Latest / Wired To Hunt Podcast / Ep. 1038: Foundations - Proximity, Procedure, and the Secret Power of Getting Close to Mature Bucks
Transcript
- 0:01Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt Foundations podcast, your guide
- 0:05Speaker 1: to the fundamentals of better deer hunting, presented by first Light,
- 0:09Speaker 1: creating proven versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind.
- 0:14Speaker 1: First Light, Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host
- 0:19Speaker 1: Tony Peterson.
- 0:20Speaker 2: Hey, everyone, welcome to the Foundation's podcast, which is brought
- 0:22Speaker 2: to you by first Light. I'm your host, Tony Peterson,
- 0:24Speaker 2: and today's episode is all about the role proximity plays
- 0:27Speaker 2: in pretty much all of hunting and fishing and why
- 0:30Speaker 2: so many people kind of misunderstand this concept.
- 0:34Speaker 3: How do you get close to a big buck.
- 0:37Speaker 2: It's scouting, it's prep work, it's planning, and it's mostly
- 0:40Speaker 2: done wrong. For most of us, proximity to our quary
- 0:43Speaker 2: matters a lot, but we often hunt like it doesn't,
- 0:45Speaker 2: and that leads to a hell of a lot of
- 0:47Speaker 2: unfilled tags and uncaught fish. We want the deer, turkeys,
- 0:51Speaker 2: are largemouth or whatever to be where we want them
- 0:53Speaker 2: to be, but they mostly aren't or won't be.
- 0:55Speaker 3: That's okay, there's a solve for this, but it kind.
- 0:58Speaker 2: Of takes a new way of thinking, which is what
- 1:00Speaker 2: I'm going to talk about right now. This might come
- 1:10Speaker 2: as a huge surprise to you. But sometimes I do
- 1:14Speaker 2: really dumb shit. I know, outwardly, it's all big public
- 1:18Speaker 2: land bucks and dead turkeys and giants' mollies and well
- 1:20Speaker 2: a whole bunch of success stories carefully curated to ensure
- 1:23Speaker 2: that the real me shows himself as rarely as possible.
- 1:27Speaker 2: But I'm dumb, and I do dumb shit, like agreeing
- 1:30Speaker 2: to do a new project based around fishing and then
- 1:33Speaker 2: deciding it wasn't enough to just challenge myself, but to
- 1:36Speaker 2: really go outside of my element. I thought about this
- 1:39Speaker 2: a lot as I was making a twenty two mile
- 1:41Speaker 2: run down a lake in South Dakota while it was
- 1:43Speaker 2: thirty one degrees outside and I had to catch a
- 1:46Speaker 2: big walleye in a very short amount of time, a
- 1:49Speaker 2: task I am really not qualified for. When you do
- 1:53Speaker 2: what I do, you can get away with not killing
- 1:56Speaker 2: on a deer hunting show, even a turkey hunting show,
- 1:59Speaker 2: because most to the folks in the audience, at least
- 2:01Speaker 2: the folks that I want watching my stuff, they understand
- 2:04Speaker 2: the inherent challenge of what we're doing in the woods.
- 2:07Speaker 2: They know that dead deer and turkeys don't come easy
- 2:10Speaker 2: in most places. And that's just reality. But blanking on
- 2:13Speaker 2: a fishing show is a different thing. I mean, who
- 2:16Speaker 2: can't catch a freaking fish?
- 2:18Speaker 3: Well?
- 2:18Speaker 2: For a lot of a whole week in the beginning
- 2:20Speaker 2: of May, I was a guy who could barely catch
- 2:22Speaker 2: a fish, and it was not much fun. I had
- 2:25Speaker 2: a lot of time to think while making cast after
- 2:27Speaker 2: cast after cast, from sunrise to sunset to cold water
- 2:31Speaker 2: that just didn't want to give up a whole lot.
- 2:33Speaker 2: I'm not going to spoil it too much, but while
- 2:36Speaker 2: I first fished for big walleyes and then I fished
- 2:39Speaker 2: for large mouth on lakes that I had never been on,
- 2:42Speaker 2: just enough fish showed up to make me feel like
- 2:44Speaker 2: I'm not a total loser. But I'm telling you, my friends,
- 2:47Speaker 2: there were a lot of hours packed into that week
- 2:49Speaker 2: where it felt like it was a foregone conclusion. It
- 2:52Speaker 2: was mostly cold and mostly really windy, and far more
- 2:56Speaker 2: challenging than what I thought I was getting myself into,
- 2:59Speaker 2: and I knew it would be pretty challenging. But those
- 3:01Speaker 2: fish that did save my ass, they showed up, and
- 3:05Speaker 2: they gave me a good reminder of just how right
- 3:08Speaker 2: you have to get things when the conditions are a
- 3:10Speaker 2: total pain and mother nature is just not pleased with
- 3:13Speaker 2: your presence. Proximity matters, and I know that might seem
- 3:18Speaker 2: like the most obvious thing in the world. I think
- 3:21Speaker 2: there is a difference between grasping a concept and actually
- 3:24Speaker 2: putting yourself into the motion to fully realize that concept.
- 3:28Speaker 2: Though anyone who has been married a long time probably
- 3:31Speaker 2: understands this. You know you should treat your spouse really well,
- 3:34Speaker 2: like you did in those early days, the dating days.
- 3:37Speaker 3: But it's not that easy after a while.
- 3:39Speaker 2: It's an easy thing to understand, but a hard thing
- 3:41Speaker 2: to put into practice. Those walleyes and those bass and
- 3:45Speaker 2: damn near all the turkeys I've had a conversation with
- 3:47Speaker 2: this spring all reminded me that our job as hunters
- 3:50Speaker 2: and fishermen is to understand how to get close to
- 3:52Speaker 2: fish and game first, and then the other tricks kind
- 3:55Speaker 2: of come into play. I talk about this a lot
- 3:57Speaker 2: with calling, where I think, you know, it's one of
- 4:00Speaker 2: the easiest ways to understand this concept. If you want
- 4:04Speaker 2: a grun in a deer, being eighty yards away from
- 4:06Speaker 2: him is way way better than being three hundred yards away.
- 4:10Speaker 2: You want more turkeys to come to you learn how
- 4:13Speaker 2: to get as close to them as you can then
- 4:15Speaker 2: call them in.
- 4:16Speaker 3: You don't always have to do this, but if you hunt.
- 4:18Speaker 2: Pressured birds or pressure deer or whatever and just struggle
- 4:22Speaker 2: to get them to you, there's a strong case to
- 4:24Speaker 2: be made for understanding proximity.
- 4:27Speaker 3: Or maybe elk is a better example here.
- 4:29Speaker 2: You think you could just go to Colorado or Idaho
- 4:32Speaker 2: or wherever on September fifteenth and just bugle from the
- 4:34Speaker 2: ridges as you walk along and get an answer on
- 4:37Speaker 2: a ranch where the elk costs twenty grand apiece. Sure,
- 4:41Speaker 2: on public land, it's not gonna happen, My friends. You're
- 4:44Speaker 2: gonna have to sneak into some of that dark timber,
- 4:46Speaker 2: you know, where you finally find some fresh sign after
- 4:49Speaker 2: five days, and then throw out a challenge bugle and.
- 4:51Speaker 3: Then you might get a response.
- 4:53Speaker 2: Now, those bass that I chased down in Iowa when
- 4:56Speaker 2: it was forty degrees out and the wind was blowing
- 4:58Speaker 2: thirty five miles an hour, they did not want to
- 5:01Speaker 2: eat at all. I know it because I saw them,
- 5:05Speaker 2: and they saw my senkos and my dice baits and
- 5:07Speaker 2: my dropshots and my jigs and my flukes and my
- 5:09Speaker 2: net rigs, and they didn't eat any of them. Only
- 5:12Speaker 2: after three days did the condition stabilize enough for them
- 5:15Speaker 2: to remotely start eating, and even then I had to
- 5:18Speaker 2: thread the needle and land every cast on their nose
- 5:21Speaker 2: in the most subtle way possible. It was the kind
- 5:24Speaker 2: of fishing where you use eight pound tests to senko
- 5:27Speaker 2: and then you target a very very specific spot while
- 5:31Speaker 2: feathering your line on your cast, so it just barely
- 5:34Speaker 2: breaks the surface when it lands that proximity to them.
- 5:39Speaker 2: If you make the cast count along with a very
- 5:41Speaker 2: subtle presentation, that was mostly the ticket I found. I
- 5:45Speaker 2: think you could have thrown a thousand swim baits and
- 5:47Speaker 2: spinner baits and crank baits and you take your chunk
- 5:49Speaker 2: and wine pick and not caught any one of those fish.
- 5:53Speaker 2: So you have proximity, but then you have procedure once
- 5:57Speaker 2: you're close. Then what Well, when it comes to this
- 6:00Speaker 2: seems so obvious, I mean, who is it looking for
- 6:03Speaker 2: the exact spot that most of the bucks will walk
- 6:05Speaker 2: through and then just planning on going in there to
- 6:08Speaker 2: shoot them. Except most hunters aren't doing that, and the
- 6:12Speaker 2: ones who are are really really successful. Compared to the
- 6:15Speaker 2: general population. We've pretty much passed the winter scouting mission window.
- 6:20Speaker 2: And the fawns are already dropping in some place, and
- 6:23Speaker 2: the bucks are already growing new sets of antlers.
- 6:25Speaker 3: So where does this leave most of us?
- 6:27Speaker 2: Now, how do you work right now to put yourself
- 6:30Speaker 2: into closer proximity to bucks's fall, you know, aside from
- 6:33Speaker 2: the most common direction for most folks, which would be
- 6:36Speaker 2: just to do some food plot work or something, you know,
- 6:39Speaker 2: which is really kind of the opposite of what I'm
- 6:40Speaker 2: talking about, even though it's not bad. You have some
- 6:43Speaker 2: options right now that don't involve manipulating the land. You
- 6:46Speaker 2: can find plenty of interesting in deer hunting spots right
- 6:49Speaker 2: now in the woods if you want to, but it's
- 6:50Speaker 2: mostly a matter of fighting bugs and heat and you know,
- 6:54Speaker 2: looking for tracks on trails right now out there. But
- 6:56Speaker 2: that's okay if you want to do it. It's also
- 6:59Speaker 2: not what most hunters are going to do during this
- 7:01Speaker 2: part of the summer. And I get it. This is
- 7:03Speaker 2: the one stretch of the year where I don't care
- 7:04Speaker 2: about whitetails a whole lot, and the woods are about
- 7:07Speaker 2: as uninviting as they are going to get the entire year.
- 7:10Speaker 2: But the question of proximity remains unanswered, and an easy
- 7:14Speaker 2: way to address it is to think about where you
- 7:17Speaker 2: usually hunt. If you're on private ground, think about your
- 7:20Speaker 2: go to setups, why do they work, and how often
- 7:23Speaker 2: do you see deer not doing what you expect them
- 7:25Speaker 2: to do on those spots. I'm not sure how relevant
- 7:28Speaker 2: of an example this is, but I'm bound and determined
- 7:30Speaker 2: to get some south wind setups going on a property
- 7:33Speaker 2: I own in Wisconsin. The layout of that property makes
- 7:36Speaker 2: it ideal for north winds because of how I have
- 7:38Speaker 2: to access it. But we don't always get a lot
- 7:41Speaker 2: of north winds, especially when I'm hunting with the girls
- 7:43Speaker 2: in the early season. And when we do get north winds,
- 7:46Speaker 2: the deer have to give up their number one defense
- 7:49Speaker 2: to get to us, or at least sacrifice a good
- 7:51Speaker 2: percentage of it, so it's not ideal. A south wind
- 7:54Speaker 2: setup is going to be a game changer if I
- 7:56Speaker 2: can figure it out, But the problem with that is
- 7:58Speaker 2: they will have a much higher chance of smell telling
- 8:00Speaker 2: me or the girls, So the approach has to be
- 8:02Speaker 2: money and the setup has to play off of where
- 8:04Speaker 2: they are most likely to travel to get to me.
- 8:06Speaker 2: I'll probably get it wrong, but I'm going to try
- 8:09Speaker 2: because it's an issue that has plagued me on that
- 8:10Speaker 2: place for eleven years, and it just generally pisses me off.
- 8:14Speaker 2: I think maybe this lesson is one most hunters aren't
- 8:16Speaker 2: comfortable with, but I think it's crazy important. You have
- 8:19Speaker 2: to try stuff that probably won't work to get close
- 8:23Speaker 2: to deer. I mean, the reason it's hard to get
- 8:26Speaker 2: close to deer is because they are very good at
- 8:28Speaker 2: keeping us from getting close to them. We look at
- 8:30Speaker 2: a risky ish setup as if it'll ruin our season,
- 8:34Speaker 2: you know, spook our target bucks and all that jazz.
- 8:37Speaker 2: But we don't look at how risky it is to
- 8:39Speaker 2: keep hunting the way we've always hunted. Volume hunting a
- 8:53Speaker 2: kill plot because that's where your camera is, and it's
- 8:55Speaker 2: easier than trying to figure out where the deer like
- 8:57Speaker 2: to travel on their own volition, is risky in its
- 9:00Speaker 2: own way. A different way to approach the proximity problem
- 9:04Speaker 2: is to not mostly give up the wind and cross
- 9:06Speaker 2: your fingers, but to understand what time grants you during
- 9:10Speaker 2: the deer season when it comes to fishing, or turkey hunting,
- 9:13Speaker 2: or pheasants and of course deer. The more time I
- 9:16Speaker 2: have personally to figure things out, the more likely I
- 9:19Speaker 2: am to do just that, and well, duh, but we
- 9:23Speaker 2: are all busy and we don't have tons of time
- 9:25Speaker 2: to go out there for days and days on end
- 9:27Speaker 2: until the secret patterns of the deer reveal themselves to us.
- 9:31Speaker 2: But we also, at least most folks can string together something,
- 9:34Speaker 2: and you should plan for that. Two days in a
- 9:37Speaker 2: row is exponentially better than going out for one day.
- 9:40Speaker 2: Two evening sits in a row is exponentially better than
- 9:43Speaker 2: one evening sit. A morning sit followed by an evening sit,
- 9:47Speaker 2: or my favorite, an evening sit followed by a morning
- 9:50Speaker 2: sit is better than a one off sit. The problem
- 9:54Speaker 2: most hunters have with this is that they look at
- 9:57Speaker 2: the rut or they look at cold front sometime in
- 9:59Speaker 2: the back half October, and they think about the conditions
- 10:03Speaker 2: as warranting a whole lot of effort. That's what's a
- 10:05Speaker 2: decider for you. That's just insane to me and might
- 10:09Speaker 2: be the biggest reason most weekend warriors rarely ever kill
- 10:11Speaker 2: big bucks. The deer are out there just waiting to
- 10:14Speaker 2: be hunted every day of the season, and you have
- 10:16Speaker 2: the opportunity to hunt them, or if you do have
- 10:19Speaker 2: the opportunity to hunt them, you should, but if you
- 10:22Speaker 2: have the opportunity to hunt them for two days in
- 10:24Speaker 2: a row, you really should, or three or whatever. This
- 10:28Speaker 2: allows you to do a couple of things. First off,
- 10:31Speaker 2: it allows you to take some risks, As I've mentioned,
- 10:34Speaker 2: that's important. It also allows you to form a plan
- 10:37Speaker 2: in real time according to what the deer are showing
- 10:41Speaker 2: you right now. This can't be replaced by trail cameras,
- 10:45Speaker 2: but they certainly can help you through this process, and
- 10:47Speaker 2: they can help you make decisions. Seeing deer and not
- 10:51Speaker 2: seeing deer both tell you a lot. When you hunt
- 10:54Speaker 2: a couple of days in stable conditions, you're getting a
- 10:57Speaker 2: crash course on what your deer do during those conditions.
- 11:01Speaker 2: If they aren't on the oak tree you've found that's
- 11:03Speaker 2: covered in siine, where are they? If they don't seem
- 11:07Speaker 2: to visit the pond you want to sit over until
- 11:09Speaker 2: super late in the evening. Can you get in there
- 11:11Speaker 2: in the morning, Can you back off and set up
- 11:13Speaker 2: for them as they make their way to the water,
- 11:15Speaker 2: or can you sit that pond for three days in
- 11:18Speaker 2: a row off the wind's right to eventually catch a buck,
- 11:21Speaker 2: you know, coming in at daylight to the drinking fountain
- 11:24Speaker 2: on a lot of the public land trips I take,
- 11:26Speaker 2: I either kill almost always on the first day or
- 11:29Speaker 2: somewhere like four to six days into the hunt. If
- 11:32Speaker 2: it doesn't work out quickly, which is pretty common, it
- 11:35Speaker 2: takes me time to work the deer enough to get
- 11:37Speaker 2: clued into something that will pay off. When you travel
- 11:40Speaker 2: out of state on a hunt like that, the motivation
- 11:43Speaker 2: is high to stick with it and keep scouting and
- 11:45Speaker 2: keep hunting.
- 11:46Speaker 3: What other choice do you have.
- 11:48Speaker 2: But when you're home and you don't expect any big
- 11:50Speaker 2: deer to be moving on the lease, you won't put
- 11:53Speaker 2: in the effort to figure out where they are moving.
- 11:55Speaker 2: And yes, they are always moving, and they're always offering
- 11:59Speaker 2: up a chance for someone. A lot of hunters get
- 12:02Speaker 2: into the season and they say to themselves they're going
- 12:04Speaker 2: to wait for the weather to get right and then
- 12:07Speaker 2: they'll go to their favorite setup, you know, the one
- 12:09Speaker 2: they believe in, and they'll think the conditions will solve
- 12:12Speaker 2: the problem for them. It works enough to talk us
- 12:15Speaker 2: into it. But there is a better way, I mean,
- 12:18Speaker 2: a really simple way to understand this is to hunt
- 12:20Speaker 2: field edges in the early season and to try to
- 12:22Speaker 2: start out where you have a lot of visibility. If
- 12:26Speaker 2: the bucks come out on the other end of the field,
- 12:28Speaker 2: get just move, you know, move there. The next night,
- 12:31Speaker 2: if you can find a good tree or tuck yourself
- 12:34Speaker 2: into the ground somewhere, try to kill them right where
- 12:36Speaker 2: they showed you they like to walk. We believe this
- 12:39Speaker 2: will work, and it does work, largely because we believe
- 12:42Speaker 2: that early season bucks are patternable and that we can
- 12:45Speaker 2: capitalize on their habits, which is somewhat true. But most
- 12:49Speaker 2: bucks are patternable to an extent all season long, even
- 12:52Speaker 2: deer on public land, and I'd say sometimes especially deer
- 12:56Speaker 2: on public land, because if they find a survival strategy there,
- 13:00Speaker 2: it works. It usually works really well. But that doesn't
- 13:04Speaker 2: mean you can't figure them out. You probably won't if
- 13:07Speaker 2: you only dip into their world sporadically when the weather
- 13:10Speaker 2: is just right, you know, just right enough to get
- 13:13Speaker 2: all your competition out there as well.
- 13:14Speaker 3: You need a little bit of time.
- 13:16Speaker 2: Now. If you want to get close to deer, and
- 13:18Speaker 2: I know you do, you have to understand that there
- 13:20Speaker 2: is no way to truly get good at that which
- 13:23Speaker 2: doesn't involve getting out there with them to let them
- 13:26Speaker 2: show you what they do. You have to understand that
- 13:29Speaker 2: to get close to deer and especially big old bucks.
- 13:33Speaker 2: Means you have to carefully follow through on a plan
- 13:36Speaker 2: for every sit, which gets a lot easier if you
- 13:38Speaker 2: know that that very sit can be followed up by
- 13:41Speaker 2: another and another. So if you blank, it's no big deal.
- 13:45Speaker 2: You tried something and it didn't work. But now that
- 13:47Speaker 2: you know that didn't work, you could follow it up
- 13:50Speaker 2: with a sit somewhere else that allows you to address
- 13:52Speaker 2: some of the things you might think conspired to keep
- 13:56Speaker 2: you know, your deer liss on the first sit. It's
- 13:59Speaker 2: sort of a process of elimination thing that resets itself
- 14:02Speaker 2: every time you have a few days away from the woods,
- 14:05Speaker 2: because things change out there. Instead of just going where
- 14:08Speaker 2: you want to hunt, you go where you think the
- 14:10Speaker 2: deer are going to be, and you figure out if
- 14:12Speaker 2: you're right. You'll mostly not be right, but that's okay.
- 14:15Speaker 2: That's how it goes, and you'll really mostly not be
- 14:18Speaker 2: right if you want to shoot a mature buck, but
- 14:20Speaker 2: again that's okay. It's more of an exercise in keeping
- 14:24Speaker 2: with it and trying to figure something out that matters.
- 14:28Speaker 2: This is kind of a strategy to kill what we
- 14:30Speaker 2: think we know about deer and show ourselves what is
- 14:34Speaker 2: actually true about them.
- 14:35Speaker 3: It's also about a.
- 14:37Speaker 2: Better way to approach things, because I promise you that
- 14:40Speaker 2: if you can string together, you know, however many sits
- 14:43Speaker 2: all season long, you'll realize that you're actually working the deer,
- 14:48Speaker 2: not just crossing your fingers and hoping they'll come by.
- 14:51Speaker 2: This is how you get in close proximity to them,
- 14:54Speaker 2: and how you figure out how to just often enough
- 14:58Speaker 2: get in close proximity to mature. I'm not saying this
- 15:01Speaker 2: is the only answer, because you should be scouting a lot,
- 15:05Speaker 2: and if you do that and you run cameras while
- 15:07Speaker 2: staying truly curious, you're gonna have real data points to
- 15:10Speaker 2: plug into your hunting plans. You'll make better use of
- 15:14Speaker 2: your time when you do have an evening and then
- 15:16Speaker 2: a morning to sit, and then on the weekend when
- 15:18Speaker 2: you can do four sits in a row, if you
- 15:20Speaker 2: can sneak away from the house just enough. I also
- 15:23Speaker 2: feel like this strategy has worked so well for me,
- 15:25Speaker 2: in large part because it allows me to just kind
- 15:27Speaker 2: of get in the zone. If I have a random
- 15:29Speaker 2: sit and nothing for a while, I feel like an
- 15:32Speaker 2: uninvited guest in the woods. But the more time I
- 15:35Speaker 2: get to be there. You know, the more days in
- 15:37Speaker 2: a row, the more I feel like I be along there.
- 15:40Speaker 2: And when that happens, I'm always better at getting into
- 15:43Speaker 2: my stands, you know, a little quieter, getting them set
- 15:46Speaker 2: up a little quieter, or just sneaking in and just
- 15:49Speaker 2: being more comfortable with the process. And when any of
- 15:52Speaker 2: that happens, or all of it happens, well, I usually
- 15:55Speaker 2: have good encounters if I have a reasonable enough timeline
- 15:58Speaker 2: to work the deer. I know this is sort of
- 16:00Speaker 2: an abstract and hard thing to put into practice now,
- 16:03Speaker 2: but it's something to think about because it'll help you
- 16:05Speaker 2: be a better hunter and fisherman no matter what you're
- 16:08Speaker 2: trying to shoot or catch. It's not a get rich
- 16:10Speaker 2: quick thing, but a sneaky way to develop some woodsmanship
- 16:13Speaker 2: and to just plug into their world while watching, learning
- 16:16Speaker 2: and priming yourself to make the next move, and then
- 16:18Speaker 2: the next move, until one of them proves to be
- 16:20Speaker 2: the right move and you find yourself in real type
- 16:23Speaker 2: proximity to the kind of buck you really want to shoot.
- 16:26Speaker 2: Do that, think about it, and then come back next week,
- 16:29Speaker 2: because I'm going to talk about more deer hunting concepts, strategies,
- 16:31Speaker 2: philosophies and failures. That's it for this week. I'm Tony Peterson.
- 16:36Speaker 2: This has been the Wired to Hunt Foundation's podcast. I
- 16:39Speaker 2: want to thank you so much for all of your support,
- 16:41Speaker 2: and I know we put out a ton of content
- 16:43Speaker 2: here at metire. We ask a lot of you guys,
- 16:46Speaker 2: and you show up for us. We truly appreciate that.
- 16:48Speaker 2: Thank you for that. Now, speaking of that content, if
- 16:51Speaker 2: you want to see more of it or listen to
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