Latest / The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast / To Help or not to Help | Sarah Beckman Enneagram Type #2

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To Help or not to Help | Sarah Beckman Enneagram Type #2 · The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_02: Hi friends, welcome back to the Simply Wholehearted Podcast.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: It means so much to have you choose to take this conversation along with you today.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Amy Wicks, your host, and here at Simply Wholehearted, we provide perspective, purpose, and plans to help you love God, love others, and live your best life.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: We are traveling through our summer in the Aneagram and we are stopping to visit to learn a little bit more about the type twos, as well as how each type can know which of the five steps to take when you are in a hard place.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know we love the Enneagram around here, and I believe that the inside of this resource will guide you to create your best, wholehearted life.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: But this can't happen until you understand who you're created to be and the message your heart longs to hear.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: Especially for those who are still trying to determine your dominant type, you'll want to tune in to each episode to see what you might resonate with most.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_02: And for those who are confident of your type, you'll want to tune in each episode because we have something for each type, every conversation.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: And not to mention it may help you better understand the other types in your life.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: Before we dive into this conversation with Sarah Beckman, here are some details and telltale signs about the Anne Graham Type 2.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_02: I like to know what people need and help make their lives better.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: I am generous, warm, and caring.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: Appreciation and gentleness are very important to me.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the type 2 is part of the heart triad.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: And like the ones, they are in the compliant or dependent stance.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_02: They also excel being focused on the present.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: Here are some great tips to help you get along with the two.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: Be specific in your appreciation, take an interest in their problems, even if they try to redirect the conversation.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: Plan fun things with them and reassure them that they are important and special to you.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: Sarah Beckman and I ended up having two conversations because, like a few others in my last hundred episodes, the devil got into the technology and I lost half of our conversation.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_02: But the Lord redeems all things, even lost episodes.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: And she was fantastic for our Aneagram 2.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_02: Now, one of my sisters is an Aneagram 2, so I have a special place in my heart for them.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_02: I'm pretty sure if you have a healthy two in your life, so do you.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: But this conversation is for each type as we also chat about what each Aneagram type needs to do when they find themselves in a hard place.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: And hey, if you didn't catch it yet, this was another two-episode week.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_02: Joel Fitzpatrick was my guest on Tuesday's episode, and it was the perfect conversation for Father's Day, which is this Sunday.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's for all the dads and all the moms as we talked about how we can support the invaluable role of fatherhood.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: Cue up that episode after you listen to this one.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: Alright, excellent.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Then I'm then I'm gonna learn a lot today.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: Now, you had talked about for sure last time you knew you were in the heart triad, and you were pretty sure you were Anneagram too, which would seem really fitting.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_02: What was kind of your aha moment of like, oh, I'm I'm pretty sure I'm Anneagram too.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I read The Road Back to You by Ian Cron.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: So so good.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I recommend to everyone.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: Just read that one.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: Such a great book.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: I loved it so much.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: And two, being in in those terms, the helper.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: I really think that the helper is, and I never would have thought of myself like that.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, years ago, when I first became a Christian, I definitely would have told you that I was very self-centered and very unaware of other people's needs, very aware of my own.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: And years later, 18 of them, 18 years later, it's I've slowly become more and more attuned to other people's needs.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: And and there is a slippery slope too.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, of course, we know this that like our Enneagram type can also be a slippery side of it.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like it can be a beautiful blessing side, but it can be a side where we have to be careful.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for many years, and I referred to this in the first book I wrote, which is called Alongside, How Do We Love Others in Their Time of Trial.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: So fitting.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So that book came first, and I really um acknowledged in that book my heart honesty, which is that I probably helped more than I should have to receive accolades or to receive instant gratification or feedback or worth or value or appreciation.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: And when you're in those years of parenting young kids and I was a stay-at-home mom, I didn't realize how much I was seeking outside my family for my worth in those ways of if I was valuable and helpful to people.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: And certainly I did it, you know, probably mostly out of a genuine pure heart, right?
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: God has loved me, He's saved me, He's people have showered me with blessing, but I really did slide into that dangerous side of being a helper, which is doing it for the wrong reasons.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so I had to really heart check that.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: And now I try very hard to do it out of pure and sincere obedience to God, which is first for me, and then and um being true to who he made me to be, which I think over time I've developed that number two, the Enneagram helper, but also just because it it is a blessing when I feel like I'm helping someone, not even if they don't say thanks.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, when you're doing it for that audience of one, you know, when you're doing it for that being the end goal of like that is what the Lord has compelled me to do today, that's been my assignment, that's who I'm supposed to help.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: Not like, you know, kind of how you said.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's really good.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's a good place to start too, because that is a key when when you're in a hard place or when someone else is in a hard place for you, are you uh are you helping others to avoid your own feelings and how and how you might need help?
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: Or are you helping someone just for the sake of hoping they will see you as a hero and savior to their situation?
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Well, again, I think it can be slippery.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think we have to be so careful that um that we're loving because we want to be obedient and be that hands and feet.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we hear that expression all the time, be the hands and feet of Christ.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so the place that we can be the hands and feet of Christ is in the middle of someone else's struggle.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: And then I think even to the next level, maybe they're a believer or a friend in the faith or what, you know, however you want to term it, maybe they have the same values and faith viewpoint as you do, but possibly they don't.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I believe that our job is to shine the light in those dark places when they don't have a context of faith, when they don't understand why someone would stop what they're doing to come over to their house and watch their kids or bring them a meal or go get their groceries or drive it, run errands, whatever it might be that we would practically do.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: It is such a testimony of our faith and of who we are when we, with no agenda and no expectation and no, I'm trying to convert you, but just truly, sincerely love someone uh in as if we're Christ, showing them love in that really hard place.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: And there's no more important time, in my in my estimation, than when they are in the darkness to come on in and be there and shine that light.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Oh man, that's so good.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's so true.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: I'd love for you to maybe go through all the five steps.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: My thought is that we'll interject some of maybe how each type would handle these different steps and how they might view it and go about it.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So the first step when you're in a hard place, I would say is to establish your mindset.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: And this kind of has to do with being intentional and choosing a focus of how we're gonna go through it.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so I have friends that have done all sorts of different things as far as choosing a focal point.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: So some have used a hashtag.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I have a friend who was pregnant with a very dangerous pregnancy.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: They didn't think her child would live, a very rare genetic disorder.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: They were on hand to go to the most acute neonatal facility that you can imagine.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And he is just turned one year old.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: So he lived through all of that.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: And they chose a hashtag before he was ever born, and it was Big God Little Warrior.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And they named him Joshua.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: And so every Caring Bridge post, every Facebook post, every email to family, every communication that they put out from before he was born through now, they've always done this hashtag of Big God Little Warrior.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it just kind of is a way for me to remember to pray for them.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I think it's just a place to hang our hat, right?
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: This focal point.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: And when you're getting ready to have a baby, they tell they used to tell you, I have no idea if they do now.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: My youngest is 18 tomorrow.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I know.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's crazy.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: But you've done it.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yay! Successful adults.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: And sidebar, I got the most beautiful note from her for Mother's Day, and in it she said, Mom, you've packed my bags well.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's up to me to unpack them and use them.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, oh man.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: That is just beautiful.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: What a gift.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, really, really, really, really a gift.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: So anyway, but this whole notion of when we were pregnant, that when we'd go to the hospital to give birth, they wanted us to have this focal point, right?
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so what can you focus on to keep you in the positive frame?
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so maybe if you're like an Enneagram who already focuses on positivity, right?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Right, that's not difficult for you, but some of us really need extra help.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so that would be something that I think is so essential.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: What is your focal point?
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, a scripture verse that you can hang your hat on, um, just a phrase, you know, that we will be strong in the Lord, or you know, whatever it might be.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's just important to have that mindset before you start or as early as possible in the middle, like when you start a trial and say, oh no, like I am in the deep, deep woods here, and I need to step back a second and really make sure that I have my eyes fixed in the right place, or I'm not gonna make it through.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's so good.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think you pointed out a good point.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: Naturally, some of the anneagram types that would be uh maybe a go-to, like their initial reaction.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: But I I would think, I mean, especially what comes to my mind is anneagram six, where anxiety and fear tend to be kind of their dark side or hidden side, right?
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: You talked about the there's the positives and the negatives.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_02: And for them, they're very cerebral.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: So they're the in the thinking triad.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so for them, it is really important to have their mindset focused on what is true, lovely, right, honorable, praiseworthy.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: And so scripture and truth and hope is really good to have on the forefront.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think on the flip side, that's the gift of maybe like an Aneagram three and eight, that they can give that to others, that they can be speakers of that hope and that truth and what's positive and light, right, and lovely.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I would even say Go to Venture is like the Anneagram one who focuses on wanting to be good and and right and to do the right thing.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: This would be just a great practical step that you can't go wrong with helping themselves get through those hard times by going to the word of God and going to that for the answers.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: You hit three of my numbers.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm two and then three and one.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, okay, awesome.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: So the steps might be setting me right up.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: The things that I created might just be like really telling my psyche.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: That's awesome.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm kind of curious.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_02: Did you do a test then?
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_02: Did you do the ready?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I did a test and I don't know which one I took.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just kind of curious because that is a perfect way to kind of dial into each of those and go, okay, which one do I most resonate with?
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: And for you, it's a you said pretty sure the heart chair ad, which the two and the three are right in there.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so you could definitely be a two-wing three, or you know, maybe a three-wing two.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but I know in our conversations before, I'm like, um, Sarah's spot on two.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: I might be two, three one day, three, two another, but definitely totally honed in on the heart.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: And my struggle point is my one, my my sort of um desire for excellence or perfectionism, that's where I see a weakness in the enneagram for me, is I have to be so careful about not letting perfectionism and wanting to do it perfectly and getting it right and overthinking and all of the things that happen in the one Enneagram that can hold me back from just doing what I'm called to do.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, and that would be your other wing.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're two, you have wings, the three and the one, and I always say we use them like salt and pepper, and each of us have a unique palette for salt and pepper.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_02: So that kind of demonstrates right there.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: So sometimes your one wing gets a little hung up on the need for perfection, which is totally understandable.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, I just hang out in one, two, three land depending on the day.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's awesome.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: That's so good.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, all right.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: Give us number two.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: Step two is draft your team, which essentially is being thoughtful about what people are gonna navigate this hardship with you.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I think this one's so good.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: I never would have articulated it this way.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and it is really important because I think that we forget, like if we were planning an event, we would definitely be looking around and seeing what people in our life would fit into like whatever committee we might need them to be on.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: Or if we have a committee of people, we'd say, Oh, your gift is decorating and your gift is food, and you're gifted over here at the administration side of it, right?
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: So if we were planning an event, whether that's work or church or neighborhood or school, we would definitely be looking at all of the giftings, abilities, talents that people have.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: And we would say, Here's how you fit into our bigger equation.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: So the same thing goes for when we're in a trial.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: We need to be thinking about like, I am gonna need to eat, my family's gonna need to eat, and I may not be the one that can cook and shop right now.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: My I'm gonna need rides, either me to treatment or my husband to treatment or my kids, or my kids are gonna need to ride a sports because my we can't do it, or whatever.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on the trial, right?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, maybe it's single parenting and you are up to your eyeballs because you now have to work and your kids can't get all the places used to take them when there was two or whatever it is, it really doesn't matter the trial, honestly.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: It could be illness, cancer, divorce, um, even grief, losing a loved one.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, totally these things all play a part.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if it's medical in nature, we definitely need to be thinking about who might be able to help us navigate that medical quagmire, which can be just so, so daunting.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: So drafting our team is about looking around and seeing who might be valuable as an asset to us and that we could enlist them to say, I might need some help.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Would you be willing to be the meal coordinator?
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: Or um, even if you aren't thinking of it and people start offering, what can I do to help you?
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: Then you can be thinking, Oh, yeah, I need a team of people.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like maybe you could be in charge of helping me manage the kids and just where they have to be every week.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: And could you help me with the calendar, help me with the rides, whatever it might be, or even enlisting other people?
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: So there's so many things that we do in a given week as moms and dads, if we have kids, even if we don't have kids, it's just what needs to get done, and I'm likely not going to be able to do it.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, who can I enlist to help me and what are the jobs?
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: So that is the second step is to really figure out who can we put on the team that will help us and knowing we shouldn't try and go it alone.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, we need all nine top types to help us through it.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think of the inward stance, those who um can either uh prefer to get peace by going inward or those who naturally do, uh and not necessarily introverted.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: So I think of like the fours, the fives, and the nines.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_02: They have ability to, you know, kind of withdraw and you know get comfort from the Lord or just from their thinking abilities or their own feelings of it.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_02: But I see how most importantly it would be really good for them to be thinking about their team because they might naturally want to go through a hard time on their own because that's their natural tendency.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_02: But it is so important, like you said, to incorporate the team, to ask for others, ask for help from others, to accept help from others.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um so there's you know, so to be thinking about that and thinking through that.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: And a five would actually be really good at organizing a team if they're willing to accept the help, which is so great.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: And or they could love someone else by organizing someone else's team if it's not them in the middle of the trial, right?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I even think sometimes for Anneagram AIDS who are the challengers and really strong and normally seen as a force, it'll be hard to accept help as well.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you tend to be very independent.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: You are able to go at it alone.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: But people really want to help you.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_02: Just as eights go to a helper in growth, um, they can they can accept that help from others because as if they can recall how it feels to be able to have the, I don't know, just the feeling you get from helping, the rewarding feeling, others, you know, desire that ability too to come alongside.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that's great.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: Form a team, be thinking about it.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: I love how you articulate it.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, so I'm interrupting this Anneagram conversation to remind you about the Simply Summer Workshop that is here to help you with the no-schedule long days, sibling fighting, boredom constant eating, and the messy house.
• 18:50
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• 18:53
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• 18:58
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• 19:05
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• 19:13
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• 19:26
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• 19:29
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• 19:31
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• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now back to our summer in the Enneagram.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, so step three is taking an honest inventory.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I imagine that you'll give me some great insight about who would be really good at this and natural.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm very excited to hear that.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: But the essence of taking this honest inventory is really figuring out who you need to have in your life and who you maybe don't.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: And this is a very hard step, but so important.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes it'll take people longer.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: They might be six months into a trial and say, wow, this is just not healthy for me, this person, this situation.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's about owning what you're going through and being willing to take the necessary steps that you need to to surround yourself with the right people.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's like a piggyback off drafting your team.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: But it's also important that it's not, it's not even just about people always, but just situations.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe you need to take an honest inventory about how many things you're involved in or what you're doing, or um how you might be overcommitted if you're a two, you might be super overcommitted and unable to really help anyone well.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: And of course, I'm gonna do a lot of two talk today because that's where I that's where you live.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: But ultimately, you know, anyone needs to recognize that we can't try to overserve.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: So if if you're helping someone, this is a step for you, taking an honest inventory.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe I've said yes to 17 ways that I'm gonna help that friend, and I need to pull back and say, I'm gonna help in one significant way, and this is what I can do right now.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I'll never forget after I walked through a friend who had terminal illness for five years, a best, best friend.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: And she's woven through both my books.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so you'll get to know her if you read the books.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: Her name is Kelly.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: And she and I were, I mean, I was an integral two in their life.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: And um when after she passed and we were, you know, moving through the grief and all the different things, I was still grabbing the phone every time a need came up for her family.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: And my husband finally just said, you know, you don't have to answer the phone every single time they call.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: And And that was really hard, but so true.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because I was overhelping and I had been sacrificing my own family literally for five years.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: And they were kind and accommodating.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: And my husband was amazing.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: But at some point, you just have to say, I can't do it all.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I was putting my own grief on the back burner.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was having some health struggles because of that, that I wasn't grieving myself.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: I was just trying to caretake for everyone around me that was still grieving.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't have a right because she's a friend, not a mom or a sister, or a wife, or a daughter.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: So it was it was a little messy.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we have to just be willing to take that honest inventory.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: And and I know people who've had to honestly ask people to not be part of their situation.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really hard.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, I know people who have said you can't come to the hospital or you can't come and visit unless A, B, and C.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can't fulfill those requirements that I have in the middle of my health struggle, then I'm sorry, but right now it has to be about me.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: So that one's really tricky and hard, and there's some finesse there.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: But you have to know that you're worth the effort that it takes to keep some peace and stability and and rightness in your life in this time.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you make so many good points.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: I am thinking about the people that this would be hardest for.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm thinking threes and sevens in particular.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_02: Threes because they want to please as much as twos want to help.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh they want to they want everyone to kind of not necessarily feel good about the situation, but feel good about them and their situation.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I I'm, you know, uh this is like revealing.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: So um it's gonna be it's gonna be really hard to say no to certain people.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's gonna be hard to give boundaries um in those relationships that are hard and fast and to stick to them and walk them out.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_02: And when you're weak and going through a hard time, that's where it's gonna go.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_02: But this I think this is a critical thing that you point out, all the reasons that you point out to maintain your health and to be able to actually get healthy in whatever it is, whether it's actually health-related or a healthy heart.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: But then sevens.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_02: Sevens have a fear of missing out and you know, struggle with scarcity.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we all ultimately have a fear of missing out.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um, the social media does not help that.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_02: But in particular for them, there's just such scarce scarcity um involved when with their insatiable appetite for more, not just food related, but people related, experience-related.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_02: And so if they're having to minimize their life because of a crisis or because of a hard place, um, that's gonna be the antithesis of their personality.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: And they're gonna really have to go to the Lord and probably get wise counsel to have help, you know, forming and shaping what it looks like your boundaries need to be.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because that's gonna be hard.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: Now, and then I think of an eight, and they're not gonna have a problem in the world with this.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: Boundaries are their jam.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna learn from it.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: I know, and they have no problem saying it and walking it out, and that's so great.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: And then, and a nine might have a hard time too, just because they can see everyone's perspective, so they're gonna really feel what you know, not necessarily feel, but they're gonna get that another person might be offended by their boundary, and and that's not pleasant for them either.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: They're gonna get it, and so they're gonna they could talk themselves out of it based on their awesome view of perspective.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, my daughter is the nine, the one who wrote me the note about packing the suitcase.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I can totally see that.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because she, I mean, she understood the message your heart needed to hear and how beautiful.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's the gift the nine gives us, not only being able to get their peace from the Lord ultimately and be carriers of that, but they can they can really get what it is, those in their life, you know, intimate life of what they need to hear.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it comes across as crazy um intuition and compassion and and maturity.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, especially if 18-year-old, you're just like, what?
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_00: How do you think so awesome?
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: The Lord didn't give me one of those.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, my husband is a nine, but he didn't give me a kick us night.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_02: I have all assertive ones.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_02: I I have all across the board as well.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's awesome.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: All right, number four.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: Four, yes.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: Step four is about determining your non-negotiables, and so you're hearing a lot of strong language, right?
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but this is good, it's what we're honest inventory and what's non-negotiable, and it sounds a little worse than it is, but I think this is just some people say that everything's non-negotiable, but I I mean I disagree.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: So you have to really start to prioritize.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: And if you have so many non-negotiables in your life, then you're gonna have to make a list of them all and just categorize them one through ten.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: And when you have to start giving a number assignment to them, it'll help you realize, oh, I can't put that one lower than a one.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: Or something has to be a 10, you know.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_00: So then it helps you.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: But this is like just even simple things like I have to keep eating well.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: This is non-negotiable.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: I can't just start falling into the comfort foods for me, or maybe your gluten or lactose or you know, intolerant, or you know, like when we don't eat well, we don't feel well.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: And that's a struggle because you don't want to eat well when you're in crisis.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but when for sure you're in crisis, your body starts to actually sock away everything you're eating because it's going into stress mode.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's like, wait a minute, we might, you know, never eat again.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the cortisol levels are through the roof.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, and that's just sort of a little physiology, but so like you know your body and know yourself.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so then this is like even like kids' bedtimes.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, people want to throw all the rules out of the window when there's a crisis, and that's good for a time.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: But if you're non-negotiable, is that if my kids aren't rested, then they everything will go crazy or haywire.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: So then you just say, you know what, there's a lot of rules that we're gonna break in this crisis, but like bedtime is essential because if my kids keep the routine of bedtime, no matter what is happening, they will thrive, even though there's crisis all around them.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever that looks like.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: So it could be exercise, diet, routines, schedules, uh, Bible study.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I have a friend who was going through a crisis, and her parents were both very ill and they lived several hours away.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: And she said, My things that I took everything out of my life except my eating, I had to eat properly.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: I did yoga once a week, and I read my Bible every day.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: And every other thing was optional, yeah, and maybe, but these were her non-negotiables, and it just helped me.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm not really good at that.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and so it really helped me.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she's more pragmatic, and that was a very wise piece of advice that she gave that then made it into these five steps because it is so important to be thoughtful.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: We do not have to be a victim of the circumstance as much as we think.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: So we want to really be proactive instead of reactive in in the trial as much as we can, at least in a few key areas.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, I think that's great.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: I think we really need to take that approach to life in general.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_02: We uh uh simply wholehearted, and with my mom's groups and everything like that, I'm always talking about we got to own our calendar instead of our time owning you.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_02: And that's a piece of it, is is kind of again, it goes back to boundaries, dog on it.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_02: But I think of so good.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: We all need them.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_02: I love the boundary conversation.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: We do.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: I could see that this would be really hard for a one who tends to have really great systems and order and even fours in particular, because part of their connection is to a one, a line of stress and growth.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_02: There's kind of comfort in the routine and the list and what they require, what the day-to-day looks like.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_02: And when that gets jumbled up, whether it's out of their control or not, really bothers them.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so kind of going back and re-evaluating, yes, I really like things to go this way, and my but sometimes we have to just go back to that, like you said, and pick your top things.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_02: What's really the most important in this time?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it's really about prioritizing because there are gonna be plenty of things that are beyond your control that you won't be able to have a rule about that are gonna go by the wayside.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: And the more you try to control the uncontrollable, the more frustrated you'll be.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, which is why this conversation of picking a few key ones that help you maintain that sense of everything's not awry in my life.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that will definitely help.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I just remember when my husband would travel, he's traveled most of our married life, which is you know going on 27 years.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's it's difficult because I had a routine when he was away, and then he would come back and throw it all to the you know, hills, right?
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: And then we would have argument and just and distress with each other, and and so in the end, I kind of had to say, here's what would help me.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I don't mind if you play and have fun and keep them up later, but you know, these things would help me when you come back home to transition our family in a way that they don't feel like you're the only one that they can have fun with, and I'm the one who's always the rules.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's good.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: Because he generally airs on the super fun humorous side, and me hanging out in you know, number one, two, three land, three, one.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: Uh anyway.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes, that's so good.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I even think for the six in particular, because uh again, the anxiety and fear, I think creating some of that like safe zone of predictability by going, as long as I do these things, I'll feel a lot better about life.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because it not it's not necessarily the practical things, but it might be comfort things.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_02: You know, kind of you talked about eating really well, doing whatever soul care it is.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's I mean, that's kind of what it's boiling down to is like, okay, how do I take care of my soul in this time really, really well?
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I may have, for a one, they may have been able to do these 10 things before they have to narrow it down for three.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: And for a six is to be able to go, okay, what's actually gonna make me feel better in this time than and experience less anxiety as I go through this hard time.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and like I have a friend who just walked her mom through Alzheimer's for several years and nursing home situation, and she had to let go of a lot of normal things because she went there daily, but she did not let go of her morning walk and quiet time, regardless.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_00: She didn't rush right over, she just took care of herself because she had to, yeah, in order to handle the the days that she would then all of a sudden be at the emergency room or get the call, or you know what I mean?
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_00: And these are long-term trials where it's a marathon, right?
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_00: You don't know.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_00: This isn't just like six weeks of a surgery recovery.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: This is this was her life for five, three, five years.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was long, so it could be motherhood for some.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, for some motherhood, that is exactly you have to put your own oxygen max mask on first.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, which is definitely so important.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's so good.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_00: All right, number five.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: Step five is crafting your response.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_00: And this has to do with people will start to ask you the same question over and over and over again in the middle of your trial, especially if it's if it's a got longevity, right?
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: So if this is something that's going on and on and on, and or if you're in a situation where they haven't seen you in a long time, it could just catch you off guard six months after something happened.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: They might see you at church or store or school or ball field, and they say something like, How is such and such, or I'm sorry about such and such, and you're just the rugs pulled out from under you, right?
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_00: So this whole notion of being intentional and forethinking and um insightful.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'm getting asked the same questions.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: How am I gonna answer that?
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so it might be something like, How are you doing?
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: What's the latest update on your health?
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: So one of the responses that you could have on hand is thank you so much for asking.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_00: But to conserve my energy, I'm asking that everyone just follow our caring bridge or our Facebook, or I'd love to add you to our email that we're sending to keep everyone up to date, just so everyone can have the same information so that I don't have to repeat it.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: I really am thankful for your concern, but it takes a lot of energy to go through it over and over.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, so it's like a thank you and yeah, and and so that really helps shelter us from feeling like we might be hurting someone's feelings.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe we're three and we're concerned about that, or yeah, we're kind of that peacemaker.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's just a standard response that we can give.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so you want to be thoughtful.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_00: What is my response gonna be?
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because you will be asked the question.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_00: And the the person that helped me understand this was a gal who lost her husband and he committed suicide.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: It was so so painful, so painful.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so then she's standing, you know, in a public place, and someone comes up to her and says, How are you doing?
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: And she says, Okay.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_00: And the gal says, I feel like you're doing really well based on your Facebook post.
• 36:08
  unknown: Wow.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: And she said, Well, I didn't feel like it was appropriate to post the picture of me curled up on the bath bathroom floor in fetal position.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: So she kind of just erupts and has this meltdown because she's so ugh that someone would have that, you know, response.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I I could tell you story after story after story of people that have said terrible, unkind, thoughtless things to someone in the middle of their children.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: We don't know them.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_02: We've all experienced it.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: And you have to be honest with yourself and recognize that it's gonna come.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: There is gonna be someone that is gonna say the stupid thing.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: I promise you.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because we're human, we all fall short, we all want to say the perfect thing, or maybe there's someone that just has less of a filter and you know they don't think the way we think about other people.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: How are they gonna receive this or perceive it?
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, maybe it's an eight, right?
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: Who just says what they mean and you know, like pick yourself up and dust off, get on with it, right?
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like I can just hear some of the eights in my life.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes they're just so straightforward that it hurts.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: And especially if you are in that heart triad, I imagine that every inch of those, every word, like they sat around at home and was the words directly to hurt us, which is so untrue, but that's how we feel.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Think about your response, you know.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there, you know, you might just say it's really hard right now if you want the honest answer, but I don't feel like going into it.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you have to have a little bit of boundaries again, yeah, and you have to have some truth and honesty, and then a little grace for the person in the situation.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_00: So we can have more grace when we've planned out our response for when we hear the crazy, dumb, you know, to for lack of a better word, response.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: I think this is so good and could apply to all nine types in this way.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_02: For one to be thinking ahead of time.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I think if we relate it to the triads in particular, the head, heart, and gut triad.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: So as we're going through a hard time, we want to craft these responses so we don't get caught off guard and instinctively respond from an unhealthy place.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: Where we either get caught off guard and our heart is triggered and we, you know, gush or have a response we don't want to, or we're stuck thinking about what a response should be and we can't seem to formulate it fast enough, or our gut instinct, those who just respond before they think or before they feel and say something that they don't want to say, or have a you know, an emotional response that they don't want to have.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: So from that standpoint, this is really good.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_02: And then on the reverse side, every type could think through how can they best because their heart's gonna go out to them, or their gut instinct, or they've been thinking about them, they want to respond in kind.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_02: A great way to ask is hey, is there a way I can be updated on this information?
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_02: Or something that really blessed me was a friend, and she's one of my Anneagram eight friends.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: She has been really good in different situations that I've gone through.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: She phrases it like this instead of I help how can I help you, she says, What would it look like to support you in this time?
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_02: So it's so good.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_02: That different phrasing gives me a better way to respond in that moment because sometimes when I hear how can I help you, or when I'm offering how can I help you, it's hard to get really specific.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_02: But somehow in that just supporting me, even if my response it feels as trite as saying prayer, that is true.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I can respond to that.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: And that's a that's an honest answer everyone can give and doesn't catch off guard.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_02: And if there's room for further conversation, then you've opened that door, you've shown that you've cared, but it doesn't put the receiver in an awkward situation and you, as you know, are honestly showing that you care and that you love.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for sure.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that I mean, we talk a lot about this in alongside and a lot of the things from that book that that have caused great conversation is you know, how can I best support you right now?
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: Which is such a great way to phrase it, or being thoughtful about what you can specifically offer someone.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're that person and maybe you don't have a close enough friendship with them where you might feel, say, how can I support you?
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because that feels that's so great and healthy, but it does, it is probably reserved for someone who is a closer friendship.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: And we talk about the tiers of relationships.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_00: So tier one being the closest, and four being someone that you don't really know personally.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just face good friends.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and like tier one is a great way to say how can I best support you because you're going deeper to that next level.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, even tier two if they're close.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: But if you're a two or three and you don't know, but you want to do something, then you can think about what you can do and then offer that.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to bring a meal on this day.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_00: I am able to drive and would love to help with the carpool.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: I am going to Target.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_00: What can I pick you up?
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'll leave it at your front step.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: I don't need to go in.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: So all those ways that we can love someone, but it requires, and this is what your ape friend has done for you is it requires thoughtfulness on the part of you instead of the lazy response, which I'm sure that it comes from a good heart, but it is a little bit lazy to just say, let me know what I can do.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: Or how can I help?
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it also might come from this need to overhelp if you're in a sketchy place with your Enneagram number where you need validation and you keep asking and asking and asking and asking and asking.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_00: You want to be valuable, you want to use your gift, and you are burdening the person that you seemingly want to help, which is a huge sticking point.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I have had this conversation hundreds of times with people who have said to me, the hardest thing is when people want to help me, and it's a burden to me to come up with something they can do to make them feel better.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because then they're having to figure out a solution in the midst of their trial.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I've watched it in action where they've come up with a solution, they've given them something to do, and then the person isn't really able, or or the timing's not working out.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's just like disaster.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_00: So the best give you gift you can give each other on both sides of the coin is if you're in a trial, make a list of specific ways you need help.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_00: If you could just keep a running list at your house, oh my gosh, I really am struggling with getting the laundry done, or I could really use someone to clean, or my yard is a mess, or my flowers are dead out front, or whatever it is, you know, that's troubling you.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: And then when people offer, you can say this would help.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_00: And vice versa, if you really want to help, if you're a two and you're ready to go and want to help someone, then you do the thought, even if you're not any enneagram should do this.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: You think through what can I do to love and serve someone and then offer that.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's so good.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_02: Recently, unfortunately, we lost our uncle.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, and it was it was really quick in the end, but in the process while he was getting uh radiation and chemo, one of the we kind of were on the list and had our hand to practical felt needs.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: And my Aunt Donna called me out of the blue one day and said, Hey, you know, give it some thought if you need to, but you know, what if you and the kids came over to clean our back patio furniture?
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's springtime, we'd really love to use it, but we haven't haven't had time or energy to clean it.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I could not tell you how thrilled I was to.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: Be asked to do that, and it was that I thought of that you in that moment because I thought she had someone counsel her to ask for specific things, and she wasn't afraid to ask.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, we're family, but and for me, you know, we just picked a good time that worked, and I it was just such a gift to be able to do that.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_02: It was great for my kids to be able to serve in that way, and to just think, even as we were, you know, at their house for funeral and all that different stuff, to just to go, okay, we were able to help in that way and to see that tangible expression of love.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: And now you're all at the house and you're able to go outside, and she doesn't have to sit there and feel terrible that nothing's cleaned and ready.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: There were so many pieces of that that played into where the community really came around and she had specific ways that people could help.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_02: They drew those, you know, boundary lines of hey, instead of asking us how we are, this is what we're looking for, instead of visiting because we can't take visitors, this is what we love.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: And they communicated that to their kids, and their kids communicated that to everyone else.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I just saw such a beautiful kind of response of just how that was carried out.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: And and if someone got offended, I have no idea.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it wasn't a big deal because there were plenty of people to love them through the whole entire thing and afterwards.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it's yeah, clear communication is so important.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it just sets everyone up for success.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: And ultimately, you know, we know that there's scriptures that talk about the body of Christ and that we're the hand is just as important as the knee and the foot and the ear and the right.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so each part doing its part is what makes it beautiful, and but it it requires someone on the other end to allow us to do our gifting, like for you and your kids to come over.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it just it works so well, it is the ultimate fulfillment of the scriptures when we can love and serve someone in their time of trial, but they have to let us.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's sort of that whole notion of when we're weak, he is strong.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: And who is he strong through?
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_00: He's strong through people that want to come and actually practically love you.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: So what a I mean, it takes humility and and bravery and courage sometimes, depending on what Enneagram you are, to actually open your mouth and say what you need, yeah, instead of assuming everyone can figure it out and would just do it or sitting home isolated and thinking, like, no one's helping me.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: Why, why are my needs not being met?
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: Well, because you aren't helping us what you need.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_00: We can't read your mind.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I mean it goes both ways, it really does.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_02: That is so spot on.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think all of these five steps are really practical.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_02: I know we have a download available for that.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_02: So people, you know, in case they were on the treadmill and driving around and didn't get to write these down, yeah, there's a there's a download.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_02: But before I let you go, one of the things that we're doing with the series, we kind of covered the Aneagram really, really well.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: For being our Aneagram 2 focused podcast, uh, we've talked about all of them.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_02: So we've answered kind of the first question well, is why do you think the Aneagram is life-giving?
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so we kind of talked about all the different ways of how that was, of the positive ones, and you shared a couple examples from your family.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_02: But and for this one, you kind of shared it too as well.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_02: But anything else that you would add to this question, how can you tell when you are responding or acting in unhealth?
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: And that one's not very flattering, but that's why we talk about it because every side, every type has those things we would rather not acknowledge.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_00: Well, for sure, for me, it's um like the three you talked about being people pleasing, which is sort of um, I'm basically like a recovering people pleaser and a recovering perfectionist.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm trying to recover from my unhealthy one and three.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: There you go.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: And and I slip back into them like many of us do, regardless of how hard you're working and how much progress you've made.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: And and we know this, like when you're stressed, you lean towards the unhealthy sides of the Enneagram number that you are.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, my unhealthy sides are the perfectionist side of the one, the people-pleasing side of the three, or the validation need of the two.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so I am pretty acutely aware of my downsides in this.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_00: And in a struggle or a trial, and it might not even be a life-altering struggle or trial, but like right now, I am in the going the way they want it to.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_02: We want it to.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_00: And like, I mean, I'm in a pretty um frantic season.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, everyone, the month of May, June, you know, summer, getting done with school and all that is definitely a stressful time.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_00: But for me right now, I have two graduates, a high school and a college, and then I have a son getting married.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_00: And that's congratulations.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness, yes, so much.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, this is my last call high school graduate and my first college graduate.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_00: So there's so many emotions, so much happening.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I've seen areas where I have definitely fallen prey to my unhealthy side uh because, or I beat myself up, right?
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_00: So just even just this week, in the last 24 hours, here's what happened.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_00: I realized that I gave my mom the wrong address for my son to send the graduation card.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so she's real sad because she worked so hard to make sure she got it there before last Saturday, and it didn't get there because I gave her the wrong address.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_01: Oh man.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was trying to get rehearsal dinner invites out, and I wrote the name wrong for a very critical person because it was very similar to a last name that there were several of, and I made a huge mistake and like called that, you know, wrote the wrong thing.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not like one of my relatives, it's someone else that I don't know and never met.
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then my daughter's 18th birthday is tomorrow and this morning, just before we get on our podcast.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going through the gifts that I feel like I've bought and ordered and had all this stuff shipping to my house, and there's like a total whole order missing.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_00: Oh no.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it was like four, they weren't all huge items, but you know, one bigger item with three little in the same order.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I look on the credit card, I call, I can't find my password.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's not there.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_00: I never actually hit order.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_00: So these three mistakes are frustrating.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so my husband, I'm like, oh my gosh, can you believe all these screw-ups that I had?
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_00: And that's my number one, my perfectionist.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why can't you keep it all together, Sarah?
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_00: When you have eight million balls in the air, how come you can't juggle them all?
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when I start beating myself up, and that's when on Enneagram one gets super dangerous for me.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's that.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_02: Oh man, we can all no one's gonna die, everyone's gonna be okay.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_00: A couple things were missed.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_02: Three to let shame where to go.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_00: A lot to me.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I'm trying to release myself from that today, realizing that I am human and I haven't got a lot of things happening.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, and no one's gonna die because I missed an order and got a couple addresses wrong.
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_02: Thank goodness.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_00: Not life or death.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: Oh man.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_02: Forgive myself.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's right.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_02: Forgive yourself, don't sit in the shame.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_02: And okay, well, the last one is what is your soul care ritual to get you back on the path to growth?
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_02: So you need to have some of that.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: We obviously you went ahead with a podcast conversation, though.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes I know for me, canceling all the things can come from a place of like I feel stuck in the unhealth, and so I just want to walk away from everything.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas that's not my path to growth.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: So I need to institute other self-care procedures and rituals.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I I love to sleep, which is I don't know, is there an Enneagram number for people that love to sleep?
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_00: No, I don't think so.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_00: Because then I can claim that we call it the the Moran sleep gene.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like all my siblings some have the gift and I don't have it.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_02: I do.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_00: And so for me, like one little way that I care for myself is I stay in bed a little extra in the morning and I don't beat myself up about trying to be up by six.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, you know, like the things will happen, and um, and walking and listening to praise music is super critical for my health and well-being, or even just walking with my husband.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_00: And um, we walk a lot together and then we pray.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes I just need the accountability of being with him so that he'll will be almost telling me like, hey, because we try to pray at the end of our walks.
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so if I forget, he always reminds me, which is super great because I need accountability and um just in general, uh-huh.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so um that really helps me.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_00: He has much more discipline, routine.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm much more of the heart girl who just like ah, feel like this today.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's great.
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_00: So walking and praise music, and um just I've really taught myself to sit and be still, and that's an art that I've taken about 10 years to learn because I am a rapid fire go like crazy.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I run a million miles an hour for the most part.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_00: I used to always need people around me to feel like I was okay.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I've learned so much about just being still with God.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes it doesn't mean it's like a big long conversation or sitting and reading 75 pages or journaling.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: It just sometimes means just being still in his presence where I shut down my mind and stop feeling like everything is an exercise of I have to accomplish something in this because that's my natural bent is accomplishing and striving and uh doing like check the box.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_00: So for me, it's more about less box checking and more just being.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's so good.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_02: That's a it's a contemplative practice that each individual Annie Graham type can engage in.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_02: And it talks about, yeah, so stillness, silence, solitude, engage, consent, and one other one that I can't remember off the top of my head, but combining those to our unique types takes us on that path to growth that we're looking for.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_02: And it's supernatural.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_02: Instead of doing more things, which some of us are prone to um inadvertently, because it's not about doing more or changing or fixing part of our personality, right?
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's becoming more who we are, meant to be in Christ by letting him do the work.
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I love it.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_00: I'm looking it up.
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_00: Sacred Enneagram.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just gonna do it.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, read it.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's your next day Enneagram book for sure.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yay! Anatomy repertoire.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_02: And may you have an amazing day celebrating your daughter's birth and your.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, hey, birthdays are for mom.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_02: We did a lot to get him here on this planet, so I'm telling you.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_02: We need to do a little parts first.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_02: Do you have a better understanding of an Aneagram too?
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_02: I certainly hope you've learned a little bit more in our conversation today.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_02: Now, you've taken the first step in the Aneagram journey and tuned into your perspective.
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_02: But if you're looking for more help, I have several ways to guide you.
• 55:21
  SPEAKER_02: The Wholehearted Aneagram Quick Start is a step-by-step plan to gain clearer understanding on your dominant type.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if you're looking for a colorful overview, my wholehearted Aneagram summary gives you the highlights of all nine types on one page.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's so helpful as you talk to others about this awesome resource.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_02: And last but not least, I've just opened up a few more coaching spots for the summer and fall.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_02: Whether you need more help discerning your dominant type or one to clarify your unique path of growth.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's easy to get on the wait list for a free 30-minute consult.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_02: All the info is in the show notes or at simply wholehearted.com.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_02: Also, be sure to follow Sarah Buckman on Instagram and get her newest book, Hope in Hard Places.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: She's filled this one with lots of relatable stories to help encourage you or a friend and practical application you can put into place right away.
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_02: Remember, we want you to invite others as we continue our summer in the Anneagram.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_02: Next week we are talking about Aneagram 3s and the message each type longs to hear.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_02: Make sure you're subscribed so you don't miss another two-episode week.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_02: You never know when I might share an extra conversation.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to check us out on Instagram and Facebook as we are posting giveaways, fun Anneagram tips, and so much more.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_02: Let's continue to invite others as we continue to pursue perspective, purpose, and plans for a simply cool-hearted life.