Latest / All Mom Does Podcast with Julie Lyles Carr / RAISING THEM WELL: Sibling Rivalry with Julie Lyles Carr (From the Archives)

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RAISING THEM WELL: Sibling Rivalry with Julie Lyles Carr (From the Archives) · All Mom Does Podcast with Julie Lyles Carr

0:01
Speaker 1: Purposely Your Life, God's Purpose. Listen at purposely dot com.
0:16
Speaker 2: This is the All One Does summer series Raising Them Well,
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Speaker 2: and this episode, well, I have to confess it comes
0:24
Speaker 2: from a place that it was one of my favorite
0:26
Speaker 2: things when listeners send me questions, things they're grappling with,
0:29
Speaker 2: things they want some insight on. Even with me, you
0:32
Speaker 2: could say, hey, here's how not to do it. I
0:34
Speaker 2: was so excited to get this question about sibling rivalry,
0:38
Speaker 2: so we pulled this one out of the archives just
0:40
Speaker 2: for you as we wrap up this incredible summer series
0:44
Speaker 2: Raising Them Well. Thanks so much for being here and
0:46
Speaker 2: take a listen. I received a couple months ago a
0:53
Speaker 2: great email from someone from a listener. I'm not going
0:55
Speaker 2: to say her full name to preserve her privacy, but
0:58
Speaker 2: I want you to hear what she wrote to me.
1:00
Speaker 2: She said, one topic I would love to hear about
1:03
Speaker 2: is dealing with sibling conflict. My oldest child has struggled
1:07
Speaker 2: with her little brother pretty much since he was born.
1:09
Speaker 2: They do have wonderful times of playing together, but there's
1:13
Speaker 2: also lots of times of hitting and screaming, and lately
1:16
Speaker 2: she's been saying I hate my brother and making rude
1:19
Speaker 2: comments about him. Now, little brother is very physical and
1:23
Speaker 2: I think to some degree enjoys hitting, kicking, punching, pulling
1:26
Speaker 2: hair and the reaction it gets. I remember fighting a
1:29
Speaker 2: lot with my sister growing up, and unfortunately I didn't
1:32
Speaker 2: pick many helpful tools from my parents in how to
1:36
Speaker 2: support my kids through it. Would love wisdom in this area.
1:39
Speaker 2: Thank you for your ministry. And that is an email
1:42
Speaker 2: from a very dedicated listener named em who I've gotten
1:45
Speaker 2: to know through the years. So I thought, you know what,
1:49
Speaker 2: I would love to talk about this whole topic of
1:52
Speaker 2: sibling rivalry, sibling relationships. Now, if you've been listening for
1:57
Speaker 2: a while, you likely know that my husband and I
1:59
Speaker 2: have eight kids and they range an age all the
2:03
Speaker 2: way from the oldest and then sixteen and a half
2:05
Speaker 2: years later, all the way down to babies number seven
2:07
Speaker 2: and eight, the twins. This idea of watching kids grow
2:12
Speaker 2: up together, the challenges that come with that, the ones
2:15
Speaker 2: that naturally get along and the ones that don't, all
2:18
Speaker 2: the personalities, the variations of personalities in a family, whether
2:22
Speaker 2: you've got two kids or fourteen, you know that all
2:27
Speaker 2: of that factors into the relationships they have with each other.
2:31
Speaker 2: And then there are the relationships you have with your
2:33
Speaker 2: own siblings, which speaks into a lot of how you
2:37
Speaker 2: may look at the relationships between your kids. I know,
2:42
Speaker 2: for me one thing that was interesting my brothers and
2:44
Speaker 2: I really, for the most part got along well. We
2:48
Speaker 2: had some seasons from time to time where things might
2:50
Speaker 2: get a little sideways, but for the most part, we
2:54
Speaker 2: really enjoyed each other. One of my brothers and I
2:56
Speaker 2: are really close in age, and so we were just
2:59
Speaker 2: a couple of years apart in school. The other brother
3:02
Speaker 2: is about six years younger than I am four years
3:04
Speaker 2: younger than the brother who's just younger than me, So
3:08
Speaker 2: he was a little bit younger and that gave us,
3:10
Speaker 2: I think, some grace for him because he was younger
3:13
Speaker 2: in some ways. But I'm realizing now when I talk
3:16
Speaker 2: about things like the Christmas batteries, there were some things
3:19
Speaker 2: that my parents did that helped lay the groundwork for
3:22
Speaker 2: the relationship that my brothers and I have. You know,
3:26
Speaker 2: one of the things that is fascinating is in scripture,
3:29
Speaker 2: there are so many sibling relationships with some really fascinating
3:35
Speaker 2: details around them. Of course, the first sibling relationship that
3:38
Speaker 2: we know about is Cain and Abel and we didn't.
3:41
Speaker 2: We know that didn't go very well. But I also
3:44
Speaker 2: think about some of the relationships Esaw and Jacob twins,
3:47
Speaker 2: who really became enemies in a very strong way over family,
3:53
Speaker 2: inheritance and property. Does that ring a modern bell for
3:58
Speaker 2: some of us today. I think about Moses, Miriam and Aaron,
4:02
Speaker 2: where Moses, being the baby of the family, you wouldn't
4:05
Speaker 2: think he would have been the one who would have
4:07
Speaker 2: had such power and ministry and authority ultimately, and yet
4:12
Speaker 2: here were Miriam and Aaron who did come alongside and
4:15
Speaker 2: support him, and there were issues. There were times that
4:18
Speaker 2: they had to hash some things out, like when Aaron
4:22
Speaker 2: built a golden calf for the Israelites in the desert
4:25
Speaker 2: and that was a little bit of a problem, and
4:27
Speaker 2: some other things that went down, and yet as siblings,
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Speaker 2: they somehow were able to maintain relationship enough that they
4:33
Speaker 2: were able to lead the Israelite people well together. I
4:38
Speaker 2: also think about Mary and Martha and Lazarus, their interactions,
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Speaker 2: Mary and Martha having very different temperaments and actually pulling
4:45
Speaker 2: Jesus into the conversation when Martha felt like Mary wasn't
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Speaker 2: doing enough and Mary thought that Martha was probably being
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Speaker 2: a little too busy and bossy, and how they dealt
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Speaker 2: with that sibling relationship. Jesus had siblings, siblings who weren't
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Speaker 2: completely convinced that Jesus was who he said he was,
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Speaker 2: Siblings who felt like we got to go get him
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Speaker 2: out of some of these public arenas in which he's
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Speaker 2: speaking and teaching this is ridiculous, and yet ultimately siblings
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Speaker 2: who came to see that Jesus really was the Son
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Speaker 2: of God. Siblings are all over the Bible, and I
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Speaker 2: don't think it's any mistake that the apostle Paul talks
5:18
Speaker 2: about us in the church as brothers and sisters in Christ,
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Speaker 2: and so the notion the nature of sibling relationships is everywhere,
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Speaker 2: and it really does shape so much of what happens,
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Speaker 2: even if you are an only child. My mother was
5:35
Speaker 2: an only child and her first cousin was like a
5:38
Speaker 2: sister to her, and they face some of the same
5:41
Speaker 2: siblings stuff that siblings in the same home would face.
5:45
Speaker 2: When it comes to your parenting with your kids. I
5:47
Speaker 2: have some ideas, I have some cautionary tales, things I
5:49
Speaker 2: wish i'd done a little bit differently, And I also
5:53
Speaker 2: want you to think of this through the lens of
5:55
Speaker 2: your siblings in your adult life, your siblings that the
5:58
Speaker 2: people you grew up with, and how you're conducting those
6:01
Speaker 2: relationships as well. Because here's the thing. We cannot say
6:06
Speaker 2: and set a standard in our own home for something
6:08
Speaker 2: that we're not modeling within our extended experience. And so
6:13
Speaker 2: if you're expecting your kids to get along really, really well,
6:15
Speaker 2: but you're actively talking about how much you dislike your
6:18
Speaker 2: own siblings, check yourself before you read yourself, because it's
6:22
Speaker 2: going to be awfully hard to model one thing in
6:25
Speaker 2: actuality and expect something different from your kids. So let's
6:29
Speaker 2: get into it, shall we. That battery story. Here's why
6:33
Speaker 2: I tell you that story. My mom's motivation for the batteries,
6:38
Speaker 2: for wrapping a package of batteries was because she wanted
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Speaker 2: as closely as she could when my brothers came out
6:44
Speaker 2: and I came out on Christmas morning, for us to
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Speaker 2: have the same number of packages under the tree. Now, listen,
6:52
Speaker 2: have I, as a mom pulled that off. No, I haven't.
6:55
Speaker 2: There are a lot of people that I was doing
6:58
Speaker 2: all the Christmas things for bounting every individual package at
7:01
Speaker 2: the end of the day, I didn't do such a
7:03
Speaker 2: great job that my mom did. But here was the thing.
7:05
Speaker 2: On the one hand, you could say, well, that's ridiculous
7:08
Speaker 2: and kids need to learn that you can't always I
7:09
Speaker 2: get it, But here's the message she was giving us.
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Speaker 2: It still carries. She wanted us to know that from
7:15
Speaker 2: she and my dad they were going to make things
7:17
Speaker 2: as fair as possible. Think about it. How often do
7:21
Speaker 2: you hear from one of your kids if they get
7:23
Speaker 2: upset with one of their siblings and they'll say, that's
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Speaker 2: not fair. Now listen, I know we can all easily
7:29
Speaker 2: respond and say, well, life isn't fair and get used
7:31
Speaker 2: to it and on. However, there's something really important I
7:36
Speaker 2: think when it comes to our kids being young and
7:39
Speaker 2: them paying attention to who's getting what and what's happening
7:43
Speaker 2: and who gets this privilege and on and on and on,
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Speaker 2: there's really something important about parents acknowledging that, yeah, there
7:51
Speaker 2: are times that sibling relationships may not feel fair, that
7:55
Speaker 2: outcomes may not feel fair, but that you as parents
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Speaker 2: not based on who's the easiest going and who is
8:02
Speaker 2: this and who is achieving the most? No, no, no, on
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Speaker 2: that you as parents are going to try to make
8:07
Speaker 2: things as fair as possible. Now, my mom being an
8:10
Speaker 2: only child, she didn't have to deal with what would
8:12
Speaker 2: be fair and who got what under the Christmas tree
8:14
Speaker 2: and all of that. So I really admire that she
8:18
Speaker 2: was determined for my brothers and I to get the
8:20
Speaker 2: message that they were going to try to be as
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Speaker 2: fair as they could be. My dad had an older brother,
8:25
Speaker 2: and one of the things that I think is really
8:27
Speaker 2: beautiful is that his parents modeled fairness. They didn't have
8:32
Speaker 2: much to their name at all, but they did have
8:34
Speaker 2: some farmland, and they were very clear with their boys.
8:38
Speaker 2: They farmed that land together, and when the crops went well,
8:40
Speaker 2: they lived there, and when the crops didn't go well,
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Speaker 2: they would go down to the coast and work in
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Speaker 2: the shipyard. One thing they really modeled for their kids
8:48
Speaker 2: is there were pieces of that land that were a
8:51
Speaker 2: little better because they were positioned by a pond and
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Speaker 2: they had road access, and there were pieces of that
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Speaker 2: land that were further back and harder to access. They
9:00
Speaker 2: modeled for their boys, we're going to make this split
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Speaker 2: of this land, this inheritance that we have for you,
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Speaker 2: small as it may be, we're going to make it
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Speaker 2: as fair as possible. And my brother and his dad
9:11
Speaker 2: modeled that beautifully when they handed off that land to
9:14
Speaker 2: my brothers and I and my three cousins. They took
9:17
Speaker 2: that ethic of it needs to be fair and they
9:21
Speaker 2: really made it stick. Now today I realize that's not
9:25
Speaker 2: all that common sometimes in families. I am amazed the
9:29
Speaker 2: number of times that I will hear of one adult
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Speaker 2: child getting a really significant piece of an inheritance and
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Speaker 2: another child not for no discernible reason, and because that
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Speaker 2: ethos of fairness hasn't been instilled, the sibling who's received
9:45
Speaker 2: the bigger portion doesn't seem to think there's a problem
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Speaker 2: with it. Fairness is a big topic, and I have
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Speaker 2: seen it tear apart families. I have seen it tear
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Speaker 2: apart sibling relationships when there's something that is inherently unfair.
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Speaker 2: Think about that with your own kids. Are there places
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Speaker 2: where if you could widen the lens and objectively look,
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Speaker 2: it really isn't fair. I want to encourage you to
10:09
Speaker 2: think about the wrapped Christmas batteries that your kids can
10:13
Speaker 2: trust and know that you're going to do everything you
10:15
Speaker 2: can to make things as fair as possible. All right.
10:18
Speaker 2: Second thing that my parents were good about, we've tried
10:21
Speaker 2: to be good about. I know this can be a
10:23
Speaker 2: little controversial for some families, but we did not allow
10:27
Speaker 2: physical fights, at least the ones that we were aware of.
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Speaker 2: Now my kids might say, yeah, well, behind the scenes
10:33
Speaker 2: we did a couple different things and smacked each other around,
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Speaker 2: But I'm telling you physical fighting that was not allowed
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Speaker 2: in the home I grew up in, and we did
10:40
Speaker 2: not allow it with our kids. Did my kids sometimes
10:43
Speaker 2: wrestle and did play get aggressive at times, sure, absolutely,
10:48
Speaker 2: But in terms of there just being an actual physical
10:51
Speaker 2: fight and that was how things were going to get
10:53
Speaker 2: resolved and we just stood back and watched, absolutely not.
10:58
Speaker 2: Because here's the thing. When you start allowing physicality to
11:02
Speaker 2: be the thing that is the determiner of relationship, it's
11:06
Speaker 2: not going to go well. There is always going to
11:08
Speaker 2: be someone who feels like they have been embarrassed, humiliated, weakened,
11:15
Speaker 2: and there's going to be someone who comes out of
11:17
Speaker 2: that situation feeling like that because they were bigger, stronger, faster, meaner,
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Speaker 2: that they somehow were better. That will never set the
11:25
Speaker 2: relationship for eventually a sibling, friendship and adulthood. It just won't.
11:32
Speaker 2: And that's an important thing to mention. One of the
11:34
Speaker 2: things that we always talked about with our kids was, look,
11:37
Speaker 2: these people that we've given you. You're going to have differences.
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Speaker 2: You're going to have different ways that you look at things,
11:43
Speaker 2: You're going to have different temperaments. But there is the
11:46
Speaker 2: potential for these to be the people in your life
11:49
Speaker 2: who are your friends for life, working toward friendship. And
11:53
Speaker 2: you know what, if you are having regular fisticuffs with someone,
11:58
Speaker 2: you're probably not going to be friends with them. And yet,
12:00
Speaker 2: when we allow that kind of behavior to go on
12:02
Speaker 2: in our home and we say, oh, boys'll be boys,
12:05
Speaker 2: or well, girls just do that kind of thing. They
12:07
Speaker 2: just smack, you know, with hair brushes, or no, we don't,
12:12
Speaker 2: that does not become the ground for friendship and adulthood.
12:17
Speaker 2: We don't hang out with people who would do that
12:18
Speaker 2: to us, right, So we did absolutely not allow physical
12:22
Speaker 2: fights within the home. Is that to say that it
12:24
Speaker 2: never happened or there wasn't somebody who took a swing.
12:26
Speaker 2: Of course that happened, but it wasn't tolerated. It was
12:28
Speaker 2: not the medium by which we said, Okay, this is
12:31
Speaker 2: how we're going to settle stuff in our family. And
12:34
Speaker 2: if you come from a family where that was the
12:36
Speaker 2: way things went down with you and your siblings, and
12:38
Speaker 2: it's creeping into your home. I want to encourage you
12:42
Speaker 2: to put a stop to that. It is not behavior
12:45
Speaker 2: that's going to bring you ultimately into a place of healthy, vibrant,
12:51
Speaker 2: appropriate adult relationships between sibling kids. And here's something I
12:56
Speaker 2: wish we had done a little different. We didn't want
12:59
Speaker 2: our kids. We didn't want our kids fighting physically, obviously,
13:03
Speaker 2: but we also didn't want them arguing all the time
13:05
Speaker 2: and bickering and all that kind of stuff. Now, I
13:08
Speaker 2: think part of that was good. Part of it, though,
13:11
Speaker 2: I think we could have done a better job teaching
13:13
Speaker 2: our kids how to have conflict without it going to
13:16
Speaker 2: that point. This is one of those areas that's really
13:20
Speaker 2: tricky because if you came from a high conflict family
13:22
Speaker 2: where there was a lot of arguing and you know,
13:25
Speaker 2: going back and forth and just taking verbal chunks out
13:28
Speaker 2: of each other, you probably crave some peace in your home.
13:32
Speaker 2: Or if you were raised in a family where things
13:34
Speaker 2: were pretty placid and personalities were a little more subdued
13:38
Speaker 2: and things were just a little smoother, then you might
13:42
Speaker 2: also see that any kind of conflict is somehow in
13:45
Speaker 2: opposition to peace. But there is conflict that is appropriate.
13:50
Speaker 2: There are times of disagreement, it makes sense, and to
13:54
Speaker 2: prepare our kids to know how to handle conflict without
13:59
Speaker 2: it seeming like attack. To prepare kids to know how
14:02
Speaker 2: to handle conflict without it turning into an attack is
14:06
Speaker 2: really going to be an important facet and something that
14:09
Speaker 2: is a tool they're going to need in their relationships
14:11
Speaker 2: with each other as they move forward. I would venture
14:14
Speaker 2: to guess that for some of you, if you don't
14:16
Speaker 2: have relationship with your adult siblings, part of it might
14:20
Speaker 2: be because you didn't know how to come through and
14:24
Speaker 2: work through conflict. Now. I don't claim to be the
14:26
Speaker 2: expert on any of this by any means, but of
14:29
Speaker 2: course there are plenty of great resources that you can
14:32
Speaker 2: check out about how to have difficult conversations, about how
14:35
Speaker 2: to navigate those things, and to use those tools when
14:39
Speaker 2: it comes to training your kids into how to have reasonable,
14:43
Speaker 2: appropriate conflict. There are tools like nonviolent communication, in which
14:48
Speaker 2: your child who is in conflict with their sibling learns
14:52
Speaker 2: to own what their feelings are in the situation without
14:55
Speaker 2: being accusatory or pointing a finger or belittling the other sibling.
15:00
Speaker 2: That's a really important skill to have nonviolent communication. There's
15:04
Speaker 2: also this that we are now seeing more and more
15:07
Speaker 2: is becoming critical how well do you repair, how well
15:12
Speaker 2: do you teach your children how to repair after a conflict?
15:16
Speaker 2: With all of this wave that we're seeing of adult
15:20
Speaker 2: children going no contact with their extended families and on
15:23
Speaker 2: and on, one of the indicators we're seeing that regardless
15:27
Speaker 2: of what the issue was and what happened and why
15:29
Speaker 2: it blew up, families who do a better job repairing
15:34
Speaker 2: after conflict, reaching out to one another, resolving Those families
15:39
Speaker 2: who are able to do that, That is one of
15:43
Speaker 2: the best protections against this phenomenon of no contact. Families
15:48
Speaker 2: who do that well, siblings who are able to do
15:50
Speaker 2: that well and repair, those who are able to say, Look,
15:53
Speaker 2: we're going to have arguments from time to time, We're
15:55
Speaker 2: going to have different ways of looking at things, but
15:57
Speaker 2: at our core, we love each other and we are family,
16:01
Speaker 2: and I'm going to do what it takes. I'm going
16:03
Speaker 2: to apologize if I need to, We're going to cooperate.
16:07
Speaker 2: We're both going to make concessions. That level of repair
16:10
Speaker 2: is something that our kids need to seem modeled with
16:13
Speaker 2: us in our marriages, in our friendships, in our relationships
16:17
Speaker 2: with our siblings, and they need coaching to show them
16:21
Speaker 2: how to do it. I've been watching my daughter do
16:25
Speaker 2: something with my granddaughter that I think is so fantastic.
16:28
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm one of those parents. I really hope
16:30
Speaker 2: my kids do far better, greater and more amazing things
16:35
Speaker 2: than I've ever been able to do in my relationships
16:38
Speaker 2: and my career and my walk with God. I hope
16:40
Speaker 2: they go far, far beyond what I've been able to do.
16:42
Speaker 2: And I love seeing this because this is so genius
16:45
Speaker 2: and is something I didn't think of and I think
16:48
Speaker 2: would have really been helpful. You know, my granddaughters are
16:51
Speaker 2: still really little. They're three and almost three, almost one,
16:56
Speaker 2: and so sometimes the older one, you know, she'll do
16:58
Speaker 2: something or bang into her little sister or whatever. And
17:01
Speaker 2: I love this. My daughter in law, my daughter will
17:04
Speaker 2: say too, my granddaughter, you need to apologize, and she's
17:08
Speaker 2: trained her to say, I'm sorry because I'm sorry because
17:14
Speaker 2: I yelled. I'm sorry because I bumped into you, I'm
17:20
Speaker 2: sorry because I took the toy. I'm sorry because that
17:26
Speaker 2: is such a profound thing I was always about. The
17:30
Speaker 2: business is saying you two. Can you guys will be
17:33
Speaker 2: on to add a time out when you tell each
17:34
Speaker 2: other you're sorry, and we would get the proverbial sorry sorry,
17:38
Speaker 2: and I counted that as repair. That's a okay, it's
17:43
Speaker 2: a step. But there's something so powerful about acknowledging what
17:48
Speaker 2: you're sorry for. And let's be really clear, I'm sorry
17:53
Speaker 2: you feel that way. I'm sorry you feel that way
17:56
Speaker 2: is not an apology. So that place of model and
18:00
Speaker 2: helping our kids say I'm sorry because gives them a
18:03
Speaker 2: tool for making repair. And when you practice it enough,
18:06
Speaker 2: it becomes something that becomes an element of your children's
18:10
Speaker 2: relationship with siblings that carries them forward. All right, here's
18:14
Speaker 2: another one. This has to do more as we are
18:17
Speaker 2: heading toward adulthood with our children, as our children are
18:20
Speaker 2: getting older. But I'm telling you I have seen this
18:22
Speaker 2: as something that can blow up sibling relationships in adulthood
18:26
Speaker 2: in a way that is so unnecessary. Make your wishes
18:31
Speaker 2: about the property you own, what's in your bank account,
18:35
Speaker 2: who gets grandma's engagement ring, whatever, Make it clear verbally
18:41
Speaker 2: tell your kids and put it in writing. My husband's
18:46
Speaker 2: a financial advisor. We have now walked through losing both
18:51
Speaker 2: sets of parents having to do the whole rigmarole of
18:55
Speaker 2: going through all the estate and closing everything down and
18:58
Speaker 2: clearing the houses, all of it. And when we talk
19:02
Speaker 2: about those experiences, and we hear about experiences is from
19:06
Speaker 2: other friends of ours who are going through similar seasons.
19:09
Speaker 2: One of the things that trips people up so much
19:13
Speaker 2: is moms and dads not being exacting and clear and
19:18
Speaker 2: in writing as to what is supposed to happen, what
19:22
Speaker 2: their wishes are next. I cannot even begin to recount
19:26
Speaker 2: to you the number of times where one sibling says, well,
19:29
Speaker 2: Daddy told me that I was going to get da
19:31
Speaker 2: da da, and the other one says, well, I never
19:34
Speaker 2: heard that, and it's nowhere in this documentation, and then
19:38
Speaker 2: you're off to the races. How sad it would be
19:42
Speaker 2: for you to invest in your kids, invest in their relationships,
19:45
Speaker 2: do everything you can in their childhoods to give them
19:49
Speaker 2: a beautiful friendship, a basis for a beautiful friendship. And then,
19:53
Speaker 2: because you wanted to avoid thinking about what was going
19:57
Speaker 2: to happen after you were gone, or it felt kind
19:59
Speaker 2: of you know, you were struggling with what to do
20:02
Speaker 2: with a particular asset or whatever, that you didn't make
20:05
Speaker 2: it clear, and that led to an abruption in the
20:09
Speaker 2: relationship to your kids after you were gone. Wow, that's
20:14
Speaker 2: not a legacy you want to leave behind. Be clear.
20:17
Speaker 2: Put it in writing.
20:22
Speaker 3: You think that you are in the final round of
20:26
Speaker 3: getting all this parenting done, You've got kids who are
20:29
Speaker 3: in high school, You're starting to think about college, and
20:32
Speaker 3: you're thinking, this is it.
20:33
Speaker 2: I'm Julie Lyles Carr. I am a podcaster and I'm
20:36
Speaker 2: a mom of eight, and here's what I want you
20:38
Speaker 2: to know about George Fox University. It's a different way
20:42
Speaker 2: of doing college. Why Because, yes, it's all about getting
20:46
Speaker 2: a fantastic degree to set your kid up for their future.
20:49
Speaker 2: They have sixty undergrad programs available at George Fox University.
20:54
Speaker 2: But that's not where the story ends. It's also about
20:57
Speaker 2: equipping them spiritually. If you get out a call with
21:00
Speaker 2: a degree, but you don't have a closer relationship with God,
21:03
Speaker 2: that obviously is going to deeply impact what your young
21:07
Speaker 2: adult life looks like. So for your kiddos, I want
21:10
Speaker 2: you to consider what would it mean for your child
21:13
Speaker 2: to be able to go to George Fox University where
21:15
Speaker 2: ninety three percent of George Fox students say they now
21:20
Speaker 2: have a closer relationship with Jesus. George Fox University is
21:24
Speaker 2: located in the Pacific northwestern Oregon. They have twenty three
21:29
Speaker 2: Division three athletic programs and one hundred percent of students
21:34
Speaker 2: at George Fox University receive financial aid. George Fox University
21:39
Speaker 2: is dedicated to their promise they want every student to
21:42
Speaker 2: be known for who God created them to be. So listen, parents, Yeah,
21:47
Speaker 2: you are getting into some of those final laps, but
21:49
Speaker 2: you definitely want to make these last laps count in
21:53
Speaker 2: a big way when it comes to the legacy of
21:55
Speaker 2: your parenting. So be sure and check out for your
21:58
Speaker 2: student George Fox dot edu. That's George Fox dot edu.
22:08
Speaker 2: So what do you do when you feel like you
22:10
Speaker 2: have a stronger relationship with one of your kids and
22:14
Speaker 2: maybe not another one. Maybe there's a kid who is
22:17
Speaker 2: more like you. You just understand that child a little
22:19
Speaker 2: bit better. Maybe there's a kid who's so much like
22:22
Speaker 2: you that it's it calls you out too much and
22:25
Speaker 2: that makes it tough. So you actually kind of prefer
22:27
Speaker 2: their sibling because their siblings a little bit easier to
22:29
Speaker 2: get along with and doesn't always reflect the mirror back
22:32
Speaker 2: on you as to the stuff you're dealing with and yourself.
22:36
Speaker 2: You know, this is a very biblical problem. It really
22:40
Speaker 2: is tail as old as time. Because Rebecca preferred her
22:44
Speaker 2: of her two twin sons. She preferred Jacob.
22:47
Speaker 1: She just did.
22:48
Speaker 2: He liked staying home with her and puttering around the
22:52
Speaker 2: kitchen with her, and remembering and doing all the recipes
22:57
Speaker 2: from days gone by, all this kind of stuff, and
22:59
Speaker 2: she prefer him. Now, what did she do with that?
23:04
Speaker 2: Is it wrong to find yourself a little more connected
23:08
Speaker 2: to one of your kids than another. I don't think so.
23:10
Speaker 2: I just think that's sometimes human nature, or just the
23:13
Speaker 2: nature by which we understand people. Let me tell you
23:16
Speaker 2: what is problematic. She inserted herself to try to get
23:22
Speaker 2: the better share for the kids she preferred. Now, I
23:25
Speaker 2: know that seems wild, and you might think, well, I
23:27
Speaker 2: mean parents today wouldn't do that, right, I've witnessed it.
23:32
Speaker 2: I've absolutely witnessed it. And what happens in that moment
23:36
Speaker 2: is nobody's fooled. The kid who is preferred knows they're preferred.
23:41
Speaker 2: The kid who is still striving for a relationship with
23:44
Speaker 2: that parent they know they're being cut out. Esau and Jacob. Yes,
23:49
Speaker 2: it has to do with Jacob's duplicity. It has to
23:52
Speaker 2: do with Esau being rash and giving away his inheritance
23:56
Speaker 2: and a moment of hunger because he was angry. Sure,
24:00
Speaker 2: all of that exists, but don't miss that behind the
24:02
Speaker 2: scenes was a mom who was not saying you two
24:06
Speaker 2: need to get along. You are both my sons. I
24:08
Speaker 2: love you both. Yes, Jacob and I have shared interests,
24:11
Speaker 2: but you saw you are just as much mine as
24:13
Speaker 2: he is. Now, we had a mom behind the scenes
24:16
Speaker 2: who was into all kinds of machinations to try to
24:19
Speaker 2: make it so that the kid that she got along
24:21
Speaker 2: best with got the best portion, and believe me, that
24:26
Speaker 2: was a huge factor in what we see as the
24:29
Speaker 2: blow up of their relationship, and it was an unfortunate one. Now, thankfully,
24:35
Speaker 2: Esau and Jacob were ultimately able to repair that relationship,
24:39
Speaker 2: but already they had temperament differences. Having a parent insert
24:43
Speaker 2: themselves in the middle of it major problem. Your kids
24:47
Speaker 2: need to know that even if you share interests and
24:50
Speaker 2: affinity with one kid, that other kid is just as
24:54
Speaker 2: important to you. Without that assurance, yeah, you're setting them
24:58
Speaker 2: up for a huge relationship failure. This next one really important,
25:04
Speaker 2: particularly when you have kids who have very different personalities.
25:06
Speaker 2: I'm thinking again of the email from my friend em saying,
25:09
Speaker 2: you know, these two kids, they've just kind of had
25:12
Speaker 2: it out for each other from the very beginning. Listen,
25:15
Speaker 2: there's going to come a point that you can't be
25:18
Speaker 2: the hub of the relationship. As much as you want
25:22
Speaker 2: your kids to love each other, as much as you
25:24
Speaker 2: may pray they have deep friendships, always you can't be
25:28
Speaker 2: the hub. I've seen moms act as the mediator. They
25:32
Speaker 2: have two kids who are different, have different interests, different temperaments,
25:37
Speaker 2: and yet they keep trying to create friendship between those
25:41
Speaker 2: two kids, or they're always in the position of referee.
25:44
Speaker 2: Now hear me will on this. There is a responsibility
25:48
Speaker 2: in your parenting that if you have one kid way
25:51
Speaker 2: laying into another kid, you're gonna have to intervene. If
25:54
Speaker 2: you have one kid who is a fast wit and
25:57
Speaker 2: fast with their tongue and they are just shredding verbal
26:00
Speaker 2: a sibling who is a little more laid back, who
26:03
Speaker 2: doesn't operate in quite the same way at a verbal level, yeah,
26:07
Speaker 2: you're going to have to step in because you are
26:10
Speaker 2: trying to lay a foundation of fairness for both sides,
26:15
Speaker 2: and so in that way you are going to have
26:18
Speaker 2: to step in. Should it be about defending the other kid,
26:21
Speaker 2: Maybe a little, but really it's about saying, in this family,
26:25
Speaker 2: we do not fill in the blank. We do not
26:28
Speaker 2: hit each other. In this family, we do not belittle
26:31
Speaker 2: each other. In this family, we do not call each
26:34
Speaker 2: other these names. That way, no matter who the player is,
26:38
Speaker 2: who is the offender, and who is the one who
26:40
Speaker 2: is on the receiving end of that, that becomes less
26:43
Speaker 2: material to the ethos that you're setting. That ethos is
26:47
Speaker 2: very important, and so yeah, sometimes you do have to
26:50
Speaker 2: step in, obviously when they're smaller, obviously for their own protection.
26:54
Speaker 2: But I'm talking about the phenomenon where the only relationship
26:58
Speaker 2: your kids have is through you. You that you are the
27:02
Speaker 2: one who is trying to connect the dots. Well, you
27:04
Speaker 2: need to call your brother, Well, you need to tell
27:06
Speaker 2: your sister such and such. Well, you know you haven't
27:08
Speaker 2: been to see your brother in such amount of time.
27:10
Speaker 2: You need to go do da da da da. Your
27:13
Speaker 2: kids need to be able to develop relationship that is
27:17
Speaker 2: for them without you in the middle of it. I
27:21
Speaker 2: am so delighted when from time to time, my adult
27:24
Speaker 2: kids who are still here locally will decide to go
27:27
Speaker 2: out on some adventure together. They'll go on a camping
27:30
Speaker 2: trip together, or they'll go to a restaurant for dinner,
27:33
Speaker 2: and my husband and I don't get invited. Now would
27:36
Speaker 2: we love to be invited, of course, but we also
27:39
Speaker 2: sit back and look at each other and we not.
27:41
Speaker 2: We're like, this is so cool. We are not. They're
27:43
Speaker 2: not doing this because we planned it, we executed the plan,
27:49
Speaker 2: we demanded. They genuinely want to go hang out and
27:53
Speaker 2: be together. That's really incredible. We love when that happens
27:57
Speaker 2: because it means we're not the hub. The flip side
27:59
Speaker 2: of this is have my kids had times in their
28:02
Speaker 2: adult lives where they haven't gotten along, where they've seen
28:05
Speaker 2: things very differently. Yeah, that has definitely happened as well
28:09
Speaker 2: politically during COVID about certain friendships and relationships one of
28:14
Speaker 2: the kids would have and another one wouldn't be so
28:16
Speaker 2: sure about it. That has absolutely happened. It is hard
28:20
Speaker 2: when you see it happen because as a parent you
28:23
Speaker 2: want to jump in the middle and explain for the
28:24
Speaker 2: other child or help one see the nuance or the
28:27
Speaker 2: context or whatever, and I'm sure those are issues that
28:31
Speaker 2: we will continue to navigate, but I will tell you
28:34
Speaker 2: for sure that the one thing I do say is, hey,
28:38
Speaker 2: that is your sibling, and you're going to have to
28:39
Speaker 2: work it out with them. It's tough in families, and
28:44
Speaker 2: I haven't always been great at this, But what we
28:47
Speaker 2: don't want to do is end up in a position
28:49
Speaker 2: of triangulation where this sibling is coming to you as
28:53
Speaker 2: the mom and saying so and so did such and such.
28:55
Speaker 2: And then you go to so and so and you say, well,
28:57
Speaker 2: your sister told me that da da da da da,
28:59
Speaker 2: And we've got this triangle happening where you are the
29:03
Speaker 2: person trying to mitigate what has happened. Where you are
29:06
Speaker 2: you're playing a game of telephone, and I'm telling you
29:09
Speaker 2: it's a recipe for disaster. For being misunderstood, for being misquoted,
29:14
Speaker 2: for being accused of being more on one person's side
29:17
Speaker 2: than the other. You can't stand in that role. It's
29:21
Speaker 2: interesting to me in the story of Esau and Jacob,
29:24
Speaker 2: they had to make the decision to reconcile as siblings.
29:28
Speaker 2: It didn't come through their dad, who by that point
29:31
Speaker 2: had passed. It didn't come through Rebecca, they had to
29:34
Speaker 2: make the choice to reconcile his siblings. It can be
29:37
Speaker 2: a tough waiting space. That is a that is a
29:39
Speaker 2: really awkward waiting room in family situations where you have
29:43
Speaker 2: a couple siblings who aren't getting along and aren't comfortable
29:46
Speaker 2: around each other, but you can't resolve it for kids
29:50
Speaker 2: over a certain age. Now, what shoul that age be, Jules,
29:53
Speaker 2: you asked me eight, nine, ten, eleven. That's going to
29:57
Speaker 2: be an individual call. That's going to be one of
29:59
Speaker 2: those things you're going to have to sort with the
30:01
Speaker 2: temperaments in your house. What I will say is you
30:04
Speaker 2: probably have an ability to step in in a healthy
30:07
Speaker 2: way somewhere in the mid teens. But after that point,
30:11
Speaker 2: you have to let your kids explore, make mistakes, repair,
30:17
Speaker 2: figure things out for the friendship they want to have
30:19
Speaker 2: with each other without you in the middle of it. All. Right,
30:25
Speaker 2: here's another thing that I have observed through the years,
30:29
Speaker 2: something I've tried to mitigate at my house. Sometimes to
30:32
Speaker 2: some level that's doing well, sometimes not. We started with
30:35
Speaker 2: the story of the Christmas batteries, trying to make sure
30:37
Speaker 2: that every kid had the same number of presents under
30:40
Speaker 2: the tree, and there is a reality that even if
30:45
Speaker 2: you are that meticulous with it, even if you are
30:48
Speaker 2: trying to demonstrate over and over that you want things
30:50
Speaker 2: to be fair, there are going to be situations that aren't.
30:55
Speaker 2: For example, I have people in my world who have
30:58
Speaker 2: dealt with a a child moving into young adult years
31:04
Speaker 2: who has needed to go to rehab super expensive caused
31:09
Speaker 2: all kinds of chaos, and a family has really made
31:13
Speaker 2: things difficult with resources and finances and all the things.
31:16
Speaker 2: It happens. And yet sometimes parents act like, well, of
31:22
Speaker 2: course we need to do this. There are child and
31:24
Speaker 2: on and on, and yet at the same time, you've
31:26
Speaker 2: got another kid who is working their tail off to
31:29
Speaker 2: pay for their living expenses through college. Okay, that's not fair.
31:33
Speaker 2: Can we just say that? And when you, as a parent,
31:35
Speaker 2: are willing to say, I recognize that from a resource standpoint,
31:40
Speaker 2: this does not feel fair. And I want you to
31:42
Speaker 2: know I see that you're not making verbal promises like
31:46
Speaker 2: we're going to make it right and we're going to
31:47
Speaker 2: leave you a check for X amount or you're not
31:50
Speaker 2: justifying it. How can you even feel like it wouldn't
31:52
Speaker 2: be fair. That's not fair of you to think it's
31:54
Speaker 2: not fair, because here I am as a parent trying
31:56
Speaker 2: to do for just acknowledge it. Just acknowledge, Hey, I
32:01
Speaker 2: recognize this is taking a lot of my time, a
32:03
Speaker 2: lot of my focus, a lot of my resources. I'm
32:07
Speaker 2: sure that might not feel fair to you. And then
32:09
Speaker 2: just listen to your kid express what it's like. You know,
32:13
Speaker 2: we have two children who have disabilities, and the focus
32:16
Speaker 2: and time that was put into their therapy modalities, the
32:20
Speaker 2: resources they needed, on and on bottom line, not fair
32:24
Speaker 2: to my other kids. And I know that you might
32:29
Speaker 2: be listening and thinking will but it's nobody's fault that
32:31
Speaker 2: did I get all that. But when you are eight
32:34
Speaker 2: years old and you want an XYZ like all your
32:37
Speaker 2: other friends, but the family budget has gone for a
32:39
Speaker 2: medical device that's critical for your siblings' development, that's hard
32:44
Speaker 2: to process when you're eight years old. So you know what,
32:45
Speaker 2: sometimes it's just better to go. I get that it's
32:48
Speaker 2: not fair. So in those moments, as much as we
32:51
Speaker 2: want to set an ethos of we want things to
32:54
Speaker 2: be as fair as possible, we also need to be
32:56
Speaker 2: setting an ethos of saying and we're human and we
33:00
Speaker 2: have a broken world in which things happen that require
33:04
Speaker 2: things that are out of proportion from one another sometimes.
33:08
Speaker 2: But what you need to know is that we're also
33:11
Speaker 2: looking out for you. Because here's the thing. When your
33:14
Speaker 2: kid says something along the lines of it's not fair,
33:17
Speaker 2: the fear that they're voicing is do you see that
33:22
Speaker 2: I'm here, that I have needs, that i have ways
33:25
Speaker 2: in which i want to be connected to you, and
33:27
Speaker 2: I'm not necessarily feeling that. Acknowledging that things in certain
33:32
Speaker 2: seasons are not fair is a place of vulnerability, and
33:37
Speaker 2: it's a place of truthfulness that I really believe your
33:40
Speaker 2: kids will appreciate and will help reduce the level of
33:43
Speaker 2: resentment that can grow from some of these situations. When
33:49
Speaker 2: you get ahead of it, when you acknowledge it early,
33:52
Speaker 2: that is really helpful so that resentment can't take hold. Now,
33:56
Speaker 2: in all of this, I want to be cautious to say,
33:59
Speaker 2: there are situations in which you may have had a sibling,
34:03
Speaker 2: or you may be raising a child within the sibling
34:06
Speaker 2: group of children you have, who really is a kid
34:10
Speaker 2: who's making things super tough for whatever reason. Sometimes you
34:15
Speaker 2: will just have a kid show up who really is
34:18
Speaker 2: more of a physical bully, who really is more difficult,
34:22
Speaker 2: who really does seem to thrive on picking on another
34:26
Speaker 2: sibling and those kinds of things. Sometimes in adulthood, you
34:30
Speaker 2: have a sibling who has drained your mom and dad
34:33
Speaker 2: dry through all kinds of different mishaps and misadventures. They
34:38
Speaker 2: are rude to you, They are mercurial, they are unforgiving
34:44
Speaker 2: whatever the thing is. Sometimes, unfortunately, in those types of
34:49
Speaker 2: sibling relationships, the best you can do is to continue
34:53
Speaker 2: to love them, but to let go of the idea
34:56
Speaker 2: that you will ever necessarily be friends. And if you
35:00
Speaker 2: are still about the active business of raising kids and
35:03
Speaker 2: you see one who's exceptionally oppositional, I want to strongly
35:07
Speaker 2: recommend that you get your whole family with a family
35:11
Speaker 2: therapist so that your other children can see that you
35:14
Speaker 2: recognize this as a problem. You want to get tools.
35:18
Speaker 2: You want to create as best loving environment as you
35:20
Speaker 2: can and not let that kid either a off the
35:24
Speaker 2: hook or shun that kid to the point that they
35:28
Speaker 2: don't feel included, that they feel like they're always on
35:30
Speaker 2: the outskirts. So often, so many of these things really
35:34
Speaker 2: are just about getting better tools, And we are trying
35:37
Speaker 2: to navigate some complex issues from a place of hey,
35:41
Speaker 2: this is all of our first time parenting too, right,
35:45
Speaker 2: we need those people in our lives who can speak
35:47
Speaker 2: in great tools, new language, ways of handling conflict, ways
35:52
Speaker 2: of trying to make things more fair, helping us see
35:55
Speaker 2: something through someone else's perspective. When you model that for
35:59
Speaker 2: your kids, Hey, we're not just out here on this
36:01
Speaker 2: island alone with no one to be able to help us.
36:03
Speaker 2: There are people who are fantastic at this and can
36:06
Speaker 2: help guide us in ways in which we can better interact.
36:10
Speaker 2: That's a powerful thing to show, to model, to give
36:13
Speaker 2: your kids, because, as my listener who wrote in said,
36:17
Speaker 2: I was raised in a family in which my sister
36:19
Speaker 2: and I had a lot of conflict and we didn't
36:22
Speaker 2: really see modeled how to handle that. Then go get tools,
36:25
Speaker 2: be intentional about it, own it. I love that she's
36:28
Speaker 2: so honest about Hey, I'm kind of lost here because
36:30
Speaker 2: I wasn't raised in an environment that handed me off
36:33
Speaker 2: a toolkit of things to do. But you will have
36:36
Speaker 2: to be proactive. You will have to go seek it.
36:39
Speaker 2: And of course I love resources like books and podcasts
36:42
Speaker 2: and all those things. But I'm also here to tell
36:43
Speaker 2: you there's something very exceptional about getting in front of
36:47
Speaker 2: another human being for whom this is their area of expertise,
36:52
Speaker 2: and letting them coach you and your kids toward better relationship.
36:56
Speaker 2: That can be a really profound thing that you give
36:58
Speaker 2: your kids. Now, as we wrap up this idea around
37:03
Speaker 2: sibling relationships, sibling rivalry, all the things, I know, we
37:07
Speaker 2: haven't been able to touch on everything, but I do
37:11
Speaker 2: want to make sure that I say this. One thing
37:14
Speaker 2: that we talked about a lot in our home was
37:19
Speaker 2: that Lord Willing, these are the relationships, These are the
37:23
Speaker 2: interactions that will carry forward in our kids' adult lives
37:29
Speaker 2: for a long time. And I do know that with
37:31
Speaker 2: my siblings through various seasons of life, various circumstances, the
37:35
Speaker 2: ways we've seen each other through things saying goodbye to
37:38
Speaker 2: my parents and what that took in terms of relationship.
37:42
Speaker 2: You know, even if you don't want to mess with
37:44
Speaker 2: your siblings anymore, even if you have a kid who's saying, man,
37:46
Speaker 2: as soon as I'm out of this house, i am
37:48
Speaker 2: not talking to those people again, life has a way
37:52
Speaker 2: of bringing those relationships back around to where you do
37:55
Speaker 2: have to deal with each other, and you're going to
37:57
Speaker 2: have some decisions to make at that point. To me,
38:02
Speaker 2: if we can make the investment now while our kids
38:04
Speaker 2: are young and still in our home and let them
38:07
Speaker 2: see the importance of having these siblings who are also
38:11
Speaker 2: their dear friends. That is an investment that pays forward
38:16
Speaker 2: in the future. That's an investment that pays forward in
38:19
Speaker 2: the future in difficult situations where difficult decisions are having
38:24
Speaker 2: to be made. My brothers and I were recently talking
38:28
Speaker 2: about that. We're really grateful the more stories we hear
38:33
Speaker 2: of people in seasons of life saying goodbye to parents,
38:36
Speaker 2: splitting apart assets, all of the things. We're so grateful
38:41
Speaker 2: for the wrapped batteries under the Christmas tree, because we
38:46
Speaker 2: are all so protective of that legacy for each other.
38:52
Speaker 2: We do our best to try to make things as
38:54
Speaker 2: fair as possible. And it's because we had parents who
39:00
Speaker 2: set that as an example, who showed us that fairness
39:05
Speaker 2: was an important component of building our relationships forward, and
39:10
Speaker 2: it has served us well. So I hope that's some
39:14
Speaker 2: encouragement for you. I know that's probably not the answer
39:17
Speaker 2: to every single situation you might have, every single conflict
39:21
Speaker 2: that has arisen your particular situation, but there are things
39:26
Speaker 2: we can do to be intentional. Just because you're born
39:29
Speaker 2: into the same household does not mean that you are
39:33
Speaker 2: automatically gifted strong relationship and love for one another. It
39:38
Speaker 2: still has to be cultivated and protected, valiantly protected. And
39:44
Speaker 2: guess what as the mama as that ad that is
39:48
Speaker 2: part of the charge to you to help build the
39:51
Speaker 2: environment in which your kids have the best shot of
39:55
Speaker 2: having a beautiful blood friendship moving forward into their lives,
40:01
Speaker 2: through the different seasons, through the challenges, all the way
40:04
Speaker 2: home until we get to God. So I hope this
40:06
Speaker 2: has been of help now, as always, I would love
40:10
Speaker 2: to hear more of your listener questions, the situations you're
40:13
Speaker 2: dealing with, your thoughts on this episode. I love when
40:16
Speaker 2: you interact with us, So you can find me over
40:17
Speaker 2: on Instagram at Julie lyles Car and Julie lyles Car
40:20
Speaker 2: all the places, and of course we have all kinds
40:22
Speaker 2: of social platforms and places that you can interact with
40:24
Speaker 2: us at All Mom Does, there's allmmdes dot com and
40:27
Speaker 2: all mom Does all over the socials. If this episode
40:29
Speaker 2: has been helpful to you, would do me a favor?
40:31
Speaker 2: Would you snag the link and send it to someone
40:34
Speaker 2: who you'd like to listen to it? Maybe it would
40:36
Speaker 2: be helpful to them. Maybe it's to your sibling that
40:39
Speaker 2: gives you, guys, a starting point in which to potentially
40:42
Speaker 2: rebuild and restart your relationship. That would mean so much
40:46
Speaker 2: to me and I will see you next time on
40:48
Speaker 2: the next episode of the All Mom Does Podcast.