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ISSTD Recap (Part 1) · System Speak: Complex Trauma and Dissociation

• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the System Speak a podcast about Dissociative Identity Disorder. If you are new to the podcast, we recommend starting at the beginning episodes and listen in order to hear our story and what we have learned through this endeavor. Current episodes may be more applicable to longtime listeners and are likely to contain more advanced topics, emotional or other triggering content, and or reference earlier episodes that provide more context to what we are currently learning and experiencing. As always, please care for yourself during and after listening to the podcast. Thank you.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: Okay, guys. It is time to talk about the ISSTD conference and give a little recap of what that was like. We've already shared our session, so I'm going to just start at the very beginning and sort of share the way through it. It might take a couple episodes. So the very first thing is that they had some amazing posters this year.
• 1:36
  There was one from Towson University that talked about high levels of dissociation and low levels of self compassion equating to quality of life and also equating to high levels of experience avoidance. But then on the other hand, high self compassion, high social support, and low experience avoidance predicted a higher quality of life. So that was interesting that that's even been measured. Like, I think we know that intuitively, but seeing it on paper, was like, oh, maybe I should be nicer to myself and I would enjoy my life more. Another poster was about the association between childhood trauma, emotional dysregulation, and dissociative symptoms.
• 2:31
  This was put on by the people from McLean, and it talked about how there was higher emotional dysregulation associated with an increase in symptoms of PTSD. So there was more detachment and more compartmentalization. And then also that emotional neglect was uniquely associated with emotional dysregulation, which I feel like makes perfect sense going all the way back to, like, the still face video. Right? Another poster talked about dissociation and physical pain tolerance and suicidality, that as trauma increases, so does suicidality.
• 3:15
  As physical pain is increased, so is the level of dissociation and how physical pain can count as a trauma, which increases suicidality. So that was interesting. And also, just again, we really need to make sure that we are caring for people who are hurting. And then I started the conference early because we were an EMDR class. And one of the things that they pointed out that I wanted to share was how the prefrontal cortex is not fully developed before age three.
• 3:53
  And so it can't tell the difference between the past and the present and the future, which goes back to things that we're working on in therapy about time disorientation and how when our cortex is offline, we can't tell time. And this is saying the same thing that when your cortex isn't developed yet, you can't tell time, which is why those early, early trauma memories show up as emotion. Because it's one thing to know that such and such happened when you were six or that this and that were patterns as you were growing up. But when you were younger than age three and those same things were already happening, you didn't have words and you didn't have capacity to store it in a memory according to time the way you do now. And so that's, again, why we have these emotional flashbacks, especially triggered by interactions in relationships.
• 4:56
  And this was really important information. So when therapy goes wrong, people drop out of treatment or commit suicide because they are in a decompensated state. That just felt significant. So and along these same lines about time, the other thing they pointed out in EMDR class that just, I didn't even know how to process this because we have been literally working on this in therapy. He said, If it happened last year and is not still happening, that's the past.
• 5:33
  But if it happened last year and is ongoing, that is still the present. So here's why that matters. And especially in our story that we've been working on the last two years with all this therapist grief, trauma can be in the past, but the issues and symptoms because of it be in the present. What? And then they talked about the memory networks, which is a whole different thing because they talked about how if you have a worry or have imagined something, then you have a memory network in your brain for that, And it gives you thoughts, emotional responses, and meanings, and those same trauma responses as if it happened already.
• 6:21
  And that is wild, you guys. So then the pre conference started on Friday. So I actually skipped the last day of EMDR because we're an audit student anyway, and I wanted to go to the conference. Because on Friday, there was an all day ethics thing with some of my favorite people. Well, Joan.
• 6:41
  Joan is one of my favorite people. Joan Turcas. She went first, and she talked about traumagenic dynamics. Number one, that our development is shaped by developmentally inappropriate and interpersonally inappropriate fashion. That is trauma.
• 7:03
  Did you get that? Developmentally inappropriate and interpersonally inappropriate equates with trauma. And then also the betrayal theory that someone the child relies on, trusts, or is dependent on has caused harm, both through the perpetration of what caused harm and the failure to protect them from that harm. You guys, that's so huge. And then she also acknowledged that a peer can help more than a therapist when you have peers that understand and are healthy and you're getting better together.
• 7:44
  And she talked about how important that is. And I thought that was huge, that that was mentioned at the very beginning of the conference. And then she talked about the powerless dynamic about the stigma of badness that's internalized because of the shame and how these are the dynamics of trauma, about it being inappropriate, the betrayal, the powerlessness, and the stigma of badness. And then she reminded therapists that the client walks into the room with transference already. It's not just something that happens in the session.
• 8:22
  That sometimes we're the good object, sometimes we're the bad object, sometimes were idealized or devaluized and always that drama triangle of rescuer, perpetrator, and victim. And so she reminded all the clinicians that trust is earned, just like through healing, we can earn attachment. And that the reason that survivors feel like they're always accused of being needy or always accusing themselves of being too needy is because of a regressive dependency because we never had our needs met in the first place. So it's not that we're needing too much. It's that we're still waiting for those needs to be met.
• 9:09
  And then the countertransference warnings for therapists about being overly fascinated with becoming the hero or the rescuer publicly so that it becomes a role or a title they're known for rather than an authentic relationship because the individual will feel that even if they're famous for something else. I thought that was really important. Next was Philip Kinzler, and he talked about relationship crises in therapy and how the therapeutic relationship has been shown to be more important than any technique or modality. He said there's over a hundred studies about that. We've talked about that on the podcast before.
• 9:54
  The therapeutic relationship itself is more important than technique or modality. And then he talked about how evidence based benefits are completely trivial and clinically meaningless. And that is my new favorite quote of everything ever, that it is trivial and clinically meaningless. He talked about how complex trauma is not even included. Control groups are grad students trained by other grad students.
• 10:25
  Susan Peace Bennett also writes about this in her book. So that's something we've talked about on the podcast before. But remember, evidence based treatment doesn't actually mean anything. He also talked about all of the pain and emotional flashbacks, things we've been working on in therapy and learning about, how these come through at stage two as part of what he called the empty depression, that there's a strain on the therapeutic relationship because in stage one, you're focused on safety and stabilization. But in stage two, there's literally no container big enough for that level of grief, for that level of abandonment, for that level of neglect.
• 11:10
  And I think that's part of what we have felt so brutally and so harshly and so heavily over the last year, that there is nothing big enough to hold the amount of pain that we have carried for so long. But the reason that therapy can still help is because we don't have to carry it alone and we don't have to move through it alone. And not being alone is the first step of meeting some of those needs that we've been waiting so long to have met. And then Chris Cortot talked about sexual boundary violations. And she mentioned there is a therapy exploitation link line that's called TELL, t e l l, therapy exploitation link line, and talked about how she wanted her book.
• 12:01
  She has this new book out called Sexual Boundary Violations in Therapy, and she wanted it to be victim centered because otherwise it's retraumatizing because once again, your source of help becomes your source of hurt. So it's that same relational injury that we started out with, right? And then Shevitz and Alan Shore both talked about interpersonal regressions and reenactments. They talked about how relational trauma induces an emotional disconnection within the self as well as between self and others. And I had not thought about that.
• 12:40
  Even though it's saying the same thing in another way, I had not thought about it in that way. Because these chronic ruptures are not followed by interactive repair, the right brain remains in a dysregulated state. And that was so powerful for us and so helpful because that's exactly what happened to us. When we left therapy and then the pandemic happened and we did not get a final conversation that was interactive, or after the birthday party, we did not get an interactive repair to follow-up on those questions as the pandemic hit. It literally left us in a dysregulated state for an entire year, literally in crisis, because we cannot regulate that without the interactive repair.
• 13:28
  And so it took finding another therapist who could not do that repair work because the rupture was not hers, but we were able to contain it and decide what we want to do with it and how to block that off and put it away and let it go, which ultimately meant dissociating it. Shut it off. It's all gone. The last five years wiped from our memory. Disappear.
• 13:54
  Erase. Delete. Delete. Delete. Like, however you wanna say Oh my goodness.
• 14:00
  Okay. So they talked about the neurobiological shift from the older left brain to the earlier right brain, but a rupture during this is accompanied by an instant dissipation of safety and trust, a shattering of the therapeutic alliance. You guys, it was like someone painted a picture of what we have been through the last two years. And I was so grateful just to finally have words for it. And I took those words to therapy, and we have been able to talk about these issues and make a plan.
• 14:34
  And we are in a much more stable and safe place. Let me tell you. So prememory relational trauma is relived and reenacted reenacted through nonverbal communications that neither the therapist nor the patient are aware of. That's intense. And they showed some research about the synchronization of the right brain.
• 14:59
  Like, there were graphics and everything. And then you guys, our very dear friend Laura Brown, we love her so much. She shared about vampires. Only Laura Brown could pull this off. But it was fantastic.
• 15:17
  I'm not gonna share right now, but it was so good and relevant. We will talk with her another time. Then there was a break for a poetry hour, and it was fantastic. It's the first time we've done this. I am involved in that group now, and people read different poems about trauma and dissociation, and it was fantastic.
• 15:41
  Then we went back to the panel and Shevitz was next and talked about how it's okay to acknowledge shame because it's toxic when we don't. And that's what I've been trying to say for a year, that it wasn't these people that were toxic or good, safe people in my life were not bad all of a sudden. That's not what happened. And there was nothing that made them bad or me bad. It was the shame that I was drowning in was what was toxic.
• 16:13
  And he said the opposite of that is the dignity, an internal state of peace that comes with recognition and acceptance with value and vulnerability. And so that's another piece we took back to therapy and have been able to focus on, let's just accept how much this hurts and how hard this was and how awful it was, contain it in therapy with therapy magic and how all of that works, and let's process this and get it unstuck so that we can have peace and be back in control of our own lives. Because that kind of shame that disintegrates self as in the relationship with the dysregulating other causes a phobia of hope and aversion to it because it means death. So when the person that you're in a safe relationship with and there's a rupture that's not repaired, the shame from that is so big that it actually destroys hope. And if that is not addressed, then it means death, either death of the relationship, suicide of the client, or termination, whether it's a healthy termination of services or not.
• 17:28
  But, oh my goodness, I was so grateful to have words for what's happened and what I've been through. That was an all day thing. It was very intense, but it was very well done, and I was so grateful. Also, ethics hours, check. And then Saturday.
• 17:46
  For us, Saturday started with Transferring Dynamics in the Treatment of Complex Trauma and Dissociative Disorders. It was a panel talking about the framework of treatment. What's being acted out, what's being projected, what's being communicated without using words. So Vic talked about when we get anxious, we stop thinking or there's complicit avoidance. So the therapist is actually helping the client avoid hard things, which is why we need support and consultation.
• 18:16
  You guys, let me say, we have never had consultation the way that we have it now and the support and groups we have it now, and we are rocking it. Like therapy and doing our work has gotten so much better and easier and more profound, but having that reflective space generally on our own stuff, on what is going on, or consulting together with other colleagues has helped us so much get back into a solid place that I feel like trauma just drug us out of. And when we talk about people being able through neurons and mirror neurons to feel what we're feeling and pick up on that, they're gonna hate therapy the way we hate therapy or think it's not helping the way we think it's not helping because we had a therapy trauma that we don't talk about in the room, but they experienced the effects of. And so to have that healing has not just helped us, but is also helping our clients. So good job, ISSTD.
• 19:19
  They talked about dissociative attunement. When we are attuned to them, but also dissociated with them, which leaves us in a dissociative place which is not helpful. So having to stay present even though we are in attuned place with them. Peter Maves talked about how the real relationship between the therapist and patient is full of what he called tears and repairs. So tears, by tears, he means ruptures, like mistakes or anything that disconnects from the relationship.
• 19:53
  And then repairs come through apologizing, owning the mistakes, learning from them, and correcting them. And to be aware that clients know us and our patterns and our paces even in ways that we don't always recognize. And so when they call things out to just receive that and to respond to it without directly placing value on what we think it means, receive their experience of it, and let them develop their own goals. So again, the morning started out right from the beginning that clients have the right to choose their own goals and their treatment and to develop and participate in the development of their treatment. That we can do what we can, but we can't do more.
• 20:36
  It's their work and their goals and their decisions to make. I thought that was wonderful. The next session that I went to on Saturday was misogyny, culture, and pornography in dissociative sexuality. And Christine Forner and someone else, I don't have their names. There was another woman also presenting, and I apologize that I don't have her name written down.
• 21:00
  But Christine specifically said that child sexual abuse needs to be called assault with genitals because that's what it is. It is not a sexual relationship. It is assault on the body. And I thought that was an interesting distinction. She said that most DID clients who are new to therapy don't know the difference between abuse and sexuality.
• 21:28
  They desperately want to be loved, but they don't know how. They don't know about consent, much less agency, meaning you have the right to your own body and to choose how it is touched and when it is touched and who is touching it or what you're doing. They don't have capacity to know about things like whether they are transgender or not when they first come to therapy. Because there's so much dissociation and unawareness that there's a lot of healing that has to happen as part of that process. She wasn't saying people who are transgender should be told they're not.
• 22:02
  That is not what she said. Let me be clear. And that there are a lot of new DID clients struggle with littles and are afraid of sex and how to focus on consent and attachment and safety and pleasure and bonding, that not all dissociative sex is problematic. And she talked about kink and other examples where dissociation is intentional and also consensual. So that was some intense stuff.
• 22:34
  Then the other woman that was speaking talked about how since 1995, like, people native to technology, like, have had technology their whole lives. They stay at home longer. They have fewer social skills. They're not getting their driver's licenses. When they went to a school dance, she told the story of going to the school dance and how everyone was just standing in a circle on their phones.
• 22:58
  They weren't even dancing. And then when they post on social media, it's based on what others appreciate so that they can get more positive feedback rather than posting as an expression of what they think or feel. And then it talked about how that's an example of misogyny because it's waiting for others to like them or approve of them before they matter, which is false. And so that is difficult. Then they spoke about adolescents and how it only takes 10 clicks to get to pornography.
• 23:34
  12% of websites are pornography. 25% of search engine requests are for pornography. 35% of downloads are for pornography, and it's watched an average of eleven hours a week. It changes the brain's tolerance for actual sexual activity, the neuroplasticity for how sexuality works in the brain, the dopamine that is released during sexual activity or during pornography, and it changes that so that actual sex is not as satisfying. It changes the neuro consolidation.
• 24:10
  There are changes from what's desired to what's required. So it's no longer about what is feel good. It's about a goal and a target and, like, a vision of what you think should happen during sex rather than an expression of sex. So sort of like the same thing, like a parallel to what's happening on social media where instead of it being an expression and a connection, it's instead specific content with a specific goal to get a specific approval. It also makes reality boring because of the dopamine and neural changes.
• 24:45
  The brain seeks getting off but can't actually orgasm in the context of intimacy as well. They are less able to connect with people, and it causes erectile dysfunction because of literal neural fatigue. And yet the use is addictive because of the brain changes, because it's easier, because it's less work, and because it doesn't require a relational commitment, which makes it, again, another version of misogyny. And so then Christine talked about how gentleness, kindness, and connection removes dissociation. And, again, I just want to say this like, I put a big star by this because I think when we left therapy and then had the birthday party but didn't hear back from the people again and then the pandemic hit, the two friends that stayed in touch with us, we were able to keep friends through the pandemic because we were able to stay connected with them.
• 25:49
  But those who didn't respond and then losing the therapist, and so we lost our source of gentleness, kindness, and connection. Our only source for that we lost. And losing that, I think, is why our dissociation increased, like, off the charts, and we struggled so much last year. But Christine Forner also talked about how the body doesn't naturally want to be dissociated. I mean, like, as children when we're born.
• 26:19
  It is a natural response to danger, but not a natural state of being. So we seek out pain to maintain dissociation. And so it's such an important thing to get therapy and to build your support systems so that you can increase gentleness, kindness, and connection because that's what removes dissociation. But she also gave the caution that applying care can hurt because in the past, that always felt dangerous. And so you have to go very slow and keep things very safe and also be careful about touch because it exposes pain and we literally have to build a capacity to tolerate it.
• 27:03
  It was such a powerful talk, guys. It had so much in it that I didn't even expect, but again, was so very helpful. And then after this session was the awards. And I guess we got the president's award, and I don't even know what that was or why we got it because the children were watching that part with us, and they were cheering so loud. I thought we were getting the media award for the podcast from last year.
• 27:34
  And so I let them watch because they've helped on the podcast sometimes, right? And so I thought it would be fun when they heard our name or whatever. And I thought it was because the awards, the conference was canceled last year because of the pandemic. So I thought they were just catching up the awards from last year because I never got the award from last year. I mean, I got it, they said so, but I never received, like, the actual award itself.
• 27:59
  And so I thought that's what they were sending and that's what they were talking about. But it turns out we got another award that was the president's award or something. I don't even know the right name. The children were cheering so loud. I totally missed it.
• 28:13
  Like, I couldn't hear anything. They told me it would replay with the other videos, so we can watch it later, but we missed it. But we got it, and the kids were happy, so that's something. Okay. And then after the awards was another session, and this was by Jennifer Frayed or Fried.
• 28:37
  I honestly don't know. I've heard it both ways from different people. I have contacted her. I emailed her people. She has people.
• 28:46
  I would love to have her on the podcast. Maybe then I can know how to say her name. But she gave a marvelous presentation on betrayal trauma theory. You guys, this is the woman who first well, I don't even wanna explain her story, but her parents were the ones who retaliated by starting the false memory people. And I don't even wanna tell the whole story because I wanna get any of it wrong, but I hope she'll come on the podcast and tell it her own story herself her way.
• 29:17
  But betrayal trauma theory is what she introduced following up on Peter Barish's introduction of attachment and how that has to do with dissociation and trauma response. So she talked about how our ability to evaluate trustworthiness is part of our survival. We depend on social contracts. We are harmed by cheating and by betrayal. And when we are empowered, we are very sensitive to it.
• 29:47
  When neither are options to confront or withdraw, then we focus on short term survival with a long term cost by greater dissociation like DID, for example. But then what she is doing is she has started the institution of courage and addresses institutional betrayal, which is an institutional level of a failure to respond to people dependent on the system. That failure can be a failure to prevent or respond or failure by making it more difficult to report or normalizing an environment that is unsafe or covering up wrongdoings or punishing for trauma reporting. So we're talking about like colleges and universities as an example, but other organizations and institutions as well. But colleges and universities, for example, when there is a rape on campus, how is it handled?
• 30:50
  How are people able to report it safely? How do they respond to those reports? Things like that. She said that forty six percent of students with unwanted sexual experiences reported being betrayed by their institution when trying to report it. She also talked about families as institutions, the delay in disclosure, dissociating what happened, and an increase of PTSD symptoms because of it.
• 31:21
  She said the harm of institutional betrayal is both pragmatic and psychological. Then she applied her research to COVID behaviors like mask slipping or noncompliance with masks, things like that. She also talks about DARVO. She made up that phrase about deny, attack, reverse the victim and offender. So perpetrators deny the charges, attack the victim, and then reverse things so that the offender is the victim and the victim is the offender.
• 31:58
  So they gave an example of, like, how in court trials, the victim becomes the accuser against the accused, which sounds like a victim, but they were the perpetrator. Right? So then I wanna share that later in a business meeting when we had town hall with ISSTD and people could ask questions, I asked the question of how could we as an organization of ISSTD prepare for and respond with institutional courage. I know that we can't respond to specific cases. Like legally, we can't as therapists or as an organization.
• 32:40
  So when there's a therapist who does something naughty, we are not allowed as an organization or as individual therapists to respond to that. And I know sometimes for survivors, that feels like betrayal. But that's actually a legal issue where we are constrained by that. But in a general sense, with a general statement or a general some kind of something not specific to any specific legal case, what could we do to show institutional courage ourselves? So I asked that question, and now that's on the list of things we're gonna talk about.
• 33:15
  And then there was a break. They did this thing with coffee. I'm not allowed to drink coffee. I mean, I've promised not to drink coffee. Can you imagine me on coffee?
• 33:25
  And so I don't drink coffee, so I skipped that. But then here is the fun thing. Do you guys remember? People have been emailing me asking me about psychedelic treatments. Let me tell you, as I said on the podcast already, I know nothing nothing about this.
• 33:45
  And the current state that I am in, I probably need to know nothing about this. It's just not an area where I am ready and prepared and able to deal with that. But just for you, as if reading your minds, not really, I'm not saying that like creepy, I just mean funny, it was an interesting coincidence, they had an entire session on this at the conference. So the first afternoon conference on Saturday was about psychedelic assisted psychotherapy. Now let me tell you, I got interrupted by the husband at the beginning of this, and he thought I said psychedelic, as in, like, on Doctor Who, the Daleks.
• 34:28
  And so for the rest of the weekend, the husband and the children were walking around like robots going dissociate, dissociate, like, exterminate from the Daleks. Oh my goodness. I can't even tell you, you guys. But she said there were two women presenting. I think one of them was Rochelle.
• 34:49
  I don't, I'm sorry. Things were happening so fast. I did not get their names, and I don't have their slides with me. So I don't have their correct names, so I do apologize. But they said the reason it matters to be aware of psychedelic psychotherapy is because the prohibition of psychedelics is going away.
• 35:11
  And so there's lots of hype about psychedelics, and it's important to understand the truths and the myths about psychedelics, which makes perfect sense. They talked about the limitations of research on psychedelics, including the focus of Western biomedicine, excluding psychedelics because of quote, quote, proper research. So kind of a similar thing like trauma and evidence based therapy. Right? The other thing, another limitation is that treatment is too often happening, quote, underground.
• 35:48
  And then there's no specific psychedelic research on dissociative disorders because, again, complex trauma is excluded from the research studies. So they explained that holotropic describes states of consciousness beyond those acknowledged by Western psychology or psychiatry. It combines the Greek word holos, which means whole, and tropic, which means movement towards. So holotropic means a movement towards wholeness, which I think is beautiful. So then they talked about psychedelics are mind manifesting compounds as opposed to ethiogenic, which are God revealing compounds.
• 36:38
  So psychedelics as mind manifesting compounds function as amplifiers of deep consciousness contents, making them more available for conscious processing. And that this has been shown to improve outcomes for PTSD, depression, suicidality, and anxiety, with poor outcomes when clinicians don't understand complex trauma or have unrealistic expectations. So then they talked about how psychedelic psychotherapy looks like different medicines with different signatures that accompany them, meaning certain ones usually act a certain way. But also to remember that experiences are highly individualized. So it's better to start with enantigens or empathogens that are not technically psychedelics, but which facilitate attunement, resonance, and general relationality.
• 37:39
  So to sort of practice and titrate with those first, and that to be careful that earlier life material surfaces so cases can become more complex, especially when there's complex trauma already. And then the time not to pursue psychedelic psychotherapy is when there are physiological contraindications, which is me, overly busy or stressed, which is me, and no social support or lacking caring relationships, also me. So I'm just not a candidate, which is okay with me. I'm okay with that right now. But some of you others who have been asking about it, at least that's information.
• 38:22
  And then they said some of it's the same as other therapies. Slower is faster. Less is more. Steady and consistent is most vital. So there you go.
• 38:32
  That was the closing of the exciting day of Saturday. The first session I went to on Sunday was mine. So we presented and we nailed it, you guys. We were so scared, like we threw up. We were shaking so bad.
• 38:48
  We were covered in hives, but we did it. We nailed it and it was very well received. And we so much appreciate the encouragement and support from so many who have contacted us since to appreciate our presentation. After that, we went to a session on transgenerational trauma across cultures. They talked about cultural racism and how slavery has changed shape and transitioned to prisons and how the police originally were slave catchers and just talked about the history.
• 39:23
  And I know that's a very sensitive topic for some people, but it was not at all a political speech. It was literally, this is the history of the development of the police force, and this is what the trauma of it looks like now for everyone and why that's an issue. And then also talked about the intersectionality of multiplicity. So not multiplicity like with DID, but multiplicity like with two layers connecting together of transgenerational trauma. So, like, someone who is Black and also lesbian or someone who is Latino and gay.
• 40:03
  Those kinds of things where it starts crossing where you've got lots of layers of historical trauma that's, like, all compounding together. So she talked about it's so important that we have to start relationships with other people and in our sessions with structural and cultural racism existing because they do, and pretending it doesn't is what makes it so hard to change. So then they applied the betrayal trauma theory that we talked about earlier that had been discussed the day before to this cultural trauma, where they literally developed this new theory of cultural betrayal trauma and an assessment for it called the cultural Betrayal Multidimensional Inventory for Black American Young Adults. And they talked about cultural support, acceptance, affirmation, different facets of interpersonal partner violence and being aware of that, like how some learn to submit and some learn to get aggressive and others learn to be people pleasing. They talked about attachment and security and empathy, that attachment is developed neurobiologically, that security is experienced through the predictability and appropriateness of caregiver response, and empathy is developed through experience of attunement with caregivers.
• 41:33
  And when caregivers are not responsive, it compromises the development of attunement, which compromises the development of empathy. And that exposure to harm or lack of care compromises security. And that children learn to control others and to try to control their environment instead of being present and caring for people. So in relational trauma, that looks like people trying to control other people by setting what the rules of the relationship are as opposed to actually caring for the person and being present with them within the relationship. The next session talked about military culture and how it's perpetuated in families.
• 42:22
  And you guys, I just have to be honest. This was actually a really triggering talk for me. The guy was super nice. He was saying really important stuff. But like all of my grandparents and my father and growing up in the VA, like, everybody was in the military.
• 42:40
  Our family was very much a military family. I just I couldn't do the talk. I just wasn't ready. But then we have the town hall meeting with ISSTD talking about just what's going on and what our questions were. Then we have the annual business meeting where they just shared, like, what we've been working on this year, the strategic plan, what's coming up next year, including next year in 2022.
• 43:11
  They plan on releasing the new treatment guidelines. And not just the new treatment guidelines, but one for adults, one for children, and one for TAE, transitional age youth. You guys, this is amazing. And not only that, but they plan on keeping the committee intact to continue updating, they said, like, every two years, like, to make sure that it's keeping up with research because research is coming out so quickly now. That was huge.
• 43:44
  The next session that I went to was cultural betrayal, trauma, and transgenerational legacy of inequality in marginalized youth. They talked about sexism and violence and internalized prejudice and how all of that impacts people of color. And it was an incredible talk. It was a powerful talk. And Heather Hall said at the end of it how it was just devastating, but also hopeful.
• 44:15
  And I really don't have better words for that. That was powerful. I had to leave that session early because I moderated the last two sessions of the day. And so I do not even have notes to tell you about them because I was having to do the moderating work, and there's a lot of paperwork with that. But I can tell you one session was from an indigenous people group from Canada.
• 44:43
  They were talking about the trauma of, like, the Spanish flu and forced migration in residential schools on indigenous people. It was an incredible talk. It was worth it is worth looking up and listening to. And then the last talk that I moderated was a how did she identify herself? She was very specific.
• 45:07
  I think she said I think her name was Rebecca Carter. She said she was a biracial, cisgender, transracial adoptee. And so we had a marvelous chat while we were waiting for her session to start about our family and our kids and her family and what that was like for her and our trip to Africa, all these different things. It was really a good conversation. And then her talk was about racism and white fragility and white supremacy and the trauma of all these layers.
• 45:48
  You guys, the sessions at this conference were incredible. It was good, good stuff for collective and historical trauma. Then Monday was the last day of the conference, and the first session that I went to in the morning was about working with victims of gender violence. And one of the things they talked about were blocking emotions like fear, shame, guilt, and grief, how they block our response to be able to choose or cope or stay or heal. Like, we can't get help when those are blocking us because it's in the way of talking or it's in the way of reaching out or it's in the way of leaving a domestic violence situation so that we can be safe.
• 46:33
  And that's why we have to get in touch with ourselves and become aware of our own defenses if we want to make big changes in our lives. The next talk that I went to on Sunday was about intergenerational trauma and the impact on the next generation. And you guys, this was so funny. I mean, not funny like hilarious. Funny like a surreal experience, a coincidence, because this was the woman who did the actual DNA Holocaust study that I referenced in my talk.
• 47:10
  So I talked about this the day before and explained it and tried to show that I knew what I was doing and that it was the most recent research. And then the next day, they had the actual lady presenting the actual research. And I was like, there you go. I told you it was new research. No.
• 47:30
  It was good stuff. But she was saying, you know how, a year ago, I think it was Veronica came on the podcast and talked about how trauma can be seen in our blood in the DNA level for five generations ago. So, oh, yes, there are some systems that don't have any trauma, but that trauma is from five generations ago. She said in her research that now they can track it seven generations ago. And that is a lot of trauma to be walking around with you guys.
• 48:05
  She did the study on the Holocaust survivors and their children, and she also is the one who did the study on in utero effects because of nineeleven. And so it's incredible research that she's done, and it was a fantastic presentation, and that's what we were referencing in our presentation. Then finally, the last session of the conference on Monday that I attended was a self care session about breathing and about movement and about yoga and about different care in different ways. And then ultimately, honestly, I had to leave because I needed to go be a parent, which was not self care. But guess what we did?
• 48:52
  We got a break for the first time in a year. So for the entire pandemic, you guys, if you have been listening, we have been in complete lockdown quarantine in our home with the six children, doing homeschool, not leaving our house because we had to take it so seriously because of our daughter with a restricted airway. And so we have had fifty six weeks of lockdown with them. And then the husband went to care for his parents. And so I have single parented the six children with the homeschooling everybody and trying to work because we can't eat if I don't work.
• 49:36
  And I have been doing that for ten weeks, eleven, twelve weeks, and it has been intense. And I am exhausted. And this self care talk was perfect because I am also now fully vaccinated. And so because I am fully vaccinated, I was able to actually leave. My husband's parents were doing okay enough that he was able to take a break for a few days and come home and watch the children, and I left.
• 50:07
  I came to the cabin where we were able to get in with a masked outdoor, no touch check-in. And the cabin has its own HVAC, so I'm not sharing air with anyone. I'm here by myself. I brought my own food so that I'm not going to the store even. Like, I am not going in public.
• 50:30
  And it's two days between people. So, like, there's been no one else in this whole building for two days, and I'm in the building by myself in the cabin. So we were able because I was fully vaccinated, and it's just like three hours, two hours from home where we live now. And so I was able to come to the cabin for a whole week by myself and rest. And we have done nothing but our work, which we have to do because we have to be able to pay our bills as a family.
• 51:07
  So I've still worked, but I have not had interruptions from little ones who need so much because they're children, not because they're bad. But with only having to work, I've been able to finish in the mornings and in the afternoons, we have been able to do things like catch up the podcast and do extra work for therapy and do some painting and do our own self care. We have gone for walks safely in the woods, no one else around at all, except a deer. We saw a deer cook healthy food that we could eat while it was still hot and go to sleep without little ones waking us up repeatedly in the night cause there's so many of them. All these things, it has been fabulous, you guys, and so good for us and coinciding with some really good things happening in therapy that we'll share about later.
• 51:59
  And so it was just fantastic. And so this was the perfect closing to the ISSTD conference, which was fantastic. These are the sessions I attended live either because I was interested in them, my family needed to know the information from them, or because they were requests from the podcast. And then the other sessions that the conference offered that I did not get to see, I was able to watch later on the video playback. And so I will share about those in another episode.
• 52:33
  But it was incredible, the things that they talked about and the things that they shared and the research that's coming out and the variety of topics on intergenerational trauma, gender trauma, racial trauma, collective trauma, historical trauma. There was a session on treating trauma with transgender populations. And you guys, there was just, it was fantastic. It was so well done. And I so appreciate them, and I hope you enjoyed listening and learning just some recaps, and we'll see if we can get some of these people to come on the podcast and share with us directly as well.
• 53:11
  Thank you. It was good stuff, you guys.
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to us and for all of your support for the podcast, our books, and them being donated to to survivors and the community. It means so much to us as we try to create something that's never been done before, not like this. Connection brings healing. One of the ways we practice this is in Community Together. The link for the community is in the show notes.
• 53:48
  We look forward to seeing you there while we practice caring for ourselves, caring for our family, and participating with those who also care for community. And remember, I'm just a human, not a therapist for the community, and not there for dating, and not there to be shiny happy. Less shiny, actually. I'm there to heal too. That's what peer support is all about.
• 54:16
  Being human together. So yeah, sometimes we'll see you there.