Latest / Who Did What Now With Katie Charlwood / 011 - Nell Gwynn - Whore of Yore

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011 - Nell Gwynn - Whore of Yore · Who Did What Now With Katie Charlwood

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Speaker 5: Hi, and welcome to Hooded What now?
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Speaker 1: Or Hello and welcome to the Coven of Contempt and
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Speaker 1: cookies or donuts whatever helps you digest historical facts? What
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Speaker 1: Welcome to hood and what Now? The history podcast with
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Speaker 1: me your petty host Katie Charlwood, intersectional feminist and reader
1:41
Speaker 1: of books. And I'm going to start this off by saying, Hi,
1:45
Speaker 1: if you are new here, this is a history podcast
1:47
Speaker 1: that is not your history class. You will hear things
1:51
Speaker 1: here that you probably wouldn't have learned in school or
1:54
Speaker 1: may have been actively avoided being told in school. But
1:57
Speaker 1: that's okay. We're allowed to get her know from different places,
2:01
Speaker 1: and it's okay if we have different opinions. However, don't
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Speaker 1: be a dick about it.
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Speaker 5: I feel is kind of the way of things. Back
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Speaker 5: to the story in hand.
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Speaker 1: This week, I am very, very excited.
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Speaker 5: To talk about a whoror of your Nell. Gwen.
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Speaker 1: I love Nell, Gwen. She is glorious. I'm gonna start
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Speaker 1: off by giving you some sources. We're just gonna jump
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Speaker 1: right into it this week. We're gonna jump right in. Okay,
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Speaker 1: So sources okay. First one is a novel. It's called
2:34
Speaker 1: Mistress nell Gwin by Marjorie Boonen, but it's it is
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Speaker 1: also known as Nell Gwin a decoration, so it's more
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Speaker 1: of a historical novel than it is a biography, but
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Speaker 1: it was still an interesting piece to read. Another vert
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Speaker 1: is nel Gwen by Charles bow Clerk, the first Duke
2:54
Speaker 1: of Saint Albans. Who is her son? So obviously an
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Speaker 1: article on the astonishing life of Nell Gwyn At the
3:01
Speaker 1: National Theater School of Canada.
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Speaker 6: There is Britannica dot com, Encyclopedia dot com, oh, Historic
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Speaker 6: qk dot com Neil Gwen, Mistress of King Charles A second.
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Speaker 1: Let us get into Nil Gwin, just like King Charles
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Speaker 1: the Second did whoa, whoa, whoa what? I love Neil Gwen. Oh.
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Speaker 1: I should probably add that I will always try and
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Speaker 1: have inclusive language here on the podcast, especially because one
3:30
Speaker 1: it's just necessary. I don't understand why you wouldn't. However,
3:34
Speaker 1: we're dealing with the sixteen hundreds, the seventeenth century. There
3:38
Speaker 1: is always the possibility that if I'm using a direct quote,
3:43
Speaker 1: maybe by Nell herself, who knows if I'm using quotes
3:47
Speaker 1: and references from the era, some statements may not be
3:51
Speaker 1: as inclusive or respectful as you know we would have
3:56
Speaker 1: them now, and we have to take that into consideration
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Speaker 1: when we're dealing with stuff in the past. So let's
4:01
Speaker 1: get right into it. The details regarding the origins of
4:05
Speaker 1: Nell's life are a kind of fuzzy because we don't
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Speaker 1: have complete verified accounts on one way or the other.
4:12
Speaker 5: It's very much like we were talking about Grandeur Wheel.
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Speaker 1: I've done my best to make this as clear as
4:18
Speaker 1: possible and as factual as possible, but a lot of
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Speaker 1: this information is coming from like poetry, plays, novels, gossip
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Speaker 1: and you know, sexist historians. So we're going to take
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Speaker 1: what we can with the pinch of salt. Eleanor Gwyn
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Speaker 1: was born on the second of February, perhaps in sixteen fifty,
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Speaker 1: perhaps in sixteen forty two, we don't know. We don't
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Speaker 1: know Her mother Ellen or there and thereabouts, known as
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Speaker 1: old Madam, Madame Gwen or Old Magwin, and she basically
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Speaker 1: lived most of her life in the West End of London.
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Speaker 1: Most biographers claim she was low born, probably because most
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Speaker 1: people back then we're low born, and her father was
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Speaker 1: some dead maybe from Wales, maybe.
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Speaker 5: Died in prison.
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Speaker 1: Who is he? We don't know? Do we care? No,
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Speaker 1: we fucking don't. So okay. Now, at one point is
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Speaker 1: assigned arms similar to those of the Gwinns of I'm
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Speaker 1: gonna try and pronounce this Welsh name and I'm gonna fail,
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Speaker 1: but I think it's.
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Speaker 5: Sansnor than sonor l l a n s a n
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Speaker 5: and o R.
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Speaker 1: I tried. If I failed, I'm so sorry, Welsh people,
5:29
Speaker 1: I am so sorry. So like, loads of places claimed
5:33
Speaker 1: to be like the birthplace of Neil Gwynn because they're
5:36
Speaker 1: able to have a record of it, so they're like, yeah,
5:38
Speaker 1: we totally are. So you've got Hereford, you've got London
5:41
Speaker 1: mainly Covent Garden, and you've got Oxford and they're like yep.
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Speaker 1: Like there's a traditional belief that she was born in
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Speaker 1: Pipewell Lane in Hereford. And one of the reasons why
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Speaker 1: that one is so popular is because like Gwinn's like
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Speaker 1: a Welsh name and it is Hereford's on like the
5:56
Speaker 1: border of Wales. Whether or not Nell's dad was like
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Speaker 1: dead or in prison or we're fucked off somewhere, we
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Speaker 1: don't know, We don't care.
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Speaker 5: But there's like stories he died in a debtor's prison.
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Speaker 1: So Nell, Rose and her mum, they're stuck. Like you're
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Speaker 1: a woman in the sixteen hundreds, What the fuck are
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Speaker 1: you gonna do? Respectable employment ain't exactly easy to get by.
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Speaker 1: So Ellen, Helena, Helena big mog Gwin, whatever she's called,
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Speaker 1: she decides to turn to the oldest profession in the
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Speaker 1: book and she sells her body to feed her little girls. So,
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Speaker 1: Madam Gwynn, she was an alcoholic and she ran what
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Speaker 1: was known as a body house, body bawdy, or you know,
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Speaker 1: as we would call it a brothel. Some historians suggest
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Speaker 1: that Nell and her sister Rose, you know, some say
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Speaker 1: that she was a child prostitute. Can one really be
6:52
Speaker 1: ahl prostitute? Because Nope, too much rage, You're not going
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Speaker 1: to do that. So like, you know, some say that,
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Speaker 1: you know that she worked in the brothel as a
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Speaker 1: she's known as like a body house servant. Perhaps she
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Speaker 1: was a cinder girl and a street seller, possibly of
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Speaker 1: herrings oysters turnips. She was known as a street hawker. Well,
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Speaker 1: so you now, what I can think of is like
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Speaker 1: a live alivel So okay, side note, So like we
7:21
Speaker 1: always talk about, you know, people of the past, and
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Speaker 1: often when prostitutes and what I would call sex workers
7:30
Speaker 1: but back then would be called prostitutes or harlots or whatever.
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Speaker 1: It's always seen as this very ce day sex workers
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Speaker 1: throughout the ages, they tend to be vilified. They tend
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Speaker 1: to be seen as these evil, scheming wenches, these harlots.
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Speaker 1: It's always seen in this derogatory, awful term, and the
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Speaker 1: deviance of the whole situation is always placed upon the women.
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Speaker 1: But like it very rarely takes into account that working
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Speaker 1: class women like Nell Gwynn had almost zero opportunity, zero
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Speaker 1: means of independent survival in that day and age.
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Speaker 5: They didn't have it.
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Speaker 1: There were little to know opportunities for these people. So
8:17
Speaker 1: the Cromwells were effectively the buzz killing jons of the
8:21
Speaker 1: you know, sixteen hundreds, and they banned anything that they
8:25
Speaker 1: felt was frivolous, including like theear tar and parties and
8:29
Speaker 1: anything like that. And for like that was like a
8:31
Speaker 1: decade of just drab, dreary sadness and Charles the Second,
8:37
Speaker 1: the best headline I've seen was Charles the Second was
8:43
Speaker 1: the King to.
8:43
Speaker 5: Randy to rule.
8:45
Speaker 1: It's glorious so King Charles the Second, Oh, King Charles Second.
8:49
Speaker 1: Anyone who's seen horrible histories, there was the King Charles
8:52
Speaker 1: the Second. Loved to party, he was he was the
8:55
Speaker 1: fun king. The monarchy is re established and he gets
8:59
Speaker 1: put back in the throne. He goes back. So sixteen
9:01
Speaker 1: sixty he's back on the throne. He quickly reinstates the theater.
9:05
Speaker 1: He loves theater. And like say, for example, even though
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Speaker 1: like Queen Elizabeth was a patron of the arts, shall
9:10
Speaker 1: we say, she didn't visit the theater, she never went there.
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Speaker 1: It's not something she did. Things were brought to her.
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Speaker 1: She was a patron of the arts, but she didn't
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Speaker 1: really go there anyway. Point being, he became king and
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Speaker 1: one of the first things he did was boom, theaters
9:25
Speaker 1: are back. And also he forms acting companies and he
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Speaker 1: legalizes the women being allowed to act because like before this,
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Speaker 1: all of the actors in any production, in any theater
9:37
Speaker 1: group or any company, shall we say, they were played
9:40
Speaker 1: by men. But when Charles the Second comes around, he's like, nah,
9:46
Speaker 1: they can act to So in sixteen sixty three, the
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Speaker 1: King's Company, led by Thomas Kilgrew Thomas Killergrew opens a
9:53
Speaker 1: new players the theater in Bridges Street, and this is
9:57
Speaker 1: literally built and renamed the Theater Royal Dreary Lane. Mary
10:00
Speaker 1: Megs was known as Orange Male. She was a pal
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Speaker 1: of old Madam Gwinn's and she had a license to
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Speaker 1: then utter and sell oranges, lemon fruit, sweetmeats and all
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Speaker 1: manner of fruit ers and confectioners wears within the theater.
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Speaker 1: So Orange mal hires the notorious Rose and Nelgwin orange
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Speaker 1: girls who they sell these like little small they're known
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Speaker 1: as China oranges to the audience inside the theater. They
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Speaker 1: sell them for sixpence each and they do it with
10:32
Speaker 1: being a bit more scantily clad. So this is the
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Speaker 1: King's playhouse, and as we said, Charles himself usually comes
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Speaker 1: to performances. So being an orange seller, being an orange
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Speaker 1: girl gave them access in connections to London's higher society
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Speaker 1: that they wouldn't have had previously. And another thing they
10:49
Speaker 1: would do so they not only would they sell their
10:51
Speaker 1: sixpence of oranges, they would deliver messages to and from
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Speaker 1: horny high society men and they would get tipped by this,
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Speaker 1: tipped for this hopefully in chain and not buy. The
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Speaker 1: type of panis Most historians do agree, though, that the
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Speaker 1: girls often ended up delivering more than a refreshments, so
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Speaker 1: they would sell fruit, they would deliver messages, and they
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Speaker 1: would also quite probably possibly provide sexual favors in exchange
11:17
Speaker 1: for money. I suppose it depends on how body this
11:21
Speaker 1: theater was really I mean, were they giving hand jobs
11:23
Speaker 1: in the back of the theater? Were they meeting somewhere
11:25
Speaker 1: a bit more discreet? Were they in a box? And
11:28
Speaker 1: when if we're in a box, you're generally fine. But anyway,
11:31
Speaker 1: point being good oldnell All. He does this for like
11:34
Speaker 1: a year. So while she's at the theater, she becomes
11:36
Speaker 1: the mistress of the leading man of the theater, Charles Hart.
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Speaker 1: So less than a year later she becomes one of
11:43
Speaker 1: the first public actresses in England. She's pretty fucking cool,
11:47
Speaker 1: so somewhere between the age of fourteen and twenty one,
11:50
Speaker 1: because we don't know her birthdate, she manages to level
11:53
Speaker 1: up when it becomes one of the actresses at Bridges
11:56
Speaker 1: Street Theater. Nellyson is like this absolute stunner. So she
12:00
Speaker 1: has chestnut hair, light hazel eyes, partly like a really
12:04
Speaker 1: nice smile. So she's also described and I'm really sorry
12:07
Speaker 1: for this as having curvacious legs and daintily tiny feet.
12:12
Speaker 1: This has definitely got some Cinderella field to it. I'm
12:15
Speaker 1: just saying, oh man, I mean, here's the thing about Nell. Like,
12:21
Speaker 1: we know she's gorgeous, right, oh like and near enough,
12:25
Speaker 1: every portrait of Nell really really shows off her bosom.
12:28
Speaker 1: The restoration was not a subtle time, my friends, not
12:31
Speaker 1: a subtle time. So Nelgwen is witty as fuck, absolutely
12:35
Speaker 1: stunning and has a strong, clear voice, which one would
12:39
Speaker 1: supposedly have if she was a street hawker before that,
12:42
Speaker 1: because she would need to be able to have people
12:44
Speaker 1: hear her so she could sell shit. So apparently all
12:47
Speaker 1: these things combined caught the eye of Killer Grew, who
12:51
Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier, and she had to prove herself clever
12:56
Speaker 1: enough to succeed as an actress. Right, So now she
13:00
Speaker 1: can't read, she can't write. She is a literate for
13:02
Speaker 1: the record, so she basically starts learning shit off other actors.
13:05
Speaker 1: So she learns to dance, she learns to perform, you know,
13:09
Speaker 1: she takes it all on board. And in general, at
13:11
Speaker 1: the time, plays had such short runs because there was
13:13
Speaker 1: such a small audience pill as limited people were going
13:17
Speaker 1: to the theater, so each thing that was shown was
13:18
Speaker 1: always going to have a short run. So the River
13:20
Speaker 1: Miles states that she was shagging all these actors and
13:22
Speaker 1: that's why they told her all the stuff she.
13:24
Speaker 5: Wanted to know.
13:25
Speaker 1: And you know what you do, what you're going to
13:26
Speaker 1: do to get yourself out of the slums of London. Girl,
13:28
Speaker 1: live your best life. And at this point she's she's
13:31
Speaker 1: a little bit of celebrity. She's known as pretty Witty Nell.
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Speaker 1: We know that she becomes a decent actress and is
13:37
Speaker 1: relatively well known by sixteen sixty five, and the first
13:40
Speaker 1: recorded appearance we have of her on stage is in
13:43
Speaker 1: March sixteen sixty five in the heroic drama The Indian Emperor,
13:48
Speaker 1: playing Sadaria, daughter of Motezuma and the love interest of
13:53
Speaker 1: Cortes played by her real life lover Charles Hart.
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Speaker 5: So yeah, so this is a drama.
13:59
Speaker 1: Now ourselves said she wasn't really super into like playing
14:01
Speaker 1: drama and didn't release through too much. So when this
14:04
Speaker 1: new restoration comedy comes around, Nell Gwynn becomes a fucking star. Unfortunately,
14:12
Speaker 1: mid sixteen sixty five. So like, just as she's like
14:15
Speaker 1: really hitting her stride, what comes to London the Great
14:19
Speaker 1: Plague of London, because of course it does, I know,
14:23
Speaker 1: you know, obviously Bridges Street shuts down, so Gwynn and
14:26
Speaker 1: her mum they basically bollocks off to Oxford following the
14:29
Speaker 1: King and his court play. The King's company has these
14:33
Speaker 1: these private shows for the King during well, they're like
14:36
Speaker 1: hiding from the second plague. And then when the theaters reopen,
14:39
Speaker 1: Gwen's back on the stage doing her fun thing. So
14:43
Speaker 1: the sixty In sixteen sixty seven, she has an affair
14:46
Speaker 1: with Charles Sackville and he's known as Lord Buckhurst. Sackville
14:50
Speaker 1: was cultured, witchy, satirical, dissolute and utterly charming. But you
14:53
Speaker 1: know what was also quite nice about Lord Buckhurst is
14:57
Speaker 1: he gave her an allowance of one hundred pounds a
14:59
Speaker 1: year so she could leave acting. But it didn't last
15:02
Speaker 1: very long. It is sixteen sixty seven and the second
15:06
Speaker 1: Duke of Buckingham, George Villiers, goes to Gwynn and he's like, listen,
15:12
Speaker 1: I want to get Charles's second new mistress, my cousin,
15:14
Speaker 1: Barbara Palmer. She's just like principal mysterress. She's like number
15:18
Speaker 1: one and honestly I really like to get closer to
15:22
Speaker 1: the King. I want to move up the ranks a
15:23
Speaker 1: little bit more. So maybe you could be as mistress
15:26
Speaker 1: because I think you're an actress. He loves a shit,
15:29
Speaker 1: what do you think? Gwinn's like, sure, I'll take five
15:33
Speaker 1: hundred pounds a year and then today's money fifty six,
15:38
Speaker 1: eight hundred and eighty nine pounds and twenty five pence esh.
15:42
Speaker 1: So this plan fails. Yeah, she has for five hundred
15:45
Speaker 1: for a year and this is like, nah, too much,
15:48
Speaker 1: no way mate.
15:49
Speaker 5: So he is so annoyed.
15:51
Speaker 1: He is shocked and appalled at Nail's response, so fucking
15:55
Speaker 1: basically offers it to mal Davis. And I like to
15:58
Speaker 1: think that this is just a little bit.
15:59
Speaker 5: Of spite because he did because she was Gwynn's sort
16:03
Speaker 5: of acting rival, like.
16:05
Speaker 1: She was the one. So Buckingham's like, you know, I'm
16:07
Speaker 1: going to go to the other company with mal Davis.
16:09
Speaker 1: She's an actress there. I'm gonna set her up with
16:11
Speaker 1: the king because she's cheaper. So that's good. And Nell's like,
16:18
Speaker 1: fuck that for a game of soldiers, I don't think, so,
16:22
Speaker 1: don't do this to people. But it's still pretty funny.
16:26
Speaker 1: Don't do this to people. So mal Davis is due
16:29
Speaker 1: to spend an evening with the King and she's having
16:31
Speaker 1: her tea time cakes. But little does she know that Nell,
16:36
Speaker 1: with the help of a friend, manages to put a
16:39
Speaker 1: very powerful laxative into these tea time cakes, thus meaning
16:45
Speaker 1: Davis had the runs instead of meeting with the king,
16:48
Speaker 1: or maybe she met with the King and then suddenly,
16:51
Speaker 1: oh oh, either way, this didn't happen. She managed to
16:54
Speaker 1: kaibosch that. So basically, Charles and Nell they begin an
16:58
Speaker 1: affair and around about sixteen sixty eight, and in general
17:02
Speaker 1: everyone thought, yeah, this isn't gonna last because they were like,
17:05
Speaker 1: he runs through women, like he runs through whatever the fuck.
17:09
Speaker 1: Everyone assumed that this was gonna be another one of
17:12
Speaker 1: the King's wings. He was shagg and actress has left
17:15
Speaker 1: right and center. He kind of did whatever he wanted. Really,
17:18
Speaker 1: but because so there she is. She's mid sixteen sixty eight.
17:23
Speaker 1: They're having the reffair. Nell is continuing to act. She's
17:28
Speaker 1: known as this comic actress. She's funny, she's witty, she's
17:35
Speaker 1: and because she's you know, she's notorious now and this
17:38
Speaker 1: brings in like, you know, larger crowds, and then playwrights
17:41
Speaker 1: are creating more roles for her, and she's just constantly
17:45
Speaker 1: showing up in all these different plays. Yeah, so she's
17:48
Speaker 1: in Dryden's and Evening's Love, She's in Lacy's Old Troop
17:53
Speaker 1: Cavalier blah blah blah blah. However, so basically she gets
17:56
Speaker 1: more committed to the king the less she acts. So, yeah,
18:01
Speaker 1: when she meets Charles, he has a wife, a primary mistress,
18:07
Speaker 1: and all of these, all these ASIX actresses he just
18:10
Speaker 1: cannot keep his dick out of because man, I mean,
18:14
Speaker 1: we make jokes about sex adres, but at this point,
18:16
Speaker 1: I'm starting to think he really just was a sex
18:19
Speaker 1: addict because he was There wasn't anything he wasn't sticking
18:22
Speaker 1: his dick in. Charles was married to the Portuguese Queen
18:26
Speaker 1: concert Catherine of Braganza, and there was this whole situation
18:30
Speaker 1: called the Bedchamber Crisis, which resulted in with most of
18:36
Speaker 1: Catherine's reading you being dumped back to Portugal and she
18:39
Speaker 1: was being ostracized from the court and we're gonna talk
18:42
Speaker 1: about we will get into this another time. So basically
18:45
Speaker 1: she has no choice but to allow Charles. Charles's mistresses
18:48
Speaker 1: to be given like semi official sort of standing and
18:52
Speaker 1: you know whatever. So yeah, so basically Nil's adopted into
18:56
Speaker 1: court and she is like this permanent fixture in count life.
19:00
Speaker 1: So like Nelle had this joke that Charles the Second
19:03
Speaker 1: she would call him Charles the third after the other
19:06
Speaker 1: two Charles. She was, she was bumping up, was with
19:09
Speaker 1: fucking love it neil Gwen when she asked for the
19:11
Speaker 1: five hundred pounds from Buckingham and he was like nah.
19:14
Speaker 1: So when she becomes Charles mistress, Charles the Second's mistress,
19:18
Speaker 1: he gives her an income of four thousand pounds a year,
19:22
Speaker 1: and this goes up to nine thousand pounds a year,
19:25
Speaker 1: and like in today's money, that's four hundred and fifty
19:30
Speaker 1: five thousand, one hundred and fourteen pounds.
19:34
Speaker 5: What the okay?
19:36
Speaker 1: Yes, please, I listen, have as many mistresses do you like?
19:40
Speaker 5: I'll take that money.
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20:13
Speaker 1: You know what, Being an actress in a harlot really
20:15
Speaker 1: set her up here because it meant that she was
20:17
Speaker 1: used to performing, which is something she would have to
20:19
Speaker 1: do at court quite a bit, because life of court
20:23
Speaker 1: it's performative, you know what I mean. And even though
20:26
Speaker 1: she was disliked by the rival mistresses, obviously she.
20:30
Speaker 5: Was very well liked by other courtiers. And she was
20:34
Speaker 5: and she had she was quite popular with the public.
20:36
Speaker 1: Oh my god. So Barbara Palmer, I fucking love this.
20:40
Speaker 1: She shows up in this like new fancy carriage, all
20:44
Speaker 1: up in Nail's face about it. So Nell. So she
20:47
Speaker 1: shows up at Barbara's estate and this rough little cart
20:52
Speaker 1: that is being drawn by six oxen.
20:56
Speaker 5: So she just goes round and round the building.
20:59
Speaker 1: Yelling to market. Oh and The whole point of this
21:05
Speaker 1: is like, Barbara, can you know, have her fancy carriage
21:07
Speaker 1: and her fancy state and do whatever she does and
21:11
Speaker 1: act how she wants to act. But they're both mistresses
21:14
Speaker 1: and it doesn't change that. So yeah, Nell's out shopping
21:19
Speaker 1: and at some point during this shopping spray and her
21:22
Speaker 1: coachman is in a fight with like all these other men,
21:25
Speaker 1: and she's like, what is going on? And he tells
21:29
Speaker 1: her that they called nell Ahore and she responds with
21:33
Speaker 1: I am a whore. Find something else to fight about.
21:36
Speaker 1: And the story goes that she gives them a wink,
21:39
Speaker 1: gets back into her carriage, and then heads on back
21:42
Speaker 1: to the palace. Oh so, so nel Gwin decides to
21:46
Speaker 1: get a portrait painted of herself. So this portrait of
21:51
Speaker 1: nel Gwin is glorious, made by a cleverly anonymous painter
21:57
Speaker 1: in the late seventeenth century. Is it's quite small, so
22:01
Speaker 1: it's barely larger than a postcard. Let me describe it
22:03
Speaker 1: for you. I will post it on the Instagram actually
22:07
Speaker 1: for you, so you can have We look a virginal
22:09
Speaker 1: white Gwynn and she's in this virginal white chemise. Her
22:13
Speaker 1: bosom is showing and she is she's flashing this bountiful
22:18
Speaker 1: bosom well stuffing sausages. And if that isn't an innuendo,
22:23
Speaker 1: I don't know what it is. I love the idea
22:26
Speaker 1: of like sending a nude and it's just like a
22:29
Speaker 1: painting that she had to pose for. I love it.
22:32
Speaker 1: So while at court Nell wasn't like used to you know,
22:36
Speaker 1: money and having a lot of it, and so she
22:39
Speaker 1: will like gamble away like massive, massive sums like so
22:43
Speaker 1: she's playing cards with this gentleman, shall we say, So
22:47
Speaker 1: she loses a bunch of money to him, and he
22:50
Speaker 1: tries to pressure her to pay him back with her body,
22:53
Speaker 1: and she's like no, she calls him a dog and
22:57
Speaker 1: absolutely refuses.
22:58
Speaker 5: Probably got King Charles thell When.
23:01
Speaker 1: Nel's with Charles the first couple of years, you know
23:04
Speaker 1: there is there isn't that much competition in the way
23:09
Speaker 1: where the mistresses. You've got Barbara Palmer who's like already
23:12
Speaker 1: on the way out. You know, she's she's getting older,
23:15
Speaker 1: you know, she's just not really up for it as
23:17
Speaker 1: much anymore. And you've got like mal Davis, who who
23:22
Speaker 1: she got rid off. Okay, so love aucking love so
23:28
Speaker 1: like proof that Nell is naturally funny.
23:31
Speaker 5: So King Charles a second is freaking out.
23:33
Speaker 1: He's got all these mistresses and they're all hounding him
23:36
Speaker 1: for money, and he's freaking the fuck out, and he's like, Nell,
23:40
Speaker 1: what do I do? And her response was, lock up
23:44
Speaker 1: your cod piece. I love that. It's like, well, oh,
23:48
Speaker 1: maybe if you weren't taking so much time getting your
23:50
Speaker 1: dick with you wouldn't have to throw coins at everybody,
23:53
Speaker 1: like deal with it, mate. So Nell Gwyn is loved
23:59
Speaker 1: by the common people, so like they all know he's
24:01
Speaker 1: pretty whitty Nell. And this is all because, like when
24:05
Speaker 1: she was acting, she was this really really popular comic
24:08
Speaker 1: performer and they loved seeing her as these like sassy
24:12
Speaker 1: heroines and comedies and romances. You know, drama wasn't really
24:17
Speaker 1: your thing, but she was so loved and you know,
24:21
Speaker 1: she was great at it. She gives birth to her
24:26
Speaker 1: first son, Charles, on the eighth of May sixteen seventy
24:30
Speaker 1: and this is like the King's seventh son by five
24:32
Speaker 1: separate mistresses, and he is this is Charles bow Clerk.
24:37
Speaker 1: So Nell is this fucking superstar. So a stage company
24:40
Speaker 1: literally waits months for her to be ready to go
24:43
Speaker 1: back to the stage, and she does. But the reason
24:45
Speaker 1: she leaves is because she has to go back to
24:48
Speaker 1: courtfield time because there's.
24:50
Speaker 5: A new girl in town.
24:51
Speaker 1: So she has spent years and years being Charles's favorite mistress.
24:55
Speaker 1: So after she gives birth to Charles, this new mistress
24:59
Speaker 1: comes in, a French mistress, Louise de Querroll. You know,
25:03
Speaker 1: I made of honor for Queen Catherine, but generally this
25:06
Speaker 1: is designed by English and friends to sort of, you know,
25:09
Speaker 1: as a way to appease King Charles. Louise becomes her
25:14
Speaker 1: main rival. They were complete opposites. So like Louise was
25:18
Speaker 1: a noble woman of noble birth, she's himmendenence, she's up here,
25:23
Speaker 1: and Nell is like, I'm from the guten mate, but.
25:25
Speaker 5: I will take you down.
25:29
Speaker 1: The rivalry between like Curwell and gwyn is just fantastic.
25:34
Speaker 5: It's it's oh, I was like, that is that is
25:37
Speaker 5: what I need to see.
25:38
Speaker 1: If you're gonna make me a historical period drama, bring
25:41
Speaker 1: me Neil Gwynn. Let me see backstabbing and fighting and
25:46
Speaker 1: just sly jabs back and forth, abs fucking Lily when
25:51
Speaker 1: so basically Louise becomes a duchess.
25:53
Speaker 5: She gets an official Dutch mistress.
25:54
Speaker 1: She becomes the Duchess of Portsmouth, and she was always
25:57
Speaker 1: bringing up like the fact that Neil was low born
25:59
Speaker 1: and she didn't she wasn't noble, and she would like
26:02
Speaker 1: say things to nell like she is such pretty clothe
26:05
Speaker 1: and she could be queen because she's been like so
26:07
Speaker 1: sarcastic about it, and Nelle was just like okay, and
26:11
Speaker 1: de Cartwheel look horror enough to be a duchess, like
26:16
Speaker 1: the Duchess Louise de Carolle. She's wearing black because some
26:21
Speaker 1: French just died, Yeah, like a French prince dies.
26:24
Speaker 5: So she's like wearing all black and stuff. And Nelle
26:27
Speaker 5: decides to do the same fucking thing.
26:29
Speaker 1: So she comes in. Somebody asks like, who are you
26:33
Speaker 1: in relation to this French prince and Nelle responds, oh,
26:38
Speaker 1: exactly the same relation that the French prince was to
26:40
Speaker 1: Mademoiselle de Carolell. So Nelle gets this house in palml
26:44
Speaker 1: and she moves into this brick town house and it's
26:48
Speaker 1: and it's owned by the crown, and basically nel says,
26:52
Speaker 1: it's like, if I don't own this house, if it
26:54
Speaker 1: isn't in my name, then it's not my house and
26:56
Speaker 1: I don't live there, So what are you gonna do?
27:00
Speaker 1: She said, you know, it has to be it has
27:02
Speaker 1: to be given to her by an act of Parliament.
27:04
Speaker 1: So that's what they do. It becomes in sixteen seventy
27:07
Speaker 1: six she's granted the freehold of the property and this
27:12
Speaker 1: like stays in her family until sixteen ninety three, and
27:15
Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty the house was still the only one
27:19
Speaker 1: on the south side of pal Mall not owned by
27:22
Speaker 1: the crown. It's fucking glorious.
27:24
Speaker 5: So the house in pal mal right.
27:26
Speaker 1: So the bed that she has there is made of
27:29
Speaker 1: solid silver and would cost like three hundred grand today
27:34
Speaker 1: to have. And the sleeping quarters also had like this
27:37
Speaker 1: suggestive warming tree for her bedroom activities, and it is
27:41
Speaker 1: inscribed with fear God and serve the King. The reason
27:45
Speaker 1: this silver bed exists is because Nell. Now, oh my god,
27:50
Speaker 1: she takes ah. I love this pettiness. I aspire to
27:54
Speaker 1: be this level of petty. Oh. So Louise de Carolelle
27:59
Speaker 1: or Louise Cartmel as she called her. So she gets
28:02
Speaker 1: this silver dinnerware from the king and it is extravagant.
28:05
Speaker 1: And now was like, all right, okay, keep your forks,
28:08
Speaker 1: my friend. So not only does she get a silver bed,
28:11
Speaker 1: but she orders this even more expensive silver table set
28:17
Speaker 1: to go along with her new furniture.
28:21
Speaker 5: Oh my god.
28:23
Speaker 3: Wow.
28:24
Speaker 1: So basically, now supporters who were you know, weren't keen
28:27
Speaker 1: on this. You know, French born duchess. They were like
28:31
Speaker 1: super mad that this foreign mistress was getting better gifts
28:36
Speaker 1: and more expensive stuff than you know, their beloved down
28:40
Speaker 1: to earth Salt of the Earth English now. But they
28:44
Speaker 1: even started a campaign to get the king to melt
28:47
Speaker 1: down all of Louise de Callell's like silver tableware, her dishes,
28:53
Speaker 1: her set, her forks and everything else and pour them
28:56
Speaker 1: down her throat. Like obviously wasn't too happy about this,
29:02
Speaker 1: so she responds with was to say that anybody may
29:07
Speaker 1: know she has been an orange wench by her swearing.
29:09
Speaker 1: I mean, okay, fair enough. Nell did swear like a sailor,
29:14
Speaker 1: and she had absolutely no qualms about it.
29:16
Speaker 5: Like she was very aware of who she was and
29:18
Speaker 5: what she did.
29:19
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, So King Charles's second is like, so
29:23
Speaker 1: he goes to Nell when he wants to talk about ship,
29:26
Speaker 1: like he stresses out. He's like, what can I do
29:28
Speaker 1: to place Parliament, Nell goes, hang up the French bitch,
29:33
Speaker 1: referring to like Louise de Carowell. So Nel Neil has
29:36
Speaker 1: a as a second child, named James with the King
29:41
Speaker 1: in December of sixteen seventy one. Yeah, and Neil, being clever,
29:44
Speaker 1: she named him after you know, Charles's brother, not because
29:48
Speaker 1: she liked him. She thought he was dour, but you know,
29:51
Speaker 1: she thought, eh, give a little give alo when he
29:54
Speaker 1: sent to school in Paris, and then when he's six
29:57
Speaker 1: he dies. The only clues of his dead are a
30:01
Speaker 1: sore leg, which could be anything. Really, there's like speculation.
30:07
Speaker 1: They're like it was an accident, it was poison but
30:09
Speaker 1: you know what, we don't fucking know. Nell accuses Louise
30:13
Speaker 1: de Caramelle of like poisoning him. So basically Nell goes
30:17
Speaker 1: into this deep depression. She's really grieving the loss of
30:20
Speaker 1: her of her son, and she's really guilty about it
30:22
Speaker 1: because she's in her mind it's her fault because she
30:25
Speaker 1: sent him away to Paris and she refused to see anybody.
30:29
Speaker 5: For months talking about kids.
30:31
Speaker 1: Charles Charles Boclerk when he's six, when he's sick. The
30:36
Speaker 1: King arrives and Nell goes come here, your little bastard
30:39
Speaker 1: and say hello to your father. And the King is like,
30:42
Speaker 1: you can't call him that, and she's like, well, your
30:44
Speaker 1: majesty has given me no other name by which to
30:47
Speaker 1: call him, and he's like, ah fuck. So then he
30:51
Speaker 1: becomes the Earl of Barford. And then because in sixteen
30:55
Speaker 1: seventy six a warrant is passed that Charles Boclerk the
31:00
Speaker 1: King's natural son and to the heirs males of his
31:03
Speaker 1: body the dignities of Baron and Herrington, County Oxford, and
31:07
Speaker 1: early of Burford in the same county. Like the reason
31:09
Speaker 1: Nell wanted a title for her son, it was more
31:12
Speaker 1: out of it was more fueled by jealousy than anything else,
31:15
Speaker 1: because Nell herself didn't really ask for a ton of
31:18
Speaker 1: stuff except.
31:20
Speaker 5: To you know, screw over other mistresses.
31:23
Speaker 1: Like that's literally it. It's kind of how our thing
31:25
Speaker 1: was because she didn't ask for so much shit, Like
31:28
Speaker 1: she didn't demand everything. He was just giving it to
31:31
Speaker 1: her more so because she didn't demand it. So when
31:35
Speaker 1: Louise de quel Will gets the title of the Duchess
31:37
Speaker 1: of Portsmouth, she's like, bits, you better give my son
31:40
Speaker 1: a title, after which Nell.
31:43
Speaker 5: And Charles get a house in Windsor.
31:47
Speaker 1: It's now called Burford House, and it's on the edge
31:49
Speaker 1: of the home park and Windsor and she lived there
31:51
Speaker 1: whenever the King was in Windsor Castle. Not only does
31:54
Speaker 1: she have Burford House in the home park and Windsor
31:57
Speaker 1: paul mal House, she also has like a summer residence
32:00
Speaker 1: which is now sixty one to sixty three kings Crossroad
32:03
Speaker 1: in London. So King Charles gets this new mistress. Her
32:07
Speaker 1: tense was apparently so she was like apparently this runaway duchess.
32:11
Speaker 1: She was an Italian beauty and apparently like she intimidated Nell.
32:15
Speaker 1: So Louise de Carowell is so enraged with her tents
32:22
Speaker 1: that she bashes her head on a bedpost until her
32:27
Speaker 1: tense has a black eye. So Nell, being very clever,
32:30
Speaker 1: decided to use her skills and get to know her enemy.
32:34
Speaker 1: So she would host card games where like Carl and
32:37
Speaker 1: Louise and Hortense, they would just gamble like huge, huge
32:40
Speaker 1: sums of money and then they would leave. King Charles
32:43
Speaker 1: the second had to foot the bill, which is fucking glorious.
32:46
Speaker 1: But Nell didn't really have to worry so much because
32:49
Speaker 1: her tense was wild, so not only did she have
32:54
Speaker 1: an affair with the Prince of Monaco at the time,
32:56
Speaker 1: she was also sleeping with Anne Leonard. This is Charles
33:00
Speaker 1: the Second's daughter algitimate, but still that's a level that
33:05
Speaker 1: that's a dangerous tight rope to what when.
33:07
Speaker 5: So when the king finds out, he's like, what the
33:10
Speaker 5: actual fuck?
33:11
Speaker 1: Get the hell out, So her tense gets knocked out
33:15
Speaker 1: and Nell is back at top of the list. In
33:17
Speaker 1: sixteen eighty one, This is Glorious, she is mistaken for
33:22
Speaker 1: the Duchess of Portsmouth, King Charles the Second's Catholic mistress,
33:27
Speaker 1: and this mob attacks her coach and so she leans
33:30
Speaker 1: out the window and she and she yells to the crowd,
33:34
Speaker 1: be civil, I am the Protestant horror, and this abates them.
33:43
Speaker 1: Sixteen eighty two, the Royal Hospital in Chelsea was created
33:48
Speaker 1: as a retreat for veterans, and this was basically inspired
33:52
Speaker 1: by Lizzie Valid in Paris this story. As the story goes,
33:56
Speaker 1: she convinces King Charles to approve the construction of the
34:00
Speaker 1: Royal Hospital for ex serviceman in the city of London,
34:03
Speaker 1: and it's basically a precursor to what a modern VA
34:05
Speaker 1: hospital would be. The story goes that she noticed like
34:09
Speaker 1: this desperate beggar on the side of the road, and
34:11
Speaker 1: she hops out of her carriage, talks to him and
34:14
Speaker 1: discovers that he fought on behalf of Charles a second,
34:17
Speaker 1: and she is like and she's like shocked that ex
34:19
Speaker 1: soldiers are homeless, like they don't have anywhere to go.
34:22
Speaker 1: She basically insists that the king takes responsibility for injured veterans,
34:29
Speaker 1: and in sixteen eighty two the Chelsea Hospital is opened,
34:33
Speaker 1: and when Henry German first earls and Albans dies in
34:38
Speaker 1: sixteen eighty four, King Charles basically gives his son Charles
34:42
Speaker 1: the dukedom of Saint Albans, an allowance of one thousand
34:46
Speaker 1: pounds a year, and gives him the offices of chief
34:49
Speaker 1: Ranger of Enfield Chase and Master of the Hawks. So
34:53
Speaker 1: on the third of February sixteen eighty five, which may
34:57
Speaker 1: or may not be her birthday, we're not entirely sure,
35:00
Speaker 1: So the King gets out of bed early and he's
35:02
Speaker 1: going to get Nell a gift because it's her birthday.
35:05
Speaker 1: But while he's getting dressed, he has a seizure. And
35:08
Speaker 1: this is basically the beginning of the end for King
35:10
Speaker 1: Charles the Second. Supposedly the King was going to make
35:16
Speaker 1: her a Countess of Greenwich, and she was going to
35:18
Speaker 1: receive a noble title, but after Charles died, that went
35:23
Speaker 1: up in smoke, and so she would stay now Gwynn
35:26
Speaker 1: for the rest of our lives. When King Charles dies
35:28
Speaker 1: on the sixth of February sixth and eighty five, there
35:30
Speaker 1: is he has a death wish death bed wish to
35:33
Speaker 1: his brother James the Second, which is do not let
35:37
Speaker 1: peer Nelly starve. James the Second ends up paying most
35:40
Speaker 1: of Nell's debts, gives her an annual pension of fifteen
35:44
Speaker 1: hundred pounds a year. Although so James the Second takes
35:49
Speaker 1: over and he's like, Gwin, you and your boy you
35:53
Speaker 1: get a switch to Roman Catholicism. And Gwen's a Protestant,
35:56
Speaker 1: hardcore Protestant, some might say.
35:58
Speaker 5: And she's like, no, thank you.
36:02
Speaker 1: Being the shrewd woman that she is, she's like, I'm
36:05
Speaker 1: an actress. I can do this. She addresses in a
36:08
Speaker 1: Sunday best she attends church, and she basically implies that
36:15
Speaker 1: she is absolutely considering converting, like she's thinking about it,
36:19
Speaker 1: she's gone over it, she's mulling it over in her mind,
36:22
Speaker 1: and this is enough for James. He's like, Okay, you're trying,
36:26
Speaker 1: because he's like, of course she's gonna of course she's
36:28
Speaker 1: gonna convert because I'm the king. She's gonna do what
36:30
Speaker 1: I say. So she's like mm hmm, takes his money,
36:33
Speaker 1: bollocks us off to pal mall, and she's quite happy
36:36
Speaker 1: she's done. In sixteen eighty seven, nel Gwyn has a
36:41
Speaker 1: stroke and this leaves her paralyzed all down one side.
36:45
Speaker 1: And May she has a second stroke and on the
36:47
Speaker 1: fourteenth of November sixteen eighty seven, at about ten pm,
36:53
Speaker 1: she dies from apoplexy effectively. Effectively. They believe this was
36:59
Speaker 1: because of syphilis. And I'm not surprised because King Charles
37:03
Speaker 1: the Second was full of venereal diseases. So what is
37:07
Speaker 1: surprising is although Nelle had what would be referred to
37:11
Speaker 1: as a less than respectable employment, when she died, it
37:18
Speaker 1: was an enormous crowd at her funeral, like the nation
37:21
Speaker 1: goes into mourning. They love this like rags to riches. Mistress.
37:27
Speaker 1: She's a concubine, and she's a courtisan, she's a horle at,
37:30
Speaker 1: whatever you want to call her. But as far as
37:33
Speaker 1: everything else she was. She was loved by the nation,
37:37
Speaker 1: She was loved by the common people. She never did
37:39
Speaker 1: anything to show disrespect to her root. She was faithful
37:43
Speaker 1: to King Charles the second, you know, once they started
37:46
Speaker 1: bumping uglies, that was her. She wasn't going anywhere else.
37:50
Speaker 1: And in her will she left gifts for all her servants.
37:54
Speaker 1: She provided so there was money for the poor. Sure
37:57
Speaker 1: there was money for Roman Catholics. She made arrangements so
38:01
Speaker 1: that funds that she had that were like money would
38:04
Speaker 1: go towards paying off the debts of people who were
38:06
Speaker 1: in debtor's prison on Christmas Day. And something we forget
38:11
Speaker 1: all the time is like she did all of this
38:14
Speaker 1: well being illiterate. This is what you would call a
38:17
Speaker 1: Cinderella story, just not in the way one would expect
38:20
Speaker 1: it to be. I suppose. I mean, this is like
38:22
Speaker 1: the more realistic version of a Cinderella story. And Nell
38:26
Speaker 1: worked her way up from the fucking gutter and ended
38:29
Speaker 1: up with three four households and becoming the most beloved
38:35
Speaker 1: concubine of King Charles by a combination of wit, charm,
38:41
Speaker 1: and poisoning her rivals with laxatives. And Nell has gone
38:48
Speaker 1: on to inspire plays and poems. And oh oh, there's
38:53
Speaker 1: a monument in Tring Park in London. It's called Nell's
38:57
Speaker 1: Monument and it is the only official monument to Royal
39:00
Speaker 1: Mistress and like the entirety of London. And that is
39:04
Speaker 1: the story of Nell Gwin. I love now, She's just
39:08
Speaker 1: a horror of your fucking love. Now what have we
39:11
Speaker 1: learned today? Don't judge someone from where they come from.
39:15
Speaker 1: Appearances can be receiving. Never underestimate a girl from the gutter.
39:20
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, if you like today's episode, I would
39:22
Speaker 1: appreciate it. If you would go onto iTunes and rate
39:25
Speaker 1: and review, give me five stars. You can say anything.
39:28
Speaker 1: You can say. I like bananas or eggplants versus aubergines,
39:32
Speaker 1: which is best? Whatever, I don't care. Do what you
39:34
Speaker 1: want to do, love your best life. But I would
39:36
Speaker 1: very much appreciate it does really it helps me be seen,
39:40
Speaker 1: It helps me share more history with other people, and
39:43
Speaker 1: it gets it out there a little bit more. And
39:45
Speaker 1: it would be absolutely fantastic if you would share this.
39:48
Speaker 1: I do to forget. You can follow me on Twitter.
39:50
Speaker 5: Who did what now?
39:51
Speaker 1: PD? Because there wasn't enough. There wasn't enough characters available,
39:56
Speaker 1: you can catch me on Instagram Who Did What Now Pod?
39:59
Speaker 1: I will post some lovely portraits of the lovely Mail
40:02
Speaker 1: Gwen up on Instagram to go along with today's Today's episode.
40:07
Speaker 1: If you want more history facts their I do sort
40:09
Speaker 1: of memes on Instagram, but I also do TikTok. I
40:12
Speaker 1: do informative videos and sixty seconds or less and I
40:17
Speaker 1: talk to you next time. Adios.
40:20
Speaker 5: Or of waita Zen My Friends by