Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Principles of Overlanding: Travel Safety Jonathon Jensen

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Principles of Overlanding: Travel Safety Jonathon Jensen · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm your host,
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and I'm joined today by my good friend JJ.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Now JJ works for the State Department, which is why
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: we only refer to him by his nickname. But we
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: have a great opportunity to go into the principles of
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: overlanding security. Now, there are some things that we need
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: to keep in mind while we travel. The reality is
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: that the world is an incredibly safe and hospitable place,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: but there are things that we can do to minimize
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: our risk, including how we park our vehicle, how we
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: set up our accommodations, a mindset around paying attention to
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: the things that are going around in the area around us.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: So in our conversation we cover a broad range of
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: subjects around security, and JJ brings a lot of his
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: experience in working at embassies around the world and sharing
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: stories of other travelers and challenges that they've had and
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: ways that those issues may have been mitigated. JJ, thanks
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: again for being on the podcast. Round number two.
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: I like that I feel special.
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: You are and we've had some nice adventures since the
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: last time that you were on the podcast. So we
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: did a trip in Kenya where we went out to
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: the coast who went to Diani and we got out
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: towards the port city and there in Kenya, went along
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: the border of across the border through a Arusha which
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: was awesome and not a RuSHA that Ambaseli that's right,
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: National Park. And then what was the other one that
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: we met, Savo that was incredible.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Man Eaters Asavo. That's that book, right, the Little Mine's
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: Eating People.
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: Incredible. It was beautiful that one moment that we had
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: with some of those folks Kenya where we were out
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: there with a couple of grenadiers and the sun was
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: getting low and there was those giraffe just hanging out.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Magical, like a magical evening, it really was. And
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: then the night time camping on a dry lake bed.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: That was so cool, in a nice barbecue. Yeah, yeah,
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: that was incredible. We just slept out there on the plaia.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah absolutely, they knew where we were, that's right. And
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: then the the other adventure up in a place that
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: looked like it was the moon almost.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah. That was really neat to be on that other
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: side of Lake Turkana. The last time that I was there,
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: I was on the west side of Turkana that was
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: pretty rough and tumble, and then when we went as
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: a little team grenadiers, then we had abed with us
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: and then we go up the east side of Lake
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: Turkana and that kind of ties into this whole security thing.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: But we were really paying attention because we needed to.
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: And there was even some reports of banditry, which is
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: still an issue in that region, and it's oftentimes for
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: reasons that people don't expect. So it seems as if
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: banditry can happen when there's a drought, for example, and
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: people are trying to provide for their families. A lot
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: of times it's conflict between tribes, between areas. Maybe think
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: of the Western US in the late eighteen hundreds, there
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: was cattle rustlers and there were bandits and people were
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: stealing cattle, and it's the same thing that's happening there.
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the cattle or the livestock is worth a lot
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: of money and also being able to provide for the livestock.
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: So if it's land and water usage as well in
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: some of these areas where they can get some water
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: and eat, and that's going to guarantee a better sale
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: at market down the road. You're going to take the risk.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: And that's a lot of source of conflict as well,
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: and there's a lot of dynamics that we're just not
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: totally aware of all the time.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it seems like it can just very depending
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: on the time of year. Yeah, so some of these places,
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: and that's why it's so good to do that little
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: bit of research and to reach out for those of
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: our listeners that are Americans, to reach out through the
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: embassies and let them know what you're doing and see
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: if there's any information on the website. Like we talked
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: about in the last podcast, making sure you get enrolled
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: in the various programs that are available.
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the STEP program is key, and even since I
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: had left Kenya, there were a number of protests that
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: we're breaking out. If you're enrolled through that program, you're
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: going to get the notifications. You're going to know about
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: the areas that the US Embassy is advising our people
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: to avoid or be mindful of, and so you'll get
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: that same information. And so it's key that you're just
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: in tune with that. I wouldn't just travel with just
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: on a whim, not doing research, and I'd say too,
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: we took a lot of calculated risk, checking with each
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: other and making sure that we both were good with
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: the movements. And sometimes you have to make a decision
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: do we drive when it's a little bit darker or not,
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: do we drive a little slower or do we take
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: this route, And it's felt really good about us as
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: a team working together.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: Then we didn't have to drive at night, which was good.
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: Maybe you guys got a little bit of darkness when
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: you were heading back into Nairobi, but by then you're
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: pretty much within the safety and security of a larger city.
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: But yeah, we made sure that we were keeping an
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: eye on each other. We were keeping a fairly tight convoy,
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: and we were paying attention to the locals. Every time
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: we'd stop at a checkpoint, you'd check in with them,
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: how are things going, how's the situation?
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Absolutely, that was a really fun trip. And then
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: even on that northern route we took along the lake,
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: driving through the desert. That was a really great experience
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: and it was good to ground truth also areas of
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: the country that even some areas that I hadn't been to.
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: I want to take a moment for a special announcement
• 6:06
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• 6:10
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• 6:14
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• 6:18
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• 6:23
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• 6:26
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• 6:29
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• 6:34
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• 6:39
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• 6:43
  Speaker 1: overland community and this podcast.
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: I also thought it was interesting we did the sundowner
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: there and just hanging out as we saw the sunset,
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: and we had a bunch of people from the local community,
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: not really nice guys that wanted to come over and
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: they want to sell us like fossils and artifacts.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: That was such a great trip. That was really beautiful
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: being out on that little peninsula in the lake. We're
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: going to go into Last time, we talked a lot
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: about security and traveler and programs that are available for
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: American travelers, but this time we're going to talk a
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: little bit more about some practical ideas around safety, and
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: I thought it would be good to go through some
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: of the ones that you had talked about, and the
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: one that's really interesting to me, let's start off with it.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: What's the leading cause of death for travelers overseas oftentimes?
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know a lot of times people think it's
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: crime related or maybe even terrorism related, but the truth
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: is generally traffic accidents is people just getting in accidents
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: because they don't understand, you know, how people are driving
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: necessarily and they make a bad judgment, and maybe they're
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: driving on the other side of the road and then
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: to it and perhaps they're pretty far away from any
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: medical attention and they end up becoming a fatality due
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: to that distance. It just speaks to what you've said
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: so many times on the podcast about really being mindful
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: when you're driving. And it's probably a combination of traffic
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: accidents and drug use, sometimes different sorts of health related incidents.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Or even like it is here somebody that's been out drinking. Yeah,
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: you can easily be I can see it. You're in Kenya,
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: they drive on the other side of the road. You
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: go out, have a meal, have a couple drinks. Next
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: thing you know you're impaired already, and now you forget
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: which side of the road you're supposed to be on.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: You can just really easily see how that could cascade
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: into a real serious problem. It was probably good for
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: you to see when we were traveling together, just how
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: conservatively I drive after all of these years. I don't
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: push it. I just don't push it.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And to what you're just saying, even silver, right,
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: I don't drink, yeah, and I'm just coming back and
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: driving on the other side. I love that everyone always
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: says it's the wrong or the right side.
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: Of the road.
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: I think it's really funny because for people to drive
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: on the right side, they say the left is the
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: wrong in a.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: Way, but all perspective, isn't it.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: A couple of times I had to check myself to say, oh,
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: it's actually on the other side of the road, but
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: you know that. And then drinking and driving. And it's
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: not only I'm I'm assuming that a lot of Overlanders
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: they're going to be responsible if not to drink and drive,
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: But it's the other people on the road as well. Right,
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: that's a problem in places like here in the United States.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: Absolutely certain times of the night there's people that are
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: under the influence. Happens overseas a lot.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: Too, and it's good to know which countries. That's one
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: of the positive things about traveling in many Muslim countries
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: is that you're much less likely to encounter someone that's
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: intoxicated because they typically do not drink. Sometimes they do,
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: but typically they do not. But it's a really good
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: idea to know if drunk driving is a problem in
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: that country or how well it's enforced. Like I remember
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: in Central America, you talk to the locals and they're
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: just like, don't be out at night. And it's not
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: like they're worried about bandidos. They're like, people are drunk.
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: I've seen people just drunk walking, not even terrifying driving.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: That's also terrifying. Someone a drunk stumbles into the road
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: right in front of you and next thing you know,
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: you've hit somebody.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: I think it was in I was in Central America
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: one time and we were driving on a road at
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: night because we were trying to we had a very
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: specific mission that we were trying to accomplish it. There
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: was a guy laying in the road, in the middle
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: of the road, and it was a it was like
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: it was like a Saturday night, So I think he
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: was just like he had just gone full force on
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: the beers and he was just hanging out and he
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: was totally out of it. It would have been really
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: easy to just run over him, if you no doubt attention.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: Sure that happens often. And some of these countries also
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: have extreme weather, so you hear about in Russia, it's
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: very common for people to be drunk and they fall
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: asleep or they fall over in the snow bank and
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: and everybody comes out in the morning they're an icicle.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: Or get swept away or something else.
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: You really do want to watch. One of the simplest
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: things we can do is the same things that we
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: would consider here is don't drink and drive. Know if
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: other people are out drinking and driving, don't drive at
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: night the difference.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: And I think about that a lot that if I'm
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: going to go out, even just in the city, and
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: I'm going out at night time and it's a Friday
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: night or something, higher chance that someone out and about
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: is possibly under the influence. I guess you just have
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: to calculate that. Depending on the country, it may be
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: a long time until police can get to you. So
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: in some countries I observed in we had rules about
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: driving a night outside of the major populated areas because
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: maybe in that country the laws stipulated that a police
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: officer had to arrive at the scene and had to
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: process the scene. So when you end up staying, if
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: you're out a night and get in a simple fender bender,
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: all of a sudden you're out there, you have to
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: wait till they arrive. Otherwise you left the scene of
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: an accident and that should create another issue for you.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: And then all of a sudden you're exposed to other
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: situations that you weren't anticipating and just were trying to
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: maybe get somewhere. So I think it just comes down
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: to planning. Of course, there's necessary times when you have
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: to do some of these things that's right, And then
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: maybe that's when you work as a team, as you
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: have everyone focused on a specific thing to keep you
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: safe as possible.
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think at the end of the day,
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: it's all a matter of statistics or Russian Roulette, depending
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: on how you want to look at it. So you
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: just don't want to spin that cylinder very often. Absolutely,
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: it doesn't mean that you never drive at night. There
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: have been times that I've had to drive at night,
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: but I avoid it like the plague, just because no
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: good comes from it usually, and plus you don't get
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: to see anything. You don't get to see all the
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: cool places when you're driving at night.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: And I'm thinking, when we drove through that lava field,
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: this is just and it's harder to describe it, but
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: you're driving and all of a sudden you hit this
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: big black patch and then you look up the mountain
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: and that it was this huge ancient lava flow that
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: came to That's right. Yeah, you're driving a nighttime, you
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: don't get to see that.
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: You would totally miss it. Absolutely. That whole route was incredible.
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: Or the we got we can't forget the elephant in
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: the middle of the highway. Yeah, he was in the
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: median right right, and that was a I've never seen
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: that before, but I think he was in between the
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: Tsavo East and west and it's checking things out. So yeah,
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: definitely got to keep an eye out for things like that.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: Wildlife in general can be a real issue for travelers
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: that we need to be careful of. That's a good
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: When we used to do work with the Marines on
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: non tactical vehicle training. The reason why they hired us
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: to do that was because of injuries and fatalities related
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: to vehicle accidents. They were trying to gain awareness and
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: experience in the soldiers around driving off highway so that
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: they would understand the risks and to better not only
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: pilot the vehicle, but if they had a flat tire
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: or anything else, that they could do that expediently. Obviously
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: in a military setting or even in the settings that
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: you encounter, having a flat tire leaves you stranded. You're
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: no longer mobile, and the risks go up quite a
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: bit with that, and that also happens with travelers. So
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: making sure that we're not overstressing the vehicle, we're not
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: pushing the vehicle too much, We're paying close attention to
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: our tire placement, because when you have a flat tire,
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: now you are immobilized, and if someone has ill intention,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: you really can't go anywhere.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're you get it fixed, giving the opportunity. And
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: I really am not comfortable at all when I've had
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: to change a flat tire or something on a highway.
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: Of course here in the US, right like it's or
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: in a lot of countries because the high speeds, you
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: don't want someone not paying attention, they're looking at their phone,
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: disrected and they end up happens to police officers all
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: the time where they're struck. But in some other countries,
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: people are very creative with uses of the road, so
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: they'll just pass people anyway on the medians or side
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: of the road, and the speeds are slower. And I'll
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: say that speaking the language of driving, in every country
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: you go to, you learn the language of that driving
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: in that country, I would say sometimes they're aware of obstacles, sure,
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: looking around, but it's just not comfortable. I don't want
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: to give any opportunity for either a robbery attempt or
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: just getting hit by something.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it does seem that the more dynamic the driving
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: is in the trey, the less likely they are to
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: be distracted because you just can't be Like here in
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: the US, we're lucky to have four or five, six, seven,
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: eight lane divided highways whatever, and so I think that
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: gives a lot of complacency to people, and then very
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: high speeds. But when you're dodging potholes all day, you
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: can't be distracted, destroy your car.
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: So the story I told you as I was ending
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: my tour, it's a good one and this is bad
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: on me. I was distracted probably I was coming through
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: this small little Massai village and then all of a
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: sudden I see this kind of brown thing kind of
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: hop in front of the car and it was a goat.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: I'm glad it was a goat, right, because there was
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: kids run over first and I struck this little goat
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: and it was a medium sized goat, and it was
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: not really great. My kids were in the car. They
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: were unhappy with me, and it was totally on me.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Hey whose goat is this? It took about ten minutes
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: for people to figure out whose goat it was, so I, yeah,
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: maybe it's a street goat, right owner, but figured out
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: who it was, negotiated the compensation, sure paid them on
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: the spot and I got out of there and so
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: they were happy. The funny thing was all my aim.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: But it's what we have to do as travelers.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, because you leave it was quite obvious I
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: wasn't local, and so you don't want again give the
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: bad an impression. You want to be a good impression,
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: give a good impression if you can about.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: Who you take responsibility because we're out recreating. In this case,
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: you were out having a nice trip with your family.
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: You weren't doing it for work. It wasn't a professional endeavor.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: You're a traveler through that region and the loss of
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: an animal like that can be significant for a family
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: food source.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: And we did the right thing. And again I'm sure
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: I paid more than I should have, but I was
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: okay with it.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: And I was what does a goat go for nowadays?
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: Well, they say they wanted one hundred and fifty dollars,
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: and I said, that thing's not worth more than thirty
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: and I think we said eighty dollars. It probably is
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: worth about fifty at market, depending on the size. Then
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: it went to the community.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, of course.
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: All my Kenyan colleagues were said, they told me, did
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: you bring the goat with you? I left the goat,
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: and I'm like, you should have brought it. You paid
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: for the.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: Goat, fresh goat meat. That's so funny that you paid
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: him and they got the goat metal.
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: It would have made the trip not so great if
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: I hit a goat and then pop it in the
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: back of the truck on top of the luggage. That
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: would not have gone well with my family. It would
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: have been a story they never wore.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: I think even now they're not going to forget that one.
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: But the community was probably super happy they got paid
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: for the goat and they got to keep the goat.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: The people were gathering around me, and so I know
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: a lot of travelers would be scared of that situation,
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: but I wasn't because I knew that they weren't angry.
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: I just was looking at everyone and I knew what
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: I was going to do, and I did what was right.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: I had just driven through and they probably held me
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: up at the next community. Actually, it would have been
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: a worse situation, much worse. And I learned about this
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: just really. Another colleague had accidentally hit a sheep or
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: something and he told me how he handled it. And
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: I'd been to some livestock markets in Kenya, so I
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: knew the going raid and that these are worth things
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: to folks happy to do it.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it is a store of wealth for those families.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: I remember when I was in Malawi and a place
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: that I stayed, the guy who was running the operation,
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: he gave me a tour of his village. He was
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: someone modest means by our standards, but fairly significant means
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: by their standards. He showed me his home and in
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: the back he had this pen and it had maybe
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: five or six cows in the pen. What he explained
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: to me was he said, you have a savings account
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: that you save for when things go bad. This is
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: literally my saving. This is the bet. And he says,
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: if I need to buy a motorcycle, I sell a cow.
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: If I need to expand on my home, or if
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: my child needs to go to the hospital or whatever,
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: I sell a cow. And they build their savings account
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: like an annuity by having more cows baby cows, and
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: then they get to get a dividend on it every
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: month with milk and so it's pretty interesting and that's
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: how humans did that for a very long time.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: It was a good experience that happened. I learned a
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: lot from it. Unfortunately, I hit the goat. I used
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: to raise goats when I was growing up. I felt
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: a special loss.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: Of course, yeah, you never want to create any unnecessary
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: suffering if you can help it. But it was also
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: an accident.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: What it really taught me, though, is man, you got
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: to be on point and you're going through these places.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: Just make sure you're completely focused. The worst thing would
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: have been that I hit a small child or a person,
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: and it can happen. There's this game sometimes in some
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: of these countries where they like they look at you
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: straight in the eye and then they want to race
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: across the road. And you just got to really be
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: on point with things, and I'll never forget it. And
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: so I'm prepared from this point forward to just refresh. Hey,
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: just be aware of being totally aware, on point and
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: paying attention.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah. We many years ago at Overland Journal, we published
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: a story from a husband and wife that did hit
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: a child somewhere in Africa, and it went through their
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: journey of taking responsibility not paying off the police. They
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: had a chance to pay off the police and leave,
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: but they actually stayed and met with the village elders
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: and met with the family. The negotiation was at the
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: end of it was that they were going to pay
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: for their other children to go all the way through
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: school and into post secondary education. It was a way
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: to give back to that family. Can never replace the
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: child that was lost, but it's a way to give
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: opportunity to the other children that they may not have
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: had otherwise absolute, but it was a tragedy for all involved.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: But because they didn't just take the easy way. The
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: local police commandante was like, he was happy to take
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: a couple thousand bucks and make it go away.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Unfortunately that's the way things work a lot of.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: Times, and the family wouldn't have gotten any of it.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And again, by you doing the right thing, doesn't
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: matter where you're from. Yeah, you're speaking to the values
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: of your family, your community, where you're from, because that's
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: the way a lot of these places view things one
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: community to another. But you're representing well everything about you. Yeah,
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: and so let's take that opportunity and do the right thing.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: I think that's always what we should do.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: And that's a good lesson, and it was. It sounds
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: like it was a good lesson for you, a reminder
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: that we got to be on point all the time.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: And for me it gets exhausting at times, and it's
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: anymore when I travel. It's why I take more break
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: days than I used to, is because I think it's
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: the cumulation of having not had something bad happen and
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: realizing that it's statistics. Yeah, and then also that I
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: just need to be more and more. I have more
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: and more responsibility other people in the vehicle. I have
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: people that I'm representing. I just need to be more.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: I have to be more and more mindful of and
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: I have to be a good example to others.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'll do another plug too that if you
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: do find yourself in a situation that you know potential
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: legal issues, that's when your pre work for going out
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: to a certain country, having the right numbers to call
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: if you're from the United States, calling American Citizen Services,
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: or if you're from another country, they have a version
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: of that usually for their country with that embassy or consulate,
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: and that being like the first call you make, because
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: there could be other things coming down the road in
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: terms of legal If you just need to be prepared
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: what you should do next and get that advisement. It
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: doesn't mean they're going to pull you out of jail.
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: It just means that they're going to make sure you
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: get the proper treatment and make sure that you have
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: a list of people you can call to help you
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: work through that issue.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: And not only that, but then someone knows where you're at. Hey,
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: I am in this community. This thing happened because you
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: may not get that next phone call. It's very common
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: for phones to be confiscated, identification to be confiscated by
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: the police, and then you don't have that opportunity, So yeah,
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: make it be your first call.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: And have your family back home also advocating for you.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: So then you may get held up and not have
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: the opportunity to make further calls, explain the situation to
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: someone at some point of contact back home, they can
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: continue to make those calls to follow up on your
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: case and make sure you're getting the attention that you
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: need and hopefully again hopefully that everything works out fine.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: And these are not new issues. Things happen all the time,
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: so people are used to working through these issues local
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: authorities and the embassies and consulates, so you're not the
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: first person. Usually it's just again, just be prepared to
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: make the calls. Be decisive if you hit an animal
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: or something you need to do, and it's a negotiation,
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: it's not just I'll just pay you whatever you need
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: to be to pay you, and know who you're paying.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: Make sure you're not paying a bribe, because when you
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: pay the bribe, once you pay the bribe, you technically
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: broken the law, you're now susceptible to anything else they
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: can come along, because then they can you actually paid
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: a bride if they really want to use that against you.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: So the best is to try to you just avoid that.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: Keeping your tracker running. If you have a spot tracker,
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: make sure it's running, it's in the vehicle or it's
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: on your person. They may not know what that is,
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: but they would know what a phone is. For example,
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: when I'm traveling, I always have a point of contact
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: back in the United States. It happens to be Brian mcvickers,
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: who's on our team, and if I'm going into an
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: area that's I've got a little higher concern, I'll let
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: him know this is where I'm at. Make sure that
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: he can track me on the tracker, so that way
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: someone at least knows where I'm at. It's been very
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: helpful in Africa recently because you got to be that
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: guy like I felt like I got Captain America in
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: the backseat, which was cool, but it's really helpful to
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: just know that someone outside of your vehicle has got
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: your back. Yeah. Absolutely, that's really helpful.
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: And a special thanks to Dometic for their support of
• 26:31
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• 26:35
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• 26:40
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• 26:45
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• 26:50
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• 26:55
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• 26:58
  Speaker 3: That makes a big difference when you're sleeping next to
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: the fridge. The USB port is now eighteen watts for
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: even faster device charging. The CFX five will cool down
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: to minus seven degrees fahrenheit and has a three stage
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: low voltage cutoff to protect your battery while running on
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: either twelve or twenty four volts DC and one ten
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: or two hundred and forty volts AC. These fridges are
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: durable and even one our most recent Overland Journal Editor's
• 27:29
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• 27:35
  Speaker 1: We talked a little bit about the hazards to be
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: aware of when traveling on roads internationally, but there's a
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: couple things that came to mind for me when I
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: read this bullet point for you is making sure that
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: your tires are in good condition and that they're at
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: the right pressures. So much of what we're going to
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: talk about today is about prevention because an ounce of
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: prevention it goes so much further. So making sure the
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: tires are in good condition, that your spare tire is
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: properly inflated as well, that you've got the tools in
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: the vehicle to change the tire out the number of
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: times that I've come across someone in the back country
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: that could not remove their tires because aftermarket wheels and
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: then aftermarket lug nuts, or maybe they forgot the key
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: to the there's things that happen so easily. So you
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: want to make sure that you or maybe the jack
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: the vehicle's lifted. Now the jack no longer works. Yeah,
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: So making sure you test all that stuff, make sure
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: that the vehicle's in good working order, as good at
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: working order as possible when it comes to vehicle issues,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: we can prevent a lot of it.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I just got to refresh on some training using
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: highlift jack and other types of tools like that, and
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: I realized that I have some of the tools, but
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: not all the tools I need.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: Right, so I have a highlift jack, but I was
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: missing some of these like soft shackles, or things that
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: would have made it easier. I still would have technically
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: been able to do it, but I made have ended
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: up damaging the vehicle. And so I saw, with some
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: professionals proper training them use some of these soft shackles
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: and different combinations and configurations, and I was like, oh,
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: that's really good. And these guys were all experts in
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: the field, and so I said, okay, I actually I'm
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: actually missing some equipment. Right, I have the highlift check there,
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: it looks cool. I have a high lift jack mounted
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: on my defender, but I also carry a model jack
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: with me as well. But you got to make sure
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: that it's tall enough, right, right. And so it's true
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: that if you don't test your equipment out before, then
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: you're just asking to be in a situation down the
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: road that you're like, oh, I actually don't have what
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: I need, and then you got to ask for help
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: and then you're out there a longer time. But with work,
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: every time, with work, we do drills a lot, and
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: every time we would do a drill, we would find
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: little things they weren't working, some batteries that went bad
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: all the time with the folks that were working with me,
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: or underneath me. I say, this is why we drill,
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: because we figure out that stuff doesn't work. Stuff went bad,
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: the batters went bad, This piece of equipment doesn't work
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: the way that.
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: You wanted interface with the vehicle properly exactly.
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: So those preventive I think just getting familiar with your equipment.
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: If you buy something new first saying, just make sure
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: it works for your application, because until you use it,
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: you're not going to know.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: You know, Like when I would work with the Marines,
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: I'd tell them, when you go into the motorpool and
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: you grab that highlux, make sure that they put the
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: right spare tire because it could be a completely different
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: bolt pattern, but they use the same size tire. It
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: would be very easy for the motor pool to put
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: the wrong spare with the wrong vehicles.
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: I just bought another vehicle to use around town, and
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: before my travel I went to check and no spare tire.
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah who got rid of the spare tire? I don't
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: know who would get rid of a spare tire. But
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: then I'm like, okay, great, now I need to figure
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: this out and get another spare. But there's workarounds, right, Yeah,
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: you can make sure you have a if you're finding
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: ways to support your travel. If I had a plug kit, yeah,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: and end up having just a simple Okay, if I know
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: how to plug a tire, I don't.
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: Know to use that spare actually really.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: Quicker and sorry, well, get a plug kit and I'll
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: have that ready. And so there's different combinations of ways
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: that we can work through problems. Again, though, if you
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: don't ever practice, then you're going to just be figuring
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: out the first time when it's happening. And that's just
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: not ideal. Right now in the States, it's a little
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: hot out here and not so much Imprescott, but in
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: Arizona and a Vegas area, and I don't want to
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: be changing a tire to one hundred and twenty.
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: Degrees no, no way, Yeah, brutal or having a vehicle
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: breakdown or anything else. I showed them how to plug
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: a tire. Yeah, they were like a couple of them
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: were like, you can do that or change out the
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: valve with a Colby valve. They wanted me to show
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: them how it worked because they're like, I don't I've
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: never seen that before. Yeah, And it was a pretty
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: cool thing to be able to show them.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: It's quick as well. And there's always someone willing to
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: teach those techniques, and there's always someone that maybe's a
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: little better versed in it, but that trained the trainer,
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: and it's a great skill to have. It feels great
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: to be able to help someone in need, to be
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: the person that can help them when they actually need
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: some help. That's great.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: I remember when I did the trip through the Stands
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: years ago on the Silk Road, and I was in
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: Uzbekistan and we were eating at this little restaurant. The
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: family they were so sweet and they just served us
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: this wonderful meal, and there was another family and they
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: spoke some English and they wanted to see our photos,
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: and it was just a really wonderful exchange. I'm trying
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: to explain, ask them, where is a good place for
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: us to stay that night? A hotel to stay. I
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: couldn't quite understand what they were saying, but basically they
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: were saying, no, you shouldn't even leave the restaurant. You
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: can stay here. You can sleep here in the restaurant.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: And they let us sleep right there on the because
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: they eat and recline and hang out. It's a big production.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: So the restaurant little booth was perfect for sleeping too.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: But then the next morning when we got up, the
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: guy who let us stay there overnight get a flat
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: tire on his latta or whatever. I gotcha, man, totally
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: plug the tire, had the compressor of the dude's eyes
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: were this figure out fixed the tire compressor ered it
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: up and he was good to go. It is a
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: way to give back.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: And even on our trip, the guys with the motorcycle
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: in the ditch or it was like a motorcycle.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: What that thing was?
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: You stopped right away, We jump over and they were
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: actually just happy to see we stopped by to help
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: them out. They had it though, but it was pretty cool.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: It's a good thing to do to just especially fellow travelers.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: We all just want to know that somebody's got our
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: back a little. Yeah, you've got some other good stuff
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: on here, like potholes, for example.
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: We talked about the animals on the road, and I
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: was just thinking about our trip and at the most
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: basic level, engineering of roads is different in different countries.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, all.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Those sorts of specs, so roads are built in different ways.
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: And we saw on that road we were on that
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: the big trucks had started to wear into the road,
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: and there was you actually couldn't go too fast on
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: that road because you'd be bouncing around because the trucksic warning.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: There's almost like a divot sort of thing, a group
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: truckers groups. Yeah, truck size pot holes. That happens, that's
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: the thing, and so they're not meant for you to
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: drive that fast. When I first came back to the
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: US after so many years, it was a little overwhelmed
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: by how fast things felt. So you start driving slower.
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: But those big holes and it just you got to
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: be paying attention, right, big holes, random speed bumps in
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: the middle of a highway. They're not painted or marked.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: The shadows can confuse you. But if you're not exceeding
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: the speed then it shouldn't be too much of an issue.
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: But how do you react when you hit it? Too
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: hard to incapacity to vehicle.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: And a lot of times people will complain about the
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: speed limits in Africa, but they're that way for a reason.
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: They have limited medical support. The road conditions change constantly,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: the condition of vehicles on those roads very widely. The
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: end of the day, just realize, like the reason why
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: you're doing fifty kilometers an hour is because it's the
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: safest speed for you to be traveling at on that road.
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: And that the roads may not be built for. Again,
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: the engineering isn't set to take a car at excessive speeds.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: And there's other little surprises that could come up. Even
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: these big trucks that you may be traveling in front
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: of and around the maintenance and that may not be
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: up on that truck, so the brakes go out sometimes.
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: And I don't like to be right in front of
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: a big truck. I like to be behind the truck
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: because then get away from them, because then the breaks
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: could fail at some point, or oversized loads, all types
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: of things that almost absolutely and so that stuff they'll
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: be rebar coming out the back with no flag on it,
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: and you're.
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: Like, whoa, that's chug a rebar right there.
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: So it's a bit of a Frogger game a little
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: bit what you need to be paying attention to. And
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: as you said, your nearest medical facility may be pretty
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: far away, even down in Baji. Did the drive several
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: times from Tijuana to Los Cabos. You would need to
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: have a sat phone because you lose signal when you
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: start to leave the ocean, very remote, and it's almost
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: like the road is up on a height kind of tiered,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: and then it falls off to the sides old there's
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: no bars, So if you're just not paying attention, you
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: could just roll off and then you got to call help.
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: How are you going to call help? And no cell
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: signal in situations like that times of the essence, where's
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: your nearest hospital that could support you? And maybe back
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: in Tijuana, Mexico City and Kenya that may have been Nairobi,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: So you don't simply don't have the time to drive
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: six eight hours to get to the nearest facility if
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: you can't treat it there, and you don't have those
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: medical supplies with you, because there may be experts nearby
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: that could help you, but they just don't have the supplies.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: But you need to be airlifted. So best is to
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: per just prevent that situation from havening.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: Remove the speed from the situation. That's the most important
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: advice that I can give when it comes to vehicle
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: travel is remove as much speed from the situation as possible.
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: The more that you're rushing, the more that you're speeding,
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: you can get away with it. In a lot of
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: times in North America because you come around a corner
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: and you always expect that corner to be what you
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: expect it to be. But when you come around a
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: corner in Africa, it could be filled with bricks that
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: just fell off the truck in front of it. Half
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: the road can be gone washed away, a tree stuck
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: in the ground. To try to give you some warning,
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: the most important thing that we can do as travelers
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: is to remove as much speed from the situation as
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: we can. We want to make sure that we have
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: as much site distance as possible when we're passing. We
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: can increase our speed slightly when we have sight distance,
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: but the less site distance that we have, the lower
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: the speed needs to.
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: Be absolutely and the conditions as they develop, fog and
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: other things. Just like you said, it's all about visibility,
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: side distance, and I'll say also paying attention to what
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: people are doing around you. Now, a lot of people
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: are very comfortable and so they'll speed excessively. They're not
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: the best examples, but if you see other people on
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: the road doing certain things, there's probably a reason why
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: they're doing it. Maybe to save a couple of minutes,
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: but maybe because of different hazards should exist. Even just
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: before I left King of there was a lot of
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: flooding caused by different range times, impacting communities, taking roads out.
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: But I did notice that the Google Maps even was
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: tracking flood affected areas. Oh wow, So sometimes I was
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: unexpected surprise for me because we're trying to gather information
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: from different communities and contacts, but the mapping software was
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: actually showing little kind of flooded areas and said this
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: area may be affected by flooding.
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: And yeah, it seems like it was pretty significant.
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: It was. Yeah, it was sporadic, just affecting different communities,
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: but several sections of the country.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Sure, you've got another one here that I think
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: is really good. How do transportation regulations differ? And I
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: have tried to download some of the equivalent of our
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: motor vehicle division regulations in other countries and you usually
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: can't find it. And there were actually some that I
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: did find, and they were so onerous that you would
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: never think that you'd even want to drive there. The
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: amount of equipment and some of the ones that I
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: was able to download for Africa because when we did
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: the Expedition seven trip, we had the resources to be
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: able to actually look for those kinds of things, like
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: what is the regulations for vehicles in that country? And
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: it was shocking some countries what they expected you to
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: have in the vehicle. You'd have a first aid kit,
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: you have to have a certain number of road flares
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: or road t angles, you have to have a certain
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: number of safety vests. It's interesting what like some countries
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: require you to have spare bulbs in the vehicle. And now,
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: but there are things that are interesting. One of the
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: advantages of the EU now is all of the signage
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: is now the same, so like when you go through Croatia,
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: it's exactly the same road signage as when you go
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: through Luxembourg. You got to look it up because they
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: don't always make sense because you can go down a
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: road and you think, oh, shoot, am I going the
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: wrong way on a one way because it has an
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: X with a circle on it, But no, that actually
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: just means no stopping and if there's one slash sho it,
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: it means no parking. They're fairly consistent now throughout Europe,
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: but in other places in Africa you have no idea
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: what some of these signs mean.
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's the signage or just how the rules work.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: You could be in a country where if if you
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: enter a roadway and let's say another car is coming,
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: you're entering the moving roadway and the other car is speeding,
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: they're coming over hill successive speeds, and there would have
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: been no way to avoid the accident. If you get
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: hit by that other vehicle, since you entered the roadway,
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: you be one hundred percent at fault. Sure, and then
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: if there's people in that other vehicle that are injured,
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: sometimes the rules may be that you go to jail
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: until their hospital bills are completely settled, or you made
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: the commitment that you'll settle those fees, so you'll say
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: they were speeding, they came over a hill, they were
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: in the opposite lane of traffic. The way the rule
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: worked is if you got hit, then you were at fault.
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: If there's an accident, sometimes the first vehicle to move
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: you just admitted fault because you're the first vehicle to move,
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: So you leave the vehicle where it is until police
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: show up.
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true. In Russia, you get it in accident,
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: you cannot move the car until the police arrive.
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So the traffic class can be a little quirky,
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: and sometimes it is really hard to find the rules,
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: very difficult, thank you. If you have a trusted source
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: in country, you might ask them, hey, what I do
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: if I'm in an accident? What am I supposed to do?
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: And they'll say, don't move the vehicles. The other point
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: I was thinking of is the insurance piece. Yes, man,
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: it's so important because if you get proper insurance for
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: a vehicle to drive in country, first of all, make
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: sure that your license works so many countries, they'll accept
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: licenses from other countries as acceptable to drive in that country.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: First of all, I one time rented a car in
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: the US with my Kenyon driver's license because my other
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: one get expired. The point on the insurance, if you
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: get in an accident and you don't have insurance, then
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: it's basically you against the world in terms of what
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: you got to pay, and you'll be paying for people's
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: college maybe. But if you have insurance, then the insurance
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: companies have to fight with each other and negotiate the settlement.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: You're totally out of the picture. You're totally find if
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: there's a suggestion, and all that information is usually on
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: embassy web pages like about insurance, get the insurance from
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: a reputable company, and then if something happens, then you're covered.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: Africa, there's something called Komesa insurance. If you're in Europe,
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: it is a green card insurance. Another one for those
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: that are listening. Most people their aspirations for international travel
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: would be probably to start with going on a trip
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: down to Mexico. It's interesting, but in Mexico it's not
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: the law to have insurance, but you want to have
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: it because they have a Napoleonic law in Mexico, which
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: means that you're guilty until your innocence has been proven,
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: which is exactly the opposite of what it is in
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: the United States. So that means that if you have insurance,
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: then again you have this insurance company that's going to
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: be advocating on your behalf. They'll be settling up any
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: of the damages, they'll be making sure that the person's
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: vehicle gets repaired. If you don't have that insurance, they're
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: gonna impound your vehicle and they're gonna hold you until
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: you can provide financial resources. And to your point, you're
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: just this one individual that's going against now someone who
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: wants a new car as opposed to the one repaired.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: Whereas the insurance company in Mexico is going to know
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: how to interact, They're going to know what's appropriate, what's fair,
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: and they're going to have the lawyers and everything else
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: the influence to be able to make sure that it
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: is fair.
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it takes you out of the picture, that's.
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: Right, the key and not under you not being detained exactly.
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: So you've got some other good ones here to talk about.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: But let's pop up to some of the other stuff
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: that we wanted to talk about, which includes evacuation insurance.
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: It's something that I always have. There are there's one
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: called ripcord, a whole bunch of different ones out there,
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: medback Assist, couple others. But do the research on that.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: We've got some good articles on that on Expedition Portal.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: But it's a good idea to have evacuation insurance in
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: addition to your own medical coverage that you have in
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: the United States, because what that's gonna do is get
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: you to first world care. So if you're in Azerbaijean
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: and you've got an acute appendicitis or whatever, they're gonna
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: evacuate you to Germany, they're gonna get you to first
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: world medical care, and they're gonna use helicopters, they are
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: gonna use planes, they're gonna use whatever it takes to
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: make that happen very quickly. Whereas if you don't have
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: those resources, then you're gonna need to get those procedures
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: done in those countries. And it's not that they can't
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: do an appendix surgery and Azerbaijan they can, but it
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: may not be orthoscopic, so you're gonna have a big
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: slice across your belly when they do that.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they idea is that the the insurance which is
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: and it's usually not as expensive as you might think
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: it is. Yeah, it's going to get you airlifted to
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: the airlifted or ground transportation or however the combination works
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: to the nearest facility that can first possibly treat your condition.
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: So if it's something that's pretty serious, then it's going
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: to get you to a place, like you said, some
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: first world care option. And if you plan on being
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: in some remote areas, you'll be surprised at how many
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: remote airstrips there are bush pilots. I've read it in
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: several these places are like there's an airstrip there and
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: we'll land. And so what that means is that you're
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: now within reaching distance of getting actual medical care if
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: you really need it something serious, and so it's invaluable.
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: It's a requirement actually for all of us, like we're
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: covered with the government, we're all covered with a form
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: of insurance that gives us those benefits. Totally necessary. And
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: one other sort of point where if we're a lot
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: of local folks are they're going to be there to
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: help you and try to help you. But I have
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: also seen fatalities where it was a fatality or serious situation,
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: and sometimes people were not able to help because if
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: you take a person to the hospital, they end up
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: dying at the hospital, you're financially responsible for that person
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: in some countries. Yeah, sure, so it's a lot of
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: times as foreigners, we get the benefit of that positive
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: we're gonna be able to compensate that person. Yeah, help,
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: you reward them for that help. But I guess just
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: again another point that it's you want all options available
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: to you if you can use them to get that
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: care as quick as possible.
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And a lot of times people travel with their partner,
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: they travel with their kids, just get the insurance, get
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: the family plan, and then if you do have a
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: medical emergency, you're going to be able to get out
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: of there quickly. You're going to be able to again
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: have them they're going to land that helicopter. These organizations
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: are well suited to providing that kind of care. One
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: of the ones that I've used recently is called DAN,
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: which is the Driver divers Something Network, and it applies
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: to both sailing, which is something that I also do,
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: and land travel. So it's actually like a super version
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: of that kind of service. And the one thing that
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: I really liked about it is that you actually had
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: a phone number to call to talk to an emergency
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: room doctor. So when we were on the sailboat, we
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: worked with a couple different doctors to come up with
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: all of the medications, the things that we could have
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: with us on the boat to address most problems. But
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: some of it would be I'd have to call the
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: doctor and say is this medication the right one to
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: run for the symptoms that he's having, And so being
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: able to call a doctor oftentimes can put you at ease,
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: or they can say, oh, that sounds like that. It's
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: this kind of a problem you've got a couple of days,
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: or maybe you need to get help immediately. And that's
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: even today, I'm a little bit under the weather and
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: my girlfriend, all of a sudden, I started getting clammy
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: and everything else, like that, you just broke your fever.
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: And I didn't know that was a thing. But she's
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: a trauma nurse, so she knew exactly what was happening,
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: and she's, oh, your fever just broke, and I was like,
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: that's amazing when someone has that level of skill. So
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: being able to call a doctor and describe the symptoms
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: that someone's having, if you're very remote, it could provide
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: you with the opportunities to provide at least some interim
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: care to help stabilize the patient until they can get
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: some additional support through these rescue operations.
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: I think something pretty cool about some of these plans too,
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: is that they actually cover you domestically, So we're thinking overseas. Yeah,
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: a lot of times your medical insurance will cover like
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: an airlift, Yeah you have some sort of condition, but
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: a lot of Overlanders are self employed or something and
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: they don't have maybe they don't have a plane that
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: covers fully. But a lot of these pretty affordable plans
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: can cover airlift too on nearby fas A that's high
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: tiered need.
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: It is, and you just want to make sure you
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: do the research because some of them exclude your home country.
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: So just make sure that because there are some that
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: do include your home country and there's some that exclude
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: your home country. So it's just important to know what
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: service do you have. At a minimum, get something like
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: a GEOS that you can get in addition to an
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: end reach. But make sure that you've got some kind
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: of evacuation insurance if you need it, because it's financially
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: it could be an endgame. A lot of people have
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: had to go bankrupt over those kinds of recoveries, So
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: something to think about on the evacuation insurance side. On
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: the preventative side, we talk a little bit about hygiene.
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: It's something that we want to be mindful of when
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: we're traveling. Is doing that self care, staying on top
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: of ourselves. And part of the reason for that is
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: if you're not paying attention, that tick has been there
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: for a couple of days, So pay attention to your body.
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: How are you feeling staying on top of if you're
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: starting to feel a little under the weather, get some rest.
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's those little bugs that will get you. I
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: just had a friend that came out with malaria and
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: he lives back in Kenya. Those preventative measures with we
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: always say, like sun's green, ken Is on the equator.
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: You and I go to the same barber. Yeah, go
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: out for more than five minutes, our heads are fried,
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: and make sure again you use that proper sun block.
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: You use that repellent. Was like deed, because that little
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: guy will get you and then you're totally out. Some
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: of the sickest times I've been from earlier travels or
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: from drinking water. Someone gave me a drink. I was
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: out doing some service work. I was out there working
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: and they gave me cold drink. I had ice in it.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: I was so sick and it was from the ice.
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: I should just maybe not accepted it, or I guess
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: I didn't know what was going to happen. But a
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: lot of times with my work, I have limited time
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: on the ground. I want to enjoy my time when
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: I'm in a place I can't be out for the count,
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: so I'll take a little bit extra preventative measures. Some
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: of those things I just talked about. Or I'll just
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: brush my teeth with drinking water. I just won't risk it.
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: Or if I'm going to eat out of place, I
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: go to a place where I see a lot of
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: people moving through. They cook the food a high temperatures.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: So it's like all those little kind of preventative pieces
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: really pay off because you're not going to be out
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: for the count.
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: Like even when you and I were traveling in the mornings,
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: we made protein shakes. The reason, one of the reasons,
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: one reason why I do it is I like them
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: feel I feel good when I have those. But it's
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: also removes an entire meal out of the possibility of
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: getting sick. It's like I have all of the ingredients
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: in my vehicle, I'm controlling the process, and it's a
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: way to keep me from getting sick.
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I eat locally a lot, but we were even
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: eating less meals too. We're eating two meals a day,
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: and it worked out really good. We went to good
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: established places to eat.
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: Sometimes you got to say no to protect yourself, yep,
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: because you get sick, then you got to stop everything,
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: or you're not operationally sound, you can't help others around you,
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: or you're just a drag on the entire team.
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: They call it the three peas, right, So you want
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: to peel it. So if it's fruit, you want to
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: peel it. You want to eat it out of a package,
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: which I don't like a lot of processed foods, but
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: or heavily processed foods. For me, that packaged food would
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: be maybe the way protein shakes that we were having,
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: or you want it piping hot, So think about the
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: three peas when you're eating internationally, just to reduce the chance.
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: And it's not to say that I don't take a risk.
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: And I made a decision long ago that I'd rather
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: deal with some gius than to offend, because it's a
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: wonderful human opportunity to have that interaction. So I choose
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: to not offend unless it's very clearly going to get
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: me sick. But I remember getting offered for mended Mayor's
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: milk and I think I said no to that.
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: I said yes to that in one country and the
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: guys assured me it was delicious, and I'm sure you
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: get used to it, but it was a shock. I thought.
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: I was thinking like it was a hard shot. It
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: was not a hord shot.
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: All right, and then we also one of the foundational
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: things that we look for in basic equipment and mindset,
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: we call it the ABC's. So we want to have
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: aids for navigation, which means we want to have a primary, secondary,
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: and a contingent form of navigation. So we want to
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: have our primary form of navigation, maybe a garment GPS
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: with tracks for Africa, a GPS that's in the vehicle,
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: and then we want to have backup apps on our phone,
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: so that would be our secondary form of navigation, maybe
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: on a tablet. You want to have multiple apps too,
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: because sometimes apps need to be updated. You don't know
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: it and you go to open it up and it
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: doesn't work. Now you're away from cell coverage and it's
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: requiring you to log or whatever. So have a couple
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: different forms of navigation apps on your phone so that
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: way it works offline in the back country. And then
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: you want to have your contingency, which your contingency when
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: it comes to navigation should always be analog. So we
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: want to have paper maps. We want to have a
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: magnetic compass that's appropriate for the hemisphere that you're in.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: And you want to have time that you take every
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: day to break that map out and just get a
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: reference point of where you're at. That way, if all
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: of those navigation aids were to stop working, or the
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: batteries were to fail, or the vehicle was to get
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: burned down, and you've lost all of those expensive pieces
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: of equipment that you've got a way to navigate yourself
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: to safety aids for navigations the first thing, and then
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: we want to have basic emergency equipment. So this is
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: also part of being prepared, is what we want to
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: have a first aid kit. We want to have medications
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: in the vehicle that can treat basic conditions that occur
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: like gi distress. There's going to be antibiotics for that.
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: Then there's going to be for cuts and stings and
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: everything else. There's going to be other treatment for that.
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: One of the most common things that people experience in
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: overlanding is burns. So it can be from a fire,
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: or it could be from hot fluid hot liquids, and
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: that's especially true in sailing. Burns are very dangerous, So
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: you want to have ways to treat burns. You want
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: to have bandages that are appropriate for burns. You want
• 56:26
  Speaker 1: to have that in that kit. And so you want
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: to have emergency supplies available in what I would call
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: a ditchbag. Some people would call it a bug out bag.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: It's not some form of survivalist. It's really just about
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: if the vehicle was to catch fire, or if you
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: were to like the flooding that just happened in Kenya,
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: you're in a flooding situation and the vehicle is being
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: swept away and you have just a moment to grab supplies.
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: It should all be in one bag. So it should
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: have your satellite communication tools. It should have your backup
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: form of navigation. It should have basic first aid. It
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: should have drinkable water inside of it. You can't last
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: very long without water, so you need to make sure
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: that you've got water available and maybe a couple high
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: protein or high energy bars that give you a little
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: bit of a sense of well being, but you probably
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: don't need that, but have all that stuff in one kit.
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: In that kit, I like to keep a rain jacket
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: or a secondary form of insulation. It's good to have
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: some form of shelter, and that can be a very
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: simple bivvy sack. And this can all fit in a
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: very small backpack. So it's a good idea to have
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: that ditch bag in the vehicle at all times. For me,
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: it was just right behind the driver's seat in the
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: Grenadier that had all that kit in it.
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I like to have all that stuff packaged together,
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: and once you really think it out and have it
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: put together and you have it in a nice little
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: smaller bag that you can move in and out, you
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: don't need to think about it next time. A lot
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: of a lot of times, my kind of similar work
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: bag I had for my work vehicle. If I did
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: a family trip, just take that out and just put
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: it in the car.
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: And we went. You had all the stuff you needed in.
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: There, it was all packaged together. I didn't, And I
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: just get you to go through it every time you're
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: about to go out to make sure that everything is fresh.
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: And you don't you need to.
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: But do you need to look at a flashlight or
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: a flash eight in a headlamp because you need that.
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: If it's for a little pawnschow, if it's raining outside, right,
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: put that on you and you can work on the car.
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: It's good to just have it all there, set it,
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: set it, and forget it, not really forget it, but
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: set it for that opportunity that you're going to need
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: to use it, and then you don't need to really
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: reinvent the wheel every time. I like to think in
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: terms of what's the most likely thing that can happen
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: as well, So anytime I'm putting that mercy equipment together,
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: and so like we talked before about plug hit things
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: like that most likely thing's gonna happen is flat tire man.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: So don't be the guy that doesn't have your flat
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: tire kit ready to plug that. I'd be the worst
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: thing in the US else other gear with you. I
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: do like to think in terms of, like you said,
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: my communications, medical, my security equipment, depending on what country
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: you're at, what you can bring and everything. When I travel,
• 59:18
  Speaker 2: like to just be able to self sustain and make
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: sure that I'm protected as well.
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: And that is the sea of the ABC's is communication tools.
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: You need to have a primary, a secondary, and a
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: contingent form of communication. Your primary form of communication for
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: most people will be their mobile phone. Always maintained a
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: backup mobile phone that had all of the critical apps
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: that I needed on it. So for most people, their
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: primary form of communication will be a cell phone. Secondary
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: form of communication for a lot of folks will be
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: something like a garment in reach, or it can be
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: a starlink, it can be an iridium SAT phone something
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: like that. And then a contingent form of communication. We're
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: coming back to analog again, so that means we're going
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: to be we're gonna need to have signaling mirrors, or
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: we're gonna want to be able to do signaling smoke
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: smoke signals. We're gonna want to be able to do
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: other forms of communication that can include radios. So radios
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: can be a really good form of contingent communication. In Australia,
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: it's common for people to have very long range radios
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: that they use in the back country.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: Could even be you have masking taping your kit. You
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: can write a message on top of your car, help
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: or something like that, and I'll even add in after
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: that contingency emergency. It could be as long as it
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: can do some sort of two way communication. But I
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: guess what I'm saying is even if it's a are
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: you okay and you're able to say yes, and I
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: guess maybe then reach falls in that category. But that
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: is a form of communication because you're able to respond back.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: Maybe not a ton of messaging, or maybe you have
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: a system that allows you just to say like that
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: I need help sure.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: Which would be like a PLB Personal Locator beacon. Those
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: are basically they're one way communication of I am in
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: an emergency.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: Exactly, yeah, got a whole lot people know that you
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: just communicated you need help.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it means it's usually life threatening. So those
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: are what we view as the ABC's. In all of
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: my years of travel, I've only had a couple things
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: that went bad, and I do this six months out
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: of the year, so for the most part, I've never
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: had an accident. I just I've been very fortunate despite
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: the fact that I've traveled so much, so it's not
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: like these things happen all the time. But I think
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: for me, part of why I still take as much
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: pleasure and joy from travel is the fact that I
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: feel fairly well prepared, and then I have pretty tight
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: guidelines that I keep in place while I'm traveling that
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: helps keep me safe. So I think that we don't
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: want anybody to feel fearful about travel. All of these
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: things that we've talked about are rare to have happened,
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: but they do Statistically, they do happen, so the more
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: prepared we can be for it, the better. In the
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: developing world, electrical standards can be a little different.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: These are just things that from traveling in different countries
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: and from having little kids at the time, and you
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: just notice these things, right, So you'll be staring at
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: a nice airbnb or something and you'll walk up to
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: the door that's maybe on a second level, and you
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: realize there's no guardrail, or the guardrails perfectly sized to
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: be higher than some small children, but you could just
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: be like, maybe just not paying attention, step off and
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: fall a story down. And you know a lot of
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: parents will just figure these things out as they come
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: into these houses and be like, oh, rail's not there,
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: the pool doesn't have a proper locking mechanism. Just basically
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: a reminder to just be aware of these things that
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: not all places have to meet the same standards when
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: it comes to housing a couple.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 1: It was a month or so ago in Mexico two
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: Americans died or one American died and one nearly died
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: in a jacuzzie in a they were at a hotel
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: in Mexico. Faulty wiring in one of the jacuzzi lights
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: and it electrocuted the guy killed him. So just make
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 1: sure that you're paying attention to that stuff.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: And we've had electrical things go off in the house
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: and we removed the panel to look and it was
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: like a rat's nest and it was fixed and everything.
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: But in some countries the legal process is so strict
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: that people have to meet certain requirements otherwise they're going
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: to be sued as a business sure, and in some
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: places it's just not the focus of attention. And so
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: that means that when you go to a place electric
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: could go out or we're visiting. We're visiting one time
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: South Africa and there was rolling blackouts and over every
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: day and so there's no generator, so we needed to plan.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: There's no electricity right now, so just a little inconveniences.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 2: The trip overall was still worth it. It didn't really matter.
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: But there can be little surprises with housing standards and
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: things like that that you just have to be mindful
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: of and just make sure that you're safe.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: With in those situations where you don't expect it to
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: be at the same standards all the time.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: Or the uh was it the showers that you know,
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: the heater.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 1: Those are always they're terrifying, and they always like the
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 1: wiring is always just tied together with those little caps,
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: and you're like, I'm in the shower with two hundred
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: and twenty volts right now, terrifying. I still take a shower,
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: but it's still I like, I know that's how I'm
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 1: going to go out. Yeah, I'm going to go out
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: with two hundred and twenty volts and some backcountry hotel. Yeah,
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: you talk a little bit about this. I think we
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: should touch on fire safety and water safety too. The
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: fire safety I think is really important because again it's
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: those standards where the ex it's can you get out?
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: Can you get out of the hotel? They're just not
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: going to have the same standards. A lot of times
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: the stairwalls are blocked. Just taking a minute to make
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: sure that you have a way to get out of
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: the hotel if there's a fire, or in the work
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: that you do. There's been more than a few hotels
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: that have had attacks.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and the good thing is that most pure staying
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: at a recommended place, usually they've done the work in
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: terms of making sure there's enough exits, but there could
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: be surprises like that exit is locked, and so just
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: mental note, quick mental note, where are the exits? I
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: am always thinking about, how have I ever seen firefighters
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: around right, and where's the nearest firefighting truck do they?
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: You know a lot of times they're bringing the water,
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 2: so there's no fire hydrants they could just draw from.
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 2: And in some places I've been at, they don't even
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 2: have proper hoses. We may have the hoses or the
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: water source, we connect them and they fight the fire.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: And so I saw a manure type fire that was
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: burning for four days and they just the water source
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: isn't really available, or maybe the fire truck. I've seen
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: a lot of fire trucks that have been donated in
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 2: some developing countries, like they're from local jurisdiction here in
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: the US and they were donated. And so fire trucks
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: from the fifties safety really old stuff still works but
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: doesn't have the capacity, and so you will see fire
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: places burned down and people get get trapped. And so
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: if you can make if you can just think about
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: ways to get out.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: You can't get on the first floor. Yeah, if you can't,
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: just pay attention to those kinds of things to again
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: preventative to reduce the likelihood. One of the things you've
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: got here is water safety. I actually think it's an
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: underappreciated consideration because a lot of times when we travel overland,
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: we want to take that boat ride, or we take
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: the ferry ride. The sketchy ferries that I've been on,
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: you realize there is not a single life preserver on
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 1: this entire boat. Yeah, are leaning pretty bad to one
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: side because they're flooding with water.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: So it's for some places that ferry is the main
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: form of transportation, like when we're in Diani, main form
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: of transportation for a lot of workers every day to
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: go back and forth to the mainland. So that means
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 2: that a lot of times we're overloaded. When sometimes the
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: embassy will recommend against forms of transportation, that's usually based
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 2: off of incidents that have happened, And so I would say,
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 2: if you're going to take a ferry, just google them
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 2: and you'll see when possibly the last incident happened, and
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 2: you can just take make a judgment and look at
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: it and just make a decision and take the longer route.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: It's the safer route. Because these fairies, they sometimes they
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: do sink cars people, they die, people do not as
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 2: swim or people all around you will become frantic. And
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 2: I don't want to be in a situation where I'm
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 2: trying to fight people off of me or my family
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: and they're just fighting for their lives as well. I
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 2: just prefer to take what take something that has good
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: standards when it comes to safety, that's right or something.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: And I'm storms approaching and I'm like, oh man, what
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: did I get myself into. It's part of the fun
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: to go to some of these places because you can't
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 2: also hold the highest standard. No, you're not going to
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 2: meet it, but you can do a little research and
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: you can tell if.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: Don't go with the bargain boat tour, go with a
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: nice boat tour. Spend the extra twenty bucks to get
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: one that's got the newer boat.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 2: Make a judgment call. Look at the boat, Look at
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 2: the people. Do they look like they're trained. Do they
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: look like they're usually that the exterior, if they have
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: uniforms and everything. A lot of times the company goes
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 2: through the efforts of training them, and so that's maybe
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: a better option.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: And even on our trip when we went out to
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: the coast and Kenya, we made the decision not to
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: take the ferry correct and that was because of safety concerns,
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: so we actually took a longer overland route to get there.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: It was very cool, but it was the right decision.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: I also wanted to take a brief moment to thank
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: all of you for listening to the Overland Journal podcast.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 1: By listening to this podcast and subscribing to the Overland
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 1: Journal magazine, you're supporting our employee own and veteran owned business.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: Impartial reviews and in depth content like this would not
• 1:09:30
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• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: I think you'd really love the print magazine as well.
• 1:09:37
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• 1:09:45
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• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: Code Overland podcast at checkout again, that's Code Overland podcast
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 1: at checkout, and I'll give you twenty percent off. I
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: sincerely appreciate your support. We've talked about most of the
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: other things. Food born illnesses we talked about a little bit,
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: but I think overall the theme for me when it
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: comes to safety is an ounce of prevention. Of course,
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: be prepared, have the things that you need in the
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: vehicle to be able to address those safety issues when
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: they arise. Focus on having the ABC's, making sure you
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: have the right having antibiotics, having I always bring a
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: needle syringe kit with me. I bring a dental that way.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: If I go into a small clinic, I can hand
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: them an IV kit if it wasn't necessary. So I
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: always have that stuff in the vehicle just as a
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 1: preventative measure, and I don't think about it again. I
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 1: just know I've got it, and I just don't worry
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: about it after that.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah. One other thing I think is very important is
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: public transportation. Some countries have really nice rails and trains.
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: It's a safe, affordable way to travel connects you at
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: the community. Back in the day, when I was a
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: missionary and I did some we use public transporission. A
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 2: couple of times I feared for my life and that
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: because the thing was overloaded and the drivers were passing
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: traffic uphill, I thought I was about to die. Yeah,
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: so I think you just make that judgment call. A
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: lot of times it's affordable rent a car or get
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 2: a private driver, or travel yourself. Yeah, right, But I
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: think that's just something that you know, if you just
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 2: take a look at that public transportation option and you
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: can tell if it's right for you. Is it jam packed?
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 2: Are they driving really crazy? There's a lot of fatalities
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 2: that happen locally, and it's because the drivers are trying
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 2: to maximize revenue. That means that they're driving as fast
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: as they can with as many people as they can.
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. And don't be afraid to get off
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 1: the bus exactly if it's I don't feel comfortable, don't
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: just sit there the next time the thing stops, get
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: off the bus and get a local taxi driver and
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: pay the money you got to pay to get where
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: you're going, so that way you feel safe. This was
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: great advice than Jonathan JJ. Thank you so much. We
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: appreciate always you being on the podcast, appreciate your friendship
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 1: and all the adventures that we've been able to have recently.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: And you've got some stuff happening with your defender, which
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: is exciting.
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: I'm very excited.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: Sand Glow, sand Glow for the win.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: Its soul is sand Glowed. Originally was I think a
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: cream color, and it's getting repainted and it's getting a
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: lot of other work done and then it's traveling to
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: my next post. So yeah, very excited, got it.
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: That's going to be awesome. Look forward to seeing that
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: thing get finished up and maybe we can go on
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: a good adventure in that. Thank you again for being
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: on the podcast and all this great advice, And just
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: for those that are listening, when you go to travel,
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: make sure you take advantage of if you're an American traveler,
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: and other countries have these kinds of resources as well,
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: but do make sure you take a look at the
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: government websites that are being posted about the countries that
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: you're traveling to get involved with the STEP program so
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: that way they know where you're going and how to
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: get in touch with you if there's an issue that arises.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of great resources out there, and an
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: ounce of prevention goes a long way.
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: And man, I'm honored again for having me on the podcast,
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 2: and again we had some really great times, absolutely good times,
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: and I really appreciate.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: You the Funder and Prescott this time.
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just really doing some college touring with one
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 2: of my sons.
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: We thank you all for listening, and we'll talk to
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: you next time.