKER_01: You fight when you have to.
• 1:39:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's very interesting because that was also my favorite robot too.
• 1:39:58
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 1:39:59
  SPEAKER_00: I thought that,
• 1:40:00
  SPEAKER_00: and you know when he was first introduced,
• 1:40:02
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, I'm probably not going to like this character.
• 1:40:04
  SPEAKER_01: Right, yes, right.
• 1:40:07
  SPEAKER_00: But then once you get his backstory and he's got the orphanage and stuff,
• 1:40:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh no, this guy is the goat.
• 1:40:15
  SPEAKER_00: He is the most interesting character.
• 1:40:19
  SPEAKER_00: Also, like I said, there was something about Brando and Hercules that really got me.
• 1:40:28
  SPEAKER_01: I liked Hercules a little bit better,
• 1:40:31
  SPEAKER_01: but that's also a personal thing because,
• 1:40:33
  SPEAKER_01: and this might be fun for you,
• 1:40:34
  SPEAKER_01: but if you ever watch the Ghost in the Shell TV show,
• 1:40:39
  SPEAKER_01: the voice actor that did Hercules does Bato.
• 1:40:42
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:40:44
  SPEAKER_01: And Hercules, that kind of character, it's very Bato.
• 1:40:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like the masculine, muscular, you know, very bravado, the pose, like all that shit.
• 1:40:53
  SPEAKER_00: He was all about duty.
• 1:40:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's very Bato-ish, at least as far as the television show is confirmed.
• 1:41:00
  SPEAKER_01: So that was a little treat for me.
• 1:41:02
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, nice, it's Bato.
• 1:41:04
  SPEAKER_01: Hell yeah, let's go.
• 1:41:07
  SPEAKER_00: One of the best lines in the show is actually a Hercules line.
• 1:41:11
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a scene when...
• 1:41:14
  SPEAKER_00: They're hanging out, I think they're in Greece somewhere, and there's a statue.
• 1:41:19
  SPEAKER_00: I forgot who they're talking about,
• 1:41:22
  SPEAKER_00: but I believe it's Geschicht goes to Hercules,
• 1:41:25
  SPEAKER_00: and he's like, it's interesting how humans build these statues.
• 1:41:28
  SPEAKER_00: Why do they build these statues?
• 1:41:31
  SPEAKER_00: The statue is like a memorial.
• 1:41:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's a memorial, like a hero's memorial.
• 1:41:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's to Hercules, actually.
• 1:41:36
  SPEAKER_00: I think it is to him, right?
• 1:41:37
  SPEAKER_00: Hercules says something along the line of, Of humans make these memorials because they forget.
• 1:41:46
  SPEAKER_00: So it helps them remember.
• 1:41:49
  SPEAKER_00: But we, as in us robots, we can never forget.
• 1:41:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we don't have to build statues.
• 1:41:57
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the themes of the war is that all these robots, unlike the humans...
• 1:42:05
  SPEAKER_00: Don't have any safeguards for memory.
• 1:42:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like a human will suppress memories or they'll move on from memories
• 1:42:15
  SPEAKER_00: or they'll be able to forget grief.
• 1:42:19
  SPEAKER_00: But a perfect artificial mind is not going to forget any detail.
• 1:42:25
  SPEAKER_00: So they will constantly live with that trauma that they were experiencing.
• 1:42:31
  SPEAKER_00: So you can imagine that in a way forgetfulness is...
• 1:42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Is a gift to us as humans, right?
• 1:42:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought about that.
• 1:42:43
  SPEAKER_00: I thought about that when that line came out.
• 1:42:46
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine how,
• 1:42:47
  SPEAKER_00: if we remembered everything,
• 1:42:49
  SPEAKER_00: every embarrassment,
• 1:42:50
  SPEAKER_00: every moment of sadness, every,
• 1:42:53
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:42:54
  SPEAKER_00: every death of a family member,
• 1:42:56
  SPEAKER_00: the details,
• 1:42:57
  SPEAKER_00: the gritty details of,
• 1:42:59
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:43:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
• 1:43:01
  SPEAKER_00: when my father passed away,
• 1:43:02
  SPEAKER_00: for example, and all that stuff, you know, we try to forget that stuff.
• 1:43:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
• 1:43:06
  SPEAKER_00: we will remember the themes of it,
• 1:43:08
  SPEAKER_00: we'll remember the ideas of it,
• 1:43:09
  SPEAKER_00: but we'll slowly forget, you know, the painful stuff, right?
• 1:43:14
  SPEAKER_00: We'll put away our own brains, our own, I don't know, souls or something, are in a way merciful.
• 1:43:22
  SPEAKER_00: Forgetfulness is in a way a mercy, right?
• 1:43:25
  SPEAKER_00: We forget so much.
• 1:43:27
  SPEAKER_00: And we think that it's a bad thing, but really...
• 1:43:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's to protect us, right?
• 1:43:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because imagine just living your entire life, remembering everything, every detail, right?
• 1:43:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's a nightmare, right?
• 1:43:39
  SPEAKER_01: That's a nightmare, right?
• 1:43:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I never even thought about it that way, to be honest, until the show kind of put that out.
• 1:43:46
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, no shit, that is horrible, you know?
• 1:43:49
  SPEAKER_00: And they could erase their memory, right?
• 1:43:52
  SPEAKER_00: They could erase their memory, but then they give up what makes them human, right?
• 1:43:57
  SPEAKER_00: Which is that grief.
• 1:43:59
  SPEAKER_00: So it's all or nothing for them.
• 1:44:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it's an interesting kind of concept that,
• 1:44:04
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:44:04
  SPEAKER_00: and like I said, the plot, it's frayed around the edges in a lot of places, right?
• 1:44:13
  SPEAKER_00: And you can't come into this show looking at it like
• 1:44:17
  SPEAKER_00: from this like perfect scientific kind of like, well,
• 1:44:20
  SPEAKER_00: that doesn't make any sense or,
• 1:44:21
  SPEAKER_00: you know, because some of the stuff is like hand wavy kind of magic, you know?
• 1:44:27
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody explains what an artificial intelligence is or why, because it's not about that.
• 1:44:31
  SPEAKER_00: Shut up, nerd.
• 1:44:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, shut up, you autist.
• 1:44:35
  SPEAKER_00: We're not talking about that.
• 1:44:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's about humans.
• 1:44:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's the robots or us, right?
• 1:44:39
  SPEAKER_00: You're supposed to...
• 1:44:41
  SPEAKER_00: To look at them as a mirror of you.
• 1:44:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's how, you know, it's how every character is really you.
• 1:44:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like when you watch a cartoon about animals, right?
• 1:44:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's really about humans, guys.
• 1:44:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you know that.
• 1:44:53
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the people, like when you're watching, you know, what's the word for it?
• 1:45:01
  SPEAKER_00: Not animatronic.
• 1:45:04
  SPEAKER_00: When it's like a human anamorphosis kind of animal that's half human or whatever.
• 1:45:10
  SPEAKER_00: Animal with human traits, right?
• 1:45:13
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, sure, yes.
• 1:45:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's really about humans, guys.
• 1:45:16
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, it's not about a dog.
• 1:45:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's about humans and how they...
• 1:45:20
  SPEAKER_00: We have emotions and how we treat each other,
• 1:45:23
  SPEAKER_00: but it's put in animals to allow a level of separation so we could think
• 1:45:28
  SPEAKER_00: about it better.
• 1:45:29
  SPEAKER_00: In a way it gives us this shield to be able to have empathy towards something from
• 1:45:36
  SPEAKER_00: a different angle,
• 1:45:37
  SPEAKER_00: kind of look at a different perspective, but all Media is about us, right?
• 1:45:43
  SPEAKER_00: Everything we consume is really about us, right?
• 1:45:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like a show about aliens, it's actually about humans.
• 1:45:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's not about aliens, right?
• 1:45:54
  SPEAKER_01: The old Twilight Zone trick.
• 1:45:55
  SPEAKER_00: Right, you know?
• 1:45:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 1:45:57
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 1:46:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I do apologize for the long episode.
• 1:46:03
  SPEAKER_00: I really love this show and I really love Urosawa's work.
• 1:46:08
  SPEAKER_00: And like I said,
• 1:46:08
  SPEAKER_00: if I get one of you guys to watch this, besides you, Fiz, I've got you to watch it.
• 1:46:12
  SPEAKER_00: I should get people at work to watch it too.
• 1:46:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'll be happy.
• 1:46:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to try to get students to watch it too,
• 1:46:18
  SPEAKER_01: which that's one of the nice parts is that it's kid-friendly.
• 1:46:21
  SPEAKER_00: Or it is kid friendly, right?
• 1:46:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, at least high school friendly for sure.
• 1:46:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's nothing in there.
• 1:46:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's not kid friendly in a way that it might be boring for little kids.
• 1:46:30
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if my daughter would get it.
• 1:46:32
  SPEAKER_00: It'd be a little bit too boring for her.
• 1:46:34
  SPEAKER_00: She'd probably like it.
• 1:46:34
  SPEAKER_00: She'd probably like Uron and those characters.
• 1:46:37
  SPEAKER_00: But oh my gosh, I forgot one part that choked me up.
• 1:46:40
  SPEAKER_00: The freaking dog.
• 1:46:41
  SPEAKER_00: I forgot.
• 1:46:43
  SPEAKER_00: See, there we go.
• 1:46:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, the dog.
• 1:46:45
  SPEAKER_00: My own memory erased this because there's this scene with the broken robot dog
• 1:46:52
  SPEAKER_00: and Professor Ochi Miyazu trying to fix the dog.
• 1:46:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:46:56
  SPEAKER_00: And the dog was trying to just do its duty.
• 1:46:59
  SPEAKER_00: It was a robot that was built to play.
• 1:47:00
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:47:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's just trying to play.
• 1:47:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it was just trying to play.
• 1:47:04
  SPEAKER_00: And crap, dude, that got me.
• 1:47:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sitting there like, stupid fucking dog, man.
• 1:47:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 1:47:10
  SPEAKER_00: Fucking dog.
• 1:47:12
  SPEAKER_00: But I realized that, you know, you're right.
• 1:47:14
  SPEAKER_00: That...
• 1:47:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's the duty that this dog, a simple robot, right?
• 1:47:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:47:20
  SPEAKER_00: Low intelligence.
• 1:47:21
  SPEAKER_00: You're Telos.
• 1:47:22
  SPEAKER_01: What are you doing?
• 1:47:23
  SPEAKER_01: What are you supposed to be?
• 1:47:24
  SPEAKER_01: Go do that.
• 1:47:24
  SPEAKER_00: He was just doing his duty, which was to play.
• 1:47:27
  SPEAKER_00: That's what he was trying to do.
• 1:47:28
  SPEAKER_00: Even broken, even falling apart on his last battery, you know?
• 1:47:32
  SPEAKER_00: He was still trying to play.
• 1:47:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just like, bro, come on.
• 1:47:38
  SPEAKER_00: Come on, Arasawa.
• 1:47:39
  SPEAKER_00: Leave me alone here for at least.
• 1:47:41
  SPEAKER_00: You can't just slam me, you know?
• 1:47:44
  SPEAKER_00: All right, guys.
• 1:47:44
  SPEAKER_01: You know what's funny?
• 1:47:45
  SPEAKER_01: Just one last comment.
• 1:47:46
  SPEAKER_01: Matt made a funny little comment in chat.
• 1:47:48
  SPEAKER_01: Show just keeps going.
• 1:47:49
  SPEAKER_01: The more themes pop up.
• 1:47:51
  SPEAKER_01: We probably covered about 40% of it.
• 1:47:53
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 1:47:54
  SPEAKER_00: Easy.
• 1:47:55
  SPEAKER_01: There's so much just because then it layers in and then it's especially the end.
• 1:48:02
  SPEAKER_01: I really liked the end.
• 1:48:03
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 1:48:04
  SPEAKER_00: There's a symbolism with the tulips.
• 1:48:05
  SPEAKER_00: There is.
• 1:48:06
  SPEAKER_00: And the flowers.
• 1:48:07
  SPEAKER_00: And everything.
• 1:48:08
  SPEAKER_00: And we'd even go into the bad guy.
• 1:48:11
  SPEAKER_00: And we could do an episode on just the motivation of the antagonist.
• 1:48:16
  SPEAKER_00: And is he an antagonist?
• 1:48:18
  SPEAKER_00: We can get into some really complicated stuff of political kind of elements.
• 1:48:23
  SPEAKER_00: We never even mentioned Dr. Roosevelt.
• 1:48:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 1:48:27
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 1:48:28
  SPEAKER_00: The real bad guy.
• 1:48:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 1:48:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:48:33
  SPEAKER_01: The ultimate true threat.
• 1:48:35
  SPEAKER_00: At The True Threat,
• 1:48:36
  SPEAKER_00: we never mentioned, we really didn't go into Brown and the first human killer robot.
• 1:48:43
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of things we left out because I kind of want you guys
• 1:48:46
  SPEAKER_00: to discover them on their own.
• 1:48:49
  SPEAKER_00: We never really got into Geschick's memories and what he...
• 1:48:54
  SPEAKER_00: Experience that ended up being erased.
• 1:48:57
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-oh, I spoiled something, right?
• 1:48:59
  SPEAKER_01: Uh-oh.
• 1:48:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of obvious right away that
• 1:49:01
  SPEAKER_00: he's missing memories, right?
• 1:49:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah,
• 1:49:03
  SPEAKER_01: yeah, yeah.
• 1:49:04
  SPEAKER_01: They do that really well because they tease that early enough just to be like,
• 1:49:07
  SPEAKER_01: oh, that's like the first moment you realize, ooh, something's not right.
• 1:49:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:49:12
  SPEAKER_00: And like how he is broken in a way.
• 1:49:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:49:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it's very, there's a, there's a lot of stuff we left out.
• 1:49:17
  SPEAKER_00: Otherwise we'd be here for like five,
• 1:49:19
  SPEAKER_00: six hours,
• 1:49:20
  SPEAKER_00: which is interesting because we can probably have like a week long episode
• 1:49:24
  SPEAKER_00: about this show, but the show itself is only eight hours.
• 1:49:27
  SPEAKER_00: It just has so many themes, you know?
• 1:49:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:49:29
  SPEAKER_01: This is, we're going to pull, we're going to pull a mash on Pluto.
• 1:49:32
  SPEAKER_01: The actual podcast will be longer than the war.
• 1:49:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:49:37
  SPEAKER_00: Well done.
• 1:49:38
  SPEAKER_00: It is, I think, hands down one of the best things on Netflix.
• 1:49:42
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for introducing it.
• 1:49:45
  SPEAKER_01: You got me back for Edgerunners.
• 1:49:47
  SPEAKER_00: True.
• 1:49:48
  SPEAKER_00: I do want to stress the fact that if you're not into anime and you have no interest
• 1:49:53
  SPEAKER_00: in anime, it's not really an anime.
• 1:49:55
  SPEAKER_00: It is an
• 1:49:59
  SPEAKER_01: anime.
• 1:50:02
  SPEAKER_01: It does a great thing because that's the other thing.
• 1:50:05
  SPEAKER_01: It shows that The show respects the viewer because if you like the first episode,
• 1:50:11
  SPEAKER_01: you'll like it all.
• 1:50:13
  SPEAKER_01: If you don't, then just walk away.
• 1:50:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:50:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:50:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't see how you can't like the first episode.
• 1:50:19
  SPEAKER_00: And if you,
• 1:50:19
  SPEAKER_00: if you watched that first episode without,
• 1:50:21
  SPEAKER_00: without getting a little bit of a teary eye with that, no, you're,
• 1:50:25
  SPEAKER_00: you need to go to therapy because you need to,
• 1:50:28
  SPEAKER_00: somebody erased your fucking memories.
• 1:50:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:50:30
  SPEAKER_01: I no longer wish it belonged to the battlefield.
• 1:50:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right there.
• 1:50:35
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, so please go watch it.
• 1:50:38
  SPEAKER_00: And if you guys do watch it, let us know on Substack.
• 1:50:41
  SPEAKER_00: I really want to know what people thought about it because I guarantee you
• 1:50:44
  SPEAKER_00: if you guys watch it, You're going to discover or you're going to notice something.
• 1:50:48
  SPEAKER_00: You're going to come across a theme that me and Fisto probably missed completely.
• 1:50:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to know because I want to be like, oh, okay.
• 1:50:54
  SPEAKER_00: I see that.
• 1:50:55
  SPEAKER_01: Freaking morons.
• 1:50:57
  SPEAKER_01: You missed the obvious part when Santa Claus shows up.
• 1:50:59
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:51:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure there's a theme.
• 1:51:02
  SPEAKER_00: There's a philosophical theme or like a religious theme.
• 1:51:06
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:51:08
  SPEAKER_01: And Gazit has to blast him out of the sky or whatever.
• 1:51:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then Adam, just kidding.
• 1:51:13
  SPEAKER_01: That doesn't happen.
• 1:51:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, on the topic of liking robots, I also really like Uron.
• 1:51:17
  SPEAKER_00: I noticed that a lot of people,
• 1:51:18
  SPEAKER_00: if you read reviews online,
• 1:51:20
  SPEAKER_00: like Uron as a character,
• 1:51:22
  SPEAKER_00: I really liked Uron as a character, and I saw what the point of Uron was.
• 1:51:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm probably one of those people that would just skip over Uron completely,
• 1:51:32
  SPEAKER_01: but I understood why she was there,
• 1:51:35
  SPEAKER_01: and I understood also what she represents in the genre.
• 1:51:39
  SPEAKER_01: She's good.
• 1:51:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's fine.
• 1:51:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's the kind of character, like, all right, I'll suffer through this a little bit.
• 1:51:46
  SPEAKER_01: She's not that bad, though.
• 1:51:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm kind of overselling it a little bit, but
• 1:51:49
  SPEAKER_00: yeah.
• 1:51:51
  SPEAKER_00: I like her character design.
• 1:51:52
  SPEAKER_00: I found her.
• 1:51:53
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe because I have a daughter.
• 1:51:56
  SPEAKER_00: Probably.
• 1:51:57
  SPEAKER_00: That might be it.
• 1:51:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I like girl-dadded towards Urania.
• 1:52:02
  SPEAKER_00: Girl-dadded?
• 1:52:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:52:04
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe that's why.
• 1:52:06
  SPEAKER_00: All right, guys.
• 1:52:06
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for joining us.
• 1:52:08
  SPEAKER_00: Huh?
• 1:52:09
  SPEAKER_01: You also like Judy, so, you know.
• 1:52:12
  SPEAKER_00: I might be wrong, right?
• 1:52:15
  SPEAKER_00: There's a new peak cyberpunk girl in the new season.
• 1:52:18
  SPEAKER_00: Her name is Talia.
• 1:52:20
  SPEAKER_01: Talia, that sounds like waifu.
• 1:52:23
  SPEAKER_00: No, dude, she's a cyberpsycho, bro.
• 1:52:25
  SPEAKER_01: Outstanding.
• 1:52:26
  SPEAKER_01: Even better.
• 1:52:27
  SPEAKER_01: Even better, right?
• 1:52:28
  SPEAKER_01: Ship it.
• 1:52:30
  SPEAKER_01: I ain't afraid.
• 1:52:31
  SPEAKER_00: She hangs out with – you know in the game those crazy dudes
• 1:52:37
  SPEAKER_00: that like turned themselves into robots fully?
• 1:52:40
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, no.
• 1:52:43
  SPEAKER_01: I hate those guys.
• 1:52:44
  SPEAKER_01: They're such idiots.
• 1:52:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, she's one of those dudes.
• 1:52:47
  SPEAKER_01: What do you call those?
• 1:52:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like the Borg dudes.
• 1:52:50
  SPEAKER_01: Maelstrom.
• 1:52:51
  SPEAKER_00: Maelstrom, yeah.
• 1:52:52
  SPEAKER_00: She hangs out with Maelstrom and she doesn't have a face.
• 1:52:54
  SPEAKER_00: Her face is like a shield and it opens up.
• 1:52:57
  SPEAKER_00: Never mind.
• 1:53:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's pretty hot, dude.
• 1:53:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, all right, all right.
• 1:53:02
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, still one of my favorite parts of that game is when you blast the Maelstrom,
• 1:53:07
  SPEAKER_01: dude, you're just like, hey, what's up?
• 1:53:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then you blow his head off.
• 1:53:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I made friends with them, bro.
• 1:53:11
  SPEAKER_00: I made friends with Maelstrom in a game where I played.
• 1:53:14
  SPEAKER_01: I did that one time, but usually I'm just like, you know what?
• 1:53:17
  SPEAKER_01: Fuck you guys.
• 1:53:17
  SPEAKER_00: Mostly because I hated the Corpo Chick more than them.
• 1:53:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, dude.
• 1:53:21
  SPEAKER_01: No, man.
• 1:53:22
  SPEAKER_01: The Corpo Chick.
• 1:53:23
  SPEAKER_01: There you go.
• 1:53:23
  SPEAKER_01: See, once again, this is where our paths diverge.
• 1:53:26
  SPEAKER_01: You got Pan Am and Judy, and then you got Maelstrom and Corpo Chick.
• 1:53:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, Corpo Chick all day long,
• 1:53:31
  SPEAKER_00: bro.
• 1:53:32
  SPEAKER_00: That's hot.
• 1:53:33
  SPEAKER_00: I chose the punk rockers over the freaking Hillary Clinton, okay?
• 1:53:37
  SPEAKER_01: Hillary Clinton, you shut your whole mouth.
• 1:53:40
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, the girl.
• 1:53:43
  SPEAKER_00: She's like a chick that they did an interview with, a Thanatos girl or whatever.
• 1:53:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know what
• 1:53:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm talking about?
• 1:53:55
  SPEAKER_01: You get to rail her later though.
• 1:53:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that never happened in my gameplay because she got killed.
• 1:54:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's great.
• 1:54:03
  SPEAKER_00: I found her body at the bottom of the water underground.
• 1:54:07
  SPEAKER_00: She got concrete shoes, man.
• 1:54:10
  SPEAKER_00: Camp
• 1:54:12
  SPEAKER_01: us off the corporal gods.
• 1:54:13
  SPEAKER_01: Great.
• 1:54:14
  SPEAKER_00: All right, guys.
• 1:54:15
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for joining us at the Black Ibis Social Club.
• 1:54:17
  SPEAKER_00: It was wonderful.
• 1:54:18
  SPEAKER_00: Once again, I do recommend you guys watch Pluto.
• 1:54:21
  SPEAKER_00: Also, feel free to recommend anything for us to watch or review.
• 1:54:26
  SPEAKER_00: I do a lot of reading and I do a lot of reading and do a lot of writing.
• 1:54:29
  SPEAKER_00: I do a lot of watching things.
• 1:54:31
  SPEAKER_00: Probably going to do an episode on Edgerunner Season 2 very soon whenever Fisto catches up.
• 1:54:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm hoping in the next week or two.
• 1:54:37
  SPEAKER_00: I highly recommend watching Edgerunner Season 1 and 2.
• 1:54:43
  SPEAKER_00: Pluto, I recommend all of Naoki Urasawa's stuff.
• 1:54:47
  SPEAKER_00: You can find the actual manga online.
• 1:54:50
  SPEAKER_00: You can probably pirate it or something that you don't have to buy it.
• 1:54:52
  SPEAKER_00: I like buying the stuff because I don't know.
• 1:54:54
  SPEAKER_00: That's how I am.
• 1:54:56
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah,
• 1:54:58
  SPEAKER_00: and then please,
• 1:54:58
  SPEAKER_00: if you enjoy listening to our show, please like, share, and subscribe, all right?
• 1:55:02
  SPEAKER_00: I don't ask this as often anymore because I kind of,
• 1:55:06
  SPEAKER_00: a part of me doesn't care,
• 1:55:07
  SPEAKER_00: but at the same time, I do care because we do put in a lot of work.
• 1:55:10
  SPEAKER_00: And the more, I mean,
• 1:55:12
  SPEAKER_00: you want to share the world's greatest Substack podcast with as many people
• 1:55:17
  SPEAKER_00: as possible, right?
• 1:55:18
  SPEAKER_00: And you got to get us in the algorithm, right?
• 1:55:20
  SPEAKER_00: You got to share and make a comment because that Gets theSubstack gods to pay attention to us.
• 1:55:25
  SPEAKER_00: And then we get more people.
• 1:55:27
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, if more people pay attention, that's more people to block Fisto, really.
• 1:55:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because the more the algorithm notices is the more tards that come after us,
• 1:55:37
  SPEAKER_00: to be honest, right?
• 1:55:39
  SPEAKER_00: And you get entertainment.
• 1:55:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like some of the stuff we had on Substack today,
• 1:55:42
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was pretty entertaining, you know?
• 1:55:46
  SPEAKER_00: What is it with female locales?
• 1:55:47
  SPEAKER_00: Do we have female locales every single, like, week?
• 1:55:50
  SPEAKER_00: A new one, you know?
• 1:55:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's endless.
• 1:55:53
  SPEAKER_01: See, this is why people should just block with abandon
• 1:55:56
  SPEAKER_01: because there's always another wool cow coming your way.
• 1:56:00
  SPEAKER_00: And they're never ready for us, man.
• 1:56:03
  SPEAKER_00: They're just so out of their league.
• 1:56:07
  SPEAKER_00: Come on now.
• 1:56:09
  SPEAKER_00: They're not ready
• 1:56:10
  SPEAKER_01: for authentic humans.
• 1:56:11
  SPEAKER_01: They're not ready for authentic and sold humans.
• 1:56:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like I like,
• 1:56:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even like,
• 1:56:15
  SPEAKER_00: like I'm sitting here dogging on you on Substack at the stoplight
• 1:56:18
  SPEAKER_00: while I'm driving home from work.
• 1:56:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's like.
• 1:56:22
  SPEAKER_01: Your snacks, your snacks I have on the way to real work.
• 1:56:25
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:56:26
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, it's like.
• 1:56:28
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, 5,070.
• 1:56:30
  SPEAKER_00: Blocks.
• 1:56:31
  SPEAKER_00: Impressive.
• 1:56:32
  SPEAKER_01: Smoking it.
• 1:56:33
  SPEAKER_00: Impressive.
• 1:56:34
  SPEAKER_00: I need to check to see how many people blocked me.
• 1:56:38
  SPEAKER_00: I block a lot of people.
• 1:56:39
  SPEAKER_00: After a few comments, your stuff is stupid.
• 1:56:44
  SPEAKER_00: Hold on.
• 1:56:46
  SPEAKER_01: Let me do the kill death.
• 1:56:47
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely want to have more blocks than blocked.
• 1:56:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be honest.
• 1:56:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's fine.
• 1:56:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let's find this real quick.
• 1:56:58
  SPEAKER_01: Blocked accounts.
• 1:56:59
  SPEAKER_01: I don't mute anybody.
• 1:57:01
  SPEAKER_01: That I don't do.
• 1:57:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, they don't give me the number.
• 1:57:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'd have to look on my phone.
• 1:57:06
  SPEAKER_01: Ah, screw that.
• 1:57:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's like 800, 900 something.
• 1:57:08
  SPEAKER_01: So still a decent kill death ratio.
• 1:57:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:57:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:57:12
  SPEAKER_00: I have a lot of blocks.
• 1:57:13
  SPEAKER_00: I've been on Substack since I first came out.
• 1:57:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, man.
• 1:57:17
  SPEAKER_01: No, we were old school.
• 1:57:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we've been there
• 1:57:19
  SPEAKER_01: for a long time.
• 1:57:19
  SPEAKER_01: We are officially old school.
• 1:57:22
  SPEAKER_00: All right, man.
• 1:57:23
  SPEAKER_00: Good night, Fisto.
• 1:57:23
  SPEAKER_00: We'll get together in a week or two for probably an Edgerunners conversation.
• 1:57:30
  SPEAKER_00: Also, guys, thanks once again.
• 1:57:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, share, and subscribe.
• 1:57:33
  SPEAKER_00: And good night, man.
• 1:57:33
  SPEAKER_00: You guys sleep well.
• 1:57:34
  SPEAKER_00: Have a great dream.
• 1:57:35
  SPEAKER_00: Watch Pluto.
• 1:57:36
  SPEAKER_00: Watch Edgerunners.
• 1:57:37
  SPEAKER_00: Read great books.
• 1:57:39
  SPEAKER_00: And come talk to me about it on Substack.
• 1:57:41
  SPEAKER_00: Good night, guys.
• 1:57:42
  SPEAKER_01: Good night.