Latest / Adult Child of Dysfunction / Ep 311: The Truth About Trauma: Healing, Patterns, and Your Story | Scott Stolarick

Transcript

Ep 311: The Truth About Trauma: Healing, Patterns, and Your Story | Scott Stolarick · Adult Child of Dysfunction

• 0:47
  Good
• 0:48
  morning
• 0:48
  everybody
• 0:48
  and
• 0:48
  welcome
• 0:49
  back
• 0:49
  to
• 0:49
  another
• 0:49
  episode
• 0:50
  of
• 0:50
  Adult
• 0:50
  Child
• 0:51
  of
• 0:51
  Dysfunction.
• 0:52
  Today
• 0:52
  we
• 0:52
  have
• 0:52
  with
• 0:53
  us
• 0:53
  Scott
• 0:53
  Stalarik,
• 0:55
  LCPCCCTP.
• 0:57
  I
• 0:57
  love
• 0:57
  all
• 0:57
  those
• 0:58
  acronyms,
• 0:58
  but
• 0:58
  we'll
• 0:58
  let
• 0:59
  him
• 0:59
  explain
• 0:59
  all
• 0:59
  that.
• 1:00
  He
• 1:00
  is
• 1:00
  the
• 1:01
  sole
• 1:01
  owner
• 1:01
  and
• 1:01
  practitioner
• 1:02
  at
• 1:02
  Mosaic
• 1:03
  Pathway
• 1:03
  counseling
• 1:04
  in
• 1:04
  Gurney,
• 1:05
  Illinois.
• 1:06
  Scott
• 1:06
  has
• 1:07
  over
• 1:07
  30
• 1:07
  years
• 1:07
  of
• 1:08
  experience
• 1:08
  across
• 1:09
  numerous
• 1:09
  clinical
• 1:10
  populations
• 1:11
  including
• 1:11
  primary
• 1:11
  area
• 1:12
  of
• 1:12
  emphasis
• 1:13
  is
• 1:13
  his
• 1:13
  trauma
• 1:14
  work
• 1:14
  as
• 1:14
  Scott
• 1:14
  is
• 1:15
  level
• 1:15
  one
• 1:15
  and
• 1:16
  two,
• 1:16
  trained
• 1:17
  in
• 1:17
  EMDR
• 1:18
  and
• 1:18
  is
• 1:18
  a
• 1:18
  certified
• 1:19
  trauma
• 1:19
  informed
• 1:20
  practitioner.
• 1:21
  Welcome
• 1:21
  Scott.
• 1:22
  Thank
• 1:22
  you
• 1:22
  for
• 1:23
  having
• 1:23
  me.
• 1:24
  Yes,
• 1:24
  I
• 1:24
  love
• 1:24
  it.
• 1:25
  And
• 1:25
  I
• 1:25
  love
• 1:25
  the
• 1:25
  fact
• 1:26
  that.
• 1:26
  Well,
• 1:26
  first
• 1:26
  of
• 1:27
  all,
• 1:27
  I
• 1:27
  love
• 1:27
  the
• 1:27
  fact
• 1:27
  that
• 1:27
  you
• 1:28
  talk
• 1:28
  about
• 1:28
  emdr
• 1:29
  because
• 1:29
  we
• 1:29
  will
• 1:29
  touch
• 1:29
  on
• 1:30
  that
• 1:30
  today.
• 1:30
  Because
• 1:31
  I
• 1:31
  actually
• 1:31
  did
• 1:32
  an
• 1:32
  episode
• 1:32
  with
• 1:32
  someone
• 1:33
  yesterday
• 1:33
  and
• 1:33
  they
• 1:34
  made
• 1:34
  the
• 1:34
  comment
• 1:34
  at
• 1:34
  some
• 1:35
  point
• 1:35
  during
• 1:35
  the
• 1:35
  episode
• 1:36
  and
• 1:36
  said,
• 1:37
  oh
• 1:37
  yeah,
• 1:37
  those
• 1:37
  triggers,
• 1:38
  like
• 1:38
  they
• 1:38
  never
• 1:39
  go
• 1:39
  away,
• 1:40
  you
• 1:40
  have
• 1:41
  them
• 1:41
  forever.
• 1:41
  And
• 1:42
  I
• 1:42
  was
• 1:43
  thinking,
• 1:43
  oh,
• 1:43
  ow,
• 1:44
  ow,
• 1:44
  ow.
• 1:44
  I'll
• 1:45
  have
• 1:45
  to
• 1:45
  do
• 1:45
  a
• 1:45
  follow
• 1:45
  up
• 1:45
  to
• 1:46
  that
• 1:46
  one,
• 1:46
  you
• 1:46
  know
• 1:46
  what
• 1:46
  I
• 1:46
  mean?
• 1:47
  Because
• 1:47
  you
• 1:48
  can.
• 1:48
  And
• 1:48
  EMDR
• 1:49
  is
• 1:49
  what
• 1:49
  a
• 1:49
  lot
• 1:49
  of
• 1:49
  people
• 1:50
  use.
• 1:50
  I
• 1:50
  know
• 1:50
  with
• 1:51
  PTSD
• 1:52
  and
• 1:52
  some
• 1:52
  of
• 1:52
  the,
• 1:53
  some
• 1:54
  of
• 1:54
  the
• 1:54
  more
• 1:55
  invasive
• 1:56
  traumas
• 1:56
  that
• 1:57
  kind
• 1:57
  of
• 1:57
  won't
• 1:58
  go
• 1:58
  away
• 1:58
  per
• 1:58
  se.
• 2:00
  So
• 2:00
  tell
• 2:00
  us
• 2:00
  how
• 2:01
  you
• 2:01
  got
• 2:01
  into
• 2:01
  trauma
• 2:02
  work.
• 2:04
  It's,
• 2:04
  it's
• 2:04
  interesting.
• 2:06
  I
• 2:07
  started
• 2:08
  out
• 2:08
  my
• 2:09
  career
• 2:10
  in
• 2:11
  working
• 2:12
  in
• 2:12
  corrections
• 2:13
  in
• 2:13
  our
• 2:13
  local
• 2:14
  jail
• 2:15
  as
• 2:15
  a,
• 2:15
  an
• 2:16
  inmate
• 2:16
  counselor.
• 2:19
  And
• 2:19
  shortly
• 2:20
  after
• 2:20
  that
• 2:21
  I
• 2:21
  got
• 2:21
  my
• 2:22
  first
• 2:22
  full
• 2:23
  time
• 2:23
  job
• 2:23
  in
• 2:24
  the
• 2:24
  profession
• 2:26
  working
• 2:26
  with
• 2:27
  the
• 2:27
  court
• 2:27
  systems,
• 2:28
  evaluating
• 2:28
  and
• 2:29
  treating
• 2:29
  sex
• 2:29
  offenders.
• 2:32
  Did
• 2:32
  that
• 2:32
  for
• 2:33
  26
• 2:34
  years,
• 2:34
  probably
• 2:35
  a
• 2:35
  bit
• 2:35
  too
• 2:35
  long,
• 2:37
  and
• 2:39
  really
• 2:40
  started
• 2:40
  to
• 2:40
  learn
• 2:41
  about
• 2:41
  trauma
• 2:42
  from
• 2:43
  kind
• 2:43
  of
• 2:43
  a
• 2:43
  360
• 2:44
  degree
• 2:45
  perspective.
• 2:46
  Both
• 2:47
  those
• 2:47
  who
• 2:48
  create
• 2:48
  trauma
• 2:49
  and
• 2:49
  cause
• 2:50
  trauma
• 2:50
  as
• 2:50
  well
• 2:50
  as
• 2:51
  those
• 2:51
  who
• 2:51
  are
• 2:51
  recipients
• 2:52
  of
• 2:52
  it
• 2:53
  and
• 2:54
  the
• 2:54
  impact
• 2:55
  of
• 2:56
  trauma
• 2:57
  on
• 2:57
  various
• 2:58
  individuals
• 2:59
  and
• 2:59
  how
• 2:59
  it
• 2:59
  can,
• 3:00
  how
• 3:01
  it
• 3:01
  can
• 3:01
  manifest
• 3:02
  in
• 3:02
  different
• 3:02
  ways.
• 3:05
  So
• 3:05
  that
• 3:05
  was
• 3:06
  sort
• 3:06
  of
• 3:07
  my,
• 3:07
  my
• 3:07
  baptism
• 3:08
  into
• 3:10
  trauma
• 3:11
  work
• 3:11
  and
• 3:13
  complex
• 3:15
  presenting
• 3:15
  clinical
• 3:16
  issues,
• 3:17
  engaging
• 3:18
  difficult
• 3:19
  clientele
• 3:21
  and
• 3:22
  just
• 3:22
  learning
• 3:23
  to
• 3:24
  view
• 3:25
  the
• 3:25
  person
• 3:26
  for
• 3:26
  the
• 3:26
  whole
• 3:26
  picture,
• 3:27
  as
• 3:27
  hard
• 3:28
  as
• 3:28
  that
• 3:28
  may
• 3:28
  be
• 3:28
  sometimes.
• 3:30
  And
• 3:31
  that
• 3:32
  was
• 3:33
  after
• 3:33
  26
• 3:34
  years
• 3:34
  of
• 3:35
  the
• 3:35
  forensic
• 3:36
  or
• 3:37
  court
• 3:37
  involved
• 3:38
  work.
• 3:38
  I
• 3:39
  really
• 3:40
  wanted
• 3:41
  to
• 3:41
  have
• 3:42
  more
• 3:42
  exposure
• 3:43
  to
• 3:43
  people
• 3:43
  who
• 3:43
  actually
• 3:45
  wanted
• 3:45
  to
• 3:45
  come
• 3:46
  to
• 3:46
  therapy.
• 3:47
  They
• 3:47
  were
• 3:47
  not
• 3:48
  court
• 3:48
  ordered
• 3:49
  to
• 3:49
  be
• 3:49
  there
• 3:49
  and,
• 3:51
  and
• 3:51
  they
• 3:51
  were
• 3:51
  willing
• 3:52
  to
• 3:52
  talk
• 3:52
  about,
• 3:53
  you
• 3:53
  know,
• 3:54
  trauma
• 3:54
  and
• 3:57
  just
• 3:57
  personal
• 3:57
  experiences
• 3:58
  and
• 3:58
  were
• 3:59
  interested
• 3:59
  in
• 3:59
  resolution
• 4:00
  or
• 4:01
  reduction
• 4:02
  of
• 4:02
  trauma.
• 4:03
  Yeah,
• 4:04
  and
• 4:04
  that's
• 4:04
  very
• 4:04
  important
• 4:05
  because
• 4:05
  you
• 4:06
  can't
• 4:06
  help
• 4:06
  somebody
• 4:07
  that
• 4:07
  doesn't
• 4:07
  want
• 4:07
  to
• 4:07
  be
• 4:07
  helped.
• 4:08
  It's
• 4:08
  the
• 4:08
  same
• 4:09
  thing
• 4:09
  when
• 4:09
  I
• 4:09
  work
• 4:09
  with,
• 4:10
  you
• 4:10
  know,
• 4:10
  people
• 4:10
  that
• 4:10
  are
• 4:11
  in
• 4:11
  addiction
• 4:12
  and
• 4:13
  you
• 4:13
  just
• 4:14
  can't,
• 4:14
  you
• 4:14
  know,
• 4:14
  talking
• 4:15
  them
• 4:15
  into,
• 4:17
  you
• 4:17
  want
• 4:17
  a
• 4:17
  better
• 4:17
  life,
• 4:18
  you
• 4:18
  want
• 4:18
  you
• 4:18
  just
• 4:18
  don't,
• 4:19
  you
• 4:19
  have
• 4:19
  to,
• 4:19
  they
• 4:19
  have
• 4:20
  to
• 4:20
  be
• 4:20
  at
• 4:20
  a
• 4:20
  point
• 4:20
  where
• 4:21
  the
• 4:21
  pain
• 4:21
  of
• 4:21
  what
• 4:22
  they're
• 4:22
  going
• 4:22
  through
• 4:23
  is
• 4:24
  worse
• 4:24
  than
• 4:24
  the
• 4:24
  pain
• 4:25
  of
• 4:25
  what
• 4:25
  they
• 4:25
  think
• 4:25
  it's
• 4:26
  going
• 4:26
  to
• 4:26
  be
• 4:26
  to
• 4:26
  try
• 4:26
  to
• 4:26
  heal.
• 4:27
  And.
• 4:28
  Yeah,
• 4:28
  and
• 4:28
  that's
• 4:29
  the
• 4:29
  same
• 4:29
  thing
• 4:29
  with
• 4:29
  trauma.
• 4:30
  And
• 4:30
  I
• 4:30
  love
• 4:31
  that
• 4:31
  you
• 4:31
  kind
• 4:31
  of
• 4:31
  flip
• 4:32
  because
• 4:32
  at
• 4:32
  some
• 4:32
  point,
• 4:33
  I
• 4:33
  mean,
• 4:33
  a
• 4:33
  lot
• 4:33
  of
• 4:33
  people
• 4:33
  get
• 4:34
  into
• 4:34
  counseling
• 4:35
  and
• 4:35
  get
• 4:35
  into
• 4:35
  therapy
• 4:36
  and
• 4:36
  become
• 4:36
  therapists
• 4:37
  because
• 4:38
  they
• 4:38
  went
• 4:38
  through
• 4:38
  the
• 4:39
  trauma
• 4:39
  themselves.
• 4:40
  So
• 4:41
  it's
• 4:41
  very
• 4:41
  easy
• 4:41
  for
• 4:42
  them
• 4:42
  to
• 4:42
  say,
• 4:42
  oh,
• 4:43
  I
• 4:43
  get
• 4:43
  why
• 4:44
  they
• 4:44
  did
• 4:44
  the
• 4:44
  things
• 4:44
  they
• 4:45
  do.
• 4:46
  I
• 4:46
  mean,
• 4:46
  it's
• 4:46
  very,
• 4:46
  it's,
• 4:47
  I
• 4:47
  can
• 4:47
  do
• 4:47
  it,
• 4:48
  I
• 4:48
  can
• 4:48
  look
• 4:48
  and
• 4:48
  I
• 4:48
  can.
• 4:49
  As
• 4:49
  someone
• 4:49
  who
• 4:50
  had
• 4:50
  two
• 4:50
  alcoholic
• 4:51
  parents
• 4:51
  and
• 4:51
  turned
• 4:52
  to
• 4:52
  drinking
• 4:52
  myself
• 4:53
  to
• 4:53
  numb
• 4:53
  all
• 4:53
  the
• 4:53
  pain,
• 4:54
  I
• 4:54
  totally
• 4:55
  get
• 4:55
  it.
• 4:55
  Sure.
• 4:56
  You
• 4:56
  know,
• 4:57
  but
• 4:58
  I
• 4:58
  love
• 4:59
  that
• 4:59
  because
• 4:59
  you
• 4:59
  have
• 5:00
  to
• 5:00
  have
• 5:00
  a
• 5:00
  much
• 5:00
  more
• 5:01
  compassionate
• 5:03
  and
• 5:03
  more
• 5:03
  empathetic
• 5:04
  and
• 5:04
  you
• 5:04
  have
• 5:04
  to
• 5:04
  be
• 5:04
  able
• 5:04
  to
• 5:05
  put
• 5:05
  yourself
• 5:05
  in
• 5:05
  their
• 5:05
  shoes.
• 5:06
  And
• 5:06
  it
• 5:06
  seems
• 5:06
  like
• 5:07
  after
• 5:07
  working
• 5:07
  with
• 5:08
  all
• 5:08
  these
• 5:08
  people
• 5:08
  and
• 5:08
  you
• 5:08
  going,
• 5:09
  there
• 5:10
  can't
• 5:10
  be,
• 5:10
  I
• 5:10
  mean,
• 5:10
  like,
• 5:11
  what
• 5:11
  was
• 5:11
  your
• 5:11
  thinking
• 5:11
  behind
• 5:12
  this?
• 5:12
  Like
• 5:13
  that.
• 5:14
  What
• 5:14
  started
• 5:14
  the
• 5:15
  360?
• 5:17
  Well,
• 5:17
  it,
• 5:17
  it,
• 5:18
  you
• 5:18
  know,
• 5:19
  back
• 5:19
  in
• 5:19
  the
• 5:20
  late
• 5:20
  late
• 5:21
  80s,
• 5:21
  early
• 5:22
  90s,
• 5:22
  it
• 5:23
  was,
• 5:24
  you
• 5:24
  know,
• 5:25
  coming,
• 5:25
  coming
• 5:25
  out
• 5:26
  of
• 5:26
  graduate
• 5:26
  school,
• 5:27
  you
• 5:27
  heard
• 5:28
  a
• 5:28
  lot
• 5:28
  of,
• 5:31
  hey,
• 5:31
  you
• 5:31
  look
• 5:32
  like
• 5:32
  a
• 5:32
  good
• 5:32
  candidate,
• 5:33
  but
• 5:33
  we
• 5:33
  really
• 5:34
  need
• 5:34
  someone
• 5:34
  with
• 5:35
  experience.
• 5:36
  We
• 5:36
  really
• 5:36
  need
• 5:37
  someone
• 5:37
  with
• 5:37
  more
• 5:37
  experience
• 5:38
  in
• 5:38
  the
• 5:38
  profession
• 5:40
  and,
• 5:40
  and
• 5:40
  you
• 5:40
  know,
• 5:40
  like
• 5:41
  all
• 5:41
  new
• 5:41
  folks
• 5:42
  to
• 5:42
  the
• 5:42
  job
• 5:43
  market.
• 5:44
  I
• 5:44
  was
• 5:45
  asking
• 5:45
  myself,
• 5:45
  well,
• 5:46
  how
• 5:46
  can
• 5:46
  I
• 5:46
  get
• 5:47
  this
• 5:48
  experience
• 5:48
  if
• 5:49
  nobody
• 5:49
  will
• 5:50
  give
• 5:50
  me
• 5:50
  a
• 5:50
  chance?
• 5:51
  And
• 5:53
  so
• 5:53
  here
• 5:53
  in
• 5:54
  Lake
• 5:54
  County,
• 5:54
  Illinois
• 5:55
  in
• 5:55
  the
• 5:55
  early
• 5:56
  90s
• 5:57
  was
• 5:58
  just
• 5:58
  when
• 5:59
  practitioners
• 6:00
  started
• 6:01
  to
• 6:01
  say,
• 6:01
  hey,
• 6:03
  we're
• 6:03
  noticing
• 6:04
  that
• 6:05
  most
• 6:05
  of
• 6:05
  these
• 6:06
  individuals
• 6:07
  who
• 6:07
  get
• 6:07
  convicted
• 6:08
  of
• 6:08
  sex
• 6:08
  crimes
• 6:09
  don't
• 6:09
  really
• 6:10
  do
• 6:10
  time,
• 6:11
  you
• 6:11
  know,
• 6:11
  in
• 6:12
  an
• 6:12
  incarcerated
• 6:13
  setting.
• 6:13
  So
• 6:13
  what
• 6:14
  the
• 6:14
  heck
• 6:14
  do
• 6:14
  we
• 6:15
  do
• 6:15
  with
• 6:15
  them?
• 6:15
  What
• 6:16
  do
• 6:16
  we,
• 6:17
  what
• 6:17
  do
• 6:17
  we
• 6:17
  do?
• 6:17
  So
• 6:18
  a
• 6:18
  lot
• 6:18
  of
• 6:19
  training
• 6:20
  started
• 6:21
  here,
• 6:22
  but
• 6:22
  needless
• 6:23
  to
• 6:23
  say,
• 6:24
  not
• 6:24
  a
• 6:25
  lot
• 6:25
  of
• 6:25
  enthusiastic
• 6:27
  folks
• 6:28
  signing
• 6:28
  up
• 6:29
  to
• 6:29
  say,
• 6:29
  oh,
• 6:29
  please
• 6:30
  let
• 6:30
  me
• 6:30
  work
• 6:30
  with
• 6:31
  sex
• 6:31
  offenders,
• 6:31
  you
• 6:32
  know,
• 6:33
  so
• 6:33
  there
• 6:33
  weren't,
• 6:34
  there
• 6:34
  weren't
• 6:34
  a
• 6:34
  lot
• 6:35
  of
• 6:36
  willing
• 6:37
  candidates.
• 6:39
  I
• 6:39
  thought.
• 6:40
  The
• 6:41
  court
• 6:41
  ordered
• 6:41
  work
• 6:42
  was
• 6:42
  always
• 6:43
  working
• 6:43
  with
• 6:43
  systems
• 6:44
  I
• 6:44
  thought
• 6:44
  was
• 6:45
  very
• 6:45
  interesting.
• 6:45
  It
• 6:46
  was
• 6:46
  always
• 6:46
  a
• 6:46
  fascination
• 6:47
  of
• 6:47
  mine.
• 6:49
  So
• 6:49
  I
• 6:50
  interviewed
• 6:51
  and
• 6:51
  signed
• 6:52
  on
• 6:52
  the
• 6:52
  dotted
• 6:53
  line,
• 6:53
  so
• 6:53
  to
• 6:53
  speak.
• 6:54
  And
• 6:56
  that's
• 6:56
  how
• 6:56
  I,
• 6:57
  you
• 6:57
  know,
• 6:57
  got
• 6:57
  my,
• 6:58
  my
• 6:58
  feet
• 6:58
  wet
• 7:00
  pretty
• 7:00
  quickly.
• 7:02
  Learning
• 7:02
  about
• 7:04
  not
• 7:05
  only
• 7:05
  the
• 7:06
  system
• 7:06
  here
• 7:07
  as
• 7:07
  we
• 7:07
  have
• 7:07
  it
• 7:07
  structured,
• 7:08
  but
• 7:11
  how
• 7:11
  different
• 7:12
  cases
• 7:12
  are,
• 7:13
  are
• 7:14
  treated,
• 7:15
  different
• 7:15
  dynamics,
• 7:16
  different
• 7:16
  politics,
• 7:19
  and
• 7:20
  really
• 7:20
  having
• 7:21
  to
• 7:21
  work
• 7:21
  hard
• 7:22
  to
• 7:23
  engage
• 7:25
  people
• 7:25
  in
• 7:25
  the
• 7:25
  process,
• 7:26
  because
• 7:27
  these
• 7:27
  are
• 7:28
  individuals
• 7:28
  who
• 7:29
  did
• 7:29
  not
• 7:29
  want
• 7:30
  to
• 7:31
  be
• 7:31
  a
• 7:31
  part
• 7:32
  of
• 7:32
  this,
• 7:32
  most
• 7:32
  of
• 7:33
  them
• 7:33
  were
• 7:33
  in
• 7:33
  full
• 7:34
  denial
• 7:34
  of
• 7:35
  what
• 7:35
  they
• 7:35
  did.
• 7:37
  Treating
• 7:38
  denial
• 7:39
  was
• 7:39
  very
• 7:39
  controversial.
• 7:40
  Then,
• 7:42
  you
• 7:43
  know,
• 7:43
  I
• 7:43
  think
• 7:43
  there
• 7:43
  was
• 7:44
  a
• 7:44
  wave
• 7:45
  of
• 7:46
  thinking
• 7:46
  that
• 7:47
  said,
• 7:47
  well,
• 7:47
  if
• 7:47
  someone's
• 7:48
  in
• 7:48
  denial,
• 7:49
  they
• 7:49
  cannot
• 7:49
  be
• 7:50
  treated,
• 7:50
  will
• 7:50
  not
• 7:51
  be
• 7:51
  treated.
• 7:54
  And
• 7:54
  then
• 7:54
  denial
• 7:55
  was
• 7:55
  sort
• 7:56
  of
• 7:56
  viewed
• 7:57
  sort
• 7:57
  of
• 7:57
  as
• 7:57
  a
• 7:57
  pre
• 7:58
  treatment
• 7:58
  phase
• 7:59
  for
• 7:59
  people.
• 8:00
  So
• 8:01
  a
• 8:01
  lot
• 8:01
  of
• 8:01
  evolution
• 8:02
  in
• 8:02
  that
• 8:03
  work.
• 8:03
  And
• 8:04
  as
• 8:05
  I
• 8:05
  went
• 8:05
  through
• 8:05
  it,
• 8:07
  I
• 8:08
  just,
• 8:08
  you
• 8:08
  know,
• 8:09
  would
• 8:09
  hear
• 8:09
  people's
• 8:10
  stories
• 8:10
  and
• 8:10
  learn
• 8:11
  a
• 8:11
  tremendous
• 8:11
  amount
• 8:12
  about
• 8:12
  their
• 8:12
  journey
• 8:13
  to
• 8:14
  whatever
• 8:14
  destination
• 8:15
  it
• 8:15
  was
• 8:16
  they,
• 8:16
  they
• 8:17
  were
• 8:17
  at.
• 8:18
  So
• 8:20
  really
• 8:20
  triggered
• 8:21
  my
• 8:21
  interest
• 8:22
  in
• 8:22
  trauma
• 8:22
  work
• 8:23
  early.
• 8:24
  And
• 8:24
  as
• 8:25
  I
• 8:25
  spent
• 8:25
  more
• 8:25
  and
• 8:26
  more
• 8:26
  years
• 8:26
  doing
• 8:27
  that
• 8:27
  work,
• 8:29
  I
• 8:29
  realized
• 8:30
  that
• 8:31
  I
• 8:32
  professionally
• 8:32
  and
• 8:33
  personally
• 8:33
  would
• 8:33
  probably
• 8:34
  feel
• 8:35
  more
• 8:35
  gratified
• 8:37
  working
• 8:38
  more,
• 8:38
  I
• 8:39
  guess,
• 8:39
  so
• 8:40
  to
• 8:40
  speak
• 8:40
  with
• 8:40
  the
• 8:40
  other
• 8:41
  side
• 8:41
  of
• 8:42
  this.
• 8:44
  I
• 8:44
  think
• 8:44
  I
• 8:44
  waited
• 8:45
  too
• 8:45
  long.
• 8:46
  But
• 8:47
  sometimes
• 8:48
  you
• 8:48
  just
• 8:48
  get
• 8:49
  stuck,
• 8:49
  you
• 8:49
  know,
• 8:50
  in
• 8:50
  a
• 8:50
  rut
• 8:50
  and
• 8:51
  feel
• 8:51
  like,
• 8:51
  well,
• 8:51
  this
• 8:52
  is
• 8:52
  my,
• 8:53
  you
• 8:53
  know,
• 8:53
  this
• 8:54
  is
• 8:54
  my
• 8:54
  specialty,
• 8:55
  my
• 8:55
  area
• 8:56
  of
• 8:56
  expertise.
• 8:57
  I
• 8:57
  probably
• 8:57
  need
• 8:57
  to
• 8:58
  stay
• 8:58
  here.
• 8:59
  There
• 9:00
  aren't
• 9:00
  enough
• 9:00
  people
• 9:01
  doing
• 9:01
  this
• 9:01
  work.
• 9:02
  You
• 9:02
  know,
• 9:02
  all
• 9:02
  the
• 9:02
  things
• 9:03
  you,
• 9:04
  you
• 9:04
  kind
• 9:04
  of
• 9:04
  tell
• 9:04
  yourself
• 9:05
  to
• 9:05
  not
• 9:05
  move
• 9:06
  on.
• 9:08
  And
• 9:08
  of
• 9:09
  course
• 9:09
  my
• 9:09
  own
• 9:09
  fears,
• 9:10
  you
• 9:10
  know,
• 9:11
  my
• 9:11
  lack
• 9:11
  of
• 9:11
  confidence
• 9:13
  to,
• 9:13
  to,
• 9:13
  to,
• 9:14
  to
• 9:14
  branch
• 9:14
  out
• 9:15
  and,
• 9:15
  and
• 9:15
  do
• 9:16
  other
• 9:16
  things.
• 9:16
  But
• 9:17
  ultimately,
• 9:18
  I'm
• 9:18
  very
• 9:19
  glad
• 9:19
  that
• 9:19
  I
• 9:19
  did
• 9:19
  it.
• 9:21
  Yeah.
• 9:21
  And
• 9:22
  not
• 9:22
  only
• 9:23
  that,
• 9:23
  but,
• 9:23
  I
• 9:23
  mean,
• 9:23
  I
• 9:23
  want
• 9:24
  to
• 9:24
  give
• 9:24
  you
• 9:24
  kudos,
• 9:24
  first
• 9:25
  of
• 9:25
  all,
• 9:25
  for
• 9:25
  doing
• 9:25
  something
• 9:26
  that
• 9:26
  was
• 9:26
  probably
• 9:27
  very
• 9:28
  frustrating.
• 9:28
  I
• 9:28
  can
• 9:29
  only
• 9:29
  imagine
• 9:30
  working
• 9:30
  with
• 9:31
  people
• 9:31
  that
• 9:31
  didn't
• 9:32
  want
• 9:32
  to
• 9:32
  be
• 9:32
  helped.
• 9:32
  But
• 9:33
  I
• 9:33
  want
• 9:34
  to
• 9:34
  stick
• 9:34
  something
• 9:34
  in
• 9:35
  there
• 9:35
  too,
• 9:35
  for
• 9:35
  you.
• 9:36
  And
• 9:37
  you
• 9:37
  have
• 9:37
  no
• 9:38
  idea
• 9:38
  how
• 9:38
  many
• 9:38
  people
• 9:38
  you
• 9:39
  probably
• 9:39
  helped
• 9:39
  that
• 9:39
  you
• 9:40
  don't
• 9:40
  know.
• 9:41
  I
• 9:41
  mean,
• 9:41
  those
• 9:42
  people,
• 9:42
  a
• 9:43
  lot
• 9:43
  of
• 9:43
  those
• 9:43
  people
• 9:43
  I
• 9:44
  know,
• 9:44
  I
• 9:44
  mean,
• 9:44
  I
• 9:44
  know
• 9:45
  that
• 9:45
  fact
• 9:45
  of
• 9:45
  denial,
• 9:46
  and
• 9:46
  I
• 9:46
  know
• 9:46
  it's.
• 9:46
  Again,
• 9:47
  I
• 9:47
  keep
• 9:47
  going
• 9:47
  back
• 9:48
  to
• 9:48
  addiction
• 9:48
  because
• 9:48
  that
• 9:49
  was
• 9:49
  kind
• 9:49
  of
• 9:49
  my
• 9:49
  specialty.
• 9:50
  But
• 9:53
  you
• 9:53
  probably
• 9:53
  said
• 9:54
  a
• 9:54
  thousand
• 9:54
  things
• 9:55
  to
• 9:55
  those
• 9:55
  people
• 9:55
  and
• 9:56
  then
• 9:56
  they
• 9:56
  didn't
• 9:56
  come
• 9:56
  out
• 9:57
  and
• 9:57
  tell
• 9:57
  you
• 9:57
  that.
• 9:57
  But
• 9:58
  they
• 9:58
  had
• 9:59
  to
• 9:59
  have
• 9:59
  gone
• 9:59
  home
• 9:59
  and
• 10:00
  self
• 10:00
  reflected
• 10:01
  or
• 10:01
  gone
• 10:01
  back
• 10:01
  to
• 10:01
  jail
• 10:02
  and
• 10:02
  self
• 10:02
  reflected,
• 10:03
  because
• 10:03
  sometimes,
• 10:04
  you
• 10:04
  know,
• 10:04
  I
• 10:05
  mean,
• 10:05
  you
• 10:05
  hear
• 10:05
  it
• 10:05
  and
• 10:05
  you
• 10:06
  don't
• 10:06
  want
• 10:06
  to
• 10:06
  hear
• 10:06
  it,
• 10:06
  but
• 10:06
  if
• 10:07
  you
• 10:07
  hear
• 10:07
  it
• 10:07
  enough,
• 10:08
  it
• 10:08
  starts
• 10:09
  to
• 10:09
  sink
• 10:09
  in
• 10:09
  with
• 10:09
  people.
• 10:10
  So,
• 10:10
  I
• 10:10
  mean,
• 10:11
  in
• 10:11
  my
• 10:11
  mind,
• 10:12
  I'm
• 10:12
  thinking
• 10:12
  of
• 10:12
  all
• 10:12
  those
• 10:13
  people
• 10:13
  that
• 10:13
  didn't
• 10:13
  want
• 10:13
  to
• 10:13
  be
• 10:14
  helped,
• 10:14
  but
• 10:14
  how
• 10:14
  many
• 10:14
  people
• 10:15
  that
• 10:15
  I've
• 10:16
  had
• 10:16
  come
• 10:16
  to
• 10:16
  me
• 10:16
  and
• 10:17
  been
• 10:17
  like,
• 10:17
  hey,
• 10:17
  I
• 10:17
  heard
• 10:18
  something
• 10:18
  on
• 10:18
  your
• 10:18
  podcast.
• 10:19
  I've
• 10:19
  probably
• 10:20
  heard
• 10:20
  this
• 10:20
  50
• 10:20
  times
• 10:21
  and
• 10:21
  for
• 10:21
  some
• 10:21
  reason
• 10:22
  it
• 10:22
  stuck
• 10:22
  today.
• 10:23
  Yeah.
• 10:24
  So
• 10:25
  I
• 10:25
  appreciate
• 10:26
  that
• 10:26
  and
• 10:26
  I
• 10:26
  certainly
• 10:27
  hope
• 10:27
  that
• 10:27
  was
• 10:28
  the
• 10:28
  case.
• 10:29
  You
• 10:29
  know,
• 10:29
  you,
• 10:29
  you
• 10:29
  do
• 10:30
  have.
• 10:31
  I
• 10:31
  don't
• 10:31
  want
• 10:31
  to
• 10:31
  say
• 10:32
  it
• 10:32
  was
• 10:32
  all
• 10:32
  negative.
• 10:33
  You
• 10:33
  certainly
• 10:33
  do
• 10:33
  have
• 10:34
  success
• 10:34
  stories.
• 10:35
  But,
• 10:37
  you
• 10:37
  know,
• 10:37
  it's.
• 10:39
  There's
• 10:39
  no,
• 10:40
  there's
• 10:40
  no
• 10:41
  accurate
• 10:41
  way
• 10:42
  of
• 10:43
  gauging
• 10:44
  recidivism
• 10:45
  unless
• 10:45
  there's
• 10:46
  re.
• 10:46
  Offense.
• 10:47
  Right.
• 10:48
  So
• 10:48
  it's
• 10:49
  hard
• 10:49
  to
• 10:49
  really,
• 10:50
  you
• 10:50
  know,
• 10:51
  track
• 10:51
  people
• 10:51
  in
• 10:52
  a
• 10:52
  longitudinal
• 10:53
  way
• 10:53
  unless
• 10:54
  they
• 10:54
  completely,
• 10:56
  you
• 10:56
  know,
• 10:57
  volunteer
• 10:57
  for
• 10:58
  it,
• 10:58
  which
• 10:58
  you
• 10:58
  don't
• 10:59
  see
• 11:00
  very
• 11:00
  frequently.
• 11:01
  So
• 11:01
  you,
• 11:02
  you
• 11:02
  just
• 11:02
  hope
• 11:02
  it
• 11:02
  sticks.
• 11:03
  You
• 11:03
  really
• 11:03
  do.
• 11:04
  Right.
• 11:04
  And
• 11:05
  you're
• 11:05
  still
• 11:05
  doing
• 11:06
  the
• 11:06
  work
• 11:06
  now,
• 11:07
  but
• 11:07
  now
• 11:07
  it's
• 11:07
  pretty
• 11:08
  much,
• 11:08
  I
• 11:08
  mean,
• 11:08
  that's
• 11:09
  one
• 11:09
  of
• 11:09
  the
• 11:09
  first
• 11:09
  things
• 11:09
  they're
• 11:10
  going
• 11:10
  to
• 11:10
  do
• 11:10
  is
• 11:10
  if,
• 11:11
  you
• 11:11
  know,
• 11:11
  you're
• 11:11
  some
• 11:12
  kind
• 11:12
  of
• 11:12
  sex
• 11:12
  offense,
• 11:13
  you're
• 11:13
  set
• 11:13
  up
• 11:13
  for
• 11:14
  a
• 11:14
  program,
• 11:14
  you're
• 11:14
  set
• 11:15
  up
• 11:15
  for
• 11:15
  treatment,
• 11:15
  you're
• 11:15
  set
• 11:16
  up.
• 11:16
  And
• 11:16
  I
• 11:16
  guess
• 11:17
  that's
• 11:17
  the
• 11:17
  way.
• 11:17
  Same
• 11:17
  way
• 11:18
  it
• 11:18
  was
• 11:18
  now.
• 11:18
  But
• 11:20
  I
• 11:20
  feel
• 11:20
  like
• 11:21
  now
• 11:21
  it's.
• 11:22
  They
• 11:22
  especially
• 11:23
  having
• 11:23
  someone
• 11:23
  like
• 11:23
  you,
• 11:23
  they
• 11:24
  send
• 11:24
  you
• 11:24
  to
• 11:24
  a
• 11:24
  place,
• 11:25
  or
• 11:25
  I
• 11:25
  hope
• 11:26
  they
• 11:26
  do,
• 11:27
  where
• 11:27
  people
• 11:27
  are
• 11:27
  coming
• 11:28
  at
• 11:28
  it
• 11:28
  and
• 11:30
  saying,
• 11:31
  let's
• 11:32
  start.
• 11:32
  I
• 11:32
  mean,
• 11:32
  I
• 11:32
  see
• 11:32
  it
• 11:33
  on
• 11:33
  Law
• 11:33
  and
• 11:34
  Order.
• 11:34
  I
• 11:34
  see,
• 11:34
  you
• 11:34
  know,
• 11:34
  where
• 11:34
  people
• 11:35
  literally,
• 11:35
  it's
• 11:35
  like
• 11:35
  the
• 11:36
  reverse
• 11:36
  psychology,
• 11:37
  you
• 11:37
  know,
• 11:37
  people
• 11:37
  are
• 11:38
  coming
• 11:38
  at
• 11:38
  it
• 11:38
  saying,
• 11:39
  it's,
• 11:39
  you're
• 11:39
  not
• 11:39
  your
• 11:40
  fault
• 11:40
  what
• 11:41
  you
• 11:41
  did.
• 11:42
  It's
• 11:42
  because
• 11:42
  we
• 11:43
  know
• 11:43
  what
• 11:43
  your
• 11:43
  dad
• 11:44
  did
• 11:44
  to
• 11:44
  you.
• 11:45
  And
• 11:45
  let's
• 11:45
  start
• 11:46
  there.
• 11:46
  And
• 11:47
  that's
• 11:47
  the
• 11:47
  trauma.
• 11:48
  That's
• 11:48
  the,
• 11:48
  the,
• 11:49
  you
• 11:49
  know,
• 11:49
  figuring
• 11:50
  out
• 11:50
  like,
• 11:51
  why,
• 11:51
  why
• 11:52
  did
• 11:52
  they
• 11:52
  do
• 11:52
  this?
• 11:53
  And
• 11:54
  do
• 11:54
  they
• 11:54
  go.
• 11:54
  I
• 11:54
  mean,
• 11:55
  I'm
• 11:55
  assuming
• 11:55
  it
• 11:56
  goes
• 11:56
  deeper
• 11:56
  into
• 11:56
  that
• 11:57
  now.
• 11:57
  Now
• 11:57
  that
• 11:57
  we
• 11:58
  know
• 11:58
  that
• 11:58
  your
• 11:59
  childhood
• 11:59
  has
• 12:00
  so
• 12:00
  much
• 12:01
  to
• 12:01
  do
• 12:01
  with
• 12:01
  what
• 12:01
  happens
• 12:02
  when
• 12:02
  you
• 12:02
  become
• 12:02
  an
• 12:02
  adult.
• 12:04
  It.
• 12:05
  It
• 12:05
  does.
• 12:05
  You
• 12:05
  know,
• 12:06
  you
• 12:07
  and
• 12:07
  I,
• 12:07
  and
• 12:07
  I,
• 12:09
  I
• 12:09
  certainly
• 12:10
  don't
• 12:10
  want
• 12:10
  to
• 12:11
  come
• 12:12
  close
• 12:12
  to
• 12:12
  sounding
• 12:13
  like
• 12:13
  at
• 12:14
  all
• 12:14
  like
• 12:14
  a
• 12:14
  sex
• 12:15
  offender
• 12:15
  apologist.
• 12:16
  There's
• 12:16
  no
• 12:17
  way
• 12:17
  I
• 12:17
  would
• 12:17
  ever
• 12:17
  do
• 12:18
  that.
• 12:19
  What
• 12:19
  I
• 12:19
  do
• 12:19
  want
• 12:20
  to
• 12:20
  say
• 12:20
  is
• 12:21
  you
• 12:21
  start
• 12:21
  to
• 12:22
  understand
• 12:24
  the
• 12:24
  full
• 12:24
  picture.
• 12:26
  Now
• 12:27
  granted,
• 12:27
  there
• 12:27
  are
• 12:27
  some
• 12:28
  outlier
• 12:28
  cases
• 12:29
  where
• 12:29
  you
• 12:29
  really
• 12:29
  sit
• 12:30
  and
• 12:30
  scratch
• 12:30
  your
• 12:31
  head
• 12:31
  and
• 12:31
  say,
• 12:31
  I
• 12:31
  have
• 12:31
  no
• 12:32
  idea
• 12:32
  what
• 12:32
  really
• 12:32
  led
• 12:33
  this
• 12:33
  person
• 12:34
  down
• 12:34
  this
• 12:34
  path.
• 12:35
  This
• 12:35
  is
• 12:35
  a
• 12:35
  very
• 12:37
  odd
• 12:37
  situation.
• 12:40
  But
• 12:40
  most
• 12:41
  of
• 12:41
  the
• 12:41
  time
• 12:41
  when
• 12:42
  you
• 12:42
  peel
• 12:42
  the
• 12:42
  onion
• 12:43
  and
• 12:43
  you
• 12:44
  start
• 12:44
  to
• 12:44
  get
• 12:44
  someone
• 12:44
  engaged
• 12:45
  in
• 12:45
  the
• 12:46
  process,
• 12:47
  you,
• 12:47
  you
• 12:48
  learn
• 12:48
  about
• 12:48
  their,
• 12:49
  their
• 12:49
  history.
• 12:49
  And
• 12:50
  oftentimes
• 12:50
  it's
• 12:51
  tumultuous
• 12:51
  and
• 12:53
  there's
• 12:53
  abuse
• 12:54
  of
• 12:54
  different
• 12:54
  kinds
• 12:55
  back
• 12:56
  in
• 12:56
  that
• 12:56
  history.
• 12:58
  And
• 12:58
  eventually
• 12:59
  to
• 12:59
  me,
• 13:00
  what
• 13:00
  I
• 13:00
  started
• 13:00
  to
• 13:00
  notice
• 13:02
  is
• 13:04
  our
• 13:04
  area
• 13:05
  really
• 13:05
  embraced
• 13:06
  the
• 13:06
  work
• 13:07
  and
• 13:07
  started
• 13:07
  to
• 13:07
  throw
• 13:08
  a
• 13:08
  lot
• 13:08
  of
• 13:08
  resources
• 13:09
  at
• 13:09
  it,
• 13:09
  which
• 13:09
  was
• 13:10
  good.
• 13:11
  But
• 13:11
  what
• 13:11
  I
• 13:11
  was
• 13:12
  noticing
• 13:12
  is
• 13:12
  the
• 13:13
  people
• 13:13
  who
• 13:13
  were
• 13:13
  victimized
• 13:14
  were
• 13:14
  not
• 13:15
  getting
• 13:16
  treatment.
• 13:17
  You
• 13:17
  know,
• 13:19
  the
• 13:19
  part
• 13:19
  of
• 13:20
  the
• 13:20
  restitution
• 13:21
  for
• 13:21
  the
• 13:21
  offenders
• 13:22
  was
• 13:23
  to
• 13:23
  pay
• 13:23
  for
• 13:24
  any
• 13:24
  therapy
• 13:24
  that
• 13:25
  the
• 13:26
  victims
• 13:26
  pursued.
• 13:27
  But
• 13:27
  oftentimes
• 13:28
  they
• 13:29
  weren't
• 13:29
  made
• 13:29
  accountable
• 13:30
  to
• 13:30
  do
• 13:30
  that
• 13:30
  because
• 13:31
  there
• 13:31
  was
• 13:31
  either
• 13:32
  no
• 13:32
  treatment
• 13:33
  or
• 13:33
  the,
• 13:34
  the,
• 13:35
  the
• 13:36
  person
• 13:36
  did
• 13:36
  not
• 13:36
  inform
• 13:37
  the
• 13:37
  court
• 13:37
  that
• 13:38
  they
• 13:38
  were
• 13:38
  going
• 13:38
  and
• 13:39
  seeking
• 13:40
  reimbursement.
• 13:41
  So
• 13:41
  it
• 13:41
  was
• 13:42
  just
• 13:42
  a
• 13:42
  whole.
• 13:44
  In
• 13:44
  that
• 13:44
  system
• 13:45
  that
• 13:45
  still
• 13:46
  still
• 13:46
  exists
• 13:47
  today.
• 13:48
  Right.
• 13:49
  And
• 13:49
  I
• 13:49
  get,
• 13:49
  I
• 13:50
  guess
• 13:50
  then
• 13:50
  I'm
• 13:50
  looking
• 13:50
  at
• 13:51
  it
• 13:51
  kind
• 13:51
  of
• 13:51
  like,
• 13:51
  obviously
• 13:52
  if
• 13:52
  there's
• 13:52
  a
• 13:53
  sex
• 13:53
  offender,
• 13:53
  then
• 13:53
  there's
• 13:54
  a
• 13:54
  victim.
• 13:55
  And
• 13:56
  I
• 13:56
  guess
• 13:56
  in
• 13:56
  the
• 13:57
  trauma
• 13:57
  informed
• 13:58
  lens,
• 13:59
  the
• 14:00
  sex
• 14:00
  offender
• 14:00
  could
• 14:01
  have
• 14:01
  started
• 14:02
  as
• 14:02
  a
• 14:02
  victim,
• 14:02
  which
• 14:03
  turned
• 14:03
  into
• 14:03
  is.
• 14:04
  I
• 14:04
  guess
• 14:04
  that's
• 14:04
  what
• 14:04
  I'm
• 14:05
  looking
• 14:05
  at.
• 14:05
  And
• 14:05
  I'm
• 14:06
  not
• 14:06
  condoning,
• 14:06
  believe
• 14:07
  me,
• 14:07
  I'm
• 14:07
  not
• 14:07
  condoning
• 14:08
  any
• 14:08
  of
• 14:08
  that
• 14:09
  or
• 14:09
  saying,
• 14:09
  you
• 14:10
  know,
• 14:10
  there's
• 14:10
  a,
• 14:10
  oh,
• 14:11
  this
• 14:11
  is
• 14:11
  a
• 14:11
  free
• 14:11
  pass
• 14:12
  because
• 14:12
  it
• 14:12
  just
• 14:13
  was.
• 14:13
  But
• 14:14
  it
• 14:14
  seems
• 14:14
  like,
• 14:17
  I
• 14:17
  mean,
• 14:18
  I
• 14:18
  don't
• 14:18
  know,
• 14:18
  I
• 14:18
  don't
• 14:18
  know.
• 14:18
  I
• 14:19
  didn't
• 14:19
  work
• 14:19
  with
• 14:19
  a
• 14:19
  bunch
• 14:19
  of
• 14:19
  sex
• 14:19
  offenders.
• 14:20
  So
• 14:20
  I
• 14:20
  didn't
• 14:21
  say
• 14:22
  what
• 14:22
  made
• 14:22
  you
• 14:22
  do
• 14:22
  this?
• 14:23
  Like,
• 14:23
  what
• 14:23
  the
• 14:24
  heck
• 14:24
  were
• 14:24
  you
• 14:24
  thinking?
• 14:25
  You
• 14:25
  know,
• 14:25
  I
• 14:25
  didn't
• 14:25
  get
• 14:26
  to
• 14:26
  say
• 14:26
  those
• 14:26
  things,
• 14:26
  so
• 14:27
  I
• 14:27
  don't
• 14:27
  know
• 14:27
  those
• 14:27
  answers.
• 14:28
  But
• 14:29
  again,
• 14:29
  I
• 14:29
  look
• 14:30
  at
• 14:30
  patterns
• 14:31
  in
• 14:31
  general.
• 14:31
  I
• 14:32
  mean,
• 14:32
  we
• 14:32
  are
• 14:33
  creatures
• 14:33
  of
• 14:33
  habit.
• 14:34
  We
• 14:34
  are
• 14:34
  creatures
• 14:34
  of
• 14:35
  patterns.
• 14:37
  Absolutely.
• 14:37
  And
• 14:38
  you're
• 14:38
  so
• 14:38
  right
• 14:38
  with
• 14:39
  that,
• 14:39
  that,
• 14:40
  you
• 14:40
  know,
• 14:41
  if
• 14:41
  we,
• 14:41
  if
• 14:42
  we
• 14:42
  think
• 14:42
  that
• 14:44
  our
• 14:44
  historical
• 14:45
  path
• 14:46
  doesn't
• 14:46
  inform
• 14:47
  our
• 14:47
  present,
• 14:48
  you
• 14:48
  know,
• 14:48
  we're
• 14:49
  missing
• 14:49
  something.
• 14:50
  And
• 14:52
  you
• 14:52
  know,
• 14:52
  when
• 14:52
  you
• 14:53
  can
• 14:53
  disarm
• 14:54
  somebody
• 14:55
  and
• 14:55
  really
• 14:56
  get
• 14:56
  to,
• 14:58
  you
• 14:58
  know,
• 14:59
  where
• 14:59
  they,
• 15:00
  where
• 15:00
  they
• 15:00
  went
• 15:00
  off
• 15:01
  the
• 15:01
  track
• 15:02
  and
• 15:02
  often
• 15:02
  very
• 15:03
  early,
• 15:06
  you
• 15:06
  know,
• 15:06
  it's,
• 15:06
  it's,
• 15:07
  it's
• 15:08
  an
• 15:08
  opportunity
• 15:09
  for
• 15:09
  some
• 15:09
  very
• 15:09
  rich
• 15:10
  work.
• 15:11
  Yeah.
• 15:12
  You
• 15:12
  know,
• 15:13
  somebody
• 15:13
  who
• 15:13
  was,
• 15:14
  perhaps
• 15:14
  knew
• 15:15
  that
• 15:15
  they
• 15:15
  were,
• 15:16
  that
• 15:16
  they
• 15:17
  were
• 15:17
  gay
• 15:17
  at
• 15:17
  a
• 15:18
  very
• 15:18
  early
• 15:18
  age,
• 15:20
  but
• 15:21
  because
• 15:22
  of
• 15:23
  certain
• 15:23
  messages
• 15:23
  they
• 15:24
  were
• 15:24
  given,
• 15:24
  felt
• 15:25
  like
• 15:25
  they
• 15:25
  couldn't
• 15:27
  pursue
• 15:28
  that
• 15:28
  with
• 15:28
  another
• 15:28
  person
• 15:29
  of
• 15:29
  age,
• 15:31
  therefore
• 15:31
  had
• 15:32
  to
• 15:32
  sort
• 15:33
  of
• 15:33
  seek
• 15:34
  out
• 15:34
  younger
• 15:35
  people
• 15:35
  and
• 15:36
  in
• 15:36
  the,
• 15:36
  in
• 15:37
  the
• 15:37
  idea
• 15:37
  that
• 15:37
  it
• 15:37
  would
• 15:38
  be
• 15:38
  more
• 15:38
  easy
• 15:39
  to
• 15:39
  conceal,
• 15:40
  you
• 15:40
  know,
• 15:41
  so
• 15:41
  there,
• 15:42
  those
• 15:42
  were
• 15:42
  some
• 15:42
  distorted
• 15:43
  kind
• 15:44
  of,
• 15:45
  you
• 15:45
  know,
• 15:45
  webs
• 15:46
  that
• 15:46
  you
• 15:46
  would
• 15:46
  encounter.
• 15:49
  And
• 15:49
  even
• 15:49
  after
• 15:50
  learning
• 15:50
  all
• 15:50
  that,
• 15:51
  they
• 15:51
  would
• 15:51
  be
• 15:52
  committed
• 15:52
  to
• 15:54
  not
• 15:55
  living
• 15:56
  an
• 15:57
  open
• 15:57
  lifestyle.
• 15:58
  So
• 15:58
  an
• 15:58
  open,
• 16:01
  becoming,
• 16:01
  becoming
• 16:02
  out
• 16:03
  with,
• 16:03
  with
• 16:03
  who
• 16:04
  they
• 16:04
  were.
• 16:04
  So
• 16:05
  very
• 16:05
  complex
• 16:06
  stuff.
• 16:06
  But,
• 16:07
  you
• 16:07
  know,
• 16:08
  trauma,
• 16:09
  Trauma
• 16:10
  rich.
• 16:10
  That's
• 16:11
  for
• 16:11
  sure.
• 16:11
  Yeah,
• 16:12
  absolutely.
• 16:13
  So
• 16:13
  I
• 16:13
  want
• 16:14
  to
• 16:14
  ask
• 16:14
  you
• 16:14
  about
• 16:14
  your
• 16:14
  Huffington
• 16:15
  Post,
• 16:16
  the
• 16:17
  article
• 16:17
  that
• 16:18
  you
• 16:18
  wrote
• 16:18
  about
• 16:18
  the
• 16:18
  complexity
• 16:19
  of
• 16:19
  trauma.
• 16:19
  But
• 16:20
  before
• 16:20
  I
• 16:20
  do
• 16:20
  that,
• 16:22
  I
• 16:22
  want
• 16:22
  you
• 16:22
  to
• 16:22
  give
• 16:23
  me
• 16:23
  your
• 16:23
  simplest
• 16:23
  explanation
• 16:25
  of
• 16:25
  what
• 16:25
  do
• 16:25
  you
• 16:26
  think
• 16:26
  trauma
• 16:26
  is?
• 16:26
  Like,
• 16:27
  what
• 16:27
  do
• 16:27
  you
• 16:27
  think
• 16:27
  trauma
• 16:27
  means
• 16:29
  in,
• 16:29
  in
• 16:29
  the
• 16:29
  mind,
• 16:30
  like
• 16:30
  to
• 16:30
  People.
• 16:31
  When
• 16:31
  people
• 16:31
  say,
• 16:31
  oh,
• 16:32
  I
• 16:32
  suffered
• 16:32
  trauma,
• 16:33
  what
• 16:33
  does
• 16:33
  that
• 16:33
  mean
• 16:34
  to
• 16:34
  you?
• 16:35
  Well,
• 16:37
  could
• 16:37
  mean
• 16:38
  first
• 16:38
  and
• 16:39
  foremost,
• 16:39
  absolutely
• 16:40
  anything.
• 16:42
  One's
• 16:43
  interpretation
• 16:43
  of
• 16:44
  an
• 16:44
  experience
• 16:45
  is
• 16:45
  just
• 16:45
  that
• 16:46
  one's
• 16:47
  interpretation.
• 16:48
  So
• 16:48
  I
• 16:48
  want
• 16:48
  to
• 16:48
  honor
• 16:49
  that
• 16:50
  and
• 16:50
  want
• 16:50
  to
• 16:51
  first
• 16:52
  come
• 16:52
  to
• 16:53
  a
• 16:53
  place
• 16:53
  where
• 16:53
  I
• 16:54
  work
• 16:54
  to
• 16:54
  understand
• 16:55
  through
• 16:56
  them
• 16:57
  what
• 16:57
  their
• 16:59
  life
• 17:00
  experience
• 17:00
  was
• 17:01
  that
• 17:01
  defined
• 17:02
  that
• 17:02
  as
• 17:03
  trauma
• 17:03
  for
• 17:04
  them.
• 17:05
  But
• 17:05
  in
• 17:06
  general,
• 17:08
  if
• 17:09
  someone
• 17:09
  asks
• 17:10
  me,
• 17:10
  what
• 17:11
  is
• 17:11
  trauma,
• 17:12
  how
• 17:12
  would
• 17:12
  you
• 17:12
  explain
• 17:13
  it?
• 17:14
  That
• 17:14
  article
• 17:15
  that
• 17:15
  you
• 17:15
  referenced
• 17:17
  is
• 17:18
  my.
• 17:18
  One
• 17:19
  of
• 17:19
  my
• 17:19
  attempts
• 17:20
  to
• 17:20
  do
• 17:20
  that.
• 17:22
  I'll
• 17:22
  say
• 17:22
  to
• 17:23
  someone,
• 17:23
  well,
• 17:25
  we
• 17:25
  all
• 17:25
  know
• 17:26
  the
• 17:26
  experience
• 17:27
  of
• 17:27
  driving
• 17:27
  on
• 17:27
  the
• 17:28
  road
• 17:28
  and
• 17:29
  having
• 17:29
  that
• 17:29
  pesky
• 17:31
  pebble
• 17:31
  kick
• 17:31
  up
• 17:32
  off
• 17:32
  the
• 17:32
  road
• 17:32
  and
• 17:32
  hit
• 17:33
  your
• 17:33
  windshield
• 17:34
  and
• 17:34
  cause
• 17:35
  a
• 17:35
  divot,
• 17:36
  you
• 17:36
  know,
• 17:37
  and
• 17:38
  you
• 17:38
  see
• 17:38
  that
• 17:38
  little
• 17:39
  divot
• 17:39
  in
• 17:39
  the
• 17:39
  window,
• 17:40
  you
• 17:40
  can't
• 17:40
  get
• 17:41
  it
• 17:41
  out.
• 17:41
  It's
• 17:41
  there.
• 17:43
  And
• 17:43
  I
• 17:43
  will
• 17:44
  say,
• 17:44
  okay,
• 17:44
  that's
• 17:45
  maybe
• 17:45
  the
• 17:46
  point
• 17:47
  of
• 17:48
  victimization.
• 17:49
  That's
• 17:50
  the
• 17:50
  traumatic
• 17:50
  event.
• 17:52
  And
• 17:53
  if
• 17:53
  that
• 17:55
  divot
• 17:56
  doesn't
• 17:56
  get
• 17:57
  sealed
• 17:58
  or
• 17:58
  treated
• 17:59
  or
• 18:00
  it
• 18:00
  tends
• 18:00
  to
• 18:01
  spider
• 18:01
  web
• 18:02
  out,
• 18:03
  you
• 18:03
  know,
• 18:03
  or
• 18:03
  at
• 18:03
  least
• 18:04
  in
• 18:04
  the
• 18:04
  old
• 18:04
  days
• 18:04
  with
• 18:05
  the
• 18:05
  old
• 18:05
  windows,
• 18:06
  it
• 18:06
  did.
• 18:07
  Still
• 18:07
  does.
• 18:08
  Still
• 18:08
  does.
• 18:10
  So
• 18:11
  I
• 18:13
  kind
• 18:13
  of
• 18:13
  explain
• 18:14
  untreated
• 18:15
  trauma
• 18:15
  as
• 18:16
  that,
• 18:16
  that
• 18:17
  it
• 18:17
  kind
• 18:17
  of
• 18:17
  takes
• 18:18
  on
• 18:18
  different
• 18:19
  arteries
• 18:20
  and
• 18:20
  different
• 18:21
  angles
• 18:22
  of
• 18:22
  its
• 18:22
  own
• 18:22
  and
• 18:23
  becomes
• 18:23
  like
• 18:24
  a
• 18:24
  spider
• 18:25
  web
• 18:25
  with
• 18:26
  various
• 18:26
  connections
• 18:27
  and
• 18:27
  avenues,
• 18:30
  which
• 18:30
  then
• 18:30
  creates
• 18:31
  the
• 18:31
  complexity
• 18:32
  of
• 18:32
  it.
• 18:34
  And
• 18:34
  most
• 18:34
  people,
• 18:35
  most
• 18:35
  people
• 18:36
  seem
• 18:36
  to
• 18:36
  resonate
• 18:36
  with
• 18:37
  that.
• 18:37
  And
• 18:37
  that's
• 18:38
  a
• 18:38
  great
• 18:38
  way
• 18:38
  to
• 18:38
  explain
• 18:38
  it.
• 18:39
  And
• 18:39
  it
• 18:39
  also
• 18:41
  kind
• 18:41
  of.
• 18:42
  I
• 18:42
  mean,
• 18:42
  it's.
• 18:43
  I
• 18:43
  love
• 18:43
  the
• 18:43
  analogy
• 18:44
  and
• 18:44
  I
• 18:44
  love
• 18:44
  the
• 18:44
  picturing
• 18:45
  of
• 18:45
  it
• 18:45
  because
• 18:46
  it
• 18:46
  just.
• 18:46
  Now
• 18:46
  it's
• 18:47
  reaching
• 18:47
  out
• 18:47
  to
• 18:48
  every
• 18:48
  area.
• 18:48
  Like
• 18:48
  even
• 18:49
  just
• 18:49
  picturing
• 18:49
  the
• 18:49
  windshield,
• 18:50
  you
• 18:50
  know,
• 18:50
  it
• 18:50
  was
• 18:50
  only
• 18:51
  affecting
• 18:51
  this
• 18:51
  one
• 18:51
  little
• 18:52
  spot,
• 18:52
  but
• 18:52
  now
• 18:52
  it's
• 18:53
  affecting
• 18:53
  everything.
• 18:54
  It's
• 18:54
  affecting
• 18:55
  your
• 18:55
  view
• 18:55
  and
• 18:55
  stuff.
• 18:56
  I
• 18:56
  know
• 18:56
  because
• 18:57
  people
• 18:57
  have
• 18:57
  always
• 18:57
  asked
• 18:57
  me,
• 18:58
  they're
• 18:58
  like,
• 18:58
  oh,
• 18:58
  you're
• 18:58
  trauma
• 18:59
  informed,
• 18:59
  so
• 18:59
  what
• 18:59
  does
• 18:59
  that
• 19:00
  mean
• 19:00
  to
• 19:00
  you?
• 19:00
  And
• 19:01
  I'm
• 19:01
  like,
• 19:01
  listen,
• 19:01
  there's.
• 19:02
  There's
• 19:02
  big
• 19:02
  T,
• 19:02
  little
• 19:03
  T,
• 19:03
  middle
• 19:03
  tree.
• 19:04
  There's
• 19:04
  all
• 19:04
  these
• 19:04
  different
• 19:05
  kinds
• 19:05
  of
• 19:05
  traumas.
• 19:06
  But
• 19:06
  ultimately,
• 19:07
  if
• 19:08
  your
• 19:08
  perception
• 19:08
  of
• 19:09
  what
• 19:09
  you
• 19:09
  happened
• 19:09
  in
• 19:09
  your
• 19:10
  experience
• 19:10
  changed
• 19:11
  the
• 19:11
  way
• 19:11
  you
• 19:12
  look
• 19:12
  at
• 19:12
  yourself
• 19:13
  or
• 19:13
  the
• 19:14
  world,
• 19:14
  yes,
• 19:15
  it
• 19:15
  was
• 19:15
  trauma.
• 19:16
  It
• 19:16
  changed
• 19:17
  your
• 19:17
  truth
• 19:17
  in
• 19:18
  your
• 19:18
  mind
• 19:18
  at
• 19:18
  that
• 19:19
  moment.
• 19:21
  And
• 19:21
  it
• 19:21
  gets
• 19:21
  buried.
• 19:22
  And
• 19:22
  like
• 19:22
  you
• 19:23
  said,
• 19:23
  if
• 19:23
  you
• 19:23
  don't
• 19:23
  fix
• 19:24
  it,
• 19:24
  I
• 19:24
  mean,
• 19:25
  traumatic
• 19:26
  things
• 19:26
  happen
• 19:26
  all
• 19:27
  the
• 19:27
  time.
• 19:27
  People
• 19:27
  get
• 19:27
  in
• 19:28
  car
• 19:28
  accidents,
• 19:28
  all
• 19:29
  this
• 19:29
  stuff
• 19:29
  happens.
• 19:29
  You
• 19:30
  know,
• 19:30
  these
• 19:30
  schools,
• 19:30
  school
• 19:30
  shootings,
• 19:31
  if
• 19:31
  kids
• 19:32
  can
• 19:32
  come
• 19:32
  home
• 19:32
  and
• 19:33
  say,
• 19:33
  mom,
• 19:33
  that
• 19:33
  scared
• 19:34
  me,
• 19:34
  and
• 19:34
  mom
• 19:34
  can
• 19:35
  hug
• 19:35
  her
• 19:35
  and
• 19:35
  say,
• 19:36
  let's
• 19:36
  talk
• 19:37
  about
• 19:37
  it.
• 19:38
  Totally
• 19:38
  different
• 19:39
  story
• 19:39
  than
• 19:39
  if
• 19:40
  a
• 19:40
  kid
• 19:40
  comes
• 19:40
  home
• 19:40
  and
• 19:40
  says,
• 19:40
  mom,
• 19:41
  someone
• 19:41
  got
• 19:41
  shot
• 19:41
  at
• 19:41
  school
• 19:42
  today
• 19:42
  and
• 19:42
  mom
• 19:42
  says
• 19:43
  suck
• 19:43
  it
• 19:43
  up.
• 19:44
  Be
• 19:44
  glad
• 19:44
  it
• 19:44
  wasn't
• 19:44
  you.
• 19:46
  Two
• 19:47
  totally
• 19:48
  different
• 19:48
  situations.
• 19:49
  Great,
• 19:49
  great
• 19:50
  point.
• 19:50
  And
• 19:50
  another
• 19:51
  thing
• 19:51
  that
• 19:51
  I
• 19:52
  do
• 19:52
  say,
• 19:52
  when
• 19:54
  people
• 19:54
  are
• 19:54
  wanting
• 19:55
  some
• 19:56
  education
• 19:56
  on
• 19:57
  trauma
• 19:58
  is
• 19:58
  a
• 19:59
  big
• 19:59
  part
• 20:00
  of
• 20:00
  recovery
• 20:01
  for
• 20:02
  someone
• 20:03
  is
• 20:04
  how
• 20:04
  they're
• 20:04
  responded
• 20:05
  to.
• 20:06
  If
• 20:06
  they're
• 20:06
  take
• 20:07
  the
• 20:07
  risk
• 20:07
  and
• 20:08
  the,
• 20:08
  and,
• 20:08
  and
• 20:08
  the
• 20:08
  courage
• 20:09
  to
• 20:09
  disclose
• 20:10
  it.
• 20:10
  Yeah.
• 20:39
  You
• 20:39
  know,
• 20:40
  if
• 20:40
  they're
• 20:41
  treated
• 20:42
  with
• 20:42
  care
• 20:43
  and
• 20:43
  with
• 20:44
  nourishment
• 20:45
  and
• 20:45
  attention,
• 20:47
  that
• 20:48
  really,
• 20:49
  that
• 20:49
  really
• 20:49
  sets
• 20:50
  the
• 20:50
  stage
• 20:50
  for
• 20:51
  healing.
• 20:53
  If
• 20:53
  someone
• 20:53
  doesn't
• 20:54
  believe
• 20:54
  them
• 20:55
  and
• 20:55
  dismisses
• 20:56
  them,
• 20:56
  they
• 20:57
  go
• 20:57
  back
• 20:57
  underground
• 20:58
  and
• 21:00
  feel
• 21:00
  like
• 21:00
  maybe
• 21:00
  it
• 21:01
  was
• 21:01
  their
• 21:01
  fault
• 21:02
  or
• 21:02
  maybe
• 21:03
  it
• 21:03
  didn't
• 21:03
  happen
• 21:04
  or,
• 21:05
  you
• 21:05
  know,
• 21:05
  all
• 21:06
  the
• 21:06
  things
• 21:06
  that
• 21:07
  you
• 21:07
  hear
• 21:07
  about
• 21:07
  are,
• 21:08
  are
• 21:09
  true.
• 21:09
  So
• 21:09
  I
• 21:09
  think
• 21:11
  having
• 21:11
  a
• 21:12
  support
• 21:12
  system
• 21:13
  that's
• 21:13
  conducive
• 21:14
  to
• 21:14
  disclosure
• 21:16
  is
• 21:17
  essential
• 21:19
  versus
• 21:21
  and
• 21:21
  even
• 21:22
  truthfully,
• 21:23
  even
• 21:23
  when
• 21:23
  you
• 21:23
  have
• 21:24
  that,
• 21:24
  there's
• 21:24
  no
• 21:25
  guarantee
• 21:25
  of
• 21:25
  disclosure.
• 21:27
  That,
• 21:28
  that's
• 21:28
  how,
• 21:29
  that's
• 21:29
  how
• 21:30
  shame
• 21:31
  based,
• 21:32
  at
• 21:32
  least
• 21:33
  sexual
• 21:33
  abuse
• 21:34
  in
• 21:34
  particular
• 21:35
  tends
• 21:35
  to
• 21:35
  be.
• 21:37
  It's
• 21:38
  a
• 21:38
  unique
• 21:39
  form
• 21:39
  of
• 21:39
  abuse
• 21:41
  that
• 21:43
  really
• 21:45
  carries
• 21:45
  with
• 21:46
  it
• 21:46
  guilt
• 21:46
  and
• 21:47
  shame,
• 21:47
  perhaps
• 21:48
  unlike
• 21:48
  other
• 21:49
  forms
• 21:49
  of
• 21:49
  victimization.
• 21:51
  Yeah.
• 21:51
  And
• 21:51
  that's
• 21:52
  also
• 21:52
  why
• 21:53
  I
• 21:53
  enjoy,
• 21:53
  I
• 21:53
  like
• 21:54
  having
• 21:54
  you
• 21:54
  on
• 21:54
  here
• 21:54
  on
• 21:55
  this
• 21:55
  adult
• 21:55
  childhood
• 21:55
  dysfunction
• 21:56
  because
• 21:56
  we
• 21:57
  talk
• 21:57
  a
• 21:57
  lot
• 21:57
  about
• 21:57
  addiction
• 21:58
  and
• 21:58
  they're
• 21:59
  same
• 21:59
  thing.
• 21:59
  People
• 22:00
  when
• 22:00
  they're
• 22:00
  not
• 22:00
  in
• 22:00
  their
• 22:01
  right
• 22:01
  minds,
• 22:01
  do
• 22:01
  things
• 22:02
  that
• 22:02
  they
• 22:02
  would
• 22:02
  never
• 22:03
  do.
• 22:03
  But
• 22:03
  there
• 22:03
  is,
• 22:04
  with
• 22:04
  addiction
• 22:04
  and
• 22:05
  blackouts,
• 22:06
  there
• 22:06
  is
• 22:06
  so
• 22:07
  much
• 22:07
  shame
• 22:07
  and
• 22:07
  so
• 22:07
  much
• 22:08
  guilt
• 22:08
  and
• 22:08
  so
• 22:08
  much
• 22:09
  stigma.
• 22:10
  Yes.
• 22:10
  You
• 22:10
  know,
• 22:10
  that
• 22:10
  people,
• 22:12
  it's
• 22:13
  hard,
• 22:13
  you
• 22:13
  know,
• 22:13
  it's
• 22:14
  hard,
• 22:14
  it's
• 22:15
  really
• 22:15
  hard
• 22:15
  to
• 22:15
  stand
• 22:16
  up
• 22:16
  there
• 22:16
  and
• 22:16
  say
• 22:17
  this
• 22:17
  is
• 22:17
  what
• 22:17
  I
• 22:17
  did
• 22:18
  or.
• 22:19
  But
• 22:19
  you
• 22:19
  know,
• 22:20
  I
• 22:20
  like
• 22:20
  to
• 22:20
  just
• 22:21
  try
• 22:22
  to
• 22:22
  make
• 22:22
  the
• 22:22
  message
• 22:23
  that,
• 22:24
  you
• 22:24
  know,
• 22:25
  you
• 22:25
  can't
• 22:25
  go
• 22:25
  back,
• 22:26
  you
• 22:26
  can't
• 22:27
  take
• 22:27
  it
• 22:27
  back,
• 22:27
  you
• 22:27
  can't,
• 22:28
  you
• 22:28
  can't
• 22:28
  undo
• 22:28
  the
• 22:29
  past.
• 22:29
  Right.
• 22:30
  But
• 22:30
  you
• 22:30
  can
• 22:30
  heal,
• 22:31
  you
• 22:31
  can
• 22:33
  become
• 22:33
  a
• 22:33
  better
• 22:33
  person
• 22:34
  and
• 22:34
  you
• 22:34
  can
• 22:34
  make
• 22:35
  it
• 22:35
  right
• 22:35
  going
• 22:35
  forward.
• 22:36
  Forward.
• 22:36
  So.
• 22:37
  But
• 22:38
  you
• 22:38
  have
• 22:38
  to
• 22:38
  want
• 22:38
  to.
• 22:39
  Right,
• 22:40
  Right.
• 22:41
  Absolutely,
• 22:41
  absolutely.
• 22:43
  So,
• 22:43
  so
• 22:44
  that's
• 22:44
  the
• 22:44
  important
• 22:44
  thing.
• 22:45
  And,
• 22:45
  and
• 22:45
  I
• 22:45
  think
• 22:46
  the
• 22:46
  word
• 22:47
  that
• 22:47
  I
• 22:47
  use
• 22:47
  is
• 22:48
  integrated.
• 22:50
  You
• 22:50
  don't
• 22:51
  want
• 22:51
  to
• 22:51
  cut
• 22:51
  yourself
• 22:52
  off
• 22:52
  from
• 22:52
  the
• 22:53
  experience.
• 22:53
  You
• 22:53
  want
• 22:54
  to
• 22:54
  integrate
• 22:54
  it.
• 22:55
  You,
• 22:55
  you
• 22:55
  want
• 22:55
  to
• 22:56
  be
• 22:56
  able
• 22:56
  to
• 22:56
  say,
• 22:56
  hey,
• 22:57
  this
• 22:57
  is
• 22:57
  part
• 22:57
  of
• 22:57
  what
• 22:58
  happened.
• 22:58
  I
• 22:58
  want
• 22:59
  to
• 22:59
  honor
• 22:59
  the
• 23:00
  fact
• 23:00
  that
• 23:00
  it
• 23:00
  was
• 23:00
  there
• 23:01
  and
• 23:01
  that
• 23:01
  it
• 23:01
  existed,
• 23:03
  but
• 23:03
  also
• 23:03
  want
• 23:04
  to
• 23:04
  give
• 23:04
  myself
• 23:04
  permission
• 23:05
  to
• 23:06
  effectively
• 23:07
  and
• 23:07
  adaptively
• 23:08
  leave
• 23:08
  it
• 23:09
  there
• 23:09
  in
• 23:09
  the
• 23:09
  past
• 23:10
  and
• 23:10
  move
• 23:11
  on
• 23:11
  versus
• 23:12
  sublimate
• 23:12
  it
• 23:13
  or
• 23:13
  treat
• 23:14
  it
• 23:14
  through
• 23:14
  the
• 23:14
  use
• 23:14
  of
• 23:15
  substances,
• 23:16
  chemicals
• 23:17
  or
• 23:17
  other
• 23:17
  forms
• 23:18
  of
• 23:18
  acting
• 23:18
  out
• 23:18
  behavior.
• 23:19
  Yeah,
• 23:20
  yeah.
• 23:20
  And
• 23:21
  never.
• 23:21
  Yeah,
• 23:21
  exactly.
• 23:21
  It's
• 23:22
  Never
• 23:22
  going
• 23:22
  to
• 23:22
  go
• 23:22
  away.
• 23:23
  You
• 23:23
  have
• 23:23
  to,
• 23:23
  you
• 23:23
  have
• 23:23
  to
• 23:24
  acknowledge
• 23:24
  it,
• 23:24
  you
• 23:24
  have
• 23:25
  to
• 23:25
  come
• 23:25
  to
• 23:25
  terms
• 23:25
  with
• 23:25
  it.
• 23:26
  But
• 23:26
  yes,
• 23:26
  you
• 23:27
  don't
• 23:27
  have
• 23:27
  to.
• 23:28
  And
• 23:28
  it
• 23:29
  doesn't
• 23:29
  have
• 23:29
  to
• 23:29
  run
• 23:29
  the
• 23:29
  rest
• 23:30
  of
• 23:30
  your
• 23:30
  life
• 23:30
  either.
• 23:31
  Like
• 23:31
  you,
• 23:31
  you
• 23:31
  can
• 23:32
  let
• 23:32
  go
• 23:32
  of
• 23:32
  that,
• 23:33
  of
• 23:34
  that
• 23:34
  part
• 23:34
  of
• 23:34
  it,
• 23:35
  as
• 23:35
  far
• 23:35
  as
• 23:35
  it
• 23:36
  being
• 23:36
  your
• 23:36
  pattern
• 23:37
  or
• 23:37
  being
• 23:37
  your
• 23:38
  habits.
• 23:39
  So.
• 23:39
  Well,
• 23:39
  I,
• 23:40
  I
• 23:40
  love
• 23:40
  that.
• 23:40
  Yeah.
• 23:41
  The,
• 23:41
  the
• 23:41
  whole
• 23:42
  concept
• 23:42
  of
• 23:42
  trauma
• 23:43
  in
• 23:43
  general
• 23:43
  is
• 23:43
  just
• 23:44
  so,
• 23:45
  like
• 23:45
  you
• 23:45
  said,
• 23:46
  it's
• 23:46
  just
• 23:46
  so
• 23:46
  complex
• 23:47
  and
• 23:47
  there's,
• 23:48
  there's
• 23:49
  no
• 23:49
  one
• 23:49
  instance.
• 23:50
  You
• 23:50
  know,
• 23:50
  I
• 23:50
  always
• 23:51
  use
• 23:51
  the
• 23:51
  example.
• 23:52
  I
• 23:52
  had
• 23:52
  a
• 23:52
  client
• 23:53
  who
• 23:54
  had
• 23:54
  this
• 23:54
  really
• 23:54
  un,
• 23:56
  unwavering
• 23:57
  belief
• 23:58
  that
• 23:58
  her
• 23:58
  mother
• 23:58
  just
• 23:58
  really
• 23:59
  didn't
• 23:59
  love
• 23:59
  her
• 24:00
  for
• 24:00
  no
• 24:00
  reason.
• 24:00
  Like
• 24:01
  for,
• 24:01
  for
• 24:01
  apparently
• 24:02
  no
• 24:02
  reason.
• 24:03
  Right.
• 24:03
  So,
• 24:04
  because
• 24:04
  she's
• 24:04
  like,
• 24:04
  I
• 24:04
  had
• 24:04
  a
• 24:04
  great
• 24:05
  house,
• 24:05
  my
• 24:05
  parents
• 24:05
  always
• 24:06
  fed
• 24:06
  me,
• 24:06
  I
• 24:06
  was
• 24:06
  loved,
• 24:07
  I
• 24:07
  was
• 24:07
  told
• 24:07
  I
• 24:07
  was
• 24:07
  loved,
• 24:08
  blah,
• 24:08
  blah,
• 24:08
  blah.
• 24:09
  And
• 24:09
  so
• 24:09
  we
• 24:09
  went
• 24:10
  back,
• 24:10
  like,
• 24:10
  went
• 24:10
  way
• 24:11
  back.
• 24:11
  And
• 24:11
  she
• 24:11
  was
• 24:11
  40
• 24:12
  something
• 24:12
  at
• 24:12
  the
• 24:12
  time.
• 24:13
  And
• 24:14
  she
• 24:14
  finally,
• 24:15
  we
• 24:15
  came
• 24:15
  up
• 24:15
  with
• 24:15
  a
• 24:16
  memory.
• 24:17
  Six
• 24:18
  years
• 24:18
  old.
• 24:18
  Her
• 24:19
  mom
• 24:19
  had
• 24:19
  gotten
• 24:19
  a
• 24:19
  new
• 24:20
  job
• 24:20
  and
• 24:20
  was
• 24:20
  three
• 24:21
  days
• 24:21
  late
• 24:21
  to
• 24:21
  pick
• 24:21
  her
• 24:22
  up
• 24:22
  from
• 24:22
  work
• 24:22
  or
• 24:23
  from
• 24:23
  school.
• 24:23
  And
• 24:24
  she
• 24:24
  waited
• 24:24
  by
• 24:24
  the
• 24:24
  bus
• 24:24
  stop.
• 24:25
  And
• 24:25
  her
• 24:25
  best
• 24:26
  friend
• 24:26
  at
• 24:26
  a
• 24:26
  sleepover
• 24:27
  in
• 24:27
  front
• 24:27
  of
• 24:27
  15
• 24:27
  other
• 24:28
  kids
• 24:28
  said,
• 24:28
  your
• 24:29
  mom
• 24:29
  must
• 24:29
  not
• 24:29
  love
• 24:29
  you.
• 24:30
  She
• 24:30
  didn't
• 24:30
  come
• 24:30
  to
• 24:30
  pick
• 24:30
  you
• 24:31
  up
• 24:31
  on
• 24:31
  time.
• 24:31
  For
• 24:32
  sure.
• 24:32
  That
• 24:32
  dug
• 24:33
  in
• 24:33
  her.
• 24:33
  And
• 24:34
  I,
• 24:34
  I
• 24:34
  use
• 24:34
  it
• 24:34
  as
• 24:34
  an
• 24:35
  example
• 24:35
  all
• 24:35
  the
• 24:35
  time
• 24:36
  because
• 24:36
  that
• 24:37
  had
• 24:37
  just
• 24:37
  as
• 24:37
  much
• 24:38
  of
• 24:38
  a,
• 24:38
  it
• 24:38
  had
• 24:38
  a
• 24:38
  40
• 24:39
  year
• 24:39
  lasting
• 24:40
  effect
• 24:40
  on
• 24:40
  her.
• 24:41
  Same
• 24:41
  as
• 24:41
  my
• 24:42
  mom
• 24:42
  telling
• 24:42
  me
• 24:42
  every
• 24:43
  day
• 24:43
  she
• 24:43
  hated
• 24:44
  me.
• 24:44
  Yes.
• 24:45
  I
• 24:45
  mean,
• 24:46
  what
• 24:46
  you
• 24:46
  would
• 24:46
  think
• 24:47
  to
• 24:47
  me
• 24:47
  was
• 24:47
  this
• 24:48
  big
• 24:48
  T,
• 24:48
  like
• 24:49
  traumatic
• 24:50
  thing
• 24:50
  for
• 24:50
  a
• 24:50
  kid
• 24:51
  to
• 24:51
  her
• 24:51
  with
• 24:51
  one
• 24:52
  sentence,
• 24:52
  one
• 24:53
  day.
• 24:53
  Yes.
• 24:54
  Yeah.
• 24:54
  And,
• 24:55
  and
• 24:55
  that
• 24:55
  speaks
• 24:55
  very
• 24:56
  much
• 24:56
  to
• 24:56
  the
• 24:56
  complexity
• 24:57
  of
• 24:58
  it.
• 24:59
  You
• 24:59
  know,
• 24:59
  two
• 24:59
  people,
• 25:01
  I
• 25:01
  use
• 25:01
  an
• 25:02
  example
• 25:02
  of
• 25:02
  two
• 25:03
  people
• 25:03
  could
• 25:03
  be
• 25:03
  in
• 25:03
  a
• 25:04
  vehicle
• 25:04
  traveling
• 25:05
  down
• 25:05
  a,
• 25:05
  a
• 25:06
  road
• 25:06
  with
• 25:06
  just
• 25:07
  a
• 25:07
  light
• 25:07
  dusting
• 25:08
  of
• 25:08
  snow
• 25:09
  and
• 25:09
  the
• 25:09
  car
• 25:11
  spins
• 25:11
  out
• 25:11
  of
• 25:12
  control
• 25:12
  a
• 25:13
  little
• 25:13
  bit
• 25:13
  and
• 25:13
  the
• 25:13
  driver
• 25:14
  regains
• 25:15
  control
• 25:15
  and
• 25:15
  starts
• 25:16
  driving
• 25:16
  again.
• 25:18
  One
• 25:18
  of
• 25:18
  the
• 25:18
  people
• 25:19
  in
• 25:19
  the
• 25:19
  car
• 25:19
  could
• 25:20
  be
• 25:20
  absolutely
• 25:21
  devastated
• 25:21
  by
• 25:22
  that.
• 25:22
  The
• 25:22
  other
• 25:22
  person
• 25:23
  could
• 25:23
  say,
• 25:23
  that
• 25:24
  was
• 25:24
  fun,
• 25:24
  let's
• 25:25
  do
• 25:25
  it
• 25:25
  again,
• 25:25
  you
• 25:25
  know,
• 25:26
  so,
• 25:27
  you
• 25:28
  know,
• 25:28
  it's
• 25:28
  just
• 25:28
  very,
• 25:29
  very
• 25:30
  unique
• 25:31
  to
• 25:31
  the
• 25:31
  person
• 25:31
  who's
• 25:32
  the
• 25:32
  recipient
• 25:33
  of
• 25:33
  it.
• 25:33
  Yes.
• 25:34
  And
• 25:34
  that's
• 25:34
  why
• 25:35
  I
• 25:36
  preach
• 25:36
  all
• 25:36
  the
• 25:37
  time
• 25:37
  when
• 25:38
  things
• 25:38
  happen,
• 25:39
  look
• 25:40
  at
• 25:40
  them
• 25:40
  as,
• 25:41
  I
• 25:41
  mean,
• 25:41
  try
• 25:42
  to
• 25:42
  find
• 25:42
  the
• 25:42
  good
• 25:42
  in
• 25:43
  what
• 25:43
  happened.
• 25:43
  Like,
• 25:44
  try
• 25:44
  to
• 25:44
  find,
• 25:44
  you
• 25:45
  know,
• 25:45
  your
• 25:45
  body
• 25:46
  doesn't
• 25:46
  know
• 25:46
  the
• 25:47
  difference
• 25:47
  between
• 25:48
  this
• 25:48
  physiological,
• 25:49
  you
• 25:49
  know,
• 25:50
  feeling
• 25:50
  of
• 25:50
  excitement
• 25:51
  or
• 25:51
  fear.
• 25:52
  It's
• 25:52
  the
• 25:52
  same
• 25:53
  feeling.
• 25:54
  So
• 25:54
  like
• 25:54
  you
• 25:54
  said,
• 25:54
  when
• 25:55
  you're
• 25:55
  on
• 25:55
  A
• 25:55
  roller
• 25:55
  coaster
• 25:56
  instead
• 25:56
  of
• 25:56
  holy
• 25:56
  crap,
• 25:57
  this
• 25:57
  is
• 25:57
  scary,
• 25:58
  this
• 25:59
  is
• 25:59
  exciting.
• 25:59
  It's
• 26:00
  because
• 26:00
  your
• 26:00
  body's
• 26:00
  going
• 26:00
  to
• 26:00
  feel
• 26:01
  the
• 26:01
  same
• 26:01
  thing.
• 26:01
  So
• 26:02
  it's
• 26:02
  how
• 26:02
  you.
• 26:03
  And
• 26:03
  if
• 26:03
  you
• 26:03
  have
• 26:04
  to
• 26:04
  spin
• 26:04
  it.
• 26:04
  And
• 26:04
  it
• 26:04
  takes
• 26:05
  a
• 26:05
  lot
• 26:05
  of
• 26:05
  practice
• 26:05
  because
• 26:06
  especially
• 26:06
  when
• 26:07
  you
• 26:07
  went
• 26:07
  through
• 26:07
  trauma,
• 26:08
  you
• 26:08
  are
• 26:08
  wired
• 26:09
  to
• 26:09
  look
• 26:09
  for
• 26:10
  negative
• 26:10
  and
• 26:10
  to
• 26:10
  look
• 26:11
  for
• 26:11
  scary.
• 26:12
  You're
• 26:12
  wired
• 26:12
  that
• 26:12
  way.
• 26:13
  That's
• 26:13
  true.
• 26:13
  That's
• 26:14
  true.
• 26:14
  Your
• 26:14
  network
• 26:15
  is,
• 26:16
  is
• 26:16
  set
• 26:16
  up
• 26:17
  a
• 26:17
  certain
• 26:17
  way
• 26:17
  to
• 26:18
  anticipate
• 26:18
  that.
• 26:19
  Yes.
• 26:21
  So
• 26:21
  what
• 26:21
  is.
• 26:21
  Oh,
• 26:22
  go
• 26:22
  ahead.
• 26:23
  Well,
• 26:23
  in
• 26:23
  the
• 26:24
  sad
• 26:24
  thing
• 26:24
  is
• 26:25
  there
• 26:25
  are
• 26:25
  people
• 26:26
  out
• 26:26
  there
• 26:26
  who
• 26:26
  are
• 26:27
  very
• 26:27
  attuned
• 26:28
  to
• 26:28
  looking
• 26:29
  for
• 26:29
  that.
• 26:31
  Yeah.
• 26:31
  And
• 26:31
  those,
• 26:32
  those
• 26:32
  people
• 26:32
  have
• 26:33
  ill
• 26:33
  intent
• 26:35
  a
• 26:35
  lot
• 26:35
  of
• 26:35
  time.
• 26:36
  So.
• 26:37
  Yep.
• 26:38
  Yeah,
• 26:38
  no,
• 26:38
  I
• 26:38
  can
• 26:38
  see
• 26:39
  that.
• 26:39
  And
• 26:40
  absolutely.
• 26:41
  So
• 26:42
  what
• 26:43
  are
• 26:43
  your.
• 26:44
  I
• 26:44
  mean,
• 26:44
  you
• 26:44
  work
• 26:45
  one
• 26:46
  on
• 26:46
  one
• 26:46
  with
• 26:46
  everybody.
• 26:47
  Do
• 26:47
  you
• 26:47
  do
• 26:47
  groups
• 26:48
  or
• 26:48
  how
• 26:48
  do
• 26:48
  you
• 26:48
  work
• 26:49
  one
• 26:49
  on
• 26:49
  one?
• 26:49
  But
• 26:50
  right
• 26:50
  now
• 26:50
  I
• 26:50
  do
• 26:50
  individual
• 26:51
  couples,
• 26:52
  some
• 26:52
  family
• 26:53
  work,
• 26:53
  but
• 26:53
  the
• 26:53
  group
• 26:54
  part
• 26:54
  is,
• 26:54
  is
• 26:55
  not
• 26:55
  part
• 26:55
  of
• 26:55
  my,
• 26:56
  my,
• 26:57
  my
• 26:57
  process.
• 26:57
  Not
• 26:58
  for
• 26:58
  lack
• 26:58
  of
• 26:59
  trying.
• 26:59
  It's
• 27:00
  just
• 27:01
  hard
• 27:01
  to
• 27:01
  get
• 27:01
  voluntary
• 27:02
  groups
• 27:02
  together.
• 27:04
  So,
• 27:05
  so
• 27:05
  I'm
• 27:05
  not
• 27:05
  doing
• 27:05
  that
• 27:06
  at
• 27:06
  present.
• 27:06
  I'm
• 27:07
  certainly
• 27:07
  open
• 27:07
  to
• 27:08
  it.
• 27:08
  Okay,
• 27:09
  but
• 27:09
  your
• 27:10
  one
• 27:10
  on
• 27:10
  one
• 27:10
  is
• 27:11
  mostly
• 27:11
  trauma
• 27:13
  avenues,
• 27:14
  I
• 27:14
  guess
• 27:14
  you
• 27:14
  could
• 27:14
  say.
• 27:15
  People
• 27:15
  that
• 27:15
  have
• 27:15
  been
• 27:15
  through
• 27:16
  trauma.
• 27:17
  It
• 27:18
  largely
• 27:18
  is
• 27:19
  whether,
• 27:19
  whether
• 27:20
  it
• 27:20
  presents
• 27:21
  as
• 27:21
  such
• 27:22
  or
• 27:22
  not,
• 27:22
  it
• 27:23
  tends
• 27:23
  to
• 27:24
  be
• 27:24
  very
• 27:24
  rich
• 27:25
  with
• 27:25
  that.
• 27:26
  And
• 27:26
  when
• 27:27
  there's
• 27:28
  resolution
• 27:30
  in
• 27:30
  it,
• 27:31
  the,
• 27:32
  the
• 27:32
  rest
• 27:32
  of
• 27:32
  the
• 27:33
  stuff
• 27:34
  tends
• 27:34
  to
• 27:34
  take
• 27:34
  care
• 27:35
  of
• 27:35
  itself.
• 27:36
  Right.
• 27:37
  Absolutely.
• 27:38
  Now,
• 27:39
  another
• 27:40
  personal
• 27:40
  question,
• 27:40
  because
• 27:41
  this
• 27:41
  is
• 27:41
  kind
• 27:41
  of
• 27:41
  off
• 27:42
  the
• 27:42
  topic,
• 27:42
  but
• 27:43
  being
• 27:44
  that
• 27:44
  you
• 27:44
  sit
• 27:44
  there
• 27:44
  and
• 27:45
  you
• 27:45
  listen
• 27:45
  to
• 27:45
  people's
• 27:46
  trauma
• 27:46
  and
• 27:46
  we
• 27:46
  are
• 27:47
  all
• 27:47
  energy,
• 27:47
  we,
• 27:48
  we
• 27:48
  absorb
• 27:48
  energy,
• 27:49
  we
• 27:49
  have
• 27:49
  to
• 27:50
  deflect
• 27:51
  energy,
• 27:51
  all
• 27:52
  that.
• 27:52
  What
• 27:52
  do
• 27:52
  you
• 27:52
  do
• 27:52
  for
• 27:53
  fun?
• 27:56
  Well,
• 27:58
  I
• 27:59
  enjoy
• 27:59
  family
• 28:00
  time,
• 28:00
  you
• 28:01
  know,
• 28:02
  time
• 28:02
  with
• 28:02
  my
• 28:02
  wife.
• 28:03
  I
• 28:03
  have
• 28:03
  two
• 28:03
  adult
• 28:04
  daughters.
• 28:06
  I
• 28:06
  cherish
• 28:07
  time
• 28:07
  with
• 28:07
  them.
• 28:09
  My
• 28:10
  two
• 28:10
  little
• 28:10
  doggies.
• 28:11
  I
• 28:11
  have
• 28:11
  two
• 28:12
  miniature
• 28:13
  dachshunds
• 28:13
  that
• 28:14
  I
• 28:14
  adore.
• 28:16
  I
• 28:17
  am
• 28:17
  a
• 28:19
  comic
• 28:19
  book
• 28:21
  Marvel,
• 28:22
  specifically
• 28:23
  junkie.
• 28:23
  Although
• 28:24
  I
• 28:24
  dabble
• 28:24
  in
• 28:24
  D.C.
• 28:25
  i
• 28:25
  will
• 28:26
  say
• 28:28
  I,
• 28:29
  I,
• 28:29
  I'm
• 28:30
  a
• 28:30
  collector.
• 28:31
  I
• 28:31
  like
• 28:31
  to
• 28:31
  collect
• 28:32
  different
• 28:32
  things.
• 28:33
  Sports
• 28:34
  memorabilia,
• 28:36
  you
• 28:36
  know,
• 28:37
  old
• 28:38
  beer,
• 28:39
  Americana
• 28:40
  beer
• 28:41
  memorabilia,
• 28:43
  mirrors,
• 28:44
  signs,
• 28:44
  things
• 28:45
  of
• 28:45
  that
• 28:45
  nature.
• 28:46
  So
• 28:47
  I
• 28:47
  try
• 28:47
  to
• 28:47
  get
• 28:47
  caught
• 28:48
  up
• 28:48
  in
• 28:48
  that.
• 28:48
  Spending
• 28:49
  time
• 28:49
  with
• 28:49
  close
• 28:50
  friends,
• 28:53
  those
• 28:53
  are
• 28:53
  the
• 28:53
  things
• 28:53
  I
• 28:54
  do.
• 28:55
  I
• 28:55
  want
• 28:55
  to
• 28:55
  get
• 28:56
  back
• 28:56
  like
• 28:56
  we
• 28:56
  all
• 28:56
  do,
• 28:57
  I'm
• 28:57
  sure
• 28:57
  to,
• 28:58
  to
• 28:58
  more
• 28:58
  regular
• 28:59
  exercise.
• 28:59
  But
• 29:00
  for
• 29:00
  some
• 29:00
  reason
• 29:00
  that
• 29:01
  always
• 29:01
  misses
• 29:01
  the
• 29:01
  cutoff
• 29:02
  mark.
• 29:02
  I
• 29:02
  don't
• 29:03
  know.
• 29:04
  Not
• 29:04
  on
• 29:05
  the
• 29:05
  to
• 29:05
  do
• 29:05
  list.
• 29:07
  Yeah,
• 29:07
  it's
• 29:08
  not
• 29:08
  as
• 29:08
  fun.
• 29:09
  No.
• 29:10
  I
• 29:10
  finally
• 29:11
  gave
• 29:11
  up.
• 29:11
  I
• 29:11
  got
• 29:11
  a
• 29:12
  shaker
• 29:12
  plate,
• 29:13
  like
• 29:13
  shakes
• 29:13
  your
• 29:13
  body.
• 29:14
  And
• 29:14
  I
• 29:14
  got
• 29:14
  a
• 29:14
  rebound.
• 29:15
  A
• 29:15
  rebounder
• 29:16
  a
• 29:16
  trampoline.
• 29:16
  And
• 29:16
  I'm
• 29:17
  like,
• 29:17
  okay,
• 29:17
  I
• 29:17
  can
• 29:17
  go
• 29:18
  out
• 29:18
  three
• 29:18
  times
• 29:18
  a
• 29:18
  day
• 29:18
  and
• 29:19
  bounce
• 29:19
  100
• 29:19
  times.
• 29:21
  Yes,
• 29:22
  that's.
• 29:22
  That's
• 29:22
  my.
• 29:23
  That
• 29:23
  I
• 29:23
  would.
• 29:23
  I
• 29:23
  would
• 29:23
  definitely
• 29:24
  do
• 29:24
  that.
• 29:24
  Yes.
• 29:25
  I
• 29:25
  sit
• 29:26
  by
• 29:26
  the
• 29:26
  pool
• 29:26
  and
• 29:26
  I
• 29:26
  watch
• 29:27
  the
• 29:27
  birds.
• 29:27
  I
• 29:27
  have
• 29:27
  a
• 29:28
  big
• 29:28
  lake
• 29:28
  behind
• 29:28
  me,
• 29:28
  so
• 29:29
  sometimes
• 29:29
  it
• 29:29
  has
• 29:29
  an
• 29:29
  alligator,
• 29:30
  sometimes
• 29:31
  it
• 29:31
  has
• 29:31
  little
• 29:31
  storks.
• 29:32
  Walk
• 29:32
  or,
• 29:33
  you
• 29:33
  know,
• 29:33
  whatever
• 29:33
  it
• 29:34
  is
• 29:34
  walking
• 29:34
  by.
• 29:34
  So,
• 29:35
  yep,
• 29:35
  I
• 29:36
  bounce.
• 29:37
  Yeah.
• 29:37
  So.
• 29:37
  Well,
• 29:38
  that's
• 29:38
  good
• 29:38
  to
• 29:38
  know,
• 29:39
  because
• 29:40
  it's
• 29:40
  good
• 29:40
  to
• 29:40
  know.
• 29:40
  I.
• 29:41
  I
• 29:41
  literally
• 29:42
  just
• 29:42
  had
• 29:42
  a
• 29:42
  client
• 29:42
  say
• 29:43
  to
• 29:43
  me
• 29:43
  yesterday,
• 29:44
  and.
• 29:44
  And
• 29:45
  I
• 29:45
  was
• 29:45
  like,
• 29:45
  are
• 29:45
  you
• 29:45
  kidding
• 29:46
  me?
• 29:46
  She
• 29:46
  goes,
• 29:47
  I
• 29:47
  don't
• 29:47
  want
• 29:47
  to
• 29:47
  tell
• 29:48
  you
• 29:48
  this
• 29:48
  story
• 29:48
  because
• 29:49
  I
• 29:49
  don't
• 29:49
  want
• 29:49
  you
• 29:50
  to
• 29:50
  lay
• 29:50
  at
• 29:50
  bed
• 29:50
  and
• 29:51
  lay
• 29:51
  in
• 29:51
  bed
• 29:51
  at
• 29:52
  night
• 29:52
  and
• 29:52
  think
• 29:52
  about
• 29:52
  it.
• 29:53
  And
• 29:53
  I
• 29:53
  was
• 29:53
  like,
• 29:54
  don't
• 29:55
  worry.
• 29:57
  I'm
• 29:58
  good.
• 29:58
  Don't
• 29:58
  worry.
• 29:59
  I
• 29:59
  was
• 30:00
  just.
• 30:00
  I
• 30:00
  just
• 30:00
  thought
• 30:00
  that
• 30:01
  was
• 30:01
  the
• 30:01
  cute.
• 30:01
  It
• 30:01
  was
• 30:01
  the
• 30:02
  cutest
• 30:02
  thing.
• 30:02
  And
• 30:02
  I
• 30:02
  said,
• 30:03
  don't
• 30:03
  worry.
• 30:03
  I
• 30:04
  said,
• 30:04
  the
• 30:04
  love
• 30:04
  doesn't
• 30:04
  stop
• 30:05
  here.
• 30:05
  I
• 30:05
  said,
• 30:06
  but
• 30:06
  the
• 30:06
  horror
• 30:06
  stories
• 30:07
  do.
• 30:07
  Like,
• 30:07
  they
• 30:07
  stop
• 30:08
  in
• 30:08
  this
• 30:08
  room
• 30:08
  right
• 30:08
  here.
• 30:09
  That's
• 30:10
  great.
• 30:10
  That's
• 30:10
  a
• 30:11
  great
• 30:11
  way
• 30:11
  to
• 30:11
  put
• 30:11
  it.
• 30:13
  We
• 30:13
  have
• 30:14
  to.
• 30:14
  We
• 30:14
  have
• 30:14
  to.
• 30:15
  We
• 30:15
  have
• 30:15
  to
• 30:15
  protect
• 30:15
  ourselves.
• 30:16
  You
• 30:17
  do.
• 30:17
  I
• 30:17
  mean,
• 30:18
  and.
• 30:18
  And
• 30:18
  it
• 30:19
  was
• 30:19
  just
• 30:19
  so
• 30:19
  cute
• 30:19
  that
• 30:20
  she
• 30:20
  was.
• 30:20
  But
• 30:20
  again,
• 30:21
  coming
• 30:21
  from
• 30:21
  a
• 30:22
  trauma
• 30:22
  background,
• 30:23
  somebody
• 30:23
  so
• 30:24
  worried
• 30:24
  about
• 30:25
  what
• 30:25
  other
• 30:25
  people
• 30:26
  were
• 30:26
  thinking.
• 30:27
  I
• 30:27
  was
• 30:27
  like,
• 30:27
  how
• 30:28
  about
• 30:28
  we
• 30:28
  just
• 30:28
  take
• 30:28
  care
• 30:28
  of
• 30:28
  you
• 30:29
  and
• 30:29
  I'll
• 30:29
  worry
• 30:30
  about
• 30:30
  Tammy.
• 30:32
  Right?
• 30:32
  It
• 30:33
  just.
• 30:33
  It
• 30:33
  was
• 30:33
  just
• 30:33
  so
• 30:34
  cute.
• 30:34
  So
• 30:34
  I
• 30:34
  was
• 30:34
  just
• 30:34
  thought,
• 30:35
  well,
• 30:35
  it's
• 30:35
  like,
• 30:35
  I'll
• 30:36
  ask
• 30:36
  what
• 30:36
  you
• 30:36
  do,
• 30:36
  because,
• 30:38
  you
• 30:38
  know,
• 30:38
  you
• 30:38
  have
• 30:38
  to
• 30:39
  have
• 30:39
  fun.
• 30:39
  Everybody
• 30:40
  has
• 30:40
  to
• 30:40
  have
• 30:40
  fun.
• 30:40
  If
• 30:40
  you're
• 30:41
  out
• 30:41
  there
• 30:41
  listening,
• 30:42
  find
• 30:42
  the
• 30:43
  things
• 30:43
  that
• 30:43
  light
• 30:43
  you
• 30:44
  up.
• 30:44
  Look
• 30:45
  for
• 30:45
  the
• 30:45
  good
• 30:45
  in
• 30:46
  everything.
• 30:46
  I
• 30:46
  mean,
• 30:46
  that's.
• 30:47
  That's
• 30:47
  about.
• 30:47
  That's
• 30:48
  what
• 30:48
  we
• 30:48
  can
• 30:48
  do.
• 30:48
  Do
• 30:49
  this.
• 30:49
  Do
• 30:49
  the
• 30:50
  best
• 30:50
  we
• 30:50
  can
• 30:50
  do.
• 30:50
  Right,
• 30:51
  Right.
• 30:51
  Right.
• 30:52
  So.
• 30:52
  So
• 30:53
  people
• 30:53
  want
• 30:53
  to
• 30:53
  work
• 30:53
  with
• 30:53
  you,
• 30:54
  Scott.
• 30:54
  Where
• 30:54
  do
• 30:54
  they
• 30:54
  find
• 30:55
  you?
• 30:56
  Well,
• 30:56
  you
• 30:57
  could
• 30:57
  best
• 30:58
  find
• 30:58
  out
• 30:58
  about
• 30:58
  me
• 30:59
  on
• 30:59
  my.
• 31:00
  Through
• 31:00
  my
• 31:00
  website,
• 31:01
  which
• 31:01
  is
• 31:01
  www.mosaicpathwaycounseling.org.
• 31:08
  And
• 31:08
  you
• 31:08
  can
• 31:09
  learn
• 31:09
  about
• 31:10
  me,
• 31:10
  my
• 31:11
  business,
• 31:12
  my
• 31:12
  likes
• 31:13
  and
• 31:13
  interests,
• 31:14
  what
• 31:14
  I
• 31:14
  do.
• 31:15
  You
• 31:15
  can
• 31:15
  learn
• 31:15
  a
• 31:15
  lot
• 31:15
  through
• 31:16
  the
• 31:16
  website.
• 31:17
  Okay.
• 31:17
  And
• 31:18
  I
• 31:18
  see.
• 31:18
  Do
• 31:18
  you.
• 31:18
  I'll
• 31:19
  put
• 31:19
  your
• 31:19
  LinkedIn
• 31:20
  link,
• 31:20
  too,
• 31:20
  if
• 31:20
  people
• 31:20
  want
• 31:21
  to
• 31:21
  reach
• 31:21
  out
• 31:21
  to
• 31:21
  you.
• 31:22
  I
• 31:22
  know
• 31:22
  you
• 31:22
  gave
• 31:23
  me
• 31:23
  your
• 31:23
  LinkedIn
• 31:23
  link.
• 31:24
  Do
• 31:24
  you
• 31:24
  want
• 31:24
  that
• 31:24
  in
• 31:24
  there
• 31:24
  or,.
• 31:26
  You
• 31:26
  know,
• 31:26
  if
• 31:26
  I
• 31:27
  had
• 31:27
  that
• 31:27
  committed
• 31:27
  to
• 31:28
  memory,
• 31:28
  I
• 31:28
  would
• 31:29
  put
• 31:29
  that
• 31:29
  on.
• 31:29
  No,
• 31:29
  I
• 31:29
  have
• 31:30
  it.
• 31:30
  No,
• 31:30
  I
• 31:30
  have
• 31:30
  it.
• 31:31
  I'm
• 31:31
  going
• 31:31
  to
• 31:31
  put
• 31:31
  everything.
• 31:32
  Yeah,
• 31:33
  no,
• 31:33
  I
• 31:33
  will.
• 31:33
  Sure.
• 31:33
  Yes,
• 31:34
  that's
• 31:34
  fine.
• 31:34
  For
• 31:35
  sure.
• 31:35
  Yeah.
• 31:36
  Okay.
• 31:36
  No,
• 31:36
  I
• 31:36
  give
• 31:36
  everybody.
• 31:37
  I
• 31:37
  put
• 31:38
  everything
• 31:38
  in
• 31:38
  the
• 31:38
  show
• 31:39
  notes
• 31:39
  so
• 31:39
  that
• 31:39
  people
• 31:39
  don't
• 31:40
  have
• 31:40
  to
• 31:40
  stop
• 31:40
  and
• 31:40
  write
• 31:41
  if
• 31:41
  they're
• 31:41
  driving
• 31:41
  or
• 31:42
  list
• 31:42
  doing
• 31:42
  laundry
• 31:43
  or
• 31:43
  whatever
• 31:43
  it
• 31:43
  is.
• 31:43
  Everything
• 31:44
  will
• 31:44
  be
• 31:44
  in
• 31:44
  your
• 31:44
  show
• 31:45
  notes
• 31:45
  so
• 31:45
  that
• 31:46
  you
• 31:46
  can.
• 31:46
  People
• 31:46
  can
• 31:46
  reach
• 31:47
  out
• 31:47
  and
• 31:47
  reach
• 31:47
  out
• 31:48
  to
• 31:48
  Scott.
• 31:48
  I
• 31:48
  mean,
• 31:48
  he's.
• 31:49
  He's.
• 31:49
  He's
• 31:50
  seen
• 31:50
  both
• 31:50
  sides
• 31:51
  of
• 31:51
  it.
• 31:52
  He's.
• 31:52
  He's
• 31:53
  worked
• 31:53
  with
• 31:53
  the
• 31:53
  victims.
• 31:54
  He's
• 31:54
  worked
• 31:54
  with
• 31:54
  the
• 31:55
  perpetrators
• 31:56
  or.
• 31:56
  And
• 31:57
  at
• 31:57
  the
• 31:57
  end
• 31:57
  of
• 31:57
  the
• 31:58
  day,
• 31:59
  nobody's
• 31:59
  perfect.
• 32:00
  So
• 32:01
  he
• 32:01
  has
• 32:01
  that
• 32:01
  compassion
• 32:02
  and
• 32:02
  that
• 32:02
  empathy
• 32:04
  to
• 32:04
  be
• 32:05
  able
• 32:05
  to
• 32:05
  help.
• 32:05
  So
• 32:05
  I
• 32:06
  love
• 32:06
  that.
• 32:06
  To
• 32:06
  empower,
• 32:07
  not
• 32:07
  help.
• 32:07
  I
• 32:08
  like
• 32:08
  to
• 32:08
  say
• 32:08
  empower
• 32:08
  instead
• 32:09
  of
• 32:09
  help.
• 32:10
  So.
• 32:12
  So
• 32:12
  if
• 32:13
  you
• 32:13
  could
• 32:13
  give
• 32:13
  that.
• 32:13
  Well,
• 32:14
  first
• 32:14
  of
• 32:14
  all,
• 32:14
  thank
• 32:14
  you
• 32:14
  so
• 32:15
  much
• 32:15
  for
• 32:15
  coming
• 32:15
  on.
• 32:16
  Thank
• 32:16
  you
• 32:16
  for
• 32:16
  having
• 32:17
  me.
• 32:17
  You're
• 32:17
  very
• 32:18
  welcome.
• 32:18
  And
• 32:18
  if
• 32:18
  you
• 32:18
  could
• 32:19
  give
• 32:19
  the
• 32:19
  listeners
• 32:20
  one
• 32:20
  last
• 32:20
  message
• 32:21
  from
• 32:21
  you,
• 32:21
  what
• 32:21
  would
• 32:21
  it
• 32:22
  be?
• 32:23
  Well,
• 32:24
  I
• 32:24
  made
• 32:25
  the
• 32:25
  choice
• 32:25
  to
• 32:25
  name
• 32:26
  my
• 32:26
  practice
• 32:27
  mosaic
• 32:28
  pathway
• 32:28
  counseling
• 32:29
  for
• 32:29
  a
• 32:29
  reason.
• 32:32
  If
• 32:33
  negative,
• 32:34
  hurtful,
• 32:34
  traumatic
• 32:35
  things
• 32:36
  have
• 32:36
  happened
• 32:37
  to
• 32:37
  you,
• 32:37
  if
• 32:37
  you've
• 32:37
  experienced
• 32:38
  those
• 32:39
  in
• 32:39
  your
• 32:39
  life,
• 32:40
  those
• 32:40
  things
• 32:40
  don't
• 32:41
  define
• 32:41
  you.
• 32:43
  They
• 32:43
  are
• 32:44
  a
• 32:45
  part
• 32:45
  of
• 32:45
  your
• 32:45
  process,
• 32:46
  a
• 32:46
  part
• 32:47
  of
• 32:47
  your
• 32:47
  mosaic.
• 32:48
  Don't
• 32:49
  stand
• 32:49
  close
• 32:49
  to
• 32:50
  the
• 32:50
  mosaic
• 32:50
  and
• 32:50
  look
• 32:51
  at
• 32:51
  it
• 32:51
  from
• 32:51
  1
• 32:52
  inch
• 32:52
  or
• 32:52
  2
• 32:52
  inches
• 32:53
  away.
• 32:53
  Step
• 32:54
  back
• 32:54
  and
• 32:54
  see
• 32:54
  the
• 32:55
  whole
• 32:55
  picture,
• 32:55
  because
• 32:55
  there's
• 32:56
  a
• 32:56
  lot
• 32:56
  more
• 32:56
  to
• 32:57
  you
• 32:58
  and
• 32:58
  that
• 32:58
  lot
• 32:59
  more
• 33:00
  that.
• 33:00
  That.
• 33:01
  That
• 33:02
  larger
• 33:02
  piece
• 33:03
  has
• 33:03
  so
• 33:04
  many
• 33:04
  positives
• 33:04
  and
• 33:05
  so
• 33:05
  many
• 33:05
  strengths,
• 33:06
  and
• 33:06
  that's
• 33:06
  what
• 33:07
  we
• 33:07
  need
• 33:07
  to
• 33:09
  connect
• 33:10
  to.
• 33:11
  Perfectly
• 33:12
  said.
• 33:12
  Perfectly
• 33:13
  said.
• 33:14
  Thank
• 33:14
  you
• 33:14
  so
• 33:14
  much.
• 33:15
  Thank
• 33:16
  you.
• 33:17
  Yes.
• 33:17
  And
• 33:17
  for
• 33:17
  everybody
• 33:18
  else
• 33:18
  out
• 33:18
  there
• 33:18
  listening,
• 33:19
  you
• 33:19
  heard
• 33:19
  it.
• 33:20
  Stand
• 33:20
  way
• 33:20
  back.
• 33:21
  Look
• 33:21
  at
• 33:21
  your
• 33:21
  big
• 33:22
  picture.
• 33:22
  Know
• 33:22
  that
• 33:22
  you
• 33:22
  are
• 33:23
  absolutely
• 33:23
  beautiful
• 33:24
  just
• 33:24
  the
• 33:24
  way
• 33:24
  you
• 33:25
  are
• 33:25
  right
• 33:25
  here,
• 33:26
  right
• 33:26
  now.
• 33:27
  Perfection
• 33:27
  is
• 33:28
  a
• 33:28
  myth.
• 33:28
  But
• 33:29
  if
• 33:29
  I
• 33:29
  had
• 33:30
  to
• 33:30
  say,
• 33:31
  looking
• 33:31
  at
• 33:31
  you
• 33:31
  right
• 33:32
  now,
• 33:32
  you
• 33:32
  are
• 33:32
  absolutely
• 33:33
  perfect.
• 33:34
  So
• 33:34
  thank
• 33:34
  you,
• 33:35
  and
• 33:35
  we
• 33:35
  will
• 33:36
  see
• 33:36
  you
• 33:36
  back
• 33:36
  next
• 33:36
  week.