Latest / Latinx Therapy / Kim Guerra on Becoming a Revolution: "¡Soy una pinche lesbiana!"

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Kim Guerra on Becoming a Revolution: "¡Soy una pinche lesbiana!" · Latinx Therapy

• 0:01
  And let's welcome Kim Guerra.
• 0:03
  Hola, Kim.
• 0:04
  Hola.
• 0:07
  Como esta?
• 0:08
  Bien, bien.
• 0:10
  So listeners, something that we didn't mention in the intro is that Kim and I actually are family friends.
• 0:17
  We've known each other for quite a few years, more than anything, she knows my younger brother very well.
• 0:23
  So we go, we go way back.
• 0:27
  Si, un abrazo.
• 0:28
  Shout out to Kim.
• 0:31
  Bueno, Kim, it's so good to see you here and to be with you so that we could learn more about you because you're as when we were preparing for this episode, I was telling you
• 0:41
  like, where do we start?
• 0:42
  Like there's so much with you because as you all heard, like Kim is not only a poet, Kim is also a therapist.
• 0:51
  so there's there's so many different experiences that Kim has and
• 0:57
  All of these experiences come with layers of healing and stories that can resonate with a lot of us.
• 1:05
  And so I think, let's go ahead and jump right into it, Kim.
• 1:09
  I was very impacted by many aspects of your stories, and one being when learning that you grew up from a very religious family, and doing a...
• 1:22
  the very religious things.
• 1:24
  And I'm wondering if you can talk to us from there and your experience of what beliefs you were instilled in and what ended up happening.
• 1:37
  Thank you for having me.
• 1:38
  I'm very grateful to be here.
• 1:39
  I feel very grateful for the work that you do.
• 1:43
  This is one of the many important conversations I feel like we need to have or I needed to hear growing up, especially growing up in a religious, very strict upbringing.
• 1:53
  And right now when people see me like this, they call me crazy, like they don't connect, that is also part of the roots many of us grew up in growing up in the church.
• 2:03
  I grew up, like it was a Catholic background, when little, and then my family started going to like an evangelical Pentecostal church after my mom immigrated.
• 2:15
  She was crossing the border and she made a promise to God saying like, okay, if I can cross,
• 2:22
  without getting deported and being sent back, I will go to church and I'll take my family.
• 2:28
  So that's how my family started going to a church when my mom, when we got back to the States.
• 2:33
  In the beginning, it was, it was like a source of hope, but then it became a source of love and hate and fear and judgment and shame all put together in the name of God.
• 2:46
  For me, I've always,
• 2:50
  I've always pursued a personal, spiritual relationship.
• 2:53
  So sometimes like I would read the Bible and I would tell people at church, Hey, like what you're doing here and how you're acting.
• 2:58
  It's not how what the Bible says.
• 3:00
  And they would get mad at me.
• 3:02
  I start to get more involved, no, but I was still trying really hard to be like this good Christian woman.
• 3:11
  And that is part of what led me to, I was in university being a good Christian girl.
• 3:17
  was in the
• 3:18
  I was like the president of the Christian club in my university.
• 3:21
  for me, so much of what kept me there was one, like the spiritual experiences I was having, tambien it was tied always to shame.
• 3:31
  It was always tied to this aim for perfection, this aim for trying to, in a way I felt that that was a way.
• 3:42
  out of my trauma and suffering that I grew up with because there was a lot of trauma and abuse in my house.
• 3:49
  And this gave me hope to come again.
• 3:53
  But then it was another type of trauma.
• 3:57
  Yeah, thank you for sharing that.
• 4:02
  think it's something that as a therapist, I've heard about as well with how my clients have been impacted by family, community, church.
• 4:11
  And we're also not creating this episode to shame anybody that's in the church and that has a positive experience.
• 4:19
  I think we all know or should know that there's different ways of practicing and different, I think, beliefs that each church households.
• 4:29
  And so we're listening to Kim's side of the story.
• 4:33
  So Kim, another aspect of this, que te inculcaron, right, ese marianismo, that you are
• 4:41
  self-sacrificial, and that you prioritize the needs of other people, and that you have a role in life here on earth as a woman.
• 4:52
  And so you ended up getting married.
• 4:55
  When did you figure out like, wow, like this isn't the life that is true for me?
• 5:11
  So I had made up my mind, I'm like, I don't wanna be like that, I don't wanna live like that.
• 5:15
  Yo decía desde chica, me voy ir un rancho, voy a adoptar animales, unas cabras, unas gallinas, y voy a adoptar bebés yo solita y voy a estar feliz.
• 5:23
  And then I started getting very involved in the church.
• 5:27
  It was like the purity culture and it was a very laid out path.
• 5:34
  for me, it was like, okay, you start dating and you're dating to marry and then you don't have sex until you get married.
• 5:40
  And I remember I told my mom, you know, I like started dating the president of the Christian club and the worship, he was a worship leader and everybody was like this, like,
• 5:50
  you know, power Christian couple, like, my goodness.
• 5:54
  And, you know, the pressure to be a good example.
• 5:58
  I remember I told my mom like, okay, after college,
• 6:02
  I want to travel and I want to pursue my career.
• 6:06
  And I remember she said like, no, so you're graduating.
• 6:09
  And the only way you can get out of my house is if you get married.
• 6:13
  And I knew that I couldn't go back to that house because the house that I was trying to escape the abuse and escape the, so I remember feeling this pressure from my mom, from the
• 6:24
  church, from the community that I was a part of.
• 6:27
  It's like, okay, kind of like my way out and my way forward.
• 6:32
  is to get married and then I'm gonna make everybody happy and I'm going to check off all the lists.
• 6:38
  I'm like, okay, I graduated from high school, I graduated from college, I got married, I waited till sex to have, no, I waited for sex, I waited to get married to have sex.
• 6:48
  And all of these things that I was like, okay, I'm just checking it off so that I can make others happy and others proud and in a way, prove that I'm worthy of love and acceptance.
• 7:01
  And that was also part of like the calladita culture where I was just like, was okay.
• 7:08
  una niña buena, una niña calladita, una mujer decente.
• 7:13
  Then I felt like that was gonna take my pain and my trauma and my suffering away.
• 7:21
  Y cuando entre al matrimonio, I also noticed how everybody was then treating me
• 7:31
  different like a señora like okay now you're married now you have to serve your husband now your main role and your main purpose in life is to make sure that he's okay i remember
• 7:42
  i wrote about this in the book that my mom and my grandma came to visit and it's like we were newlyweds and i was like okay i told my mom he was still sleeping and i'm like okay
• 7:55
  and then i go let's do this i'm like okay
• 8:07
  And was just like, it's like not the end of the world.
• 8:23
  And they were looking at me like.
• 8:25
  kind of like one ashamed of me like, my gosh, what type of wife did we raise you to be?
• 8:31
  And then another part, little, like little girls who were doing a little like, my gosh, okay, let's They didn't tell anyone.
• 8:40
  So I just kept noticing that and I also started to go to therapy during that time and I started going to get my master's for therapy and that's when I started to learn more
• 8:52
  about.
• 8:54
  having agency and standing up for myself, setting boundaries and not shrinking.
• 9:00
  And I realized that I spent so much of my life shrinking and so much of my life serving others and feeling that was the only way people would love me.
• 9:12
  And I also started to learn how like the institution of religion and the church was not the only way for me to have a...
• 9:21
  a relationship or experience with God and with faith and to also get in touch with my queerness during this time and kind of stepping out of those of the boxes that I was
• 9:39
  raised in and learning more about me, learning more about life.
• 9:45
  I can't go.
• 9:49
  back after knowing this and seeing this.
• 9:54
  I got married at 22, like a week after I graduated college.
• 9:59
  And then I started my masters when I was like during this process when I was 22, 23.
• 10:09
  And I got divorced at 24.
• 10:11
  No, sorry, 26.
• 10:13
  How did your family take the divorce?
• 10:19
  It was very painful, very lonely.
• 10:22
  I got so much shame.
• 10:24
  Shame from my family, shame from the church, shame from most of the people that were in my life at that time.
• 10:32
  que me juzgaron muy fuerte and made me feel like I was a failure for giving up.
• 10:40
  And they did not understand that instead of giving up, I felt like I was finally fighting for me.
• 10:49
  finally having the hope and strength to give me the life and the love that I deserved.
• 10:55
  también the marriages that I was in was not a healthy one and it was something that towards the end I would call my mom every day crying and I would be like, I can't, like,
• 11:06
  now this now this And even after calling and, you know, kind of asking for help from my family, from my parents,
• 11:16
  It was always like, poor thing, what will people what will people say, but like what will God in the Bible, he says this.
• 11:25
  And so it got to the point where I had to just be like, nobody else is living this life and nobody else is experiencing what I'm experiencing right now.
• 11:36
  And I'm the only one that can and will fight for me in this way right now.
• 11:43
  So I stopped.
• 11:45
  talking to my family about it.
• 11:48
  And I remember I like printed out the divorce papers.
• 11:53
  Solita y me encargue de hacer mi research.
• 11:56
  And I did it myself and it wasn't until the divorce was finalized that I went to my family.
• 12:02
  It was actually finalized during my birthday.
• 12:04
  So I was like, my birthday gift to myself is this divorce, this liberation.
• 12:09
  Ya les dije, me pueden apoyar o no, pero ya está hecho.
• 12:13
  It's decision.
• 12:14
  I'm happy.
• 12:15
  This is one of the proudest moments of my life.
• 12:18
  So it's like, I'm going to go celebrate.
• 12:20
  You do what you got to do.
• 12:21
  Yes.
• 12:23
  just dropped the mic on them and you're like, you know, I'm free.
• 12:27
  This is something that you the to do and you made that choice.
• 12:31
  And it wasn't easy because I think when you confronted your family, you knew you were risking losing them at that point.
• 12:38
  And that would have been on them.
• 12:40
  Exactly.
• 12:43
  We also talked offline a little bit more about the role your grandma played in all this.
• 12:49
  And so I'm wondering as you were exploring your queerness, what role did she play in your life?
• 12:57
  It's like the risk of losing them.
• 13:01
  I was like, I would not, I'd rather lose everything in anyone, but not lose myself again.
• 13:07
  And that was part of stepping into my queerness too.
• 13:12
  that part of my therapy was to myself, accept myself, love myself.
• 13:29
  Because, as I a step forward, a step back, but that also helps me that
• 13:40
  and my identity has been a process for me.
• 13:43
  It's also a process for them.
• 13:49
  It's like conflicting for them to know.
• 13:52
  I remember when my grandma, like somebody outed me to my grandmother when I had my first girlfriend and she called me saying, she was just like really, really harsh.
• 14:05
  And I grew up in a very homophobic home.
• 14:13
  And so those were kind of like some of the first responses that I got from them.
• 14:19
  I remember that my uncle actually talked to my grandma and told her, if you love her, the most important thing is that you want to see her happy.
• 14:29
  And if she's happy being who she is and loving who she loves, and you want to be part of that, you need to change the way that you're acting.
• 14:38
  And she called me and she apologized.
• 14:45
  I feel like even if she doesn't understand everything, as long as somebody remains curious, it opens up doors to have conversations that are productive and constructive.
• 14:58
  So she goes back and forth with supporting you.
• 15:02
  And I think it's a matter of her also dealing with
• 15:06
  with all that Marianism and all her times.
• 15:35
  you know, those moments when she would get mad that others would offend you.
• 15:41
  And what were those moments like with your Abuelita?
• 15:45
  There's a story that I laugh about and I wrote about this in the book, that there's this time that she was talking to my aunt and my aunt was like, Kim got the fucking family's
• 16:01
  And then my mom's like, Mi Tita is like, como se atreve a decirte una pinche lesbiana, le voy a partir su madre, yo ya le dije que si te vuelve a una pinche lesbiana otra vez, le
• 16:10
  voy a partir su madre.
• 16:12
  And at first I was like getting mad, like with her, I'm like, yeah, yeah, you tell her, you stand up for me, gracias tita.
• 16:18
  And then I was like, no, I'm like, pero si soy una pinche lesbiana, y no hay nada malo, está diciendo la verdad.
• 16:25
  I'm like, I had to kind of reframe it myself too, where I'm just like, sometimes like,
• 16:45
  My grandma was like listening and I was like going off like,
• 16:59
  Okay, But all way I'm going to break her mother.
• 17:03
  I was like, okay, you do what you want.
• 17:06
  tried.
• 17:06
  like, I tried.
• 17:09
  It's one of the many times where she pops up and is trying to trying to do her best.
• 17:18
  She's figuring it out.
• 17:20
  But there it it is.
• 17:21
  No, beautiful.
• 17:23
  To have that support when it's when it's expressed.
• 17:29
  It was we'll go ahead and talk a little bit now about your book, your newest book.
• 17:35
  And people can see it through my blur, Badass Bonita, Break the Silence Become a Revolution, which goes hand in hand with your grandma's energy and your energy as well.
• 17:46
  think this is inspirational here.
• 17:49
  Unearth Your Inner Guerrera.
• 17:51
  So what was the inspiration for this book?
• 17:54
  And when did you start?
• 17:57
  I don't know if I should ask about the concept or when did you start writing it?
• 18:00
  book, okay, it's like the book that I've always wanted to write, but I've always been afraid to.
• 18:12
  but if I'm honest with you, I kept looking for
• 18:23
  Like books that talked about Latinas and healing and mental health and the specific things that we were dealing with so that I can bring that to my class and my research and the
• 18:32
  type of work that I wanted to do.
• 18:34
  I kept looking, looking, looking and I very, very few things.
• 18:38
  And the things that I did find at the time were either very old and written by white people or simply very recent and written by white people.
• 18:47
  So I just like kept getting so frustrated and I was like, okay, go.
• 18:50
  There's very specific things that I'm looking for that I need.
• 18:52
  for this research.
• 18:54
  I'm going to have to write it myself.
• 18:56
  But I said it like joking before I wrote anything, before I thought I could do something like that.
• 19:07
  But I just remember feeling like there was something missing that I was like, if nobody does it, I'm going to have to do it myself.
• 19:13
  And the years I started writing and I started finding my voice.
• 19:18
  Empecé a trabajar con mujeres, mujeres mariposas, the cohort program, the coaching program.
• 19:24
  And there's very specific things que para mí eran importante compartir.
• 19:31
  que I felt like it was like medicine for me and my healing journey that I wanted to share with other people in their healing journey.
• 19:39
  Con las palabras, con las historias, con el contexto de nuestra cultura, de nuestra, like very, como,
• 19:50
  a combination that doesn't need to be into our experiences.
• 19:56
  A knowing that usually is found that often.
• 20:05
  It's like a book.
• 20:09
  It's like a memoir.
• 20:11
  It's like self-help.
• 20:13
  It's educational.
• 20:16
  I saw the CDC cited in there too.
• 20:20
  It's beautiful.
• 20:21
  know, I like the demos.
• 20:24
  We were this abuso trauma pseudo clients of the system as well.
• 20:32
  It was when it show Kim the Felicito.
• 20:36
  It is an orgo.
• 20:37
  I'm so proud of you of what you have birthed, not just like your coaching programs, but obviously your books.
• 20:43
  And this is, you know, community.
• 20:45
  This is truly healing.
• 20:47
  As I was reading it, I was just like, wow, like
• 20:49
  I want to cry, but I have to hold it together because I don't have time right now.
• 20:55
  But I had to put some chapters down because see, see that's what you're thinking.
• 20:59
  don't want it to be like, come on, see a self help book.
• 21:03
  No, it's come okay.
• 21:04
  Checking off the boxes.
• 21:05
  No, it's come okay.
• 21:06
  Okay.
• 21:07
  I want it to be full of like the, the, the, highlights and highlights.
• 21:10
  And it is a book that you will have to put down.
• 21:12
  I don't want it to be a book that you read all in one sitting.
• 21:15
  that you're to have to read book book and take your time.
• 21:19
  You want to be embraced and you embrace too.
• 21:22
  you're to be this book, I feel, it's going to put you work a little bit in your heart, but you're going feel like you're drowning, but rather like you're sailing deep waters and
• 21:38
  you're going drown and it's going to teach you to swim better.
• 21:42
  and accompany you your way as you learn to love yourself and set yourself free.
• 21:47
  It talks about using our voice, about not being quiet, especially knowing how harmful it is for us when we hold in our truths, when we don't call out abuse, when we don't hold
• 22:02
  people accountable, when we don't hold ourselves accountable for our own life and for our own decisions.
• 22:08
  So I want it to be a book that you go to.
• 22:11
  over and over again and that every time you pick it up, it's to a little more.
• 22:15
  That's right, that was my experience of it and I think that it's going to be very well received out in the community and so it's not even out yet, it's out on September 17th,
• 22:27
  right?
• 22:28
  Yes.
• 22:30
  Yeah, so I think by the time this episode is out, it will likely be out, Kim, one of the...
• 22:38
  Almost final questions that I have is also, you know, from your book and your experience for somebody that has walked through a similar thing that you have when it comes to
• 22:50
  religion and sexuality and shame and family.
• 22:54
  What are some, what's some guidance that you can give to people listening that can resonate?
• 22:59
  First thing is if you believe in a higher power, if you believe in God, if you are a person that
• 23:07
  has faith and or practices, any spiritual practices, come on, I want you to know that you are that you are loved and that you are worthy and deserving of a love that does not
• 23:20
  include shame for who you love and who you are.
• 23:23
  But I mean, like, thankfully, I always felt loved by the God that I believe in.
• 23:30
  And I always felt supported in my spiritual walk.
• 23:33
  But I also met many people that have been hurt.
• 23:36
  and blamed and hated and shamed and oppressed by people who say they believe in a loving God and then they're very hateful towards people that are different.
• 23:47
  So I want the first thing people to know is like to take away the shame from your sexuality, from your orientation.
• 23:54
  If you are gay, lesbian, pan, sapphic, trans, non-binary, you are loved and you are worthy of love.
• 24:02
  I think more and more now there's different communities that have
• 24:06
  sprung up for people who want to practice faith and spirituality that does not include hate and shame and fear.
• 24:13
  I always think that that's something that there needs to be a bridge where people can practice any spiritual practices that they want and not feel that it has to exclude their
• 24:23
  queerness or their full expression of self.
• 24:26
  And I also am a firm believer in making homophobes racist, misogynist, pissed off by how free.
• 24:32
  and liberated we are and how much we love each other.
• 24:35
  si, que las tias criticonas, las personas de la iglesia, muchas personas that get pissed off by seeing me happy and by seeing me be free and by seeing me be loved and love
• 24:46
  somebody.
• 24:47
  Para mi eso me da más fuerza and I hope that it gives you strength too that you're making people uncomfortable with your freedom.
• 24:54
  You're making people uncomfortable by you loving you.
• 24:57
  The systems of oppression thrive when they...
• 25:00
  see that the people they're trying to oppress, oppressing themselves when we internalize that oppression and we see ourselves through the eyes of the oppressors, that's when you
• 25:10
  have a lot of internalized homophobia ourselves or we hate ourselves for being queer, for being gay, for being trans.
• 25:17
  And there's so many times that when we unlearn that internalized oppression, that's when everything changes.
• 25:27
  But it starts many times in
• 25:30
  and believing that we are worthy of love and worthy of happiness and peace and joy and safety.
• 25:37
  Yeah, yeah, thank you.
• 25:39
  And I think, you know, for people that are allies like myself, I think it's also important for us whether we are a friend of somebody, a relative, an acquaintance, that we also step
• 25:52
  into our privileges that, you know, society holds for us.
• 25:58
  and that we use our voice, we use our bodies to help, you know, as well to defend, you know, in whatever way is also safe for you.
• 26:10
  But definitely that is safe for them as well, right, that we don't normalize this any hate, we don't normalize discrimination.
• 26:20
  And we do what we can in those moments to stop the hate.
• 26:23
  And we are greater in numbers as well.
• 26:26
  So when people psychologically start seeing other people stand up for what is right, people will step in, you know, thanks to your voice as well.
• 26:35
  So.
• 26:36
  Yes.
• 26:36
  Thank you for saying that because they're okay.
• 26:38
  I'm kind of the most.
• 26:39
  There's so much privilege in being in a straight, hetero couple.
• 26:45
  put him.
• 26:45
  I was like married.
• 26:48
  was Christian.
• 26:49
  I was married to a white man.
• 26:52
  Those things.
• 26:53
  At that time, I didn't know, but gave me so much privilege.
• 26:58
  treated me differently and better because of those things.
• 27:02
  Not only in society, but in my family.
• 27:05
  Like, look, a beautiful Christian with a white man, a white They're like, you made it.
• 27:12
  You are making all of us proud.
• 27:17
  And when I said no to all of that,
• 27:23
  and embrace my queerness and I started to be in queer relationships and when I was not identified as the good Christian girl anymore, the way that those privileges were
• 27:36
  stripped, I felt the weight of that so strong in my life.
• 27:44
  When you have those privileges, use it.
• 27:49
  do not, for me it helped so much when I was going through my process, like to have people in my family, in my community step up and step in for me.
• 27:58
  Like my uncle who talked to my grandma, he'll go, how you're acting is not okay.
• 28:03
  And if you love her, you gotta change what you're doing.
• 28:05
  If he had not spoken to her, I don't know if my grandma and I would be speaking today.
• 28:10
  If my brother had not stepped in with my mother and said, you're treating her differently because she has a queer partner and that makes you uncomfortable.
• 28:18
  Like if you're going to treat her that way, you're going to treat all of us that way.
• 28:21
  Or you're going to treat her the way you're treating all of us.
• 28:24
  Pero la verdad que se necesita tener esas conversaciones entre you and to be an ally, especialmente en nuestras familias, que allí empieza muchas revoluciones.
• 28:38
  Sí.
• 28:38
  Bueno, Kim, muchísimas gracias por tu tiempo, por compartir parte bien pequeña de tu historia.
• 28:46
  Can you please share where people can learn more about what you're up to, where they can buy the book, just where they can find you?
• 28:54
  can find me on Instagram, Barra Se Que Bonita, on TikTok.
• 28:59
  You can find the book too on, well, everywhere books are sold, September 17th.
• 29:04
  You can pre-order it now and get a free sticker.
• 29:09
  can also email me, lo que sea.
• 29:11
  I'm very excited.
• 29:12
  I'm very grateful for this process.
• 29:15
  It's been a long time coming.
• 29:17
  And so I look forward to also seeing, you know, all the beautiful things come your way from this and in the future, but little by little, right?
• 29:27
  Like we're going to enjoy the present moment, the launch of this.
• 29:30
  And yeah, I'm going to have all of Kim's information in the description as always.
• 29:36
  This episode is on YouTube for those of us listening on the podcast.
• 29:41
  And Kim, thank you I you very and congratulations.
• 29:45
  Thank you for who you are and what you do.
• 29:48
  All right.
• 29:50
  Until next time.