Latest / Marci talks money (and life) / Mother and Daughter Talk Life, Money Mindset, and Personal Growth | Kelly and Sydney Arrendell
Transcript
- Marci Grossman (00:15) Hello, I am MoneyMarci. Welcome. I am thrilled to welcome today's guests, Kelly Arrendell and Sydney Arrendell. Kelly is the mother of this duo. She has spent her professional and personal life focusing on the spiritual element and self growth. She earned undergraduate and graduate degrees in religious studies. Kelly loves observing humanity and the world around her. For her, humor is one of the greatest gifts in this life and it has enhanced and informed her spiritual life. Their podcast highlights how our own evolution as a person affects not only ourselves, but the communities we are a part of and the people we encounter. She loves connecting with others and hearing their stories, knowing there is much to learn. Sydney is the daughter of this duo and has a background in music. She earned her undergraduate degree in piano performance from OU and her master's degree in conducting from Oklahoma City University, which is the same school her mom went to. She conducted a church choir and orchestra, worked as a conductor for an afterschool program called Sydney And Kelly (01:16) Yes. Marci Grossman (01:22) El Sistema in OKC and started a community orchestra in Edmond, Oklahoma. What qualifies her to do their podcast? Probably not too much, but she loves talking with her mom, learning from her and creating communities with people that have similar interests. Welcome, Kelly and Sydney. And I didn't say it in the intro, but I love the title of your podcast, An Incomplete Guide to Personal Growth. Sydney And Kelly (01:49) Yes. Marci Grossman (01:50) How did you come up with the title? Sydney And Kelly (01:51) So mom was very insistent that she believes she never has all of the answers even though I think she does and so we're trying to come like brainstorm I was like well it's like a guide you know we can be a guide to people she's like no because I can't have all the answers. So she was very insistent on the word incomplete because we constantly grow yeah yeah Marci Grossman (02:13) And the world changes, so even if you knew everything on this day, tomorrow, something changed somewhere. Sydney And Kelly (02:17) It sounds a different. So we knew we wanted to be about personal growth and then she was very insistent it had to be incomplete. Incomplete. Marci Grossman (02:26) Well, what made you decide you wanted to podcast? Sydney And Kelly (02:29) Honestly, it was, ⁓ it was right. Yeah, it was pretty soon after I had my son. And I was like, you know, I feel like there's so many things going on in life that I can go to my mom for and ask advice for. And she'll have either good insights or whatever. And I know that, you know, friends and other people that don't have that sort of a resource. And so I was like, you know what, people should know what you're saying and other people need to hear your own like wisdom that you have about life and how to be a better person. So let's just put it out there. So that's why. And I said, okay. She said you have to show up don't always commit well. No. You will start projects and not all of them finish, you know? Hence the incomplete. Yes. Marci Grossman (03:16) And you always knew you were going to work on it together because that was the whole point. Sydney And Kelly (03:19) Yeah, yes, that was the whole point. Yeah, it's like I was like, okay, we always we have great discussions pretty frequently. And so like other people should listen to what we talk about. I think. Yeah. Marci Grossman (03:32) So basically when you're working on something, Sydney, I guess typically you say, this is something I want to make sure we share or this is something that happened to me or happened to someone and let's talk about it. Sydney And Kelly (03:40) Mm. Yes, and a lot of it is like either I have questions about the world, either spiritually or just like how my mom can be so calm all the time. ⁓ And so it's either questions I come up with or things that I see happening in the world or maybe a book I read sparks it. And so kind of a lot of different things kind of spark our topics. And sometimes mom will come up. I come up with some, I come up with some of the, we tried to, trying to do some experiential things that are out of our comfort zone, because that's how you grow. So we've done axe throwing and and we're gonna do candle making soon. So we can I try to come up with those. Yeah. She won't do that fly thing yet where you... The skydiving? Marci Grossman (04:31) ⁓ I've done iFly. iFly is amazing. Yeah, and it's, you're not jumping out of an airplane, you're just in a wind tunnel. it is well within a reasonable risk tolerance, a lot of reasonable security. I never felt that it wasn't safe there. Sydney And Kelly (04:34) Is it okay? See? Okay. Okay. Okay. Marci Grossman (04:50) and it was an amazing experience. So I look forward hearing back from you guys after you go. Sydney And Kelly (04:55) Okay, okay. It's a deal. Okay. Yay. Marci Grossman (04:58) In fact, you should videotape it because you also post like on YouTube or something where there are videos, right? So you got to videotape it. Sydney And Kelly (05:03) Yes, yep, we do. Fun, yes. Can't wait to see your face. No. ⁓ man. Yeah. that's great. Yes. Marci Grossman (05:12) Well, it's gonna look like this. Because you're in the wind tunnel. So my podcast, which you're generously guesting on, is about money and life. So what kind of financial conversations did you have growing up? What kind of things as you've learned, as you've learned and you're having your podcast, I imagine money or financial decisions or grocery shopping or taxes or things have come up either on the podcast or just conversations you've had. How do you approach those? Sydney And Kelly (05:24) Yeah. Yes. Do you want go first or me? You go ahead. ⁓ cause I didn't do well. No, I was not talked about. Money was not discussed actually. Like at all. Other than here is, ⁓ what I had an allowance. Yes. Here's your allowance and you can either choose to spend it or you can choose to save it. I told you to give some to the church. ⁓ I thought it was more spend or save. And my nature is to save. My nature is I don't need anything. If I need something, I'll just ask for it on my birthday. So we did not really talk about it. Now, I knew that they had stocks and investments and stuff. And so at 17, I had. $7,000 and I went to their financial, I was like, I need to go to your financial advisor. So I went and I started a mutual fund. And that was my experience with money before adulthood. Marci Grossman (06:47) Well, at 17, you're getting ready to spend it all for college, so. Sydney And Kelly (06:51) Yes, luckily they had a college fund for had a college fund set aside. knew that. Yeah. She knew she had that. Yes. And then I was like, well, I got to save for the rest of my future. So she has always been that way. Yes. And then you have another daughter that is opposite. Well, and so I think it hard to balance. it was. It was very different. And my own upbringing. Marci Grossman (06:55) Okay, so that was separate and that was okay. Sydney And Kelly (07:17) All my mom told me was, you just have a, what is it, a hole in your pocket? Money burns a hole in your pocket. It was her attitude toward me. And she was frugal. But more than she needed to be. And then some. Yeah. And my dad wanted to give to us because he didn't have stuff. And so it was, there was this struggle of money. Yeah. And guilt was put on it. And so I know part of that was I didn't want to the guilt. Yeah. I thought you figure out a safe. That's wrong. I know. I know. It's not just on you though. Dad, we were both that way. Yeah, it just wasn't talked about. Like I just knew that okay, my parents have money so they must save. My dad works so they make money. And so you work to make money. And then you save and then you save to spend on vacations or whatever fun stuff, you know, well, I think we did do a little bit of talking. when you got, I think your driver's license and you got a checkbook and a debit and we talked about, you know, you not having the credit card and not having, ⁓ not having debt. We did talk a little bit about that. Look at your face. Maybe you didn't listen. No, I'm just kidding. I don't remember. didn't have huge discussions. And I know, and I don't remember being like, this is how, there was no discussion on this is how you budget. This is maybe how much you know let's say you have rent in the future how much maybe that should take up. How do you budget for things you know? Guilty. Guilty as charged. Marci Grossman (08:54) But that's not uncommon. I'm walking around to tell everybody, you should talk about money. But the reason I'm doing that is because we don't do a great job of it. Our parents talked in different ways depending on their education, their knowledge, their situation as to how much they would talk to about it. Sydney And Kelly (08:57) Yeah. We don't. Yeah. Marci Grossman (10:03) My father was a CPA. And as I became more and more interested, we had more and more Sydney And Kelly (10:03) Yeah. Marci Grossman (10:10) of those financial talks, but I have a sister and a brother. My brother is a psychologist. My sister is a teacher. And they had conversations, but they were different than the ones I had. So I'm sure if you talk to all three of us, yes, we knew to spend, to save, to donate. We knew there are things you have to make sure that you have enough money for, ⁓ whether we called it coherently budgeting or just kind of planning ahead. Sydney And Kelly (10:34) Yeah. Yeah. Marci Grossman (10:39) But we all had different conversations with the same parents. I think your sister would say she had different conversations with your parents or she took different things away from them. And that's part of the reason that actually having the active conversations is important because otherwise it's all about perspective. I saw them do this, this is what I think it meant, and this is how I'm going to kind of take that into my life. And if you misinterpreted what and why, Sydney And Kelly (10:44) you I'm sure. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Right, right. That's true. And you are a natural ⁓ saver. And you just... I mean, I'm sure there are psychological You'll look at me and go, why did you buy new socks? Yeah. I like the way they feel. You had a whole drawer of perfectly good socks. they were getting old. Marci Grossman (11:07) you're taking an incomplete image with you. Well, there is- Right, but there is something that you saw at some point in time and that made you feel, yeah, I wanna save. And that's fine and there's nothing wrong with that, but now you're looking at things from a different perspective as a mom, as someone raising your child, do you have one or two? Just one. Raising your child in a different time than you were raised, in a different situation than you were raised and... Sydney And Kelly (11:52) Just one. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Marci Grossman (12:01) you know, what are the lessons that your intention is to teach? Sydney And Kelly (12:05) That's good. I would love to start having conversations about it sooner, in an appropriate way, in a way where you don't put adult problems on a child. But in a way, it's like, you know, he knows that we go to the store and we pay. He knows that we, you know, it starts simple. No, okay. So this is what happens. This is the times we live in. Marci Grossman (12:18) Right. Sydney And Kelly (12:31) We were out of something and he looked, we better order that. We'd just order some. ⁓ you're in trouble, Sydney. The world we live in. If you're out, you order it. But I think to stop. ⁓ I think instilling. the idea of, you want something, how do you use your money in a way where you want to get it? Making it, I think, more obvious that there are choices with money. then being able to describe it, it's like, oh, I got you a car. You have a car. You're 16, you have a car. How do you think that happened? Do you think that happened because I had the money set aside? How did I help that for you? It's like discussing where things come from because you didn't really do that. And hopefully then later that can be on him. Sorry, we didn't really do that. I I had to buy my car. I didn't have to do it. No. But I'm feeling. Marci Grossman (13:29) Right, and because of that you wanted to make sure she would have a car when she needed it. So that changed her perspective because the car was there. Whereas you were looking at it when you were growing up saying, okay, I got to figure out how I'm going to get a car. Sydney And Kelly (13:33) Exactly. Yes. Mm-hmm. Yes, yeah. Or drive that huge station wagon. I want to be more intentional about building on this concept of money and building onto this concept of how does it work in the world? How do you get it? What do you want to do with it? ⁓ how do the things that you have, where does it come from? And why do you, you know, it's like, where does it come from? It's not just- this earning part in there. yes, yeah. Marci Grossman (14:12) And the earning part is a little bit harder for kids. I think I was maybe six or seven years old and someone asked me what my dad did for a living. He played on an adding machine and told his clients how much they owed him. Sydney And Kelly (14:15) It is. Oh yeah. Mm-hmm. Marci Grossman (14:28) You know, that was to me, that was an accounting. There was an adding machine because there weren't computers back then. So he did things on an adding machine and then he wrote bills and sent them to clients. So I don't know what they owed him money for, but there was an adding machine and there were bills. Sydney And Kelly (14:28) I love it. Is it? Yeah. Yes. Yes! Yes, I love that. But yeah, so I think just building on it in a way where it can be healthy, where he doesn't feel like you gotta spend or you gotta, there's something healthy to it. And then I am going to sit with him and talk to him about how to budget, what to think about, how it works, walk through it, talk about numbers, do all that stuff, because it's hard to figure it out on your own. It is hard. Marci Grossman (15:11) How old is he? Sydney And Kelly (15:12) He's only three. Marci Grossman (15:14) Okay, so it's a little bit early, one of the... can Sydney And Kelly (15:16) It is, it's early. She plans ahead. I do. Marci Grossman (15:21) One of the earliest lessons you can do with your son, and probably a couple of years from now, not quite yet, is do you have an ice cream truck in your area that comes by? Well, if you go to the ice cream truck, it costs two or three dollars for this ice cream cone that looks like SpongeBob or whomever. And if you go to the store, Sydney And Kelly (15:24) Mm-hmm. yet. yeah, we got to start off. Yeah. Yes. Mm hmm. Yes. Marci Grossman (15:45) you can buy six of these for five bucks or seven bucks or whatever else. So it's like this money will buy you one at the truck or maybe it would buy three at the truck to get six at the store. Sydney And Kelly (15:48) Thank Yeah. Yeah. Marci Grossman (15:59) That kind of gets you something that they can put into perspective that they can kind of process because they know the difference between one ice cream and two ice creams. Sydney And Kelly (16:04) and That is a great idea. That's a good idea. That is just to start teaching that thinking. Yeah, and there's no real attachment to it. It's not like good or bad. You know, it's just... It's objective. Marci Grossman (16:19) It's totally a choice. You can have this one right now. I understand if you want this one right now and you're paying for the ice cream truck experience and whatever else. If what you want is more ice cream and you can wait till we go to the store, I'm not saying you're gonna eat it all right now, but then it will be there for your convenience. And that's just something they can kind of feel the difference of, yeah. Sydney And Kelly (16:26) Yeah. No. Yeah. start to agree. Yeah. And then you get to know, what's a treat and what's... Because down the road we make choices, you know, tonight I'm going to spend a little more and I'm going to get this meal versus or whatever it is versus... It's not that important. Right now. Yeah. So I mean, it's kind of... Marci Grossman (16:58) Right, we can take two friends and go to McDonald's, or we can take no friends and go to Red Robin. Those kind of decisions are decisions that younger kids can kind of understand without it getting too big into long-term and short-term and all of those kind of things. Sydney And Kelly (17:02) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I like that. Those are great ideas. So yeah, I was gonna ask about having those in your book. Do you have any suggestions? You got another book coming out for children now, right? Marci Grossman (17:35) I have another, well no it's not for kids. mean, 14 or so, but not three year olds. I haven't figured that. My drawings are not very good. So I'd need to get an artist and a whole big thing. Yeah, It's not in the budget. Sydney And Kelly (17:40) Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ yeah. That's funny. I'm speaking of money. Marci Grossman (17:56) Have you talked about financial things and financial decisions and stuff on your show? Sydney And Kelly (18:02) No, we really haven't. This is the first and Sydney's been asking That's why I've been talking about it. She has asked me several times and so we are now, but we haven't in the past. No, it took a bit. It really did. Well, the two things about finding somebody, because a lot of times when I think of financial, think of all the details of financial advisor and that type of thing versus conversational. Top money topic, you know topic and finding somebody who wouldn't out to get somebody as a client and that kind of thing but simply to Yeah to talk and engage. Yeah, we really haven't and it's taken a little bit, but it's definitely something that I mean even with my friends Which I think is good at least with close ones I think it's getting more common to be more open about it, you know Like we've gone through different house buying experiences and then talking about well, we do a girls trip. Okay Yeah, I can save up for this much, so let's look at it. And it's like even a little bit of group budgeting sometimes. Yeah. And I like that. And I just felt like, it's something we need to put on our podcast so people know it's OK to talk about. Yeah. And. Marci Grossman (19:11) right, and Sydney And Kelly (19:13) that, you know, even within your age group, you can look at your different friends and there's just finance, there's different earning power, there's different, you know, what's your priorities? ⁓ It's all different. Yeah, but you find a cohesive aspect to it. Marci Grossman (19:30) Right, and you don't have to be an expert to talk about money because if you're just talking on your show, the two of you talking about a car buying experience, you don't have to say, well, I can't afford this or whatever. But you can talk about shopping around for interest rates and what your experience was without putting too much numbers into it. Because if you're trying to help people understand things by by the amazing stories that Kelly can share, you know, let some of them be financial stories. Sydney And Kelly (19:55) Yeah, that's true. That is true. and how feel. Yeah, yeah. Because there was, you know, like when Paul and I started out. Everything we had was used. Yeah. You know, every piece for everything. You know, we didn't have. And then we did get into some debt because we were living in Amarillo and I was not happy. so, Amarillo, Texas is not a place. Not always a place. Anyway, so we did some traveling and got some debt and then it was like, well, this doesn't feel good. So let's climb out of this. And figure out. And figure out how we live in a different way. Yeah. Marci Grossman (20:40) Yeah, but those are stories you could be sharing because sometimes just hearing the challenges that people go through. One of the things I do when I'm writing the book is I collect stories because I can give you information, but if I didn't go through something, I can't really tell you the story. And a real story hits differently than I say, well, imagine if such and such happened to you, whereas someone else telling their story, mean, your podcast, your... Sydney And Kelly (20:43) Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Marci Grossman (21:09) incomplete podcast. It's a great conversation starter. It's a great way to show people the ways they can have those financial conversations with each other. Sydney And Kelly (21:10) Yeah. that in. That's true. I really hadn't thought about that. I know and I do think... I don't know. Maybe it's not any more complicated than other generations. But I feel like sometimes people my age, it's like, OK, lot of my friends have some student loan debts they've had to deal with. And how do you budget and finance for that? But they still want to start a family at some point. So how do you manage both of that together, and on top of just everything being expensive? on top of not, it's like negotiating at work. How do you negotiate for a better sale or better benefit or whatever? I feel like sometimes, yeah, honestly, student loans are big one but different debt like that just makes it so complicated these days. And it does I was reading an article the other day about that trying to compare who had it rougher. Yes. baby boomers and you know what and I don't know what your but the you know interest rates for house were 18 percent. I couldn't even. So how do you deal with it right so they had that to contend with. Yeah. Marci Grossman (22:22) There's always different things. There's always different challenges. I do think right now the ratio of ⁓ college to the ratio of average salary is out of whack and that's a huge challenge. The ratio of housing to the ratio of income is out of whack ⁓ compared to what it was when I was... Sydney And Kelly (22:24) Thank Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Marci Grossman (22:46) you know, much younger, probably Kelly's age. And that impacts things. So that is challenging, but there are other challenges that we had that they don't have. So it's always going to be different. Sydney And Kelly (22:47) Yeah. Right, What a, yeah, what a starter home used to be. I look at people's starter home now and I'm like, really? That was my, that was like my third house. yeah, exactly. And you're, that's supposed to be a starter? no. True. Yeah. Marci Grossman (23:14) Well, it becomes expectation and just even the expenses that are standard now that I didn't pay. I didn't have a cell phone growing up, so I didn't have a cell phone bill. I didn't have internet, so I didn't have the internet service fee, the $100, $200 a month depending on where you live and what it includes. I didn't have cable TV, so there wasn't a fee for that. I didn't have to have a computer, let alone all the various Sydney And Kelly (23:16) Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yep. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Marci Grossman (23:43) computer devices and things that come with it and and the space for everybody to have their own computer set up Sydney And Kelly (23:49) Yeah, that's true. Yes, and because I think about that and I think of a landline and it's like I thought that was expensive That is nothing. Yeah group cell phone plan. you know, it's like it just Yeah, and everything adds up the streaming the day. let's the cable. Okay Well, let's double it because we spend it on streaming and not knowing what you spend it on I think is a problem. How many things are we streaming? my gosh You forget you subscribe to something, you know, and it's crazy. Marci Grossman (24:22) and then it bills it automatically to your credit card and you don't even realize you're paying for a streaming service or a gym service or whatever else you no longer use. Sydney And Kelly (24:30) Yes, and they make it very difficult to unsubscribe. Marci Grossman (24:35) and they make it difficult to find it because it's built into your bill. If you don't look at your bill every month and say, wait a second, what is this? Then you don't realize and that's, you know, it's a challenge to find those things. Sydney And Kelly (24:38) Yes. Yeah, yeah. have to dive into it. is, yeah. And although they say, okay, want, the other thing is your statements online. You know, they used to come in the mail, so you'd open it, you'd automatically see, well, then you got, ⁓ I don't have time right now, I'm not gonna look online, I'll do that later. Maybe. Right? And it's like when it came in the mail it was so much easier to look at. convenient. Yeah. Marci Grossman (25:14) Well, and it was a reminder because it came in the mail. So you would put it on your desk or your table, your counter, wherever it is, and you would have to pick it up and do something with it. Whereas now it comes in your email, you skip over it, and then 400 more emails come and you never get back to it. Sydney And Kelly (25:17) Yeah. All right. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. That's a that. ⁓ Yeah. Man. Thank goodness for fraud alerts. That too. That too. That's right. Marci Grossman (25:41) Yeah, and if we didn't have our cell phone, we wouldn't get our fraud alerts. ⁓ Sydney And Kelly (25:47) That is so funny. Yes. So. Marci Grossman (25:51) Well, I appreciate you taking the time to talk with me and have these very enlightening money conversations about learning about money, about talking about money. Do you think of anything you want to mention that maybe we haven't covered yet? Sydney And Kelly (26:00) Thanks. Yeah. Hmm. I can tell you how I feel about money. Because I have, you know, it was a struggle. Yeah. When I was in debt and I didn't, when we married I had no debt. I was really, because I've gone, I've cycled, you know, where I buy these clothes with the credit, newly wonderful Dillard's credit card or whatever, you know? Yes. And I learned that, Kelly, you can have one credit card. Yeah. that you use, maybe you have another because you need to build, the stupid way you have to build your credit, so you have to spend, pay, it's like, that's a trick. anyway, narrowing that down and getting out, it felt so good. And I love watching that little savings grow, and so I'd go, remember how that feels. Remember how it feels to have that cush, to have that money in the bank. have that flow, you know, and so I really, yeah, and maybe that's the type of person I am, the feeling type, you know, that type, but I went with the feeling. It's kind like after I exercise, I may not have wanted to exercise, but I love the feeling after. Yeah. And I go, remember that feeling when I'm getting out of bed and don't want to go. You know, that type of thing. So I associated money with that to go, that feels really good to when you, when I use my credit card to pay it all off and go, you know, and so I go, I associate that with money. No, that's good. And I remember how it feels. Marci Grossman (27:43) What about you, Sydney? Sydney And Kelly (27:46) think money is just, even nowadays sometimes it's hard to bring up with my parents. And there are times, I think now... And it depends, I mean, obviously on your level of privilege. But I think a lot of people, as they get older, and even in their 20s and early 30s, sometimes they're still dependent on ways that their parents can help them. And so you're having to continue these conversations of money when you don't want to. When differently, yeah. And differently. I think, but it can have this level of shame, because at times, I mean, especially you're. You're supposed to be done with that. You're supposed to be on your own. You're supposed to have your own money and do your own thing. But I think sometimes it's more common than we realize to continue to have these money ties and to continue to have this help. And there's not really like there shouldn't be a shame around it. And it should be something to be grateful for if you can have it and if you're, you know, can still have that healthy relationship with your parents through it and stuff. And so I think it's something that like Money gives you independence, yes, and freedom, but if you need help along the way, that can always be okay too. That's okay too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Marci Grossman (29:05) Okay, well, Kelly and Sydney, thank you so much for being my guests today. I appreciate you taking the time to join us here and give me someone to Sydney And Kelly (29:13) Yeah, it's been a pleasure. for having us. you. Marci Grossman (29:18) To my listeners, I will be sharing a link to Kelly and Sydney's podcast, An Incomplete Guide to Personal Growth in the show notes. Please check them out. They have a lot of fun and a lot of interesting information. Don't forget to subscribe, leave us a review and stay tuned. I'll see you next time. This has been MoneyMarci on Marci Talks Money (and Life). You got this. Sydney And Kelly (29:31) Yes.