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Heart-Led Healthcare Revolution with Dr. Barbi Phelps-Sandall · The Heart-Led Business Show

• 0:01
  Speaker: Welcome to The Heart-Led Business Show, where compassion meets commerce and leaders lead with love.
• 0:09
  Speaker: Join your host, Tom Jackobs, as he delves into the insightful conversations with visionary business leaders who defy the status quo, putting humanity first and profit second.
• 0:20
  Speaker: From heartfelt strategies to inspiring stories, this podcast is your compass in the world of conscious capitalism.
• 0:29
  Speaker: So buckle up and let your heart guide your business journey.
• 0:36
  Tom Jackobs: Well welcome everybody to the Heart-Led Business Show where passion meets purpose.
• 0:41
  Tom Jackobs: And today we're diving into the delightful world of Barbi Phelps-Sandall from the charming corners of Cleveland, Ohio, to the vibrant pursuits of integrative OB-GYN.
• 0:52
  Tom Jackobs: Barbi's journey is as colorful as a painter's palette.
• 0:57
  Tom Jackobs: With 25 years of heartfelt experience, she's committed to elevating quality of life for her patients.
• 1:04
  Tom Jackobs: Plus she's had a little adventure sprinkled in like scuba diving in the Galapagos, and sharing laughter with international students.
• 1:12
  Tom Jackobs: So grab your headphones and get ready to be inspired by a woman who truly embodies the spirit of a heart-led business.
• 1:20
  Tom Jackobs: Barbi, welcome to the show.
• 1:23
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Thank you so much for having me, Tom.
• 1:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's delightful to be here.
• 1:26
  Tom Jackobs: I am so glad you're here as well, and I'm really anticipating today's conversation as well because I love speaking with medical doctors who are transitioning from the traditional medical practice into integrative, regenerative, functional, and just the more holistic approach to medicine.
• 1:47
  Tom Jackobs: So I'm excited to talk to you about how you're doing that, because I know you're in the process and then how that's unfolding as you go along.
• 1:56
  Tom Jackobs: So I'm really excited about today, but first, I always like to ask, what's your definition of a heart-led business?
• 2:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: My definition of a heart-led business includes listening clarifying.
• 2:15
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And looking for solutions.
• 2:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I know those are bullet points, but that's the core of it.
• 2:22
  Tom Jackobs: Could you dive into each one of those a little bit more and just what's your vision of what good listening, clarification, and finding the solution really looks like.
• 2:33
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: when I'm meeting with a patient, especially for the first time really with every appointment, but with the first time in particular, I look them straight in the eye.
• 2:42
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We're sitting level, and I asked them why they came in today what did they expect to get from the appointment.
• 2:52
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And then I really have to pay attention to what they're saying.
• 2:57
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Um, I've been to doctor's appointments before where they were typing on a computer while they're talking to me and they're not looking at me, and it's like, I don't really need to be in the room.
• 3:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You know, they can type away what they want.
• 3:09
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: There was no connection.
• 3:12
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 3:13
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And listening attentively does take a lot of energy, so you really have to focus in and still kind of maintain so that you can get through the rest of the day too.
• 3:25
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So sometimes I jot down a word or two on a piece of paper while they're talking, but I try not to take my eyes off of theirs.
• 3:33
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Once they get done and most of the time it's about two, two and a half minutes.
• 3:38
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's surprising, it seems longer when it's going on, but once they're done, I try to echo back to them what I heard.
• 3:47
  Tom Jackobs: Uh, love that.
• 3:49
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: They might make changes in the conversation then, but that's how you get a little deeper.
• 3:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: 'cause oftentimes the first thing somebody says to you isn't really what they mean.
• 3:59
  Tom Jackobs: Yep.
• 4:00
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And it could just be the verbiage, but it could be they really came in for something else, but they needed an easy way to back into it.
• 4:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So that clarification is the key.
• 4:12
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 4:13
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 4:14
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And then we talk about options for fixing the problem.
• 4:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I usually give people a list from the easiest thing to start with, down to maybe more definitive treatment.
• 4:29
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: this is all based on, starts off with lifestyle and then we work down to different options.
• 4:36
  Tom Jackobs: Oh.
• 4:37
  Tom Jackobs: Nice.
• 4:38
  Tom Jackobs: that's a really great framework and just for really good communication in general.
• 4:44
  Tom Jackobs: And definitely something that, I teach in my sales training as well, is that active listening, the, I call it mirroring back.
• 4:52
  Tom Jackobs: But the clarification, like you said, that is so critical even in, in personal relationships when you're speaking to somebody, like when I'm talking to my mom or someone, mom, let me just repeat back what I heard you say was, and then a lot of times it wasn't like I heard something different than what she was communicating or something like that.
• 5:13
  Tom Jackobs: And so it saved so much anguish over the years.
• 5:18
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Uh, no, absolutely, and it has to be done in a very open, Receiving way.
• 5:25
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's not the matter of saying, what do you mean by that?
• 5:28
  Tom Jackobs: Right.
• 5:28
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's really, you know, letting somebody explain where they're coming from.
• 5:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And you have to feel comfortable and safe too.
• 5:38
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's with that opener where they're allowed to talk, it kind of lets them settle in a little bit.
• 5:44
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 5:44
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 5:45
  Tom Jackobs: And that's brilliant.
• 5:46
  Tom Jackobs: That's awesome.
• 5:47
  Tom Jackobs: So, shifting gears a little bit now, tell us a little bit about your business and what makes it heart-led.
• 5:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I am an OB-GYN, a general OB-GYN, that, went on and got a, did a fellowship training at the University of Arizona in integrative medicine Prevention has always been my passion.
• 6:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: medicine is my second career.
• 6:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was a dental hygienist before going to medical school, and the whole field of dental hygiene is the only one that I'm aware of that is based solely on prevention,
• 6:19
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 6:19
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: and that's where it all started.
• 6:21
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And so it's near and dear to my heart.
• 6:23
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I've just spread it beyond dentition.
• 6:26
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So with setting up my practice, the idea was to really work on people, giving people permission to take care of themselves, my women patients in particular.
• 6:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But sometimes a husband is brought along and they're a part of the conversation sometimes.
• 6:45
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But anyway, the whole idea is we work together.
• 6:48
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: If you work on taking better care of yourself, I can work on helping you on that journey.
• 6:55
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 6:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's often not as specific as this, that I'm verbalizing it to them that way, but I'm giving them ideas to help solve their problems with my guidance.
• 7:07
  Tom Jackobs: Hmm.
• 7:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That's worked really well.
• 7:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So I've had this based practice for a number of years.
• 7:16
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Insurance doesn't pay well, especially to individual doctors.
• 7:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We don't have anybody to do collective bargaining for us, and I certainly can't do that myself.
• 7:25
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You're working your tail off because time is money, and I hate that expression, but it is true when you have a business model like that.
• 7:34
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I came to a point where I need to do something a little bit different.
• 7:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So I started offering concierge services and that helped quite a bit, and it gave me more time to talk with patients.
• 7:49
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I became more familiar with them.
• 7:51
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: The more I know about them, the more I can do for them, the more I can pick up on things when there is a problem.
• 7:58
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Um, for example, if a patient of mine ends up in the emergency room.
• 8:04
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I know them really well.
• 8:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And if a doctor calls me says, your patient's here.
• 8:09
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: These are the problems.
• 8:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: This is what I'm doing.
• 8:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Is there anything else?
• 8:14
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I can say, okay, stop right there.
• 8:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: this is who she is.
• 8:19
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: This is a chronic problem.
• 8:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's not new.
• 8:21
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You don't need to do the million dollar workup for them, right?
• 8:26
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But do these simple lab tests, and as long as you think she's stable.
• 8:30
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And that's key obviously.
• 8:32
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: She can go home.
• 8:33
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I can see her in the office tomorrow.
• 8:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I keep my patients outta the emergency room as much as possible.
• 8:41
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And sometimes if they get, if they contact me and the answering service is working right, and patients are cognizant that they can use the answering service, and if I talk with them, I can even save them a trip into the emergency room.
• 8:53
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But it's because I know them.
• 8:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: If it's somebody I don't know as well, I may tell them, yeah, you need to go in and be checked out, get a workup done.
• 9:01
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 9:02
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: when you know somebody and you know their history, you've gotten along for a number of years.
• 9:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It changes the whole scenario.
• 9:10
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 9:10
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 9:12
  Tom Jackobs: So in that insurance model, how many patients would you have to see a day to survive as a business on average?
• 9:22
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Yeah, I try not to look at the numbers because then you get from your heartfelt business.
• 9:27
  Tom Jackobs: True.
• 9:28
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: but we were seeing between 25 and 30.
• 9:32
  Tom Jackobs: Wow.
• 9:32
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It was painful.
• 9:33
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's very painful.
• 9:34
  Tom Jackobs: That is painful.
• 9:35
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 9:36
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 9:36
  Tom Jackobs: Wow.
• 9:37
  Tom Jackobs: So good that you've, moved out of that or moving outta that and doing the concierge.
• 9:42
  Tom Jackobs: Now, something else that I wanna unpack a little bit.
• 9:45
  Tom Jackobs: So you transitioned from being a dental hygienist to an OB-GYN, which is in my mind anyway, that's a little bit of a stretch.
• 9:55
  Tom Jackobs: Like what, what was, what was it the transition, like for you?
• 9:59
  Tom Jackobs: Had you always wanted to be an OB-GYN and or how, how did that work out for you?
• 10:05
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I had delusions of grandeur as a freshman in medical school mean in um, undergrad that I wanted to become a doctor, but I didn't have financial support.
• 10:15
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I didn't have emotional support.
• 10:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was floating on my own.
• 10:19
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I did this at Ohio State, which there were, 48,000 of us on campus at the time.
• 10:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was really bobbing along and that's about it.
• 10:27
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So once reality set in and I was gonna graduate in a few years, I needed to find something that I could really do.
• 10:37
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And so I was just looking around at the health professions.
• 10:41
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I didn't think I wanted to be a nurse because my mother had very bad things to say about the job itself.
• 10:48
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I was in a sorority and eight of the members were in the dental hygiene program.
• 10:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And since I had this background in biology and with their influence, I said, yeah, this looks pretty interesting and you can make a good living on it.
• 11:05
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: support yourself with it.
• 11:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I applied and fortunately got in.
• 11:09
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It was a grueling two years.
• 11:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I started to realize what was deep inside, and if you reach deep inside, you can do almost anything.
• 11:19
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 11:19
  Tom Jackobs: Oh, that's great.
• 11:21
  Tom Jackobs: Then the transition, how did you transition then to.
• 11:23
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: some of the dentists that I work for, suggested I look at going to medical school, or excuse me, dental school and one in particular was very supportive, very influential on me.
• 11:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: He had a daughter that was just a few years younger than me with the same dilemma, really wanted to go to medical school, but was struggling a little bit.
• 11:44
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So he said, I, I think you got a lot more to give and you're obviously interested in doing that, so why don't you take a look around.
• 11:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But he said, I'm very sorry that I never looked into medicine as a career myself.
• 11:59
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So he encouraged me to be a little more open-minded.
• 12:02
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: He had a patient who was a professor at one of the local universities.
• 12:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: He taught chemistry He was also a guidance counselor for students.
• 12:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So he suggested I go and meet with him, which I did.
• 12:14
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And again, a lot of great support there.
• 12:18
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: nobody, painted any rosy pictures.
• 12:21
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: He said, it's gonna be a challenge, it's gonna be tough, but I think you really, can do it.
• 12:28
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So instead of going into dentistry, I applied to medical school.
• 12:32
  Tom Jackobs: That's awesome.
• 12:33
  Tom Jackobs: And the specialty of OB-GYN.
• 12:35
  Tom Jackobs: Why?
• 12:36
  Tom Jackobs: Why that specialty?
• 12:38
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was really interested in genetics and my, in my background in biology, I took a lot of genetics classes and so that's how I got there.
• 12:47
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: My thoughts were that I would eventually do a fellowship in medical genetics.
• 12:52
  Tom Jackobs: Oh.
• 12:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: After going through medical and starting at age 33, going through medical school and then residency, and I started talking about fellowships and my husband said, don't even bring it up.
• 13:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Don't bring that f word up.
• 13:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I it was another three years beyond where I was.
• 13:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I said, all right, maybe I can step back, work for a while, rethink this.
• 13:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And then out in practice, which was great.
• 13:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was really enjoying it.
• 13:22
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And then I heard about Andrew Weil's', program in integrative medicine.
• 13:27
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I knew about it for a few years before I decided to make the jump and apply to it.
• 13:32
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: it's a two year program.
• 13:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You spend three years in two, excuse me, three weeks in Tucson during that time with them.
• 13:40
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But all the rest of it was interactive.
• 13:42
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And that allowed me to do it.
• 13:44
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I was still holding down the fort.
• 13:46
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But I was able to get through this program, which was just absolutely amazing.
• 13:50
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And it wasn't a fluffy thing being online.
• 13:53
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We had to take tests along the way and you had to pass things.
• 13:57
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: you wouldn't graduate from the program.
• 14:00
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 14:00
  Tom Jackobs: We hope so.
• 14:01
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Yeah.
• 14:02
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: and some of it really kicks your butt, but we got through it.
• 14:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I think everybody, one person dropped out along the way in my class, but everybody else graduated.
• 14:13
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We're still interconnected.
• 14:15
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: it's pretty wonderful.
• 14:17
  Tom Jackobs: Well, that's great.
• 14:18
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 14:18
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And we learned a lot.
• 14:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It really taught me to be more open-minded.
• 14:23
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We know what Western medicine is, training the United States, definitely.
• 14:27
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But we learned a little bit about traditional Chinese medicine.
• 14:31
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We learned about Ayurveda, not that they were training us to be practitioners, but to have a basic understanding of the benefits of it and when you might break a referral.
• 14:45
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Now we also learned about physical therapy, about massage therapy, the impact that can have on somebody's life.
• 14:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: We learned about complementary cancer care.
• 14:58
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Absolutely incredible.
• 15:00
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You can take somebody that's undergoing radiation or chemotherapy and with a few little things added to their day.
• 15:09
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Make them much more comfortable.
• 15:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So they're not quite as fatigued.
• 15:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: They're not throwing up so much.
• 15:14
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: There are ways to prevent hair loss.
• 15:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: it's pretty amazing for somebody to enter that process and come out the other end not feeling quite so beat up.
• 15:25
  Tom Jackobs: That's what I love about integrative and functional medicine is'cause it, we look at the root cause and, look at the whole person, not just that one symptom that they might be coming in for.
• 15:36
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Right.
• 15:37
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Exactly.
• 15:38
  Tom Jackobs: So shifting gears again just a little bit.
• 15:41
  Tom Jackobs: Let's talk about the business side.
• 15:44
  Tom Jackobs: And I know, you don't like to always talk about numbers, but we're gonna talk about numbers because business is business and you can be heart-led and be a profitable business at the same time.
• 15:55
  Tom Jackobs: So how do you, first of all, how do you balance in your mind and your mindset, being heart-led and also knowing that you need to make a profit in the business?
• 16:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I try not to talk about money with patients.
• 16:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: those that have insurance, they're probably gonna be pretty well covered.
• 16:17
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 16:18
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But sometimes they will ask, is this covered by insurance?
• 16:23
  Tom Jackobs: Right.
• 16:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I'm open about that.
• 16:26
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's like this option is not, this option is.
• 16:30
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Here are the benefits and the cons of each of these.
• 16:36
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And then you have to decide.
• 16:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But if they're looking at something that they're going to have to pay for or use their, HSA account for.
• 16:46
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And they're, hesitant about it, I usually say something along the lines of, aren't you worth it?
• 16:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Why don't you think you're worth it?
• 16:56
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 16:58
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And if I can just give you an example, urinary incontinence is prevalent in the United States.
• 17:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's estimated by one study that 78 million women suffer from incontinence of some kind.
• 17:13
  Tom Jackobs: Wow.
• 17:13
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Yeah, a tremendous number.
• 17:16
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And what many of them start doing is using pads or disposable underwear.
• 17:21
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: so if somebody is doing that, I do add that up for them.
• 17:25
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I say, look, you're paying$2,000 a year for diapers.
• 17:29
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And you might live 20, 30, 40 more years.
• 17:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That cost is probably gonna escalate over time.
• 17:38
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's not very comfortable.
• 17:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Nobody likes to sit in wet pants, okay?
• 17:43
  Tom Jackobs: Right.
• 17:44
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Right.
• 17:44
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Whereas if you do emsella treatment, which uses electromagnetic stimulation of the pelvic floor muscles, you sit on a chair fully clothed, all right?
• 17:57
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You sit there for 28 minutes with this stimulation.
• 18:00
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Initially, you do it twice a week for three weeks in a row.
• 18:04
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That costs a little bit more than your yearly payment for diapers.
• 18:10
  Tom Jackobs: Yep.
• 18:11
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And you're gonna be out of the diapers and you're gonna be able to wear the clothes that you wanna wear.
• 18:17
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You gonna be able to go places that you've stopped going to.
• 18:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You can forget about knowing where every bathroom along the way on a trip is located, right?
• 18:27
  Tom Jackobs: It's gonna
• 18:27
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: free you up.
• 18:28
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I've given them the options.
• 18:30
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That's the heartfelt part.
• 18:32
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: The decision they make is the right decision for them.
• 18:36
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: They may change their mind, and I always let them know, you can always come back to this.
• 18:42
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 18:42
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And it's not unusual that they do pretty quickly.
• 18:46
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 18:47
  Tom Jackobs: I like that you're giving them like the full picture and that in including what they would spend in alternate, either alternate treatments or alternate solutions to the problem.
• 19:01
  Tom Jackobs: And what I think people forget and it's good that you bring it up during the conversation, but people forget when they're paying out$20 here.
• 19:09
  Tom Jackobs: they forget to add it all up for the year.
• 19:12
  Tom Jackobs: And it's more than.
• 19:14
  Tom Jackobs: More than$2,000 and yeah, you might have to plop down$2,000 at one time for the emsella treatments, but it's done.
• 19:24
  Tom Jackobs: There's no more.
• 19:26
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Right.
• 19:26
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:28
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And just along with it goes, their confidence coming back.
• 19:34
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 19:35
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I'm gonna be able to take that plane ride from San Francisco to New York City, and not gonna have to sit on the edge of my seat to make a dash to the bathroom or to hope that there's not a long line there when I need to get there.
• 19:51
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Otherwise I know I'm gonna have an accident.
• 19:54
  Tom Jackobs: Ugh.
• 19:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So that's pretty amazing.
• 19:58
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 19:59
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Incontinence itself is very isolating, wearing diapers probably is too.
• 20:04
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: it's a small solution to a bigger problem, I think.
• 20:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And there are a number of things in women's healthcare that are like that.
• 20:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: some of the medications that we use are not particularly pleasant with the side effects, but early on in the game when people were trying to work out how to treat incontinence, I said, well, this particular type of medication that's used in psychiatry, but one of the side effects is people have a hard time urinating.
• 20:34
  Tom Jackobs: Oh wow.
• 20:36
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: All right, so you could take a much lower dose than somebody that's got a mental health problem does, It's gonna make it harder to urinate, so you're gonna be sitting in there longer, but you're less likely to peak.
• 20:47
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Okay.
• 20:48
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 20:49
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It also causes constipation, which is also unpleasant, that's where it starts.
• 20:52
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You're trading one thing for another.
• 20:54
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 20:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: My goal is to help them trade the right thing in.
• 20:59
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: To get over the problem.
• 21:02
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 21:03
  Tom Jackobs: I think that definitely speaks to the heart and having the heart-led business and then the way that you position the solutions and offer to them in a balanced way, that's protecting your business because that's really good sales in general is give all the options.
• 21:19
  Tom Jackobs: This is what, and then give your recommendation because you're the doctor and then let them make that decision.
• 21:25
  Tom Jackobs: I think that's a really good balance of, being, profit, knowing that you need to make a profit and you need to, you need to pay the bills.
• 21:34
  Tom Jackobs: And you can still be heart-led at the same time.
• 21:38
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And 95% of the time this is gonna be successful.
• 21:42
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 21:43
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Now, I can't lie to them and say, this is going to fix the problem.
• 21:47
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It might just make it better, but better is certainly not a bad place to be when you're isolated.
• 21:55
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 21:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: When you're leaking urine.
• 21:57
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 21:58
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And I also encourage patients, again, getting my integrative training into this, I encourage them to start taking Pilates.
• 22:06
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Once a week ongoing, once a week, it's gonna help tighten your core muscles that's gonna help support your pelvic floor.
• 22:15
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You're making an investment in yourself, but that doesn't mean, you do these things, you walk away from it and everything is solved.
• 22:22
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: You need to continue that investment.
• 22:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But getting them out of the house to go to a Pilates class, okay, that's a part of the game too.
• 22:30
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: They find that they like it, they're interacting with people in the class.
• 22:33
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: They might start taking more, they might get more interest in their overall, physical health.
• 22:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And they usually do that.
• 22:41
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I'm really impressed because some studios around here charge an arm and a leg.
• 22:46
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: For your classes, you can find other things that are less expensive and really just as good.
• 22:51
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But they're willing to pay a little bit for that too.
• 22:54
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So they're investing in themselves.
• 22:56
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 22:57
  Tom Jackobs: And that's such a good thing.
• 22:58
  Tom Jackobs: I know when I was in the fitness realm.
• 23:02
  Tom Jackobs: Whenever a lot of the women that came in, it was always, they put everybody else first for the longest time, and now they were at a point in their life and their career where now they could focus on themselves.
• 23:13
  Tom Jackobs: And it was like this whole relief and release from them of a burden now.
• 23:19
  Tom Jackobs: Oh, that I get to take care of myself and they just love it as well.
• 23:22
  Tom Jackobs: So it's, yeah.
• 23:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That's really true, and it's hard for them to make that leap from taking care of everybody else to being able to focus on themselves.
• 23:31
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: it's hard for them to spend a little money on themselves.
• 23:34
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: they might have a kid In college, and I get that.
• 23:37
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I understand that completely.
• 23:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But that investment goes a long way.
• 23:41
  Tom Jackobs: Yep.
• 23:42
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It goes a very long way.
• 23:43
  Tom Jackobs: Oh yeah.
• 23:44
  Tom Jackobs: Because if you can't take care of yourself, how are you gonna take care of anybody else?
• 23:47
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That's right.
• 23:48
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: That's right.
• 23:49
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: But they sleep better if they're not incontinent because they don't have to get up at night.
• 23:54
  Tom Jackobs: True.
• 23:55
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 23:55
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 23:55
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: makes for a happier person all the way around.
• 23:58
  Tom Jackobs: Hundred percent.
• 23:59
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's amazing.
• 24:02
  Tom Jackobs: That's awesome.
• 24:03
  Tom Jackobs: Barbi, how can people learn more about you and your practice?
• 24:07
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: I have a website.
• 24:08
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's drbarbi.com.
• 24:09
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Barbi is B-A-R-B-I.
• 24:12
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: So D-R-B-A-R-B-I.
• 24:15
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: com.
• 24:16
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: And our website includes much of this information.
• 24:20
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: My office is located in Mountain View, California.
• 24:24
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: The office phone number is(650) 988-7830.
• 24:30
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: while I do have to see patients in the office face to face for a first appointment, some things can be done, through telehealth appointments.
• 24:39
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: If there are other things that need to be explored and can be done that in a consultation fashion, and I've got an amazing staff.
• 24:46
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Come meet us.
• 24:48
  Tom Jackobs: Awesome.
• 24:48
  Tom Jackobs: Well, thank you Barbi for coming onto the show and sharing your wisdom and sharing your experiences being a heart-led business owner.
• 24:55
  Tom Jackobs: I really do appreciate you taking your time.
• 24:58
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: Thank you for having me, Tom.
• 25:00
  Barbi Phelps-Sandall: It's been a real pleasure.
• 25:02
  Tom Jackobs: Absolutely.
• 25:03
  Tom Jackobs: And thank you show listeners for listening into the show today.
• 25:07
  Tom Jackobs: We really do appreciate it.
• 25:08
  Tom Jackobs: Make sure you're checking out everything that Barbi's doing.
• 25:10
  Tom Jackobs: We're gonna put all that down into the show notes, so you can just click on the links and it'll take you right to our website as well.
• 25:17
  Tom Jackobs: And, make sure you do check that out.
• 25:19
  Tom Jackobs: And if you're in the mountain view area, go say hi.
• 25:21
  Tom Jackobs: And then also if you could do us a favor and give the show a rating and a review that just helps spread the word about the Heart-Led Business Show, and helps others realize that you can have a heart-led business and still make a profit at the same time.
• 25:37
  Tom Jackobs: And until next time, lead with your heart.
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: You've been listening to The Heart-Led Business Show, hosted by Tom Jackobs.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: Join us next time for another inspiring journey into the heart of business.